The 'Star Wars' Movie Draft

In a galaxy far, far away … Sean and Amanda use the Force to bring in their fellow Jedis Chris Ryan, Mallory Rubin, and Van Lathan for a 'Star Wars' movie draft. They share their anticipation (or lack thereof) for ‘The Mandalorian & Grogu,' break down their relationships to the movies themselves, and draft some of their favorite and least favorite things about the iconic franchise. Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Guests: Chris Ryan, Mallory Rubin, and Van Lathan Producer: Jack Sanders Production Support: Lucas Cavanagh and Sarah Reddy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:15Sean Fennessey?

  I'm Sean Fennessey.

• 0:16Amanda Dobbins?

  I'm Amanda Diamond.

• 0:17Sean Fennessey?

  And this is The Big Picture, a conversation show about Star Wars. CR is here, which must mean we are drafting today, but he's not the only one. We are also joined by two superstars of fandom and culture podcasting. Mallory Rubin of House of R and Van Lathan of The Midnight Boys. Ring of Tailgate.

• 0:35Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 0:37Sean Fennessey?

  Higher Learning.

• 0:40Sean Fennessey?

  The Rewatchables.

• 0:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 0:42Sean Fennessey?

  The Big Picture Podcast.

• 0:43Speaker 02

  I come onto here a lot.

• 0:45Sean Fennessey?

  What's your Substack called?

• 0:47Speaker 02

  Oh, it's called Fuck You If You Disagree.

• 0:48Sean Fennessey?

  Right, all of those things.

• 0:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, that's a good one.

• 0:51Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, and I thought we should all.

• 0:53Amanda Dobbins?

  Is it fuckyouifyoudisagree.substack.com?

• 0:56Speaker 02

  It's actually, the name of the blog part, I think it's just Van Lathan, but.

• 1:02Amanda Dobbins?

  Either way, it's good. I just want to make sure people can get where they need to go.

• 1:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's tough.

• 1:05Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 1:06Speaker 02

  Yeah, I like it.

• 1:07Sean Fennessey?

  A lot of strong opinions on that Substack. I thought we could all get together and talk about Star Wars. Because there is a Star Wars movie coming out in less than a month. And that movie is called The Mandalorian and Grogu.

• 1:18Amanda Dobbins?

  Yes.

• 1:20Sean Fennessey?

  I can say for at least four of us, Star Wars is very important. Amanda, would you say that Star Wars is important to you?

• 1:29Amanda Dobbins?

  We're finding me, this, we are once again finding me at a very interesting point in my Star Wars journey. Because I have two young sons and they are coming alive to the possibility of Star Wars. And for whatever reason, I think it's mostly because my husband was like, yeah, let's show them Star Wars. I am okay with this, at least the original trilogy. I feel really good about showing to them. I'll tell you why, Van Lathan, because last night I and my older son Knox saw Phantom Menace together for the first time. Both of us sitting down for the first time. Yowza, that was bad. That was bad. It was bad to look at.

• 2:14Amanda Dobbins?

  I knew everything about Jar Jar Binks, except actually what that character was like. And I really couldn't believe it. So.

• 2:21Speaker 02

  Do you want, do you want to do?

• 2:22Speaker 03

  The voice now?

• 2:22Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah. We should do that, yeah, on camera and into the mic. Yeah.

• 2:26Amanda Dobbins?

  But this is a-

• 2:29Sean Fennessey?

  Millions of Star Wars fans just turned the podcast off.

• 2:31Speaker 04

  This is fantasy. You're a millennial and you're a prequel kid just because of your age group.

• 2:36Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, and I'm elder, though.

• 2:38Speaker 04

  Same.

• 2:39Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't know, I thought it was quite bad. And so I'm watching these again as the parent of a child. And I was like, this is not interesting, visually ugly, and mostly about taxes, or trade routes, or both. Honestly, it wasn't clear to either of us, so that was sort of an issue.

• 2:57Speaker 03

  Very relevant.

• 2:58Amanda Dobbins?

  The original three are exciting and beautifully handmade, and you understand, like, it's, you've talked about when your parents went to see it, and the spaceship goes over your head, and you're just like, wow, I'm seeing something magical.

• 3:10Speaker 03

  I was in utero at that moment.

• 3:12Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, and there we go. And here we are now. It's beautiful.

• 3:15Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, post-coital, one might say.

• 3:17Amanda Dobbins?

  So, well, eight months after, yeah.

• 3:20Sean Fennessey?

  Is that how long it was?

• 3:21Speaker 03

  Whenever it debuted in 77, it was right before I was born. Was the summer, it's 77?

• 3:25Sean Fennessey?

  Coincidence? I think not.

• 3:27Speaker 03

  Yeah, so look where I got to in my life.

• 3:29Amanda Dobbins?

  So, I'm growing, you know, I'm learning, and parts of Star Wars I'm really embracing, and other parts-

• 3:35Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, well, that was a very open-minded testimonial there about the fantasy.

• 3:40Amanda Dobbins?

  It was really bad.

• 3:42Sean Fennessey?

  So, let's, I'd like for each of us to talk about the first Star Wars movie that we saw and how it made us feel. Now, you've talked about this, obviously, you just shared that you, would you describe that as having seen it?

• 3:53Speaker 04

  When he was a fetus?

• 3:54Speaker 03

  That's a really interesting question about when life begins.

• 3:57Speaker 04

  Interesting.

• 3:57Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, great.

• 4:00Sean Fennessey?

  Maybe only me, Van, and Chris should be able to talk about that. What do you guys think?

• 4:04Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think that's a good idea. We can just lean back. Just listen. Yeah, we'll just, we'll reply and relax. Pipe down. Yeah, we'll just process and receive.

• 4:13Sean Fennessey?

  What was your first Star Wars?

• 4:15Speaker 04

  Uh, so my first experience with Star Wars was, if you guys will recall, they re-released the original trilogy on the eve of the prequels. And my dad took me to see the re-release at the Senator Theater in Baltimore. And it is one of the foundational formative film-going and fandom and nerd experiences of my life.

• 4:35Sean Fennessey?

  Was it 97? What year was that?

• 4:36Speaker 04

  So Phantom Menace came out in 99, so they re-released them in 98. 97 or 98. Yeah, heading into it. So I was like 12. I was in, you know, in middle school. And it was just the best. And I remember like really kind of thinking back on that when Jason and I did Binge Mode Star Wars. And like, I have this really specific kind of concrete memory in my mind. Like, I feel, perhaps apocryphally, that I can remember where I was sitting. And yet, like 10 times, I've had to text my dad, "Did we see this at the Senator or the Charles?" You know, so that's how memory works, right? But every time I ask him that, he texts me back within 10 seconds, "The Senator!" Exclamation point. Like, it's such a fun memory for him, too, to have gotten to like introduce me to Star Wars.

• 5:16Speaker 04

  And then we rolled right in from the re-release of the original trilogy into Phantom Menace, which is like a foundational experience in another way, including recognizing at a very young, impressionable age that things are not always consistently excellent and, you know, your fandom is a journey over time, right? So yeah, it's just the best. And it's been a part of my life since I was very young.

• 5:39Sean Fennessey?

  Do you remember your first one?

• 5:40Amanda Dobbins?

  I also went to that re-release. I went, I think, Phipps Plaza in Atlanta, Georgia. Yeah, you know it. And with my friend Drew, like who is probably listening. And our parents had a similar thing where my parents were not super pop culture-plugged in, as we have learned over these years. But even they were like, "We think we should take you to go see Star Wars." And I went with a friend. I remember being like, "Cool. Yeah, you know, that was pretty good." I don't think I saw the other two in theaters. So again, I was 14. So a slight difference in age and attitude at that point in my life. But that was a big deal. I remember it.

• 6:20Sean Fennessey?

  It was. The re-releases were huge. I assume you saw that. The first one was the first, but the first time you saw a Star Wars movie?

• 6:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, my dad showed it to me. This was back in the eighties. He was amazed by it. He was one of the people that went to see Star Wars and just could not believe what he was seeing. And he talked about it as if it were a legend.

• 6:41Sean Fennessey?

  Mm hmm.

• 6:41Speaker 02

  So when, by the time I get shown it, it's not like, you know, in the way that your parents give you like religion? And they tell you all the beautiful, amazing things about religion and like why it's important. That's how my dad like felt about Star Wars. He felt like Skywalker, Darth Vader, all of that stuff. He was just like amazed by it. Now, he was not a sci fi guy. So for him, it was kind of basically an action movie with like,

• 7:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 7:07Speaker 02

  He didn't look at it, but it became really quickly for me, a religious experience. Like from as, almost as early as I can remember, all the way up for the rest of my life.

• 7:16Sean Fennessey?

  You make a great point, the way that it has transcended some of the tropes and cliches of classical science fiction. And I feel like when I was a kid, there was Star Trek and there was Star Wars.

• 7:26Speaker 03

  Mm hmm.

• 7:26Sean Fennessey?

  And Star Trek was science fiction. Star Trek was pointy headed and Star Wars was adventure. Star Wars was mythology. And it wasn't the same thing. And so I was always a Star Wars kid. And as I've gotten older, I've gotten more interested in Star Trek and kind of what Star Trek is really about. And I didn't, I didn't have anybody put it in front of me when I was a young kid, but I did have my parents at a very young age.

• 7:46Speaker 03

  Probably also like a scarcity thing, like Star Trek is just always on like reruns and stuff.

• 7:50Sean Fennessey?

  Absolutely.

• 7:50Speaker 03

  When you get home from school and then Star Wars was like major event. I, the one thing that was funny thinking about opening remarks for this, for this draft is that, so what, when does Revenge of the Sith come out?

• 8:01Speaker 04

  Two thousand and five, and it is the movie that I have seen in movie theaters more than any other film.

• 8:06Speaker 03

  So I don't think I saw the second two prequels in movie theaters.

• 8:10Speaker 04

  Oh damn.

• 8:11Speaker 03

  And I think I have spent as much of my Star Wars life. Critiquing it as I have celebrated it.

• 8:18Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 8:18Speaker 03

  So like, that is also another element of Star Wars and why the draft is probably really interesting is that like, from the earliest days of podcasting, Andy and I have been talking about like, what would Star Wars be if it could be perfect? What would you do differently with Star Wars? What should they do with Star Wars on TV? How should they reimagine Star Wars? And it's been this like, thing that even before Force Awakens, we were talking about and then obviously through the sequels and the TV stuff and, and all the stop and start iterations of it in movies. It's been a fascinating object of conversation and kind of Monday morning quarterbacking what they're doing with it. Almost as much as it's been just pure, I love these, these movies.

• 8:58Speaker 04

  Yeah, and I think that the perception of how much Star Wars there is in front of you at any moment in time, obviously connects to how you relate to it. Like if you are an EU fan, now Legends Canon fan or something, then like, books, right? That was your lifeline to Star Wars for a long time and like the, the, the just absolute desert, the Tatooine-esque desert between film releases. Like that was where you would seek out stories. Now you have, you know, for many Star Wars fans, like too much Star Wars sometimes. It's been a long time since the, the last movie, obviously Rise of Skywalker was 19. It's been like more than half a decade since the film, but there's been a glut of TV shows, right? And mileage may vary on your relationship to that.

• 9:34Speaker 03

  Glut is the word.

• 9:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, but you know, if you're like obsessed with Star Wars, you can play the video games, you can build Lego helmets, you can read comics, you can read the novels, you can watch all the shows, you can watch the animated shows. Everybody's relationship to it is different and it can be the most important thing in your life or something where you're like, this is a blockbuster event, I'm going to check it out. And there are a million versions of that in between. I love hearing everybody's like first exposure to it and what the kind of like seminal aspect of it was. Cause you know, I think for me with my dad, it was about fandom and it was about science fiction and fantasy, but it was also real like Joseph Campbell hero's journey exposure too, through Luke, obviously. So there are just so many different gateways and like, I love now hearing from people, it's, it's fun to hear how you're exposing.

• 10:18Speaker 04

  Knocks inside to it because the like, order of how you would choose to introduce somebody to Star Wars now is such a fascinating thing. And I think that like, for our peers, there will be people. In five, 10, 20 years, we're like, the first thing I'm gonna show somebody is Andor.

• 10:34Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:35Speaker 04

  You know, right?

• 10:36Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:37Sean Fennessey?

  That would be confusing, but yeah.

• 10:38Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 10:38Speaker 04

  But that's a choice that you could make. It's a choice that you can make.

• 10:42Speaker 02

  Let's radicalize them.

• 10:43Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 10:43Speaker 02

  Um, you know, part of my, legitimately, part of my development as a human being has been learning to appreciate the prequels. Like, not as an art, but like, as a human being.

• 10:54Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 10:55Speaker 02

  Um, because I went through, I've told this story before, such a Herculean effort to see Phantom Menace. I was at Louisiana Tech University, my, like, John's car had broken down, his tires weren't fixed. I got John's tires fixed on his car so that we could drive to Monroe and see the movie. This probably cost me $350 or $400, right, to go and see the movie because I had to see it.

