‘L.A. Confidential’ With Bill Simmons, Chris Ryan, Sean Fennessey, and Andy Greenwald

As we close out CR Month, the guys gather together for one more pod that is all very off the record, on the QT, and very hush-hush. They take a trip to the Formosa Cafe and revisit Curtis Hanson’s ‘L. A. Confidential’ starring Russell Crowe, Guy Pearce, Kevin Spacey, and Kim Basinger. Producers: Craig Horlbeck, Chia Hao Tat, Eduardo Ocampo, and Matt Pevic Join us in San Francisco for a live taping of ‘The Rewatchables’ on April 8th! Tickets go live on April 1st HERE Find what you're looking for. https://www.amazon.com/firetv/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Bill Simmons?

  This episode is brought to by Ethos. As a parent, life insurance feels like a no brainer. It just gives me peace of mind knowing my family will be taken care of. And Ethos makes getting it fast and easy. Apply online in minutes. Get up to 3 million in coverage with no medical exam, just a few simple health questions. Take 10 minutes to get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote at ethos.com/rewatch. That is E T H O S dot com slash rewatch. Application times may vary, rates may vary.

• 0:39Bill Simmons?

  Before we start today's show, I have an announcement. It's been a while since we've done a live rewatchables on the road. That's my fault. I'm just, I'm just lazy. I'm sorry. But we are finally, it's never happened before. We're coming to San Francisco. We've never done a live show in San Francisco. And that's all about to change because I am bringing CR. I'm bringing Van. I'm bringing Mallory. And we are doing a live episode of Basic Instinct, which we did a million years ago, I think during COVID. We're, we're running it back. It's going to be way more fun. We have more categories and one of the more fun movies to talk about from the last 35 years for a variety of reasons.

• 1:22Bill Simmons?

  I'm not even sure it's legal to have Van and Mallory in the same place talking about Basic Instinct. We'll find out. We will be at the ACT's Tony Remby Theater Wednesday, April 8th. And you can join us. Tickets go on sale Wednesday, April 1st, 10 a.m. Pacific. All you have to do is head to the ringer.com/events for more information. The ringer.com/events and you can see us Wednesday, San Francisco, April 8th. There's a Giants game that day. There's a, there's a Warriors game the next day. We're right in the middle of it. We're going to see you in San Francisco. This episode of the Rewatchables is presented by TikTok.

• 2:06Bill Simmons?

  The online world moves fast. That's why TikTok approaches teen safety with families in mind. From the start on TikTok, teens get over 50 built in protections right when they join. Their accounts start private by default. For those under 16, direct messages are turned off. Only friends can comment on their videos. When safety comes first, discovery can follow. Learn more at tiktok.com/guardiansguide. The Rewatchables is brought to you by The Ringer Podcast Network. We're in a new studio we have in Hollywood, which allows us to have four people on the Rewatchables again. Four people who have never done a video podcast together, even though we have all worked together really since the early 2010s.

• 2:49Bill Simmons?

  Sean Finacy hosted The Big Picture, Andy Greenwald, Chris Ryan. You guys did a little podcast called Hollywood Prospectus in the Grantland days. And now we're here. You do the watch together. Greenwald's always doing stuff. It's the end of CR Month. We couldn't have CR Month without you, Andy.

• 3:08Speaker 01

  I really appreciate that.

• 3:09Chris Ryan?

  This is the only thing I wanted, was this quartet.

• 3:11Speaker 01

  This is really meaningful to me.

• 3:12Chris Ryan?

  This is my LA quartet, actually.

• 3:14Sean Fennessey?

  I have to say, there are not three men on God's earth who have done more to celebrate the greatness of Chris Ryan publicly than these three men. We have really gone above and beyond.

• 3:25Bill Simmons?

  It's like a CR celebration.

• 3:28Chris Ryan?

  I wanted Van and Mahoney when you guys were around.

• 3:31Sean Fennessey?

  There's other, you know, Chuck Klosterman, he loves you. This trio, we love Chris Ryan.

• 3:36Speaker 01

  Are we bringing Burnthall in now or after?

• 3:39Bill Simmons?

  Well, to go back to the start of the Rewatchables, the first, the early seeds of The Ringer, which was basically my back house, 2015, and we started my podcast and we started the watch with Chris and Andy. And it got to the point where they would just kind of go through my house. My dogs wouldn't even bark anymore. You were doing the watch and that was also where the Rewatchable started because we did the anniversary heat December 2015. And now we've all circled back and this is the last episode of CR Month. What did you think of the choices, Andy?

• 4:11Speaker 01

  I thought they were amazing, that they were representing the man himself. I thought it was a little, we were just discussing, it's a little chalk at the end. You could have gotten a little.

• 4:19Chris Ryan?

  More creative.

• 4:20Bill Simmons?

  What was the one you really wanted that you didn't get from CR Month? Like, what would have been the craziest, wildest one for you that would have been realistic?

• 4:28Speaker 01

  Rise of Skywalker? Just run it back?

• 4:31Sean Fennessey?

  That'd be good.

• 4:32Speaker 01

  Some of your favorites? Uh, no, I mean, I, I, I think we all thought you were gonna do Heat again. Um, but I don't know if there's anything left to say there.

• 4:40Chris Ryan?

  No, we'll save it.

• 4:42Bill Simmons?

  There's plenty to say. I have a lot of thoughts. I have more thoughts than I've ever had.

• 4:46Sean Fennessey?

  Was the live show that you did about Heat considered?

• 4:49Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 4:49Speaker 01

  No.

• 4:49Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 4:50Chris Ryan?

  That was NBA awards.

• 4:51Sean Fennessey?

  That's not canon.

• 4:52Bill Simmons?

  No. That was just an excuse to have Chris do Pacino impersonations for an hour and a half.

• 4:57Chris Ryan?

  Which was just me screaming, like, I think, I think I have to go back in the lab with Pacino.

• 5:01Speaker 01

  Do you think you're gonna take a step back for the next month?

• 5:04Chris Ryan?

  I asked him about this and he was like, what are you talking about? You know, I was like, am I, am I getting put out to pasture?

• 5:09Sean Fennessey?

  Money never sleeps.

• 5:10Speaker 01

  This isn't, this isn't the gold watch. This wasn't like... Are you gonna be petty if you have to go to the hospital?

• 5:16Sean Fennessey?

  You guys are the gold watch. I mean, come on.

• 5:17Bill Simmons?

  Well, coming up next, a request from CR, LA Confidential.

• 5:37Bill Simmons?

  1997, Sean. Titanic, Boogie Nights, Good Will Hunting, LA Confidential, and Jackie Brown. We used to make things in this country.

• 5:46Sean Fennessey?

  I'll have you know, I have the exact same list right in front of me. 1997 movies, Boogie Nights, Jackie Brown. I have others, but we can talk.

• 5:53Bill Simmons?

  But those five specifically just feels very rooted in 97. And then this one, Greenwald, there's the, the revisionist history of 97 now is that this should've won the Oscar and not Titanic. So why don't we just start there?

• 6:06Speaker 01

  For sure, yeah, this was definitely the, the critics pick. It was definitely the burgeoning college student who wished they were critics pick. We all felt very smug for loving this movie and caping up for it. Um, but I don't think there was ever a moment when it seemed like it was like, I mean, it was never gonna win against a juggernaut like Titanic, but it wasn't even like a hit, was it? It was more of a critically, a critically well-regarded, modest smash, the type that they don't make anymore.

• 6:30Bill Simmons?

  It made 126, which I was surprised by.

• 6:32Chris Ryan?

  It's a kind of hit that people used to be satisfied with.

• 6:33Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah. It did pretty well, but it just was up against the most successful film in the history of movies, so by comparison. But you, you were in the Academy at that time?

• 6:42Chris Ryan?

  I, I mean, I was a huge, huge Titanic supporter. I mean, I think my work speaks for itself, the way I whipped votes during that time period.

• 6:50Bill Simmons?

  Big call girl guy. So this movie resonated with him immediately? Why, why this one? Why did this have to be in CR month?

• 6:58Chris Ryan?

  I think that this is kind of a perfect Hollywood movie. It's interesting because I have a kind of different relationship than people may assume or you might assume, which is like, I love it, but I love it conditionally because I come to it from the novels. I come to it from the Elroy books and it's quite different than the novel. Elroy has like a weird relationship to it. I think he knows it made him a lot of money and made his name go even further than it already had, but I think he also is like, they left out a lot of the plot and a lot of the sort of soul of the book and kind of sanded down the edges. But that being said, like we said with Fargo, I think I was like, Fargo is a five tool movie. It's like, this is a five tool movie too.

• 7:39Chris Ryan?

  Where it's the acting, the writing, the cinematography, the direction and the music are all like completely in sync, completely in harmony. There's not a bum scene really in this movie. We can nitpick about it, but like, you're watching this and you're just watching the best that Hollywood can make, I think at this era.

• 7:56Bill Simmons?

  Do you agree with that?

• 7:58Sean Fennessey?

  It's like an amazing plate of chicken Parmesan. You know?

• 8:01Chris Ryan?

  In a good way?

• 8:02Sean Fennessey?

  In a good way, yeah. It's like, it's not that complicated.

• 8:04Bill Simmons?

  The Dantana's chicken Parmesan?

• 8:06Sean Fennessey?

  I love Dantana's chicken Parmesan.

• 8:07Bill Simmons?

  It's gone downhill a little bit.

• 8:08Chris Ryan?

  It's my favorite.

• 8:09Sean Fennessey?

  The protein to sauce ratio. I'm coming in here. I'm coming in here throwing you.

• 8:12Bill Simmons?

  Andy, no. Save that for hottest day. The Dantana's chicken parm is wonderful.

• 8:17Sean Fennessey?

  All right. It's just, it's a, it's a, it looks on the surface like it's gonna be simple. But then when you cut in and you look at the layers, you look at the depth, the way the sauce meets the cheese meets the chicken, there's a lot going on here. There's a lot, there's, it's, it's, it's deeper than it seems. And it's only $29.95 on the menu, you know?

• 8:35Bill Simmons?

  Well, we also have.

• 8:36Sean Fennessey?

  Not at Dantana's anymore.

• 8:38Bill Simmons?

  We have chicken Parmesan prices for, uh, Crow and Pierce.

• 8:41Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 8:42Bill Simmons?

  Which is one of the things that really helps us. Crow's not even Crow yet. He's barely Crow. Knew him from the one Denzel movie, didn't know him from anything else at the time.

• 8:50Speaker 01

  I think it's Romper Stomper, right?

• 8:51Sean Fennessey?

  That was his biggest movie to that point, yeah.

• 8:53Speaker 01

  Have you guys done that yet? Romper Stomper?

• 8:54Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 8:55Speaker 01

  That's a good pick.

• 8:55Sean Fennessey?

  That would have been the final, yeah, the final edition for the show.

• 8:58Bill Simmons?

  That was gonna be CR year.

• 8:59Chris Ryan?

  CR 27, that's a fun one.

• 9:01Sean Fennessey?

  And you wanted to do an entire Nazi month, is that what you said? Nazi adjacent, The Believer, what else could you do there?

• 9:07Speaker 01

  The industry X.

• 9:07Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 9:08Bill Simmons?

  Coming out of this movie, would you have bet on Pierce or Crow being a bigger star? Cause I would have been on Crow. But Pierce is, it's a great movie for him.

• 9:17Speaker 01

  I thought that they would both be big stars.

• 9:19Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 9:20Speaker 01

  And Pierce is actually a little bit weirder. Like the parts of the character that, the reason why he gets the part, right? Is because he has the cheekbones and he looks like a leading man.

• 9:27Chris Ryan?

  Straight jaw, yeah.

• 9:28Speaker 01

  But he's kind of a freak on the margins. And I think that that served him well in the later part of his career. But I thought that he was like, yeah, he's gonna be the more handsome leading man type coming out of it.

• 9:38Sean Fennessey?

  I guess I thought Crow. The movie really loves Crow. It's really, really interested in Bud White in a way that I find even the book isn't as interested in Bud White.

• 9:47Speaker 01

  Uh-uh.

• 9:48Sean Fennessey?

  And you can tell, and Curtis Hanson, the director, talked a lot about how most of the executives wanted the movie to be Bud White's movie. And they wanted it to be like-

• 9:57Chris Ryan?

  Guy ass kicking asshole.

• 9:59Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, like, almost like Arnold Schwarzenegger is like the toughest cop in 1950's Hollywood. And obviously that he wasn't gonna let that happen, but I mean, Crow went on to have the bigger career. I don't, I'm not sure if this is in my hot take or what, but Pierce as an actor is just a fascinating guy. And his career is really, really interesting and where he's gone. And the fact that he's still cooking, like, he's still doing his best work right now says a lot. Crow is in a way different place. So, the legacies are kind of perfect, right? Cause one guy really went up, the other guy did fine.

• 10:28Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 10:28Sean Fennessey?

  And then they kind of traded places somewhere along the way. So it's really interesting in that way.

• 10:32Chris Ryan?

  He's a little bit, I don't even know if he's a little bit older. How much older than DiCaprio is he? Like maybe five, six years, right? I, for him, it's not L.A. Confidential that's always the big question mark for me. It's Memento because I think it would be relatively easy to project him into a number of Christopher Nolan leading roles going forward. And at which point you start to get into like, could that guy have been Batman? Like-

• 10:54Bill Simmons?

  Well, there is like, there are a bunch of Bale movies you could have thrown him in and he probably would have been able to drive the car.

• 10:59Sean Fennessey?

  He's a great cop, that's it.

• 11:00Speaker 01

  We can save this for the casting part, but this was a question I had too. Because obviously the casting makes this movie and the casting was kind of, not controversial, but more challenging. Because Curtis Hanson said he wanted unknown so that the audience didn't have preconceived notions. But if you think about, I'll defer to the film experts here on this, but like, who are the other 30 year old people that they may have been trying to put in this movie?

• 11:19Chris Ryan?

  There, there, there's some, it was kicked around, McConaughey was, was one.

• 11:24Bill Simmons?

  The casting whatevs weren't what I wanted, McConaughey was the big one. It's funny, it's a perfect Damon part, like the, the Guy Pearce one, it's basically, he plays that part in The Departed nine years later, right?

• 11:35Speaker 01

  But Guy Pearce is like 10, almost 10 years older than DiCaprio.

• 11:38Bill Simmons?

  I don't know if I would have bought McConaughey as Exley. I think that would have been a bad move.

• 11:42Chris Ryan?

  It's coming off Time to Kill where it would be like, pretty much like, an extension of that character.

• 11:46Sean Fennessey?

  And they're wearing the same glasses as they, as in Time to Kill.

• 11:49Bill Simmons?

  Pierce had a certain energy, it was, it reminded me of when Sean got to Grantland, where he's like, "I'm just here to do good work," but he was secretly scheming who he could take out. That's, that's, that's the Guy Pearce energy.

• 12:01Speaker 01

  I don't want to bogart this, but I did come into this movie realizing why you picked this group, because if you had to do it, there is a hothead who can hang with everyone and is strangely popular with the ladies. There is a cerebral power broker who is very, very moral. There's another charming power broker who knows where all the bodies are buried in a senior role.

• 12:18Bill Simmons?

  That is true, that's me. And I'm committing crimes.

• 12:21Speaker 01

  And then you had to get a semi-self-loathing guy who moonlights in Hollywood and kind of forgets where his bread and butter is, and gets called back. So it's hard to work that.

• 12:29Chris Ryan?

  So you're Jack.

• 12:30Bill Simmons?

  Hollywood Andy.

• 12:32Sean Fennessey?

  We've got beautiful Lynn Bracken over here too, in the producer's chair.

• 12:37Speaker 04

  Kurt's gonna be like, "It's all hush."

• 12:38Bill Simmons?

  He's a Simon Baker character.

• 12:43Chris Ryan?

  They're all bad.

• 12:44Bill Simmons?

  Come on Kurt, it's just acting.

• 12:46Speaker 01

  I think that makes, you haven't done it before.

• 12:47Sean Fennessey?

  That makes Gahow Johnny Stompanato, of course.

• 12:49Bill Simmons?

  Oh yeah, no question. Well, my, I wrote this down, LA is a beautiful, seductive, fucked up place that's really here to break your dreams and steal your soul.

• 12:58Speaker 01

  Is that what we told Sean? We wanted him to move for Grantland? I believe it was.

• 13:02Sean Fennessey?

  I'm so happy that I'm here. Honestly, I love it here so much, and this movie is a good reason why. I think most people have this weird tortured relationship with the city, and I'm like, "I love it. I love that it's a shithole." I love that it's full of people who are doing terrible things to each other every day. I think that's fascinating. It's way more interesting than you would have it be understood than when you're like, watching movies in, in the 90s and you're like, "Oh, well, this is the city of dreams." Like I don't dispense with all that. I'm not interested in that. I'm interested in like the nastiness of the city. And this movie is all about that.

• 13:27Chris Ryan?

  It's really, oh, go ahead.

• 13:29Speaker 01

  No, just worth noting because Curtis Hanson is from here. And I feel like you could, he's not as interested in the narratives or presenting it a certain way. He's just like, well, yeah, this is also a place.

• 13:38Chris Ryan?

  Mm hmm. There's something kind of melancholic about watching this and watching Boogie Nights because I think they're both, you know, obviously period pieces made in the nineties about earlier eras of Los Angeles. And one thing LA had, I think, even up to maybe the point where we moved here, was still those bones were still there. Like you could still probably shoot the outside of the Formosa and not have a target next to it.

• 14:00Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 14:01Chris Ryan?

  And now that is kind of, I think, fully changed. I think you can still find it in different neighborhoods. But it's wild watching this movie and thinking about how little they must have had to do when it came to Hollywood, you know?

• 14:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, in the nineties.

• 14:14Chris Ryan?

  Because if you're shooting Hollywood in the nineties, I mean, it doesn't look that much different than Swears, you know?

• 14:18Speaker 01

  It's forty five years between when the movie is set and when they filmed it, and it's thirty years.

• 14:22Chris Ryan?

  Years since they made it. Yeah.

• 14:24Bill Simmons?

  One of the great themes that we've talked about in other rewatchables episodes about LA, that everybody comes here wide eyed with a dream, right? And sometimes it really works out. Sometimes it kind of works out. But multiple characters say this in the movie, like Kim Basinger says at one point, like, basically says, I didn't, obviously come here to do this, but it's kind of how it ended up, right? Some people try it, try it, try it, and they leave. And we knew, you know, I'm older than you guys, but we had a bunch of people that when my kids were younger, that kid, the parents in schools and one guy's trying to be an actor, another person's trying to be a director. Eventually it just doesn't work out.

• 15:02Sean Fennessey?

  You, you moved here for a job in show business.

• 15:05Bill Simmons?

  Right. I moved here to write for a TV show. But this is, this is kind of how it goes. And sometimes the city chooses you out. I mean, the corruption stuff, which I think we've seen in the last thirty years has morphed into different, more public versions of this. But that underbelly of what was going on, that was always part of the romance of LA, like, right? Like, it's like, could make you, it could break you, you could be found dead. You don't know who the good guys and the bad guys are.

• 15:30Chris Ryan?

  A lot of people who don't want to know how the sausage is made. So it's like.

• 15:33Bill Simmons?

  Godfather, Jack Waltz.

• 15:34Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 15:35Bill Simmons?

  God tomb. Listen to me, my crap, Mick friend.

• 15:40Chris Ryan?

  Jack would have fit in great in this movie.

• 15:42Bill Simmons?

  You could have easily thrown him in. But there were two quotes in here. One was, "Life is good in Los Angeles. It's paradise on earth. That's what they tell you anyway." De Vito says at the beginning. And then, "How can organized crime exist in a city with the best police force in the world?" Which seems to be, you're big on these Elroy books, but this seemed to be a huge theme in these LA books in the 40s, 50s, 60s.

• 16:05Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, so he writes this quartet of novels, the LA Quartet. It's Black Dahlia, Big Know Where, which is my favorite, LA Confidential, and then White Jazz. And like, they kind of get increasingly Byzantine and hallucinatory as he goes on. And he would later take on The Kennedy Assassination, one of your pet projects.

• 16:22Bill Simmons?

  You just recently talked about that, and wait a second.

• 16:25Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, and they try, I mean-

• 16:26Bill Simmons?

  We saw The Kennedy Assassination.

• 16:28Sean Fennessey?

  No kidding. Wow, congrats. That's great. Are you gonna visit the White House? What's gonna happen next?

• 16:33Bill Simmons?

  No, it's done.

• 16:35Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, they don't even need me.

• 16:36Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, they don't need me.

• 16:38Chris Ryan?

  He basically tries to write a secret history of Los Angeles in these novels. And some of them are fictionalized versions of real characters. So in the novel of LA Confidential, a lot of stuff is happening at what is basically Disneyland.

• 16:51Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 16:52Chris Ryan?

  But is not in this, in this adaptation. I think the, one of the things that really, really struck me about watching this and refreshing myself with the novel is, it is an incredible adaptation. It's an incredibly brave adaptation, but it's also like two guys, Brian Helgeland and Hanson, sitting down and just drilling, like, what is this movie going to be about? And every scene needs to be about one of the three cops and hopefully more.

• 17:19Bill Simmons?

  So initially it was eight, right? And they narrowed it down to three.

• 17:21Chris Ryan?

  It's got like-

• 17:22Sean Fennessey?

  Huge group of characters.

• 17:23Chris Ryan?

  So many characters, so many different spinning out-

• 17:26Speaker 01

  And it spreads over eight years, right? It's like a much broader canvas.

• 17:29Chris Ryan?

  It's three years in this movie.

• 17:30Sean Fennessey?

  And more real people in the book than are in the movie as well. Even though the movie is trying to balance like the truth of Hollywood versus this created world. It's a, it's an incredible book that I voraciously read right before the movie came out and was kind of shocked by how different it is.

• 17:46Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 17:46Sean Fennessey?

  Um, but it has this like-

• 17:50Sean Fennessey?

  Really readable, but also awkward style, where it's like all staccato. Like, the writing is like five-word sentences over and over and over and over again. So you almost like can feel the words coming out of the typewriter as you're reading it. It's a very unusual, and it's different from his other books. His other books are not like that as much. I feel like they're a little bit.

• 18:08Chris Ryan?

  The White Chasse is a little bit. It's like weird. The movie is way closer to the way like Robert Downe writes in Chinatown than it is Elroy's novel. But the scenes are short in this film, for the most part. And I feel like that replicates the feeling of page turning. Like, where you're like, I gotta, I just gotta keep going. But you're right. I mean, his, Elroy's authorial voice is, you can't replicate that on screen without extensive voiceover.

• 18:36Speaker 01

  But can you think of another example of an adaptation that is respected on both sides of the aisle? Like, the way this is? Because I think people who love the book.

• 18:43Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 18:44Speaker 01

  Understand that it's a different piece.

• 18:45Chris Ryan?

  It's unflammable.

• 18:46Speaker 01

  And respect how well it's made. Mid-Vic and Cruisin'. The only two.

• 18:50Sean Fennessey?

  Was Cruisin' a book?

• 18:52Bill Simmons?

  I think it was a book, right?

• 18:53Sean Fennessey?

  Was it, it was a novel?

• 18:54Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 18:55Speaker 01

  I've got it in my bag.

• 18:56Sean Fennessey?

  Well, yeah.

• 18:57Bill Simmons?

  Andy's trying to adapt it right now for a remake.

• 19:00Sean Fennessey?

  You, you, you want to be on the re-Cruisin'? They're gonna cruise again.

• 19:04Bill Simmons?

  Andy was with us on the Cruisin'. Andy, have you ever, you're a guy who's written some scripts from time to time?

• 19:10Chris Ryan?

  Time to time.

• 19:11Bill Simmons?

  For the last, I don't know, nine, eight, nine, 10 years?

• 19:13Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 19:14Bill Simmons?

  Have you ever tried to adapt a book?

• 19:15Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 19:16Bill Simmons?

  How hard is it? What are the things we don't know?

• 19:19Speaker 01

  Well, it's very hard. I think the hardest thing is the fidelity issue. Like, when I did Briar Patch, I basically just took the characters and the plot and changed everything. Because, A, it's not a beloved, I mean, it's a, I love it, but it's not a very well-known book. So you have that liberty to do it. But I think the most important thing is, when adapting anything, is that you have to, as the adapter, try not to be too precious about what you know other people love and zero in on what you love. Because the enthusiasm is the one thing that you can carry from the book to the screen. And I think that that's what these guys did to a degree that is almost unprecedented. When you see, you know, you watch Curtis Hanson, like, on Charlie Rose from promoting the movie 30 years ago.

• 20:00Speaker 01

  He brings the same like pitch that he brought to Arnon Milchan and the producers to Charlie Rose. Where he's like, here are six images that I found about coming to Los Angeles in the 50s. That remind me of a place that I grew up in that is no longer, that no longer exists. And I showed him a picture of Aldo Rey and I thought about how I love these characters even though I hate them. And those were the pillars of his adaptation. And for whatever reason, maybe it's ego or whatever, he felt comfortable throwing everything else away.

• 20:28Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I think that if, if I were trying to adapt a James Elroy book, I would just completely lose myself. Being like, well, we can't have this without this. We can't have this without the Disney character. We can't have this without Inez being a bigger character.

• 20:42Speaker 01

  It's like a metastasized tumor. Everything touches everything.

• 20:44Chris Ryan?

  And these guys are just like, no, we're fucking screenwriters like, and we need to like make every single scene. Go into the next one and every action has a consequence and every single thing needs to be about the theme of these guys. And it's just a really, really impressive piece of work in that way.

• 20:58Sean Fennessey?

  I think it's notable that of the LA Quartet, only two of the books have been made into movies. And the other one is a really bad De Palma movie. And the other, I always wanted to see white jazz and Clooney wanted to make white jazz for the longest time. And you heard about like Smokehouse is making white jazz for like five years. And it never happened. And that book is so cool and fascinating. It's about like a cop who is also a hitman for the mob. And then he has this like kind of confrontation with himself over how the city really works. And he's also really hot for his sister.

• 21:27Chris Ryan?

  Incestuous.

• 21:29Sean Fennessey?

  Crazy book. They never happen. They're just, they're really hard to do. So I think Andy's right on like, this is an amazing. Way of like kind of calling something that's very big, like a 500 page novel down to two hours and 10 minutes.

• 21:40Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, it's just like, there is a central mystery that we are going to solve.

• 21:44Speaker 01

  It's ruthlessly efficient too. I feel like I know, you probably all noticed it when we were rewatching it, like looking for a seam, looking for something to either make a joke about or point out. And it just rolls almost to the point of you just get lost in it. And I stopped taking notes both times watching it.

• 21:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, there's some stuff that I'm like, this wasn't as electric as I remembered. But there's nothing where I'm like, you could just lose this, really.

• 22:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's a structurally almost perfect movie. I noticed. I watched it two times in the last week. I was like, man, they're just. This is like a big ass bone in filet with like no fat at all.

• 22:15Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 22:15Bill Simmons?

  Just zooming through it. I think if I adapted, I would be more in the Kubrick. Um, camp, like, kinda like fuck this guy with the writer.

• 22:25Bill Simmons?

  I'm gonna get some moon landing stuff in here. And, uh, I almost think you, if the author's mad at you when the movie comes out, maybe that's where you wanna be.

• 22:33Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but there's a difference between like the guy who wrote Eyes Wide Shut, who's like, you know,

• 22:37Bill Simmons?

  Dead?

