Pod Insights The Why Files: Operation Podcast The CIA, Men in Black and the Plot to Take Out JFK | The Maury Island Incident About this episode June 1947. Harbor patrolman Harold Dahl witnesses six metallic objects over Maury Island, Washington. One drops molten slag onto his boat. A stranger in a black suit arrives the next morning, knowing details Dahl shared with no one. Two military investigators examine the debris. Their plane crashes. The evidence vanishes. Sixteen years later, witness Fred Crisman surfaces in the JFK assassination investigation. Declassified files reveal he was a CIA disruption agent. On November 12, 1963, Kennedy issues a classified memo demanding UFO disclosure and cooperation with the Soviets. Ten days later, he's gone. The same operatives who investigated UFOs in 1947 appear connected to Dallas. Guy Banister. Allen Dulles. Fred Crisman. The UFO case might have been a hoax. But what it exposed was real.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5KXsiBZjOM
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Transcript 6,637 words · 15 speakers
Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
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1:13 AJ Gentile? June 1947. Boat captain Harold Dahl watched a formation of UFOs drop molten metal over Puget Sound. The debris wrecked his boat, burned his son, and killed his dog. Then terrible things started to happen to Dahl's family, beginning with a visit from a mysterious stranger in a black suit. Over the next 15 years, about a dozen people connected to this UFO sighting died mysteriously. Investigators, military officers, journalists. But the most dramatic death of all: John F. Kennedy.
1:55 AJ Gentile? On June 21, 1947, Harold Dahl was patrolling around Maury Island with his 15-year-old son, Charles, a crewman, and his dog, Sparky. They were looking for straight timber that had fallen off boats. Timber companies paid for any logs returned to them. Around 2 that afternoon, Charles pointed at the sky. Six doughnut-shaped objects hovered about 2,000 feet above the water. Harold cut the engine. The objects made no sound. Each was about 100 feet wide with a hole in the center. They looked like massive metallic tires with portholes around the outer rim. Five of the objects floated in a circle around the sixth, which was losing altitude and moving radically.
2:35 Speaker 02 Was my ex-wife driving?
2:37 AJ Gentile? No.
2:38 Speaker 02 Because swerving out of control, leaking fluids, and ruining vacations, that's her speciality.
2:43 AJ Gentile? She wasn't driving. The craft was directly over the boat, maybe 500 feet above them. Harold could see into it through the windows.
2:51 Speaker 02 Did he see my ex-wife in there?
2:53 AJ Gentile? No! Do you want to hear about the UFOs or not?
2:56 Speaker 02 Sorry, sorry. I'm still harboring a little resentment. Hey, go ahead.
3:01 AJ Gentile? The wobble got worse. Then there was a deep but harsh crack. Then the craft started dumping material. Thousands of strips of thin metal rained down like confetti. Then came the heavy stuff, white hot liquid metal. The hot metal hissed when it hit the water. Then heavy pieces slammed into the boat, some the size of a baseball, but some as big as tires. Charles screamed when a piece burned through his shirt. Another hit their dog, Sparky, killing him instantly.
3:29 Speaker 02 Oh, that's too bad. They should have brought their kit.
3:32 AJ Gentile? Stop it. Harold tried the radio, but the equipment was dead. Harold had seen enough. He fired up the engine and ran the boat onto the beach. They hid in the trees and watched. The damaged craft rose and rejoined the formation. All six accelerated toward the open ocean. The encounter lasted about 20 minutes. Harold said maybe 20 tons of material had fallen from the craft. He took photographs, the objects in flight, the debris field, the damaged boat. That night, he met his business partner. ...partner Fred Christman, who doubted the story. The next morning, Christman sailed to Maury Island to see for himself. He found the debris exactly where Harold said it would be, covering the beach for hundreds of yards. Some pieces were still warm. Then he looked up.
4:16 AJ Gentile? One of the craft hovered silently for five minutes before vanishing. He had the proof, photographs, physical evidence, and now his own sighting. Later that day, a stranger arrived at Dahl's door. Black suit, black hat, brand-new Buick with no plates. And somehow, this man knew every detail about the event. Harold Dahl had just met history's first: Men in Black. The stranger in black sat across from Harold at a diner in Tacoma. He ordered breakfast, but he never touched it.
4:54 Speaker 02 Ah, that's a power move. Men in Black aren't as intimidating when they're eating waffles.
