‘Can’t Hardly Wait’ With Bill Simmons and Joanna Robinson

The Ringer’s Bill Simmons and Joanna Robinson call Barry Manilow from a phone booth at 2 a.m. before rewatching the cult teen classic ‘Can’t Hardly Wait,’ starring Ethan Embry, Jennifer Love Hewitt, and Seth Green. Podcast Manager: Craig Horlbeck Video Producers: Jack Sanders and Chia Hao Tat Try Loom today, visit loom.com to get started Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Welcome to the brand new Zach Lowe Show. That's right, I'm back to have the same in-depth NBA conversations you're used to. We're going to talk about the games, the X's and O's, the drama. The playoffs are coming up and now you get to see every episode in full on video on Spotify and on my own YouTube channel. Episodes drop every Monday and Thursday with a collection of guests you're going to love. So make sure you follow and subscribe to the brand new Zach Lowe Show on Spotify or wherever you watch or listen to your podcasts. Let's go!

• 0:35Speaker 01

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• 2:06Bill Simmons?

  The Rewatchables is brought to you by The Ringer Podcast Network. You can find Joanna Robinson on House of R with Matt LaRueven.

• 2:12Speaker 05

  Correct.

• 2:12Bill Simmons?

  My longtime friend.

• 2:13Speaker 05

  Absolutely.

• 2:14Bill Simmons?

  You can find the three of us on the Prestige TV podcast. We just broke down the season finale of White Lotus, which we have not seen yet as we're recording this podcast.

• 2:23Speaker 05

  I know. We're living in a bubble. We don't know.

• 2:25Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, we don't know. They've been hiding the screeners from us. But Joanna's been in LA for how many, how many weeks now?

• 2:33Speaker 05

  Six weeks.

• 2:33Bill Simmons?

  Six weeks.

• 2:34Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:34Bill Simmons?

  And you've done, I think, about 95 podcasts in those six weeks.

• 2:38Speaker 05

  And you thought I deserved a reward today, right?

• 2:40Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, so I said, we gotta do Rewatchables before you leave.

• 2:43Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:43Bill Simmons?

  I sent you a list, and one of the two movies that you said was absolutely one of your all-timers was Can't Hardly Wait. And I was like, really interesting.

• 2:53Speaker 05

  Who says no? Who says no?

• 2:54Bill Simmons?

  I can't say no to that.

• 2:55Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 2:56Bill Simmons?

  So we're gonna dive into Can't Hardly Wait next.

• 2:59Speaker 06

  Time to get freaky! Their first night of freedom.

• 3:02Speaker 02

  He is the most dark guy in school. Yeah. And school's over.

• 3:06Speaker 06

  Was their last chance. Amanda? To say what they want. God, you're a hottie. Can I see you naked? Do what they feel.

• 3:14Speaker 02

  Maybe I should wear a hat. Listen here, Hootie. Hootie!

• 3:17Speaker 06

  And be who they are. I wonder how William was doing at the party.

• 3:21Speaker 02

  I can't feel my legs. I can't feel my legs!

• 3:24Speaker 06

  Can't Hardly Wait, rated PG-13. Opens everywhere June 12th.

• 3:44Bill Simmons?

  Here's why I was really intrigued when you wanted to do this.

• 3:47Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 3:47Bill Simmons?

  It's, it's kind of less about Can't Hardly Wait, which I think has become like a pretty big cult movie.

• 3:52Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 3:52Bill Simmons?

  Over the last 20. I mean, we even wrote about it for The Ringer once upon a time.

• 3:55Speaker 05

  Yeah, great.

• 3:56Bill Simmons?

  The late 90s is such an interesting movie time. And where Can't Hardly Wait fits into that with just what was happening in Hollywood in general and then the movie and what it was trying to do and how rewatchable it became when it wasn't, I don't think anyone thought, whoa, this is amazing when it came out and then it just kind of kept going and going and going.

• 4:15Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 4:16Bill Simmons?

  And I'm not sure that happens anymore because I just think this is a Netflix series now. I don't even think this movie would exist.

• 4:22Speaker 05

  No, this movie doesn't exist. I think, yeah, the closest you get recently, and it's not even that recent, is Netflix's American Vandal that TV series they did, or something like Booksmart, you know? But this being as mainstream as it is, having the soundtrack that it does, having the roster of talent that it does, we don't make this anymore at all.

• 4:42Bill Simmons?

  So why do you love it? It just hit you at the perfect time in your life?

• 4:46Speaker 05

  Yeah. Do you have a teen movie that's like exactly?

• 4:48Bill Simmons?

  All the eighties.

• 4:49Speaker 05

  But like, what's like your micro generation, like exactly right, if you had to pick one eighties teen movie?

• 4:54Bill Simmons?

  Probably Breakfast Club.

• 4:55Speaker 05

  Breakfast Club.

• 4:56Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. But I mean, Breakfast Club, just one of the guys, Karate Kid, Secret of My Iron, Can't Buy Me Love, Sixteen Candles, like, there's like, there was 20 of them. We had less channels back then.

• 5:06Speaker 05

  Well, the eighties teen movies like can't be beat, but there's something about 1998, Can't Hardly Wait for a very specific, I think, micro generation, which is my generation, which is the one between millennials and Gen X, that gap generation, Generation Catalano, whatever, Generation Oregon Trail, whatever you want to call it. This is our teen movie. And I have, like, if you asked me, based on my friends in high school, everyone I knew, and how often they quoted this movie, I would have said this was the biggest movie of 1998.

• 5:38Bill Simmons?

  I'm not surprised.

• 5:39Speaker 05

  And it wasn't at all, but like, that was what it felt like at the time.

• 5:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Well, not so, it's like, internet's forming, but not really yet. But the big thing for me is how influenced this was, and this whole era was influenced by those eighties movies.

• 5:53Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 5:54Bill Simmons?

  This is like the, the sons and daughters of John Hughes.

• 5:58Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 5:58Bill Simmons?

  And all of these other things, and they're just, they're just stealing different things that worked. Like, this movie is basically, they're stealing Say Anything.

• 6:05Speaker 05

  That's what they said.

• 6:06Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, they admit it. They're like, we watched Say Anything, and we're like, why isn't that big party? Why isn't that just the whole movie? They're stealing John Hughes stuff left and right. They're stealing from Secret of My Iron. They're stealing from Can't Buy Me Love with the nerds, like.

• 6:20Speaker 05

  But like, but making it just slightly tuned to the frequency of nineteen ninety eight.

• 6:26Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 6:26Speaker 05

  Um, but yeah, we're not, we're not reinventing the wheel with this movie at all. Except it's a weird bridge between those eighties movies, which were so about your social circles. Right? You can't, if you're, unless you're like Lloyd Dobler, you can't move between

• 6:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 6:42Speaker 05

  social circles in the eighties unless you fall in love with someone and that's your way across to the popular kids or whatever it is. And then after this movie into the aughts, when you get movies like Twenty One Jump Street or Booksmart, the message is less like, hey, you're in a clique and you belong there. And usually when you get to these like big party scenes, super bad or something like that, it's about how we're all just teenagers and friends together figuring it out.

• 7:10Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 7:10Speaker 05

  You know, and this is just right on the cusp of that when you get scenes between like the nerd and the jock at the end of the movie, where they have this bonding moment, like it's not about, can I get the popular girl? Though that is the, the spite of this movie, but it's about, we're all about to leave high school and none of this is gonna mean anything anyway.

• 7:29Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 7:29Speaker 05

  Once we're gone, you know?

• 7:30Bill Simmons?

  And also I'm stuck in this role that I became in high school and this is basically my last night to break out of it.

• 7:37Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 7:38Bill Simmons?

  If I don't like where I've been pigeonholed or positioned, can I get out of it this way? Um, and you mentioned the aughts, like American Pie comes right, basically right after this movie.

• 7:49Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 7:49Bill Simmons?

  And we just go from like, we're down here to blowing up. And you watch this movie now and they talk about it in some of the research, like this should have just been, this should have started the R rated high school comedy movie phase. And they kind of had it and a lot of the stuff got cut out because it was still that attitude of, no, no, we need to get the kids to be in the theater. We need high school kids.

• 8:09Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 8:10Bill Simmons?

  And they didn't see the big picture, which American Pie saw, and that changed everything.

• 8:14Speaker 05

  Right. This was originally rated R and they cut a bunch of like drug use out.

• 8:18Bill Simmons?

  Wait to talk about all the stuff they cut. It's unbelievable.

• 8:19Speaker 05

  In order, in order to make it tamer and that I think neutered it a bit. But there is like something then quite sweet about it, like some of the, like stuff, the stuff they cut out sounds like funny and fun and we'll get to that. But like, this is just a very sweet movie at the end of the day.

• 8:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 8:35Speaker 05

  Despite all the other things that happened and some of the stuff that is aged, aged very poorly.

• 8:39Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 8:40Speaker 05

  But like, there is just like a very. Innocent way about this movie, you know?

• 8:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's one of those movies that just immediately was on for fifteen straight years. And one of the reasons it was on for so long was it was so translatable to TBS, TNT.

• 8:53Speaker 05

  Totally.

• 8:54Bill Simmons?

  Any channel, they didn't really have a lot to cut. There's a couple of bad words. They don't, there's no nudity. There's nothing, people being drunk, but you're not really seeing them like, cause they were so careful about the PG thirteen. It just immediately moved into this fifteen year run.

• 9:09Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly. And everyone I knew had it on DVD. This was like a huge DVD sale. I have this in my collection movie.

• 9:17Bill Simmons?

  It's funny, cause I was watching and I got nostalgic for that era. You know, I was older, I was in my late twenties at that point.

• 9:23Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 9:23Bill Simmons?

  But I was, I had, you know, my uncle's daughters who were all going through the, all of these movies. And I went with them to a couple of them. Um, and it all of a sudden, there was this boom and we'll go backwards, cause you have Clueless and then you have Scream.

• 9:36Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 9:37Bill Simmons?

  And Scream is what, Scream's the tipping point.

• 9:40Speaker 05

  Cause.

• 9:40Bill Simmons?

  Scream breaks Hollywood's brains.

• 9:41Speaker 05

  Micro budget makes over a hundred million dollars.

• 9:44Bill Simmons?

  Teen horror movie, but really a teen movie and everybody goes and Hollywood's going, hmm.

• 9:49Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 9:49Bill Simmons?

  So you have this generation raised on Hughes, Risky Business, Karate Kid, Can't Buy Me Love. Just all those movies. Now they're ready for their generation. You have the internet, that's not the internet yet. You have high school kids still going to movies.

• 10:05Speaker 05

  Hmm.

• 10:05Bill Simmons?

  Like as like, nobody's like home online all the time, cause online really hasn't happened yet.

• 10:09Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 10:10Bill Simmons?

  So they're still like, what am I doing tonight? Where am I going?

• 10:12Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 10:12Bill Simmons?

  It's a big date thing. You also have network TV. It's just create, it's like this farm system of teen stars.

• 10:20Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 10:20Bill Simmons?

  Cause you have nine oh two one oh and Party of Five and, uh.

• 10:23Speaker 05

  And the WB is coming up, yeah.

• 10:25Bill Simmons?

  Dawson's Creek.

• 10:26Speaker 05

  Dawson's.

• 10:27Bill Simmons?

  So it's, it's almost like the real world creating the chat, the feeder system for the challenge.

• 10:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 10:32Bill Simmons?

  It's like, here's Katie Holmes, throw her into disturbing behavior.

• 10:35Speaker 05

  Exactly, exactly.

• 10:36Bill Simmons?

  Hey, here's Jennifer Love Hewitt. You like her in Party Five? Here she is. This, and so it's this little sweet spot, PG thirteen. This is really when they figured out exactly how far they could go. And then you have Maxim magazine, that era is there where Jennifer Love Hewitt, whoever the, the best looking girl in the movie. They were always in that world. And then the last thing was the pop music. For whatever reason, and the same thing happened in the eighties, in the mid eighties. The pop music just makes sense for movie soundtracks. Like these bands like Blink one eighty two, like they're just like, they're just

• 11:09Speaker 05

  Smash Mouth.

• 11:10Bill Simmons?

  Background, yeah, background music for movies.

• 11:12Speaker 05

  It's perfect. The soundtrack to this movie is insane.

• 11:16Bill Simmons?

  It's really, and it really feels like, it feels like nineteen ninety eight.

• 11:19Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 11:20Bill Simmons?

  We talk about that sometimes on this pod about when music just makes perfect sense for when the movie came out. And this is one of those where it's like, of course.

• 11:29Speaker 05

  I was talking to a friend of mine, in terms of that, that ramp up that you just mentioned Clueless and Scream to this, I was talking to a friend of mine who's just, yeah, just like two, three years older than me, and she's like, oh, this isn't my movie at all. And I was like, what's your movie? She said Clueless, you know? And so there's just like, there's the Clueless, and then there's American Pie. And this is just like in that weird gap between, I think.

• 11:49Bill Simmons?

  Cause Hollywood was still trying in the late eighties, early nineties. It's just the movies weren't that good. But then, like for, there's a certain generation, kind of between me and you, where like Adventures in Babysitting is their movie.

• 12:00Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 12:01Bill Simmons?

  You know?

• 12:01Speaker 05

  And that's another, I mean, the movie that is just a teen party, there aren't as many as you would think there are, but they're all interesting to me. And then The One Crazy Night, which Adventures in Babysitting is, but like that One Crazy Night idea is, always hits for me. I love, I love that as a concept for a movie.

• 12:19Bill Simmons?

  One Crazy Night always works. High school is about to be over. This is our last chance to change the perception of who we are. That always works.

• 12:27Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 12:28Bill Simmons?

  Somebody pining for somebody else. That always, I mean, that was basically Sixteen Candles. That was the blueprint.

• 12:32Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 12:33Bill Simmons?

  So this movie is just grabbing different little tiny things. The other thing, the teen movie boom we mentioned, it's really an amazing post Scream three years. I wrote down all the movies. I think I got all of these. And American Pie was the biggest one, but you have, I know what you did last summer, one and two. Halloween H two O?

• 12:51Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 12:52Bill Simmons?

  Which they reinvent Halloween, basically is a teen movie?

• 12:54Speaker 05

  Michelle Williams, yeah.

• 12:56Bill Simmons?

  Um, The Faculty.

• 12:57Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 12:58Bill Simmons?

  Um, I, I gotta say, I'm embarrassed by how many I saw. I saw a lot of these in the theater, including The Faculty, including Disturbing Behavior.

