Chris Eubank Jr. Opens Up About His Grief, Living In His Father’s Shadow & His Future

Chris Eubank Jr. is a boxer on his way to being the best in the world. A journey into boxing like no other, Chris didn’t just have to step out of the shadows of his own demons to make his name in the ring, but out of the shadow of his own father. But Chris’s journey to the top hasn’t been seamless. He’s been knocked back by some bruising defeats, and - as he explains - by tragedy. When his brother tragically died of a heart attack, Chris’s world almost fell apart. But it isn’t how you get knocked down, it’s how you get back up. Over and over again in Chris’s life, he’s had to look deep within himself to find his inner strength to match his outward toughness. It hasn’t been easy for him, but he wouldn’t have had it any other way. Follow Chris: https://twitter.com/chriseubankjr https://www.instagram.com/chriseubankjr/ Follow me: https://beacons.ai/diaryofaceo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  I don't do a lot of interviews like this, so there's not a lot of people that do get to see this side of me.

• 0:05Speaker 01

  Chris Eubank Jr. The biggest fight of his life.

• 0:10Speaker 00

  Growing up, I was always Chris Eubank's son. A lot of people would say, "You're trying to steal your son's limelight." To a certain extent, maybe he was. "I have to do something here to where people know me for me."

• 0:22Speaker 00

  I got myself into this gang. Some kid had got my number. He was like, "Wait till I find you." I went into school with a baseball bat to find this kid. I take the baseball bat out. That changed the path of my life.

• 0:38Steven Bartlett?

  The first time I went to Dubai, there was a young guy there and offered to train me.

• 0:45Steven Bartlett?

  That was your brother.

• 0:48Speaker 00

  I just started crying, man. It was, you know, one of the worst days of my life. I knew my brother was in Dubai and I didn't go and see him. That would have been the last time I would have saw him before he passed.

• 1:05Speaker 00

  A man named Nick Blackwell, he got taken to hospital. He actually died on the way to hospital. They had to revive him with an adrenaline shot. Those types of incidents are what put things into perspective and make you think about what you're doing.

• 1:17Steven Bartlett?

  Have you ever had this conversation with your father about your emotions?

• 1:21Speaker 00

  This is too much.

• 1:24Steven Bartlett?

  So without further ado, I'm Steven Bartlett and this is the Diary of a CEO. I hope nobody's listening, but if you are, then please keep this to yourself.

• 1:40Steven Bartlett?

  Chris, one of the really remarkable things about your story that I was... That kind of broke the mould a little bit was someone that comes from a family, as you described, where you did have comfort because your father was very, very successful in his career. It seems like a little bit of an anomaly that you had such discipline and appetite for struggle and pain because usually that comes from, typically, stereotypically, that comes from a background of intense hardship.

• 2:14Steven Bartlett?

  So I guess where my question is, like, where did that come from in you? And is that something you saw in all of your siblings?

• 2:22Speaker 00

  I always had that very competitive uh personality, you know, and before I found boxing, I was heavy into sports in school, cricket, rugby, football, athletics, swimming, um, and I I just got a high off of competing and winning, just just competitive. That's all I all I wanted to do was test myself against other guys. Um, and then obviously when I found boxing, uh, I I quickly understood that this was the ultimate form of competition.

• 3:00Speaker 00

  You couldn't get anything more intense, more hardcore, more pure than two guys putting gloves on, getting into the ring and and going until somebody can't go anymore.

• 3:14Steven Bartlett?

  Did you have that from your dad at all? Was was he ever pushing you in those early years before you even knew he was a boxer to be competitive, to win, and that that was important? Or was it more just innate in in you?

• 3:27Speaker 00

  You know, it's funny, my father actually, he was the opposite in terms of supporting or, you know, pushing me towards boxing. He he banned me from going to to boxing gyms for a couple of years. He didn't think I'd be tough enough, you know. So, uh, you know, I I was begging him all the time, let me, let me go to the gym, let me, let me, let me go and spar, let me go and train. And he he would just tell me, no, no, you're not going. Stick with your athletics, stick with your rugby, stick with your football, stick with your studies. That was a big thing for him, you know, because he didn't have that education growing up. Um, boxing is going to be too tough, you know, you've got so

• 4:11Speaker 00

  many, look at, look at where you are, you're in a mansion, you you go to private school, you know, you've got everything you need and want here. Why why do you need to go down to the gym and and get your ass kicked every day? So, um, you know, it took years of me nagging and begging, let me do it, let me do it. Um, finally, he gave in. And I guess the rest is history. Now we're here.

• 4:37Steven Bartlett?

  When I was younger, I remember my older brothers could all eat really spicy food. And I remember someone saying to me at the table, maybe one of my brothers, maybe my mum. She was like, don't give that to Steve, he can't eat it. When I heard that, it sounded like a challenge to me. Now, when you said that about your dad, it almost sounded like a dare. It sounded like a challenge. Did you receive it like that? Him saying you're not tough enough to do that.

• 4:59Speaker 00

  Absolutely. You know, as a kid,

• 5:03Speaker 00

  when you're told you can't do something, you want to do it ten times more.

• 5:07Steven Bartlett?

  Do you think he was aware of that? He's a smart man.

• 5:10Speaker 00

  You know what? I've never thought of it like that. I've never thought about that. Like, was he,

• 5:16Speaker 00

  was he trying to bait me? You know, was he saying this or stopping me so that when I actually did start, I would go so hard that I would actually, you know, make something of myself in the sport? I have no idea. If he did, then that's a hell of a, you know, a thing. But, um, no, I mean, I genuinely think that he, he did really think I wasn't tough enough. I mean, world champions, the best fighters in the world generally come from poverty, from hardship, from broken homes. And they fight because they have to fight. There is, there's no other option for them. If they don't win, if they don't succeed in boxing, they don't eat.

• 5:58Speaker 00

  You know, they don't have a home to go to. They can't pay the bills.

• 6:03Speaker 00

  So that's what fuels them to, to make it. They have no choice. Whereas me, I had, I had many choices. So in a way, I see it as, I see it as actually more of a, an accomplishment. Because I didn't have to go through everything I went through to get to where I am today. Thirty four fights, thirty two wins. The pain, the hardship, the sacrifice, the suffering. I didn't have to do any of that. I could have stayed in school. I could have

• 6:40Speaker 00

  kept the rugby up or the, or the, or the football or the cricket. You know, and I, I would have made it in any sport I wanted to make it in. I know that. Why? Just, just because of my passion and my, my drive, you know, once I, once I zone in on something I want to do, nothing else matters. And I will, I will do it and I will get there by any means necessary. People that don't know about boxing or don't know how to fight. They think that you've got to be big and strong and mean and full of hate. And that's what enables you to be a great fighter or to be able to, to win in the fight game.

• 7:21Speaker 00

  And sure, some of those things are going to help you, you know, speed, power, all of that stuff plays a big part for sure. But the biggest part of being able to be a great fighter is, is this.

• 7:35Speaker 00

  And a lot of people don't realize that or don't know that it is, in my opinion, I don't know, seventy, eighty percent mental. You know, the balls and the, the grit that you have to have to, you know, walk through crowds of that, thousands of people.

• 8:00Speaker 00

  And while you're walking there, knowing that, you know, once you get to that ring and walk up those stairs, you're going to have to take off your jacket.

• 8:11Speaker 00

  The bell's going to go and you're going to have to fight somebody. You're going to have to get hurt and you're going to have to hurt somebody in front of thousands of people and millions of people around the world. That in itself, that, that walk, most people on the planet could not, cannot do that. Just the walk, let alone the fight part.

• 8:35Speaker 00

  Takes a lot of mental strength.

