How to Stop Defining Yourself by Your Failures Feat. Dr. Nate Zinsser

You think you know what confidence is. You don't. Not yet. I brought Dr. Nate Zinsser onto this show because what he teaches is unlike anything you have heard in any self-help book or motivational speech. He is the director of West Point's Performance Psychology Program. He has spent 30 years teaching the most elite military leaders, Olympic athletes, and pro sports teams in the world how to build real, unshakable confidence from the inside out. He is the psychologist behind Eli Manning's two Super Bowl victories over my Patriots, and I'll never forgive him for it. But here is what got me. This is not about pumping yourself up. This is about rewiring your brain at the neurological level so that confidence becomes your default. And every single one of you can do it starting today. Here is what you will gain from this episode: The Psychological Bank Account: Learn the exact exercise Dr. Zinsser gives every West Point cadet to build a foundation of confidence from the memories and experiences you already have The Five Minute Daily Practice: Discover the single most powerful mental training habit you can build, three questions at the end of every day that literally rewire your brain for confidence Temporary vs. Permanent: Understand how the most confident people in the world process setbacks differently and how to adopt their framework starting today You Are Not a Failure: Learn the most important distinction in this entire episode. You may have failed at something. That does not make you a failure. Dr. Zinsser explains how to stop letting that one lie destroy your confidence Preparation and Performance: Find out why the psychology of preparation and the psychology of performance are completely different and why confusing them is costing you You have everything you need to start building your confidence today. No excuses. #Maxout! Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at https://shopify.com/mylett See how K12 Powered Schools can help unlock your child’s full potential! Enroll online today at k12.com/mylett Head to dosedaily.co/MYLETT or enter MYLETT to get 35% off your first subscription. Start improving your health with real data from Tiny Health. Get $50 off your first at-home test kit at tinyhealth.com/mylett 👉 SUBSCRIBE TO ED'S YOUTUBE CHANNEL NOW 👈⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ → → → CONNECT WITH ED MYLETT ON SOCIAL MEDIA: ← ← ← ➡️ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠INSTAGRAM⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ➡️⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠FACEBOOK⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ➡️ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LINKEDIN⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ➡️ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ➡️ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠WEBSITE⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Ed Mylett?

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• 0:42Ed Mylett?

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• 1:03Speaker 01

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• 1:35Speaker 02

  This is the Ed Marlin Show.

• 1:38Ed Mylett?

  Hey, welcome back to the show, everybody. So this week, I want to get right into it. We're going to talk about self-confidence, and this is not your normal self-confidence podcast, you know, with the normal platitudes that you hear a million times about how to build self-confidence. This is going to be different. And the reason it's different is because of my guest. You guys know I curate guests that I believe can bring something to the table that haven't been at the table before, for so many of you. And Dr. Zinser is absolutely fits that criteria. Let me tell you why. He's the Director of West Point's Performance Psychology Program, where he trains US Military Academy cadets and leaders how to operate effectively. Frankly, how to build their own self-confidence with some of the most important people in the world. He's also worked with Olympic athletes, pro sports teams. Kind of Eli Manning stands out

• 2:23Ed Mylett?

  to me because he beat my Patriots twice. So I definitely have to dive into that one. And obviously, corporate leaders and elite military leaders as well. He's got a great book called The Confident Mind, bestselling book as well. This is going to be a unique conversation. It's going to help you get more confident. So, Dr. Zinsser, welcome to the show.

• 2:41Speaker 03

  Thank you so much for having me on, Ed. I'm really looking forward to this.

• 2:45Ed Mylett?

  He's also medicated. He's eight days out of knee replacement surgery. I'm just kidding.

• 2:49Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm only medicated with acetaminophen, so there will be no, there will be no drowsiness, there will be no slips of the tongue, there will be no embarrassing references made.

• 2:58Ed Mylett?

  Outstanding. And by the way, it's okay if you do. It gets us more downloads, so feel free. So let me ask you a question. I want to start out just basis, just for kind of laying a foundation, just because I'm curious myself too. Tell me about your work at West Point. I've never been allowed anywhere near the place, so I would just like to know what your work's like there.