• 11:18Speaker 04

  In 1999, also.

• 11:20Speaker 02

  In 1999. And when I get there, halfway through the movie, I'm like, yo, this isn't working. Like, I'm looking at scenes, I'm like, yo, are they dead-ass right now? It's kind of how I felt when I was in Michael. And, and so like, it, it, by the time I get to the end of the movie, I leave on the high of Duel of the Fates, and it feels like the end scene kind of laundered the rest of the film.

• 11:41Sean Fennessey?

  Had the exact same experience.

• 11:42Speaker 02

  Right.

• 11:43Sean Fennessey?

  That was exactly how I felt.

• 11:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:44Speaker 02

  But then, later on, when the, at the height of the anti-prequel movement, I-

• 11:50Speaker 04

  Prequel was leading that movement?

• 11:52Speaker 02

  Um, it was a huge backlash to the prequels, right?

• 11:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, sure.

• 11:56Speaker 02

  I came to respect and enjoy them, not only for what Lucas was attempting to do, but for what he was able to do at the time, and for what I feel like was an irrational fan backlash to not being able to play with the same toys from the 70s.

• 12:14Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 12:14Speaker 02

  And it actually changed the way I view a lot of things, like, period. Because people set out to tell stories that'll sometimes challenge you and won't be as accessible as you need them and want them to be. But like, analysis of that stuff to me is like, how much you love it, what can you, what can you enjoy from it? And how it deepens the lore and your connection to what it is. And the prequels definitely deepened my connection to Star Wars. They deepen my appreciation for Star Wars, and they sophisticated Star Wars for me a little bit, if they, even if they did that imperfectly.

• 12:45Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I had a very similar experience as Amanda was showing my daughter the movies, and I would say, to a movie, she's enjoyed every movie, she really like threw herself into this and really be, but I, I, I think- I probably saw A New Hope when I was four or five and I had, we had them on VHS. And so like I, they're very formative for me, just in terms of any kind of story and storytelling. And I was voracious about the action figures and begging my parents and Toys R Us to buy me the action figures. And when one was sold out, like trying to figure out ways to order them somehow, begging the cashier at the store. Like I was, I had a very obsessive personality even then. And I similarly was kind of heartbroken by Phantom Menace, aside from the Duel of the

• 13:28Sean Fennessey?

  Fate sequence. But to see that movie with Alice and to see how into Anakin she was, and to watch Anakin become her favorite character in these movies is amazing. It is fascinating. And I never could have done that because I was 17 when The Phantom Menace came out. And I was 21, 23 when, when The Revenge of the Sith came out.

• 13:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Right.

• 13:51Sean Fennessey?

  So I do think it's a lot of like when it hits you, when it finds you and what you're open to. And it doesn't change the fact that like the CGI is not good in The Phantom Menace at times. But there are other times where like, I don't know, the, the pod racing sequence is like exciting and fun. Like, it's like, if you're a little kid.

• 14:07Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 14:08Sean Fennessey?

  That's, that's great movie making.

• 14:09Amanda Dobbins?

  My 18 month old was in the room for the pod racing sequence and just kept pointing at the TV and going, fast, fast, fast. You know, so there is something primal about it that I understand. What, what you're saying is interesting with your relationship to the prequels, because it does feel like Star Wars is both like the blueprint for fandom or modern fandom as we see it, as we understand it. And also like a living experiment, you know, like in real time of putting you all through these new situations of 20 years without something. And then you get these new three things, but it doesn't live up to both what you remembered, both the originals and then everything that you've been filling in and spinning off side to side. And I mean, that certainly was true with the, what are

• 14:54Amanda Dobbins?

  we calling the last trilogy?

• 14:56Speaker 04

  The sequel trilogy.

• 14:56Amanda Dobbins?

  The sequel trilogy.

• 14:58Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 14:59Amanda Dobbins?

  Where it's, you know, it's, it is funny. And even now with Mandalorian and Grogu, to watch everyone who has had such a deep relationship to these movies that are just giant pieces of corporate entertainment at this point and have been now for 25 years.

• 15:17Amanda Dobbins?

  And be both angry like about the corporate decisions, but also so stressed out about the interpersonal connections and, um, and like, how is Mandalorian and Grogu even going to be received? And you're on a podcast being like, I will not even like, go watch it because you know, That's the final thing. Like, Clyde's in the mix. And then, you know, Sean and I saw 17 minutes of it, the first 17 minutes at CinemaCon. And, you know, I won't spoil too much to say that we watched over it, we watched it and you leaned over to me and very angrily whispered, why would they put that blank in these places? And your, your complaint was textual. Your complaint was you have not honored like

• 16:01Amanda Dobbins?

  the sanctity of my memories. It is, it's a fascinating social experiment that we're all doing in real time.

• 16:08Sean Fennessey?

  I, I, I think it's just a deeply, deeply, deeply personal piece of art that is also controlled at the highest levels by the biggest cultural entertainment conglomerate in the universe. And so there's an inherent friction. Like there's this huge emotionality that comes with it. And then there's all this business concern. And then there's also, because it's been such a transformative act of movie making technologically, it's been also at the vanguard of the way that movies are made is changing for all of the sequels and for even for the TV shows. I mean, you can now look back on all these TV shows that Disney Plus made as the kind of key indicator of what happened to this holy union of the way that entertainment operates where it's like, this is what TV is, this is what movies are.

• 16:52Sean Fennessey?

  We don't really cross these streams, so to speak, and everything, everything can be comfortable. And then once they started doing that, and once the Mandalorian came around, it kind of changed the expectations for what is theatrical, what is a TV show? And now we're kind of like doubling back, you know?

• 17:07Speaker 03

  We're unwinding from that.

• 17:08Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, they're trying to, but the number of people who don't understand that the Mandalorian and Grogu is a movie instead of a TV show, then they're going to have to go somewhere else to see it. It's like, it's a big hurdle for Disney.

• 17:20Sean Fennessey?

  Or they won't go see it.

• 17:21Speaker 02

  I will say this, I do think that sometimes, particularly in the Star Wars community, we take a lot of larger cultural and artistic issues and make them specifically about Star Wars. Everything has been corporatized, right? I played and really enjoyed playing the Godfather the video game.

• 17:37Sean Fennessey?

  Sure, I played that too.

• 17:38Speaker 02

  That was a good video game.

• 17:39Amanda Dobbins?

  So what do you do in Godfather the video game?

• 17:42Speaker 02

  You start off-

• 17:43Speaker 03

  You import olive oil.

• 17:44Speaker 02

  But you do though, you start off on your rise as a soldier.

• 17:47Amanda Dobbins?

  You sit in an orange grove?

• 17:48Speaker 02

  And then you move up to be the Don.

• 17:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Alright.

• 17:51Speaker 02

  Okay, and it's a very fun game.

• 17:53Sean Fennessey?

  What was your, do you have an Italian Don name?

• 17:56Speaker 02

  I can't remember.

• 17:57Sean Fennessey?

  Okay. Like Don Imbroglio?

• 17:59Speaker 02

  This game comes out, this game comes, came out in like, what is it, oh eight, oh nine, something like that?

• 18:03Sean Fennessey?

  I thought it was even earlier than that.

• 18:04Speaker 02

  It might have been earlier than that, but like, so like, and you know, then they make a movie on Paramount about the making of The Godfather, which in and of itself is kind of a cash grab to connect you to all of that.

• 18:14Amanda Dobbins?

  I think you'll find that was a TV show, but again.

• 18:16Speaker 02

  TV show, whatever.

• 18:17Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, I mean, it's complicated.

• 18:19Sean Fennessey?

  I watch every minute.

• 18:20Speaker 02

  Right, so, so like, like what I'm saying is that all of this stuff has been corporatized. I think with Star Wars, there's almost a specific criticism that people levy at it because of the expectation of the purity of Star Wars.

• 18:32Amanda Dobbins?

  Sure.

• 18:32Speaker 02

  The expectation of the feeling that you're supposed to get from the story. The themes of it are about destiny and they're about family, they're about betrayal, they're about all of these things, and they felt so real, so real and so pure at that time. The question is, should you theme park ride them? And my answer is always the same, if you can do it right.

• 18:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, exactly.

• 18:56Speaker 02

  Like, if, if you can do it right, do as much of it as you can.

• 19:01Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 19:01Speaker 02

  But when you do it wrong, people are gonna have all kinds of reasons about why it's going wrong. And one is gonna be you then stepped on a product and all of that stuff. But if you can do it right, I'll take as much Star Wars as you're willing to give.

• 19:13Speaker 03

  I'm in a great place, I think you and I will probably discuss Andor more in depth on this pilot at some point next month, but I do feel like Andor gave me in my 40s what Star Wars gave me when I was seven. And so like, I'm like, anything else after this is, is honestly a bonus.

• 19:28Sean Fennessey?

  A better understanding of Marxism, or?

• 19:30Speaker 03

  Well, just like, that was everything I, I ever wanted, that I couldn't articulate. It was like that adult version of Star Wars and that level of, of complexity and drama and, and, and a world building experience. It's like everything I had ever wanted as an adult from that when we were joking about like, wouldn't it be cool if they said cheers at Mos Eisley, like, you know, like? They gave Tony Gilmore 600 million dollars and that's what he made and, and I'll, I mean, so this is like, even with Grogu, all jokes aside, I'm like, I hope it's good, you know? I will see it, I will see it.

• 20:02Amanda Dobbins?

  You, you're gonna come with us, it's fine, I'm not discounting on it, so.

• 20:05Speaker 03

  Don't let down my

• 20:07Amanda Dobbins?

  He also thinks Saquon Barkley is coming, so

• 20:12Speaker 03

  You get like five Nox's counting on it.

• 20:20Sean Fennessey?

  Are you excited about it?

• 20:21Speaker 04

  About Mando Grogu?

• 20:22Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 20:22Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, I, my relationship to like any new Star Wars releases generally, I will hope desperately that it's good until I have been robbed of every single reason to allow myself to think that. Like, I want, I love Grogu.

• 20:35Speaker 03

  Palpatine's returned.

• 20:36Speaker 04

  Somehow Palpatine returns is one of the low points of my life. I was sitting next to Sean when that happened. I'm like, still.

• 20:41Sean Fennessey?

  That was a tough one.

• 20:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, I, I think Rise of, I, I think that everything you're saying, my relationship to the prequels is similar as well, where like, I think that Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones are like terrible movies, but the prequels are very important to me and to my Star Wars fandom. And I think Sith is like, just actually genuinely unironically great. Um, I think that two of the three sequel movies are very good. Obviously, one of those two is quite divisive. I think that Rise of Skywalker is not only a bad movie, but a shameful, to the like, where do the corporations get in and, and metal too much? A shameful, uh, uh, manifestation of fearing your own fanbase, right? And the need, and

• 21:26Speaker 04

  obviously, like, we've talked about Lashadai over the years. We don't agree on it. That's fine. I think that like a healthy debate about what to do inside of a Star Wars movie is like totally valid. I think the way that that manifested was unfortunate. And I think that, um, Lucasfilm and Disney feeling that they then had to like walk back the direction of that sequel in order to like appease some of the bad faith, uh, voices in the fandom to the point where like, not only do things in that movie happen that make no sense, if you've been reading books for years and you're all like current on Palpatine cloning, like whatever, but somehow Palpatine returns is like embarrassing as a story beat and a line of dialogue and all of it. The lack of like confidence to actually follow through on Chewie, all of that.

• 22:11Speaker 04

  Having like the-

• 22:12Speaker 02

  Kill that Loki, man.

• 22:12Speaker 04

  I agree. I love Chewie. I said it as soon as the movie ended. I was like, this is an insane choice. Yeah, it was like representative of a certain type of fear that was like driving that film. And I think the like moment of, oh, you know, like lightsaber should be tweeted, like the weapon of a Jedi should be tweeted, treated with more respect is just a sub tweet at the prior film in a way that I think is like deeply lamentable. When Star Wars is in that place, you can operate with confidence. I mean, the reason that Andor is so great is because it's an excellent assured piece of storytelling, but also because it was like created from a place of intention. You can look at Andor and say, new hope. Then we go to Rogue One and then we go to Andor. And if you want to broaden even further, you can say Rebels takes place in parallel.

• 22:55Speaker 04

  If you're interested in the animated verse, that's a lot of expanded world building and storytelling. Yeah. That's not like, oh, you can't keep going back to the same well in Star Wars. It's like you have to do it well. So Mando Grogu, like, I think that the question of should that be season four of a TV show or a movie is completely valid. And certainly the trailers, which like I found very exciting because I think that Grogu is one of the only pure and good things in the last like 10 years of being alive. I just think Grogu is iconic and I love him and he makes me really happy. I like the Anzelins, I liked Din. I've, I thought seasons one and two of Mando were like really excellent and season three was very uneven, sometimes good, often bad.