• 8:38Speaker 00

  Takes a lot of guts, a lot of heart, you know, mental strength. It's a huge thing in boxing.

• 8:46Steven Bartlett?

  It's a big thing in life, even outside of boxing, right? In business and in all, I think, great endeavors. Do you think it's something that you can, from what you've seen in the gym, something you can teach or train?

• 8:58Speaker 00

  I think you can.

• 8:59Steven Bartlett?

  Have you seen it taught to someone that didn't have it?

• 9:03Speaker 00

  I've seen fighters improve, you know. I've seen fighters over the years become more confident and in their abilities and, you know, that does transfer for, that does transfer over to their performances in the ring. I think to a certain extent, you do have to have that strength, that, that belief and that courage and that, that mental fortitude to fight. It can be enhanced in some ways, but only to a certain extent.

• 9:35Speaker 00

  Because at the end of the day,

• 9:38Speaker 00

  there are going to be times in training, in sparring and definitely in, in the fighting, where you're going to get hurt, you're going to be in a position where you're questioning yourself. What am I doing here? Am I going to be okay? Can I beat this guy?

• 9:58Speaker 00

  Should I give up? Should I find a way out? This is too much. Every fighter experiences that, that, that moment, you know?

• 10:08Steven Bartlett?

  Have you experienced that?

• 10:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 10:09Steven Bartlett?

  In a fight?

• 10:11Speaker 00

  There's one time where I was close to giving up. One time, I went to Cuba before I turned pro. Out there, obviously, they have the Olympians and, you know, their, their Olympic training is second to none, you know, these guys are animals, they're monsters. In Cuba, they have this thing called technical sparring, which I had never done and I never did ever again until maybe up like two years ago. But technical sparring is basically.

• 10:45Speaker 00

  You're sparring, but you're not sparring to hurt the guy. You're sparring to work on technique, you know, so it's like an agreement. All right, listen, I'm not gonna go all out here, you know, we're gonna work on the jab today, or we're gonna work on foot movement. Um, we're not trying to bang each other out, you know, they, they, they're big on that, they're big on technical sparring. I had never done anything like that. My, my whole mentality was if I'm gonna spar you, I'm gonna try and get you out of there. Because that's how my mentality is gonna be when I'm in a real fight. Hmm. So I, I need, that's just how I need to be. Um, the Cuban Olympic heavyweight representative

• 11:26Speaker 00

  walks up the stairs and gets into the ring. I thought he was coming into the ring to, to shadow box and warm up for his sparring session with somebody else.

• 11:36Speaker 00

  He said, no, no, no, you guys, you guys are gonna spar. I was like, uh, he's about three times the size of me, what, what do you mean? He's like, yeah, yeah, it's okay, it's okay. Well, you know, he'll work with you, he'll work with you. Technical sparring. So I thought, sure, that's fine, let's go. First round goes, first bell goes, this guy sprints over to me and just starts laying into me, the biggest shots, bang, bang, bang. Head up, moving out the way, dodging, running around the ring, and he's just coming at me, and I can't get this guy off of me. He knocks me out of the ring, he punches me, I, I fall out of the ring, I drop down, it's like a three, four foot drop onto concrete.

• 12:22Speaker 00

  My knee hits the, hits the concrete, my leg goes dead. Right? This is the second round that this happened. I still have one more round afterwards. So I'm getting up, leg's completely gone. I'm looking up.

• 12:39Speaker 00

  And this heavyweights like leaning over the the ropes, looking at me, looking down at me. And I have a decision to make. Do I get back in? Or do I say, listen, my knee is bad. You're too big. Yeah, I've got a concussion. Let me, you know, let me just take a break. So I'm sitting there, I'm looking around, everyone's looking at me, my dad's there. I was like, you know what? Let's fucking go. Let's go. Walked back up, knowing, knowing what I was about to receive, once as soon as I got back in the ring. And that's what happened. Click, you know, clapped us back in. Just starts laying into me again for another, another, another two rounds. But my whole thing was.

• 13:24Speaker 00

  I have to finish the three rounds. Why? Because I said I was gonna do the three rounds. I said I would bar him the three rounds. I'm not leaving this gym. With everybody knowing that I quit. Why not?

• 13:41Speaker 00

  Why not? Because uh. I couldn't, I couldn't live with myself. I've got to, I've got to go home and go to sleep.

• 13:49Speaker 00

  How am I gonna go to sleep with that on my mind? You know, I can go to sleep with getting my ass kicked by a guy who's three times bigger than me. I can, I can sleep like that. I can't go to sleep knowing that he, another man made me quit. Made me run out of the ring. No. So I got back into that ring and I took my beating like a man. And from that day on, I was never scared again. So that was the worst.

• 14:17Speaker 00

  Experience of my life in terms of. Boxing, but it was also the best experience. Because I knew. I knew what I was capable of. I knew I had it inside me to not give up. I knew I could take a shot. I knew I had what it, what it would take. To make it. If he can't make me quit, who's gonna make me quit? Nobody.

• 14:41Speaker 00

  So that stuck with me for the rest of my career.

• 14:43Steven Bartlett?

  Something really interesting which I gained from that, which is like we basically create a personal like philosophy or story with ourselves. And in that moment, when you're looking up and stepping back into that ring with that massive guy in there, it's like you're you're writing or making a story about yourself, one that will probably follow you forever. And I think about this sometimes when I'm on my own and I'm on my Peloton and I'm either exhausted or knackered and I know there's seven minutes left and I know I can just get off it. But this thing in my head goes, but then Steve, you're changing your own personal story, which is that sometimes Steve quits when it's hard. And the thought of having to live the rest of my life with that, and it sounds like a very strange thing I've never said before, but the thought of having to live with that personal story,

• 15:26Steven Bartlett?

  that personal philosophy, that that's who I am, is never worth getting off the bike. Because, okay, it's seven minutes today, but it's a lifetime of thinking that's who I am. And it sounded like that in that moment, you you had a choice about who you were gonna say, you know, and it's a self thing. I know there's other people there, but sometimes when I'm sure you have it in the gym or whatever, when no one's around, it's just you and you.

• 15:49Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 15:50Steven Bartlett?

  You have a decision to make about who you who you are, right?

• 15:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 15:53Steven Bartlett?

  Happens a lot in training, I imagine as well, right?

• 15:55Speaker 00

  No, that that's actually when it happens the most, you know, there are times, you know, I'll be I'll be on the treadmill. Where I'll be running and you know, I'll get a cramp in in the in my calf.

• 16:07Speaker 00

  I've still got eight minutes to go.

• 16:09Steven Bartlett?

  Cause you said you were gonna do.

• 16:11Speaker 00

  Cause I I've set the timer for forty minutes on the thing. So I'm on I'm on thirty two minutes. The the cramp starts going. You're on the treadmill.

• 16:20Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah.

• 16:22Speaker 00

  You've got, you've got eight minutes to go and I'm I'm running like this now.

• 16:30Speaker 00

  But I'm not getting off the treadmill because I've got to do the eight minutes.

• 16:35Steven Bartlett?

  Why? No one's there.

• 16:36Speaker 00

  Nobody's there, but if the treadmill can make me quit.

• 16:42Speaker 00

  What happens when I get into the ring with a guy who's he's hit me and I'm hurt? He's gonna make me quit too. So I'm I'm on that treadmill for eight minutes like that. Just try and just try and not try not to get the pressure on this leg. But I'm finishing the forty minutes. Now, that is, you know, it's it's huge because it it teaches you to believe and to know that, you know, no matter how hard things get, you will find a way. You'll find a way. It doesn't matter who's watching, you know. You know, because, yeah, no one's around right now, so no one would know if you took that break.