• 13:05Speaker 05

  I love, you're like the only person who's ever talked about disturbing behavior.

• 13:08Bill Simmons?

  Disturbing Behavior is good.

• 13:09Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:09Bill Simmons?

  I still defend it. Uh, Varsity Blues.

• 13:12Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 13:12Bill Simmons?

  Cruel Intentions, I think was one of the higher end ones. I'm Throwing and Bring It On.

• 13:17Speaker 05

  Sure.

• 13:17Bill Simmons?

  Ten Things I Hate About You.

• 13:19Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 13:20Bill Simmons?

  She's all that.

• 13:21Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:21Bill Simmons?

  Drive me crazy.

• 13:22Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:23Bill Simmons?

  I think we can count Never Been Kissed, even though it's Drew Barrymore going back to high school.

• 13:27Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:27Bill Simmons?

  I'm gonna sneak in.

• 13:28Speaker 05

  Look at it. Yeah.

• 13:28Bill Simmons?

  And then we have the weird ones, like Wild Things, Teaching Mrs. Tingle, Jawbreaker, Drop Dead Gorgeous.

• 13:34Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:35Bill Simmons?

  And then But I'm a Cheerleader. So that's, that's 20? And those are on three years.

• 13:42Speaker 05

  It's amazing time. What a time to be a teenager in America.

• 13:44Bill Simmons?

  And Hollywood's just like, more high school, more high school. Here's more money.

• 13:47Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 13:47Bill Simmons?

  Oh, you got it.

• 13:47Speaker 05

  What are we doing with the cast of Seven Seven?

• 13:49Bill Simmons?

  Oh, it's a horror movie in high school? Great. Oh, wait. What about that Fifth Fleet in Dawson's Creek? Can we get them in something?

• 13:54Speaker 05

  Kevin Williamson's just running the game between Dawson's and all of the Scream movies and Teaching Mrs. Tingle and everything else that comes out.

• 14:00Bill Simmons?

  And I guess like, and then you have like the Skulls in movies like that that weren't necessarily high school movies, but we're also dipping into the same teen pool.

• 14:07Speaker 05

  Because Joshua Jackson is in it, PC. Yeah.

• 14:10Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Um, anyway.

• 14:12Speaker 05

  The Dawson's Creek cast is in like almost every single one of those movies that you mentioned.

• 14:16Bill Simmons?

  It became like Mad Libs, mix and match.

• 14:18Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 14:18Bill Simmons?

  Cause Party of Five Two, uh, Bailey never made it.

• 14:22Speaker 05

  No.

• 14:23Bill Simmons?

  Matthew Fox was too old.

• 14:25Speaker 05

  Bailey's in, uh, he's in Go.

• 14:28Bill Simmons?

  Right. But that's an adult movie. Lacey.

• 14:31Speaker 05

  But.

• 14:31Bill Simmons?

  Lacey Chabert, what's her, Lacey Chabert?

• 14:33Speaker 05

  Chabert, Chabert. Yeah. Mean Girls.

• 14:36Bill Simmons?

  She was too young, but then rose and became Mean Girls. That became the stunt casting for that.

• 14:40Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 14:41Bill Simmons?

  J Lo being in this movie was a big deal because she was a big deal on Party of Five.

• 14:45Speaker 05

  And she had just popped and she signed this before she did I Know What You Did Last Summer.

• 14:51Bill Simmons?

  Which popped the movie.

• 14:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 14:54Bill Simmons?

  I forgot this because I was researching Jennifer Love Hewitt, who everybody had a crush on.

• 14:59Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah.

• 14:59Bill Simmons?

  For probably four years.

• 15:00Speaker 05

  How she went by Love?

• 15:01Bill Simmons?

  I forgot they spun off.

• 15:03Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 15:04Bill Simmons?

  Party of Five where she had, she had this whole spin off show where she went to go find her birth parents. I think I blocked this out of my mind.

• 15:11Speaker 05

  Wait, did it have?

• 15:12Bill Simmons?

  Time of Your Life.

• 15:13Speaker 05

  Time of Your Life?

• 15:14Bill Simmons?

  She went to New York City to find her birth parents. How is that a show?

• 15:17Speaker 05

  Did it have, who's the guy from 90210 who dated Donna, who was the musician?

• 15:22Bill Simmons?

  Oh, Jamie Walters.

• 15:23Speaker 05

  Yeah, Jamie Walters. Is he in Time of Your Life?

• 15:26Bill Simmons?

  It sounds like that. It sounds like it adds up.

• 15:28Speaker 05

  That's true.

• 15:28Bill Simmons?

  Ray Prue with one T?

• 15:29Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 15:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. So she dated Carson Daly. She was just in that whole world.

• 15:35Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 15:36Bill Simmons?

  Had some tough career stuff. Lost out on Rumlin and Julia to Claire Danes.

• 15:41Speaker 05

  Thank God.

• 15:42Bill Simmons?

  Lost out. Broke Down Palace.

• 15:46Speaker 05

  Your favorite Claire Danes movie.

• 15:47Bill Simmons?

  She lost at Kate Beckett sale for that role.

• 15:49Speaker 05

  Oh, wow.

• 15:50Bill Simmons?

  Cause one of those things is, yeah.

• 15:51Speaker 05

  Claire Danes and Jennifer Love Hewitt.

• 15:53Bill Simmons?

  How about that?

• 15:53Speaker 05

  In Broke Down Palace?

• 15:54Bill Simmons?

  That's like the most nineties thing that's ever happened.

• 15:56Speaker 05

  Wow.

• 15:56Bill Simmons?

  But the problem is you were on those TV shows. You had no time to do anything else. Like they're in the research, like Melissa Joan Hart. She's the crazy yearbook girl on this.

• 16:05Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 16:06Bill Simmons?

  And she had to film all her scenes late at night because she was also filming her.

• 16:09Speaker 05

  Sabrina, the teenage witch.

• 16:11Bill Simmons?

  All these, all these people, they never had the time to branch out. That's what killed the nine oh two and O cast too.

• 16:16Speaker 05

  Um, Jennifer Love Hewitt was so big for such a concentrated period of time. There were just coke commercials that were just Jennifer Love Hewitt.

• 16:25Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 16:26Speaker 05

  Hair dye commercials that was just Jennifer Love Hewitt. It was just like, but it was such a flash. And I remember, do you remember, I don't know how much you watched Punk'd on MTV.

• 16:35Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah.

• 16:35Speaker 05

  But like, do you remember her episode of Punk'd? Where like the joke was she was going to be cast in a really cool movie. Like it was like when her career was slightly waning and they brought her into a casting office to talk to a producer.

• 16:48Bill Simmons?

  Oh, no.

• 16:49Speaker 05

  And they're like, here's this really cool prestige movie that we want to do. And they were trying to sort of freak her out by the premise of it. And at the end, it's one of the saddest Punk'd reveals because she's like, oh, I'm not going to get to be in the cool movie, am I?

• 17:00Bill Simmons?

  Oh, no.

• 17:01Speaker 05

  Devastated.

• 17:02Bill Simmons?

  Well, the saddest one was just the Timberlake.

• 17:04Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 17:05Bill Simmons?

  Cause I think he started crying.

• 17:06Speaker 05

  He did cry.

• 17:07Bill Simmons?

  Jennifer Love Hewitt was interesting because she was really polarizing. Men, men liked her and at least all the women I knew didn't like her. And it made them mad that men liked her.

• 17:19Speaker 05

  Interesting.

• 17:20Bill Simmons?

  And so she became, and this happens sometimes.

• 17:23Speaker 05

  Like didn't feel like a girl's girl to women.

• 17:26Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, you know, sometimes women are like, oh, she's so cute. I love her. And then other times like you like her.

• 17:31Speaker 05

  Interesting.

• 17:31Bill Simmons?

  And she just moved into that, into that world for some reason.

• 17:35Speaker 05

  I would say out of, I would say the reason, well, I mean, it's, it's very clear what she has, but like, I would say. Out of the Party Five cast, there's like Neve Campbell, who's like the girl's girl. Like the girl's like Neve Campbell. And there's Jennifer Love Hewitt. Yeah, for the boys.

• 17:52Bill Simmons?

  Neve Campbell had a nice run, too. She was another one. I mean, she started with Scream.

• 17:57Bill Simmons?

  The, uh, they filmed this in October 97. Co-writer-director Harry Alfons said, suddenly every place was open for business for teen movies. Students realized the audience was underserved. We had one, tight budget, the whole thing. So the movie, they have the dorks and the hot girls. Briny cute guy. The girl Lauren Ambrose's character, who's clearly gonna be more successful than all these people down the road.

• 18:23Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 18:24Bill Simmons?

  The queen bee with no identity. Different kids stuck to whatever their shtick was that they can't get out of. The captain of the football team who can see the finish line and his psycho fan friends. Class dork finally having fun for the first time. But then they have all these other really fun, kinda cliche characters that they, some of them they ended up having to cut out. But like, the girl who shouldn't have had the party.

• 18:46Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 18:47Bill Simmons?

  And it's just going wrong. Like, we all know her. The over-the-top beer book girl, the nerds getting revenge, the stone guys with the watermelon, foreign exchange guy, the klepto, stone girl staring at banana. Like, they're just hitting all these archetypes.

• 19:01Speaker 05

  And I think it was what-

• 19:01Bill Simmons?

  And it works.

• 19:02Speaker 05

  What's so fun about this movie is that I think there's like six or seven characters who have actual names. And everyone else is like-

• 19:09Bill Simmons?

  You've no idea who they are.

• 19:10Speaker 05

  It's like stoner guy, like in the cast list, it's like stoner guy, popular girl, klepto kid, like all of that sort of stuff.

• 19:16Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, what's there, like Knife Girl?

• 19:18Speaker 05

  Earth Girl.

• 19:18Bill Simmons?

  Earth Girl.

• 19:19Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 19:20Bill Simmons?

  Easily could have been Knife Girl. Um, but you also had the cast of, uh, it's about his 90s as it gets.

• 19:26Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 19:26Bill Simmons?

  Seth Green, right around his apex. Ethan Embry, well, I can't wait to talk about him. Peter Fassonelli, who ended up marrying Jenny Garth. Charlie Corsmo.

• 19:36Speaker 05

  I know.

• 19:37Bill Simmons?

  Complicated career.

• 19:38Speaker 05

  Hook, yeah.

• 19:40Bill Simmons?

  What about Bob, Hook, uh-

• 19:44Bill Simmons?

  Dick Tracy?

• 19:45Speaker 05

  Yeah, Dick Tracy.

• 19:47Bill Simmons?

  Stopped acting with MIT, came back for this in complicated circumstances, and then that's it. I don't think he acted really again.

• 19:53Speaker 05

  I still remember there was like a People Magazine article of it was like the return of Charlie Horstmo. It was just sort of like, here he is. You remember him from Hook?

• 20:01Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 20:01Speaker 05

  He's a teenager now.

• 20:02Bill Simmons?

  He's back.

• 20:03Speaker 05

  And then he was gone again. But he's great in this movie.

• 20:05Bill Simmons?

  Um, Lauren Ambrose, who became the most successful actor of the group.

• 20:10Speaker 05

  This is a, this is a Six Feet Under prequel.

• 20:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 20:13Speaker 05

  You've got Freddie Rodriguez here, Eric Alford here.

• 20:15Bill Simmons?

  She's blowing people out of, out of the water in all of her one on ones.

• 20:19Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 20:19Bill Simmons?

  Melissa Joan Hart, Jamie Presley's in here.

• 20:21Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:22Bill Simmons?

  Clee DuVall, and then we got crazy cameos, Jason Segel, Breckin Meyer, Donald Faison, Selma Blair, and Sarah Ruh, to name five.

• 20:31Speaker 05

  I love that you put Sarah Ruh in that list. Jerry O'Connell.

• 20:34Bill Simmons?

  Jerry O'Connell, who's gonna be coming up later for Dion Waiters.

• 20:37Speaker 05

  Jenna Elfman.

• 20:39Bill Simmons?

  Jenna Elfman. Yeah.

• 20:41Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 20:41Bill Simmons?

  A lot of people in this.

• 20:42Speaker 05

  I mean, it's just like, you've got Seth Green out of Buffy, you've got Jenna Elfman out of Dharma and Greg, like, yeah, the, the sort of like, this is TV, but make it a movie vibe is here. And I think what I loved, when they talked about casting this film, they said they knew so many actors who played teenagers. They weren't all teenagers themselves, they were all in their twenties, but actors who could play teenagers. They knew so many of them who were out of work. Um, and so they just had all of them come in and read. They threw all their headshots on the floor.

• 21:10Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 21:11Speaker 05

  And was just sort of like, picking and choosing. And if you didn't make the lead role, they just stuck you in one of these side roles and everyone said yes to it.

• 21:17Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 21:17Speaker 05

  Deborah Kaplan was dating Breckin Meyer at the time.

• 21:20Bill Simmons?

  Co-director, yeah.

• 21:21Speaker 05

  Right. So he just like, brought all his friends over, Seth Green's here, you know, all that sort of stuff. And it's just like.

• 21:27Bill Simmons?

  And they all have other jobs. So it's like, yeah, I can do two days.

• 21:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 21:30Bill Simmons?

  Or I can show up on Thursday night and play stone guy.

• 21:33Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly.

• 21:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. I like that era. Uh, Seth Green, you mentioned.

• 21:38Bill Simmons?

  This is like one of the most late nineties things about this movie is the Seth Green character, because I must think five years later, it makes no sense, five years earlier, it makes no sense, but this was like a type of

• 21:48Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 21:49Bill Simmons?

  person for five years here, for maybe like three years.

• 21:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 21:52Bill Simmons?

  And he's really funny.

• 21:54Speaker 05

  So good.

• 21:54Bill Simmons?

  And I was ready to, I went into it because I hadn't seen it in a couple of years, being like, ah, he probably didn't age that well. And I was like, no, he's actually really funny.

• 22:01Speaker 05

  No, it's perfect because when Lauren Abrams' character calls him out later for it and he drops like his black accent that he's adapted. And then when his friends drop the N word in front of like actual black people later in the movie and they're just like, fuck, you know, so like the movie knows exactly what it's doing, I think, with this character.

• 22:18Bill Simmons?

  I liked his Tupac for his yearbook quote.

• 22:21Speaker 05

  So good.

• 22:21Bill Simmons?

  He's got a love kit. Chorus was great. Um, and then the soundtrack we have talked about. Just, I'll just Third Eye Blind.

