Pixel vs Nexus with UrAvgConsumer

Every Tuesday this month, Vergecast co-host Dieter Bohn hosts a series of discussions diving deep into tech review season, each focusing on a specific product. This week, Dieter talks with YouTube's UrAvgConsumer about how the recently announced Google Pixel 5 shares some common ground with Google's 2013 smartphone project the Nexus 5. This episode was brought to you by Novartis. To learn more about Cell and Gene Therapy visit vox.com/ad/novartis Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:45Speaker 01

  Greetings, mobile accomplishers. I am Dieter Bone. This is part of our special run for The Vergecast where we talk to other reviewers about all of the hardware that's coming out this season. And this week, I'm very excited. We have got Juddner Ora. He's your average consumer on YouTube. What's going on, guys? It's your average consumer. And we are looking at a review that I've been teasing for a while. It's the Nexus 5 from 2013. The reason I wanted to talk about the Nexus 5 is we just saw the announcement for the Google Pixel 5. And I think they're really comparable devices. Low cost, new kind of wireless network, coming into a very interesting phone market. We talked a lot about the differences between the phone markets back then and how they are now.

• 1:30Speaker 01

  We also talked about what it's like to be a reviewer who works primarily on YouTube, like Juddner does. I'm really jealous of the fact that he has all these different formats that he can make. You know, I've got blog posts and I've got reviews on the website and then I make some videos, whereas he just makes YouTube videos. So he can do a lot of really interesting things. We also looked at some of our very, very early YouTube videos. They're kind of embarrassing. I'm just going to say that mine is 10 times more embarrassing than Juddner's was because mine made everybody who uses Android on Reddit hate me for three years. I'll tell the whole story in the show. I had a really great conversation with Juddner. I really think you're going to enjoy it.

• 2:11Speaker 01

  Jonora, thanks so much for joining us. You are the average consumer on YouTube. And I don't believe this, but it may be that some people in our audience haven't seen your videos or heard of you. So can you talk a little bit about your channel, what you do?

• 2:23Speaker 02

  Sure. So I, of course, have a tech channel also on YouTube. I call it your average consumer because I want the videos to be easily digestible for the average consumer. You know, tech for the everyday person, walk away knowing whether or not something is what they want to buy or something they should stay away from.

• 2:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's a more fun, but also like more useful thing than maybe some of the stuff that I do. Cause I'm like hands on reviews, go. We can get into that later. So I had you here and I've been telling people that we're going to be talking about a product they weren't expecting. And if you looked at the title of the podcast, you'll see that we're talking about the Nexus 5 review. Which is ridiculous because that was six or seven years ago.

• 3:04Speaker 02

  Super long, yeah.

• 3:05Speaker 01

  But I thought it was interesting because we just got the announcement, official, finally, after all the leaks, announcement of the Pixel 5 and the Pixel 4a 5G. And I don't know, I don't have a review unit yet. Do you? Do you want to tell me?

• 3:18Speaker 02

  No.

• 3:18Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  Fortunately, no.

• 3:21Speaker 01

  So since we can't talk about that review till later, I wanted to talk about the Nexus 5 because I think it's really like a parallel device to the Pixel 5. It was really cheap. It was the first Nexus on a new wireless standard and like just a bunch of interesting stuff. But before we get there, we should actually just talk about the Pixel 5 stuff. Did you, did you watch Google's infomercial?

• 3:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:44Speaker 01

  What'd you think?

• 3:44Speaker 02

  It was good. I mean, it's honestly what I would expect from one of their presentations. It felt right in line. But you know, the Pixel 5 itself, I like what I saw in certain aspects. I mean, it looks pretty good on paper for, you know, a Pixel device. I'm very happy that the front of it at least looks up to date.

• 4:03Speaker 01

  Right.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Just like the screen and that, it looks like a 2020 device. So I'm pretty happy about that.

• 4:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, the back, man, that's, I don't know. What do you, how do you feel about fingerprint sensors on the back? I initially was like, meh, but then I kind of miss it. I don't know how I quite feel about it.

• 4:18Speaker 02

  I've missed fingerprint sensors since they've vaporized.

• 4:22Speaker 01

  Right.

• 4:22Speaker 02

  It's weird because it feels like a step backwards.

• 4:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:26Speaker 02

  We're not used to seeing features go away. And when something else comes along, see that go away in favor of the older feature. You know, we haven't really seen that yet. So it feels weird. I feel like I'm finally starting to get used to face unlock. And now that that's gone, it's like, do we know if there's even like an unsecure, like a not very secure version of the face unlock?

• 4:50Speaker 01

  They might pull it. Android has had a not secure version of face unlock since the Galaxy Nexus, which was, I don't know, 2012 or 2013 or something, way long ago. But they, you know, it might still be there, but I guess you could use that. But I would never, I don't know.

• 5:07Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 5:08Speaker 01

  Do that. But you're right. It's weird to have a phone where they pull stuff. So the processor is technically, I think, even slower than a Snap 855. If you just do a benchmark on it. Maybe that doesn't matter. Who knows? We'll see. But they don't have the, it doesn't have the Pixel Neural Core image processor. Goes back to the fingerprint sensor. There's a lot of stuff that's like, huh.