• 3:14Speaker 03

  Well, you got to come pay us a visit. The Military Academy is an extraordinary institution. Every year, 4,000 young men and women from all across the country and from at least a dozen foreign countries, train in a very rigorous curriculum, including academic training, physical training, military training. After that 47-month experience, these young men and women are graduated with a Bachelor of Science degree, and they are commissioned to Second Lieutenants in the Army. They serve a minimum of five years. Some of them go on to serve 10, 20, 30

• 3:55Speaker 03

  years and reach very high ranks in the Army. Others leave after five or 10 years and take leadership roles in the private sector and civilian governance. My work at West Point, 30 years directing a performance psychology program, was to take what we knew from sports science about the intangibles of human performance, and take them out of any kind of mysterious or intangible framework, and reduce them to learnable, practicable skills. So we were teaching cadets

• 4:33Speaker 03

  the how to remain confident when the crack hits the fan, which it always does, how to be focused on what's important, even though there are a million distractions, and how to retain energy and awareness and enthusiasm despite tons and tons of physical, mental, and emotional stress. So there's a curriculum that we established, which has been going on in West Point for over 30 years now, and it's been exported to various units outside of West Point, different Army posts around the country and around the world.

• 5:10Ed Mylett?

  And now little pieces of it will be exported. This is what's so great about podcasting, by the way. Someone like me, or, you know, probably some of my friends listening, I really could get nowhere near West Point, but through podcasting, I'm going to pick up, you know, some of the things that these elite performers have picked up in their life. So let me ask you a question. Basic question first, because I do a lot of work on self-confidence, and I also work with athletes and, and corporate people and CEOs, etc. But your work is so specific. What is it that creates confidence in the brain? Like, just as a mechanism to begin with? How would you answer that?

• 5:45Speaker 03

  What is it that creates confidence in the brain? Well, the only thing that creates anything in the brain are clusters of neurons that fire together. And what we all have in our brains are clusters of neurons that fire as a result of and as a cause to certain thoughts and memories and experiences. And if you get your brain continually firing those particular clumps of neurons, it just becomes your brain's default habit. And so you find yourself engaged

• 6:23Speaker 03

  rather than hesitant. You find yourself excited rather than apprehensive. And it's simply because you have trained yourself to think and think in one way only. And because you have been thinking in one way, you have literally done some physical rewiring of the gray matter between your ears and the gray matter that goes down your spinal cord.

• 6:48Ed Mylett?

  Now, that rewiring, let's say you're listening to you today, and you're like, okay, I do have a consistent way of thinking, and I've been thinking for 30 years as an unconfident person. I've replayed memories from childhood or my adult experience where I've had a failure or a setback. Or maybe not even that. Maybe I've just always been pretty, in my mind, average.

• 7:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:09Ed Mylett?

  Right?

• 7:10Speaker 03

  You, you just said it. I've always been in my mind, pretty average. Keep going, Ed.

• 7:16Ed Mylett?

  Well, I've not, I, so I live that. You know, my belief system is if you live that way in your mind, your external world will probably produce those results, right?

• 7:24Speaker 03

  You're 100% right.

• 7:26Ed Mylett?

  So, so if I've lived this way for a long time, I've got that wiring, what are some of the practices, and please take a few minutes on this, that you would offer to my audience that could begin to rewire what goes on in their mind? Like, actual practices, practical application, strategic stuff?

• 7:47Speaker 03

  First applicable practice, take whatever time is necessary, and a piece of paper and a writing implement, and write out a list of your most enjoyable, enthusiastic, rewarding accomplishments in your life. Whatever they may be, okay? I liken that process to basically opening up a bank account, a psychological bank account of achievements, awards, good experiences, and everybody has them. We may have overlooked them for various reasons, which

• 8:30Speaker 03

  we can get into, but they're there, okay? Nobody makes it into West Point, nobody makes it into a college athletic program, nobody makes it to a professional level, nobody makes it to the C-suite, but I've done a hell of a lot of good things. So the first thing we need to do is shine a light on that. It's like being a miner, and you're looking for those nuggets of gold or diamond. It's like being a detective. I'm looking for clues. So I outlined an exercise called the top 10. Top 10 moments. If you're a baseball pitcher, it's your top 10 moments playing baseball. I was High School Player of the Year, I had

