S2E47: Chani Nicholas: Astrology Beyond the Horoscope | Talk Tracks

Astrology is often reduced to sun signs and daily horoscopes, but its history and practice go far deeper. In this episode, Ky sits down with New York Times bestselling author and astrologer Chani Nicholas for a wide-ranging exploration of what astrology actually is, where it comes from, and how it has been used across centuries. Chani breaks down the basics of a birth chart, rising signs, houses, planets, and timing techniques, while tracing astrology back to ancient systems of observing patterns between the sky and life on Earth. Together they explore fate versus free will, astrology as a tool for self-understanding and purpose, and the idea that the movements of the cosmos may reflect patterns unfolding within a larger, interconnected reality. Chani explains the major astrological shifts happening now and what previous cycles might suggest about the moment we’re living through. Whether you’re deeply versed in astrology or have never looked beyond your sun sign, this conversation offers a fascinating introduction to the history, philosophy, and practice behind one of humanity’s oldest systems for making meaning of the sky. _______ Explore Chani's book, You Were Born for This: Astrology for Radical Self-Acceptance https://amzn.to/4zIxMis. And enjoy a 30-day all access pass to the Chani app with code TELEPATHYTAPES30 _______ Join The Telepathy Tapes Backstage Pass https://thetelepathytapes.supercast.com/ to get ad-free episodes, never-before-heard interviews, behind-the-scenes documentary footage, and access to our private Discord community. This is your invitation to come closer. To help shape what’s next. To be more than a listener… to be a co-creator of this paradigm shift. So if you’ve felt moved, if you’ve felt seen, if you’ve felt the call, subscribe today and join us: thetelepathytapes.com. https://thetelepathytapes.com/ _______ Thank you to our sponsors! Alloy http://myalloy.com/ - Try the original estrogen-powered M4 skincare from Alloy. Visit myalloy.com http://myalloy.com/ and use code TAPES for $20 off your first order! BiOptimizers https://bioptimizers.com/tapes - Make this the year you finally get your sleep, your energy, and yourself back. Get 15% off at bioptimizers.com/tapes https://bioptimizers.com/tapes when you use my code, TAPES. Honeylove https://www.honeylove.com/?utm_medium=Podcast&utm_source=Podscale&utm_campaign=PR&utm_creative=TelepathyTapes&amount=20percent Treat yourself to the most advanced bras and shapewear on the market. Save 20% off Honeylove at honeylove.com/TAPES. https://www.honeylove.com/?utm_medium=Podcast&utm_source=Podscale&utm_campaign=PR&utm_creative=TelepathyTapes&amount=20percentKa'Chava https://kachava.com/ - Go to kachava.com https://kachava.com/ and use code TAPES for 15% off your first order. Luminara https://www.luminara.care/ - If you’re curious about energy healing and ready to experience it for yourself, Luminara is offering 20% off your first session for listeners of The Telepathy Tapes. Just go to luminara.care https://www.luminara.care/ and use code TAPES20. Quince https://www.quince.com/tapes - Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to Quince.com/tapes https://www.quince.com/tapes for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Ky Dickens?

  Hi, everyone. I'm Kai Dickens and welcome to The Talk Tracks, brought to you weekly by TTT Media. In this series, we explore the threads that weave together our understanding of reality, science, spirituality, consciousness, and even unexplained phenomena. Because every era has ideas once dismissed as impossible until someone was willing to investigate them seriously. And on this show, we do just that.

• 0:28Speaker 01

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• 0:58Ky Dickens?

  If you want to see our incredible guests in person, we have a video version of this episode on the Telepathy Tapes YouTube page. Today, we're talking to Chani Nicholas, the New York Times bestselling author of You Were Born For This: Astrology for Radical Self-Acceptance. She's also the world-renowned astrologer behind the Chani app, and she also served as a resident astrologer for Oprah Daily. It's going to be a fascinating conversation around something I know very little about, which is astrology, its roots, and how it can best serve and inform us today. So, Chani, welcome to The Talk Tracks. It's great to have you here. Introduce yourself, who you are, what you do.

• 1:32Speaker 02

  My name is Chani Nicholas. I am a professional astrologer. I have a tech company. We have an app called the Chani app, regretfully named my own name. And it is an astrology app that provides people with weekly readings, and there's meditations, and there's a whole explanation about your chart. And my main goal with it all, with our business and with everything we do, is to help people access the potential of their creative power. And I think that we give people the blueprint of their potential in the palm of their hands.

• 2:14Speaker 02

  And I want you to take that and go be of service in the world.

• 2:19Ky Dickens?

  Love that.

• 2:19Speaker 02

  Because I think that when we know what our gifts are, it's like a little bit of a shortcut to being of service.

• 2:27Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 2:27Speaker 02

  Because we need to be embedded in our purpose, because that embeds us in our joy and in our development and in an appropriate struggle, like the struggle that is meant for us. And when we're engaged in that, I think we feel alive. And I believe that that is always connected to being of service.

• 2:48Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:49Speaker 02

  So, I want to give you insight into your being, but I don't want you to stop at navel gazing. I hope that that swiftly moves you into

• 2:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 2:59Speaker 02

  taking part in creating the world that we desperately need to create together.

• 3:04Ky Dickens?

  Love that.

• 3:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:05Ky Dickens?

  And so, a lot of our listeners are like really scientific and

• 3:09Speaker 02

  Yes, love.

• 3:10Ky Dickens?

  come to this kind of

• 3:11Speaker 02

  Love science.

• 3:11Ky Dickens?

  everything skeptically. And some people are like

• 3:13Speaker 02

  Love skeptic.

• 3:13Ky Dickens?

  bought in, super woo-woo. We have, and I say that, both sides with love.

• 3:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 3:18Ky Dickens?

  And I love trying to meet them both. So, I think for the most basic, like, from the most basic point of view, can you just define the different, what is astrology and how is it different from astronomy?

• 3:28Speaker 02

  Well, they used to be the same thing, right? Like, historically, when you look at the longest-running scientific document, it was, it's a series of cuneiform tablets that are documenting the movement of the planets. And that was someone watching the sky and watching the planets and also taking note if anything happened on Earth when that thing in the sky happened. And so, in the beginning, astronomy was astrology. They were not separate. I'm fine that they're separate now. They're also not separate to

• 4:05Speaker 02

  me. So, I have no qualms with people not quote-unquote believing in astrology. I don't think we should all believe the same thing. I think that is a cult.

