The Most Sickening Story the Media Says Doesn’t Exist: First-Hand Account of the White Genocide

They've told us that ethnic cleansing against whites in South Africa isn’t happening. They say it’s a racist conspiracy theory. Leon Lotz knows they’re lying. He’s a South African farmer. His story will shock and sicken you. Leon Lotz is a South African farmer and former military serviceman whose family survived a series of brutal farm attacks. In 2010, eight armed attackers invaded his in-laws’ farm, murdering his father-in-law, severely assaulting his mother-in-law, and raping his wife, Adel, in front of their children. Leon now speaks publicly about his family’s experience and the violence affecting South Africa’s farming communities. Paid partnerships with: Vulnerable People Project: Stand with Christians in the land where Christianity began, go to SaveWestBankChristians.com American Financing: NMLS 182334, nmlsconsumeraccess.org. Average savings based on borrowers who save over $199.99. Call 800-685-5696 or visit http://www. AmericanFinancing.net/Tucker. Hallow prayer app: Get 3 months free at https://Hallow.com/Tucker Alp Pouch: Shop the new Frontier collection at https://AlpPouch.com/Tucker Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid, and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes, and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the HouseMajorityPact.com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.

• 0:29Speaker 01

  If you remember the 1980s, you probably remember the anti-apartheid movement, or as it was called in the United States, the anti-apartheid movement. Apartheid was the longstanding system in South Africa in which the minority white population ran the political system. And to some extent, it was a system of separation, where in certain parts of the country, black populations lived in what were called townships, and white populations lived in their own towns. And there was a legal separation between the groups. It was a kind of segregation. And as noted, it was longstanding. It went on for many decades. And in the United States, beginning in the 70s and then accelerating into the 1980s, it was extremely unpopular with activists,

• 1:14Speaker 01

  particularly on college campuses. So if you think about protests against this or that regime that have broken out over the last 20 years on campuses, PEC One, East Timor, Darfur, whatever campus advocates, activists, radicals are mad about. In the 1980s, they were mad about apartheid. And when you went to college campuses, Brown University famously, there were shanty towns on the quad at a lot of schools, where kids built mock shanties, hovels, shacks that were supposed to represent the squalor in which the black population of South Africa was living. Apartheid was hard to defend. It was racial discrimination.

• 1:58Speaker 01

  There's no question about that. And so, over time, the anti-apartheid movement, not just in the United States, but throughout the West, had an effect. And we should note that in the US, political figures did not oppose the college anti-apartheid movement. They endorsed it. They encouraged it. Very much unlike the anti-Israel protests of a couple of years ago on college campuses. Nobody went to jail for opposing apartheid on an Ivy League campus. Nobody had his green card pulled or was deported. No, America's ruling class was four-square behind the campus protesters. And again, they were protesting something that was very obviously unfair.

• 2:41Speaker 01

  Racial segregation is unfair, always, because you don't choose your race. In any case, in part due to unrelenting pressure from the United States and Britain and the West generally, apartheid fell in 1994. And it did so peacefully. The white government basically handed over its power in an election. And of course, on the other side was a then very famous figure called Nelson Mandela, who had been a revolutionary. He is spending decades in jail for trying to bomb a train. But by the time 1994 rolled around, he was a figure of reconciliation and peace and power sharing between black and white. And so those elections took place in 1994,

• 3:24Speaker 01

  and the rest of the world sighed a sigh of relief and pointed to South Africa and said, "It's gonna work. It's gonna be great." And then, by and large, the West stopped paying attention to what happened in South Africa. And that intentional aversion of gays has gone on for, well, 32 years now. But what did happen in South Africa? Well, a lot of things, and none of them good. The country fell apart economically. And it did not, by the way, become less racist. Over the past 30 years, the government of South Africa, run by the same political party that took power in 1994, the African National Congress, the ANC, has passed almost as many race-specific laws

• 4:08Speaker 01

  as the apartheid government did. And in some ways, is much more brutal. A huge percentage of the white population has left to New Zealand, Australia, the UK, United States, and Canada, to English-speaking countries around the world. And if you talk to any of them, they left because they felt there was no more opportunity in South Africa because they had the wrong skin color. Meanwhile, the economy collapsed. Infrastructure collapsed. So what you had in South Africa, 32 years later after apartheid, was every bit as much racism, but a lot less electricity. Probably not a win. What's interesting, however, is that almost none of the people in the United States and Europe

• 4:51Speaker 01

  who called for an end to apartheid were willing to admit what had happened, partly because they were implicated in it. South Africa didn't get any better. In fact, it got much worse. And the racism, the one thing that they correctly opposed about apartheid, had increased too. It had just switched sides. So fast forward from 1994 to May of last year, and the White House. This was a part of the Trump term, where the president was still trying to make good on his campaign promises before giving up entirely in favor of prosecuting an Iran war. But at the time, last May of 2025, President Trump was doing something he suggested he would do on the campaign trail,

• 5:34Speaker 01

  and that's say something publicly about anti-white racism, which is widespread, in some cases codified, including in the United States. And in a lot of ways, the only institutional racism that's still allowed in the Western world. And Trump had suggested, as he was running for president, that he would be the one person brave enough to say something about that on the grounds that all racism is wrong. Not because it's bad to hurt one group, but because it's bad to hurt any group. It's a universal principle. It applies to everybody. And so, in May of last year, Donald Trump gave this press conference. Watch.

• 6:12Speaker 02

  We have many people that feel they're being persecuted, and they're coming to the United States. So we take from many, many locations if we feel there's persecution or genocide going on. And we had a lot of people. I must tell you, Mr. President, we have had a tremendous number of people, especially since they've seen this. Generally, they're white farmers, and they're fleeing South Africa. Excuse me, turn the lights down. Turn the lights down. And just put this on. It's right behind you. Johan.

• 6:46Speaker 03

  There's nothing this parliament can do, with or without you. People are going to occupy land. We require no permission from you, from the president, from no one.

• 6:58Speaker 02

  These are articles over the last few days. Death of people. Death, death, death. Horrible death. Death. I don't know.

• 7:14Speaker 00

  But you know that there are black people who are dying.

• 7:16Speaker 02

  White South Africans are fleeing because of the violence and racist laws. And this is all... I mean, I'll give these to you. So when you say, "What would I like to do?" I don't know what to do. Look at this. White South African couple say that they were attacked violently. But the fake news in this country doesn't talk about that. They don't want to talk about it. But now they have to talk about it. But they won't. This won't even be a subject.

• 7:45Speaker 01

  So the man next to him was Sir Ramaphoso, the president of South Africa. And the clip that Trump played, he played a couple of clips there, included a well-known political figure, an ANC-aligned figure called Julius Molema, calling for the murder of whites openly. Now, calling for the murder of anyone on the basis of race is a crime in South Africa, which has hate crimes laws. But he has never been punished for that and continues to do it even until this day. Again, acting on behalf of the government run by the man you just saw sitting next to Donald Trump. And so Donald Trump, in his inarticulate way, if you didn't know the backstory, you might not know exactly what he was talking about, was trying to call the world's attention

• 8:29Speaker 01

  to the reality of South Africa. And the reality is, that has been for a long time, a racist reality. The government treats people differently on the basis of their skin color. And if you have the wrong skin color in South Africa, you can get hurt, raped, or killed. And that's just a fact, incontestable. And yet, it is contested in the United States. What's so striking is not that Trump said that, though no president has ever come close to saying anything like that, and good for Trump. But the response to Trump saying that really told you everything about how we got a system like that in South Africa in the first place, and why we still have a version of it here

• 9:09Speaker 01

  in the United States, a system in which whites are at a structural disadvantage in hiring, college admissions, government contracting. That still exists in the US as it has for many decades, and everybody knows it. But no one's allowed to talk about it, or people feel intimidated out of noticing it, because as one, the American news media screams racism every time someone points out the existence of anti-white racism. Here, for example, is how CBS News covered the press conference you just saw. Watch.

• 9:44Speaker 04

  President Trump has stopped all US refugee admissions except one group, the white Afrikaner ethnic minority that once led South Africa's brutal apartheid regime. The first group has already arrived in America claiming they've been victims of violence and discrimination. Claims of a white genocide are often circulated by right-wing groups

• 10:07Speaker 05

  To put it into context-

• 10:08Speaker 04

  ...but are simply not true, said Afrikaner academic Pete Krokamp.

• 10:13Speaker 05

  There's no sign of it, never has been. This is the land of Molkhanani if you're white.

• 10:18Speaker 04

  Everyone's joking that they're surprised to wake up and suddenly find it's too dangerous to go outside because there's a white genocide. So there is humor, and there is also frustration. As for Afrikaner farmers, most will say Uncle Donny, as they call President Trump, is being fed a false narrative.

• 10:36Speaker 01

  Oh. So there are two things to learn from CBS News's report. One is that none of this is happening, and if you think it is, you're a racist. And two, that the apartheid regime was brutal. In other words, when the whites had power, they were brutal. And the implication there, of course, and some will say it out loud, is that any brutality visited on the whites in the past 32 years is deserved because it's payback for what other white people did 32 years ago. All right now. Now, of course, CBS News has no way of knowing this. That wasn't a CBS News employee you saw there. CBS News doesn't have a bureau in South Africa. That was a stringer, a freelance employee that CBS hired. As for the Afrikaner

• 11:21Speaker 01

  academic, is he a mainstream voice in South Africa? No, he's not. And then the claim, if you ask a white farmer in South Africa, how many white farmers did CBS News poll on this question? Well, as far as we can tell, none. There is no news in the news segment you just saw. It is a propaganda piece designed to intimidate you from asking follow-up questions like, is there racial discrimination against whites in South Africa? Have white farmers been killed for being white? If so, how many? Those questions go completely unaddressed because were they to address them, they would find that everything the president implied was entirely true. But it wasn't just CBS News, which by the way, is now run by Barry

• 12:05Speaker 01

  Weiss, who is a professional racial grievance monger, whose entire public career is devoted to protecting the interests of one group, a group she describes as, quote, "my people." But any attempt by other groups to do that is shouted down immediately, you'll notice. In any case, it wasn't just CBS News. Here's ABC News's reaction to the same press conference.