• 9:11Speaker 03

  my first college start here, I got my first college win there. So that sort of establishes the bank account. And then, and this exercise, one, the last guy who interviewed me for a podcast refers to this as the deadlift of mental training exercises. If you're going to do one strength exercise, you're deadlift. If you're going to do one thing consistently in terms of building your confidence, you're going to do what I call the ESP Daily Reflection.

• 9:46Speaker 03

  At the end of every day.

• 9:49Speaker 03

  You reflect on your experiences of the day and ask yourself three questions. Where did I put in quality effort? Here, here, here. Second question. What did I get right? Oh, I made a success here. I did well on this drill. I got this compliment there. Third question. What am I making progress in? Well, I'm getting better at understanding the periodic table. I'm getting better at understanding certain AI implications in my business. I'm getting it better at throwing that deep corner back shoulder fade. Okay. And that reflection takes literally five minutes.

• 10:32Speaker 03

  And I encourage people to keep that in some kind of written journal format.

• 10:36Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 10:36Speaker 03

  And that is a daily deposit into that mental bank account that I described.

• 10:43Ed Mylett?

  I have to tell you.

• 10:44Speaker 03

  Establish the bank account.

• 10:45Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 10:45Speaker 03

  And then you add to it and you add to it and you add to it and you add to it. Those are, those are the two most important exercises, practical drills that people can do to build up a sense of certainty about themselves.

• 11:01Ed Mylett?

  Okay, guys, I have to tell you, first of all, don't discount what he just said. So my producer's my son actually now. And so I know he's in the studio sort of a smirking because one of the techniques that I teach with the athletes or leaders that I work with is called the highlight reel.

• 11:16Speaker 03

  Same deal.

• 11:16Ed Mylett?

  Correct. Same deal. But let's talk about why this works and why people don't do it. So the reason that I do, so I'll have people pick two or three highlights and then feed to themselves the cognitive rehearsal of the next highlight they wish to achieve in their life.

• 11:30Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 11:30Ed Mylett?

  And the reason that this works, everybody, and you correct me if I'm wrong, but confidence, success, peak performance, the zone, whatever you want to call it, is actually a neurology. There's a chemistry that's happening within your body when you're choking or nervous or scared or unconfident. And there's a different chemistry in your body that you inhibit that is a confident one. And when you do these little deposits, you're actually reminding your body of what that neurology is like, correct?

• 12:00Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 12:01Ed Mylett?

  Just making deposits.

• 12:02Speaker 03

  That's, that's a great way to understand it, yes.

• 12:05Ed Mylett?

  Okay. Now, the challenge is, for most people, it's interesting. The lack of confidence that we all have produces our filter for the way we see ourselves in the world. So for most people, they'll say, when you just said that, so let's just dig deep, let's push each other here. They'll say to you, well, I, I haven't thrown a touchdown. I didn't get into West Point. Heck, I couldn't get into a junior college or, you know, I'm an entry level person working in a cubicle somewhere and I don't, I don't have these deposits. The truth is, that's a lie, isn't it? That they have had successes, but their lack of confidence is a filter where they discount themselves and the things they do well. So if you ask the average person, give me a list of the 20 things the last year you've screwed up or messed up, they can recall that in a minute.

• 12:50Ed Mylett?

  But if you said to them, give me three things you did in the last month or the last day that were great, they have to search through this bizarre, this filter they've got that tells them they're worthless. So could you just speak to that for a second in terms of not all of it has to be some touchdown you've thrown in the NFL. It could simply be, you know, a great conference call you had or a great Zoom or a great interaction with your children that just was loving and kind, right?

• 13:15Speaker 03

  All of the above qualify. Any memory, any statement about yourself in the present, any fantasy, vision of something you want in the future that creates a sense of energy and optimism and enthusiasm is worth hanging on to, however small it might be. The point that you're raising there, which is really important, is that so many of us were brought up to think that we can only value our experience, we can only value ourselves if we have achieved everything that the world has deemed to be important.