• 22:38Chris Ryan?

  Dead, and like James Elroy going around being like, this is a fucking turkey.

• 22:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 22:42Chris Ryan?

  These guys are communists.

• 22:44Sean Fennessey?

  Kubrick does the same thing that Andy is talking about though, which is like, he just picks what he likes. Like,

• 22:48Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 22:48Sean Fennessey?

  In Lolita, he's just like, this is so funny to me. And he's, I'm gonna make this like a broad comedy about a forty-five-year-old man who wants to fuck a teenager.

• 22:55Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 22:56Sean Fennessey?

  And that's, you know, that's, there's a comic aspect of Lolita, but it's not Peter Sellers.

• 23:01Bill Simmons?

  We're living through it.

• 23:01Sean Fennessey?

  Doing bits, you know? Yeah, that's true. Um, so I, I think it's like, it's kinda brave, but also I think there's some like industrial design to the way that Curtis Hanson did it too. Where he was just like, studios don't wanna make period pieces. They don't wanna make noir movies because they never make any money. I'm not gonna shoot this in black and white. Like, every choice I make is gonna be so this movie can get made, so that it can be commercially successful. And that I can also make something that I think is artistically interesting. It's a pretty, pretty like slick move by an old studio directing hand.

• 23:26Chris Ryan?

  His run here where it's like Hand the Rocks to Cradle, River Wild, this, and then Wonder Boys and Eight Mile, kinda like culminating after that.

• 23:34Bill Simmons?

  Just a tour de force.

• 23:35Speaker 01

  In her shoes erasure.

• 23:36Chris Ryan?

  Oh, in her shoes, right?

• 23:37Speaker 01

  Not at this table.

• 23:37Chris Ryan?

  But it's kind of like the dark twin of Ron Howard. You know what I mean? Like, that incredibly safe pair of hands.

• 23:44Bill Simmons?

  Save that for your one-man show, that's a good one. Dark twin of Ron Howard, yeah.

• 23:50Chris Ryan?

  It is I! John Howard! What if the Apollo 13 crashed? Anyway, he's just like this incredibly, um, professional, like, maybe there's nothing in this that's like super flashy, like holy shit Scorsese camera move, or something you've never seen before, but all of the jigsaw pieces wind up coming together.

• 24:14Speaker 01

  That, that's the thing when I was watching it, there is no, even some of the questions that I know were categories we're gonna get through about if it could be improved in certain ways, like, every single piece of this movie is in service to the movie.

• 24:23Chris Ryan?

  Mm-hmm.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  It is the type of like buttoned up Industry forward professionalism that we do not do anymore.

• 24:29Chris Ryan?

  It kind of reminds me of Apollo 13 in that way, where it's just like, oh, you're watching it. And it's like, oh, man, and then this, and then this, and then this.

• 24:34Speaker 01

  And there's no ego in like Dante Spinotti's like, yeah, I know how to shoot this. And Jerry Goldsmith is like, I get it. I'm already 75.

• 24:41Sean Fennessey?

  It's a bunch of grownups. Yeah, it's just a bunch of grownups who are like, we had a really good idea for a movie. This is how we're gonna do it.

• 24:45Speaker 01

  Let's make the picture.

• 24:46Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 24:46Bill Simmons?

  Well, he did the opening credits. Wasn't that part of his pitch?

• 24:49Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 24:49Bill Simmons?

  He had all the postcards. That was like literally how he made the movie.

• 24:53Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 24:53Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Hand That Rocks The Cradle is a great example. That movie's been made 17,000 times. It's being made now. You could go on Netflix and probably find five of them right now. They make them on Lifetime every week. And for some reason, that's probably the best one of all of them. Except for maybe Fatal Attraction. We're doing it. We're saving it for From Hell Month. It's just so well done. But what's the movie? It's like nanny's mad at the family and she's just getting revenge. Like, that's every Lifetime movie. For some reason, that's the best one.

• 25:22Sean Fennessey?

  It is, um, I popped it in last night after watching Ali Complential, just to be like, what, what was Hanson's style? To your point, like trying to figure out like, what is it that he does like with the camera? How the movies look, the colors of the movie? And it's a totally different looking movie, totally different feeling movie. But even though it is a bonker script, do you remember the premise of The Hand That Rocks The Cradle? Where it's like a woman is assaulted by her OBGYN?

• 25:43Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 25:44Sean Fennessey?

  And she goes public on him. And then he kills himself and his wife, his widow, then gets a job as the nanny. And then seeks revenge.

• 25:55Bill Simmons?

  DeMornay's part.

• 25:56Sean Fennessey?

  Yes. So it's like, it's a nutty Lifetime movie.

• 25:58Bill Simmons?

  And the only person who's on tour is the special needs gardener.

• 26:01Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, played by Ernie Hudson.

• 26:02Chris Ryan?

  Oh, that's right. I forgot about the gardener.

• 26:04Bill Simmons?

  The movie's amazing.

• 26:05Sean Fennessey?

  Julianne Moore's in it. She's murdered in it. Like, yeah, it's a, it's a bizarre movie.

• 26:08Bill Simmons?

  Julianne Moore's Hall of Fame smoking performance CR. Just, just smoke burring from every.

• 26:15Sean Fennessey?

  But it is like, it is, the, the ideas in it are Lifetime movie level. You know, like, it is really dopey in a lot of ways. But it looks so great and it feels so professional.

• 26:25Speaker 01

  And you watch these interviews with Curtis Hanson and his heroes and some people he actually interviewed because he started as a journalist visiting sets. As he talks about like Howard Hawks, Sam Fuller, and it's just like, the thing is the thing.

• 26:35Sean Fennessey?

  Yep.

• 26:35Speaker 01

  And speaking of great shows where people talked around a wooden table, I did watch this Charlie Rose interview. And he's like, well, Charlie, you know, every movie has a simple concept behind it. And you can just say it in a line, you know? And he's like, so with, he asked about Hand, Hand That Rocks The Cradle. And he goes, every movie has a simple concept. Charlie leans in and goes, is it the hand rocking the cradle? No, it's just be careful who you trust when you turn around, but.

• 27:00Sean Fennessey?

  A patented rose charm.

• 27:02Bill Simmons?

  What's the LA confidential?

• 27:03Chris Ryan?

  Your OBGYN kills himself and you say what?

• 27:08Bill Simmons?

  Maybe that could be a new CR character.

• 27:09Chris Ryan?

  Charlie? I've tried him out before, yeah.

• 27:12Bill Simmons?

  What is LA confidential in a sentence?

• 27:15Speaker 01

  Uh, city of angels is full of devils, right?

• 27:20Chris Ryan?

  Sounds good.

• 27:21Sean Fennessey?

  There's a good, good line in it. I think it's, I think it's Jack Vincent who says, everybody wants something.

• 27:25Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 27:26Sean Fennessey?

  This is a real.

• 27:26Speaker 01

  Whatever you desire.

• 27:27Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 27:28Bill Simmons?

  I wrote down some themes, including tabloid culture, still prevalent.

• 27:32Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 27:33Bill Simmons?

  Police brutality, haven't gotten rid of that yet. Racism, still exists. Good and evil, sure. Seductive and beautiful LA that's here to steal your soul, still exists.

• 27:43Chris Ryan?

  How about, uh, using blackmail against the rich and powerful to advance your political and financial interests?

• 27:49Speaker 01

  No, no, that's a bridge too far.

• 27:52Bill Simmons?

  What else? Anything?

• 27:53Sean Fennessey?

  I think it's a really good movie about the real and the fake and how they coexist in the city very comfortably.

• 27:57Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 27:57Sean Fennessey?

  That like, you can see Michael Jackson having a dance off with Spider-Man on the streets of Los Angeles. And that feels normal. That you can step on the walks of fame and that feels normal. That you can walk past the Chinese theater, that you can go up to Beverly Hills and look at homes. You can go on tours of people's homes in the city. And also, you know, there's like a lot of crime and, and, and there's a lot of sadness and, and poverty and, and terrible things happening in the city on a daily basis. And that like, they all are just kind of coexisting in a way that is very unusual even for, by metropolis standards.

• 28:27Speaker 01

  But to that point, maybe, and well, I'm sure we'll talk about it later, but maybe the most important scene in the movie is the scene when Exley insults the real Lana Turner, who is actually dating a real gangster. All of which was true. Johnny Stompanato and Lana Turner were dating.

• 28:40Bill Simmons?

  By the way, that was its own movie. Um.

• 28:42Speaker 01

  Incredible.

• 28:43Bill Simmons?

  You could have just detoured into a separate.

• 28:45Sean Fennessey?

  Did they make that movie?

• 28:46Bill Simmons?

  I don't think they ever made it successfully.

• 28:48Chris Ryan?

  Because of, like, of her daughter, right?

• 28:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 28:50Chris Ryan?

  Her daughter.

• 28:51Sean Fennessey?

  Murdered Johnny Stompanato. Were you worried about spoiler alert there on the murder of Johnny Stompanato?

• 28:56Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, don't worry about that, Sierra. What you said though, when I moved out here to work for Jimmy Show and we were right on Holly Boulevard and would go out to get coffee and Spider-Man and Superman were doing, and it took me six months to get used to it, how weird everything was. The Man Theater where the premieres happen, the stars, just the weirdness. But you do get used to it.

• 29:14Sean Fennessey?

  You do.

• 29:15Bill Simmons?

  And I don't know, for everybody, it's different. For me, it was like six months in, I wouldn't, I wouldn't blink.

• 29:20Chris Ryan?

  I think that, like, I start every single day here the same way, which is like, it's too bright, it's too hot. And then I get to 6pm, and everything turns purple, and it's the perfect temperature, and you're like, oh, I'm never leaving. You know, it's like, it's that kind of weird, like, you can exist in heaven and hell at the same time sensation that Elroy writes about incessantly.

• 29:40Bill Simmons?

  Well, Greenwald mentioned the three types of police officers in this movie: aggressive rule breaker, star fucker, personality builder, and straight arrow idealist. And they do a great job within 20 minutes of like, okay, I get, I get your type. I get you, I get you. Cromwell, hmm, what's he up to? And it's just, we're up.

• 29:59Chris Ryan?

  Well, the genius move that they pull is that they all have to go before the police commissioner and respond to a, the same question, which is, are you gonna rat on your friends?

• 30:07Sean Fennessey?

  Right.

• 30:07Chris Ryan?

  And Ashley says yes, Jack says maybe, and Bud says fuck no.

• 30:11Sean Fennessey?

  One of the ingenious ideas of the book that is also really well-preserved in the movie is that, like, those three characters are three very clear male archetypes post-World War II. Right? There's like, the G.I. Bill college boy, there's the World War II grunt, right, who's in the trenches, who's like all muscle. And then there's like, the very cynical, like, I just wanna get what's best for me person in the 50s that's trying to kinda get fat as he heads into the second half of his life. And those are like, those set up, I think, kind of an archetype of masculinity over the next 75 years in America that are really smart. And the idea of using them as like, this triangle of trying to solve something together is really, really fascinating. You know, they kinda do represent like, one person ultimately. They kinda feel like the totality of a guy living in a city.

• 30:55Speaker 01

  Well, also, each one of them, during the course of the movie, tries to overcome the limitations that they realize they have placed on themselves.

• 31:00Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 31:01Speaker 01

  Like Bud's whole thing is that he's not smart enough to do it, until someone tells him that he is.

• 31:05Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, they all wanna be the thing that they are not. Like, Ashley wants to be his dad, Jack wants to be thought of as moral, even though he knows he's not. And Bud wants to be smart, even though he's strong.

• 31:16Bill Simmons?

  Don't forget all the call girls who wanna be various stars.

• 31:18Chris Ryan?

  Exactly.

• 31:19Bill Simmons?

  They get cut.

• 31:20Chris Ryan?

  They get cut.

• 31:21Bill Simmons?

  They get cut to look like Veronica Lake.

• 31:23Sean Fennessey?

  If you could be cut to look like anyone, who would you be cut to look like?

• 31:26Bill Simmons?

  Chandler Bing.

• 31:28Sean Fennessey?

  That's perfect.

• 31:30Bill Simmons?

  Rollo Tomasi.

• 31:32Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 31:33Bill Simmons?

  One of the great stealth plot ideas of all time, because I was thinking like, they're the big ideas. Like where the Kaiser, like ironically spacey Kaiser Soze. Awesome. Oh, holy shit. What's in the box?

• 31:45Chris Ryan?

  Again, spacey, yeah.

• 31:47Bill Simmons?

  You know, the, the six cents. We all know like the huge ones. The stealth, I don't know what this is, and then it reveals itself in a very small way, but you're like, oh, it's, it's way up there. I don't even know what it's competing against.

• 32:02Chris Ryan?

  Movie invention. The Rollo Tomasi idea is the, is Hanson and Helgland like coming up with them themselves.

• 32:07Speaker 01

  There's such, there's elegance and efficiency and play throughout the entire movie. Because you were thinking about these different archetypes. The movie does a, I think people can watch this movie and be a little confused the first time potentially. And it doesn't really hold your hand. And yet if you watch it again, you realize that it does do the Chyron of the characters' names. It does show Susan Lefferts' face when we first met her.

• 32:27Bill Simmons?

  With the narration, oh yeah.

• 32:28Speaker 01

  To remind you, it nudges you. And then when you get to something like Rollo Tomasi, you can imagine Helgland and Hanson for months beating their heads against the wall, being like, how can we combine these moments? How can we educate the characters with something that is clever, with something that is, gets us along the track fast?

• 32:44Bill Simmons?

  You couldn't have called it John Malone, like the Rollo Tomasi was really smart. It's a memorable thing. My son, I watched it with my son, he missed it. He didn't, because, well, it's the two, and then when, when Cromwell says it to him, you really have to be paying attention to Pierce's face. So I, I, I don't think he totally got it. And Pierce does such a great job in that scene, which is.

• 33:05Speaker 01

  He does a lot of jawbone now.

• 33:07Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but it's like, that's the way actually he usually looks, so Dudley wouldn't pick up on actually looking like he has to take a shit anyway. Like, it's always kind of how he looks.

• 33:16Bill Simmons?

  Craig, did you, had you seen this movie before?

• 33:18Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 33:19Bill Simmons?

  Was it hard to follow and did you get the Rollo Tomasi?

• 33:23Speaker 04

  I did get the Rollo Tomasi, but to Andy's point, I had trouble sometimes. There are so many last names just being thrown around throughout the entire movie that I had to kind of stop and almost like go to another tab and be like, wait, which one is, has this last name? That part was harder, but I did catch Rollo Tomasi.

• 33:36Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 33:37Chris Ryan?

  It's funny, it's like, there's two things that jump out at me when I watch it. One is that Buzz Meeks is the, one of the main characters of the previous novel. So like his, his life and death in this book is much more significant, kind of. Um, and then the heroin, which kind of is a runner throughout the plot of like, somebody stole the heroin from Mickey Cohen. And it's like, that is a major animating factor in the book and it kind of gets yada yadded at the end of the movie.

• 34:06Sean Fennessey?

  I think it's, he's never said it, but I think it's one of the reasons why Elroy is very hot and cold on the movie is because it cuts out that part of it, which he's, that's like, the way that drugs started running through the city is a big theme of all of his novels. And the movie is not really super interested in that.

• 34:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, same thing with the freeway.

• 34:22Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 34:22Speaker 01

  It's like the sort of the, the actual spine of what was changing and how it was going to be changed is kind of yada yadded.

• 34:28Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 34:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 34:29Bill Simmons?

  Do you miss heroin as a big plot in a movie? Feels like we're not getting it as much lately.

• 34:34Sean Fennessey?

  Well, I mean, we live in a time where, you know, like a different kind of drug, I think dominates these kinds of movies too. Like opioids is really, it's just a different thing. But like, I remember vividly talking to my dad when he, he was literally on a heroin task force for years. And then they like, kind of paused that and shifted their focus onto more fentanyl related cases when he was working. Cause everything in this country changed. It doesn't mean heroin is gone, but it just doesn't hold the, this is the rise of heroin, you know? Like this is the rise of, you know?

• 35:02Speaker 04

  Coming up next on First Take, heroin or fentanyl? What's a better movie drug?

• 35:07Speaker 01

  In that, what Sean was saying, Chris, it's like the rise of Skywalker, but for a drug.

• 35:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, that makes sense.

• 35:11Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 35:12Bill Simmons?

  Uh, you mentioned the screenplay and how it came from the 1990 James Elroy novel. Where, um, basically Hanson said, he was talking about the apparently golden era of the twenties and thirties, which had been basically bulldozed. I was trying to think of other movies and TV shows that kind of hit that a little bit. Mad Men, when they went to LA, which I can't remember, I haven't, I gotta re-watch. But Mad Men's my next sauna show after I'm done with Thrones.

• 35:42Chris Ryan?

  Your Instagram followers.

• 35:43Bill Simmons?

  After I get out of the 1300s and go to the 1960s.

• 35:50Bill Simmons?

  But Batman was in LA almost for the whole season, right? And didn't it tap into this? I'm remembering vaguely.

• 35:56Speaker 01

  He would go, he would go occasionally and then, then it's certain, then one season Pete is living out here and it was the only time they could ever do exteriors because they shot LA for New York the rest of the time. So everything was, which kind of helped the show because it was kind of hermetically sealed. But I think it definitely captured the sense, the, still the boom times of being out here, that this was a place where everything worked and was golden and verdant and full of possibilities and opportunities and sunshine.

• 36:22Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Well, and pre-sports, because the Dodgers come late 50s and so do the Lakers, right? And then the Angels come and then all of a sudden it's like, LA, here we go. Yeah.

• 36:32Chris Ryan?

  Pre-Wally Joyner.

• 36:33Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 36:36Speaker 01

  But that idea that's in this movie too of like, we're selling it, we've decided on the dream we're going to sell people.

• 36:40Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 36:40Speaker 01

  But we had to create this too.

• 36:42Chris Ryan?

  This is, me and Sean's beloved Babylon is also about this.

• 36:45Sean Fennessey?

  It is. That's probably the best representation of that period of time that this movie is kind of reacting to.

• 36:50Bill Simmons?

  It's a TV movie?

• 36:51Sean Fennessey?

  Nope. It was a feature film.

• 36:53Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 36:53Sean Fennessey?

  Directed by Damien Chazelle, starring Brad Pitt, Margot Robbie.

• 36:56Bill Simmons?

  Came out in the theaters?

• 36:57Sean Fennessey?

  Yep. Yep. Good film.

• 36:59Bill Simmons?

  I'll look for it.

• 37:01Speaker 01

  But you could also make the point, I think it's, I think this is something that Curtis Hansen did as well when he was pitching it around, that most noirs that we think of as classics are set in like the 30s and 40s, which was psychologically and physically a different time in America.

• 37:15Chris Ryan?

  Fashion is different.

• 37:16Speaker 01

  And intentionally, and, and the only 40s in this movie is Veronica Lake. And that's intentionally, she's, as we say, cut to look like that. Everything else is just an abundant optimistic time. And this is still the underbelly of it.

• 37:29Bill Simmons?

  So Hansen held a mini film festival for the people in the movie and showed them The Bad and the Beautiful, In a Lonely Place, Don Segal's The Lineup, Private Hell 36, and Kiss Me Deadly. I don't know if Sean had any thoughts. I haven't read your Substack today.

• 37:44Chris Ryan?

  Can I ask you?

• 37:45Bill Simmons?

  I don't know if you covered those.

• 37:46Chris Ryan?

  Would the most fun part about directing a film be like programming the pre-film?

• 37:50Bill Simmons?

  The film festival for the cast?

• 37:52Sean Fennessey?

  That would, that would underline the fact that I don't know how to make films, but I do know how to program a festival of old movies.

• 37:58Bill Simmons?

  We brought in Sean Fantasy for Film Festival. Did you have any thoughts on those five?

• 38:03Sean Fennessey?

  I've seen all the movies and I love all of them. I think Don Segal is like, I don't know if you mentioned him, is like act, a director that Hansen really likes, but that's clearly a, you know, kind of a for hire guy who can work in a lot of different. Sorts of dramas, but is really good about like Guy with a Gun. Guy with a gun, who's on a mission, who's got a problem to solve. A lot of his movies are like that. Um, and then the Killing the Kubrick movie is really interesting because there's a lot, apparently, of Sterling Hayden's character in that movie in the Budweiser performance. That Russell Crowe looked at him.

• 38:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, because also he was Sterling Hayden was physically, didn't Elroy say this? That he wanted that Sterling Hayden was his choice to play Budweiser?

• 38:40Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, interesting.

• 38:41Speaker 01

  Because he was physically a big actor.

• 38:42Sean Fennessey?

  In the book, he's like the Incredible Hulk.

• 38:44Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, he's the biggest guy in L.A. in the book.

• 38:46Bill Simmons?

  I don't, Crowe looks pretty jacked in this movie.

• 38:47Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but there's a couple of shots where you're like, he's like a little bit taller than Danny DeVito.

• 38:51Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. How tall do we think Crowe is?

• 38:53Chris Ryan?

  He's listed at six. I looked it up.

• 38:56Bill Simmons?

  Is this like a Major League Baseball?

• 38:57Chris Ryan?

  I think he's like an I version.

• 38:58Sean Fennessey?

  He's a 5'10".

• 38:59Chris Ryan?

  Down a couple of inches in the, in the talling.

• 39:01Bill Simmons?

  The Major League Baseball heights thing has been my favorite subplot.

• 39:03Chris Ryan?

  It's funny, it's like he's listed.

• 39:05Bill Simmons?

  Gavin Lux lost three inches.

• 39:05Sean Fennessey?

  Did he?

• 39:06Bill Simmons?

  He went from 6'1" to 5'10".

• 39:08Chris Ryan?

  What?

• 39:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, because they're measuring all these dudes for the strike zone.

• 39:11Chris Ryan?

  Oh.

• 39:12Bill Simmons?

  A lot of height line going on.

• 39:14Chris Ryan?

  Wait, so everybody gets?

• 39:15Bill Simmons?

  No, no. This is an amazing story. I gotta have Billy Gill come on and do the whole breakdown of this. Yeah, there's been a lot of height line. Um, we're gonna take a quick break and then I want to talk about the actors. This episode is brought to by Fire TV. You've been there settling in for a relaxing evening of TV. You waste half the night scrolling through options, can't really find anything to watch. Well, enter Fire TV. It's entertainment with zero effort required. Fire TV serves up personalized recommendations from across all your apps, all in one place. It's your helper. Not sure what to watch next? Just tell Alexa Plus what you're in the mood for. She'll pull up the perfect recommendation. Problem solved.

• 39:56Bill Simmons?

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• 40:05Speaker 05

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• 40:50Bill Simmons?

  The actors, Russell Crowe. So I know this movie got nine nominations, but I look at it as like the starter kit for Proof of Life.

• 40:58Chris Ryan?

  That's why.

• 40:59Bill Simmons?

  This movie walked so Proof of Life could run?

• 41:01Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 41:02Bill Simmons?

  I don't know, was that part of CR month for you?

• 41:04Chris Ryan?

  Absolutely went into the, into the math, yeah.

• 41:05Bill Simmons?

  Stuff of legend?

• 41:06Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 41:07Sean Fennessey?

  Stuff of legend.

• 41:08Bill Simmons?

  But you can see it. You can see where the next 10 years are going. Like, he's just a movie star in this movie. You can see it.

• 41:13Sean Fennessey?

  Caruso could have done LA Confidential.

• 41:15Bill Simmons?

  So I had that in.

• 41:16Chris Ryan?

  He would have been in the LA version of it.

• 41:18Sean Fennessey?

  Wow, he would have been good.

• 41:20Bill Simmons?

  Can I, I had this on my recasting couch. What about him in the devito spot?

• 41:26Chris Ryan?

  No, not Sid.

• 41:29Bill Simmons?

  Listen.

• 41:29Sean Fennessey?

  No, I think Vince Sens. I think he would have been a really interesting Vince Sens. I think, I mean, he's, he's a little younger, a little younger, but, I mean, he could do actually, but he's not.

• 41:38Bill Simmons?

  CR is alive right now. Look at CR.

• 41:40Chris Ryan?

  Cause I'm trying to think of like, would I, like, Caruso at that time, is this pre or post NYPD?

• 41:43Bill Simmons?

  This is post NYPD and post Jade.

• 41:46Chris Ryan?

  So Stenzlin would have been.

• 41:47Sean Fennessey?

  Post Jade.

• 41:48Bill Simmons?

  Pre CSI and pre-prove life.

• 41:50Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 41:51Bill Simmons?

  Available.

• 41:52Chris Ryan?

  Guy, Jack would have been a good one. It kind of fits the book a little bit more. I mean, Jack's a little like washed in the book and in the movie, it's like, boy, he could, he's basically like the double for the guy.

• 42:04Sean Fennessey?

  He's like Dean Martin, yeah.

• 42:06Bill Simmons?

  But Crowe, perfect. Guy Pearce. We mentioned the Bale thing.

• 42:13Sean Fennessey?

  I think that's a great comparison.

• 42:14Bill Simmons?

  I think this is Bale, they're making this movie in 07, it's clearly Bale is, is Exley, 2005 range.

• 42:20Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, cause you got to admit. You gotta admit intelligence for sure. And that kind of posture, right? That stiff posture. But then there's like, he's got some stuff going on, you know? He is not, he doesn't grab Lynn Bracken lightly. He like, he grabs her.

• 42:35Speaker 01

  No, and also there's the scene that I really caught on rewatch is when the cameras show up outside the night owl and Dudley like puts his hat on and actually kind of flexes.

• 42:43Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 42:43Speaker 01

  He does, what did Wesley call Sicario? He does the gym flex. Gym selfie. The gym selfie of a performance in that moment.

• 42:52Bill Simmons?

  And then Spacey, who from 95 to 99 rips off Usual Suspects, Seven, Outbreak, Time to Kill, L.A. Confidential, American Beauty, and wins two Oscars. And he's really good in this movie. And now it's like Kevin Spacey problematic, to say the least.

• 43:09Chris Ryan?

  I think even to Guy Pearce especially.

• 43:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 43:14Bill Simmons?

  He's just a really good actor.

• 43:16Sean Fennessey?

  I, I think this is his best performance.

• 43:19Speaker 01

  I'm with you. I thought I would be on an island with that.

• 43:21Sean Fennessey?

  I, I think he's.

• 43:21Bill Simmons?

  Not nominated.

• 43:22Sean Fennessey?

  I think he's been more iconic, obviously, as villains in movies and more memorable in certain movies. But given that he's on screen for 25 minutes and is doing a lot of acting with his face.

• 43:35Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 43:35Sean Fennessey?

  And not with his words.

• 43:36Chris Ryan?

  That's like some of my favorite lines and line readings in the movie.

• 43:40Bill Simmons?

  Also, a classic Spacey performance where it's like, is this guy straight or gay? Is this guy a good guy or a bad guy? Is this guy funny or not funny?

• 43:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, like the layers to the scene with Matt Reynolds where he's like, yeah, show business.

• 43:54Bill Simmons?

  Even like when he's talking to Exley, it's like, is he flirting with this guy or is he just talking to him? Like there's, it's always, he's like that last level of actor where he's playing it, where you're trying to figure out what he's up to in the scenes. And that was with House of Cards. He's basically playing this guy as an older House of Cards as a senator.

• 44:12Speaker 01

  And everything about the role is performance, which increasingly as he got more rewarded for his performances, that became what he did is he was doing schtick most of the time.

• 44:20Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I don't feel like this was schick enough.

