Pod Insights The Moth The Moth Radio Hour: Curtain Call About this episode In this hour, three artists known for their work on stage tell their personal stories on The Moth's. This episode is hosted by Moth Executive Producer, Sarah Austin Jenness. The Moth Radio Hour is produced by The Moth and Jay Allison from Atlantic Public Media.
Storytellers:
Tiq Milan keeps an important secret from his mother.
Amelia Zirin-Brown is caught between her hippie upbringing and being one of the cool girls.
Doug Wright becomes penpals with kindred spirit, John Boy from The Waltons.
Podcast # 928
Transcript 0:14 Speaker 00 This is The Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Jenness. At this point in The Moth's history, we've featured over 60,000 stories on stages around the world. Moth storytellers come from all reaches of society: farmers, plumbers, astronauts, teachers, voodoo priestesses, firefighters, people who have never been onstage before The Moth, and people who are famous for their work onstage. The three storytellers in this episode all have recognition for their artistry onstage. Our first teller, Teek Millan, is known for speaking all around the world, advocating
0:57 Speaker 00 for the most vulnerable of us, and his TED Talk has 3 million views and counting. He told this new story with us on the Walter Kerr stage in New York City when The Moth had its first night on Broadway. Here's Teek Millan.
1:19 Speaker 01 I was my mother's fourth daughter. The first she had when she was 15 years old. Years later, one of my sisters had a baby at 15 years old. So when I was 15 and I sat my mother down at the kitchen table, I knew exactly what she thought I was going to tell her. I said, "Mommy, I gotta tell you something." She said, "Aw, shit." I said, "Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. I'm not pregnant, I'm gay." She was shocked. She was shocked, but she got over it quickly and she became one of my fiercest allies. I remember seeing her when I'd be marching in the Pride Parade in my hometown of Buffalo, New York, she'd be on the sidelines, her and her younger sister Stella, waving their
2:04 Speaker 01 rainbow flags, drinking their wine coolers, having a good time. We grew really close. Particularly when I moved here to New York City in my twenties to start my adult life. I really needed her so much. I needed her for everything. I called her every day and twice on Saturdays. To help me make decisions about decorating my apartment. To help me make decisions about school, about my beginnings of my career. I would tell her all about the beautiful women that I was meeting and I was dating, but I didn't tell her that I was their boyfriend. My mother was a nurse for over forty years. So I caught a case of the sniffles. I'm calling her to ask her what tablets to take. But I didn't call and tell her that I was taking a half cc of testosterone every two weeks.
2:48 Speaker 01 I didn't tell her I was transgender. But she knew something was up. So one day I'm at work and she calls me. She said, "Tikaboo," that was her pet name for me. She said, "Tikaboo, I hate to call you at work, but I just got to ask you this question. I just got to get this off my chest." I said, "Mommy, what's up?" She said, "Why you got to be so mannish? Why can't you be a soft butch like Ellen DeGeneres?" I said, "Cause I'm not Ellen, Ma, okay?" She says, "You know what? I should have never allowed this. I should have never accepted you. I should have never accepted you. What would have happened if I had never accepted you?" I said, "Well, Ma, I still would have been me. I just would have been me without a mother." And she thought about it for a minute and she said, "Well,
3:33 Speaker 01 you ain't got enough good sense to do anything without me, so I guess I'll stick around." "Thank you." So we laughed and went on about our conversation. But I didn't take that opportunity to tell her because I was scared. My mother had really had high expectations of me. And she used to say, "I'm raising you to be better than me." And I thought that me being trans meant that I was failing at that. And as a transgender person, one of the things that we risk is we risk losing everybody in this life that we thought loved us in order for us to find ourselves. And I was not ready to lose my mother. I just needed her too much and I just loved her too much. So I kept it a secret. I didn't tell her for years. And our relationship definitely took a hit.
4:18 Speaker 01 It was a strain on our relationship because I'm from Buffalo. So I would just go back and forth, just visit like four or five times a year. I stayed for a week at a time. But during these years, I would only go home maybe once to stay for a couple of days. And it wasn't sustainable. It wasn't sustainable particularly because now my transition is progressing. And now it's time for me to have surgery. And I still had no plans to tell her. And my girlfriend at the time looked at me and she said, "You are crazy. You and your mother are best friends. You talk to her every day. She's a nurse. She will never forgive you if you don't tell her that you are about to have major surgery." So I was like, "All right, I'm gonna tell her." So one day I call her. I said, "Mommy." She said, "What's up?" I said, "I got something to tell you." She said, "What is it?"