• 13:59Speaker 03

  Great grades in school, great bunch of friends, won every game you ever played in, had the most attractive spouse possible. We have been socialized to kind of search for, hang on to, and unfortunately define ourselves by our negative experiences. So much of our socialization has brought us to that. And I am constantly, and it sounds like you're constantly as well, urging people to look for, hang on to, and define yourself by the quality of your effort, the successes that

• 14:40Speaker 03

  you have achieved, and the, basically the magnitude of the obstacles that you have overcome. That's what you want to define yourself by.

• 14:50Ed Mylett?

  The two things you said that stand out to me that you've repeated twice, and I don't think people give themselves enough credit for this, is effort. The basis often for the foundation of confidence has to begin with your effort because effort precedes the result. And so if all of your confidence, guys listening, is based on the, the results you produce all the time, you're going to be waiting around a long time to build that self-confidence level. But if it's predicated on effort, you know, that I did get into the gym, I did do the reps I said I was going to do, I did do one more at the end when I promised myself.

• 15:21Speaker 03

  I emptied my daggone mailbox at the end of the day before I left the office.

• 15:26Ed Mylett?

  Hmm. See, this is fascinating to me. Like, this is how confidence is truly built, everybody. Let me ask you a question about, um, a failure. So, or a traumatic event, because I know with, with warfighters or soldiers of any type, I mean, they may have, uh, it could be a PTSD moment, there could be childhood trauma, there could be, I flunked a test. And this oftentimes can kind of scramble our wiring, right? Where like, I've known people, for example, who are very confident people and frankly, their spouse left them and their, their confidence is annihilated. Or they're very good in business and then something happened to the business and they've had a bad year or lost the business.

• 16:10Ed Mylett?

  And in all honesty, they've almost become a shell of themselves externally. And I know that started internally.

• 16:15Speaker 03

  They never fully recovered from that setback.

• 16:17Ed Mylett?

  What would you say to that person who's gone through something like that?

• 16:21Speaker 03

  What I'd say to them is we've got to protect that bank account of yours. We've got to set up some cognitive safeguards so that the imperfect physical world that we live in and your personal physical inevitable imperfections do not destroy the energy, the optimism and the enthusiasm that you have been building up by reflecting constructively on your various memories and your experiences. So I steal a whole lot of work from the positive psychology movement, spearheaded by Martin Seligman at the University of Pennsylvania, looking at how do we mentally

• 17:05Speaker 03

  respond to setbacks? Do we see them as temporary? Yeah, they happened, they suck. But it was just a one time deal. Or do we say to ourselves, uh-oh, it happened and it's going to happen over and over and over again. Permanent. Do we look at our setbacks as temporary or permanent? Take your pick. Secondly, do we look at our imperfections and our setbacks and our failures as basically limited in terms of where they occurred? Yes, it happened in that inning of the baseball game. Yes, it happened at that, in that conversation with that individual or that board meeting. Or do we say to ourselves, oh, every time, everywhere, all these things get screwed up.

• 17:51Speaker 03

  Do we keep them limited or do we globalize them? Okay. And third, and this is where it really gets important, and this is what most people struggle with most of all.

• 18:03Ed Mylett?

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• 20:07Speaker 03

  When a setback takes place, are we able to put it in a perspective? Yeah, it happened, but it's non-representative of me.

• 20:17Ed Mylett?

  Ooh.

• 20:17Speaker 03

  It's non-representative of me. It happened, there could be consequences, but that setback does not tell the truth about me.

• 20:29Speaker 03

  So I have to keep my

• 20:31Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 20:32Speaker 03

  setbacks and failures temporary, limited, not the truth, as opposed to permanent, everywhere, and absolutely the truth about myself.

• 20:44Ed Mylett?

