Stop Letting One Person Control Every Conversation

Some conversations test your patience. Others test your character. In this call-in episode, I answer your questions about staying calm when emotions run high, setting boundaries with the people you love, handling conflict with confidence, and responding without losing yourself. We talk about how to handle a spouse who won't stop talking, how to tell your friends you hate texting and want them to call you instead, what to do when a parent refuses to use your chosen name, how to navigate political disagreements with family, and whether it's wrong to expect financial help from a wealthy sibling. Leave me a voicemail to be featured on the show! https://www.jeffersonfisher.com/ask-jefferson Join me on Supercast for ad-free episodes, bonus content, and AMAs: https://jefferson.supercast.com/ Order The Next Conversation Workbook: https://www.jeffersonfisher.com/workbook Want a FREE communication tip each week? Click here to join my newsletter. https://www.jeffersonfisher.com/newsletter Thank you to our sponsors: Pendulum: Go to https://pendulumlife.com/jefferson and use code JEFFERSON for up to 20% off your first order. Gusto: Go to https://gusto.com/jefferson and use code JEFFERSON to get three months free when you run your first payroll. BetterHelp. Click https://betterhelp.com/jeffersonfisher for a discount on your first month of therapy. Like what you hear? Don’t forget to subscribe and leave a 5-star review! Order my new book, The Next Conversation, today! https://www.jeffersonfisher.com/book Suggest a topic or ask a question for me to answer on the show! https://www.jeffersonfisher.com/topic **Chapters:** 0:00 How to Handle a Spouse Who Talks Too Much 6:40 How to Tell Friends You Hate Texting 12:15 When Your Parent Refuses to Use Your Name 21:13 Navigating Political Disagreements With Family 28:45 Expecting Financial Help From a Wealthy Sibling Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

  I kind of snuck out to ask you a secret question because my husband gets hurt about this, but he talks so much, like he just won't like stop talking. And I feel like the only way I can say anything is to interrupt him. He's sweet. He's the honey. He just is one of those people that doesn't pause. And one thing leads to the next. I don't know how to have like a back and forth conversation with him. We've been married 26 years, Jefferson. But what do I do? Like, he doesn't even have awareness of how he's controlling the entire conversation because he just won't stop talking. And if I say anything and I interrupt, he says, wait, I'm still talking. Wait till I finish. And it's driving me crazy. Help me. I love him.

• 1:13Speaker 01

  I don't not love him, but it makes it very fatiguing to have a one-way conversation every time we talk. Thanks, Jefferson. How do I know if you answer?

• 1:24Speaker 02

  You know, if I answer when I say this right here. Hey, Michelle. Michelle, y'all been married 26 years and just now you found this out? Like, you've been, you knew this since the day I've been dating. You've been together 26 years and just now? You're saying he talks so much? You knew this. You knew this. This is part of also why you love him. Imagine if he was the opposite for a second. Imagine if he was the opposite and you, he was like pulling teeth. He wouldn't be the same person. You wouldn't love him as much. All right? So know that that's part of his personality. And most likely, it's very akin to like one of his, one of his parents, right? Probably somebody, one of his mom or dad, was also very talkative because it's,

• 2:07Speaker 02

  it's one of those inherited communication traits is talking so much. They don't know when to stop. Okay, what can you do? There are some practical things that you could do. One is we're going to do this in a spirit of love. You already told me many times you love this man. I love that. We're going to do this in a spirit of love. That means when you need to interrupt him, when you need to interrupt him because he's talking way too long, I need you to have a little bit of a smile on your face as if you're saying this in love, playfully. Maybe it's like you called him a honey. Maybe you need to, you can either use his name or use some other kind of affection name. So if his name was, I don't know.

• 2:51Speaker 02

  Let's just say, um, Joe. I need you to be Joe, right? I need you to be playful a little bit. Use his name. Or if it's honey, sweetie, anything, mi amor, whatever it is. Hey, be able to do that, okay? What it does is going to get him to stop just for a second.

• 3:16Speaker 02

  Listen to me. Don't wait for a pause in the conversation because it ain't coming. Okay? So even if these mid-sinits, if it's gotten to a point where you can't really take it anymore, I need you to go ahead and interrupt and insert that right there. Okay? Now, if it is something that he has shared before and he's repeating it, it's okay for you to say, hey, I, you probably may not remember. You did tell me this before. I have heard this, right? It's good for them to know because they're obviously, they're not remembering that. Or if you need to, what I like to say is,

• 4:01Speaker 02

  hey, I need the headline first. Meaning, get me to the top of the story. Because right now, like a newspaper, you have me on page, you know, at the bottom it says, see page 3F. And you got me way back there. I need you to give me to the top of the story here. And so what I like to say is, can I get the, I need the headline. I need the headline. Or I think one thing would be great. I would love to see this with you and your honey, all right? Is three, make a plan.