• 5:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, it is just surprising to see the steps backwards.

• 5:30Speaker 01

  Yeah. But I mean, it is, you know, it's supposed to be a mid-range phone. So you review everything. I've watched your Note 20 Ultra stuff that you've done. And you also reviewed like the mid-range phones. How do you, when you're approaching needing to make a video about something that's like in the mid-range, it's explicitly not like the super flagship that everyone wants to know about the cool new tech stuff. Do you approach those kinds of things differently than you do the flagships? Or is it just, you just need to tell people, you know, if it's good or not or what?

• 5:56Speaker 02

  So for me, mid-range, I'm looking at those like, can I complete all the tasks that I'm used to doing on those devices? That's, that's more of the criteria there. Just like, can I get regular stuff done? For flagships, it's like, okay, I know I can get regular stuff done. What more does this product bring to the table?

• 6:16Speaker 01

  Right.

• 6:16Speaker 02

  And that's kind of the difference, the way I look at them. I think when you do it like, when you look at it that way, it makes, it makes it a little bit easier. And when a device has, a mid-range device has a little something extra, that's just like a much bigger bonus. Where it's like, you get the job done and it's got a couple of cool features too.

• 6:31Speaker 01

  Does this one thing?

• 6:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:33Speaker 01

  I guess for the Pixel, it'll probably be the camera again.

• 6:35Speaker 02

  Has to be.

• 6:36Speaker 01

  Gotta be, right? I mean, they, they actually talked big game about improving video this year, which I was not expecting.

• 6:42Speaker 02

  I didn't expect that either. I was actually pretty impressed with the portrait mode and night sight combination. That's a lot of, that's a lot of work for that processor, I'm assuming.

• 6:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 6:52Speaker 02

  It just seems like Google's coming with the camera, so it's just surprising to see that kind of evolution there with even that processor.

• 6:59Speaker 01

  Well, tell you what, we will review it when it, when we get it, but we should actually talk about the Nexus 5. So, okay, this was, it came out in 2013.

• 7:08Speaker 03

  The Google Nexus 5 is now official. The LG-made device has a 5-inch 1080p display, supports LTE, and runs on the new Android 4.4 Kit Kat. Besides a few design tweaks, the new OS integrates SMS into Hangouts, upgrades Google Now, and adds search to dialer, essentially turning it into the Yellow Pages.

• 7:26Speaker 01

  What do you remember about the Nexus 5?

• 7:28Speaker 02

  You know, it's weird. I feel like Google loved that phone.

• 7:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 7:33Speaker 02

  For so many years, that was the phone they used as their product images for any kind of software. That's a Nexus 5, whether it's Hangouts, or I don't know, whatever software they came out with.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 7:46Speaker 02

  It was a Nexus 5, even after multiple phones came out. But in particular, that phone, it was interesting to me because it was just, what was it, 400 bucks?

• 7:56Speaker 01

  It's 350, I think.

• 7:57Speaker 02

  350.

• 7:58Speaker 01

  Wild, right?

• 7:59Speaker 02

  You hear that price nowadays and you're thinking like, you know, super low-tier phone, but it wasn't. We saw LTE come to it. I actually took a look back at my review, and it's interesting to see that the camera wasn't really like a big thing for the Nexus line back in the day. Watching movies and playing games are a pleasure on this device, as the screen is much better than it was with the Nexus 4. Although, there is a drawback that hinders the experience, and that's the speaker. The speaker is very easy to block depending on how you hold the device, and can lead to some completely muffled audio.

• 8:34Speaker 04

  You got the lightning? Light the bastards up.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  Muffles out. Okay, so what's funny to me about that, I mean, we should get into the camera in a minute, but the fact that you pointed out that you can muffle the speaker every single phone. Like you, we had to point it out on the Note 20 Ultra. Why do they keep making mistakes?

• 8:56Speaker 02

  It is the weirdest thing. You would, you would think, I mean, and they watch these reviews, you know, so it's, they know that this is a message that not only are people experiencing, but we're talking about, but it just doesn't matter. I guess it's maybe just easier for them to make it that way, but you would think that's a problem that got solved years ago.

• 9:15Speaker 01

  Well, so they did solve it for a while. It was a thing where you would get front-facing speakers on phones and that was the thing. And everyone was like, oh, finally. And then it turns out nobody cares, I guess, except for us.

• 9:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, then they're like, you know what? We need more, we need bigger screens.

• 9:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:28Speaker 02

  What, who introduced those kinds? I think HTC was really big on, what was it? The Boom, the Boom Speak?

• 9:35Speaker 01

  They had the Boom Sound. So their first one was a Windows phone that had a slide-up speaker that was front-facing and it was like meant to, it was like meant to replace a Bluetooth speaker. And then they had Boom Sound on the HTC One, which was a direct competitor to this Nexus 7 back in the, it was the 1M7 technically.

• 9:52Speaker 02

  Right.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  We should, we should talk, that phone was hot.

• 9:55Speaker 05

  HTC Boom Sound, dual-frontal stereo speakers with built-in amplifiers for sharper, richer sound. The new HTC One.

• 10:03Speaker 01

  Okay, so besides the speaker, are there any other little things that like bother you on that people just keep doing it in phones? Like fix this one little thing. I'm tired of it. It's been years. Cause like covering the speaker is like a big one for me.