5:03 Speaker 01 And this is exactly how it came out to her. I said, "Ma, I am having a double mastectomy, a chest reconstruction. I'm a man." She said, "What the fuck?" So she's like hyperventilating on the phone, right? So I said, "Listen, mommy, I'm having surgery and I'm having surgery in three days. And I would love for you to be here for me, but if you can't, I understand." And she said, "Just get off my phone and let me think. Just get off my phone." Click, and she hung up on me. And she hung up. And I didn't hear from her. So the day of my surgery comes around and I'm all prepped and ready for surgery, getting ready to get wheeled in. The door opens up and guess who it is? It's my mom, Miss Mary.
5:48 Speaker 01 And here she comes and she has this plush Ralph Lauren robe. And she has a jar full of chocolates covered in blue foil. And she has a little blue plush little teddy bear for me. And she was there with me the entire time I was in surgery and during recovery. So I got discharged and we go back to her favorite hotel, which is the Marriott Marquis here in Times Square.
6:13 Speaker 01 And we're kinda just hanging out in the hotel room and I look over and she's crying. And I said, "Ma, why are you crying?" And she said, "Because it feels like my daughter died."
6:24 Speaker 01 And that was one of the hardest things I've ever heard. But I understood it because my transition wasn't just mine alone. I went from being a daughter to a son. I went from being the little sister to the baby brother, from the favorite auntie to the favorite uncle. So I grabbed my mother's hand and I looked in her eyes and I said, "Mommy, I'm yours and you're still mine." And everything that you've taught me, all the memories that we have made as mother and daughter, have informed me and fortified me as a man that I am today.
6:55 Speaker 01 And we laughed and we cried and we talked. And I think it was in that moment when she really started to understand me and accept me as her son. But it wasn't necessarily a smooth transition. She kept messing up my name. She kept messing up my pronouns. And so one day I called her and I said, "Mama, look, I'm not coming home anymore. I'm not coming home to visit if you can't get my pronouns right and you can't get my name right." Because not only is it humiliating, okay, it's unsafe. You could be putting me in a really unsafe position when you do this. She said, "Oh, my God, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I'll be better." I said, "All right, get it together." So a few days later, she calls me. And she said, "Oh, Tika Boom, you'd be so proud of your mother. You'd be so proud of me." I said, "Why, mommy? What's going on?"
7:40 Speaker 01 She said, "Because I've been practicing.
7:43 Speaker 01 Me and Stella been role-playing, practicing your name and your pronouns. You'd be so proud of your mother." And I said, "Mama, I'm always so proud of you." And she said, "Oh, I just love you." And I said, "I love you too." And we went on in conversation the way we had always done.
8:02 Speaker 01 So, June 2014. I get a phone call from my mom.
8:09 Speaker 01 And this time, she is hysterical crying, hysterical.
8:13 Speaker 01 And I said, mommy, what's going on? And she said, baby, you got to come home right now. You got to come home right now. And I said, mama, I'm coming home on the 19th. And she said, baby, I'm not going to be here on the 19th. Because the cancer has mushroomed throughout my entire body. The tumors in my lungs and in my backs are bigger. The initial tumor in my breasts, you gotta get home right now. Now, we knew mommy had a cancer diagnosis, but I don't think we knew it was that bad. So I got on the first thing smoking back home. Now, by the time I get home, my mother's in hospice, in and out of consciousness. And one of my sisters is there. And she sees me and she says, Teak is here, here she is. Teak is here, she finally made it. Here she is, Teak is here.
8:58 Speaker 01 My mother slowly opened up her eyes and she whispered, "He." And that was one of the last words she spoke. So over the next couple of days, the family, we had it set up so that she was never alone. Right, we all took a shift. And I had the morning shift. So, one morning I come in, and it's pretty obvious that we're reaching the end now. Every breath she take is so labored. Her whole body moves.
9:35 Speaker 01 And there's this loud gurgle with every breath that just fills the room. So I come up to her hospital bed and I take the guardrail down. And I get in bed with her, just like I used to when I was a little kid. And I put my head on her shoulder. And I put my lips to her ear. And I said, mama, you could go. I said, it is okay. I promise you, I'm gonna be okay. You did such a good job raising me. You can go. And then I fell asleep. Fell asleep, right there. And when I woke up, the room was silent. And my champion had died right there in my arms.
