Ikecheck

We've captured lightning in a bottle this week. We somehow managed to record The Vergecast in the brief moments between the Arizonan llamas and the white-gold-blue-black dress debate. It was a moment of clarity, a calm we didn't know we should have savored. Journey back with us to that simpler time, and hear Nilay Patel, Dieter Bohn, Chris Ziegler, and Sam Sheffer weigh in on the FCC's net neutrality ruling, the price of an Apple Watch, the upcoming Galaxy S 6, and the classic 1992 romantic thriller, The Bodyguard. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Nilay Patel?

  This episode of The Vergecast is brought to you by Squarespace. Squarespace is the easiest way to create a beautiful website, blog, or online store for you and your ideas. Squarespace features an elegant interface, beautiful templates, and incredible 24/7 customer support. This is me shouting out Ellis Hamburger because he's going to tweet this at me. Try Squarespace at Squarespace.com and enter offer code VERGE at checkout to get 10% off. Squarespace, build it beautiful, Ellis.

• 0:30Nilay Patel?

  Hey, everybody. Welcome to The Vergecast, where everyone has different ideas about what the tagline should be. On this piece, on this piece of paper is what I was going to say.

• 0:39Speaker 01

  Piece of paper?

• 0:40Nilay Patel?

  Not paper.

• 0:41Speaker 01

  Verizon typed out for you?

• 0:42Nilay Patel?

  Verizon, yeah. It's written, it's like a commentary track for theverge.com.

• 0:46Speaker 01

  It's been that for a month and you just never read.

• 0:49Nilay Patel?

  Well, you should change it every time.

• 0:50Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 0:51Nilay Patel?

  Hi, I'm Neelai Patel.

• 0:52Speaker 02

  I'm Dieter Bone. And I'm Chris Siggler.

• 0:54Nilay Patel?

  Hey!

• 0:55Speaker 02

  I'm here too. I'm Sam Shepard. How's it going?

• 0:58Nilay Patel?

  What? Sam, Sam's feeling feisty today, man. Got his big policy win under his belt?

• 1:05Speaker 01

  Yeah. We won.

• 1:07Nilay Patel?

  So, we should get right into it. So, this is Vergecast.

• 1:10Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:11Nilay Patel?

  I realized that for like years of this show, the years that The Vergecast existed and previously, the Engadget podcast, we would announce what week it was. And we just haven't done that since rebooting the show.

• 1:21Speaker 02

  They're going to miss it.

• 1:22Nilay Patel?

  I don't know. Not one person has mentioned it. I was listening to an old show and I was like, there was like a whole thing that we did where I was like, it's the week of whatever day it is. Like Josh and I would like, we'd both scramble to figure out what day, what week it was. And I just stopped doing it.

• 1:35Speaker 02

  Why don't you get into like a fiscal week or something? For fiscal week 14.

• 1:43Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I mean, it's, just so you know, I'm going to tell you that it's the week of February 23rd. Please let me know if that information is useful to you. And if it's not, we'll just stop doing it.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  So, February 23rd, assuming you're a week starts on Monday kind of person, which you should be because that's the only way to do it.

• 1:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, who whose week starts on Sunday?

• 1:59Nilay Patel?

  Everybody thinks the week starts on Sunday.

• 2:01Speaker 02

  No, no, no. Sunday is a day of sadness.

• 2:03Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 2:03Speaker 02

  Sunday is the like a day of mourning.

• 2:06Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 2:06Speaker 02

  For the weekend.

• 2:07Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 2:07Speaker 02

  For the week gone by.

• 2:08Nilay Patel?

  And then you.

• 2:08Speaker 02

  Monday you begin a new.

• 2:09Nilay Patel?

  You you you pick up from your your your hangover. And then you feel bad that you're gonna have to work and then you get over like, you know what? It's okay. I'm ready to face it. And then you realize you're not, and then you crater even further.

• 2:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:21Nilay Patel?

  And then you get drunk again.

• 2:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:23Nilay Patel?

  And then you go into work on Monday.

• 2:24Speaker 02

  Becky refers to this as having the Sundays.

• 2:26Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 2:26Speaker 02

  She will mournfully look at me like basically every Sunday be like, I have the Sundays. And we don't speak for like five hours.

• 2:32Nilay Patel?

  It's a beautiful marriage, I have to say.

• 2:34Speaker 02

  I know.

• 2:35Nilay Patel?

  We're really in love. A ridiculous amount of news is we should get right into it. So happily, as it happens, the FCC scheduled their open internet hearing today on a Vergecast day. I'd like to thank Tom Wheeler for his support. You can mention offer code VERGE to get 10% off, Tom Wheeler. No, so the open air, we were live logging it. We did a really fun thing kind of by accident where Addy was there at the FCC meeting room.

• 3:04Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 3:04Nilay Patel?

  TC was smoking dude at home. I was here in the office and we all live logged it together, which is really fun. Cause it is boring.

• 3:12Speaker 02

  Is this the first three location live blog we've done?

• 3:15Nilay Patel?

  I think so. It was wild. So we live live this morning. We have a bunch of news on the site.

• 3:18Speaker 01

  Addy took amazing photos.

• 3:20Nilay Patel?

  Addy took amazing photos.

• 3:21Speaker 01

  Picture of FCC commissioner Ajit Pai drinking from the Reese's.

• 3:24Speaker 02

  Oh, my God. The world's largest mug.

• 3:26Nilay Patel?

  With and just look at him.

• 3:27Speaker 02

  He looks like a frogging.

• 3:29Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 3:29Speaker 02

  Sorry.

• 3:30Nilay Patel?

  That's none of my business. That's what he was saying. Chris, why don't you run us to the FCC news and then I will start ranting.

• 3:37Speaker 02

  Well, the FCC news is that we are now under a new. This podcast is being brought to you under a new regulatory regime.

• 3:44Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 3:44Speaker 02

  Which is very exciting.

• 3:46Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 3:46Speaker 02

  The internet is now free and open. Before it was, it was a nightmare, dystopian nightmare where Comcast decided that you couldn't see the verge.

• 3:53Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 3:54Speaker 02

  But now everything is different. Everything is better.

• 3:56Nilay Patel?

  Everything is different. Now we live under King Obama's regulatory oppression.

• 4:02Speaker 01

  In this new age of internet, the only thing you're allowed to look at are llamas.

• 4:08Nilay Patel?

  Oh, man, that's actually the biggest news of the day.

• 4:10Speaker 02

  It really is.

• 4:10Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, so, so the world is different now, is what you're saying.

• 4:13Speaker 02

  Yes, Title II regulation, which we, you know, we have an encyclopedic backlog of news to sort of bring you up to speed on exactly what that means. But the long and short of it is that the FCC wants to make sure that there's no prioritization on the internet, meaning no fast lanes, no slow lanes. A company can't prioritize one content provider's content over another. And everything is wonderful.

• 4:39Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I mean, this hearing was theater of the highest order, right?

• 4:43Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 4:44Nilay Patel?

  So we all knew it was gonna happen. Let me set some stage for you. Is that a phrase? Let me set some stage for you. No, it's let's, let's set the stage, not some stage.

• 4:56Nilay Patel?

  Let me do a shoddy job of setting the stage. So, complete theater, top to bottom, right? So Clyburn, Commissioner Clyburn, Commissioner Rosenmercel, and Chairman Wheeler all come out. They're all wearing like royal blue.

• 5:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, they all come out a little bit earlier, like exactly on time.

• 5:15Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 5:15Speaker 01

  And sit down.

• 5:16Nilay Patel?

  They, they hold hands and then they sit down.

• 5:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, to thunderous applause.

• 5:20Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, it was just very strange. And Wheeler's like, oh, history will never believe that we didn't coordinate this.

• 5:26Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:26Nilay Patel?

  Because no one believes them.

• 5:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:28Nilay Patel?

  Because what the hell, like you're holding hands.

• 5:30Speaker 02

  Well, blue is the color of freedom and the open internet.

• 5:33Nilay Patel?

  And the Democrats.

• 5:34Speaker 02

  It's true.

• 5:36Nilay Patel?

  So then they sit down and then there's like, actually, let me rewind. First, we turn on the live stream in the office.

• 5:42Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 5:43Nilay Patel?

  The live stream, the holding screen for the live screen, like, please wait, we're starting soon, is, I kid you not, it is a red to white to blue gradient that was like shoddily made in Photoshop.

• 5:53Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 5:54Nilay Patel?

  And like, in impact font, it says like, we will be starting soon, the FCC, like.

• 5:59Speaker 02

  Like the meme font.

• 5:59Nilay Patel?

  Like the meme font. And then there's just funk music playing.

• 6:04Speaker 01

  It's the Menahan Street Band, a Brooklyn-based group that formed in 2007.

• 6:10Nilay Patel?

  I just want you, it's like, it was like, what, 9:30 in the morning or whatever when we turned it on? Just imagine being in an office where, you know, a group of reporters is watching an FCC hearing and I receive. A note from somebody like across the office that says, please turn down your jams. Wrote back, I was like, these aren't jams, like, we're about to cover an FCC here.

• 6:35Nilay Patel?

  So funky music playing, they walk in, they're holding hands, thunderous applause. Then Commissioner Pi and Commissioner O'Reilly walk in. Commissioner O'Reilly still refuses to explain why he spells his name so badly. Just imagine, close your eyes and imagine how you spell the words O'Reilly and then mess it up.

• 6:50Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 6:51Speaker 01

  I think he wants us to pronounce it O'Reilly.

• 6:54Nilay Patel?

  I'm sure he would. So they sit down. And we get through the first thing on the agenda, which is actually really important.

• 7:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, municipal broadband.

• 7:01Nilay Patel?

  And so that, you know, the FCC is saying states can't write laws that prevent cities from starting their own broadband. It's a big deal. But like, whatever, like, they get through it, just like, that, it's, it's like, they, you know.

• 7:13Speaker 02

  It's a weird thing to power through in any other FCC meeting, it would be the biggest item on the agenda.

• 7:18Nilay Patel?

  Right. But here. Powered through it.

• 7:19Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, there was, there was a little bit of like, let's just talk for a while.

• 7:24Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Yeah, there was like the history of constitutional law.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 7:28Nilay Patel?

  From Pi. And it was like, I, I said this in the live blog, but it's like, you, when you go to law school, everybody wants to take con law, like, that's, that's where the hotshot professors are, like, arguing in front of the Supreme Court and like, you know, you dream that you're gonna go argue in front of, that's like, why are you gonna go to law school? I'm gonna save the First Amendment. And then you take like a con law class and it's that lecture that Pi was giving. And you're like, you know, there's just a lot more money, like, working for an oil company or something. I'm out. Who's that contracts class? So they, they powered through municipal broadband. The three to two, another party line vote.

• 8:04Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 8:05Nilay Patel?

  Three to two, Democrats say the FCC is gonna preempt these state laws, prohibit municipal broadband. And then there's like a pause. And like, literally commit, they're all tweeting on the stage. Like, literally, Chris is tweeting with Commissioner Rosenwessel.

• 8:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:18Nilay Patel?

  Adjutary Pi is like, favoring Chris, and actually, they're only tweeting at you.

• 8:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, they, they, yeah, he faved my tweet and then, uh, Rosenwessel, um, I didn't even mention her, I just said, it looks like each commissioner has their own craft of coffee, which is pretty dope. And she's like, actually, it's water.

• 8:37Nilay Patel?

  Fact check, it's breaking my heart.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  Does the official FCC account still follow you?

• 8:42Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 8:42Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 8:43Speaker 02

  Yeah. Thanks to Eli.

• 8:44Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 8:45Speaker 02

  He hooked that up.

• 8:47Nilay Patel?

  What a sad thing to hook up.

• 8:51Nilay Patel?

  Well, I'm brokenhearted because I have a crush on Commissioner Rose, myself, but she won't pay attention to me. She only pays attention to me.

• 8:56Speaker 02

  She's, she's a lovely, actually, all kidding aside, I think that she's, she's the power broker.

• 9:02Nilay Patel?

  She's absolutely the powerhouse.

• 9:05Speaker 01

  The city municipal wifi, she's like broadband barnstorming?

• 9:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, she's folksy.

• 9:10Speaker 01

  Barn raising.

• 9:11Nilay Patel?

  She's got the charm.

• 9:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 9:13Nilay Patel?

  She is like, she's, when I was first trying to speak on that neutrality, she's like, let me do something revolutionary. I'm not going to say a lot.