• 17:23Speaker 00

  But what happens when you're in a situation where the world is watching? And you're in that same position of pain or or of of, you know, uncertainty about, you know, so you got a big speech or you, you know, some something's happening and everyone's watching and you don't know, you don't really wanna keep going. You know, then you'll get that same feeling. You know what? I'm gonna do it, not, ah, well, listen, I'm I'm I'm done, I just this is too much. You don't ever wanna put that, ah, that spirit inside yourself, you know? You gotta you gotta keep those demons out. You know, and they are demons, you know, and if you and if you let them in enough, they take over.

• 18:08Speaker 00

  I don't let anything like that inside me. I always beat what it is ah that's in front of me, what it is, whether it's mental, whether it's spiritual, whether it's physical. Um, I always make sure I come out on top.

• 18:22Steven Bartlett?

  One of the ways we learn about who we are, and I and I was, I guess that self story that I was talking about there is by looking at others. We can sometimes compare ourselves to our peers or those around us or whatever it might be and say, I know that I'm different because everyone around me isn't like this thing. They're not like, they don't have this trait or quality or think in this way that I do. When I look at your career and what you've done, it is remarkable because, as you said, you had so many other choices, but you chose what I consider to be the most tumultuous, struggle-filled one. And so I I when I when I sit here, I go, what is it about you? That's made you where you are today and this this great champion?

• 19:08Steven Bartlett?

  The character traits, the attributes, what is it?

• 19:12Speaker 00

  I've always had a strong mind. I've always had a strong soul. I've always known what I wanted to do. Uh, and that I was never gonna stop until I did it.

• 19:24Speaker 00

  I had a lot to live up to. You know, growing up, I was always Chris Eubank's son. You know, from an early age, I was like, yeah, but that's not my, I'm not Chris, that's not my name. My, my name is Chris. He made it even harder by calling me Chris. He made it even harder, this guy.

• 19:43Speaker 00

  But I knew that that's not, I couldn't go the rest of my life as that, as just being the son of. Well, that's Chris Eubank. I have to do something here to where people know me for me.

• 19:57Speaker 00

  That was a big driving factor. Becoming my own man, doing something that people would be proud of and that my family would be proud of. Uh, and that I could say was my own. Now, some people would say, well, then why did you go into boxing, which is, you know, the same sport your dad did?

• 20:17Speaker 00

  You know, it's a good question. I mean, I guess that, you know, I guess that competitive

• 20:26Speaker 00

  soul inside of me maybe wanted to see if I could be better than what my dad was.

• 20:33Speaker 00

  See if I could be better than the guy who said I, I wasn't tough enough.

• 20:39Speaker 00

  I'm sure that was in my mind in the early stages. Now that I've done so much, it's, it's not at all, you know, I, I don't ever compare myself to my father. People do all the time, you know, oh, who would have won in a fight if you, you and your dad fought or, you know, did, would you ever spar with him? Um, I don't, I don't think about any of that, you know? I just have to be the best fighter I can be. Because at the end of the day,

• 21:07Speaker 00

  especially in boxing, you know, you, you know, you, you're only gonna be competing with yourself. That's how you, that's how you elevate. That's how you get better. Not by focusing on other people. And I think that that goes for, you know, any industry. If you if you're constantly looking at other people and what they're doing and, you know, why they made it or why they didn't make it, you know, you you you're losing out on on you and what, you know, and on what is best for you and how you're gonna progress. I never looked up at anyone and said, I wanna do that and I wanna be there. I just, I always just thought to myself, you know what? This is gonna be so hard as it is. I don't wanna put any added pressure on myself. I don't wanna, you know,

• 21:49Speaker 00

  can I can I get as many wins as my dad or, you know, can I be more famous or make more money like? All that stuff is just, it's a, it just messes with your mind. So you just have to focus on day by day, week by week, fight by fight, just being the best you can be. And and that's what I did and I just built that up over the years. Until, you know, until I had made my own name and made my own uh path. Um, my father's always been there. He's always been there to support me and and guide me. I think he's now taken a a backseat a lot, a lot, a lot more than he was originally. He was frightened and sad at the beginning of my career, you know?

• 22:32Speaker 00

  You you look back on YouTube at the at the at the press conferences and the weigh-ins. He was right there, you know, and he'd be talking on my behalf sometimes. A lot of people would say, you know, oh, you you you're trying to steal your son's limelight. Um, to a certain extent, maybe he was, or maybe he, I don't think he was doing it consciously like, oh, I wanna, I wanna steal his sunshine. But it's just, he's such an entertainer, he's such a a people person, he just couldn't help himself. You know, he'd he'd have to get up in the middle of a a press conference and do some poetry or or talk shit to my opponent or he had to, he just, that's just who he is. Um, and early on, I actually didn't mind it because

• 23:17Speaker 00

  I was so hell-bent on just becoming a good fighter. I didn't even really wanna talk to the public.

• 23:26Speaker 00

  And I, and I, and I, I always got, and I still do get a lot of uh trolls online, social media. So it gave me like kind of like a bad taste for publicity and, and media and, and. So I didn't really even wanna deal with that. I just wanted to fight. I just wanted to get my record up so that people could start saying, okay, yeah, this kid's a bad boy. That's all I cared about. So it was actually him, he, he actually did take a, a lot of pressure off of me by him kind of doing the talking for, for a certain amount of years. Um, now that I'm established, now that I am, you know, where I am in the sport,

• 24:08Speaker 00

  that isn't needed. You know, I'm thirty two years old now. I can't have another man at my press conferences speaking on my behalf. It's just, it's, it's just not gonna fly. So for the last few years,

• 24:24Speaker 00

  he hasn't been doing that. I'm comfortable in front of a camera now. I wasn't comfortable at the beginning. The beginning I was very, and I look back and I look back at the, all these pictures I used to take with fans and, and interviews. And I was always very serious and stone-faced and not fun to really listen to in interviews. And people would say, oh yeah, I met you, I met you, uh, you know, I've, I've, I met you in, in two thousand thirteen, two thousand fourteen. Look, look, here's a picture. And then, and then, and I'd be sitting, I'd be standing up something like this.

• 24:58Steven Bartlett?

  Why was that? You just, you just had a bad opinion of that, no, that kind of?

• 25:04Speaker 00

  No, I just, I was just so serious. I was just so obsessed with boxing, like. And for me, when I'm in the fight, I don't play. You know, some guys, you know, they, they walk, they walking into the ring, you know, Manny Pacquiao's and Manny Joshua's and the high-fiving guys and smiling and, you know, dancing to the music. I'm not that guy. I can't, I can't be like that. If I know I've got a fight, I'm a barbarian, you know, I'm, it's wartime.

• 25:37Speaker 00

  And even though I'm light outside of the ring now, as an adult, what, e- even now, I, I, I still, once it's fight time, I'm not smiling. I'm not a nice guy. Now, at the start of my career, I guess I couldn't, I couldn't separate the fighter from the guy in the street. They were the same guy. So whether I was in the ring or I was taking a picture with a fan, I wasn't smiling, I was a serious dude.

• 26:07Speaker 00

  Now, as you get older, you, you know, you understand, you can't, you can't be like that around normal citizens because it's, it's, it's, it's just weird, you know, you, you have to be able to smile. I, I smile in all my pictures now because these pictures, they have them for the rest of their lives and, and they show them to their friends, their family. And what do you want? Do you want that? Or do you want, oh, he's a nice guy? Or, oh, he's an asshole. He couldn't even, he couldn't even smile. He looked so serious. He didn't look like he didn't want, you want to be there. You know, that's one

• 26:47Speaker 00

  thing I've learned is very important. Being in the public eye, you have to give people time and you have to be happy about it. Because, you know, one encounter is not just one encounter. If you meet somebody, you're actually meeting their friends, their family, their son, their daughters. You know, that one person, it's a spider web. So that one person is actually a thousand different people. And it's either gonna be, he was a really good guy. He was a cool guy. He said he took, he took a picture and he spent, you know, he spent time and talked to me. That's the, that's the story that goes out to the thousand people. Or,

• 27:32Speaker 00

  what an asshole, what a wanker. Which one of those stories do you want being spider webbed out into the universe, you know? And it all comes back around because you meet the friends, you meet the family. You see the tweet. Yeah, you see the tweets, you know, it all comes back around. So, good energy, positive vibes. Give people your time, you know? Because those pictures and those stories.