10:17 Speaker 01 I tell you, there are no words to express how devastating that was for me. The sun still doesn't shine as bright anymore. And I was really lost. Because my mother, she was my moral compass. She was my guiding light. She was the only person in this world who could check me. So I'm like, who's going to check me now? And as I processed my grief over time, and really self-reflected on this idea that she was raising me to be better than her. In actuality, it wasn't about me being better than her. She was raising me to live in this world without her. And not only am I living, but I am thriving because I am the man that she raised. Thank you.
11:08 Speaker 00 That was Teek Millan.
11:12 Speaker 00 Teek says he's a diehard Buffalo Bills fan and a mama's boy. He told this story with us all over the world, and it's also included in The Moth's bestselling anthology, A Point of Beauty. Teek is an advocate for equity and inclusion, and he credits The Moth for being an integral part of his development as an artist and a speaker.
11:36 Speaker 01 Every time I get offstage, people come to me in tears, with hugs and celebration and in mourning of my dear, sweet mother. I've been able to submit her legacy and give thousands of people an example of unconditional love, and I know she's shining down and is so proud of her baby boy.
11:55 Speaker 00 To see photos of Teek and his mother, Miss Mary, after they saw the Broadway show Fences, and in Times Square hanging out with the naked cowgirl, go to our Radio Extras page at themoth.org.
12:18 Speaker 00 If this story makes you think of some of your own, tell us. You can find information on how to pitch us at themoth.org.
12:33 Speaker 00 After our break, a teenager on the coast of Oregon gets thrown into the world of Mean Girls when The Moth Radio Hour continues.
13:20 Speaker 02 The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.
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14:30 Speaker 00 This is the Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Jenness, and this episode features three artists famous for their work onstage. Our next storyteller is Amelia Zirin Brown. She goes by Rizzo. She's a world-renowned cabaret singer. The New York Times calls her shows, quote, "a fierce but kind-hearted fusion of comedy, burlesque, performance art, and rock and roll." Rizzo told this story at a Moth main stage in Portland, Oregon, where we partner with Literary Arts and Oregon Public Broadcasting. Here's Rizzo.
15:11 Speaker 04 I'm five years old, and we pull into Ona Beach State Park. And I dust off the sesame seeds from my halvo snack off of my favorite brown corduroy romper. It had patches and kind of an Elizabethan flair to it. And I'm trying to get some knots out of my hair, and I decide to just cover it up with my favorite raspberry beret, put it on a jaunty angle. And I go out into the clearing, and the moment I see these other five-year-old girls, I realize that they're really different from me. They were clean, number one, and I guess their hair was, like, what do you call it, brushed?
15:51 Speaker 04 And pulled back in these, like, tight ponytails with lots of plastic clips, and they were wearing shoes. And I felt like I should turn around. I didn't have my A-Team by my side, Amber Star and Aurora. I was all alone, but I soldiered through and got through the first day of the Brownies. I was raised by a group commonly referred to as hippies. But these weren't just any hippies. These were theater, dance, and art hippies who raised me, you know, basically with trust falls and mime.
16:32 Speaker 04 And it's not a great idea to be caught in a trust fall by a mime, by the way.
16:40 Speaker 04 But it was a really great idea to be raised by these people. They taught me I could be whatever I wanted to be. And my parents made, you know, Shakespeare in barns and Chekhov in basements. And, and my father made a life-size puppet of the Elephant Man that sat in our living room for too long and still frightens me. And I had my sisters, who were not my actual blood sisters, but my sisters Amber Star and Aurora by my side. We were raised together, breastfed together. We started modern dance when we were three. You know, it's important to do contractions at that age. And, and I had them by my side, but this summer, they were off traveling.
17:24 Speaker 04 And my parents thought it might be a good idea to socialize me with kids outside the community. And so there I was, with the thing underneath the Girl Scouts, which is called the Brownies. And I clocked Kristy and Mindy right away. They, yeah, they like looked so shiny. And they, the differences really unfolded when lunchtime came as all the other girls opened these space-age plastic cases with cartoon ponies and Care Bears on them and pulled out these sandwiches made from bread as white as clouds. Just spongy and uniform in shape.
18:08 Speaker 04 It looked like a drawn piece of bread. And on it, like condiments that looked like primary paint colors, so bright. And a luncheon meat of indiscriminate animal. It must have been a snake because it was so round.
18:24 Speaker 04 But the piece de resistance was the beverage. You see, they had this Mylar pouch with a picture of paradise on it.