• 12:31Speaker 06

  Tonight, an extraordinary scene in the Oval Office. President Trump ambushing the president of South Africa with false claims the nation is engaged in genocide against white farmers. President Cyril Ramaphosa said he came to the White House to discuss trade.

• 12:46Speaker 07

  We are essentially here to reset the relationship between the United States and South Africa.

• 12:52Speaker 06

  But Trump had other ideas. The president insists white South African farmers are being persecuted and murdered on a mass scale, unproven claims that have been amplified by Elon Musk, a native of South Africa. There is a crime problem in South Africa, but there is no evidence it is racially motivated or amounts to genocide. White people make up only 7% of the country, but own the vast majority of its farmland.

• 13:17Speaker 01

  So again, that's not a news piece. There's no information, despite the little graphic at the bottom, which is designed to let you know whites have too much already. This is just justice. But it begins by describing the president's comments as an ambush of the poor president of South Africa who's just here trying to strike up a new relationship with the United States. And here, Trump ambushes him. Actually, that same president, Cyril Ramaphosa, has said openly anti-white things in public for many years. He, not that long ago, pointed to neighboring Zimbabwe, which did in fact genocide its whites. There are almost none left in the country, stole their land, allowed them to be murdered by mobs,

• 13:59Speaker 01

  and said that is a model for South Africa. That president that they're defending as the victim of an ambush has said point-blank many times in public that his plan is to steal not just the real estate, the land of the white population, but their personal property without compensation. That's his party's official position. In fact, as the ANC, his party, phrases it, compensation will be, quote, "nil," which means nothing. So there are real questions here that might be worth exploring if you were a news organization. But instead, ABC News, like CBS News, dismisses everything Trump says as false without proving it's false, just stating it's false. It's false. In any case, the whites are bad. This

• 14:43Speaker 01

  is and has been for decades the position of every news organization in the United States, and not simply that, of groups who you thought were dedicated to protecting the human rights of human beings. Here's the ADL's statement on claims of white genocide in South Africa, and we're quoting. "For decades, white supremacists globally were cheerleaders for the institutionalized white supremacy of apartheid in South Africa. They have reacted bitterly to the end of the racist policy and to the progress South Africans have made in pursuit of racial equality and reconciliation." Keep in mind, the ADL is a group whose aims are to protect global

• 15:23Speaker 01

  Jewry. That's what ADL says it exists to do. Why are they attacking whites in South Africa who say they are the victims of institutional racism, which they are, and of organized violence, which they are? Why would it be in the interest of ADL to attack them for that? What exactly did they do wrong? How are they anti-Semites for not wanting to be killed on their farms? They don't explain that. But the statement goes on. "White supremacists have seized upon some of the farm-related violence in South Africa since the end of apartheid to peddle a propaganda campaign that exaggerates and distorts the situation to imply that the South African whites are imperiled." Again, what possible interest would the Anti-Difamation League have in attacking whites in South

• 16:06Speaker 01

  Africa who say they're being killed, especially since there are many, many hundreds who have been killed? And that's documented. That's not a guess, and it's not a conspiracy theory. And every single one of them was killed by a black South African. This is intra-racial crime, and it is racially motivated, and the testimony of almost every survivor corroborates that. So why is it in the interest of the ADL not simply to deny it's happening, but to attack the survivors of it and their family members? You have to ponder that for a minute. Here's Wikipedia's response to this racial conspiracy theory. Quote, "White genocide

• 16:49Speaker 01

  is a political myth based on pseudoscience, pseudo-history, and ethnic hatred, and is driven by a psychological panic often termed white extinction anxiety." White extinction anxiety, often referred to as white extinction anxiety. So let's just, I don't know, get the demographic numbers, which are publicly available, for the biggest white countries in Europe and North America, and ask a really simple question. Is the percentage, the proportion of the white population going up or down, say, over the past 50 years? Has it gone up or down? Well, it's not only gone down, it's bottomed out. The United States went from nearly 90% white over 60 years to probably less than half

• 17:33Speaker 01

  white. So that's white extinction anxiety? No, those are facts. So again, it's not enough to pretend that it's not happening. Wikipedia, like the ADL, like CBS News, like ABC News, feels the moral obligation to attack anyone who happens to notice what's happening. "The facts are themselves racist. Objectively," again, Wikipedia, "white people are not dying out or facing extermination. The purpose of the conspiracy theory is to justify a commitment to a white nationalist agenda in support of calls to violence."

• 18:18Speaker 01

  Noticing is hate, noticing is violence. So underneath all of this are two questions. One, is it actually happening or not? And wouldn't it be interesting to find out? Rather than just dismissing it out of hand as an act of violence to notice that people are being raped and murdered? Wouldn't it be easier just to talk to people in South Africa and see what their experience is? Do a little reporting on the subject? And the second question is, is it ever okay to attack, to hurt people on the basis of their race? And of course, in the view of the ADL, of the anonymous Wikipedia authors of ABC and

• 19:03Speaker 01

  CBS and NBC and pretty much every news organization in the United States, yes, it is okay in certain circumstances. Not all races are equal. Not all death is the same. The death of some groups, the oppression of some groups is totally unacceptable, and the deaths of other groups, the oppression of those groups is morally justified. So it's worth saying it out loud. That is wrong. That is the definition of a distorted racist worldview. The only acceptable worldview is that all human life is equal in value. It's a universalist perspective. Every person is not of identical ability, but every person is of identical value, and it is always wrong.

• 19:47Speaker 01

  No matter what the color, or ethnicity, or culture, or language, it is always unacceptable to kill the innocent. And that would include Palestinians in Gaza, it would include whites in the Transvaal, it would include every single Jews, Filipinos, it would include every person. It is always wrong to hurt people who did nothing wrong, and that would include hurting people because of how they were born, which is not a crime. It's an accident. And so you should know that in denying the existence of something that is objectively

• 20:26Speaker 01

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• 23:53Speaker 01

  Thanks. Meantime, we thought it'd be worth talking to someone who lives in South Africa, an actual South African farmer. So we invited him to our house and spent a great deal of time with him. His name is Leon Lotz. We're about to show you the interview we did with him two days ago. And we warn you, before you watch this, that this is one of the most wrenching conversations we've ever had. It's shocking, we believe every word of it is true, but judge for yourself. Leon Lotz. Leon, thank you for doing this very much. So in the United States, we are told that farm murders are not real, and that people who talk about farm invasions, the murder of white farmers in South Africa are both

• 24:35Speaker 01

  delusional, they're making it up, and they're racist. Is it real?

• 24:41Speaker 07

  I can speak of my own behalf and everybody that I know. So I myself come through a farm murder, where my father-in-law was shot and killed in front of my, of my wife and my kids. My wife was raped at the same time by one neighbor. So I moved from that farm to another farm to get out of the crime scene. I moved to the Kuru, where I thought it was much safer. We were there for a couple of months, and then the one next door neighbor got murdered.

• 25:25Speaker 07

  His wife made it, they shot her twice. I bought a farm from a lady called Marlies Daniels and Fred in Middleburg in the Eastern Cape. Her parents got executed on the knee shot behind the head. Two years back, a guy that rented a farm in the same area, they slit his throat like an animal. I have got one here as well.

• 26:10Speaker 07

  I don't know whether the camera can see this.

• 26:14Speaker 01

  I see it.

• 26:16Speaker 07

  What is that from? This was also an attack that I actually, there's so many attacks that I come through, proper attacks, and this one was almost forgotten. And I've got a stamp wound in my leg, on the side of my leg, on this side. That one I survived. So you, when you do get attacked, you stay away from the police. Because if you do report, or they do catch one, the first thing that will happen to you is they will open a case of assault against you. So they will lock you up first, and then hopefully you'll be out in two, three days

• 27:01Speaker 07

  out of jail, whatever, depends on who you know as attorneys or whatever will happen. Most of these cases, the murders don't get investigated, the dockets are empty. We know many of them, we can prove this. This is not something against the government or whatever, but it doesn't get investigated. In some of these, this is being a point straight to police. Brand's docket is empty. In Steinsberg, there's just nothing. The other thing that they lie about is the death certificates.

• 27:44Speaker 07

  I've got the death certificates, I've got pictures for you. My father-in-law's one, I forced him to put on the death certificate murder. Eventually, they put on it with massive conflict. They put on it gunshot wound to abdomen. The other death certificates of people that I know that got murdered says cause of death are natural causes. So they don't investigate the murders, nothing happens. So how can the stats prove that we're being murdered? There's about 30,000 farmers left, white farmers left in South Africa.

• 28:22Speaker 01

  How many were there in 1994 when the government changed?

• 28:26Speaker 07

  I think more than 100,000, I'm not exactly sure of the figures, but it must be more than 100,000 farmers.

• 28:31Speaker 01

  Or 30,000.

• 28:32Speaker 07

  The big ones has got bigger and bigger. The smaller ones, like myself, we are first in line for fire. We have got top, top farmers in South Africa, like really good farmers. Under the circumstances, we farming, I might take my hat off for some of those farmers producing food. And we producing enough food in all these circumstances that we can export food. So telling us that we're lying is...

• 29:07Speaker 07

  Our own ambassador here in America, Mr. Rolf Meyer, says that he's a white South African and he will speak on behalf of us. I would like Mr. Meyer to really talk the truth. He actually needs to be arrested for whatever they've done to humans, even in the national party. He needs to be arrested. He closes his eyes now and say that we don't get murdered. Please come with us that we can show you. Come live with me for three days. Mr. Rupert said when he was here with Mr. Trump that he sleeps with his doors open. Mr. Rupert is a billionaire.

• 29:44Speaker 01

  This is Johan Rupert.