• 10:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, no, definitely. That's a good, that's actually a pretty good question. One thing that they always do, you got me on that one.

• 10:22Speaker 01

  So for me, it's face smoothing, actually, on the, on the selfie camera.

• 10:26Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 10:27Speaker 01

  I don't mind if it's there and I'm happy to turn it on and I actually use it. But even on the default, you think you've turned it off, especially on like Samsung phones, it smooths no matter what. And it always just looks a little bit fake to me. I don't know, I get really persnickety about cameras, I guess. I keep using the word persnickety, right?

• 10:46Speaker 02

  No, but I completely understand that sentiment. It always just looks so processed, you know? It makes you like you're in baby mode. It's a weird, it's a weird thing to see when we look at ourselves in the mirror every day. And then we see this completely different image and it looks like we did some kind of Photoshop to fix our face up, you know? Yeah, I can completely understand that. I'm not a huge fan of those either. Whenever there's an opportunity to turn it off, that's like one of the first things I do.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, I mean, also, I can fix it in an editor. I know most people don't really like throw it into a full-on photo editor, but they've gotten so good and so easy now, like Google Photos is actually really great now. They just updated it. That if I want to smooth my face up, I can always get it done after the fact in an editor, you know?

• 11:31Speaker 02

  But maybe, maybe us camera snobs are the wrong ones to that, you know, to really judge. Maybe the average, the average person who, I don't know, has a blemish that they don't want to show, maybe, maybe they appreciate it a little bit more, but.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  Well, reviewing like a phone, reviewing phones is tough because you look at a bunch of Android phones and like a bunch of them are usually going to have the same processor. You know, they're like, a bunch of stuff is really samey and like you can talk about some software differences, but usually the big thing that's different between each phone is the camera. And so you end up spending way more time than you expect on the camera, when really it's not the most important thing on the phone, right?

• 12:07Speaker 02

  Right.

• 12:08Speaker 01

  So we played your clip, we're gonna play my clip, but I gotta, I gotta set it up, all right? They're announcing the, we know they're gonna announce the Nexus 5, it'd leak because everything Google makes leaks, right? And so they call me up, we're having an event, I'm like, cool, we're gonna bring four people, we're gonna live blog it, we're gonna do the Verge thing where we like show up with a huge crew and do a big live blog and then go to a big hands-on, it'll be awesome. They're like, no, no, no, no, no, we're gonna do a really small event for just like maybe 15 journalists. And you only get one person that can come and that's it. And it's not going to be livestreamed, it's just really quiet. Like, uh, no, that sucks. You gotta let me bring somebody. Like, well, look, like, there's this guy that got put in charge of Android not that long ago. And, you know, he just wants, he wants to have a really chill event. His name is Sundar Pichai, okay?

• 12:53Speaker 01

  And so he just wants a really chill event. And so I'm like, okay, fine. But I pushed and I pushed and I pushed. I finally got them to let me bring a video director.

• 13:01Speaker 02

  Nice.

• 13:02Speaker 01

  So it's me and this guy, Christian Mazum. So we show up, they announce the phone. We ask them questions. Everything's fine. Okay, go do a hands on. We're at, I don't know, some Google office in San Francisco or something. Here's what happened. It was just like 15 people and the room was deathly quiet, just utterly quiet, super echoey. And everyone was like doing their thing and working. So he turns the camera on, I start talking and everyone like looks at me. And I'm like, oh, oh, this is awkward. And there is an eight megapixel camera with optical image stabilization. So that should help it take better shots. It has a HDR plus, which does a better HDR shots. We'll see how it goes. Usually Android cameras aren't that impressive.

• 13:40Speaker 02

  Oh, man.

• 13:41Speaker 01

  So this whole video is like maybe a minute and a half tops. And I was so nervous to talk too loudly in that room. I talked really, really quietly and didn't really make my points really well. But here's the thing, because there weren't other camera people there, there was like maybe one other person. This was one of the only videos on the entire internet for like a few days of the Nexus 5. It was just me like whispering to the camera like ASMR style and not actually testing it yet. Not actually putting it through its paces because like I had to do this really fast because I wanted to get it up. Because we were going to be the first.

• 14:14Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 14:15Speaker 01

  And then I say this thing about Android cameras.

• 14:18Speaker 02

  Right, yeah.

• 14:19Speaker 01

  We'll see how it goes. Usually Android cameras aren't that impressive. So back in the day, it was this phone. There was, I think it was like the S3, maybe it was the S4. HTC was just getting good. But what I meant to say was Nexus cameras. Because were Nexus cameras any good before like the Nexus 5X or even the Pixel? They were not, right? They were like not that good. They were fine, but they were not like the central focus of the thing.

• 14:45Speaker 02

  No, it wasn't their strong point.

• 14:47Speaker 01

  Yeah. But the result of this video being the only thing that people could watch about the Nexus. Because people were desperate to get Nexus content was r/Android on Reddit hated me for about three years. Just, I was the guy who hated Android for years. And I founded Android Central. I like Android.

• 15:04Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh. Yeah, I get it. Like you're in the moment, you're just trying to just get something out there.