18:37 Speaker 04 I watched as they peeled some sort of instrument of destruction off the back of the pouch. It must have been a spear of sorts, because they stabbed the belly of that beast and they drank its blood in glory.
18:49 Speaker 04 I wanted nothing more than to taste whatever this rainbow was. I saw their lunches and I thought, "It looked so fun, like a vacation made for kids." And for the first time, I looked at my own lunch with disappointment as I pulled out my sprouted flaxseed and millet bread
19:13 Speaker 04 out of, you know, a bag hand-sewn by my father, made from Guatemalan fabric. And the bread had "chumis" on it. "Chumis," you had to say that because it was it was so granular.
19:30 Speaker 04 It had been hand-pestilled, hand-pestilled by loud New York Jewish women. And I pulled out my beverage, which was a rusted mason jar, filled with cloudy apple juice that had separated during the day, so it was interactive.
19:48 Speaker 04 At the end of lunch, Kristi and Mindy, we had already decided wordlessly that they were the leaders of the group. They had came over to me with like, "The girls in The Shining, only more frightening."
19:59 Speaker 04 Hands held. They said, "Dirty girl." They didn't know my name yet.
20:05 Speaker 04 "Dirty girl, we were just wondering if you wanted this Capri Sun. Capri Sun, Capri Sun."
20:12 Speaker 04 It had a name. How did they know? They read my mind. I said, "Thank you so much." I bowed professionally. I grabbed it from their hands. I took the straw in my mouth.
20:22 Speaker 04 I judged it to the left and right. I couldn't... Deeper, I should try deeper.
20:29 Speaker 04 Nothing. Only Christie's expelled air. She had puffed it up to make it seem like there was a drink. And then Christie laughed. And Mindy laughed. And then all the Brownies laughed. And I laughed too. But when my mom picked me up, I cried. And I got through that week of Brownies somehow with my head down and quieter than I'd ever been. And then I got through elementary school with Breeze. I had Amber and Aurora by my side. You know, and still, we had this wild life where we would make this art and our parents would have cast parties where all of a sudden they would disappear in the middle of the party to have
21:14 Speaker 04 a meeting in the laundry room about herbs.
21:18 Speaker 04 And we had this life, but then we, you know, had each other. And we had this kind of secret life, but then I made it through elementary school and then middle school came. And the first day of middle school, I was at my locker and then down the hall, who do I see but the Capri Sun Duo? Christie and Mindy for the first time since then. They were walking, it seemed as if in slow motion, with their flaxen hair blowing. They were wearing guest jeans with zippers at the ankles, Keds, and a Spree sweatshirt, a Benetton sweatshirt, and Swatch watches on East Pritz. I was bowled over by their cookie cutter glamour.
22:02 Speaker 04 And that week also, a dare officer had come into our classroom. A police officer who said, "You know, kids, it'd be a great idea if you told me if you knew anyone who did drugs." And I remember so distinctly my mom sitting me down and saying, "Amelia." She said, "Amelia, we don't lie, but sometimes we admit or bend the truth." Like when we order you something off the children's menu and "Could you please stop correcting us and letting them know you're 12?" When you're on an airplane, if you're ever on an airplane, and someone asks you if you're Jewish, I want you to lie.
22:43 Speaker 04 And the third time is if an officer asks you if we are friends, smoke marijuana. By this time, you know we do. We just don't agree with the rest of the country. They think it should be illegal, and we use it to relax, just like they do their whiskey. So I had already learned that I had to hide parts of myself, to pick and choose what to expose, to fit in, to survive. And I was picking and choosing some things off of the wardrobe of Christie and Mindy. "Please, Mom, please, can I buy some guest jeans? Please," I begged, I begged for each little bit. And slowly through the year, even though Amber's mom, Nancy, suggested
23:26 Speaker 04 that perhaps we just buy one pair and cut off the little triangle and put a piece of Velcro and just share it.
23:35 Speaker 04 I collected all the pieces of clothing. And by 7th grade, I decided I was quitting dance and I was quitting theater because I was going to join the basketball team with Mindy and Christie. And midway through 7th grade, Mindy and Christie, at lunchtime, send one of their minions to me, Katie or Danny. You can see what kind of names you had to be, to be a leader here. And they said, "They want you to sit at lunch with them." Oh my God, my mom wanted to come. I was them. I sat down.
