Pod Insights The Sporkful Dan Savage Recommends A Polyeaterous Lifestyle (Reheat) About this episode What should you cook for breakfast the morning after? How can couples share power in the kitchen without driving each other crazy? We talk food and relationships with Dan Savage, who writes the sex advice column Savage Love and hosts the podcast Savage Lovecast.
Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Dan Pashman? Boar's Head brings to the deli the taste of deep fried turkey. Look, whether or not you've had deep fried turkey, I think you can probably understand that it's amazing. But making it is also a massive production. That's why Boar's Head now presents the Friar's Turkey Breast. One bite and flavor takes over. Perfectly seasoned, deliciously golden fried. A backyard tradition, available at the deli only from Boar's Head. Discover the craftsmanship behind every bite at your local Boar's Head deli. Boar's Head, committed to craft since 1905. I grew up on Lando Lakes cheese. I still remember going to the supermarket deli counter with my mom and her ordering Lando Lakes American cheese. And now, Lando Lakes cheese and butter are a huge part of my home. There are so many easy weeknight recipes using Lando Lakes cheese and butter that bring delicious
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1:02 Speaker 01 Sirius XM Podcasts.
1:10 Dan Pashman? Hey, everyone, it's Dan here with another reheat for you. This one features my conversation with longtime sex advice columnist and podcaster, Dan Savage. Now, if you don't know Dan Savage, you should at least be able to tell by the fact that he is a sex advice columnist that this conversation may get a little racy. So if you're listening with kids, that's just another episode. But if not, you're gonna love this because Dan and I get into how food opinions and eating habits can affect dating and relationships, including my own marriage. I also open up the phone lines and dish out some food and relationship advice of my own. Of course, if there's a reheat you want to hear, drop us a line, [email protected] . All right, thanks so much and enjoy my conversation with Dan Savage.
1:51 Speaker 02 On Valentine's Day, it's romantic. People want to feel like their partners are attracted to them. And think about the times you actually do want to have sex with your partner. It's not when you sat across the table watching them chew. People want to have sex with their partners after they went out and did something together. Get out of the house, go effing bowling, whatever. Just go be physically active, go do, go move with each other, and then you'll want to screw. Watch your partner inhale chocolate mousse at a restaurant after a three hour dinner? You're not going to want to put your dick in there.
2:18 Dan Pashman? I don't know, you've never seen my wife eat chocolate mousse.
2:22 Speaker 02 You could put a video up on Twitter and I will check it out.
2:30 Dan Pashman? Food is a huge issue in relationships. We hear about it all the time here on The Sporkful. From what you order on a first date to how you cook together when you've been married for 20 years. How and what people eat can be common ground, but it can also be a source of tension. Today on The Sporkful, love and sex columnist Dan Savage dishes on eating in a relationship and cooking in one.
2:51 Speaker 02 Get the fuck out is also a division of labor.
2:53 Dan Pashman? Right.
2:54 Speaker 02 Somebody's moving around the kitchen, you know, and they're doing their thing and they're not, you don't communicate very well and they don't want to knock into you and bustle. Like, one of you just go the hell away.
3:04 Dan Pashman? By the end of this episode, you'll be ready to wrap that special someone in fondant and take them up to bed. Actually, that may be the only good use of fondant. Just don't try to eat it.
3:17 Dan Pashman? This is The Sporkful. It's not for foodies, it's for eaters. I'm Dan Pashman. Each week on our show, we obsess about food to learn more about people. Valentine's Day is next week, which means it's a perfect time to talk with Dan Savage. His nationally syndicated sex advice column and podcast are called Savage Love. He's also the creator of the It Gets Better movement, which started with queer adults offering advice to young people struggling with their sexuality. I met up with Dan in his office in Seattle and I wanted our conversation to follow the same arc as a relationship. We'd start talking about eating on a first date and end talking about food in a marriage. My marriage. But let's not get ahead of ourselves, because as we know, first comes love. I want to go through some of the different ways of sharing food and I want you to tell
4:02 Dan Pashman? me what you think it says about the person.