5:00 AJ Gentile? He already knew Harold's name, the names of his wife and son. He knew everything about the incident, the craft, the debris, Charles' burned arm. He knew about Sparky. He even knew that Harold was hiding on the island, watching the craft. The stranger told Harold to keep quiet, or bad things might happen to him and his family. Harold ignored the warning. He talked to family, friends, even the press. And the next day, the story hit the papers. Then the tragedy started. Charles vanished. Weeks later, he was found in Montana, bussing tables, with no memory of who he was or how he got there. And a few days later, he was hit by a car. Then Harold's wife became suddenly ill. His business was vandalized.
5:45 AJ Gentile? His family was constantly threatened. Harold got the message. But Fred Christman wouldn't stay quiet. He contacted Ray Palmer, editor of Amazing Stories, magazine that covered the paranormal and UFOs and science fiction. Palmer asked Kenneth Arnold to investigate. Arnold was a pilot and deputy field marshal. He became famous for his own UFO sighting near Mount Rainier, just three days after the Maury Island incident. Arnold described the objects as "moving like saucers skipping across water." Reporters called them "flying saucers," and the name stuck. There were so many sightings of UFOs in the area during this time, that it was called "The Summer of Saucers." And remember, Roswell would happen just a few weeks later.
6:28 AJ Gentile? Arnold flew to Tacoma on July 29th with United Airlines Captain E.J. Smith. Smith had also seen UFOs that summer. They met Harold and Christman at the Winthrop Hotel and examined the debris. The metal looked ordinary, but Arnold still found the story compelling. Late that night, just as Kenneth Arnold and E.J. Smith were getting ready for bed, the phone rang.
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7:29 AJ Gentile? The man on the other end of the call was Ted Morello, a reporter from United Press International. Morello said an anonymous source was feeding him every detail of their private conversations: names, times, even the UFO description. Morello wanted more information.
7:44 Speaker 04 Look, Arnold, all I'm saying is, I'm gonna get the information. I'd rather get it directly from the source.
7:50 AJ Gentile? Captain Smith grabbed the phone, shouted a few obscenities, and hung up. At first, they blew it off, but after thinking about it, they became concerned that they might be caught up in an espionage plot. They started to panic. They swept the room for bugs, but they didn't find any. But later, it was discovered that the intercom in the room had been converted into a microphone. Someone was listening.
8:12 Speaker 02 How do you know which room the bug?
8:14 AJ Gentile? Well, when Arnold got to Tacoma, all the hotels were booked, but for some reason, the Winthrop had a room registered in his name. Arnold assumed Ray Palmer had bought him his room. He didn't. The next morning, he called two military intelligence officers he trusted: Captain William Davidson and Lieutenant Frank Brown. They specialized in UFO cases. They arrived two days later. When Arnold told them about the room being bugged... They weren't worried about it. This didn't help Kenneth Arnold's growing paranoia. Harold refused to speak with military intelligence, but Crisman was excited to. He relayed every detail of the story. The meeting lasted for hours. And before he left, Crisman gave the officers 30 pieces of metallic debris in a cornflakes box.
8:56 Speaker 02 Yeah, I hope alien metal doesn't get soggy in milk.
8:59 AJ Gentile? The officers left after midnight with the UFO samples. Their B-25 flew out of McCord Air Base at 1:30 a.m. Two hours later, the plane went down.
9:17 AJ Gentile? Two hours into the flight, the B-25's left engine caught fire. Davidson tried to stabilize the aircraft, and Brown ordered the two crewmen to strap on parachutes and bail. They landed safely. Investigators did not. The bomber crashed near Kelso, Washington. Davidson and Brown died on impact. Their bodies were recovered, but the UFO debris was gone. And nobody knows what happened to the evidence, but some think it was taken by the FBI. The FBI was quietly following the Maury Island incident. They quietly followed all UFO reports. In July 1947, the FBI investigated a UFO case in Twin Falls, Idaho. A crash this was found and turned over to Special Agent Guy Banister.
10:00 Speaker 02 Yeah, he said to...
10:01 AJ Gentile? Wait for it.
10:02 Speaker 02 Okay.
10:03 AJ Gentile? All of this is documented in FBI files labeled "Security Matter X." SMX for short. The FBI's Real X-Files. They dealt with strange cases, UFOs, unexplained phenomena, things that they couldn't acknowledge to the public. Researchers were aware of the X-Files, but the FBI didn't discuss it. They weren't officially declassified until just a few weeks before I wrote this.