  That's

• 20:44Speaker 03

  And that's just a distinction that everybody can make. It takes some practice to establish that as a habit, and I'm constantly counseling

• 20:53Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 20:54Speaker 03

  people to do that, challenging them to put just the difficulties of life with a capital L in those temporary, limited, and not the truth terms. Because if we go that way, we are blind to our own possibilities and to our own capabilities.

• 21:15Ed Mylett?

  Wow, that's profound. That was really good right there, Nate. Really good. You know, I, I find the third one so prominent where people will have a failure, and I'll literally hear them say, I'm a failure.

• 21:29Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 21:30Ed Mylett?

  They

• 21:31Speaker 03

  That is precisely the point. Instead of, okay, I failed at something.

• 21:37Speaker 03

  They make the categorical judgment, henceforth, I am a failure. No, you might have goofed that calculus test. You might have goofed that fitness test. You might have goofed your execution of your high bar set in the gymnastics meet. Okay. Let's leave it right there.

• 21:57Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 21:58Speaker 03

  Let's not draw the conclusion that I'm a failure categorically.

• 22:04Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 22:05Speaker 03

  And people have to practice that.

• 22:07Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, that term you made of, you ought to ask yourself this, everybody, too. Do you sort of globalize results? I love that term because, you know, you were in a relationship, this person doesn't love you anymore. That doesn't mean you're unlovable.

• 22:18Speaker 03

  Right.

• 22:18Ed Mylett?

  In this relationship. You know, another thing I've deduced, listening to you, and it's like, it's, it's an old school thing, because you're such a scientifically based guy, but that you don't hear anymore in what I call like self-help circles, or, or personal development, or self-confidence. This interesting thing you've said three different times, I think, and I want you to speak to it. You know, it used to be that, hey, listen, you got to get excited. You got to have some enthusiasm. I met, you know what's interesting? I never hear that anymore, the word enthusiasm. Yet you've said it three times. It's like, almost like this missing thing that used to be talked about all the time. But there's something to be said for the level of enthusiasm you bring to a project, a meeting, a relay, and it's just one of these things that, at least for me, I think we just forget. It's

• 23:02Ed Mylett?

  like, okay, I prepared my notes. I know what I'm going to say, or we've got a game plan for the game, or the meeting, and you forget the enthusiasm, the energy part of confidence, of success, of making it infectious. So speak to enthusiasm, and also, how does that impact the other people, your family, your business people you lead?

• 23:21Speaker 03

  Um.

• 23:23Speaker 03

  You know, I think the word enthusiasm sometimes gets misinterpreted to mean, you know, confetti and balloons, and, and angels blowing trumpets, uh, great big deals. But how about just that little sort of secret smile? Hmm, yeah, this could be really cool. That's enthusiasm. This meeting could turn out great. We could smoke these guys in the second half. Okay? I could turn my platoon into the shit hottest bunch of dudes and dames in the army. And it, it, it's not this boisterous loud thing. It's just this internal, oh, hmm, yeah, that could be cool.

• 24:06Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 24:06Speaker 03

  That, that level of enthusiasm, I think is really productive, and it's something that you can sustain throughout the day, the week, the month, the quarter, career, you know, jumping up and down, and with the balloons and the confetti, oh, that's kind of tiring, you know?

• 24:24Ed Mylett?

  Yeah, you're right.

• 24:25Speaker 03

  And, and to your second point, it's just that quiet, okay, we're gonna do this. That quiet level of enthusiasm, people are drawn to that automatically. They don't necessarily know why. They just say, I, it's cool being around that dude. Okay, that woman has certain degree of classy power, because she communicates, but she's not doing it necessarily to impress everybody else.

• 24:56Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 24:57Speaker 03

  She's just doing it because she knows it's the right thing to do, and it somehow, I don't know, it leeches out and draws other people to you.

• 25:08Ed Mylett?