• 28:00Speaker 00

  Stay with them for the rest of their lives.

• 28:03Steven Bartlett?

  And becomes your karma.

• 28:05Speaker 00

  And becomes your karma. It becomes how people treat you that you've never met before. You know, you've really got to be aware of the power of your energy towards other people. If if you give off bad vibes and then you get bad vibes. If you're a good person, if you give people time, it all comes back around.

• 28:25Steven Bartlett?

  There's been this kind of perception because of that, because of you were very stone-faced, that you're unemotional. Sure, you've heard this before.

• 28:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 28:34Steven Bartlett?

  What's the truth in that? Are you unemotional?

• 28:40Speaker 00

  I've heard that. I've heard that word many times throughout the years with girls I've dated.

• 28:47Steven Bartlett?

  Oh.

• 28:48Speaker 00

  That's always been a really bad or hard thing for them to to get past is that I'm not an emotional guy. Apparently, I'm very hard to read when I'm in a relationship or on a date or whatever it is. You know, they don't know if I even like them.

• 29:11Speaker 00

  Am I emotional? No, I'm not. I have emotions, obviously, but, you know, like, for you to upset me

• 29:22Speaker 00

  is it's damn near impossible. And, you know, I will never shout. I I don't think I I can't remember the last time I shouted at somebody.

• 29:32Speaker 00

  I don't have that emotion to, you know, if you if you do something wrong to me or to disrespect me or okay, and then I just never see you again.

• 29:44Speaker 00

  I I don't get that, like, you know, what are you doing, you know? Like, that so many people get. I don't have that in me. I don't know why. You know, if I knock somebody out in the ring.

• 29:57Speaker 00

  I stand there.

• 30:01Speaker 00

  And look at them while they're on the floor, that's it.

• 30:05Speaker 00

  You know, ninety nine point nine percent of fighters, they they knock a guy out.

• 30:10Speaker 00

  Jumping up on some, you know, high fiving people. I see people crying, oh. You know, I don't, I don't have that emotion. It's like, yeah, I knocked you out. This is what I said I was gonna do. This is what I've trained for, for my whole life. So, yeah, that's what happened. Um.

• 30:31Steven Bartlett?

  Do you ever worry though that that's gonna get in your way a little bit in terms of, especially romantic relationships? Women are a little bit more emotional than men. Um, they're more in touch with their feelings. I mean, the data shows that quite clearly. So, do you ever think that's gonna inhibit you from forming romantic relationships?

• 30:51Speaker 00

  I mean, I've never really thought about it and it's not.

• 30:55Steven Bartlett?

  Cause she said you wanted kids. I remember hearing you say that.

• 30:58Speaker 00

  Of course, yeah. I mean, who doesn't? Um, well, I mean, some people don't, but eventually I do want a kid. But, you know, the woman I'm gonna have a kid with is not gonna be a woman that needs an emotional man. You know, some women don't need that.

• 31:14Steven Bartlett?

  Was your father emotional?

• 31:16Speaker 00

  No, no.

• 31:18Steven Bartlett?

  Your mother?

• 31:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 31:22Steven Bartlett?

  Father emotional at all?

• 31:25Speaker 00

  No.

• 31:26Steven Bartlett?

  Affectionate?

• 31:28Speaker 00

  I knew he loved me and that, you know, I knew I could, I knew he wanted the best for me.

• 31:37Speaker 00

  He, he was emotional enough to, for, for me to know that, uh, that's my dad and I would do anything for him. And I love him, you know? Some, some people don't have that relationship with their dads, you know? I love my dad, but I respected him and I feared him.

• 31:55Speaker 00

  Um, I did fear him. So, and that was, you know, he was very strict growing up. I couldn't get away with anything.

• 32:06Steven Bartlett?

  I think that's sometimes about myself. I think, you know, I actually grew up, I still to this day call my mum and dad by their first names. Never called them mum and dad. And then I, I think there was a lack of affection and emotion in my child, in my childhood. So I had to kind of learn growing up, how to be affectionate and emotional. I remember someone calling me their best friend and me feeling this like internal repulsion, like the fuck? Like, and then when I would, when I'd get into a relationship with, well, no, this is even worse. When I'd find someone that I fancied and I'd pursue them, the minute they showed interest in me, I'd, I'd reject them. And so until I realized that was going on and I had this like weird thing in me, it controlled me. And I meant that at twenty seven, I had my first proper relationship.

• 32:51Steven Bartlett?

  So.

• 32:51Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's.

• 32:53Steven Bartlett?

  I'd learned a bad model of affection, relationships and emotions. So.

• 32:58Speaker 00

  I feel like I've become a little bit more emotional as I've gotten older. You know, before, nothing could faze me, you know, doesn't matter what would happen, nothing would faze me.

• 33:12Speaker 00

  Up until a few, maybe, maybe over the last like two or three years, there's been a few times where I've watched movies

• 33:23Speaker 00

  and I'd get this like, you know, something sad would happen and I'd get this, this feeling, you know, like,

• 33:33Speaker 00

  and I, I never cried, you know, but, you know, that, like, that start of like, I might cry.

• 33:42Speaker 00

  And I was like, what, what the hell is this? You know, like, this is weird. And that's, that's only have started happening over the last couple of years. So I don't know if I'm becoming more mellow, uh, or I don't know, but I'm, I'm just, I'm just not an emotional person. You know, I haven't cried. You know, the last time I, well, I was, the last time I cried, I was, I was twelve years old. And then I cried again when my brother died last year. So, you know, that's, that's twenty years. In twenty years, I've cried once. So, yeah, I mean, I guess you could say I'm not emotional, but that's what I needed to be, to do the things I've done

• 34:26Speaker 00

  in the ring. That, that, that was, that was my journey. That was, that was how I was able to do it. Um, I had to get my emotions out to be able to perform ice cold. You know, some guys use their emotions to help them fight more. That was my path, you know? If I ever, if I ever felt emotions getting involved in, in, you know, whether it was hate or anger or being afraid, I would, I, I noticed that it affected my fighting negatively. I would make mistakes. You know, if I went into a sparring session, I really didn't like the guy, you know, and I went out there and really tried to hurt him, I'd actually hurt

• 35:09Speaker 00

  him less than if I was just cool, calm, cold and calculated, you know? I'd make mistakes. I'd attack when I wasn't supposed to attack, or I would, I'd move and I would do certain things, which I'm just, I'm only doing because I just wanna get him, you know? And it's like, boxing is a chess match, you know? At the highest levels, you have to think about everything that you're doing. The guys that think while they're in the ring, not just react, those are the guys who, who make it to the, the top of the top.

• 35:39Steven Bartlett?

  Have you ever had this conversation with your father about your emotions? About dealing with emotions, suppressing emotions, whatever? Because, I don't know, I struggle to believe that you're not emotional. As, as you've seen, you, you, it does come out in you, but it just seems like you've learned how to suppress and not express those emotions.

• 35:57Speaker 00

  I have never had this conversation with my father. No, we've never talked about emotions or feelings. Um.