10:26 AJ Gentile? The Maury Island UFO incident attracted the attention of FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover. Reporting for the Tacoma Times, Paul Lance released the names of the officers killed before the military announced them. He also reported that an anonymous source told him the plane was shot down with a 20-millimeter cannon.
10:43 Speaker 02 Who shot it down?
10:45 AJ Gentile? Well, the official report is that the left engine had a mechanical failure.
10:49 Speaker 02 Yeah, a cannon-sized hole do that.
10:52 AJ Gentile? FBI agents interviewed Harold and Fred, and the pressure was getting intense. Two Air Force officers were dead, and the press was calling it sabotage. Harold wanted out. After retelling his story, he finally admitted there were no UFOs. Fred Christman also said it was just a joke. J. Edgar Hoover told the agents to close the case. But Special Agent Jack Wilcox corrected Hoover. "We have the memo." Wilcox wrote the doll didn't admit to a hoax. He only said he would call it a hoax to avoid trouble. He'd rather be known as a liar than someone who saw a UFO. Privately, he still said the story was true, and so did Christman. Soon after the investigation, Paul Lance, the reporter, died of sudden meningitis at age 29.
11:36 AJ Gentile? Doctors never found the cause. The Tacoma Times folded a year later. Fred Christman was recalled to military service and sent to Alaska. Harold Dahl disappeared from Tacoma. Someone was tying up loose ends. But Fred Christman would resurface in Dallas 16 years later, when he was photographed near the Gracie Knoll in Dealey Plaza during a presidential motorcade.
11:59 Speaker 03 Holy shit!
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12:39 AJ Gentile? Fred Christman wasn't just a harbor patrolman who witnessed something strange over Puget Sound. Years later, classified documents revealed there was much more to his story.
12:52 Speaker 05 Tactical Fighter Experimental. Nobody knows what those words mean, but that's the word. Tactical Fighter Experimental will serve the forces of freedom and will be the number-one airplane in the world today.
13:12 Speaker 06 There's been a good deal of discussion of the long and hard fought competition to win the TFX contract, but very little discussion about what this plane will do.
13:23 AJ Gentile? Crisman was a decorated fighter pilot who flew 211 combat missions in WWII. In 1942, he was recruited by the Office of Strategic Services, the OSS. After the war, the OSS became the CIA, and Crisman went with them. The easy papers exposed his real job: Career Disruption Agent. He monitored targets and fed them disinformation.
13:47 Speaker 06 Crisman has served many years as an active agent for the old OSS and later the CIA. He is rated an extended agent. He is an information specialist and highly trained in internal security. He has worked overseas and has served as a regular United States Air Force officer, but his primary training has always been slanted in the direction of disruption work inside the borders of the United States.
14:15 AJ Gentile? Crisman ran businesses that existed only on paper: no goods, no services, no employees. In 1966, FBI informants tracked him moving $100,000 in cash to California. The FBI looked the other way. Then there was his political work. He gathered intelligence on American politicians and submitted more than 1,000 reports to the CIA. He fed damaging information to political opponents.
14:41 Speaker 02 Yeah, this guy sounds like Christopher Steele. Ah, what's our rule? I, I, I know, we don't joke about the Clintons, I know.
14:54 AJ Gentile? By 1963, Crisman was part of a network of far-right, anti-communist, anti-Castro CIA operatives. But this network had a problem. John F. Kennedy wanted to dismantle the CIA and make peace with the Soviet Union. To people like Crisman, Kennedy wasn't a president, he was a traitor. A group of men with deep ties to the government, military, and intelligence community decided JFK had to go.
15:25 Speaker 07 Yeah. Pack your bags. Operation Lancer is a go. Understood.
15:32 Speaker 05 Where they combined military civilian defense payroll is well over a billion dollars. I don't recite these for any partisan purpose. They're the result of American determination to be second to none. And as a result of...
15:53 Speaker 05 In the past three years, we have increased the defense budget of the United States by over twenty percent.
16:09 Speaker 08 From Dallas, Texas, the flash, apparently official, President Kennedy died at 1:00 PM Central Standard Time, 2 o'clock Eastern Standard Time, some thirty-eight minutes ago.
16:28 AJ Gentile? New Orleans was chosen for planning. It was close to Latin America and Cuba, and local authorities were infamous for being on the take. And the city was full of anti-communist operatives. Clay Shaw was a New Orleans businessman connected to two CIA front companies. He provided cash and intelligence while maintaining his cover as a respected community leader. Shaw denied CIA involvement, but years later, the agency admitted he was a valuable asset. In 1967, New Orleans DA Jim Garrison launched the only criminal investigation into JFK's murder. Shaw was charged and arrested. His first call after arrest? Fred Christman.