  This is, by the way, I love doing a show. It's the little subtle distinctions that I get from someone like you. It's so profound, as a 55-year-old guy, of bringing a sustainable level of enthusiasm to your endeavors, not the crazy bells and whistles that can't la, can't endure the season, the year, the company. You know, you're right, it's sustainable enthusiasm. I love that classy level of confidence that, by the way, everyone, a lot of you are listening on audio, those of you that are listening on YouTube saw this, but what Dr. Zizer was doing was, he was, there was this kind of smirk in his physiology. And so I want you to speak to this for a second, too. Is there a connection between physiology and

• 25:52Ed Mylett?

  the mental level of confidence, whether that be physical exertion, the way we use our face, our breathing? Is there a correlation in your mind that you teach between physiology, physical movement, and confidence?

• 26:05Speaker 03

  Um, there definitely is a connection. I wouldn't consider myself an expert on it. Um, I do know that shoulders slumped forward, head facing downward, tends to both communicate a lack of enthusiasm, and it literally tends to produce it in oneself.

• 26:29Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 26:30Speaker 03

  Conversely, shoulders back, chin up a little bit, eye contact, okay? This communicates to the observer a level of engagement, a level of enthusiasm.

• 26:44Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 26:45Speaker 03

  And there is some research to demonstrate that posture alters your emotional state.

• 26:53Ed Mylett?

  Okay.

• 26:54Speaker 03

  It's somewhat controversial, but I urge everybody to try it.

• 27:00Ed Mylett?

  Yep.

• 27:00Speaker 03

  Stand up straighter.

• 27:02Ed Mylett?

  Yep. I, I, by the way, I

• 27:03Speaker 03

  Keep your shoulders back.

• 27:04Ed Mylett?

  I agree. I actually think, I don't think this is disputable. Listen, when you got on the Zoom here today, I knew immediately, within 30 seconds, I was dealing with a confident person as it comes to the topic he was speaking on. There's an, there's a, uh, an assumption physically that somebody makes when they're confident, and there's a doubting, sort of constricted, bent over physiology of someone who is hopeful you're going to believe them. I hope you like me. I hope you find me attractive. I hope you think, there's a difference between hoping and assumption, and it's not arrogance. There is a physical connotation to how we do hold ourselves, and it's not, and to your point, I don't think it's over the top. I

• 27:49Ed Mylett?

  think it's subtle. I think it's nuanced. I don't think it has to be, you know, you see those guys that walk around way too puffed out, right? Way too much of their chest. You know, this guy's a, is a poser. And I'm sure there's a similar physiology for a woman. It's subtle, but I do think those of you that are working on your confidence, you should at least check a box of how's my physiology, my facial expressions, how I walk, how I talk, my pace, my tonality, my cadence, I think matters.

• 28:15Speaker 03

  Am I acting in a way that I would want to follow somebody?

• 28:19Ed Mylett?

  Wow.

• 28:20Speaker 03

  Am I being the kind of person that I would want to follow?

• 28:24Ed Mylett?

  Wow.

• 28:25Speaker 03

  It can be as simple as that. Who are the people that you are sort of, sort of naturally, almost unconsciously engaged with?

• 28:35Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 28:36Speaker 03

  What are they like? Are they

• 28:39Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 28:39Speaker 03

  set back? Are they, all right, all right, all right. Are they open?

• 28:45Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 28:46Speaker 03

  Open.

• 28:47Ed Mylett?

  Hmm.

• 28:49Speaker 03

  Why don't you just be that way? Just try it for a little while. You're not faking anything. You are being a version of yourself. That's not fake. That's you being you.

• 29:00Ed Mylett?

  Yeah.

• 29:00Speaker 03

  Let's explore that.

• 29:02Ed Mylett?

  Very good. Yeah, you're right. I think sometimes I think, well, I'm copying this person. There's a difference for me, because when I was young, I lacked confidence. I did exactly what you thought. I thought, well, who do I admire? Who would I want leading me? And what I would call that, guys, that's listening, so you don't feel fake, it's more like modeling somebody than copying them. It's my version of the things I've noticed in them that I found pleasing, or attractive, or brought me confidence.

• 29:27Speaker 03

  Effective.

• 29:28Ed Mylett?

