Pod Insights The Rich Roll Podcast Introducing Feel Better, Live More: The Secret To A Happy Life With Eliud Kipchoge (The World’s Fastest Man) About this episode Today I’m sharing an episode of Feel Better, Live More hosted by Dr. Rangan Chatterjee.
In this episode, Dr. Chatterjee sits down with Eliud Kipchoge, the legendary Kenyan long-distance runner who became the first person to run a sub-two-hour marathon.
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Transcript 15,867 words · 3 speakers
Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Rich Roll? Eating well rarely falls apart because of one big failure. It's the daily question that wears you down like, what am I actually going to make tonight? What's in the fridge? And it's exactly why we built the Plant Power Meal Planner. It's a personalized, plant-based meal planning program that matches you with recipes based on your taste, your allergies, your cooking skills, and how much time you actually have. You build through this program, a balanced nutrient-dense plan for your entire household in a few minutes. Then it generates a grocery list for you with one click that plugs right into our delivery partners. All the recipes in the program are built by dietitians with culinary training. Plus, you get your own food coach to help you problem solve along the way.
0:44 Rich Roll? It's kind of an amazing thing. For listeners of the show, all you special people, we're offering an exclusive $20 off an annual subscription right now. To get it, go to meals.richroll.com, take your quick personalization quiz, and enter promo code RICHROLL20 at checkout. Hey, everybody. Welcome to the podcast. You guys are in for a treat because my good friend, the good doctor, Dr. Rangan Chatterjee is in the house. Longtime listeners know Rangan well. He's been on the show, I think, four times, but not since before the pandemic. It's been a couple of years.
1:26 Rich Roll? But Rangan, for those who are new, maybe you, I'll let you give your bio. But Rangan's here because he has an amazing podcast called Feel Better Live More. He's part of the Voicing Change family, and we're going to introduce you to his show by sharing one of my favorite episodes of his show, and I think maybe of yours. I don't know.
1:45 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, it's definitely one of my favorites.
1:46 Rich Roll? Might not be able to pin down, but maybe share a little bit about who you are, what your background is, and your show.
1:52 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, so I am a medical doctor. I qualified from Edinburgh Medical School back in 2001, and my career has been on somewhat of an evolution ever since. I don't think what I am doing today is what I thought I'd be doing when I left and stepped out of Edinburgh Medical School for the last time. Because today, I'm a podcaster like you, I'm an author, yes, I'm a doctor, I teach doctors. But really, in essence, I think what's evolved over my career is this understanding that it's our collective modern lifestyles, how we live, but also how we think
2:31 Rangan Chatterjee? that impacts the quality of our lives. It impacts our health, yes, but it also impacts our happiness and our relationships. And I've gone through many iterations throughout my career of being slightly frustrated in medicine and feeling that a lot of what we have to do is to suppress symptoms with drugs. I threw a few personal experiences with my son and my father. I really got more and more passionate about the idea that lifestyle can be our best medicine if we know what to work on. And that led to me, back in 2015, I think it's almost 10 years now, maybe it was 2014, I got my own primetime television series in the UK called Doctor in the House. It got shown
3:16 Rangan Chatterjee? to five million people a week in the UK and has gone to 70 countries around the world. It's still probably the proudest, it's still probably the things that I look back on to go, yeah, that was pretty incredible, what I managed to show the British public and people around the world through that series. I think now on reflection, that show was ahead of its time. I think if it landed today, it would land in a completely different way. I think back then, what I was doing was deemed a little bit, what's going on here? Now I'll give you an example on that show. You mean like woo woo? I wouldn't say woo woo, but you know, basically Doctor in the House was where I
3:55 Rangan Chatterjee? went to live alongside families who were sick, right? They were under GPs and specialists. They usually had a diagnosis and they were on medication, usually. But they applied to go on the show because they couldn't get better. And so the whole premise is that the doctor goes into their house. And so for four to six weeks, I spent time with these guys and I helped a lady put her type 2 diabetes into remission in 30 days. I helped another lady with panic attacks, reduced them by 70 to 80% in just six weeks. I helped a lady with severe pains with fibromyalgia, IBS, depression. I helped her become pain free. For the first time in 10 years, I helped her become pain free in six weeks. I helped
4:38 Rangan Chatterjee? a lady with menopausal symptoms without the use of hormones get almost completely better. But the incredible thing was that I did it all with nutrition and lifestyle and mindset. It was using no pharmaceutical drugs. And so when I say that that was a bit ahead of its time, I remember when the episode, one of the first episodes was me helping her reverse her type 2 diabetes in 30 days. Back in 2014, Rich, that wasn't common knowledge. You know, there was a bit of pushback online saying this is an irreversible disease. It's a chronic progressive disease. This is not true. Don't get me wrong, there was mostly great feedback, but it was my first, it was my first interactions with social media.
5:23 Rangan Chatterjee? And I very quickly had to learn how to deal with negativity, which I did find really hard back then, if I'm completely honest. But today, 10 years on, it is widely accepted that type 2 diabetes can be put into remission. So that series was really quite profound for me in so many ways that I've only really appreciated even in the last two, three years. Even in writing this new book, I've gone, why do I have such a different perspective on health than so many doctors? I think my cultural upbringing, you know, being in an Indian family where we understand or we get infused with the idea that food is medicine from a young age, that if you're sick, your mum actually puts extra turmeric in your
6:07 Rangan Chatterjee? curry, or if you've got a sore throat, she'll make honey and grated ginger and turmeric. Like, you grow up with this idea that food is medicine, and then you don't get taught that in medical school. So there's a slight conflict. But then also, most doctors, even if they are practicing in a more holistic way and may get one hour with their patient, let's say, they still won't see what I got to see. I got to see how every single input in these families' lives impacted their health. Even if I had an hour with them, they still wouldn't tell me the stuff that I saw. I'd be like, ah. Could this person's symptoms be in some way related to the fact that the husband is talking to the wife?
6:47 Rangan Chatterjee? This kind of emotional stress, this relationship stress that's impacting how they feel about themselves? I got to see all of this and go, wow, health is so much more than just what I see in the consultation room. In fact, 99% of our health outcomes basically, pretty much come from outside the consultation room, right? So these experiences, that primetime series led to me, you know, writing books. And, you know, I'm blessed to have this podcast, which has been going for seven years now. I've said this publicly, I'll say it again, Rich, you were a huge inspiration for me to actually start my show because of the way you conducted your conversations. That's what inspired me the most.
7:30 Rangan Chatterjee? This is a guy who is bringing real intentionality to each conversation. Each conversation feels like a special event. Nothing is just dialed in. The way that you dress it up and put it online and the audio quality, all these things were like, oh, that's the kind of show I want. Right now, I think I've evolved into having my own style now, but definitely you inspired me massively to have the confidence to go long as well. Because in the UK back then, people were saying to me, your show should only be 40 minutes. That's the length of the average commute. So my first six shows were 40 minutes. I mean, I haven't listened to them, I'm not sure I could put myself through that.
8:11 Rich Roll? Well, no one should go back and listen to the first, anybody who's been doing this thing should go back and listen to the beginning. But I think, I mean, first of all, thank you. And I think what you've built is really potent and powerful. There's a reason why it's the number one health podcast in the UK. Not only is it the number, I mean, you're in like the top five to 10 of all podcasts in the UK. Like what you've built is incredibly powerful. It's reaching millions of people and not just reaching them, like really impacting them in meaningful ways. And so I love not only what you do, but like how you do it, because I do think that you bring a level of integrity and intentionality to, you know, this medium with your experience.
8:53 Rich Roll? And there's a reason why it's successful and I'm really proud to be supporting you in this venture and also just to be your friend. So
9:00 Rangan Chatterjee? Me too, man. I appreciate that. Thank you.
9:02 Rich Roll? Yeah. And so the idea here is like, we just wanted to introduce all of you, and by you, I mean the audience who might be new to Rangan to what his show is. So we're going to share an episode of it. What episode are we going to be sharing with everybody?
9:17 Rangan Chatterjee? Well, we're going to share, I think, what might be one of the only long form conversations that exists with Elliot Kipchoge, the Kenyan marathon runner, the only human to our knowledge that has ever run a marathon in under two hours.
9:32 Rich Roll? I'll admit to a little bit of jealousy. When I saw that you published that, I was like, damn, Rangan. How did you get him? Like, that is not a guy who's like doing the podcast rounds. I don't think he's ever done a podcast, except for yours.
9:45 Rangan Chatterjee? I think he's, you know, when his film came out, I think he popped him on a couple. I got offered him then, actually, but interestingly enough that these were going to be 10 minute conversations on Zoom. I don't want to do that. I don't want to have a 10 minute conversation on Zoom. It's not really what my show is about. It's like yours. It's long form. We want to go deep. And so I appreciate how lucky I am. I know what it's like when you see another podcast host and they get some guests that you've been trying for years. You're like, how do they manage that? Like, I tried this and I tried that, but I didn't get a response. Really, that came about through my relationship with the London Marathon and the team there. I've helped support them for a number of years, promote them. I spoke to Hugh Breschner,
10:24 Rangan Chatterjee? the kind of the head of the London Marathon on my show a few years ago. And it's, again, through developing good relationships with people and they knew I wanted to talk to Elliot. I didn't get much notice. I live in the northwest of England. My studio is in the northwest of England, outside of London. I'm lucky that because of the size of the show, people will travel up to my studio.
10:49 Rich Roll? How long does it take from London to get there by train?