17:10 AJ Gentile? Christman made repeated trips to New Orleans and Dallas in 1963. Some suspected he was one of the shooters at Dealey Plaza. Then there was Guy Banister, the FBI agent who investigated UFO crashes in 1947. Bannister coordinated with military intelligence during the Moray Island investigation. Fred Christman is thought to be the anonymous source feeding him information. After leaving the FBI, Bannister became a private investigator in New Orleans. But he wasn't running a typical PI business. Witnesses saw crates of military-grade weapons moving through the building. And Fred Christman's trips to New Orleans that year weren't vacations. Witnesses saw him at Bannister's office multiple times, meeting with other conspirators.
17:52 AJ Gentile? Some say he delivered cash, others say he delivered something else: documents from the Moray Island investigation, reports about a UFO crash, and debris that didn't match any known aircraft. Bannister's office was the primary hub for plotting against Kennedy. Now, this might sound unlikely, but the conspirators overlooked one detail that connected them all. Bannister's detective agency was located at 531 Lafayette Street in New Orleans. But the building sat on a corner. It had another entrance, another address: 544 Camp Street. Now, this address is important because it was the home base of the most famous conspirator of all: Lee Harvey Oswald.
18:44 AJ Gentile? This web of conspiracy ran from Puget Sound to New Orleans to Dallas. 16 years of covert operations spanning UFO cover-ups and political assassinations. And the covert operators had a motive powerful enough to kill a president. President Kennedy engaged in secret peace talks with Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev. They discussed cooperation, not confrontation. They talked about ending the Cold War. Kennedy even proposed a joint US-Soviet space program to explore the moon together.
19:16 Speaker 02 Oh, the Russians would have liked the weather in Burbank were they filmed that.
19:20 AJ Gentile? Not now, please. To prove his commitment to peace, Kennedy made a gesture of ultimate trust. He decided to reveal America's most protected secret.
19:30 Speaker 02 Eh, why hot dogs come in packs of 10, but buns only come in packs of 8?
19:35 AJ Gentile? No.
19:35 Speaker 02 How to fold the fitted sheet?
19:37 AJ Gentile? No.
19:38 Speaker 02 What's really in a McRib?
19:39 AJ Gentile? No. He wanted to declassify all UFO files. On November 12th, 1963, just 10 days before his death, Kennedy issued two memos. The first was National Security Action Memorandum 271.
19:55 Speaker 09 I have initiated a program for the orderly declassification of all UFO intelligence files affecting national security. I have instructed the CIA director to prepare a program for the sharing of this data with NASA, where it can be put to use in the context of the Space and Lunar Exploration Program.
20:13 AJ Gentile? The second memo was classified top secret. Kennedy sent it directly to the director of the CIA.
20:19 Speaker 09 Furthermore, I have requested that the CIA develop a program of substantive cooperation with the Soviet Union in the field of outer space, including the development of specific technical proposals. I have asked that the CIA work closely with the Department of State and other agencies as appropriate in developing this program.
20:46 AJ Gentile? To former CIA Director Allen Dulles, who Kennedy had fired after the Bay of Pigs disaster, this wasn't diplomacy, it was treason. Dulles had overseen the UFO cover-up since 1947. He'd investigated the Moray Island Incident. He knew what technology the government had recovered from alien craft. Kennedy was demanding access to the biggest secret in human history, and he planned to share it with America's enemy. Ending the Cold War might be good for humanity, but it was bad for business. The defense industry was already furious with John F. Kennedy. He awarded the largest defense deal in history to General Dynamics. Everyone expected it to go to Boeing, the cornerstone of the military-industrial complex. But because of JFK, Boeing and its network of powerful allies
21:31 AJ Gentile? had just lost a fortune.
21:33 Speaker 02 Especially all the people in Congress who bought Boeing stock ahead of the announcement.
21:37 AJ Gentile? No doubt about that. Jim Garrison did some more digging. He found that Boeing used to have an employee they called "a chaos agent." The man allegedly committed corporate espionage. He spread disinformation. He even killed people on behalf of the company. And that chaos agent was Fred Christman.
21:55 Speaker 10 Crisman is a former employee of the Boeing Company. In intelligence terminology, this ordinarily means that the connection still exists, but that the former employee has moved into an underground operation. Crisman has been engaged in undercover activity for a part of the industrial warfare complex for years.