• 23:34Speaker 04

  Um, I don't know if that should be a show or a movie, but like if it's a movie and it's good, I don't know that we'll care if it was a movie or a show. We'll care that it was good. So-

• 23:46Speaker 02

  What do you think? So last thing I'll say, I know we gotta get into the draft, a couple of things. Number one, there is, a lot of times we talk about corporate failures and there certainly have been corporate failures from Disney, but these things to me- From the, to the degree that things are corporatized, it's when story and narrative power fails. And/or a lot of money made by our corporation. That's one guy that they said, hey, go do your story. Right? When we go back and look at even the intention of, or the construction of the sequel trilogy, three directors on three different movies.

• 24:23Speaker 03

  Couple got fired.

• 24:24Speaker 02

  Couple got fired, but like, three different, that doesn't make any sense. Right? Like, that's not the way typically these movies have been made. These movies have been made with a sense of a three-story arc. You're trying to get to something at the end, and you're doing that. You're committed to that. For all of the people who were sickened and disgusted by Jedi turning Luke Skywalker into a coward.

• 24:50Speaker 04

  That's not what happened in that movie.

• 24:52Speaker 02

  That's exactly what happened. By Jedi turning Luke Skywalker.

• 24:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Turning into, but whatever.

• 24:57Speaker 02

  Like, turning Skywalker into a coward. The reality is, if turning Skywalker into a coward is the way that you get to some sublime, emotionally and narratively brilliant conclusion in the third movie, great.

• 25:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 25:17Speaker 02

  But if that gets you to somehow Palpatine has returned, I gotta ask why my favorite white boy threw his lightsaber away. And like, that is what leaves you hollow.

• 25:27Speaker 04

  No, this is revisionist history, because I agree, obviously, about.

• 25:30Sean Fennessey?

  This can't be the last Jedi podcast.

• 25:31Speaker 04

  No, of course. But you were saying that after Last Jedi, not after Rise of Skywalker.

• 25:36Speaker 02

  I'm saying what?

• 25:37Speaker 04

  Those complaints about Last Jedi were in real time. They weren't a result of Rise of Skywalker.

• 25:41Speaker 02

  No, no, no, no. Last thing I say, but that's not what I mean.

• 25:44Sean Fennessey?

  Somehow I doubt it.

• 25:45Speaker 02

  Just work, work, no, no, that's not what I mean. What I mean, what I mean is that the movie, it's that decision, that storytelling decision, could have been made whole if it was going someplace that.

• 25:57Sean Fennessey?

  I agree with that. Even though we disagree about The Last Jedi, it's still, it was a failure in that respect, because there was no follow-through on whatever storytelling decisions were made in The Last Jedi.

• 26:06Speaker 04

  That's a Rise of Skywalker.

• 26:07Amanda Dobbins?

  Hold on, hold on, hold on. So Luke Skywalker is your favorite white boy?

• 26:12Speaker 02

  Ever.

• 26:13Amanda Dobbins?

  Of all the white boys?

• 26:15Speaker 02

  Of any white boy ever. Luke Skywalker and then Ryan Gosling from Tribe. Close number two.

• 26:21Speaker 04

  Where do CR and Sean rank?

• 26:23Speaker 02

  I mean, these are, these are my white boys.

• 26:26Speaker 02

  That'll count. You know what I'm saying?

• 26:28Sean Fennessey?

  Wow. Well, we're gonna get Ryan Gosling very soon in a Star Wars movie.

• 26:32Speaker 02

  He killed in that one. Didn't say shit, just drove and fucked people up. I love it.

• 26:36Sean Fennessey?

  Somehow, I don't think that's gonna be the energy he brings to Starfighter, based on his past few films, and Sean Levy's Uvra. Um, we got, we got a draft movies, and obviously, there are only 11 of these movies. And, and as we've noted, some of them are quite bad. And that's so weird for something to be so special to so many people, and also to be almost evenly divided between the good and the bad. Close to. So with that in mind, I've devised a slightly new kind of draft for us. Um, different kinds of categories than we've done before.

• 27:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 27:07Sean Fennessey?

  And I'm hopeful that you guys-

• 27:09Speaker 03

  Possibly more strategic in a lot of ways?

• 27:11Sean Fennessey?

  I think so.

• 27:12Speaker 04

  So, so just to clarify then, the animated theatrical release Clone Wars from 08 is not eligible?

• 27:17Sean Fennessey?

  Well, I'll put it on the board to have a discussion about it. I've not seen the film.

• 27:20Speaker 03

  I've not seen it.

• 27:21Speaker 04

  I would consider it-

• 27:22Amanda Dobbins?

  What? I was, I was honestly ranking my favorite white boys.

• 27:26Speaker 02

  Who's number one?

• 27:27Sean Fennessey?

  It's a whole other episode. I don't, you know.

• 27:29Amanda Dobbins?

  I mean, I was gonna ask where Ben Affleck is on your list.

• 27:31Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 27:32Speaker 02

  Uh, Batfleck is up there, but I can't-

• 27:34Amanda Dobbins?

  What about Abrak?

• 27:36Speaker 02

  Uh, come on, man. Let's not, let's talk about, I mean, shout out to them, but like, nah, they're not up there.

• 27:40Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, alright, that's-

• 27:41Speaker 02

  You know what I'm saying?

• 27:44Speaker 02

  Shout out to them, but we're not, you know.

• 27:46Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 27:47Speaker 02

  I mean, I put fucking Chipper Jones above.

• 27:51Sean Fennessey?

  That's despicable. That is heinous.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  I know there's some problematic shit, but, but, but I used to fuck with Chipper Jones.

• 28:03Amanda Dobbins?

  It wasn't me. Chipper Jones over the Beastie Boys.

• 28:06Speaker 02

  Like, I, hey.

• 28:06Amanda Dobbins?

  That's fucking bullshit, man.

• 28:08Speaker 02

  I don't fuck with the Beastie Boys like that. I love Paul's, I love all of that stuff.

• 28:13Sean Fennessey?

  We have to delete the episode. I really was excited about this draft.

• 28:16Speaker 02

  For me coming up, I watched, I had a, I, I know Chipper is who Chipper is.

• 28:20Speaker 03

  So you fucking don't like Last Jedi and you like Chipper Jones?

• 28:24Speaker 02

  Chipper Jones was the baddest motherfucker at third base for a long time for my favorite team. Like, some of this, some, it's diminishing returns, man.

• 28:32Sean Fennessey?

  As always, I'm glad you're here, but what the fuck?

• 28:34Speaker 02

  I'm just being for real, man.

• 28:35Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, okay, here are the categories that we're gonna be drafting from. Seven categories for five drafters. That's gonna be thirty-five draft picks. The categories are as follows. Movie. This is very simple.

• 28:46Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 28:46Sean Fennessey?

  You draft a movie.

• 28:48Speaker 03

  A Star Wars movie. Or twelve films.

• 28:49Sean Fennessey?

  One of eleven or twelve films.

• 28:51Amanda Dobbins?

  So what is the twelfth one?

• 28:52Speaker 04

  So The Clone Wars, which is an animated film, but it was a theatrical release.

• 28:56Sean Fennessey?

  It was. It made eighty million dollars.

• 28:58Speaker 04

  In theory, it should, it could be eligible.

• 28:59Sean Fennessey?

  You're right, it's eligible.

• 29:00Speaker 04

  And it is the first installment of what became a more than decade-long-running animated series, which I will say to you once again, especially if Alice has said Anakin Skywalker is my favorite character, you simply must watch The Clone Wars. Now, the movie, pretty bad.

• 29:15Sean Fennessey?

  I'm trying to limit the screen time here. So the idea of like an eighty-episode animated series is a lot.

• 29:19Speaker 04

  It's more than eighty episodes. The Clone Wars and Rebels are both wonderful. Rebels is, I think, one of the best Star Wars products, period, ever. I really would recommend it. The movie, The Clone Wars movie, is pretty bad. The television show is really good. The movie's pretty bad. However, Rada the Hut, Jabba's son, known by Stinky in that movie, is, of course, a character in Mando Grogu, voiced by Jeremy Allen White.

• 29:42Sean Fennessey?

  That's correct.

• 29:42Speaker 04

  So you could consider it a hallmark.

• 29:43Speaker 03

  Is he just voiced, or is he doing any circus stuff?

• 29:45Speaker 04

  You think he's out there in like the...

• 29:47Speaker 03

  Circus stuff where he's like, I'm on set.

• 29:49Sean Fennessey?

  I hope so. Maybe we'll find out with one of those behind-the-scenes mocap videos.

• 29:53Speaker 04

  Mocap?

• 29:53Sean Fennessey?

  Where he's got a tennis ball on his head.

• 29:54Speaker 03

  He's like smoking, he's just like, I'm trying to get Rod's head.

• 29:57Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah. Does he sing any Bruce songs in the film?

• 30:00Amanda Dobbins?

  I honestly feel like the number of times I personally, in my little screen of just doing that meme with all the numbers, like trying to understand what's happening, is already at like fifteen.

• 30:10Speaker 03

  We're gonna help each other out, but we're also...

• 30:11Amanda Dobbins?

  I've already Googled, what is the chronological order of all the Star Wars properties?

• 30:15Speaker 03

  Chronological.

• 30:16Amanda Dobbins?

  Chronological. So, and now I'm reading a Reddit page, and I'm reading about Attack of the Clones, which I was conflating with Clone... It's fine. I did do homework for this. I prepared my own version.

• 30:30Speaker 03

  She and I chatted last night.

• 30:31Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 30:32Speaker 03

  We were talking.

• 30:32Sean Fennessey?

  Sounds like it was a good talk.

• 30:33Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 30:34Sean Fennessey?

  Um, okay, second category after movie. This is movie you've been cursed with.

• 30:39Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 30:39Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 30:39Speaker 04

  Can you explain this one to us?

• 30:40Sean Fennessey?

  Yes. You will be drafting a movie for someone else, and you will be cursing them with that movie. For example, we know that Van does not like The Last Jedi.

• 30:52Speaker 02

  Coming around to it, but no.

• 30:54Amanda Dobbins?

  It's too late.

• 30:55Speaker 04

  Too late.

• 30:56Amanda Dobbins?

  You don't like The Last Jedi and you do like Chipper Jones. Yeah.

• 30:59Sean Fennessey?

  Now.

• 31:00Amanda Dobbins?

  That's canon.

• 31:00Sean Fennessey?

  Now, there's two ways to think about this.

• 31:02Speaker 03

  You guys better put that on the lower, the lower third for Van.

• 31:05Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 31:05Speaker 02

  Chipper Jones stan?

• 31:07Sean Fennessey?

  You, don't forget you exist alongside Van's favorite white boys with Chipper Jones. You're in league with him, as am I, so this is complicated for us.

• 31:14Speaker 03

  I mean, like, it's a, it's a big tribe, the white boys.

• 31:17Sean Fennessey?

  Sure is.

• 31:17Speaker 03

  You know what I mean? There could be different sides of the aisle there.

• 31:19Sean Fennessey?

  And you say growing stronger every day.

• 31:21Amanda Dobbins?

  Luke Skywalker being number one is not really a list you want to be on, in my opinion.

• 31:26Speaker 02

  303 career batting average, 468 home runs.

• 31:29Sean Fennessey?

  Just, please, no more.

• 31:30Speaker 03

  That's cursed. You're basically saying, hey, I know you don't like this, fuck you.

• 31:34Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, or, we all agree this movie isn't good, and you're cursed with it.

• 31:38Speaker 04

  Right. So you're not only selecting the film, but the person to give it to.

• 31:41Sean Fennessey?

  Correct. Now, you can only give it to, like, there's only one pick per person. So, if Amanda gives me a movie, and I give Mal a movie, you know, me and Mal can't, you can't give us two.

• 31:52Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 31:53Speaker 03

  Movies can be drafted again in cursed?

• 31:56Speaker 04

  No.

• 31:57Sean Fennessey?

  There's only 11 movies available, period, because there's only two pure movie categories.

• 32:01Speaker 04

  So the movies category will be good movies that we like.

• 32:04Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 32:04Speaker 04

  The movie you're cursed with is we are assigning what we think is either, overall, the worst movie, or the one that is most personally galling to the person we're giving it to. So like, we could, to just stick with the animated example, Chris famously hates animation, could give Chris Clone Wars because he despises animation and doesn't think it's a viable art form, even though it's...

• 32:23Sean Fennessey?

  You absolutely could do that, yes.

• 32:25Speaker 04

  Interesting, okay.

• 32:25Amanda Dobbins?

  But it's not eligible.

• 32:27Sean Fennessey?

  I'll say it is eligible, why not?

• 32:29Speaker 04

  Which is, I mean...

• 32:30Amanda Dobbins?

  Now, there are two movies I haven't seen.

• 32:32Speaker 04

  It also just, it brings Ahsoka into the character set, so I think, I think that is meaningful. Just throwing that out there.

• 32:37Amanda Dobbins?

  Ahsoka.

• 32:39Speaker 04

  Throwing it out there.

• 32:40Sean Fennessey?

  You know you're right.

• 32:41Speaker 04

  I think it's more meaningful than inclusion.