• 9:23Nilay Patel?

  Just, just a phenomenal human being and good votes in that neutrality.

• 9:28Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 9:28Nilay Patel?

  Anyway, so they start.

• 9:31Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 9:31Nilay Patel?

  So they start with, who do they start with? Clyburn?

• 9:34Speaker 01

  Uh, yes.

• 9:35Nilay Patel?

  Yes. And so Clyburn, when she starts talking about neutrality, makes it about, I would say like about history, right? So she's like, we're doing this, because when I say it's theater, it is actually theater. Like, everybody knows how they're going to vote.

• 9:48Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 9:48Nilay Patel?

  The proposal, they've all read it.

• 9:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, they, they weren't talking, they weren't, they were like, the vote that is happening today, the, the way that we are voting, like from get go, everybody knew exactly what the vote was going to be and talked about it.

• 10:00Nilay Patel?

  Right. And then we, we found out, Addie, like, did some reporting yesterday and found out that they're not allowed to meet privately in groups larger than two, because they need to negotiate and like, per the sunshine and government law, they have to like negotiate out in the open.

• 10:14Speaker 01

  In the open, yeah.

• 10:15Nilay Patel?

  But like, there was no negotiation. Addie had this line, it's like, if you take five people, no matter who they are, and force them to sit in a room and talk about each other without talking to each other, there's no way it's going to look like they like each other.

• 10:29Speaker 02

  There was more passive aggre, no, just flat out aggression in that room.

• 10:32Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 10:33Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 10:33Speaker 02

  Than I've seen in a long time.

• 10:34Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, so Clyburn starts, she's like, this is history, like, this is about voices, there's, Chad Dickerson, the CEO of Etsy, talked, and he's like, there's so much participation, our sellers, who are like mostly women and people who work at home, like, they, they're passionate about this issue. Clyburn was like, this is, we're, you know, she was like, this is about justice and speech. Rosen Rossell, very short, she's like, and between, after all of these, weirdly, Wheeler would pop in, it's like, and Tom Wheeler would be like, good job. It was very strange. Rosen Rossell gave a brief thing, like, this is what we have to do, we can't take a backseat. And Wheeler's like, you know, you edited out how cool you are. You're the best. That was some real leadership.

• 11:18Nilay Patel?

  Like, it was just weird, like, just a weird scene.

• 11:20Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 11:21Nilay Patel?

  And then Pi, who's a post, and he's like, way off.

• 11:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, for a long time.

• 11:27Speaker 01

  I definitely got two cups of tea during his, uh, his speech.

• 11:31Speaker 02

  He was going on for a while.

• 11:33Speaker 01

  And, oh, two cups of tea and wrote a blog post and like, organized some travel.

• 11:40Speaker 02

  And then at the end of all that, Wheeler.

• 11:42Speaker 01

  No, no, no, we're not, the best part about the Pi's thing is in the middle of, in the middle of his huge, long rant, uh, Apple, like, steals the spotlight for a while.

• 11:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, Apple, Apple got, got bored with stealing the spotlight from actual tech companies, so now they're just trolling the government.

• 12:02Speaker 02

  Uh, but yeah, so, so Pi finishes and then Wheeler's like, so, uh, which way are you voting? Is, are you unsure? Like, he just straight up trolls him.

• 12:11Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah, no, I gotta read some of his pie quotes, because the Pi part of it was like, it was like a medley of other people's political one-liners.

• 12:20Speaker 01

  Oh, yes.

• 12:22Nilay Patel?

  He, he, oh, he, he quoted Barry Goldwater. That was the, if you let the nose of the camel into the tent, the whole camel goes into the tent. First, I looked it up on Wikipedia, it's been around since the 1850s, but it's been around politically only since Barry Goldwater.

• 12:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:35Nilay Patel?

  Which.

• 12:36Speaker 02

  I mean, that's.

• 12:36Nilay Patel?

  It's still a long, I mean, I'm just saying, like, it's just, there was like, first, there was a competition, so you could be the folksiest.

• 12:41Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 12:42Nilay Patel?

  So like, they were all saying things like, that dog don't hunt. And then Rosen Rossell was like, I, barnstorming.

• 12:47Speaker 01

  He quoted, he quoted Reagan.

• 12:48Nilay Patel?

  He quoted, wait.

• 12:49Speaker 03

  The only thing we have to fear.

• 12:51Speaker 01

  That's not Reagan.

• 12:52Speaker 02

  That's, yeah.

• 12:54Speaker 01

  Reagan possible.

• 12:56Nilay Patel?

  Well, yeah, that's actually really.

• 12:58Speaker 01

  Well, okay.

• 12:59Nilay Patel?

  I've checked Reagan.

• 13:00Speaker 01

  I've checked Reagan.

• 13:01Speaker 02

  Good president.

• 13:03Nilay Patel?

  Reagan is like four presidents. This is dangerous territory.

• 13:06Speaker 03

  I was very far away removed from Reagan.

• 13:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, he's like, you could say he's very nice.

• 13:11Speaker 03

  He's very nice.

• 13:12Nilay Patel?

  That'd be like hype check Eisenhower. Oh, that's a tough one. Hype check Eisenhower, hype check Ike.

• 13:19Speaker 03

  Wasn't, wasn't, um.

• 13:21Nilay Patel?

  Ike is definitely like our newest cartoon character. Like that's our Snapchat series is hype check Ike.

• 13:28Nilay Patel?

  He's just like bounces around.

• 13:30Speaker 03

  Is there, I don't think there's any hype surrounding old presidents because they're just like old.

• 13:35Speaker 03

  Who cares?

• 13:36Nilay Patel?

  Pipe check Lincoln.

• 13:38Speaker 03

  I mean, he's tall and hat and like got shot in a theater like.

• 13:44Nilay Patel?

  He's tall. He's tall. He got shot in the face. So it's tall, it's tall hype or?

• 13:52Speaker 03

  Tall hype.

• 13:53Nilay Patel?

  You know, you left out the most essential Lincoln fact, right? Which is that he ended the civil war.

• 13:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, slavery, yeah.

• 14:03Speaker 03

  He did some other things.

• 14:04Nilay Patel?

  All right, I won't, I won't ask you to assign a numerical hype score. He also quoted, Pi also quoted, uh, George H W Bush. What? Uh, read my lips. Read my lips. There will be new taxes. A delightful inversion. I'm here from the government, I'm from the government here to help. That was Reagan. The only thing I fear in fear yourself, I, uh, FDR. Uh, there was something else.

• 14:26Speaker 03

  And then he went on to quote like a bunch of gadgets, right?

• 14:29Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah, he just listed off. That's what I'm looking for. Samsung smart TV. No, was that, was that, was that Pi or was that? That was Pi.

• 14:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, that was Pi. When he was going off for like four minutes.

• 14:38Nilay Patel?

  I got it, I got it, I got it. Here it is. So he went on, he was, so this is like the classic opposed to net neutrality move. You, you list cool things and then you say that we won't get any more cool things if Comcast has to behave. Yeah. Right? So here's the list.

• 14:55Nilay Patel?

  Uh, iPhones, Surface, Waze, the potato salad Kickstarter. Yeah, right. Seinfeld, crackle. Crackle? Just not a good argument. Like if your argument is like, yeah, you know, we should have these rules because otherwise we wouldn't get crackle. Like even Sony be like, yeah, that would be great. That would be awesome because we don't know where you're on this shit. Uh, Roku, Nest, iTunes, Netflix, The Man in the High Castle. Like just, uh, I think House of Car, like, he was just rat, Samsung Smart TVs, I say that one already? Like, he was just rattling off stuff.

• 15:27Speaker 02

  Because you know what I love is the smart TV features on my Samsung.

• 15:31Nilay Patel?

  Wait, the, the, the peak of his rattling off stuff was the potato salad Kickstarter.

• 15:36Speaker 02

  Right.

• 15:37Nilay Patel?

  You were a minute ago.

• 15:38Speaker 02

  Oh, come on.

• 15:42Nilay Patel?

  I mean, it was just incredible. And so like, it's all of these arguments and the thing that I didn't realize. So he makes all these arguments. He's like, this is going to let the government in the door. This is definitely the taxes. And then O'Reilly starts and O'Reilly begins with like, straight up. He's like, I was reading Twitter after my last presentation. Some people thought I went on for too long. And he's like, well, buckle up.

• 16:01Speaker 02

  Yeah. And then he proceeds to just go on forever.

• 16:07Nilay Patel?

  And so he's on that. And when I realized like, you know, we, while you're watching, like this is theater. Like, this isn't useful. And then I went and I read Fox News afterwards.

• 16:16Speaker 02

  Oh, boy.

• 16:16Nilay Patel?

  And all those quotes are just into the Fox News media machine.

• 16:20Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:21Nilay Patel?

  Right? Like, it was wild. And it's like, I don't think net neutrality is a partisan issue. I actually don't. I think because of the way the FCC is structured, it's three to two and there's Democrats and Republicans. I think everybody hates their cable provider. I think everybody hates their internet service. I think everybody hates AT&T and Verizon. I don't think these companies are loved. I think the only telecom company that I think that even remotely inspires any sort of mild affection is T-Mobile.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 16:46Nilay Patel?

  Because they're crazy.

• 16:47Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:48Nilay Patel?

  Right?

• 16:49Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:49Nilay Patel?

  Like, they've, they've done the work of being crazy. They have like.

• 16:51Speaker 02

  I would say so. Yeah.

• 16:53Nilay Patel?

  But that's the only one. And they're the upstart. So like, of course, every, everyone else hates everyone else.

• 16:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:58Nilay Patel?

  Right?

• 17:00Nilay Patel?

  So I think that transcends politics. Like, it doesn't matter. Like, when, uh, when Ted Cruz is like, neutrality is Obamacare for the internet. Like, his Facebook page got flooded with like, his supporters being like, no, shut up. Right? So even the Republican position and. People, there's obviously more depth this, but even like the Republican bill in Congress that was rapidly introduced to like shut down Title II. The rules are the same, right? The rules in the Republican bill are no paid prioritization, no blocking, no throttling, right?

• 17:30Speaker 02

  Right.

• 17:31Nilay Patel?

  Those are the same rules. They're just not title. It's like they literally were like, well, you, we want the same thing, but we want to do it this way, not that way.

• 17:37Speaker 02

  Right.

• 17:38Nilay Patel?

  Which is crazy. And that's like, that's a hard thing to politicize because you're like, no, the opposition is not to the rules. The opposition is the make, the legal mechanism and Obama.

• 17:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 17:49Nilay Patel?

  And like, that's where they have to go.

• 17:50Speaker 02

  Well, and Pi was really pushing that angle hard. He kept saying over and over again that he thinks that Obama basically shoved Title II down the FCC's throat. It's like, no, actually the four million people who rode into the FCC shoved it down Wheeler's throat.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  So, I mean, is that just for the politics, but is that also like, are they trying to build a case for eventually saying that like the FCC didn't have total control of this process?

• 18:14Nilay Patel?

  No. I mean, that was like a, Pi and O'Reilly kept on doing, they kept on calling it the President's Plan.

• 18:18Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:19Nilay Patel?

  Uh, which I think is great because it was. Right? Like, he campaigned on this plan.

• 18:24Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, I think they're, they're banking on the fact that people like Obama a lot less than they like or dislike the FCC, right? Like they, they, they're just using, they're invoking that name to get some, some hate out of people.

• 18:37Nilay Patel?

  I, I think they're just saying like, ooh, like the, the President's Plan is like, it's a, like a, it's a specter of evil, but like, I don't think anybody cares if the FCC processes.

• 18:46Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:47Nilay Patel?

  Who cares?

• 18:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 18:49Nilay Patel?

  Like, I kinda care. That'd be cool. I bet O'Reilly cares.

• 18:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:53Nilay Patel?

  Ajit Pai hates the FCC. That's his number one go-to argument. He's like, these five unelected assholes, why are they doing it?

• 18:59Speaker 02

  Including myself.

• 19:00Nilay Patel?

  I just had this vision of him in his office being like totally paralyzed. He's like, ah, I really want to get some water, but I'd be trampling the rights of the American citizen.

• 19:12Nilay Patel?

  So anyway, so O'Reilly goes and he just goes off forever. And then Wheeler like goes crazy.

• 19:19Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, he lost it.

• 19:21Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, like just pounding the table being like, he's like, people who are like, this is the government interfering with nonsense.