22:18 AJ Gentile? The cabal assembled the team: CIA operatives, mobsters, Cuban exiles. Businessmen like Clay Shaw brought in locals like David Ferry and Guy Banister. And the man nobody talks about, but who shows up everywhere, is Fred Crisman. The network that silenced Harold Dahl was activated again. But this time, they needed someone to take the fall. Someone with the perfect background to be blamed. And that man was Lee Harvey Oswald. Oswald had served as an aviation electronics operator in the Marines. In 1957, he was stationed at naval air facility Atsugi in Japan, one of the most secret bases in the world, home of the U-2 spy plane program developed at Area 51.
23:02 AJ Gentile? Oswald worked on the radar systems with crypto clearance. He tracked U-2 flights. He knew their flight patterns, altitudes, and capabilities. And two years after Oswald left Atsugi, the Soviets shot down a U-2 over Russia. The man accused of killing the president had direct access to America's most sensitive technology, and somehow, the Soviets got that same information. The assassination of John F. Kennedy was a coup, designed to protect the biggest secret in human history. We were just weeks away from ending the Cold War and full UFO disclosure. But...
23:37 Speaker 11 But all of that ended on the 22nd of November, 1963.
23:48 AJ Gentile? In 1969, a photograph surfaced: three men being arrested behind the grassy knoll at Dealey Plaza, minutes after Kennedy's assassination.
23:58 AJ Gentile? They're known as the Three Hobos, or the Three Tramps. But, these men don't look like hobos. Clean clothes, well-fed, fresh shaves. Jim Garrison believed they were intelligence operatives, part of the plot to kill JFK, possibly even the shooters. Researchers spent decades trying to identify them. Some say E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis, both intelligence operatives, both part of the Watergate break-in team, the White House Plumbers. Woody Harrelson's father, Charles Harrelson, was a contract killer. Forensic analysis matched him to the youngest tramp. Career criminal Chauncey Marvin Holt claimed he worked for the CIA on multiple operations: the Bay of Pigs invasion, targeting communist leaders. He said the CIA sent him to Dallas.
24:42 AJ Gentile? And look at tramp number three, the older man with the hat. That looks like Fred Christman. But, nobody knows for sure. Dallas police didn't cooperate with early investigations. They finally released their records in 1989. They identified the tramps as John Gdney, Gus Abrams, and Harold Doyle. When spoken with a Texas accent, Harold Doyle sounds like Harold Dahl. These photographs weren't discovered for four years. Private researcher Richard Sprague found them buried in newspaper archives. By then, the men had vanished.
25:15 AJ Gentile? Garrison subpoenaed Fred Christman on October 31, 1968. Remember, when Clay Shaw was arrested, he made one phone call, not to his lawyer, not to family, to Fred Christman. Christman testified for about an hour before the grand jury. His testimony doesn't match reality. He said he'd never been to New Orleans before 1966, but records show multiple trips in the early 1960s. He said he didn't know Clay Shaw or Guy Banister. Multiple witnesses place him in Banister's office. Christman did admit to knowing Thomas Beckham, a local entertainer and anti-Castro activist. When pressed about their relationship, Christman said he was helping Beckham get into the record business.
25:54 Speaker 02 Yeah, he was gonna help him make a few hits. See what I did there?
25:59 AJ Gentile? Very clever. But Beckham was also filing documents for anti-Castro operations and handling money for Guy Banister's network. In 1966, Christman and Beckham incorporated seven businesses in Olympia, Washington, most of them shell companies. Beckham testified that he visited Banister's office all the time. Fred Christman said he knew nothing about that.
26:22 AJ Gentile? Garrison believed one of the bullets that hit Kennedy came from the fence behind the grassy knoll. And he believed Fred Christman pulled the trigger, but he couldn't prove it.
26:31 Speaker 02 Couldn't prove it? The guy's connected to CIA, UFOs, and a guy who got the first phone call. What do you need, a signed confession odorized by a lizard, people?
26:39 AJ Gentile? That's not how the legal system works.
26:41 Speaker 02 The legal system? That's what they want you to believe. The real system involves secret handshakes, LSD, and making sure your star witness doesn't accidentally fall out a window.
26:52 AJ Gentile? Christman was dismissed and never charged. Clay Shaw was found not guilty. But Garrison never stopped believing that, for some reason, a man who witnessed the UFO crash in 1947, a man with deep ties to the intelligence community, and a man who is openly and loudly extremely far-right and anti-communist, was on the grassy knoll at Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963.