• 32:45Speaker 02

  How was I supposed to know how it was spelled?

• 32:53Sean Fennessey?

  No one at home can see what you see. The third category is Skywalker family member.

• 33:01Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, so we were talking about this before you got here because you, Sean Fantasy, the architect of this demented game.

• 33:07Speaker 03

  The architect from The Matrix.

• 33:09Amanda Dobbins?

  Have been dealing out inconsistent information. And you and I had a long chat in the press box at CinemaCon about who was and was not a Skywalker. And you were doing, you were being a little bloodline about it. You were saying no one by marriage.

• 33:26Sean Fennessey?

  No, that's absolutely not true. That did not happen.

• 33:29Amanda Dobbins?

  Now he's angry just because.

• 33:31Speaker 03

  This is season three.

• 33:32Sean Fennessey?

  You just completely lied. Like that did not happen. In fact, I just talked to Mallory about this yesterday.

• 33:37Amanda Dobbins?

  That's fine.

• 33:38Speaker 04

  You said in the press box sitting next to, should we be picturing you guys?

• 33:41Sean Fennessey?

  I don't know what you're talking about.

• 33:42Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, my God. I was literally naming people and you were like, no, that's not a Skywalker. It's fine.

• 33:48Speaker 04

  I'm envisioning the two of you like, like Palpatine and Anakin in the opera box. And like the evil head turn like.

• 33:55Sean Fennessey?

  Not by a Jedi.

• 33:57Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 33:58Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, no, any, but marriage is eligible. Children are eligible.

• 34:01Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, no.

• 34:02Speaker 04

  So bloodline, marriage, and you could get creative. Okay.

• 34:05Speaker 03

  Was there a press box?

• 34:07Sean Fennessey?

  There's a press area.

• 34:08Speaker 03

  I like the idea of you like tapping away on your.

• 34:10Sean Fennessey?

  That is what it is. It's hundreds of people with their laptops open.

• 34:13Speaker 03

  Pam, Pam Abdi and Mike DeLuca.

• 34:15Sean Fennessey?

  In the CMS typing up their pieces while it's there.

• 34:18Speaker 04

  Did Darth Blaggus the wise come up at all when YouTube were talking?

• 34:21Speaker 02

  No fucking way.

• 34:22Amanda Dobbins?

  Right, well.

• 34:22Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:23Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 34:23Speaker 04

  Wow, look at this collaboration between these two.

• 34:26Amanda Dobbins?

  Allegedly, yes, this person is because they're married in by marriage. So there you go.

• 34:30Speaker 04

  This is fascinating. So you're working together. Van is helping Amanda and I guess that could come into play.

• 34:35Speaker 02

  You wouldn't call Lars a Skywalker.

• 34:37Speaker 04

  Nope. But by marriage. By marriage, he would, that, yeah.

• 34:41Speaker 02

  Wait.

• 34:41Speaker 04

  Clee Lars would be eligible as Shmi's husband. That's what, that's, yes.

• 34:45Sean Fennessey?

  That's true.

• 34:46Speaker 02

  Well, I was about to get.

• 34:48Speaker 04

  I don't know if that would be the choice here, okay? But.

• 34:51Speaker 03

  Is that, is that Owen?

• 34:53Speaker 04

  Owen is, Clee is.

• 34:54Speaker 02

  His dad.

• 34:55Speaker 04

  Clee married Shmi.

• 34:56Speaker 03

  Where's he at?

• 34:56Speaker 04

  And then Owen.

• 34:57Speaker 03

  Is that Joel Edgerton?

• 34:58Speaker 04

  Owen is Joel Edgerton.

• 34:59Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 35:00Speaker 02

  Clee is the guy, remember he's in, come to him, is like, he married.

• 35:04Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:04Speaker 03

  It doesn't matter, I'm not gonna draft him.

• 35:06Sean Fennessey?

  We don't really need to worry about Lars, I don't think.

• 35:08Speaker 04

  I mean, it's not the deepest category, you never know.

• 35:09Speaker 02

  I was about to get into a whole patriarchy type thing. Like, if you marry, who can marry into somebody's family, you know?

• 35:16Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, would you let Chipper Jones marry into your family?

• 35:19Speaker 04

  I would just say Star Wars is, in many ways, about found family, and we should have a pretty broad interpretation of what family is.

• 35:25Speaker 03

  Chipper advanced Thanksgiving.

• 35:27Speaker 02

  Where, fully decked out in real tree.

• 35:29Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, the fourth category is hero or villain.

• 35:32Speaker 04

  I have a question.

• 35:32Speaker 03

  Oh, God.

• 35:34Sean Fennessey?

  Shoot.

• 35:35Speaker 04

  So, a, a character can only be drafted in one category.

• 35:38Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 35:38Speaker 04

  Of course, characters are eligible in more than one category, so if a character is taken in Skywalker, they cannot also be taken in hero-villain. Why are hero and villain together instead of being two separate categories?

• 35:49Sean Fennessey?

  Because that's what I wanted to do.

• 35:50Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 35:51Speaker 02

  Damn.

• 35:51Speaker 04

  A lot of characters in Star Wars. We could've gone even deeper.

• 35:53Speaker 03

  It's really fun when you're in charge of things.

• 35:55Speaker 04

  Could've been here all day.

• 35:56Sean Fennessey?

  This is so far going great. Um, the fifth category is vehicle.

• 36:00Speaker 04

  Okay. Chris just looked at his watch.

• 36:01Speaker 03

  No, I was just curious where we were at.

• 36:05Speaker 02

  Ninety-seven percent of the vote, though. My first ballot Hall of Famers, just like, ninety-seven percent.

• 36:09Sean Fennessey?

  For Chipper Jones.

• 36:10Speaker 02

  In the baseball Hall of Fame.

• 36:12Sean Fennessey?

  Good to know. We'll be editing you entirely out of this episode, I want you to know. Vehicle can be anything. It can be an individual vehicle that one character is known for flying or driving.

• 36:22Speaker 03

  Can it be a star vehicle for an actor who appeared in a film?

• 36:25Sean Fennessey?

  No, that's not eligible. It can be, uh, various military vehicles that we know about from the, the Empire or the Rebellion. Um.

• 36:35Speaker 03

  This is one where I was like, no problem, I got this.

• 36:38Sean Fennessey?

  The next category is problematic character.

• 36:41Speaker 02

  Oh, in what regard?

• 36:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:44Sean Fennessey?

  Well, I would like to leave this open to interpretation.

• 36:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, okay.

• 36:47Sean Fennessey?

  To me, I feel like you can read a lot of characters that are beloved as problematic, and you can read a lot of problematic characters as beloved. It's one of the interesting things about this series is that it is obsessed with cultural heritage, but not specifically race in the way that we think about it. And it's come under some fire over the years. And then there's other characters where I'm like, why is that not a problem?

• 37:11Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 37:11Sean Fennessey?

  We can explore that here.

• 37:12Speaker 04

  Sure. But so, okay, so then it could be the more overtly like way we think about this is problematic, but it, so we're not talking like problematic fave. This is a character for like derision and ridicule.

• 37:22Speaker 03

  You just have to make the case when you're.

• 37:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, whatever.

• 37:24Sean Fennessey?

  I think if you're like, I'm horny for Kylo Ren, that can be your pick.

• 37:28Speaker 04

  I mean.

• 37:29Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 37:29Speaker 04

  A long, long established fact.

• 37:30Sean Fennessey?

  But more specifically, I think cultural problematism is what we're discussing here.

• 37:35Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 37:36Sean Fennessey?

  Jar Jar's already been invoked. Jar Jar, historically problematic movie character.

• 37:40Speaker 04

  But you could go the Kylo route or another character like, okay.

• 37:43Sean Fennessey?

  You gotta make a good case for it.

• 37:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 37:44Sean Fennessey?

  I think it will make for an entertaining category.

• 37:46Speaker 04

  Interesting.

• 37:47Sean Fennessey?

  Good?

• 37:47Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 37:47Sean Fennessey?

  The last category is wildcard, which is literally any cool thing about Star Wars. Anything.

• 37:52Speaker 02

  Anything.

• 37:53Sean Fennessey?

  It could be an object, could be a person.

• 37:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 37:56Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 37:56Sean Fennessey?

  Could be, if you wanted to be a TV show, it could be that.

• 37:59Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 37:59Speaker 04

  Oh, whoa.

• 38:00Sean Fennessey?

  Um, you could do anything. Now, you can't, there's no addressing TV shows otherwise throughout the other six categories.

• 38:06Speaker 03

  Although Rogue One will have some of our favorite characters.

• 38:10Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 38:11Sean Fennessey?

  And so then because some of those characters appear on TV shows, you will be able to claim them because they appear in Rogue One.

• 38:16Speaker 03

  And Mandalorian Grogu counts, doesn't count.

• 38:18Sean Fennessey?

  We haven't seen it yet, so I feel like it's not, we shouldn't make it eligible yet.

• 38:22Speaker 04

  Okay, so like the Razor Crest ship is not eligible in vehicle because that's just been in trailer so far in the television show.

• 38:29Speaker 02

  Nothing from the, okay, cool. Interesting. Nothing from the TV shows is eligible in the draft.

• 38:34Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's the movies draft.

• 38:35Sean Fennessey?

  It's gotta come from the movies.

• 38:36Speaker 04

  This is the big picture.

• 38:37Speaker 02

  Yes. Cool. I'm trying to think, what else?

• 38:39Speaker 04

  Jeez.

• 38:40Sean Fennessey?

  Does that make sense?

• 38:41Speaker 02

  Of course.

• 38:42Sean Fennessey?

  There are, of course, many of the canonical characters have appeared in both film and television.

• 38:46Speaker 02

  Of course, a lot of them.

• 38:47Sean Fennessey?

  But not all of them.

• 38:47Speaker 02

  Not all of them.

• 38:48Speaker 04

  Right.

• 38:48Sean Fennessey?

  But you've just found a loophole for Sokka Tano, so that's good for you.

• 38:51Speaker 03

  And now, if you come in last place in the voting.

• 38:55Sean Fennessey?

  What's that?

• 38:56Speaker 03

  If you come in last place in the voting, do you promise now, in front of everyone, to do the entire Odyssey pod as Jar Jar?

• 39:06Sean Fennessey?

  Just checking in. How many more Jar Jar jokes do you have?

• 39:13Sean Fennessey?

  I would say, I honestly don't know if draft order is crucial here. Is it crucial?

• 39:18Speaker 04

  I think so.

• 39:19Speaker 03

  I don't know.

• 39:20Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, we know that you think so.

• 39:21Speaker 02

  I'm here for the vibes.

• 39:22Speaker 03

  You could think so, but I think you also have a very specific view of.

• 39:25Speaker 04

  I personally think having a top three pick, yeah. Well, I think having a top three pick would be meaningful, but I think it's such a deep set of candidates in many of these categories that like, no one's fucked, no matter where they end up. And obviously, coming around quicker on the turn is, I think, very beneficial in this draft. So, you can probably make your piece, no matter what.

• 39:47Sean Fennessey?

  Okay. Jack Sanders, we need the draft order.

• 39:50Speaker 05

  Van, what the fuck are you doing, man? Chipper Jones? Are you kidding me?

• 39:53Sean Fennessey?

  That's right.

• 39:54Speaker 05

  We're laying on the ground, we're dying, and you're kicking us while we're down.

• 39:58Speaker 02

  Say, Chipper was the man. What the fuck?

• 40:00Speaker 05

  He was not the man.

• 40:01Speaker 02

  One of the best high school players of all time as well.

• 40:04Speaker 04

  This is, look.

• 40:04Speaker 05

  Shameful. Drafting first is Sean.

• 40:07Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 40:09Speaker 02

  Drafting first is who?

• 40:10Speaker 03

  You know, it's been a while, though. I think it's been a while.

• 40:12Speaker 04

  Fucking annoying.

• 40:13Sean Fennessey?

  Nice to hear. It's nice to hear that.

• 40:15Speaker 04

  That home cook in here at the big deck.

• 40:16Speaker 03

  Everything's coming up fantasy this week.

• 40:17Sean Fennessey?

  That's so nice.

• 40:19Speaker 05

  Drafting second is Mallory.

• 40:20Speaker 04

  Okay, I feel fine now.

• 40:25Speaker 04

  Interesting.

• 40:27Speaker 04

  I feel pretty good about it.

• 40:28Speaker 05

  Drafting third is Van.

• 40:30Speaker 02

  Nice.

• 40:30Speaker 03

  Kind of where Chipper Jones used to bat, right?

• 40:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, hot corner. Play third.

• 40:35Speaker 05

  Fourth, Amanda, and fifth, Chris Ryan.

• 40:37Speaker 04

  Okay. Okay. How do you feel about that?

• 40:40Speaker 03

  We'll see.

• 40:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's...

• 40:44Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 40:44Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 40:45Speaker 04

  I think I know what you're gonna do at five, actually. I feel happy for you. I actually think this board worked out well, probably, for what every individual person wants to do.

• 40:52Speaker 03

  That it's gonna be boring.

