Weird Al Yankovic: The Sporkful Interview (Reheat)

Dan sits down with the one and only "Weird Al" Yankovic, the man behind "Eat It," "Fat," "My Bologna," and so many other classic food-related parody songs. What would be his ideal ratio of cookie to white stuff in an Oreo? And which does he prefer, the rye or the kaiser?

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Dan Pashman?

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• 0:42Dan Pashman?

  The mini golf alone is probably worth, it's like the mini golf capital of the country. They have the most incredible elaborate mini golf courses. They also have more than 80 championship, full-size golf courses, plus 60 miles of beautiful coastline, all-season sunshine. Of course, you can relax by the beach or the pool. There's also jet skiing, fishing charters, paddle boarding, and of course, food. Oh man, did we eat well in Myrtle Beach. From fresh local seafood to craft burgers and craft beers to kebabs on the boardwalk. With more than 2,000 restaurants to choose from, from legendary no-frill seafood shacks to chef-driven dining, Myrtle Beach has it all. Plus, live entertainment at the beach, there's always something epic going on. So, summer may be winding down, but in Myrtle Beach, you're gonna find the coastal vacation of your dreams all year long.

• 1:27Dan Pashman?

  Start planning your ultimate beach vacation at visitmyrtlebeach.com.

• 1:34Dan Pashman?

  Hey, everyone, Dan here with another reheat. And in honor of our 15th anniversary, this month, we are pulling especially old episodes out of the darkest recesses of the deep freezer. Last Friday, we released the first-ever Sporkful episode, episode number one, along with a classic one on sandwich science with Robert Krulwich. Today, we're sharing my entire interview with Weird Al from 2014. I was so excited to have Weird Al on the show. I was trying so hard for like, two years to get him on the show. Like, every three months, I would email his manager, "Hey, is he free now? How about now?" And the manager would say, "No, right back in a few months." Two years. Finally, he said, "Hey, Al's doing a concert up in northern Westchester." This was like, two hours from where I was living. And he says, "If you want to get there early before the show, you can interview him backstage while he's hanging out and waiting for the show to start."

• 2:18Dan Pashman?

  I said, "I'll be there." And having Weird Al on the show, dissecting so many of his classic songs, it was a special memory. It felt like maybe the first really big guest, not counting Rachel Maddow and Marc Maron, because I had worked with him in the past, the first really big guest I got on The Sporkful, who I didn't know before. So it was a big milestone for the show and one of my favorite episodes, and I'm excited to share it with you. And hey, great news for all the Weird Al fans out there, he's going back on tour this year. For tour dates and tickets, check out weirdal.com/tour. And as always, if there's an episode you want us to defrost and share, drop us a line at [email protected]. All right, here's my episode with Weird Al.

• 2:56Speaker 01

  This is The Sporkful.

• 2:58Dan Pashman?

  Hi, who's this?

• 2:59Speaker 02

  This is Joe, calling from Post Falls, Idaho. I'm 16 years old, and I've got a serious problem with onions.

• 3:05Dan Pashman?

  Okay, tell me about it.

• 3:06Speaker 02

  Well, ever since I was way younger, I have completely detested onions, I mean, just hated them, but my mom's always been cooking for a bunch of other kids, so it's a... she doesn't want to cook anything separate without them, so I've always kind of force fed them, and she always said that, you know, "You'll like them when you get older, you'll appreciate them when you get older." And as I started getting older, I started to panic, just thinking, "Oh, shoot, I still hate onions." And it, you know, it was like one of those things, like, "I'm supposed to grow out of this, what's happening here?" And my mom's an excellent cook, I mean, she makes this meatloaf with, you know, like the ketchup on it and the bacon, and then you slice into it, and it's just these onions, big old onion slices, and it's like, oh, it just ruins any dish for me, and I've just always hated it.

• 3:47Dan Pashman?

  How many siblings do you have?

• 3:48Speaker 02

  I've got seven.

• 3:49Dan Pashman?

  Seven siblings?

• 3:50Speaker 02

  Three sisters and four brothers, so mom cooks on a pretty big scale.

• 3:53Dan Pashman?

  Where are you in the eight?

• 3:55Speaker 02

  I'm the oldest.

• 3:56Dan Pashman?

  Okay, oh, I see, all right. And all seven of the other siblings like onions?

• 4:00Speaker 02

  Yeah, mostly, they just find them tolerable, you know, it's like lettuce.

• 4:04Dan Pashman?

  And is there any format in which you like onions a little bit, or it's just 100% no matter what?

• 4:11Speaker 02

  Well, I actually kind of appreciate the really teeny chopped sweet onions, like on a hamburger or something, but I don't think that even really counts, you know?

• 4:19Dan Pashman?

  I think that does count, first of all, Joe. I don't think you should be so hard on yourself. When your mom puts the onions into the meatloaf, does she cook them first, or does she put them in raw?