24:12 Speaker 04 And I realized really quickly the order of the day was to make fun of the other girls that were in 7th grade with us. And Christie said, "Ah, did you see what she's wearing? Oh my God." I mean, what is it? It has splatters of paint on it intentionally? I knew exactly who they were talking about. Aurora had been wearing this jacket made by a family friend named Becky, whose art was to throw paint at vintage clothing.
24:42 Speaker 04 I loved that jacket. It had puffy sleeves, a snatched waist. Mindy said, "Yeah, she's so weird. Did you see her glasses? What do you think, Amelia?" I took a sip of my milk.
24:56 Speaker 04 Yeah, she looks like she cuts her own bangs with craft scissors.
25:02 Speaker 04 They laughed, and I died inside.
25:07 Speaker 04 I had cut my own hair with her, with craft scissors, and I was selling myself out so hard. At the end of lunch, Mindy and Christie and Danny and whatever her freaking name was, they started picking up speed. They were like running, running fast through the breezeway. We were running from some boys, but then they picked up some intentional speed, and then they took a quick right into the library and a quick left through the computer room. And I was just trying to catch up. I wasn't as athletic as they were. And I, I just saw out the window of the computer room that they had gone into the girls' bathroom. And I took a breath, and I slowly, as quietly as I could, entered the bathroom.
25:52 Speaker 04 And I heard them, they were huddled in the disabled toilet. And they were saying, "Did we ditch her? Do you think we finally ditched her?" They were talking about me, and, oh my God, what a gift. What a gift to be given so clearly and so young, that I had built this house on sand. And I stood back, I went and searched out Aurora. I found her, I hugged her as tight as I could. I didn't tell her this story, and I still haven't told her the story until now.
26:24 Speaker 04 And, and then I, I, for the first time, really felt the joy and the gift that all these adults that had raised me had given by modeling their genuine and expressive selves. And I walked into high school wearing combat boots and a goodwill dress with Aurora and Amber by my side. The A-Team was back. And I carried on that joy. And seriously, this is what happens when you tell a child they can be whatever they want to be. I went into a life of a niche world of cabaret, where I melded songs and stories through the portal of glamour with the greatest wish that somebody in the audience
27:07 Speaker 04 is going to be inspired to let their light shine through whatever normative cracks have held them back.
27:16 Speaker 04 Thank you.
27:25 Speaker 00 That was Amelia Zirin Brown, AKA Rizzo. She's a performance artist, comedian, singer, composer, and actor. She also has a Grammy for her collaboration with Yo-Yo Ma. She travels the world with her original pieces that fuse storytelling, audience experiments, and powerful vocals. And she lives in a bungalow of love and glitter with her partner Nicholas and son Tennyson. Rizzo is still friends with Aurora. She told her a version of this story before it went on stage, and they both cried on the phone. Rizzo says, "It's such a beautiful gift to have friends that you shared your early years with. It also lends a vulnerability that's a little frightening, too.
28:09 Speaker 00 Our shared childhood was idyllic in so many ways, but it was definitely not perfect. It's amazing to have these women, who I traveled through every stage of my life with, still in my orbit."
28:31 Speaker 00 Rizzo was the last to tell her story at this Moth main stage in Portland, Oregon. And as our host, John Good, wrapped up the night, Rizzo stepped offstage, did a quick change into a sequined onesie. The stage lights dimmed and changed color. And she came back out and sang Leonard Cohen's "How the Light Gets In", which was our show's theme for the night. It was perfect, and here's a little of that now.
28:59 Speaker 05 All the wars, they will be fought again. The holy dove, she will be caught again. She will be bought and sold and bought again. The dove is never free. So ring the bells, they still can ring. Forget your perfect offerings. There is a crack, a crack in everything. That's how the light gets in.
29:39 Speaker 05 We asked for signs, the signs were sent. The birth betrayed, the marriage spent. Oh, the widowhood of every government, a sign for all to see. I won't run no more with that fallen crowd. While the killers in high places say their prayers out loud. Oh, but they've summoned up, they've summoned up a thundercloud, and they're gonna hear from me. Ring the bells, the still can ring.
30:22 Speaker 00 To see the video of this closing act and to find where Rizzo is performing next, go to themoth.org and look for the extras for this episode.
30:29 Speaker 05 Crack in everything, that's how the light gets in.
30:34 Speaker 00 After our break, a boy in Texas gets himself a famous television pen pal when The Moth Radio Hour continues.
30:42 Speaker 05 Strike up the drum, there will be no march. To every heart, every heart, love will come. But like a refugee, ring the bells, it still can ring. Forget your perfect offerings. There's a crack, a crack in everything, that's how the light gets in.