• 19:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:28Nilay Patel?

  He's like mad. I've never seen him like it. I think he finally realized what it's like to not fight against the American people.

• 19:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 19:35Nilay Patel?

  Cause he was like, what about this other crappy plan I have? And they're like, no, no, John Oliver, flood the FCC, crash the servers. President's yelling at you. He's like, that sucked. I'm doing what you want and it's gonna be awesome. Like that was kind of his message.

• 19:46Speaker 03

  Neelai, would you attribute today's success to two things? One, your article you wrote a year ago and two, no. And what about John Oliver?

• 19:56Nilay Patel?

  I think John Oliver, so you know, I think, I'll put it this way. I think we exist like in an ecosystem of media. Right? So that piece, a lot of people read it. It's one of those popular things that are written. I think that fed into, there was a lot of noise about it at that moment. Right? And I think John Oliver's people like read a lot of the noise and made their own segment and that got way more eyeballs than ours.

• 20:17Speaker 03

  Right. That was in like June, John Oliver's thing. Yours was in February.

• 20:20Nilay Patel?

  Right. So that, that like buildup happened. So like, yeah.

• 20:24Speaker 03

  And he's also, he's also able to reach like the public kind of thing, you know?

• 20:29Nilay Patel?

  I mean, I think that, I mean, this is like, it's kind of like a vergy thing to think about, like. The net neutrality segment on John Oliver's show, I think is what broke last week tonight into the mainstream.

• 20:40Speaker 03

  Yeah. Oh, interesting.

• 20:42Nilay Patel?

  Right. And that's a, that's crazy.

• 20:43Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 20:44Nilay Patel?

  Right. Like here's a new show. It's on K, it's on HBO. You have to pay to get it. And they're like, they are throwing their segments off onto YouTube. That's weird. But how are you monetizing that? You're not driving signups to HBO. You picked net neutrality and like.

• 20:56Speaker 03

  And then they did it.

• 20:57Nilay Patel?

  Right. And now there's like the John Oliver race every week where every site posts his thing. And like Vox is like. Bunch of traffic from, like Jox today just straight up. I saw that Vox is very good at re-promoting content. It's like their, their whole thing is they want to make persistent content. And explain the news while this thing. And straight out today, one of their tweets was like, hey, net neutrality, you should watch this John Oliver thing again. Right? Cause it is the most that I think that broke open the issue for a lot of people when he was, when he was just like this, when he called Tom Wheeler a dingo.

• 21:28Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 21:29Nilay Patel?

  Like, um, and he said cable, cable company fuckery. Like, I think that broke it open for a lot of people. Like, this is cable companies being corrupt. In a way that the Daily Show and like, uh, Colbert Report and those, those shows can do in a really effective way. But it's why I think that, I think that segment like broke his show open.

• 21:48Speaker 03

  Interesting. So it simultaneously broke his show open and like broke, you know, the, the mainstream, like, you know, 18 to 32 year olds. Like it made them give a crap about net neutrality.

• 21:59Nilay Patel?

  What's wrong with 33 year olds? Why 18 to 32?

• 22:02Speaker 03

  You know.

• 22:02Nilay Patel?

  Corporate Sam is doing his marketing demos. He's in the score. He's slicing it up.

• 22:06Nilay Patel?

  It is fascinating because there was.

• 22:08Speaker 01

  Isn't it? That's the demo. It's 32.

• 22:10Speaker 03

  Sorry, Chris. They're, they're aged.

• 22:11Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I'm out of the game, man.

• 22:13Speaker 03

  No, but, uh, like, uh, what would have happened if John Oliver didn't, you know, do that segment? We could be in a very different place right now.

• 22:20Nilay Patel?

  No, that's why it's, it's crazy. And I've seen, and that was like, we, so I mean, here's the thing. The FCC does clearly does not have good technology, right? Like during the hearing today, like the mics were humming. The stream kept dropping. The screen kept dropping. There's like, they're playing funk music over like a PowerPoint gradient, like just like not a great handle on technology.

• 22:44Nilay Patel?

  Oh, what was I saying? Oh, we crashed their servers. So like, when we did the internet is fucked. Like we were like, call this number. And they're saying, we brought down their phones and their servers. And then John Oliver did it again. And all that leads me to believe is that like their servers were not made for any sort of volume. Like you can DDoS the, like the FCC by being like, hey, like call four of your friends.

• 23:05Nilay Patel?

  Just bring it down. Uh, anyway, so then it's done. Uh, they have the vote. This is, I think the craziest part. Wheeler gives his like big speech. He had the vote. Uh, and then they everyone applauds thunderous applause. And he starts banging his gavel. Uh, he's like, we're done. It's over. And then he's like, wait, wait, wait. I forgot. And he says, are there any announcements? I got so caught up in banging the gavel.

• 23:27Nilay Patel?

  And then Ashipai, who's been like raging, like Addie's like, all the tension is out of this room. Ashipai just is like, you know, I was like at a party and there's this guy that I just really want to commend him for all the work he's done. That's like, are you just hanging out? Yeah. Are you just, are we all just done now? Like, see you later. And then they like broke a little bit, everybody milled around and then they had press conferences. They all started raging again.

• 23:49Speaker 02

  Yeah. But then after that, they, I think they piled into a different room and took a bunch of questions from people.

• 23:55Nilay Patel?

  They did.

• 23:55Speaker 02

  And they, they were just kind of hanging out. We saw Mike O'Reilly, just kind of like casually with like one elbow on the podium.

• 24:02Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. So weird. Our government's so weird. Like we trust these people.

• 24:06Speaker 02

  Well.

• 24:07Nilay Patel?

  Like they're playing funk music and talking about guys who met at parties and then they're like arguing about legal stuff. Like it's so goofy. These five unelected, un-American. Um, anyway, so Chris, what do you think? What's your, what's your hot take on this subject?

• 24:19Speaker 02

  I think we're, uh, we're in for years and years and years of litigation.

• 24:23Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 24:23Speaker 02

  That's my, that's my legal opinion.

• 24:25Speaker 01

  How long until the first lawsuit?

• 24:27Speaker 02

  Well, uh, we've already seen some pretty huffy statements come from Verizon.

• 24:32Speaker 01

  Oh God, we gotta talk about Verizon.

• 24:33Speaker 02

  Yeah, we have to talk about Verizon and AT&T. Um, so Verizon's statement, um, they jokingly printed in Morse code saying, oh, we forgot what year it was.

• 24:42Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then if you didn't, you couldn't read the Morse code, you, you could get a paper copy of like typewriter written.

• 24:48Nilay Patel?

  They use a typewriter font.

• 24:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:50Speaker 02

  And it's like, cool guys. I, I wasn't into, uh, your point of view before, but now that you've given me a typewriter copy press release.

• 24:58Speaker 01

  Also, it, yeah, you know what? You, like the same regular, like you're, it's all just communication lines. So yeah, you're actually making the point for me that they should all be regulated in the same rules.

• 25:09Nilay Patel?

  I mean Verizon, I mean, it's funny because the rules are like Verizon has lived under some of these rules before.

• 25:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:16Nilay Patel?

  Comcast is like, no paid prioritization, no blocking and no throttling.

• 25:21Speaker 02

  Well, I mean, they're still, they're still under the, they're still under the, the rules of the open internet order until what is it? 2018 as a result of the, the, uh,

• 25:29Nilay Patel?

  NBC.

• 25:29Speaker 02

  NBC purchase.

• 25:30Nilay Patel?

  Right. So it's just weird. Like, um, I, I recorded an episode of What's Tech? Shout out to What's Tech, Chris Plant. And Plant was like, that all sounds like really common sense. Like, why is it so controversial? And I don't have an answer. Like, Of course, the internet, like, of course, internet trap, like ISP shouldn't throttle internet traffic.

• 25:48Speaker 02

  Right.

• 25:49Nilay Patel?

  Of course that you shouldn't like, of course Netflix shouldn't be able to pay to be delivered faster than YouTube.

• 25:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 25:54Nilay Patel?

  It's just reverse, like, literally, it's like, if you readily accept that Comcast shouldn't slow down YouTube, then you should not as readily, you should equally accept that YouTube should be able to pay Comcast to be faster than Netflix.

• 26:06Speaker 02

  Right.

• 26:07Nilay Patel?

  Because then they're just throttling, they're effectively throttling Netflix.

• 26:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, the, I mean, the nut of the pie O'Reilly argument, I think, really comes down to you are trying to regulate theoretical problems that haven't happened in the real world, and first of all, that's not entirely true. And secondly, that's like saying, well, we're not going to make murder illegal because nobody is, has killed anybody. I mean, what?

• 26:29Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 26:29Speaker 02

  To set up the rules that makes sense.

• 26:31Nilay Patel?

  And also, I mean, their whole thing, I wrote it somewhere, it was, they keep saying, we don't believe that the ISPs are interfering in the market. Like, until they do, we don't need these rules. And I'm sitting here, I'm like, I absolutely know that they are.

• 26:44Speaker 02

  Right.

• 26:45Nilay Patel?

  Like, here's some, another piece of news from this week is like, Google bought Softcard, right? The, the carriers' mobile payment.

• 26:52Speaker 02

  So, Google bought Softcard technology and intellectual property.

• 26:56Nilay Patel?

  Right, they bought a bunch of patents and they bought, like, the product and they're probably gonna fire everybody, like.

• 27:00Speaker 02

  They're already, like, they're already announcing that they're turning off the Softcard app pretty quick.

• 27:04Nilay Patel?

  Right, so the carriers started their own do, like, inevitably doomed mobile payment alliance. Like, when telecom companies start an alliance, you, in your head, you should think this will fail.

• 27:15Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 27:16Nilay Patel?

  That's just a fact. Hilariously, their first name for Softcard was ISIS. So, "Google Defeats ISIS" is a headline that I pitched. It was not, was immediately rejected. So, they started this thing, but they blocked Google Wallet in favor of promoting their own solution.

• 27:34Speaker 02

  No, that's not even true. They blocked Google Wallet in favor of having nothing because their solution wasn't ready yet.

• 27:41Nilay Patel?

  Right, but they want Google to be adopted.

• 27:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:44Nilay Patel?

  Right? So, they blocked, they blocked Google's product in Android phones. If you remember, the Galaxy Nexus was supposed to have Google Wallet, and Verizon kept it off of there. That, well, there you go. Like, that's all the evidence I need that they should not be allowed to do anything. Um, so whatever, but we need better rules. Uh, so they bought Google Wallet. I remember when Hangouts was announced, Hangouts video calling.

• 28:03Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah.

• 28:04Nilay Patel?

  AT&T would not let Google preload it on their phones, on Nexus phones.

• 28:08Speaker 02

  No, you could have it, but like the video, the video portion of it couldn't be preloaded. Like you had to like.

• 28:14Nilay Patel?

  Well, I, I had some crazy ass conversation with AT&T where they patiently tried to explain to me the difference between an app from Google Play and an app that was preloaded. And I was like, there isn't a difference. What is the difference? Like, well, one app is preloaded. Like, what, what, why?

• 28:29Speaker 02

  Apps.

• 28:31Nilay Patel?

  Like, there's like blog posts, you can go look them up. What's the AT&T guy's name?

• 28:34Speaker 02

  Uh, Secconi?

• 28:36Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, like the crazy AT&T policy.

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:38Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Like, he has like a 3,000 word blog post, like patiently explaining that like preloaded apps are different than Play Store apps.

• 28:44Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:45Nilay Patel?

  And none of it makes sense.

• 28:46Speaker 02

  I, I'm not even kidding when I say everyone should read attpolicyblog.com because that's where Secconi posts. And it is this amazing alternate universe, like from the, from the point of view of a D, like a, you know, a DC power player, basically. And it'll really, really open your eyes to what happens there. It's insane.

• 29:04Nilay Patel?

  What, what, I mean, it's, it's why, I mean, you've been reading him for years. And then, uh, FaceTime over cellular, right?

• 29:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:10Nilay Patel?

  Like, Apple wanted to do it and AT&T was like, no, it has to be Wi-Fi first. And then it was Wi-Fi first. And it's like, dude, I get it. Your network is fragile. Your mobile carrier, but just leave these people, like, leave them alone. Like, let the products fail. Like, they're gonna, if Apple wants to put FaceTime over cellular, like, and it sucks, like, people will blame Apple, they won't blame you.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:28Nilay Patel?