• 4:30Speaker 02

  She puts them in raw.

• 4:31Dan Pashman?

  Mmm.

• 4:34Dan Pashman?

  Joe, I want to say a few things to you. First of all, I sense that you're getting a little bit worried that you may be plagued by this issue for life because you feel like you're 16 and you should be growing out of this by now. And I don't think you should be so hard on yourself. Like me, I did not like tomatoes well into my twenties. Now, I can't wait for summertime tomato season to roll around and go to the farmer's market and get great tomatoes and I'll slice a big, thick slicer tomato and sprinkle salt on it and eat it with a fork and knife like it's a steak.

• 5:02Speaker 02

  Mmm.

• 5:03Dan Pashman?

  So, give yourself some time, but I understand that right now, you're in a predicament. You need to get through these meals in a way that doesn't inconvenience your mom too much.

• 5:14Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. My sister's always said, I mean, how do you expect to ever find a wife that's gonna cook without onions? And that's a bleak future right there. I mean, I can't imagine that, you know?

• 5:22Dan Pashman?

  Yeah. I don't think that's gonna happen to you, Joe, but one thing I will say is that, look, you can tell your mom, if it's not too much trouble to her, there's a couple of things she could do to help you out. The best would be to cook the onions in advance before putting them into other dishes.

• 5:39Speaker 02

  Really?

• 5:40Dan Pashman?

  Yes. That will soften them and sweeten them and make their flavor milder.

• 5:44Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 5:45Dan Pashman?

  But if she doesn't have time to do that, and I certainly understand if she doesn't, if she even just chops up the onion and then soaks it in cold water for 15 minutes and then puts it in, that will also help to soften and take out some of the sharpness of the flavor of the onion.

• 6:04Speaker 02

  Right, okay.

• 6:05Dan Pashman?

  Separately, I want you to take charge a little bit in the kitchen. When your mom's not in there trying to do stuff, I want you to move on to caramelization. I want you to Google it, caramelized onions, and I want you to cook onions that way. So, Joe, I want you to try all of these different techniques and I want you to report back. Will you report back and tell me how your onion therapy is going?

• 6:25Speaker 02

  I definitely will, Dan.

• 6:26Dan Pashman?

  All right, Joe, well, thanks so much for your call.

• 6:27Speaker 02

  All right, thanks so much, man.

• 6:36Dan Pashman?

  This is The Sporkful. It's not for foodies, it's for eaters. I'm Dan Pashman, and we're about to challenge your assumptions about consumption and drop a sporkful of knowledge on you. Because we're obsessively compulsive about eating more awesomely, and because if history has taught us anything, it's that the hosts of food shows need a lot of catchphrases. Let's go ahead and jump into today's topic for mastication and rumination, which is Weird Al: The Sporkful Interview.

• 7:04Dan Pashman?

  Well, friends, I am extremely excited to bring this show to you today. I've been a fan of Weird Al's for a long, long time. He's written so many great songs about food. I had the privilege of sitting down with him in person backstage before a recent concert. Al has his second children's book coming out on June 25th. It's called My New Teacher and Me. It's available for preorder now. I will link to it at sporkful.com. We talked a bit about the book, but we talked mostly about eating, as we do here on The Sporkful. And basically, what I wanted to do was to use the many, many songs Al's written about food, so many of his parody songs reference food, to use those as sort of chapter headings or jumping off points to talk about the food issues that are referenced in those songs.

• 7:47Dan Pashman?

  So that's what we did. It was a great time, and here's the interview.

• 7:52Dan Pashman?

  Your new children's book is entitled My New Teacher and Me, and it really encourages kids to follow their dreams, and also, in a way, to question authority, I think, which is kind of cool. And this is your second children's book. I'm curious to hear you compare the creative process between writing one of these books and writing the music that you write.

• 8:09Speaker 03

  It's a similar process in a way. You know, I've been writing verse for a few decades, and it's a form that I'm pretty familiar with. So in a sense, it was like writing sort of a long song, a long song that they didn't have to write their music for.

• 8:23Dan Pashman?

  And I want to talk about the book a little more, but I want to kind of try to connect it to your music. And your music continues to find audiences with new generations of, as you put it in other interviews, 15-year-old boys, although I think that's kind of selling yourself short, really with people in their formative years is how I would put it. What I find amazing is that, you know, a lot of the music that I listened to when I was in my formative years, I look back now, it's a punchline. Your music, I don't think of that way. And I think that most people don't think of it that way. They have a real earnest attachment to it that stays with them. And I think it's especially interesting because so much of your music is ironic, and yet there's a very pure and earnest attachment that people have to it.

• 9:07Dan Pashman?

  And I'm curious if you have any theory as to what it is about you or your music that makes that connection possible.