• 15:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:12Speaker 02

  A little stumble of the words and.

• 15:13Speaker 01

  That's all it takes.

• 15:14Speaker 02

  Oh, that's kind of rough.

• 15:17Speaker 01

  And bezels on the side of the screen are very, very thin. So it's actually relatively comfortable to hold in the hand despite the massive screen. We're going to have a lot more with the Nexus 5 soon, but for now it's just a quick look. Okay, so we finally reviewed the phone. Like, what did you think of the phone? Like, as a phone? Did you think it was any good?

• 15:33Speaker 02

  I liked it, actually. I mean, I liked it. It was, back in the day, it was pretty snappy. Nexus devices were, you know, smooth. It was usually a pretty smooth experience. I think the only thing, I had the bright red version.

• 15:45Speaker 01

  Which was super red. It was like this orangey red, like-

• 15:49Speaker 02

  Exactly. It was like a more of an orange, it was right in the middle. You know, you could see it wear a little bit on the back with the material that it was made out of. But for the most part, I kind of liked it, you know? There was always this point of pride back in the day if you're running stock Android. Like, you know, you're getting the full experience here.

• 16:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:07Speaker 02

  It was nice to have. It's just interesting to see just how things have changed since then.

• 16:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, so one of the dramas when it first released is the camera was actually really bad. I was right. Everyone flipped out, the reviews were terrible. And then six weeks later, Google put out a software update that kind of fixed the camera.

• 16:25Speaker 06

  Google has released the Android 4.4.1 update that brings dramatic improvements to the Nexus 5's camera, including faster focusing, better low light, and less shutter lag. We've tested it ourselves and came away rather impressed.

• 16:38Speaker 01

  By the time the red one came out, the camera was actually like, pretty decent. And now, when we're reviewing, like I was saying before, now when we review phones, like, everyone pays attention way more to the camera. But back then, when we're like, hey, this camera is bad. It was like, oh, wait, people care? Google's like, oh, the camera needs to be good? I didn't know.

• 16:57Speaker 02

  That's funny, now they put all their eggs in that bag, that one bag.

• 17:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, right? Now it's camera or nothing.

• 17:02Speaker 02

  Right.

• 17:03Speaker 01

  I mean, I love that phone. It was, it was my phone for like, that entire year, like 2014. I just kept going back to it.

• 17:11Speaker 02

  Oh, was it the one that stayed in your pocket?

• 17:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was fast enough. I mean, I broke like, three of them. I kept breaking the screen on it for some reason. That was the, like, that screen was really fragile for whatever reason.

• 17:22Speaker 02

  That would break my heart if I, luckily I haven't broken a screen just through normal use yet.

• 17:27Speaker 01

  Really?

• 17:28Speaker 02

  I probably shouldn't have said that out loud.

• 17:33Speaker 02

  Next thing you know, my next phone, Pixel 5, it's gonna happen.

• 17:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:37Speaker 02

  But- Yeah, that's never happened to me. That kind of sucks.

• 17:40Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, it sucks, but it was only 350 bucks, I guess, right?

• 17:43Speaker 02

  Right, exactly.

• 17:44Speaker 01

  But I mean, lots of people walk around with broken phones all the time, you know, lots of people like, do you, you put a case on your phone?

• 17:50Speaker 02

  I absolutely do.

• 17:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I don't.

• 17:52Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 17:53Speaker 01

  I'm crazy.

• 17:54Speaker 02

  You're brave.

• 17:55Speaker 01

  Well, I don't know, I don't leave the house.

• 17:57Speaker 02

  Still.

• 17:58Speaker 01

  Not right now, yeah.

• 17:59Speaker 02

  I still couldn't do it. You stub your toe or something and then boom, that phone pries out your hand.

• 18:04Speaker 01

  I guess. Well, I mean, that's maybe, that's why people maybe don't care that much about camera bumps, right? Because there's always a case on it anyway.

• 18:10Speaker 02

  Right, right, right.

• 18:11Speaker 01

  All right. One more thing before we take a break. I played my embarrassing video. I think it's only fair that we play one of your early videos. Is this okay?

• 18:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. That, this, this video guts me.

• 18:26Speaker 02

  Hey guys, this is your average consumer. And today I have a little video for you guys because all about Mac 27, wanted to see a comparison between the beat mixers, the solo CDs and um, I don't have the studio, so I can't compare those. But I do happen to have the beat. It sounded like someone was, had a gun to my head and told me to make the video.

• 18:50Speaker 01

  I mean, my video sounded like a hostage negotiation. Like I was on the, they've got me, they've got me trapped. I'm here stuck here, the Nexus 5, they're gonna kill me.

• 18:59Speaker 02

  It's rough to watch that one because it's just like they're, I'm completely void of energy. There's just, and you know, it, just looking back at it, there's just so little effort. It's just, just me, just, just talking. And it's so funny because I forgot that a comment, that was like my third, fourth video, I think.

• 19:19Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 19:19Speaker 02

  And I was so small back then that a single comment could drive me to make an entire video.

• 19:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:26Speaker 02

  So that's kind of how that video happened. And um, just looking back at it, even the way it's edited, I thought I was fancy. I had my regular camera, a webcam fired up. I, I tried to put the, I put the webcam footage over my normal camera's footage and you can still see the sides of my other, my HD camera versus the four by three on the webcam.