  There you go. Right. Thank you. Thank you for saying that. Okay, I'm going to give you a guy. I need to know about this, because you talk about our minds. There's this dude, I'm a huge Boston sports fan. And you're already smiling and I liked you Nate until I found out you helped this guy. And now you're, I'm on the fence until we're done here today, but so I'm a Pats fan and I think most of you know, if you're not football fans, there's this guy named Eli Manning, who basically ruined my life twice. And, and I mean it, like ruined my life. And so Eli Manning's quarterback for the New York Giants, he's not in the Hall of Fame yet, but he should be. I'll even say that on his path. He's won a couple of Super Bowls. He's basically really one of two people

• 30:13Ed Mylett?

  who ever beat Tom Brady in the Super Bowl, and he actually did it both times he played him. So think about that, you guys. He's also got an older brother who was a great player. He was like almost the second one in the family. So some of you feel that way. Oh, my sister's the rock star. My brother's the one that everybody looks up to. Eli had that with his own dad and his own brother. He was like third wheel and he's won two Super Bowls and beat the GOAT twice. Tell us about your work with Eli and I, someone told me you got a story, at least I need to hear about Super Bowl 46, which I probably don't want to hear and I'll probably get it edited out, but I want you to tell it anyway. Tell it anyway.

• 30:48Ed Mylett?

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• 31:32Ed Mylett?

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• 32:13Ed Mylett?

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• 32:49Speaker 03

  I first met Eli in the spring of 2007. A former West Point grad, West Point assistant coach, who was on the Giants coaching staff, suggested to head coach Tom Coughlin, you know, I think that this guy Nate Censor at West Point, you know, might be a good influence on Eli.

• 33:15Speaker 03

  And, you know, Tom Coughlin grilled me for a couple of hours in his office. And he said, okay, we'll give this a shot. Eli and I connected and we just began a relationship, a mentor mentee relationship. And the thing that immediately impressed me about Eli was the simple trait of curiosity. What's out there that might help me? Okay. And, and he's been very, very clear about this. When he's been asked about it in, you know, different, you know, different interviewing sessions and, you know, different, you know, different media outlets. He's been very clear. Everybody

• 34:01Speaker 03

  talked about, oh, you gotta be mentally tough. You gotta be mentally tough. You gotta be mentally tough. He had been told that playing college ball at Ole Miss. He'd been told that, you know, in his three years with the Giants. I didn't meet with him until that gap between his third and fourth Giants season. He, you know, everybody had talked about how important this is. You gotta have a great attitude. You gotta be mentally tough, da, da, da, da, da. But nobody had ever broken it down into steps. Okay. And Eli was, you know, he was a very attentive pupil, you know?

• 34:38Speaker 03

  And he and I met regularly throughout the spring and the summer of 2007. We continued our relationship, basically breaking down every game he played from a psych, from a mental point, mental toughness point of view, you know? And so now February of 2008 comes around and Eli puts on an incredible show in the fourth quarter and ends up beaten heavily favored and at that point, undefeated Patriots for, for Super Bowl 42. It was one of the coolest moments of my life.

• 35:17Ed Mylett?

  One of the worst of mine.

• 35:20Speaker 03

  Okay. Now, four years later, four years later, the Patriots and the Giants again face each other in the Super Bowl. Okay. And once again, the Patriots are favored and once again,

• 35:36Speaker 03

  Eli has a remarkable fourth quarter. Okay. The Giants were down by

• 35:45Speaker 03

  two points with four and a half minutes on the clock. The ball's on their own 10 yard line. They've got enough time to dink the ball down the field, kick a field goal, go up by one, but that means they're going to give the ball back to Brady and the Patriots with like two minutes on the clock? And all they gotta do is dink the ball down the field and they'll kick a field goal and win. So the Giants gotta score a touchdown if they are going to win. And so Eli takes a snap and the shotgun looks right, looks over the middle, sees Mario Manningham deep, right about at midfield, and he launches this perfect arc of a ball. Their two Patriot defenders draped all

• 36:27Speaker 03

  over Manningham, but this ball is so beautifully placed that it just falls right into Manningham's hand and he steps out of bounds right, right neck. He almost knocks Bill Belichick over, you know, when he steps out of bounds after making that catch. That play set up the Giants go ahead, touchdown. For all intents and purposes, game over. Two days later, Eli is doing his mandatory, I guess ESPN radio interview, and he's asked about that play.