• 4:39Speaker 02

  Truly, have a conversation with him that says, hey, you know I love you. You love me, don't you? And he's going to say, yes. There are times that you know, and I know, that you use way more words. You're pretty, you use, that you love words. We know you love a lot of words. And sometimes my cup of your words gets full. And once it's full, I can't hear anything else. And I know I want to hear what you have to say, but I can't, I can't hear anymore. So to make sure that you and I can communicate well, what will be helpful for me in this relationship? To communicate to you, to let you know,

• 5:24Speaker 02

  hey, we might need to taper this off. Because most likely, when people talk so much, they just don't know how to land the plane. So they just keep, keep it in the air because they really don't know how to land it. And so they will just continue to, to talk. Create it as a fun process in game where it's lighthearted, where you say, hey, what, what can I do? What can I say? And maybe you create a code word where it's, you know, I don't know, I'm going to go crazy here. Maybe it's you just say, hey, bongos. Like, come up with a name, okay? That is goofy enough, playful enough, that you're not offending him, you're not cutting him off.

• 6:07Speaker 02

  And you're also having to stand your ground and say, this is getting too much for me. For him to know, it's a word that y'all have agreed to, to say, you got to wrap it up. Here's, there's the countdown. You got, you got five more seconds, 10 more seconds to get this thought done. Maybe he's a sports guy and you go, hey, shot clock started. Like, you need to be able to, to count this down to know he has a time at the end of it. That's what I would go with because it sounds like you have a beautiful relationship. Keep that, maintain that. Don't overthink this. Say it. He already knows he's using a lot of words. So ask him, involve him in the process of, hey, what can I do that's going to save my sanity? That's going to allow me to say, hey, you've, you've, you've filled up the top of the cup. It's now overflowing. I'm not really hearing anything.

• 6:52Speaker 02

  And if anything, it's making me more aggravated. Give me, what's, what's the headline here? Hey, shot clock's down to 10, right? Even, you can just be as playful as you want. That's the key takeaway. Be playful with it.

• 7:05Speaker 03

  Hi, my name is Molly. In my generation, I feel like everyone just texts all the time. And I do not like texting. I expressed that to someone and they still just text. And I wanted to ask you, is there a better way to approach that conversation? Or is it just you can't change people? And that's just the way they are. And that's just not my person.

• 7:24Speaker 02

  Hey, Molly, I lied to you.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  Here's what I need you to know. One, texting is communication. So I need you to see at a base level that people are wanting to communicate with you. I agree on, it's not your favorite mode of communication. Wasn't that long ago that texting didn't exist? And people still figured out how to communicate, right? So I, I hear you on that. Two, my, my hope would be, and when you hear this response, that you would soften your approach a little bit to texting because there's a practicality of where we're at right now of this is the norm and the default, how people first connect with one another.

• 8:10Speaker 02

  Three, that being said, you are absolutely within your right to say, you know what? I'm not really a texter. I'd much prefer just to call you. And our communication, if you think of me, call me. And don't worry about text to me. Texting's not my favorite. Call me and I call you. You have that ability. And I kind of love that. There is a place, and you know this, when texting is not enough, you have to hear human voice, to hear their words, to see them in front of you, to feel that warmth, right? You can't, you can't feel the warmth of a smile

• 8:55Speaker 02

  the same way you can in the smile of an emoji. It doesn't hit the same. So when you feel like, hey, this is somebody who matters to me a lot. And maybe it's dating, maybe it's a friend or whatever it is. And you, and you voice that to them that says, hey, I am, the way I do friendships, I do not text. I would much prefer, you call me. You call me. And if I don't answer the call, leave me a voicemail. That's, I'm old school that way. That's, this is how I handle it. And if they can't respect that, then they are not your people. Right? Then, then there are people who will say, you know what? It's worth it to me. I care enough about you to say,

• 9:40Speaker 02

  if I want to communicate with you, this is what I need to do. Yeah, you're worth it. Then hear me, you're worth that. If that's your requirement for communication and friendship and relationship, you are worth that. And what's the cost? A phone call? What's the cost to them? If, if you are not worth picking up the phone and hearing your voice.