• 19:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:49Speaker 02

  Horrible editing, low and no energy. It's just at the beginning.

• 19:53Speaker 01

  On the other hand, when you're getting started on something like YouTube, like you, you had the headphones you had, right? You're like, I didn't have this other one, but like you work with what you got. You do your best, you talk to the camera, you, you try something, right? Like if, if I'm doing, I'm trying to learn some more camera skills. I'm definitely not a YouTuber, but every single time I make a video, I try and do one thing, like one new thing, a camera technique, or like try and be more, have higher energy, or whatever, like I work on one thing for each video, like this video, I'm going to get better. I'm not, I don't try and like be perfect all at once. And so the fact that you were trying to switch between, you know, your webcam and your HD cam, like you should give yourself more credit, man. That's great.

• 20:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I mean, all that has led to, you know, just what I know now, just practicing. It's always good to, I like your strategy, just at least give one thing a go every single time, just, just get better and better and better.

• 20:45Speaker 01

  Well, you know what? That's a great place to take a break and we should actually talk about what it's like to make tech YouTube videos now that, you know, we know what we're doing.

• 20:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 20:57Speaker 07

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• 21:26Speaker 01

  We're back. You know what? I'm sure that you get asked this all the time, but you're a big YouTuber. You got a, you got a 3 million subscribers. How did you get your start? Did you jump? I'm assuming you didn't jump full time right away. So what was your progression from, I want to make some tech YouTube videos to your average consumer now today?

• 21:43Speaker 02

  Okay. So for me, it pretty much started, I think my senior year of college.

• 21:48Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 21:48Speaker 02

  I was watching a lot of tech videos. Smartphones were fresh. I was following pretty heavily. I think channels like PhoneDog back in the day.

• 21:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, Noah.

• 21:59Speaker 02

  Techno Buffalo, Noah was my man.

• 22:01Speaker 08

  Hey, what's going on everybody? I'm Noah from PhoneDog.com and this is the Google Nexus One. In a word, this is the best Android phone you can buy right now. At least in the United States.

• 22:09Speaker 02

  I watched these guys and I just love it. I was learning so much. I always had a love for technology, but it's not something I really had. I was able to use and have, get my hands on all the time. So I was, it was all, I was just soaking it in through YouTube. And after some time, I felt like, you know what? I bought a couple of Android devices. And I was like, you know what? One day, I, I think I can do this too. I think I can make some videos. But I remember having to go back and watch those videos, hear what they were talking about, and having to do research. It's like, I have no idea what this processor means or what that thing does. I'm gonna go research it. And I learned. But when I wanted to do my videos, I was like, alright, I want it to be super easy. I don't want anyone watching

• 22:52Speaker 02

  my videos to have to go and do extra research like I did.

• 22:55Speaker 01

  Right.

• 22:56Speaker 02

  So I was like, alright, I'll call it your average consumer. Cause that's who I'm gonna be talking to. Just regular videos. Like you walk away knowing it's fast. It does this. It does that. Not super spec heavy. You'll just know your end experience. And

• 23:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 23:12Speaker 02

  You know, I just started making terrible videos as you, as you saw. And it, uh, I was driven by commenters who said, hey, we wanna see this. We wanna see that. It helped me to just keep going. And they just, from there, became what it became, you know? But that's, that's how I got my start. Just wanting to do the same thing I saw so many other people doing and I fell in love with and just do it on, you know, an easier level.

• 23:40Speaker 01

  One of the things I love about your videos is you never take for granted that people know what a thing is, or that, like, people don't wanna see it. So, I don't know, like, just like the thing that really struck me, uh, you showed off wireless Dex on the Note 20 Ultra.

• 23:55Speaker 02

  I'm gonna turn on Dex. And what's cool is that it works with mini smart TVs. As you can see, I've got an LG TV that I set it up with before. And you know, Samsung LG, they're not exactly buddies. We're gonna start this.

• 24:09Speaker 01

  And you're like, here's what it is. Here's how it works. This is really cool. And I'm like, you know what? That is really cool. And I like, didn't even talk about it because like, oh, Dex was on the S20. So everybody knows that. And like, that's not true at all. Like, you actually do need to show the thing, even if it's old hat to me or to you. It actually is really cool and you should show it. And like, I love that you always, always do that on every new thing.

• 24:32Speaker 02

  Thank you. Yeah, I think it's so easy for us to be a little jaded, you know? Ah, that's clearly a gimmick. Eh, we've seen that before. And even though things might come off as a gimmick for us, for someone who doesn't, who's not in the world, they're just like, oh, my phone can do this? I had no idea. I just needed to send a text message or browse the internet. But there's so much more power there sometimes that people just don't know about.

• 24:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, and it's, you also don't need to always treat it as like, well, you, should you buy this thing or not because of this one feature? It's like, you buy the thing or not if it's good, but if you do get it, you should know about this one cool feature. It's like a nice thing that's extra on it. It might not drive your purchasing decision, but not every feature needs to do that, right?