10:51 Rangan Chatterjee? It's on a quick train, but it's still one hour 40 minutes. It's a really nice, relaxing train with only two stops. So people really enjoy it. But really, that's your day. If you're in London and coming up to mine, that's your day done. Now, most guests do come unless it's, let's say, a top US guest who's in London for just two days and they literally can't fit it in. And if I really want to speak to them, I'll go down. But I think with about two weeks' notice or maybe 10 days, Someone from the London Marathon reached out and said, hey, Ron, and I know you've been trying to get Elliot for a while. We have some time with him when he's in London in like 10 days. You know, what do you think? I'm like, trying not to sound overly keen. Yeah, sure. I'd love
11:34 Rangan Chatterjee? to do that. And we basically set up an interview. I was told that you don't have long. He's very, very busy. He's got lots of press engagements. And I thought, okay, look, this guy, I've always been drawn to him. I just find his manner.
11:50 Rich Roll? There's an elegance to his demeanor and his disposition that, and a gravitas and like a grace, but also like a humility.
12:00 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
12:01 Rich Roll? That's rare in such an extraordinary champion.
12:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. And I thought, I have to do this. I really want to do this. And I, you know, I remember sitting with my children for his first sub two hour events. My wife was away. We were watching it early morning in the UK. He didn't make it. We saw it the next time. We watched it together. So it's a kind of family thing for us as well. Like, we talk about Kip Chogi a lot.
12:21 Rich Roll? Your kids are fans.
12:23 Rangan Chatterjee? My kids are fans. Yeah. So what happened is that I thought, okay, so we can, why don't we all go down for the weekends, stay in a hotel in London. I was interviewing on the Sunday morning of the marathon. He was going to like, I think, start the race or something. So I think I was told it has to be in this hotel room at 8am or in this hotel where he's staying. It cannot be anywhere else.
12:43 Rich Roll? He wasn't running. He was starting, like announcing the start, you mean?
12:47 Rangan Chatterjee? I think so. He had run the week before in Berlin and that's when he got the world record. Literally.
12:52 Rich Roll? So he's literally a week off of setting the world record when you met up with him?
12:56 Rangan Chatterjee? Exactly. So a very fortunate time to have him. And what's really interesting is that my kids said, Daddy, can we meet Elliot? And the team were amazing. They were like, they didn't say I couldn't bring my kids, but they were like, we've only got this time. You don't get longer. He has to run out straight away. So obviously I knew in which room we were recording because my cameraman Gareth came down and he set up and he really tried to make it look beautiful. I said, mate, we've got to make this look good. I think this is the only long form conversation with Elliot that I've seen. So just in honor of this individual, let's try and make it look good. So Gareth came down, he spent a whole day trying to light the room, which is, you know, it's a standard London hotel room. And then I tell
13:37 Rangan Chatterjee? you the things I remember, Rich. Elliot came in and I can get quite excited, to say the least, right? I can be quite an amped up guy sometimes. He is so calm and quiet that I started to respond to him. I started to talk quietly and slowly. And it was amazing to see what power, what magnetism can exist with another human being. Like their energy starts to change the energy of the people around them, which I found really profound. So we have this conversation. I had told my kids that morning, we were staying in a different hotel. I said, guys, if you want to meet Elliot, I don't know, like it's hard with the team and being really precise on times. And I said, guys, I'm recording in this room in this hotel.
14:22 Rangan Chatterjee? I said to my wife, make sure you and the kids are outside the door 10 minutes before the end. And I gave them the time. And my wife tells me afterwards that they couldn't even get there. Like Elliot's team were like, where are you going? They're like, you know, no one can come in here. And she's like, no, no, wrong is my husband. Like, so she insisted, no one's going to stop my wife getting anywhere. So they're waiting outside the room. I finished with Elliot. I think we go for about an hour and 15 in the end. So I managed to work out a bit of extra time. And then one of the loveliest things that I remember was that the publicist said, okay, yeah, great. No problem. We need to take Elliot now. My kids came in and he just stopped. He sat down, he spoke to them, his publicist is trying to move him on. He's just sitting there. My son takes his T shirt off.
15:07 Rangan Chatterjee? Elliot writes a handwritten message, signs it for him, gives it him back. I have seen Rich, maybe like you, I've seen people on the mic and off the mic. And it ain't always the same thing. And what I realized that day was Elliot is the same person on and off the mic. He was gentle, he was calm, he was present. He was so lovely with my children. He gave them gifts. He said, anything else you want? He went and asked them, his PR to get something, he signed it for them. Another thing I've reflected on since that is that I've spoken to Elliot Kipchoge on my podcast. I've also, like you, spoken to Kylian Journe. And I've always thought it's incredible that two of the humblest people I've ever
15:50 Rangan Chatterjee? met on my show, I would say Elliot and Killian. And I always thought this is so interesting. Why is that? Is it because their sports are in nature? They see the magnitude of existence? Like, you know, you don't see that as much with football in the UK, or let's say basketball, where we can often see ego attached to someone's fame and their success. I didn't get a hint of ego from either Killian Journe or from Elliot's. And that is something I think a lot about, but it was a beautiful conversation with a quite beautiful man.
16:23 Rich Roll? It's so cool, man. I love it. That's a great story. And what an extraordinary human being to be able to like, share space with. And it's always cool when it's somebody who is so accomplished and fascinating, but isn't kind of like doing the podcast round. Like, there's a specialness to it, right? Because you know, like, this guy's not going next door right after you to go somewhere else. Like, this is a, this is a very like, kind of special moment in time.
16:49 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, and I feel lucky. And the truth is, you know what it's like? We're not always going to get the guests that we want. And sometimes those guests appear on other shows, and that's just the way of the world. I feel that, yeah, for whatever reason, karma, the universe, whatever, for some reason, that happened for me. And, you know, it's still, it's like pinch me when Elliot sends me a DM on something, or he'll comment on something on my Instagram. And I'm like, oh, that's Athlete Chogi. Do you know what I mean? It is nice. But I kind of, I feel we built up a rapport that day. Which, of course, is what we do when we have these conversations.
17:24 Rich Roll? That's what happens when you have these experiences. You know, we're always striving to create something meaningful. And that comes with authenticity and intentionality and true curiosity, I think, you know, to try to create something authentic. So, anyway, I love it. I can't wait for all of you, the audience, to hear or watch what's about to follow. Rangan, thank you for being a member of the Voicing Change family, for being a friend. His podcast is fantastic, Feel Better, Live More, available on YouTube, wherever you get podcasts, Apple, Spotify, like, all the places, right?
17:59 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
18:00 Rich Roll? Yeah?
18:00 Rangan Chatterjee? You know it, man.
18:01 Rich Roll? All right, man. Cheers. Cool. Enjoy, everybody. Peace.
18:10 Speaker 02 I'm not a believer of success. I believe in pure and good preparation, in pure and clean planning. You should live by it, sleep by it, run by it, relax by it, walk by it. You need to have the right systems. You cannot sit and wait for success. You need to do it.
18:31 Rangan Chatterjee? Hey guys, how are you doing? I hope you're having a good week so far. My name is Dr Rangan Chatterjee and this is my podcast, Feel Better Live More.
18:44 Rangan Chatterjee? Today's guest is someone who I've been trying to set up a face-to-face conversation with for around two years. And a couple of weekends ago, it finally happened. Elliot Kipchoge is a Kenyan athlete who's widely regarded as the greatest marathon runner of all time. He's won two successive Olympic marathons, 10 major titles, and of course, he's the only man to have ever run a marathon in under two hours, which he did back in 2019 in Vienna as part of the 159 Challenge. This was an incredible achievement for humanity, but was not recognised as an official world record because it was not an open competition and he used a team of rotating pacemakers.
19:29 Rangan Chatterjee? Now, our conversation took place in London on the weekend of the 2022 London Marathon, exactly seven days after he had once again broken the official Marathon World Record in Berlin. Now, I want to be really clear at the start of this episode. This is a conversation for everyone. Whether you are a runner or not, I think you're going to find Elliot's insights highly relevant and applicable in your own life. And one of the main reasons I wanted to talk to Elliot was not actually because of his running ability, it's because I've always been fascinated by the energy that this man
20:08 Rangan Chatterjee? radiates. He has a calmness, a humility, a modesty, and a complete lack of ego which I and millions of others around the world find ourselves drawn to. In our conversation, we cover many different topics. We talk about reflection and why in this tech-heavy world, he still keeps a handwritten training journal. We talk about success and why he doesn't actually believe in success, which I think is remarkable for a man who has achieved so much of it. We discuss why he always does his runs as part of a community, why he smiles in the latter parts of a marathon, how he manages to stay injury-free, and what he really thinks about retirement.
20:51 Rangan Chatterjee? But for me, one of the most insightful parts of this conversation is hearing Elliot talk about self-discipline and why he feels that this is one of the most important skills that we can develop. Elliot is probably best known for the phrase "no human is limited", and hearing him explain what this means to him really brings to life the idea that it's self-discipline that will help you reach your own potential. This really was a special conversation with an incredible man. I hope you enjoy listening. And now, my conversation with the one and only Elliot Kipchoge.
21:33 Rangan Chatterjee? As we're having this conversation, it's pretty much exactly seven days, almost to the minute where you were running in Berlin and when you broke the Marathon World Record again. How's the last week been for you?
21:51 Speaker 02 Last week I recorded, Sunday was great day. I broke a world record. But from Sunday afternoon, I've been a little bit busy. I'm walking up and down, doing some sponsor stuff and making sure actually everybody is happy before I fly back to Kenya.
22:10 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, looking forward to going home, I'm sure.
22:12 Speaker 02 Absolutely, yes.
22:13 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
22:13 Speaker 02 Yeah.
22:15 Rangan Chatterjee? Obviously, you've done many interviews since you broke the world record. We've watched many of them on television or on the internet. What's it like for you, though, when you're not in public? So last Sunday, for example, what's it like for you when you're in your hotel room at night and you go to sleep? What is it like in those private moments for you?