• 44:22Speaker 01

  There's a moment that I, one of my favorite moments in the movie, this really small moment is after they've told the boxer that they're gonna help his brother get freed and they go back to the car and the guy's like, you're gonna come see me, right? You're gonna go talk about it. And Spacey just has the cigarette in his mouth and he goes, keep it up. Keep it up. And it's like, it's such a perfectly choreographed bit. It fits the character because the character is always looking for the moment to camera. Because that's what he admires most.

• 44:46Sean Fennessey?

  There's a really great Elroy quote about Spacey. That I think kind of sums up both his performance and also kind of how we understand him as a public person. And even some of the thorniness without actually coming out and saying anything specific where he says. Spacey is so deft, he is so controlled, is so subtle, is so good at suggesting a character's inner life with a minimal of outward action. He glides. There's something amorphous about the guy. I met him a couple of times. I don't have any kind of rapport with him, you know? I like him well enough. He's not a bad guy, but there's a mask that's up when you meet him personally. And I imagine that this helps him when he immerses himself. It's a deep immersion performance. Some of the best self loathing I've ever seen on screen.

• 45:23Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, like I'll, I still think that. Well, this will come up in other parts of the pod, but like the, him coming across Matt's body and like the wordless kind of like. Funeral he has for Matt, but like kind of also himself as he like slides down is like. That's really, really good shit. You know, like that's, that's.

• 45:42Bill Simmons?

  The problem with his career, which was, I mean, that run was incredible. He could never, like, remember he made that terrible movie Pay It Forward?

• 45:50Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 45:51Sean Fennessey?

  Tough one.

• 45:51Bill Simmons?

  He could never just be a normal person. He couldn't be like, Kevin Spacey is now a high school teacher with a heart of gold. He always had to play these mysterious guys. And I, I gotta be honest, I think he's like a one on one. I don't think he exists anymore. This was like a specific type of actor who. Kind of, you kind of knew what the perfect Kevin Spacey role was. And I don't know who's filled that void since. I don't think we've found the person.

• 46:17Sean Fennessey?

  I think that kind of character forward mainstream American drama, it just doesn't really happen that much anymore. He did actually pivot to television because he was kind of an actor who could really thrive in that space, but. You know, when you go back and look at the movies and the parts that he took on, it's not unreasonable to be like, there's kind of a red arrow pointing at the unseemliness of this person.

• 46:36Bill Simmons?

  Sure.

• 46:37Sean Fennessey?

  And almost the industry telling you by how they're casting him, like what they think of him, that is really fascinating.

• 46:41Speaker 01

  And what's so weird is, I remember at the time when he was at his apex, he was always talking about how Jack Lemmon was his hero.

• 46:47Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, that's right.

• 46:48Chris Ryan?

  Success of Jack Lemmon.

• 46:48Speaker 01

  And the thing about Jack Lemmon was that everyone loved Jack Lemmon.

• 46:51Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 46:51Speaker 01

  He played in every man, whether it's the apartment or grumpy old man. You're like, I like that guy.

• 46:55Sean Fennessey?

  So warm.

• 46:56Speaker 01

  He's, he, he seems like a decent guy.

• 46:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Kevin Spacey in The Odd Couple, you would have been like, is he gonna kill Oscar?

• 47:00Speaker 01

  Yes, it's absolutely a first film.

• 47:01Chris Ryan?

  I think the hardest is he gets to like Lemon, Lemon is like, in a way like the Margin Call performance where he's kind of more like Shelley and Glengarry and doing that kind of hangdog like, but.

• 47:12Speaker 01

  Which he can do.

• 47:12Chris Ryan?

  Is, is kind of an outlier. He's right. Like, there's, there's a lot of Kevin Spacey performances, you'd be like, so you picked him to be the guy in Seven? Interesting. You know, like.

• 47:22Bill Simmons?

  No, it's true.

• 47:22Chris Ryan?

  He's the kind of guy who'll cut his fingerprints off. Interesting.

• 47:25Speaker 01

  What's probably worth restating for the younger audience is that he was the star. He was the top billed star of this movie and that, speaking of professionalism with Curtis Hanson, what he could do and what he couldn't do. He was like, my deal breaker is I want unknowns, and we'll get to that in terms of these other cops, so they don't have a predisposition about them. For Dudley, I want someone that everyone thinks is the farmer in Babe. So that everyone will like him, so we'll do that misdirect. And then we'll have a movie star play Jack Vincent, and he, and he got Kevin Spacey.

• 47:52Sean Fennessey?

  He, he said he tried to get him to make it before he won For Us To Suspect. And it was winning the Oscar is I think one of the big reasons why this movie got to go. Because it wasn't gonna go just with Pierce and Crow.

• 48:03Bill Simmons?

  It was just a certain type of part, and he was the best at it. But if you put him in like The Ref as like the husband, that's, it's just not gonna work. Kim Basinger, there's two separate conversations here. Conversation number one, CR, the Catherine Trammell, would you throw your life away for this obvious stay away award? Pretty solid, pretty solid choice.

• 48:22Chris Ryan?

  It's pretty, it's, she's operating at a high level, but the Oscar.

• 48:28Bill Simmons?

  Well, that's the second conversation. She wins Supporting Actress, and if you were saying, hey, if you knew nothing, who won the Oscar? Would have been like a, kind of a fourth round pick?

• 48:39Speaker 01

  From this movie?

• 48:40Bill Simmons?

  Maybe like the ninth pick if we did a draft?

• 48:42Sean Fennessey?

  From this cast?

• 48:42Bill Simmons?

  From this cast, cinematography, director?

• 48:45Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, yeah.

• 48:46Bill Simmons?

  Adaption, you pick any category.

• 48:48Chris Ryan?

  You do Julianne Moore, I would, I personally would put Bridgette Fonda and Jackie Brown.

• 48:52Speaker 01

  Also, this was the year you were whipping votes for Gloria Stuart.

• 48:54Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 48:55Speaker 01

  I heard she was quite difficult to work.

• 48:56Bill Simmons?

  I deep that that Oscars year, but before we do, Craig, did you, were you surprised she won the Oscar for this?

• 49:02Chris Ryan?

  Shocked. I, I mean, I would have given her a razzie. I think she's probably the only character in the movie where I'm like, this takes me out of it a little bit.

• 49:11Sean Fennessey?

  I think it is like, among, among the more bizarre wins in recent Oscar history, I don't think she's bad.

• 49:18Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I think the Oscar screws up our perception of the performance.

• 49:22Sean Fennessey?

  I think if she was, if she didn't win the Oscar, you'd be like, she looks enough like Veronica Lake that this is interesting.

• 49:28Bill Simmons?

  She's the same character as the natural and the lady that introduces Redford. It's no different.

• 49:32Sean Fennessey?

  But the Oscar is just like, she has four scenes, they're fine.

• 49:36Chris Ryan?

  In the same apartment, wearing the same gown, having the same conversation four times.

• 49:40Speaker 01

  That's a lovely house in Hancock Park.

• 49:41Chris Ryan?

  Sure.

• 49:41Speaker 01

  Which I think we need to recognize.

• 49:42Bill Simmons?

  We have a whole place to talk about that. Can't wait.

• 49:45Speaker 01

  I, I was confident that was coming up, but I think that like Hanson is really good with actors and is very fond of actors. And he, he gives her opportunities to show more variety than she had been given in a lot of other parts. And certainly even what this part would suggest, like there's the moment when they're in the theater watching Roman Holiday. And Bud whispers something to her and she's a little playful and throws popcorn at him. So he's giving her a chance to succeed. But my question, Sean, as the local Oscar expert, I feel like Oscars like to do this thing where it's like, we're rooting for this person who got a chance to show us something. And it's time to reward them as the next phase of their career begins. And tip, there wasn't really a next phase for her.

• 50:25Sean Fennessey?

  Well.

• 50:26Speaker 01

  Is there precedent for that?

• 50:27Sean Fennessey?

  Usually it's when someone has made like 10 or 15 all time beloved classics. Or they've been a part of like something really special about movie history. And Kim Basinger is a beautiful star and a good actor, but like. What are her five best performances? What are the unforgettable moments in Kim Basinger movie history? You know, she's Vicky Vale. You know, she's, she's, she was a Bond girl.

• 50:48Bill Simmons?

  I was gonna say Nine and a Half.

• 50:49Sean Fennessey?

  She's in Nine and a Half Weeks, you know, which is like a good erotic thriller.

• 50:52Bill Simmons?

  It's an intense movie. Craig, you should watch that with Liz tonight. Nine and a Half Weeks, it's a rom-com.

• 50:57Sean Fennessey?

  Craig, but like, I think you're right that it almost seemed to be like, okay, well, we can't wait to see what you do next. But usually when they give someone like this an award, it's someone like Amy Madigan, right? Who's like in their sixties or seventies.

• 51:07Bill Simmons?

  And they can't wait to see what she does. We gotta go through this. I deep dove this. So she beats Joan Cusack in In-N-Out.

• 51:13Speaker 01

  Wild nomination. Good performance.

• 51:14Sean Fennessey?

  I think she's good in that movie.

• 51:15Speaker 01

  She's very good.

• 51:16Sean Fennessey?

  She's very, she plays the wife of a man who is gay, who like, isn't coming out, but is coming out. And it's like, that movie.

• 51:22Bill Simmons?

  Who's the star of that movie?

• 51:22Sean Fennessey?

  Is that Kevin Kline? Yeah.

• 51:23Speaker 01

  How's that movie aged?

• 51:24Sean Fennessey?

  I haven't seen it in a long time. It did shoot in Northport, which is the town next to me. And when it was shooting, it was like Frank Oz and Kevin Kline are making a movie next door. And it seemed like a big deal.

• 51:32Speaker 01

  You don't think Tom Selleck was the big name at that moment?

• 51:34Sean Fennessey?

  That was great casting, I thought.

• 51:36Speaker 01

  We'll do the rewatchables for AG month.

• 51:38Bill Simmons?

  Minnie Driver in Good Will Hunting?

• 51:42Sean Fennessey?

  Sure.

• 51:42Speaker 01

  Good performance. Yeah.

• 51:43Bill Simmons?

  She's, I don't think she should have won, but I thought she was good in that movie. Yes.

• 51:47Sean Fennessey?

  I think she's excellent in it. I love her.

• 51:50Bill Simmons?

  Julianne Moore in Boogie Nights? I mean, this is.

• 51:52Speaker 01

  There's your winner.

• 51:52Bill Simmons?

  What the fuck are we doing?

• 51:53Sean Fennessey?

  So fucked up.

• 51:54Bill Simmons?

  What are we doing?

• 51:55Sean Fennessey?

  So fucked up.

• 51:56Bill Simmons?

  Like, like, we should just put a thousand people to a movie theater, show Boogie Nights, and then a confidential and be like, guess who won supporting actor? It's like, it's just insane. It's a good way of putting it.

• 52:06Sean Fennessey?

  It's a great idea.

• 52:07Bill Simmons?

  I think that, uh.

• 52:08Sean Fennessey?

  Should we do like the, the Jubilee, like debate style thing with Gen Z kids, but do it for Oscars history, you know?

• 52:14Bill Simmons?

  I just have. This one isn't a debate, like Julianne Moore, her job is thirty times harder in that movie.

• 52:19Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 52:20Bill Simmons?

  I just think that movie had a little bit of a stigma. It's porn, nineties. They, they, it was just, it was on the edge. It was, had a lot of like acclaim for how, but it was a young director and they were just like, fuck that.

• 52:31Sean Fennessey?

  Lynn Bracken is also a prostitute. It's not as though it's like.

• 52:34Bill Simmons?

  I know.

• 52:34Speaker 01

  But is there, can you look at this, Sean, and like, see the gamesmanship involved? Because people, voters, like, do you think Gloria Stuart was, came in second?

• 52:42Bill Simmons?

  So Gloria Stuart was the fifth one from Titanic, the old lady. I, I. Who's still talking about Jack, who she spent a weekend with. Meanwhile, she has this whole fucking family. She's in like eighty seconds of the movie. I'd be so mad if my wife, I, Ben and I talked about this on a rewatch.

• 52:54Speaker 01

  And she dies and she remembers.

• 52:55Bill Simmons?

  I'd be so mad.

• 52:55Speaker 01

  That guy.

• 52:56Bill Simmons?

  If we lived together for sixty years, you'd remember this fucking Jack? Twenty-four hours with them.

• 53:01Sean Fennessey?

  I don't think that's why Gloria Stewart was punished and humiliated at the Academy Awards when they gave Kim Basinger this Oscar.

• 53:07Speaker 01

  But do you think that like the thinking person's voter, in this case, voted for Kim Basinger because they knew LA Confidential wasn't going to win?

• 53:13Sean Fennessey?

  I'll tell you what I think happened.

• 53:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 53:14Sean Fennessey?

  I watched a bunch of the making of documentaries that are on the Blu-ray for this movie. And in every single-

• 53:19Speaker 01

  Is that physical media?

• 53:19Sean Fennessey?

  Physical media, yes. It's a Blu-ray. Every single interview, when they are asked about Kim Basinger, just like, she's just like the best person. She's just really cool. And Danny DeVito was like, you know, she just really cares about the work and she's like a really nice person. And there's none of this weird like talking around Kevin Spacey being a maniac stuff going on in the interview.

• 53:40Chris Ryan?

  Kevin, what he did after work, I can't say.

• 53:42Bill Simmons?

  And then Kevin got a, eh, Kevin's Kevin.

• 53:48Sean Fennessey?

  So, but when you go back and look at the year, she won BAFTA, she won SAG, she won the Globe, she won everything. She dominated the season. So-

• 53:57Bill Simmons?

  Really weird.

• 53:58Sean Fennessey?

  People just like her.

• 53:58Chris Ryan?

  There should have been Twitter back then because I think they would have like been like, let's really interrogate this. Are we really gonna do this?

• 54:04Sean Fennessey?

  I guess so.

• 54:04Bill Simmons?

  I wrote down a couple more. Bridgette Fontaine and Jackie Brown. Heather Graham and Boogie Nights?

• 54:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, why not?

• 54:11Sean Fennessey?

  Sure.

• 54:12Bill Simmons?

  Sigourney Weaver and Ice Storm.

• 54:14Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah. Well, that's a good one.

• 54:15Bill Simmons?

  Parker Posey and Waiting for Guffman?

• 54:17Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 54:17Bill Simmons?

  Although the Oscars doesn't do comedies.

• 54:19Sean Fennessey?

  Yep.

• 54:20Bill Simmons?

  But I think you could make a case for all of those to at least be nominated. Really strange year.

• 54:26Bill Simmons?

  This is a new game I'm playing with IMDB's. When IMDB suggests the four movies you know the person from? What do you think IMDB says known for for James Cromwell?

• 54:36Speaker 01

  This is great.

• 54:37Chris Ryan?

  Babe, Babe Pig in the City, Eraser.

• 54:41Bill Simmons?

  You still haven't named one.

• 54:43Speaker 01

  Not one?

• 54:44Chris Ryan?

  Really?

• 54:45Speaker 01

  Does it, does TV count? Does it do TV in there?

• 54:47Sean Fennessey?

  No, I don't.

• 54:48Bill Simmons?

  It's four movies.

• 54:49Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, this is four. This is, wow, this is my new favorite game.

• 54:52Bill Simmons?

  This is a great game.

• 54:52Chris Ryan?

  Sean's gonna steal this.

• 54:54Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, I might.

• 54:57Sean Fennessey?

  I, I, he, there's a couple of animated movies he did voice performances. Were there any animated performances?

• 55:02Speaker 01

  Nope.

• 55:02Bill Simmons?

  L.A. Confidential is one.

• 55:03Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 55:03Speaker 01

  Star Trek First Contact.

• 55:06Bill Simmons?

  L.A. Confidential, I, Robot.

• 55:08Chris Ryan?

  Oh, I, Robot.

• 55:09Bill Simmons?

  The Green Mile and The Longest Yard. IMDb gave this for James Cromwell.

• 55:13Chris Ryan?

  The Longest Yard remake?

• 55:14Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and the remake.

• 55:15Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 55:16Bill Simmons?

  Come on, IMDb. You gotta do, give us a little, how is Babe not in there?

• 55:20Speaker 01

  That's not right.

• 55:21Bill Simmons?

  Babe was in, Goldman thought that was the best movie of 1993 or whatever year.

• 55:24Sean Fennessey?

  I'm shocked it's not in the top four.

• 55:26Chris Ryan?

  Do you want to talk Cromwell for a second?

• 55:29Bill Simmons?

  Incredible run by him.

• 55:30Chris Ryan?

  Did you?

• 55:30Bill Simmons?

  I thought Succession was the exclamation point.

• 55:33Chris Ryan?

  Oh, he's so good.

• 55:33Bill Simmons?

  It was a multiple exclamation point.

• 55:35Sean Fennessey?

  I'm seeing, I'm seeing Big Hero Six as number two as animated performance.

• 55:38Speaker 01

  I think that's the algorithm.

• 55:39Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 55:40Bill Simmons?

  I have that.

• 55:41Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, you're looking at Google. Sorry, I thought you were saying Letterboxd.

• 55:44Bill Simmons?

  Oh, no, I was doing IMDb.

• 55:45Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, IMDb. Okay, got it.

• 55:47Chris Ryan?

  Um, Cromwell, I assume when you watch this, you're probably like, when did you sort of feel like Dudley was, was not on the straight and narrow? When you're watching L.A. Confidential?

• 55:57Bill Simmons?

  I don't, I don't remember how I felt when I saw it in the theater.

• 55:59Chris Ryan?

  He's Satan across these four books.

• 56:02Sean Fennessey?

  That's exactly what it was.

• 56:02Bill Simmons?

  Did you know?

• 56:03Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 56:03Bill Simmons?

  Did you know he's the bad guy?

• 56:04Chris Ryan?

  And I kind of didn't really until they basically told me.

• 56:07Sean Fennessey?

  It's the only, it was the only downside of reading the book beforehand, I thought.

• 56:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 56:10Sean Fennessey?

  Because the movie handles it so well.

• 56:12Bill Simmons?

  But the casting of him was so great, because this is like three, three and a half years after Babe.

• 56:17Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 56:18Bill Simmons?

  And in general, he was always like, oh, I like that guy. He, it was like when they flipped Ronnie Cox in the late eighties.

• 56:23Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 56:24Bill Simmons?

  With Robocop.

• 56:25Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 56:25Bill Simmons?

  Like, oh, Ronnie Cox.

• 56:26Sean Fennessey?

  And friendly face. It's like, nope, I like flipping them. That's what they've done. Yeah, that's good.

• 56:30Bill Simmons?

  It's like a heel turn.

• 56:31Speaker 01

  I can remember seeing this in the theater at age 20 and being shocked, having not read the books. I, absolutely a memorable rug out from under me moment.

• 56:41Sean Fennessey?

  The, the way that they film Jack's death is really, really good. Like, it's really, really.

• 56:46Bill Simmons?

  Addiction boyo.

• 56:47Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 56:47Bill Simmons?

  He's really great in this.

• 56:48Speaker 01

  What do you think with the new strike zone, how would Cromwell fare? I mean, he's, he's six, seven, six, eight.

• 56:54Chris Ryan?

  Is he really that tall?

• 56:55Bill Simmons?

  It was, it was the biggest flaw of Succession, that him and Brian Cox were brothers.

• 56:58Speaker 01

  They couldn't even be in the same frame.

• 56:59Bill Simmons?

  He was like a foot, foot and a half taller than him.

• 57:01Speaker 01

  You would need two Brian Cox's to reach.

• 57:03Bill Simmons?

  So nine Oscar nominations. It won for adapted and it won for supporting actress. Um, you know, the best actor in a supporting role that year? Robin Williams won for Good Will Hunting, Robert Forster for Jackie Brown.

• 57:19Sean Fennessey?

  No Slender, please.

• 57:21Bill Simmons?

  Anthony Hopkins and Amistad. Greg Kinnear and As Good As It Gets is the weak one.

• 57:27Sean Fennessey?

  Terrible.

• 57:27Bill Simmons?

  That's like, that tire's just wobbling in the back. And then, uh, our guy Burt Reynolds of Boogie Nights. No John C. Riley. Uh, I think Spacey. It's kind of insane he was a nominee. I think the only reason he was nom- was a nominee was because he won.

• 57:42Sean Fennessey?

  I think so too.

• 57:42Bill Simmons?

  And they were like, fuck him.

• 57:43Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah. And two years later, he wins again for American Beauty.

• 57:45Bill Simmons?

  Best Actor.

• 57:48Bill Simmons?

  We've talked about this year before. It's a, it's a weird one where you have Peter Fonda's in there and Dustin Hoffman and Wag the Dog.

• 57:54Speaker 01

  Have you ever seen Yuli's Gold?

• 57:55Sean Fennessey?

  I have, yeah.

• 57:56Speaker 01

  Have you seen that?

• 57:56Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 57:57Speaker 01

  Is it?

• 57:57Sean Fennessey?

  It's a nice film.

• 57:58Speaker 01

  Do you prefer Yuli's Gold or Lorenzo's Oil when it comes to like ingredients you can get at Erawan?

• 58:03Bill Simmons?

  Such a deep premier magazine.

• 58:04Sean Fennessey?

  They're very different films. Uh, Lorenzo's Oil is a very traumatizing film about a family, a couple trying to find a cure for their child's illness.

• 58:13Bill Simmons?

  That is not a, not a good hang that movie.

• 58:15Sean Fennessey?

  It's really a sad film. Uh, Yuli's Gold's about a beekeeper. Who's a kindly old man who's trying to make a connection with his family.

• 58:21Bill Simmons?

  Andy likes to get a turmeric latte at Erawan with Lorenzo's Oil in it.

• 58:24Speaker 01

  I do, just like a little bit.

• 58:25Bill Simmons?

  That's what he asks for.

• 58:25Speaker 01

  Some people get a cream top latte, not me.

• 58:27Chris Ryan?

  I think they could have named that movie a little bit better.

• 58:29Sean Fennessey?

  Lorenzo's Oil.

• 58:30Chris Ryan?

  Because it makes it sound like it's like a landman, you know, like.

• 58:33Speaker 01

  It makes it sound like Boogie Nights.

• 58:37Speaker 01

  It's the eighties, we gotta start using Lorenzo's Oil.

• 58:39Sean Fennessey?

  They renamed Flirt-a-Lee Lorenzo's Oil.

• 58:41Bill Simmons?

  Like I'm always talking about.

• 58:44Bill Simmons?

  So if you had say Crow for Best Actor, Guy Pearce for Supporting, or Spacey for Supporting, and you could only give one nom.

• 58:51Sean Fennessey?

  It feels like the rare actor, actor for Pierce and Crow. Like two best actors.

• 58:56Bill Simmons?

  Interesting.

• 58:56Sean Fennessey?

  And that only happened a couple of times, right?

• 58:59Bill Simmons?

  So who is, but who would you go with between Crow and Pierce?

• 59:02Chris Ryan?

  Pierce.

• 59:03Sean Fennessey?

  Probably Pierce too.

• 59:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:05Speaker 01

  You'd give Pierce the Oscar nomination over Russell Crowe for this movie?

• 59:08Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 59:08Bill Simmons?

  I think that's the right call.

• 59:09Chris Ryan?

  I also would, I also think Russell Crowe was gonna.

• 59:12Bill Simmons?

  Could have done both. Could have been like when we have two guards and all NBA together.

• 59:16Chris Ryan?

  Bud, but I think it shows a little bit more that he is. Not American, like I, I think his accent and his manner sometimes comes across as a little like, I'm still on the set of Virtuosity. I think Pierce is incredible.

• 59:31Bill Simmons?

  A hundred and thirty-eight minutes, Craig plus thirty-eight.

• 59:35Speaker 04

  There's just a lot of food on the plate. I don't think you could have, you couldn't make the same movie for an hour and forty minutes. That's just like not possible, but this did feel a little long to me.

• 59:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I did have a horrifying thought that you could have easily done this as a six-episode drama. And there's like specific cuts.

• 59:51Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but you would need to have, if you were to, I, I, please, anybody.

• 59:54Bill Simmons?

  I was just thinking like, there is like natural like cliffhangers.

• 59:57Chris Ryan?

  They've tried making this as a TV show. Nobody has the stomach.

• 1:00:01Sean Fennessey?

  Shut the fuck up about making this a TV show.

• 1:00:04Speaker 04

  I'm usually never a TV show guy, but what is going on here?

• 1:00:07Bill Simmons?

  This IP is off limits.

• 1:00:08Chris Ryan?

  Anybody to do Elroy unless you've got the stomach to like do Elroy.

• 1:00:11Speaker 04

  Well, we have, we have the evidence. They tried to make this TV show twice, available times.

• 1:00:15Speaker 01

  Perhaps what's a better way to do it, to express this.

• 1:00:18Bill Simmons?

  He's so sad.

• 1:00:19Speaker 04

  This is Eli confidential.

• 1:00:21Speaker 01

  Look what we used to be able to do. Like there are, what this movie does with like ellipses, with like just assuming you're gonna get there of condensing time of showing you the five most interesting moments in this character's journey is remarkable. And I went into the, I, I was reading the, the shooting script to see if there were like, you know, novelistic disquisitions about whatever. Hundred percent no. The things that got cut were like the two things that I have in my nitpicks of what I wish were in the movie. Like it started with the more stuff about the freeway. Like it was just more context, table-setting stuff. Or you came into a scene a little bit before. Like I think it starts with um, Johnny Stompanato and Bud and Stenzlin.

• 1:01:01Bill Simmons?

  Johnny Stomps.

• 1:01:01Speaker 01

  So there's more of that and you, and, and you, the payoff in the movie where he's like, I don't need your twenty bucks. I'm not a rat anymore. The first scene is him accepting twenty bucks from Bud and Stenzlin to be a rat. But you don't need it.

• 1:01:12Sean Fennessey?

  I think if you told me that the same way that this is a movie made by really, really gifted craftspeople and like veteran filmmakers, if it was like, okay, Matthew Weiner or Vince Gilligan are taking on it. The works of James Elroy.

• 1:01:25Bill Simmons?

  I'm vetoing it.

• 1:01:26Sean Fennessey?

  That would be, I would at least more open to that, but if it's just like.

• 1:01:29Bill Simmons?

  Can't.

• 1:01:29Sean Fennessey?

  Coming to CBS, Sunday nights, LA Confidential. If the movie.

• 1:01:34Speaker 01

  I'm ready.

• 1:01:35Bill Simmons?

  No, the movie's at a certain level. I don't think you can do it. I think it's off limits. Like, they made a fucking Boogie Nights TV show.

• 1:01:41Chris Ryan?

  But obviously it is very.

• 1:01:42Bill Simmons?

  You can't.

• 1:01:43Chris Ryan?

  People are very tempted. Like, Dahlia got made, they've wanted to make White Jazz. I think Big Nowhere would be incredible.

• 1:01:49Bill Simmons?

  Wouldn't the movie be to just do, it's a, each season is a different Elroy novel and you just basically do that?

• 1:01:55Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 1:01:56Speaker 01

  You Castle Rock, but Elroy.

• 1:01:57Sean Fennessey?

  It would be cool because of the way that all of the characters intersect. You know, famously, or infamously, Dudley survives LA Confidential. And like Chris said, he kind of hovers over the trilogy, the quartet of books. And so if you had like one amazing, if you had like John Malkovich as Dudley Smith across four seasons of TV, and it's 12 episodes each, and they're each an adaptation of the novels, and all the novels are long, that would be interesting, but it just has to be like the most talented adapter of that kind of work in the world, and maybe it's any.