• 22:30Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 22:31Bill Simmons?

  Smash Mouth.

• 22:32Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 22:32Bill Simmons?

  Blink 182, Parliament, Matthew Sweet, The Replacements, Sublime, 311. Some of these aren't on the soundtrack, but most of them are. Eve 6, G-Love. Um, and then a bunch of stuff that's like a little bit nostalgic-y, like Tone Loc, Bust a Move.

• 22:49Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Run DMC.

• 22:51Bill Simmons?

  Some of those, like Paradise City.

• 22:52Speaker 05

  Mm hmm.

• 22:53Bill Simmons?

  Because it's been like eight to 10 years since those songs hit and they're kind of bringing them back. It's probably the, probably my favorite thing about the movie. And I don't even really love a lot of these songs, but it reminds me of 1998.

• 23:04Speaker 05

  Yeah, the like, the use of Mandy, the Barry Manilow piece inside of this, the use of the Guns N' Roses song, um, Yazoo, Only You, playing at the end. That's an eighties movie, like, throwback track. So, yeah.

• 23:19Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, this movie knows, like, hey, we're

• 23:22Speaker 05

  We're stealing.

• 23:22Bill Simmons?

  We're not stealing, we're like, we're homage borrowing.

• 23:26Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly, exactly.

• 23:28Bill Simmons?

  And Dire Straits is great, too.

• 23:29Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah, the Romeo and Juliet drop, yeah.

• 23:31Bill Simmons?

  So Harry Alfons said, um, We should do a throwback to John Hughes. We talked a lot about Say Anything specifically the party scene and then we were like, what if that's the whole movie? And it was.

• 23:41Speaker 05

  When I read that, which I think was in the Ringer piece about this, I, it, it really clicked something in place to me because like if you think about that scene in Say Anything with like Lily Taylor.

• 23:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 23:50Speaker 05

  Singing about Joe.

• 23:52Bill Simmons?

  Joe Lys.

• 23:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, Joe Lys.

• 23:53Bill Simmons?

  When he cries.

• 23:54Speaker 05

  When he cries. Um, yeah, you're just like dipping inside of all these different little groups.

• 23:59Bill Simmons?

  Key man.

• 24:00Speaker 05

  Inside that party. Yeah.

• 24:01Bill Simmons?

  It's funny, Say Anything probably did it better at that party, but it also only had to do everything in 20 minutes.

• 24:07Speaker 05

  Yeah, it's like 15, 20 minutes, the whole, the whole movie. This, this movie also just goes and goes and goes.

• 24:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 24:13Speaker 05

  Every scene, but like you're following a character out of a scene right into another character in the next scene.

• 24:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 24:18Speaker 05

  Or are there these fascinating cuts like Preston turns off the radio and as his hand blacks out the screen, Melissa Joan Hart like opens the trash can, you know, it's just sort of like, it doesn't let you breathe in a way that doesn't feel panicky, but feels just sort of like it's a wild party night and we're just gonna go from one scene to the next.

• 24:35Bill Simmons?

  I had that in What Stage Is The Best because it's, it's like frenetically edited in a good way.

• 24:40Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 24:41Bill Simmons?

  Because that's what it's like to be at a party like that. We're just like, oh, this person, oh, this person, oh, this is happening. And, and it tries to hit that and it's doing like quick jump cuts and it's not like the editing doesn't feel dated.

• 24:51Speaker 05

  No.

• 24:52Bill Simmons?

  Um, I think they do a good job.

• 24:54Speaker 05

  I agree.

• 24:55Bill Simmons?

  It did get nominated for an award. An MTV Movie Award.

• 24:59Speaker 05

  Hell yeah, that's where it belongs.

• 25:00Bill Simmons?

  Jennifer Love Hewitt, right there. This is, that's another part of this whole where it's like.

• 25:04Speaker 05

  The golden popcorn.

• 25:05Bill Simmons?

  It's the Carson Daily Show, it's the movie award, like all this stuff, there's a pop culture feeling to all this crap.

• 25:10Speaker 05

  I, I didn't look into it, but I, I can't wait to know what TRL had to do with Can't Hardly Wait.

• 25:16Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I'm sure they were plugging the shit out of it.

• 25:18Speaker 05

  Absolutely.

• 25:18Bill Simmons?

  By 2012, Entertainment Weekly did top 50 best high school movies of all time. Can't Hardly Wait number 44.

• 25:25Speaker 05

  Way too low.

• 25:26Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 25:26Speaker 05

  Way too low.

• 25:27Bill Simmons?

  I thought that was gonna be like the teens.

• 25:28Speaker 05

  Yeah. Twenties are the lowest, I would say. And, uh, because I mean, the eighties were just full of them. Um.

• 25:35Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 25:36Speaker 05

  The other thing is Deborah, Deborah Caplan and Harry Alfond, um, have you seen Josie and the Pussycats?

• 25:42Bill Simmons?

  Not in 20 years.

• 25:43Speaker 05

  I think that this movie and that movie, which they also did are, you know, which also has Seth Green and Breckin Meyer and like all, you know, the, the foreign exchange student in this movie and stuff like that. Tara Reid is just like a meatball right down the middle of like, again, a specific generation, a specific sense of humor. And when you, just seeing the Pussycats, a movie that a lot of people write off because it looks so dumb.

• 26:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 26:07Speaker 05

  But has Alan Cumming and Parker Posey, which everyone loves right now.

• 26:10Bill Simmons?

  Interesting.

• 26:11Speaker 05

  Is like, one of the funniest things I've ever seen and has this similar sort of joke per minute rate inside of that movie. So, really underrated.

• 26:20Bill Simmons?

  This movie, thirteen million dollar budget, made twenty-five million.

• 26:25Speaker 05

  Which is not terrible, but not what they wanted.

• 26:27Bill Simmons?

  No. Well, I think part of the problem is it was a glut of movies like this. And it felt like they were coming out every week. Our guy, Raj, Roger Ebert, one and a half stars.

• 26:35Speaker 05

  Yeah, tough.

• 26:36Bill Simmons?

  He says, "There's one character in Can't Hardly Wait who is interesting and funny. Maybe it was a mistake to write her in. She makes the other characters look like nap brain bozos. Her name is Denise. She's played by Lauren Ambrose and she has a merry face, a biting tongue, and a sardonic angle on high school."

• 26:51Bill Simmons?

  And then just kinda continues to-

• 26:53Speaker 05

  We all wanted to be Denise, I think, watching this movie, you know? Like, the best.

• 26:59Bill Simmons?

  All right. We are going to take a break and talk about Loom by Atlassian. What's the most frustrating thing that's happened to you since you've been in LA? Traffic?

• 27:12Speaker 05

  Traffic's a good one.

• 27:13Bill Simmons?

  Traffic's a good one?

• 27:14Speaker 05

  Yeah, sure.

• 27:15Bill Simmons?

  Is it just way worse than where you live?

• 27:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, and the barrier is bad. But I think, well, I think because I've been coming to the office so much, I have an actual commute, which is not true when I'm back home. So, yeah.

• 27:24Bill Simmons?

  I hate traffic. I hate the way people drive out here. It constantly frustrates me. I can't get used to it. It's also really frustrating when you start feeling stuck at work with too many unnecessary meetings. Luckily, there's a simple solution for that: use Loom video messaging. You and Mallory should use this.

• 27:37Speaker 05

  We should.

• 27:38Bill Simmons?

  It can simultaneously record both your screen and yourself, share a quick update, provide feedback, train a colleague, everything in between. Plus, add Loom AI to your meetings. For instant written notes and recordings, try Loom today at loom.com. That is L-O-O-M dot com.

• 28:20Speaker 07

  Shop Folgers Instant Coffee and more at your nearest retailer.

• 28:25Bill Simmons?

  Let's do most rewatchable scenes. This is hard because-

• 28:28Speaker 05

  So hard because they're all micro scenes that sort of bleed into each other.

• 28:31Bill Simmons?

  So I wrote down a few that I thought, and then if I missed any, tell me. The four idiots trying to decide how that they should dump their girlfriends-

• 28:40Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 28:41Bill Simmons?

  When we meet the football captain and his dumbass friends. Throwing that in. Corazmo and the nerds setting up the attack on the house using a lot of Star Wars language. I don't know if you want to-

• 28:53Speaker 05

  Yeah, Boba Fett, Grand Moff Tarkin. I don't want to be Grand Moff Tarkin.

• 28:56Bill Simmons?

  Cool. Was that, did that all check all the boxes? No, I'm not a Star Wars guy.

• 29:00Speaker 05

  I do know that. It's funny because I'm not, I didn't put it in What's Aged Poorly or whatever, but they were all like, they all want to be Boba Fett because Boba Fett's so cool. And that was before Disney Plus made a TV show about Boba Fett that made Boba Fett way less cool.

• 29:11Bill Simmons?

  Oh, so that's on What's Aged the Worst?

• 29:13Speaker 05

  Yeah, kind of.

• 29:14Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Amanda's friends trying to make her feel better about Mike dumping her and comparing to Gwyneth Paltrow.

• 29:20Speaker 05

  She's not prettier than Gwyneth.

• 29:24Bill Simmons?

  I love that part. Kenny over here and the cute girl saying she's hooking up with the next guy who talks to her because she's so upset. She got dumped.

• 29:32Speaker 05

  Yeah. When he starts talking to her and she looks over at her friend, her friend's like, eh, okay.

• 29:40Bill Simmons?

  The letter flying around is really funny.

• 29:42Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 29:42Bill Simmons?

  It's on, falls out of the garbage and it's somebody, just the way they do that, I enjoy watching that.

• 29:48Speaker 05

  Rolls on the kegs, stuck in someone's shoe, all of that, yeah.

• 29:51Bill Simmons?

  Tripp McNeely's one cameo, played by Jerry O'Connell. "You were a sexual icon.

• 29:57Bill Simmons?

  I thought college was going to be a 24/7 orgy. Guys like us are a dime a dozen." We are a dime a dozen.

• 30:12Speaker 05

  Speaking of which, you still with that Amanda chick?

• 30:16Bill Simmons?

  And the burp is, uh, pretty impressive. Anyway, that part's fun.

• 30:19Speaker 05

  Jerry is perfect.

• 30:20Bill Simmons?

  I'm throwing in Jason Segel's one scene, just because it's Jason Segel and I couldn't believe he was in the movie and I forgot.

• 30:26Speaker 05

  And he's like, I think 19 in this movie or something like that.

• 30:29Bill Simmons?

  Velma gets some love.

• 30:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. She's a hip, hip lady.

• 30:32Bill Simmons?

  The Mike Amanda showdown. I like the big showdown with everybody watching in a party, which would never happen in real life, because.

• 30:39Speaker 05

  You mean, record scratches don't actually happen in real life?

• 30:42Bill Simmons?

  What's happening? People are fighting. Um.

• 30:44Speaker 05

  Yeah, his delivery of Amanda, you know, Amanda. Yeah, well, you're the one, Amanda. He's gonna be embarrassed.

• 30:54Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 30:54Speaker 05

  And she's like, wow, you really got me there, Mike. Oh, really good, really good.

• 30:58Bill Simmons?

  Uh, all the Kenny and Denise bathroom stuff and then, um, Mike's crew turning on Charlie Corsmo at the end. And Kenny and Denise singing each other together. And then we find out that, uh, Charlie Corsmo's character became the next Mark Zuckerberg.

• 31:15Speaker 05

  Exactly.

• 31:16Bill Simmons?

  I think is, and nothing turned out well.

• 31:18Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 31:18Bill Simmons?

  What did I miss?

• 31:20Speaker 05

  Um, I would guess, I would say Jenna Elfman's Scott Baio monologue.

• 31:24Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 31:25Speaker 05

  Is really good.

• 31:25Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 31:26Speaker 05

  It's really, really good. But yeah, all of the Kenny and Denise ba- if that were just one scene, that's the most rewatchable scene, like.

• 31:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 31:32Speaker 05

  Him dropping his whole thing, him calling her out, their history. Do those shoes serve an orthopedic function? Like, everything that happens in the bathroom is great.

• 31:43Bill Simmons?

  I agree. This'll be fun. What's the most 1998 thing about this movie? What do you have?

• 31:50Speaker 05

  I mean, we already talked about the soundtrack. I would say Smash Mouth very specifically.

• 31:55Bill Simmons?

  Smash Mouth and Blink 182, I think, have to be both mentioned.

• 31:58Speaker 05

  Um, The X-Files being so prevalent in here.

• 32:01Bill Simmons?

  Had that as well. Trust no one, the truth is out there. This was a weird era for. People really latching on to the X-Files as like a personality.

• 32:10Speaker 05

  Yeah, from this light, you look a bit like David Duchovny, as they say to Charlie Corso. Also, one of the, one of the nerds is, claims to be dating Christie Turlington, has a girlfriend from the internet.

• 32:22Bill Simmons?

  I love that one. She's in Fiji right now.

• 32:24Speaker 05

  Yeah, she's a photo shoot in Fiji. Everything Seth Green.

• 32:28Bill Simmons?

  Yep.

• 32:29Speaker 05

  And the bride and Gwyneth thing, which you already mentioned.

• 32:32Bill Simmons?

  I had that as well. The only thing I had that you didn't mention, other than Jennifer Love Hewitt, who just seems trapped in the mid 90s in a lot of ways, is Amanda Beckett's yearbook quote is, "I'd rather see the world from another angle," which is from Jewel. Just having a yearbook quote from Jewel is the most late 90s thing possible.

• 32:50Speaker 05

  And it's perfect for her.

• 32:51Speaker 08

  Can we talk about the goggles? Who was, was that real? Were people wearing goggles in 1998?

• 32:56Speaker 05

  The rave culture goggles, not to like a party, but to a rave, yeah.

• 33:01Speaker 08

  Okay, so you did, you knew somebody, or knew of somebody who would kind of throw on some goggles to go out at night?

• 33:07Speaker 05

  To like a rave, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

• 33:08Speaker 08

  What's the point of that? Just to protect your eyes?

• 33:10Speaker 05

  Fashion.

• 33:11Speaker 08

  Oh, just fashion.

• 33:12Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah. And also like snowboarder culture sort of bleeding into fashion.

• 33:16Speaker 08

  Oh, sure, okay.

• 33:17Bill Simmons?

  I can't wait to get Producer Craig's take at the end.

• 33:20Speaker 05

  I know, I'm so excited.