22:39 Speaker 02 When I am actually in the hotel room alone, I think it's a crucial time for me to audit myself, internalize what has happened the day, and actually try to go back what has been happening for the last four months. And actually, I appreciate what we have been doing actually for four months, which has ripped good fruits on that day. So it's internalizing and accepting and just making your mind really calm that it has happened. And tomorrow is another day.
23:19 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
23:21 Rangan Chatterjee? Many people struggle to keep their minds calm.
23:25 Rangan Chatterjee? Big things may happen in their life, at work, or with their family, or pressure, and they really struggle to calm their minds. You seem to be someone who has a very zen approach to life, a very calm approach. How do you manage to calm your mind when you've achieved something so huge?
23:47 Speaker 02 I am a believer of some philosophies. I'll give an example. I'm a believer of a philosophy, if you are going up the tree, you are stepping on the branches of a tree. And immediately, when you actually, you grab a branch, you test the branch, if it's strong enough to hold your weight. And if it's strong enough to hold your weight, then you go up. Immediately, you stepped on the branch.
24:19 Speaker 02 Then you aim for the next branch. Then you have already actually got this branch.
24:24 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
24:25 Speaker 02 You forget the branch. You wait for the next one. Get the crap the next one. Test it actually with us. Enough actually, and enough the branch itself has enough muscle to hold your weight. Then you go up. What I'm trying to say is this. Berlin Marathon was a branch. I worked for that branch for four to five months.
24:51 Speaker 02 And last week on Sunday on twenty fifth, I got the branch.
24:55 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
24:56 Speaker 02 After getting the branch actually.
24:59 Speaker 02 What else? I've got the branch. I need to aim for the next one. So just forget it, aim for the next one. Because that's how, that's how I believed in that philosophy. And the philosophy actually has helped me to, to know that in life, every day is a challenge.
25:18 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
25:19 Speaker 02 Every day is a challenge, you know. You were in a, in a loop actually with, with somebody on twenty sixth, at ten in the morning. And I told that person that, you know, you see now the organizers, the organizer of the Berlin is thinking of next year.
25:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
25:38 Speaker 02 So Berlin Marathon twenty twenty two is already out.
25:41 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. It's really inspiring. Is that, is that an approach you've always had to life? Even as a child? Or is it something you've learnt through your career?
25:50 Speaker 02 It's something I learned through my career. I have grown enough in the career. Close to twenty years in, in running. And I know a lot, I know what, what could actually knock you out and what can actually uplift you, what can make you actually to be a real person.
26:07 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. When you're about to embark on something like last Sunday, the Berlin Marathon.
26:15 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you know beforehand that I'm going to try and break a world record today? Is that already in your mind? Or I guess there must be things you trained for four or five months, but you can't control the weather, for example. You know, many of us who run at weekends, let's say, some days we're not feeling it, you know, our legs don't feel as though they've got the the energy or we don't have the mindsets. So I'm really interested for you, when you have done so much training to build up for one race while the world is watching. Do you have a strategy in your head that today I'm going for the world record?
26:54 Speaker 02 I will start by saying that I don't actually, I'm not a believer of success. For the first thing, I don't believe in success, but I believe in good preparation and planning which can bring success. That means within actually the five months, if I don't work hard, I will not be successful. But if I got well planned, well prepared, then I'm sure of success. What I'm trying to say is this. For four months, I am really training. Eating the targets for over eighty percent is that then I feel I'm really comfortable in my my body. My legs are good.
27:39 Speaker 02 Then actually, one day to go, then I I start to audit what I've been doing. If what I've been doing actually is went well, as I expected, then the next day I'm ready for the next day. Anything might happen. If the rain comes in, if it's too hot or if the weather is okay, then I will handle it. But I will accept the results, you know. They say actually, if you don't accept the results, then if you want to enjoy the sport, you need to accept the outcome. Behave any outcome, I will not regret.
28:20 Rangan Chatterjee? Acceptance seems to be a really key part of your approach to life. You mentioned, of course, already that the Berlin Marathon is gone. That's the branch. You've got the branch now. You accept it and move on irrespective of what had happened. You also mentioned that.
28:37 Rangan Chatterjee? You don't believe in success. That's really interesting to me. Does that mean? Is it you don't believe in success or certainly when I hear you say that and describe it? Is it that the success is the four months of training? That's the success?
28:54 Speaker 02 Let me explain that when I say I don't believe in success. Success is there. But you cannot sit and wait for success. Yeah. Success is waiting for you to actually say, hey, just grab me.
29:14 Speaker 02 But rule number one, you should be prepared. Rule number two, we should be well planned.
29:22 Speaker 02 Rule number three, you should be actually capable of grabbing the success. That's what success is saying.
29:29 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
29:30 Speaker 02 Success is there, I don't deny. But I believe in preparation, in pure and good preparation, in pure and clean planning can lead to success.
29:43 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
29:44 Speaker 02 I don't think that you can actually believe that I will be successful in a marathon.
29:50 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
29:51 Speaker 02 And you don't follow actually the program totally. You know, the moment you don't, you skip one, you will actually count on the very day.
30:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
30:04 Speaker 02 Yes.
30:06 Rangan Chatterjee? It's so fascinating.
30:10 Rangan Chatterjee? What I'm hearing from you is that, yes, you happen to be a marathon runner, but you're saying that actually this approach kind of applies to all of us.
30:22 Speaker 02 Um, yes, you know.
30:27 Speaker 02 Success is, you can define success in different definitions.
30:32 Speaker 02 Ten or twenty or anything you have.
30:36 Speaker 02 But at the core of everything, you know, I'll give you an example that you are in class and you you are last year's exam.
30:45 Speaker 02 In December, and you have three months to study.
30:50 Speaker 02 If you don't start hard, if you don't actually go into a group discussions to share what you know and somebody else can give you what you or he knows, I don't think you will actually be get the first class honors. You know, success, you can be successful in running, but you can run too thin. And it's that success, that success according to you. Yeah, you can be successful in life and you run two five. You can be successful in life and run two one. That's difference of success. You can be successful in education and you have a pass. Yeah. You can call yourself you are successful, you have credit. You can call yourself you are successful and you have distinction.
31:34 Speaker 02 So it, what's success really?
31:39 Speaker 02 I think success, what I'm trying to say is the mastery of what you are doing. If you have mastered what you are doing, then that's, that's success.
31:49 Speaker 02 But you need to do it. You need to have the right systems for success to come in. The real right systems, the moment you lack systems, the moment you have, you lack the positive systems within here. Yeah. You, you, you will really look for it, but you will not get it. So it's good that in life, you need to weigh yourself and, and, and declare that, hey, I belong here. Even as sportsman, you, you, you, you really need to actually stand and say, no, I need to be successful. Yeah. I belong here. It doesn't mean that people can see you are successful, you are not. People can really still doubt. Please, it's good to actually tell yourself, I need to be successful. Yeah.
32:33 Speaker 02 But I need to wake up, I need to be actually doing what's right at the right time, at the right place.
32:41 Rangan Chatterjee? We all need our own individual definition of success, don't we?
32:44 Speaker 02 Absolutely. If you want to be successful, define in your own words.
32:49 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
32:50 Speaker 02 Yeah. In your own words, the way you understand, your own language, define success in your own language.
32:56 Rangan Chatterjee? Because someone who's never run before, if they were to complete a 5K, if they were to build up to running five kilometres,
33:05 Rangan Chatterjee? that could be success for them.
33:06 Speaker 02 Absolutely, yes.
33:09 Rangan Chatterjee? It depends on your...
33:09 Speaker 02 They are building up and they have actually completed 5K.
33:12 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
33:13 Speaker 02 In the next three months, they are completing 10K. That's success.
33:18 Speaker 02 But you cannot actually wake up today and actually complete that 20 kilometres.
33:25 Rangan Chatterjee? Last Sunday, I was glued to the race. And actually, I want to share with you, there are three moments in my life where I have witnessed a great sporting occasion with my two children. And two of them actually involved you. One of them was when Tiger Woods won the Masters in 2015. But the other two were last weekend when you broke the world record and also when you went under two hours in 1:59. I was sitting with my two children around the computer watching. It was really special moments. Now, at halfway, when we saw the splits of,
34:06 Rangan Chatterjee? of course, you all know 59 something at halfway. I was feeling nervous, which is ridiculous because I'm not running, you're running, and you look really relaxed. But I'm thinking, oh, man, is he gonna break two hours today? Has he gone off too fast? How aware of the time are you in that moment? What was going through your head?
34:30 Speaker 02 Oh, you know what happened is that I was feeling well. My legs were actually on the right shape and...
34:41 Speaker 02 We crossed the halfway, we crossed the twenty K and realized, hey, ten fifty six is so fast. Then I tried to calculate to give another two minutes and fifty seconds. I saw it will be actually under sixty. But all in all is that that was a big motivation for me, that if I am crossing actually under sixty with a half, then I will not miss a world record. So I was keeping myself a morale that please, let me push. If I run, two hours flat, well done good. If I missed and run a world record, that's what I need. So it was a blast on my side.
35:20 Rangan Chatterjee? It was a blast.
35:21 Speaker 02 A blast on my mind, yeah.
35:22 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you feel any pressure because of who you are, because of the amount of people who look up to you and watch you? You know, are you aware of that pressure from the outside or is it just another race for you?
35:37 Speaker 02 It was a huge pressure. Actually, it's a pressure from all sides, you know.
35:42 Speaker 02 On Friday, actually, I just jumped in to press conference for whom and all the channels were asking me, are you going for world record? And I told them, no, who told you I'm going for world record? I'm coming here to run a good race and if that race can be translated to be a course record or if you can call it a world record, I will appreciate. That's what I told them.
