Private Chef Life (Part 2): Chef Olivia Tiedemann on Going Private, Breaking Pasta in an Emergency, and Her Worst Restaurant Job Ever

We’re back for part two of our three-part series on private chef work, this time with guest Olivia Tiedemann. She tells us how she went from the fine dining world of New York City, to working as a private chef, to Instagram stardom. Plus, we discuss: The “kitchen habits” from restaurants that we just can’t kick Fork It or Forget It: Breaking pasta in half How Olivia transitioned out of fine dining and her best advice for success in private work Working big events, including F1, South Beach Wine & Food Festival, and the Cayman Cookout Walk In Confession: Olivia tells us about the most incompetent chef she ever worked with Follow Olivia: @oliviatied Follow the show: @chefscutpod Follow Adrienne: @chefadriennecheatham Follow Joe: @insta.flamm

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Adrienne Cheatham?

  Welcome back to The Chef's Cut. I am Adrian Cheatham.

• 0:04Joe Flamm?

  And I am Joe Flamm. Age, so good to be back.

• 0:07Adrienne Cheatham?

  It is so good to be back, Joe, and this is gonna be part two of our private chef series. And if you remember, part one, last week, I revealed that I, Adrian Cheatham, am a part-time private chef. And the clip we posted on socials, Joe, I have had so many friends creeping up out of the woodwork that I didn't even know were doing private work, telling me that that's what they're into now. So this has opened up so many candles.

• 0:33Joe Flamm?

  Your private chef coming out party has been robust, A.G.

• 0:37Adrienne Cheatham?

  And what better way to keep that party going, Joe, than episode two of our three-part private chef series? We have none other than the queen of Instagram private chefs, Olivia Tiedemann. She has over four and a half million followers. And Joe, on this episode today, you're gonna learn things about Olivia that you don't see on the Gram. You're gonna learn how she got started in her private chef career, making that switch from restaurants, the places that her new career path of social media stardom are taking her, things that she loves, things that she absolutely hates, and a little bit of everything in between. And another thing

• 1:18Adrienne Cheatham?

  that I cannot wait for everybody to hear is her absolutely hilarious walk-in confession, which might be one of our best stories yet.

• 1:27Joe Flamm?

  You have a forking forget it that might get her to throw her computer. And I think you got a little game for us at the end.

• 1:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  I think so. Joe, let's get into it.

• 1:39Adrienne Cheatham?

  Olivia, thank you so, so much for joining us here on The Chef's Cut. It is great to have you.

• 1:46Speaker 02

  Thank you so much for having me. Honestly, this is, this is really cool for me. Way cooler for me than I'm sure it is for you.

• 1:51Adrienne Cheatham?

  I mean, you do so much cool shit. I find that hard to believe.

• 1:54Speaker 02

  I try, but I really like you guys. I don't know if I've mentioned that yet, but I was a huge fan. I watched your season, like, probably three times over.

• 2:02Adrienne Cheatham?

  No way.

• 2:03Speaker 02

  Yeah, you've been a favorite of mine for a long time. Joe will pretend he was a favorite of mine, too.

• 2:07Joe Flamm?

  That's all right. I'll take that.

• 2:09Speaker 02

  So can we be?

• 2:10Joe Flamm?

  I don't, I don't need, I don't, I don't need any honesty. I'm totally good with me.

• 2:14Speaker 02

  I actually, even before Instagram was like a major thing, like I wasn't big on using Instagram much, but I followed your restaurant, Joe.

• 2:21Joe Flamm?

  Oh, right, huh?

• 2:22Speaker 02

  Right after that season came out on Instagram. Like I followed what both of you guys were doing a long time ago. When I didn't really know why then.

• 2:30Joe Flamm?

  Well, we're so pumped to have you because like, you know, Adrian obviously lives in the private chef world too. And in my background, you know, the first restaurant I worked at, I worked for Art Smith, who I think is, you know, he was Oprah's personal chef forever. And I think it's such a fascinating world that people don't know anything about. So when me and Adrian started this, one of our goals was like talking to someone else who lives in that space. And so we were super, super stoked to get you on here. So thank you so much for taking the time. I know you travel all over the place. You do a million things. So we really, really appreciate it.

• 3:03Speaker 02

  Of course. Yeah. Thank you.

• 3:04Joe Flamm?

  So first thing to get into today. So one of the things, I brought this up to Adrian the other day. I was talking with a friend of mine. And I think it's like the chef version of like, you know, when you, those weird little things where you're realizing you're starting to become your parents. I think there's a chef version where it's like, you're starting to become that one chef you worked for. There's that one or two weird things that you picked up along the way. And my buddy was saying he hired a guy who worked for a guy he worked for. This guy's thing was that for service, you were only allowed to use two tablespoons of Malden. So you had to measure out two tablespoons of Malden salt. And that's what you had on your station for service. So he watched this kid set up a station and he saw him do the two tablespoon thing. And he was like, you worked for GM.

• 3:50Joe Flamm?

  Yeah. How'd you know? He's like, the salt. He's like, the salt gave it away. And like, you know, for me, I worked for Stephanie Izzard for a couple of years. And so like, one of my things from her was you were never allowed to 86 anything. Didn't matter time of day, time of night, what you had to do, who you had to kill, who you had to rob to get that thing. You did not 86. You know what I mean? You ran out of halibut, start driving towards the ocean and you find more fucking halibut. Steph's gonna burn your. So it's like, I still have that in my head where I'm like, we can't eighty six anything. So my question to you ladies today is kind of like, do you have that like one thing that was like a kitchen thing, a chef thing?

• 4:30Joe Flamm?

  You know, whether it's a towel fold or how you set up your cutting board where you're like, it's a weird, like non negotiable. Where you're like, I can't not do it.

• 4:39Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'll go first while you think about. So I, I was like super OCD. I started in pastry. I have OCD habits and once I form them, I can't, I can't go back to not doing them. So my towel fold is a hundred percent. When I stack them up, it's the letter fold. So the blue stripe is in the middle of the side towel. I have to fold each side and the seam has to be facing up. Fold each side in like a letter and then fold it in thirds again. And all of the stack, the blue line has to be lined up down the side.

• 5:13Joe Flamm?

  Wait, wait, did you say the seam is facing up?

• 5:15Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, there's a right, there's a right side and a wrong side. The seam, where the seam on the sides of the towels, that's the back of the towel. That's not.

• 5:22Joe Flamm?

  Oh, okay, okay. I thought you meant like the fold.

• 5:24Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh, no, no, no.

• 5:25Joe Flamm?

  I was like, that's.

• 5:27Adrienne Cheatham?