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28:03 Speaker 03 every plan has a $0 or low monthly plan premium, which makes it easier to save, too. So this Medicare planning season, plan well with Humana. Learn more at gethumana.com. Humana is a Medicare Advantage HMO and PPO organization with a Medicare contract. Enrollment in any Humana plan depends on contract renewal.
28:28 AJ Gentile? This isn't supposed to be a JFK video. I've tried to stick with Fred Christman and the Maury Island UFO. If you want a deeper dive on JFK, let me know, there's plenty there. The claim is that the assassination of JFK wasn't just political. It was an operation to protect the biggest secret in human history: the discovery and reverse-engineering of UFOs. And rabbit holes don't get much deeper than this. So... what's true? Well, 60 years later, some facts are documented, others remain speculation. The debris allegedly on the B-25 disappeared. Skeptics say the metallic rocks were industrial slag from a nearby smelting company.
29:05 Speaker 02 Pieces of UFO is industrial slag? Eh, that's like calling a Fabuché egg a chicken rock.
29:13 AJ Gentile? Skeptics also point out that after Kenneth Arnold saw his flying saucers near Mount Rainier, UFO sightings exploded across the country.
29:22 AJ Gentile? Now, Doll and Christman might have been lying for money, trying to get their story published. Christman did have a letter published in Harper's Magazine in 1946, where he described battling creatures in an underground cave. He published a second letter in Amazing Stories in May 1947, two months before the Maury Island incident. Fred Christman does have connections to the JFK assassination, but the evidence is circumstantial. Jim Garrison was criticized for making connections without hard evidence, relying mostly on witness statements. The House Select Committee on Assassinations said there was likely a conspiracy. They never confirmed Christman's involvement, and the photograph allegedly showing him near Dealey Plaza is grainy. It looks like Christman to me, but it's hard to be sure.
30:05 AJ Gentile? To this day, nobody knows for sure who they are. The plane crash happened, that's documented. But the military said it had nothing to do with the Maury Island investigation.
30:15 Speaker 02 Oh, the military said so! Eh, we'll pack it up, everyone, the military never lies, case closed.
30:27 AJ Gentile? Lee Harvey Oswald did work on the YouTube program at a Tsukiji base in Japan. But thousands of people did. Thousands of people had clearance for classified programs. It doesn't prove that he was part of a UFO cover-up. But some facts won't go away. In 1959, Lee Harvey Oswald defected to the Soviet Union. He renounced his citizenship and said he'd provide military secrets, which we know he had. He found a job, he met his future wife Marina. Then in 1961, he came back. And typically, when a defector wants to return from the Soviet Union, they face intense scrutiny. They have to negotiate with both governments. It's a long, difficult process. Permission isn't always granted. But Lee Harvey Oswald came back with no problem. The US State Department even loaned him the money.
31:11 AJ Gentile? They provided his wife with a visa.
31:13 Speaker 02 Ah, the old secret agent welcome-home package. Comes with a loan, a wife, and an alibi. Ah, nice work if you can get it.
31:20 AJ Gentile? Oh, there's more.
31:21 Speaker 02 There always is.
31:22 AJ Gentile? Special Agent Jack Wilcox's memo to J. Edgar Hoover directly contradicts the official narrative. Remember, Wilcox reported that Dahl didn't actually admit to a hoax. He said Dahl would call it a hoax to avoid trouble, but privately insisted the story was true. And this is in declassified FBI files. Crispin also said the UFO sighting was real. He said so in 1967 to UFO researcher Gary Leslie.
31:51 Speaker 12 I will tell you this much. The Maury Island incident was no hoax. The FBI and the Air Force know it was no hoax. The pieces of the UFO that are still in our possession have proven that it was no hoax. Most of you play games, make a silly hobby out of a matter that should scare you to death. I have little patience with most of your organizations.
32:13 AJ Gentile? Fred Crisman's CIA involvement is confirmed in the easy papers. He was a career disruption agent who ran disinformation operations inside the United States. Guy Banister investigated the Maury Island UFO case for the FBI. He operated out of 544 Camp Street in New Orleans. Lee Harvey Oswald worked at that same address. This connection is documented. ...these November 12th, 1963 memos are real. He requested cooperation with the Soviet Union on space exploration. He demanded access to UFO files 10 days before his assassination. Allen Dulles, who Kennedy fired, was appointed to the Warren Commission investigating his death. And nobody can explain why Allen Dulles, who despised the president, was put on that commission.