• 25:13Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 25:14Speaker 01

  Okay. So the other thing that I love about your channel that I'm actually kind of jealous of is most, I do like hands-on videos. I'll do reviews. And if I want to do like a video essay, I'll make a processor video. It's like, I have a deep thought about the future of computers, but I've got a whole other job. So that's about all I have time for. But you have just a ton of different formats that you make. You've got some really cool like haul unboxings. You've got these day in the life videos that I love.

• 25:38Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 25:39Speaker 01

  You know, you've got the reviews, you've got like your home tours. How do you decide, you know, wake up in the morning, you want to make a video, you got a new thing in your hand? How do you decide what like, what format to choose when you're making a video? Cause you can do so much more than just hands-on or review.

• 25:53Speaker 02

  Okay. So for me, I think it all depends on obviously like the product. So sometimes if it's a product that I think, if it's something I think a lot of people will be interested in, I feel like they're going to want to know. Like the nitty gritty.

• 26:06Speaker 01

  Right.

• 26:06Speaker 02

  You know, so a real day in the life for flagship devices. Listen, you'll know exactly what you're getting out of this. It makes sense. And if it's something that they might not know about, I'll try and do something a little bit more creative. Maybe, you know, just something that may not draw their attention just based on the name of the product itself. But like, let's say it's a lesser known product. I'll try to spin it as something like an interesting just video in general, like video format. And try to just piece it in there.

• 26:35Speaker 01

  Right.

• 26:35Speaker 02

  Just so people can get their eyes on it and then be exposed to something new, you know? So if it's like, I don't know, a list of tech that I didn't expect to love.

• 26:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:44Speaker 02

  You know, it's a nice time for people to just see, oh, okay. So there are these products out there that I probably wouldn't pay attention to. And, you know, it kind of fits in like that.

• 26:53Speaker 01

  Right.

• 26:53Speaker 02

  But yeah, we try so many different things. We know what the, I guess our audience likes. We know what they really engage with. And, um, you know, it's just a matter of finding what products, you know, kind of just best fit that those formats. And we have our staples, uh, but sometimes we try to go out of the box with that too.

• 27:12Speaker 01

  So the other thing that you do, like your house, your family, congratulations.

• 27:16Speaker 02

  Thank you, thank you.

• 27:17Speaker 01

  Like, but they're all characters in the video. Like I, I feel like I, like I'm looking at you on our chat. I'm looking at like, I watch you make videos. I watch you do a bunch of unboxings right behind where you are. What's it like making the place where you live like a character in your videos?

• 27:32Speaker 02

  So that's actually something that's been, I guess, pretty intentional.

• 27:36Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:36Speaker 02

  Uh, cause I, we have a studio as well, but we have studios in like an apartment, you know, like a separate apartment. Cause I wanted to have like that kind of homey vibe.

• 27:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 27:47Speaker 02

  I like the idea of being guy next door, like the guy you can just come up to, ask him about tech, very casual. I don't want anyone to feel like, oh, Judd is this stuffy guy who he just stands in front of the camera and spits everything out at you. Nah, I'll let you into my world. That's why I do the real day in the life. I try to, I try to have things in my home or try to have like a home setting. So people can kind of view themselves in the situations or the, the way I present the videos.

• 28:16Speaker 01

  True.

• 28:16Speaker 02

  And having, having friends and, you know, family involved too. It just makes it all the better because not only can I be more of myself in front of the camera. But, you know, it adds entertainment and it also adds a layer of. Like getting other people's opinions in as well. So there's just like so many good benefits to just having family and friends and even just like a setting that feels welcoming.

• 28:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, I love that. That's totally true. I wish I could do more of that, but my apartment's too small. I'm in a closet right now. Okay, sorry. We were supposed to be talking about the Nexus 5. I totally took us way off track. So we talked about how like tech YouTube has changed. The Nexus 5 came out in this really weird context. Google wasn't making its own hardware yet. And I feel like this is like 2013, 2014. The smartphone world still felt like it was wide open.

• 29:10Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 29:10Speaker 01

  Samsung hadn't taken over. HTC was still really popular. Nokia, like they were still making Windows phones.

• 29:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:19Speaker 01

  Like, I kind of miss those days a little bit.

• 29:21Speaker 02

  It was a very different world. If, like you said, it was a lot more open. There was so much variety and everyone was coming in with this one feature or this one thing that kind of separated them from the rest.

• 29:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:34Speaker 02

  It's a little bit, quite a bit different now.

• 29:37Speaker 01

  Well, it's like everyone sort of figured out what the core stuff is and they're competing on sort of the same thing. But so we were talking about the HTC one, that's Boom Sound, right? So you, when you were going out there, you could go, HTC had this thing that was all metal. It had front-facing speakers. And then it had this wacky 4-megapixel camera. It was like the ultra pixels.

• 29:56Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 29:56Speaker 01

  Because they figured out that if you have big pixels, you can bring in more light. And they're like, this is it. This is the one. It's like, well, the camera quality actually was.

• 30:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. In theory, it sounded great.

• 30:09Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then there was this Lumia 1020 and there was a 920 before that. Do you remember they were, they were Windows phones and then they had just massive.

• 30:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, those big sensors.

• 30:20Speaker 09

  With the Lumia 1020. You will see things you've never seen before. An entirely new ultra-high resolution, 41-megapixel, backside illuminated sensor. The 41-megapixel sensor.