36:06 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
36:07 Speaker 02 But there was a lot of pressure from the channels, everybody was expecting that you can run. Then I told them, no, I'm coming for a good race.
36:14 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. It's that approach, isn't it, that you keep talking about? It's process over outcome, it's the journey over the destination. That's what I'm hearing as I hear you speak.
36:23 Speaker 02 Yes, yes, you know, you cannot actually say, you know, human being is not machine. You cannot, it's, you cannot set yourself for a certain time and run that time, no. You never know what will happen.
36:40 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
36:40 Speaker 02 Yeah, on the way, marathon is life and all challenges are on the way. But I always put my mind that I need to run well. I need to run certain time, try to push myself according to what I've been doing in training. Thinking, you know, before you do something, you need to internalize first.
36:58 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
36:59 Speaker 02 You need to internalize, you need to really put in your heart and in your mind. You need even to think and imagine crossing a finishing line with a world record. Then you will cut it. You cannot work and just rush. The moment you cut it, then you say thank you and you move on.
37:28 Rangan Chatterjee? Last Sunday after the race, I went to the kitchen with my kids. We were having a late breakfast because we missed breakfast to watch you break the world record. And my 12-year-old son had a question for me, which, if you don't mind, I was going to put to you.
37:41 Speaker 02 Yes.
37:43 Rangan Chatterjee? He said, Daddy, Elliot was celebrating just before he got through the line. If he hadn't celebrated, do you think he would have gone one or two seconds even quicker than what he did do? So this is a child's question, and I watched the video again on YouTube this morning. And it certainly appeared that, obviously, you knew you'd broken the world records. There was a smile, there was some sort of hand celebrations. And it did appear to me that your pace slightly slowed at the end. So the question for my son is, could you have gone one or two seconds faster had you not celebrated?
38:23 Speaker 02 It's a very good question.
38:27 Speaker 02 I want to answer and to answer that.
38:31 Speaker 02 I already saw that I'm inside the world record. So I didn't mind actually celebrating, provided I need something called a world record.
38:41 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
38:42 Speaker 02 So I was sure of a world record and decided to celebrate and got it.
38:48 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
38:48 Speaker 02 Yeah.
38:49 Rangan Chatterjee? Well, huge, huge congratulations.
38:51 Speaker 02 Thank you.
38:52 Rangan Chatterjee? You know, I know you want to inspire people to run. I've heard you say that in many interviews and many conversations.
39:00 Rangan Chatterjee? And I've been thinking about inspiration recently. What is it about people like you that inspire so many of us around the world? Because, you know, I'm a doctor, okay? So I may dream about being an elite marathon runner, but I'm not an elite marathon runner.
39:18 Rangan Chatterjee? But I remember after that race, I felt inspired. Um, I went into the garden and I did some sprints. I got my skipping rope out and did some skipping. There was something about watching you, a fellow member of the human race, achieve something so special that really inspired me, within my life, to do a bit more. Why do you think that is?
39:45 Speaker 02 Um, inspiration actually is that I always say that life is about movement. Uh, and I want to inspire people to move. All the professions actually, whether you are engineer, a doctor, whether you are a teacher, whether you are a manager, all sorts of professions in this world. For them to survive, for them to live longer, is the spirit of movement. What I'm trying to say is this, if you move, that's how to earn a good life. If you move, that's how to live longer.
40:29 Speaker 02 But the only movement which is available is the less expensive movement, which is running. If you run, then, you know, I'm trying to, to, to tell people that you can't run actually to be a good old man. But I need you to run to actually to be fit and to live longer.
40:54 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
40:55 Speaker 02 That's my inspiration. That's why I always say I want to push, uh, uh, running to be a family lifestyle. The moment all the families actually crap running and not really put in, in their family and call it a family lifestyle, that will be great. However, in the morning, you can see the kids and the parents just putting on shoes and just walk around, just, just move.
41:22 Rangan Chatterjee? Yes.
41:22 Speaker 02 It's about movement, just move. The world will be full of luck.
41:27 Rangan Chatterjee? Are you familiar with Park Run? It's a big global movement. Um, it's, it started in the UK and, and many, many towns and villages around the UK and now in the world. There's a 5K every Saturday morning. And people of all abilities come, children, adults, they all get a time. But you know, the fastest will be running in fifteen, sixteen minutes. The slowest will maybe be an hour. But it's a big community spirit and people run together. And you know, what you just said about running as a family.
42:03 Rangan Chatterjee? I'm pretty sure if Park Run did not exist, I'm not sure my kids would be runners. Like, my son loves running.
42:13 Rangan Chatterjee? But I think he loves running because of Park Run. So the way we start every weekend is me and my son, we go down to the local 5K. Rain or shine, you know, windy, cold, hot, doesn't matter. We turn up and we do a 5K. And so for me, it's how we spend our family weekends together, which I think speaks to what you're talking about.
42:36 Speaker 02 Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. And if all of us, if the spirit, what you are doing in UK can go to every country
42:47 Speaker 02 in this world, then actually we'll be fine. The two years, actually, the world will change. Yeah.
42:54 Rangan Chatterjee? Why did you start running?
42:56 Speaker 02 Oh, I started running. My neighbor was running, I wanted to run like him, which is my coach now. And the aim was of running actually and training hard was just to feel our life will be up the skies by actually getting a ticket and then fly.
43:15 Speaker 02 Yes, but at long last, I traveled to Europe, ran, I realized that so sport can give me life. Sport actually can keep food to my table, to my siblings and my parents and the rest. So I started to focus in a professional way.
43:34 Rangan Chatterjee? And did you know from the start that, hey, I'm pretty quick here, I can beat people around me? Or did that come later?
43:41 Speaker 02 No, that one came later, no, not really. I just training and wanted to just perform, go to compete and and actually compete with other people. Get a position and come back home.
43:58 Rangan Chatterjee? As I talk to you, Elliot, I think back to a conversation I had a few years ago on this show with Kylian Journe, the, you know, regarded by many as the greatest mountain runner of all time. You, of course, are regarded as the greatest marathon runner of all time. And what really strikes me from chatting to both of you is there's a real modesty, a real humility. And I'm really interested, why do you think that might be? And do you think there's something unique to running that kind of gives off that flavour in the people at the top of the sport?
44:39 Speaker 02 I think it's about understanding life and understanding what you are doing. That always, when you are at the top of something and you have an ego, that's a sign of actually failure. And at the end of it, actually, when you are at home and you realise that your ego is up, then it doesn't feel like you are human. So it's the way you think that you treat a little world is full of a human family and an ego will go away. And
45:16 Speaker 02 I trust that the moment you chase away ego, that's the best place to really get into the course, the best place to think, the best place actually to think with other people and respect other people, the best place actually to get your trainings in a good way.
45:36 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. Do you think there's something about running or running long distances that it kind of burns the ego out of you?
45:45 Speaker 02 I trust the long runs. When you are running for long, training for long, helps you to actually to know how to handle suffering. And if you know how to handle suffering and pain, that's what long runs is helping, is helping me or helping any other person. But all in all, I think it's the only way to calm your mind, that, hey, what do you want again? And if something happens, then it does happen and we need to move on, you know.
46:20 Speaker 02 I don't know, I can't explain because I don't understand more as far as ego is concerned. But uh uh I believe actually, at the end of the day, you know, before you go to bed, I think everybody actually is reflecting what has happened for the whole day.
46:38 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
46:38 Speaker 02 That you actually uh affect the world in a positive way or in a negative way for the whole day. You actually, what did you do? Do you do anything negative or positive? That's what people actually should be asking themselves at the end of the day before you go to bed.
46:56 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
46:56 Speaker 02 And if you happen to actually have those thoughts,
47:02 Speaker 02 then actually you'll realize that there is no need of actually having an ego.
47:08 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
47:08 Speaker 02 Yeah, this life is actually good when you are on the crown.
47:13 Rangan Chatterjee? You come across incredibly calm and zen in your manner. And you mentioned there that running and particularly long runs is a good way to calm the mind. So I guess for me, I'm thinking, were you always calm and zen and relaxed? Or do you think it's the fact that you run so much that has made you calm and relaxed?
47:40 Speaker 02 Uh, I think that's in my personality, but running has helped me to to be more calm.
47:47 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. You mentioned reflection and how important it is maybe every evening to think, you know, what have you done in the day? Have you contributed to other people? You know, have you behaved in a way that uh in a manner that you wanted to behave in? And I know that you are a very keen journal, you have a journal.
48:08 Speaker 02 Yes.
48:09 Rangan Chatterjee? And in one interview, you've mentioned that your pen and your journal are two of the most important things that you possess.
48:17 Rangan Chatterjee? I wonder if you could speak to journaling. Why is it so important to you? And why do you still do it by hand in an age where we have computers and technology?
48:28 Speaker 02 I have a lot of channels. I have a channel which for training every day. I have a channel for for the shoes that I'm using every day.
48:39 Speaker 02 I have a channel that when I'm reading a book, I just say I like the best points. I need to put down on a on a notebook.
48:49 Speaker 02 I have a notebook whereby it's a what to do in that day that I write all of them down. And I'm actually focused on the day to day, my daily programs that I need to do to rush up and down when I'm at home. So believing actually on the hand or writing actually is that I believe that they say, write it and you'll remember. Yeah. So the moment the moment you write it, you will remember. So that's why I'm still carrying around a channel. The channel I have ninety now at home. If you happen to come to Kenya and visit me, I will show you what I was doing two thousand and three thousand.
49:29 Rangan Chatterjee? Well, I would love to.
49:32 Rangan Chatterjee? So that's every year. You write down all of your running.
49:37 Speaker 02 Absolutely.
49:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Every single run.
49:38 Speaker 02 Every single run.