• 33:21Bill Simmons?

  I've never, never saw it, and I just honestly can't wait. What's aged the best? Denise Fleming, activities none for her yearbook thing. It's like genuinely funny. And then Kenny playing JV basketball for one game.

• 33:35Speaker 05

  Oh, my god.

• 33:36Bill Simmons?

  That really made me laugh. I have a bunch, what do you got?

• 33:38Speaker 05

  What's aged the best? I think this is overall a very like sex positive movie. And I also like that Kenny introduces sex as very bad, like their first time is very bad, I think that's great. I think the Tripp McNeely stuff really, really plays, like really plays. And what I mentioned before about the sort of like the blurring of social circles inside of this party, I really like. That just feels like a step out of the 80, like from, I don't know, Porky's Revenge of the Nerds, like all that sort of stuff, it really felt like stratified, or Breakfast Club, which is, which is supposed to be about common bonds, but then you get those archetypes, you know, we are the nerd, you know, the burnout, the popular girl, whatever it is. And, and that's just not how high school, I thought, growing up watching 80s teen movies,

• 34:23Speaker 05

  I thought that's what high school was, and it wasn't what high school was at all, you know?

• 34:26Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Breakfast Club has this scene where Anthony Michael Hall's character is like, "What's gonna happen on Monday?" Are we, are we gonna be friends? And Molly Ringwald's like, I don't think so.

• 34:39Speaker 05

  And it's like, if you called my name, would you walk on by?

• 34:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 34:41Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 34:42Bill Simmons?

  And she says to Emilio Estevez's character, like, come on, if he walked up to you, you just bust his butt, you know?

• 34:48Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 34:48Bill Simmons?

  It's like, oh, man, these people are just doomed. Yeah, there's a little, this is a little more hopeful of an era. I have a couple.

• 34:54Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 34:55Bill Simmons?

  A high school called Huntington Hillside High?

• 34:59Speaker 05

  And it's filmed-

• 35:00Bill Simmons?

  What is that?

• 35:00Speaker 05

  It's filmed at Torrance High School. Cause we only get like the little, the Amanda intro is really where we're at.

• 35:06Bill Simmons?

  So are they saying this is in the Palisades?

• 35:08Speaker 05

  No, but like Torrance High-

• 35:10Bill Simmons?

  Or Huntington Beach?

• 35:11Speaker 05

  Torrance High is where they filmed all, like, that's where they filmed Buffy. It's where they filmed, uh, She's All That.

• 35:17Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 35:17Speaker 05

  All of the high school stuff was set at that high school.

• 35:20Bill Simmons?

  What's Huntington with a hillside? I just wanna know where that is in California.

• 35:23Speaker 05

  It doesn't exist.

• 35:24Bill Simmons?

  I don't know where that exists. Caring about UFOs has aged the best, cause now UFOs are attacking us-

• 35:30Speaker 05

  It's true.

• 35:30Bill Simmons?

  All over the place.

• 35:31Speaker 05

  It's true.

• 35:32Bill Simmons?

  I like when Charlie Corsmo's, uh, nerd character is like, basically creates the template for McLovin.

• 35:39Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 35:39Bill Simmons?

  Um.

• 35:40Speaker 05

  Hundred percent.

• 35:41Bill Simmons?

  And, but when he gets drunk that one time and he's like, I can't feel my legs.

• 35:46Speaker 05

  I have-

• 35:46Bill Simmons?

  I have no legs.

• 35:47Speaker 05

  Also-

• 35:48Bill Simmons?

  It's so good.

• 35:49Speaker 05

  The beer's gone bad.

• 35:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that, that's good too.

• 35:52Speaker 05

  All good.

• 35:52Bill Simmons?

  The Fiji thing's funny.

• 35:55Bill Simmons?

  Seth Green saying, why y'all gotta waste my flavor? Damn, like, all his, like, flavor stuff-

• 36:00Speaker 05

  Every, yeah.

• 36:01Bill Simmons?

  It was really funny.

• 36:02Speaker 05

  Time is honey, yeah, it's all good.

• 36:03Bill Simmons?

  And then, uh, Paradise City is a nostalgic rock song. I had for what's aged the best. But just in general, high school movies age the best because they just capture whatever the decade is in this weird way.

• 36:14Speaker 05

  Charlie Corsmo's character being like, I know this song, some kid I tutored made me listen to it. I know all the words, really good.

• 36:20Bill Simmons?

  Big Kona Burger Award, best use of food and drink?

• 36:23Speaker 05

  The weed brownie on Denise that gets licked off by Eric Balfour.

• 36:27Bill Simmons?

  Which they had to PG thirteen. And there's, you just kinda have to know that it's a weird.

• 36:33Speaker 05

  You just know it's a Lee Brownie.

• 36:34Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, you just kinda know. You know, but you don't really know. Uh, Kid Cudi Pursued Happiness Award for Best Nito Drop. There's a million choices here, but can I make the case for Dire Straits Romeo and Juliet? Cause that's a great song.

• 36:44Speaker 05

  It's a great one.

• 36:45Bill Simmons?

  And it's perfectly dropped.

• 36:46Speaker 05

  It's when he's driving.

• 36:48Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, it's just really, it's really well dropped.

• 36:51Speaker 05

  I gotta give it to Yazoo's Only You because.

• 36:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 36:54Speaker 05

  Only You has that intro, like at the beginning that you can play underneath.

• 36:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 36:59Speaker 05

  The dialogue and then it hits. Yeah.

• 37:01Bill Simmons?

  That song's good. That was music that me and my friends all listened to in the eighties. Now I'm like, wow, I can't believe we listened to all that stuff. Uh, the Amanda Dobbins Award for Coolest Piece of Real Estate, new category.

• 37:13Speaker 05

  Oh, okay.

• 37:14Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 37:15Speaker 05

  I love it.

• 37:15Bill Simmons?

  Due to Amanda.

• 37:16Speaker 05

  I love it.

• 37:16Bill Simmons?

  She hasn't been on the rewatchables in a while.

• 37:19Speaker 05

  Let's bring her back.

• 37:19Bill Simmons?

  I don't think she cares.

• 37:21Speaker 05

  Well, we were gonna do a movie and Mal said we couldn't because it was Amanda, Amanda would crucify you. Um.

• 37:27Bill Simmons?

  Anyway, the Amanda Dobbins Award for Coolest Piece of Real Estate, new award, the, uh, the house.

• 37:32Speaker 05

  The pool.

• 37:33Bill Simmons?

  The house is just a great high school party house. It even has like the, the staircase that goes both ways.

• 37:39Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 37:40Bill Simmons?

  And it's just, they did a good job. I have some sad news though, like genuinely sad.

• 37:44Speaker 05

  It's an Altadena, so.

• 37:45Bill Simmons?

  It burned down in the Altadena.

• 37:47Speaker 05

  I was worried about that.

• 37:48Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 37:48Speaker 05

  I saw that it was an Altadena home and I was worried it burned down.

• 37:50Bill Simmons?

  I was like, oh.

• 37:51Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 37:52Bill Simmons?

  Tough one. Um, the Ches Rockwell and Brock Landers Award for Best Character Name. It's gotta be Tripp McNeely, right?

• 37:58Speaker 05

  It's Tripp McNeely. Well, it's Tripp McNeely, but in terms of like the rest of the cast having names that are just their archetype, there's Ready to Have Sex Girl and there's Ready to Have Sex's Friend is, is what they're called in the, in the credits.

• 38:12Bill Simmons?

  That's in the credits?

• 38:13Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 38:13Bill Simmons?

  Ready to Have Sex Girl?

• 38:15Speaker 05

  And Ready to Have Sex Girl's Friend. Yeah.

• 38:16Bill Simmons?

  Wow. Imagine telling your parents that.

• 38:18Speaker 05

  I landed this role.

• 38:19Bill Simmons?

  Stay for the closing credits. I'm ready to have sex.

• 38:21Speaker 05

  I'm ready to have sex girl. Yeah.

• 38:22Bill Simmons?

  Oh, you have a flex category. What do you got?

• 38:25Speaker 05

  Would a cellphone ruin this movie? New category.

• 38:28Bill Simmons?

  Wow, new category.

• 38:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, like they talk about this all the time with X-Files. You couldn't do the X-Files with a cellphone because if you had a cellphone, you could take a photo of the weird stuff you see or, you know, that sort of stuff. And so, and horror movies, I think all the time about the way in which cellphones and the internet have ruined basic premises for movies.

• 38:47Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 38:47Speaker 05

  And so, let's say Amanda has a cellphone, a smartphone in the movie. And she picks up the letter, it's from Preston Myers, she's like, goes on social media, she's like, goes on his Insta, who's Preston Myers? Nobody's streaming from this party, nobody's TikToking from this party, like, nobody's down their phone, they're all sort of like here and having a good time, so.

• 39:06Bill Simmons?

  That's a great category. I wonder who that should be named after. I gotta really put some time and thought into this, maybe the readers can help.

• 39:14Speaker 05

  I would love that.

• 39:14Bill Simmons?

  There's a lot of movies that are just completely undermined with the cellphone.

• 39:17Speaker 05

  Yeah, horror movies and thriller, action movies, it's much harder to do those with everyone having a smartphone in their pocket. Die Hard, can you do Die Hard if you have a, the same way, if you have a smartphone? So, sometimes they have to come up with, you know.

• 39:32Bill Simmons?

  Well, if a payphone's involved, you know that they, you know, the payphone has that device.

• 39:37Speaker 05

  Does Preston even get to meet Jenna Elfman if he has a cellphone? No, he needs that payphone, so.

• 39:43Bill Simmons?

  That's a great one, great category. All right, here we go, the Butch's Girlfriend Award for weak link of the film.

• 39:51Bill Simmons?

  My biggest issue with this film for 27 years is Ethan Embry. And the character, I know, it's a controversial take.

• 39:59Speaker 05

  Oh, no.

• 40:00Bill Simmons?

  A lot of people get really upset about it.

• 40:01Speaker 05

  Okay, let's fight about it.

• 40:03Bill Simmons?

  I just don't understand Preston at all, and I was doing the research, and he has this interview he did like 12 years ago where he said, "At the time when we were shooting, I was the world's biggest stoner."

• 40:12Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 40:13Bill Simmons?

  "I remember the director came up to me and asked if I was altered," and he like couldn't remember anything in the movie. Then there was this anecdote about how Jennifer LaBue gave him a teddy bear full of breath mints for their climactic kissing scene, because everyone on the set knew he spent all of his time smoking pot in his trailer, and she didn't want to kiss like a pop mouth guy.

• 40:32Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 40:33Bill Simmons?

  And so I watched it the second time after I did the research, and I was like, that totally makes sense with how he's playing this character.

• 40:40Speaker 05

  Oh no, this is traumatic for me though. I love Ethan

• 40:45Bill Simmons?

  I'm sure you do, girls love it.

• 40:47Speaker 05

  Preston Myers is like. It's funny because the way that I think people, women of your generation feel about Lloyd Dobler is how I feel about Preston Myers. And Lloyd Dobler is one that I like, don't really fully.

• 41:03Speaker 05

  I'm trying to erase that from my mind.

• 41:07Speaker 05

  The red suede jacket, the like, he's gonna go study with Kurt Vonnegut for the summer. Like, this is just such a right down the middle sensitive girl.

• 41:16Bill Simmons?

  I knew this would get you.

• 41:17Speaker 05

  Guy, yeah.

• 41:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 41:18Speaker 05

  Remember how you tried to provoke me on White Lotus last week?

• 41:21Bill Simmons?

  I tried a bunch of times.

• 41:21Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, this one, this one got me.

• 41:24Bill Simmons?

  This is great.

• 41:24Speaker 05

  You landed.

• 41:25Bill Simmons?

  Just wait until we get to the recasting couch, because I have a couple of suggestions.

• 41:28Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 41:29Bill Simmons?

  Uh, what do you have for the butcher's girlfriend?

• 41:31Speaker 05

  Um, I don't know that this movie has a weak link. Um, because every, anyone who's like, even slightly wobbly, they're gone the next moment.

• 41:41Bill Simmons?

  Doesn't even really matter.

• 41:41Speaker 05

  Yeah, and I personally think the core cast is kind of perfect. The only one I would say is like, because when we get to the casting what ifs, I don't know if Peter Fatsinelli is

• 41:51Bill Simmons?

  He was my backup choice.

• 41:53Speaker 05

  As Mike Dexter, you know?

• 41:54Bill Simmons?

  I think there were some other possibilities with that character.

• 41:57Speaker 05

  They said they wanted Fatsinelli because he has, uh, I think the word they use is like a streak of malice to him, and I agree, but I actually kind of wish Mike Dexter were like a little less evil than he is inside of this movie.

• 42:10Bill Simmons?

  I don't know how to make sense of his character, but I, I can just only compare it to the greats from the eighties, specifically, um, the goat, Billy Zapka.

• 42:19Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah.

• 42:20Bill Simmons?

  Um, and you think like, if this was a Billy Zapka role.

• 42:23Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 42:24Bill Simmons?

  Now the whole movie falls, you're like, oh, I totally get who this guy is. He's not Zapka-y enough. On the Zapka scale, he's like a three.

• 42:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 42:32Bill Simmons?

  And I don't know, I was trying to think of other actors from that generation.

• 42:36Speaker 05

  Or like Spader in Pretty in Pink.

• 42:39Bill Simmons?

  Right, who's just like, ah, man, that guy's a fucking asshole.

• 42:41Speaker 05

  Yeah, but like, also has something, you know?

• 42:45Bill Simmons?

  I don't, either he needed to be bigger and more physically imposing, or he needed to have that Zapka kind of feel to him, or even like a Judd Nelson kind of, kind of wild card, I might get in a fight at all times guy.

• 42:57Speaker 05

  I feel like you need, you need to understand, like Amanda has this whole speech, uh, I was thinking of Craig Sheffer in, um, in, uh, Some Kind of Wonderful.

• 43:05Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 43:06Speaker 05

  You need to understand why Amanda was with him for so long, and she gives a speech about that, about how she was nobody or old school, then Mike latches on and turns her into a somebody. But like, you think a little, he's just so.

• 43:19Bill Simmons?

  I had that in What's Age the Worst. You're spending three years with this dude just because he's good at football? Yeah, it doesn't make sense. It makes you think less of her.

• 43:26Speaker 05

  Exactly.

• 43:27Bill Simmons?

  What's Age the Worst?