• 10:03Speaker 02

  Then, my goodness, how in the world would ever the friendship be worth it to them? You are worth picking up the phone and hearing your voice. And if that is how you communicate, one, I kind of applaud you in that sense. To say, hey, I really care about this, this type of deep connection. I need that. I need that in my life. You know what, probably? I need more of that, too. I need more of that, personally, me, Jefferson. I need more of that in my own life. Where we get so quick, day in and day out, and we only communicate by text. And if we just call that person. So maybe you've, you've done something and aroused something to somebody else listening to this and say, you know what? I've been relying too much on text. I need to, I need to call my friend.

• 10:48Speaker 02

  Anybody, for those of you who know what it's like in your life, when a friend just randomly calls on you, just calls out of the blue. And they go, no, I just wanted to see how you're doing. Just thought of you, wanted to call and hear your voice. It's, it's like just a full ray of sunshine hits your face. Like you just feel like somebody cared about you. So I want you to know, yes, you are absolutely entitled to want that, to need that, to say, this is my requirement in relationships and friendships. I don't do text. I don't do text. If all these places and shopping places can say, hey, we're cashless, you can be textless.

• 11:30Speaker 02

  You know, I mean, like, my goodness, just say, I'm a, I'm a textless, uh, I'm a textless romantic. How about that? We'll go, we'll go with that. I love it. You stick with that. And the people who don't want to do that, you're spot on. They're not your people. Before we keep going, I want to take a moment to tell you about Pendulum. I don't know about you, but when I have busy schedules, whether it's in summer or kids and school's back in session, I don't make all the best eating decisions. Have that afternoon crash, or maybe I'm trying to grab something salty or sugary or sweet. And I know that my diet's all over the place. Metabolic Daily by Pendulum has changed that for me. It's a little capsule that I take with food. And what it does is it helps as a prebiotic, make sure that my cravings don't come out

• 12:15Speaker 02

  of nowhere. So I stay fuller longer. I don't have sugar cravings. I sleep better, I have better energy, and it just helps my overall metabolism. Because if your gut's not right, then really nothing is right throughout the day. So you can go right now to pendulumlife.com/jefferson. Use the code Jefferson and get up to 20% off your first order. Pendulumlife.com/jefferson. Use the code Jefferson for 20% off. And now let's keep going.

• 12:40Speaker 04

  Hi, Jefferson. I'm a longtime follower of your advice on Instagram, and I'd love your perspective on something. My name is Asha. About 15 years ago, I legally changed my name because my birth name never felt like me. My current name is the name everyone knows me by, including my young daughter, and is deeply meaningful to me. The problem is that my mom still refuses to use it. She continues to call me by, by my birth name and even keeps that name in her phone. I understand that changing my name may have felt painful or even rejecting to her, and I've genuinely tried to have empathy for that. But it's been 15 years, and hearing my birth name still brings up a lot of difficult feelings for me.

• 13:22Speaker 04

  It's also becoming confusing for my daughter because she only knows me as Asha. I know I can't make someone change their name in their phone or choose to use my legal name, and I know how to communicate a boundary like, I need you to call me by my name. But where I get stuck is the consequence. I don't want a consequence to feel like a punishment or an ultimatum, but I also don't know how to protect myself when someone repeatedly refuses to acknowledge something as fundamental as my name. So my question is, how do I respond when someone who loves me refuses to recognize me as I am now?

• 14:03Speaker 04

  And where's the line between enforcing a healthy boundary and trying to control someone else's behavior? I really appreciate what you're doing. Thanks so much for your thoughts on this.

• 14:13Speaker 02

  Thank you, Asha, because that's your name. Asha, thank you. Where's the line between drawing a healthy boundary and using a boundary to control somebody else's behavior? The line is the intention behind it. Because you can use a boundary to try and manipulate, to try and, you know, be a hedge around, away from different kinds of behaviors that are both harmful or productive. Or is it out of, this is something that is protecting me?