49:39 Rangan Chatterjee? And what are you documenting? Like, what are you writing down? Like, what distance, pace?
49:44 Speaker 02 I'm writing the the time I cover and the distance. Everything I'm doing, if the ice pack, massage, everything I'm putting there.
49:55 Rangan Chatterjee? So it helps you remember. Does it help you also when you're reviewing it, kind of see patterns? Oh, when I do this, this happens. Or when I do this, I'm running quickly, that sort of thing?
50:08 Speaker 02 The good thing is that, you know, if you are writing everything every day,
50:15 Speaker 02 it helps you not to miss the training. Because the moment you miss training for two days, you will just put, when you refer to your channel, you see, oh, I missed the training last week three times. I missed the training this week two times with no reason at all. So it's good actually that I really need my my book to get to get filled. That's why I don't miss training.
50:40 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you do it when you wake up? Do you do it after the run? Do you do it in the evening? Or does it just depend day to day?
50:49 Speaker 02 When I wake up, I don't handle anything. I just wake up, get my clothes put on. When I wake up, I don't see, I don't have, I don't handle my, my, my phone. I'm waking up, prepare for a run. After the run, I go back for breakfast. Coming back to relax, then I start now to, if I, my training was twenty kilometers, then I write actually the time I cover and the kilometers. And I close the channel and start to check the phone if there is some texts or to refer or emails or anything else. But totally, I treat myself first for other things.
51:31 Rangan Chatterjee? So you wake up, you get yourself ready for a run. You're not looking at your phone, you do your run. It's only after that important thing is done for you that you then get into what the rest of the world wants you to do?
51:45 Speaker 02 Absolutely. Yeah, I always tell people that even in the camp that during breakfast, actually, don't bring my phone. Even we sit alone in our camp whereby mobile phones are not allowed in the kitchen or the dining, where we are eating. To make people actually eat well and concentrate. Reason number one is that it's to avoid this people actually to cut their phones immediately after training. So you need to cut one hour of taking shower, taking breakfast, taking care of yourself before to respond to the, to the whole world.
52:25 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
52:25 Speaker 02 Most of them actually were saying that, hey, you know, emergency might be in. Then I ask them, we are out of, out of our rooms for one hour thirty minutes. If any emergency happens within one hour thirty minutes, we lose all of it. They say, no, then there is no need for actually rushing to the phone.
52:47 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
52:48 Speaker 02 Yeah. And what has happened after has happened. You can actually bring it back.
52:54 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, I love that.
52:57 Rangan Chatterjee? So what kind of time do you normally wake up? And then, you know, I'm interested in that sort of routine. You wake up, is that with an alarm? Is it without an alarm? And then how long does it take you to warm up before you're out for your run? Usually.
53:12 Speaker 02 My alarm is actually on at five, five forty-five. That's quarter to six. Wake up, do the necessary change and put on. Then about six, then I'm on the road with the whole team and start training.
53:30 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you always run in groups?
53:32 Speaker 02 Yes.
53:32 Rangan Chatterjee? When you're training?
53:33 Speaker 02 We always run in pickles.
53:39 Rangan Chatterjee? But how does that go? Because if you're one of the fastest human beings on the planet, which I think you are, and most of us think you are, how does it work then when you're running in groups? Because presumably at some point, depending on what kind of run you're doing, presumably you're the fastest. So help me understand, how are you running groups?
54:05 Speaker 02 Oh, you know, training actually is not about competing. Your training, we are not competing. So, if you're honest, we normally run, well, I'm even five meters actually at the back. And but totally always that my life, I need to be with people and run with the young people to actually motivate them. When I'm there, actually, everybody is alive, life, there is life when I'm there. When I miss training in the morning or when I'm doing something else, then everybody, I will receive hundred calls after one and a half hours, where are you? So it's, it's about training, it's not about competition. But you can train actually for four months in a good way with everybody.
54:50 Speaker 02 But I think the mind, people should learn or actually practice or practice their minds to handle pressure and have, clearly have hard work and believe in pushing the limits. The moment they believe in pushing the limits and handle the pressure, they will run very fast, you know? It's about what you think that can carry your day.
55:18 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
55:32 Rangan Chatterjee? In the West, certainly here in the UK, and I think also in America, the relationship a lot of people have with running, or I guess movement in general, is to help them, you know, deal with the stresses of their day. These days in the UK, people will talk about running for their mental wellbeing. My taxi driver, a chap called Daniel, in the north-west of England, he told me a few months ago that he runs 10K every day, seven days a week. And he says if he doesn't run those 10K, he doesn't feel good. He doesn't feel he's settled. A lot of us also do this by ourselves, right?
56:16 Rangan Chatterjee? You know, culture in the West has become quite isolated. People often don't live near their families, near their friends. They're living, maybe they've moved to a different city for work, and they often work by themselves, and then they go running by themselves, and they struggle to motivate themselves to keep going. But what I'm hearing from you is that you're running groups. And of course, that makes sense. Like, if you're not going to show up, you're letting people down. They're going to say, "Hey, Elliot, where are you? You know, why are you not running today? What's going on?" And it makes me, it really fits into what I think, where I think we're really going wrong in the West. We're becoming more isolated. We're doing more and more things by ourself.
57:00 Rangan Chatterjee? And I think that's why that group park run every Saturday is proving so successful for so many people across the UK and around the world, is because people are running in groups, which helps motivate you. Have you noticed this? When you go around the world, you're speaking to people, have you noticed that culturally, the relationship to running we may have, let's say, in the UK or in America, is different from the relationship people have with running in, let's say, Kenya? Absolutely, yes.
57:33 Speaker 02 In America and Europe, most people are running by themselves. But my encouragement is that, that's why I always say I want to make running a family event. Is that if you want to enjoy more running, you run, get a group. Get two, three, four, five people, actually. Assemble yourselves, actually, in a point. If it's every day, then that's well done, good.
58:04 Speaker 02 And just run, you'll enjoy. You'll just talk as you are going. Ideas are coming in and you put on paper, ten o bit. And then, you know, it's good, you know, sometimes when you are alone, you think you are running and you are not running. Your mind is in another place, you know. Running is not about legs. Running is about, actually, the mind. Your legs might be on the park, but your mind might be, actually, on the plane.
58:31 Speaker 02 So you need, you need a group, so that it can, actually, protect your thoughts from, actually, exploding, going away and bring back to where you are running. So group running, actually, is crucial to keep you on the course, make you enjoy running and you cannot, actually, get tired, you know. The moment you are alone, you start to think a lot, then you cannot finish 10 kilometers if you are, actually, aiming it.
58:56 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
58:56 Speaker 02 Yeah.
59:00 Rangan Chatterjee? Many of us struggle with motivation.
59:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you ever wake up in the morning and you know you're due to have a run? And do you ever think, like many of us, oh, I can't be bothered today. It's not, I'm not feeling it today, I want to stay in bed. You know, help us understand, are you, are you as human as the rest of us? Or do you wake up, yeah, it's time to run?
59:24 Speaker 02 Oh, actually, there's some days where I don't feel like running.
59:29 Rangan Chatterjee? Really?
59:30 Speaker 02 Absolutely, yes. But just lie in the bed and I ask myself, if I don't run, what will happen? And you know, if you don't run in the morning, you'll lie to yourself that at 10 o'clock, I will go for a run. At 10 o'clock, you'll say, no. 4 o'clock, I'll go for a run. Then the day, actually, will be off. So I'll ask myself, what will happen? Then I wake up, get my shoes, get my clothes. In ten minutes' time jogging then my foot will come up again.
1:00:01 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:00:02 Speaker 02 Training and I'll be in life, I will come to life again.
1:00:08 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, no, I love that. Do you tend to run every day usually?
1:00:11 Speaker 02 Yes, I run every day.
1:00:12 Rangan Chatterjee? Every day?
1:00:12 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:00:13 Rangan Chatterjee? Even like, I don't know, like, I know you're in recovery now because you, obviously you ran last weekend. Are you still running every day?
1:00:20 Speaker 02 I know, so I'll start next week to run again, yes.
1:00:24 Rangan Chatterjee? And for many of us, when we do a marathon, the next day can be quite painful in terms of going up and down stairs. We can really, really feel it.
1:00:34 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:00:35 Rangan Chatterjee? Is it the same for you or can you walk effortlessly the day after?
1:00:38 Speaker 02 No, it's the same for me.
1:00:39 Rangan Chatterjee? Same for you?
1:00:40 Speaker 02 Going the stairs actually, you know, where and there has been there has been actually as a car in your muscles and you know, all that thing back from the road is, is hard.
1:00:55 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. So you have the marathon hobble like, like the rest of us. Okay.
1:01:02 Rangan Chatterjee? Hearing what you're saying about groups and running together, I, I'm drawn back to last Sunday's race again where
1:01:09 Rangan Chatterjee? I don't know, obviously you had, you had the pacers. There was a fellow competitor who was with you for quite a long time. I don't know if you were aware of that. If you're thinking, wow, people are still with me. I, I don't know what goes in your head at that time. I'm very interested. But then there comes a moment where you no longer have your pacers, you no longer have competitors to help push you.
1:01:36 Rangan Chatterjee? What goes on in your mind there? Because then it's down to self motivation at that point. You don't have, many of us know that actually we can run faster if there's people around us. If we're trying to beat someone or we're trying to keep up with someone. But in many of the races I've seen you do, you're out in front by yourself. Is it hard to keep that motivation going for you when it's just you?
1:02:02 Speaker 02 Oh, let me start with when people are around me. Yeah. Firstly, I always say I will run my own race. If anybody actually wants to run my race, then he's welcome.
1:02:20 Speaker 02 I will not actually deny you are welcome to run my race. So if you want to run your own, that's okay, but I'll run my race. That's why I don't see, I don't actually uh uh turn myself and look back.