• 43:28Speaker 05

  Uh, the gay sex trap or the F slur drop?

• 43:32Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, and there's some.

• 43:33Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 43:33Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. Late 90s.

• 43:35Speaker 05

  Yeah. Very Heathers.

• 43:38Bill Simmons?

  Having a crush on Scott Baio and telling a long monologue about it?

• 43:44Speaker 05

  This is before Twitter. This is before we knew what Scott Baio capable of on Twitter.

• 43:48Bill Simmons?

  Even like go back and watch, uh, Charles in Charge or Happy Days and be like, wait, really? Scott Baio?

• 43:53Speaker 05

  Joni loves Chachi, Charles in Charge, Scott Baio meant something before he let us know who he was.

• 43:59Bill Simmons?

  How about the drummer of the band at the party saying to the lead singer that he looks like Lestat? Does anyone under 40 get that joke?

• 44:05Speaker 05

  The vampire, well, they do now, Interview with the Vampire is back. Vampire Lestat.

• 44:09Bill Simmons?

  You're right.

• 44:09Speaker 05

  Okay, come back around. Um, and then Birkett Meyer calls Donald Faison the character Hootie because he wants to wear a cowboy hat. It's great.

• 44:18Bill Simmons?

  Um, all right, so the R rating that this movie didn't get, here's some of the research. Fascinelli says they cut out one character crying drunk girl,

• 44:27Speaker 05

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:28Bill Simmons?

  who they subtitled because she was just talking complete gibberish and she was played by, uh, by Jan Brady from Brady Bunch movies.

• 44:36Speaker 05

  So good.

• 44:36Bill Simmons?

  That sounds great. I wish that person was in the movie. Stone Girl, who you can see staring at the banana at one point, was in the movie way more.

• 44:44Speaker 05

  Amber Benson from Buffy Vampire Slayer. Yeah.

• 44:46Bill Simmons?

  Um, they changed the pot brownies to brownies, but we knew. At one point, I think, uh, the, the guy from Cruel Intentions, what's his name from Save the Last Dance? That guy?

• 44:56Speaker 05

  Sean Patrick Thomas, something like that. Yeah.

• 44:59Bill Simmons?

  Instead of bullshit, he says bull corn.

• 45:03Bill Simmons?

  I've never heard bull corn ever.

• 45:06Bill Simmons?

  Apparently, Jason Segel wasn't just holding the watermelon, but but started to have sex with it.

• 45:10Speaker 05

  He fucks the watermelon.

• 45:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 45:12Speaker 05

  Before American Pie happened, Jason Segel fucks the watermelon.

• 45:15Bill Simmons?

  Did American Pie just rip off like seven things from this movie?

• 45:17Speaker 05

  When you know that and you rewatch this movie and you watch Jason Segel just like scooping the watermelon out of the ride, you're like, Jesus Christ.

• 45:27Bill Simmons?

  And then, uh,

• 45:30Bill Simmons?

  who said this? Oh, Ethan Embry. Asked if he felt any anger when movies like American Pie and Superbad kicked off a wave of successful raunchy teen comedies, Embry replies, absolutely, like you fuckers. This is like the last, it's almost like a black and white TV before we get to color. Like this movie is completely different if they make it five years later.

• 45:50Speaker 05

  Yeah, and he said that they also kind of neutered Empire Records as far as he's concerned. And I'm like, I guess there's like suicide attempts in that movie. Like, there's stuff in that movie that I'm just like, what? What was the darker version of Empire Records?

• 46:02Bill Simmons?

  Wasn't with them on that one.

• 46:05Bill Simmons?

  The Van Lathan Award for did this movie need more black people? Just throwing it in. I bet he would say yes, because there's like two black people in it.

• 46:12Speaker 05

  There's two. So there's two black characters who are like in the popular clique.

• 46:16Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 46:16Speaker 05

  Right? The aforementioned Say the Last Dance star, Sean Patrick Thomas. I hope he brought him up from Cruel Intentions. That's a great one. Donald Faison is here. There's like reminiscing.

• 46:27Bill Simmons?

  Donald Faison. All right, there's, yeah.

• 46:28Speaker 05

  There's reminiscing guy. Like, remember that time that we hit this, then the other thing? I think if you can count them on one hand, though, then then there aren't enough. Yeah.

• 46:36Bill Simmons?

  Just shouting out Van.

• 46:37Speaker 05

  I think also when you have, having Kenny and his friends in this movie, it would be great if we had a like more substantial black character who was like, what the fuck? Yeah, exactly.

• 46:48Bill Simmons?

  The Ralph Lauren Rubenek Partridge Overacting Award. I have my pick, but you go.

• 46:53Speaker 05

  Sarah Rue. Earth Girl. You're sheep, all of you? Bah? No? You love, you love it?

• 46:59Bill Simmons?

  I loved it. I'm going back to Preston.

• 47:02Speaker 05

  And you're going back to Embry.

• 47:04Bill Simmons?

  Bandage shirt for Amanda. That's my sign.

• 47:07Speaker 05

  This is tough. This is tough for me.

• 47:08Bill Simmons?

  That's my sign.

• 47:11Speaker 05

  Do you like, so do you like Ethan Embry in like Empire Records or that thing you do? Like, have you liked him in other things?

• 47:19Bill Simmons?

  He's okay. I do not think he was the right choice for Preston.

• 47:22Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 47:22Bill Simmons?

  Can't wait to give you my alternatives.

• 47:24Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 47:25Bill Simmons?

  The CR thinks Luke Wilson could have been Harrison Ford hottest take award. What do you got?

• 47:29Speaker 05

  Preston and Amanda should not wind up together at the end of this movie.

• 47:33Bill Simmons?

  Who does Amanda end up with?

• 47:35Speaker 05

  Herself. She should Kelly, she should Kelly choose herself.

• 47:39Bill Simmons?

  Oh, the Kelly Taylor? Wow.

• 47:41Speaker 05

  She should choose herself because she gives this whole monologue about how she doesn't do it like when the opening and everyone knows where they're going to college. And everyone's going to a good school, by the way. She knows they're, they know where they're going to college.

• 47:50Bill Simmons?

  Schools are really good at Huntington Hillside High.

• 47:52Speaker 05

  Yeah, Kelly's going to UCLA. Okay.

• 47:55Bill Simmons?

  Crushing it. Dartmouth.

• 47:57Speaker 05

  But Amanda's undecided.

• 47:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 47:59Speaker 05

  She doesn't know where she's going to school. She doesn't know who she, and that's fine, but she doesn't know who she is. She gives this whole monologue to her creepy cousin about how she doesn't know who she is if she's not Mike Dexter's girlfriend. And then she immediately gets into her, like that day gets into a relationship with Preston.

• 48:14Bill Simmons?

  I had this in picking nits. It felt a little soon.

• 48:16Speaker 05

  Choose yourself. Get to know yourself, Amanda.

• 48:19Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 48:19Speaker 05

  Watch Runaway Bride and figure out what kind of eggs you like. You know what I mean?

• 48:23Bill Simmons?

  Go away for a weekend with like your mom and your aunt.

• 48:25Speaker 05

  Go backpacking in Europe. Take a gap year. Yeah.

• 48:28Bill Simmons?

  I'm with you. I have my hottest take.

• 48:31Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 48:33Bill Simmons?

  An ensemble cast high school movie centered around one big party is the easiest and most watchable movie anyone can possibly make. And I don't understand why there's 20 of them a year.

• 48:44Speaker 05

  Let's make one.

• 48:45Bill Simmons?

  Craig, your thoughts? Is there an easier thing to do in Hollywood than an ensemble cast high school movie centered around one big party?

• 48:54Speaker 08

  I don't know if it's the easiest thing you can do, but it's the most watchable. It's the most sought after. Everybody wants it, but there are so many attempts that don't work. So it's kind of a combination of both where I, I want a million of these. I mean, I think they try now. There's movies like Sweethearts on HBO that just come and go and disappear.

• 49:11Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 49:11Speaker 08

  They just need to put them in theaters.

• 49:13Speaker 05

  I agree. Um, other.

• 49:15Bill Simmons?

  I'm just do these, I would, every year it should be like a federal law.

• 49:19Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 49:20Bill Simmons?

  We're gonna have tariffs. Maybe this could be a law too, like federal law. We have to make one a year to capture whatever the year was with an ensemble high school movie.

• 49:27Speaker 05

  Maybe this is what Mikey Madison should do post her Oscar win.

• 49:30Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, use your power, Mikey Madison. Go back to high school.

• 49:34Speaker 05

  On the, on the like Preston and Amanda should not have wound up together front.

• 49:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 49:38Speaker 05

  In the original conception of this, Preston winds up with Denise, which of course, that's, that's the eighties template, right? That's the Teen Wolf, some kind of wonderful.

• 49:48Bill Simmons?

  My wife mentioned that when we were watching it.

• 49:50Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 49:50Bill Simmons?

  She was like, are they setting, she, she couldn't remember it. She was like, are they setting up? They end up together at the end. And I was like, no, they actually swerve on this.

• 49:57Speaker 05

  Yeah, they really do. But I, I, you know, something kind of wonderful is one of my favorite movies of all time. And I just think that like Denise deserves better than Kenny and Amanda deserves to like figure herself out. And Preston and Denise have this like really nice thing. So I'm, I'm pro that.

• 50:13Bill Simmons?

  I actually almost put that in what's age the worst. Um, when it says Denise.

• 50:18Speaker 05

  Gets back together.

• 50:19Bill Simmons?

  Five minutes later. I just would have had that.

• 50:22Speaker 05

  Yeah. And then they get back together.

• 50:23Bill Simmons?

  Get back together.

• 50:23Speaker 05

  They break up five minutes later.

• 50:24Bill Simmons?

  Kenny's a schmuck.

• 50:25Speaker 05

  Cause that freeze frame on her is so good.

• 50:27Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 50:27Speaker 05

  She's just like, it's like the end of the graduate. She's like staring off like, what have I done sort of moment? Yeah.

• 50:33Bill Simmons?

  All right. Before we get to casting, what ifs, we'll take one more break.

• 50:37Speaker 09

  I hope I don't have to cancel again tonight.

• 50:39Speaker 03

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• 51:37Speaker 10

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• 52:04Speaker 07

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• 52:08Bill Simmons?

  Casting whatevs, they wrote the role of Kenny with Breckin Meyer in mind and he was shooting 54.

• 52:15Speaker 05

  The Studio 54 movie.

• 52:16Bill Simmons?

  Instead, a movie I'm kind of obsessed with because

• 52:19Speaker 05

  Really?

• 52:19Bill Simmons?

  It's one of the most legendarily butchered movies ever released from an editing standpoint. And then there's this whole director's cut that I don't know if you've ever seen.

• 52:27Speaker 05

  I've never, is it, is it good?

• 52:29Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. It is like the biggest disparity between what a movie that was actually released where you're like, this movie's incoherent, what's happening? And then the director's cut, it's like, oh, these three actually ended up in like some weird threesome kind of relationship and got caught up in like, it, it, it fills in a lot of blanks.

• 52:48Speaker 05

  I believe you, I'm gonna watch the director's cut of Studio 54.

• 52:51Bill Simmons?

  Hard to find. Um, anyway, he took a small role in a, as the lead singer of Love Burger.

• 52:57Speaker 05

  Anyone order a love burger?

• 52:59Bill Simmons?

  Uh, so they wanted Embry to read for the nerd, for Charlamagne part. And Embry insisted, I said, no, I know I'm not your typical leading man type, but I thought this movie is better suited if they didn't cast that guy. And they said, okay. Big mistake.

• 53:19Speaker 05

  Women agree, women love Preston, men love Jennifer Lewis, women love Preston Marsden.

• 53:23Bill Simmons?

  Agree to disagree. Here, here, Kaplan said they were looking very closely at James Marsden for Mike Dexter, but Fast and Delight had a hint of danger that he didn't.

• 53:35Speaker 05

  Marsden would have been great.

• 53:36Bill Simmons?

  Marsden, everybody's been in on Marsden and he's finally had his moment and it took.

• 53:42Speaker 05

  You feel like Jury Duty is the moment?

• 53:43Bill Simmons?

  Jury Duty, I think this Hulu show, I think, I think Marsden's like, it's finally all happened.

• 53:49Speaker 05

  Coming back to the X-Men.

• 53:51Bill Simmons?

  Took him two decades. Everyone likes Marsden. What's that Catherine Haggel movie?

• 53:55Speaker 05

  Uh, oh, Twenty Seven Dresses. He's great in that.

• 53:59Bill Simmons?

  I've, I listen, I had to.

• 54:01Speaker 05

  He's great in Enchanted.

• 54:02Bill Simmons?

  I had to listen once to my wife and Juliette Lippman have like an 18 minute James Marsden conversation.

• 54:09Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 54:10Bill Simmons?

  While I was like pouring gasoline on myself.

• 54:12Speaker 05

  He never must, Hairspray, he never misses. Marsden never misses.

• 54:16Bill Simmons?

  Gotta say, uh, met him and talked to him at a, at an Oscars party and just a handsome guy.

• 54:21Speaker 05

  And like a nice guy.

• 54:22Bill Simmons?

  It's a nice, nice handsome guy.

• 54:24Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 54:24Bill Simmons?

  And, uh, doesn't seem like he has a lot of problems in life. Uh, they wanted Alicia Witt for the Lauren Ambrose role. That's an interesting one.

• 54:31Speaker 05

  It's a great one.

• 54:33Bill Simmons?

  It's a good, uh, she's another one that I feel like, and she's had, she's had some good roles over the year, but I, I thought she was so good in that Sopranos episode. Oh, you didn't see it. It made me, made me wonder. I feel like there was more there career wise for her.

• 54:46Speaker 05

  Definitely. She was on, she basically played this Denise character on the show Sybil. Like she played Sybil Shepherd's daughter and she was basically doing exactly this down to like the red hair. And so I feel like they just wanted that, her to do that. She would've been great.

• 55:00Bill Simmons?

  Big, what was that movie with the urban legend, the high school movie?

• 55:02Speaker 05

  Urban legend.

• 55:03Bill Simmons?

  No, another thing with Alicia Witt, uh, Sean fantasy, card carrying Alicia Witt.

• 55:07Speaker 05

  He was a redhead.

• 55:08Bill Simmons?

  That, that's like, in a, that's a Mount Rushmore for him.

• 55:11Speaker 05

  Yeah. Two weeks notice.

• 55:12Bill Simmons?