4:06 Speaker 02 Okay.
4:06 Dan Pashman? You're sizing this person up on a date.
4:08 Speaker 02 People eat very differently because they're being observed.
4:10 Dan Pashman? Right.
4:10 Speaker 02 And they know they're being observed because somebody is sussing them out about whether they want to keep seeing them. And people eat self-consciously, particularly women, eat very self-consciously at that stage in a relationship.
4:20 Dan Pashman? How so? Like, give me specific examples. What do you think is different about the way women eat? In that situation.
4:25 Speaker 02 Well, women aren't supposed to, you know, when it comes to sex, have desire. You know, they're not supposed to be the actors or agents of their own shit of making their sex life happen. They can't appear to be too lustful because of all the like slut chaming and guilt we heap up on women. And that spills over into food, you know, appetites, sexual appetites for food can be stigmatized as well. And women will perform eating and eat very little. I'm not endorsing that.
4:51 Dan Pashman? Right.
4:51 Speaker 02 That is an observation.
4:52 Dan Pashman? Right, right.
4:53 Speaker 02 I'm not saying that's how women should eat.
4:54 Dan Pashman? No, no.
4:54 Speaker 02 Or how all women do, you know, get into trouble when you start generalizing about 3.5 billion people.
4:59 Dan Pashman? Right.
4:59 Speaker 02 But generally and broadly, I think, you know, you read what women have to say about how they eat on dates when they know this is straight guy is observing them. The straight guy eats very unselfconsciously and a woman picks up a salad.
5:08 Dan Pashman? I mean, I, I, I think there, I think, I know that when I was dating, I would be somewhat conscious, maybe less so than a woman, but like, I wouldn't eat something that was like, that was likely to drop all over myself, which I do frequently when I eat.
5:22 Speaker 02 Me too.
5:24 Dan Pashman? I, right. I wouldn't order something that might negatively affect my digestive processes later that night.
5:32 Speaker 02 Yeah, you don't want to fart when you're getting a blowjob.
5:34 Dan Pashman? That's right. Yeah, that's a turn off, I'm pretty sure. And so.
5:38 Speaker 02 You hope it's, it's not always a turn off, but you're always hoping it's a turn off. You don't want to accidentally find yourself in bed with somebody who's happy you had the baby back ribs and the beans.
5:46 Dan Pashman? Well, you know, to each his own, Dan, as I'm sure you know better than anyone.
5:50 Speaker 02 I'm down with the each his own thing, but I don't want to. I should keep it to I's statements. I shouldn't make it generally, you don't want, the universal, you don't want to find yourself in bed. Some of you do, I don't.
6:00 Dan Pashman? Let's talk about the morning after. What do you cook for someone the morning after when you want them to stay? And what do you cook when you want them to leave?
6:10 Speaker 02 Well, you pull out the stops if you want them to stay. You don't make something you can't make. Don't make something bad. Don't like pull out Martha Stewart and try to make eggs benedict or something stupid. But if, and breakfast is simple. I never understand these people go line up for brunch on Saturday and Sunday morning. Outside, there's a restaurant by my house, people line down the block for brunch. Making eggs is easy. Poaching a couple of eggs, a couple of eggs poached on toast and some sliced fruit, that's all you need. And that's really easy and it's nicer and, and.
6:39 Speaker 02 Almost more thoughtful than something crazy. You don't want to appear to be trying too hard. No eggs benedict. You want to try hard and fail because then what you've said is I suck at this cooking thing. And you don't want to, you know, overplay your hand. So something simple that you can bust out.
6:53 Dan Pashman? See, that's an interesting.
6:54 Speaker 02 That says, please come back.
6:55 Dan Pashman? Right. The thing about trying too hard, this I think is an interesting relationship issue. I'm sure you hear about it all the time in your work, but like, why is it that people don't like people who are trying too hard?