• 29:47Speaker 07

  Yeah, I am not upset with him. He also, I'm breeding racehorses as well and Johan also breeds horses. I actually need him in the industry. Without him, we don't have a racehorse industry. But he cannot sleep with his doors open if he lives the way I live. He's got all the security with him. We haven't got that luxury. If you drive in South Africa, wherever you go, you will see burglar-proofing, barbed wire fencing, steel palisade fences, alarm systems, cameras, dogs, whatever. When we came through here last night, that's absolutely a miracle.

• 30:30Speaker 07

  There's wooden houses, there's cars standing outside. We can't leave cars outside. They will break in, those cars steal the battery, steal the tires or the rims off and they will murder you for a vehicle. The insurance that we pay to be safe in our houses, there's thousands of rands a month. My insurance is 20,000 rand a month. To have insurance, it's a fact that they will come and break in again. I mean, I've been through three farm attacks, the one I actually forgot. It's a way of living.

• 31:14Speaker 07

  The older you get, the more tired you get of all this bullshit. And I am so tired of my own people and a British person sitting in England and a Pete Coakham and a Rolf Meyer and Rudal Landman and whoever they are, in your own country telling that we are not being murdered. They can say that we're not being murdered because it's the biggest fraud in the world that it's not on the death certificates, these murder cases don't get investigated. When they do catch murderers, the one that murdered my father, the police said he murdered 23 people. Not, I didn't say that, I didn't thumbsack that.

• 31:59Speaker 07

  He got a life sentence for 146 years. He came from Mozambique, a black man.

• 32:05Speaker 01

  He was not even, he was an immigrant to?

• 32:08Speaker 07

  Yeah, Mario Konzo. So a month back, I started to find out where he was and then they came back saying they very ashamed, but he was released after a year. So whenever you in South Africa in jail, you sit, max 10% of your sentence, then you walk.

• 32:31Speaker 01

  After murdering your father-in-law?

• 32:33Speaker 07

  Yeah, murder for, there was a person working for me here, he stabbed his own people. He's now sitting in jail for three years. Not one of the people he stabbed died. My father died. He raped my wife. He sat a year and he's out. And how is this things possible? They don't investigate anything. You can't get anywhere, you don't lay a case. You will go to jail first. Now, we are getting murdered. The difference between our murders and the Cape Flat murders, the Cape Flat murders is

• 33:17Speaker 07

  the same ethnic group. If I call about ethnic groups, I know the world understand this, we've got black people, we've got brown people, we've got white people in South Africa. Then you've got immigrants from Mozambique, Zimbabwe, all of Zimbabwe is in South Africa, as does Mozambique. There's people from Alawi in South Africa. So every now and then there's xenophobia, they push them out, but I don't know how far they go and then they back again. I think these illegal immigrants will build their houses and then when there's enough houses, they will be chased out so they can just take their houses for free and then they just carry on.

• 33:58Speaker 07

  But I think the difference between the murders and the Cape Flats is the same ethnic group murdered their own people. Malima will stand up there and say, kill the boer, kill the farmer. So a boer is a farmer in Afrikaans. He actually give them order to kill us. They don't steal. It's not a theft gone wrong. They come to murder us. They don't steal anything. They will take weapons, urinate on you, put their feces on you, whatever, rape.

• 34:28Speaker 01

  Put their feces on you?

• 34:30Speaker 07

  So the one main thing of it is, is when they do these things, they will get their own feces out, spread it all over their house and on the people they murdered. That is the way they do it. To dishumiliate or dehumanize you, whatever they do.

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• 35:56Speaker 00

  Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' health care to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the House Majority PAC dot com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.

• 36:25Speaker 01

  They rape women and then defecate on them?

• 36:28Speaker 07

  Yeah, that is, that's the way they're, and they will urinate on them. I'll get to that now, but of the 33,000 farmers that's left in South Africa, that's our ethnic group. There's more white people in South Africa than 30,000, but there's only about 30,000 white farmers that farm. There's no way that we as white farmers will go and stand there and sing, kill the worker, kill the, whatever.

• 37:05Speaker 01

  Kill the black?

• 37:06Speaker 07

  We don't do that. We don't go out murdering them, but if you open social media, you'll see black people reporting that we, white farmers, are murdering hundreds and thousands of blacks. Where? Where do we do that? There's no place that we sing like Malima, that is all over, that just did it on Saturday again. Kill the farmer, kill the boer. Politically, that is correct for the ANC. We can't have an old flag, that is hate speech. But this man can order people to kill, like he did with some of the people that's here with me.

• 37:50Speaker 07

  They were singing that, kill the farmer, kill the boer, and then they attack you. So a different ethnic group will come and murder us as whites. White people don't want to murder white farmers. There is white people that murder, that needs to be, I don't know where we've got to go with them, but there's criminals in every society. But in a civil society, how can you do things like this? How can you heat up an iron that you iron clothes with and when you rape a woman, burn her with that iron in the inside of her thighs, on her face, while you rape her, bite pieces

• 38:35Speaker 07

  out of her lip and carry on for days in a shack? I know of people that they've taken off the pipes of the washing machine while they tie the wife to a chair. The husband had to look, she had to look at the husband, push the pipe down his throat, cook the kettle and pour the boiled water down his throat. And then Rolf Meyer will say, this is not happening.

• 39:08Speaker 07

  Our own president, like they're calling sovereignty now.

• 39:15Speaker 07

  Now that the American government has imposed sanctions on their visas.

• 39:22Speaker 07

  So what does this sovereignty means to them?

• 39:26Speaker 07

  Jan van Ribbich apparently came in in 1625.

• 39:32Speaker 07

  So all the people of color then got poor.

• 39:39Speaker 07

  I was born in 66, 1966. I bought my first farm with money I saved doing farrier work on horses.

• 39:52Speaker 07

  I put it in a tin. I bought a farm after Nelson Mandela was released. Now they want to take my property for free, not pay me for it, no compensation.

• 40:00Speaker 01

  You were a blacksmith shoeing horses?

• 40:02Speaker 07

  Yes, so that's how I made money to eventually buy a farm. I didn't inherit it. I didn't get a loan. I didn't qualify.

• 40:13Speaker 07

  So now they want to just take whatever I've worked for.

• 40:16Speaker 01

  You didn't take your farm from black people?

• 40:19Speaker 07

  I've never murdered people. I've never taken any farm from anybody. I bought a farm that was in the market for three years in the new South Africa while after Nelson Mandela was released. So why didn't a black person buy the farm?

• 40:33Speaker 01

  So you think they're going to try and take it from you because you're white?

• 40:36Speaker 07

  I think it's a definite that we will lose your farms. I don't think it's going to take too long. This is what Nelson Mandela is screaming for. This is what they're doing. They're hiding this to the whole world. We are producing food. We're not there for the political side of it. I've got nothing to do with the political side of it. I just want to live and be free.

• 41:00Speaker 07

  I can't have a gun all the time.

• 41:05Speaker 01

  Can you start at the beginning of the story that you told at the outset of your father-in-law's murder? What happened?

• 41:15Speaker 07

  So my father was farming with pigs. He had a naval break operation.

• 41:22Speaker 07

  My wife went there to look after the farming operation.

• 41:29Speaker 07

  While he was in hospital, he came out on the Friday. I had a horse racing at Turf and Train Racecourse in Johannesburg. On the Saturday, I actually entered this horse just to get to my father-in-law so that I have an excuse to go there.

• 41:48Speaker 07

  The farm is about 600 kilometers away from Turf and Train Racecourse. I left there four o'clock in the morning on Saturday. The horse ran, I think it ran last.

• 42:01Speaker 07

  I went back to my father's farm, offloaded the horse. And eight o'clock that evening, my wife said to me, my wife is a very thin

• 42:14Speaker 07

  posture-wise woman. She was about 50 kilos, 54 kilograms.

• 42:22Speaker 07

  So eight o'clock that evening, my wife said to me, don't you want to go back to the farm? Just now they steal the sheep or break into the house while if we're not there. So under normal circumstances, my father would first jumped up and said, you're not driving back. You came here this morning. You didn't sleep. You're staying over till the next morning.

• 42:45Speaker 07

  So the Lord must have saved me. And I got up from the table, took the horse box, loaded the horse and went back. I arrived there around about three o'clock. Just after I arrived, the phone rang and it was my mother-in-law.

• 43:07Speaker 07

  And all I heard was, she said, they shot, they shot that, they shot that. And I could hear this bastard screaming in the background, swearing at her,

• 43:20Speaker 07

  telling us he's a white dog and a white bitch and a white whatever.

• 43:27Speaker 07

  And then everything went dead.

• 43:30Speaker 07

  Phone was off. I was 600 kilometers away.

• 43:38Speaker 07

  My two daughters were there. My youngest one was about three years old.

• 43:42Speaker 07

  My son was there. One of my jockeys was there.

• 43:47Speaker 07

  If Gavin wasn't a jockey and they didn't think he was a kid, they would have shot him as well.

• 43:54Speaker 07

  The first thing they asked was, is there men in the house?

• 44:02Speaker 07

  So they wanted to shoot my son's dog, a little jackass. He had to take his shoelace and tie the horse, the dog's mouth closed.

• 44:17Speaker 07

  So they tied him up and he managed to untie himself to get a pipe out of the cupboard to protect himself. But he couldn't break the pipe out. I think the Lord saved him also like that. But yeah, so they heard him and while they were busy with the deal, they were walking up and down my father's room. They haven't shot him yet. And they all said to me, the worst fear she ever had was

• 44:55Speaker 07

  I think my son was about 16 years old, 16 years old.

• 45:03Speaker 07

  So they all said

• 45:08Speaker 07

  they had the gun on his head. They don't know whether they would have pulled the trigger and shoot my son.

• 45:15Speaker 07

  So eventually they went to my father's room.

• 45:18Speaker 07

  My daughter, they closed the door and told her she must keep quiet.

• 45:25Speaker 07

  When they opened the door, they must have been in the house before. My son said he opened the door and then he took the pistol and hit the light switch on. And when my father lifted up, he shot him in his stomach in front of my son.