1:02:34 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:02:35 Speaker 02 Who is there, because I am running my own race.
1:02:39 Speaker 02 Uh if actually uh the distance actually is going up and the speed is going up and the and the muscle starts to to to to actually uh soar and nobody's there. Then I'm motivating myself, I'll I'm still pushing, I'll push by my own. No, because I trust in my trainings, I trust in what I've been doing. So I know what I've been doing will just take me to the finishing line. So I so I I I'm not actually scared of of maybe losing some minutes because I'm alone or or or or here and there, no.
1:03:17 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:03:19 Rangan Chatterjee? You say you're pushing.
1:03:23 Rangan Chatterjee? One of the most striking things to me, Elliot, when I watch you run
1:03:28 Rangan Chatterjee? is how relaxed you look. There's an elegance, you look majestic, your posture is fabulous. In fact, I find it very hard to tell the difference between you at mile one and at mile twenty six. To me, maybe I I've got an untrained eye, but it looks remarkably similar. Whereas if you go to a local race here, uh towards the end, you will see all kinds of postures and people somehow trying to struggle to get through.
1:04:03 Rangan Chatterjee? So you're saying that you're struggling and you're pushing. Of course, why would you not in order to break a world record? Yet, at the same time, you look super relaxed. Can you help us understand that?
1:04:17 Speaker 02 Oh. Looking super relaxed is uh that's a good for is good for me. And uh and that and it's that uh I have actually trained well and trained my body actually to.
1:04:33 Speaker 02 Run in a super relaxed way, but in high pace.
1:04:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Hmm.
1:04:38 Speaker 02 So when I am in the race, I'm just maintaining it. But you know, to maintain that speed is what I, it's what actually is really hard to maintain. But it's good to maintain in a good posture without actually struggling so much.
1:04:54 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:04:58 Rangan Chatterjee? I've spoken to many people on this show before about nasal breathing, about some of the benefits that we have when we breathe through our nose instead of through our mouth. And I can't tell when I watch you, you, you, you look so relaxed, certainly for the first half of that marathon last Sunday, when I was watching you, I thought, is Elliot just breathing through his nose or is his mouth open? Um, do you, do you think about this? Is this something you're, you're aware of?
1:05:25 Speaker 02 Yes, but I breathe through my mouth.
1:05:27 Rangan Chatterjee? You breathe through your mouth?
1:05:28 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:05:29 Rangan Chatterjee? From the start to the finish?
1:05:31 Speaker 02 The more the speed, the more the more it's, you cannot breathe in your nose with it.
1:05:36 Rangan Chatterjee? At the speed you're going?
1:05:37 Speaker 02 No.
1:05:38 Rangan Chatterjee? No, I can, I can believe that. I can believe that. But thank you for, thank you for clarifying that. Um, yeah.
1:05:46 Rangan Chatterjee? And what about your smile, what I call the Kipchoge smile? We hear that you smile when you're in pain. Is that true? Or, you know, maybe, maybe explain to us, you, you know, you seem, for someone who is running such long distances at such, frankly, a pace that we can't fathom. You know, I know you were at the, the running show yesterday, so I'm guessing you saw people trying to run your pace.
1:06:12 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:06:13 Rangan Chatterjee? And I'm guessing nobody look, like, first of all, what is it like for you when you watch amateur runners trying to run at your pace?
1:06:22 Speaker 02 Uh, I feel tense.
1:06:25 Rangan Chatterjee? You feel tense?
1:06:25 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:06:26 Rangan Chatterjee? Why?
1:06:27 Speaker 02 No, you know, it's, uh, even seeing yourself running on TV, you just feel.
1:06:35 Speaker 02 But uh. Do you worry they're gonna injure themselves on the treadmill and fall off? Yeah, I saw last year somebody who fall, uh, fall, but I think he was not injured, so.
1:06:45 Speaker 02 Yeah, but uh, I call it a smile is to enjoy, you know? If you feel that pain,
1:06:54 Speaker 02 please give that pain. If you feel the pain, then feel it. The more you actually move with the pain, that's where success is.
1:07:04 Speaker 02 Yeah. Everybody, if you are ten and you feel the real pain, then everybody is feeling the pain. And few of them who actually know how to handle pain will be successful and will move on to another level. So how do we learn how to handle pain? Uh, you should understand that uh, pain is part of success. Just to combat pain in the positive thing. Yeah. That uh, uh, uh, success is not coming on a silver platter. You need to work for it. The moment you are working for it, that's how you undergo pain. Yeah. Yeah. Pain in your body and pain in your mind thinking, you know?
1:07:45 Speaker 02 But I tell you, if you'll enjoy, immediately you cross the line, immediately the pain is no longer there. Yeah. So you think pain is a good thing? Absolutely, yes. It's a good thing. Pain is a good thing. It's actually guides you to to know that you need to work hard. It's guiding you to respect that success that you have earned. Yeah. Yes.
1:08:08 Speaker 02 If all people, all successful people actually did not undergo pain, then you can see other things in this world. But because pain is guiding them that if I play, uh, I am successful, but if I don't do the right thing, actually, I, I will not have success again. Yeah, it's fascinating hearing that, Elliot, because I'm, I keep thinking about what you said earlier, that's.
1:08:33 Rangan Chatterjee? Planning, it's about preparation. That's almost where the success lies, not in the actual outcome of the race. You know, you didn't quite say that, but that's certainly what I'm.
1:08:44 Speaker 02 That's what I mean.
1:08:45 Rangan Chatterjee? That's, yes, that's what I'm taking. I found that a really powerful idea. And you say on the day then, no matter what's happening, the crowds, the weather, things you can't control, well, you can trust yourself because you know you've done the training.
1:09:02 Speaker 02 Absolutely.
1:09:03 Rangan Chatterjee? Now, that's really powerful. If we apply that to pain, I'm asking you, how can we, each of us learn to handle pain better? But I keep thinking about what you said, well, if you've never practised being in pain, how would you know ever how to handle it? So it sounds as though you have trust in your body because you know you've done the work, you've experienced pain, you've got through pain, you've overcome adversity. So you know on the next day or the next day, you've got that experience in your body, I know I can do this. And it sounds like that's a key thing for you, the trust that you have because you've done the hard work.
1:09:47 Speaker 02 The harder the work you are doing, the more the pain. But that one doesn't prevent you from actually, the big day that, let us say I've trained for four months in a good way, there is pain, but you enjoy the pain. In that very day that you are running a marathon, pain should be there. On training is not the last days, you will experience pain here. But what I'm trying to say is that the moment you actually encounter that pain, please persevere with the land of fear, because that's where success is.
1:10:28 Speaker 02 The moment you don't feel pain, then you are not approaching success. The moment you really feel that place I need to just quit, that's where success is. Don't quit, still keep on. I always tell people, press on, press on and press on. The minute you press on, you press on, you press on, you will get to where you are going.
1:10:52 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:10:55 Rangan Chatterjee? Many people feel nervous the day before, let's say, a marathon or a big work presentation or something big in their lives. They feel a little bit nervous and anxious and they don't sleep very well. So it's pretty well known, many amateur marathon runners, I did my very first marathon last year at the London Marathon, which didn't go particularly well, but I did finish, I did complete it and I'm planning to do it in April. Do you ever find yourself the night before a race, lying in bed thinking, man, I need to sleep, I can't sleep, I've got a big race tomorrow? Has that ever happened or have you trained yourself to sleep well the night before a big race?
1:11:39 Speaker 02 Uh, not really, I'm like other people. Sleep for two hours, wake up, see, oh, it's no longer, another two hours. So it's, it's common, it's a good thing and, and it's good for, it shows that you are prepared to, to, to enjoy your work tomorrow.
1:11:54 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. I know you wear an Oura ring to track your sleep.
1:11:59 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:12:00 Rangan Chatterjee? Um, and I'm really interested in technology and how it can help us with our health. I think sometimes we can overuse it potentially. Um, you obviously are an elite athlete, so knowing, you know, how you're running, how you're sleeping, these things are really, really important for you to do your job. Is it demoralising for you the night before a race? I don't know what happened the night before Berlin, for example, if you have a bad night's sleep and you look at your Oura ring in the morning and you see a really bad readiness score or, has that ever happened and does that demoralise you or have you learnt not to take too much notice?
1:12:38 Speaker 02 Uh, the next day I turn actually, click to the app and...
1:12:43 Rangan Chatterjee? You won't look?
1:12:44 Speaker 02 I won't look.
1:12:45 Rangan Chatterjee? Oh, so if you've had a bad night, you won't look?
1:12:47 Speaker 02 I, I don't look.
1:12:48 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:12:49 Speaker 02 Yes. But I know, I've been running many marathons and it's, it's epic for one day to go to really sleep.
1:12:58 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:12:59 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:13:00 Rangan Chatterjee? I'm always fascinated by talking to people like you who are at the top of their game. And, um...
1:13:10 Rangan Chatterjee? Like I think of other people at the top of their sports, people who are regarded as the greatest and you know in golf, for example, Tiger Woods is regarded as by many people as the greatest or certainly one of the greatest golfers of all time. Now, I've heard Tiger Woods say in interviews that when he is playing his best,
1:13:31 Rangan Chatterjee? he's so focused on what he's doing with the ball and where the hole is that he doesn't hear or see the crowds.
1:13:40 Rangan Chatterjee? I've heard you say earlier that actually you do hear the crowds, you enjoy hearing what they have to say. So I'm interested, you know, as I share that sort of insight from Tiger, do you ever get like that where you're not hearing them and you're really focused or does it just depend on what stage of a race you're in?