• 1:02:25Bill Simmons?

  Well, the other problem would be, they'd be shooting it in Vancouver, because we have a terrible mayor and a terrible governor, and we can't shoot shit in here, because the whole film industry has gone to shit. We're gonna take a break and come back.

• 1:02:37Speaker 06

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• 1:04:04Speaker 05

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• 1:04:09Bill Simmons?

  All right, so $35 million budget made $126.2 million LA Confidential. Rodger Ebert, four stars. LA Confidential is seductive and beautiful, cynical and twisted, and one of the best films of the year.

• 1:04:21Chris Ryan?

  No shit.

• 1:04:22Bill Simmons?

  Raj. Raj has been on fire in 2026.

• 1:04:25Chris Ryan?

  You could have blindfolded me and I would have said pretty much that. That would be his review.

• 1:04:31Speaker 01

  Did your dad review this?

• 1:04:33Chris Ryan?

  I don't know. Probably.

• 1:04:35Bill Simmons?

  I had too many rewatchable scenes. I'll go through, I'll go fast. Crow meets Basinger the first time. Exley shows up at the Night Owl Coffee Shop after all the murders and then they take the picture after. He's like, hold on, let me take my glasses off for this great shot. Crow goes to Basinger's house. She came on a bus with Dreams to Hollywood and this is how it turned out. Thanks to Pierce, we still get to act a little.

• 1:04:59Speaker 01

  To be fair, she took a bus from Echo Park to Hollywood. Her mother lives, you know.

• 1:05:04Bill Simmons?

  I do like you're the first person in five years who didn't tell me I look like Veronica Lake.

• 1:05:08Chris Ryan?

  It's like you look better, right?

• 1:05:09Bill Simmons?

  Really good move by, by our guy. The interrogation scene, can we talk about this quick?

• 1:05:14Speaker 01

  Why quick?

• 1:05:15Bill Simmons?

  This scene's a fucking banger.

• 1:05:16Chris Ryan?

  It's a masterpiece of Folgers. Yeah.

• 1:05:18Sean Fennessey?

  It's probably my favorite. I think it's my favorite.

• 1:05:21Speaker 01

  And just to be clear, where are we putting the parentheticals? Interrogation into Bud going to solve the real crime?

• 1:05:27Chris Ryan?

  You can have that, but it's just Exley moving from room to room, Bud with the chair. Dudley and Jack, the sort of deep focus shots. It's just all the reflective stuff that they're doing. It's so awesome.

• 1:05:39Bill Simmons?

  Just quickly, Bud kills the rapist, almost fights with Exley. Exley kills three guys, becomes Shotgun Eddie. We have a couple of good action scenes. The Rollo Tomasi story.

• 1:05:51Bill Simmons?

  The two Johnny Stompanato scenes, which I'm just lumping together because we get, what do I get if I give you your balls back, you wop cocksucker?

• 1:06:01Bill Simmons?

  Could you hear the word "wop" again? I'm half Italian, I could joke about it. Uh, and then the she is Lana Turner and we get to see the Formosa Cafe. Yeah. Then we get Lynn Bracken, seduces Exley, and then Smith shoots Hollywood Jack, and then the Rollo reveal, all in a row. Um, see here, I have a question. The shocking Kevin Spacey death scene, after Cromwell goes heel,

• 1:06:28Bill Simmons?

  the Rollo Tomasi, the way he says it and then dies, is that eligible for the Jesse Eisenberg? That's good, you should be proud of that right there. Don't worry if you don't make it any further award for best line reading.

• 1:06:37Chris Ryan?

  Funny you said that, because I have, that was gonna be my flex, but it was a different Spacey line.

• 1:06:41Bill Simmons?

  Oh, well, save it, okay. Do you like that new category?

• 1:06:44Speaker 01

  I'm excited. There are a lot of, I gotta say, it's been a minute, there are a lot of new categories.

• 1:06:47Chris Ryan?

  We've been iterating.

• 1:06:48Speaker 01

  There's a little category creep, a little bit.

• 1:06:50Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, no comment. Um...

• 1:06:52Bill Simmons?

  I like to have a lot of choices. It's like a big diner. Just kind of, if you just have, you want a corned beef sandwich?

• 1:06:58Speaker 04

  The factory menu, yeah.

• 1:07:00Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:00Sean Fennessey?

  You're, but like, how often when you go to a diner are you changing up the order? Because like, the thing about a diner is, you find what you like, and you stick by it, right?

• 1:07:10Chris Ryan?

  Fine, I'll cut the flex categories down. I like trying to challenge myself to like, I, I think the thing that's weird about...

• 1:07:14Sean Fennessey?

  How often will you get sushi at a diner?

• 1:07:16Speaker 04

  It's like specials, you get any specials today.

• 1:07:18Chris Ryan?

  Right?

• 1:07:19Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, sometimes.

• 1:07:20Chris Ryan?

  Sometimes, right?

• 1:07:21Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:21Speaker 01

  You got them.

• 1:07:22Bill Simmons?

  If you're doing the specials, fine.

• 1:07:23Speaker 04

  Bill should start each pod by reading the specials, which is the new categories for the episode.

• 1:07:27Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, that's a good idea. I like that.

• 1:07:28Chris Ryan?

  That's good.

• 1:07:29Bill Simmons?

  I have a cream of broccoli?

• 1:07:30Sean Fennessey?

  Um, can I just add one or two?

• 1:07:33Bill Simmons?

  Well, I'm not done yet.

• 1:07:34Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, you're still going.

• 1:07:34Bill Simmons?

  Bud finds the photos, Danny DeVito's trunk.

• 1:07:38Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:39Bill Simmons?

  Tough one.

• 1:07:40Sean Fennessey?

  Convenient.

• 1:07:40Bill Simmons?

  He thought it was of him. No, it's not of you, it's of Exley.

• 1:07:43Sean Fennessey?

  Hmm.

• 1:07:44Bill Simmons?

  Uh...

• 1:07:44Sean Fennessey?

  That's like when I see social clips of the Watch, and I'm like, no, Chris, Chris.

• 1:07:49Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 1:07:50Speaker 01

  Then you come chasing him down on the Pasadena commute.

• 1:07:54Bill Simmons?

  And then Bud versus Exley, where it seems like Bud's gonna kill him, and then they decide to work together. Bud tortures the DA for answers, which includes the combo toilet dunk, legs dangle outside the window. We don't get that often.

• 1:08:07Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:08:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, one, but not both.

• 1:08:09Chris Ryan?

  Incredible riff.

• 1:08:10Bill Simmons?

  The big shootout at the end.

• 1:08:12Chris Ryan?

  Victory motel.

• 1:08:13Bill Simmons?

  CRO is, talks about situational awareness with action scenes. Tight spaces where the camera is, can follow where everybody is. It's a good one for that.

• 1:08:22Chris Ryan?

  It's really good. Yeah. And it's, it's a, it almost feels a little bit premature. Like when you're watching the movie, you're like, oh.

• 1:08:31Bill Simmons?

  We're doing this now.

• 1:08:32Chris Ryan?

  This is the big shootout. We're done. Okay. Cause in the book, I feel like you're like, it's just like, you know, and the Victory Motel shootout isn't quite the same in the book and stuff like that. There's like a train and shit, but yeah.

• 1:08:43Bill Simmons?

  Also Crow, some of his gun work in this movie leads to proof of life three years later.

• 1:08:48Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 1:08:48Bill Simmons?

  A lot of people don't make that point.

• 1:08:49Chris Ryan?

  I was just having a conversation about this the other day.

• 1:08:52Bill Simmons?

  With Meg Ryan?

• 1:08:52Chris Ryan?

  Um, you know, since the emergence of wearing the tactical bulletproof vest, I think we've seen a different kind of like gun acting going on.

• 1:09:02Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:02Chris Ryan?

  And it's also like, especially since John Wick.

• 1:09:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:05Chris Ryan?

  But between this and, uh, uh, To Live and Die in L.A., I kind of miss guys running around with a revolver shaking everywhere. You know, like, where it's like Pankow jumping over something and being like, hey.

• 1:09:19Bill Simmons?

  I forgot to tell you, I was watching the first eight episodes of Miami Vice again because they're on Tubi. Pankow is in Glades.

• 1:09:28Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I know.

• 1:09:28Bill Simmons?

  Couldn't, there was a Pankow, like a Pankow rejuvenation in Glades.

• 1:09:32Chris Ryan?

  I was gonna text you about this, but I was like, I don't, I don't want to bother him with, about Pankow.

• 1:09:35Bill Simmons?

  You can never bother me with Miami Vice.

• 1:09:37Sean Fennessey?

  Two guys and one girl, and then the two guys realize they love each other at the same time. And the girl's like, hey, but we're the one girl.

• 1:09:45Bill Simmons?

  Listen, Tubi's flexible for us.

• 1:09:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:49Bill Simmons?

  Whole, whole series is there. We talking about the Pankow sons? Cousin Ira?

• 1:09:53Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:54Bill Simmons?

  Pankow had a tough pod run to live and die in L.A.

• 1:09:56Chris Ryan?

  You gave him a tough time. I think I liked him.

• 1:09:58Sean Fennessey?

  I was kinda with Bill. I see both sides.

• 1:10:02Bill Simmons?

  Didn't have the balls to jump on the Pankow recasting bandwagon, but was hinting.

• 1:10:05Sean Fennessey?

  I was.

• 1:10:06Bill Simmons?

  You were more on my side than Ciar.

• 1:10:07Chris Ryan?

  Did you get a note in your mailbox from Billy Peterson about, he's like, hey, love your work?

• 1:10:12Bill Simmons?

  No, he's just, all he does is just roll in piles of money. Yeah.

• 1:10:15Speaker 01

  That's great. Never heard of podcasting.

• 1:10:17Bill Simmons?

  He has a swimming pool with just twenty dollar bills in it. He just dives into it. Uncle Scrooge is it all day. Just swims around and watches the bills flap.

• 1:10:24Chris Ryan?

  So what's your?

• 1:10:25Bill Simmons?

  What did you, what scenes did you have that I didn't mention?

• 1:10:27Sean Fennessey?

  Well, we mentioned it, but when Exley and Bud and Vincennes go into the DA's office or the captain's office, and they're being kind of confronted with, will you rat? The way that those three scenes are cut, another amazing Spacey performance when he is told that he's gonna have the show taken away from him, just on his face is amazing. And then putting Ed behind the mirror and observing when Jack is being interrogated. I think that whole section is so smart and kinda like, that's when the movie coalesces and you're like, oh, it's these three guys. Like, this is really what this movie is about, isn't it? These three cops.

• 1:10:57Bill Simmons?

  What did you have for most rewatchable?

• 1:10:59Speaker 01

  You named them all, but it's the interrogation scene for me.

• 1:11:02Chris Ryan?

  It's the interrogation.

• 1:11:03Speaker 01

  It jumps up such a level and to see, it's always fun when the audience gets put in the same position as some of the characters when Jack says, are you sure College Boy is up to this? And he's like, I think you'll be surprised with what the boy is capable of.

• 1:11:15Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:16Speaker 01

  And we all lean in being like, oh, I guess we're about to be surprised. And then I didn't, has there been other precedent of the manipulation of the live mic in an interrogation scene?

• 1:11:24Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 1:11:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, he's conducting it. He's like Dudamel in there. He's a god.

• 1:11:28Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. He's like, he's making sure that the other guys can hear certain things that the other, the other.

• 1:11:33Speaker 01

  And really good Foley on the snap of the switch. He's really, everything is so.

• 1:11:36Bill Simmons?

  I had that in what's aged the best is when College Boy was an insult.

• 1:11:41Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:11:42Bill Simmons?

  In like the 40s, 50s, 60s, like, oh, look at College Boy. We just don't have, we've lost College Boy. I don't know what it is now. Like Masters Boy?

• 1:11:50Sean Fennessey?

  Doesn't have the same ring.

• 1:11:51Bill Simmons?

  P G D boy.

• 1:11:52Chris Ryan?

  Guy, I don't know.

• 1:11:54Bill Simmons?

  Just the era where you would make fun of somebody for pursuing higher education just somehow somehow.

• 1:11:59Chris Ryan?

  I feel like it's like that was for a minute. People were calling guys libs. That was like sort of, hey, they're gonna let the lib.

• 1:12:06Speaker 01

  So that's the most lib thing I've ever heard. You think that's over lib?

• 1:12:09Bill Simmons?

  Over lib.

• 1:12:10Speaker 01

  They're like, I was at Air One today and no one was calling me a lib.

• 1:12:13Chris Ryan?

  Libs are back, man.

• 1:12:15Bill Simmons?

  So we all have the, we all have the interrogation.

• 1:12:18Chris Ryan?

  Uh, I have the interrogation.

• 1:12:19Bill Simmons?

  Interesting.

• 1:12:20Sean Fennessey?

  I have one other small one, which is Bud visiting Pierce Patchett for the first time.

• 1:12:23Chris Ryan?

  God, such a good scene.

• 1:12:24Sean Fennessey?

  I love that scene. We have not talked about Pierce Patchett and just like.

• 1:12:28Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Strathairn, come on.

• 1:12:29Sean Fennessey?

  Strathairn is so good in this movie too.

• 1:12:31Bill Simmons?

  Our guy.

• 1:12:31Chris Ryan?

  Dion, Dion Dave.

• 1:12:33Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, okay. Well, I don't, I don't want to piss on it.

• 1:12:35Chris Ryan?

  But he's so good in, he can do that in any movie. Sneakers, like whatever, like.

• 1:12:40Bill Simmons?

  One of my favorite I M D Bs, including he's in the best Miami Vice episode ever. Our Straits Brothers in Arms.

• 1:12:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:49Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 1:12:49Bill Simmons?

  The third episode of season two.

• 1:12:51Speaker 01

  Just keep you in.

• 1:12:53Sean Fennessey?

  Cut the energy.

• 1:12:53Bill Simmons?

  Him and Bruce McCall.

• 1:12:55Chris Ryan?

  Yep. McGill. McGill?

• 1:12:58Bill Simmons?

  Bruce McGill.

• 1:12:58Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:59Bill Simmons?

  Bruce McCall.

• 1:13:00Chris Ryan?

  Bruce McCall.

• 1:13:01Bill Simmons?

  Bruce McGill.

• 1:13:02Chris Ryan?

  New coach of Creighton.

• 1:13:06Bill Simmons?

  I was watching, uh, Bruce McGill in a really terrible Bruce Willis movie that I like. Can you guess?

• 1:13:12Sean Fennessey?

  The Color of Night?

• 1:13:13Chris Ryan?

  Castle?

• 1:13:14Bill Simmons?

  Nope.

• 1:13:15Sean Fennessey?

  Is it, uh, Hudson Hawk?

• 1:13:16Bill Simmons?

  Bruce McGill, Bruce Willis.

• 1:13:20Bill Simmons?

  Sarah Jessica Parker.

• 1:13:21Chris Ryan?

  Oh, the Striking Distance?

• 1:13:23Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah. This is the boat, right?

• 1:13:25Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:25Speaker 01

  Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh boat cops.

• 1:13:27Bill Simmons?

  Disgraced cop doing now like Pittsburgh Coast Guard.

• 1:13:30Chris Ryan?

  Pittsburgh what In-N-Out was to Long Island. People in Pittsburgh were like, striking distance.

• 1:13:34Bill Simmons?

  Willis was here. Willis was having a.

• 1:13:37Sean Fennessey?

  I kind of like that movie.

• 1:13:38Chris Ryan?

  Made it all the way to Philly.

• 1:13:39Bill Simmons?

  It's good.

• 1:13:39Sean Fennessey?

  The third act where it's like all in that one boat and he's gonna get move around the boat, but he's being spotted. Yeah, I saw it.

• 1:13:45Bill Simmons?

  It checks some boxes. I'll tell you that much. Cops not liking each other. There's disgraced cops.

• 1:13:51Chris Ryan?

  Pennsylvania.

• 1:13:52Sean Fennessey?

  Come on.

• 1:13:53Chris Ryan?

  N A P.

• 1:13:54Sean Fennessey?

  It's right in the heart of the Barry Bonds era too, is it not?

• 1:13:56Bill Simmons?

  It's like early nights.

• 1:13:57Chris Ryan?

  Oh, it's the Killer Bees.

• 1:13:58Bill Simmons?

  It's pretty good.

• 1:13:58Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:58Chris Ryan?

  Benea, or was it?

• 1:13:59Sean Fennessey?

  Well, Benea was on the Mets at this point, I think. Sad. I still is. A O, Philly guy with the most Philly joke of all time.

• 1:14:05Bill Simmons?

  When I'm hosting Tubi Classics in seven years.

• 1:14:08Sean Fennessey?

  C R month will allow it.

• 1:14:10Chris Ryan?

  The only other thing I would shoot out for odd is like a rewatchable. I have the interrogation scene. You know what's fucking great is the post Exley shootout montage that they do to skip ahead time where it's like, Exley gets promoted, Jack returns to Badge of Honor, Bud goes like continues to see Lynn. And then you get like, um, you know, Bud keeps beating up all of the mobsters moving in on Mickey's turf and the 10 opens.

• 1:14:36Bill Simmons?

  Those montages can go the wrong way. That one works.

• 1:14:39Chris Ryan?

  It really does.

• 1:14:40Bill Simmons?

  But I think it got, it's probably the worst part of The Godfather when it, Pacino.

• 1:14:44Chris Ryan?

  Oh, it's just the newspapers?

• 1:14:45Bill Simmons?

  Michael kills McCloskey and Solozzo and then it's like, it's like playing this carnival music and they're just showing newspapers.

• 1:14:52Speaker 01

  The other, the other risk, the other risk you run is like driving the bus past something you actually wish you could stop and get out and spend more time in.

• 1:14:58Chris Ryan?

  Like the Santa Monica freeway.

• 1:14:59Speaker 01

  Well, on the Santa Monica freeway, two Pierce Padgett's gender bending champagne parties.

• 1:15:03Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 1:15:04Speaker 01

  Which really, like they, they had a location.

• 1:15:06Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:07Speaker 01

  You know, they brought in the cabaret dancers.

• 1:15:09Bill Simmons?

  They might bring those back.

• 1:15:11Speaker 01

  Those parties?

• 1:15:11Chris Ryan?

  Gender bending parties at your house?

• 1:15:12Bill Simmons?

  Just, I might do have a Pierce Padgett party.

• 1:15:15Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:16Speaker 01

  You should.

• 1:15:16Bill Simmons?

  Just like guys, no limits tonight.

• 1:15:18Chris Ryan?

  Just a bunch of chicks wearing clutch sweatshirts.

• 1:15:20Bill Simmons?

  Cut like modern actresses, which is, we just go for it.

• 1:15:23Sean Fennessey?

  I'm listening. I'm listening.

• 1:15:26Chris Ryan?

  Just a bunch of chicks wearing clutch sweatshirts.

• 1:15:31Chris Ryan?

  I was like, nothing.

• 1:15:34Bill Simmons?

  Craig's already RSVP'd now. Uh, what's the most 1997 thing about this movie? Tough one, cause it's set in the 50s, but it's, it's gotta be Young Crow, right?

• 1:15:43Chris Ryan?

  Uh.

• 1:15:44Bill Simmons?

  Would you say anything else?

• 1:15:45Sean Fennessey?

  On the poster?

• 1:15:45Speaker 01

  Kevin Spacey as a leading villain.

• 1:15:47Bill Simmons?

  Kevin Spacey on the posters.

• 1:15:48Chris Ryan?

  A-list species, probably.

• 1:15:50Speaker 01

  And I had, this is to, not to piss Sean off, but I had that this is a movie in the first place is the most deeply 1997 thing about it. Because this would be, this is a TV show.

• 1:15:58Bill Simmons?

  What streamer would this be on?

• 1:16:00Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 1:16:01Sean Fennessey?

  I don't know, man. We're just, we're coming off Project Hail Mary. Book adaptations are back. Like this is, this is the way with movies is adapt these really good novels into movies. This was how it was for like 40 years in Hollywood.

• 1:16:12Speaker 01

  But this was not a popcorn slam dunk, beetroot bestseller.

• 1:16:15Sean Fennessey?

  True, true.

• 1:16:17Bill Simmons?

  Do you guys want to hear my son's review in the kitchen of Project Hail Mary?

• 1:16:20Chris Ryan?

  Sure.

• 1:16:20Bill Simmons?

  Did I tell you this?

• 1:16:21Sean Fennessey?

  You texted it to me, yeah.

• 1:16:22Bill Simmons?

  He was like, how was it? And he said, it sucked. It's like, really? It sucked? People like, he's like, no, it was good.

• 1:16:31Bill Simmons?

  It sucked, but it was really good. It kept my interest. And I'm glad I saw it in the theater. I was like, it sounds like you liked it. He's like, no, I liked it.

• 1:16:39Bill Simmons?

  I was like, we gotta work.

• 1:16:40Chris Ryan?

  Do you think he was intimidated by thinking he was going against conventional wisdom?

• 1:16:43Bill Simmons?

  I think he was trying to zag, cuz I don't know what he was thinking. We're still working on him.

• 1:16:48Sean Fennessey?

  I do, to his credit, there's that thing where the expectations are really high for a movie and you're like, this did not meet the expectations.

• 1:16:54Bill Simmons?

  That's where we landed. Yeah.

• 1:16:56Sean Fennessey?

  It's good and I appreciate it, but it's not.

• 1:16:58Bill Simmons?

  The next thing he said was, it wasn't like 2001.

• 1:17:02Chris Ryan?

  That's his favorite movie. Yeah.

• 1:17:03Speaker 01

  That's true, though.

• 1:17:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't gonna be 2001, Ben. So we're working. He's only 18. We're in progress. Uh, special category I threw in, the Floyd Gondoli Butter in My Ass and Lollipops in My Mouth Award for something I just enjoy. I like scared characters with a puddle of pee underneath them.

• 1:17:22Chris Ryan?

  We get two in this.

• 1:17:23Bill Simmons?

  Oh, home run. Every time.

• 1:17:25Chris Ryan?

  If someone pisses themselves, it means it's a good movie.

• 1:17:27Speaker 01

  I didn't think they'd go back to the well, so to speak.

• 1:17:29Bill Simmons?

  You know somebody scared when they're just, the pee's running down their leg, or there's pee under their seat? It's the last level of fear.

• 1:17:37Speaker 01

  Craig, don't put the cameras down beneath this table.

• 1:17:41Chris Ryan?

  That's how I felt when you guys asked me if I liked Proof of Life.

• 1:17:45Bill Simmons?

  Craig, you like Proof of Life. You just don't know it yet.

• 1:17:47Chris Ryan?

  My Gondoli was Cadillac Eldorado's driving around L.A. In the 1950s. It's pretty cool. I just go for it.

• 1:17:55Bill Simmons?

  Would Jeff for What's Aged the Best, Andy?

• 1:17:57Speaker 01

  What's Aged the Best? I was, I thought your Floyd Gondoli would be like, a group of men being told to go out and like, pursue justice without mercy. Like, that is just such a slam dunk for you.

• 1:18:07Bill Simmons?

  That is.

• 1:18:09Speaker 01

  What's Aged the Best, um, well, we already said, uh, racial profiling is an attempt to project dominance and safety in a community. Going great. Um, I thought, uh, audiences' willingness to explore twisty morality genre tales, just not in movie theaters. Uh, you had tabloid culture. Um, I feel like, I feel like L.A. is still a rough adjustment for some outsiders. You don't usually get pulled into the victory motel.

• 1:18:33Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 1:18:33Speaker 01

  But, you know, emotionally, it can be a tough adjustment.

• 1:18:35Chris Ryan?

  That's what working above Herbalife was, Grantland.

• 1:18:38Speaker 01

  That's right. That's right.

• 1:18:39Chris Ryan?

  It was kind of our victory motel.

• 1:18:44Bill Simmons?

  What'd you have?

• 1:18:46Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, uh, well, my gondoli is when a seemingly kindly old Irishman is the most evil person in the movie. Which is also, we find that in The Town as well, of course. There's many such examples. And this one has a great one in Dudley. But what's aged the best is, there was a really good interview with Hanson, where he said, "I love characters who only have one scene, but they're the star of that scene." And this movie is a great example of that. And there's a handful of actors, when we get into some of the other character categories, we can talk about. But that's a really clever idea that I think has been dispensed with a bit over the last 25 years.

• 1:19:21Bill Simmons?

  Tarantino bought in with The Watkins.

• 1:19:23Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 1:19:24Speaker 01

  But it's like the coroner. The coroner like has a, he's had a whole day before Budweiser walked into his office.

• 1:19:28Sean Fennessey?

  I mean, Stenzland is a great example of a character. When he's in the scene, he's the star of that scene.

• 1:19:32Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's right.

• 1:19:33Bill Simmons?

  That's a good one. What do you have, Sierra?

• 1:19:34Chris Ryan?

  For best?

• 1:19:35Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:36Chris Ryan?

  Pierce Patchett as a proto Epstein, enriching himself, exerting control from the shadows, using blackmail.

• 1:19:44Chris Ryan?

  This is more of like a movie thing. I think for the novel readers, they're a little like, alright. But Dudley telling Exley he'll never be a great cop unless he can shoot a criminal in the back in order to get justice. And that's exactly how Exley kills Dudley.

• 1:19:59Bill Simmons?

  I had that as well.

• 1:19:59Chris Ryan?

  And just like the balls on these guys to do the Dudley, to make Dudley like a twist, rather than going into it, we all know Dudley is like the dark prince of Los Angeles. And instead, it's like, holy shit, this guy is taking over for Mickey Cohen.

• 1:20:14Bill Simmons?

  I have corrupt L.A. cops, which you mentioned. I love movies where the police department hates one of their own cops.

• 1:20:21Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:20:22Bill Simmons?

  Always works.

• 1:20:23Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, shunning him.

• 1:20:24Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and there's like, they're in groups and he's coming around the corner and they're just kinda stink eyeing him.

• 1:20:28Sean Fennessey?

  Serpico, yeah.

• 1:20:29Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's, that always works for me.

• 1:20:30Chris Ryan?

  I was kinda like, there's, I don't ever wanna use Sora, the AI video thing.

• 1:20:36Bill Simmons?

  But?

• 1:20:37Chris Ryan?

  But I kinda wanna put Inspector Todd in L.A. Confidential. Is that that fucking Exley out there?

• 1:20:45Chris Ryan?

  Hi guys.

• 1:20:46Bill Simmons?

  Just put him in every cop movie?

• 1:20:49Chris Ryan?

  Increase racial harmony within the LAPD, yeah.

• 1:20:53Bill Simmons?

  Talking about getting plastic surgery is having you cut? I think we just need to bring it back.

• 1:20:57Sean Fennessey?

  That just come back, yeah.

• 1:20:59Chris Ryan?

  You're gonna have me cut to look like Nick Wright?

• 1:21:03Chris Ryan?

  Where's Chris been?

• 1:21:06Sean Fennessey?

  Why does Chris have so many chief's opinions?

• 1:21:08Chris Ryan?

  Why does Chris have a QB tier? Is Chris okay?

• 1:21:13Bill Simmons?

  DeVito, I mean, I know it's the 50s, so you can get away with it, you couldn't now, but when he rips off the back to back, "Did you know the DA is a swish?", and then he does the Reynolds as an AC dosey, two phrases nobody's said in 50 years?

• 1:21:27Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:27Bill Simmons?