7:09 Speaker 02 It's not that people don't like people who are trying too hard. It's that the sensing that they're trying too hard creates sort of an obligation on you. Makes you aware that, you know, it puts a burden on you almost. If you have sexual relations with someone for the first time in your apartment and they come into your kitchen after showering off and there's some insane spread on the table, they're going to think, this is a little much for breakfast, the first time I sleep over. This is actually kind of makes me feel obligated to, A, if he sleeps over at my house or she does, to lay out a similar spread. Like what's being communicated by that is I'm so into you, I'm so into you. And people aren't ready to hear that at the start. Even if they are into you equally as hard, they aren't ready to hear it because saying that
7:53 Speaker 02 with food or just saying it with words that early in a relationship, it displays poor judgment and poor impulse control, the two, two things people look for in a partner.
8:02 Dan Pashman? Let's talk a little bit about Valentine's Day. Do you and your husband do anything special on Valentine's Day?
8:06 Speaker 02 Nope.
8:07 Dan Pashman? I, I feel like it's almost like the relationship version of New Year's Eve. Like all this expectation, all this pressure to make it something super special, which invariably makes it disappointing.
8:19 Speaker 02 Right. And you've been assaulted by commercials. There's this anxiety around not getting what other people are getting. And I don't think that people should do anything on Valentine's. My standard advice, though, for people who do do something on Valentine's Day, sex first, then go out to dinner. Because the calls I get and the letters I get in the wake of Valentine's Day are from people who are nervous and disappointed and spooked that they didn't have sex on Valentine's Day. They went out to dinner and then they came home and fell asleep. Well, because you were full of heavy food and booze and chocolate and you fell asleep. So have sex at seven o'clock and then go out to dinner at nine 30 or 10. When the restaurant's empty, easier to get a reservation. The staff isn't so frazzled and you, you'll have already nailed the sex part.
9:05 Dan Pashman? Let's talk about couples cooking together. There was a term that I heard, I don't know if the New York Times coined it, but that was the first time I came into contact with it a while back. They did a story about couples cooking together.
9:15 Speaker 02 Which only happens in Viagra commercials.
9:18 Dan Pashman? Well, they coined the term kitchen bully. And I don't know if you have this experience in your home. I know I have it sometimes in my home in both directions.
9:27 Speaker 02 Which is why couples don't cook together and shouldn't cook together.
9:29 Dan Pashman? Okay, go on.
9:30 Speaker 02 Well, cooking, I think, is a solitary process. And everybody has their own ideas about how it should be done. And if one of you is the better cook or enjoys cooking in a relationship, I think you should cede the cooking to that person. If they indeed enjoy it, you're not burdening them with the cooking. It's what they want to contribute. Let them cook, get the fuck out of the way, and you clean up. But you know, you only ever see couples cooking together merrily in commercials where relationship dynamics are misrepresented in order to sell us products.
9:56 Dan Pashman? So tell me, so here's my personal situation. You tell me what, how you think I should deal with this. So I think my wife would freely acknowledge that I am the more experienced, accomplished home cook. But she's a good cook and she, there's a few dishes that she makes that I love that are really delicious. The issue is that, especially because since I've started doing this food podcast, or without me in charge, I've accumulated more food and cooking knowledge. So now I know more and it's very hard for me to walk into the kitchen and see her cooking and like.
10:27 Speaker 02 Then don't look. Turn right around and walk back out.
10:30 Dan Pashman? Really?
10:30 Speaker 02 Yeah, don't look.
10:31 Dan Pashman? Even if I could say something that would make the meal better, like if I have a tip that's like, actually you should cook this chicken at 400, not 350. And I know it'll be better.
10:40 Speaker 02 If you can gently slip it in.
10:42 Dan Pashman? Okay.
10:42 Speaker 02 Which applies not just to cooking. And get away with all sorts of stuff in a relationship if you can gently slip it in.
10:48 Dan Pashman? Okay.
10:48 Speaker 02 So lube that comment up and gently slip it in.