  And they, it's just never gonna, I mean, to this idea that there hasn't been harm, like, there's already been tons and tons of harm in mobile.

• 29:35Speaker 02

  Right.

• 29:35Nilay Patel?

  I think less so on the wired side.

• 29:38Speaker 02

  Well, there's been a little bit, like, with, like, you watch, like, the Netflix performance and it's like, doing fine.

• 29:44Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 29:44Speaker 02

  And then as soon as they're in negotiations with Comcast, it drops.

• 29:47Nilay Patel?

  Yep.

• 29:47Speaker 02

  And then they resolve it and it comes back up again.

• 29:49Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Just, just, just wild all the way around. And like, so these rules, you know, it's so funny, like, we talk about net neutrality, we're so deep in it. Um, I actually, I commissioned a post from Ross and Chris to just go to all the mainstream newspapers and like clip the paragraph where they desperately try to explain what net neutrality is. Because it's just impossible to do.

• 30:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:08Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. The Fox News one was net neutrality is the idea that all things should run at the same speed.

• 30:14Speaker 02

  There you have it.

• 30:17Nilay Patel?

  Close enough. I like, yeah, sure. Like, I'll take it. It's just like, it's wild.

• 30:22Speaker 02

  Obama net. That's what it is.

• 30:23Nilay Patel?

  Obama net. It's just wild to think that it's so hard to talk about, even on the, in the context of this show, where we've been talking about it forever. I've been talking about it forever. Chris has been covering it forever. We're still like, talking through it or around it. We're, we never like attack it head on because it's so like unruly.

• 30:41Nilay Patel?

  But yet, the public cares about it so deeply. Right? Like, I think, well, fascinating thing is on YouTube, there's just hundreds of like amateur net neutrality explainer videos.

• 30:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:52Nilay Patel?

  Just people desperately, they're so caught up in it, that they're like, I have to explain this to someone. I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna crack the code. And you can just watch them forever. There's some of them are very good. And it's just like, people are so passionate about not screaming with the internet.

• 31:04Speaker 02

  Yeah. And that's what ended up delivering, what, what was it? Three and a half, four million comments to the SEC system? So, yeah, people are passionate about it.

• 31:13Nilay Patel?

  So what's next, Chris? What happens? Other than lawsuits?

• 31:16Speaker 01

  Advertising is next for our podcast.

• 31:17Nilay Patel?

  Definitely lawsuits are coming.

• 31:18Speaker 02

  Lawsuits are definitely coming, but otherwise, I think, hopefully, it's, it's business as usual. I mean, like, I get 100 megabit internet at home, but I, you know, the Comcast merger is incoming. Speaking of which, we, we should, we should address how that, like, those two things interplay, because there is an interplay there.

• 31:36Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 31:38Speaker 02

  So Comcast CEO Brian Roberts, Comcast had their earnings yesterday. And during the call, there was a question about whether something, gee, I'm paraphrasing, paraphrasing here, but something to do with whether they would consider not suing over Title II regulation in order to help secure a merger with, with Time Warner, which they're, they're trying to do. And he talked around it and basically said, we don't want to be treated any different from anyone else in the industry.

• 32:11Nilay Patel?

  Right.

• 32:11Speaker 02

  So which is, as far as I'm concerned, shorthand for if everyone else sues, we're gonna sue.

• 32:16Nilay Patel?

  Right, right. And also, I think for, yeah, well, well, we're happy, because they already are happy with that. They keep saying it.

• 32:23Speaker 02

  Right.

• 32:23Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. We're already under these rules until 2018.

• 32:25Speaker 02

  I mean, and, and so again.

• 32:27Nilay Patel?

  2018 is not very far away.

• 32:28Speaker 02

  It isn't at this point.

• 32:29Nilay Patel?

  It just sounds far. It's the future.

• 32:31Speaker 02

  But.

• 32:31Nilay Patel?

  Pipe check 2018.

• 32:33Speaker 02

  Beef.

• 32:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, but the Apple car won't be here by then. So are you sure about that?

• 32:37Speaker 03

  How do you know? They said, they said minimum, it's going to go into production in 2020. Could start next year, bro.

• 32:42Speaker 02

  You don't know what minimum.

• 32:44Speaker 01

  Also, I thought beef was for Snapchat.

• 32:47Speaker 03

  Beef has transcended into culture.

• 32:48Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 32:50Nilay Patel?

  And I'm gonna tell the story and then we're, we're gonna read the ad.

• 32:54Speaker 01

  Then we'll come back.

• 32:55Nilay Patel?

  I'm gonna tell the story and then we're, and we'll talk about the watch. Wait, do we need to finish talking about Comcast? Here's what I know about Comcast. Comcast like profit per user is like up $5 in the past three years.

• 33:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:05Nilay Patel?

  Like, they're fine.

• 33:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:06Nilay Patel?

  Their stock shot up on the day.

• 33:07Speaker 02

  Everybody's stock shot up.

• 33:08Nilay Patel?

  It was like, they're fine.

• 33:10Speaker 02

  Well, right. So, so the only point that I was trying to make is that I think that, that Title II regulation happened today was in many ways just a safeguard against the internet getting jacked. And, and it's, it's comforting to have that, that safeguard in place. So, yeah, I think.

• 33:28Nilay Patel?

  I mean, I think the, the, it's like, it is a utility. Like, we can't live without it.

• 33:32Speaker 03

  Will this stop AT&T from throttling me after five gigs?

• 33:35Nilay Patel?

  No, no.

• 33:36Speaker 03

  Because I have a lot of data. Damn it.

• 33:37Nilay Patel?

  No, I mean, it's, I, I think the effects.

• 33:39Speaker 02

  What are you doing with your data, Sam?

• 33:43Speaker 03

  Um, high quality Spotify.

• 33:45Speaker 01

  Uh, I was gonna guess high quality Tinder, but.

• 33:47Speaker 02

  Ooh, there's a high quality Tinder?

• 33:49Speaker 03

  I actually have no dating apps on my phone right now.

• 33:52Nilay Patel?

  Do you have any tablet?

• 33:54Speaker 03

  I don't own a tablet. I got rid of that fuck phone 6 plus.

• 33:59Nilay Patel?

  Wow, what?

• 34:00Speaker 02

  You're so angry.

• 34:01Nilay Patel?

  Did you just try to throw down a 6 plus burn?

• 34:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:04Nilay Patel?

  I asked you if you had a tablet?

• 34:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:05Nilay Patel?

  I got it.

• 34:06Speaker 03

  I thought, I thought that's what the joke you were making, so I played to it.

• 34:10Nilay Patel?

  I mean, good, well done. Let me tell you a story about Sam.

• 34:13Speaker 02

  Oh, God.

• 34:14Nilay Patel?

  So we, we had, uh, where the Verge is being profiled in another publication. So we had a reporter here.

• 34:20Speaker 02

  Oh, boy.

• 34:21Nilay Patel?

  It's true. So the reporter's like walking around, like meeting people and all that stuff. And we get to Sam and the reporter, like, they're very curious about Snapchat, like, what we're doing on Snapchat. So I'm like, we start talking. I'm like, Sam, do a snap. Seems like a basic thing that you could do, right? Like, we're talking about a thing that you do.

• 34:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:39Nilay Patel?

  You're here in the office with the tool with which you do the thing. And Sam looks at me dead serious and he's like, the first rule of Snapchat is you can't force a snap. Just like, no, just rejects me in front of this reporter. He's like, nope, not doing it. And then he keeps going like epic Snapchat feel. You know, our lawyers are Suzanne and Samantha are like here. They were live logging each other in Slack. Cause Sam's just like, just a beautiful, here's the highlight. Here's the one. And this is true. And it explains so much about about our Snapchat scene. Sam goes, I don't think of them as followers. I think of them as friends. It's beautiful.

• 35:16Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 35:17Nilay Patel?

  The real verge on Snapchat.

• 35:18Speaker 02

  That's, yeah. The real verge on Snapchat.

• 35:20Nilay Patel?

  All right, we need to take a break and we're going to come back. We're going to talk about the Apple Watch. But first, let's talk about websites. Uh, and websites built on Squarespace. Websites that are simple and powerful and beautiful. Websites that you don't do a good job of making. So you need 24/7 support by, I should just read the other copy.

• 35:42Nilay Patel?

  Now, I mean, let's, let's be real. I have two choices here. One, we have like a list of points to hit.

• 35:48Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:49Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. And I could like weave a beautiful story.

• 35:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 35:52Nilay Patel?

  Or I could just read the copy.

• 35:54Speaker 02

  It's up to you, man.

• 35:55Nilay Patel?

  I'm going to get better at the other thing. But first, building a website can be tough. And if you do know your way about coding, creating something that looks good and works well is a time consuming affair. Whether it's a business site, a portfolio, a restaurant, or whatever else. In this day and age, you probably need a website. Chris, do you have a website?

• 36:15Speaker 02

  I do.

• 36:16Nilay Patel?

  What do you do with it?

• 36:17Speaker 02

  I, I blog once in a while.

• 36:20Nilay Patel?

  I was, I do. I haven't, I haven't written my personal blog in forever. But if I was gonna update that, I would take it off that bust Tumblr.

• 36:29Speaker 03

  Wow. Like I said, transcendent to culture.

• 36:34Nilay Patel?

  Sam tells a reporter that Bee for Bus has quote transcended into the culture. So if I was gonna build Bee for Bus.com, I would say lucky Squarespace makes it easy to build beautiful websites. Squarespace provides simple, powerful, and beautiful website templates. They should have like literally a column that says Beef and a column that says Bus. Like all the old ugly ones. Not only that, but these templates are part of Squarespace's responsive design, which means your website's scaled, look great on any device, further minimizing the hassles of making a website on your own. Every website you build also comes with a free online store if you need it. Christopher?

• 37:10Speaker 02

  Do I need a website?

• 37:12Nilay Patel?

  I mean...

• 37:13Speaker 02

  Are you asking me a question? I'm sorry.

• 37:15Nilay Patel?

  I mean, you of all the people I know sell more things. Oh yeah, you absolutely should launch an online store. You should start a site called like Chris's Old Stuff.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  If I'm not mistaken, Sam, do you own SideHustle.com?

• 37:27Speaker 03

  I will not answer that question live on the air.

• 37:30Speaker 02

  Well, anyway.

• 37:33Nilay Patel?

  Oh my god.

• 37:34Speaker 02

  A lot of people are selling a lot of things. The internet is a great place to sell things.

• 37:38Nilay Patel?

  I think that meets the requirements here. Seriously, you can't beat the ease and simplicity of Squarespace, which is true, I think. Squarespace gives you 24/7 online support and a beautiful website for $8 a month, which is peanuts.

• 37:53Speaker 02

  It's not bad, really.

• 37:54Nilay Patel?

  It's like less than your peanut budget.

• 37:55Speaker 03

  It's like Netflix.

• 37:56Nilay Patel?

  It's like only you have to provide content. It's like reverse Netflix. What are you doing? Binge creating a website. It's the best weekend ever. You can even get a free domain if you buy Squarespace for the year, which is good because most of my domains are expiring. Dude, Dieter, what are you waiting for? Start a trial with no credit card required. Dieter, get on it.

• 38:19Speaker 01

  I was waiting to find out why I don't need a credit card, I guess.

• 38:25Speaker 03

  ReverseNetflix.com is a great idea.

• 38:27Nilay Patel?

  So here's what you do, because you would sign up with offer code VERGE to get 10% off your first purchase. And to show your support for the Vergecast, which is what you're listening to, maybe watching if you're one of the tiny handful of weirdos who watch us. Love you, weirdos. So thank you, weirdos. Thank you, Squarespace.

• 38:46Speaker 03

  We love you.

• 38:47Nilay Patel?

  And Dieter, read the tagline.

• 38:48Speaker 01

  Squarespace: Built to Beautiful.

• 38:51Nilay Patel?

  Is it build or built?

• 38:53Speaker 01

  Both.

• 38:55Nilay Patel?

  Squarespace, anything goes.

• 38:58Speaker 02

  Well, build it beautiful is present tense. Built a beautiful.

• 39:01Nilay Patel?

  It's like, no, one's a command, one's a imperative. Go do this thing. And then the other one's, oh, I did this thing.

• 39:06Speaker 02

  Right.

• 39:07Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 39:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:08Nilay Patel?