• 40:54Sean Fennessey?

  Can you repeat the draft order so I can remember it?

• 40:57Speaker 05

  Sean, first. Mal, second. Van, third. Amanda, fourth. Chris, fifth. I'll put it up on the TV, and it's in the doc as well.

• 41:05Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, that's exciting. Gosh.

• 41:08Speaker 04

  Sheesh. Okay.

• 41:09Sean Fennessey?

  I feel like one and two are both extremely strong positions.

• 41:12Speaker 04

  I agree. I actually think the top three is really good.

• 41:15Sean Fennessey?

  The top three?

• 41:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:17Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 41:18Speaker 02

  I feel like there has, I feel like there's a clear order in the top three.

• 41:21Speaker 04

  I agree.

• 41:21Speaker 03

  That's interesting.

• 41:22Speaker 04

  When we get through the top three picks, we'll see if we're thinking the same thing, but I suspect we are.

• 41:27Sean Fennessey?

  There could be chaotic moves made early on.

• 41:29Speaker 02

  There could be chaotic moves as well. It's a draft. There's always some chaos.

• 41:35Sean Fennessey?

  I think Chalk as Empire Strikes Back is the first overall pick, which is one of the greatest movies ever made, is the greatest sequel ever made.

• 41:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 41:43Speaker 03

  Not the greatest sequel ever made.

• 41:44Sean Fennessey?

  It's better than Godfather 2, in my opinion.

• 41:46Speaker 04

  What is with you and Godfather 2?

• 41:49Sean Fennessey?

  It's got some flaws.

• 41:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, what are they?

• 41:50Sean Fennessey?

  There's a three and a half hour podcast where I illuminated some of them.

• 41:55Speaker 04

  I prefer to re-listen to JFK.

• 41:57Sean Fennessey?

  I really, I really love it. I think it's a great film, but I like the Empire Strikes Back more, and it hit me at a different time in my life.

• 42:05Sean Fennessey?

  And I think it's amazing that it turned out the way that it did, because it wasn't as fully conceived as we like to think it was. The more you read about it, the more you realize that while Lucas had an idea for a trilogy, he had not really mapped out where that movie was going to go. And that very smart decision to make the movie darker, to give it a bummer ending, to, I think, center Han in the way that he did in the movie. And...

• 42:29Speaker 02

  Solo.

• 42:31Sean Fennessey?

  I think it's an incredible feat of movie storytelling, and it's my favorite Star Wars movie. And I would say A New Hope is right behind it, you know, like it's right up there. But Empire Strikes Back in movie, which I think is fairly straightforward, would others have gone in a different direction?

• 42:47Speaker 02

  I would have.

• 42:48Speaker 04

  I would not have gone in a different direction. I would have done that same thing.

• 42:50Sean Fennessey?

  You would have gone in a different direction.

• 42:51Speaker 02

  I would have gone New Hope, yeah.

• 42:54Speaker 04

  This is gonna work out well for you, because I know what you would have done at number one, and you're gonna get to do it at three. Because I am taking A New Hope, and Van will be taking Darth Vader.

• 43:03Speaker 04

  So, because those were clearly his top three picks in some order, I think no question. But, at the end of the day, I think that the character fields, all of them, are just much deeper and stronger than the movie field. Again, kind of like, a little bit of an irony inside of Star Wars, where the quality is most limited in the films themselves, and then there are all of these iconic people and things and ideas inside of them. Empire, also my favorite Star Wars movie. I would have taken it at one, but I'm thrilled to have New Hope at two. Like, it's a coin flip between those two. Two of the most iconic and important movies ever made, and A New Hope changed movies. It changed genre films, but it changed movies and it changed movie history, and it is one

• 43:45Speaker 04

  of the most seminal and foundational installments in the history of story. I think that its connection to...

• 43:54Speaker 04

  This larger tapestry again, whether it's like The Hero's Journey or something like, how did Frank Herbert's Dune inspire George Lucas? And now you look at the Dune movies and there's this new generation of filmgoers who are like, wow, that's a lot like Star Wars. And then you get people to discover the actual connected nature of these things across time. It's like, it's just inextricable from the history of Star Wars movies. If you made me pick, even though A New Hope is not my favorite, Empire is, if you made me pick my single favorite moment in Star Wars history, I'm like gonna cry. It's binary sunsets. There's just nothing like it.

• 44:32Speaker 04

  It's the best. So I just, it's, yeah, I'm thrilled. I'm thrilled. And I'm happy the van gets to take the.

• 44:39Speaker 04

  Would you have done Vader at one?

• 44:41Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 44:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, okay.

• 44:41Sean Fennessey?

  Well, so the question is what category? Because you can draft him in Skywalker family or you can draft him in hero or villain?

• 44:49Speaker 02

  See, this is why I always get fucked up in drafts. Um, I'm going to take him in hero or villain.

• 45:00Sean Fennessey?

  Interesting.

• 45:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, I should have probably taken him in Skywalker family. I'm gonna take him in hero.

• 45:03Sean Fennessey?

  Now that category gets a little slimmer.

• 45:05Speaker 04

  I, yo, boy, okay.

• 45:07Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm gonna take him hero or villain. I'm gonna thin that out a little bit. I think that this is, it's difficult to talk about how iconic the character is. One of the most iconic characters in American and world cultural history. And interesting, when you first see, this is to me, a gauge of how Star Wars was when it was creatively pure and kicking. Throughout the three movies, you got more Darth Vader. But as you got more Darth Vader, the character got deeper and better. So the idea that like, the more Star Wars you get, the more it's watered down, is directly refuted by the character arc, to me, of the

• 45:51Speaker 02

  kid, of the, of Vader that the entire thing is oriented around. You get a little bit of him, he's scary. You get more of him, you learn that he has this cosmic tragedy that he looks for his. Looks at his son for redemption for, and then at the end, he gets that redemption. So you get more Vader and it gets better. That to me is Star Wars. He is synonymous with villain, with evil, but he is also synonymous with twisted good. He's the breathe, the, the breathing, the moving, the lights, everything. Cool ass motherfucker that your heart goes out to.

• 46:29Speaker 02

  Like to me, there's, I can't think really of a character that is superior to him in culture period. As far as mythology is concerned.

• 46:40Sean Fennessey?

  How much of this pick is a pick for Anakin? As it is a pick for Darth Vader?

• 46:45Speaker 03

  Does this pick take Anakin off the board?

• 46:46Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 46:46Sean Fennessey?

  It does.

• 46:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:48Sean Fennessey?

  Because Anakin is a whole other person.

• 46:53Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 46:54Speaker 02

  You know what's funny is he is a whole other character, but in a way he's not. He is a whole other character, but the darkness that manifests itself that has always existed inside of Anakin Skywalker. Is this idea that we all have that thing? That if someone sees it and decides to pull us out of it, to pull it out of us, should I say? That we can become that. So Darth Vader is as much a part of Anakin's nature as he's genociding sand people. Right? Like it, it, as he's doing all the stuff that he does, it's just as much a part of him as the goodness that's a part of him. The selflessness that's a part of him.

• 47:33Speaker 04

  The women and the children too.

• 47:34Speaker 02

  Yeah. So like it, to me, these guys are like one in the same. And the, the movie is about how someone can see you and take advantage of you and use you, use your power to their end.

• 47:43Speaker 04

  George Lucas has said like many times, Star Wars is, if it had to be distilled to one thing, it's the tragedy of Anakin Skywalker. You can't say Anakin and Vader are separate people. You just can't.

• 47:52Sean Fennessey?

  So whenever I'm having a bad day.

• 47:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 47:55Sean Fennessey?

  They just open up YouTube and I look at the sequence at the end of Rogue One. When Vader is annihilating rebels.

• 48:02Speaker 04

  Fucking awesome.

• 48:04Sean Fennessey?

  And it's like, we've discussed this multiple times on pods before. It's like, it's the one time, really the one time. When I got the very small feeling of childhood Star Wars enjoyment.

• 48:16Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:16Sean Fennessey?

  Of like, I'm six. And this is exactly what it was like, or what I wanted to see when he's, you know, using the force to raise people to the roof of the corridor there.

• 48:28Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 48:29Sean Fennessey?

  And it's interesting that like, they gave us just a little, little, just a tiny taste of that over the last 10 years. Now, he did show up on the fucking, whatever TV show, was it Obi-Wan Khan or Obi?

• 48:39Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's in other, the shows a lot. I mean, he's very, I mean, Anakin is the main character of the Clone Wars show, and Obi-Wan and Ahsoka are also the main characters of that, but-

• 48:48Sean Fennessey?

  But not theatrical movie Darth Vader.

• 48:51Speaker 04

  Yeah, Vader, Vader is in Rebels. You're gonna get that childhood feeling of wonder when you watch Ahsoka and Vader duel in the season two finale of Rebels, Twilight of the Apprentice, and that mask cracks and you see Anakin's eye and he says, "Ahsoka."

• 49:04Amanda Dobbins?

  You know, we have so little left in this life. Four Beatles movies and that, so.

• 49:08Sean Fennessey?

  That's tough. I don't know if I have 200 episodes of animated Star Wars in front of me.

• 49:13Speaker 03

  Rebels is fantastic.

• 49:14Speaker 04

  Rebels is great.

• 49:16Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, excellent and interesting pick for the future of this game. Okay, so Amanda, your fourth.

• 49:23Amanda Dobbins?

  I've been spending this entire time deciding whether I want to do this to Chris, and I kinda have to.

• 49:32Speaker 04

  Damn.

• 49:32Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 49:32Amanda Dobbins?

  And I'm really, and I know, well-

• 49:35Speaker 03

  Well, honestly, it'll open up the floodgates.

• 49:38Sean Fennessey?

  I think it is the correct pick.

• 49:40Amanda Dobbins?

  But like, I, I want you to know that, that you're my friend, and that you were-

• 49:45Speaker 03

  I think that when you think about like, your blank check appearance, like your last couple of months of podcasting, you've been laying the groundwork to do what I think you're about to do.

• 49:53Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, that's true. Okay, Blank Check was recorded many months ago, so I don't remember. I was like, did I make fun of Chris?

• 49:58Speaker 03

  This is also my guy.

• 50:00Amanda Dobbins?

  It is, it is your guy, but I do have to, in Skywalker, take Skywalker by marriage, Han Solo, who is just a very hot, charismatic man, and is my entry point into what is exciting about Star Wars. And it's very funny watching it with a small child who is way more into Luke, and even Leia, and I keep being like, but what about that guy? You interested in Han Solo? Look at, look at him. He's, he's swashbuckling. He's doing fun. Oh, you don't like, you don't like Han?

• 50:31Speaker 03

  I love Solo.

• 50:32Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 50:33Speaker 03

  But-

• 50:34Speaker 02

  I think him being in the Skywalker category.

• 50:37Speaker 03

  By, by.

• 50:38Amanda Dobbins?

  By marriage.

• 50:39Speaker 04

  I think you two did the categories in the opposite way. I would have taken Vader in Skywalker and I would have taken Han in Hero. But it doesn't, I mean, at the end of the day.

• 50:47Speaker 03

  Han Solo.

• 50:48Amanda Dobbins?

  I'm, I'm playing by the rules.

• 50:51Sean Fennessey?

  You're playing by the rules.

• 50:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Exactly. He just yelled at me about it.

• 50:53Sean Fennessey?

  They're playing by the rules.

• 50:54Amanda Dobbins?

  You know, he did the natural flair and everything.

• 50:57Sean Fennessey?

  Don't lie.

• 51:00Sean Fennessey?

  It's that simple. Don't lie.

• 51:01Amanda Dobbins?

  It's fine that you don't remember any conversation we've ever had, but you can't turn it on me.

• 51:06Sean Fennessey?

  This is an incredibly strong machine right here.

• 51:08Amanda Dobbins?

  Except when it comes to social interactions with other people.

• 51:11Sean Fennessey?

  Only you.

• 51:12Amanda Dobbins?

  That's fine.

• 51:13Speaker 04

  I never doubted that Amanda would be selecting Han Solo in the first round. And frankly, I thought if Amanda got the first pick, she would have taken Han Solo there.

• 51:19Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't know whether I.

• 51:21Speaker 04

  The one question Adam asked me before is what will you do depending on how the board falls? If Amanda gets Han before you? And I said, I am prepared for that. We're the two greatest.

• 51:29Speaker 02

  Solo goes before Luke Skywalker.

• 51:30Speaker 04

  Harrison Ford enthusiast.

• 51:32Amanda Dobbins?

  A thousand percent.

• 51:33Speaker 03

  He, like Luke Skywalker. He never slips.

• 51:36Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 51:36Speaker 03

  He never, he never fucks up.

• 51:38Amanda Dobbins?

  Skywalker is like kinda whiny and also, you know, has the burden of expectation. He has the burden of the name. Han Solo is just there to have a good time and, you know, fall in love with Leia. Listen, I love you. I know. Like A plus. It taught a whole generation of women.

• 51:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:55Amanda Dobbins?

