Hotline: Folding phones in cars, EVs in Mexico

Transportation editor Andrew Hawkins is here to answer your questions about the confluence of cars and gadgets. Could a folding phone replace a dashboard display? What to do about the iPhone Pro Max not fitting the Tesla's built-in wireless charger? And we hear from a listener who -- shockingly -- doesn't care about CarPlay. Further reading: The car of the future is an EV golf cart Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to [email protected] or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

• 0:02Speaker 00

  Welcome to The Vergecast, the flagship podcast of Android Auto. I'm one of the producers of the show, Travis Larchuk, and today we've got a very fun hotline episode for you. The Verge's transportation editor, Andrew Hawkins, is going to join us to answer some of your questions that we've been saving up about cars. Before we get to it, you should know that we did tape this before the iPhone Duo was announced. The first question we talk about hits on folding phones. We specifically talk about the Z Fold 8. We obviously would have brought up the Duo if we had taped this. After, we do not have time machine technology at The Verge yet. We are working on it. Before we get to that, here's what else is happening on The Verge today.

• 0:42Speaker 01

  I'm Josh Kahas, and this is 90 Seconds on The Verge for Wednesday, September 23rd, 2026. Meta is expected to announce new smart glasses tonight. Its Meta Connect event starts at 7:00 PM Eastern, and we'll be live blogging it here at The Verge. The big question, can you forget how you feel about Meta? Mark Zuckerberg would probably like it if he did. Meta has found itself at the center of high-profile lawsuits, negative press, and public backlash against its products and technologies. And its Reality Labs division also took over $80 billion in operating losses over the last five years. Let's see if these new pervert glasses can right the ship. Meanwhile, Discord will now automatically estimate your age. Starting today, Discord will automatically assign users to an estimated age group based

• 1:23Speaker 01

  on multiple account signals, such as account age in history and connected communities, servers, and games. Back in February, Discord received criticism for its botched age verification rollout that resulted in a data breach that exposed user info and scanned photo IDs. With this new system, the company is anticipating that 90% of its users won't be asked to confirm their age and aims to use less intrusive options that don't require sensitive personal data. And finally, if you're looking for another place to see advertisements, great news. According to a report from Bloomberg, McDonald's is launching a limited pilot program for displaying ads from other brands on its drive-through menus while customers wait for their meals. McDonald's spokesperson told Bloomberg that this test allows the company to explore

• 2:04Speaker 01

  ways to share post-purchase content that customers may find helpful, relevant, or interesting. In other words, people aren't buying enough 20-piece McNuggets, so can we please sell you some Meta AI glasses on the side? You can read more at theverge.com. That's 90 Seconds on The Verge for Wednesday, September 23rd, 2026.

• 2:23Speaker 02

  Support for the show comes from Amazon Prime. Believe it or not, the holidays are just around the corner. Do you feel ready? Have you been making your list and checking it twice? Maybe not, but that's okay, because here's a tip that'll help you knock out all of your holiday shopping at once without going broke. I'm talking about Prime Big Deal Days. On October 6th and 7th, get epic deals on home decor, fitness gear, electronics, toys, and so much more with new deals every day. Prime Big Deal Days is here. Shop deals now.

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• 3:31Speaker 00

  Andrew, let's talk cars.

• 3:33Speaker 02

  Let's do it. I'm down.

• 3:34Speaker 00

  All right. Here is, first of all, you're the transportation editor.

• 3:37Speaker 02

  I am.

• 3:38Speaker 00

  What is your favorite form of transportation?

• 3:40Speaker 02

  Bicycle.

• 3:41Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 3:41Speaker 02

  Hands down, bicycle. It's the most efficient. It's the, it's the one that will leave you feeling better about your life and your choices. Everyone should ride a bike. And if you can't ride a bike, I'm sorry, but I hope that there, there's a variety of mobility devices that are close to, close enough to a bike that I feel like everyone has the potential to get on a bike, and I very much encourage everyone to do that.

• 4:05Speaker 00

  Well, now that we've said that, let's talk about cars.

• 4:07Speaker 02

  Damn it.

• 4:08Speaker 00

  All right. We've got our first question. This is from Brandon, and this is, uh, this is kind of a curveball to start us off. It's actually about the Galaxy Z Fold.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  Something I know a lot about.