  Just, I thought it was a...

• 1:21:29Sean Fennessey?

  There's a lot of colorful Elroy-isms in the book too that are, you don't hear too often.

• 1:21:35Bill Simmons?

  And then Russell Crowe said that L. Wright told him Budweiser doesn't drink, so Crowe didn't drink during the entire shoot and described it as the most painful period of his life.

• 1:21:46Bill Simmons?

  And not ironically.

• 1:21:49Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, probably why he looks great by the end of the movie.

• 1:21:51Chris Ryan?

  I mean, he legendarily like builds his own bar at set, like he has like a pub set up, or he did.

• 1:21:59Bill Simmons?

  Who did, so the best all-time drunk actors? Quentin Jaws is number one.

• 1:22:05Sean Fennessey?

  We said Robert Shaw.

• 1:22:05Bill Simmons?

  He died when he was like 34.

• 1:22:07Sean Fennessey?

  Richard Harrison and Oliver.

• 1:22:09Chris Ryan?

  Tom Cruise and Oliver Reed.

• 1:22:11Bill Simmons?

  Oliver Reed was another, he died during Gladiator.

• 1:22:14Sean Fennessey?

  Sterling Hayden.

• 1:22:15Bill Simmons?

  Sterling Hayden.

• 1:22:15Sean Fennessey?

  Long goodbye, didn't even look at the script. Yes, famously huge drunk.

• 1:22:19Chris Ryan?

  Peter O'Toole in Lion and Winter.

• 1:22:21Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I mean, throughout his entire career as well.

• 1:22:24Chris Ryan?

  Robert Mitchum? Yeah. Incredible Mitchum story. Mitchum wouldn't do Saturday Night Live unless they gave him a case of Jose Cuervo Golds. But he wouldn't go on.

• 1:22:35Bill Simmons?

  That's silver, I'm not doing it. Nick Nolte was a famous one.

• 1:22:38Sean Fennessey?

  That's a good one. I mean, Colin Farrell, you know, our beloved Colin Farrell for a time, you know, he was.

• 1:22:43Bill Simmons?

  Andy, could this be in a Ringer podcast for you where each episode is just a history of a drunk actor?

• 1:22:48Sean Fennessey?

  Sure, yeah. Do we do the full arc of the character?

• 1:22:51Bill Simmons?

  Remember how much time we spent talking about Robert Shaw and the Jaws?

• 1:22:55Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:55Bill Simmons?

  We spent like 20 minutes, he was daring Dreyfus to climb up on top of the boat. Shane Ham and Dreyfus was gonna do it. Spielberg had to step in because he was gonna die. Did you ask Spielberg about that?

• 1:23:06Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, we talked about it at length. It was roughly 50 minutes of our conversation, which is about Robert Shaw being shitfaced during the making of Jaws.

• 1:23:12Bill Simmons?

  What would it be now, Craig? Just somebody who took too many gummies? Who?

• 1:23:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, overdosing on CBD during a pod.

• 1:23:20Bill Simmons?

  And just...

• 1:23:21Speaker 01

  Soft.

• 1:23:21Bill Simmons?

  Again, we knew, we used to know how to make things in this country. We used to be able to really be belligerently drunk on movie sets.

• 1:23:27Sean Fennessey?

  Cut women so that they could work in brothels modeled on movie stars.

• 1:23:31Speaker 01

  Now, to be fair, uh, Kim Basinger has not been cut. We should be clear.

• 1:23:36Sean Fennessey?

  She's not.

• 1:23:36Bill Simmons?

  She dyed her hair a tiny bit.

• 1:23:38Speaker 01

  Pride of Bisbee, Arizona.

• 1:23:40Bill Simmons?

  Sierra, what do you have for Great Shot Gordo?

• 1:23:42Chris Ryan?

  Uh, all the stuff in the interrogation scene before Exley goes in, there's like a great one of Jack in the front of the frame, Dudley in mid. Exley is reflected off the glass and you can see into the interrogation booth to see the kid waiting for them. And it's just like, these guys are spinati.

• 1:23:58Bill Simmons?

  It's funny, I was watching the movie thinking that was like minus 250 on FanDuel, that that was gonna be Sierra's Gordo. Did you have a different one? You love reflection shots. I do. You're a big reflection guy.

• 1:24:07Sean Fennessey?

  Multiple split diopter shots in the movie. Mul- like three, I think.

• 1:24:10Speaker 01

  Name them.

• 1:24:11Sean Fennessey?

  Um, well, one in particular, when Exley and Bud burst into the DA's office, they show Rifkin in the background and Bud in the foreground. And like, it's just, it jumps out at you. Um, I think also just the, the, one of the very last shots in the movie is Exley holding up the badge in the shadows of the cop cars arriving, which is just a beautiful, uh, image.

• 1:24:32Bill Simmons?

  I like the cop cars coming over the hill.

• 1:24:33Sean Fennessey?

  That's really good. There's one other one too, which is like the, when Exley and Bud White are about to show down, like have a showdown in the street. And like, it's one of the only zooms in the movie. And like zooms in on the two of them and captures them in the frame head to head with each other.

• 1:24:46Speaker 01

  This is the thing I wanted to say, like, it is such an unshowy movie in terms of camera work and direction. It is always serving the story. And then when I went through it to consider this category, that's what jumped out. The very few times that they choose to move the camera.

• 1:24:58Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:59Speaker 01

  You pay attention. So weirdly, one of my nominations for this category is like, not even that memorable of a scene. But it's when Stenzland walks out of, um, Dudley's office after, after turning in his badge and gun. And he puts out his hand to shake Bud's hand and we kind of move the camera around to this just wall of raw beef faces all being like raw deal stens. And then we completely move the camera to see Exley coming down the hall.

• 1:25:21Chris Ryan?

  All alone.

• 1:25:22Speaker 01

  And and similarly, you called it a minute ago, when Bud shows up at Patchett's house and he's at the top, Patchett's putting at the bottom and they're both in frame and you feel the divide between them.

• 1:25:32Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Chess Rockwell Brock Lander's award for best character name Hollywood Jack, the big V.

• 1:25:38Speaker 01

  Lot of good ones in this.

• 1:25:39Bill Simmons?

  The big V. He had two names. He pulled out two nicknames successfully.

• 1:25:45Chris Ryan?

  I'm lot of good ones.

• 1:25:46Sean Fennessey?

  Pierce Morehouse Patchett, which is P I M P is pretty darn good.

• 1:25:50Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, pretty good.

• 1:25:51Speaker 01

  What about Buzz Meeks, Dick Stenzlin?

• 1:25:54Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:54Speaker 01

  I would say there's like a shadow version of this category, which is missed opportunities, because there are a lot of characters in the film, some of whom have lines and have a role to play. And their names are chief of police or city councilman.

• 1:26:06Chris Ryan?

  I think that's because those guys in the novel, Lee's the chief of police are like.

• 1:26:10Speaker 01

  Real people?

• 1:26:11Chris Ryan?

  Real cops, like, yeah.

• 1:26:12Speaker 01

  It's just, it's just, I feel like if you were able to like dine out in Los Angeles in 1998 and be like, guess what? I'm in the best picture nominated film, L A Confidential. And I have three scenes. Who do you play? Councilman? It's kind of a bummer.

• 1:26:25Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:25Sean Fennessey?

  It is a bummer.

• 1:26:26Bill Simmons?

  Amanda Dobbins award for best piece of real estate.

• 1:26:28Speaker 01

  Here we go.

• 1:26:29Bill Simmons?

  Shout out to Amanda. The L A Confidential house, it's in Hancock Park. It's right next to the 10th and 11th hole of Wilshire Country Club.

• 1:26:39Chris Ryan?

  And this is Lynn's house?

• 1:26:41Bill Simmons?

  This is Lynn's house. So it's basically the 11th 11th fairway. It was for sale twice in the last seven years and the first time, so it was on one of my walks. Went, checked it out, went, did an open house before somebody fixed it up. And it's pretty beaten up. But it was like the L A Confidential house, everybody in the in the neighborhood knows the house.

• 1:27:02Sean Fennessey?

  All that Bud White sperm, is that what the issue was?

• 1:27:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:27:04Sean Fennessey?

  Keep the black light in the house.

• 1:27:06Bill Simmons?

  But it was cool.

• 1:27:07Chris Ryan?

  Buy it to put his money in there?

• 1:27:09Bill Simmons?

  Well, there's no backyard. It was like mostly a front yard and then a side yard that's next to the golf course. And it was kind of like, this is something you'd really have to spend money to fix it up. Somebody bought it, fixed it up and then sold it during COVID for 7.5 million dollars.

• 1:27:23Chris Ryan?

  Do you think they gutted it or do you think that amazing like front room is still there?

• 1:27:26Bill Simmons?

  I think they kept the bones, but I think they had to fix, it was one of those where you walked on it, you could feel the floors creaking.

• 1:27:32Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. Buzz Meeks is buried under there.

• 1:27:34Bill Simmons?

  But it's fucking cool. And that's a really cool street that. Um, you basically come off Rossmore, which is one of the first big Hollywood streets. You take a left and you go down and it curls around.

• 1:27:44Sean Fennessey?

  Hmm.

• 1:27:45Bill Simmons?

  And where it curls is where that house is. So you see it and it curls right through Coinga. Um, but it's a really cool, distinct house. I don't know how livable it is.

• 1:27:53Sean Fennessey?

  And it's funny, this is the category I picked for my flex category, but I didn't pick that house. I picked Pierce Patchett's house.

• 1:27:59Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, that's the architectural marvel.

• 1:28:01Bill Simmons?

  So I had some thoughts on the Pierce house, cause that's the runner up. I wanted it to be even bigger.

• 1:28:07Sean Fennessey?

  The inside.

• 1:28:08Bill Simmons?

  I wanted it to be like this, like the fucking Babylon house.

• 1:28:11Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:28:12Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:13Bill Simmons?

  Cause if he's dealing, if he's dealing H, Sean, he's getting that H money.

• 1:28:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, but he's slipping it too.

• 1:28:18Bill Simmons?

  Plus, oh, maybe he's, maybe he's using the product.

• 1:28:21Chris Ryan?

  He's also got to pay for all those ladies to get cut.

• 1:28:24Speaker 01

  Getting cut was more expensive than I think.

• 1:28:28Chris Ryan?

  That might not be covered by insurance.

• 1:28:29Bill Simmons?

  So you like the house?

• 1:28:30Sean Fennessey?

  I don't, are the interiors in the movie, the actual interior of the?

• 1:28:34Chris Ryan?

  I've never been, it's up the street from where I live.

• 1:28:36Sean Fennessey?

  It's in Los Feliz. It's, it's the level house. It's a very famous house, very famous architectural masterpiece in LA. Um, that was built like a hundred years ago. It's, it's, but it feels like it was designed in the fifties and it's beautiful.

• 1:28:49Speaker 01

  It's a Neutra house. It was built in twenty seven.

• 1:28:50Bill Simmons?

  The great thing about Hancock Park is like, these houses have been around for a hundred and ten years and like some shit went down in a lot of the houses. And you just can kind of feel the energy where it's like, yeah, definitely.

• 1:29:01Sean Fennessey?

  Like Amityville Horror Style? What do you mean?

• 1:29:02Bill Simmons?

  Well, you never know. Ghosts. Yeah. Who knows? Sean, fantasy word for stealth homage that gives every movie nerd a criteria orgasm. What a pleasure to have Andy here for this category.

• 1:29:12Speaker 01

  I'm excited for this. But wait, I, what about the real estate? I thought someone was going to mention Bob's Market in Echo Park, which is that the, is like the three streets converging where the boxer is? And that's the, that's where Fast and Furious starts, right? Isn't that like, that's the market?

• 1:29:24Bill Simmons?

  Wow. I, I didn't want to bring that up, but it did look a little familiar.

• 1:29:28Sean Fennessey?

  On CR month of all months, you would invoke Fast and Furious.

• 1:29:33Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, it's fine, man.

• 1:29:34Speaker 01

  I've never seen it. I just thought you, I thought that was appealing to, to you, Sean.

• 1:29:39Sean Fennessey?

  What do you have for criteria orgasm?

• 1:29:43Sean Fennessey?

  Two, two and they're related. Uh, as Andy mentioned, Bud and Lynn go to a showing of Roman Holiday. The Audrey Hepburn, Gregory Peck classic, uh, Oscar winning movie. Um, released September of 53, so it's right, the perfect time because this movie is December, January, January. And when Jack goes for a drink after the party at Badge of Honor, he goes to the frolic room, which is right next door to the Pantages Theater, which is showing on the marquee, The Bad and the Beautiful, which is, as you mentioned, is one of the key inspirations for this movie.

• 1:30:18Bill Simmons?

  Frolic room's still there.

• 1:30:19Sean Fennessey?

  Still there.

• 1:30:20Chris Ryan?

  My only other criteria orgasm is an oral.

• 1:30:23Bill Simmons?

  You don't get to have criteria orgasms. This is Sean's solo, solo category.

• 1:30:28Chris Ryan?

  Cause it's music based.

• 1:30:29Bill Simmons?

  You just joined in, it was.

• 1:30:30Sean Fennessey?

  It's CR month.

• 1:30:30Bill Simmons?

  Alright, it is CR month.

• 1:30:32Chris Ryan?

  Jerry Goldsmith based some of the score off of Leonard Bernstein's On the Waterfront score.

• 1:30:38Bill Simmons?

  Pretty good.

• 1:30:39Sean Fennessey?

  It's a fact.

• 1:30:40Bill Simmons?

  CR month, that's good to have a criteria orgasm on CR month.

• 1:30:42Chris Ryan?

  He riffed on it.

• 1:30:43Sean Fennessey?

  Do you, have you ever orgasmed on the show?

• 1:30:46Chris Ryan?

  On this one?

• 1:30:46Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:30:47Chris Ryan?

  During Sicario, you just didn't know.

• 1:30:49Sean Fennessey?

  It's a quiet death.

• 1:30:50Chris Ryan?

  It's time to meet God.

• 1:30:52Sean Fennessey?

  Little death.

• 1:30:54Sean Fennessey?

  Walked into the dark.

• 1:30:55Bill Simmons?

  Did, did you hear on the mailbag, a listener said that the Emily Blunt character should have been Tom Cruise?

• 1:31:04Bill Simmons?

  It was amazing, amazing email. Like Tom Cruise, the firm, early nineties.

• 1:31:10Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, in too deep.

• 1:31:11Bill Simmons?

  Young guy who's a rational.

• 1:31:13Chris Ryan?

  I'm not a soldier.

• 1:31:15Bill Simmons?

  It's a pretty interesting thought. Maybe you could do that on Sora.

• 1:31:18Chris Ryan?

  Sure.

• 1:31:18Bill Simmons?

  Tom Cruise in Sicario. You have a flex category.

• 1:31:21Chris Ryan?

  Uh, let's see. I had Jesse Eisenberg. That's good. You should be proud of that right there. Don't worry if you don't make it any further award for best line reading was, uh, when Jack says to Exley, why in the world do you want to go digging any deeper into the Night Owl killings lieutenant? Cause it's like, that made you, you know, um, so yeah, that was my favorite line reading.

• 1:31:44Bill Simmons?

  Butch's girlfriend word, weak link of the film. This will be interesting. Do we have a weak link, Sean?

• 1:31:51Sean Fennessey?

  I don't think that it's bass singer, but I wrote down bass singer because I didn't know what to do.

• 1:31:54Bill Simmons?

  Okay, Andy?

• 1:31:56Speaker 01

  I, this might be sort of a niche thing, but I think DeVito is the worst onscreen Italian as Jew since De Niro in Casino.

• 1:32:05Sean Fennessey?

  Great take.

• 1:32:06Speaker 01

  Like, I, like-

• 1:32:07Chris Ryan?

  This is honestly, yeah.

• 1:32:09Speaker 01

  I, I'm fixated by this.

• 1:32:11Sean Fennessey?

  Love it.

• 1:32:12Speaker 01

  Like, there's a lot of, and we'll get to, I imagine, Cromwell's Irish accent, but like, there's a lot of, certain words are doing a lot of labor for DeVito's performance where he's just like-

• 1:32:22Chris Ryan?

  Boy chick.

• 1:32:23Speaker 01

  Come on, boy chick.

• 1:32:23Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:24Speaker 01

  Like, okay, yeah, I found that. Maybe, maybe the scales are even because Jason Alexander played a character named George Costanza. So maybe the Jewish Italian alliance is strong.

• 1:32:33Sean Fennessey?

  This, this is a real hobby horse of yours, though.

• 1:32:35Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, you like to point out great acts of anti-Semitism in casting, yeah.

• 1:32:39Bill Simmons?

  I love it.

• 1:32:39Speaker 01

  Come on.

• 1:32:40Sean Fennessey?

  Anytime it comes up on the watch, I like it.

• 1:32:42Speaker 01

  Role of representation, like the muckraking editor-in-chief of Hush Hush Magazine, crouches in closets to photograph the rich and powerful having sex.

• 1:32:54Chris Ryan?

  Ellis Logue at a BJ.

• 1:32:55Speaker 01

  This is important for the culture, okay? So I'm just saying, that's an opportunity.

• 1:32:59Chris Ryan?

  For sure.

• 1:33:01Speaker 01

  That's the weak link.

• 1:33:01Chris Ryan?

  Uh, the passage of time in this movie is not super well documented to me. So I think if you watch this movie like the way Craig did, like, first time, like, did you think years have gone by in this movie? It was a little unclear.

• 1:33:14Bill Simmons?

  Is that true?

• 1:33:15Chris Ryan?

  Uh, yeah, it starts in fifty-three and, no, fifty-one.

• 1:33:20Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, they flip a newspaper at one point, the newspaper says fifty-three.

• 1:33:22Chris Ryan?

  Oh, I would've said months. In the book, it's like a decade almost, it's, it's, it's eight years or something.

• 1:33:27Bill Simmons?

  I'm gonna throw in a Dodgers game in there.

• 1:33:28Speaker 01

  But they do a good job of it, like, it doesn't really matter.

• 1:33:30Chris Ryan?

  It doesn't really matter, it's not a weak link, and I also think, like, to that, to that same point, like, the heroin, it's, it's still kind of hard to track the heroin in the, in the movie.

• 1:33:40Bill Simmons?

  My weak link-

• 1:33:42Bill Simmons?

  Was Danny DeVito.

• 1:33:43Speaker 01

  Yes, thank you.

• 1:33:44Chris Ryan?

  For different reasons?

• 1:33:45Bill Simmons?

  For the reasons you mentioned.

• 1:33:47Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 1:33:47Bill Simmons?

  I just wasn't buying it. He's just an Italian.

• 1:33:50Speaker 01

  He's just Danny DeVito.

• 1:33:51Bill Simmons?

  I also, he takes me out of the movie a little.

• 1:33:54Chris Ryan?

  A little bit.

• 1:33:54Bill Simmons?

  His Danny DeVito-ness is just too omnipresent and too much of a history of them and he's in taxi and his remains. I can't buy him as a character and I almost don't know if we needed a famous actor for that part. I just, every time he's in a scene.

• 1:34:09Chris Ryan?

  It's such a good Buscemi role or something.

• 1:34:10Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's just.

• 1:34:11Speaker 01

  There you go again. I know it's the arm hunt, but excuse me.

• 1:34:17Sean Fennessey?

  Another Italian?

• 1:34:18Chris Ryan?

  Is Kevin Pollak Jewish?

• 1:34:19Speaker 01

  What about Pankow?

• 1:34:20Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:21Speaker 01

  He's right there.

• 1:34:22Chris Ryan?

  Pankow? Come on.

• 1:34:24Bill Simmons?

  Honestly, Kevin Pollak could have done it.

• 1:34:25Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:34:25Sean Fennessey?

  He could have. I find that DeVito is a great first voice to hear when the movie opens and you're getting those postcards. And he's a kind of a great narrator, but when he's in scenes and Spacey, who is a big showy actor, but is much more subtle in this movie. And DeVito is just throwing ham sandwiches at him nonstop. I mean, it's crazy how big he is.

• 1:34:45Speaker 01

  Why they cast a Goy.

• 1:34:47Sean Fennessey?

  Could be.

• 1:34:47Bill Simmons?

  I just think he's done too much comedy over there. Like even when he was getting like beaten up in the chair. At the end, it's like, come on, it's Danny DeVito.

• 1:34:57Bill Simmons?

  I had a, I had one for this, for recasting. Is Billy Crystal too famous for that part?

• 1:35:03Chris Ryan?

  Yes.

• 1:35:05Sean Fennessey?

  Well, you certainly made the case Danny DeVito is way too famous for this part. Why is Danny DeVito even in this movie?

• 1:35:10Bill Simmons?

  My point is if you're gonna go famous for that part, I'd rather have Billy Crystal.

• 1:35:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:35:14Bill Simmons?

  And then.

• 1:35:15Speaker 01

  I'm trying to imagine Billy Crystal.

• 1:35:17Bill Simmons?

  My dream choice would have been Larry David, because nobody knew who Larry David really looked like in 97.

• 1:35:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, this is the big brain thinking I want. Yes.

• 1:35:26Bill Simmons?

  It could, that could have been where we went, but I just.

• 1:35:29Chris Ryan?

  So that's when Larry David walks up to Jack Vincent and he says, this guy has a jackalit in his stomach.

• 1:35:39Bill Simmons?

  I don't know, he took me on the movie. Too much history. Anyway, What's Aged the Worst? Kevin Spacey.

• 1:35:45Bill Simmons?

  I didn't like the Pierce house as much. I really wanted like a Babylon house for him. I wanted like just this house is obscene. We're like in Hollywood Hills. There's no house within, maybe we're in Malibu. I don't know. I just wanted like a giant, kind of like crazy, oh my god, this guy's gotta be the richest guy in LA kind of house.

• 1:36:06Sean Fennessey?

  Gotta no sell that one.

• 1:36:09Bill Simmons?

  Guy Pearce, Kevin Spacey stuff.

• 1:36:12Chris Ryan?

  Pierce said that Spacey got handsy with him on the set.

• 1:36:16Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and he was uncomfortable and the whole thing. I don't, probably should have just punched him.

• 1:36:22Bill Simmons?

  James Ellroy's relationship to the film is all over the map.

• 1:36:26Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:36:27Bill Simmons?

  Ninety seven, he said it was a work of art on its own level. And in two thousand sixteen, he said it was problematic. And in two thousand twenty-three, he said it was turkey of the highest form.

• 1:36:37Chris Ryan?

  And it, but the crow and basing are impotent, right?

• 1:36:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:41Chris Ryan?

  And then when Curtis Hanson died, he was like, it's a pretty good movie.

• 1:36:47Bill Simmons?

  James Ellroy. I didn't have any other What's Aged the Worst.

• 1:36:48Sean Fennessey?

  Kind of a weird cat.

• 1:36:49Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:50Sean Fennessey?

  You know?

• 1:36:50Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:36:52Speaker 01

  I think What's Aged the Worst is hands down the opening, and I quote, "There are jobs aplenty and land is cheap. Every working man can have his own house." I don't know, were any millennials, Craig, do you want to weigh in on that?

• 1:37:04Chris Ryan?

  Don't have a home.

• 1:37:06Speaker 01

  Can working men have a home?

• 1:37:08Chris Ryan?

  Greg is producing this from an Acura. From San Diego.

• 1:37:11Sean Fennessey?

  There's one other quote in the film that is obviously very purposefully, almost groan worthy, but from downtown to the beach in twenty minutes is a heinous note, which is just simply not true.

• 1:37:22Chris Ryan?

  Unless you're driving a cab.

• 1:37:24Sean Fennessey?

  You're buying in. Interesting.

• 1:37:26Chris Ryan?

  A couple of What's Aged the Worst. The fight. That Bud and Exley have in the records room when he catches Exley like after Lynn.

• 1:37:36Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:36Chris Ryan?

  He would have fucking killed him. Like the way he's like throwing him around the room. He's like slamming his head into a filing cabinet and the guy is like a shiner afterwards.

• 1:37:43Speaker 01

  That's also Russell Crowe's audition to be Wolverine.

• 1:37:45Chris Ryan?

  That's right.

• 1:37:46Speaker 01

  That's why he.

• 1:37:47Bill Simmons?

  I think when he throws the chair out of the window for no reason at all.

• 1:37:50Chris Ryan?

  Just to be like, ah, god damn it.

• 1:37:51Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I had something, somebody had to pay.

• 1:37:53Sean Fennessey?

  Something else we gotta bring back is just being able to be ruthlessly violent in the workplace, you know, just throwing furniture through windows.

• 1:37:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that was definitely an HR violation.

• 1:38:00Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:01Chris Ryan?

  I don't think that they had.

• 1:38:02Speaker 01

  Is that the day you transition to talent? Only is the day you make that.

• 1:38:04Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, as soon as I can get a window out, yeah.

• 1:38:06Chris Ryan?

  Do you think that the LAPD had HR?

• 1:38:09Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 1:38:10Chris Ryan?

  Right.

• 1:38:10Bill Simmons?

  I don't.

• 1:38:11Chris Ryan?

  Uh, and then the only other thing that.

• 1:38:14Bill Simmons?

  Do they have it now? I think is a better question.

• 1:38:16Chris Ryan?

  The Lynn, uh, Dudley Bud triangle.

• 1:38:21Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:38:21Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:38:22Chris Ryan?

  That, that whole like, we're gonna take pictures of Exley with Lynn to make Bud go crazy so that he attacks Exley thing is the one, uh, film only flourish that is a little off because in the book, Inez, the rape victim, is actually the center of their love triangle.

• 1:38:40Bill Simmons?

  So you think Elroy saw that part and said, what the fuck?

• 1:38:43Chris Ryan?

  Well, I think it's just almost as like, why wouldn't they just have Exley killed? Like they're doing that to everybody else. Like why?

• 1:38:48Bill Simmons?

  I think Elroy sounds insane, but if somebody did like an adaptation of the book of basketball and they had like Karl Malone third, I would fucking lose my mind.

• 1:38:57Speaker 01

  But you said, you said your adaptation would be to forget the entire text.

• 1:39:00Sean Fennessey?

  I, I, we gotta game this out. Who, who's, who's making the film?

• 1:39:03Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, is it narrator?

• 1:39:04Sean Fennessey?

  Is it a scripted film?

• 1:39:07Bill Simmons?

  Nobody is.

• 1:39:07Sean Fennessey?

  A 12 part documentary?

• 1:39:09Bill Simmons?

  I have an easy category.

• 1:39:11Sean Fennessey?

  I will direct the 12 part documentary Book of Basketball if I can reorder the pyramid in any way, yes.

• 1:39:16Speaker 01

  And the film festival beforehand is gonna be killer.

• 1:39:19Bill Simmons?

  The rough, low hand of Rubenek Partridge over acting word is an easy one. It's the old lady who IDs her call girl daughter and then has two other terrible scenes and looks like David Letterman. Looks like David Letterman in drag.

• 1:39:30Speaker 01

  Gwenda Deacon?

• 1:39:31Bill Simmons?

  Just, it's just a zero the entire time.

• 1:39:33Chris Ryan?

  Say her name, come on.

• 1:39:34Bill Simmons?

  Did somebody call in sick? Was there some Oscar winner that at the last second like fell ill and they just had to grab someone?

• 1:39:41Speaker 01

  In one scene, it's a vibe. Like, okay, that she's when she's identifying, that's my girl. And you're like, wow, that was really memorable, you know, day player that they found to play that role.