31:14 Speaker 02 The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts.
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33:16 Speaker 00 You're listening to the Moth Radio Hour. I'm Sarah Austin Jenness. Doug Wright, our final storyteller, won a Pulitzer Prize in Drama for writing, I Am My Own Wife. I remember seeing this on Broadway in 2003, and it remains one of my favorite pieces of theater ever. The show also won the Tony for Best Play. Turns out Doug is a listener of The Moth, and he's wanted to share a story with us for some time. How cool. I, though, found it a little daunting to give story notes to a famed story writer, but Doug loved the process. I talked with Doug in the green room before he took the stage in East Hampton. Doug, how do you feel before going on?
33:58 Speaker 07 Oh, a little anxious. It's always a little nerve-wracking.
34:03 Speaker 00 Is it fun to tell? Do you, I mean, it's just a little piece of you.
34:08 Speaker 07 It's great fun to tell. And as someone who writes as my profession, and it's such a solitary activity, you can get jealous of the actors onstage. And so it's my little 10 minutes when I get to do a tiny play. And that's kind of thrilling for me. So it's a pleasure.
34:29 Speaker 00 Looking forward to hearing it. And with that, here's Doug Wright, live at The Moth in East Hampton, New York, when we partnered with Guildhall.
34:40 Speaker 07 So it's 1974, Dallas, Texas. I'm 11 years old, and I'm sitting on this mustard-colored couch. And my eyes are glued to a 19-inch Sony Trinatron. Good night, Grandpa. Good night, Mary Ellen. Good night, Jim Bob. Good night, John Boy. My siblings and I are each allowed one hour of television per week because my staunch Presbyterian mother thinks that if we watch too much, we'll have brain rot or go sterile.
35:23 Speaker 07 My older brother has chosen Star Trek. My younger sister, Donnie and Marie. But Thursdays are my big night because I've chosen The Waltons, the tale of a Depression-era family eking it out in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia. In truth, I'm a little obsessed with The Waltons' eldest child, John Boy.
35:53 Speaker 07 He's got this shock of blonde hair, and this really sensitive face, and this sexy mole on his cheek, almost like a beauty mark. And he's not very good at farming. He does not like to hunt. He's a writer. In fact, the entire series, The Waltons, was based on a bunch of books by a man named Earl Hamner. And as a kid, I tore through those books. And one of them even contained the recipe for John Boy's favorite cake. It was an applesauce spice cake with whiskey frosting.
36:38 Speaker 07 And for years, I insisted to my mother that that was my definitive birthday cake. I knew that I had to get in touch with John Boy, or at least the actor who played him. So I went to the dime store, and I got one of those big chief writing pads, like the one he had on the show. And I sat down to write him a letter. And in it, I told him everything. I told him about my theater classes, and I told him that I wrote stories too, but they were secret for my eyes only. Because in them, I wrote about all of my failings,
37:21 Speaker 07 that I was probably too sensitive for a boy, that the other kids at school called me sissy, and that most days ended getting beaten up at the bike racks or at the lockers. And I thought he might understand, because he was sensitive too. Maybe he even wrote for the same reason.
37:45 Speaker 07 That letter was 22 pages long.
37:52 Speaker 07 I finally found a manila envelope large enough for it, but I still needed stamps. Now, my dad was a retired marine, and I wasn't sure he'd be too thrilled if he knew his son was writing mash notes to a male ingenue on television. So I snuck into his study, which was strictly off limits, and I went to his stamp dispenser, and I just start pulling roll after roll after roll. I plaster this manila envelope with them, and on the way to school, I put it in the mailbox. And then I wait. And a week passes. Then two weeks. A month.
38:37 Speaker 07 I get during that time maybe a copy of Boy's Life, a birthday invitation. And then, one day, curled up in the mailbox like a scroll, an envelope with the return address, Laura Marr Studios, Burbank. I tore it open. "Dear Doug, thank you for your letter. I'm grateful you are a fan of the show. Please keep watching. Best, Richard Thomas."
39:18 Speaker 07 Terse, I know, but to me it was poetry.
39:27 Speaker 07 Best of all, he had included a photograph. He's wearing this sort of jaunty knit cap, and I can still see that blonde hair and that sensitive face and that signature mole. And I know I have to do something really special with this picture. So this time, I sneak into my dad's dresser. And I pull open a drawer, and there are all his business shirts, crisp and white, lined up in perfect formation. And I reach in, and I pull out the cardboard that the dry cleaner uses to keep them from wrinkling. And I take a bunch of that, and I run back to my room, and I cut it in the shape of a frame. And I build a little stand for the frame.