• 4:22Speaker 00

  And it does relate to cars, so here we go.

• 4:25Speaker 05

  This is Brandon. I've been listening to your podcast for a while, big fan, and all the discussion about the new Galaxy Z Fold and how you kind of don't need a phone that opens up. I know there's not much of a case for it, but I was wondering if there might be a case made by, weirdly enough, the Slate Truck? Because I can see a market where you have a phone that you then unfold and set up as like your console in your car. Or if you're a drone pilot, you open it up and you use that as your control system. Obviously, it's not going to be much use for the average person. You just open it up, watch videos.

• 5:05Speaker 05

  Nobody's really going to do that, but for utility uses, the Z Fold and these foldable phones might have more use as long as they have like as a control system. And I just want to know what your thoughts are on that. Is that a good enough case for them?

• 5:22Speaker 00

  So first of all, can you remind us what the Slate Truck is?

• 5:25Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 5:25Speaker 00

  And why this?

• 5:26Speaker 02

  I just want to, uh, we'll set this, see, the Slate Truck is a new electric truck that is in production right now. And the whole concept of it is like, you know, strip out everything that you possibly can strip out from an electric vehicle, except for, you know, all the basics. And that is the way to sort of bring down the cost, right? Because that's been sort of like this persistent problem in the EV market today is that they're just too expensive, and a lot of that has to do with the battery and supply chains. But essentially, Slate's philosophy is like, if we just stripped everything away, if we start, get rid of all the features, all the fancy stuff, they, I mean, they really did. I mean, they got rid of the power windows, they got rid of the internal screen, there's no radio, um, there's not, you know, I mean, there's HVAC and there's a steering wheel,

• 6:10Speaker 02

  and that's basically it. So, you know, the idea of like a manual crank, uh, uh, for, for your windows, I think, would probably shock a lot of people in, uh, in our modern, modern days today. But I think that that is sort of what they're trying to get at. You can add a lot of stuff, you can sort of spec your Slate Truck and build it as you would like, like to see it, but the, the bare bones blank slate has basically very little. So I think what this guy is getting at is, you know, there's no screen in the car, there's no infotainment system, there's no way to sort of get, you know, sort of the standard things that we all now kind of like live to expect these days, whether it's navigation or media, music, podcasts, whatnot, this podcast.

• 6:51Speaker 02

  So I love this question so much because it could only spring from the mind of a Vergecast listener in some ways, right? Because you're, it shows that you're like listening to all the stuff that we're talking about, and I really appreciate that. I think that that's amazing. And yeah, I do think that there is a case to be made that a foldable phone/table like the Z Fold could have a use case in, in the Slate Truck, because it is sort of like the ultimate BYO electric vehicle. Like you bring your own phone and there's, it's, you can, you can add up a mount to the dashboard and you can just have your phone sort of mounted in there, much in the way that a lot of people do with their phones, a lot of Uber drivers, for example. And so the idea of having just like your, your skinny little iPhone or Android phone,

• 7:36Speaker 02

  maybe that's not appealing to a lot of people. Maybe they want something that's a little bit bigger. So they could possibly have, you know, bring their, their foldable in, in, and that could serve that, that purpose, I think, very well. I feel like this, this feels like a challenge to me personally. Like I'm, once we get the Slate Truck to test out, and I feel like I got to bring a Z Fold with me in order to, to do this. So Brandon, if you're out there, I'm going to make this happen. I don't know how or when it's going to happen, or if the Slate, Slate is ultimately going to be a successful product or not, but I'm going to try my best to make this happen for you.

• 8:10Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's just, it gets to the ongoing, you know, where is the computer question? I can't wait for the article where we go through what foldable form factor is best to put it to your Slate Truck.

• 8:25Speaker 00

  Well, this one is, this next question is related to this. This comes from Maxwell.

• 8:32Speaker 00

  Who writes in, "I drive a Tesla that has a built-in wireless charger and I really liked it when I got it. Handy place to put the phone, no cords, neat. Until I upgraded to a 17 Pro Max last year and now my phone won't charge because the massive camera bump lifts it too high off of the charger. This is such a problem that you can find aftermarket MagSafe replacements that go in the same spot, but personally I have just started using a cord again."