• 45:44Speaker 07

  Then they attacked my mother-in-law, threw off the bed.

• 45:51Speaker 07

  My son got a handgun. He had to open the safe. He managed to hide the handgun and he said to me, Dad, I could have shot him in his back.

• 46:01Speaker 07

  And when he walked out, but I didn't know who was with my mother

• 46:06Speaker 07

  and my sister, if I fired a shot and they heard it, what would happen?

• 46:13Speaker 07

  So luckily he didn't shoot the man.

• 46:20Speaker 07

  It's another thing to get murdered.

• 46:24Speaker 07

  But it's a completely different thing to take somebody else's life.

• 46:29Speaker 07

  This is not, this is not the way we are. This is not who we are.

• 46:36Speaker 07

  We are Christian people. We don't take other people's lives. We can protect ourselves and that Malay mom is no and Ruve Meier and Ramaphosa.

• 46:48Speaker 07

  You will push us and push us till something breaks. We still got something to lose that's in your advantage.

• 47:01Speaker 07

  But also my youngest daughter started crying.

• 47:10Speaker 07

  And the girl had to cover her. So can you imagine

• 47:18Speaker 07

  what a mother must feel like?

• 47:22Speaker 07

  To go and lie over a kid that's three years old to protect her after they've raped her?

• 47:31Speaker 01

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• 48:58Speaker 00

  Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman, Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the HouseMajorityPact.com, not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.

• 49:32Speaker 07

  And they all did not tell them, we have a David that's tied this right there.

• 49:39Speaker 07

  Because she said, even as get to a cold case, they will humiliate her.

• 49:47Speaker 07

  This is the way the system works. She did put in the affidavit that they pushed their hands into her and they touched all over.

• 50:04Speaker 07

  So I drove back.

• 50:08Speaker 07

  I phoned my one black farmer, farm worker that worked for me earlier.

• 50:17Speaker 07

  He said, "I'm a spitter." He started working for me when I started farming.

• 50:24Speaker 07

  Until today, he's still working for me. He is like family. And he is a brown person.

• 50:33Speaker 07

  He's done more for me than

• 50:38Speaker 07

  any white person that I do know.

• 50:46Speaker 07

  So I phoned him. He packed my bags, baked me some tea, got me in the vehicle, and phoned me after that every half an hour to make sure that I got there safe.

• 51:05Speaker 07

  Going past one of these small towns, I stopped at a church on the Sunday morning.

• 51:11Speaker 07

  And I asked a priest there to pray for me.

• 51:16Speaker 07

  I don't even know his name. If it wasn't for that, I wouldn't have been able to get back to the place I was just been.

• 51:24Speaker 07

  So on that specific day, I probably drove like

• 51:30Speaker 07

  twelve, eight, twenty hours nonstop.

• 51:36Speaker 07

  I went through a toll gate.

• 51:40Speaker 07

  On the way there,

• 51:44Speaker 07

  I've been in the military and I've done.

• 51:49Speaker 07

  I did martial arts and there was nothing in the world that scared me. I was so scared that I couldn't breathe.

• 52:01Speaker 07

  When I drove through that toll gate, I was about ten, fifteen kilometers away. And it felt like the Lord was missing.

• 52:10Speaker 07

  He was not there anymore.

• 52:16Speaker 07

  At the inside, I knew. I just knew it that somebody would have been raped. That's the way they do it.

• 52:29Speaker 07

  I got to their house. My wife was standing outside.

• 52:33Speaker 07

  I've said this many times. It looked like if you see a chicken that would stood in the rain.

• 52:39Speaker 07

  Adele looked like that.

• 52:42Speaker 07

  So Adele's nickname in Africans was cricket. This is an English cricket. Because of her posture, because she was small.

• 52:53Speaker 07

  Now, while after I put the phone down with my mother, I phoned a friend of mine, Wallace Toldme. And he got the police. If it wasn't for that, I don't know what would have happened. But it took me a couple of minutes before my brain registered that I can phone somebody. I got such a big fright that my brain was empty.

• 53:15Speaker 07

  So when I got there and I saw my wife standing there,

• 53:20Speaker 07

  I didn't have any words. You can't pray. You don't know what to do.

• 53:27Speaker 07

  And at that moment, still you don't hate the way they hate us.

• 53:35Speaker 07

  And if sovereignty, sovereignty means for this ANC government that they've been screaming this week that my blood and my family's blood must flow

• 53:49Speaker 07

  for the poverty that is happening in this, in South Africa.

• 53:54Speaker 07

  They must put that blame in front of the old national party, the roof mayor, the every other clerks. Pete Krokamp,

• 54:04Speaker 07

  Ramaphosa Azuma, Malama. They've been running this country for how many years now? Thirty years. Why do my wife have to be raped? And my family being murdered? So that they can have a party? That I've got to pay for it? By getting murdered? Because there's poverty?

• 54:31Speaker 07

  And then they will say, "You're getting murdered because you treat your farm workers badly."

• 54:39Speaker 07

  It is the worst lie in the world.

• 54:47Speaker 07

  If those farm workers are in the way, they will also shoot them. Like they do.

• 54:54Speaker 07

  But I want to state it again.

• 54:58Speaker 07

  We are being murdered by another ethnic group. The Cape Flats and all the murders in the country. That is not on white farmers. That same ethnic group murder their own people. We are not being murdered by our own white people. We are being murdered by black people.

• 55:22Speaker 01

  Why?

• 55:25Speaker 07

  I don't know. I think they hate us because we've got farms. Politically, they said that we stole everything from them.

• 55:35Speaker 07

  When I was in the military, I remember one of the points that the ANC made was to crash the economy. Because they said, if they crash the economy and get the whole country unruly, they will stay in power. And this is exactly what they're doing at the moment. They're crashing the whole economy because if there's, if you've got nowhere to go, they can stay in control forever.

• 56:02Speaker 07

  I don't care if there's poverty.

• 56:05Speaker 07

  But how can thirty thousand people be

• 56:09Speaker 07

  to blame for the poverty of millions in this country? How can thirty thousand people look after millions of people? From Malawi, from Mozambique, from Zimbabwe, and from South Africa? How is it possible?

• 56:28Speaker 01

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• 57:05Speaker 01

  How productive are white farmers in South Africa?

• 57:09Speaker 07

  I've sold fertilizer for Gavelon fertilizers in the US. I've been in the US when I worked for Gavelon. I've been in many places in the world, in Australia. Not, I haven't been to Europe. But if you, I can't say in bushels, but if you are a South African farmer and you plant corn, the average farmer in South Africa on a center pivot in the worst conditions that we've got will harvest sixteen tons average on corn. So we are productive farmers. We buy all the tactors that come from the US and wherever. We are, we up to standard.

• 57:54Speaker 07

  Eighty tons of potatoes to a hundred tons of potatoes. On wheat, we also do eight to ten tons. Soyers, we can do on the dryland areas, we can do two tons depending on the weather. But we've got top, top farmers. Cattle production, we, we up with the best in the world. We don't have to stand back anywhere.

• 58:18Speaker 07

  We right up there, the best in the world. Farmers in South Africa don't get subsidized like many farmers in other parts of the world do.

• 58:28Speaker 07

  They've got to get their own finance, do their own thing. There's no help from the government at all.

• 58:35Speaker 07

  They do block us that we can't import like fertilizer directly. They've got all these rules and regulations that you can't import directly.

• 58:45Speaker 01

  Does South Africa produce its own fertilizer?

• 58:48Speaker 07

  We used to be self-sufficient in fertilizer in totally, in total. At the moment, we not.

• 58:55Speaker 07

  The Sessel that we had is not producing fertilizer anymore. It's been taken over by the government. We had a phosphorus plant in Palabora that went to Riches Bay. They didn't produce any granule this season so far. Nothing. They'd be standing for six months. We've got to import everything.

• 59:14Speaker 07

  We're under massive strain at the moment with the wars that's going around. We can't get fertilizer. Vessels has got to come from Russia and all over. So still with all that, farmers are still producing. We're getting murdered. We're having everything against us from the outside world. And we are still producing. We are still there.

• 59:36Speaker 01

  But South Africa was once self-sufficient in fertilizer?

• 59:39Speaker 07

  Total.

• 59:41Speaker 07

  Totally. We, we were self-sufficient, everything except urea. It was always cheaper to import urea

• 59:48Speaker 07

  than to manufacture it ourselves.

• 59:51Speaker 01

  But the government in thirty years has destroyed the entire industry.

• 59:54Speaker 07

  There's nothing left.

• 59:57Speaker 07

  There is nothing left.

• 59:59Speaker 01

  That's horrifying.

• 1:00:00Speaker 07

  So

• 1:00:02Speaker 01

  So why do you think it is the farmers, though, the thirty thousand, mostly well, white, but a lot of them Afrikaans-speaking farmers? Why are they the targets of this violence? When they're such a small percentage of the white population?

• 1:00:20Speaker 07

  I think the ANC government is using it. They've got to tell uneducated people that we are to blame for their poverty. And they managed to get that over. Those people think we are to blame for their poverty. If you drive a car, they would think that that car actually belongs to them. Um, they destroyed our schools. They destroyed our hospitals. There's no hospitals in the small towns left anymore. Really? It looks like Big Sties. You can't go there. Um, there's no hospitals. I had to, when my wife got sick, I had to drive 800 kilometers to the nearest hospitals and 350.

• 1:01:04Speaker 07

  If you get a heart attack, there's no helicopter taking you. You're not going to make it. There is no hospitals left. There's no doctors left. The people are just leaving. What would happen if you, what's the nearest hospital to your? Mine is either Bloemfontein, it's 350 kilometers away, or Port Elizabeth, 350 kilometers away. And if that, if those hospitals doesn't have space, then you go to Cape Town. How far is that? 890 kilometers away from me. So I've did that tip for three and a half years after the murder. Every two months. Why did you go every two months? Uh, so, yeah.