• 9:15Speaker 03

  I think that at a certain age, in your formative years, as you put it, you're more open to this kind of humor, this kind of questioning authority, a reverence. I remember when I was maybe 13 years old, I was crazy about Mad Magazine. I would go to used bookstores and try to find back issues, and it was really like a major driving force in my life. And I was obsessed with it. And I still enjoy Mad Magazine, but not as much as I did when I was that old. And it's kind of telling because, you know, I've got a fan base that extends generations, but I think my hardest core fans are still the formative years people. In fact, if you ask most people that are, you know, older, like what their favorite Weird Al album is,

• 9:59Speaker 03

  almost without fail, it's the one that they heard when they were that age. It's like it really made an attachment with them somehow. So there's a nostalgia that happens with my older catalog.

• 10:09Dan Pashman?

  I have a theory I'd like to run by you that sort of connects to your book, and I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it, which is that so much of childhood and growing up is about learning all these rules. And so much about parenting is just teaching all these, everything from like, "Don't eat that, eat this, don't eat that, don't cross the street now, wait till that thing happens." And you're constantly having to learn these rules and abide by them, and it makes the world a really confusing and weird place when you're young, because a lot of the rules don't make sense. And I think that people who connect, artists and creative people who connect with people in their formative years... Depict the world as young people see it. It's a weird messed up world that doesn't make a lot of sense.

• 10:48Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 10:48Dan Pashman?

  I mean, I love Maurice Sendax's books.

• 10:50Speaker 03

  Sure.

• 10:51Dan Pashman?

  And I think that that's something that your music and your book both do. I'm curious how you feel about that, or if that is something you strive for.

• 11:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, it's not overt. I mean, I'm not ostensibly trying to do that, but I mean, it's all in the going towards some kind of comedic release. It's an absurd world sometimes. And again, you know, the whole questioning the authority thing, which what Mad Magazine did so well. I mean, everything from Madison Avenue to politicians and saying that these grownups are not necessarily always telling you guys the truth. And that's an important thing to learn when you're young.

• 11:26Dan Pashman?

  Right, right. So as we segue from your work to our discussion of food, I have a polka and food-related question for you.

• 11:33Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 11:34Dan Pashman?

  I'm sure you're familiar with the classic song Beer Barrel Polka.

• 11:37Speaker 03

  Of course.

• 11:38Dan Pashman?

  In that it has the lyrics, roll out the barrel, we'll have a barrel of fun. Roll out the barrel, we've got the blues on the run. Zing, boom, tararal, sing out a song of good cheer. What does tararal mean?

• 11:50Speaker 03

  I wasn't sure that it was, I've heard tarara.

• 11:53Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 11:53Speaker 03

  And some people say tararal.

• 11:55Dan Pashman?

  Okay.

• 11:55Speaker 03

  You know, it depends on your translation of it. And I'm not sure what the literal translation of tarara or tararal would be, but now that you brought it up, that's something I should look into.

• 12:05Dan Pashman?

  Do you know what language it was being translated from?

• 12:08Speaker 03

  I don't even know that. I feel so bad. I mean, that's like such a, you know, such a seminal polka piece. I think I'd know a little bit of the background of it.

• 12:16Dan Pashman?

  Well, don't feel too bad, because I did Google this before.

• 12:18Speaker 03

  Okay, well, you can tell me then.

• 12:19Dan Pashman?

  I did not find anything definitive. I mean, I ended up at Yahoo Answers, which is, you know, makes Wikipedia look like the Library of Congress. And someone there wrote that the song was first sung in the English version from a Polish translation. And this person admitted that it was a guess. 1939, Poland was invaded by Germany, and zing, boom, tararal is related to the sounds of war. I.e. bullets surrounding an unflappable group of people who won't have their life changed without celebration.

• 12:43Speaker 03

  Interesting. You know, my wife is a part Polish, so maybe I'll go home and ask her what tararal means.

• 12:47Dan Pashman?

  Okay, all right. See if you can find out about that. You can tweet me the answer.

• 12:50Speaker 03

  Okay, will do.

• 12:54Dan Pashman?

  So let's segue full-fledged to food here. You are a vegetarian, have been for about 20 years now, right?

• 13:01Speaker 03

  Something like that, yeah.

• 13:01Dan Pashman?

  And even went through a vegan period.

• 13:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, I still consider myself a sort of vegan. I mean, I'm a vegan, but I cheat. You know, because, you know, you got the cheese pizza on the bus and yeah, it's hard not to sneak a pizza every now and then.

• 13:15Dan Pashman?

  Right. And I know you've said, I know you've moved away in your songwriting a little bit from the food songs, but I'd like to use some of those songs as jumping off points.

• 13:22Speaker 03

  Sure, of course.

• 13:22Dan Pashman?

  For us to just talk about food. And we'll kind of go, not necessarily in chronological order here. Some of these will be rapid fire.

• 13:28Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 13:29Dan Pashman?

  If we can go in more detail. But let's start at the beginning. My Balona.