• 8:59Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 8:59Speaker 00

  This is like a tale as old as time with like built-in technology in cars, right? Like you've got a bunch of, you know, USB ports now all over the place.

• 9:08Speaker 02

  Right. And if there's anything that can really show sort of like how fast technology is moving and how quickly old technology becomes obsolete, it's the car, right? Because that is the, you know, the sort of the piece of technology or the product that people tend to keep around the longest, right?

• 9:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 9:23Speaker 02

  Like, you know, if they're not, maybe, you know, maybe they don't have like a three year lease. Maybe they, you know, they, they're, they're paying off their car or what have you. It's something that they want to keep for a long time and they want to get a lot of use out of it. So it is, I can understand the frustration when wireless technology and obviously phone technology is sort of not keeping the pace with what you got in your car. Yeah, it's, it's a, it's, I mean, like, you know, it's a first world problem, but it's a problem nonetheless. And it's something that I did a little digging after I read this question and saw that there's a lot of people who are experiencing this problem. Especially because, I mean, this is something that people, you know, have been complaining about wireless charging in their cars for a long time. If you don't have Qi charging in your car, it, it's a fair bet. I don't have it in my car, for example, and

• 10:08Speaker 02

  the wireless charging pad sucks. Every time I take the phone out, it feels like it has less power than it went in and it's like really hot to the touch. So it just feels like it's not working. So I've actually been, been plugging it in with the regular old USB C for a long time as well. And it's fine. It works a lot better that way, I think. Because yeah, it's like with that camera bump, you're just making the, the, the, the charging pad have to work all that much harder to get the charge into your phone, which you don't want to do. That's what really heats up the, the phone too. So it's, I can see the problem there. And I think that the solution, while inelegant, is just plug it in.

• 10:46Speaker 00

  I have a question. Are there any cars that have figured out a good place? Like if, if you've plugged your phone in, a good place to put your phone when it's plugged in? Because I've been in so many cars where it's like, okay, cause I can like jam this into a place that was like made for coins or like put it upside down into the cup holder. Have you, have you been in any cars that have figured this out?

• 11:06Speaker 02

  They, they, they are trying, they have their best minds working on Travis. I, I, and I, I feel like they, they are still struggling. I've been in a lot of cars and I've seen all variety of little drawers and slots and cubbies and weird sort of like all sorts of manners of things that they're trying to find a way where people can put their phones so that it doesn't fall in that dreaded place, the space between your seat and the center console where everything goes to die and nothing ever comes out again. So yeah, it is, it is a constant problem. I haven't really seen anyone quite figure it out yet. I feel like Tesla has a good solution. It's just like it's at an angle and it like just

• 11:49Speaker 02

  goes there really well. Although now with the camera bump, it's, it's a little bit less of a flat, perfect fit for a lot of them. I mean, yeah, I don't know. It's, it's, you know, because phones are changing and the sizes are so different. It's like, how do you design a solution, right? When everyone's got something different, right? Maybe you have a Z-fold and you want to like unfold it and, and, and have that charge. You know, it's, it's sort of like, I can, I can sympathize with the automakers who are just like trying to engineer a solution to like a constantly shifting problem.

• 12:20Speaker 00

  All right. This is our last question along this theme. It is from a listener who has not identified themselves.

• 12:27Speaker 06

  Can I just say that I don't care about Apple CarPlay and all that? Like all my cars have it and I want it. But the reality is, the only reason I actually want it, deep down, if I had to like strip away all the features and you're like, what's the one thing you could have? It's for the maps. I drive a Toyota Land Cruiser now, the new one, and I had to pay a subscription for the map to tell me what road I'm on, to tell me the north, south, east, west, anything. And the map sucks. They gave me the free trial. It was terrible. So CarPlay, I don't care. Good maps, I do care.

• 13:02Speaker 00

  We found the one person who doesn't care about CarPlay.