• 4:19Ky Dickens?

  That's right.

• 4:20Speaker 02

  I need less cults in the world, especially in this country. And I think believing, not believing, using, not using, whatever your thing is, I just want you to move speedily towards it. But it is a pattern recognition system. And that 700-year document is the beginning of writing that down. Of course, astrology and a kind of cosmology has existed way, it predates that massively. We can look at like the drawings in the caves of Lassoe

• 5:00Speaker 02

  in France, and they were drawing bulls, and they were drawing what we think are probably the Pleiades, the stars, rising up over the eastern horizon around the spring equinox, most likely, because that would have been a signal to them that life was coming back and that things are going to start to grow in the way that they only do in spring and summer.

• 5:24Ky Dickens?

  Interesting.

• 5:24Speaker 02

  So, all of our origin stories, since the beginning of time, come out of our relationship with the Earth and the sky. There is no culture on Earth that was not in its origin paying attention to the living world around it, including the sky.

• 5:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 5:43Speaker 02

  You had to. You had to know when the sun was going to be bright and when it was going to be minimal, because your food source depended on it.

• 5:52Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 5:52Speaker 02

  So, if you look at the major religious festivals and holidays of all religions, all major religions, they will happen around the solstices and the equinoxes. Not only that, they'll happen around the full moon or the new moon around the solstices and the equinoxes, or there within.

• 6:09Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 6:10Speaker 02

  I mean, these constellations rose and fell in a certain pattern, year after year after year after year. And then, we realized that people who menstruated menstruated in the same time period as the lunar cycle.

• 6:28Ky Dickens?

  Mm-hmm.

• 6:31Speaker 02

  Like, that's just something we emerged into.

• 6:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 6:38Speaker 02

  And so, there's really good reason to think that the moon and the menstruation cycle taught us math. We're counting, right? The sun will teach us math. The sun will teach us rhythms. The moon will teach us math. The moon will teach us rhythms. Of course, we know like the moon affects the tides, and there's also that for people who lived along the shoreline of any place in the world. And so, the idea of a culture being separate from the sky, take astrology out of it, but the idea of a culture being separate from the sky and separate from the Earth and separate from the ways in which

• 7:19Speaker 02

  those things are in conversation is, to me, a purely settler colonialist framework.

• 7:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  To not think that we would be in relation with everything in the living world around us is one of the great losses of settler colonialism.

• 7:38Ky Dickens?

  Absolutely.

• 7:39Speaker 02

  You know, and this is

• 7:40Ky Dickens?

  That's my rant. I love it. Well, you brought up something interesting, because I was talking to my producer, Selena, about how even the most skeptical person around astrology can understand the moon affects you, right? Like, that's the most, it affects the water and

• 7:55Speaker 02

  Well, this is the thing. You can go, we can go down that path. Sorry to cut you off.

• 7:59Ky Dickens?

  No. Well, I was gonna say, but then I think the next branch is, okay, but it's not too far of a leap then to be like, every astral body could affect us in some way if the moon is. But then it's like, how do you start dividing it into sun signs and like what people I think most think of around astrology, right? It's like, I'm a Taurus.

• 8:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, okay. So, let's unpack

• 8:16Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 8:16Speaker 02

  some of what you just said. We're all in this like unified experience, like we're all connected. Everything is connected. We are all a part of each other.

• 8:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 8:27Speaker 02

  And that includes space and Earth and all of it.

• 8:30Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 8:30Speaker 02

  So, there is that. I'm not disqualifying that. But that's not how I look at astrology. I look at astrology as a reflection. So I don't think the planets are doing something to me. I think that there's a pattern that unfolds in the sky. And that is a reflection of living inside of an intelligent universe that is speaking to itself. I'm a part of it, you're a part of it, we're all a part of it. And you can say that's ridiculous and superstitious or whatever.

• 9:03Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:04Speaker 02

  But again, astrology comes out of, for me at least, it comes out of this idea of we're, we're living inside of a conscious body that is alive.

• 9:17Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:17Speaker 02

  And it is trying to be in conversation, again, with us, but it's with itself. Like, we're all part of an intelligent system. And again, I think like patriarchy and colonialism has just tried to strip us of that and to deduce it.

• 9:34Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:34Speaker 02

  And, and I know that scientists will listen to me and scoff at me, and that's also fine.

• 9:39Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 9:40Speaker 02

  But I also think the deeper you go into a scientific journey, the more in awe you're going to be of how everything operates.

• 9:49Ky Dickens?

  Well, this is such, it leads me into a question that, so a lot of times at the telepathy tips, we talk about the paradigm that we live in, and there have been many paradigms.

• 9:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 9:58Ky Dickens?

  And that in order for something like telepathy to be true, it can't work in our current materialist paradigm, it can't. So what a lot of scientists, they're called post-materialist scientists, and they've started like even, you know, new academies to look at each other's work and improve each other's work. And, you know, beyond this new frontier, they talk about, well, the, the new paradigm we can move into will be that consciousness is fundamental. It's not the thing, you know, created by our brain and then it dies when our brain dies. It is the baseline, and if it's the baseline, then it can do things that even physics can't account for.

• 10:30Speaker 02

  Right.

• 10:31Ky Dickens?

  And so that's a paradigm in which these things are possible.

• 10:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:34Ky Dickens?

  So it sounds like with astrology, you're really talking about something, a bigger paradigm, for it to be informing us and in conversation with us. Like, what is the paradigm in which we have to be in?

• 10:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, I work within a very structured astrological paradigm, where there's correlations between everything. So there's correlations between a planet and metals and gemstones and colors and the day of the week that it belongs to and the hour of a specific day and places in your home or in the world and occupations and mannerisms and also like temperaments in the body and physical conditions. And so to me, like, I can look around this room and be like, oh, Venus, oh, Jupiter, oh, you know, and like pick things out in terms of the color and the shapes and the textures and the qualities of things.

• 11:25Speaker 02

  And so I'm operating inside of a paradigm where there's, it's kind of like a prism of like each planet has like all of these ways that it iterates down into and manifests itself on the physical plane. And so that when it does something, then I'm looking for that correlation.

• 11:48Ky Dickens?

  So cool.

• 11:49Speaker 02

  It's really wonderful and very helpful to look at astrology in retrospect. Because either the thing happened or it didn't. Either the astrology works or it doesn't.