• 30:34Speaker 01

  I kind of think that we are maybe entering another round, hopefully, of weird experiments and not just everybody competing on who can have the best low-light camera performance.

• 30:45Speaker 02

  Absolutely.

• 30:46Speaker 01

  Are you keeping up on, like, I guess it's folding phones, right, is the thing?

• 30:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm immediately thinking of like, what is it, the LG Wing?

• 30:52Speaker 10

  And this is the LG Wing. Yeah, I know, looking at the pictures, it looks weird and wild, but LG's done a great job.

• 30:59Speaker 01

  Oh, man, what do you think of that thing? That thing is wild.

• 31:02Speaker 02

  I haven't seen it in person yet, and I have so many questions in terms of just like how it is to actually use it on a day-to-day basis.

• 31:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:10Speaker 10

  And just flipping it open and closed is incredibly nice. It's also way thinner and lighter than you would expect from something with two screens and a weird flipping hinge like this.

• 31:20Speaker 02

  I think it's the most out-there design we've seen so far.

• 31:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:24Speaker 02

  Like, folding phones, you know, we get it, it makes sense, but flipping...

• 31:29Speaker 01

  Twisty whatever, yeah.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  I know, it's crazy, so we are starting to see experiments because, I don't want to say smartphones have plateaued, kind of plateaued in terms of like just features and new things that we'll see come to them. So now, this experiment of adding extra screens or expanding screens, it's really taking over.

• 31:52Speaker 01

  The other thing that was different in that era, and we should actually talk about this with the Nexus 5, is Google had this Nexus strategy where they didn't make the phones themselves. They went to like different manufacturers every year and said, "Make us a phone," and they did it so that they could just make a new version of Android and like show off what, how this new processor could work or whatever. But now, we have this Pixel strategy. How do you think that's going?

• 32:14Speaker 02

  I don't know. It was interesting because back in the day, who'd they have for the Nexus 5? LG?

• 32:19Speaker 01

  That was LG.

• 32:21Speaker 02

  I remember every time a Pixel came out, I mean, a Nexus came out, I was always waiting for my favorite manufacturer to get the nod.

• 32:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:29Speaker 02

  I always wanted to see HTC, like, is HTC gonna make a comeback on the Nexus?

• 32:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:33Speaker 02

  Which I think, I like that Google has taken over. I think it means there's, you know, more control and we're not seeing a second device somewhere out there that looks exactly like it, but with different software.

• 32:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't know if people remember this, but the Nexus was always basically based on another phone that the company already made. And so you kind of knew that this was just like the Google version of whatever the other, other, was it like the G3 for the Nexus 5? I can't remember.

• 32:59Speaker 02

  I don't remember either. Oh, it's possible, though. It might be like the G3.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:03Speaker 02

  What did he call those versions of Android? I mean, those phones that always had just like a stock version of Android.

• 33:09Speaker 01

  The Google Play Edition.

• 33:10Speaker 02

  Yes, the Play Edition.

• 33:12Speaker 01

  And that, that came like right around that time. And so you could get the, the stock version of it. Cause back in the day, we, we thought of it as a stock version. It was technically still like, it was the Google version. It wasn't pure stock Android, but you could get something without TouchWiz on it because TouchWiz was way too much back then, right? It was, it was so much stuff.

• 33:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was like my least favorite, I would say. And having that option was so cool. But either way, I digress.

• 33:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, sorry.

• 33:41Speaker 02

  I do like that Google has taken it on themselves. Having made the best choices in terms of like design, all that, and who knows? That's up to each person to decide, but I, I still like it being in-house. You know, I feel like it's, it gives them more control, whether or not they choose to exercise, you know, really listening to feedback and implementing that, you know? But I do like the strategy. I feel like we've seen Microsoft do a really good job of that with their hardware.

• 34:11Speaker 01

  On the surface, like the laptop stuff.

• 34:13Speaker 02

  Exactly, laptops.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Tablets.

• 34:15Speaker 02

  Just seeing them like, all right, you know, we're going to take this in-house, start making our own things. And, you know, we've seen pretty good success for them. So I like the idea as just a matter of like execute.

• 34:27Speaker 01

  Well, so I like, I agree with you. I like the idea because you, Google gets to make what it definitely wants to make. Right? It's not, oh, well, this year the Nexus is not so good because it, you know, they, they based it on the bat, the wrong phone this year. Right?

• 34:39Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 34:39Speaker 01

  The Nexus 6 was a Huawei phone. It had all sorts of bugs. So now like what Google makes, like it, Google's responsible for, right? There's nobody else to blame, but it also means that there's nobody else to blame, right?

• 34:50Speaker 02

  Yeah. Yeah. And I, I, I love Google. Don't get me wrong. I'm not, I love the Pixel devices. But one thing I feel like we see manufacturers kind of learn and, you know, change things up a bit. I feel like the Pixel's learning curve has been like not the best.

• 35:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 35:10Speaker 02

  Just, just from the hardware perspective, it's just, we, I feel like I haven't been wowed by the hardware in a while.