• 14:53Speaker 02

  Because it sounds, Asha, that you're having a lot of pain associated with this, and I don't blame you. Everybody knows you by this name. Your daughter knows you by this name. And here, your mom is openly for 15 years refusing to accept that. I love that you're able to kind of step into her shoes for a second and say, hey, I can see that there's also a part of this that has to be kind of painful, that, that as part of choosing my name, I have somehow rejected that. And maybe she's feeling like, your mom feels like in the way you've rejected her by not wanting to have that name.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  There's also a place that both things can be true of, it's been 15 years, this is who everybody knows you as, it never felt the way to you. So how are we going to communicate this? I'm assuming that y'all have had a lot of conversations about this already. And I'm very, very curious about what her answer would be to the question of, what is it bringing up for you? What is preventing you from calling me by this name? What would, what does it mean to you when you call me, if, if you were to call me Asha instead of my given name?

• 16:18Speaker 02

  What would she have to admit to herself if she called you by the name that you go by now? Right? Because that's, that's her work. That's her work to deal with. When we talk about the boundaries level of it, here's what I need you to know, because I love that you say, I don't want to feel like a punishment. But a consequence is a consequence, Asha. If I were to continue to press the red button and the sign says, if you press the red button, you're going to have to, you know, leave the room. Well, that's, that's the consequence of it. There is, there is, it's math, right? It's how, there's inputs and there's outputs. And so by her choosing this path, she's also choosing the consequence.

• 17:02Speaker 02

  So that's, that's, that is nothing that, as you said, that you can control. So here, here's some practical takeaways that I would, I would give for this. One, I want you to see that taking a step away from this is your mother's choice not so much yours. In other words, you're willing to have an open relationship with her, a loving relationship with her. And here are the requirements for that. You are allowed to have requirements in a relationship, no matter if it's romantic, if it's friendship, if it's somebody you're related to, you are allowed, you have the right, the privilege of having requirements.

• 17:42Speaker 02

  And one requirement for you is that you use your given name. There's nothing more important to somebody than the sound of their own name, because it's, it's deep. It's how you identify who you are. I mean, there's a reason why my name isn't, you know, William, it's, it's Jefferson. And if my mom only wanted to call me William, I like to go by Jefferson. There's a point of that, it says that you might be, she might be rejecting me, and that might be how you're feeling. So how do we put this in terms of a boundary? I want you to understand that part of the consequence might need to be that you take some space away from each other. And I mean that.

• 18:26Speaker 02

  Maybe you've already tried that. The consequence could be, hey, I don't respond to that name. If you continue to call me by this name, then I need to take some distance away. Then I need to reevaluate our relationship. Then I need to take a pause, and I'll, I'll respond to you in a few weeks. You see how it's, it's more than just saying, please don't call me that? That's, that's not enough of a boundary. I need it to be much more assertive and conditional, meaning I, I, it's not you can't call me that, it's I, I don't respond to that name.

• 19:08Speaker 02

  If you, you hear the condition, if you continue to call me that, then, three, this is the consequence of saying, if you continue to do this, this is what you're going to get. It's, the choice is yours. Then I'm going to need to take some space, I'm going to need to reevaluate this relationship. You feel me? Now, where can we go from here? I want you to know that there is a time and place possibly for the conversation, for you to outline. Let's say you haven't addressed this with her, for you to say, this is very painful for me. And if you love me, then you, you don't want to cause me pain. Maybe there is somewhere where it's baby steps.

• 19:50Speaker 02

  And when she feels maybe more comfortable calling you something that's more akin to daughter or my love, or it's something that is, she can associate with you, that she's used maybe your, your whole life. My mom, my mom's always called me sweetie. Like something that is still a loving, endearing, meaningful term, that does not cause her the same level of, of pain. Because this stuff goes deep. This is, this is, this is, this is really deep stuff. So maybe there's a, a conversation that you can have around that. And three, what I need you to know is that when you make the consequence of a boundary

• 20:29Speaker 02

  conditional, it leaves it entirely in their hands to accept it or not accept it. And if they don't accept the boundary, then they are accepting the consequence of it, and that is not your fault. That is not punishment. Hear me. When you have a consequence to your boundary, it is not a punishment. You are doing exactly what you need to protect yourself. And it sounds like that's, it sounds like you have all the right tools at your disposal in, in place, Asha. So I would, one, reconsider how you put up the boundary. Two, leave the door open with questions over, what would it look like? What would it mean to you if you called me by the name that I go by now? What, what would that sound like to you?

• 21:14Speaker 02

  How would that feel to you? Rather than getting upset that she's not. So there's a lot of onion peeling that's gonna need to happen. And three, I need you to be okay with putting a very hard line consequence. That means distance, that means space for both of you to reevaluate, take some time, reconsider before the conversation comes back. That's what I would hope for the relationship between you and your mom. Great question.