  Talking out of school.

• 55:13Speaker 05

  She's in Dune.

• 55:15Bill Simmons?

  Yep.

• 55:15Speaker 05

  She's, yeah, she's been around. She's in a season of Justified, which is not the best season of Justified, but that's not her fault.

• 55:22Bill Simmons?

  Her Sopranos episode is really great. Um, so they cast somebody else for the, uh, nerd role of William that Corzmo ended up doing. And it was this actor named Adam Han Bird, who had been in Little Man Tate and he just didn't fit and they had to fire him.

• 55:38Speaker 05

  I think they said he looked like too young. He's 15 years old and he just looked like a baby.

• 55:41Bill Simmons?

  And they just couldn't.

• 55:42Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 55:43Bill Simmons?

  Couldn't land the plane on it.

• 55:44Speaker 05

  Are you a Little Man Tate? Have you?

• 55:46Bill Simmons?

  I'm not.

• 55:47Speaker 05

  Uh, I loved that movie and, uh, I've, uh, this is a real moment for me, but not only Alicia Witt for Denise, but also Reese Witherspoon and Christina Ricci.

• 55:56Bill Simmons?

  Did you believe that?

• 55:57Speaker 05

  You don't believe that?

• 55:58Bill Simmons?

  Was too famous at that point. Yeah. She was like leading Pleasantville and she was in.

• 56:02Speaker 05

  She wasn't.

• 56:03Bill Simmons?

  Fear at that point.

• 56:04Speaker 05

  Was, well, fear.

• 56:05Bill Simmons?

  I think she was too famous to be in this movie.

• 56:07Speaker 05

  But I think.

• 56:07Bill Simmons?

  She's only the Jennifer Love Hewa character if she's in this.

• 56:10Speaker 05

  But she was also doing like, she was kind of doing edgy at this time.

• 56:14Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 56:15Speaker 05

  That, you know, like she did freeway, like she was trying to do edge. And so I feel like. I don't know. I understand what you're saying. It's just.

• 56:23Bill Simmons?

  She's like Cruel Intentions like a year later. I don't know. She's like you put her on the front of the poster. So I think unless it's the Jennifer Love Hewer role, I don't see it.

• 56:30Speaker 05

  Yeah, she did Fear and Freeway in 96. And then she doesn't have anything in 97.

• 56:36Bill Simmons?

  Pleasantville.

• 56:36Speaker 05

  Overnight Delivery. Pleasantville's 98.

• 56:39Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 56:39Speaker 05

  Overnight Delivery in 98, which is her and Paul Rudd. I don't know if you've seen that. That's like a.

• 56:43Bill Simmons?

  You don't know if I've seen that. Who are you talking to?

• 56:45Speaker 05

  But like.

• 56:46Bill Simmons?

  That movie's good.

• 56:47Speaker 05

  It is good, but she's doing, she's doing Edge. She liked to do Edge for a little while and then she got into Pleasantville and Cruel Intentions and sort of like the good girl thing.

• 56:57Bill Simmons?

  The Best That Guy Award category is one of the best ever. Because we have, here's three nominees and you might have more. The guy who paid Dirk DeGruy to jerk off in front of the church. He's Mike Dexter, one of his friends.

• 57:12Speaker 05

  Okay. Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 57:14Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 57:14Speaker 05

  Oh, my God.

• 57:15Bill Simmons?

  There's one.

• 57:16Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 57:16Bill Simmons?

  Poppy from Seinfeld as the cop.

• 57:18Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 57:19Bill Simmons?

  And then Tara from 90210, who became obsessed with Kayla Taylor and became single wave female. She's in this too as one of the high school kids. That is the all time big three. Dirk DeGruy, 90210, Seinfeld. I'm in.

• 57:33Speaker 05

  That's your, that's your, that's your type factor. I would say Amber Benson from Buffy Vampire Slayer being in here is like a big one for me.

• 57:41Bill Simmons?

  I don't know who that, I didn't know who Amber Benson.

• 57:43Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 57:43Bill Simmons?

  I didn't know what her name was.

• 57:44Speaker 05

  Tara, yeah, from Buffy.

• 57:45Bill Simmons?

  So you're a big Buffy person?

• 57:46Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 57:48Bill Simmons?

  Cause in 90210, one year they had, uh, Brandon's girlfriend. Who.

• 57:54Speaker 05

  Who went on to play Anya.

• 57:55Bill Simmons?

  Who went on Buffy.

• 57:56Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 57:57Bill Simmons?

  And that was the best Brandon girlfriend. That was the one he should end up with. But I think she left to do Buffy.

• 58:02Speaker 05

  She's great on Buffy though.

• 58:02Bill Simmons?

  I can't remember her name was, but she was like the editor of the newspaper.

• 58:05Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 58:06Bill Simmons?

  She wrote the big abortion story that it turned out she was the one that had the abortion big swear at the end.

• 58:11Speaker 05

  Um, yeah, she's amazing. I.

• 58:14Bill Simmons?

  Buffy was like a pretty, that was another farm factory for these movies.

• 58:18Speaker 05

  Yeah. You've got Seth Green, Sarah Michelle Gellar showing up in things, um, Alison Hannigan in American Pie.

• 58:24Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 58:24Speaker 05

  Um, yeah, the WB was just.

• 58:27Bill Simmons?

  Farm system.

• 58:28Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 58:29Bill Simmons?

  Dionne Waiters Award. You mentioned Melissa Joan Hart. I think she's eligible. Sarah Rude, Jenna Elfman. And, uh, Jerry O'Connell, I think, and Jason Segel.

• 58:41Bill Simmons?

  Can I make the case for Klepto Kid?

• 58:43Speaker 05

  Klepto Kid's a great one.

• 58:44Bill Simmons?

  Who has no, no, and he's one of those guys.

• 58:47Speaker 05

  I think he shows up in American Pie too, like I think, yeah.

• 58:49Bill Simmons?

  Klepto Kid's just continually just showing up and stealing something and I think he's my favorite.

• 58:54Speaker 05

  He's really funny. He steals the gumball machine at the end. Brian Klugman, who plays stoner guy who's not Jason Segel with the like curly hair.

• 59:03Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:03Speaker 05

  He's the one who's got the Velma from Scooby Doo line.

• 59:05Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:06Speaker 05

  He's the one who says Preston wears T-shirts sometimes.

• 59:08Bill Simmons?

  That's a good one.

• 59:09Speaker 05

  He says Preston, like I, I just, I love him. He shows up with a dinosaur throughout the whole movie. I really like him.

• 59:16Bill Simmons?

  All right. Recasting couch director city.

• 59:20Speaker 05

  Okay. I do have a Preston candidate here.

• 59:26Speaker 05

  Freddie Prince Jr.

• 59:28Bill Simmons?

  Oh, another one that the women like, that the guys never totally got.

• 59:32Speaker 05

  Because like Freddie, you know, and she's all that, like he was often cast in the like cool, the popular kid role.

• 59:38Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:38Speaker 05

  The jock role, but I think he would have really thrived in this sort of like sensitive kid role. I think this would have been a good moment for him. Yeah.

• 59:46Bill Simmons?

  I have two options for you.

• 59:47Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 59:49Bill Simmons?

  Marsden.

• 59:50Speaker 05

  Marsden for Mike Dexter?

• 59:52Bill Simmons?

  Marsden for Preston.

• 59:53Speaker 05

  Marsden for Preston.

• 59:55Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 59:57Bill Simmons?

  You nerd him up a little bit, but I feel like I'm way more believing

• 1:00:03Bill Simmons?

  that she's going to be just immediately smitten by Marsden. And maybe Marsden changes his hair that like he, maybe he's got some weird hairdo until the last day of high school.

• 1:00:12Speaker 05

  But like the thing about Preston, the thing about Preston is she rejects him when she just thinks he's a rando and it's only because he wrote that letter.

• 1:00:19Bill Simmons?

  So nobody rejects Marsden?

• 1:00:20Speaker 05

  No one says no to Marsden.

• 1:00:21Bill Simmons?

  Well, here's my other idea.

• 1:00:23Speaker 05

  No one puts Marsden in a corner.

• 1:00:25Bill Simmons?

  Jason Segel and Ethan Embry just switch parts.

• 1:00:28Speaker 05

  Okay, because he's already stoned? He's ready to fuck a watermelon?

• 1:00:31Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, he's, he's already watermelon fuck run.

• 1:00:34Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:00:34Bill Simmons?

  And then we got Jason Segel, first movie ever, age 19. He's like tall and skinny and gawky, but he's, he's cool and, and from what we know from him over the next 10 years could have pulled it off.

• 1:00:45Speaker 05

  This is similar to his role in Freaks and Geeks. I think he really could have.

• 1:00:47Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:48Speaker 05

  Done it. Yeah.

• 1:00:49Bill Simmons?

  All right. So I got you on board.

• 1:00:50Speaker 05

  You got me.

• 1:00:52Bill Simmons?

  Craig has a choice. Flex category.

• 1:00:55Speaker 08

  I made up a new category.

• 1:00:56Bill Simmons?

  Great.

• 1:00:57Speaker 08

  It's the Matt Flynn $26 million contract award for the person I can't believe we thought was going to be a star and it goes to Ethan Embry.

• 1:01:08Bill Simmons?

  Yes.

• 1:01:09Speaker 05

  I needed another woman on this podcast. Guys don't get it.

• 1:01:13Speaker 08

  No, I don't. I don't get it. I don't get it. The whole cast, I don't really understand, but.

• 1:01:17Bill Simmons?

  Craig, what do you mean?

• 1:01:18Speaker 05

  No, my God.

• 1:01:19Bill Simmons?

  You don't get it? He's doing, he's fucking Shaggy from Scoob and Co.

• 1:01:22Speaker 05

  Nightmare. Nightmare.

• 1:01:24Bill Simmons?

  Shaggy.

• 1:01:26Speaker 08

  That's great. So what's that category called? It's the Matt Flynn 26 million dollar contract award for the person I can't believe we thought was a star.

• 1:01:34Bill Simmons?

  So Matt Flynn was this guy who was a backup QB in the Packers. And he played like two games at the end of the season and did well in the two games.

• 1:01:42Speaker 08

  He threw five touchdowns in one game and everybody freaked out.

• 1:01:45Bill Simmons?

  And Seattle, so it was the last game of the year. It didn't really mean anything. Seattle freaked out, gave him this huge contract and then he wasn't good. And that's who Craig compared Ethan Embry to.

• 1:01:55Speaker 05

  That's a, that's a, that's a great category. I really like it. I just fundamentally disagree with the premise, but I like it as a, as a category going forward. Another casting option.

• 1:02:04Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:05Speaker 05

  Because, uh, thinking about Ethan Embry, I don't know if he could have gotten away with playing a teenager. But Tom Everett Scott from that thing you do.

• 1:02:13Bill Simmons?

  Hmm.

• 1:02:13Speaker 05

  Right? Like in the, in the Preston role. He's got that sort of like nerdy, cute sweetness.

• 1:02:21Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that's solid.

• 1:02:22Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:02:24Speaker 05

  But that's another one. Tom Everett Scott is another one where I was like, I really thought he was gonna be a big deal and then he wasn't at all.

• 1:02:30Bill Simmons?

  I have to test drive one more candidate for the football player.

• 1:02:34Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:02:36Bill Simmons?

  What about Mark Wahlberg? Just, just six years too old to be in the movie as Mike Dexter.

• 1:02:42Speaker 05

  Mark Wahlberg in his fear era.

• 1:02:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, just Mark, fear Mark Wahlberg. Real, really menacing. And you kind of can't believe he's in the movie, but that gave him a lot of money to be in it. I don't know.

• 1:02:53Speaker 05

  I think they need, I think for this movie to have stuck beyond the micro generation that it hit. It needed like adjacent, it needed one more person who stayed quite famous to have been in one of the leading roles.

• 1:03:05Bill Simmons?

  Well, that's 10 Things I Hate About You.

• 1:03:08Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:03:08Bill Simmons?

  Heath Ledger vaulted that movie to a whole nother. I mean, we already did that one on rewatchables. Half-Assed Under Research, we mentioned Melissa Joan Hart, who was filming Sabrina at the same time and took B12 vitamins to stay energized during the all-night shoots.

• 1:03:23Speaker 05

  B12 vitamins?

• 1:03:24Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. I'm gonna wonder, uh, what that really was. And then, um, apparently when the, um, when they finished filming in the place, they allowed. The whole cast to destroy the house for one last scene and they spent an hour destroying the house.

• 1:03:40Speaker 05

  Cause the, I mean, the interior was a set.

• 1:03:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:43Speaker 05

  And then the exterior is the Altadena house that is no longer. Uh, fun fact, Breckenmeyer married Deborah Kaplan and they had two kids.

• 1:03:50Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:03:51Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:03:52Bill Simmons?

  He, and he could have been, who was his character?

• 1:03:54Speaker 05

  He would, could have been Kenny, but he was the lead singer of Loveburger.

• 1:03:57Bill Simmons?

  I mean, he's another one who could have been Preston. I'll basically accept anyone else from that era as Preston.

• 1:04:02Speaker 05

  But Breckenmeyer had just come off Clueless and he's, he's like got that stoner energy off of Clueless.

• 1:04:07Speaker 08

  What about Justin Long?

• 1:04:09Bill Simmons?

  Is he old enough?

• 1:04:10Speaker 05

  Is he too young?

• 1:04:10Speaker 08

  He's the same age as Ethan Embry.

• 1:04:13Speaker 05

  But I think he like looked too young, but.

• 1:04:16Speaker 08

  I thought Ethan Embry looked, he kinda had a receding hairline even at 21.

• 1:04:19Speaker 05

  It's true. It's true.

• 1:04:20Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, I actually looked, I was gonna put that for what's age the worst, thinking he was like 38 when he filmed the movie and he was 21.

• 1:04:26Speaker 08

  I was shocked that he was 21.

• 1:04:29Bill Simmons?

  Uh, Apex Mountain, Ethan Embry, definitely.

• 1:04:32Speaker 05

  It's Ethan Embry.

• 1:04:33Bill Simmons?

  Jennifer Love Hewitt, no question. Party of Five crossed with this movie, crossed with, I know he did last summer.

• 1:04:39Speaker 05

  Yes, this time.

• 1:04:40Bill Simmons?

  This never got bigger. This exact moment is her moment.

• 1:04:42Speaker 05

  This exact moment. I don't know that this, and dating Carson Daly, as you pointed out.