32:56 AJ Gentile? And publicly, Attorney General Robert Kennedy accepted the Warren Commission report. But according to his son RFK Junior, he privately called it "a shoddy piece of craftsmanship."
33:06 Speaker 02 "Shoddy? That's an insult to shoddy craftsmen everywhere."
33:19 Speaker 07 There's a six-year cover-up. You know, the Warren Commission was run by Allen Dulles, who was the head of the CIA, who my uncle fired. Congress found that, yeah, it was a plot. It was a conspiracy. There were multiple people involved. It was my father's first instinct. That agency had killed his brother.
33:44 AJ Gentile? And we all know what happened to RFK Senior.
33:46 Speaker 07 Senator Kennedy has been shot, is that possible?
33:49 Speaker 13 Senator Robert Francis Kennedy died at 1:44 a.m. today, June 6th, 1968.
34:03 AJ Gentile? The Warren Commission's investigation was deliberately incomplete. The CIA withheld thousands of documents. They're holding them still. Witnesses were ignored. Evidence was suppressed. Declassified files now reveal the CIA actively obstructed the investigation. The cover-up is no longer theory, it's documented fact. Kennedy awarded a major defense contract to General Dynamics instead of Boeing. This cost the military-industrial complex billions. Fred Christman worked for Boeing. The biggest mystery isn't whether UFOs dropped debris over Puget Sound. It's the connections that followed. The same people who investigated UFO cases in 1947 show up in the JFK assassination 16 years later. Guy Banister, Fred Christman, Alan Dulles.
34:47 AJ Gentile? Same addresses, same witness intimidation, same classified operations. Now, maybe Harold Dahl made up the UFO story. Maybe the plane crash was mechanical failure. And maybe every connection is a coincidence.
34:59 Speaker 02 No such thing as a coincidence. That's like finding out your proctologist and your dentist's shared office. Something stinks, and it takes the fluoride.
35:09 AJ Gentile? Kennedy did demand UFO disclosure. He planned to share classified information with the Soviet Union. Two years earlier, Kennedy laid out his vision for space.
35:17 Speaker 05 Now it is time to take longer strides. Time for a great new American enterprise. Time for this nation to take a clearly leading role in space achievement, which in many ways may hold the key to our future on Earth.
35:38 AJ Gentile? Kennedy threatened the military-industrial complex. And about the CIA, he said, "I will splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces and scatter it to the winds." Ten days after demanding access to the UFO files, he was dead. The UFO might have been a hoax, but the conspiracy it exposed is real. The cover-up didn't end in 1963. The same agencies that probably killed Kennedy still operate with the same secrecy. The same classification systems still hide the truth. The CIA says they're protecting America from its enemies. But the more you look, the more you realize, they're protecting themselves. America's most dangerous enemy isn't Russia, or China, or Iran.
36:17 AJ Gentile? It's the CIA. Thanks so much for hanging out with us today. My name is AJ. You know Hecklefish.
36:29 Speaker 02 I'm just a patsy.
36:31 AJ Gentile? This has been the Y-Files. Get fun, learn anything, do us a favor, hit like, subscribe, comment, share. I'm told that stuff still helps the algorithm. But who really knows? Like most topics we cover on this channel, today's was recommended by you, by a lot of you. So if there's a story you'd like to see or learn more about, go to theyfiles.com/tips, or just email us at [email protected] . And remember, the Y Files is also a podcast. You could take us on the road. Twice a week, I post deep dives into the stories we cover here and also post episodes that are a little too hot for YouTube. Anyway, it's called, wait for it, The Y Files Operation Podcast, and it's available everywhere you get your podcasts. And if you are listening on a podcast
37:14 AJ Gentile? platform, do us a favor, hit like, follow, thumbs, whatever those buttons are. That stuff actually really does help out. Now, if you need more Y Files in your life, you may want to adjust your medication. No, I'm kidding. You could check out our Discord server. I think we're over 80,000 members over there. So 24/7, there's someone on Discord. They're talking about the same geeky, weird stuff we talk about here. It's a great community. It's a lot of fun. It's really supportive, and it's free to join. Now, speaking of 24/7, check out our 24/7 livestream on the Y Files Backstage. Over there, we run episodes back to back with a lot of unique, fun content in between. And I pop in there sometimes and say hello,
37:57 AJ Gentile? and you never know when you're gonna get hit with a free membership. We drop a lot of fun stuff in there. You know what? Now that I think about it, the videos are fine, but it's the live chat. That's a lot of fun. If you want to follow what's going on with the Y Files, you could check out our production calendar. It's at theyfiles.com/cal. There you can find our episode schedule, upcoming podcasts, live streams, all that stuff. Special thanks to our patron who made this episode happen and made the whole channel possible. Everything on the Y Files is dedicated to our Patreon members. I could not do this without you, and I appreciate you sticking with me through the hard times. And if you've been with this channel for a while, you remember those. But I'm back, almost. And if you'd
38:39 AJ Gentile? like to support the channel, keep us going, and join this amazing community, become a member on Patreon. For as little as $3 a month, you get access to all kinds of perks. You get to see videos and podcasts early with no commercials, exclusive merch only available to Patreon members, plus two private live streams every week, all just for you. And the whole Y Files team is on the stream, so there's my big fat faces on there, and you can see Victoria. Jen, Gino, everybody's there. And you can turn your webcam on, jump up on stage, ask a question, tell a joke if you want to learn more about a topic or suggest a topic. It's a great way to engage with us and get to know us as people, because we are, allegedly. Another great way to support the channel is grab something from the Wi-Fi store.