• 1:01:49Speaker 07

  After, after the murder, first my mother-in-law got, got cancer and she passed away. And very soon after the murder, I could see my wife was getting sick. She did test HIV. And luckily she didn't have HIV.

• 1:02:28Speaker 07

  But she got, first she was diagnosed with remojoy arthritis, then the chemo. And the last two months of her life, she was also diagnosed with fibromyalgia. And if you go back on the science of these diseases, fear and anxiety, extreme fear and anxiety is a definite cause of these diseases, as is diabetes. A friend of mine, Sean, was attacked while they were asleep and stabbed. And Sean has got diabetes now. He was stabbed while he was asleep? Yeah, they walked into his house, tied them up, him and his wife, and started stabbing him.

• 1:03:12Speaker 07

  While he didn't wake up at first. Shell was awake, tied her up, put socks in her mouth, put the tie, tied them up, tied them up till they, they quieted and then just started stabbing him. Just, they, they won't ask questions. If they walk in, they, if you're, if you're a man, they will kill you. Because they've got to get you out the way. Did they stab his wife? No, luckily not. Um. And so after the murder, we waited for four days for forensic to eventually pitch up

• 1:03:54Speaker 07

  to take fingerprints. In that time, my kids are there. There's animals on the outside that you've got to look after, that's got to be fed and watered. And then you've got to wait for forensic to hopefully get, they forget some fingerprints, this or that. The meantime, you can't clean the blood that's everywhere. Kids had to walk over that. You can't fix these kids again. You can't get them to be normal again.

• 1:04:36Speaker 07

  When I was 17 years old, when I went to the Malati, I didn't experience this, that we are experiencing now. And we had a proper Malati force in South Africa. We could look after ourselves. But I've never experienced what I'm experiencing now. You can go for psychiatry treatment and this and that. They can pray for you. You can pray for yourself. And after that, you will see on social media or here that somebody will phone you and say, there's another murder there. They don't put it in the news anymore. They hide it.

• 1:05:18Speaker 07

  Nobody talks about it. The people near you will talk about it and then somebody else will just hope it doesn't hap, that it don't happen to you. And then you'll get on social media. Statistical wise, we don't murder you. Because in the Cape flats, there's hundreds of kids being murdered, coming back to the same thing again. The same ethnic group that murdered them. They're not murdered by whites? No, by their own people. But so then, we waited for four days.

• 1:05:57Speaker 07

  After that, I had to go to a state mortuary. I think in the US, if there's a murder, there's a specific mortuary where they investigate those murders and those bodies go to.

• 1:06:18Speaker 00

  Now, more than ever, we need someone on our side. But Rob Whitman? Whitman's votes drove up costs, cut Medicaid and risked 350,000 Virginians' healthcare to pay for tax breaks for himself and his donors. He's not on our side. Shannon Taylor will fight corruption, cut taxes and bring down costs. This November, vote for Shannon Taylor. She's for us. Paid for by HMP, the House Majority PAC dot com. Not authorized by any candidate or candidate's committee.

• 1:06:49Speaker 07

  In South Africa now, the state mortuaries are in the locations. That's in any case where I had to go to, in Sebo King. I had to drive 10 kilometers into that location where it's definitely not safe if you're white. It's not a place where you want to be. They will murder you if you drive in there. You cannot stop. You've got to go and get there and get out. So when I eventually got there, there was a sign on the wall there. And I was sitting there crying.

• 1:07:31Speaker 07

  And on that sign, it said, no bodies will be kept here for longer than three months. I wish Ramapaza and Louvre Mail would tell me that I'm telling a lie now. And I couldn't understand what I was reading because I was crying and I was afraid and I was, emotionally, I was, I was drained. They made me sit there for two hours, maybe longer, before I could witness the body.

• 1:08:06Speaker 07

  Because you must say, this is who the person is, sign all the documents. So eventually, a black man came. He had chungum, chewing it. And he fell back in a chair on the other side of a counter. And he was leaning backwards like this, as he was on the beach. And he blew this bubble with the chungum. The meantime, they were talking and laughing and I don't know what jokes they were talking, whether they were talking about me, whatever they were doing, I don't know. It's very disrespectful.

• 1:08:47Speaker 07

  If you haven't experienced racism, you go there and tell me if you haven't experienced racism. So when that bubble burst, he said to me, so what happened to the deceased? I was never treated so disrespectfully in my whole life. So after massive conflict with that, we eventually walked to the body and I remember the guy from Doves that, that had to move all the dead bodies.

• 1:09:27Speaker 07

  I looked at him and I said to him, does the Lord really exist? And he said to me, yes. I said, how is that possible? Because you see this every day. And he said to me, that's what you see here, it's not, it's not the Lord, it's Satan. And I'm big ashamed of saying it. While I was sitting there, I was looking down at him and I thought to myself, how can you do a job like this? Why didn't you rather go to university or college or study something? How can you do something like this?

• 1:10:07Speaker 07

  Without those people, I do not know what we will do in South Africa. And I've got to take hats off to them. So we stood up and he said to me, if you're not scared of bodies, or if you are scared of bodies, then just look at the back of my head. Do not look to the side.

• 1:10:33Speaker 07

  So the norm in South Africa is if that those state mortuaries, the refrigerators don't even work.

• 1:10:42Speaker 07

  There's too many bodies in any case. There's no space for them. They don't come and pick up the bodies. And that is black people.

• 1:10:51Speaker 07

  Because it's Zimbabweans, Malawis, whoever is here.

• 1:10:57Speaker 07

  They don't pick up the dead. They just leave them there.

• 1:11:02Speaker 07

  So by law, I think they must keep them there for three months. So while I was there, there was not enough space for those dead bodies. Why don't they pick up their bodies of their people? It's cheaper, it's too expensive. So they just leave them there.

• 1:11:19Speaker 07

  So, and that's poverty. And that's got to be blame on me because I'm a white farmer.

• 1:11:28Speaker 07

  So the bodies were lying. That's not just poverty. Some of the poorest people in the world pick up the bodies of their dead. Doesn't happen in South Africa. There's something else there. That's disgusting. So the bodies were lying, I went through a passage and we turned. And it was bodies, I walked through the middle of the bodies, the bodies were lying on both sides and they had these blue covers halfway over the bodies without clothes.

• 1:11:56Speaker 07

  So as they

• 1:12:00Speaker 07

  were heating up, or I don't know what they were doing, they would swap them around.

• 1:12:05Speaker 07

  Put them at the refrigerator, turn them around. So my father was lying on the table there

• 1:12:13Speaker 07

  without any clothes.

• 1:12:19Speaker 07

  The fear in his face was still there.

• 1:12:26Speaker 07

  I'm not scared of a dead body.

• 1:12:30Speaker 07

  But what I saw was horrific.

• 1:12:33Speaker 07

  My brother fell with a motorbike and I went through the same story.

• 1:12:40Speaker 07

  My brother had long hair, died in a motorbike and, not in a murder, just a normal accident, but all his hair got shaved off. They cut him open in his head and they put stitches in that far apart. I can do a barbed wire fencing better than what they do. My question to them is, if you put on the death certificate, cause of death unnatural causes, why the hell do you have to cut the bodies up and do any forensic

• 1:13:06Speaker 07

  investigation on it in any case?

• 1:13:10Speaker 07

  You don't open a case of murder. So why do you cut those bodies open? Why don't we have a say?

• 1:13:19Speaker 07

  But my father was, his beard was long, the blood was in his mouth, on his cheeks, in his nose.

• 1:13:29Speaker 07

  They cut him open from

• 1:13:32Speaker 07

  the bottom all the way to here.

• 1:13:36Speaker 07

  And the stitches were, I don't know, five centimeters apart. It looked absolutely horrific and disrespectful.

• 1:13:46Speaker 07

  Why do I have to go to a state mortuary?

• 1:13:53Speaker 07

  To witness a body, to be treated like an animal?

• 1:13:59Speaker 07

  And then move the body to a proper

• 1:14:03Speaker 07

  place where we can bury, where we can put the dead away?

• 1:14:11Speaker 07

  If my wife or my daughter or my son had to go there

• 1:14:18Speaker 07

  and witness a dead body?

• 1:14:23Speaker 07

  A day I would probably have died sooner, sooner.

• 1:14:45Speaker 07

  Then after you sign those documentation, then you've got to go and get a death certificate.

• 1:14:58Speaker 07

  You get to Internal Affairs, you stand in a queue all day long.

• 1:15:04Speaker 07

  There's not one white person working there, there's only black people working there. You stand in a queue to get anything, you get IDZ, I don't know what else you get there.

• 1:15:16Speaker 07

  And you cry and everybody look at you like you're an idiot.

• 1:15:21Speaker 07

  Standing in a queue crying.

• 1:15:24Speaker 07

  And when you eventually get to the front, they come back with a death certificate and say cause of death unnatural causes.

• 1:15:33Speaker 07

  I tore mine up. And I said, I will not accept this. The police arrived again.

• 1:15:42Speaker 07

  Massive conflict. And eventually I got this death certificate that says, Kansya Dwin to abdomen.

• 1:15:55Speaker 07

  We've got a farmers' organization called AgriSA. It is the only agricultural organization that the government accept as a spokesperson, call it a spokesperson.

• 1:16:11Speaker 07

  I've mentioned this to them many, many years back. Our own organization has never stood up for one farmer.

• 1:16:22Speaker 07

  I've personally spoken to top management.

• 1:16:27Speaker 07

  At that stage, Dan Creek. They did nothing.

• 1:16:33Speaker 07

  They just hide these death certificates under the table. Nobody come back to me and say, you're wrong, you're right, nothing. So I've got pictures of it, I can show it, I can prove it.

• 1:16:48Speaker 07

  We had a spike of farmers, I think around about 10 to 2010, 2007, don't take me on it, but all of a sudden, those death certificates, when it used to say bullet wound ball, whatever it used to say, it now changed.