• 12:02Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 12:03Speaker 02

  And so if an astrologer from 1,200 years ago can say and speak to the specifics of this moment just because of what the planets are doing, what does that say?

• 12:15Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 12:16Speaker 02

  Does that mean anything to you? And if it doesn't, great, it means something to me.

• 12:21Ky Dickens?

  That's, has there been a lot of research like, like on old astrologers that might have, people have looked back and been like, wow, this man or woman was absolutely correct around XYZ?

• 12:32Speaker 02

  I mean, yeah, that's what we do.

• 12:34Ky Dickens?

  Okay, that's fascinating.

• 12:35Speaker 02

  Literally our job.

• 12:36Ky Dickens?

  So like, but looking back into like, like, who are some of the famed astrologers?

• 12:41Speaker 02

  Oh my God, do you want me to give you lists? I mean.

• 12:43Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, kind, I'm just so curious. Cause it's something I don't think people realize was like, kind of an art form. Right? A gift to people, like, read these and bring it down. It takes a lot of intelligence, right? And observation and probably time and dedication to like constant patterns and understanding them.

• 13:02Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:03Ky Dickens?

  And just like anything, there's going to be people who are probably great at that. It's natural for them.

• 13:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:07Ky Dickens?

  And then others who aren't. And then looking back at history, there's going to be superstars.

• 13:11Speaker 02

  Well, yes, and it's kind of like looking at the authors of any ancient text.

• 13:17Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 13:18Speaker 02

  You're like, is this a conglomeration of people? Is this, some people say it's like a divine, you know, like.

• 13:24Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 13:24Speaker 02

  Offering, that it's from a, a kind of, you know, more like mythic figure in a way. And then there are the texts that survive because certain cultures were able to preserve them and hide them depending on who was conquering who. So if you remember, I'm coming from what we call Western astrology, but it's, it's really from, you know, the land we would call like Iraq, Iran, Egypt, like, we're looking at ancient stuff. And in the ancient times, when you would, when you would take over a certain population, when you would conquer them, the first thing they would do is go for the astrology.

• 14:07Speaker 02

  They, and all the knowledge systems that they have. So when you conquer a certain town or city or peoples, you're like, where are your books? Where are your scholars? What do you know? And so we're left cobbling together as system, but we have like a good amount of documents and there's still a lot to be translated.

• 14:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 14:27Speaker 02

  Like, I think most people don't understand that a lot of astrologers, especially that go into these kind of vaults, are mythologists, they're historians, they're cosmologists, they're, they're interpreting, they're translating, they know ancient languages in order to, to translate this stuff. Like, it's not the horoscope that you read in the magazine. That's a gateway into what astrology really is. It's the, and then there's, you know, modern astrology, which is a whole other different thing. And so it's got this really rich, deep, historic tapestry,

• 15:09Speaker 02

  which I think is interesting whether you believe in astrology or not, whether you think it works or not.

• 15:14Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 15:15Speaker 02

  Because it is part of astronomy and it is part of the medical, our understanding of medicine is, is its origins are astrological.

• 15:24Ky Dickens?

  How so?

• 15:26Speaker 02

  Well, the planets rule different parts of the body. And so in the most ancient schools, the oldest schools, like say in, in Southern Europe that taught medicine were teaching it astrologically. They were teaching like, there's different qualities to each one. There's different humors, there's different ways in which the planet will manifest and like you'll have this ailment because, oh yeah, well, this is happening. There's a whole practice of medical astrology and it has ancient roots. It's not something, it's not new age. None of the stuff I'm talking about or I practice is new age at all.

• 16:04Ky Dickens?

  Well, I'm just so glad that you're adding this texture and richness. Cause I do think people think astrology and they think of a horoscope.

• 16:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:11Ky Dickens?

  That's it. And not this rich, deep history.

• 16:14Speaker 02

  No.

• 16:14Ky Dickens?

  And I'm curious, because you talked about your practice. And what are some of the, like, maybe ancient practices? How do they differ? Like, what are the ones that have survived today? And which is the one that you lean on or conglomeration of ones you lean on?

• 16:29Speaker 02

  Well, there's, you know, a longstanding evolution of it and then shifts in terms of how people used it. And then there's like this really short period of time where it kind of like explodes into this really detailed, really like high functioning, full, complete system. And that's where we're like, well, who wrote that? Who did that? How'd they get there that quickly? And there's, you know, like legends about who did it, how, how it came to be. There's not a lot of proof to, you know, back things up, but we have this system from a kind of seemingly like a conglomeration of all those things coming together.

• 17:08Ky Dickens?

  I love a good legend. Do you remember any of the legends or like what the tenants of the legend were?

• 17:12Speaker 02

  Some people say it's this person or this deity or this spirit, Hermes Trismegistus. But that means like three of something. Hermes is another word for Mercury, it's the scribe, it's the, so there's like, there's, people point, like ancient astrologers will point to that person, deity, man, I don't know, and say that that's what it's from, but there's no like ability to source him.

• 17:39Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 17:39Speaker 02

  Or that, that person.

• 17:41Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, fascinating.

• 17:49Ky Dickens?

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• 18:34Ky Dickens?

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• 19:55Ky Dickens?

  When it comes to the astrological signs that a lot of us know of today, that kind of evolved in Greece, right? Wasn't that like a more Hellenistic?

• 20:05Speaker 02

  Well, like, a lot of what we refer to, and obviously, all of the planets are given those, like, a Greco-Roman, kind of like, you know, glaze. But there's deeper roots to all of that. So, the Zodiac, like, the ways in which we see it now has been, again, like, put through different iterations. Like, the Egyptians had, the ancient Egyptians had that full system of decims.

• 20:33Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Okay. So, when did modern astrology, and I say this knowing that I might be qualifying it wrong, but what we now understand to be looking at a chart, and here's your sun sign. Like, why did the sun sign become such a big deal that everyone knows?

• 20:49Speaker 02

  Because it's the access point.

• 20:50Ky Dickens?

  Okay, so what does that mean?

• 20:51Speaker 02

  It's the gateway drug.

• 20:52Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 20:52Speaker 02

  Because you know, pretty much, you know the day you're born.

• 20:55Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 20:56Speaker 02

  So it's the lowest common denominator. It's the easiest access point. But before that, astrologers mostly were like, your rising sign was who you were.

• 21:06Ky Dickens?

  And what does that mean?