  To not expect that much from men. But also, you know, when the, when the going gets tough, you're gonna get like half an admission of emotion.

• 52:04Speaker 02

  You know what? Let's beat down this Lilith Fair oriented narrative around Solo right now.

• 52:09Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 52:10Speaker 02

  You know why she appreciated it?

• 52:12Amanda Dobbins?

  Why?

• 52:12Speaker 02

  Because she knew that that took a lot.

• 52:15Amanda Dobbins?

  Leia.

• 52:16Speaker 02

  Leia, yeah. Because, because.

• 52:20Speaker 02

  Because she knew how much it took for him in that moment to connect with that. That was Han giving his best at that time, which we used to be able to do for one another. You know?

• 52:33Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, I agree, but he also didn't have to say too much, which I really appreciate. You don't wanna say too much ever.

• 52:40Speaker 04

  Did the movie Solo, which is a part of this draft.

• 52:43Sean Fennessey?

  It sure is.

• 52:43Speaker 04

  Yeah. Dilute.

• 52:46Speaker 04

  Khan is a character for you.

• 52:47Amanda Dobbins?

  I wasn't as mad as everybody else about that.

• 52:49Speaker 04

  Same. #MakeSolo2Happen.

• 52:51Speaker 03

  I went back to watch it again. And it's not Alden's fault.

• 52:54Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 52:55Speaker 03

  Well.

• 52:55Speaker 04

  No, I agree with that. Yeah.

• 52:57Speaker 03

  Like it.

• 52:58Speaker 04

  Nobody other than Harris and Ford should be asking Khan Solo.

• 53:01Sean Fennessey?

  I agree. It's not his fault.

• 53:03Speaker 03

  It's a really bad script.

• 53:04Sean Fennessey?

  It's an incredible bungle in a million directions. Totally, it's way off. The firing Lord and Miller, which is, we now see it in the light of Project Hail Mary's Day. What an absolute nightmare decision that was, not letting those guys try to figure out a new tone for Star Wars, which could have set up an entirely interesting new future. Getting scared of the tone that they were going for there was horrible. Alden's fine. I like him a lot as an actor, but the movie is just, as I, I think I wrote a column about it when the movie came out. I was like, this movie's not special. There's nothing exciting about telling this story. And it's the same vibes that I'm getting from Mando right now.

• 53:38Speaker 03

  The most like, hold your breath moment of Solo is him playing cards with Lando. And you're like, oh shit. This is like, like Don Glover's really going for it here. And that, that, but like, all the action sequences, the train robbery's okay.

• 53:50Speaker 04

  Sounds like we can curse Shawn with Solo. That's, that's what's.

• 53:52Sean Fennessey?

  No, I don't, I don't think it's the worst Star Wars movie. I just think it's kind of a nothing.

• 53:56Speaker 04

  Has anyone ever told you, you have some dried and voss vibes?

• 53:59Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 54:00Amanda Dobbins?

  How are we doing that?

• 54:01Sean Fennessey?

  The drafts bring that out in me. Yeah.

• 54:04Speaker 04

  Great pleasure yacht, though. First light.

• 54:07Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, Betme? Oh, I mean, there could be worse things to be compared to.

• 54:10Speaker 03

  He was the man in that movie.

• 54:11Sean Fennessey?

  Not a bad villain. Yeah, he worked. Pretty good villain.

• 54:13Speaker 04

  Yeah. Anyway, Han Solo. I'm sorry, Chris.

• 54:15Sean Fennessey?

  Great pick.

• 54:16Speaker 03

  That's okay.

• 54:16Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, CR. Those are the, I would say those are the big four.

• 54:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 54:20Sean Fennessey?

  In this draft.

• 54:21Speaker 03

  Skywalker family, I'm gonna take Luke Skywalker.

• 54:23Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 54:24Speaker 03

  Who, while he goes up and down over the course of the sequels, I would say for those first three films, and especially some of the shit he pulls in Return of the Jedi, was, he was just my guy. You know, like doing the backflip off of the, the prison barge.

• 54:44Speaker 04

  Yeah. That's your first example?

• 54:46Speaker 03

  Of what he does that's cool?

• 54:47Speaker 04

  Iconic.

• 54:48Speaker 03

  Killed his dad, too. That was sick. But, uh, no, Luke Skywalker is like, he and Han are the ways in for Star Wars and I think are ultimately like the kind of missing pieces of the prequel for me. Or just like, I never really got into Hayden Christensen. Also, like, you kind of know where that's going. And Han Solo is like the cool factor that I think the prequels missed for me. Like, that kind of like, get a load of all this shit attitude. I don't know why I'm talking about Han Solo, clearly mad that I didn't get to draft him. But Luke is the root of all the mythological stuff that I think attracts people to Star Wars across generations. And it's just like a kid from nowhere becoming the most important thing in the universe. It's like this really powerful dream, you know?

• 55:32Speaker 04

  Yeah. And when you say from nowhere, you mean hidden in his father's home? Still drives me crazy that they made that choice.

• 55:41Sean Fennessey?

  Just very quick sidebar. Whenever I'm playing Star Wars with my daughter, she's always like, be this person. And then there's like a line that you go to, to be that person. So whenever she's like, be Luke Skywalker, I always say, I'm Luke Skywalker. I'm here to rescue you. Like, there's like some...

• 55:57Speaker 02

  Yeah. Oh, okay.

• 55:58Speaker 04

  Yeah. Give us a little Toshi station. Little power converter.

• 56:03Speaker 02

  Power converters.

• 56:03Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, power converters, yeah.

• 56:06Speaker 04

  That's not true.

• 56:07Sean Fennessey?

  For Han?

• 56:09Speaker 04

  That's impossible.

• 56:10Sean Fennessey?

  What do you think is the like, go to Han line?

• 56:13Speaker 03

  Boring conversation, anyway.

• 56:16Speaker 04

  You like, almost can't pick. There are so many.

• 56:19Sean Fennessey?

  Well, that was why I asked the question, so you could pick.

• 56:21Speaker 04

  Oh, but I mean, it's like, God, every Han moment is iconic.

• 56:24Sean Fennessey?

  I never know what to say when she's like, do Han.

• 56:27Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 56:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 56:28Sean Fennessey?

  Well, yeah.

• 56:28Speaker 02

  I just love that.

• 56:29Speaker 04

  You could use a kiss. I do think I Love You I Know was very, very high on the list. Never Tell Me the Odds, obviously iconic.

• 56:35Sean Fennessey?

  I like that one.

• 56:37Speaker 04

  Perhaps counterintuitively, some of the subtler Han moments are actually the best ones, especially on a rewatch. Like, you know, Luke training with the training remote and Han challenging Obi-Wan, heading into that, you know, first step into a larger world moment, which is also iconic. Like...

• 56:53Speaker 02

  International Han line to me.

• 56:54Speaker 04

  Exactly, that Han moment is sort of like.

• 56:56Speaker 02

  Hokey religions is not gonna be a good rap. That is his mantra.

• 56:59Speaker 04

  And you just understand his worldview from that moment so clearly. And then, of course, when you build toward like something like in Force Awakens, he's like, that's not how the Force works. You feel like you have just lived an entire life with this person. That's fandom at its best, I think.

• 57:10Speaker 03

  Hokey religions was my yearbook quote, so thank you.

• 57:13Sean Fennessey?

  It was really good.

• 57:15Speaker 02

  But you know, you know what my favorite moment from Han ever is, though? That to me told me about the character when I was a kid.

• 57:19Speaker 03

  We just immediately started talking about him.

• 57:21Speaker 04

  There's a reason Han went first.

• 57:22Speaker 02

  So I, I love Luke Skywalker, but my, my favorite Han moment is actually the moment where Luke feigns that he has incestual love for his sister and Han.

• 57:34Speaker 04

  Feigns? That's a very generous interpretation, sir.

• 57:36Speaker 02

  That's the way I look at it now.

• 57:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 57:38Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 57:38Speaker 04

  The proto Targaryens, let's be real.

• 57:40Speaker 02

  And, and Han right away starts fucking with him. Like right away starts poking holes in Luke.

• 57:46Sean Fennessey?

  Peacocking.

• 57:47Speaker 02

  Just, just right away, so I don't know, maybe a guy, and he's not serious about it at all. He's just fucking with the kid Han Solo. Han Solo, perfect. And that's, that's kind of what Star Wars was for me at the first.

• 57:58Speaker 03

  So, uh.

• 58:00Speaker 04

  You know what you're gonna do here.

• 58:01Speaker 02

  Yeah, you have to do it.

• 58:02Speaker 03

  I'm gonna take Rogue One in movies.

• 58:04Speaker 04

  Of course you are.

• 58:05Speaker 03

  Uh, a movie that's probably like got two things going for it and against it. One, Sean's point about the Darth Vader scene at the end. I don't think I remembered a single thing about Rogue One other than that because it was so intense that I had like a blackout because of, of how I felt at the very end of that film. And then Andor coming along and expanding it and giving so much of Rogue One like a resonance and a meaning that it maybe didn't have on first viewing. But watching Rogue One after Andor, we talked, we did a pod about that.

• 58:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 58:37Speaker 03

  I thought it really deepened my experience and Rogue One is just the best version of the Disney Star Wars experiment so far, I think, in terms of on big screen to me. Uh, I think that despite a lot of MacGuffins and planet hopping, like it still has like a through line that I, that I really attach myself to. It's got a great villain. It's got incredible set pieces and, uh, I think is, is gonna age very well. So I'll go Rogue One in movies.

• 59:04Speaker 04

  Scarf scene, sequence still just looks astonishing. That like kind of crystalline water, oh gorgeous, yeah.

• 59:11Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I think it's also underrated. It's got Ben Mendelsohn and Mads Mikkelsen and it's got great actors and really great parts.

• 59:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, Donnie Yen.

• 59:19Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, Donnie Yen. It's really slick. It's more grown up. It's the most grown up of the movies. And we actually did watch it with Alice and while we were watching it, I was like, this is a war movie. This is a real trench warfare movie. And there's some great spy stuff and there's some fun Star Wars lore components of it, but it is a really down and dirty, bomb them out of their hole kind of a film.

• 59:43Speaker 04

  And even just the ideas and the conversations are so mature and nuanced. You know, Cassian, like, now it's real for you is one of, I think, the great subtle challenges, character to character in Star Wars history. This is a draft. I think it's been a super great celebration so far. I'm curious, do you guys think we should try to tear Chris down a little bit and put on the record that he has come out in support of CGI Tarkin? What do you think?

• 1:00:03Speaker 03

  Oh, I don't mind that. Of all the great crimes committed against humanity in the last 15 years, either CGI Tarkin-

• 1:00:09Sean Fennessey?

  You think Peter Cushing would have been into it?

• 1:00:10Speaker 03

  No. I mean, if they had to cut the check.

• 1:00:13Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, did the Cushing fam, did the estate get paid for that?

• 1:00:17Speaker 03

  British people in general.

• 1:00:18Sean Fennessey?

  Who is Grandma Tarkin?

• 1:00:20Speaker 02

  That is so fucking, she's killing me over here.

• 1:00:22Speaker 04

  No, I just googled CGI Tarkin to get a visual.

• 1:00:25Speaker 02

  Every time we say something, I look over here.

• 1:00:27Speaker 04

  Well, maybe I need a visual.

• 1:00:29Amanda Dobbins?

  But at the end of the day, she has Han Solo, so she could win the Oscar. Do whatever.

• 1:00:33Speaker 02

  Click them. You guys are a little bad. Click them.

• 1:00:34Speaker 03

  You could try this, but I just think, English actors, if you're like, here's the direct deposit, like, Michael Caine is me.

• 1:00:41Speaker 04

  I love the ones. I love the ones.

• 1:00:43Sean Fennessey?

  I feel like they did get the estate's approval. Did they? I don't remember what that worked.

• 1:00:48Amanda Dobbins?

  Would you give approval for CGI Sean?

• 1:00:49Sean Fennessey?

  Who am I giving it to?

• 1:00:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Me.

• 1:00:51Sean Fennessey?

  Well, I would never give that.

• 1:00:54Speaker 04

  You're giving it to William Simmons.

• 1:00:55Sean Fennessey?

  No.

• 1:00:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:57Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, okay. Now Amanda has her second pick.

• 1:01:02Amanda Dobbins?

  In movie, I'm taking The Last Jedi, which I know you would use as a curse, but I was very moved by it when I saw it in theaters. I rewatched it this morning, was equally moved by it. I- I guess I sort of understand. I do understand the reading of it as if not like a betrayal of fans, but that that movie connects with me because I do not identify as like a Star Wars capital F fan. And it is a real opening of the world and not just who can be a Jedi, but who can watch these movies and connect to them in any sort of way. And so I I find part of that. And I really, I find the Rey stuff until Rise of the Skywalker burying.

• 1:01:45Amanda Dobbins?

  If I didn't get Last Jedi, I was gonna take Force Awakens just because of the scene.

• 1:01:48Speaker 04

  So good movie.