• 1:39:49Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:39:50Speaker 01

  Of all the people who show up on set and you're like, let's reward this person with entire.

• 1:39:53Bill Simmons?

  Two more scenes.

• 1:39:54Speaker 01

  Two more scenes.

• 1:39:55Bill Simmons?

  Really bad. You have a flex category.

• 1:39:57Sean Fennessey?

  I already did it. It's Pierce Patchett. You just shot me down. You said, it's not a nice house and it's not architecturally significant and I should stop talking and so I will.

• 1:40:06Bill Simmons?

  I thought it was a nice art. I was saying, I feel like his house would have been splashier and more.

• 1:40:12Sean Fennessey?

  What's his, what's his background, Pierce? How did he make his fortune?

• 1:40:16Bill Simmons?

  Businessman.

• 1:40:16Chris Ryan?

  H, H slinging H.

• 1:40:18Speaker 01

  No, no, I think he's dabbling now.

• 1:40:20Sean Fennessey?

  But he's like, oh, he's in his 40s or 50s at this point. So like, what did he, how did he make his fortune?

• 1:40:24Speaker 01

  Honestly, people age differently.

• 1:40:26Sean Fennessey?

  Good point.

• 1:40:27Chris Ryan?

  I think he's emerged out of a world of blackmail and extortion.

• 1:40:30Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:40:30Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 1:40:31Bill Simmons?

  I had a major nitpick for this that I was gonna do later, but I'll do now since Sean brought it up. I just think gambling's part of this.

• 1:40:38Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:40:38Bill Simmons?

  I don't know how he misses it. The guy's a businessman. You got H over here.

• 1:40:42Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:40:43Bill Simmons?

  I got my call girls here.

• 1:40:44Chris Ryan?

  Horses.

• 1:40:45Bill Simmons?

  I'm having that. I have like a whole underground casino in my giant palace.

• 1:40:49Sean Fennessey?

  He's watching March Madness hitting parlays.

• 1:40:51Bill Simmons?

  That's probably every boxing thing. The guys are going down there. They're taking bets. There's no way he's not doing gambling.

• 1:40:56Chris Ryan?

  In LA, so there would have been this vacuum.

• 1:40:58Bill Simmons?

  Big missed opportunity. The CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford. Hottest take a word, Andy. You haven't done this before.

• 1:41:06Speaker 01

  I don't know if I have a hot take for this. I struggle to find one.

• 1:41:09Bill Simmons?

  I have one.

• 1:41:10Chris Ryan?

  I think this is like the perfect modern period film in that it feels really true to life. It has all of the sort of superficial, like the cars, the production design, all of it looks like the 50s, but it feels like a 90s movie.

• 1:41:27Bill Simmons?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:41:27Chris Ryan?

  It's cut like a modern film.

• 1:41:29Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:41:29Chris Ryan?

  The acting style is decidedly modern. Everything about like the performance and the editing and the feel of the film is like 97. Like you could put this up against Usual Suspects and it feels very similar, but then they take all of the know-how of like how to make a full-on LA noir movie and push it out there. It's just like the perfect balance.

• 1:41:51Speaker 01

  We should, we should shout out Brian Raftery, our friend's article on theringer.com about 90s noir. It really talks about why. Why the decade, like the 50s and the 90s were decades that celebrated noir? Because they were decades after a big conflict. Where the United States had a very clear, like, you know, self, at least the way they thought of ourselves. There's Boy Scout role to play, and then there's kind of a moral morass afterwards.

• 1:42:12Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, yeah. Take wasn't hot enough. I'm coming in way hotter.

• 1:42:16Speaker 01

  Okay, that was warm.

• 1:42:17Chris Ryan?

  I'm just telling you, I'm gonna be squorching. Sean, you go.

• 1:42:21Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, um, setup to fail there. This is...

• 1:42:25Chris Ryan?

  You can come in hot. I'm just saying, people are gonna get burnt.

• 1:42:27Sean Fennessey?

  The second best adaptation of The Wizard of Oz of all time.

• 1:42:31Chris Ryan?

  That's good. That's pretty good.

• 1:42:33Bill Simmons?

  It's a good hottest take.

• 1:42:34Sean Fennessey?

  And Wicked and Wicked for Good are very far near the bottom. Um, there's Bud, the cop with no brain. There's Ed, the cop with no heart. And there's Jack, the cop with no courage. And then there's the victimized girl Lynn, who just wants to escape Oz and go back home to Arizona, not Kansas. And they all get what they want.

• 1:42:52Chris Ryan?

  And Dudley is the wizard?

• 1:42:53Sean Fennessey?

  He is the wizard of Oz.

• 1:42:55Speaker 01

  Who are the flying monkeys? That was really good.

• 1:42:57Sean Fennessey?

  Um, I didn't invent that take. That is something that has been suggested about this movie.

• 1:43:00Chris Ryan?

  That's really good.

• 1:43:01Sean Fennessey?

  It is good.

• 1:43:02Chris Ryan?

  If you played Dark Side of the Moon, starting at...

• 1:43:06Speaker 01

  Who invented that take and can we get them here before the end of recording?

• 1:43:08Sean Fennessey?

  It's been written about since the 90s, because the archetypes of the characters are so strong. And it's like, why does this movie feel so familiar, even though I've never seen this movie before?

• 1:43:16Chris Ryan?

  It feels like getting trapped by Tarantino in a kitchen somewhere. He's like, what you don't know, man! It's LA Confidential. It's just Wizard of Oz! Man?

• 1:43:26Bill Simmons?

  Uh, mine is, uh, this is almost a new category. The Pierce Patchard Award for most reprehensible movie plot idea. That was actually pretty awesome. His business of high-class call girls being cut to look like movie actors? I think it's kind of a brilliant business. Great job by him.

• 1:43:43Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 1:43:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's ahead of its time.

• 1:43:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Like, I think you could do this now.

• 1:43:48Chris Ryan?

  You think he wins Shark Take?

• 1:43:49Bill Simmons?

  I think you could do that. You got a Shark Take right now and be like, so we got the Kardashians. We have Margot Robbie. And I don't know, I think, I think in the room, I think Cuban buys it.

• 1:44:00Chris Ryan?

  I, I, I, who knows, Bill? Maybe it's still happening today.

• 1:44:04Bill Simmons?

  Craig?

• 1:44:05Speaker 04

  I literally had this written down. I was like, this guy invented deep fakes, essentially.

• 1:44:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:44:12Bill Simmons?

  Casting what ifs. We mentioned McConaughey. He turned it down, said in 2018. Really regretted it. Russell Crowe turned it down, then they talked him into it. Nothing else interesting, there was a Isabella Scrupco offered the lead female role, turned it down. I don't know if I believed it. That was in one of the research things.

• 1:44:31Sean Fennessey?

  Goldeneye.

• 1:44:32Bill Simmons?

  Goldeneye. So one of the things, other things I saw, bass singer was their first choice, they really wanted her, so who knows?

• 1:44:39Chris Ryan?

  There was a Michael Madsen as Bud thing?

• 1:44:41Bill Simmons?

  I didn't believe that one.

• 1:44:42Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:44:43Bill Simmons?

  No, I'd kick the tires on it, I just think at 97, is Madsen getting a movie like this?

• 1:44:49Speaker 01

  What about Michael Madsen cut to look like Russell Crowe? Could I interest you in that?

• 1:44:54Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, this could go both ways, we could start doing guys too, yeah.

• 1:44:57Speaker 01

  That's very, it's.

• 1:44:58Sean Fennessey?

  Go on.

• 1:44:59Chris Ryan?

  No, you could cut guys to look like other actors.

• 1:45:01Speaker 01

  And then what would happen?

• 1:45:02Chris Ryan?

  Look at this Glenn Powell lookalike I have, yeah.

• 1:45:05Speaker 01

  And what are you doing with him?

• 1:45:06Chris Ryan?

  Fucking having a catch, I don't know.

• 1:45:09Bill Simmons?

  Don't torture CR on CR month. I bet that guy wore it as a smorgasbord.

• 1:45:15Speaker 01

  There's so many of that guys, this is the best.

• 1:45:17Chris Ryan?

  Run his routes.

• 1:45:18Sean Fennessey?

  You wanna do the Pierce patch it, but just to make cool friends who look like famous?

• 1:45:22Chris Ryan?

  I'm gonna make fucking Colin Farrell from Miami Vice and go get mojitos. But he's just some dude from Nebraska.

• 1:45:31Speaker 01

  Got off the bus?

• 1:45:31Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:32Sean Fennessey?

  That's a good idea.

• 1:45:33Chris Ryan?

  I'm a foodie for mojitos.

• 1:45:34Bill Simmons?

  I feel like he would do that.

• 1:45:36Speaker 04

  Have you seen that video of the guy who hires the Tom Cruise impersonator and just has him come over to his house?

• 1:45:42Speaker 04

  One on one?

• 1:45:43Chris Ryan?

  It's a very human desire. Pamela Anderson is Lynn Bracken, did you kick the tires on that?

• 1:45:48Bill Simmons?

  I just don't believe it.

• 1:45:49Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:45:49Bill Simmons?

  I don't think they're going, she's this is a year after Baywatch.

• 1:45:53Chris Ryan?

  Mysteries of this podcast to me is when you'll decide a rumor is not real.

• 1:45:58Bill Simmons?

  Listen, there's a sniff test of these, and I just don't think Curtis Hanson was like, you know who we should get? Pamela Anderson to play, I just don't see it. And I think as the years pass, as we discussed, I think that people just start adding stuff into the history of the movie, and I'd.

• 1:46:14Sean Fennessey?

  I want to start doing that for recreation, just popping on the IMDb trivia page.

• 1:46:18Bill Simmons?

  Or Wikipedia, you can just basically start adding shit. That's that guy, we have a ton. We have for the, for the common man, the Craigs out there, we have Straight Tharn. I think people, not everybody knows his name. Rob Rifkin is definitely that guy.

• 1:46:32Sean Fennessey?

  I have Ron Rifkin, yes.

• 1:46:34Bill Simmons?

  Ron or Rob?

• 1:46:34Sean Fennessey?

  Ron.

• 1:46:35Bill Simmons?

  Ron Rifkin.

• 1:46:36Chris Ryan?

  I'm going so much deeper.

• 1:46:37Sean Fennessey?

  The leader of SD6.

• 1:46:38Bill Simmons?

  We have Matt McCoy, the dad from Hand That Rocks The Cradle, callback.

• 1:46:42Speaker 01

  Wait, Matt McCoy also, who I will always think of as Nick Lassard, the replacement for Steve Guttenberg in the later period Police Academy movies.

• 1:46:50Sean Fennessey?

  Thank you, Five and Six.

• 1:46:51Speaker 01

  Five and Six, I was like, this guy's gonna be a star as big as Steve Guttenberg. That's 10 year old, that was my first podcast take.

• 1:46:57Chris Ryan?

  And then in one of the TV adaptations, he played Exley's dad.

• 1:47:01Bill Simmons?

  Matt McCoy is Matt McCoy. Except for Craig.

• 1:47:05Chris Ryan?

  There's a couple other guys.

• 1:47:06Bill Simmons?

  Stealth one, Alan Graf is the wife beater in the beginning.

• 1:47:09Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:47:09Bill Simmons?

  I feel like he might have been in the most rewatchables, even more than Tom Cruise.

• 1:47:13Chris Ryan?

  He's a legendary stunt coordinator and second unit director, but yes, he has been killed in 74 rewatchables.

• 1:47:19Bill Simmons?

  But I know that we have the same winner for this.

• 1:47:21Speaker 01

  I'm excited.

• 1:47:22Chris Ryan?

  Do you have Thomas Arana?

• 1:47:25Bill Simmons?

  What part was he?

• 1:47:26Chris Ryan?

  He's one of Dudley's henchmen who's in, he's the fucking guy at the end of Hunter October. And he's Russell Crowe's homie in Gladiator, and he's in Limitless.

• 1:47:37Bill Simmons?

  So, great choice, but that was not who I had. There's another one from the first rewatchable.

• 1:47:40Speaker 01

  John Mahone, yeah, that's who I have. John Mahone is always, if you go.

• 1:47:44Sean Fennessey?

  I assume you're talking about Paul Guilfoyle.

• 1:47:47Bill Simmons?

  The guy driving the armored truck in Heat is one of the guys that get in the prison fight with.

• 1:47:54Chris Ryan?

  Wait, wait.

• 1:47:55Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, the first guy who's driving the car.

• 1:47:57Chris Ryan?

  Oh my god, are you serious?

• 1:47:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:48:01Chris Ryan?

  The guy who's like got shit coming out of his ears?

• 1:48:02Bill Simmons?

  The guy who's driving the armored truck and he looks over and sees the truck and does this?

• 1:48:06Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:48:06Bill Simmons?

  He's the first guy that they punch.

• 1:48:07Chris Ryan?

  You can't hear you slick.

• 1:48:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:48:10Sean Fennessey?

  Cousin Art, you know?

• 1:48:12Bill Simmons?

  I can't believe you didn't notice that.

• 1:48:13Chris Ryan?

  I'm sorry. I mean, this is why you're you, man.

• 1:48:16Bill Simmons?

  I thought you would have been riding with me on this.

• 1:48:18Chris Ryan?

  I'm riding now.

• 1:48:19Bill Simmons?

  I literally don't know that guy's name.

• 1:48:21Chris Ryan?

  I found out that guy was in fucking Hunt for October Gladiator and Lividus.

• 1:48:24Speaker 01

  What about Tom Mahone, though?

• 1:48:25Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, he's great. Yeah.

• 1:48:26Speaker 01

  Chiefs of Police. He was the American president, Armageddon, Zodiac. In Austin Powers 2, he was NATO Colonel. He was Earth Corp ship commander in something. And famously, he was the LMU coach in the Hank Gathers story.

• 1:48:41Chris Ryan?

  Oh.

• 1:48:42Sean Fennessey?

  Oh.

• 1:48:42Speaker 01

  I just put that into appeal to Bill.

• 1:48:43Chris Ryan?

  Who was the LMU coach? Wasn't it somebody famous? Who was there?

• 1:48:46Speaker 01

  Paul Westhead.

• 1:48:46Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, that's right. Yeah.

• 1:48:47Speaker 01

  There you go. But again.

• 1:48:49Bill Simmons?

  So that guy, he's typecast, but in a good way. And he's telling his wife, "Yeah, there's this new Tom Quincy. There's this part for the general. I think I'm gonna get it."

• 1:48:59Speaker 01

  I'm either one of the-

• 1:48:59Bill Simmons?

  He just kinda knows at this point.

• 1:49:01Speaker 01

  I'm either one of the chiefs of staff, or I'm chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, no matter what it is.

• 1:49:04Chris Ryan?

  Philip Baker Hall is busy. That's that guy. Yeah.

• 1:49:07Bill Simmons?

  Who do you have for Dan Waiters CR?

• 1:49:08Chris Ryan?

  I think this is straight, just there.

• 1:49:11Bill Simmons?

  Adam as well, unless you wanted to throw some Dick Stenzlin at me.

• 1:49:14Chris Ryan?

  I'd throw Simon Baker in here as well.

• 1:49:15Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:49:16Chris Ryan?

  Early Simon Baker. First Simon Baker, actually. So much so that he has a different name.

• 1:49:20Sean Fennessey?

  Three Aussies in this movie.

• 1:49:24Bill Simmons?

  Did get my wife's attention when he came on. Cause, you know, Big Devil Wears Prada.

• 1:49:28Chris Ryan?

  Sure.

• 1:49:28Bill Simmons?

  Part for him.

• 1:49:29Sean Fennessey?

  What about The Mentalist? Were you a fan of that show?

• 1:49:31Bill Simmons?

  Never watched it. Recasting Couch Director City. Did anybody have anything else for this?

• 1:49:35Chris Ryan?

  I do.

• 1:49:36Bill Simmons?

  We already talked about this. What do you got?

• 1:49:37Chris Ryan?

  I wanna talk something out here.

• 1:49:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:39Chris Ryan?

  For Dudley.

• 1:49:39Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 1:49:40Chris Ryan?

  Posture weight.

• 1:49:42Speaker 01

  Oh. Bonus points for actually Irish.

• 1:49:44Chris Ryan?

  Authentically Irish.

• 1:49:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:49:46Bill Simmons?

  If there's a hell, your mother's in it.

• 1:49:48Chris Ryan?

  Unquestionably fucking evil the second you see him. Nobody's like, what a nice guy.

• 1:49:53Speaker 01

  Small, though, of stature. Not of charisma.

• 1:49:56Chris Ryan?

  But is closer to like what Dudley was, which was just like very sinister.

• 1:50:01Sean Fennessey?

  You think Posture Weight communicates evil right away?

• 1:50:04Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, don't you? I mean, I know in the Jim Sheridan movies.

• 1:50:07Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, in The Name of the Father, he's so moral.

• 1:50:09Chris Ryan?

  But he's coming off the lawyer, unusual suspects.

• 1:50:12Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, yeah. Kobayashi. Yeah.

• 1:50:14Chris Ryan?

  Coming off that. Yeah.

• 1:50:16Speaker 01

  That's good.

• 1:50:17Chris Ryan?

  And then I had-

• 1:50:17Bill Simmons?

  How tall is Cromwell?

• 1:50:19Speaker 01

  He keeps growing in my estimation. He's like-

• 1:50:20Chris Ryan?

  He's six seven.

• 1:50:21Bill Simmons?

  Is he like Victor Wembanyama?

• 1:50:22Sean Fennessey?

  Wemby, yeah.

• 1:50:23Chris Ryan?

  The only other ones I had was, uh, how about Campbell Scott or Josh Charles as Exley?

• 1:50:29Speaker 01

  Oh, good choices.

• 1:50:31Bill Simmons?

  Is Bale too young?

• 1:50:33Speaker 01

  At this point?

• 1:50:34Chris Ryan?

  I'm just trying to get an American a job.

• 1:50:36Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I see what you're doing. So Damon, it should just be Damon.

• 1:50:40Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 1:50:40Bill Simmons?

  He could have done this, Talented Mr. Ripley, Good Will Hunting, and Rounders all in a row. Would have been like, oh, my God, the fucking goat is here.

• 1:50:46Sean Fennessey?

  Pretty good.

• 1:50:48Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I like that.

• 1:50:49Sean Fennessey?

  It's one year after Larry Flynt, so Ed Norton is a possibility, and he, you know.

• 1:50:54Bill Simmons?

  Ed Norton, that's a really good one.

• 1:50:57Sean Fennessey?

  That's Andy Greenwald.

• 1:50:58Speaker 01

  That's why I'm here.

• 1:51:00Bill Simmons?

  So Ed Norton was American History X and Rounders in 97.

• 1:51:06Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:51:06Bill Simmons?

  So would not have probably been available for this movie, but would have been a really good Exley.

• 1:51:11Speaker 01

  I think so.

• 1:51:12Bill Simmons?

  Ed Burns?

• 1:51:16Sean Fennessey?

  You're for Saving Private Ryan? She's the One, is that 96?

• 1:51:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:51:20Chris Ryan?

  Yeah. I don't know. Ed Burns is Exley?

• 1:51:23Sean Fennessey?

  Ed Burns was a hard-boiled detective in a TV show like seven years ago. What was that show called? Yeah, what was that show called?

• 1:51:30Speaker 01

  Great question.

• 1:51:31Sean Fennessey?

  I watched some of that show.

• 1:51:32Chris Ryan?

  Was he a detective?

• 1:51:33Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, obviously Ed Burns, Long Island, and got stuck for life.

• 1:51:36Bill Simmons?

  Andy, you have a flex category.

• 1:51:37Speaker 01

  I do. What was this show called? Was it Public Morals? Yeah, my flex category is probably, let me find it, but it was, you probably could have guessed that I would have chosen this. I chose the Big Kahuna Burger category.

• 1:51:48Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 1:51:48Speaker 01

  But I don't know if I did it right, because there are a couple of opportunities to discuss food and drink in this movie. How much time do we have, Les Gray? I mean, generally, this maybe this also goes into the Floyd Gondoli. Like, I really like movies set in an era when there are no choices in liquor stores. You walk in, you say, give me a box, and in that box, I want gin, scotch, and vodka. And the guy's like, okay. I don't know what the holdup is, too. Like, I feel like he could have been doing this more quickly since there were no other options.

• 1:52:15Chris Ryan?

  It's also just, like, great to go into stores where people are just dicks to you from behind the counter. Like, where it's just like, don't worry about a Yelp review, man.

• 1:52:22Speaker 01

  I also feel like, I feel like Nick from Nick's Liquor's entire performance was 80-yard for some reason. You never see his face. It always sounds like a very strong voice. Also, speaking of drinks, I really feel like Stenzland, you know, probably is correctly labeled as a malcontent and maybe not a good cop. Pretty fun at parties, considering his mixology abilities, in which he takes dark liquor and light liquor and just pours them into the punch.

• 1:52:45Chris Ryan?

  The eggnog?

• 1:52:45Speaker 01

  At the same time.

• 1:52:48Speaker 01

  Shout out to Formosa, which still exists. You can still get a good meal there. I don't think you can, like Johnny Stompanato, have a daytime Schlitz there and just with the company of your own thoughts. Which I did enjoy.

• 1:53:00Speaker 01

  And then the only other, uh, the only other food really mentioned in the film is, um, Matt Reynolds' last meal. Which is, which is pretty iconic. It's a frankfurter, french fries, alcohol, and sperm.

• 1:53:11Sean Fennessey?

  Tough one.

• 1:53:13Bill Simmons?

  Tough order.

• 1:53:14Speaker 01

  It's a tough order. But maybe, you know, restaurant menus were different then.

• 1:53:17Chris Ryan?

  That's, uh, the secret menu at In-N-Out.

• 1:53:19Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, Dudley picked up the check.

• 1:53:20Speaker 01

  That's panel style?

• 1:53:23Speaker 01

  God damn.

• 1:53:25Speaker 01

  I thought it was just, they threw the onion.

• 1:53:27Chris Ryan?

  Nope.

• 1:53:31Sean Fennessey?

  Can't believe Sierra Month is ending.

• 1:53:32Bill Simmons?

  Half-assed research. Uh, no building in LA back in the day was led to be taller than City Hall, so they had to basically cheat all the camera work. So we wouldn't see any buildings at that. Um, so they had the fight scene with Guy Pearce and Russell Crowe. It was shot four months after principal photography had ended, and Pearce had shaved his head for another movie, so he's got a wig on. But I didn't really notice the wig when I was watching it.

• 1:53:58Sean Fennessey?

  I'm wearing one right now.

• 1:54:02Bill Simmons?

  The cop that congratulates Exley at the end is Daryl Gates, famously of the LAPD.

• 1:54:07Chris Ryan?

  It's a weird movie for him to make a cameo.

• 1:54:08Bill Simmons?

  Controversial, to say the least.

• 1:54:10Sean Fennessey?

  Not ideal.

• 1:54:10Bill Simmons?

  Very strange choice.

• 1:54:11Sean Fennessey?

  Not ideal.

• 1:54:12Bill Simmons?

  And then you mentioned the rape victim, Inez, in the, in the movie, um, who then disappears after one more scene. In the book, she's

• 1:54:19Chris Ryan?

  Huge.

• 1:54:19Bill Simmons?

  Huge, and with Exley, and they just cut all that out.

• 1:54:22Chris Ryan?

  And works for his dad. Yeah, it's crazy.

• 1:54:26Bill Simmons?

  And then the, the level house is here, that's Patchett's home. It's a famous house, as we mentioned. Bracken's house is at 501 Wilcox, which is, which is, uh, we talked about, next to the Wilshire Country Club.

• 1:54:39Chris Ryan?

  Current inhabitants just had to broadcast an entire module.

• 1:54:43Bill Simmons?

  Sorry, guys. And then, uh,

• 1:54:48Bill Simmons?

  and then, uh, the Victory Motel was built.

• 1:54:51Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. They just like the location and they built. It's like the Inglewood. Yeah. Like the oil fields out by there. Yeah. Apex Mountain, Chrono. Spacey? This is.

• 1:55:00Speaker 01

  I think there's a case to be made there.

• 1:55:03Bill Simmons?

  It's either this or American Beauty, but I like this. I prefer this. Cause it sets up American Beauty and.

• 1:55:07Sean Fennessey?

  I wrote down Spacey.

• 1:55:08Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Guy Pearce, it's Memento. Although it didn't really turn into anything after Memento like we thought. I think he's had a great career. No, but I'm saying after Memento, it's like.

• 1:55:17Sean Fennessey?

  I think post The Brutalist it might be now.

• 1:55:21Bill Simmons?

  Wow.

• 1:55:21Sean Fennessey?

  I think he is very well regarded as an actor. It was a film.

• 1:55:26Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:55:26Sean Fennessey?

  Came out in twenty twenty four.

• 1:55:29Bill Simmons?

  You start, you start Brutalist? Started Brutalist. Listen, did you?

• 1:55:34Speaker 01

  I think you made the right call.

• 1:55:36Bill Simmons?

  Wow.

• 1:55:36Sean Fennessey?

  So it's just two shameful opinions here.

• 1:55:39Speaker 01

  Walk out on that movie.

• 1:55:40Bill Simmons?

  Not, not all of us have to watch every movie. We can pick and choose a tiny bit.

• 1:55:43Sean Fennessey?

  It was nominated for Best Picture. It wasn't like some obscure piece of shit.

• 1:55:46Bill Simmons?

  My weird one's nominated.

• 1:55:49Speaker 01

  But really, it could have been a TV show.

• 1:55:50Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, I will assassinate both of you. He's, tell you what.

• 1:55:56Bill Simmons?

  I have another secret for you. I never finished Babylon.

• 1:55:59Speaker 01

  My, my, my main concern, Sean, I, I'm with you in terms of Guy Pearce being an interesting actor who will age into different gravitas. He should probably stay offline. I don't know if you've seen some of his recent retweets and quotes regarding certain global actions. Let's just say that I, the, the tenor of his tweets suggest that he was pro Danny DeVito being cast as Sid Hutchins.

• 1:56:19Sean Fennessey?

  I see.

• 1:56:20Speaker 01

  And he would not want someone else cast in that role.

• 1:56:21Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, no.

• 1:56:22Bill Simmons?

  I'll just throw that out there.

• 1:56:23Sean Fennessey?

  Okay. So you want to, you want him abolished from society? What are you saying?

• 1:56:28Bill Simmons?

  No, no, I just want him to take his phone away. Stop tweeting. Seedy L.A. noir crime movies, Chinatown? Apex Mountain? Yeah. Gotta be, right? Yeah. Basinger. I don't, I really don't think this was Apex Mountain for her. I think it was in the eighties during that nine and a half week stretch. Did she? Dude, the getaway after this?

• 1:56:45Speaker 01

  She's a big movie. She was. Getaway was before this.

• 1:56:48Bill Simmons?

  Getaway was before this. I think it was nine and a half weeks Batman, like that era. What did she follow this up with?

• 1:56:53Speaker 01

  Everyone loved her, some well deserved vacation.

• 1:56:56Bill Simmons?

  She married Alec Baldwin and I think she she scaled back a tiny bit after this.

• 1:57:01Sean Fennessey?

  But they weren't they married before this movie? They were married during this film.

• 1:57:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:57:04Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:05Bill Simmons?

  I saw No Mercy in the theater with my mom.

• 1:57:08Speaker 01

  Her next movie was Eight Mile five years later.

• 1:57:10Bill Simmons?

  Just wanna throw that out there.

• 1:57:11Speaker 01

  It's weird.