• 21:08Speaker 02

  Well, when you're born, we look at the sign, we look at the place that you're born in, like, the exact location, and then we look to the eastern horizon, and we see the exact piece of sky that was coming up over it. Because the rising is the ascension, so that is the marker of life. And the western horizon is where things go down, so that's the marker of death. When the sun rises up over the eastern horizon at daybreak, the, many ancient cultures thought, especially the Egyptians, thought the sun was being reborn. And so that's, and then all the planets, all the stars, everything comes up over the eastern horizon.

• 21:52Speaker 02

  So that's the point of, like, coming from the underworld to the upper worlds, right? And so when you're born, we look to that point of sky, because that is the marker of your life.

• 22:02Ky Dickens?

  Interesting.

• 22:02Speaker 02

  So that's you saying, this is me, at this specific moment, in this specific location. The sun is in the same sign for 30 days. That marker changes every moment, every, you know, minute or two. It's shifting.

• 22:18Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 22:19Speaker 02

  And every, depending on what sign we're talking about, but every hour or two, every couple hours, it changes sign. And so, that's really hard to know.

• 22:28Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 22:29Speaker 02

  Where you were born, what time you were born, you know, did you get the marker of that?

• 22:33Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 22:34Speaker 02

  What's really easy to know is, like, basically what day you were born.

• 22:38Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 22:38Speaker 02

  And so, sun sign. And then, we always have to match astrology with technology, and to know the times in which it will have a burst. And so, we have, around the time of the printing press, an astrologer, namely Alan Leo, but there was a group of them, being like, oh, well, if I wrote a horoscope for, I think, the king, the queen, some royal. And then there's astrologers that are like, oh, well, if we give everybody their own personal reading, because that was so popular, we give them their own personal reading, we'll just tell them about their sun sign, and then everyone can experience this.

• 23:22Speaker 02

  And so it was really the creation of a whole, kind of, new thing. And the printing press then proliferated that.

• 23:28Ky Dickens?

  Interesting.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  So if we think of, like, social media over the last 15 years, giving astrology a massive boost, it's the same as back then.

• 23:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 23:38Speaker 02

  When those sun sign horoscopes. It's just a different iteration of it.

• 23:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 23:42Speaker 02

  And it is a much wider spread kind of situation.

• 23:48Ky Dickens?

  So where, tell me if these are valid or not, and I just want to really reach the whole audience. So, when you think of, like, I'm a Taurus, and, you know, that comes with certain characteristics, right? You're very loyal, you're dependable, you-

• 24:04Speaker 02

  Depending on your chart.

• 24:05Ky Dickens?

  I am. I mean, but like-

• 24:07Speaker 02

  She's like, no, me.

• 24:09Ky Dickens?

  But where does that come from? These, like, ideas that your personality traits are influenced by your sun sign?

• 24:15Speaker 02

  That's modern.

• 24:16Ky Dickens?

  It's modern? Like, what would the ancient astrologers think about that?

• 24:20Speaker 02

  The ancient astrologers didn't care about your personality. They wanted to know if you were going to live or die.

• 24:25Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 24:25Speaker 02

  They wanted to know if your brother was going to steal your inheritance. They wanted to know if hyenas were going to come and eat you in the night. Like, it was totally, like, they were like, girl, I don't care about your personality.

• 24:34Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 24:35Speaker 02

  It was all about your lot in life.

• 24:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 24:39Speaker 02

  It was about your fate.

• 24:40Ky Dickens?

  That's so interesting.

• 24:41Speaker 02

  So, there's, you know, there's astrologies being used for a lot of different things, but it was never about your personality.

• 24:47Ky Dickens?

  So this came up way later, like, when we-

• 24:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's like, the last 150 years, 100, 150 years-ish, you know?

• 24:53Ky Dickens?

  Isn't that interesting? Because that's what people, I think, think of, like, the average person now.

• 24:57Speaker 02

  Well, you know, we're way more narcissistic now.

• 24:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Right, totally.

• 25:02Speaker 02

  And capitalism. Capitalism demands that we be so, that we be hyper-fixated on our individualism.

• 25:09Ky Dickens?

  Yep.

• 25:10Speaker 02

  And all of our personality traits, now we can optimize it all.

• 25:13Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 25:13Speaker 02

  So that it can siphon everything it can from us.

• 25:17Ky Dickens?

  Right, yeah, yeah.

• 25:19Speaker 02

  And look, it's not that understanding your personality via astrology isn't, couldn't be deeply healing. I think it is. It was for me. Like, when someone read my chart for the first time, I was like, I am like that. Oh my God. Like, and I also thought I was so bad, or wrong, or, you know, ill put together because of that, but you're just telling me that I am that. And so, that is a way to self-acceptance, I think.

• 25:44Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Based on what you just said, it can be extremely healing to know that, like, your destiny is written in the stars, but it can also be terrifying, because can you have agency to change it?

• 25:55Speaker 02

  Couple of things. The chart is a snapshot of the sky the moment you were first born, the moment you're, like, pronounced here. But in a way, the chart also keeps moving, right? So it's not a stuck stagnant thing. There's, you can think of it- Like a living organism. As you unfold, so too does your chart. As you grow, so too does your chart. That's all you, babe.

• 26:27Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 26:27Speaker 02

  You know, like, no one can do that growth for you. No one's gonna make the choices for you.

• 26:31Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 26:32Speaker 02

  There's that piece of it.

• 26:33Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 26:34Speaker 02

  And then there's also, you know, the ancient astrologers were always like, you do this in context. Like, you don't pretend that if you're giving a reading to someone who is living in a certain set of conditions, that they're not in those conditions. Don't pretend like the systems we're living within don't impact us. You give a reading to somebody in context.

• 26:55Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 26:55Speaker 02

  And that is explicitly said by a lot of ancient astrologers. So they even thought that, you know? It's not like everyone's starting from the same place.

• 27:03Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. When you first stumbled into astrology, well, how did that happen? And what were your views on it? And how have they changed?

• 27:11Speaker 02

  I mean, I was 12, so.

• 27:12Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 27:13Speaker 02

  I hope my views have changed a lot.

• 27:15Ky Dickens?

  But you were really young when you first like had an interest in it.

• 27:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, not an interest, I had a reading.

• 27:20Ky Dickens?

  Okay, not just.

• 27:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:22Ky Dickens?

  So you walked into the reading, you just were like.