• 21:44Speaker 05

  Hi Jefferson, my name is Carol. And my issue is mostly with my daughter, who's on the opposite side of the political field, to the point where she sometimes says I'm racist, which is really hard to hear. We try having a conversation. I try to use some of your tools so it doesn't escalate, but it gets difficult sometimes. And then we end up not talking about it because either of us don't want to get in an argument. But if I do voice my feelings, I'm afraid she'll cut off contact with my granddaughter. So it makes it hard to come to an understanding or a middle ground.

• 22:27Speaker 02

  Wonderful question.

• 22:32Speaker 02

  Rule number one for me is always if you can't avoid politics, avoid it because it changes. Not even the news can agree on what's happening in politics. And there are certain things that it's not about the actual issues. It's about the actual heart issues behind it. And that's a whole lot harder and a whole lot deeper. So that's rule number one. If you can, I prefer you avoid it. Number two, if it's now become a thing in the conversation and you saying that she thinks somehow that you've made some kind of derogatory remark and she now perceives this in some ways to your character

• 23:16Speaker 02

  and that really bothers you and scares you, I think that is absolutely valid. Here is where, rather than trying to prove points, okay, I need you to start sharing and asking about her perspective. I love that you're using the tools about not escalating things. Keep doing that because that's probably gonna save a lot of heartache and grief. What I now need you to do is ask questions such as, what am I, what am I missing? How can we talk about the things that are important to you? And how can I share my perspective without upsetting you in some way? Help me understand what I'm missing.

• 24:01Speaker 02

  Talk about how you two communicate and how you can talk about the process of how you're communicating about this, or whether y'all even want to talk about politics. So rather than letting it be the elephant in the room, what I would prefer you do is to say, hey, I can tell, and I'm sure you can see too, that when we start talking about politics, things kind of fall apart and it doesn't really help either one of us. Are you good? And with us just having an understanding that it's you see things and I see things and that both things can be true and fair and continue. Let's talk about your granddaughter. Let's talk about all the other amazing things.

• 24:46Speaker 02

  Let's talk about the other 99% of things that are going right in your world. So there's that conversation. Two, I would love for the conversation to begin with something along the lines of, help me. Help me understand why, how this has become so important. This topic has become so important to you, right? Help me understand where you come from or where you learned this or how long you've held on to this belief. Don't get into the, you know, why can't you just understand? Why can't you just get it as soon as you go into the, I, why can't you just be like me?

• 25:31Speaker 02

  Kind of communication, the other person is just gonna close up. Now, I'm not saying you do that. I'm saying a lot of people do. And it's natural, it's easy to fall into that trap, but it's gonna close off the line of communication. So what I need you to do is ask her for help.

• 25:50Speaker 02

  That could be a really big step in y'all's relationship. I would pray that it would be for you to say, help me understand, not just about this topic, because it's not about the topic. It's about how this topic became so ingrained with you. How can we communicate about this? How can I give my answers genuinely without you thinking that I am trying to be narrow minded about this? What would I need to say and express for you to understand that I truly want to keep an open mind about this conversation? See, you can go two different paths. We can either decide not to talk about politics

• 26:34Speaker 02

  or if we're gonna talk about it, let's do it in a way that's going to open it up and say, nobody's pointing fingers in this discussion. We're simply hearing things out. So I want you to use words that show perspective. When you need to voice a response, that you have a point of view on something, do not begin with, you know, I just don't get, or I don't understand, or you just, and you never. Instead of that, I want you to be able to say, I see things differently. Instead of, I disagree. Nah, I don't agree with that. Instead of that, I see things differently. I have a different perspective.

• 27:18Speaker 02

  I take another approach. Anytime that you use those kind of words, it's not going to get her nearly as defensive. And so that allows more conversation to be fluid and flow. And that would be my recommendation. If you can, just talk about your granddaughter. Before we keep going, I want to take a moment to tell you about Gusto. I, Jefferson, believe it or not, I have owned probably three to four businesses before I am doing this in this world. And there are a lot of different things that I did that were just for the fun of it. Bless my wife's heart of hobbies of like, I want to start this out. And you know what? I have used Gusto as a payroll system for every single one of them. I'm thinking I'm on like six payroll Gusto account.