  No, that's way wrong.

• 5:28Joe Flamm?

  You should be put on a fucking list if you're doing that like.

• 5:32Adrienne Cheatham?

  That and I have to grind pepper each day. Like pepper mills, you know, if I'm using that for something that a bigger grind is okay, fine. But like, most of my day, I start and I like grind black pepper and white pepper separately. So that I have them fresh for each start of the day.

• 5:50Speaker 02

  Oh, you are crazy.

• 5:52Joe Flamm?

  You're still using white pepper?

• 5:54Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh, yeah. That's for fish.

• 5:56Speaker 02

  You know, weirdly, the pepper reminds me of something. I was gonna tell a totally different story, but one of the first chefs that I worked for in like a small place, never used pepper on anything. He just didn't really like it. And it changed my mind so completely about pepper where it's like not a mandatory thing. Like it's not salt and pepper every single thing, every single time. And it made me stop using pepper unless I actually wanted pepper. So maybe like not peppering things might be mine.

• 6:23Adrienne Cheatham?

  That's pretty deep. Damn. I mean, pepper is a spice, not a seasoning. So there are times where yeah, but wow, I hadn't thought about it like huh.

• 6:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, and people call it out like a ton in videos. Like I've real almost never use pepper. Like if I'm gonna put pepper on a steak, it's gonna happen like after. And it's just like something I don't even think about anymore. Those weird subconscious things where you like start to believe something is bad. Because somebody told you once, you know, kind of like how you were talking about earlier with like the malden salt and it's weird. It's weird how those things imprint.

• 6:52Joe Flamm?

  I think like I rarely do it on fish too. It's the same where it's like I'll finish afterwards with it.

• 6:57Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 6:58Joe Flamm?

  But I think like when I started cooking Italian food again, it's like, you know, it's definitely much more of a spice in Italian cuisine. And if pepper's there, it's like, we're having fucking pepper. You know, it's cacio e pepe, it's carbonara, it's amatriciata. It's things where it's like pepper is here and then it's making a fucking point of it.

• 7:14Speaker 02

  Mm hmm.

• 7:14Joe Flamm?

  I think people are so automatic with it, right? They're just like, oh, it's a piece of fish, salt and pepper. It's like, maybe.

• 7:19Adrienne Cheatham?

  It is overused. I agree with that. It's overused.

• 7:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, totally. And there's like a lot of other ways you get a little spice going on.

• 7:25Adrienne Cheatham?

  What's your other habit?

• 7:26Speaker 02

  Oh, God, I was having like a PTSD moment thinking about this one place that I worked where I was on a fish station and um. The fish always had more scales on it, like always had more scales on it. And this place was like huge and really, really busy. And it was inside of a hotel as well. And every single piece of fish, like this station was so chaotic. I had to wash and dry. Like every time just to make sure there were no scales left. And then we're probably selling hundreds of these pieces of fish every day because it was like. It was black sea bass. They were small and they were cut into like thirds and they had to get a crispy skin on them. So I'd be like rush speed washing all these fucking fish for every single scale. Before like having to then like dry them.

• 8:08Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, you're like patting them like.

• 8:09Speaker 02

  Like, yeah, as dry as they get.

• 8:11Joe Flamm?

  Giving CPR to them.

• 8:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, and get this nearly impossible crispy skin because it's not the easiest fish to get a crispy skin on. And oh, God, yeah. So that I now relentlessly like am scrubbing and washing fish anytime because I have this fear of being yelled at about a scale, even though. It's probably not that big a part of my life anymore. Like one scale wouldn't end the world, but there would end the world.

• 8:36Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah.

• 8:36Joe Flamm?

  No, you like can't shut it off. It's those weird things. It's like I used to, uh, I, the first chef I worked for, I would put like, I would put towels down on my station. Because I'm a, I'm a big guy, so I could never like wrap my apron twice and like tuck my towels into it. I can only wrap my apron once.

• 8:54Joe Flamm?

  And so like, I would put them down when I was doing something. I put a dirty towel down. So he would come on my station. He would pick up the towels and he would throw them in my face.

• 9:01Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 9:02Joe Flamm?

  So I'm like, like still to this day, this was 20 years ago. Like I'm a grown man who works for myself. And I'm like, if I put a towel down for a second, I'm like, oh shit. And I like pick it up.

• 9:12Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah.

• 9:12Joe Flamm?

  Put it under my arm like really fast. Cause I'm like, someone's gonna pick this up and smoke me in the face. Which has not happened in 19 years, but I'm still.

• 9:22Adrienne Cheatham?

  But it could happen. What if you popped out of the fucking pass and just like threw a towel in your face?

• 9:26Joe Flamm?

  Right. Just absolutely.

• 9:27Speaker 02

  Maybe I'll come to your restaurant and I'll find your fucking towel.

• 9:31Joe Flamm?

  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you come to my restaurant, you see me put a towel down. If you smoke me with it, I'll be like, god damn it.

• 9:38Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah.

• 9:38Joe Flamm?

  Damn it. The fear was real.

• 9:39Speaker 02

  I didn't, I didn't really get putting the, the, the rag in your, uh, in your apron tie. I don't feel like it's a comfortable place for that. I think leaving it on the counter, so long as it's not dirty, disgusting is totally fine.

• 9:51Adrienne Cheatham?

  I would leave mine on the piano sometimes, like in front of the burner, like on that big space. And it's not too close to the heat that it's going to set on fire.

• 9:58Speaker 02

  Um, yeah.

• 9:59Adrienne Cheatham?

  Because sometimes like if it, it, you know, I don't know. We wore all white, like especially at La Bernardette, everything was white pants, shirt, apron. So if I have like a smudge of like, I've padded my black bask in and then I have that like little bit of black water on the towel. And I put it on my side, then yes, my apron is now smudged and I'm going to have to go change because you can't have smudges in the kitchen. Yeah. Yeah. So I would leave mine down a lot.

• 10:24Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 10:25Speaker 02

  You know, I find that that's something people are always really surprised to hear. Like when I'm working, when I'm cooking, especially now that like I'm recording a lot more. I'm cooking and wearing like a chef coat and it's white. And they'll be like, wow, like you don't get anything on your clothes. And I'll tell the stories of like, well, if there was something. On my clothes in a lot of these restaurant environments, like if anything gets on your fucking stark white outfit, you have to go put on another one.

• 10:49Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yep.

• 10:49Speaker 02

  You know, people are so shocked to hear that. Like, it's funny the things that people don't know about like how it goes back there or like why you even wear white. It's kind of like it's meant to not get dirty. It's kind of a point that like you're gonna look pristine all day and it's hard to do. And now I can make tomato sauce at home in this white tank top and nothing will happen.