• 27:24Speaker 02

  I didn't know what the hell it was, yeah. I had a reading and I really, it really changed my life.

• 27:29Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 27:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:30Ky Dickens?

  If you go back and look at that original chart, like, have you gleaned any information from it? Like, does that chart still hold up?

• 27:36Speaker 02

  That's my chart.

• 27:37Ky Dickens?

  It's just your chart. Like, they were right. I mean, it's hard to get a chart wrong.

• 27:39Speaker 02

  No, I mean, it's my chart. It's like, that's a curtain.

• 27:42Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 27:42Speaker 02

  That's my chart.

• 27:43Ky Dickens?

  Okay, got it.

• 27:44Speaker 02

  It's a literal just writing. It's, well, it's not writing, but it's the planet, it's just what it is.

• 27:50Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 27:50Speaker 02

  So I've had a million different astrologers, you know, give me a different reading, but they're all basically saying the same thing. The different way of looking at the chart, but it's, that's where the planet was.

• 28:00Ky Dickens?

  If people want to get their chart read and they don't remember the exact minute they were born.

• 28:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 28:05Ky Dickens?

  Does that, is that like really gonna throw it off if you're like within the hour? Does it?

• 28:09Speaker 02

  A minute can change things.

• 28:11Ky Dickens?

  Really?

• 28:11Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you work with what you've got. So if there's no, if you can't contact the hospital, if they didn't keep the records, if there's nobody in your family that remembers anything, if you're adopted, if you were born in a place where, you know, it was just like not even thought of to remember. A lot of my Persian friends have been like, we had a different calendar. So it doesn't even like translate. My dad thinks it's this day or this day. And it's, I, so there's, you know, a lot of people don't know.

• 28:40Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 28:40Speaker 02

  And that's what makes the barrier to entry really great. So astrology is not a fair system.

• 28:47Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 28:47Speaker 02

  Because it doesn't care if you don't know.

• 28:50Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 28:51Speaker 02

  But there's astrologers that do something called rectification. And they'll go through your entire life and they'll look at all of the major moments of your life and they'll deduce what time you were born.

• 29:03Ky Dickens?

  That's cool.

• 29:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:05Ky Dickens?

  Wow, it's like reverse engineering.

• 29:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

• 29:08Ky Dickens?

  So for someone who's never seen a chart, can you explain what's on it? And like what houses are? And, you know, what does everything signify? The planets and all that stuff?

• 29:18Speaker 02

  It's a snapshot of the sky. So it tells you where everything was when you were born. So every planet, every planetary body that we take into consideration, and exactly where the earth and sky met. Then there's just a lot of astrologers arguing about how to chop up the sky after that. Then there's like a million different house systems, which is figuring out where everything goes. But everything is there. And then you look at like, everything's in a sign. Every planet or planetary point is in a sign. And there's no right or wrong way to do it. There's just different paradigms to work in. There's different practices.

• 29:59Speaker 02

  The practice I use is something called whole sign houses, which sees the sign as the house itself. It's way closer to what Indian or Jyotish or Vedic astrology uses.

• 30:10Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 30:11Speaker 02

  Houses are domains of life. So there's 12 houses. There's 12 signs. There's seven traditional planetary bodies. And then there's things that we've added on, like the modern planets. And then there's the nodes, the places where eclipses happen. There's minor planets like Chiron. There's all these asteroids. And then there's like tons of stuff that you can add.

• 30:35Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  There's also calculations that came through like Islamic traditions that are calculations of the sun, moon, and the ascendant. And those will give you things like the part of fortune or, sorry, the lot of fortune or the lot of spirit or the lot of marriage or the lot of doom and gloom. I'm kidding, but like, you can, there's these mathematical equations that will calculate kind of any specific thing you want, the lot of love, of all of it. And so those are used for timing techniques and those are used for understanding like when something will unfold. Houses, there's 12 houses. The first house is the self because it's related to the eastern horizon.

• 31:20Speaker 02

  And so it's, talks about the moment you came into this world. And so it's the only part of the chart that's you. That's why the rising sign is so potent. It tells us the moment that your soul arrived in body as separate from the body that gave it birth. And so like, okay, now I'm here on my own. Then every other house in the chart is dealing with an aspect of your life. So the second house is about money, assets, resources. Third house is communications, siblings, extended family. Fourth house is endings and history and roots and lineage. And it goes on and on, children and then work and illness and partnerships and marriage

• 32:03Speaker 02

  and death and inheritances and resources, other people's resources. And then religion and travel and career and friends and communities and sorrow and self undoing and loss and longing. And so anything that you want to look at in life is held within those 12 spaces.

• 32:24Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 32:25Speaker 02

  And so if you ask me a question, I'm gonna go into that realm of the chart and see, is there any planets there? If not, there's a planet that governs that part. And then I'm gonna look for it and I'm gonna see what it's telling me. Where is it? What planet is it? What sign is it in? What is it talking to? What qualities is it telling me? Is this a successful thing? Is this a hard thing for the person? What does that mean?

• 32:50Ky Dickens?

  Is there one planet, when you see the planet, you're like, oh, this is not good. Do they have different, really?

• 32:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, there's, I, I come from an astrological tradition where it's like, that's not good.

• 32:58Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 32:59Speaker 02

  There are bad things. I come from a, a tradition that's like, that is hard. That will fuck you up. This is great. That will help you a lot.

• 33:10Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:11Speaker 02

  And so I think it's really helpful to have that distinguishing factor.

• 33:16Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:16Speaker 02

  I like cold, hard facts.

• 33:18Ky Dickens?

  I do too. I would rather know, like, this bad planet's in this house.

• 33:23Speaker 02

  And well, this is, this, it's not even bad planet. It's like, all planets are in all of our houses. And there is gonna be one planet in particular that's rough for everyone.

• 33:35Ky Dickens?

  Which one?

• 33:35Speaker 02

  Well, if you're born at night, it's gonna be Saturn. If you're born in the daytime, it's gonna be Mars. It doesn't mean that the other one can't give you a hard time.

• 33:43Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 33:44Speaker 02

  But that will be the one that, like, every chart, that's the first thing I look at. And then there's also one planet that's gonna be especially good for you. And so that is also gonna tell you a lot. If you're born in the night, it's gonna be Venus. If you're born in the day, it's gonna be Jupiter.

• 34:01Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 34:01Speaker 02

  And so right away, I'm clocking, where are those? Where are Mars and Saturn? Where is Venus and Jupiter? What's the ascendant? Where's the ascendant ruler? Where's the sun and moon?