• 1:01:49Amanda Dobbins?

  Once she gets the, once she gets the lightsaber, like at the end, I I will never forget that. And I'm not like a

• 1:01:55Speaker 04

  Forrest Gump in Force Awakens is awesome.

• 1:01:57Amanda Dobbins?

  You know, I'm not a sentimental person in that kind of way. In addition to that, Last Jedi is like funny with great performances and looks really good. I mean, the final showdown, the showdown in the red throne room, obviously. But then also when you have Kylo Ren and Luke Skywalker

• 1:02:14Speaker 04

  Oh, on crate?

• 1:02:15Amanda Dobbins?

  Dueling it out of the

• 1:02:16Speaker 04

  On the middle of the planet, crates, gorgeous.

• 1:02:17Sean Fennessey?

  Holdover maneuver. That looks amazing.

• 1:02:18Amanda Dobbins?

  It's made like incredible. That's Laura Dern, you know, like it's made so well. And with such a love of the franchise, I think, but then the willingness to turn it over, which I understand.

• 1:02:29Speaker 04

  Fans angry.

• 1:02:31Amanda Dobbins?

  You've been, man has been nice to me and I'm sitting next to him. So like, I'll be nice about it, even though I do kinda, I think you're you're wrong, but that's okay. I was very moved by The Last Jedi and that's, that's my pick.

• 1:02:43Speaker 02

  It's a great movie. It's a great movie.

• 1:02:45Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:02:46Speaker 02

  It really, it is. It just pokes holes.

• 1:02:47Speaker 03

  I think some of your Reddit posts from that era kind of trade out opinion, but yeah.

• 1:02:51Speaker 04

  I think there's a question of whether it's a savvy pick in a draft that people will be voting on, given how it is considered.

• 1:02:58Amanda Dobbins?

  What if I give it a fuck?

• 1:02:59Speaker 04

  Yeah. I I love The Last Jedi and I

• 1:03:01Sean Fennessey?

  It's a perfect pick for you.

• 1:03:02Speaker 04

  Yes. I think it's a great movie. I'm really happy that you picked it.

• 1:03:05Sean Fennessey?

  I love this movie. I've always loved this movie.

• 1:03:07Speaker 04

  I think it's fantastic. And like, I wish Rian Johnson had gotten to make more Star Wars movies. And I think

• 1:03:13Speaker 04

  To me, like the Luke stuff in that movie is really bold and brave and interesting. And it's like, what you said earlier about religion, like thinking of Star Wars as a religion. Like, who doesn't question their faith at some point?

• 1:03:24Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:03:24Speaker 04

  You know, to confront our sacred ideal of the chosen one in a moment of feeling really lost and confused about the thing he has put his entire sense of self and life and the world into because of choices that he made and mistakes he made and also choices other people made. I just thought it was such an interesting decision to explore that. And, you know, it's funny because like watching your face when Holdo was invoked, there are so many different things you can point to in that movie that like, it's a litmus test for how you feel about the movie, but maybe more broadly, like playing with these things. Like, obviously, there was a lot of like, did the Holdo maneuver break canon? And then a lot of rebukes to that. But I will never forget.

• 1:04:02Speaker 03

  Why did it break canon?

• 1:04:03Speaker 04

  In terms of do like hyperspace lanes work that way?

• 1:04:05Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:04:05Speaker 04

  But I will literally never forget watching Last Jedi in the theater for the first time and the sound being sucked out of the theater when that happened. Like, do you remember what that felt like? That's like a great movie theater moment.

• 1:04:14Speaker 03

  Did you see that at Disney?

• 1:04:15Speaker 04

  Uh, I saw it at ArcLight.

• 1:04:17Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 1:04:18Speaker 04

  Well, I remember walking over from the office and seeing it at ArcLight.

• 1:04:20Sean Fennessey?

  You and I saw it at Disney together.

• 1:04:22Speaker 02

  One, one sentence.

• 1:04:23Speaker 04

  Not fucking invited.

• 1:04:25Speaker 02

  Making Luke Skywalker hold a lightsaber and decide on whether or not he's going to murder his nephew in cold blood is akin to me to making Seth Rogen James Bond. Like, that right there, I understand characters and all of that stuff.

• 1:04:42Speaker 03

  There's just, I think there are three people at this table who just don't care about those rules. They're too, they don't care, and that's really what's interesting.

• 1:04:48Speaker 02

  I understand that, like that plus.

• 1:04:51Sean Fennessey?

  I can't do this with you, but I will just say it's an amazing echo of the crisis in the prequels. It's just a fascinating future exploration of the problem of Anakin. Like, it's all connected in my mind, that what they did not learn through Anakin, they, he had to seriously consider through Ben.

• 1:05:11Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:05:11Sean Fennessey?

  That, to me, is really strong thematic storytelling. I really love that choice. I understand why it upsets people.

• 1:05:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:05:16Sean Fennessey?

  I understand why we have this kind of Jesus Christ-like idea of Luke Skywalker.

• 1:05:20Speaker 04

  Oh, it's like, oh, so your problem is like a

• 1:05:22Amanda Dobbins?

  Superman like Luke Skywalker can't even think about killing people type thing.

• 1:05:26Speaker 02

  No, my problem is that. My problem is the entire galaxy. Luke has legitimately devoted his life to building his power where he could rebuke the empire. All of what he did has been undone. Han is in the wind. His sister is in trouble. He's pouting on a planet. It just doesn't make any sense. And to me.

• 1:05:45Sean Fennessey?

  Middle age is tough though. I'm figuring it out, you know? It feels more real now even than it did five years ago. Sometimes you're like, I just want to take my ball and go home.

• 1:05:54Amanda Dobbins?

  It's a very beautiful planet.

• 1:05:56Speaker 02

  It's a gorgeous planet.

• 1:05:56Speaker 04

  He got that green milk straight from the teat, man.

• 1:05:59Amanda Dobbins?

  And I do, I like.

• 1:06:00Sean Fennessey?

  I think it's a great pick.

• 1:06:01Amanda Dobbins?

  I like those.

• 1:06:02Speaker 02

  It's a great pick too.

• 1:06:03Amanda Dobbins?

  I, to be clear, it didn't even occur to me that it would be controversial in a voting. I mean, I know that it, I know that it will, but like, I don't acknowledge those people. Like, please don't vote for me.

• 1:06:14Sean Fennessey?

  You're sitting next to one.

• 1:06:15Amanda Dobbins?

  And then go find another free podcast, you know?

• 1:06:17Speaker 02

  I would have, if I was taking a movie, I would have taken Jedi. If I, yeah, if I, if I was going to take a movie, I would have taken Jedi.

• 1:06:23Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:23Sean Fennessey?

  Well, you'll have your chance right now.

• 1:06:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. I'm not going to take Jedi. I'm going to take a vehicle.

• 1:06:30Speaker 04

  Oh, nice.

• 1:06:31Speaker 02

  I'm going to, I'm going to take the most iconic thing to me in Star Wars that is still left on the board.

• 1:06:37Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 1:06:37Speaker 02

  And I'm gonna take the Millennium Falcon.

• 1:06:38Sean Fennessey?

  That's a great pick.

• 1:06:39Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, when I look up and down, when I look up and down the board.

• 1:06:44Sean Fennessey?

  You now have the Millennium Falcon and Darth Vader. That's pretty good.

• 1:06:47Speaker 02

  Yeah. So like to me, when you think of Star Wars, you think of all of these characters. But the one thing where all of this shit was going down and really encapsulates what the rebels were trying to do in the original trilogy. Is that broken down rust bucket of a ship that somehow was still the fucking fastest thing in the galaxy.

• 1:07:08Speaker 03

  I was thinking about this. I'm really glad you picked it because I also think it's representative of you. Millennium Falcon is for the homies. It's for everybody. We're all gonna, you have to go down here and shoot. You have to target like top fighters.

• 1:07:19Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 1:07:20Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go plot the course, you know, you do this. X-wing fighter, it's you and a droid. You know what I mean? Like X-wing fighter is more of like a solo thing. It's more of blast shield down. I'm just gonna fucking fuel the.

• 1:07:30Speaker 04

  Some of us like to be alone, you know?

• 1:07:32Speaker 03

  Well, I mean, I think it's an interesting witness test if you prefer the vehicle of a solo artist or one that's like, me and everybody, we're gonna gamble a little bit here, we're gonna play some cards, and then we're gonna go fight some shit.

• 1:07:43Sean Fennessey?

  You're a collaborator.

• 1:07:44Speaker 03

  Yeah. Miley Falcone is my thing.

• 1:07:46Speaker 02

  As well, yeah. Love it.

• 1:07:48Speaker 04

  Falcone also just one of the true genuine through lines of the entire franchise.

• 1:07:52Sean Fennessey?

  It is.

• 1:07:52Speaker 04

  So, valuable.

• 1:07:53Speaker 03

  Dubious ownership history. The Carfax on that is kind of...

• 1:07:58Speaker 04

  Yeah. Tough to get that vehicle insured at this point.

• 1:08:01Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, Mallory.

• 1:08:03Speaker 04

  Easy. I'm taking Obi-Wan as hero. I honestly can't believe he fell this far.

• 1:08:07Speaker 03

  When you close your eyes and you think of Obi-Wan, do you think of Ewan McGregor?

• 1:08:10Speaker 04

  I see you and McGregor.

• 1:08:11Speaker 03

  You fucking kid out of a dream.

• 1:08:12Speaker 04

  What? When I close my eyes in general, I see Ewan McGregor, so...

• 1:08:15Amanda Dobbins?

  Mallory.

• 1:08:16Speaker 04

  No question. And actually, I see the animated Obi-Wan, frankly, with that square jawline.

• 1:08:20Speaker 02

  Is that the only time that that's ever happened? Like, think about it. Is that...

• 1:08:25Amanda Dobbins?

  Has it happened?

• 1:08:25Speaker 03

  I don't think it happens.

• 1:08:26Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, it depends on what you're talking to.

• 1:08:28Speaker 02

  You don't think that... You were the chosen one!

• 1:08:31Amanda Dobbins?

  I do not...

• 1:08:32Speaker 02

  I have the high price!

• 1:08:34Speaker 04

  I'm sorry.

• 1:08:35Speaker 02

  Don't try it.

• 1:08:35Speaker 04

  Guys.

• 1:08:36Speaker 02

  My nigga tried to flip anyway, got his shit fucked up.

• 1:08:38Speaker 04

  Mustafar is iconic. Come on.

• 1:08:40Sean Fennessey?

  I like it. It's not, has not replaced Alec Guinness.

• 1:08:42Speaker 02

  I actually do think that Ewan McGregor is Obi-Wan Kenobi.

• 1:08:45Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:08:45Speaker 02

  I think, I think, I think that he is.

• 1:08:47Amanda Dobbins?

  But they both are in that part. That is like the dividing line. Like, that's absolutely insane, but I know you guys are living a different life.

• 1:08:52Sean Fennessey?

  There's more of...

• 1:08:54Speaker 04

  Yes. But at the end of the day, again, genuinely with all of the animated installments and all of it...

• 1:08:58Amanda Dobbins?

  Is he voicing this?

• 1:08:59Speaker 04

  No, he's not.

• 1:09:00Amanda Dobbins?

  The... It's just leaving money on the table.

• 1:09:03Speaker 04

  The fact that you could have such a passionate debate is Ewan McGregor, your Obi-Wan is Alec, your Obi-Wan, it's just more fodder for why it's a great pick. Like, he's one of the most iconic and essential characters in Star Wars. Certainly, undeniably, one of the most important Jedi.

• 1:09:19Speaker 03

  Did the abomination of the television show affect your appreciation for Ewan's performance?

• 1:09:22Speaker 04

  I thought that was the hottest he'd ever looked.

• 1:09:24Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 1:09:24Speaker 04

  Sliced and space sushi in the sun, you know? Bearded, filthy, wonderful stuff. Uh, yeah, Obi-Wan is most, one of the most important characters in Star Wars. One of my personal favorites. I have Obi-Wan's lightsaber. Like to think about Obi-Wan's lightsaber in some other ways. Obi-Wan and the Duchess Satine, one of the great Star Wars tragic romances in the wider canon. You know?

• 1:09:47Amanda Dobbins?

  I mean, at some point, Mallory, that's just not functional.

• 1:09:49Sean Fennessey?

  That seems kind of violent.

• 1:09:50Speaker 02

  I think it depends on what you can take.

• 1:09:52Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, that's a good point.

• 1:09:53Amanda Dobbins?

  I have to tell you.

• 1:09:54Speaker 04

  Let's spice it up.

• 1:09:56Amanda Dobbins?

  At some point, you can anymore, but that's fine.

• 1:09:59Speaker 04

  Do you know who the Duchess Satine? You know who the Duchess Satine is?

• 1:10:03Sean Fennessey?

  More elegant than a blaster. That's what they say.

• 1:10:07Speaker 04

  Indeed. Yeah, yeah, there you go. Obi-Wan versus Grievous. Will someone take Grievous? Maybe. Obi-Wan is hero.