• 11:08Adrienne Cheatham?

  And even like the jacket, if you get something on the front, you know, the chef would be like, go, like, go to the corner. Go stand in the corner and flip your jacket to the other side.

• 11:15Joe Flamm?

  The demoralizing of being told to go change your chef coat too is like, you feel like a little kid, you know, they're like, they're clean your room. I want to clean my room.

• 11:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, like, like, feel like some kind of dirty little slob. Meanwhile, you're working so hard and anybody would probably be dirty.

• 11:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, would be much filthier.

• 11:37Adrienne Cheatham?

  So today I have a fork it or forget it that I think you will both have very strong opinions on, especially Joe Good South Side Italian. You know, Olivia, Brooklyn born and raised, also Italian and a pasta aficionado as well. So fork it or forget it. Breaking your pasta, spaghetti, dry pasta before you put it in the pot.

• 11:58Speaker 02

  Oh, my God, this is a question?

• 12:01Joe Flamm?

  That's not a question.

• 12:02Speaker 02

  This is a yes or no question?

• 12:03Adrienne Cheatham?

  People, people are doing it. People are doing it.

• 12:06Joe Flamm?

  This is like fork it or forget it. Are you into punting puppies off a bridge?

• 12:12Joe Flamm?

  It's like, no, that's insane. Why would you do that? It's like, I don't know, people are doing it.

• 12:16Speaker 02

  I have a weird take on it though, because I actually did this the other day, but before anybody panics. It's because I had, I was in Jamaica last week and

• 12:26Joe Flamm?

  International waters, no rules there.

• 12:29Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly. Um, I was so hungry and it was like really hard to get around over there. Like, I didn't have a car. We had this guy that would like take us places and he wasn't there and I was just hungry. And I found a bag of macaroni in the Airbnb, like just dry pasta, macaroni, but it was only a little bit. And then there was a box of fettuccine, I think it was. And there was also only a little bit.

• 12:50Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh.

• 12:52Joe Flamm?

  You want noodle kaboodle.

• 12:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, I did.

• 12:55Joe Flamm?

  You kaboodle.

• 12:56Speaker 02

  They're all up.

• 12:57Adrienne Cheatham?

  A Franken noodle.

• 12:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. So I snapped them into like, you know, little pieces so that they'd be about the same size and easier to eat. So in a survival situation, maybe you could do that. But for no reason at all, just breaking it to fit into your pot, you just need to get a bigger pot and I'm not interested.

• 13:17Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, no, I mean, it's like, get a fucking taller pot.

• 13:21Joe Flamm?

  Or like cook a short.

• 13:22Speaker 02

  Get a taller pot.

• 13:23Joe Flamm?

  Cook a shorter noodle. You're not ready for that long noodle that if you cannot figure out the logistics of getting a noodle that's only this fucking long into a pot, you're not ready for it. You're just not at that point in your cooking life.

• 13:35Adrienne Cheatham?

  I didn't even know that people were doing this. To be honest, I saw it and I was like, wait, what? And it was like, you know, watching my Italian boyfriend freak out while I break noodles. And I was like, wait, people break noodles? Like this is a thing? I had no idea. I literally had no idea.

• 13:50Speaker 02

  I mean, it's bizarre thing to do. Bizarre thought process behind it.

• 13:54Adrienne Cheatham?

  Like they're this long for a reason. Don't you think you should like?

• 13:58Joe Flamm?

  And I'm gonna tell you, I'm gonna tell you who it is because it's my own who are doing it. It's a goddamn Irish. You know what I mean? And it's, it's, it's a half Irish person. That is like, that is like my, my, my Italian grandmother would never. My dad's mom, thousand percent.

• 14:16Joe Flamm?

  She snapped that shit right in half, throw a can of tomato soup over it and you know what I'd be? It'd be like, this is spaghetti. And it's like, it's not.

• 14:23Adrienne Cheatham?

  Grandma Mary would freak out.

• 14:25Joe Flamm?

  This is a sin against humanity is what this is. There's no reason people should be doing that.

• 14:30Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay. So it's, it's a unanimous forget it.

• 14:32Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 14:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay.

• 14:34Joe Flamm?

  Yes.

• 14:34Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay.

• 14:34Speaker 02

  Hell yeah.

• 14:35Joe Flamm?

  You didn't, you didn't speak your mind on this, Adrienne. So don't be sitting over there in the corner. You better.

• 14:40Adrienne Cheatham?

  I did. I said, I didn't even know people were doing this. And so I was surprised that people were doing this. And I'm like, wait, this is a thing. So maybe, I don't know.

• 14:48Joe Flamm?

  Rogers Park, you know, relatives. So don't.

• 14:50Adrienne Cheatham?

  But my mom had big pots, like she came from a family of 12. So it's not like any cooking utensil in our house was small.

• 14:58Speaker 02

  You guys fight like this all the time?

• 15:00Adrienne Cheatham?

  All the time.

• 15:01Speaker 02

  That was a crazy bicker that just went down. These two have been going at it for a while.

• 15:05Adrienne Cheatham?

  That's two people who met in a competition.

• 15:09Speaker 02

  It's actually really sweet that you're both like still really close friends like this.

• 15:13Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh yeah, we kick it. That's my homie. Every time I'm in Chicago, I'm like, which restaurant should I go to? Joe's, like one of Joe's, whatever it is, it's gonna be one of Joe's restaurants.

• 15:21Joe Flamm?

  And I see someone who knows Adrienne probably once a week.

• 15:25Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, my family and friends.

• 15:27Joe Flamm?

  All her family is still here, you know, because one of us like stayed in the city we're from and one of us abandoned it. And so, you know, I think it's just nice for them to, to, to have that. You know what I mean? To have that sense of family from someone here.

• 15:40Adrienne Cheatham?

  Oh, yeah, yeah. All right, subtle shade he's throwing. Olivia, let's take it to line check and this is where we go a little more in depth and ask some questions. And really get your thoughts on some things that we find interesting in our industry and beyond.

• 15:56Speaker 02

  Hell, yeah.

• 15:56Adrienne Cheatham?

  So in the food world, especially now, private work is more visible. That was something that like you didn't really see before, you didn't really hear about before. But it's really opened up that career path for a lot of people. But most people who are in restaurants don't know how to get started in private work. So how did you make that switch from restaurants to private work? Like, how did you find your first private client and then build that career?