• 13:44Dan Pashman?

  When you're not trying to rhyme with Sharona, do you say balona or baloney?

• 13:49Speaker 03

  Well, I used to always say baloney, but it's spelled balona. And, you know, I certainly worked with a Sharona. And because of my song, I have since then always said balona.

• 14:02Dan Pashman?

  Really? So the song changed you?

• 14:03Speaker 03

  It's the song changed me, yes.

• 14:05Dan Pashman?

  All right, well, I looked it up in the dictionary. Either pronunciation is technically acceptable.

• 14:09Speaker 03

  Yes, yes.

• 14:11Dan Pashman?

  The white stuff.

• 14:29Dan Pashman?

  Do you eat Oreos?

• 14:31Speaker 03

  Um, on occasion. I mean, you know, not often. I don't even, are they vegan? I'm not sure if the white stuff actually is.

• 14:40Dan Pashman?

  I think, well, I'm not sure about vegan. My wife was raised in a kosher household and I know that they took the, I think it was gelatin or whatever pork product used to be in there. So I think they are vegetarian.

• 14:50Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 14:50Dan Pashman?

  But they may not be vegan.

• 14:52Speaker 03

  Right. Yeah, you know, on occasion I do, but I can't say it's a current, you know, it's not a big part of my diet.

• 14:57Dan Pashman?

  When you do eat them, what's your strategy?

• 14:59Speaker 03

  Ah, well, you know, a kid will eat the middle of the Oreo first.

• 15:02Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 15:02Speaker 03

  And save the chocolate cookie outside for last.

• 15:04Dan Pashman?

  Okay.

• 15:05Speaker 03

  Uh, myself, um, usually I will either, I'll either put the whole thing in my mouth, or I'll eat one of the cookies first and then eat the cream and second cookie second.

• 15:16Dan Pashman?

  When you do the cream and second cookie, which side is up?

• 15:20Speaker 03

  The cream, right? I'm not a monster.

• 15:22Dan Pashman?

  Uh, well, I, I would, I would actually argue the other way, Al. I, I think you should put the cream side down.

• 15:26Speaker 03

  So it's like a surprise? So you don't know like what you're getting?

• 15:28Dan Pashman?

  No, so that the cream is on your tongue and it accentuates the cream flavor.

• 15:33Speaker 03

  Wow. Well, that's another way to look at it.

• 15:37Dan Pashman?

  See, I aspire to be the Weird Al of food.

• 15:39Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 15:40Dan Pashman?

  It's just as crazy as anything you would sing about.

• 15:41Speaker 03

  Yeah. No, that's, I'll have to try that sometime.

• 15:43Dan Pashman?

  Okay.

• 15:43Speaker 03

  That could be a whole different sensation.

• 15:45Dan Pashman?

  I, I, it's big, it's big. What do you think, if you were designing a new Oreo with, with pure ingredients, one that you could eat all the time and feel good about, what ratio would you choose between the cookies and the filling?

• 15:58Speaker 03

  Well, I, I think the quintuple stuff would be good. You know, cause I don't think they've, they've done that yet.

• 16:03Dan Pashman?

  Yeah, that's true.

• 16:03Speaker 03

  In fact, like an entire pack of Oreos, there's only got like two cookies and the rest is just stuff between them.

• 16:08Dan Pashman?

  Right. That would be pretty amazing. Yeah. I, uh, I stumbled upon some of these sort of, um, fancy bakery imitation Oreos that were really good. They had a, I would say 1.5 to 1 cookie to filling ratio.

• 16:22Speaker 03

  Did that work for you?

• 16:22Dan Pashman?

  And that was really nice. Each cookie I would say was like 0.75.

• 16:26Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 16:26Dan Pashman?

  It's adding up to 1.5 to 1.

• 16:29Speaker 03

  There, there's a, um, a burger chain, I won't mention the name of them, but they, they make artisanal ding dongs. It's probably actually much better for you than the actual ding dong, but again, it's the whole nostalgia thing. It's like, it's, it's not the ding dong you grew up with, so.

• 16:40Dan Pashman?

  Right, right. Yeah, there, there is something, there's a certain sort of like hyper-processed umami thing that happens.

• 16:45Speaker 03

  Exactly, exactly.

• 16:53Speaker 04

  It's time to open up a can of advertisements.

• 16:58Dan Pashman?

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• 17:40Dan Pashman?

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• 18:23Dan Pashman?

  Learn more at USPS.com/holiday.

• 18:28Dan Pashman?

  I grew up on Lando Lakes cheese. I still remember going to the supermarket deli counter with my mom and her ordering Lando Lakes American cheese. And now, Lando Lakes cheese and butter are a huge part of my home. There are so many easy weeknight recipes using Lando Lakes cheese and butter that bring delicious restaurant taste right to your table. From chicken parm to weeknight shrimp pad thai, Lando Lakes has plenty of quick dishes that'll have the whole dinner table talking. Visit landolakes.com/reцепes/collection for easy weeknight dinners.