• 1:57:12Sean Fennessey?

  She took five years.

• 1:57:12Speaker 01

  Which one did you see with your mom?

• 1:57:13Bill Simmons?

  No Mercy with Richard Gere and Kim Basinger where they're handcuffed together and trying to escape in New Orleans. And there was.

• 1:57:20Chris Ryan?

  I gotta admit, I don't know this movie.

• 1:57:21Bill Simmons?

  It's bad.

• 1:57:22Sean Fennessey?

  I haven't seen it.

• 1:57:23Bill Simmons?

  My mom really wanted to see it. I hadn't been hanging out with her and we went and uh.

• 1:57:29Bill Simmons?

  And there was a point I'm like, wow, this is a weird one to be with my mom.

• 1:57:31Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:57:32Bill Simmons?

  I wish, kinda wish I wasn't with my mom.

• 1:57:34Sean Fennessey?

  It's amazing that just ninety seconds ago you were like, I don't have to see every movie. But you're telling us about you seeing No Mercy.

• 1:57:41Bill Simmons?

  Gere and Basinger, come on.

• 1:57:43Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, it turned out to be legendary.

• 1:57:45Bill Simmons?

  Frolic Room.

• 1:57:46Sean Fennessey?

  Wait, hold on. I have a question. Do you think that Eight Mile is rewatchable?

• 1:57:50Bill Simmons?

  I don't love it.

• 1:57:51Chris Ryan?

  It's an interesting time capsule. I don't know if I.

• 1:57:53Sean Fennessey?

  I know.

• 1:57:53Bill Simmons?

  I'm glad it exists, but I wouldn't like get the four K.

• 1:57:58Sean Fennessey?

  I wonder if my just of being a few years younger makes me like that movie a little bit more.

• 1:58:01Chris Ryan?

  You were more of an Eminem guy.

• 1:58:02Sean Fennessey?

  I was more into Eminem.

• 1:58:03Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 1:58:04Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:58:04Speaker 01

  He spoke to you.

• 1:58:05Bill Simmons?

  Frolic Room.

• 1:58:06Chris Ryan?

  That movie peaks with Bob Deep playing in the opening seconds.

• 1:58:09Bill Simmons?

  DeVito, no.

• 1:58:10Sean Fennessey?

  It's a critical part of the film.

• 1:58:10Chris Ryan?

  I know.

• 1:58:11Bill Simmons?

  Evil Cromwell? Has he been evil in anything else?

• 1:58:15Chris Ryan?

  Uh. He's ba- bad in a couple of things, but not the devil.

• 1:58:20Bill Simmons?

  What's your favorite Cromwell?

• 1:58:23Chris Ryan?

  It's this.

• 1:58:25Speaker 01

  Oh, God. Well, he really is good in that Star Trek movie. I think he's very good in that. But Succession was good and, you know.

• 1:58:33Bill Simmons?

  I really loved him in Succession.

• 1:58:35Chris Ryan?

  He's Uncle Ewing?

• 1:58:36Bill Simmons?

  Favorite Cromwell.

• 1:58:37Speaker 01

  He's really good in it.

• 1:58:38Sean Fennessey?

  He's hilarious in that, cuz he's, he's, his, him and Nicholas Braun are genius together. He plays the president in a Jack Ryan movie.

• 1:58:46Chris Ryan?

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:58:46Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:58:47Sean Fennessey?

  Um, but I think this is like maybe his.

• 1:58:49Chris Ryan?

  Like Harrison Ford, Jack Ryan, or which one?

• 1:58:50Sean Fennessey?

  No, it's uh the Ben Affleck one.

• 1:58:52Chris Ryan?

  Oh, some.

• 1:58:52Bill Simmons?

  I think he's excellent in this. I'd probably, I might say this. Toilet Face Dunking, I still think it's St. Elmo's Fire.

• 1:58:58Chris Ryan?

  Hmm, okay.

• 1:58:59Bill Simmons?

  Um, Fifty's L.A.

• 1:59:03Bill Simmons?

  Maybe.

• 1:59:04Speaker 04

  Dangling a guy out the window to get a tour.

• 1:59:06Bill Simmons?

  Dangling a guy out the window, sure.

• 1:59:08Chris Ryan?

  Toilet dunking Big Lebowski, pretty good one.

• 1:59:09Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 1:59:10Bill Simmons?

  Good call.

• 1:59:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, good.

• 1:59:12Bill Simmons?

  I've got a special big picture episode, toilet dunks.

• 1:59:15Sean Fennessey?

  That's a really, for a slow time.

• 1:59:17Bill Simmons?

  Like a June.

• 1:59:18Sean Fennessey?

  Be like, two and a half, three hours.

• 1:59:20Chris Ryan?

  I would pay $10 to watch Amanda watch four hours of guys getting dumped in a toilet.

• 1:59:26Sean Fennessey?

  Do we have four hours of that much footage?

• 1:59:28Bill Simmons?

  I gotta say, whenever there's a toilet dunk, I always think about the actor. And if I had been the actor, like, how many times I would have asked the crew, are we sure it's clean? Nobody's going to the bathroom this?

• 1:59:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:59:40Bill Simmons?

  Who cleaned it? Like, I, I just can't think of anything worse. The Santa Most Fire is a good one because it's like a pretty, like, grungy bathroom.

• 1:59:47Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 1:59:50Bill Simmons?

  Hancock Park Movie Houses. It's probably the, it's the, it's the Howard Hughes house in The Aviator, I still feel like.

• 1:59:57Chris Ryan?

  Which one's that?

• 1:59:59Bill Simmons?

  It's on the eighth hole in Wilshire, it's when they land the plane.

• 2:00:01Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 2:00:02Bill Simmons?

  But he's in that. I feel like that's the best movie location of all of them. Uh, Cruiser Hanks.

• 2:00:08Speaker 01

  Oh wait, can we do one Apex Mountain here?

• 2:00:09Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:10Speaker 01

  For me, this is the apex mountain of guys getting shot in the heart. Like, the, the dude watching the cartoons.

• 2:00:17Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:00:18Speaker 01

  Will live rent-free in my head forever because of the noises he makes after being shot. And the attention paid to Kevin Spacey's post-heart shot. It's very good, I feel like they had a shot in the heart consultant on this film.

• 2:00:29Bill Simmons?

  After the, it's like, you, you don't need to, that guy's done. You shot him in the heart.

• 2:00:33Speaker 01

  Checking your pulse?

• 2:00:34Chris Ryan?

  A heart shot if it's double-tapped and then a guy gets a headshot after, because Wayne grows like.

• 2:00:39Speaker 01

  That's a good one.

• 2:00:40Chris Ryan?

  When they get him in the hotel room, but then he gets shot in the head.

• 2:00:42Speaker 01

  And what movie was that, Chris?

• 2:00:43Chris Ryan?

  Heat.

• 2:00:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:00:44Bill Simmons?

  Well, fortunately, we have a future Cirque du Soleil co-er here, Craig Rolbeck. Shot in the heart, you die instantly, right?

• 2:00:51Speaker 04

  No, I don't think you do, which is why when Russell Crowe shoots him and then go, immediately checks his pulse, I guess he wouldn't have a pulse if he was just shot in the heart, but it has been literally like, two seconds.

• 2:01:00Bill Simmons?

  Yes.

• 2:01:01Speaker 04

  Because we see Spacey die and he gets, he gets 20 seconds to deliver the line of Rollo, uh, what is it?

• 2:01:07Sean Fennessey?

  Tomasi.

• 2:01:08Speaker 01

  I don't think I would have had that in front of my mind.

• 2:01:10Speaker 04

  Sometimes you die instantly when you get shot in the heart, sometimes you don't.

• 2:01:13Chris Ryan?

  It depends if you're ventricle or.

• 2:01:15Speaker 04

  I, I mean, I think your brain still works, so I.

• 2:01:17Sean Fennessey?

  It's amazing to have five doctors here and not know the answer to this question.

• 2:01:20Speaker 01

  Well, look, we're all about doing our

• 2:01:22Bill Simmons?

  Feel free to email us the answer.

• 2:01:23Speaker 01

  All of us are employed at the CDC, Sean, and we are all trying to

• 2:01:26Chris Ryan?

  How many games could Jason Tatum play after getting shot in the heart? You know, just like, right, right back at it.

• 2:01:32Sean Fennessey?

  Don't tempt OG Ananobe, is all I'm saying.

• 2:01:35Bill Simmons?

  Cruise or Hanks? Hanks as Hollywood Jack?

• 2:01:39Sean Fennessey?

  Uh...

• 2:01:40Chris Ryan?

  Cruise is actually...

• 2:01:41Sean Fennessey?

  Cruise is actually is what I was thinking as well.

• 2:01:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I'd Cruise is actually was the other choice. So we go Cruise?

• 2:01:47Speaker 01

  I think Hank, later Hanks as Dudley.

• 2:01:50Chris Ryan?

  Hmm, that would be a great twist casting.

• 2:01:52Bill Simmons?

  Cause you'd... Hanks would never go heel like that. What's the closest he came?

• 2:01:56Sean Fennessey?

  Elvis?

• 2:01:56Bill Simmons?

  Road to Perdition?

• 2:01:57Sean Fennessey?

  No, he did, he did it in, um, uh, what's the Wachowskis movie?

• 2:02:02Chris Ryan?

  Cloud Atlas?

• 2:02:03Sean Fennessey?

  Cloud Atlas, yeah.

• 2:02:03Chris Ryan?

  Doesn't he play like nine guys in that?

• 2:02:05Sean Fennessey?

  He plays like four characters, but he does play a villain, yeah. You haven't seen it?

• 2:02:09Bill Simmons?

  No, this, this would have been good for him. I think for the catalog, him playing one villain in the 90s with all the other shit he did would have been good.

• 2:02:16Chris Ryan?

  Do you think it would be fun if Bill watched Cloud Atlas?

• 2:02:18Sean Fennessey?

  I do think it would be fun. Um, yeah, I think if we could get some

• 2:02:21Bill Simmons?

  It would be, how long would Bill last during Cloud Atlas would be a better game.

• 2:02:25Sean Fennessey?

  I don't think it's your speed, but you're not a Hanks completist. That's something we can say about you. You haven't seen them all.

• 2:02:31Bill Simmons?

  I haven't been happy with the 21st century in Hanks. I'm, I've been on the record for a while. I know you have as well.

• 2:02:36Sean Fennessey?

  I wish he did some different things.

• 2:02:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:38Sean Fennessey?

  He's trying, he's trying a lot of new instruments. They don't all sound good.

• 2:02:42Bill Simmons?

  I think when you fly as close to the sun as he did in the 90s and then with Cast Away, I don't, at some point, it's like, I've, I've won seven titles. What else do you want from me?

• 2:02:51Speaker 01

  He only seems happy in the Wes Anderson movies now. He enjoys that.

• 2:02:54Sean Fennessey?

  He's good in those. I think he's good at that.

• 2:02:56Speaker 01

  Even Cranston.

• 2:02:56Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, they're, they're cooking it.

• 2:02:57Speaker 01

  Two man weave.

• 2:02:58Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:58Bill Simmons?

  Scorsese or Spielberg? Clearly Scorsese.

• 2:03:01Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, but I do think it would be interesting to see Spielberg have, the way that this movie excises some of the gross stuff from LA Confidential and also makes the characters a little less... I mean, Exley is like, lies about his war record in the novel. Like, there's a lot of stuff like about these characters that are even worse. But if you kind of like gave Spielberg this script, I do think it would be good. That being said.

• 2:03:23Bill Simmons?

  He would have cast DeVito as the hush hush editor.

• 2:03:26Speaker 01

  Thank you. A hundred percent.

• 2:03:28Chris Ryan?

  Dreyfus would have been back in the mix.

• 2:03:30Sean Fennessey?

  That's great.

• 2:03:31Chris Ryan?

  Dreyfus.

• 2:03:32Sean Fennessey?

  That's a great pick.

• 2:03:33Chris Ryan?

  Oh, my God.

• 2:03:34Speaker 01

  That's great.

• 2:03:34Chris Ryan?

  That would have been great.

• 2:03:35Speaker 01

  Sean, for this category, I feel like you have to stand up for like the working director like Curtis Hanson. Because again, if it's Scorsese or it's Spielberg, it has a very different point of view.

• 2:03:43Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 2:03:44Speaker 01

  Don't you think stylistically?

• 2:03:45Bill Simmons?

  That's not the game, though. You have to pick.

• 2:03:47Speaker 01

  You have to pick.

• 2:03:48Sean Fennessey?

  One thing I will say about Hansen that he said that I thought was really interesting is he was like, I like suspense films. And that's not really a word you hear. Like, we talk about thrillers all the time on the show. This is often called a crime movie. This is a suspense movie, the way that like a lot of Alfred Hitchcock films are, where you're just like, really want to know where it's going and what's gonna happen. And you're kind of like, you're locked in. Like we were saying, there's just not a lot of fat on the movie. And because of that, if you look at almost all of it, The River Wild is the same thing. Where the whole time you're like, where is this going?

• 2:04:18Bill Simmons?

  You like that movie?

• 2:04:18Chris Ryan?

  The River Wild? Fuck, yeah. I like the remake, too.

• 2:04:23Bill Simmons?

  I watched on Netflix a movie called Gaslit by My Husband.

• 2:04:29Speaker 01

  It's right there in the title.

• 2:04:29Chris Ryan?

  We didn't finish Babylon.

• 2:04:31Bill Simmons?

  First of all, it was amazing. It was a Lifetime movie. It was number one on Netflix. Had to check it out. And I was just riveted the entire time. What do you think about suspenseful? Or?

• 2:04:41Sean Fennessey?

  Gaslit by My Husband?

• 2:04:43Bill Simmons?

  The title is Gaslit by My Husband.

• 2:04:45Sean Fennessey?

  Was this?

• 2:04:46Bill Simmons?

  It was everything I wanted.

• 2:04:48Chris Ryan?

  Did anybody appear in it that we would ever have heard of?

• 2:04:50Bill Simmons?

  Didn't recognize one actor.

• 2:04:52Speaker 01

  Will the algorithm on Netflix just roll from this rewatchables right into that film? Can we arrange for that?

• 2:04:57Bill Simmons?

  When we do the, when the after CR month, when Gaslight by My Husband is the next episode.

• 2:05:02Sean Fennessey?

  Gaslighting month is a good idea. You could do the film Gaslight.

• 2:05:05Bill Simmons?

  Craig, you should check it out, Liz. I think you guys would like Gaslight by My Husband. Yeah, she, she's basically thinks she's going crazy, but he's doing stuff to her. And, and it's, it's actually, it actually would have been a really good movie with better actors. That's my, that's my one blurb.

• 2:05:20Sean Fennessey?

  I'd like to encourage you to check out the 1940s classic Gaslight, around which this seems to be very clearly inspired by.

• 2:05:26Bill Simmons?

  Best hang, worst hang. Best hang?

• 2:05:30Bill Simmons?

  Probably Lynn, Kim Basinger's character.

• 2:05:32Chris Ryan?

  That Jack.

• 2:05:34Bill Simmons?

  Hollywood Jack? Best hang? Go to the frolic room with Hollywood Jack? Pierce Patchett is the best hang.

• 2:05:39Chris Ryan?

  Andy.

• 2:05:39Bill Simmons?

  Cool house, cool attitude. House of heroin.

• 2:05:43Sean Fennessey?

  He's on heroin all the time, so he's chill.

• 2:05:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Maybe four hours of golf with Pierce Patchett would be fun. It'd probably be eight hours.

• 2:05:50Chris Ryan?

  I think Jack would be like, I know how to get into all the clubs. I know, like, we go get a nice meal or something like.

• 2:05:55Bill Simmons?

  Grease the wheels.

• 2:05:56Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:05:57Sean Fennessey?

  Dudley?

• 2:05:58Chris Ryan?

  No.

• 2:05:58Bill Simmons?

  Best or worst? No. He does like his whiskey from Ireland, though. He had that good line.

• 2:06:03Sean Fennessey?

  Knows all the secrets of the world?

• 2:06:04Bill Simmons?

  Hmm. Where's Tank? Stenland? No, no, no, Mrs. Lefferts. Oh, yeah. There's also a dead body.

• 2:06:11Chris Ryan?

  I had actually, but he's right.

• 2:06:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, you're right. Pickin' Nits. I mentioned the gambling really bothered me, that there was no gambling in this movie.

• 2:06:22Bill Simmons?

  Kim Basinger was prettier than Veronica Lake. I did some Veronica Lake research. Whoa. No.

• 2:06:27Chris Ryan?

  Is that your hottest take?

• 2:06:28Sean Fennessey?

  Hold on.

• 2:06:29Bill Simmons?

  I just think, like, she's right. I just needed to dye my hair and I'm good, because I'm hotter than Veronica Lake.

• 2:06:36Sean Fennessey?

  That's a subjective opinion, right?

• 2:06:37Bill Simmons?

  Fair.

• 2:06:38Sean Fennessey?

  Whoever's hotter. She, I don't think she looks like Veronica Lake.

• 2:06:41Bill Simmons?

  She doesn't.

• 2:06:42Sean Fennessey?

  Nor do I think she acts like Veronica Lake.

• 2:06:43Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 2:06:44Sean Fennessey?

  And so she might be the actress who most looks like Veronica Lake at that time, who would make sense for the movie.

• 2:06:49Bill Simmons?

  No, I think they would have cast that differently if anyone who went to the movie in 1997 could remember who Veronica Lake was, except for, like, the film nerds.

• 2:06:57Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, but like, even just the way that Veronica Lake, she's a way more playful actor.

• 2:07:01Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:07:01Sean Fennessey?

  She is like way funnier and is in like a lot of light comedy in the 40s, and Kim Basinger is not a funny actor at all.

• 2:07:08Bill Simmons?

  No. No.

• 2:07:09Chris Ryan?

  Do you think the lady who's, they think is a Lana Turner look-alike, but is Lana Turner in fact looks like Lana Turner?

• 2:07:17Bill Simmons?

  I thought that was pretty good, actually. Yeah, I didn't mind that one. Lana Turner and Johnny Stoppinato, by the way, weren't together until a couple of years after this movie wrapped up, which was... They kinda shaved it. Anything else for nitpicks?

• 2:07:31Chris Ryan?

  A lot of my...

• 2:07:32Speaker 01

  We talked about it in What's Your Worst? There's a lot of, um, it's actually not that fun to go searching for nits for this movie because there's like a thousand people being like, "Actually, plastic ketchup bottles weren't invented until the 70s."

• 2:07:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I know.

• 2:07:43Speaker 01

  And actually, glasses were...

• 2:07:44Bill Simmons?

  The books, the books in Pierce's bookcase.

• 2:07:45Speaker 01

  The only nit that I really, bugged me on re-watch was, there's the scene where Dudley's like, "Edmund, lose the glasses. I've never seen a police officer wearing glasses." And then it cuts to Stenzlin pouring liquor and the first guy with his cup is fucking Four Eyes. So I feel like Dudley just left that party.

• 2:08:00Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:01Speaker 01

  Come on.

• 2:08:02Bill Simmons?

  Sequel, prequel, plus siege TV, all black cast, are untouchable. So in 2020, Brian Helgeland, the writer, said there was a sequel that was in development with Chadwick Boseman, who then got sick. And they decided not to do it.

• 2:08:16Chris Ryan?

  Not based on an Elroy novel?

• 2:08:17Bill Simmons?

  It was set in 1974 and Crow and Pierce would have both been in it.

• 2:08:21Chris Ryan?

  What?

• 2:08:22Bill Simmons?

  And it just kinda fell apart. This is what the research said.

• 2:08:24Speaker 01

  And said Warner Brothers passed and he said that Elroy was either on board or had been spoken to.

• 2:08:29Chris Ryan?

  Okay. Interesting.

• 2:08:33Bill Simmons?

  Is this movie better with Wayne Jenkins, Fergie the florist, Zane Lowe? Or somebody else? Who do you have, CR?

• 2:08:41Speaker 01

  I just wanted, like, I just wanted to just shout out the other TV pilot.

• 2:08:45Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 2:08:45Speaker 01

  Because there were two. There was one in 2003 that you can watch online with Kiefer Sutherland as Hollywood Jack.

• 2:08:50Bill Simmons?

  And the trio logo during the heyday of trio.

• 2:08:53Speaker 01

  The trio's brilliant but canceled when they were air pilots.

• 2:08:56Bill Simmons?

  Really good idea, by the way.

• 2:08:57Speaker 01

  I wish we could bring that back. But the one that, that was for CBS 2019 is pretty compelling because it was created by a writer named Jordan Harper, who wrote a book we love called Everybody Knows. And it was Walton Goggins as Vincent's. It was Shay Wiggum as Stenzlin. Then a bunch of other, like, good working actors, like Mark Weber was Bud White. And Harper's whole pitch was that he was gonna spread out time. And so the night owl wasn't even gonna happen until the second season and...

• 2:09:24Chris Ryan?

  And that's like, you can't go find that one.

• 2:09:25Speaker 01

  You can't find it. I've heard, I've heard... That it was very good and that also CBS never ever would have made it. Right. Because it was a very strange choice for CBS in 2019.

• 2:09:34Sean Fennessey?

  I just don't know how you can do a show like that on network television.

• 2:09:36Speaker 01

  No. It was an era when I think they were taking swings to try, like, will we become cable? Or will we? CBS was like, can you move it to Chicago? Exactly. And just set it in a fire department? And have them never leave the fire department? If you just called it Cops, Colon, Los Angeles. Yeah. It probably would have been on the full schedule. Sorry to interrupt. What do you got, CR? You have Wayne Jenkins, Fergie the Floor, Zane Lowe, anybody else?

• 2:09:58Bill Simmons?

  We've had Zane every week this month.

• 2:10:00Chris Ryan?

  Dudley, man.

• 2:10:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, yeah.

• 2:10:02Chris Ryan?

  Here we are, from the streets of Dublin to the boulevards of Sunset, the city of angels. And you, you've always held that badge high. That's your journey, but now you're on the other side of the law. So tell me, tell me how you got there. Tell me what you plan to do with all that H, the rackets, the sin, the vice. Just explain it all to me, man.

• 2:10:24Bill Simmons?

  It just kills fantasy.

• 2:10:27Sean Fennessey?

  Why? Why does Zane keep entering cops?

• 2:10:32Chris Ryan?

  Yo, if Zane just, just launched Cop Talk. And was talking to fictional and non-fictional cops. Amazing.

• 2:10:42Speaker 01

  But he talks about their, like, career high points.

• 2:10:43Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I mean, everything is like, as if they're Harry Styles. It's like, you've just, you know, all the sounds you feel, you're hearing, you're seeing.

• 2:10:51Speaker 01

  You're bracing people.

• 2:10:52Chris Ryan?

  Harry.

• 2:10:53Bill Simmons?

  I thought for sure you were gonna have him interview the Simon Baker character.

• 2:10:57Chris Ryan?

  It's been a rough for you, mate. Matt Reynolds' last meals. Oh, a hot dog with a top of semen. But here you are, man.

• 2:11:08Chris Ryan?

  So close to badge of honor.

• 2:11:14Sean Fennessey?

  I can't, I, it's, it's in the, uh, it's in the burnt hole zone where I can't make eye contact with you when you start doing it. It transformed. Have you ever watched the Zayn interview? Yeah, because of Chris. Oh, he encouraged it.

• 2:11:28Chris Ryan?

  No, I didn't encourage. I didn't tell you you have to watch a Zayn interview, did I?

• 2:11:32Sean Fennessey?

  You tell me to do lots of things. It's weird, it's like, I was, when, when, when Zayn, like, interviewing Adele or whatever was happening during Crantlin and Juliette and Chris were both so into it. They would show it to me and I'd be like, this is nothing to me. Like, I don't know what is interesting about this. Like, it's fine. It's an interview of an artist.

• 2:11:49Bill Simmons?

  They were just walking around the office with a computer showing it to different people, hoping to connect.

• 2:11:54Sean Fennessey?

  Um, but what you've done with it, you've transformed.

• 2:11:56Chris Ryan?

  And today, the return of that.

• 2:12:01Chris Ryan?

  This is fucking playing low.

• 2:12:05Bill Simmons?

  Just one Oscar, who gets it?

• 2:12:07Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, Dante Spinotti.

• 2:12:09Chris Ryan?

  Nah, he fucking blacked out here.

• 2:12:10Sean Fennessey?

  The cinematographer. Uh, Chris explained it so well, I thought, which is like, how does the, this movie doesn't look like it's trying to be a 50s movie. It looks like it's trying to be a 90s movie. Titanic one, yeah. This movie actually won two Oscars and lost seven, and it lost all seven to Titanic. Oof. Tough beat.

• 2:12:28Speaker 01

  Dante has an incredible, incredible CV, where he's also known as working as being the primary DP for Michael Mann and Brett Ratner.

• 2:12:35Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, he shot parts of Melania.

• 2:12:38Speaker 01

  He did Manhunter and X-Men: The Last Stand.

• 2:12:40Chris Ryan?

  I think I read a Q and A with him about Melania, where they were like, what are you doing? And he was like, I'm a working journalist.

• 2:12:46Sean Fennessey?

  He's interviewed by The New Yorker about it, and he was just, he was, he wouldn't blink. He was like, yeah, I took the job. I'd take it again.

• 2:12:51Speaker 01

  He is, I believe, how old is he? He's currently, um, 84, 85?

• 2:12:58Bill Simmons?

  It's a very well shot documentary. Probably, it's real questions.

• 2:13:02Sean Fennessey?

  You say you haven't finished Babylon, but you have completed Melania?

• 2:13:07Bill Simmons?

  I didn't finish Melania either. I did watch the first 20 minutes.

• 2:13:10Chris Ryan?

  But you haven't watched Gaslit by My Husband to completion?

• 2:13:13Bill Simmons?

  The first.

• 2:13:14Sean Fennessey?

  That's also Melania.

• 2:13:15Bill Simmons?

  Gaslit by My Husband, if there, when's the sequel?

• 2:13:17Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:13:18Bill Simmons?

  She's gotta remarry, have it happen again. Probably, it's real questions. Actually. Like a whiff, maybe, gang? Maybe there's something going on there with him and Bud?

• 2:13:27Speaker 01

  What does Lynn say? You can't fuck Bud by fucking me.

• 2:13:30Bill Simmons?

  That was, I thought the tell and also like he was really, now granted, Lynn looks great.

• 2:13:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:13:36Bill Simmons?

  Um, but it's the only time he's interested in that the entire movie and it seems directly because of some sort of weird Bud thing, but.

• 2:13:43Speaker 01

  I think that's true.

• 2:13:43Bill Simmons?

  I don't know.

• 2:13:44Sean Fennessey?

  It kind of, by not having him take care of Inez, like it also undercuts a little bit of his White Knight, kind of like, presentation in the book.

• 2:13:52Bill Simmons?

  I just thought that whole part was weird. Then, uh, this is the biggest one to me. Is it a better movie if, if Bud just dies? Do we need to see him again?

• 2:14:01Sean Fennessey?

  It's kind of related to my unanswered, but which was what was Bud White gonna do to support Lynn in Arizona?

• 2:14:05Speaker 04

  Or what was Lynn gonna do to support Bud?

• 2:14:07Speaker 01

  The dress store. She's going to do the dress store.

• 2:14:09Speaker 04

  Do you think that that's like-

• 2:14:10Sean Fennessey?

  She's gonna pay for the, he's been shot like multiple times.