• 16:23Speaker 02

  So I, this is always a tough one, especially when people are asking for help or advice because, and I think this probably happens for most people that end up in private work. You kind of just get really lucky, like one time. You know, like you really just need one shot to get your foot in the door and it's hard to come by. But for me, I was working in restaurants and I was just severely unhappy. Like I kind of got really burnt out, you know? I was in like world domination mode for a couple of years. I was like, I just want to be the best. Like, I don't care about anything. And I was just kind of powering through for years and um I got really burnt out. I took a break.

• 17:02Speaker 02

  For uh just a couple of months and my dad was working as a grip on um a show. Like a TV show set and they needed a PA and he was like, oh, do you wanna come do this? And it was like the day I had walked away from my job and I was like never gonna go back in and I was like, you know what? Yeah, why not? So I did that job for like a month or so and just like kind of calm down for a little bit and I got a phone call completely out of the blue. From a friend of my aunt who was a private chef and she was moving on to like a bigger job. And she was looking for somebody to replace her. And I just picked up the phone and that was literally how that happened. Like she had mentioned to my aunt, like, oh my god, I need to find somebody.

• 17:47Speaker 02

  My aunt was like, oh, my niece is a chef. And it just worked out, you know, and as soon as I got that call, I was like, yeah, hell yeah. I mean, I think being a private chef is kind of a dream position for a lot of chefs because it can be such a brutal life and. It's just so much nicer to be a private chef, like you can kind of cook whatever, you can really follow things. Differently, you can pull off shit that's so much more fun and kind of invigorating and it was just like a dream for me. And so I went, I did that job. I didn't know it then, but it was actually in the client's mind. It was a trial, but I had like gotten rid of my apartment, like sold all my shit and like drove all the way to the Hamptons to do it.

• 18:29Speaker 02

  Cause there was no other way. That was just how the logistics worked out. So yeah, I went out there and the trial went well. Unbeknownst to me and I stayed and they were just fucking awesome. I just loved that job. So I would say something I always try to tell people if they do ask me is. To care a lot about the relationships that you do make. Like the impression that you're leaving on other people in a professional environment because you never know when somebody's gonna think of you for something. And if you ever do kind of get a shot like that, like you take it really seriously if you want it. And remember, you know, working in. People's houses and being trustworthy and being somebody that people want in their house and wanna be around.

• 19:11Speaker 02

  It's kind of half the battle with this. There's a lot of mediocre, not, I'm, let me not be an asshole and say that, but like. Not everybody's like, you know, dreams of being like the fucking best chef ever. You can be kind of a cook and be a private chef. As so long as you cook good shit. And um, you're, you're pleasant to be around and you keep shit neat and clean and, you know, you're a trustworthy person.

• 19:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  And people don't talk about that enough. Like you have to have enough front of house skill. Like you have to be able to be pleasant. Like you said. You're in somebody's home. So like, think about that way. You're coming home to somebody who's got just like. A black cloud of dark energy around them and they don't wanna make eye contact with you. They don't wanna answer direct questions. That's not gonna be the kind of person that you. Take past the trial. It'll be like, no, this person's gotta go. We need somebody else. And people don't talk about that at all in private work, that that is such a big part of it. It's just, don't be a dick. Be professional.

• 20:06Speaker 02

  Wouldn't it, it would be weird if there's somebody in your house that's cooking for you that you're like uncomfortable around. You gotta be able to keep people a little bit at ease.

• 20:13Joe Flamm?

  See, I think that would make it actually really feel like family. You know what I mean? Like you're a little bit scared of them. Like this person might just start yelling at me at some point. It's like, then it's like, oh, it's like.

• 20:23Speaker 02

  Sounds like you might be interested in that. Maybe we could, maybe we can arrange that.

• 20:26Adrienne Cheatham?

  Maybe, I mean, there might be somebody in the Hamptons hiring for next summer. And how long did you keep that client for, Olivia?

• 20:32Speaker 02

  I actually just visited them again this summer because they're so sweet. And so I worked for them for the past like three years. I, I think it was three summers ago. And then obviously I can't really do it full time anymore, as much as I truly want to. So this year. Was the first year I couldn't fully work for them, but I went out to the Hamptons and I arranged with their house manager to help me sneak in one morning. On the lady's birthday. So I like snuck into their estate, into their kitchen, started making breakfast and they came downstairs and um. I was like, surprise. And she was like, what the fuck are you doing here?

• 21:08Joe Flamm?

  That's awesome.

• 21:10Adrienne Cheatham?

  That is, that's so cool.

• 21:11Joe Flamm?

  I think part of the, I think the private industry is so interesting because it's, I feel like everyone I know, and like, why we wanted to ask you that question is because like, most of the private chefs I've talked to, like, how they got their job, it's like purely reputation based, right? And I think like you nailed it. It's like, not just about like your cooking prowess, but like, this is a person who you'd want to be around. You know what I mean? Like Adrian kinda had like a similar path of, you know, I think how she got into it. And like, you know, Art Smith did it and it was like, he was doing like fruit carving demos at like Williams Sonoma. And like someone from Oprah discovered it and then Oprah was like, come be my private chef. And he was her private chef for like 20 years. And it's like, what? Like, so I think it's just such a unique path, right?

• 21:54Joe Flamm?

  Where it's like, you can get into it, but I think the people who really do it and have done really well at it are so reputation based. And it just, you know, like, kinda like you said, somebody knew somebody and called them and was like, this person's great. And then you get your foot in the door and you're like, oh yeah, I'm never leaving. This is where I want to be.

• 22:10Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, and people don't talk about that enough. Like, people who are regulars, like the people like Olivia's client, they probably have relationships with some of the top chefs and restaurants in New York. So they'll say, hey, do you guys have anybody that's leaving or that you could recommend for me? I need a new private chef. And that chef will think of former, you know, usually they, they want somebody who's been in a management role, sous chef or CDC. So they'll think about their people who were good people that would pair personality wise before the cooking part of it. Because every client is different. So you can be a great fish cook, but this client doesn't eat any fish. Or, you know, you're a great meat cook, but this person is a vegetarian or vegan.

• 22:56Adrienne Cheatham?

  So the chef will first think about employees and cooks and chefs that they had come up through their ranks that were good people. And they don't talk, you know, that's something that's really, really important because if your reputation was that you were, you know, a triggering shitty person in the kitchen, they're not going to recommend you to any of those clients coming through.

• 23:14Joe Flamm?

  To go be in somebody's house. Like, oh, this guy's a great cook, but total asshole. No, thank you. Like, I'll come see him at the restaurant where I don't have to talk to him.

• 23:26Joe Flamm?