• 18:57Dan Pashman?

  For a long time, I did not understand the point of vests. Like, why not just have a jacket? That covers your arms, too. But something clicked for me. I think I got gifted a vest and now I am obsessed with vests. And it just adds that little bit of toastiness. And I got this new Quince packable puffer vest. I love that you can just squish it up and shove it in the bottom of your bag. That way you have it with you all day. If it gets a little chilly, break out the vest. I also got a Quince down quilted vest. It is so soft and cozy. They make them for men and women. And as with everything you get at Quince, they focus on high-quality staples made with premium materials like 100% Mongolian cashmere, 14-karat gold, and Italian leather. These are all timeless, versatile pieces that feel special to unwrap and become everyday favorites long after the holidays.

• 19:41Dan Pashman?

  Give the gift of quality this holiday season. Download the Quince app for app-exclusive offers or go to quince.com. Get free shipping on your order and 365-day returns, now available in Canada and the UK, too. And when Quince asks where you heard about them, let them know it was the Sporkful. It's the best way to support the show.

• 20:03Dan Pashman?

  Welcome back to another Sporkful reheat. I'm Dan Pashman and I have a very big, exciting announcement for you. This past November, I took a group of Sporkful fans and some others on a special trip across Italy to eat pasta, to retrace many of the steps I took on my own research trip for my cookbook, and we had so much fun and ate so, so well. We ate spaghetti alla sassina in Bari. We took a cooking class with Silvestro Silvestri in Leche. We ate with Katie Parla in Rome. And the folks at Culinary Backstreets who organized the tour, they added some stops that I didn't even know about, that were new to me, that were incredibly delicious and also fascinating. Point is, it was so great, we're doing it again this November. We just opened up spots. It's a small group, so space is limited. Bottom line, come eat pasta with me in Italy.

• 20:47Dan Pashman?

  For all the details, go to culinarybackstreets.com/sporkful. Now, back to this week's reheat.

• 20:59Dan Pashman?

  Moving on, I love Rocky Road.

• 21:25Dan Pashman?

  Chocolate's getting old, vanilla just leaves me cold. Do you stand by those lyrics today?

• 21:29Speaker 03

  No, I never, you know, not every lyric that I write is autobiographical. In fact, I like Rocky Road. I wouldn't go so far as to say that I love it. I don't think-

• 21:38Dan Pashman?

  It's not as good of a lyric, though, right?

• 21:39Speaker 03

  I don't think I've actually had Rocky Road ice cream since 1982, because that's- Or 83 was when the song came out. And as part of the promotion for that song, I had to participate in so many Rocky Road ice cream eating contests, that I think I've gotten my lifetime's share of Rocky Road ice cream.

• 21:55Dan Pashman?

  Right. So if you are more open to chocolate and vanilla than you say, which- Do you have a preference between the two?

• 22:01Speaker 03

  It depends how it's made. Like, really good vanilla is great, and really good chocolate is great. So it kind of depends. But between the two, I generally say chocolate, because I always, as a kid, I know this is not the case now, but as a kid, I always thought that vanilla was like plain ice cream. It's like clear. It's like ice cream without any flavor. It's like, why would anybody order vanilla? It's like, no flavor.

• 22:25Dan Pashman?

  Do you have a cup or cone preference?

• 22:26Speaker 03

  Um, I generally go cone, with a sugar cone. Uh, because it's extra. With a cup, you can't eat the cup. But with a cone, you get a cone.

• 22:34Dan Pashman?

  Right, right. I want to move on to grapefruit diet.

• 23:00Dan Pashman?

  Do you like grapefruit? Do you eat it?

• 23:01Speaker 03

  I do. I eat it particularly. I usually only eat it when I'm on a diet because when I'm trying to lose weight, I'll eat like half a red ruby grapefruit every morning for the entire length of the diet. And I like it, but it really kind of, you know, in my brain now it means like diet. So when I'm not on a diet, I generally don't eat it.

• 23:20Dan Pashman?

  So was Grapefruit Diet one of the more autobiographical songs?

• 23:23Speaker 03

  You know, I think I wrote that song before I ever tried that as a dietary technique. But then I read a book saying, well, it wasn't the Grapefruit Diet book, but it was just saying that grapefruit was a great breakfast if you wanted to try to lose weight. So and it seemed to work.

• 23:38Dan Pashman?

  What's your grapefruit eating strategy? Do you use a spoon to scoop out the half?

• 23:41Speaker 03

  I do. I actually have a grapefruit spoon somewhere, but I usually don't bother trying to find it. So it's just a matter of digging out each segment and eating segment by segment. And then when it's all done, I take the half grapefruit and I walk over the sink and I squeeze the rest into my mouth.

• 23:59Dan Pashman?