1:13:58 Speaker 02 Starting from the beginning, I can hear what the crowd are saying on the way. People are singing and I'm not looking up at them, but I'm focusing on the road. But I hear that people are cheering on the way and I have no problem, that's good, cheering is good.
1:14:18 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. So you hear it and you use...
1:14:21 Speaker 02 But I block my mind from thinking outside and bring the mind to the every mile splits, every kilometer splits and focus on the project at time.
1:14:36 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah. You're obviously very well known around the world.
1:14:42 Rangan Chatterjee? Many people with profiles like yours will face, you know, maybe 95% positive comments online, but maybe 5% negative comments. When those negative comments come, if they do, how do you deal with them?
1:14:58 Speaker 02 Oh, negative comments are there in all the sport, you know.
1:15:05 Speaker 02 The law of nature cannot allow us to to think together. Oh, there is optimists and pessimists in this world. And we need to respect all of them because we are all human beings. So any negative thought actually we respect and and and that's life, you know. Uh, uh, you know, uh, other things actually is that uh, you don't, you you you need to adjust, forget, just see then forget, you know, you don't put in your mind. But the law is there, there is a lot of positive remarks, negative remarks. What can you do?
1:15:43 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:15:44 Speaker 02 Yeah, you cannot prevent them from talking. But you can prevent them from coming inside your life because they are negative.
1:15:53 Rangan Chatterjee? Some top athletes have struggled when they retired. You know, Michael Phelps, another great, you know, all time swimming great. It's been well documented, he has struggled with uh, mental health problems uh, in the past and I watched the documentary he made about Olympians and how many of them have really struggled, you know, that four years is all about that one race. And then the day after there's, oh, what am I getting up for? I've got nothing to um, nothing to train for, nothing to practice for. And I'm really interested. You appear to be, to me at least, in the prime of your career. I hope we we're seeing you running for many, many years to come.
1:16:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Have you thought about retirement? So have you thought about how you're going to feel when you no longer do this as your job?
1:16:45 Speaker 02 Oh, yes, uh, in front of my mind, I know I will retire. But I will retire when the time comes in. Uh, I'll retire running actively. But uh, I'll still go around uh, all the big city marathons, running for charity, to to actually raise funds for my for my foundation to to build libraries and and and actually uh, construct the environment.
1:17:16 Speaker 02 I I I think I'll be more busy when I retire and and and I want to, I'm looking forward for it.
1:17:22 Rangan Chatterjee? So you don't need the running, the world records to make you feel good about yourself?
1:17:27 Speaker 02 And not at all. I I could have retired in twenty nineteen when I break a two hour parry. So it's uh, I will retire when my muscles are no longer consuming the trainings. When my mind is no longer actively consuming uh the training, so.
1:17:47 Speaker 02 Uh, I want to retire in a good way. I don't want to retire because I have made an history. Then why do I retire if I made history? If I've been inspire a billion people by running under two hours. And then the next day a kid, a teenager asks.
1:18:11 Speaker 02 Is that person who inspires still running? No, he retires. Then what what's the meaning of running?
1:18:18 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, yeah.
1:18:21 Speaker 02 The meaning of running is that you inspire many people, you still run and show them. Uh, running is life. Uh, making history and actually removing the the barriers in the minds of people is a great thing. But we need to keep on.
1:18:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, yeah. So you think you'll still be running in your seventies, your eighties or not?
1:18:41 Speaker 02 Absolutely. Yes. You know, uh, seven years ago, I met. An old man in in Athens in Greece. Uh, I was there for. For some uh awards. And the old man actually was uh ninety one, ninety one years. I was a very good old man, ninety one years, still working. And then we were doing, he told me, no, now you are running marathon. And I told him, yes. Uh, he told, he told me that uh he has to be running in his life, all his life. But he will stop running at hundred.
1:19:19 Speaker 02 I trust now he's ninety eight. I've never followed him, I've not got his conduct. But I think he has no two more days, two more years to to run because he's becoming old because of the knees and everything, but still running.
1:19:34 Speaker 02 So if you, if you want to, I asked him, then what's the secret actually? You have a good, you are quite clean with a tie and you don't look like you are ninety one. He told me the secret is running.
1:19:48 Rangan Chatterjee? Wow.
1:19:49 Speaker 02 Yeah.
1:19:51 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, I guess if you were to stop running after, let's say, another Olympic gold or a, or another, another world record, then I guess in some ways it's not consistent with your philosophy, which is those are just outcomes. There are things that, you know, happen as a side effects of you just concentrating on getting up each day, doing the work, having a plan, you know, preparing, executing on your plan. And I guess whether you're a competitive athlete or whether you're just running for fun to raise money, you still seem to have that real love of running. I mean, do you ever get up, Elliot, and, you know, forget the log, forget what my coach
1:20:32 Rangan Chatterjee? has said, I just wanna run today because I'm free and I just wanna experience what it feels like.
1:20:37 Speaker 02 Absolutely, yes. Our coach actually are leaving us free on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays. It's not that it's in the morning, we are running as a group in a free way.
1:20:50 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:20:50 Speaker 02 Just run and enjoy running for twenty kilometers.
1:20:55 Speaker 02 It's just the way you feel.
1:20:57 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, yeah. How have you managed to stay clear of injuries in a way that, you know, it seems to be quite rare? And, and the context of me asking this is in the UK, and I think in America, there are various statistics going around that, you know, sixty to eighty percent maybe of runners have to stop or give up at some point because of injury. Whereas you appear to be someone who, touch wood, manages to stay relatively clear. Is there anything you can share about that?
1:21:32 Speaker 02 First is that injuries are a part of life in sport.
1:21:37 Rangan Chatterjee? Hmm.
1:21:37 Speaker 02 Injuries are part of actually a, a challenge in sport. But what I'm doing is that.
1:21:46 Speaker 02 When I'm resuming training after a marathon, then I take care of my body with a massage
1:21:53 Speaker 02 and making sure my muscles are good. I will start the first month of actual resuming training by going to gymnasium for the whole month, three, three days a week.
1:22:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Okay.
1:22:05 Speaker 02 Like running on steps, lifting some weights, aerobics for the whole month.
1:22:13 Speaker 02 That whole month actually is really intensive, mixing with some runs and it can, it can actually, it makes my, my muscles actually to, if there is something going on, it can actually keep a sign immediately and I can handle it. And after that one month, I go to another step of actually endurance speed and endurance training to build my muscles. So two months actually of my training is building the muscles and, and, and actually like chasing the injury. And you'll never, if you do that, you'll never get an injury. Or if you get an injury, it will be just a small injury.
1:22:57 Speaker 02 It will bite away because you can't prevent everything. But you have done a lot which, uh, it's eight percent of your, it's about eight percent chance that you cannot get an injury.
1:23:10 Rangan Chatterjee? Would, would you say you're good if, if an injury is starting to come up or you feel a niggel? Are you quite good at saying, hey, look, I'm not gonna do that long run today. I just need to look after this.
1:23:21 Speaker 02 Absolutely. When I get, uh, you need to tell something which is wrong, I, I, I trace it immediately.
1:23:28 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:23:29 Speaker 02 Yeah, it's good to trace as highly as possible.
1:23:32 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah, yeah. Cause I think a lot of people, a lot of my patients that I speak to, their, their work is so pressured. They're so looking forward to their Saturday run that even if they've, they're injured, they run through and they often then get, get injured. And then they're off for two months. They can't do anything. And I feel like I see this a lot with training plans, Elliot. I don't know your view on this.
1:23:57 Rangan Chatterjee? Of course, you are an elite athlete whose job revolves around running.
1:24:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Many people with busy jobs and I'm not saying you don't have a busy job. I mean, let's say a non-elite athlete, let's say a busy parents trying to do their job, look after their children, they're trying to squeeze a run in at the weekends, or they're trying to train for a marathon. And they see a published training plan online. Okay, three runs a week, this one's 12 miles, this one's 14. My feeling as a doctor is that sometimes we don't trust ourselves enough. We see the plan and we think, even though I'm tired or my knee is hurting, I must stick to that plan because that's the published plan.
1:24:45 Rangan Chatterjee? Whereas I kind of feel we should be using plans as guidance, but we also have to trust ourselves and go, it's not the right thing for me today. What's kind of your perspective on that?
1:24:57 Speaker 02 My perspective actually is that you should have a feeling of yourself. Feel for yourself, is it am I good enough to do this established thing? You should have that personal belief, that listen to your body.
1:25:14 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:25:15 Speaker 02 If you listen to your body, actually that's really crucial. So it's good to listen to your body, to what is necessary. It can save you energy, can save you actually not being injured and many things. It's really good to listen to your body.
1:25:32 Rangan Chatterjee? Self-discipline is something that I've heard you speak about before. You said it's very, very important. When you say self-discipline, what exactly do you mean by that?
1:25:45 Speaker 02 That's crucial thing and that's value number one. You know, in our come, I set up, I printed a huge field board.
1:26:01 Speaker 02 When you hand out a kit,
1:26:04 Speaker 02 the second kit you get a huge billboard with sixty values. Sixty? Six zero. Six zero values, wow. Yes. I encourage everybody to get fifteen values. Fifteen? After getting fifteen, they should narrow them to three.
1:26:26 Speaker 02 Those three values, you should live by it, sleep by it, walk by those values, run by those values, relax by those values, go around with your friends, guided by those values. Then we come to self-discipline, which is inside those values. What I mean by self-discipline is, it's that sacrificial of personal passions and pleasures,
1:26:57 Speaker 02 that you sacrifice those passions and pleasures to allow you to do or to work on your career.
1:27:08 Speaker 02 How can you handle self-discipline?
1:27:12 Speaker 02 The rule number one is to get vitamin N.
1:27:18 Speaker 02 Vitamin N? Yes.