• 35:15Speaker 01

  Right. So this is, my take on it is they're really conservative right now. So actually the Pixel 5 is the perfect example of this. They went back to a fingerprint sensor, but everybody else, Samsung has been doing in-screen fingerprint sensors. OnePlus has been doing in-screen fingerprint sensors. It's like, it's a whole thing. Google didn't. So part of it is cost savings. But part of it and their, their explanation for it is, well, the one on the back is a thousand percent reliable and it's faster. And they're not wrong. Like I do still have a little bit of lag sometimes, even on like a super fast, hot Samsung phone hitting that fingerprint sensor under the screen. But it's like not exciting.

• 35:53Speaker 02

  Right.

• 35:53Speaker 01

  Is the, the TikTok there.

• 35:55Speaker 02

  Exactly. And honestly, I'm not with you mentioning that. I'm, I remember liking having a fingerprint sensor in the back. It's just so funny how, how our opinions can change over time because of the way the market goes. But I really enjoyed having a fingerprint sensor in the back because you could just pick up your phone and like the second you pick it up, your, your finger can directly go on to the sensor and your phone is unlocked. It's a pretty quick and easy experience, honestly. Still, it's still so weird to see them take a step back.

• 36:23Speaker 01

  So with the Nexus 5, they came in at that 350 price point. They had done it with the Pixel or the Pixel, the Nexus 4. Uh, and so it was they, they were a little bit cheaper than everybody else. All phones were cheaper back then. But they were they were cheaper than everybody else. There wasn't a lot of competition at that price point at that quality. So the Nexus 5, one of the reasons I loved it is it was cheaper than everybody else, but equal quality. But now with the Pixel 5, there's a lot more competition this year, right, than they had with the Nexus 5. There's the there's the OnePlus 8 out there that's relatively cheap. 8 Pro can sometimes be that same price. The Samsung 20 FE, it's got the faster processor, it's got like three cameras on it. There's an iPhone 11 that's the same price and the iPhone 12 is

• 37:06Speaker 01

  going to be, who knows, probably around that same price. What do you think of like the landscape that they're putting this mid-range Pixel 5 in?

• 37:13Speaker 02

  It's competitive, you know, it's really competitive right now. And I feel like they went down to weight class, but that weight class is kind of stacked too, you know. It's not just like bringing down the price. You're not competing with flagships anymore. There's, there's a whole group of phones in that area now. And it's going to be a tough battle because in the phone department, there are some really big names out there like Samsung and, you know, Apple. So it's, it's not going to be any easier. I liked the direction, but it would have been cooler to see things like, to see those flagship specs or, you know, sort of flagship specs at that price point, you know, seeing

• 37:54Speaker 02

  the Snapdragon 865 or something in there rather than the 765. Being able to have those things and kind of call it like, hey, Google just slashing prices. That's, that's a more interesting story, you know. But I mean, it's still, and if it had like 120 Hz, you know, those just, just those features that we expect from the flagship, if they were able to bring that down, then we're, you know, we're able to compete.

• 38:18Speaker 01

  That's actually like the central conflict of the Pixels. Who pays attention to the Pixel? Like really, truly, who knows what the Pixel? Tech nerds, right? People that are like really into phones and tech and Android are like, oh yeah, I know about the Pixel. I know what that means. I know, people know that Google makes a phone now or whatever, but like the people that are really paying attention are the people that know the difference and what might care about the difference between a 90 Hz and 120 Hz screen. So they're making a phone for the masses, but the only people paying attention to them Are people that are into tech and that's a really hard thing for them to deal with.

• 38:48Speaker 02

  And people in that category, that market is looking so heavily at those numbers.

• 38:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, and they're super informed.

• 38:56Speaker 02

  Exactly. And even if the numbers don't tell the entire story, or they don't, you know, exactly dictate the experience, that audience is super driven by those numbers like insanely. So it does make it a lot tougher because people will just look at it on paper and just say, hey, this, I mean, this one plus Nord over here has a 40 something megapixel camera, 30 something megapixel, like, you know, it just makes it really, really tough.

• 39:22Speaker 01

  Well, lucky for everybody, there are YouTube channels like Your Average Consumer that will tell the people about the specs and about the numbers so they understand them, but also talk about the actual experience of the thing, if it's any good, and if the average consumer should want it. Where can people find you if they want to go looking for you?

• 39:39Speaker 02

  YouTube, I mean, actually anywhere. You can find me on all social media. Just type in Your Average Consumer and I'll pop up.

• 39:45Speaker 01

  All right, man. Well, appreciate you coming on the podcast and I'll be waiting for your Pixel 5 review.

• 39:50Speaker 02

  Sounds good, man. Can't wait to see yours too.

• 39:54Speaker 01

  Thanks so much for General R for coming on the show. Like he said, you can find him on YouTube. He's at YourAverageConsumer. That is U R A V G Consumer. I am on Twitter. I'm at @Backlon. And actually, if you wouldn't mind tweeting at me or even shoot me an email, [email protected], let me know what you think of these Tuesday episodes. Is there anything like to change? Are there any products you definitely want us to talk about? Really curious to get your feedback. Next week, we have a new guest. I'm very excited to say we're going to have Marques Brownlee. You know him as MKBHD, so tune in for that.

• 40:27Speaker 11

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