• 34:13Ky Dickens?

  An ascendant ruler is the like.

• 34:15Speaker 02

  Is the planet that rules the sign that is rising up over the eastern horizon when you're born. That's the planet that's steering the direction of your life. And then I, you know, I'm, I'm kind of like, that's what I'll glean, like, at just like immediately. It also doesn't mean that if you have like a really good setup, that it will be good for you. Spiritually speaking. Or psychologically speaking.

• 34:37Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 34:38Speaker 02

  You can see people waste a lot of good luck. You can see people also not have to like evolve or stretch themselves or, again, you're kind of like looking at a, a type of privilege, right? Like, oh, this just comes easy to you. You don't even know.

• 34:55Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 34:55Speaker 02

  How, how hard most people struggle with this thing. It just is a gift for you.

• 34:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah, it's fascinating. How is technology? I mean, now you can, you can still go to astrologists and have your chart read, which has to be a very meaningful, like intimate experience, I'd imagine.

• 35:09Speaker 02

  Hopefully.

• 35:10Ky Dickens?

  Hopefully.

• 35:12Ky Dickens?

  But it seems like you could obviously put in all this stuff into an app. I mean, and is that just as effective? You might not get all the interpretation, but.

• 35:21Speaker 02

  It's different, you know? An app, you know, like, we made our app so that you could have a tool to be more empowered when you're engaged with astrology. It's not gonna be as in-depth as if you go to an astrologer. But I'm going over how the movements of the planets are impacting you week to week in a general kind of way. And what an astrologer's gonna do is it's gonna, they're going to give you their interpretation of it. But once you leave that reading.

• 35:55Speaker 02

  You're gonna forget like 80% of why they said what they said.

• 35:58Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 35:59Speaker 02

  There's the experience of it that's healing and really important. But if you wanna actually use it as a tool, it's really good to have somewhere to go to be like, wait, where is my moon? And what does that mean again?

• 36:12Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 36:12Speaker 02

  And so the app is just there to be like, oh, it means this. And then it also tells you about this. And by the way, this thing is also happening.

• 36:18Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. Is there a place where you find like if someone wants to have a great, you know, meeting with an astrologer where you can find kind of vetted astrologers or people?

• 36:26Speaker 02

  No.

• 36:27Ky Dickens?

  Okay, so it's really like you just have to.

• 36:28Speaker 02

  Word of mouth.

• 36:29Ky Dickens?

  Word of mouth.

• 36:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 36:30Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 36:31Speaker 02

  I mean, I'm sure there, there, there could be. I, you know, I'm sure people will comment below if there is.

• 36:36Ky Dickens?

  Right, yeah.

• 36:37Speaker 02

  Please do comment below. But I think maybe Chris Brennan has a list. He might have a list. The astrology podcast might have a list on their website.

• 36:47Ky Dickens?

  Well, if someone wants to learn or train, I mean, it's just like anything.

• 36:49Speaker 02

  You can learn and train places.

• 36:51Ky Dickens?

  And, and they will have like an education that you go through just like.

• 36:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you can study with my teacher, Demetri George, and take her different levels and work your way through her incredible books. Or you can, you can take Chris Brennan's course. There, Austin Kopic has a course. Like, there's a lot of really incredible astrologers that do like these full courses that you can go through all their different levels and all their different classes. Yeah.

• 37:15Ky Dickens?

  So what's happening right now astrologically? Like this year, I mean, the world seems like a dumpster fire, I think, to a lot of us.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:23Ky Dickens?

  Can we glean anything from the charts?

• 37:25Speaker 02

  Well, do you want to hear what this astrologer said 1,200 years ago?

• 37:28Ky Dickens?

  I would love that, yeah.

• 37:30Speaker 02

  There's one from 1,200 years ago and there's one from 400 years ago.

• 37:34Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 37:35Speaker 02

  I've read this at an event I did for Mum Donnie because he was elected on one of the best days of the year in 2025.

• 37:46Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 37:47Speaker 02

  Because it was Jupiter and the sun coming together and Jupiter had just entered Cancer. And Jupiter and Cancer, Cancer is a special condition. It's like a once in 12 year blessing. And so it was a seed, a beginning of something that portended, to me, something very fortuitous and generative and abundant.

• 38:07Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 38:08Speaker 02

  And so when I was looking into the astrology and of the year before he was elected, I found this, again, the astrologer and the scholar Ali A. Alomi. He translates. And so he translated this text from an astrologer called Abu Mashar. He's a famous ninth century Persian academic and astrologer. And this is his translation. It indicates a time where there is an emergence of a powerful and commanding leader. This is a moment that demonstrates the growing power of the local. That is Jupiter and Cancer, and this is why. Jupiter is the planet of the greater benefic.

• 38:51Speaker 02

  But in Cancer, Cancer is a sign that's ruled by the moon. The moon is our local planetary body. The moon is close to us.

• 38:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 38:59Speaker 02

  Everything else is really far away. The moon is right there. And so anything that the moon governs, anything in Cancer, what we want to focus on is what is right here.

• 39:10Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 39:11Speaker 02

  How can we nurture and nourish and care for what is right around us?

• 39:14Ky Dickens?

  It's interesting because you really have to be up on current events to try to interpret all this, right?

• 39:18Speaker 02

  I should hope so. If you're an astrologer, you're talking about time. So if you don't know what's going on in the world, I don't know what you're talking about.

• 39:25Ky Dickens?

  Right. Yeah, I mean, you really have to be zoned in.

• 39:28Speaker 02

  I hope so.

• 39:29Ky Dickens?

  I mean, that is.

• 39:30Speaker 02

  You don't, not, not every, you know, it's a choice. You can either be like, what are we living in? How did we get here?

• 39:36Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 39:36Speaker 02

  What are the ancients saying about it?

• 39:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 39:38Speaker 02

  What did they live through?

• 39:40Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 39:40Speaker 02

  This is not the first time we've done this.

• 39:42Ky Dickens?

  No.

• 39:42Speaker 02

  But we knew that nothing was going to remain business as usual as of 2025. So 2025, Pluto changed signs, Saturn changed signs, Uranus changed signs, and Neptune changed signs. They went in and out of their new signs. But that's a huge thing to happen because some of those planets take about 20 years, some take 15, some take seven, some take three to change signs. Those things happening all at the same time is like, oh, whatever we were doing before, it's done as of 2025 and we are living in a new reality.