• 2:14:13Bill Simmons?

  This year's the what nail word? What are they doing in Phoenix? He's got a hole in his face.

• 2:14:17Speaker 01

  This is what I wondered, like-

• 2:14:18Bill Simmons?

  Form a call girl?

• 2:14:18Speaker 01

  Is the implication that he can't speak anymore because he is a bulletproof-

• 2:14:22Speaker 04

  That's in the book, he can't talk anymore. Yeah.

• 2:14:23Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:14:24Bill Simmons?

  And he's really surviving the two gunshots and then the one right to the face from five feet away?

• 2:14:29Speaker 04

  That felt like a note. I mean, it wasn't a note, but it felt like what we gotta have is like the three good people in this movie handshake at the end.

• 2:14:36Bill Simmons?

  Were you surprised to see him in the car at the end?

• 2:14:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, that was my flex. The Clarence Whorley should have died. I, I do think he should have died. It would have been better for his character. Go down a hero. Showing him in the car, I thought, I think the whole ending, I felt a little deflated at the end. Her line at the end is like-

• 2:14:50Speaker 01

  Some guys get the girl or whatever.

• 2:14:52Speaker 04

  Yeah, some guys get the world, others get an ex hooker and a trip to Arizona. And then you see Russell Crowe. I do feel like it kind of deflated a little bit.

• 2:15:00Bill Simmons?

  I think Aaron Rodgers said that to Mike Tomlin when the Steelers fell apart last year.

• 2:15:05Speaker 04

  He's coming back, so.

• 2:15:06Bill Simmons?

  There's a case that this movie could just end at the hotel and we don't even need the last two scenes.

• 2:15:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, the badge.

• 2:15:12Bill Simmons?

  We definitely don't need the, the psycho ending with him explaining the entire plot in the, uh, to all the cops.

• 2:15:20Speaker 04

  That's Elroy. Every Elroy book is like, there was a five, 10 page scene of like, they find the one guy who can explain everything and he does.

• 2:15:29Bill Simmons?

  Is that the all time, why did you add this scene?

• 2:15:32Sean Fennessey?

  The psycho?

• 2:15:32Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:15:33Sean Fennessey?

  Person?

• 2:15:34Bill Simmons?

  Like, just get that scene out of there. Turn the movie off as soon as, people listening who haven't seen Psycho, during the big attempted murder scene at the end, just end the movie.

• 2:15:44Sean Fennessey?

  I, I've gone back and forth on the Psycho one. Maybe we can save it for the Psycho episode, but I think-

• 2:15:50Bill Simmons?

  Psycho be Psycho episode? I love that movie.

• 2:15:51Sean Fennessey?

  I, that would be great if you wanted to do Psycho. I love Psycho.

• 2:15:54Speaker 01

  I like the way you acted as if you didn't just suggest it. Oh, you guys want to do Psycho?

• 2:15:57Sean Fennessey?

  Well, I never actually thought we would make a film-

• 2:15:59Bill Simmons?

  He planted the suggestion and then made the other person think they thought of it.

• 2:16:03Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, but it's 1960. We don't do movies that, that far back historically. But I would love to do that. But there, there's two things-

• 2:16:09Bill Simmons?

  Running out of movies now that we've done CR movies.

• 2:16:11Chris Ryan?

  Vertigo. Don't you want to do Vertigo?

• 2:16:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Vertigo we've talked about for a while.

• 2:16:14Sean Fennessey?

  That's, but that's like horny CR, horny Bill Hall thing too. Speaking of cutting women to look like other women, that's a part of Vertigo as well.

• 2:16:23Chris Ryan?

  That's not like a big pastime of mine is cutting women to make them look like Edie Falco in Copland.

• 2:16:28Sean Fennessey?

  The Psycho thing, the thing about Psycho is the psychiatrist explaining Norman Bates, that, that part is terrible.

• 2:16:33Bill Simmons?

  That's what I mean.

• 2:16:34Sean Fennessey?

  But the cutaway to Norman at the end with the fly and him like, the voice in his head, that part is great.

• 2:16:39Bill Simmons?

  I was talking about the doctor explaining for four minutes.

• 2:16:43Chris Ryan?

  I had a problem with it.

• 2:16:44Bill Simmons?

  What do you got?

• 2:16:46Chris Ryan?

  Do you think it'd be more entertaining if Shams adopted Sid's writing style? Word around the forum is that Lucas Slovenian sweetheart is taking his kids back to the motherland. But while the baby mama's away, the cat will average 34 points a game. Hashtag Shams.

• 2:17:04Bill Simmons?

  Hush, hush.

• 2:17:06Sean Fennessey?

  Again, Shams is now portrayed by Robert Loggia, which is problematic.

• 2:17:10Speaker 01

  Problematic.

• 2:17:11Chris Ryan?

  Why is that problematic?

• 2:17:13Bill Simmons?

  Can Shams, can we add Shams to the windjacket St. Lo category?

• 2:17:16Chris Ryan?

  But Shams, Shams Hudgens?

• 2:17:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. This is great. This is what Shams needed.

• 2:17:21Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:17:22Speaker 01

  Rebrand.

• 2:17:23Sean Fennessey?

  A little boost.

• 2:17:24Bill Simmons?

  Instead of him like going on First Take in these shows, he could just, that could be his little video thing.

• 2:17:28Chris Ryan?

  Everybody in Boston is talking about whether the two Js will be able to share the ball. And what it means for the two Ps, Peyton Pritchard.

• 2:17:39Chris Ryan?

  Why is this Robert Losha?

• 2:17:44Bill Simmons?

  It's Robert Losha as Shobbs as the

• 2:17:49Chris Ryan?

  That's my Davido voice.

• 2:17:51Bill Simmons?

  Is that weird?

• 2:17:51Sean Fennessey?

  You can do better than that.

• 2:17:56Bill Simmons?

  Workshop.

• 2:17:57Sean Fennessey?

  That's good.

• 2:17:58Bill Simmons?

  Secret handshake club member billion one from this movie. It's gotta be the night owl coffee mug, right?

• 2:18:02Chris Ryan?

  I had roller to Masi. I guess, is that too big?

• 2:18:05Bill Simmons?

  For what is, what is it, though?

• 2:18:07Chris Ryan?

  I don't, I don't know, because

• 2:18:08Bill Simmons?

  That was memorabilia.

• 2:18:11Bill Simmons?

  No, it's memorabilia. It has to be something I could show.

• 2:18:13Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, night owl.

• 2:18:14Speaker 01

  You gotta be the night owl. That we could each share, and if one of us is killed.

• 2:18:18Chris Ryan?

  That's pretty good.

• 2:18:18Speaker 01

  We should come up with that, yeah.

• 2:18:19Bill Simmons?

  There wasn't, like, was there a matches from the Victory Hotel?

• 2:18:23Sean Fennessey?

  I, I had Jack Vincent's tortoiseshell sunglasses, which I think are sick.

• 2:18:28Chris Ryan?

  But this is different than memorabilia.

• 2:18:31Bill Simmons?

  It's memorabilia, but it's secret handshake memorabilia.

• 2:18:34Chris Ryan?

  Gotcha. Okay, so my

• 2:18:36Bill Simmons?

  If I just had a night owl coffee mug and you were like, is that LA confidential? It's like one of those. Like, you almost have to, like, get it.

• 2:18:43Chris Ryan?

  So you haven't seen me leaving flirtily business cards at your house, then?

• 2:18:46Bill Simmons?

  Flirtily business cards? That'd be another one.

• 2:18:49Speaker 04

  I gotta go on. The opening scene of the movie, the opening montage, they show you a Hush Hush magazine cover that says the line that Davido says in the beginning of the movie of, ingenue dykes in Hollywood? You could, that would be mine. The Hush Hush magazine.

• 2:19:03Sean Fennessey?

  Where would you leave that?

• 2:19:03Bill Simmons?

  Frame Hush Hush. We could put it right there.

• 2:19:05Speaker 04

  Just among a stack of regular magazines.

• 2:19:07Chris Ryan?

  Put it right next to Michael Rich's.

• 2:19:08Speaker 04

  Just imagining Bill getting ingenue dykes in Hollywood served to him on Netflix.

• 2:19:12Bill Simmons?

  I'm searching for it tonight on eBay.

• 2:19:14Speaker 04

  And just be like, alright, I was gonna watch Babylon, but fuck it.

• 2:19:19Speaker 01

  Brutalist is too long.

• 2:19:20Bill Simmons?

  You guys laugh, but put on Gaslight by My Husband. Get gaslit. Give it 10 minutes and see if you're still watching.

• 2:19:27Speaker 04

  It would be a good bit for you, Sean, like

• 2:19:30Sean Fennessey?

  Start logging it.

• 2:19:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:19:31Sean Fennessey?

  Is there a sequel to this?

• 2:19:33Bill Simmons?

  It would be funny if you just logged it out of nowhere.

• 2:19:35Sean Fennessey?

  I'll watch it. Look, I'll watch anything. I don't care.

• 2:19:37Bill Simmons?

  Was number one on Netflix? That had my attention. Coach Finstock, Mr. Miyagi, were best, worst life lesson. Some men get the world, others get ex hookers and a trip to Arizona. It's a pretty good life lesson. Best double feature choice? We all have Chinatown.

• 2:19:51Sean Fennessey?

  Who framed Roger Rabbit?

• 2:19:54Sean Fennessey?

  Which is similarly a movie about this period in history. Post-war detectives trying to solve a big cover-up. But also a kind of a parable about the building of the highways. And who controls the ways and means of the city.

• 2:20:08Speaker 01

  What noir would you put up with this, In A Lonely Place?

• 2:20:10Sean Fennessey?

  That's a great one. That one's a little Hollywood inside baseball.

• 2:20:14Chris Ryan?

  I like Touch of Evil for that.

• 2:20:15Sean Fennessey?

  That's good. Mexico.

• 2:20:16Chris Ryan?

  Not an LA movie. I would also say as a kind of museum piece more than an enjoyable movie, the Brian De Palma's Black Dahlia, which there is now legendarily a director's cut. I don't, I don't know if that's true or not.

• 2:20:29Bill Simmons?

  Are there Dahlia heads out there?

• 2:20:31Chris Ryan?

  I mean, Black Dahlia is an incredible novel.

• 2:20:33Bill Simmons?

  I'm saying for the movie.

• 2:20:35Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, I think there are people who are like, there's a secret director's cut that would be better.

• 2:20:39Speaker 01

  Holding that hope.

• 2:20:40Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:20:41Sean Fennessey?

  So I think a really good semi-classic noir, not as seen as some of the best-known ones that would be good for this is The Blue Dahlia, which is, um, features Veronica Lake. Alan Ladd is the star. It's about a guy who comes home from World War II and takes a trip to Los Angeles. And it's the only original screenplay that Raymond Chandler ever wrote. And he was nominated for an Academy Award for it. And it's like, it's a pretty good movie. It's not considered on the, like, Bogart class of noirs, but I really like it.

• 2:21:09Bill Simmons?

  I have a double feature guest slip by my husband.

• 2:21:12Chris Ryan?

  That's good.

• 2:21:13Sean Fennessey?

  Good choice.

• 2:21:13Bill Simmons?

  I'd watch it first, though, and then go in LA Conference.

• 2:21:15Chris Ryan?

  Did you have one?

• 2:21:16Bill Simmons?

  Step up.

• 2:21:16Speaker 01

  In A Lonely Place.

• 2:21:17Chris Ryan?

  In A Lonely Place.

• 2:21:18Speaker 01

  But you said it wasn't good enough.

• 2:21:19Bill Simmons?

  Who won the movie?

• 2:21:20Sean Fennessey?

  I didn't say that.

• 2:21:21Speaker 01

  I remember it.

• 2:21:21Chris Ryan?

  No, you guys are turning at each other.

• 2:21:24Bill Simmons?

  I've been praying for it for two hours.

• 2:21:27Chris Ryan?

  Who won the movie?

• 2:21:28Sean Fennessey?

  Curtis Hanson.

• 2:21:32Speaker 01

  Come back to me.

• 2:21:35Chris Ryan?

  I actually think they're.

• 2:21:36Bill Simmons?

  Hell, go on.

• 2:21:38Speaker 01

  I feel like, I feel like Crowe has been minimized. We have not talked about.

• 2:21:41Sean Fennessey?

  You might be right.

• 2:21:41Chris Ryan?

  Crowe is the answer.

• 2:21:42Speaker 01

  Kind of won this movie.

• 2:21:44Bill Simmons?

  Crow wins the movie because it sets up ten years of Russell Crowe being one of the biggest stars we have.

• 2:21:50Speaker 01

  And a feeling.

• 2:21:51Bill Simmons?

  It has to start with this.

• 2:21:52Speaker 01

  It still matters, like as little as it happens where it's like you go to a movie and you don't really know this person. You leave the movie only talking about this person.

• 2:21:59Chris Ryan?

  Yeah, that's true.

• 2:22:00Speaker 01

  And being like, oh, this is a new.

• 2:22:02Bill Simmons?

  It's a new, it's a breakout.

• 2:22:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, what are we gonna do with this next? How are we gonna see him next? Who's gonna harness this rage in this surprisingly modest frame?

• 2:22:11Bill Simmons?

  I also think he needs it for the IMDb, like just a collage of work. This is a good one to throw in there and then he's got Gladiator and of course everything peaks with.

• 2:22:20Chris Ryan?

  It's a good argument. I just, I just have.

• 2:22:22Bill Simmons?

  Beautiful Mind.

• 2:22:23Chris Ryan?

  The writers, just because it's like an unadaptable book and they made.

• 2:22:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, that's true.

• 2:22:27Chris Ryan?

  A great script out of it.

• 2:22:28Bill Simmons?

  That's fair. All right, here we go. Producer Craig, what do you got?

• 2:22:33Speaker 04

  I don't want to get crushed for this.

• 2:22:34Chris Ryan?

  You don't like it?

• 2:22:35Speaker 04

  I liked it, I didn't love it. I liked it, I didn't love it and I do, it's always tough. Every time I listen to you guys, by the end of it, I'm like, wow, then maybe that was way better than I thought. But in the moment, I thought the lead three actors were great. I thought the story was really interesting. I don't know, it felt just like a little cheesy to me and the dialogue, I had trouble with a lot of the dialogue. And I don't know if it's just great actors, tough dialogue, or if that is kind of the, the style of the noir 50s world they're building. And that's the way it's supposed to be. But when it wasn't Pierce, Russell Crowe, or Spacey, and it was like the DeVito or the Kim Basinger, mixed in with some of the dialogue, I had trouble kind of like fully get my hands dirty with it.

• 2:23:15Bill Simmons?

  That's when you're on Steelers mock drafts?

• 2:23:17Speaker 04

  No, I was locked in the whole time. I paid attention.

• 2:23:19Speaker 01

  There are a couple, like there are a couple of lines that like are a little clunkier than I remember them being. Like when, when Exley's trying to get Jack to go and Jack's like, are you ready to pay the consequences?

• 2:23:28Speaker 04

  Yeah, right.

• 2:23:29Speaker 01

  Which I don't think is something you say or do. But.

• 2:23:32Speaker 04

  And then I started, you know, after I watched the movie, I was reading some stuff and then I was like, oh, wow, this is, Library of Congress is saving this movie, preserving this film and everyone's like greatest movie ever made. And I was like, oh, maybe I'm, I'm missing something and need to watch it again.

• 2:23:43Bill Simmons?

  I mean, I see what he's saying though. I think it's a second watch movie that, I think the second time when you don't, you're not so worried about following every single thing that's happening. And you're just watching it for the actors and the choices. It's a different movie.

• 2:23:58Speaker 04

  But not only is it a 30 year old movie, but the.

• 2:24:01Chris Ryan?

  The lexicon of the film is seventy-five years ago, so it's like basically a western to you.

• 2:24:06Speaker 01

  My thing, when I saw the movie, I was relatively film illiterate of old movies and I hadn't seen the noirs that it was influenced by, and so my relationship with this movie has deepened because of what it sent me back to.

• 2:24:17Chris Ryan?

  That was probably how I felt about Chinatown when I saw it, where I was like, this is so incredible, and then you go back and watch forty's and fifty's movies and you're like, whoa, the style of the acting and the style of the performance.

• 2:24:26Bill Simmons?

  One thing that's noteworthy is a lot of people have tried and failed to make movies like this.

• 2:24:30Chris Ryan?

  Oh, like Dexter Squad?

• 2:24:32Bill Simmons?

  I think this is one of the high degree of difficulty.

• 2:24:36Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I could see what they're going for, but that just didn't work, or they cast the wrong person, or they didn't have the feel for it. There's only a couple that have actually made it.

• 2:24:44Speaker 01

  Or tried to be about too much, like this is going to the TV point, like the smartest decision they made was the one that was harshest maybe for Elroy super heads, which is if it's not about these three guys and their journey with this one case, it's not in the movie.

• 2:24:56Bill Simmons?

  What was that one Affleck made, it was in LA, but it was in the mid two thousand teens?

• 2:25:00Chris Ryan?

  They Live by Night?

• 2:25:01Bill Simmons?

  The gangster movie? Oh, no, no, I'm talking about, it was sent, They Live by Night.

• 2:25:06Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, Live by Night.

• 2:25:07Bill Simmons?

  Live by Night. But that's an example of like, when you go way back and you're really going for it.

• 2:25:12Chris Ryan?

  That's thirties, right?

• 2:25:13Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and I, I don't.

• 2:25:14Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:25:14Chris Ryan?

  Good book.

• 2:25:15Bill Simmons?

  I like Affleck, I don't know if that movie totally worked, but.

• 2:25:18Sean Fennessey?

  But Hollywoodland would actually be an interesting double feature with this, because that's sort of about a similar, a few years later, in the mid, late fifties. I, this is a movie where I fully just copped to having on my fifteen-year-old glasses, where I, in ninety-seven, you went through some of the movies, like I made a much longer list of movies, all of which I tried to see or saw in movie theaters that like, totally switched me on. I was voraciously consuming movie magazines at this time. It was The Game, it was Cronenberg's Crash is that year, Contact is that year, Private Parts, the Howard Stern movie, Night Falls on Manhattan, the Lumet movie, I Know What You Did Last Summer, Wag the Dog, we mentioned In-N-Out, In the Company of Men was a huge movie that year.

• 2:26:00Sean Fennessey?

  Event Horizon, Liar Liar, like all of those movies, I was really just starting to go crazy.

• 2:26:07Bill Simmons?

  Hit you at the perfect time.

• 2:26:07Sean Fennessey?

  Where I was like, I'm going every Friday.

• 2:26:11Speaker 01

  Good year.

• 2:26:11Bill Simmons?

  Same thing.

• 2:26:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:26:12Bill Simmons?

  It's why I still support Karate Kid, all those Purple Rain.

• 2:26:17Chris Ryan?

  Inspector Todd.

• 2:26:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, fifteen, I think, is the key movie year. I even saw it happen with my son a little bit. See, your brain has just developed enough that you can start actually understanding movies and you think you're smarter than you are.

• 2:26:28Sean Fennessey?

  That's what, and this movie is a really a good, like, you're a grown up now?

• 2:26:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:26:31Speaker 01

  Movie? That's exactly right.

• 2:26:32Chris Ryan?

  But it'll be interesting to watch Ben's taste develop, because we had video stores and what was in the theaters. Ben has everything that's ever been made, like at his fingertips.

• 2:26:42Bill Simmons?

  When are we gonna have, maybe Zane can interview Ben. Ben, you fell in love with Kubrick?

• 2:26:49Chris Ryan?

  So when you see Project Hail Mary, you're seeing a copy of a copy.

• 2:26:54Bill Simmons?

  Uh, that's it for CR month.

• 2:26:55Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:26:56Speaker 01

  Wow.

• 2:26:56Bill Simmons?

  We did it. Five movies in a mailbag. Unbelievable.

• 2:26:59Chris Ryan?

  Thanks, guys.

• 2:27:00Bill Simmons?

  Frank's favorite rewatchables month, I think.

• 2:27:03Chris Ryan?

  A lot of bangers. I'm sorry I couldn't close it out strong for you, but it's okay, man. I had a great time.

• 2:27:07Bill Simmons?

  Um, what were the highlights?

• 2:27:09Chris Ryan?

  Definitely Matt Reynolds' last meal.

• 2:27:15Chris Ryan?

  The highlights, we're getting to finally do Sicario and getting to podcast with my guys, you know?

• 2:27:20Sean Fennessey?

  What do you think of all this? As someone who's known him longer than anybody?

• 2:27:23Chris Ryan?

  What does that mean?

• 2:27:24Speaker 01

  Well, no, I think it's, it's, it's.

• 2:27:26Bill Simmons?

  You should ask that like Zane.

• 2:27:28Sean Fennessey?

  What do you think of the artist?

• 2:27:29Speaker 01

  Every month of my life for the last thirty years has been CR month, so it's just nice to see everyone else catch up.

• 2:27:34Bill Simmons?

  Did you guys know each other when this movie came out?

• 2:27:36Speaker 01

  Yes. Yeah, we, this is our thirtieth anniversary this year.

• 2:27:39Sean Fennessey?

  Oh.

• 2:27:40Chris Ryan?

  That's sweet.

• 2:27:40Bill Simmons?

  Unbelievable.

• 2:27:41Speaker 01

  But we didn't see this movie together. You were, you were, he was probably at parties.

• 2:27:45Chris Ryan?

  Ninety-seven? I was probably going to see like.

• 2:27:48Bill Simmons?

  CR, who would you hold good son style if they're both hanging on a cliff and you had to save, you could only use strength to save one?

• 2:27:54Chris Ryan?

  Of Greenwald and Sean?

• 2:27:55Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:27:56Chris Ryan?

  It's a tough question.

• 2:27:57Bill Simmons?

  All right.

• 2:27:57Speaker 01

  I've lived a full life.

• 2:27:58Bill Simmons?

  Save it for April.

• 2:27:59Speaker 01

  I'm fine.

• 2:28:00Sean Fennessey?

  I'm younger.

• 2:28:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, Sean has more to give.

• 2:28:04Bill Simmons?

  My mom is furious that we didn't do any in the cruisers.

• 2:28:07Chris Ryan?

  Well, we could still do it. Are you now holding a hostage for the next CR month or?

• 2:28:11Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 2:28:11Sean Fennessey?

  Will there be another CR month?

• 2:28:13Bill Simmons?

  I think every March should be CR month. I don't know why we wouldn't do that.

• 2:28:17Chris Ryan?

  I'll compete with March Madness.

• 2:28:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's kind of.

• 2:28:20Chris Ryan?

  It's patino in CR.

• 2:28:21Speaker 01

  I'm glad that it's a thirty-one day month. It's not like Women's History Month being like February. This is good.

• 2:28:26Bill Simmons?

  We cram five, that was one of the reasons we did, I mean, the next, when we do From Hell Month, I think that's gonna be the, the peak of the rewatchables.

• 2:28:33Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:28:33Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 2:28:34Sean Fennessey?

  Can you, do you have like a?

• 2:28:35Bill Simmons?

  I was scouting Breakdown.

• 2:28:38Chris Ryan?

  Oh, fuck.

• 2:28:40Chris Ryan?

  Can we do Perfect Getaway from From Hell?

• 2:28:42Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 2:28:43Chris Ryan?

  Okay.

• 2:28:44Bill Simmons?

  That's noir.

• 2:28:45Sean Fennessey?

  Wait, is Breakdown?

• 2:28:47Chris Ryan?

  The Timothy Olyphant?

• 2:28:47Sean Fennessey?

  The Breakdown from Hell?

• 2:28:48Bill Simmons?

  Trucker from Hell.

• 2:28:49Sean Fennessey?

  But isn't that dual?

• 2:28:51Bill Simmons?

  No, but Breakdown's different. They take his wife.

• 2:28:54Sean Fennessey?

  I mean, I love Breakdown and I love JT Walsh.

• 2:28:56Bill Simmons?

  Breakdown's insane.

• 2:28:57Sean Fennessey?

  I'm a huge fan. Another similar Curtis Hanson style guy, Jonathan Mostow made that one.

• 2:29:04Bill Simmons?

  My favorite one that's on the From Hell month schedule is Domestic Disturbance with John Travolta and Vince Vaughn.

• 2:29:11Sean Fennessey?

  Yep.

• 2:29:11Bill Simmons?

  Evil stepfather.

• 2:29:12Speaker 01

  I don't remember this at all.

• 2:29:14Sean Fennessey?

  Who's the evil stepfather?

• 2:29:15Bill Simmons?

  Vince Vaughn

• 2:29:16Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 2:29:16Bill Simmons?

  is the evil second husband to Terry Polo.

• 2:29:20Sean Fennessey?

  Oh.

• 2:29:21Bill Simmons?

  And John Travolta is the first husband. And he thinks something's up with this guy. So you guys didn't notice that? There's something up with this guy.

• 2:29:28Sean Fennessey?

  Is Domestic Disturbance Harold Becker?

• 2:29:30Bill Simmons?

  I think it is.

• 2:29:31Chris Ryan?

  I think that the Perfect Getaway is From Hell. It's the people we meet on vacation from hell.

• 2:29:36Bill Simmons?

  Oh, you're talking about the Steve Zahn one? Oh, yeah, yeah. I like that movie.

• 2:29:40Chris Ryan?

  I love that movie.

• 2:29:41Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:29:42Bill Simmons?

  It's a good one. Good little... You familiar with that one, Andy?

• 2:29:44Speaker 01

  No, I love... This is like Seen Under the Hood.

• 2:29:46Chris Ryan?

  It's a really good twist.

• 2:29:47Speaker 01

  This is how it gets made.

• 2:29:48Sean Fennessey?

  Don't spoil it.

• 2:29:49Bill Simmons?

  Good Hawaii movie.

• 2:29:50Chris Ryan?

  It's a good Hawaii movie.

• 2:29:52Bill Simmons?

  Get to go on location.

• 2:29:52Chris Ryan?

  Uh, Perfect Getaway with Steve Zahn, Timothy Olyphant, and Mila Jovovich.

• 2:29:56Bill Simmons?

  You've told me about this film.

• 2:29:58Sean Fennessey?

  Quality flick.

• 2:29:59Chris Ryan?

  We should go to Hawaii, record it there.

• 2:30:01Bill Simmons?

  Could we do a live show in Hawaii?

• 2:30:03Chris Ryan?

  Get neffed out?

• 2:30:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, sounds great.

• 2:30:04Sean Fennessey?

  It's the greatest place on earth, so please.

• 2:30:06Bill Simmons?

  It really is. That sounds awesome. All right, CR month. Thanks to Craig Rollback.

• 2:30:09Chris Ryan?

  Thanks, guys.

• 2:30:09Bill Simmons?

  Thanks for letting me celebrate. Thanks to Gahan Eduardo as well and everybody else at The Ringer. Great to be in here in the studio. We'll do... Anytime we have three or less, we're doing we're doing my studio.

• 2:30:20Chris Ryan?

  Yeah.

• 2:30:20Bill Simmons?

  It's just more of an intimate space.

• 2:30:23Sean Fennessey?

  How did it feel?

• 2:30:24Speaker 01

  It felt great. It's like riding a bike.

• 2:30:26Bill Simmons?

  You can listen to CR and Andy on the watch, CR, Sean on Big Picture. And we'll see you in April in the rewatchables.

• 2:30:45Speaker 08

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• 2:31:16Speaker 09

  It's getting chilly outside. But you know what that means?

• 2:31:22Speaker 09

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