40:12 Speaker 07 And then with watercolors, I paint all these little Model T Fords all around the edge of the frame, like the Waltons used to drive. And I put John Boy's picture right in it. And I put it on my nightstand. And the next morning at breakfast, my dad is like, "What the hell is going on? Why are my shirts wrinkled? Where the fuck are my stamps?"
40:38 Speaker 07 But I keep mum, because John Boy and I are really, I figure, friends now. We're pen pals. And I keep writing him. And even more remarkably, he writes me back. Now, it's true, the letters become shorter. "Dear Doug, thanks, Richard."
41:02 Speaker 07 But he keeps enclosing a new and different photo. So more photos mean more cardboard frames. And pretty soon, my bedroom is becoming a shrine to John Boy Walton. He's on the windowsill. He's on the dresser. He's on my nightstand. Now, this doesn't thrill my older brother, with whom I actually share the room.
41:33 Speaker 07 So he says to me one day, "What's the matter with you? Are you in love with him or something?" And I say, "No. He's my hero, and a lot of people put their heroes on the wall." And my brother says, "Yeah, maybe Farrah Fawcett or Joe Namath, but John Boy Walton?"
41:53 Speaker 07 And I'm like, "You don't understand." And pretty soon, he starts waging passive-aggressive war. And he takes his model planes, and he hangs them from the ceiling of our bedroom. So our room becomes this blizzard of Hellcats and B-52s, all aiming right for John Boy, like they want to take him out.
42:16 Speaker 07 So, uh, finally, a couple of years pass, and I'm no longer feeling quite so freakish. And I'm actually starting to make friends in the drama club and on the literary magazine. And I decide I want to invite them over to my house, like they invite me to theirs. And a little voice in me says that this photo montage of mine might spell social suicide.
42:47 Speaker 07 More than anything, I think I worried that it revealed more about me than I had yet admitted to myself. So, one day impulsively, I tore down all the pictures of John Boy. I put them in a shoebox, and I shoved it far under my bed. It was a burial of sorts, a kind of denial, I think. So, four decades pass, and I actually become a writer, just like John Boy. And I'm a very fortunate one. I've had plays on Broadway, and I've written some movies. Uh, so it's going pretty well.
43:29 Speaker 07 And I'm about as far out of the closet as you can be.
43:35 Speaker 07 I live in the ultimate gabor-hood, Chelsea. And I have two cats. And I have a husband. And, uh, my husband, David, and I got married in 2008, at the very height of the culture wars.
43:54 Speaker 07 And like a lot of people at the time, we got sucked into a wildly unproductive debate on Facebook with this anti-gay marriage zealot named Diane.
44:08 Speaker 07 Diane would write, "Do what you want, but please don't call it marriage, and whatever you do, it doesn't belong in the church." And I'd hear that, and I'd write in a fury, "Diane, your opinion is mean-spirited and ill-informed." And she'd write, "Well, all my gay friends know that's how I feel, and they still love me." And I'd write, "Well, that's because they're a bunch of self-hating assholes." So this went on and on. And my friend said, "Stop it, it's not going anywhere useful." But I kept egging her on.
44:47 Speaker 07 So, not long after that, this producer friend calls me. And she says, "So I'm commissioning gay playwrights to write short plays on the theme of gay marriage. And we're gonna put them up commercially at the Minnetonka Lane Theater in the West Village. And would you be interested in contributing one?" And I thought, "Well, this is perfect. I don't have to write a new play. I'm just gonna adapt this Facebook thread."
45:18 Speaker 07 And the way I figure, the characters are gonna be me, my husband David, and our nemesis Diane.
45:28 Speaker 07 So I adapt the thread as a dialogue, and I send it to the producer, and she quite likes it. So it goes into the evening. I'm delighted. The casting director calls me and says, "You're gonna be thrilled. For the role of Diane, we have this Broadway Tony winner, Beth Level. She's gonna be simply amazing. And your boyfriend, your husband, he's gonna be really thrilled because he's been played by a true hunk, Kelly Ripa's husband, Mark Consuelos.
46:02 Speaker 07 And in the role of Doug, how would you feel about Richard Thomas?"
46:13 Speaker 07 You probably know him best as John Boy Walton.
46:20 Speaker 07 Oh, I say, I think he might be very good.