  All right, we're out of the ad zone. This content is no longer sponsored.

• 39:11Speaker 03

  And now we're in the phones.

• 39:12Nilay Patel?

  Explain to me more concisely in like 30 seconds, 10 seconds, because I wasn't listening before. What, what if, what is the relationship between the Comcast Time Warner merger and this FCC decision?

• 39:25Speaker 02

  Well.

• 39:25Nilay Patel?

  What does, what happens next?

• 39:27Speaker 02

  Well, so you can see how it could be valuable for Comcast to play ball in not objecting too hard to the Title II regulation in order to help secure

• 39:41Speaker 02

  popular opinion in DC, for lack of a better phrase.

• 39:44Nilay Patel?

  Right, but like, other than them like creating favor by going along to get along with this decision, this decision doesn't have any direct impact on the chances of whether or not this thing goes through.

• 39:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, they're still, yeah, still apples and oranges. It's just a question of whether they want to, you know, not object to it in order to make people happy.

• 40:01Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I mean, I will, we should really move on to the watch, but I will say this.

• 40:08Nilay Patel?

  Comcast and NCTA, which is basically Comcast lobbying organization, National Cable and Telecom Association. They are doing a hilariously good job of promoting tweets to basically say things like, we love the open internet. Find out more here, and then you click on it, and it's like, screw Tom Wheeler.

• 40:25Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:26Nilay Patel?

  And it's like, just so confusing. They've co-opted this language in such a weird

• 40:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:30Nilay Patel?

  way, like Comcast is like, but we are the internet.

• 40:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:32Nilay Patel?

  Why would we want to hurt it? We love it.

• 40:34Speaker 02

  Right. Well, but there are also these situations where you get Comcast in a corner and talk to them, and they're like, but, but we built this thing. The government didn't build this thing. We built it, like, we, you know, why are they taking it away from us? Why are they, you know, stopping us from doing what we want to do with it? And that's, you know, that's the language that they don't want you to hear, but that's what they really think.

• 40:57Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, they're very, they're very strange, just in general. Okay.

• 41:01Speaker 02

  Apple Watch?

• 41:01Nilay Patel?

  Other than, yeah, Apple Watch.

• 41:04Nilay Patel?

  Dieter, you want to take us to the watch?

• 41:05Speaker 01

  So, uh, what happened today is-

• 41:06Nilay Patel?

  And the MacBook, I have to say, like-

• 41:08Speaker 01

  We're expecting a MacBook.

• 41:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but-

• 41:09Speaker 01

  And the watch.

• 41:10Nilay Patel?

  Okay, fair.

• 41:10Speaker 01

  Right?

• 41:11Nilay Patel?

  It's, it's gonna be both of those things.

• 41:12Speaker 01

  Because we've seen plenty of the rumors for, for the MacBook and like the watch is like, "It's time," because the thing they said is-

• 41:17Nilay Patel?

  It's time.

• 41:19Speaker 01

  Don't even.

• 41:20Nilay Patel?

  Oh my god.

• 41:20Speaker 01

  So the, uh-

• 41:21Nilay Patel?

  Pebble time.

• 41:22Speaker 01

  Came out, uh, it's, uh, March 9th. Uh, if you really want to know the details, it's happening at the, the San Francisco, uh-

• 41:29Nilay Patel?

  Year Buena.

• 41:29Speaker 01

  Venue, Year Buena, so it's like a different kind of thing than on the campus.

• 41:33Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 41:33Speaker 01

  Uh, and the, it's got a beautiful flower looking thing, uh, which fits with the watch for some reason.

• 41:39Speaker 03

  Gonna be on my next Supreme jacket.

• 41:40Speaker 01

  And the tagline is "Spring Forward," which is like a, you know, time joke, I guess.

• 41:45Nilay Patel?

  It's a time, I mean, the best, the best analysis of the time joke I saw was on, on Bloomberg. Where they like literally posted a tweet that said, "Update: Sources confirm event will be about watch," and then there was an explanation of the joke. They're like, "Spring Forward is a reference to daylight savings time," and Liz, who used to work at Bloomberg, was like, "No, Bloomberg has this really strict policy where they have to explain everything."

• 42:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:06Nilay Patel?

  Which is the best.

• 42:06Speaker 01

  Um, so Bloomberg is like the worst people on Twitter? Like, when you make a joke and then someone replies explaining the joke to you?

• 42:13Nilay Patel?

  Uh, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's those people. No, Bloomberg is fine on Twitter.

• 42:17Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 42:17Nilay Patel?

  But you're saying, "Never mind."

• 42:19Speaker 01

  I got you. You got me. Uh, what else is there to say about the watch?

• 42:22Nilay Patel?

  We got each other, bro.

• 42:24Speaker 01

  Uh, so, yeah, the event's coming. Um, a bunch of people got invited from what Twitter looked like, like, Apple has been on this trend of inviting more and more people to their events, and I think that's continuing. Uh, I saw that, um, our friend, our YouTube friend, Marques Brownlee, got an invite.

• 42:38Nilay Patel?

  Oh, hey!

• 42:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:39Speaker 03

  My invite got lost in the internet, just by the way.

• 42:42Nilay Patel?

  The, uh, the last, the last event- Hype check Apple invites.

• 42:45Speaker 03

  I mean, where's mine?

• 42:46Nilay Patel?

  Hype check Spring Forward.

• 42:48Speaker 03

  Hell, yeah.

• 42:50Nilay Patel?

  Hype check daylight savings time.

• 42:51Speaker 03

  What? It is so dumb that that exists.

• 42:54Speaker 01

  Yeah. When's the last time you wore a watch?

• 42:57Speaker 03

  Uh...

• 42:59Speaker 01

  G-Shock.

• 43:00Speaker 03

  No, I don't have a fucking G-Shock. Uh, I wear, I wore a Pebble for like, I don't know, like, two weeks, probably like a year ago.

• 43:07Speaker 01

  You're gonna buy this Apple watch and wear it for three days and then you're not gonna do it yourself?

• 43:11Nilay Patel?

  It's not just you? I can- Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hype check open. Hype check G-Shock.

• 43:16Speaker 03

  Dude, you, you create this hype around G-Shock solely yourself.

• 43:20Nilay Patel?

  They sell them at Flight Club. There, there's nothing hyper than Flight Club. Anyway.

• 43:25Speaker 01

  It's real. So, there's a real, like, world here in which Chris is just Sam 10 years in the future.

• 43:33Nilay Patel?

  I don't know that I hadn't made that connection before.

• 43:37Speaker 02

  Just pointing out the Selman Flight Club.

• 43:38Speaker 01

  So if you let us talk about the Apple Watch for just a few more minutes, I'll let you talk about Forza and Fast and the Furious.

• 43:45Nilay Patel?

  Pebble time.

• 43:48Speaker 01

  So the like, what else do we know about the watch, the Apple Watch?

• 43:52Nilay Patel?

  Well, here's what I think they have to show off in the night. So we've been, we've been speculating this for a while, but now we have, there's an event. They've said it's coming out in April. They have to show you how it works.

• 44:01Speaker 01

  They have to, they have to show you how it works. They have to trot out a bunch of developers.

• 44:04Nilay Patel?

  Yep. They gotta do apps. They gotta show how it connects to the phone.

• 44:07Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 44:07Nilay Patel?

  They, I think Apple's not dumb, right? They, they read everything. They've heard the criticism. They have to know that the question is, what is it good for?

• 44:15Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 44:16Nilay Patel?

  What is a killer Apple?

• 44:17Speaker 03

  Absolutely nothing.

• 44:18Nilay Patel?

  Nah, you don't know that.

• 44:19Speaker 03

  That was a reference.

• 44:21Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I did. I did. Yeah, real funk music.

• 44:23Speaker 03

  Right, yeah.

• 44:24Nilay Patel?

  On the verge, man.

• 44:25Speaker 03

  I think this is going to be like when they showed off the original iPhone at Macworld and then they had their event six months later. And now it's like that point where we all saw the watch and now everyone's expectations are already set because of the event already. And there's been like all this like up and down of the press, like, oh, it's gonna suck. No, it's gonna be good. And the other day, Tim Cook was like, oh, you could wear in the shower. I, this is not the fanboy in me speaking, but I believe that they are going to have a slew of new things that they withheld from the old event to be like.

• 44:58Speaker 01

  I wouldn't say a slew.

• 45:00Nilay Patel?

  I, I mean, I think what they withheld, I think.

• 45:03Speaker 03

  It got better over the last six months.

• 45:05Nilay Patel?

  About that event, the more I'm like, pretty crystallized in my opinion of it, which is Apple bought their own hype. And they did all the things that Apple is known for in creating hype without any of the substance, right? And so they're like, this is a revolution. This is our next big category. This is magical. This is gonna change everything. Like, they said all those things.

• 45:27Speaker 03

  Right.

• 45:27Nilay Patel?

  But we all walked away with like a very kind of confused.

• 45:29Speaker 03

  Yeah, it doesn't really feel like it's as revolutionary as the iPhone was. It's just like Apple.

• 45:33Nilay Patel?

  I mean, absolutely not.

• 45:34Speaker 03

  Right.

• 45:35Nilay Patel?

  Apple just made a watch. But the expectation that they would create something as revolution, as revolutionary as the iPhone is fundamentally unfair.

• 45:43Speaker 03

  Right.

• 45:43Speaker 01

  Right.

• 45:44Speaker 03

  I would say so.

• 45:44Speaker 01

  But so, but I'm saying like, there was all this sizzle and there was none of the steak. And I think, I don't think Apple is dumb. I think they've been paying very close attention.

• 45:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 45:51Speaker 01

  And I think this event is like, gonna be demo after demo after demo of stuff it can do.

• 45:55Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 45:56Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 45:56Speaker 02

  Because they've had developers.

• 45:57Speaker 01

  Easy to figure out and like, oh, it's really simple. It's just, oh, there it is. Okay, cool.

• 46:01Speaker 02

  Right.

• 46:01Speaker 01

  Right.

• 46:02Speaker 02

  So they're gonna do that, and then I think we're gonna see this MacBook.

• 46:04Speaker 01

  No, well, no, there's, you're missing one super duper important thing.

• 46:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 46:08Speaker 01

  Pricing and availability.

• 46:10Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 46:10Speaker 01

  Because the pricing, you know, there's all sorts of stuff. I think the, the best thing written about the pricing is like what John Gruber put up last Friday, where he not only like said, doubled down, like, look, this is gonna cost between $10 and $20 grand at the high end. He also.

• 46:24Speaker 03

  What?

• 46:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:25Speaker 03

  The gold one is 10 to 20 grand?

• 46:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, easily. Yeah.

• 46:29Speaker 02

  No. If, if you look at the, if you look at the amount of gold in the edition, I, I, I had a really long conversation with luxury Singleton about this.

• 46:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:38Speaker 02

  If you, if you look at the amount of gold in the edition, uh, it, it doesn't come anywhere, it can't come anywhere close to what would justify a $10,000 price.

• 46:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, no way.

• 46:47Speaker 01

  And because of the. They could still do it.

• 46:49Speaker 03

  It'll be like 1,500, it'll be like 2 grand.

• 46:51Speaker 01

  No.

• 46:51Speaker 02

  No, it'll be more than that.

• 46:52Speaker 01

  It'll be 10. I bet you 10.

• 46:54Speaker 02

  I think you're both wrong. It's gonna be 3 to 5.

• 46:56Speaker 01

  No way.

• 46:56Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 46:57Speaker 01

  Anyway, it's gonna be a lot. But the, the other thing that he's speculating is that you're not.

• 47:01Speaker 02

  Marked.

• 47:02Speaker 01

  You're not gonna be able to like, pick and choose your different bands on the high. Like, if you go to buy the edition, it like, the gold one comes with this band, or maybe this band, and that's it.

• 47:11Speaker 02

  Right.

• 47:11Speaker 01

  Which is interesting, but that makes sense because Johnny Ive like, like, crapped all over Moto Maker in his New Yorker profile, right? So why would Apple want a Moto Maker experience for the Apple Watch?

• 47:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 47:22Speaker 01

  Wait, but it's interchangeable bands. I think on the sport one, they'll let you like have. You can get a few, I'm sure.

• 47:27Speaker 02

  With tons of colors and stuff.

• 47:29Speaker 01

  But I bet you, you can't go get the luxury band just on its own. That's the thing that he's, he's guessing.