• 1:04:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:46Speaker 05

  I don't know that this movie, like of those three things, I don't know that this movie.

• 1:04:50Bill Simmons?

  I'm just saying, this, this specific timeframe, 98.

• 1:04:53Speaker 05

  The entrance she gets with the fan on her preposterously enormous hair.

• 1:04:59Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:04:59Speaker 05

  And the sneaker pips are playing underneath is like an all-timer, like any actor in Hollywood wants that to have happened to them at some point in their career.

• 1:05:08Bill Simmons?

  Fascinating, definitely.

• 1:05:11Speaker 05

  No, Twilight.

• 1:05:13Bill Simmons?

  Oh, I don't know Twilight.

• 1:05:14Speaker 05

  I also don't know Twilight that well, but he is a big deal in Twilight.

• 1:05:17Bill Simmons?

  How big is he in Twilight?

• 1:05:18Speaker 05

  He's, he's the like patriarch of the vampire family.

• 1:05:21Bill Simmons?

  Oh, that sounds important. That's more important than this movie and being married to Jenny Garth at the same time. You're right.

• 1:05:26Speaker 05

  He's got Twilight money.

• 1:05:27Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, Twilight. Alright, that's fine. Jenna Elfman, yes. Cause she's on that show at the same time.

• 1:05:32Speaker 05

  Darma and Greg, yeah.

• 1:05:33Bill Simmons?

  Darma and Greg, plus she cameo on this where it's like a big deal. She made a cameo.

• 1:05:37Speaker 05

  What was the, what was the?

• 1:05:38Bill Simmons?

  It was like there.

• 1:05:39Speaker 05

  Keeping the Faith, is that what that's called? The one with Edward Norton?

• 1:05:43Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:43Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:05:44Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. 90's teen movies?

• 1:05:47Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:05:48Bill Simmons?

  Oh, no, I don't know if it is or not. These are we're debating.

• 1:05:51Speaker 05

  I don't think so, because.

• 1:05:52Bill Simmons?

  I actually think the answer is Scream.

• 1:05:55Speaker 05

  That's a good one. It might be Clueless.

• 1:05:57Bill Simmons?

  Oh, yeah, you're right. It might be Clueless.

• 1:05:59Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:05:59Bill Simmons?

  It's Scream or Clueless.

• 1:06:01Speaker 05

  Clueless is like right in the middle, you know what I mean? So, yeah.

• 1:06:04Bill Simmons?

  And American Pie is 2000?

• 1:06:06Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:06:06Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, so that's.

• 1:06:07Speaker 05

  Or 99. American Pie might be 99.

• 1:06:09Bill Simmons?

  Oh, shit. If Pie's 99, then I think that's.

• 1:06:14Speaker 05

  You think it's American Pie?

• 1:06:15Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:15Speaker 05

  Well, the question about, yeah, it's 99.

• 1:06:17Bill Simmons?

  Too secret. Yeah, that's the one I know.

• 1:06:20Speaker 05

  But like the thing, I would say, yes, it spawned sequels, but I think the fact that it spawned sequels then like takes it out of the 90s, whereas Clueless is just pure.

• 1:06:29Bill Simmons?

  Buried in the 90s.

• 1:06:30Speaker 05

  90s, you know?

• 1:06:32Bill Simmons?

  Corzmo. I really liked him in What About Bob? But I don't know. I don't know what his apex.

• 1:06:38Speaker 05

  He's great. He's great in, uh, in Hook, Run Home, Jack.

• 1:06:41Bill Simmons?

  All in one night high school movies?

• 1:06:45Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:06:46Bill Simmons?

  Probably Superbad?

• 1:06:47Speaker 05

  Superbad is, I love Superbad. I love Booksmart. Dazed and Confused?

• 1:06:56Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that's pretty good, too.

• 1:06:57Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:06:58Bill Simmons?

  I would say Superbad. I think it was the most successful and it had the most people in it that went on to become even bigger.

• 1:07:07Speaker 05

  Dazed and Confused is like the art house.

• 1:07:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, that's like the.

• 1:07:12Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:07:12Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, the indie one.

• 1:07:13Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:07:14Bill Simmons?

  Blink 182 and Smash Mouth?

• 1:07:16Speaker 05

  Yes. Smash Mouth, certainly.

• 1:07:18Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:19Speaker 05

  This is Smash Mouth's movie.

• 1:07:22Bill Simmons?

  Cruise or Hanks?

• 1:07:25Speaker 05

  There's like no adults in this movie. Where do you?

• 1:07:27Bill Simmons?

  No, you gotta go, we're, we're allowed to take any year of Cruise or Hanks. So you can go, you can go early 80s either.

• 1:07:33Speaker 05

  Baby Hanks as Preston Myers?

• 1:07:36Bill Simmons?

  It's interesting, because I was thinking Risky Business era Joel Goodson Cruise.

• 1:07:41Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:07:43Bill Simmons?

  Dorking it up, but then deep down, there's a little more there as Preston, or Cruise as Mike Dexter.

• 1:07:48Speaker 05

  Yeah, Cruise as Mike Dexter is a really good one. You know who like gave me Risky Business Tom Cruise is Corzmo when he's doing Paradise City. There's like this cruisiness to him. That's really interesting.

• 1:08:00Bill Simmons?

  Craig, you pick.

• 1:08:01Speaker 08

  I I was thinking the same thing. I think Hanks as the lead. I think Cruz as Mike Dexter.

• 1:08:06Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:08:06Bill Simmons?

  Oh.

• 1:08:07Speaker 08

  Cruz is too small for Mike Dexter. He can't be a football player. They'd have to fudge that.

• 1:08:11Bill Simmons?

  All right. So let's go Hanks. Like 1979 Hanks as Mike Dexter.

• 1:08:15Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:08:16Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. All right.

• 1:08:17Speaker 05

  No, wait, as Mike Dexter.

• 1:08:18Bill Simmons?

  I mean, as as Preston. Yeah. Scorsese or Spielberg? Hilarious category. Uh, I'd probably go Spielberg for this one.

• 1:08:26Speaker 05

  Definitely Spielberg. Spielberg. Can you imagine?

• 1:08:29Bill Simmons?

  Scorsese. Yeah, there's.

• 1:08:30Speaker 05

  Can hardly wait.

• 1:08:31Bill Simmons?

  Lot of cocaine.

• 1:08:31Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:08:34Bill Simmons?

  What role would Philip Seymour Hoffman have played? Probably Tripp McNeely.

• 1:08:37Speaker 05

  I would say Jenna Elfman's angel role.

• 1:08:40Bill Simmons?

  Oh, interesting. Hail Angel?

• 1:08:42Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:08:42Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Picking nits. Um, I have a couple. What do you have?

• 1:08:48Speaker 05

  This is a perfect movie. I have no nits to pick.

• 1:08:50Bill Simmons?

  Okay. Uh, the cops break up that party in one hour.

• 1:08:56Bill Simmons?

  I just wrote down Amanda Beckett. What's happening there? She was with this idiot for three years and goes to a party and doesn't seem to really have any friends and just kind of wanders around in a daze.

• 1:09:06Speaker 05

  Know anyone?

• 1:09:07Bill Simmons?

  Like you, you have no identity? Like what?

• 1:09:09Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:09:09Bill Simmons?

  Like, I just feel like she would have a little more.

• 1:09:12Speaker 05

  This is the thing is like.

• 1:09:13Bill Simmons?

  A little more wherewithal.

• 1:09:14Speaker 05

  I was reading the negative reviews, which I couldn't wholly disagree with. And they were like, there's no depth to these characters. I was like, I think some of them have depth, except Amanda, who's just intentionally a blank slate, but then that's just not that interesting. So, yeah.

• 1:09:31Bill Simmons?

  Nobody else uses the upstairs bathroom for this entire party? I mean, has anyone ever been to a high school party? People are, they're looking at the line. They're looking around.

• 1:09:39Speaker 05

  Yeah, not a single person tries the door.

• 1:09:41Bill Simmons?

  For two hours, they're trapped in the bathroom. Nobody else goes up there. Come on. Amanda has no idea who Preston is. How, how big was this high school?

• 1:09:50Speaker 05

  But she doesn't, I mean, that's, I guess, Sarah Rue's point is like, you don't know any of us. You know, you're shitty. Popular Friends.

• 1:09:58Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:59Speaker 05

  Absolute iconic Jamie Presley performance in this movie, by the way.

• 1:10:02Bill Simmons?

  We should have mentioned her in What's A Stage to Best.

• 1:10:04Speaker 05

  She's great in this.

• 1:10:06Bill Simmons?

  Always loved her.

• 1:10:07Speaker 05

  And so she just hung out with like those

• 1:10:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:11Speaker 05

  four dudes and those three girls and that was it.

• 1:10:14Bill Simmons?

  Never saw anyone else.

• 1:10:15Speaker 05

  And her cousin.

• 1:10:15Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:16Speaker 05

  And had no other friends, then yeah. But that just makes you think poorly of Amanda.

• 1:10:20Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:10:21Speaker 05

  Cause at least Ionee Sky's character in Say Anything like had a reason she didn't know anyone, right?

• 1:10:27Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:28Speaker 05

  It was like she was sheltered and, you know, home, like not homeschooled, but just sort of like was on this track and stuff like that. So when she shows up at the high school party and say anything and nobody knows her, but they're all like, we wish we had known you.

• 1:10:42Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:10:42Speaker 05

  We wanted to know you.

• 1:10:43Bill Simmons?

  It was acknowledged.

• 1:10:44Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:10:48Bill Simmons?

  I Kenny and Denise just having sex right away after they talked for 10 minutes when they were both pretty socially immature. I don't know. I'm flagging it. Late 90s. Things were starting to flip, but.

• 1:11:00Speaker 05

  She had had, it wasn't her first time.

• 1:11:03Bill Simmons?

  No.

• 1:11:04Speaker 05

  And.

• 1:11:05Bill Simmons?

  I just felt like they probably, I don't know. I don't know if they're just.

• 1:11:07Speaker 05

  They like make out a bit, but they don't.

• 1:11:08Bill Simmons?

  And I don't know if they're banging boots in two minutes on the, on the cold bathroom floor.

• 1:11:12Speaker 05

  He does have the love kit.

• 1:11:14Bill Simmons?

  He does. Maybe the love kit got her. Sequel, prequel, prestige, TV, all black cast or untouchable. Can I talk you into semi prestige?

• 1:11:23Speaker 05

  Okay.

• 1:11:24Bill Simmons?

  Like an eight episode Amazon, all set in a final night of a high school and it's almost done like the pit with Noah Wiley. Where it's like each hour is an actual hour at the party.

• 1:11:36Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:11:38Bill Simmons?

  Craig, would you watch that? Sure, yeah.

• 1:11:40Speaker 05

  But that's similar, that's similar.

• 1:11:41Bill Simmons?

  The pit crossed with Can't Hardly Wait, eight hours at somebody's house.

• 1:11:45Speaker 05

  That's kind of similar to what.

• 1:11:47Bill Simmons?

  That's where the B12 vitamins come in.

• 1:11:49Speaker 05

  Yeah, exactly. That's kind of similar to what American Vandal tried to do with like their breakdown of what happened one night at a party.

• 1:11:54Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:11:55Speaker 05

  But, uh, yeah, do it pit style. What is John Wells doing? Why not? Can't Hardly Wait, the TV series.

• 1:12:00Bill Simmons?

  Wiley is the most back anyone's ever been back.

• 1:12:02Speaker 05

  A hundred percent back.

• 1:12:03Bill Simmons?

  He's full time back.

• 1:12:05Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:12:06Bill Simmons?

  Is this movie better with Wayne Jenkins, Danny Tre, Doris Burke, Sam Jackson, Nell, Byron Mayo, Barney Cousins, Tony Roma, Harley Mays, Chris Collinsworth, Daniel Plainbill, Long Legs, or Wilford Brimley in The Firm?

• 1:12:19Speaker 05

  I already said.

• 1:12:20Bill Simmons?

  We could say nobody.

• 1:12:20Speaker 05

  I already said Philip Seymour Hoffman in the Jenna Elfman role, but what about Danny Trejo in the Jenna Elfman role? Just in terms of like, not even, it doesn't have to be an angel, but just in terms of like, the one adult who wanders in and gives you advice and is Danny Trejo? That sounds.

• 1:12:36Bill Simmons?

  Dressed like an angel?

• 1:12:37Speaker 05

  Or not, but just like, is there, talking about Scott Baio or whatever he wants to talk about, Danny Trejo, I think could, belongs in this universe.

• 1:12:46Bill Simmons?

  Can I have you, Sam Jackson as the cop?

• 1:12:48Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:12:49Bill Simmons?

  Instead of Poppy from Seinfeld, Sam Jackson comes in and just Sam Jackson's it up for like six minutes and then they just give him a million dollars?

• 1:12:55Speaker 05

  While Blink 182 plays in the background.

• 1:12:57Bill Simmons?

  What the fuck is going on at this party? You guys are crazy. Just one Oscar who gets it, I'm gonna unfortunately say nobody for this one, which we rarely have a nobody, but.

• 1:13:06Speaker 08

  No, you have to do it, that's the rule, you have to get an Oscar.

• 1:13:10Speaker 05

  I have one.

• 1:13:10Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:13:11Speaker 05

  I have two. Best editing.

• 1:13:15Bill Simmons?

  Best editing, that's good, good answer.

• 1:13:17Speaker 05

  Mark Bridges, who's the costume designer who went on to win an Oscar for The Phantom Thread.

• 1:13:23Bill Simmons?

  There you go, that sounds great.

• 1:13:25Speaker 05

  I mean Kenny's goggles, everything Kenny, everything 90s, what the popular girls are wearing, they're like bra and skirt set.

• 1:13:35Bill Simmons?

  Costume design.

• 1:13:35Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:13:35Bill Simmons?

  And the nominees are, can't hardly wait.

• 1:13:37Speaker 05

  Can't hardly wait, yeah.

• 1:13:38Bill Simmons?

  Sense and sensibility. Probably an answerable questions, I don't really have any other than this one. The Five Year Reunion sequel was sitting right there in 2003, and all of these people were still relatively famous enough.

• 1:13:53Speaker 05

  And American Pie is cooking.

• 1:13:54Bill Simmons?

  But they could have made it way more raunchy and five year, same thing, one night, we, we catch up, at that point, the movie had kinda taken off as a cult movie.

• 1:14:03Speaker 05

  Oh my god.

• 1:14:03Bill Simmons?