10:50 Dan Pashman? So you be me, I'm my wife.
10:52 Speaker 02 And pick your bet, like one comment per meal cooked, maybe.
10:56 Dan Pashman? Okay, that's good advice.
10:57 Speaker 02 But not this, that, the other. Don't take over.
11:01 Dan Pashman? Okay, so, so, so, uh, let's go ahead and, and, and role play here.
11:05 Speaker 02 All right.
11:06 Dan Pashman? I'm my wife, you're me, you just walked in, there's one comment to make. Tell me, uh, how would you say it to me?
11:13 Speaker 02 I think the way to do it is this, you know, one of the people I interviewed said it's a good idea to do this. Not, I'm telling you that you're an idiot and you don't know, but we both didn't know this and now we both know it because I learned it doing my food podcast. So if you frame it not as I am correcting you, but I have this new information that corrected how we both used to cook chicken, maybe you'll get away with it. Maybe that's the lube you need to slip it in.
11:35 Dan Pashman? Okay, I like that. I like that.
11:36 Speaker 02 Good luck with it. But I think you should go with my original advice, which is to back slowly out of the kitchen and go look at something else. If you can't look at somebody cooking without tossing comments out about how they could be doing it better.
11:46 Dan Pashman? Right.
11:46 Speaker 02 That's a bad strategy for cooking. It's a bad strategy for sex. It's a bad strategy for driving. It's a good strategy for high conflict relationship. Oh, you know, you could be cooking that chicken, but you know, I have a blowjob technique for you while you're down there, that maybe you might find helpful, would improve the blowjob for me. Nobody wants to hear that.
12:04 Dan Pashman? Right.
12:04 Speaker 02 While they're blowing you, nobody wants to hear that.
12:14 Dan Pashman? Coming up, I'll ask Dan for more advice on my own relationship. Janey doesn't care as much about going to restaurants as I do. So what's the solution? Then later in the show, I will take Dan's seat and become the relationship expert myself. I'll help a couple in Illinois work through a unique food conflict. Stick around.
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16:04 Dan Pashman? Welcome back to another Sporkful Reheat. I'm Dan Pasch. Hey, if you want to hear what I'm eating and reading every week, you should sign up for the Sporkful newsletter. I'll give you my weekly recommendations and so do our producers and the whole rest of our team. We also share announcements about exciting things happening with the show, when there's special discounts on my pastas. And on top of all that, if you subscribe to the newsletter, you're automatically entered into giveaways for cookbooks featured on the show, as long as you live in the US or Canada. There's literally no downside. Sign up right now at sporkful.com/newsletter. I promise we won't spam you. We're only going to send you really good stuff. Again, that's sporkful.com/newsletter. Thanks.
16:41 Dan Pashman? Now, let's get back to my conversation with Dan Savage. I still had some questions for him about food-related tensions between my wife, Janie, and me.
16:49 Speaker 02 Do I put your wife's consent to hash out your relationship with her on the show?
16:52 Dan Pashman? Yes, I called her on the way here. She's a huge fan of yours and she loves what you do.
16:55 Speaker 02 Oh, thanks.
16:55 Dan Pashman? But here's one of the things that we run into is that she's not as passionate about food as I am. She doesn't love to eat. Like she, her idea of a great night is just like eating cereal on the couch and watching The Real Housewives. Like, that's all she needs. She also doesn't like to spend money. So she doesn't like to go out to, I'm not even talking about a super fancy, super expensive restaurant, even for the two of us to go out and spend $80 for the two of us to eat a decent meal. Like, I get excited about that and she immediately, the check comes and she's like...
17:29 Speaker 02 Wasn't worth it.
17:30 Dan Pashman? Right, right. And I used to resent that a little more until I got a hold of these flavor tasting tabs that test your palate. And, and she couldn't taste anything on the tabs, which the results show that she is in the bottom 25% of tasters. So I feel like I can't really hold it against her. And on one hand... Hey, look, we don't do everything together. I can go out for a nice meal with someone else.