• 47:34Speaker 02

  By the way, for those of you who don't know, you said luxury again. Micah Singleton, his nickname is Luxury Singleton.

• 47:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  Cause he lives a full custom lifestyle.

• 47:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, he lives a bespoke lifestyle, for sure. How many do they sell first weekend?

• 47:46Nilay Patel?

  I don't know.

• 47:46Speaker 02

  They sold 10 million iPhone 6, 6 pluses.

• 47:50Nilay Patel?

  It's not the iPhone.

• 47:51Speaker 02

  Like, that's the thing.

• 47:52Nilay Patel?

  I know, I know.

• 47:52Speaker 02

  That's like, I mean, speculate.

• 47:54Nilay Patel?

  The iPhone, like, created, like, the world, right? Like, uh, the, the whole notion of the modern smartphone came from the iPhone.

• 48:01Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 48:02Nilay Patel?

  At that, at that time.

• 48:02Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 48:03Nilay Patel?

  Um, and I know there's gonna be a, like, this is the moment when I start getting pictures of old Nokia phones on Twitter. Like, they're, they're just coming. I said, "The iPhone created the notion of the modern smartphone." And now, like, old photos of old Nokias. They're, they're, like, wing, like, somewhere in Finland, like, somebody woke up. No!

• 48:21Speaker 01

  Sent you a communicator 9000 or whatever.

• 48:22Nilay Patel?

  Exactly.

• 48:23Speaker 02

  I'm just, I'm gonna just...

• 48:24Nilay Patel?

  No, but, like, it can't be, like, all of the stuff that happened, right?

• 48:27Speaker 02

  3 million, 3 million i, uh, i-watches, weekend one, 3 million.

• 48:31Nilay Patel?

  Okay, that's a number.

• 48:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 48:33Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. Uh, I, look, I think they have to do the thing. Like, I am...

• 48:37Speaker 01

  I'm assuming there's 3 million to be bought, but anyway.

• 48:39Nilay Patel?

  I don't know, like, this actually goes into the Pebble time, right? Like, so Pebble did the time this week. They put it on Kickstarter, which is super thirsty.

• 48:49Nilay Patel?

  Just was. Um, and, you know, we saw, we did the exclusive video. Uh, and, you know, their whole, Pebble's whole thing is like, this isn't, we don't make it do a lot of stuff. Right? They're like, "This is about notifications." They redid the UI. The UI looks really adorable.

• 49:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:04Nilay Patel?

  Um, it's maybe a little, the whole thing looks a little too cute to me.

• 49:09Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, it was described as a Tamagotchi on a wristwatch.

• 49:12Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, I think it looks like a Hamzire.

• 49:15Speaker 02

  You, you can't charge $150 for a, for an object that looks like that. You just can't.

• 49:19Nilay Patel?

  Ah, that's fine.

• 49:20Speaker 02

  Like...

• 49:22Nilay Patel?

  You're going up to Eric Mises, like, "You can't do that."

• 49:25Speaker 02

  No, I, I, I think I tweeted this yesterday, that, like, the, the Seiko that you can buy for $150 looks like, well, called a piece of art, but it looks like a, a piece of fine jewelry.

• 49:34Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, but it doesn't do what this thing does.

• 49:36Speaker 02

  It's, it, it's $5 worth of electronic components in this thing.

• 49:41Nilay Patel?

  Oh, come on.

• 49:41Speaker 02

  It's a very low-quality display.

• 49:44Speaker 01

  You say that, but it's a it's a color display that will let the thing last for seven days, unlike the Apple Watch, which will last a day presumably. That's what we're guessing.

• 49:53Speaker 02

  This is true.

• 49:54Speaker 01

  That's that's important to me.

• 49:55Speaker 02

  There have been lots of rumors about Apple not really being able to hit their battery life targets.

• 50:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, which is a big problem. Like, also, like, I will say that having to, like, do a thing to make the time appear on the watch defeats the entire purpose of the watch.

• 50:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 50:11Speaker 01

  If I can't subtly glance down and see the time, I have to like, go like that. It's like, well, just.

• 50:17Speaker 02

  Right.

• 50:19Nilay Patel?

  I've actually, the rumors of the battery life have been around since before the watch, like, for a year.

• 50:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:25Nilay Patel?

  Like, I would hear, like, Apple's are gonna watch, yeah, that battery is gonna be a big problem for them.

• 50:29Speaker 02

  Well, there is the the classic Apple move of them seeding, like, seeming to seed bad news and then exceed those poor expectations.

• 50:38Speaker 01

  Right, yeah.

• 50:39Speaker 02

  They they did that with the original iPad. If you remember, I think the the rumors were that it was gonna cost a thousand dollars or something, right? And then that made the price look really good when they announced it.

• 50:49Nilay Patel?

  I think the addition, I think they gotta go big on the number for the addition.

• 50:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:53Nilay Patel?

  I I think three to five is like, it's whatever. Like, that like feels like, like accessible.

• 50:58Speaker 01

  They need to, they need to make it feel like, holy crap.

• 51:01Nilay Patel?

  There's one, they gotta be like, it's man, you know, like. No way. Yeah, why? They have all the cheaper ones they can sell.

• 51:07Speaker 02

  No, I'll give you two reasons. One, uh, so you're saying it's gonna cost 20K? Is that your, is that your final statement?

• 51:15Speaker 01

  I would say, I would, I would just like to experience the moment where they put up the pricing slide and he's like, this piece of garbage is 349. I am next class.

• 51:27Speaker 01

  And then he's got the the middle one where he's like, here's, here's a number, 600 bucks or whatever, it's gonna be in the middle. And then he's like, you know, and then he like, he's gonna get real quiet.

• 51:37Nilay Patel?

  The addition is crafted of the finest materials.

• 51:40Speaker 03

  Solid gold.

• 51:41Nilay Patel?

  Babies, whatever the hell. And he's like, it's a very special product. We're so proud to have made it. Johnny's done such a good job putting, turning babies into phones.

• 51:51Speaker 03

  Johnny, please stand up.

• 51:52Nilay Patel?

  Johnny, Johnny, no, he's just like, no, I'm just, I don't do this. And he's like, and we're pricing it to match.

• 51:59Speaker 03

  I bet they don't even.

• 52:00Nilay Patel?

  And then they're like, and it's like $4.99, the thing drops down, that'd be amazing.

• 52:03Speaker 03

  I bet they don't even talk about the price of the gold one on stage.

• 52:05Nilay Patel?

  No, but I think, but I think, and then I think he's like, the Apple Watch Edition will retail for $20,000. We're building a custom experience in our store. And then they unveil the store.

• 52:16Speaker 01

  They're gonna do the store unveiling. They definitely are gonna talk about the stores for a long time.

• 52:20Speaker 02

  So if they do that.

• 52:21Speaker 03

  That was amazing.

• 52:23Speaker 02

  If they do that. You've been waiting to do that on camera. This is a move he's been doing lately.

• 52:32Speaker 03

  Someone give that please, immediately, please.

• 52:36Nilay Patel?

  For those of you on audio, that is my new finger gun sound.

• 52:41Speaker 03

  It's so good. Did you like the head jerking? Oh, it's great. You really get into it.

• 52:48Nilay Patel?

  Tim Cook drops a 20k.

• 52:51Speaker 03

  He does the sharpshooter on the stage.

• 52:54Nilay Patel?

  At Johnny. Johnny, my man.

• 53:01Speaker 01

  All right, we should, we should move on.

• 53:02Nilay Patel?

  No, we're not done with this watch.

• 53:04Speaker 01

  Oh, God.

• 53:05Nilay Patel?

  We're going along today.

• 53:06Speaker 03

  Chris, I want to hear your two.

• 53:07Nilay Patel?

  Johnny, two hour verge cast, it's coming. Here we go.

• 53:10Speaker 01

  Tangle up.

• 53:11Nilay Patel?

  Push the turbo button on that PC, buddy.

• 53:15Speaker 02

  Listen to us at 1.5 speed.

• 53:19Speaker 01

  John, you just got pwned.

• 53:22Nilay Patel?

  Pronounced owned.

• 53:23Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 53:24Speaker 02

  No, it's pronounced pwned.

• 53:25Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 53:25Speaker 02

  At $10,000.

• 53:26Speaker 03

  Chris is B, clearly.

• 53:28Speaker 02

  At $10,000, they would have to immediately explain. They cannot put off the conversation of what do you do in a year when you're like, I want the new one.

• 53:37Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 53:38Speaker 02

  Like at, at, at $3,000 to $5,000, they can put off that conversation until next year. At $10,000, they cannot.

• 53:44Speaker 01

  You told. Totally misunderstand Apple like the Apple is totally fine to have that just hanging out there.

• 53:51Nilay Patel?

  At three to five, I agree.

• 53:52Speaker 01

  No, even at 10, they're totally fine to just have it hang out there. They don't, they don't care about what you think.

• 53:59Speaker 03

  What is the most expensive product Apple has ever made?

• 54:02Speaker 01

  Like the 20th anniversary.

• 54:05Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, $74.99.

• 54:07Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:08Nilay Patel?

  No, I don't think that's the most expensive product ever.

• 54:09Speaker 03

  I know you could like max out.

• 54:10Nilay Patel?

  Well, Lisa was like $18,000.

• 54:12Speaker 03

  Right, but you could max it up. I'm saying like baseline thing like this.

• 54:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, Lisa.

• 54:16Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 54:17Speaker 02

  Lisa was 10,000.

• 54:18Speaker 03

  No. Oh, wow.

• 54:19Speaker 01

  And plus, if it's not replaceable or they leave it out there, it becomes even more of a luxury item, even though like, like a $10,000 watch. But a $10,000 watch that expired, that goes bad after a couple of years is way more baller than a $30,000 watch that lasts forever.

• 54:34Nilay Patel?

  I don't understand that.

• 54:35Speaker 01

  That is ostentatious.

• 54:37Nilay Patel?

  The Lisa was introduced in January 19th, 1903 and costs $10,000, approximately $23,700 in today's dollars.

• 54:45Speaker 01

  And well, that was the.

• 54:46Nilay Patel?

  That's crazy.

• 54:47Speaker 01

  Right, but that was the product that made the Mac exist, right? Because Steve Jobs was like, this is ridiculous.

• 54:52Nilay Patel?

  It's just funny, we complain about like $700 phones now.

• 54:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah.

• 54:55Nilay Patel?

  And it's like, ugh. There's a Lisa for 24K, everybody. It runs one app and it's crappy.

• 55:02Speaker 01

  And it's not even gold.

• 55:03Nilay Patel?

  It's a revolution.

• 55:05Speaker 03

  You're, you're, you both are presumably going to be there, right? You like Neel and Dieter, they're, they're, they're going to get to the, the watch price and they're going to be like, it starts at 3.49 or whatever, right? They're in a room, you're going to be in a room with developers, okay?

• 55:20Speaker 01

  No, we're going to be in a room with incredibly, no, no, incredibly fashionable, beautiful, rich fashion people.

• 55:27Speaker 03

  I just, I, it's going to be, to me, I think it would be absolutely laughable if Apple was like, yeah, the gold one's $10,000. Ha, ha, ha, you rich people are going to buy it anyway, like, no way.

• 55:37Speaker 01

  No, they're gonna, they're.

• 55:38Nilay Patel?

  Okay, I would like to point out that my finger gun story is way more believable than, than Tim Cook tackling at rich people.

• 55:44Speaker 01

  It's the most beautiful.

• 55:45Nilay Patel?

  Like, you know, he's a rich person.

• 55:48Nilay Patel?

  I'm going to buy it as well.

• 55:52Speaker 03

  A week and a half.

• 55:52Speaker 01

  They're not the aliens from The Simpsons.

• 55:57Speaker 03

  Chris, I'm with you.

• 55:58Nilay Patel?

  It's gonna be like, we made a product that only other Apple employees could afford to buy.

• 56:03Speaker 03

  No, like, the people in Dubai and people in China and people in India and people, rich people everywhere are going to buy the gold one. But ten to twenty thousand dollars is absurd. And I'm happy to be proved wrong.

• 56:15Speaker 02

  It's not gonna be ten to twenty.

• 56:17Nilay Patel?

  I would say the class of people that you are talking about, that they spend that much money on like, private plane flights. Which are, you know, like, that's true.