• 1:17:05Speaker 07

  So I think Ramaphosa is doing the biggest fraud in the world, first of all, with the death certificates. And don't tell me, the ambassador here in the US, Mr. Roofmeyer, doesn't know that. Because he was part of the government

• 1:17:21Speaker 07

  reporting to the president, Mr. Evy Declark at that stage. He must have known all this. And he must still know it.

• 1:17:33Speaker 07

  If you've gone through all that,

• 1:17:38Speaker 07

  then first of all,

• 1:17:41Speaker 07

  they don't investigate the murder. If they do investigate it,

• 1:17:47Speaker 07

  the docket at the police station will go missing.

• 1:17:51Speaker 07

  It will just disappear.

• 1:17:54Speaker 07

  You've got no say over it.

• 1:17:58Speaker 07

  If they do catch somebody like this one, Mario Konzo, that murdered my father-in-law.

• 1:18:06Speaker 07

  He murdered 23 people.

• 1:18:11Speaker 07

  He got a life sentence of 146 years. We went through that whole ordeal.

• 1:18:17Speaker 07

  So when you get to court,

• 1:18:22Speaker 07

  I just studied agriculture, so I'm not an attorney, I'm not an advocate. I'm not a politician. I'm a normal person. I battle to pay my accounts. Like any other normal person.

• 1:18:37Speaker 07

  But my farm workers are being sorted. They live, they eat.

• 1:18:44Speaker 07

  I will not feed somebody like Roofmeyer and Pete Krokump in South Africa. That is white. I will rather feed a black person, not Malama.

• 1:18:56Speaker 07

  We are not all racist, black and white people. I can't be blamed for what's happening in the Cape Flats. You are murdering your own people. I'm standing up for myself. For my own people, for my own family.

• 1:19:13Speaker 07

  I have been in three attacks.

• 1:19:18Speaker 07

  We survived the first two. Nobody got killed.

• 1:19:24Speaker 01

  Is that how you got the scar on your chin?

• 1:19:28Speaker 07

  That's one of them, yeah.

• 1:19:29Speaker 01

  What happened?

• 1:19:32Speaker 07

  I was slaughtering cattle and walked onto them and they saw me and said I was gonna report them, they had to kill me.

• 1:19:39Speaker 01

  They were slaughtering your cattle?

• 1:19:41Speaker 07

  My grandfather's cattle, so.

• 1:19:46Speaker 07

  They tried to slit my throat, fought back, I've got a scar on my leg, scar on the side.

• 1:19:53Speaker 07

  That one was actually okay.

• 1:19:56Speaker 07

  The other one, they came onto my grandfather's farm, said they wanted to buy sheep.

• 1:20:05Speaker 07

  My grandfather, we immediately saw that there was trouble. My wife was there with me, we didn't have kids yet.

• 1:20:13Speaker 07

  My grandfather sent my wife into the house and said she must put the lights off, turn the, open the dogs, something like that. At first she didn't register. And when she got it, she went into the house, opened the safe, got the guns out. I went in the other way around the house, my grandfather stood there. And when we got inside, the next minute, it was a taxi full of people, they came out with AK-47s and just started shooting at us.

• 1:20:40Speaker 07

  So my grandfather came through the kitchen door and we fired back.

• 1:20:48Speaker 07

  We phoned the police. They came there, no forensic investigation, nothing.

• 1:20:55Speaker 07

  And nothing happened of it afterwards.

• 1:20:56Speaker 01

  Why did they start firing an AK-47 at you?

• 1:21:00Speaker 07

  No idea. We didn't have any sheep to sell.

• 1:21:04Speaker 01

  Did you know these people?

• 1:21:05Speaker 07

  No.

• 1:21:06Speaker 01

  Had you ever seen them before?

• 1:21:08Speaker 07

  The same ones that murdered my father, never seen them ever before.

• 1:21:13Speaker 07

  So in court, in the, this Mario Konzo was caught. And the court had said that there was eight people outside, six people, so when you're on, in a farm murder, you've got all these burglar roofing outside.

• 1:21:24Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:21:25Speaker 07

  All the steel fences, all the barbed wire to keep people out. But you're in the house, you're stuck in your own house, you can't get out.

• 1:21:30Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:21:37Speaker 01

  But you don't, I mean, to drive to a stranger's house and open fire with an AK-47 for no reason is a strange thing to do.

• 1:21:44Speaker 07

  Same what they did when they murdered my father-in-law, said this is what they do, they dive past and see there's a soft target and they just go in.

• 1:21:50Speaker 01

  Did they steal a lot of things?

• 1:21:53Speaker 07

  They don't come to steal, they, they come to take guns and murder and take vehicles. They don't steal anything, there's no theft involved here.

• 1:22:04Speaker 01

  They just wanna kill the whites?

• 1:22:05Speaker 07

  So the second attack.

• 1:22:09Speaker 07

  I came back from work, stopped in front of the farm gate and here was this black man standing in front of the gate with racehorse bridles, racing bridles, those racehorse, racing bridles are very expensive. Aluminum, alamite shoes, horses, a whole lot of things, they wanted to sell it to me.

• 1:22:31Speaker 07

  So I phoned the policeman and I said, there's a, there's a man standing in front of my gate and it looks like he wants to sell me stolen goods. So they said to me, I must bring him into town to Kimberley. They will give me money, there's a bar there, a horseshoe hotel, I must stop there, they will wait for me there, I must get this man in the car, walk in, they will give me money. There will be police in the car park right next to me. So it worked 100%. Police were standing outside, they didn't look like policemen, also black people.

• 1:23:05Speaker 07

  Got out, they gave me the money and I offered him the money. And when he took the money, they arrested him. So that was it, one thief less. But he escaped. And he came back. With my barn and light.

• 1:23:22Speaker 01

  He set your barn on fire?

• 1:23:23Speaker 07

  My tactors burned down, some of my tactors, my equipment, I had alfalfa bales there that burned down. And as it is, you always underinsure when things like that happen. I think I lost about 1.3, 1.4 million rand to that stage, which was from my pocket.

• 1:23:43Speaker 07

  Met up with my wife in the house with guns, took my guns. It took me months to get my guns back. Eventually they caught him again, got my firearms with him. And he escaped again, and he's still at large till today. I never caught him, I was treated like a criminal because my guns got missing.

• 1:24:05Speaker 07

  And they wanted to cancel my firearm licenses and all that.

• 1:24:08Speaker 01

  It sounds like if, if strangers are pulling up with AK-47s, that it's easy to get a gun in South Africa.

• 1:24:17Speaker 07

  The only people that's gonna have a license is us.

• 1:24:20Speaker 01

  Whites?

• 1:24:20Speaker 07

  Yeah. A license for a firearm, the rest is, AK-47, we're not allowed to have automatic rifles or weapons with us. You've got to have a special license to get something like that.

• 1:24:35Speaker 01

  You, you don't have AK-47s?

• 1:24:36Speaker 07

  No, we can't, we can't have that on our, there is people that does have, but there's special reasons why you'll have, why you'll have something like it. So handgun is there, and a hunting rifle, single shot guns, but other than that, no.

• 1:24:52Speaker 01

  Wait, so you've been the victim of three farm attacks, they tried to cut your throat, they attacked your wife, they murdered your father-in-law in front of your kids, but you can't have an AK-47, but they do?

• 1:25:04Speaker 07

  Yeah, no, you're not allowed.

• 1:25:06Speaker 01

  That sounds like America.

• 1:25:07Speaker 07

  So if you, if you.

• 1:25:13Speaker 07

  Look, I don't wanna shoot anybody.

• 1:25:17Speaker 07

  If you do shoot one of those intruders.

• 1:25:22Speaker 07

  I can guarantee you a million percent that I will be in jail first.

• 1:25:29Speaker 01

  In your house?

• 1:25:30Speaker 07

  In my own house, I can guarantee you that I will sit in jail, so you don't wanna shoot them. You don't even wanna point a gun at them. Then you in big trouble.

• 1:25:42Speaker 07

  So they are trying to disarm us now.

• 1:25:46Speaker 01

  How is this not ethnic cleansing? It sounds like ethnic cleansing to me, if you take one group of people on the basis of their race and say you can't defend yourself, and they tell everyone else you can rape their wives and murder them, that sounds like ethnic cleansing.

• 1:26:00Speaker 07

  It's all, it's all blamed on the poverty that was caused by me and my friend, Mr. Jan van Rebeek, when he came in in 1625. So I don't know how I was communicating with him, probably via WhatsApp, telling him that we are going to destroy South Africa, that we are going to steal everything.

• 1:26:23Speaker 07

  I haven't got the answer for that.

• 1:26:27Speaker 07

  If you, they're trying to disarm us now, like 100%, to take all our firearms away from us, that we can't have licenses, they're trying their utmost best to disarm us. Because they are worried that we are going to defend ourselves. We cannot go and defend, you cannot fight AK-47 with a 9mm pistol.

• 1:26:50Speaker 01

  No, you can't.

• 1:26:50Speaker 07

  That is impossible. And there is not one farmer in South Africa.

• 1:26:57Speaker 07

  That wants to murder and shoot people, there's not one of us. Why would we do that? We need each other, we need to carry on, we need, all we wanna do in South Africa is be at your own business and carry on, why can't we be safe? Why murder us for the poverty that you as the ANC has caused? How can I be blamed for the poverty?

• 1:27:24Speaker 01

  You said you don't wanna shoot anyone, you're a Christian, you don't wanna harm other people, and I believe you. How do you think the people who shot your father-in-law felt, do you think they felt bad about it?

• 1:27:36Speaker 07

  No, I don't think they'd even get nightmares of it.

• 1:27:42Speaker 07

  How can you murder 23 people?

• 1:27:45Speaker 07

  And sit and smile when you get to the courtroom, look me in the eye and grin? And provoke me in such a way that I think I'm gonna get a heart attack?

• 1:27:54Speaker 01

  He did that to you, the man who raped your wife and shot your father-in-law?

• 1:27:57Speaker 07

  Looked at me and smiled at me and other people were sitting next to him, they only caught one of eight. So when you go to court, these people can pick an attorney or an advocate, or one is being provided to them.