• 36:07Speaker 00

  I'm not gonna say he's not that type of guy because he actually may be now at this stage in his life, you know, he's he's found God, he's very religious now. Um, so maybe I actually could have this conversation with him, but you know, ten years ago, twenty years ago, there's just no way I could never sit down with him and and talk about my feelings, you know, he'd be like, feelings, let me let me take my belt off and show you about feelings, you know.

• 36:37Steven Bartlett?

  Really?

• 36:38Speaker 00

  It was not, you know, very strict, very, um, yeah, very, uh, you you you I got away with nothing as a kid, you know, but I I I think I needed that because I was very boisterous, I was very, I had a lot of energy, you know, I got myself into this gang when I was a kid and, you know, I was going around, I was fighting, I was, you know, skipping school, um, the only thing that somewhat kept me in line was knowing that if I got caught or if I went too far, my dad was waiting for me at home.

• 37:19Steven Bartlett?

  Do you really think he would have taken his belt off if you had tried to chat to him about feelings?

• 37:23Speaker 00

  I'm I'm exaggerating that part.

• 37:25Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 37:26Speaker 00

  But listen, the belt came off many times.

• 37:27Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 37:28Speaker 00

  But when I stepped out of line as a kid.

• 37:30Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah.

• 37:31Speaker 00

  Um, you know, that strictness, those that punishment, uh, stopped me from going even more overboard than I already did. And I did go overboard, you know, you can go on YouTube right now and see a video of me street fighting at sixteen years old in the car park in Brighton. And I was doing that every other week, you know. So imagine what I would have been doing if I if I could if I could just have free rein, if I had nothing stopping me from doing anything, it would, you know, I'd be in jail, hundred percent. Um.

• 38:09Speaker 00

  You know, we're Jamaicans, we're built differently, you know, we're there's just something in our DNA which, you know, we we have this thing where we, you know, we like to cause trouble, man, I don't know why. Um. My father was the same, you know, he got into all types of trouble as a kid, you know, stealing and getting arrested and fighting, you know, that's just, I don't know, we just, we come from a bloodline of of ruffians, you know, it's just how we are. I'm a lot more refined now as an adult, you know, I look back at some of the things I was doing and I'm just like what was I thinking? I remember

• 38:55Speaker 00

  I went to college for maybe a month or two before I ended up moving to America. Some kid from the school that was opposite from the college had somehow gotten my number and I had got in a fight with his brother and these are these two really big kids. And he got my, he called me at like two AM, woke me up. He's like, yo, who do you think you are? I'm gonna fuck you, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna eat you, I'm gonna do all this stuff to you. You know, watch, wait till I find you, watch, hung up the phone.

• 39:31Speaker 00

  I knew who the kid was because I knew his voice. Right.

• 39:36Speaker 00

  The next day, I went into school with a baseball bat in my gym bag. So I have the gym bag, so obviously no one can see it. Lunch bell rang, went, picked up my bag, started walking across to the other school to find this kid.

• 39:56Speaker 00

  And when I say find him, I mean like, I was walking in and out of classes. I was opening the doors and seeing, you know, and the teacher was looking like, who are you, what are you doing? I'm like, don't worry about it. So I was walking from classroom to classroom to classroom to classroom. On your own? On my own, yeah, to find this kid. With the baseball bat in my bag and, you know.

• 40:22Speaker 00

  I thank God, I thank the good Lord above that I didn't find him. That I didn't see him.

• 40:31Speaker 00

  Because, you know.

• 40:34Speaker 00

  I walk into a classroom or I see him on the football field, I take the baseball bat out and I hit him with it.

• 40:41Speaker 00

  Finished. You know, one, I could kill the kid, I'm in jail for the rest of my life. Um.

• 40:50Speaker 00

  You know. I would, I would have been banned from going to America. So my, my whole, my whole foundation. Uh, everything that I learned going over to the States as, as, uh, at eighteen years old. Having my first amateur fights, training with Floyd Mayweather and his father. That would have all been washed away. I would have never, I would have never done it. So I would never have done anything in boxing because that was, that was, that start was what built me up. You know.

• 41:23Speaker 00

  You know, I just, so I just thank God that he wasn't there that day because that could have changed the path of my life. You know, and I just look back at that like, how, what were you thinking? Like, how stupid could you be? But obviously as a kid, you, you're not thinking about.

• 41:38Steven Bartlett?

  Consequences are America.

• 41:40Speaker 00

  You know, you, you, you know, you're just upset that some kid called you up and, and called you an asshole and said he's gonna mess you up the next time you see him. You're not thinking about traveling and getting banned and going to prison and you're just thinking, I wanna be a big man and, and, and show everyone I'm hard. You know, so it's just, you know, you have to have, that's why I say I, I thank God for my father as well for how strict he was because. You know.

• 42:05Speaker 00

  There were other times where there were things that I was gonna do. But I didn't do them because I didn't wanna suffer the consequences of my old man. So, um. Yeah.

• 42:19Steven Bartlett?

  You talked earlier about your, the death of your brother, Sebastian.

• 42:25Steven Bartlett?

  The first time I went to Dubai, I went to the gym there. And there was a young guy there that came over and offered to train me. And he trained me for about, I think, two weeks individually. That was your brother. Got loads of photos, hundreds and hundreds of photos of him training me on the bags there. I remember him as being just the most generous, pure. Pure is the word that I always come back to, giving person. He didn't ask me for any money. He never asked me for a thing. He trained me on the bags both times that I came to Dubai. And I wasn't, he didn't necessarily know who I was or what I was doing, but he did that out of the goodness of his heart.

• 43:10Steven Bartlett?

  And then he continued to message me and speak to me on Instagram about superfoods and we talked a lot about that. Obviously, he, there was a tragic accident and he passed away from that. What can you tell me about that incident and the lasting impact that's had on you and those, those around you?

• 43:29Speaker 00

  I mean, you know, this is fresh. This is, this only happened a year ago.

• 43:40Speaker 00

  And I never had to, I've never dealt with anything like that in my life.

• 43:49Speaker 00

  I told you, I'm not an emotional guy.

• 43:53Speaker 00

  The last time I cried, I said I was 12 years old. But the day I found out, I cried the whole day. I cried the whole day. I cried for like two days straight.

• 44:11Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, my, so my dad actually, I had Covid. I had Covid when I found out. My dad came to my house.

• 44:21Speaker 00

  He woke me up. He said, come outside. And I thought I'd done something wrong because he had, he had a look in his face which was.

• 44:32Speaker 00

  I don't know, I just couldn't, I can't describe it, but it was, I knew something was wrong. Um, so I thought that, you know, I don't know, I, I don't, I, I wasn't sure what, what, what I was about to hear. He took me outside, my little brother, my little brother Joseph, um. He's, he lives with me and I have an outhouse.

• 44:53Speaker 00

  Uh, so he lives there, he went and got him, and he sat us down and he told us, and, um.

• 45:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, I just started crying, man. It was, you know, one of the worst days of my life and, um.

• 45:09Speaker 00

  You know, it's just, it's so crazy to, to think that somebody that is so healthy, you know, like you said, he was telling you about the superfoods and. You know, he trains every day, you know, peak physical condition, um. Can just, you know, have a heart attack and just, just gone.

• 45:31Speaker 00

  Still, still just blows my mind, you know, um. I thank God that, you know, he didn't suffer, he didn't, he didn't really feel anything, he just went. Um, and I also thank God that he had a son.

• 45:48Speaker 00

  Uh, his son was born maybe a month or month before he passed. Um, and he, Rahim, and he looks just like him. So, we have that, you know, um, we have Rahim to carry on his legacy. And I thank God for that every day, um. You know, he's just now starting to walk, learning how to walk. He has a seven or eight teeth, he's, he's a great kid, very good looking kid, um.