• 40:25Speaker 02

  And it gets entrenched in 2026.

• 40:28Ky Dickens?

  The new reality does.

• 40:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 40:29Ky Dickens?

  Oh, no.

• 40:30Speaker 02

  But the Jupiter part of it reminds us that it's up, it's up to us. No one's coming to save us. We have to do the power of the local. That is the place we have to lean all the way into. And that is where everything changes.

• 40:46Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 40:46Speaker 02

  The last time Pluto was in Aquarius was the Haitian Revolution, the French Revolution, and the American Revolution.

• 40:51Ky Dickens?

  Really?

• 40:52Speaker 02

  And the Industrial Revolution. Robots. If you haven't seen France in the news a million times over.

• 40:59Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 41:00Speaker 02

  But it's also like an eat the rich kind of vibe.

• 41:02Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 41:03Speaker 02

  And so what are we living in?

• 41:05Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 41:05Speaker 02

  We are living in oligarchs trying to consume everything, trying to speed us into realms of disaster so that they can buy up more. Chaos is good for them. So they're trying to, you know. And so again, it's time for the masses to remember the leverage that we have. Okay, so that's Pluto.

• 41:24Ky Dickens?

  Okay.

• 41:25Speaker 02

  The last.

• 41:27Ky Dickens?

  I know. I need a drink.

• 41:29Speaker 02

  Yeah. The last time Neptune was in Aries was the Civil War. So we have revolutionary period, Civil War here. And then the last time Uranus was in Gemini, also during the Civil War, but it has an 84 year cycle. So the last time Uranus was in Gemini was World War II. Was the creation of NATO. Was the creation of a new world order. And then add to that, the last time that Neptune and Saturn made a conjunction was during the fall of the Berlin Wall. Was another time of redrawing the lines. And these two made a conjunction in late February, seven days before Trump started bombing Iran.

• 42:14Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 42:16Speaker 02

  Wow. Every time that Uranus has been in Gemini, this country has been involved in a war. And so as soon as Uranus went back into Gemini, it was like, here we are.

• 42:27Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 42:28Speaker 02

  Everything is at play right now.

• 42:30Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 42:30Speaker 02

  The world is reordering itself.

• 42:33Ky Dickens?

  Wow.

• 42:33Speaker 02

  We don't have to stay here, though.

• 42:35Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:35Speaker 02

  We are either going to band together and find solidarity in it or be taken out by it. And that part is our choice.

• 42:45Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 42:45Speaker 02

  This is the landscape. This is maybe you want to call it part of our fate. What if we don't have to live through a war?

• 42:53Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:53Speaker 02

  What if we could just get to reconstruction?

• 42:55Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 42:55Speaker 02

  And protect it.

• 42:56Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 42:57Speaker 02

  And shift this narrative because we know where it goes.

• 43:01Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 43:08Ky Dickens?

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• 45:51Ky Dickens?

  Is there anything about astrology that still has you just like in a state of wonderment or mystery or magic?

• 45:57Speaker 02

  Yes, all of the time. I mean, it's, I'm constantly in awe of like, wow, that's happening. And this is what's happening in the sky. We'd all be like, can you believe it?

• 46:08Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 46:08Speaker 02

  This happened on the day that we said, and it is the mark of it.

• 46:12Ky Dickens?

  And but that must be what keeps people in conversation with it, right? Because it's adding up. Like, if it didn't, you'd walk away.

• 46:19Speaker 02

  Right, exactly.

• 46:20Ky Dickens?

  So is there anything like, you know, that I haven't covered that you want to touch on or anything that maybe when you talk about it and you really want to like spark the interest in someone else?

• 46:29Speaker 02

  Well, I guess my invitation, if you're curious about astrology and about your chart, is that I want you to think about it as a map of your soul's journey in this lifetime. And that if you experiment with going in the direction that your chart says to go in, how do you feel? What happens? What opens up? And I say that because that's what happened to me. Like, I got a reading when I was 12 years old, and I was, you know, enthralled with astrology, and I learned about it, and I gave readings in my 20s. And then it was kind of overwhelming for me, and I left it, and I came back to it in my 30s. And then I started to really take it seriously. And I started to study

• 47:14Speaker 02

  with my teacher, Demetra George. And she, when she gave me a reading, she was like, oh, well, of course, you would do this. And of course, you would also write. Do you want to write? And I was like, well, I do, but I can't write. Like, I'm not smart enough to write. And she was like, well, okay, whatever. You can dwell on yourself down if you want to, but it's in your chart.

• 47:38Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 47:39Speaker 02

  And that gave me permission to write. And writing changed my life.

• 47:44Ky Dickens?

  That's so cool. Because you know what I think about? You said something about the chart just recently. And it made me think about, you know, especially in the new agey world, it's like, oh, you're living in flow, you're living in flow. And when you're in flow, everything works for you. It's like, the whole world unfolds as it should for you. It feels like that, at least. But it feels like if you kind of are moving.

• 48:01Speaker 02

  God forbid you struggle.

• 48:02Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. But if you're moving in flow with your chart, and you know what it is, and kind of what your obstacles might be, and what you're called to do, or what your strengths are, it might be like a tip off to how to live in flow and kind of find your way.

• 48:15Speaker 02

  That's what gave me access to success. That's what, that's how I connected with people. Like, I used to write horoscopes, and that's how I was known. And so that was my gateway to this whole other life. Like, there's, there's me before I started writing horoscopes, and then there's me after. And it's a specific demarcation in my life.

• 48:41Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 48:42Speaker 02

  I didn't make any money for a long time, for years, and I struggled, and it was hard and whatever. But it was, when I started doing that, it changed everything.

• 48:51Ky Dickens?

  Yeah. And now you're a New York Times bestselling author.

• 48:55Speaker 02

  You know, like, that is in my chart.

• 48:57Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 48:58Speaker 02

  It is.

• 48:58Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 48:59Speaker 02

  But I didn't give myself permission to do it for a long time. If someone, if she could have said that to me 10 years earlier, maybe, you know, everything would have been different. But I didn't think I was smart enough, or, or I didn't think I was good enough to write. I put it on this really high pedestal. And I kept myself from it for a long time. And then, once I started doing it, it did. And then I met my wife, and then everything changed.

• 49:26Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 49:26Speaker 02

  It was literally a 180 for me.

• 49:28Ky Dickens?