1:27:21 Speaker 02 That's the rule number one. You need to inject yourself with vitamin N. N is for? N is to learn to say no.
1:27:31 Speaker 02 That's a vitamin. Yeah. That's how to get self-discipline. Secondly, is setting your priorities right.
1:27:42 Speaker 02 Thirdly, is avoid complaining.
1:27:48 Speaker 02 Those are the three factors which can lead you to self-discipline. I want to tell you that doing all these things is not one night event. It's a process. It's like going to a gymnasium. If you go to gymnasium for nine hours, I go for three months.
1:28:10 Speaker 02 Who is going to get the muscles, good muscles? It's me, because I'm going for three months. If you go for nine hours, it's just nothing. You destroy your body. So it's a process. It's a process. It's a really process.
1:28:23 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:28:23 Speaker 02 That you can actually, in the three month time, you have absorbed the self-discipline. That's why I always tell people, it's not a one night event. To get vitamin and learning to say no in everything is not easy.
1:28:39 Rangan Chatterjee? No.
1:28:40 Speaker 02 Setting your priorities right is not easy.
1:28:44 Speaker 02 Avoid complaining in anything is not easy. But if you combine the three
1:28:49 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:28:49 Speaker 02 things, you can have self-discipline. And without those three, then there is no self-discipline. That's what I mean by actually trying to tell people, self-discipline is the key to any professional sports person or sports woman.
1:29:06 Rangan Chatterjee? And I've heard you say before that
1:29:10 Rangan Chatterjee? the discipline, it doesn't restrict us, it actually gives us more freedom.
1:29:15 Speaker 02 Absolutely, yes. I always say that disciplined ones are free in life.
1:29:21 Speaker 02 The indisciplined ones are not free, they're in prison. Because you are in discipline and whenever you go, you know that I am not supposed to do this and you are doing that. That means you are in prison. In this world, you need to be, we need to be free, walk free, live a honest life. And, and, and, and, and, and, and that's the way to go.
1:29:44 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:29:47 Rangan Chatterjee? You're commonly known for the phrase, no human is limited.
1:29:52 Rangan Chatterjee? When you say no human is limited, what do you mean by that?
1:29:58 Speaker 02 Uh, no human is limited actually cannot, is not applying purely to sportsmen and sportswomen. It's not for running alone. It's for all the professions in this world.
1:30:14 Speaker 02 I want that engineer actually to remove that barrier in his mind. That you or she can think and in a way something which can help the world.
1:30:27 Speaker 02 I want that teacher actually to have the best mind to inject knowledge to the kids.
1:30:34 Speaker 02 I want that psychologist actually to have the best knowledge to actually talk to people and remove what they have as a problem.
1:30:43 Speaker 02 I want that coach actually to have the best skills to instill to his both women and men.
1:30:52 Speaker 02 I want that policeman to really know how to talk to people and to handle peace and security in his or our country. I want that leader to really provide the real skills of leadership. I want those all leaders actually to impress that they are not limited and make sure that the world is in peace and the world is developing towards a positive direction. That's what I mean by no human is limited. It implies to everybody, it's a universal thing which affects every human being in this world. And if everybody actually absorbed and grabbed that phrase, no human is limited.
1:31:34 Speaker 02 You can wake up tomorrow and walk, you can wake up tomorrow and run, you can wake up tomorrow and do anything. I want that student actually to get the first class on us because he or she is not limited. I want that person actually to get that expensive course and work on it and pass it because he's not limited. That's what I mean.
1:31:55 Rangan Chatterjee? How do you instill this sort of philosophy in your own children? Is it hard? Do they see what you do and that inspires them? Or do you also have any sort of specific ways that you talk to your kids about things like this?
1:32:11 Speaker 02 I'm trying actually always to talk with my kids in a free way. To tell them, I always ask them, do you know I am going to come from Monday to Saturday morning?
1:32:26 Speaker 02 They say yes. To do what? To train. After training, you can compete. After competing, you win.
1:32:40 Speaker 02 After winning, then you make us comfortable and pay our school fees. That's what my children are saying. So I told them, you are also not limited. Go to school, work hard, come and play and do anything else and you will be successful. And they're accepting.
1:32:59 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:32:59 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:33:02 Rangan Chatterjee? It's been such an honour, honestly, Elliot, to talk to you. You're someone who has been incredibly inspirational for me in my own life.
1:33:14 Rangan Chatterjee? You know, when I go running and I'm feeling tired, I often think of you. I think, come on, run like Elliot's. You know, that literally happens in my mind. I stand up a bit taller, I think, keep your form, keep your good posture like he does. So I know you know you're inspiring millions of people around the world. You're certainly inspiring this British guy here talking to you right now.
1:33:38 Rangan Chatterjee? Before we finish up, just a couple of things in my mind. Many people these days, when they run, they try and distract themselves from the pain with music or podcasts.
1:33:52 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you have any view on the benefit of running with music and or podcasts?
1:33:57 Speaker 02 During these runs, it's good to listen to music and listen to podcasts.
1:34:02 Rangan Chatterjee? During the easy runs?
1:34:02 Speaker 02 Yes.
1:34:03 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:34:04 Speaker 02 But with the intensive runs, I don't think you will listen because you're just pushing your body. And music and podcasts cannot work. But with the easy runs, when you are relaxing, when you are at the gym, when you are at the bike, after bike, podcasts and music is really good.
1:34:25 Rangan Chatterjee? Fantastic.
1:34:26 Speaker 02 Yeah, because you can actually listen to a podcast for an hour and you forget that you were running for an hour. Hey, so it's one hour.
1:34:35 Rangan Chatterjee? The breaking two hours was of course done in specific conditions. You obviously have shown yourself that you can run a marathon in under two hours, which is still one of the most incredible things I have seen.
1:34:53 Rangan Chatterjee? Do you think within your career it's going to be possible to do that in a competitive marathon?
1:35:00 Speaker 02 Absolutely, it's possible. I have demonstrated that I currently now organized the marathon. Which I personally, I cannot say it was in a specific condition because you know,
1:35:15 Speaker 02 a few people actually are there to try, not even there to try. They are the thing to run under two hours. Phew, I think I am the only one who has been there to think and there to try, yeah. None are there to try, leave alone even, leave alone, no, they have never even there to think, leave alone to try. Just a thinking to run in their minds that can I run two hours? Never. So it's still a hard job for people actually to accept. But all in all is that I know
1:35:58 Speaker 02 running under two hours in a normal marathon like in Atlanta and Bali and Chicago is absolutely possible.
1:36:05 Rangan Chatterjee? And where's that going to come from? Where's that improvement going to come from? Is it training, nutrition, mindset, shoes? I mean, where do you think? Because to me, like my kids, we were talking about this last week. He goes, ah, daddy, just another minute to go. If he can do that. But of course, at that level, 10 seconds is huge. A minute is like another marathon. Like where do you feel that improvement is going to come from?
1:36:39 Speaker 02 The improvement, I believe, will involve many things.
1:36:43 Speaker 02 Nutrition will be there, technology will be there. Teamwork, teammates, you are right, systems are like teammates, those who are working, people working around you
1:36:55 Speaker 02 will take their key positions. And all will be well. So I think if
1:37:03 Speaker 02 If actually the right systems will be there on an athlete, after those right systems, if that athlete actually has the right mind, and he has really thing, and he wants to try,
1:37:25 Speaker 02 then he will run under two hours.
1:37:26 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:37:27 Speaker 02 First and foremost is that the systems might be there in a good way.
1:37:31 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:37:32 Speaker 02 But if this person actually, as he agree in his heart and mind to try to run under two hours, that's a big question. Which we should put on and we should actually, uh, uh, uh, make it actually before we tell somebody to come and try. We need to, he himself actually need to come in a broad daylight and say, hey,
1:37:59 Speaker 02 I have thought enough.
1:38:00 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:38:01 Speaker 02 And I want to try.
1:38:02 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:38:03 Speaker 02 Then the systems comes in.
1:38:04 Rangan Chatterjee? Yeah.
1:38:05 Speaker 02 And we set the date.
1:38:07 Rangan Chatterjee? It's, it's so inspiring speaking to you and I'm, I'm pretty sure this conversation is going to inspire everyone to do their own version of a sub two hour marathon in their own lives. It may not be a sub two hour marathon, but it could be, you know, whatever it might be for that person, but as you say, you need to imagine it, you need to believe it first before you're ever going to achieve it. I think that's a very, very powerful message. Elliot, this podcast is called Feel Better, Live More. When we feel better in ourselves, we get more out of our lives. And finally, at the end of, for me, a wonderful conversation with, with incredibly inspirational guy.
1:38:47 Rangan Chatterjee? I just wonder for people who are struggling around the world, they're, they're struggling with the state of their lives. They're struggling with, you know, making things consistent, doing the things that they said they were going to do. Have you got any final words for them?
1:39:03 Speaker 02 Uh, first and foremost is that, you know, many of us are struggling, many of us actually have lost the hope. And you know, when you lose hope, they say, yeah, first and foremost is that you can survive with water for forty days. But if you lose hope, it's only five seconds and you are dead. So it's good to have hope. And that is that we should actually try to understand about life and to know what life entails. You know, then it will actually allow us not to struggle so much, but to understand it, work on it slowly by slowly and you learn to learn.
1:39:46 Rangan Chatterjee? Ali Kipchoge, thank you so much and good luck for everything you're doing. I really appreciate it.
1:39:50 Speaker 02 Thank you very much.
1:39:55 Rangan Chatterjee? Really hope you enjoyed that conversation. As always, do you have a think about one thing that you can take away and start applying into your own life? Thank you so much for listening. Have a wonderful week and always remember, you are the architect of your own health. Making lifestyle changes always worth it because when you feel better, you live more.
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