• 46:23Speaker 00

  I guess that one instance, I feel like that has made me more of an emotional person since that's happened.

• 46:34Speaker 00

  It makes you think just like how before something that happens to you, you hear about all that stuff on your news and to other people and you see it in movies. And it's just like, no, well, whatever, you know, it doesn't, it doesn't really register. But when there's a death in your family, then then the next time you hear about someone passing away, then you get that immediate feeling of what you dealt with and then you start to sympathize and empathize and with the people that it's happening to that you don't know. And I never had that emotion before until, until this happened.

• 47:11Speaker 00

  And it just, you know, like I said, I had COVID. And that meant that I actually couldn't make it to his, his funeral, which is, you know, it's just crazy. Like I was in Florida for the whole of COVID, right? And when I say that these guys didn't care in Florida, like the beaches were full.

• 47:37Speaker 00

  No one's wearing masks. I, I, I remember going to the beach and I would walk along the beach, thousands of people and I'd be wearing a mask. This was like peak COVID. And people would be looking at me like, what are you wearing a mask for? Like, they did not care. I was in, I went to Texas. I was in Dallas for a month. I was partying every night.

• 47:54Speaker 00

  Never got COVID.

• 47:57Speaker 00

  And then the day my brother dies, I have COVID and I can't get on a plane and fly to Dubai for his funeral because I have COVID. And in the Muslim religion, they have to bury him as quickly as possible.

• 48:15Speaker 00

  They couldn't wait. I thank God that my family were able to go out. I had to stay.

• 48:25Speaker 00

  You know, I don't, I don't believe in regrets.

• 48:32Speaker 00

  I believe what's meant, you know, what's meant to be will be. And you know, you should be happy with whatever happens in your life, you know, but I would say there is one regret I have in my life. Uh, and that was. Uh, I actually went, so I hadn't, I hadn't seen my brother for quite some time. And, uh. I was, I had a holiday, this was, I don't know, maybe three or four months before he passed away. I stopped off, I had to stop off in Dubai and I stopped off in Dubai for like a couple of days before I flew to this destination.

• 49:12Speaker 00

  And, um.

• 49:16Speaker 00

  I didn't wanna, I didn't wanna see anybody. Uh, nobody knew that I was making this trip. I knew my brother was in Dubai and I didn't go and see him.

• 49:27Speaker 00

  I just, I didn't want people knowing I was in Dubai, so I just, I stayed in my hotel room and I didn't see anybody. And then I left and I went to the next destination. That's, that's probably the one regret I have in my life now is that I didn't go and see him, you know, cause that would have.

• 49:45Speaker 00

  That would have been the last time I would have saw him before he passed. Um.

• 49:51Speaker 00

  You know, and these things, it just teaches you, you've got to appreciate.

• 49:57Speaker 00

  And you've got to, um.

• 50:03Speaker 00

  You know, don't take anything for granted, nothing is guaranteed, you know, the people you love. Be with them as much as you can. Appreciate them, enjoy them. Don't get into fights, you know, don't do things which are just wasting time because. One minute they're there and one minute they're gone and then you've got to think about all the things you could have done with them or should have done with them. That you didn't because, you know, you're, you're too busy or you, you know, oh, I'll see them again another time.

• 50:34Speaker 00

  You know, it's, uh, it's, it's crazy how the world works, but yeah. Appreciate everyone at all times and, you know. Family is, family is number one, you know. Don't let anything ever get in between that, don't take it for granted, that's one thing I've learned.

• 50:55Steven Bartlett?

  You know, investing a lot of time in your relationship with Rahim?

• 50:58Speaker 00

  Absolutely. Yeah, we're on the phone all the time. I've got a million videos of him on my phone. My, my, my, uh, my brother's wife, Seb's wife, Salma, she sends me videos every day of Rahim. Um, they're coming over to England actually in a, in a month or so. And yeah, so Rahim is, is now my son, you know, that's, that's how I feel. Um.

• 51:28Speaker 00

  You know, yeah, she makes me wanna have a kid. I was never really planning on having a kid until after my career. And I still may not, but, um.

• 51:40Speaker 00

  I want Rahim to be able to grow up with

• 51:45Speaker 00

  my, my son, you know, I don't want them to be too far apart.

• 51:50Speaker 00

  Um, you know, me and my brother Seb, we were, you know, a year and a half apart. So we were very close, you know, we did everything together. Um, so I want, I want Rahim to have that. So, you know, within the next few years, we'll, uh, we'll see what happens.

• 52:07Steven Bartlett?

  One of the things I couldn't quite ascertain from Googling was if you are, if you are in a relationship or if you're dating, you keep, you keep all that stuff very private. I don't blame you to be honest, but I couldn't quite ascertain where you're at with that. Um, most things said you weren't, but is it

• 52:24Steven Bartlett?

  a part of your life?

• 52:26Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 52:27Steven Bartlett?

  Yeah.

• 52:28Speaker 00

  One thing I've learned is that relationships and social media don't mix.

• 52:36Speaker 00

  Um.

• 52:39Speaker 00

  I've just, I've seen social media mess up so many relationships. Uh, that I just, you know, I decided a long time ago that whoever I was with, uh, is not gonna be, it's not gonna be a public relationship. My life is public. People can see what I'm doing every day. I want something that's for me.

• 53:01Speaker 00

  Uh. You know, and you've got so many girls out there who.

• 53:07Speaker 00

  You know, they're they're just clout chasers, you know, they they just want, they wanna say that, you know, they're, look at me, look at these pictures, we went here, we went there. Um, I don't need that in my life, you know, I've got enough clout, I've got enough uh attention on me. So I I keep my private life private, so much so that I've actually seen comments online saying that I'm gay. You know, this guy's never in pictures with girls, he's never gotten, he's got no girls on Instagram, I think he's gay. I've seen that like multiple times and just, you know, I laugh my ass off whenever I see that. But yeah, I just, I just don't, uh, I don't believe in mixing the two. I don't, I don't see any positives from it, you know?

• 53:51Speaker 00

  People see something, if they see something, if they see people happy.

• 53:59Speaker 00

  Some, mo- most people yell, that's great, but there's, there's a large p- percentage of people that if they're seeing something happy, they, they wanna try and make it unhappy. That's what, as, as crazy as that sounds, that's what some people do, you know? So uh, I'm, I'm not gonna let anybody take shots at or try and muddy my relationship. Because I've seen it happen before, it will, you know, and it happened, it happens all the time. I believe a private life should be private and that's, that's how I've chosen to, to keep my relationships.

• 54:34Steven Bartlett?

  Good to hear, I agree.

• 54:36Speaker 00

  I'm not gay.

• 54:41Steven Bartlett?

  We talked a bit about um Seb there and his approach to like health and fitness. I actually looked back through my conversations with him before you came. And all of our conversations were about health and fitness. He'd asked me a few things about social media and some advice there, but did that incident also impact how you viewed the health implications of the sport that you do? Because, you know, you can get one, one hit in boxing and it can be, it can cause really bad damage, right? Did, has that brought it more into the spotlight for you that your, the fragility of your health and?

• 55:15Steven Bartlett?

  You know, I hear a lot of boxers talk about not overstaying their welcome. Tyson Fury this weekend after he won the fight talked about that as well. Has that, is that front of mind for you when you, you, you think about your career?

• 55:26Speaker 00

  I wouldn't say that what happened with Seb has, um.

• 55:32Speaker 00

  No, it hasn't, it hasn't affected how I think about boxing.

• 55:37Speaker 00

  You know, I've, I've been doing this game, I've, I've been in this game for a long time. I've been in fights where, you know, I've hurt people to the point where they, you know, have been in a coma. I, I've, I fought a, a man named Nick Blackwell. Years back and you know, he, he, uh, he got taken to hospital. He actually died on the way to hospital. They had to revive him with an adrenaline shot and he was in a coma for two weeks.