46:29 Speaker 07 So, the first rehearsal is coming up. The night before, I cannot sleep at all. I'm planning it in my mind, how I'm gonna walk in there so cool, so relaxed. Every inch the professional playwright. I'm gonna greet each and every actor, and then take my seat and listen to the read-through. I walk in, it's a sort of blonde rehearsal room, there's a circle of chairs for the cast, there's this craft services table in the middle with morning pastries and coffee. And there is Richard Thomas.
47:12 Speaker 07 He's older, his hair is gray now, but he still has that really sensitive face and that mole.
47:21 Speaker 07 And I walk up to him, and I had barely gotten my name out, before the entire story pours out of me like an avalanche.
47:36 Speaker 07 So I'm standing there, beet red, waiting for his response. And he says, "Doug, I really wish I could tell you that I remember that 22-page letter, but I don't. And the reason I don't is a lot of young men wrote me, asking for reassurance. Because it was the 70s, the era of Kojak and the Million Dollar Man, and I was the only male lead in a primetime TV show who didn't carry a gun. I held a pen and used it to express my feelings.
48:20 Speaker 07 And I had no notable love interests on the show. And people often accused me of being sensitive."
48:32 Speaker 07 So your voice was one of many reaching out to me at the time. And I want you to know why I chose to do your play. My son is gay, and I want him to grow up in a better world, where he doesn't have to reach out to strangers on the television for approval.
49:05 Speaker 07 And I said, "Stop it, Richard. I'm gonna fall in love with you all over again."
49:14 Speaker 07 So, uh, it's been almost, uh, four decades now. And as a writer, I've sort of found a niche for myself, writing about outsiders, uh, those, uh, people who don't readily fit into society's confines. Uh, I wrote about a, uh, trans person in Germany, and I wrote about a comedian's struggling with mental illness. And more often than not, I'm writing to kind of exercise my own perceived frailties. Uh, my insecurities, my self-doubts, my darkest fears,
49:55 Speaker 07 all those things that I think alienate me from the rest of the species. And ironically, I find by naming those, it's how I find community. In a lot of ways, I think I'm still that 11-year-old kid, crying out in the dark, eager for approval and reassurance that he has a rightful place in the human sphere. So, good night, John Boy. Thanks.
50:38 Speaker 00 That was Doug Wright. Doug is an award-winning playwright and screenwriter. He's a recovering Texan and currently lives in New York City with his husband, singer-songwriter David Clement, and their two felines, Glenys and Murray. Doug occasionally runs into Richard Thomas in New York theater circles. He says, "I've visited him backstage, post-show, and we've gossiped together in the aisle of our neighborhood Home Depot." To see photos of Doug and his husband David around the world and at The Moth Ball, our annual gala, go to themoth.org. These stories are all from artists, but moth stories come from everyone: nurses, pilots,
51:21 Speaker 00 arborists, hot-dog-eating champions, scientists, dog walkers, introverts, dreamers, really everyone. Consider telling your story at The Moth. We want to hear from you. Find an open-mic story slam through our website, themoth.org, and please share this episode with a friend you think would love The Moth and these stories. You can find us on social media, too. We're on Facebook @themoth and on Instagram @mothstories. That's it for this episode of The Moth Radio Hour. We hope you'll join us next time.
52:14 Speaker 02 This episode of The Moth Radio Hour was produced by me, Jay Allison, and Sarah Austin Genes, who also hosted and directed the stories in the show. An extended interview with Sarah and Rizzo is available at themoth.org on the Radio Extras page. Our co-producer is Vicky Merrick, associate producer Emily Couch. The rest of The Moth's leadership team includes Sarah Haberman, Christina Norman, Jennifer Hickson, Kate Tellers, Marina Clujay, LeAnn Gully, Suzanne Rust, Sarah Jane Johnson, and Patricia Urenia.
52:49 Speaker 02 Moth stories are true as remembered and affirmed by the storytellers. For extras related to all of these stories, just go to themoth.org. Our theme music is by The Drift. Other music in this hour from Tom McDermott and Evan Christopher, Yo-Yo Ma and Dave Brubeck, Erasmo Patranga, Jerry Goldsmith, and Geek Music. We receive funding from the National Endowment for the Arts. The Moth Radio Hour is produced by Atlantic Public Media in Woods Hole, Massachusetts. Special thanks to our friends at Odyssey, including executive producer Leah Reese Dennis. For more about our podcast, for information on pitching its own story, and to learn more about The Moth, go to our website, themoth.org.
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