  Interesting. That's an interesting move there. That's, you don't squeeze it into a glass?

• 24:03Speaker 03

  No, no. Then I have to wash the glass. That's the point of that.

• 24:07Dan Pashman?

  What is a grapefruit spoon? What does it look like?

• 24:09Speaker 03

  It's got a serrated edge. It's like a small, thin spoon that's got kind of a jagged edge on one side. So it helps you cut out the sections better.

• 24:17Dan Pashman?

  I noticed that a lot of your songs about food, which I understand are not all autobiographical, but they're written from the point of view of someone who eats a lot of very decadent, very unhealthy food. And I'm sure that there's, there's obviously comedic potential in that. So I understand that. But I wonder if, because you're very thoughtful about what you eat, I wonder if you ever use your music to pig out vicariously?

• 24:38Speaker 03

  I never really thought of that that way. When I wrote Grapefruit Diet, that was sort of my sequel to Fat in a way, because like after he becomes morbidly obese, well, I better, better drop a few pounds. So I got to include whatever fat jokes I didn't get the first time around.

• 24:52Dan Pashman?

  The outtakes.

• 24:53Speaker 03

  Right.

• 24:55Dan Pashman?

  Lasagna.

• 25:08Dan Pashman?

  I think that you may have unwittingly agreed with my opinion about lasagna when you wrote that song, because a lot of lyrics are sort of like, "You should eat my lasagna, or if you don't like that, try these other foods." I think that lasagna is a severely overrated food. I think that it's a ton of work to make it, separating those strips is a giant pain in the butt.

• 25:29Speaker 03

  For the longest time, my road manager had a thing and the writer saying that no lasagna backstage.

• 25:36Dan Pashman?

  Really?

• 25:37Speaker 03

  Because I didn't know this, but apparently lasagna is very cheap to make, apparently. So, a lot of promoters are like, "I'll give them lasagna." And then you wind up eating lasagna five times a week. So, you know, I like lasagna, but that was off the writer for a long time.

• 25:49Dan Pashman?

  Okay, but so, you don't quite share my disdain for it?

• 25:53Speaker 03

  For lasagna? I like it okay. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's overrated, but I think it's rated just fine.

• 26:00Dan Pashman?

  See, I kind of feel like, okay, someone's gonna make you lasagna, and their time wouldn't be better spent doing something else for the world.

• 26:07Speaker 03

  Like, paint my house.

• 26:08Dan Pashman?

  Right, exactly. And give me what I think is basically the same thing, which is baked ziti.

• 26:12Speaker 03

  Okay, there you go.

• 26:14Dan Pashman?

  The same thing, except it doesn't require the fine detail of the layering of the ingredients, which is so time-consuming and tedious.

• 26:20Speaker 03

  Right, so make me some baked ziti and give me a back rub.

• 26:22Dan Pashman?

  Exactly.

• 26:23Speaker 03

  There you go.

• 26:24Dan Pashman?

  Which would you rather have out, baked ziti and a back rub, or lasagna?

• 26:26Speaker 03

  Well, I'd rather somebody give me a back rub using the baked ziti. That'd feel pretty good.

• 26:31Dan Pashman?

  Would you rather have a back rub with baked ziti or lasagna?

• 26:33Speaker 03

  Oh, that's a tough one. That's really tough. I might go with the lasagna.

• 26:39Dan Pashman?

  Really?

• 26:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 26:41Dan Pashman?

  Actually, I guess for a back rub, that might be better, because you can kind of drape the long strands of pasta over your back. It's sort of almost like a massage towel of sorts.

• 26:49Speaker 03

  That's what I was visualizing.

• 26:50Dan Pashman?

  The ziti would all fall off.

• 26:51Speaker 03

  Right, right.

• 26:52Dan Pashman?

  It's not good massage food. I think that's a great point.

• 26:58Dan Pashman?

  The Rye or the Kaiser?

• 27:19Dan Pashman?

  Do you have a preference between the two? Which would you use in which situation?

• 27:23Speaker 03

  Well, rye certainly if you're doing any kind of a patty melt situation. Uh, I'm a kind of a rye fan. I don't have anything against Kaiser, but I'm a rye fan from way back.

• 27:34Dan Pashman?

  Okay, alright. I, I, my wife is a huge rye person, so we always have a lot of rye in our house. But we have a bit of a dispute. Maybe you can actually take sides in this, which I'm sure you're eager to do.

• 27:46Dan Pashman?

  I know that it's more convenient to get the bread sliced. Let's say you're getting rye bread fresh at a bakery.

• 27:50Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 27:51Dan Pashman?

  They get the machine that'll slice it for you.

• 27:52Speaker 03

  Right.

• 27:53Dan Pashman?

  The slices are very thin. I love a rye bread unsliced, so you can slice the slices thicker than the machine can even do. You get them three quarters of an inch to an inch thick, like a grilled cheese on thick cut rye bread.