• 56:26Speaker 03

  I guess, yeah. They're just, they're just on a whole nother level of like, monetary, like, how they think of value, like. When you like, spend like, twenty bucks, like, out drinks, it's like, oh, I'll drop ten grand, like, at a club, kind of thing, right?

• 56:38Nilay Patel?

  I mean, like Shane Smith, he spent three hundred thousand dollars.

• 56:41Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 56:41Nilay Patel?

  The CEO of IAS, at CES, spent three hundred thousand dollars on wine and dinner.

• 56:45Speaker 03

  Right.

• 56:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, but to be fair, he had just one hundred thousand dollars playing blackjack.

• 56:48Nilay Patel?

  So he was like, I'll spend three hundred thousand dollars on this dinner, like, sure. Like, it was so much money that it made, that this story came out because it made the casino's earnings report. Like, it was like, highlights of the quarter, it's like, one person is rich. Like, circled. This was cool, smiley face.

• 57:09Nilay Patel?

  No, I think they gotta go big. I don't know, I don't have any backup on that. I don't, I, I think that they have to. If they're, if they are doing what they say they're doing, right, Johnny, I was redoing the store with Angela Aaronson. They're doing all of that, it's not for a bunch of like, thousand dollar watches.

• 57:25Speaker 03

  Hey, so then maybe this is like-

• 57:27Nilay Patel?

  Like, Apple, Apple's already in the category of retailers that sells thousand dollar items.

• 57:32Speaker 02

  Right, but, but a five thousand dollar watch is, is a Breitling, it's a Fortis, it's a, it's a very low end Rolex. It's, it's, it's still a high end watch, but it's, it's, uh, within the realm of reason that a normal would buy it, can buy it.

• 57:47Nilay Patel?

  I think that they, they've got, they've got the low end edition for the normals.

• 57:50Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 57:51Nilay Patel?

  But like, I'm talking about the top tier-

• 57:53Speaker 03

  I'm starting to kind of like shift.

• 57:55Nilay Patel?

  Is going to not be for normals.

• 57:56Speaker 03

  Like, you picture the Apple store, like, a year, right?

• 57:59Speaker 02

  The whole point of luxury is that regular people can't afford it, that's why it exists.

• 58:02Nilay Patel?

  But I'm saying, right.

• 58:03Speaker 02

  It's not because it feels good or looks good.

• 58:05Nilay Patel?

  Only get to watch in gold and rose gold.

• 58:08Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 58:08Speaker 02

  Man, this gold with black band looks pretty cool.

• 58:10Speaker 03

  And so does a gold with red. Here's what I'll say like-

• 58:12Nilay Patel?

  But Apple can split the difference. They can have it both ways.

• 58:14Speaker 03

  So, so imagine like in a year from now, the Apple Store-

• 58:17Speaker 02

  We think the gold with red looks good?

• 58:18Nilay Patel?

  We're never gonna resolve this. We're never gonna convince each other we should move on.

• 58:21Speaker 03

  The gold with red looks awesome. No, I think the, the Apple Stores with this watch-

• 58:25Speaker 02

  I think it just looks like my mom. Like, I look at this and like, I definitely just see like my mom. Like, this is my mom's purse.

• 58:31Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 58:32Speaker 02

  Yeah. Anyway, carry on.

• 58:32Speaker 03

  That's the point. No, I was gonna say, like, this-

• 58:35Nilay Patel?

  Like, that's the whole reason why I don't think that you're gonna be able to, like, interchange the straps is, look at the- Yeah, yeah. The dot on the crown.

• 58:42Speaker 03

  This could be Apple's move into, like, the real luxury game. Like, when you go into an Apple Store, it's like computers, phones, and then like, watches. Nice, beautiful. And then the, the $10,000 one is like, in the glass case with like, lights and stuff.

• 58:58Nilay Patel?

  It's like the Virtu Store inside the Nokia Store.

• 59:00Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 59:00Nilay Patel?

  The- Or the-

• 59:01Speaker 02

  Hype check $10,000.

• 59:03Nilay Patel?

  Or like the Magnolia Store inside the Best Buy, but not totally broken.

• 59:06Speaker 03

  It's- I can't wait to see like, rich kids of Instagram and every one of those dudes is just gonna have the gold Apple Watch. Like, it is gonna be awesome to do a hashtag search on Instagram that day and the next day and like, the first week to see, like, the just influx of rich dudes on their private jets. Cause like, that's gonna be-

• 59:25Speaker 02

  It's not gonna be that cool to see that.

• 59:26Speaker 03

  It's- I think it will be cool. It'll be hype. It'll be hype for like, a minute.

• 59:29Nilay Patel?

  Really.

• 59:30Speaker 02

  Isn't it gonna be weird when you guys are live blogging next to like, Vogue? Like, cause that's what's gonna happen this time. Anna, Anna Wintour is gonna be next to you, live blogging.

• 59:39Nilay Patel?

  Just like tethered with her DSLR.

• 59:41Speaker 02

  Duper weird.

• 59:41Nilay Patel?

  Yeah. And she's taking pictures of their flip phone.

• 59:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:44Nilay Patel?

  Uh huh. How are they gonna give her a watch?

• 59:45Speaker 02

  Oh, no. She probably uses a, a Porsche Design P9999898.

• 59:52Speaker 03

  What the hell phone is that? BlackBerry?

• 59:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 59:55Speaker 03

  Jesus.

• 59:56Nilay Patel?

  Well, I was just watching a movie where, where like, there was like, the guy who was like, a rich guy and they gave him a Porsche BlackBerry and it was super funny. I can't remember what movie it was.

• 1:00:04Speaker 02

  In, uh, in that movie where, um, Sacha Baron Cohen is a dictator. The dictator. He uses.

• 1:00:11Speaker 03

  Good job, Chris.

• 1:00:12Speaker 02

  He uses, he uses in the movie Amobiato, which is a, I believe it's a, is it a Canadian brand? I don't know, but it's, it's an ultra high end. It's like a Virtu competitor. It's the only time I've ever seen Amobiato outside of like.

• 1:00:25Speaker 03

  They probably paid a hell of dollars to put it in that movie.

• 1:00:28Nilay Patel?

  Man, I'm gonna definitely end up buying one of these.

• 1:00:30Speaker 03

  The gold?

• 1:00:31Nilay Patel?

  No, no.

• 1:00:32Speaker 03

  Are you hype lord?

• 1:00:33Nilay Patel?

  If I had $20,000 to blow, I would definitely just go on one coast to coast private plane flight.

• 1:00:38Speaker 03

  Just to do it? And then you, and then you would buy the watch and then ride home with the watch?

• 1:00:43Nilay Patel?

  No, it's just, here's the thing about this watch in particular, like you can just spend $349 and have this watch.

• 1:00:47Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:00:47Nilay Patel?

  Like, Chris is like a watch guy, right? Like you care about watches.

• 1:00:51Speaker 03

  Do you have a watch on right now?

• 1:00:53Nilay Patel?

  No.

• 1:00:54Speaker 03

  Some watch guy, yeah.

• 1:00:55Nilay Patel?

  I do. Some watch guy.

• 1:00:57Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, but that's because you, you literally stole that off my desk. I watched you, I watched you.

• 1:01:03Nilay Patel?

  You refused to review.

• 1:01:04Speaker 02

  I watched you Bogart.

• 1:01:06Nilay Patel?

  I said, do you want to review this? You have until the end of the day to decide.

• 1:01:09Speaker 02

  At the end of the day, I said, are you doing it or not? And you're like, eh. And then I took it so that we could have a review.

• 1:01:15Nilay Patel?

  You straight up Bogarted the watch, bro.

• 1:01:17Speaker 02

  And you just keep lying.

• 1:01:19Speaker 03

  Chris, you buying an Apple Watch? Who in this room is not buying an Apple Watch?

• 1:01:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, I really.

• 1:01:25Nilay Patel?

  Okay, first of all, Chris buys everything.

• 1:01:27Speaker 03

  And then he's gonna try and sell it to us.

• 1:01:31Nilay Patel?

  Like, Chris, how fast until the staff email that says he wants an Apple Watch?

• 1:01:37Speaker 02

  Just follow Chris Ziegler on Twitter. He will sell one to you three hours after it's available.

• 1:01:42Speaker 03

  I mean, that's kind of, yes, that's kind of true.

• 1:01:44Nilay Patel?

  No, I mean, I will say the only, it's weird because I bought both Pebbles. I'll probably end up buying a Pebble Time.

• 1:01:49Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 1:01:50Nilay Patel?

  Just because.

• 1:01:51Speaker 02

  Pebble Time.

• 1:01:52Nilay Patel?

  Why did they name it?

• 1:01:53Speaker 03

  Stop. Is that a notification? When you get a notification, Pebble Time.

• 1:01:57Nilay Patel?

  I mean, it's such a bad name.

• 1:01:59Speaker 02

  Man, no, we, we had a solid hour of quality puns.

• 1:02:03Speaker 03

  Oh, no.

• 1:02:04Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, making, we ended up making time.

• 1:02:05Speaker 02

  When we do the headline.

• 1:02:07Nilay Patel?

  But like, whatever. It's like you have to, it's the first one of a new category. You can, of course, you gotta buy it. You gotta, you gotta screw with it a little bit. I mean, it's literally what we do here.

• 1:02:15Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:02:16Nilay Patel?

  But I.

• 1:02:17Speaker 03

  And you want to send your heartbeat to David Pierce? Oh, one question about this. One question. Are you gonna be able to do the Inspector Gadget? Hey, what's going on? Done. And then you listen to your message like on your wrist. Is there a speaker on this thing where you can just like? Listen to it like this?

• 1:02:31Speaker 02

  Why is your elbow? What's this?

• 1:02:33Speaker 03

  No, this like the watch is here. I'm gonna wear the watch on the inside of my wrist.

• 1:02:37Speaker 02

  Why?

• 1:02:38Nilay Patel?

  Cause he likes shattering things. No, it's got Ion X glass.

• 1:02:42Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, that's right.

• 1:02:44Nilay Patel?

  Are you gonna be able to do that? Wait, wait. This watch is like the pinnacle of Apple just giving things names that never had those names before.

• 1:02:50Speaker 03

  The crown.

• 1:02:51Nilay Patel?

  Tapped, yeah.

• 1:02:52Speaker 03

  All those names. No, but what are you gonna be able to do the the the dream of the, you know?

• 1:02:58Nilay Patel?

  That's not the dream of anyone but like wannabe Secret Service agents to like talk to your wrist.

• 1:03:03Speaker 03

  I can, I can text four friends right now, say, how sick would it be if you did the thing and they'd be like, hell, yeah.

• 1:03:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah, and then how sick would it be if you were Kevin Costner in The Bodyguard? He doesn't know what that is.

• 1:03:15Speaker 03

  Never seen that movie. So, nope. I will be Sam Schaefer with the Apple Watch.

• 1:03:21Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my god.

• 1:03:22Speaker 03

  So, can can any of you answer the question?

• 1:03:24Nilay Patel?

  I'm imagining Sam when he just stood right there.

• 1:03:28Speaker 03

  No one knows. No one knows. We'll find out Monday.

• 1:03:30Nilay Patel?

  He's saving Wendy. He's just running in.

• 1:03:33Speaker 03

  I've never seen this movie.

• 1:03:34Nilay Patel?

  The crowd's going crazy. The Bodyguard. You know, you know the Whitney Houston song, I Will Always Love You?

• 1:03:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, I know that one.

• 1:03:40Nilay Patel?

  That's from The Bodyguard. Right. That's where that, there was this like weird period where like hit songs only came from movies. Yeah.

• 1:03:47Speaker 03

  Is that true?

• 1:03:48Nilay Patel?

  True. Like, we, what were you looking at? We were looking at the Berlin song from Top Gun. Like, nobody believing that that song was written for Top Gun.

• 1:03:55Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 1:03:55Nilay Patel?

  Take My Breath Away is like, it's just from Top Gun. Yeah. Like, straight up, like, Berlin wasn't like, hey, cool song. They're like, like Jerry Bruckheimer was like, yeah, I got this movie about jets. And I'm like, got it.

• 1:04:09Nilay Patel?

  Fuck, that, that's Whitney Houston. I take, uh.

• 1:04:11Speaker 03

  What was the four year making of this movie?

• 1:04:13Nilay Patel?

  Uh, The Bodyguard?

• 1:04:14Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:15Nilay Patel?

  You should watch The Body, you should know these things.