  So my kind of secondary question of this, and this is one that I'm always really curious about because like age and I talk about a lot like because she does, you know, obviously a ton of events, you do a ton of events. And I think like the, the, how do you like, when you're doing these big events, like, you know, do you have like people already who are like your road dogs?

• 23:44Speaker 02

  Yeah, you're doing the Vegas Grand Prix.

• 23:46Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 23:47Speaker 02

  Oh, my God.

• 23:48Joe Flamm?

  Vegas Grand Prix where you're like, you call up, you know, Tina and you're like, Tina, we're going to fucking Vegas, pack the knives, meet me at the airport, let's go, we're rolling.

• 23:55Speaker 02

  Tina, we're going to Vegas. I wish I knew where Tina was.

• 23:59Joe Flamm?

  You know what I mean? Like, do you like, how do you, because like, I don't think people realize like what, you know, we've all done big events where it's like, you know, for me, it's like, I have, you know, like my little mini militia of cooks in Chicago, where it's like, we can roll fairly deep to something.

• 24:14Speaker 02

  And you can prep and pack and ship.

• 24:17Joe Flamm?

  And I could prep and pack and ship at the restaurant. So we show up, we open bags and we cook, we're ready to roll. But it's like when you're cooking out of, you know, your home or someone else's home, it's like, you can't make 11 boxes of food, cryo vac them all, and then, you know, fly to Vegas.

• 24:32Speaker 02

  I feel so seen by this line of questioning.

• 24:35Joe Flamm?

  It's just like, I don't think people realize like, that's a monster lift. Because like, when I was in between, like, you know, restaurants and I'd have to do dinners and it was like, I was cooking out of my house. I was like, this is night.

• 24:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:46Joe Flamm?

  And so I'm always curious about like, how, you know, chefs in like, the line of you and Adrian, like, how you set that up, how you do that to, to make it feasible.

• 24:55Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, that is a really good question, and I can't wait to talk about this. Um, so I have not really had people or like an infrastructure at all. And when I started, you know, all this started just really fast for me and just like, all at once. And then all of a sudden, I was being like called in to do different shit. Like last year, I did F1 as well. And that was, it was like 3, 4,000 people we were cooking for. I had to make three different, it might have even been four different dishes. And I had no one. I went there alone. And fortunately, like, the actual event itself, like they'll, they have people that work there, they intend for this, but everybody else in that lineup,

• 25:36Speaker 02

  I don't know how I ended up in that lineup. Also, it's like John George and like, Morimoto are there. It was like 18 people. And they have restaurants, they have like staff, and they have people that can help them carry out this vision. I just kind of had to depend on whoever they handed me from the hotel. They did a great job. No shade at all. I'm just saying like I don't have my own people.

• 25:57Joe Flamm?

  Right. John George and Morimoto have seven people who are on the email.

• 26:01Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah.

• 26:01Joe Flamm?

  With them before they even respond.

• 26:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, and it was fucking hard. And like I've encountered situations just like that one a lot. That was just the biggest one. And I've never had people really, or even recipes like written out, ready to go for these things. Like now I've just finished my book. So now I do. Like I just kinda got to a point where I can somewhat control what's going on. But no, like it's just been me trying to figure shit out a lot of the time and just trying my best. One of the first events that I did actually, and this is where I learned that things are gonna be a little, a little hairy. Was food and wine in Miami like last year, year and a half ago.

• 26:40Joe Flamm?

  Oh, South Beach one?

• 26:41Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah. I started online two years ago. So that's when everything started popping. Actually, yesterday was two years.

• 26:47Adrienne Cheatham?

  Aw, congrats.

• 26:48Speaker 02

  Thank you. And it was in, I guess it's February, right? South Beach is when the first event was and I showed up there. They asked me for all these really, really specific details, like down to the, the most annoying detail of everything I was gonna cook for this like three course dinner event. And I get there after like the chefs in the hotel had berated me for like all this information down to the gram. They, they didn't even have the stuff. Like they didn't even have the stuff in there. I think they were fucking with me. I think they thought I wasn't gonna figure it out. And I got there, day of in Florida. And I did figure it out. They didn't have my fish. I was like, you're gonna get a fucking fish. And they got the fish and I prepped, honestly, I prepped all of my shit completely by myself while everybody in this room.

• 27:31Speaker 02

  Kinda just like did whatever else they were doing. And I think that they thought it was like funny. And then I did it all. And then what's funny about that?

• 27:38Adrienne Cheatham?

  Right. And that was three courses for how many guests?

• 27:41Speaker 02

  A hundred and twenty-five.

• 27:42Adrienne Cheatham?

  That's crazy.

• 27:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 27:43Joe Flamm?

  That's, and it, cause it's like, I always tell my chefs now, I'm like, they're like, oh, they'll say we have help. I'm like, don't trust these people. Don't trust anyone. I go, we are gonna.

• 27:51Speaker 02

  Don't trust anybody.

• 27:53Adrienne Cheatham?

  Cause they could tell you they have and then be like, oh, we have five people to work with you. You get there and it's like, oh, they're all tied up. You're on your own. What? Like, I'm like, are you kidding me?

• 28:03Joe Flamm?

  I got absolutely burned by that one time when I was like a young CDC and I was like, never again. Never again is this gonna happen to me. And so it's like, I roll in with everything. I'm like, we are ready for anything. If they don't order any food for us, it doesn't matter. We'll go to a store, we'll pick it up, we'll get it. We like, these are the three stores that exist there.

• 28:22Speaker 02

  It's crazy how you have to get fucked like that once to know that a fucking can happen and that you're not gonna let it ever again.

• 28:29Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, I mean, not, not having your ingredient, like, why ask me for measurements down to the gram if you're not gonna execute some of the bulk prep? On the recipes for me or have the stuff in-house? Like, what is that about? Do you feel like they were doing that because would have done that if you were coming from a restaurant?

• 28:45Joe Flamm?

  Dude, South Beach is a shit show. South Beach is a, no, South Beach is a shit show. And like, I know you can't say this, Adrian, because you live in Miami and you might do that event again, but I never plan on doing it again.

• 28:55Adrienne Cheatham?

  I haven't done that since I was working for Marcus.

• 28:57Joe Flamm?

  That one it is. And it's like, normally I would say, I would think, I would, if I were you, I would definitely take that personally, but I'm a child. But like, I think like, South Beach is just always one of those ones where it's like, like, I don't remember them telling us like, rules of what we had to wear in the hotel kitchen. They're like, you need to be in a white chef coat and you need to like, do this. And I'm like, it was like, for fucking who? You know, the last time we did it was like 2,000 portions or something. I'm like,

• 29:24Adrienne Cheatham?