• 1:28:13Speaker 07

  I've got to sit with a state prosecutor that's there on the day. So we went to court years after the murder was committed, I don't know how many years, three, four. So the state prosecutor was a white man, the man that was representing the murderer was also white.

• 1:28:33Speaker 07

  The guy on the bench was a white guy.

• 1:28:38Speaker 07

  So we don't have a jury in South Africa in courtrooms.

• 1:28:44Speaker 07

  The judge decides by himself. The judges are employed by the president.

• 1:28:52Speaker 07

  So they employ their own judges. We've got no say about that.

• 1:29:00Speaker 07

  So I've got to go to court, except the state prosecutor that's there.

• 1:29:07Speaker 07

  This specific man came, he smelled of alcohol, he was sweating, he was late.

• 1:29:14Speaker 07

  And that whole thing that you put over, I don't know what you call it even.

• 1:29:21Speaker 07

  He said, we ran into an empty courtroom and he said to my wife, please tell me what happened at the murder, for three, four minutes. Then we walked to court for three days.

• 1:29:32Speaker 07

  They took my wife apart inside. At one stage, the, the guy that was representing, the white man that's representing this murder, wanted to know what they've done to her. And she only committed rape to me like three, four years after that.

• 1:29:53Speaker 07

  In the meantime, she had an HIV test. With nobody knowing. Waiting if it's positive or not.

• 1:30:08Speaker 07

  And you go through that whole thing in court so that this man can tell you you're a liar.

• 1:30:17Speaker 07

  You get fined, found guilty.

• 1:30:20Speaker 07

  I witnessed the body.

• 1:30:23Speaker 07

  I got the death certificate. We go to court.

• 1:30:28Speaker 07

  You know how many years of my life I've lost?

• 1:30:32Speaker 07

  Being scared.

• 1:30:35Speaker 07

  Sitting next to a kitchen table that you can't even talk. You can't say anything.

• 1:30:42Speaker 07

  All that's in your head and your mind is what happened to you.

• 1:30:47Speaker 07

  And then this white attorney will tell my wife in court that she's lying. And if everything is finished and he gets a sentence of 146 years, he gets at least after a year. They are telling me now he died. They can't prove anything to me.

• 1:31:04Speaker 00

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• 1:32:00Speaker 07

  So my wife got sick.

• 1:32:05Speaker 07

  We got to a professor in Cape Town. They all agreed that the diseases because of the intense fear that she had experienced.

• 1:32:17Speaker 07

  Her fingernails started losing

• 1:32:23Speaker 07

  from the front to the back.

• 1:32:28Speaker 07

  All dead of them.

• 1:32:31Speaker 07

  That she was in so much pain that she couldn't see herself when she went to a toilet.

• 1:32:40Speaker 07

  The humiliation in that for women.

• 1:32:45Speaker 07

  That if she had to use her head

• 1:32:51Speaker 07

  to blow her hair off, she's washed them. The ones that's left.

• 1:32:58Speaker 07

  Of all the pain because the fingernails are losing because of these diseases.

• 1:33:06Speaker 07

  I cannot take my wife. I couldn't take her to a hospital where I live. There is no hospital left.

• 1:33:15Speaker 07

  The closest one that I could help her was in Cape Town. I waited for three and a half years. Maybe more.

• 1:33:27Speaker 07

  At one stage, we stayed there for six months and she needed treatment.

• 1:33:36Speaker 07

  She gets chemo.

• 1:33:40Speaker 07

  There's a thing that if you don't have white blood cells.

• 1:33:45Speaker 07

  That you inject, that I had to inject her around your navel. They're called Grastiva, I think.

• 1:33:54Speaker 07

  In your hand, wise, it's 1,500 RMB injection. So that your body can make white blood cells so that you have an immune system.

• 1:34:07Speaker 07

  My medical aid didn't pay for it. I had a hospital plan. The government doesn't pay that.

• 1:34:14Speaker 07

  I had to pay 60,000 RMB a month. I don't know how long.

• 1:34:21Speaker 07

  To pay for that. Five injections a week, only Saturdays and Sundays not.

• 1:34:28Speaker 07

  That causes your bone marrow to expand.

• 1:34:37Speaker 07

  She got allergic to morphine. No normal person can live that long.

• 1:34:44Speaker 07

  And be on painkillers and your liver and your kidneys last.

• 1:34:50Speaker 07

  Of all the chemo and chemo tablets and everything you drink.

• 1:35:03Speaker 07

  When I came with those injections.

• 1:35:07Speaker 07

  Four hours after that, your bone marrow expands and then she's in so much pain.

• 1:35:13Speaker 07

  And there's nothing I could do for her. But I do.

• 1:35:18Speaker 07

  But these tablets that you dissolve in water, that was the only thing that worked. A tray is full of that.

• 1:35:27Speaker 07

  But I'm not a medical doctor. I had to inject her myself.

• 1:35:33Speaker 07

  And to bring that bloody thing there.

• 1:35:37Speaker 07

  To know

• 1:35:45Speaker 07

  how much pain she's going to be in four hours after that. And then Saturday, she's better. Sunday, she's okay. She walks, she laughs, she laughs, she tries to cook. Visit the kids. Monday morning.

• 1:36:00Speaker 07

  Nine o'clock, I've got to give that injection all over again.

• 1:36:06Speaker 07

  I spend thousands of RMBs to try and keep my wife comfortable.

• 1:36:14Speaker 07

  If you had treatment for leukemia and all that and you've got to drive back home. 800 kilometers.

• 1:36:23Speaker 07

  When we, we, we, when we had this country.

• 1:36:28Speaker 07

  We had hospitals, you can drive in your own town. Two kilometers and you were at a hospital. Somebody would have treated you.

• 1:36:35Speaker 01

  What happened to the hospital?

• 1:36:37Speaker 07

  The hospitals just got destroyed by the ANC government. There's no hospitals anymore. There is just no hospitals. It looks like big size, you can't go there.

• 1:36:50Speaker 07

  I invite anybody to go to these small towns in between Johannesburg, Durban and those places. Go there and see what happens. See if you're patient and you would be treated.

• 1:37:05Speaker 07

  Please, no hospitals left. Trauma Plaza, all these hospitals are gone.

• 1:37:11Speaker 07

  So then I had to drive her all the way back home.

• 1:37:15Speaker 07

  All the expenses are for me.

• 1:37:19Speaker 07

  They murder us, they rape our wives. My daughter had to go through psychiatrist treatment.

• 1:37:28Speaker 07

  When a kid is 15 years old and book herself into a hospital.

• 1:37:35Speaker 07

  Where they try and fix your head. By herself. You must know, a kid is in trouble.

• 1:37:43Speaker 07

  And she phoned me and said, Dad, I'm here now, I can't live for myself any longer.

• 1:37:50Speaker 07

  She didn't commit suicide.

• 1:37:54Speaker 07

  She wrote a book.

• 1:37:56Speaker 07

  With poems in it. You read that thing.

• 1:38:02Speaker 07

  And it's your own kid. You can't do anything but cry.

• 1:38:08Speaker 07

  And then the whole world comes back and say, you're lying, you racist bastards, you murdering the black people. That's why they murder you.

• 1:38:18Speaker 01

  They do say that too. That's what the American media says.

• 1:38:22Speaker 07

  Say that all over the world.

• 1:38:25Speaker 07

  If you go back to the death certificates. If you go back to the investigations, that does not happen.

• 1:38:31Speaker 07

  We cannot prove that we are getting murdered. There is a genocide going on. If there's 25,000 or 30,000 of us left. How many more can they murder?

• 1:38:45Speaker 07

  Any family in South Africa has got people, family that works overseas or lives or immigrated to Australia, America, New Zealand or England.

• 1:38:56Speaker 07

  I don't know of anybody that hasn't got family that's been in, that's in another country.

• 1:39:01Speaker 01

  Are you gonna stay?

• 1:39:03Speaker 07

  I've got to stay. My kids doesn't want to go. It's a beautiful country. We're trying to fix, we need solutions, we need help.

• 1:39:10Speaker 07

  What the solution is, I don't know.

• 1:39:13Speaker 01

  But, I mean, the intent obviously is to, is to kill you or force you to leave.

• 1:39:21Speaker 07

  Yeah, I think

• 1:39:24Speaker 07

  we'll probably see it out till they start taking taking the farms, taking our property.

• 1:39:32Speaker 07

  And then your own agricultural organization, AgriSA, is negotiating with the ANC government.

• 1:39:44Speaker 07

  On my behalf of my own property that I worked and paid for without my permission.

• 1:39:50Speaker 01

  What do you mean negotiate? What is there to negotiate?

• 1:39:52Speaker 07

  They are setting the rules how they can take these farms away. Which farms must be taken?

• 1:39:59Speaker 07

  They started that long ago. What is the criteria? That they can take your farm away? And then they come back and say, no, it's not that bad. They won't just take your farm. They can take anything they want. It's been written in the law books. They can take my car away if they want. Without compensation.

• 1:40:21Speaker 07

  We're going the same route as Mbappe.

• 1:40:24Speaker 07

  But we've got to stand up

• 1:40:27Speaker 07

  and try and save something. If I can save one daughter and one wife from being raped or to go through witness a body.

• 1:40:42Speaker 07

  Go to court.

• 1:40:45Speaker 07

  If we can pick our own attorneys and our own advocates for the government to pay.

• 1:40:51Speaker 07

  Then I'll get somewhere.

• 1:40:53Speaker 01

  It doesn't sound like you can persuade them. I mean, anyone who would allow this to happen is evil and isn't open to reason or negotiation.

• 1:41:08Speaker 07

  I look sense the malati.

• 1:41:12Speaker 07

  What I was taught is they are not negotiable. They are not, it's impossible to negotiate with them.

• 1:41:24Speaker 07

  They ran to Russia when there was an apartheid system in place.

• 1:41:31Speaker 07

  They ran to Russia, to Lebanon, and wherever, where did they run to?