• 37:03Speaker 03

  And he's asked specifically, do you ever consider the ramifications of failure at a time like that? And this is basically asked being an NFL quarterback. Do you think about screwing up in an important moment? That's a very, yeah. Consider that question. Do you consider the ramifications of failure at moments like that? And I think Eli wanted to say, are you out of your freaking mind, dude? He basically, being the gentleman that he is, said, well, that's exactly what you don't do. In moments like that, you think about all the times you have succeeded with a fourth quarter comeback. You recall the games against this team and this team and this

• 37:46Speaker 03

  team and this team where you were successful in those particular kinds of moments. You forget about the other ones. He literally said, you misremember those misses and you hang on to the memories of your successes. That's the feeling. That's the feeling. So the ability to think about, I've done some good stuff. This could be really cool. That's the feeling that you want to have when you are in your own equivalent of the fourth quarter of a Super Bowl, rather than, oh, this is

• 38:26Speaker 03

  really big. I better not mess this up. Okay. And if any of your listeners were watching the figure skating events at this year's Winter Olympiad, you saw a couple people who were clearly, uh oh, this is the Olympics. I can't afford to screw up. Failure would be really bad. And you also saw a couple of people who were

• 38:49Speaker 03

  I'm just here to see how well I can skate. I'm just here to be artistic. I don't need a gold medal. I just want to be in the moment and be joyous. Those are the people that won the medals.

• 39:00Ed Mylett?

  Oh my gosh, brother, that's one of the best stories ever on the show. Because there's a lot to pick apart there. You guys, you know, when someone makes a point, I like to pick apart things. That, did you hear what he said? He said, the feeling. Remember earlier in the podcast where I said that it's a chemistry and a neurology? There's a feeling, there's a, when you have the right thoughts, you're creating a neurology, a chemistry in your body. That is that of success. When you're feeding yourself to failure thoughts, you're feeding yourself the neuro biochemistry of someone who's not going to perform under pressure. That's why these thoughts matter. While we're recording this, this weekend, I'm a, I'm a golf guy. Down the street from where I live was the Players Championship Golf Tournament.

• 39:43Ed Mylett?

  And there's this guy, Cameron Young, he's down by a shot going to the 17th hole. He birdies 17. Now he's tied on the 18th hole. His competitor, who's a great player, hits a ball a little bit to the right. He's going to be blocked out. He's going to have to lay up. This guy gets up and you know what he says he was thinking? He says out loud, this is the biggest shot of his life. He says, I'm going to hit the greatest drive of my life. And he visualized other great drives he had hit prior. There's a water to the left. There's out, there's a hazard to the right. He striped a 375 yard drive, longest drive of the entire tournament. On the most important hole, right down the middle, and he wins the golf tournament.

• 40:26Ed Mylett?

  And it's because of the imagery, just what you taught Eli to do, that he fed himself. That is one of the best stories I've ever heard, and I'm frustrated that you did that to beat my Patriots. And I'm going to leave it in the podcast. So let me answer a couple of questions. We only have a certain amount of time. I want to give everybody tools as well. How do you feel about cognitive rehearsal and visualization? And if you like it, how does someone get better at it?

• 40:51Speaker 03

  Well, the second question is very simple. You get better at it as you practice. Okay?

• 40:57Speaker 03

  Visualization is a term that kind of implies the visual aspect of seeing something around you or seeing yourself in something. I use the term envisioning, slight linguistic variation. Because in order to basically fool your nervous system into believing that you are throwing that touchdown or making that presentation while you are just sitting, thinking about it. In order to get the nervous system really, really dialed in, you want to include, what might it sound like? What might the air be like? What am I feeling? Okay?

• 41:43Speaker 03

  So, you know, if I'm working with a quarterback and I want him to envision

• 41:52Speaker 03

  execution of a play, you know, maybe stand up and have a ball in your hand. Okay? Okay, and I'm

• 42:00Speaker 04

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