• 28:05Speaker 03

  Oh, that sounds good.

• 28:06Dan Pashman?

  Cause then you get different strata within the bread. You get a crispy exterior, you get a soft fluffy interior. And the other nice thing about getting it unsliced is that you can have different thickness of slices for different situations. So let's say you want one sandwich, you feel like having it be extra thick or thinner, you can adjust that on a per sandwich basis.

• 28:25Speaker 03

  Well, I can understand that, but you know, they say it's the best thing since sliced bread for a reason. Cause sliced bread is awesome.

• 28:33Dan Pashman?

  I don't agree. I think it's overrated. I think that the worst thing since sliced bread could be sliced bread.

• 28:38Speaker 03

  That might be true as well. No, I, I don't know. I mean, well, obviously if you're looking for an extra large slice of rye bread, sliced bread wouldn't be your option. Uh, but, and I'd say in like eighty seven percent of the cases, sliced bread works just fine for me.

• 28:54Dan Pashman?

  Okay, alright. I mean, I'll respectfully disagree.

• 28:57Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 28:57Dan Pashman?

  I mean, I, I.

• 28:58Speaker 03

  I don't know how respectful you're being right now, actually.

• 29:00Dan Pashman?

  I guess I can't disagree with what works best for you, because you know that better than I do. But I would, I would encourage people to get bread unsliced. The other thing is that when you get it unsliced, it stays fresh for longer. I'll put the whole loaf in the freezer, take it out, you can barely let it defrost a tiny bit. Saw off a frozen slice, then let that defrost and it, and it was, cause you're exposing less of the bread's air.

• 29:21Speaker 03

  Sounds like a lot of work. I think you just, you get a slice and you eat it very quickly.

• 29:28Dan Pashman?

  In one of your more recent songs, Whatever You Like, you name check a lot of cheap foods, among other cheap goods.

• 29:47Dan Pashman?

  What are some of your guilty pleasures, food guilty pleasures?

• 29:50Speaker 03

  Oh, I love tater tots. Those are amazing. I've always loved those. I never went through my ramen stage in college so much. I mean, it's okay, but not one of my faves. You know what I love is like the cheap, cheap macaroni and cheese.

• 30:04Dan Pashman?

  Do you add anything to it or do anything to it different from the box instructions?

• 30:08Speaker 03

  I, you know, I'm a, I'm a rule follower, so I pretty much follow the box instructions. You know, I'm one of these kind of cooks that, you know, it's all got to be scientific. Like, I'm not like, oh, put a little of this and a little of that. Well, exactly how, how many grains of salt? Exactly, yeah.

• 30:23Dan Pashman?

  What happened to questioning authority, Al?

• 30:25Speaker 03

  Well, you know, I, I go the different way in the kitchen.

• 30:28Dan Pashman?

  So, so it's okay to upend society's cruel conventions, except in the kitchen?

• 30:33Speaker 03

  That's exactly right.

• 30:36Dan Pashman?

  All right, now we're getting to the big guns here. Eat it.

• 30:55Dan Pashman?

  Have some more chicken, have some more pie. It doesn't matter if it's boiled or fried. Just eat it. Have some more chicken, have some more pie. It doesn't matter if boiled or fried. I had to take issue with that lyric. I think it does matter.

• 31:01Speaker 03

  If the pie is fried?

• 31:03Dan Pashman?

  Well, I mean, fried pie. You must have had, have you had fried pie?

• 31:05Speaker 03

  I don't think I have.

• 31:06Dan Pashman?

  Oh, it's so good.

• 31:07Speaker 03

  Really?

• 31:07Dan Pashman?

  I mean, it's either...

• 31:08Speaker 03

  Well, anything fried, anything fried on a stick.

• 31:10Dan Pashman?

  Right, exactly. You know, a, a, and boiled pie is not going to be very good. So that one is an easy one. I mean, boiled chicken versus fried chicken also.

• 31:18Speaker 03

  Well, I think the protagonist in this, this song is just saying like, I don't care if it's boiled or fried. It is your obligation to eat this, whether it tastes good or not.

• 31:27Dan Pashman?

  But in that lyric, do boiled and fried apply both to the chicken and the pie?

• 31:33Speaker 03

  Uh, it's whatever you want it to be. I left it vague on purpose, so you can put your own meaning onto it.

• 31:38Dan Pashman?

  Okay, okay. Fat.

• 32:01Dan Pashman?

  In fat, ham on, ham on whole wheat, alright. In the fat video, when you sing that lyric, you take, you sort of start to take a bite out of a ham sandwich, and then there's a cut, and then you kind of toss it. You don't really see you taking a bite. I believe that video was shot before you became a vegetarian.

• 32:18Speaker 03

  Uh huh.

• 32:18Dan Pashman?

  Was it a real ham sandwich, and did you take a bite of it?