• 56:04Speaker 00

  You know, that, that was national news.

• 56:08Speaker 00

  You know, those types of incidents, of incidents are what really put things into perspective and make you think about what you're doing. And the risks and the implications. As a youngster, you don't think about it. You know, when something like that happens, then you do think about it and you, and you think about it even more as you get older. Because as you get older, especially in boxing, you.

• 56:37Speaker 00

  You're affected more by the punishment you take.

• 56:41Speaker 00

  I feel like when I was young, it's like I could do anything and I'd never get hurt. You know, at 32, you know, you pick up sit little injuries and, you know, you.

• 56:54Speaker 00

  The shots you take, you feel them that little bit more than you used to.

• 56:59Speaker 00

  You start forgetting things, you know?

• 57:02Steven Bartlett?

  Do you think that's correlated, that forgetting things? So what, you'd forget like a, a name or something and you'd, and you'd.

• 57:09Speaker 00

  Like my recall is, is a lot worse than it used to be. So.

• 57:15Speaker 00

  You know, in my twenties, um, if I couldn't remember something, I'd sit there. And within five seconds, I get it. You know, you do that thing when you think about it. Oh yeah, that's weird. Now it's 10 minutes.

• 57:32Speaker 00

  You know, I it's it's it's really embarrassing to say, but I I forgot the name of somebody one time. It took me a week, every day, sitting there, like throughout the day, whenever I would remember, what was the name, what was the name? And then a week later, bang, it just came to me.

• 57:53Speaker 00

  I just I could, and it was just nuts, you know, because now, now I force myself to remember, because it's like you're training your brain. It's called recall. So I'll, I'll force myself. If I'm, if I, you know, I could easily just go on my phone and what was the name again? Google. Oh, yeah, that was it. But now I, now I force myself to pull it out of my mind. Um, and that, there was one particular name and it took me a whole week before it just snapped back.

• 58:23Steven Bartlett?

  Do you have recall apps on your phone? I read that somewhere, that you had like a, an app on your phone to help you train your brain?

• 58:27Speaker 00

  So I have an app now. It's called um Elevate. And it's basically going to the gym, but for your brain, you know. So I've got here, so you've got like spelling, recall, eloquence, precision.

• 58:45Speaker 00

  You know, you, it's, it's, it's games, it's games that you play, you know, vocabulary, uh, math equations, you know, just little games to play each day and it just keeps your mind working. Your, your, your, your mind, your brain is like a muscle, you know, if you keep using it, the more you use it, the better it gets, right? The stronger it gets. And I think it's important, you know, especially because as you get older, you, you know, I do, I know, I notice it, you know, it's, I'll, I'll go into a room and I'll put my phone down somewhere. And then I'll walk off and then I, where's my phone? And then I'll walk around the room looking for the bloody phone. It's, you know, and it's like, I'm, it shouldn't, this should not be happening. Um, is that from getting hit in the head? I don't know. Is it just I'm

• 59:30Speaker 00

  getting, I don't know. Um.

• 59:33Steven Bartlett?

  Sounds like me, to be honest, and I don't get hit in the head.

• 59:35Speaker 00

  I don't drink, you know, you know, I got, I got friends, they drink every night, you know, and they're very smart guys, you know, they're in business, they're in economics, they're, you know, they, they're in tech, they. But they drink a lot sometimes. So it's like, and I, I feel like, you know, drinking kills brain cells, right? Just like a punch would. But they seem to be okay. I don't know. So maybe, maybe that, maybe that impact is, is just, it's just different. I don't know.

• 1:00:05Steven Bartlett?

  We talked about feelings earlier, right? Um, and how there's been a lot of sort of generational changes around men expressing their feelings. And one of the big changes I think I've seen in the last 10 years from 10 years ago, when I was what for 19 to now is this topic of mental health and men. And I think it's really been pushed to the forefront because the stats around mental health in our country, you know, you've heard them, we've all heard them, that the biggest killer of men under the age of 45 is themselves. And a lot of people point and go, well, why is that? A lot of the mental health charities cite that men don't express themselves enough. They're not emotional. They don't talk. And we've had all the campaigns about talking and, um, those kinds of things. Have you ever experienced anxiety or depression?

• 1:00:49Steven Bartlett?

  Or any sort of mental health, um,

• 1:00:54Steven Bartlett?

  ailment?

• 1:00:56Speaker 00

  That's one thing that I do thank God for is that I've never experienced any of that.

• 1:01:05Speaker 00

  It's hard for me to relate to

• 1:01:09Speaker 00

  hearing about people with depression and anxiety. Like, I've just never experienced anything like that. I know it's a thing.

• 1:01:21Speaker 00

  But I'm, I'm just an extremely happy and content person. And I'm not saying that to, you know, big myself up. That's just how I am. It's like, it doesn't matter what happens. I'll find

• 1:01:34Speaker 00

  the bright side. Or if there's something bad going on in my life, I'm, I'm able to just cut it off and move on.

• 1:01:45Speaker 00

  Or deal with it to the, to where it stops being an issue.

• 1:01:49Speaker 00

  Um, I've, I've never been the type of person that will let something affect me.

• 1:01:55Speaker 00

  You know, from day one in my career, I've had, I've been, I've been a target. I get a serious amount of shit online to this day. Uh, haters, doubters, non-believers. I have like a whole army dedicated to just sticking it to me on a daily basis online. It's unbelievable. Um, and the funny thing is if I walk out into the street, it's pictures, it's photographs, it's love. None of these guys are around. Why is that? I, you know, I, I got it at the beginning. Well, actually I didn't get it at the beginning. It really got to me because, you know, I'm, I'm young, I'm coming into the game.

• 1:02:39Speaker 00

  I'm trying to be the, you know, trying to do the best I can. And I've got people constantly coming at me. Oh, you think you're your old man, you, you, you're a copycat, you'll never be as good as him. Uh, you're a wannabe. You know, and when I, when I saw, when I first started experiencing this, uh, this hatred and this, uh, you know, this trolling, it did affect me.

• 1:03:05Speaker 00

  I didn't get depressed because I'm not the type of person, but angry, you know? Why are these people saying these things? What, what have I done to them? Um, I couldn't understand it, you know?

• 1:03:19Speaker 00

  Um, maybe that is why I had for so many years, that kind of, that stone wall when I was taking pictures of doing interviews. Because I'd seen so much, so much negativity online, you know?

• 1:03:35Speaker 00

  But then after a while.

• 1:03:39Speaker 00

  I I don't know, it it just it just switched one day and I was just like.

• 1:03:45Speaker 00

  Well, why am I getting upset? Why am I getting pissed off with these random guys? I know I know what it was. Some guy wrote something, uh, I think on my Facebook. I think I just had a fight and he said, um.

• 1:03:58Speaker 00

  Terrible performance. You're an embarrassment to your family name. I hope you get knocked out in your next fight, you scumbag. Right? I'm I'm a I'm a twenty two year old kid. Got so and you know, I'm I'm looking, I'm like, Jesus, like, you know, it's just nuts. I clicked on his profile. I was like, I've got to see who said this. I mean, who is this guy? He must be some amazing guy to be saying this to me. And, uh. You know, it was this. Fat. Bloated. Just nobody. And he was sitting on his couch with a with a beer. That was his profile picture.

• 1:04:39Speaker 00

  And he and it and he had his cat next to him and he was in shorts and like a wife bea. Um, you guys don't say wife beer. That's my American thing coming up. Uh, tank top. Um. And I was like, hold on, this is the guy that just called me a scumbag?

• 1:04:58Speaker 00

  I'm letting this guy.