  Isn't that so wild?

• 49:30Speaker 02

  So wild.

• 49:31Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 49:31Speaker 02

  So wild.

• 49:32Ky Dickens?

  If someone wants to have like, a deep dive and start to learn about this, and figure out what, which maybe branch they want to study, are there any books that you could recommend?

• 49:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, my book is a, is an entry point. My book is called, You Were Born For This: The Astrology of Radical Self-Acceptance. It is a really good like primer on like, an introduction to your chart, and what it means, and how to rethink things. Then there's like, super hefty astrology books that are incredible, and well worth the time it takes to get through them, and just loaded with so much astrological data. Demetra George has two books, volume one and volume two, about traditional astrology that are exceptional, and they are like, an incredible standard, like bearer of traditional astrology.

• 50:25Speaker 02

  Chris Brennan has an incredible book as well, that is like, an encyclopedia of everything. Nicholas Campion wrote The History of Astrology, volume one and volume two, which takes you through, it's not about how to be an astrologer, or how to do astrology, but it is an incredible compilation of astrology through the like, the like, different epochs of time, and tells you about like, the deep history of it, and how it kind of came to be.

• 50:56Ky Dickens?

  What do you think would change if people spent more time looking at their charts and understanding their charts?

• 51:00Speaker 02

  I don't know. I have no idea.

• 51:02Ky Dickens?

  So it's not something that you're like, on a crusade to be like?

• 51:05Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, no, no.

• 51:10Speaker 02

  Please, no. I'm like, good, don't like astrology. You know what I mean? Like, there's a certain point to which its popularity makes things weird.

• 51:18Ky Dickens?

  Right. Okay, let me this.

• 51:20Speaker 02

  It's a mystery tradition in some ways. Like, there's some very, there's some very hard and fast rules that I love and go by. And then there's this point at which you're like, I don't know, I think it's good if we're not all doing this thing. Because there's also like, really good astrological times, and you don't want everyone to do the same thing on the same time. Like, where I want, you know, I want people, obviously, to know about my app, and the things that we're doing. And I think it's really helpful. And then I always have to feel like, this is just for us, though.

• 51:51Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 51:51Speaker 02

  Like, this is like, a secret thing that we're all doing together. Like, they can, maybe, I feel very like, do not perceive me about it.

• 51:58Ky Dickens?

  Let's end on this question, Sad. What do you think a healthy relationship with astrology looks like?

• 52:03Speaker 02

  Great question. I think a healthy astrology, a healthy relationship with astrology looks like forgetting about it, you know? And then remembering it. And then being with it really obsessively for a little while, and then not. Like, there's times where I'm looking at my own app all the time, and reading my own horoscope, and being like, oh, my God, that's so true. And then there's times where I just forget all about it.

• 52:29Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 52:30Speaker 02

  I mean, I'm never fully forgetting about it, because it's my work, so I'm always having, but I'm forgetting about how it is for me personally.

• 52:35Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 52:36Speaker 02

  And I'm looking at how it is landing in the world. So I am always thinking about how it's going on around me, or what it's meaning for what's happening around me, and how it's like, being lived out by us collectively. That's always just, I'm always so gobsmacked by that.

• 52:52Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 52:53Speaker 02

  But for me personally, I like to forget about my own personal astrology. Just like, go live my life.

• 52:57Ky Dickens?

  I love that you read your own app, though. Does that, do you read any other astrologers, or consult with another astrologer every once in a while?

• 53:03Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have, I have an astrology reading from a friend of mine, who I love. And because Demetra stopped, she fired me. She would, you know, like, I would keep going to her until the end of time, but she stopped giving personal readings. So, and I go to other astrologers, any, like, I, there's, astrologers are so fascinating. And everyone has like, a slightly, they're all, we're all like, working in like, a different timing technique, or we're like, oh, I just picked this timing thing up again.

• 53:31Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 53:31Speaker 02

  There's so many tools out there that you can't actually use them all at the same time. And so like, I'll go get a reading from my astrologer, and she'll be like, oh, yeah, I'm back into this thing. And I'll be like, oh, fascinating. Like, give me the read on that.

• 53:43Ky Dickens?

  Yeah.

• 53:44Speaker 02

  And it will always give you like, this phenomenal little take on the moment, and what's happening.

• 53:50Ky Dickens?

  I love that.

• 53:50Speaker 02

  And then I'll like, remember it for a while, and then I'll forget about it again. And I'll maybe see my notes a couple of months later, and be like, oh, yeah, that did happen.

• 53:56Ky Dickens?

  Yes.

• 53:57Speaker 02

  There's no such thing in believing astrology, or believing in astrology.

• 54:01Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 54:02Speaker 02

  It either works as a tool, or it doesn't.

• 54:06Ky Dickens?

  Mm hmm.

• 54:06Speaker 02

  So which is it?

• 54:07Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 54:08Speaker 02

  Right. To me, I think the evidence is clear, but if it doesn't work for you, great, go find a tool that does.

• 54:14Ky Dickens?

  Right.

• 54:15Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's my feeling.

• 54:16Ky Dickens?

  That's great.

• 54:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 54:17Ky Dickens?

  Well, very awesome to have you here.

• 54:20Speaker 02

  Yeah, thank you so much.

• 54:21Ky Dickens?

  Thank you so much. Such a great education. I think our listeners are going to love it.

• 54:25Speaker 02

  Great.

• 54:26Ky Dickens?

  That's it for this episode of The Talk Tracks. But new episodes will be released every Wednesday, so stay tuned as we work to unravel all the threads, even the veiled ones that knit together our reality. And please remember to stay kind, stay curious, and that being a true skeptic requires an open mind. To dive in deeper, subscribe to our Backstage Pass by visiting our website. With it, you'll unlock access to bonus content like telepathy tests, Ask Me Anything interviews with myself and guests. You'll be able to enjoy the podcast ad free, connect with other members on our Telepathy Tribe Discord, and hear and see exclusive content from the Telepathy Tapes Vault. Visit our website at thetelepathytapes.com for more info on how to subscribe to our Backstage Pass. Thank you to my amazing collaborators. Producers Catherine Ellis and Selena Kennedy.

• 55:11Ky Dickens?

  Technical directing, audio mix, and finishing by Jeremy Cole. Opening and closing music by Elizabeth P. W. And original logo and cover art by Ben Condor Design. I'm Kai Dickens, your executive producer, writer, and host.