17:53 Speaker 02 Ding ding ding.
17:54 Dan Pashman? But like, but I, but, but I liked, you know, it's fun to share a great meal with someone that you care about. And so she's a good sport and she'll sometimes be like, yeah, sure. Like, let's go out wherever you want to go. But like, there's a little bit of a disconnect there. So what's the, what's the solution?
18:09 Speaker 02 You go out with other people and have those fancy foodie meals with other people who can really appreciate and enjoy it and dish about it with you and you don't make her perform delight in a restaurant where she is bored or unable to taste all the subtleties. My husband likes to go out dancing and I hate it. I don't enjoy it. Um, and every once in a while I'll go to a club with him, just so I go to a club with him. But otherwise he goes out with his dancing friends, his clubby friends, and I don't resent him for going out on those nights. Bye, have fun. Thank you for not being the kind of insecure bag of slop who can't do this on his own.
18:42 Dan Pashman? So really what you're advocating.
18:43 Speaker 02 You go for the fancy meals. She stays at home and watches Real Housewives and eats cereal. And then you're both happy.
18:47 Dan Pashman? Right. So, so what you're advocating for my wife and me is a polyeterous relationship.
18:54 Speaker 02 Yes, essentially.
18:55 Dan Pashman? Polyeteri.
18:56 Speaker 02 You should, that's a good term. You should, you should totally have that trademarked immediately.
19:00 Dan Pashman? But, but what happens to like, she might say, it's okay. Sure, honey. Let's be polyeterous. But then I go out all over town.
19:07 Speaker 02 And she's upset. Well, you just have to check in, you just have to check into each other. You have to talk to each other.
19:11 Dan Pashman? And, and how does that explain? Tell me how that conversation goes.
19:13 Speaker 02 Well, it works in my house with Terry going, I'm going out tonight. Do you want to come? And I say, no. And he says, okay, bye. So I think you go to her and say, I made reservations at this restaurant. If you want to come, I'd love to go with you. If not, I'll make, I'll ask somebody else to come along and let her choose, let her pick. And then she, without any stigma or guilt or sad feelings or long faces is free to opt out whenever she wants.
19:35 Dan Pashman? What if she starts going out for nice meals with other people? How am I supposed to feel about that?
19:41 Speaker 02 Hmm, I don't know. I don't know how you're supposed to feel about that because.
19:45 Dan Pashman? That's the other side of the polyeteri coin, isn't it?
19:48 Speaker 02 Yeah, it is the other, but that's, you know, to, to, to stretch the sexual sort of analogy to its breaking point. There are people with really low libidos whose partners get permission to go have sex with other people. Uh, and then when the low libido partner thinks they want to have sex with other people, the partner who's already been out there having sex with other people is like, I'm only doing this because you don't want to have sex very often. And now you're saying you want to have sex more often?
20:12 Dan Pashman? So how do you advise those people?
20:13 Speaker 02 I advise them to break up.
20:16 Speaker 02 Maybe we should, maybe we should back slowly away from this analogy.
20:19 Dan Pashman? Honestly, I, I don't foresee a day when my wife is going to start going out to dinner with other people. I mean, we get two small kids. She's content with her bowl of cereal on the couch and her TV.
20:30 Speaker 02 Yeah, then you don't have to hire a sitter either. You're saving money left and right.
20:33 Dan Pashman? I always say I'm not worried.
20:33 Speaker 02 You can split the check if you go out with somebody else and you don't have to hire a sitter. What's not to like?
20:37 Dan Pashman? Another question about, uh,
20:39 Speaker 02 Pick up a box of Lucky Charms on the way home for the wife.
20:43 Dan Pashman? She loves Lucky Charms.
20:44 Speaker 02 Me too.