• 13:05Speaker 02

  Was that person's name N, N Patel? No. That's probably not. No. Uh, I, you know, it's a lot, a lot of people disagree with that statement. A lot of people care about Apple CarPlay as we find amongst our readers and in surveys done, uh, you know, that it is the, like the number one thing that people care about in their cars. And I think like automakers are figuring out that maps are kind of like a sneaky way of getting around, having to sort of bend over backwards for Apple or for Google. And the way that they figured it out is to bend over backwards for Apple and Google by just integrating

• 13:48Speaker 02

  their own map, those own, you know, those tech companies mapping products into, directly into the software of their, of their vehicle. So you've got GM right now, who uses, you know, Google built-in, you know, a variety of other automakers do as well, Volvo, Volvo, Polestar, a bunch of others. Ford just announced that it's going to be directly integrating Apple Maps into its future vehicles, which has sneakily become like, I think a lot better in some ways than Google Maps.

• 14:17Speaker 00

  It really is.

• 14:17Speaker 02

  I made the switch recently and I'm like enjoying it a lot more. But yeah, I think that that's, that's sort of like what you're seeing from the automakers is that they're realizing that their own navigation systems suck terribly. And while they would love to keep, um, you know, their customers within their own sort of like software ecosystem, they, I think they're realizing that that's not what they want. The customers want Apple CarPlay. They want Android Auto. They want their own maps with their own saved places and their own routes and everything that's like, you know, sort of perfectly curated to the, to, you know, to the way that they want, want it to be. So the way to do that is to sort of just have it be a native app on the infotainment. And I think that that's what we're sort of seeing the trend now.

• 14:58Speaker 00

  What is the advantage of that as opposed to just CarPlay or Android Auto?

• 15:04Speaker 02

  Well, yeah, I think the, especially if you have an electric vehicle, there's ways in which, you know, you can bring in vehicle data into your, into the map and into the navigation that a lot of electric vehicle owners will find very useful. So like, for example, like if you're navigating, you know, on a road trip and you want to see how much charge you have left when you get to your destination, uh, you know, a native, a native system will, would be able to see that better than a phone mirrored system or a projected system. And there's also a lot of other things too about, uh, sort of like ways in which that they can better merge sort of the, the data of the vehicle itself, the driving data, fuel levels, all that kind of stuff into the map. So make it, you know, just a better experience for people.

• 15:46Speaker 00

  Cool. I have a comment about maps in cars.

• 15:49Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 15:49Speaker 00

  I think if I'm on, and there might be a way to do this. I think if I'm on a road trip where I'm going like five hours or something, I need to be able to hide how much time is left in the trip. Cause I look at that like maybe every two minutes. I'm like, oh my God.

• 16:03Speaker 02

  I need to do the, the exact same thing, but only because I have a petulant eight year old in my backseat usually who's like sees the map and sees the amount of time and is constantly giving me a headache about how much, how much, literally if it takes more than five minutes to get to any destination, he's pissed off. So yes, I agree with you. We need to find a way to hide the amount of time left.

• 16:24Speaker 00

  You hear that, Apple?

• 16:26Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 16:27Speaker 00

  You hear that, Google?

• 16:28Speaker 02

  Please find it for, Andy and Travis are asking you specifically to hide that.

• 16:32Speaker 00

  Let us swipe it away.

• 16:36Speaker 07

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• 20:41Speaker 00

  All right, our next question, we did a very fun episode about this trend of EV golf cart like cars.

• 20:49Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, that was fun.

• 20:50Speaker 00

  Yeah, it was great. And this question is related to that.

• 20:55Speaker 09

  Hey, Vergecast, this is Jason from Nova Scotia. I've been thinking a lot after hearing the EV golf cart episode. And I've been thinking a lot about Fisker and the downfall of Fisker 2.0. I think there's a lot to learn there. And I guess my question is like, why haven't we seen a company that essentially takes as many existing off the shelf pieces and builds a reasonable car? One of the things that I see, like the downfall of Fisker was that they really tried to do in-house software that was bad. I think one of the things that they really did right was partner with Magna for manufacturing and engineering, because they took a company that knows how to build and manufacture a car.

• 21:37Speaker 09

  And a lot of these startup companies try and do everything and reinvent the wheel themselves. So like new batteries, new motors in-house, software in-house, you know, all of these vertical integration like Tesla, and they try and try and copy that model. But I wonder, like, we're at a point now where Rivian provides automotive software, Google provides automotive software. We can buy off the shelf batteries. You can buy Bosch motors that are really good. You can partner with Magna. I'm just wondering, like, why? We, I don't think there's a car company that I'm aware of that's like just taking as many off the shelf pieces and just putting together a really good car. Just curious if you have any thoughts on that?