• 28:03Speaker 02

  This is how good this is. I don't compare them to anybody else. Gusto is in an absolute league of their own. If you own any kind of business or want to start anything and you're an entrepreneur, payroll is one of the scariest, most heartburn moments of a business owner because you're not really sure what it means, how to do it. What's the best way to do it? You want to make sure that you're taking care of your people, but are they on a salary or are they hourly? And don't even get me started on payroll taxes. And especially if people are working remote and all that does. Listen to me when I tell you that Gusto is all you need when it comes to searching for a payroll provider. They make it easy, they make it seamless, and you can actually get on the phone with a real human when you have real questions. So take it from me, Gusto is what's up when it comes to payroll.

• 28:48Speaker 02

  Right now, you can go to gusto.com/jefferson and use the code Jefferson and get three months free when you run your first payroll. Gusto.com/jefferson, three months free, which is incredible when you use the code Jefferson. And now, let's keep going.

• 29:03Speaker 06

  Hi Jefferson. I am 79 years old and have a brother aged 75, who is a super successful Hollywood personality in the 80s and 90s. He's worth about a hundred million. My question is, is it wrong of me to expect him to help me financially? My husband is partially disabled now. We've been there 50 years and are very happy. We are also not allowed to visit my brother in LA or on his 3,000 acre farm. Thank you very much. I've never expected anything from him

• 29:45Speaker 06

  and have always been close to him as children. I'm very proud of him.

• 29:58Speaker 02

  My answer is going to be yes. I do think it is wrong to expect someone to help you financially.

• 30:10Speaker 02

  I do not think the hope or the thought is wrong. I think the expectation is. Because their life is their life and your life is your life. And if you expect somebody else, even despite your own circumstances, if you expect and put that on them, then you're setting yourself up for the relationship now being about the expectation of the unsaid and why wouldn't they? Don't they know? Shouldn't they see?

• 30:45Speaker 02

  Now you've made that the relationship rather than simply the love for one another. And it sounds like there is a lot that is into that question. Because it doesn't make clear why the distance? What cost it? How long there's been distance? I love that you and your husband are happy and you've been married for so long. And that sounds wonderful and healthy. So I want to clarify that the hope of somebody, your brother helping you, that's not wrong. I do believe that the expectation that he help you is wrong.

• 31:27Speaker 02

  Sure, it would be nice.

• 31:30Speaker 02

  But that's not what the relationship has ever been about. As soon as you put money in any kind of relationship, family, friends, otherwise, as soon as you insert the issue of money between you, there is a reason why money is the root of all evil. It separates, splits even the closest of people, even those who love each other so much. When money's involved, greed happens. And maybe, maybe there's the chance

• 32:06Speaker 02

  that we can look at this in the most positive light. Because I prefer to look at it in the most positive light, really the most real light. Let's, I want to be, let's put it in the most genuine light. I see two different sides. One, the brother is just a greedy, want to keep it all to himself, you know,

• 32:25Speaker 02

  McScrooge. Or two, he doesn't want money to be a thing in any of his relationships.

• 32:35Speaker 02

  Now, if he gives money to others in the family, but doesn't give to you, that's, that's different. That's telling. I know people in my life that in their family, it's the whole issue of like, do parents pass on money to their kids? Or is there expectation of getting something when somebody else is successful? And when somebody has, you know, their, their star shoots upwards as everybody else expects something. And then that goes into the question of, is the relationship, was it ever really real? Or is it just the now, the, where's my, where's my gimme gimme? Where's my handout? That does not sound, I'm not saying at all that's you. Because what I hear you saying is, I've never asked him for anything. I love that. Stay that way. Stay that way.

• 33:20Speaker 02

  I don't think that the hope inside of that is, is wrong for you to feel that way. I want you to understand how you feel about it. I think it's totally valid. It would be nice. It really would. It would be, it would be super nice and helpful. That's his choice, not your choice. It does sound like there's a bigger conversation on how estranged you two are. I would love to hear what the response would be to you tossing up the question of, hey, before you and I leave this earth,

• 33:58Speaker 02

  I just want to know, have I ever done anything? Am I missing anything that would have brought us closer together?

• 34:09Speaker 02

  Was there ever a time that I, I missed the step? Or I missed the chance to grow closer with you? Or show up better as a sister for you? Or show love to you? And just pose that question and see what kind of response that you get. Because your brother and sister and y'all are now at a stage of life when these kind of conversations, if they left unsaid, then they'll never be finished. So I, I encourage you to have that conversation and really

• 34:46Speaker 02

  focus on the marriage that you have and the beauty that y'all have created in, in all the years. So all the best to you and your family.

• 34:56Speaker 07

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