20:46 Dan Pashman? So my wife was raised in a kosher home, which you probably know means no pork, no shellfish, but people may also not realize that it means you can't mix meat and dairy. And it even means in a true kosher home, you're supposed to have separate plates and separate utensils and separate cooking implements so that nothing that ever has dairy on it can ever touch something that had meat on it. Now she is not so insistent that we have our home that way. But I'm also Jewish, but I was raised in a, like, we eat everything household and I love pork and shellfish and I love to cook and I love butter on just about everything.
21:21 Dan Pashman? And we've reached this sort of like tenuous compromise where I said, okay, I won't cook pork or shellfish in our house. I can eat whatever I want. We're out of the house and if, and I can buy cooked pork or shellfish outside the house and bring it home and eat it on a paper plate.
21:37 Dan Pashman? And I also won't cook with meat and dairy together, like really blatantly, like I'm not going to melt cheese on top of her chicken. I'm not going to make her chicken parmesan.
21:48 Speaker 02 And deep dish pizza with sausages right out.
21:50 Dan Pashman? Right. None of that. But, um, you know, here, here's really the issue is that when I just talk about the, the kosher issue with her on an intellectual level, we really kind of agree that.
22:04 Speaker 02 That it's horseshit.
22:06 Speaker 02 That it's goofy, purely arbitrary cultural inheritance.
22:09 Dan Pashman? Right. What I find frustrating, though, is that intellectually she and I agree, but she feels guilt because she feels like this is a tradition that's been in my family for many generations. And I respect that and I'm respectful of the way her family wants to eat. But it's frustrating for me when she, when it's more like, I almost, if she was like, I want to be orthodox, I'm just taking all the rules. I'd almost be like, okay, you know, that's an issue on a larger level. But like, it's that it's more that she just feels.
22:38 Speaker 02 What is it you want me to say that's going to upset your wife? I feel like you should slip me a piece of paper across the table with exactly what you want me to say about this.
22:44 Dan Pashman? What? How should I, how?
22:46 Speaker 02 To get your, to help your wife through this. Or what it is, you've always wanted to say that you haven't been brave enough to say to her about it.
22:51 Dan Pashman? I don't, I think I probably said it all. I guess, I don't know if you have any, like, is this sort of tenuous compromise that we have, which sometimes is a source of tension, because she'll say like, she feels like I'm pushing her away from this thing she wants to observe. But sometimes I feel frustrated because I feel like it's all a bunch of BS. And why should I have any restrictions? So we have this kind of tenuous compromise that works nine days out of 10. Is that the best we can hope for?
23:17 Speaker 02 Oh, yeah, absolutely.
23:18 Dan Pashman? Is there something else we should be doing differently?
23:20 Speaker 02 Tenuous compromise is, I think, the gold star for long-term relationships. If you can get to a tenuous compromise about something, Yahtzee, you win. You won't get to, you know, surrender, unconditional surrender on most sort of points of contention in a long-term relationship. But if you can hammer out some, carve a groove into each other and hammer out a workable compromise.
23:40 Dan Pashman? And then?
23:41 Speaker 02 I mean, do you feel really restricted and restrained by the compromise? That you can't make a pork loin for dinner for your family?
23:46 Dan Pashman? Not terribly restricted. Not terribly. But it's also, you know, like, my parents will go buy me a delicious lobster roll and bring it to my house. And that is delicious and wonderful.
23:57 Speaker 02 But you have to eat it in the car.
24:00 Dan Pashman? I can eat it at home, but it's still, I'm sort of like, but I would like there to be more lobster rolls in my life. I'm not a.
24:06 Speaker 02 But there'd be less wife, Ben. So you have to pick.
24:09 Dan Pashman? Okay.
24:10 Speaker 02 The price of admission, more wife means fewer lobster rolls. And hopefully you love your wife more than you love dead lobsters.
24:16 Dan Pashman? I do.
24:27 Dan Pashman? That's Dan. Savage, his nationally syndicated sex column and podcast are called Savage Love. Now, as you know, we've been talking about the way food affects relationships here on the Sporkful for years, often by taking calls from you. And while I may be no Dan Savage, I like to think I've dished out some decent advice over the years. So, right now, we're going to share one of the very first food and relationship calls we ever did here on the show, and it remains one of our favorites. So, let's go to the phones.