  Olivia, I feel like if you posted an Instagram story and just said, looking to build a team for events, you would have some top-notch people who would like be your advance team. Like the president, you know, like, get, get prep started. I have a few people that I've worked with in restaurants that when I do events, I call them up usually as far ahead as possible so that they can arrange their schedules. I give them a 12-page breakdown on everything we're doing. And we roll up in there and just knock it out of the park. And sometimes I can't get anybody to come with me because people have jobs. So don't get me wrong. Sometimes I'm in there on my own, executing a thousand lobster beignets, but sometimes, you know, Joe will send me a sous chef from his place.

• 30:07Joe Flamm?

  And all she sends me back is a fucking snow globe, you believe me?

• 30:11Adrienne Cheatham?

  You're lucky you got your sous chef back.

• 30:13Joe Flamm?

  He's awesome.

• 30:14Adrienne Cheatham?

  Everybody was trying to steal him. But yeah, it's like, I really feel like you, you could build such a great team because people love your food, they love your personality, and they would be so motivated to like, work with you for that.

• 30:28Joe Flamm?

  But it's like, yeah, you're two years into this wild ride, you know, it's like, you know, how do you know how long and fast it's gonna go? So it's like, it's not like when you build a restaurant, you're like, oh, I have to have a sous chef, right? I have to have a dishwasher. You're like, they just asked me to do this, I have to show up.

• 30:43Adrienne Cheatham?

  Right.

• 30:44Joe Flamm?

  And hopefully, they have people for me. Like, I don't think people get how crazy that is. It's like, you showed up to cook for 3,000 people, like, by yourself with a bag of knives. And like, just like, like, yo, they said it's gonna be cool, and I'm really, really hoping it's gonna be cool. Or like, this is going to be the last time I cook.

• 31:07Speaker 02

  No, you're so spot on, because that was the scariest day of my life. And going there, I just knew, I had no idea what I was about to walk into, too. But this year, I'm actually doing it again. So it went well enough that they asked me to do it again.

• 31:20Joe Flamm?

  That's awesome.

• 31:20Speaker 02

  And I do have two, I got two ladies that I know that are also private chefs that are gonna come and help me this time.

• 31:28Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 31:28Adrienne Cheatham?

  That's awesome.

• 31:29Speaker 02

  So hopefully, it'll go a little bit, maybe even better.

• 31:31Adrienne Cheatham?

  Because you want to be able to enjoy your time there, too. You don't want to be in the kitchen, like, you know, 22 hours out of the day.

• 31:38Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 31:38Speaker 02

  Yeah. You also want to like, make sure, it's harder to execute things at a really high level when you're operating like that, like, just on your own. You kind of have to just like, fucking rush. So it's not gonna be as pretty as you want it to be, or it's not gonna be, you know what I mean? And I just don't want that to happen.

• 31:51Joe Flamm?

  And you just can't possibly get eyes on everything, right? When you're that buried in it. When you are so involved with that prep, that it's like, you're not able to like, take a step back and be like, okay, everybody's plating this the way I want. Everybody's doing this. And it's like, and when you're talking about, you know, 125, you could troubleshoot. When you're talking about 2, 3,000 people, whatever decision you made has been made, and that thing is rolling.

• 32:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 32:16Joe Flamm?

  There's no fixing it, there's no changing it. It's like, you can't be like, oh, you know what? Actually, I want to add mushrooms to this. It's like, oh, okay, let me just go get 1,100 pounds of mushrooms to throw on this dish right now.

• 32:26Adrienne Cheatham?

  Wash them, prep them, cook it, right.

• 32:28Joe Flamm?

  That'll only take us 11 hours. We got you, chef.

• 32:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 32:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  So you've been doing a lot of big events lately. What was like the first big event that you got invited to do that you were like, holy shit, this is beyond social media. This is like back to cooking and being in the kitchen and like, whoa.

• 32:48Speaker 02

  I mean, I hate to be repetitive, but the best answer to this is F1 last year. Like that blew my mind when they asked me to do that.

• 32:55Joe Flamm?

  Was that, was that Austin or was that Miami or where was that one?

• 32:58Speaker 02

  Um, it was in Vegas.

• 32:59Joe Flamm?

  Oh, it is Vegas. This is the same one as this one. So.

• 33:01Speaker 02

  Those are the first time I went to Vegas. That's an interesting place.

• 33:04Adrienne Cheatham?

  Wow.

• 33:05Speaker 02

  Um, but yeah, that, that really was like a coming to God moment. I was like, holy shit. Like where, how, how did I get here? You know? So that was really cool.

• 33:15Adrienne Cheatham?

  Through hard work is how.

• 33:18Joe Flamm?

  It's gotta be like a cool moment of like, you know, I felt like for me, like the first time I saw my name listed with like one of my old bosses as like, not like the person helping her, but it's like, oh, we're both doing this. Where it's like looking at that menu and it's like John George, Morimoto, you know, Olivia and you're just like, what the fuck?

• 33:38Speaker 02

  For John George and then I did that event and I was on the lineup with him. And it was like that exactly what you're saying.

• 33:46Adrienne Cheatham?

  That is so awesome.

• 33:47Joe Flamm?

  Good to see you.

• 33:48Adrienne Cheatham?

  Right.

• 33:48Speaker 02

  Yeah. And I went and I saw him and I visited him in his restaurant and he didn't even know I worked for him. Cause he has so many. And also it was COVID time. So I guess I was wearing a mask, but he had no idea. And then when I, when I told him, he seemed a little nervous. Like everybody got a little tight when I said it in the room. And I was like, oh, it's cool. Like I loved it there.

• 34:07Adrienne Cheatham?

  It's not like you were gonna tell bad, bad stories. Like I, I got PTSD from working there.

• 34:13Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 34:13Speaker 02

  No, no, I actually liked that place better than any other place. I think.

• 34:17Joe Flamm?

  I, I, I cooked a tasting for two guys and they didn't remember. And I told that about them later when I was doing an event at their restaurant. And they were like, oh yeah, like, you know, we didn't like really know you around. I was like, I cooked a tasting for you guys like seven years. So they were both like. But I was like, yeah, you didn't give me the job.

• 34:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah.

• 34:33Joe Flamm?

  Uh, uh, and I was like, that's good. Like, everything worked out. Like, it's all about that.

• 34:39Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, when, uh, when Repair invited me to do the Cayman Cookout, which is his food festival down in the Caymans in January. It's like always over MLK weekend in Grand Cayman Island at the Ritz Carlton there. And I was like, did he mean to send me an invitation to cook at this? I was like, wait, I'm doing like a beach demo and like a plated course out like lunch and another like event doing a course. I was like, did he like, you know, mean to email somebody else and type my name in by mistake? Cause like we keep in touch. It's like, no, Adrian, I wanted you to do this. I was like, oh my God.