• 1:41:37Speaker 07

  Probably Iran also.

• 1:41:42Speaker 07

  We've got nowhere to run.

• 1:41:47Speaker 07

  If I can plead with the United States government, wherever they will be, I don't care. I've got to stand up for my own family. I cannot stand up for the Cape Flats or for wherever.

• 1:42:00Speaker 07

  We've got into a situation that I've got to stand up for my own family. It came as close as that. I've got to stand up for my own kids, my own grandchildren around me like that.

• 1:42:11Speaker 01

  It sounds like you will.

• 1:42:14Speaker 07

  I made that decision already.

• 1:42:17Speaker 07

  I've lost

• 1:42:20Speaker 07

  the love of my life that I was being worth for 37 years.

• 1:42:27Speaker 07

  My whole family has been destroyed. This is stolen like 10 years of my life.

• 1:42:34Speaker 07

  When I started chewing horses,

• 1:42:39Speaker 07

  I was so excited when I put the first money down to buy a farm. I cannot explain this to you.

• 1:42:46Speaker 07

  When I had 10 goats and five sheep,

• 1:42:50Speaker 07

  that was the best thing in the world that happened to me.

• 1:42:55Speaker 07

  I've built it up in such a way that we can live.

• 1:43:00Speaker 07

  And now I've got to give it away for free. They tell me I stole it.

• 1:43:08Speaker 07

  And because their sovereignty in this government and they can make laws to punish Yanvan Ribeck,

• 1:43:16Speaker 07

  I came back, I keep on coming back to the same thing. Because the intelligence that's in this government is of such that that's the only thing they've got. I cannot be blamed for the poverty that's there.

• 1:43:31Speaker 07

  That's not my doing. I'm making a contribution, as is all my fellow farmers in South Africa, towards poverty. But we cannot look after the millions that's coming as illegal immigrants into this country.

• 1:43:49Speaker 07

  That is the government's job, not us.

• 1:43:53Speaker 07

  And from taking my farm away and murdering me is not going to solve the problem. Malema can scream whatever he wants. He's got no brains at all or any intelligence to plant corn tomorrow morning or to farm with cattle or do whatever he is. They will die of hunger if we are not there. They will.

• 1:44:16Speaker 01

  So it, over all of this is a government and a judicial system that is ignoring what's happening. Judges seem to refuse to bring any of the perpetrators to justice. Who appoints the judges?

• 1:44:33Speaker 07

  Yeah, so look, I'm not a,

• 1:44:37Speaker 07

  I'm not a state president or something, but the state president has got the say and Malema is also on this board or whatever that decides.

• 1:44:46Speaker 01

  Julius Malema.

• 1:44:47Speaker 07

  Who the judges will be, so.

• 1:44:50Speaker 01

  So for people who don't follow South African politics, Julius Malema has been the head of something called the Economic Freedom Fighters, correct?

• 1:44:56Speaker 07

  Yeah, he's the head of the Economic Freedom Fighters. He's the one that sings the song, "Kill the boar, kill the farmer."

• 1:45:01Speaker 01

  Yes, he is a kind of Al Sharpton of South Africa, open racist, open anti-white racist, calling for violence against whites. But he has been portrayed as an opponent of the ANC, the ruling party. But how is he appointing judges?

• 1:45:18Speaker 07

  I, I think Malema, my personal opinion is Malema is just a front. Malema is heart and soul working for Ramaphosa.

• 1:45:31Speaker 01

  For the ANC.

• 1:45:32Speaker 07

  Yeah, heart and soul, I mean, everything points to it.

• 1:45:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, it seems obvious even from here watching.

• 1:45:39Speaker 07

  I was lucky enough that I wasn't in a proper school and I was at university when it was still there.

• 1:45:46Speaker 07

  Although I studied agriculture, I don't think I'm that brain dead that I can't see it.

• 1:45:50Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:45:54Speaker 07

  There's an attorney in Cape Town, Millie Wesley, that's found him guilty on hate speech.

• 1:46:01Speaker 07

  They've gone to court the other day again.

• 1:46:06Speaker 07

  He's supposed to be in jail. Nothing is happening to him.

• 1:46:11Speaker 07

  He's been found guilty of firing off the firearm where 80, 90,000 people were sitting

• 1:46:20Speaker 07

  in public.

• 1:46:22Speaker 07

  He's not in jail.

• 1:46:25Speaker 07

  If I point

• 1:46:28Speaker 07

  a water pistol that I buy from the local shop where they sell bread that kids play with, that will be plastic and neon green in color.

• 1:46:41Speaker 07

  If I point that play gun at you,

• 1:46:47Speaker 07

  you will end up in jail.

• 1:46:50Speaker 07

  I know this because my son-in-law played with an air gun with a man of color,

• 1:47:00Speaker 07

  a BB gun. And unfortunately,

• 1:47:05Speaker 07

  pushed his limits and shot the man on his leg. He almost, he ended up almost in jail. He got a fine of 100,000 rand.

• 1:47:19Speaker 07

  And a suspension on his job for six months.

• 1:47:27Speaker 07

  And it read that he was found guilty of pointing a firearm.

• 1:47:33Speaker 07

  A BB gun that kids play with.

• 1:47:36Speaker 07

  Malema can fire off

• 1:47:39Speaker 07

  an automatic rifle in public. Find, they found him guilty of that. Nothing happens to him.

• 1:47:51Speaker 07

  If Malema would ever become the president of South Africa,

• 1:47:57Speaker 07

  you will see blood flow like you've never seen.

• 1:48:02Speaker 07

  You will never, ever see a bigger dictator than him. The biggest question is always,

• 1:48:13Speaker 07

  they start with you running to America.

• 1:48:18Speaker 07

  We can sort out our own problems.

• 1:48:23Speaker 07

  How can we sort out your own problems? How many times that we speak to this government? How many times that you pray? The court doesn't even help you. How can you sort out your own problems and be sovereign? Like this new president came here over the weekend or when did he comes here? Did he come here, the one in South Africa?

• 1:48:44Speaker 07

  That says we, they must not be sanctions against their visums.

• 1:48:52Speaker 07

  How is that possible? That they can judge themselves the right to have people murdered all the time? Stand in front of the whole world and sing, "Kill the boar, kill the farmer."

• 1:49:09Speaker 07

  Fire off a rifle.

• 1:49:13Speaker 07

  You employ the judges, you Julius Malema, with Ramaphosa. He's on the board.

• 1:49:22Speaker 07

  Nothing happens to you.

• 1:49:26Speaker 07

  There's no statistics, it doesn't make sense at all.

• 1:49:30Speaker 07

  I mean, how is this possible? The only way that we can stop this is

• 1:49:37Speaker 07

  these politicians cannot have all the power. They cannot have all the power. The only way we will survive

• 1:49:47Speaker 07

  is somewhere along the line. There's got to be self-governance, like we've got a place there called Urania. It's people that's got a normal farm

• 1:49:58Speaker 07

  on the other side of Hope Town in the Northern Cape that started and made a massive success of this farm. Now the ANC and Malema is going for them all the way because it's racist. How can it be racist?

• 1:50:13Speaker 01

  These are people who've destroyed every institution in your country, from the power grid to the schools, to the hospitals, governance itself, the courts. None of it works. The murder rate's out of control. The rape rate is the highest on the planet. And now they're murdering Afrikaan-speaking peoples and stealing their farms. So on what basis can they say you don't have a right to have your own community? I don't understand.

• 1:50:39Speaker 07

  I can't answer you on that also.

• 1:50:42Speaker 01

  It does sound kind of familiar as an American, I have to say.

• 1:50:45Speaker 07

  All, all I know is

• 1:50:50Speaker 07

  at one point,

• 1:50:54Speaker 07

  my family's blood can't flow

• 1:50:58Speaker 07

  for the sake of Yanvan Ribeck and the poverty in the country.

• 1:51:03Speaker 07

  I can promise you, if we were governing that place, the poverty would have been not like it is now.

• 1:51:08Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:51:10Speaker 07

  But I can't be blamed for that. But I don't want to be a state president. All I want to be is I want to be a farmer.

• 1:51:18Speaker 07

  As an agronomist, I can make a contribution to my fellow farmers. Because, I come back to that, we do have the best farmers in the world.

• 1:51:32Speaker 07

  We are Christian people

• 1:51:37Speaker 07

  and your farmers has got integrity.

• 1:51:41Speaker 07

  To be still farming in South Africa if you don't have integrity,

• 1:51:47Speaker 07

  you can't produce food because financially we don't get anything. You've got to do everything by yourself.

• 1:51:56Speaker 07

  To harvest 16 and 18 tons of corn, 8 tons of wheat or 10 tons of wheat,

• 1:52:03Speaker 07

  80 between 200 tons of potatoes on citrus, I can't, I don't know the facts, I'm not a,

• 1:52:12Speaker 07

  I don't have the knowledge about trees and all that, but

• 1:52:18Speaker 07

  how can they not see that the South African farmer is making a contribution to this, to South Africa?

• 1:52:27Speaker 01

  Well, of course they can see it and that's why they hate you.

• 1:52:31Speaker 01

  Godspeed, Mr. Lott. Thank you very much for spending all this time and for accounting what you did.

• 1:52:37Speaker 07

  It's been, it's a privilege and we do appreciate it.

• 1:52:44Speaker 07

  And on behalf of the whole of South Africa

• 1:52:52Speaker 07

  and even the people in the Cape Flats that's getting murdered,

• 1:52:59Speaker 07

  I do wish it could have been different.

• 1:53:04Speaker 07

  You don't know how we wish that we could just live in peace together. There's enough farms for everybody to buy. Buy them and farm them. The government has got enough money.

• 1:53:21Speaker 07

  We've got enough knowledge as white farmers to set people up and start farming.

• 1:53:29Speaker 07

  But

• 1:53:31Speaker 07

  not for free. We didn't come here for free. We're not going for free.

• 1:53:39Speaker 01

  God bless you.

• 1:53:40Speaker 07

  Thank you very much.