24:56 Speaker 06 Hi, Dan. This is Barbara Young in North Aurora, Illinois. My husband and I have issues about how we eat cornbread muffins.
25:05 Dan Pashman? Okay, go on.
25:06 Speaker 06 He always takes a knife and cuts them horizontally, so there's a bottom and a top, and then while they're warm, he butters them, lets the butter melt in. And I take the muffin and I break it with my fingers, top to bottom, so that there's a piece of the nice crown, the nice top, and a piece of the, you know, the bottom on each half, and that it's craggy in the middle. So, when I butter it, it's got nooks and crannies for all the butter to melt into. And we don't understand each other. How we eat cornbread muffins.
25:44 Dan Pashman? How long have you guys been married?
25:45 Speaker 06 We've been married about 10 years, together quite a bit longer than that.
25:49 Dan Pashman? Okay. So, it's two issues. Part is that you like the nooks and crannies, part is you want a little bit of top in every bite.
25:57 Speaker 06 Yeah, pretty much, yeah.
25:59 Dan Pashman? And the nooks and crannies is really what you're getting at there, Barbara, is surface area to volume ratio, a common hobby horse here on the Sporkful. By breaking it apart and having an uneven surface on the piece of cornbread muffin, you are increasing the surface area available to absorb that delicious, delicious butter.
26:18 Speaker 06 Yes, and it just tastes better that way.
26:20 Dan Pashman? Okay, all right. Well, that's a strong argument. Is your husband Bruce around? Can I talk to him?
26:26 Speaker 06 He's right here.
26:27 Dan Pashman? Okay.
26:27 Speaker 06 Yes, hang on.
26:28 Dan Pashman? All right, let's see what Bruce has to say for himself. Hello. Hey Bruce, how are you? I'm pretty good, how are you? Good, good. So, so I was just talking to your wife Barbara. She's got some issues with the way you eat cornbread muffins. What, uh, what do you have to say for yourself? I have some issues with the way she eats it too. (laughing) Um, I'm not sure. I, I've always done it this way. Cornbread, when you try, for me, when you try to tear it apart, often it breaks. And so, cutting it in half seems to keep the pieces together, so you don't have little chunks around. Um, which is one of the reasons why I do it. And I like cornbread muffins a lot.
27:09 Dan Pashman? I like the top better than the bottom, but I still like them both and I, I will butter it and eat the bottom and then, and eat the top later and, and really enjoy it. What do you say to Barbara's comment about the butter? About the, the crags, the nooks and crannies and the advantages that those present? Um, I'm, I, I, I think that's just a little overrated. I find, uh, with a, a nice smooth surface to put hot butter on, it, uh, it, it melts right in and through the cornbread.
27:47 Dan Pashman? Do you ever slice the cornbread muffin horizontally? Put the butter on the insides and then griddle it till it gets golden brown and crispy? Um, let's see. No, I have to say I've never tried that. That certainly sounds fun. It's more than fun, it's freaking amazing. But, uh, (laughing) um,
28:09 Dan Pashman? this is an interesting one. And, and so, so what do you think about it? Where, where do you lie in this controversy? Well,
28:20 Dan Pashman? I, I, I have to say that I think your approach is probably say a lot about your personalities.
28:30 Dan Pashman? Like, for instance, actually, you know what? Barbara and Bruce, I'm gonna put you on hold for a minute. Are we good? They can't hear me? Okay, alright. I'm gonna make a prediction. I'm making a prediction, we'll see if I'm gonna be right. Barbara likes to get in there. She likes to pull the food apart with her hands. She wants maximum butter. She is someone who... She's more the one who's a little bit willing to take risks, a little bit more full of gusto. Bruce, he's more the steady... He's the steady hand. He wants a nice, smooth cut. He's got his way of doing it. It's the way he's always done it, and he's happy. Alright?