• 35:14Speaker 02

  Oh my God, I love that.

• 35:15Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, I think I texted you right after I saw that. I was like, oh shit. I was like, you're like, even, cause that, I think you went the same year. Maybe Steph went for the first time.

• 35:23Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay.

• 35:23Joe Flamm?

  Even like she was like, you know, she's done every event. She was like, holy shit, like Cayman.

• 35:28Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, it was me, Kristin Kish. It was her first year. It was my first year doing it. And there were just a bunch of other chefs and it was so cool. It was so awesome to like be in that headline. And then I brought my sous chefs with me and they crushed it. And I was getting compliments, you know, on my team. And they're like, but you don't have a brick and mortar restaurant. So it was like all the chefs in there were like, they couldn't wrap their mind around somebody who doesn't have a brick and mortar restaurant being invited to do the event. And being able to assemble a team. And it was just like, no, like you have the background. Failure is not an option. When you come from like restaurants, like whatever it takes to make it happen, it's gonna happen.

• 36:10Adrienne Cheatham?

  So I will like, I'll see you, I'll see you when the dishes come out. Like, uh, we'll both get to the finish line.

• 36:15Speaker 02

  Wow. That makes me feel a lot more, uh, prepared for the future.

• 36:21Adrienne Cheatham?

  Well, you're already crushing it, so you're good.

• 36:22Joe Flamm?

  And you need some sous chefs. You can be an agent call. We'll, we'll, we'll hop on a plane.

• 36:26Adrienne Cheatham?

  Hell, yeah.

• 36:29Speaker 02

  Joe, do you want to take us to walk in confessions?

• 36:32Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, so we all came up through this and we all have those days where it was like, you either were like, this is the worst day of my life. This will be my last day on the line, last day in the kitchen. I'm never gonna make it back from this. And you do it, it's okay, it's fine. Or those times where everything completely goes sideways behind the scenes. And like, you somehow make it through, you get the dinner out, nobody's any of the wiser. And you're like, we were this close to calling like, the fire department, NSA, and like, three other departments to like, shut this down. Also, like, private chefs always have really good ones, because you guys do events everywhere, every place. Or from your line days, of just like, one of those days where it's like, everything went sideways and you hung with it.

• 37:10Speaker 02

  God, we gotta do this.

• 37:15Speaker 02

  I mean, instantly, what comes to mind is like, one of the very last places I worked, I worked at this really tiny restaurant, I'm not gonna name it, because we're about to, we're about to tear it up. But a small place, um, really small, full of broken promises. And, uh, this was, this was the first time I was a head chef. And, um, we had a really hard time with the, like, employees. And fucking, maybe it was my fault for being like, inexperienced at the time. But we had a lot of, just like, a revolving door of like, really, kinda, kinda bottom of the barrel workers in the kitchen. It was just, it was so hard.

• 37:56Speaker 02

  And I, one week, like, I was really losing my shit. And it was a small line, it was a pretty small place. And I realized that I could kind of do it myself if I had to, because there were days where like, I would, me, I'd be flipping out with this guy, or like, this guy just completely disappear, we have a new guy, whatever the fuck. It was a bad system. And there was a day, it was me and like, the last guy.

• 38:23Speaker 02

  Like, the guy that we had that week, we had one guy left on this particular day. And, um, I hated him so much.

• 38:36Speaker 02

  And I asked and I asked him to bring me the chicken stock from the fridge. I asked him to bring me the chicken stock from the fridge and he came back with a bucket of Dijon mustard.

• 38:51Speaker 02

  And I was like, I was so at the, look at the vein in my neck right. I was so like at the end of my fucking rope and it was, I was so stressed. We've been on and off working alone the whole fucking week. I looked at this bucket of Dijon mustard and I was like, get the fuck out. Get out. Get out.

• 39:11Adrienne Cheatham?

  And this is the last man standing.

• 39:13Speaker 02

  The last man. Like, so then it was just me.

• 39:18Speaker 02

  And he was like, what? Are you sure? I was like, get the fuck away from me. Get out. Please get out before.

• 39:25Joe Flamm?

  Take your fucking mustard bucket with you and get the fuck out.

• 39:29Speaker 02

  Take your fucking Dijon and get out. And he left and then my boss like, cause they're like, the owner called. He was like, why did you do that? I was like, fuck you. I, I don't need you to understand. You keep sending me like these idiots from your other place. Like this is not, I don't care. I don't want him back. He's like, he'll come back. He'll do good. I'm like, no, he won't. I will finish this today. Probably finish it tomorrow. Maybe I won't be alive next week. Let's see what happens. That was a dark day.

• 40:00Adrienne Cheatham?

  Sounds like it.

• 40:03Joe Flamm?

  So did you just run service by yourself that day?

• 40:06Speaker 02

  Yeah. And, and a lot of, a couple of days at that place. Like, I won't say a lot, like it was multiple weeks in a row or anything, but it would be sporadically, I would. Like, once I realized that I could, it gave me a little freedom to be like, okay, if there's like a actual crackhead in here and I don't want him here, like I think they could go.

• 40:21Joe Flamm?

  It's either me and mustard bucket guy, or I'm just gonna hang out by myself here and cook and that. And not, and not murder mustard man.

• 40:31Speaker 02

  But it wasn't much longer there. No, it was maybe, I actually ended up getting COVID and I couldn't taste anything for a little while. And so I caught like a like two weeks off because I got COVID and that was nice. And then I came back and I couldn't taste for a while.

• 40:47Adrienne Cheatham?

  That is the chef-iest thing I've heard today where you're happy to get sick because you can finally get a day off.

• 40:54Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 40:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, that was amazing. I was like, damn.

• 40:57Joe Flamm?

  Yeah, my body has revolted against me hard enough that it has to shut down.

• 41:01Adrienne Cheatham?

  Yeah, I used to hope sometimes I'm like, if I get hit by a car today, I get a day off.

• 41:08Speaker 02

  You just said something so important, the holding it against you. If you did like if if I had gotten hit by a car, somebody would have hold it against me.

• 41:16Adrienne Cheatham?

  Well, we have a couple of minutes left, so I want to throw a curve ball and throw in a quick segment. This will be fast and furious and fun, I promise. And Joe, I know you love my cheesy names.

• 41:28Joe Flamm?

  That was like, I hope she's not naming it. God, for the love of God, don't let her have a name for this thing.

• 41:33Adrienne Cheatham?