• 1:05:01Speaker 00

  Affect my day? No, no, this has got to stop. And from that day on, I just realized it's not it's not even me. It's they're unhappy with themselves. They're unhappy with me. You know, the people that are trolling, you know, they've got whatever they've got going on in their lives. They're upset. They're unhappy. They and they're projecting that onto other people who are. Who they see as doing them doing well for themselves and they, you know, oh, he's look at him. He's, you know, he's got all that, you know? Let me see if I can bring him down. You know, I'm upset, so let me see if I can make him upset like. That sounds crazy to me to do that, but that's. What I've come to understand that some people do. You know, they're unhappy, so they want to make other people unhappy with them.

• 1:05:46Speaker 00

  As soon as I realized that. I never, I never worried about trolling or bad comments again. I actually, and now I actually enjoy them. You also must know that it's profitable for you. Absolutely. Mayweather taught us that. Absolutely, yeah. I mean, in boxing, that's another, that's another thing which made me stop worrying about it because I knew, after a while, I started, I started seeing these trolls at my fights. You know, I'd be walking to the ring. Boo, you're gonna get knocked out, what are they? I'd hear all this stuff walking to the ring. Right? And I thought, hold on a second. That guy bought a ticket.

• 1:06:29Speaker 00

  He paid to be there to, to shout at me as I walked past.

• 1:06:35Speaker 00

  And I'm, you know, I'm getting a percentage of that ticket. What am I upset about? All right, he shouted at me, but I've just made some money off the guy. So then, then I understood, right? You have to be a villain or you have to be a, a hero in the sport of boxing. Love or hate, you can't be in the middle.

• 1:06:59Speaker 00

  I have a lot of fans. And I have a lot of haters. Both buy their tickets, both

• 1:07:07Speaker 00

  buy their pay-per-view subscription to watch on TV. Both get online and talk and build a profile.

• 1:07:17Speaker 00

  The guys that are in the middle, they're the guys who don't do well because when you're neutral in the sport of boxing, people don't tune in, they don't talk, they're not interested. It doesn't matter how good of a fighter you are, if you're not a character that can inspire emotion, whether good or bad. Then on a Saturday night, when you get into the ring,

• 1:07:37Speaker 00

  you know, the people will be sitting there when they get off work or wherever they are. Oh yeah, he's fighting tonight, but there's this really hot girl and she's gonna be at this club. Yeah, I'm, I'm gonna go to the club. I'll, I'll watch the replay or I'll just, I'll find out what happened the next day. Yeah, I don't need to. That's what happens when you're neutral or when people aren't really that interested. If they hate you. Forget the, forget the girl in the club. I'm going to that fight to see him get knocked out. Let's go. Let's go. Forget everything else. And if they love you, forget the girl in the club. I want to be there when he wins. Those are the guys, love and hate, that will tune in, that will watch you every fight, that will talk about you. So that's one thing

• 1:08:21Speaker 00

  I learned early on. You have to be, you have to be a character. You have to be something that people can either get behind or get against. And that's very much, I feel, what I am. At the beginning, most people were against me because they saw me as a gimmick, as somebody who's just trying to make a quick buck, use my name to get a bit of profile, have a few fights, and then probably go on Love Island or Big Brother or whatever it is, and you know, whatever. But then obviously, as the years went by, win after win after win, a lot of the haters turned into fans. There's still a lot of haters left, but you know, we're working our way to making them into fans, slowly but surely.

• 1:09:05Steven Bartlett?

  Quick one. We bring in eight people a month to watch these conversations live here in the studio, when we're here in the UK and when we're in LA. If you want to be one of those people, all you've got to do is hit subscribe. Do you feel like your career is complete? And if the answer is no, what do you think is required in terms of your boxing career? With the knowledge that, as you said before we started, that there is a window of time where you, you get to do this, and you get to do it at the highest level. What is required, if the answer is no, to make you feel that your, your career was complete?

• 1:09:38Speaker 00

  It's an absolute no. I've had a lot of great fights. I've had a lot of great wins, but there's still so much more left, you know? There's still so many more big fights out there for me to, to take part in and to win. You know, I want to capture these world titles, you know? I've been a world champion at super middleweight. I'm back down at middleweight now. And, you know, the, the, you know, the map is wide open. There's, there's a lot of great fighters and they have belts, and I can get in with these guys and I can beat these guys.

• 1:10:18Speaker 00

  You know, boxing, you do have a short window, but I live my life correctly. I live the boxing lifestyle. Boxing is not just a sport, it is a lifestyle.

• 1:10:32Speaker 00

  You know, outside of a fight camp, I'm not drinking, I'm not doing drugs.

• 1:10:39Speaker 00

  I'm not overeating and blowing up in weight, which so many fighters do. And then they have to spend weeks or months cutting that weight back off to make whatever weight they're gonna be at on fight night. I don't do any of that. I stay in the gym. I stay dedicated. I stay healthy. I stay responsible.

• 1:11:01Speaker 00

  So that being said, I will be able to fight until

• 1:11:07Speaker 00

  I will be able to fight effectively and I would say until I'm thirty seven, thirty eight, thirty nine years old. I'm thirty two now. You know, my father retired at thirty two.

• 1:11:20Speaker 00

  I'm so, I'm, retirement isn't even close to what I'm thinking about. You know, I am financially stable.

• 1:11:29Speaker 00

  But there's still so much more money out there to be made. There's, there's still so much more accolades out there to collect. And I still have a lot left in the tank. So to answer your question, no, my career is not complete, far from it, even, even though I've had thirty four fights, you know, more fights than a lot of fighters have had and thirty two wins is still not complete. There's still so much more I'm gonna do.

• 1:11:57Speaker 00

  And the next few years

• 1:12:00Speaker 00

  are the money years and they are the years where I need to fight the best, beat the best and really cement my legacy.

• 1:12:09Steven Bartlett?

  We have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest asks the next guest a question. They never know who they're writing it for. They said hello, which is the first time anyone said hello, but hello, I was wondering what you believe happiness is and how it can be achieved.

• 1:12:28Speaker 00

  Um, as I said before, I'm an extremely happy person. I may not look it at times, but I'm very content. Um, I don't get angry, I don't shout, I don't put other people down. I don't wish bad on other people. Um, if someone's successful, if someone's doing better than me, I look up to that. I praise that, I respect that, you know. Other people, they see people succeeding or doing better than them and they think, oh, I wish he would trip up. You know, why has he got all that? Why is, why is she doing that and I can't do it? Don't be like that.

• 1:13:12Speaker 00

  You can never be happy if you're constantly comparing yourself to other people and, you know, not wanting the best for everybody, including yourself. You know, it's a mirror, life's a mirror, you know, you, you, whatever you're projecting is, is projected back to you. If you, if, if you're negative, that's what your life is gonna be. And that's whether it's thoughts, that's whether it's tweets, that's whether it's what you're saying to people. Everything comes back around, you know? So happiness is, is positivity, is being a good person, is being a genuine person. Um.

• 1:13:55Speaker 00

  You know, don't lie to people. If, if you think something's wrong, say it. You know, if you, if you think that somebody's doing something wrong or that they're on the wrong path, help them. Because you're helping yourself, you know? Be positive, that's the key to happiness.

• 1:14:17Steven Bartlett?

  Chris, thank you for doing this, it's been a huge honour. And I can't wait to see what you do over the next couple of years, in your money years, in and outside of the ring.

• 1:14:26Speaker 00

  And I thank you for giving me the opportunity because, yeah, there's not a lot of people that, that do get to see this side of me. You know, all they see is the big bad guy in the ring, who's throwing punches, you know? I don't do a lot of interviews like this, so yeah, I appreciate you, uh, putting me on here and hopefully the fans get to see a different side.