29:11 Dan Pashman? I also suspect that Bruce is neater than Barbara. Those are my predictions. Okay, let's bring him back.
29:20 Speaker 04 Hello?
29:21 Dan Pashman? Bruce and Barbara, can you hear me?
29:22 Speaker 04 Yeah.
29:23 Dan Pashman? Could you hear what I was just saying just then?
29:25 Speaker 04 No, uh-uh.
29:25 Dan Pashman? Okay, okay. So, keep Barbara nearby, I'm gonna ask you a couple of questions now, Bruce.
29:31 Speaker 04 Okay.
29:31 Dan Pashman? Between the two of you, which one would you say is the more adventurous? The one more likely to take risks? The one who's more... Who may live life on the edge with a little more gusto?
29:45 Speaker 06 Hmm.
29:46 Speaker 04 Um, well, personally, I'd say that we're pretty close, but probably me.
29:51 Dan Pashman? Really?
29:52 Speaker 06 Yeah, I'd agree.
29:54 Dan Pashman? Really? Well, shows you what I know.
29:56 Speaker 06 Not by a lot.
29:59 Dan Pashman? And now, which one of you is neater around the house?
30:04 Speaker 06 That would be me.
30:06 Dan Pashman? So, it was the exact opposite of what I had predicted. Well, I will tell you this. Here's where I come down on your debate. I think that if you are going to eat the muffin, hide out of the oven, I would go with Barbara's approach. I would break it up by hand, because I agree, I want a little bit of that crust in every bite, and I like those crags for catching more butter. However, I have often done Bruce's approach when the muffins aren't quite so fresh, and in that case, slice them in half horizontally, butter the insides, and then put those buttered inside sides down and griddle them in a nonstick pan,
30:51 Dan Pashman? so they turn golden brown and crispy and buttery.
30:54 Speaker 06 We have to try that. We often have more than enough cornbread muffins to have some the next day. We're definitely going to try that.
31:01 Dan Pashman? There you go. And if you really want to go hardcore, if your muffins are big enough, you can do what I call muffin trifurcation. Slice them into thirds. This time I would go vertically. Slice them vertically into thirds, and then you have the middle slice that's got two open sides. You butter both sides and griddle both sides of that one.
31:19 Speaker 06 Ooh.
31:21 Dan Pashman? Now you are vastly increasing your butter per muffin, which is something we can all get behind, I think. Well, Barbara and Bruce in North Aurora, Illinois, enjoy your muffins.
31:31 Speaker 06 Thank you so much. Thank you.
31:32 Dan Pashman? Thanks, guys. Take care.
31:33 Speaker 06 Thanks for the good ideas.
31:39 Dan Pashman? This show is produced by me along with our senior producer. And Sandy. Associate producer.
31:44 Speaker 04 Ngofen Putubuele.
31:45 Dan Pashman? And our editor. Gianna Palmer. The show is mixed by. Jared O'Connell. Music help from Black Label Music. The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher. Our executive producers are Chris Bannon and Jenny Radley. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
31:59 Speaker 01 And I'm Noni from New York City, reminding you to eat more, eat better, and eat more better.
32:13 Dan Pashman? This reheat was produced by. Gianna Palmer. The team that produces The Sporkful today includes me along with managing producer.
32:19 Speaker 01 Emma Morgenstern.
32:20 Dan Pashman? And senior producer. Andres O'Hara. Our engineer is. Jared O'Connell. The Sporkful is a production of Stitcher Studios. Our executive producer is Camille Stanley. And hey, did you know you can listen to The Sporkful on the SiriusXM app? Yes, the SiriusXM app, it has all your favorite podcasts, plus over 200 ad-free music channels curated by genre and era, plus live sports coverage. Does your podcasting app have that? And there's interviews with A-list stars and so much more. It's everything you want in a podcast app and music app all rolled into one. And right now, Sporkful listeners can get three months free of the SiriusXM app by going to siriusxm.com/sporkful. Until next time, I'm Dan Pashman.
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