• 32:21Speaker 03

  That's an excellent question. I honestly don't remember. Uh, I'm, I'm sure I took a bite of it. Um, yeah, I mean, I have to method act.

• 32:31Speaker 03

  And it very well could have been a ham on whole wheat. Uh, let's say that it was.

• 32:34Dan Pashman?

  Okay, alright, we'll go with that.

• 32:35Speaker 03

  Alright.

• 32:36Dan Pashman?

  But, but in theory, at that point in your life, you would have-

• 32:38Speaker 03

  I could have. I could have feasibly been actually eating a ham on whole wheat.

• 32:42Dan Pashman?

  Well, Weird Al Yankovic, the new children's book is My New Teacher in Me. It comes out June 25th. It's available for preorder right now. I will link to it at sporkful.com. Al is also on tour until early August. Find his tour dates and more at weirdal.com. Al, I've been a huge fan of your music for so long. It's been a real pleasure to talk to you. Thank you.

• 33:00Speaker 03

  Thank you so much.

• 33:08Speaker 02

  Hello?

• 33:09Dan Pashman?

  Joe, it's Dan Pashman from The Sporkful. How you doing?

• 33:11Speaker 02

  Pretty good, buddy. How's it going?

• 33:12Dan Pashman?

  Good. Now, at the start of this show, listeners heard our last conversation, which actually was recorded about three months ago. Now, here we are on the present day, and I'm calling to check up on you. How are you doing with the onions?

• 33:24Speaker 02

  Actually, just great. Um, I, I had the meatloaf again last night, and, uh, we tried soaking the onions, and, um, it worked great. It was so much better. I actually, uh, I had seconds, and it was great.

• 33:35Dan Pashman?

  So soaking the onions in the cold water really helped?

• 33:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, it took the nasty, kind of skunky onion, onion taste out of it.

• 33:42Dan Pashman?

  Alright, great. Have you done any other experiments?

• 33:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, actually, a couple of weeks ago, my mom said she was making chicken on the grill, and they usually have caramelized onions with that. And I said, "Oh, great." This is just what Dan wanted me to do. She made this, these great chicken breasts, um, smothered them with this cheese sauce and bacon, grilled, it was so, so good. And, uh, half of my chicken breast, I put the caramelized onions on it, and it was great. It was completely fantastic, and I ate it leftover again a couple nights later.

• 34:10Dan Pashman?

  Wow, so this is a big breakthrough here. You know, you, here you, a few months ago, Joe, you were worried about living a, a life, uh, alone, no wife, no onions, no nothing, and now, you know, you, you're, now you're well on your way.

• 34:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's been a huge help.

• 34:23Dan Pashman?

  And, and, uh, what does your mom have to say about all this?

• 34:25Speaker 02

  She's actually been treating it kinda like a joke. She thought it was pretty funny that I had to call into a radio station.

• 34:30Dan Pashman?

  (laughing)

• 34:31Speaker 02

  You know, to talk about onions, but, um, she's, she's been helping out a lot, actually. She's, um, she's kinda been enjoying it. She's, you know, flipping it, flipping it into food that, um, that we usually don't have it in. She made mashed potatoes a few weeks ago, and, uh, I, halfway through, I said, "You put onions in this, didn't you?" And she said, "Yeah." She, she was sneaking onions into the mashed potatoes.

• 34:50Dan Pashman?

  (laughing) Well, uh, Joe, I'm so glad to hear, uh, that you're on, uh, on the path to onion righteousness. Uh, keep up the good work out there in Idaho.

• 34:59Speaker 02

  All right. Hey, and I just listened to your episode that you did with, um, Ian and Mike from How to Do Everything.

• 35:04Dan Pashman?

  Right.

• 35:04Speaker 02

  And that was pretty awesome. Um, they're like my second favorite podcast, so, um...

• 35:08Dan Pashman?

  Do I need to ask what your first is?

• 35:10Speaker 02

  Definitely you.

• 35:11Dan Pashman?

  (laughing) Well, I'm gonna, I'm gonna...

• 35:13Speaker 02

  And I, I definitely fall on your side of the, the sandwich controversy. I think they're going way too far with that.

• 35:18Dan Pashman?

  Well, I appreciate you saying that. I will make sure that Ian and Mike hear that you said that. Joe, thanks so much for your call, take care.

• 35:24Speaker 02

  All right, thanks, Dan.

• 35:27Dan Pashman?

  The team that produces The Sporkful today includes me, along with managing producer... Emma Morgenstern. And senior producer...

• 35:32Speaker 05

  Andres O'Hara.

• 35:34Dan Pashman?

  Our engineer is... Jared O'Connell. The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher Studios. Our executive producers are Nora Ritchie and Colin Anderson. And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app? Yes, the SiriusXM app, it has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated by genre and era, plus live sports coverage. Your podcasting app have that, and there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more. It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one. And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to siriusxm.com/sporkful. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.

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