39:22 Speaker 02 Great, I got a T-shirt. Oh, one of these fistable coffee mugs, stick a fist in. But if it gets stuck, don't, uh, don't call me. Go to the, to the emergency room. I, I claim no responsibility for your fist. Oh, get a hoodie, oh, show my face on it. Look at one of these adorable, squeasy, animal talking. Look how cute he is. One of these talking doll toys.
39:44 AJ Gentile? But if you're gonna buy merch, make sure you become a member on YouTube. I know, hear me out. YouTube members get 10% off everything in the Wi-Fi store, and it's only $3 a month. So if you're gonna spend $40 on T-shirts or fistable coffee mugs, if you become a member on YouTube, get the coupon code, it pays for itself. And look, if you want to cancel after you shop on the store, that's totally fine. The membership is there to save you money and not make me money. In fact, all the money from YouTube memberships goes to my great team.
40:14 Speaker 02 Yeah, but keep that, uh, keep that a little, uh, little secret between us, eh?
40:18 AJ Gentile? Those are the plugs. I didn't add any more this week, did I? I got some more coming though. Some more plugs are in the works. So that's gonna do it. Until next time, be safe, be kind, and know that you are appreciated.
41:25 Speaker 14 I fear the crackhead and got stuck inside Mel's hole with MKUltra I'm being only too aware Did Stanley Kubrick fake the moon landing alone? On a film set, were the shadows people there? The Roswell aliens just fought the smiling man, I'm told And his name was Cold And I can't believe I'm dancing with the fish Head to fish on Thursday nights with AJ2 And one more zombie beat all through the night
42:06 Speaker 14 All I ever wanted was to just hear the truth So one more zombie beat all through the night
42:31 Speaker 14 The Mothman sightings and the solar storms still come To have got the secret city underground Mysterious number stations, planets circle to Project Stargate And what the Dark Watchers found In a simulation, don't you worry though The Black Knight said a lot of tone to me So I can't believe I'm dancing with the fish Head to fish on Thursday nights with AJ2 And one more zombie beat all through the night
43:12 Speaker 14 All I ever wanted was to just hear the truth So one more zombie beat all through the night Head to fish on Thursday nights with AJ2 And one more zombie beat all through the night All I ever wanted was to just hear the truth So one more zombie beat all through the night
44:27 Speaker 03 Network freedom and flexibility. That's what you want in a healthcare plan. With a Humana Medicare Advantage PPO plan, you can see any doctor in the country who accepts Medicare, including specialists. No referrals, no kidding. Learn more at gethumana.com. See any doctor who accepts Medicare and is willing to bill Humana. Humana PPOs may not be available in all areas. Benefits and costs share may vary. Humana is a Medicare Advantage PPO organization with a Medicare contract. Enrollment in any Humana plan depends on contract renewal. Network freedom and flexibility. That's what you want in a healthcare plan. With a Humana Medicare Advantage PPO plan, you can see any doctor in the country who accepts Medicare, including specialists. No referrals, no kidding.
45:10 Speaker 03 Learn more at gethumana.com. See any doctor who accepts Medicare and is willing to bill Humana. Humana PPOs may not be available in all areas. Benefits and costs share may vary. Humana is a Medicare Advantage PPO organization with a Medicare contract. Enrollment in any Humana plan depends on contract renewal.
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