  You're welcome. It is, we're gonna call this segment Turn and Burn.

• 41:36Joe Flamm?

  Okay, that's not so bad.

• 41:37Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay, see, I'm getting better. It'll be kind of this or that type questions. So I'll give you two options, Olivia. You pick yours. Tell us what you like out of the two. Okay, you ready?

• 41:49Speaker 02

  I'm ready.

• 41:49Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay, Togarashi or Tajine?

• 41:53Speaker 02

  Hmm, Tajine.

• 41:55Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay, dark chocolate or milk chocolate?

• 41:58Speaker 02

  Oh, milk chocolate.

• 41:59Adrienne Cheatham?

  Ooh, filet mignon or New York strip?

• 42:03Speaker 02

  Hmm, ribeye.

• 42:05Adrienne Cheatham?

  Ooh.

• 42:07Joe Flamm?

  I like it.

• 42:08Adrienne Cheatham?

  Takis or Flamin Hots?

• 42:10Speaker 02

  That's a good question. Takis are so weird.

• 42:14Speaker 02

  I understand them like in my mouth. They are exciting, but I don't understand them.

• 42:20Joe Flamm?

  I don't understand them in my mouth. You've had some pretty good quotes on this episode.

• 42:27Speaker 02

  Let's go Takis for fun then.

• 42:28Adrienne Cheatham?

  Why not? You know, hell, yeah. Sherry vinegar or balsamic?

• 42:33Speaker 02

  Oh, sherry vinegar.

• 42:34Adrienne Cheatham?

  Hmm, for the win. Yes, I'm done. My work here is done.

• 42:38Joe Flamm?

  Your ancestors punching the air right now. How could you? Our own against us.

• 42:44Adrienne Cheatham?

  That's all I got. I am surprised by milk chocolate.

• 42:47Speaker 02

  I, I'm not. Milk chocolate is so much better. Who wants to eat bitter, bitter, dark chocolate?

• 42:51Joe Flamm?

  I, I like both, but I like milk chocolate a little bit better. And I feel like I'm like the only person on the planet.

• 42:56Speaker 02

  Really? Well, I'm, I'm there with you.

• 42:57Adrienne Cheatham?

  You're not alone anymore.

• 42:58Joe Flamm?

  That who like still like is like waving the milk chocolate flag. Like everybody wants to use like dark chocolate for everything. And I'm like, yeah. I'm like, have you guys like had a candy bar? It's fucking awesome.

• 43:09Adrienne Cheatham?

  Okay, in a candy bar, yeah. I had a, I had a fun sized Butterfinger for breakfast yesterday and milk chocolate. Yeah, that's perfect with that.

• 43:17Joe Flamm?

  Nice little breakfast right there.

• 43:19Adrienne Cheatham?

  It was with the black coffee.

• 43:20Joe Flamm?

  Yeah.

• 43:21Speaker 02

  Dessert's like supposed to be fun, you know? Dark chocolate feels too adult. It, I almost, it feels to me like people are faking the fact that they like that because it feels more grown up. Like milk chocolate is clearly sweeter and better.

• 43:34Joe Flamm?

  Right. I like dark chocolate and I eat it like, it's like when I'm like, I'm gonna have like a healthy sweet thing in the house for like after the kids go to bed. Like I'll have a piece of dark chocolate and then it makes me like, feel like I'm not a total piece of shit.

• 43:47Adrienne Cheatham?

  It doesn't give you the same like creamy palate coating feel as milk chocolate. I'm not gonna lie. But I, I like bitter flavors. So I think that's why I like dark chocolate.

• 43:55Speaker 02

  Hmm. Yeah, I mean, like if you're into like coffee grounds and like

• 44:02Speaker 02

  cherry pits, you know?

• 44:05Joe Flamm?

  That's what agents are too. Coffee grounds and cherry pits.

• 44:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:08Joe Flamm?

  She's a big Malort girlie.

• 44:10Speaker 02

  Toast them up. Yeah. Give me Malort with a cherry pit in it.

• 44:14Joe Flamm?

  You were awesome. This was so much fun. Thank you so much for your time.

• 44:18Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 44:19Joe Flamm?

  You're an absolute blast. I love talking all the private chef stuff. I think it's so cool. I think it's so interesting. And I think it's one of those things just like, like so many of my like young cooks and chefs like ask about it, uh, but they're so intrigued by it. And, um, I think like both of you showing that pathway so visually for young chefs is so important. You know what I mean? There's not only one road in this, but there's so many ways to go. So I think it is really, really cool that you share that side of it and how special and how fun it is. Thank you for hanging out with us and chopping it up about it. I really appreciate it.

• 44:50Adrienne Cheatham?

  Olivia, you rock. You are one of my favorite people to see, like, personality-wise and your food. It's so creative. It's like a breath of fresh air. It's like being in a kitchen without having to be in a restaurant kitchen. It's like, yeah, you're somebody I would like sling pans with on the line any day, but I like that, you know, people get to have a life and a little bit of freedom. So if you're not one of the 4.45 million people who already follow you, tell everybody where they can find you.

• 45:18Speaker 02

  On Instagram, Olivia T I E D. And I also just started, like, YouTube. I don't know if you guys saw that, but I'm very excited about that. We've been working hard on that.

• 45:28Adrienne Cheatham?

  What is it, Rich and Hungry?

• 45:30Speaker 02

  Yeah. So I just started doing long-form stuff, and that's on YouTube as Olivia T I E D as well.

• 45:37Adrienne Cheatham?

  And then you have a cookbook coming out now, too, right?

• 45:40Speaker 02

  I do. And that just takes forever. And then it takes another forever, doesn't it? So it will be a little while, but it's coming.

• 45:46Adrienne Cheatham?

  Good. We look forward to announcing that when it is available for everybody to find on the show, because I'm sure it will be just as awesome as you are.

• 45:54Speaker 02

  Thank you guys so much for having me. This is so cool.

• 45:59Adrienne Cheatham?

  All right, now, before we go, Jo, we have a very special request for everybody in our Chefs Cut Nation. Leave a comment, leave a review, not a one-star, wherever you listen to your podcasts, because it actually does really help. And don't forget, next week, we have Sam Cass, former private chef for the Obamas, in with us for part three of our Private Chef series. Jo, tell them where they can find all this.

• 46:24Joe Flamm?

  So you can follow us at the Chefs Cut Pod on IG, and then make sure you subscribe to us on wherever you're getting your podcasts from, Apple, Spotify, whatever. Subscribe, like, comment, so you don't miss out on any of the fun.

• 46:38Adrienne Cheatham?

  This has been the Chefs Cut, life beyond the past.