• 22:17Speaker 09

  And like whether there's just kind of a missed opportunity there and we've just yet to see it.

• 22:23Speaker 00

  So first, can we, can we define some terms here? Can you remind us Fisker, who they are? What, what is the, the failure that is being referred to here?

• 22:31Speaker 02

  Absolutely. So Fisker was a, a car company that went bankrupt a few years ago. Henrik Fisker was the, the founder of that company. Their idea was to build, you know, and they did. They, they built one car, one car only called the Ocean. And if you live in New York City, you'll probably see a lot of them out on the street right now because they're being used by Uber drivers almost exclusively. But this was, you know, he's sort of like this famed auto automotive designer who had like a long story career, wanted to start his own thing, fashioned himself a bit of a, you know, it's like a, another Elon Musk type. And it just didn't work out, you know? It's, you know, for, I think, a variety of reasons. You had the pandemic, you had chip shortages and supply chain disruptions and all sorts of things.

• 23:16Speaker 02

  And he went, he tried to go, you know, tried to sort of navigate through those turbulent waters and didn't end up happening. It was one of many EV companies, EV only companies, sort of in that, those exuberant pandemic and post pandemic years that did not pan out. And I think, yeah, I think that this, that Jason has, has the right, right idea that this, that they tried to do too much, right? And you're seeing some of those companies, it's working out for them, right? For Rivian, it's working out. They are also sort of taking the Tesla path of vertically integrating, designing their own software, designing their own chips, building their own motors. But, you know, at the same time, no company is completely 100% vertically integrated, right? Like, they're sourcing their battery cells from, you know, from China.

• 24:01Speaker 02

  They have to, you know, while they are designing their own autonomous driving software chips, the chips will have to be built and, and produced at a chip fab by, by an outside chip manufacturer. So I think that there are companies that are more vertically integrated than others. I'm not, I'm no expert in this at all, but I do talk to a lot of these companies and ask them, you know, why are you spending so much upfront to do all of this stuff? When you could just do what Jason is suggesting? Buy, buy the Nvidia chips off the shelf, buy, you know, the, the motors from Bosch or buy, you know, the cells from, from Panasonic or whomever. And the answers they always give to me is, you know, the, the upfront cost is for, you know,

• 24:45Speaker 02

  in the future, we'll, we'll be able to reap all of those benefits from that, all the revenue, all the profits. And they don't have to then turn around and sink those profits into the, you know, more suppliers who, you know, they don't have control of the suppliers. They could raise the prices, they could, you know, there are, there are constraints, there are shortages. You know, they're selling to other people as well. You know, there's a lot of complication and supplier, you know, sort of tier one supplier and OEM relationships. And I think that, you know, these companies, in order to sort of position themselves, what they see as the best success for the future is to sort of vertically integrate as much as possible. Now, I think what he's saying with, with regard to these golf cart, low speed electric vehicle

• 25:27Speaker 02

  companies that we're starting to see come out, companies like Ambo and Chip and some others, they are kind of going that route. They are, you know, Ambo, for example, which is building this really cool looking golf cart, is contracting with Magna. And I'm sure like a lot of the parts are coming from suppliers. Magna is a European-based contract manufacturer. So basically, you know, other car companies will, will work with them to just do like sort of the, the, the basic, you know, process of, of assembling and building their cars. So they're, they're one of several, but they're kind of like one of the top in the field in terms of contract manufacturing. And so, you know, while the design and sort of the, you know, the core technology might be

• 26:12Speaker 02

  in-house, most of the stuff that they're going to be getting is coming from outside because they can't just like, you know, a company like this, a small startup, which has the aspirations to become like the biggest, you know, golf cart company in the world, which I, you know, there's still like a hard ceiling on that aspiration. It is not going to build its own like huge vehicle manufacturing factory in the same way that like, for example, Rivian was able to do. So I, I, I think you see a lot of diversity out there. I think that there's something to be said for Jason's idea of just like cobbling together like a Frankenstein car from like all of these outside, you know, suppliers. I think that that would be kind of cool, but I don't know if the math on the sort of the business side really works necessarily in that way.