  It's sitting right there.

• 1:14:04Speaker 05

  Great call.

• 1:14:05Bill Simmons?

  I don't know why they did it, they could also do the 30 Year Reunion movie, but I'm not sure people would be as excited about that one.

• 1:14:11Speaker 05

  But they might, because it would be like, what are these people doing now? And it would be exciting to see them. We don't see Breckin Meyer that often, do you know what I mean? It would be fun to see him. Donald Faison is making a lot of telephone commercials and has a podcast, but like.

• 1:14:23Bill Simmons?

  Maybe Amanda has a personality by then?

• 1:14:25Speaker 05

  Maybe, maybe she's grown a personality, yeah, yeah.

• 1:14:28Bill Simmons?

  You have any answerables?

• 1:14:30Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:14:30Bill Simmons?

  Okay. There's a one day award for what happened the next day. Uh, I have Preston and Amanda dated for two years and then she immediately started dating the soccer captain of whatever school she was going to and dumped him. I think it's a two year romance.

• 1:14:44Speaker 05

  That or he met someone at his college who actually had a personality.

• 1:14:49Bill Simmons?

  Who actually could have a conversation.

• 1:14:52Speaker 05

  And, and when he's like, I'm gonna do a summer internship with Kurt Vonnegut and she's like, great, that's great for you. But he meets someone at his college who like has read a Kurt Vonnegut book.

• 1:15:00Bill Simmons?

  Who actually has read Kurt Vonnegut. Yeah, that's smart. What piece of memorabilia would you want from this movie? Or not want?

• 1:15:05Speaker 05

  This is easy for me.

• 1:15:07Bill Simmons?

  The goggles?

• 1:15:07Speaker 05

  No, it's the Love Burger shirt from the band.

• 1:15:10Bill Simmons?

  Oh, that's a great one.

• 1:15:11Speaker 05

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:15:13Bill Simmons?

  I also, I wrote that in the love camp, but then the yearbook would be kind of funny to have.

• 1:15:17Speaker 05

  Oh, yeah, yeah.

• 1:15:17Bill Simmons?

  Cause people signed it.

• 1:15:18Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:15:19Bill Simmons?

  Um, the goggles are pretty good. I'd give those to Craig, cause he was obviously fascinated by those.

• 1:15:24Speaker 05

  Craig definitely gets the goggles.

• 1:15:25Bill Simmons?

  Coach Finstak award for best life lesson. Fate only takes you so far.

• 1:15:30Speaker 05

  That's beautiful.

• 1:15:31Bill Simmons?

  I actually really learned something about life in this.

• 1:15:33Speaker 05

  Uh, here's mine. Always wear shoes in the dorm shower.

• 1:15:38Bill Simmons?

  Right. You don't want to get warts.

• 1:15:40Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:15:40Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:15:41Speaker 05

  There was a kid in my dorm freshman year who got like, something really gnarly happened to his foot in the dorm shower. And I was like, you clearly didn't see Can't Hardly Wait.

• 1:15:49Bill Simmons?

  Right.

• 1:15:49Speaker 05

  If you had, you would have known. You always gotta wear shower shoes in the dorm shower.

• 1:15:52Bill Simmons?

  Shower shoes are important. Uh, best double feature choice. What do you have?

• 1:15:56Speaker 05

  Super bad. Super bad.

• 1:15:58Bill Simmons?

  So I had 16 candles. Interesting. Maybe it's a triple feature.

• 1:16:01Speaker 05

  Generational thing. Yeah.

• 1:16:02Bill Simmons?

  So it'd be 16 candles, Can't Hardly Wait.

• 1:16:05Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:16:06Bill Simmons?

  Super bad. And then book smart?

• 1:16:08Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:16:09Bill Simmons?

  And that's like four generations of all in one day movies. Maybe throw in Say Anything for a quintuple header.

• 1:16:14Speaker 05

  I love it.

• 1:16:15Bill Simmons?

  Sounds great. Who won the movie? This is hard.

• 1:16:20Speaker 05

  The nineties? Did the nineties win the movie? Does it have to be, does it have to be a person?

• 1:16:25Bill Simmons?

  Can be whatever you want.

• 1:16:26Speaker 05

  Can be whatever I want.

• 1:16:29Speaker 05

  I would say for the time in terms of like stock and recognizability out of the movie and all that sort of stuff. Might be Seth Green. This was like a big Seth Green moment.

• 1:16:40Bill Simmons?

  So. I had it narrowed down to Ethan Embry. Because there's just no way he was ever gonna lead another movie after this. So he gets to at least point to like, hey, that time I led a movie. Uh Seth Green, who's just having an incredible run here.

• 1:16:56Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:16:56Bill Simmons?

  Do we mention him in Apex Mountain?

• 1:16:58Speaker 05

  No.

• 1:16:59Bill Simmons?

  I might have forgotten to put him in there. Cause he has Austin Powers.

• 1:17:02Speaker 05

  Yes.

• 1:17:02Bill Simmons?

  He's Scott Evil. He has this, he's on Buffy. Um, he's just all over the place and it feels like he's. Um, everybody likes Seth Green. He had a really high approval rating.

• 1:17:13Speaker 05

  And then he does Robot Chicken.

• 1:17:15Bill Simmons?

  You know, this was in his first high school movie.

• 1:17:18Speaker 05

  I can do this. Um. Airborne?

• 1:17:20Bill Simmons?

  I don't know if you're gonna get it.

• 1:17:22Speaker 05

  Airborne? Does that count?

• 1:17:24Bill Simmons?

  Not what I'm thinking.

• 1:17:26Speaker 05

  Um, My Stepmother's an Alien? Is he in high school?

• 1:17:28Bill Simmons?

  Can't Buy Me Love.

• 1:17:29Speaker 05

  Oh, Can't Buy Me Love.

• 1:17:30Bill Simmons?

  He's Chucky, the little annoying brother who keeps trying to, who, he's Patrick Dempsey's brother.

• 1:17:35Speaker 05

  Have you seen Airborne though? The rollerblading movie?

• 1:17:39Bill Simmons?

  I don't know if I saw Airborne.

• 1:17:40Speaker 05

  Oh.

• 1:17:41Bill Simmons?

  Yeah?

• 1:17:41Speaker 05

  Oh.

• 1:17:42Bill Simmons?

  Okay.

• 1:17:42Speaker 05

  You should watch Airborne. Uh, Young Jack Black's in that movie.

• 1:17:46Bill Simmons?

  Really?

• 1:17:47Speaker 05

  Seth Green's in that movie. A lot of Uback's in that movie. It's about a California surfer bro. Who moves to like the, like Minneapolis, something like that. It's like snowing all the time. And he discovers rollerblading and that's how they all like bond together. The hockey kids and the California kid.

• 1:18:04Bill Simmons?

  I missed out on all the roller skating, rollerblading, skateboarding movies. All of them. I didn't, I haven't seen any of them.

• 1:18:10Speaker 05

  Glean the cube?

• 1:18:11Bill Simmons?

  Yeah, none of them.

• 1:18:11Speaker 05

  Wow, okay.

• 1:18:12Bill Simmons?

  None of them. Um, for who won the movie?

• 1:18:18Bill Simmons?

  I think you could say Lauren Ambrose. Because she had the best career after and it's so cool to see her in this movie now.

• 1:18:24Speaker 05

  She gets um six feet under sort of off the back of this. Yeah.

• 1:18:29Bill Simmons?

  And you see the seeds evolve it. She's had a really good career. I I mean, in the moment, it felt like Jennifer Love Hewitt won the movie, but as you said, like her characters doesn't really have a lot going on, but.

• 1:18:39Speaker 05

  I think this cemented something for for her moment.

• 1:18:42Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:42Speaker 05

  But it didn't carry her beyond this.

• 1:18:44Bill Simmons?

  I like your Seth Green call.

• 1:18:45Speaker 05

  Yeah, I think it's Seth Green. Yeah. He's the most quotable. Someone was just like always running around.

• 1:18:50Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:18:50Speaker 05

  Dropping Kenny, Special K quotes.

• 1:18:53Bill Simmons?

  All right, I'm nervous. Craig Oralbeck, our producer, who's never seen this movie.

• 1:18:57Speaker 05

  I genuinely can't wait because I bet I like, I feel like I know.

• 1:19:00Bill Simmons?

  You can't hardly wait.

• 1:19:01Speaker 05

  I can't hardly wait.

• 1:19:02Speaker 08

  You, look, I'll be kind. The bar is just high for high school comedies. The bar is really high and this is like watching Bob Pettit. And you're like, I get it maybe in the moment. It, I don't know if it holds up. You know what I mean?

• 1:19:15Speaker 08

  It kind of feels like.

• 1:19:16Bill Simmons?

  Bob Pettit, he's a nineteen fifty's basketball player.

• 1:19:19Speaker 08

  It just feels like you ran, if you ask Chat GPT, like, write me, say anything in three minutes. And it it cranked out, can't hardly wait. It's tough because it like has the look of American Pie, but it has like the feel and the earnestness of like a say anything. And I think for my generation, but the earnestness, high school comedy died before I came around. Like by the time I showed up, it was like super bad.

• 1:19:45Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:19:45Speaker 08

  And all that stuff. So kind of going back to this, like the hopeless romantic shtick.

• 1:19:52Speaker 08

  It was tough. It was tough. And and it's in the the the lack of star power in the cast was shocking. And Sean, I was talking to Sean this weekend about it and he was like, oh, yeah. Ethan Embry, like people thought he was, he was a thing.

• 1:20:02Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:20:02Speaker 08

  For like two years and everybody in this movie, they were like, they thought everybody was gonna go on and have like a real career.

• 1:20:07Bill Simmons?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:07Speaker 08

  And so going back now, I was, I was shocked at the casting of this film.

• 1:20:11Bill Simmons?

  That's, that was one of the reasons I was so excited to do it. Because it's like this time capsule that you can't really explain 27 years later.

• 1:20:19Speaker 05

  Incredible like mid-tier of success where like I can name check every single person in this movie. But Craig, who just like is, you know, like a decade younger than me or whatever, is just sort of like, that guy, that guy, that guy, like they were never a thing. And also, this is sort of exactly what I expected, Craig, because it's just like, it really is a you had to be there movie.

• 1:20:38Speaker 08

  Yeah, totally.

• 1:20:39Speaker 05

  You definitely had to be there. And I like, I didn't expect, I was like, Craig's not gonna like this at all.

• 1:20:43Speaker 08

  No, I know. It's, it's just, it's laid on thick, you know, all the, all the archetypes are laid on pretty thick. I do think there are like storylines that I like. I actually, I think the nerd kid getting drunk is funny. That worked for me. Yeah. And I thought the best part of the movie, you didn't really talk about it, the Jerry O'Connell scene, I think is legitimately good. Yeah. And that could have been the sequel or, or just exploring the theme of peaking in high school or the guy who was awesome going to college and realizing that he's a loser and coming back. I thought that interaction between the two of them was like, was like, you know, the, the ghost of, of Christmas past coming back and telling you like what your future is like. I thought it was pretty good. It was like a, you know, Mike Dexter was looking at his future on the bench. I thought that was good.

• 1:21:22Speaker 05

  So you want the Mike Dexter, uh, like burns out in college.

• 1:21:26Speaker 08

  Yeah. Yeah, I want, I want Mike Dexter going to college with Jerry O'Connell.

• 1:21:31Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:21:31Bill Simmons?

  But you know what, Craig, everything he just laid out is one of the reasons I like this movie. Is because the late 90s had no interest in really exploring anything.

• 1:21:39Speaker 08

  No.

• 1:21:39Bill Simmons?

  They just wanted, they, they cared about, is there a good soundtrack? Did you get enough young stars? Can you describe the theme of the movie in a sentence? Let's go. Can you film this in 25 days? And this was just three years of movies.

• 1:21:52Speaker 08

  I think this movie thought it was satirizing high school archetypes. And in reality, it was just kind of sloppy versions of them.

• 1:21:59Speaker 05

  I don't think it thinks, I don't think it thought it was doing anything. I think genuinely, and I, I don't see that as a negative. I think it was just sort of like, to your point, we have $2 to rub together and we know a bunch of young people are out of work. And we want to stake our claim as directors because he's, this writing duo had never directed anything before.

• 1:22:19Speaker 08

  Yeah.

• 1:22:20Speaker 05

  And so they're like, what's the lowest stake thing that they can, that we can put together and, and. And is funny throughout, which it is. And so-

• 1:22:28Bill Simmons?

  Part of this era, they just shamelessly ripped off movies that already happened.

• 1:22:32Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 1:22:33Bill Simmons?

  You know, like, what was the movie, the Freddie Prince movie where the girl-

• 1:22:36Speaker 05

  She's all that?

• 1:22:37Bill Simmons?

  It's ba- it's basically Secret Admirer, not Secret Admirer, Can't Buy Me Love, just-

• 1:22:41Speaker 05

  Oh, 100%.

• 1:22:41Bill Simmons?

  Redone. Um, or you'd have movies like The Faculty where they were just like, "Do you have the script yet? I had, Faculty's evil, that's all we got, but we gotta shoot three weeks from now and we have a couple of people on board already. Nick Stalls in, let's go.

• 1:22:57Speaker 05

  We've got Elijah for like, one month, yeah.

• 1:23:00Bill Simmons?

  So let's just start filming and we'll figure out the script. And that's just kinda how they did it back then. People were dumber back then, Craig. I don't know what to tell you.

• 1:23:07Speaker 08

  Too much B-12, I don't know.

• 1:23:08Bill Simmons?

  Yeah. That, that was producer Craig Horlbeck. Thanks to Gahow as well, behind the scenes.

• 1:23:14Speaker 05

  Thank you.

• 1:23:15Bill Simmons?

  Thanks to Joanna for spending so much time in LA with us.

• 1:23:18Speaker 05

  I genuinely consider this a gift to me. Thank you so much, Bill.

• 1:23:21Bill Simmons?

  You can watch this on the, uh, Ringer Movies YouTube page as well, and we will see you next week.

• 1:23:26Speaker 05

  You have to watch it because you have to see Bill's impression of Ethan Embry with your own two eyes.

• 1:23:32Bill Simmons?

  Maybe I'll bring in Ethan Embry for the future for the, uh, is this movie better off with Sam Jackson, that whole category. Ethan Embry can be in it.

• 1:23:42Bill Simmons?

  Thanks, Joanna.

• 1:23:55Speaker 11

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