• 1:04:17Speaker 03

  Neil, I high checked Bodyguard.

• 1:04:18Nilay Patel?

  I mean. You can't high check Neil, are you? Yeah, I mean.

• 1:04:21Speaker 03

  The hype checker has to come to the hype check.

• 1:04:23Nilay Patel?

  Especially on The Bodyguard. I, hype check refused.

• 1:04:27Speaker 03

  Smack the mallets.

• 1:04:28Nilay Patel?

  All right. Is that our show? We want to load it. Is there anything else we can talk about?

• 1:04:31Speaker 01

  Um, World Congress is coming up next week. Pay very close attention.

• 1:04:35Speaker 03

  When does it start?

• 1:04:36Speaker 01

  To what we're doing. Uh, I believe that like presto is like Sunday, so.

• 1:04:40Speaker 03

  So tune into The Verge on Sunday. Like a day where we're usually just probably hung over in bed or like out to brunch or like going on a job.

• 1:04:47Speaker 01

  If you have a case.

• 1:04:48Nilay Patel?

  This is the worst pitch ever.

• 1:04:49Speaker 01

  Come to theverge.com.

• 1:04:51Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah. Sundays on The Verge.

• 1:04:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:53Speaker 03

  Keep it locked.

• 1:04:53Nilay Patel?

  Sad together.

• 1:04:55Speaker 03

  No, happy together. So happy together.

• 1:04:57Nilay Patel?

  Oh, my God.

• 1:04:59Speaker 01

  So you could, the only song you're allowed to sing on The Verge cast is "I Will Always Love You."

• 1:05:02Speaker 03

  I am not going. Well, I might.

• 1:05:04Speaker 01

  In addition to our podcast, you can also find What's Tech, which is a great podcast.

• 1:05:09Speaker 03

  Yes, you should listen to What's Tech.

• 1:05:10Speaker 01

  Both are available at iTunes.com slash The Verge.

• 1:05:13Nilay Patel?

  We didn't talk about the Galaxy S6 at all.

• 1:05:15Speaker 03

  Hello, Llama Chaser. That's all you need to know. Hello, Llama Chaser.

• 1:05:18Nilay Patel?

  Here's actually the biggest news of the day.

• 1:05:20Speaker 03

  Oh, wait. Wait, can I tell a story? I want to tell the story. Okay. So, so Casey, one of our developers here.

• 1:05:28Nilay Patel?

  I'm still not talking about the Galaxy S.

• 1:05:31Speaker 03

  That thing, it'll leak to death before it comes. It already has. So Casey, one of our developers, saw it on the internet and goes, dude, Llama Chase. And I'm like, LOL, what? And he's like, dude, and he just hits me with the URL and he's like, put this on the TV. And I just put it on the TV and there's a live Llama Chase in the middle of, it was Arizona, right?

• 1:05:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, Arizona.

• 1:05:52Speaker 03

  And a black llama and a white llama. And then just like the internet just erupted with llama coverage. Okay? And Eli like comes out of a meeting. He's like, dude, there's this llama. And like as he's saying this, he turns around and he sees this big ass TV with the llama chase. And he just goes, yes. That's awesome. That's really awesome.

• 1:06:11Nilay Patel?

  It was really captivating.

• 1:06:12Speaker 03

  And then we just, we just sat there and watched the llama chase.

• 1:06:14Nilay Patel?

  It appears that llamas are very difficult to catch.

• 1:06:17Speaker 03

  It was like a solid 30 minutes.

• 1:06:19Nilay Patel?

  No, there's a, there's one long, I can't believe I'm talking. It's so stupid. There was one long sequence in which the man just calmly walked alongside the llama.

• 1:06:30Speaker 03

  He was gonna say, hey llama.

• 1:06:31Nilay Patel?

  And I was like, why didn't he just catch it? Like, you're right. Like, it's moving slow. You're moving slow.

• 1:06:36Speaker 03

  But what's your move?

• 1:06:37Nilay Patel?

  And then he like, he like reached out to like pet it. And the llama was like, nope. It's like, boo.

• 1:06:45Nilay Patel?

  The Galaxy S6 leaked a lot this

• 1:06:48Speaker 01

  So did the HGC 1M9.

• 1:06:50Nilay Patel?

  The HGC 1M9 looks terrible.

• 1:06:51Speaker 01

  It looks, it looks fine.

• 1:06:53Nilay Patel?

  It looks like the HGC M8.

• 1:06:54Speaker 01

  Why is that terrible?

• 1:06:55Nilay Patel?

  It looks like the H, in profile, it looks like the M8 wearing an astronaut suit. I'm just gonna say.

• 1:07:00Speaker 03

  The bottom of it is an iPhone.

• 1:07:02Nilay Patel?

  But you know what I'm talking about? It's got like a half and then it's got like the pack on the back.

• 1:07:05Speaker 01

  They gave it a camera that isn't a piece of junk. Like, isn't that all you wanted?

• 1:07:09Nilay Patel?

  Sure they did. I don't believe.

• 1:07:10Speaker 01

  Well, we'll see.

• 1:07:11Nilay Patel?

  Do you believe they gave it a camera that's a piece of junk?

• 1:07:12Speaker 01

  I don't believe any Android camera isn't a piece of junk until I try it and then I end up disappointed. That's what happens all the time.

• 1:07:17Nilay Patel?

  Chris is the only one who liked the Mi Notes camera, or didn't like the Mi Notes camera. Everyone else was like, this is great. I think our standards of photography have just fallen as a culture.

• 1:07:23Speaker 02

  Well, like, my, my test was the simplest possible test. I went into Herald Square, took a bunch of pictures with the Mi Note and the iPhone 6 Plus. One looked great, one looked terrible. End of story. And they were both full auto, which is how real people use their cameras. It's like, I, you know, I reject anyone who says, oh, well, you just needed to turn this on or this off or like, change the aperture. No, no, no, no. It like, when you open your camera, you press shoot and then you're done with it.

• 1:07:51Speaker 03

  Did you tap to focus, like, and, and expose for the, like, the bright sun?

• 1:07:56Speaker 01

  Did you use a camera?

• 1:08:00Speaker 02

  Uh, mm, I think so. I don't remember. But, um, but point being, like, I can show you all the shots I took. Like, they were consistently better on the 6 Plus.

• 1:08:13Speaker 03

  Uh, it doesn't really surprise me.

• 1:08:15Speaker 02

  But that being said, I mean, the Mi Note is, is a surprisingly good phone.

• 1:08:18Speaker 01

  Still haven't talked about the Galaxy S.

• 1:08:20Speaker 02

  Nah.

• 1:08:21Speaker 01

  We just can't do it. It leaked all over the place. Leaky, leaky McLeekerson. And it looks like there's two versions.

• 1:08:27Speaker 03

  There's the, the, the edge one and the regular one. And it has, literally has the bottom of the iPhone 6 and 6 Plus. Like, if you hold those things simultaneously and you have like one second to look, you will not be able to tell the difference.

• 1:08:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:08:40Speaker 03

  It is a straight gank.

• 1:08:42Speaker 01

  Sam, Sean O'Keane, Photoshop your face.

• 1:08:44Speaker 03

  Oh, I, yeah, I dropped, I dropped it in here. It is kind of beautiful.

• 1:08:47Speaker 01

  Well, I just tweeted it to everyone.

• 1:08:48Speaker 03

  Oh, great. Awesome.

• 1:08:50Nilay Patel?

  Uh, look, the Galaxy, it's gonna be fine, right? It's gonna be fine.

• 1:08:53Speaker 03

  We'll see it at Mobile World Congress.

• 1:08:55Nilay Patel?

  I'm telling you, but I will, I will, I will, I will, I will unequivocally, and everybody is questioning this. I think the one M9 looks bad. It has like a bad two-tone paint job. What are you looking at?

• 1:09:06Speaker 02

  This is the moment when the guy loses control of the llama?

• 1:09:09Nilay Patel?

  Oh, yeah?

• 1:09:11Nilay Patel?

  It's like, gone. I'm done with this. That's so good. That's my life.

• 1:09:14Speaker 03

  And he lassoed the crap out of that white one.

• 1:09:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:09:17Speaker 03

  It was awesome.

• 1:09:18Nilay Patel?

  Okay. Galaxy S6. We're probably gonna see, I mean, it's gonna be fine. I think the S6 Edge is a huge gimmick. I think those curved screens are a huge gimmick.

• 1:09:30Speaker 02

  Yes, I agree. And it's not to say that curved screens won't eventually be awesome, but I think they're still trying to figure out exactly what you do with them.

• 1:09:38Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:38Speaker 02

  And they haven't figured it out yet.

• 1:09:39Nilay Patel?

  And there's not, Samsung will never figure, like, Samsung, like, the task for Samsung, like, figure out what to do with a hardware gimmick? Like, it's not, it's like, that's like getting in a car and like, drive up. Samsung does not have that capability.

• 1:09:53Speaker 02

  If you remember correctly, their first phone with a curved display was the Galaxy Round, which was, which was first of all curved in the wrong direction inexplicably. Secondly, uh, the only, the only special feature about it was something called round interaction.

• 1:10:09Nilay Patel?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:09Speaker 02

  Which no one could actually figure out.

• 1:10:14Nilay Patel?

  It's funny how completely I blocked that out and how much it is coming back. I'm, like, Samsung is great at hardware gimmicks. They just don't have the chops to build software to take advantage of them. Anyway, that's it. Sam, you get, you get three social networks.

• 1:10:28Speaker 02

  Ooh, three.

• 1:10:28Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:10:29Nilay Patel?

  You gotta pick. I, I think there's.

• 1:10:30Speaker 03

  Snapchat.

• 1:10:31Nilay Patel?

  There's, there's one. Do that.

• 1:10:32Speaker 03

  Snapchat. Um, you should follow us on Snapchat. Uh, we are The Real Verge. We have like a bunch of shows, like new shows come up every week. Then we have our YouTube channel. You should subscribe to us on YouTube. We are youtube.com/theverge. Awesome videos there as always. There is a hella backlog of videos you can find too.

• 1:10:48Nilay Patel?

  Hella backlog.

• 1:10:49Speaker 03

  Um, and you can also, um, find us on Facebook. We are facebook.com/verge. We post all of our articles there as they happen. Uh, hella articles. And, and that's where you should hit us up. Um, and yeah, that's.

• 1:11:02Nilay Patel?

  That was the right three social networks.

• 1:11:03Speaker 03

  That's, that's the, that's the thing.

• 1:11:05Nilay Patel?

  Sam is at SamSheffer on.

• 1:11:06Speaker 03

  Shab, ShabSheffer.

• 1:11:09Nilay Patel?

  Sam is available on Twitter. So is Dieter. So am I.

• 1:11:12Speaker 03

  At SamSheffer.

• 1:11:13Nilay Patel?

  Backlong, reckless, Z Power, Sam Sheffer.

• 1:11:17Nilay Patel?

  You should go on iTunes. That's the thing you should do. You should tell me how much you should rate. Give us five stars on iTunes and then tell us how much you think the Apple Watch Edition will cost. Also, apparently, many other podcast apps.

• 1:11:32Speaker 02

  Many.

• 1:11:33Nilay Patel?

  All of them, actually, no.

• 1:11:34Speaker 02

  Every single podcast app.

• 1:11:35Nilay Patel?

  I think we just did a Stitcher thing. We're just get in there. Get in your podcast zone.

• 1:11:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:11:39Nilay Patel?

  Rate us highly and then leave a comment about the price of the Apple Watch Edition. And that's it. That's The Vergecast.

• 1:11:46Speaker 01

  Goodbye.

• 1:12:07Speaker 04

  Hi, I'm Chris Plant, and I believe technology can be, well, a little impenetrable. So I've invited my friends into a tiny padded room to tell me how it all works.

• 1:12:17Nilay Patel?

  And now you're just on your high horse, and you don't care about the people. You just care about getting what you want.

• 1:12:23Speaker 05

  I almost killed a woman and her child on a bicycle with a drone.

• 1:12:27Speaker 06

  I'd say probably my all-time, like, true heart of hearts ship is Agent Dale Cooper and Audrey Horne on Twin Peaks.

• 1:12:34Speaker 04

  I'm sitting there with this watch on my wrist, and the staff at this particular Applebee's were not too impressed. You can hear it all on my new podcast, What's Tech?, from The Verge.