• 26:57Speaker 00

  All right, we got one more. All right. Okay, this is from Claudio. Here we go. Hey, Andrew, specifically addressed to you.

• 27:04Speaker 02

  Wow, I, Claudio, I see you, I hear you. Thank you.

• 27:09Speaker 00

  Hey, Andrew, listen to the Vergecast episode about how BYD beat Tesla. If Neel I won't expense a trip to China for you and David to drive cars unavailable in the US. Come on, Neel I.

• 27:21Speaker 02

  Let's do it.

• 27:22Speaker 00

  I would like to go too, if possible. A cheaper option is to take a short flight to Mexico City. You should look at the Mexican car market. It could provide good insight into what could come to the US soon. The car market in Mexico is highly competitive and new Chinese brands have quickly grabbed a significant share. Even American brands like Chevrolet are now rebadging Chinese models as theirs. If you like the BYD Seagull, you need to check out the Chevrolet Spark EUV. BYD even launched its first pickup truck, the BYD Shark in Mexico before it did in China.

• 27:55Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:55Speaker 00

  What do you think?

• 27:56Speaker 02

  Well, first, I just want to say the reason why I've not been to China yet to drive any of their electric vehicles is because The Verge pays its own way. Many other outlets and influencers and content creators accept paid travel from these companies. So they're, you know, flying on, you know, BYD's dime. The Verge doesn't do that. We don't accept money or anything of value from the companies we cover. That's just the, the price we pay for having ethics in this bankrupt world of ours. But yes, no, Claudio is absolutely right. Mexico is increasingly becoming a place where you're going to see a lot of these Chinese vehicles, Canada as well. Canada just started importing several thousand electric vehicles for the very first time.

• 28:39Speaker 02

  We are now going to be sandwiched in between two countries in which there's going to be plenty of electric vehicles. There are a lot of, you know, sort of sneaky electric vehicles in the United States. We have our Volvos, we have our Polestars. Polestar, just recently, they ruled against them and they're not going to be allowed to sell in the United States anymore, unfortunately. But there are vehicles that are made, Lincolns, for example. Your grandfather's Lincoln might've come from China, because a lot of those Lincolns are built and made in China. But because it has the Lincoln brand on it, somehow it's okay. So we had this policy in place that this allows some brands, but not others. I happen to think that eventually we will get some Chinese electric vehicles with some pretty, you know, strict limitations on like who and what and where and how.

• 29:23Speaker 02

  But I think Claudio is absolutely right. Claudio, if you want to put me up in Mexico, I don't, I don't know if you live there, but I would happy to, I can couch crash, crash on your couch. And I'd love to go and test out some of the, the Chinese vehicles that they have there.

• 29:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, and any listeners in China, if you want to put us up in your apartment.

• 29:42Speaker 02

  We're, we're available. We're very neat, we're clean.

• 29:44Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 29:45Speaker 02

  We tidy up after ourselves.

• 29:47Speaker 00

  Neel I, open up the budget, come on.

• 29:49Speaker 02

  It'll be a fun hang.

• 29:50Speaker 00

  Let us go to China.

• 29:51Speaker 02

  I promise.

• 29:52Speaker 00

  All right. Thank you, Andrew. This is great.

• 29:55Speaker 02

  This was a lot of fun. I love, I love hearing these questions and I would be happy to do it again and anytime you want me to do it.

• 30:01Speaker 00

  Well, keep sending us your questions. You can email us, [email protected]. You can call the hotline 866-VERGE11. And you know what? We haven't asked about this for a while, but why not give us a review on your podcast? Five stars.

• 30:15Speaker 02

  Sure.

• 30:15Speaker 00

  Just, I don't know, just think about it.

• 30:17Speaker 02

  We love it.

• 30:18Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's not going to hurt you. And if you want to support everything that we do here and get ad-free podcasts, subscribe to The Verge. Do it. The Vergecast is part of the Vox Media Podcast Network. We are produced by the best team in podcasting, Josh Kahas, Eric Gomez, Brandon Kiefer, and there's also me. Later.

• 30:39Speaker 07

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