• 1:10:13Speaker 02

  Did you miss it?

• 1:10:14Amanda Dobbins?

  Did you miss it?

• 1:10:16Speaker 04

  I would like to request that the picture is you and McGregor.

• 1:10:20Speaker 02

  Why do you guys always get? Cause remember when Mal dropped the blowjob situation years ago?

• 1:10:25Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:25Speaker 04

  Last summer.

• 1:10:26Sean Fennessey?

  That was one year ago.

• 1:10:27Speaker 02

  I watch that clip all the time. Like if I'm like all the time.

• 1:10:30Sean Fennessey?

  Maybe not all the time.

• 1:10:32Speaker 04

  I remember Amanda's reaction pretty vividly. There's the sharpened taken breath.

• 1:10:37Speaker 02

  And I look at, I look at both of you.

• 1:10:39Speaker 04

  Amanda's reaction was amazing. I think you guys were supposed to like, both like, this is Mal and Amanda was like.

• 1:10:45Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't even remember what was it.

• 1:10:46Speaker 04

  This is really a bummer. I went up to Snatch. I took Snatch and was talking about basement blowjobs.

• 1:10:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, right.

• 1:10:52Speaker 04

  Back in Reisterstown, Maryland. Some fond formative memories.

• 1:10:55Amanda Dobbins?

  Honestly.

• 1:10:56Sean Fennessey?

  So glad we were able to relive it again.

• 1:10:59Amanda Dobbins?

  It was just like.

• 1:11:00Speaker 02

  You say it again this time. You're just like.

• 1:11:03Amanda Dobbins?

  It was a recognizable sense memory thing. Like I wasn't in that basement, but I was like, sure.

• 1:11:07Speaker 02

  Everybody that's watching right now, pause it, go back and listen to it. Freeze on Amanda's face.

• 1:11:15Amanda Dobbins?

  It's just basements I have seen, you know?

• 1:11:17Speaker 02

  Oh shit. Oh my God.

• 1:11:19Speaker 04

  I have a new hope in Obi-Wan. I feel pretty good. Okay.

• 1:11:23Speaker 02

  Kenobi, the greatest Jedi of all time to me, by the way.

• 1:11:25Sean Fennessey?

  Glad we were able to circle back to.

• 1:11:26Speaker 02

  He's the greatest Jedi of all time.

• 1:11:27Sean Fennessey?

  Being pleasured by a lightsaber. Um, I have two picks.

• 1:11:32Speaker 04

  You do.

• 1:11:33Sean Fennessey?

  And I'm tremendous.

• 1:11:34Amanda Dobbins?

  Mallory's basement?

• 1:11:36Sean Fennessey?

  They should set the next film there. Yeah. Will Mando be visiting your basement?

• 1:11:39Speaker 02

  That's where the hunt for Ben Solo ended.

• 1:11:43Speaker 04

  I was a railroshitter. That's elegant.

• 1:11:45Sean Fennessey?

  That's elegant timing.

• 1:11:47Speaker 04

  Yeah. I'm surprised. Oh. Oh. Good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.

• 1:11:51Sean Fennessey?

  I have two picks. And I'm gonna tell you both of the people that I'm gonna take.

• 1:11:55Speaker 04

  Oh, I know what you're doing.

• 1:11:56Sean Fennessey?

  I'll be taking Leia Organa.

• 1:11:57Speaker 04

  Yeah. Okay, yeah.

• 1:11:58Sean Fennessey?

  And I'll also be taking Kylo Ren, AKA Ben Solo.

• 1:12:01Speaker 04

  Good.

• 1:12:01Sean Fennessey?

  Now.

• 1:12:02Speaker 04

  Gamesmanship. I like it.

• 1:12:03Sean Fennessey?

  Now Leia, I obviously have had an amazing experience with Star Wars, because if there is no Leia, my daughter's not getting into Star Wars. She's not connecting with these movies. She's an incredibly strong entry point for them, for a lot of people, but especially for young women who are getting into the stories, because she's one of the very few women with any agency in the movie.

• 1:12:21Speaker 04

  Wait till she meets Ahsoka.

• 1:12:22Sean Fennessey?

  And I'm trying to figure out what's the right place to put her versus put Ben Solo, because they're mother and son.

• 1:12:30Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:12:31Sean Fennessey?

  They're both heroes. One of them is also a villain. And they're both Skywalkers.

• 1:12:36Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:12:37Sean Fennessey?

  So I'm not sure if, like, just visually speaking, looking at the board, one makes more sense. I think Leia as my Skywalker makes the most sense.

• 1:12:45Speaker 04

  I think that's correct.

• 1:12:45Sean Fennessey?

  And Ben Solo as the hero or villain, since he's both. He's, I might argue, one of the most interesting choices you could make in that category.

• 1:12:53Speaker 04

  Agreed.

• 1:12:54Sean Fennessey?

  You picked the other one in Darth Vader.

• 1:12:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:12:57Sean Fennessey?

  About Ben Solo, Kylo Ren is one of my favorite characters in movies in the last 20 years.

• 1:13:02Speaker 04

  I love him.

• 1:13:02Sean Fennessey?

  I think he is an amazing creation.

• 1:13:04Speaker 04

  So good.

• 1:13:04Sean Fennessey?

  And such a perfect evocation of a certain kind of male psyche that was just very prevalent in the time when he was created. And it's really interesting to me when you can take, like, contemporaneous psychological profiles of men or women and put them into these crazy worlds.

• 1:13:20Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 1:13:20Sean Fennessey?

  Like, genre storytelling. And that, like, frustrated, emo, sad boy, why can't I be, like, why can't I, why are my parents making me be this way? Why can't I get back to the time, like, my grandfather, who was so cool? My parents don't want me to, you know? Be successful, they won't let me have my own independence, like all of those very common, touchable ideas, putting them inside of a Star Wars villain and making him this kind of like snively person who also has amazing power and like looks cool.

• 1:13:47Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:47Sean Fennessey?

  But doesn't know how to hold the confidence was just like an amazing choice. I've always loved Driver. I think he's a great character, so he'll be hero or villain.

• 1:13:55Speaker 03

  Skipping through Last Jedi, uh, last night and the scene where Snoke is like, take that ridiculous mask off is so devastating because it's just like, oh, you don't need this to breathe. You're just being like, this is just-

• 1:14:07Sean Fennessey?

  Trying to be cool.

• 1:14:07Speaker 03

  Hot topic Darth Vader.

• 1:14:08Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 1:14:09Speaker 03

  And it's such a great insult to him and then he fucking cuts him in half because of it.

• 1:14:14Sean Fennessey?

  That's the thing, he's still really powerful. Like, he's still a very cool Star Wars character, but with all of that frailty like right on the surface.

• 1:14:21Speaker 03

  I had completely forgotten the dyad thing.

• 1:14:24Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, dyad and a force.

• 1:14:25Speaker 03

  Tied together.

• 1:14:26Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, yeah. And he's shirtless for all of it with that like just very square torso.

• 1:14:33Speaker 04

  That's a great moment where she's like, can you, do you have like anything you could put on?

• 1:14:35Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:14:36Speaker 04

  Cowl, anything.

• 1:14:37Sean Fennessey?

  In Last Jedi?

• 1:14:38Speaker 03

  What?

• 1:14:38Sean Fennessey?

  That idea of them being able to see each other across-

• 1:14:42Speaker 04

  Force timing, as the kids call it.

• 1:14:44Sean Fennessey?

  Force timing, yeah.

• 1:14:45Amanda Dobbins?

  For people who are just listening, it should be noted that you just shrugged.

• 1:14:48Speaker 02

  I mean, I like the connection that they had. I think that that character of Ben Solo is kind of in ways indicative of the failures of the sequel trilogy.

• 1:14:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Wow.

• 1:14:57Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:14:57Amanda Dobbins?

  Why?

• 1:14:58Speaker 02

  Because they didn't know what to do with him.

• 1:15:00Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, the ending is unforgivable for both of them.

• 1:15:02Sean Fennessey?

  Because I think that's a Rise of Skywalker problem.

• 1:15:03Amanda Dobbins?

  I agree.

• 1:15:04Speaker 04

  Oh, why the Skywalker problems?

• 1:15:05Speaker 02

  It is, but at the same time-

• 1:15:06Sean Fennessey?

  His arc in Last Jedi is so great to me.

• 1:15:08Speaker 04

  I agree.

• 1:15:09Speaker 02

  I, I, to me, they, like, there's even in, there's inconsistencies with the power of the character. The movie starts with that character freezing a blaster bolt in midair. So you're thinking, oh my God, this is a nuke level Skywalker blooded fucking menace.

• 1:15:26Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, one of the strongest we've ever seen.

• 1:15:27Speaker 02

  Then at the end of the movie, he gets fucked by like, he's like Finn is in a lightsaber battle with him. Like, they never quite clearly tell you-

• 1:15:35Speaker 04

  Well, he's been shot, he's bleeding out, but he's also emotionally devastated by his choice to kill his own father.

• 1:15:41Speaker 02

  I get it, but like, a lot of times when I-

• 1:15:43Speaker 04

  He's been undone.

• 1:15:44Speaker 02

  I look at the murkiness of those films. To me, the murkiness of those films can be laid at the feet of the murkiness of the villain that is right there in the films. Like, and, and, so, look, I, like, it is a Rise of Skywalker problem, but The Rise of Skywalker is one of the movies that Kylo Ren is in.

• 1:16:00Sean Fennessey?

  I, I think it's fair to say there's some kind of inconsistencies about like how powerful or not powerful certain characters are through, across all the movies. Um, I just think that's the boldest choice to me, that character, across that sequel trilogy, is that, like, the, the power and the way that he's positioned.

• 1:16:17Speaker 03

  And having him be like, let's get like a Marlon Brando, James Dean style, like, agitated, method-y person to, to do this.

• 1:16:26Sean Fennessey?

  Exactly, that's exactly what I was thinking, the performance style of the actor, which is very different from the kind of like elevated pop fantasy that came in all the other movies. Okay, those are, those are my three picks. Back to Mallory.

• 1:16:38Speaker 04

  Um, okay, geez, there are so many things I want to do here. This is really, I think Skywalker has gotten so thin that I'll wait, uh, which I'm okay with. I usually in a draft, wild card is like, I think, almost synonymous with save it till the end, but I think that there are, to me, two potential picks inside of wild card that are, could have been in the first round of this draft. I'm torn which I want to do, but I will be going with my wild card here.

• 1:17:10Sean Fennessey?

  Hmm.

• 1:17:11Speaker 04

  I'm gonna go with my heart. I'm a little hard head on this. I'm taking lightsabers.

• 1:17:14Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:17:15Speaker 04

  I think in a Star Wars draft, it's pretty important that lightsabers be selected.

• 1:17:18Speaker 03

  You obviously have a personal attachment to the concept.

• 1:17:21Speaker 04

  You guys, you know how many lightsabers I own? A lot.

• 1:17:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, now we have a completely different.

• 1:17:26Speaker 04

  What do I use them for?

• 1:17:27Speaker 02

  Get out of here now.

• 1:17:28Speaker 04

  Ask my husband.

• 1:17:29Speaker 02

  Tough stuff.

• 1:17:30Sean Fennessey?

  She looked right at me when you said that.

• 1:17:33Speaker 04

  It's because I know that he doesn't appreciate when I stare into his eyes when I say those.

• 1:17:37Speaker 03

  Has he moved around at all? I haven't checked in a while.

• 1:17:40Speaker 04

  Um, I, I will be jealous of the person who gets the other thing I considered taking in wild card, but I'm so thrilled to have lightsabers and I, I'm, I think this is the right thing for me to do here. Lightsabers, genuinely one of the most iconic things in all of pop culture, all of the world.

• 1:17:52Sean Fennessey?

  Good pick in a rare moment when an early wild card. Pick, I think is very justified. Yes. I thought about weapons. I just didn't think there were enough weapons.

• 1:17:59Speaker 04

  That's part of why I really wanted to have lightsabers because Star Wars is very much about duels and battles. And I don't think frankly, like blasters are going to be selected or should be.

• 1:18:09Sean Fennessey?

  You could have been more specific. You could have said Luke's lightsaber.

• 1:18:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, but why? Now I get them all.

• 1:18:14Sean Fennessey?

  I'm just saying.

• 1:18:15Speaker 04

  Now I get all of them. All of them, right?

• 1:18:17Sean Fennessey?

  You could have said Mace Windu's lightsaber.

• 1:18:19Speaker 04

  That is one of the ones I own. You know, as a Ravens fan, purple saber, pretty cool. Uh, but no, I'm just getting every single one. So I don't need to make the choice, which is pretty wonderful and powerful.

• 1:18:27Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, Van Lathan.

• 1:18:28Speaker 02

  I am going Wild Card two. I'm taking the most iconic stuff that's still available to me. And I'm taking the Force.

• 1:18:36Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 1:18:37Sean Fennessey?

  Incredible pick.

• 1:18:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, I have that in my top three in Wild Card.

• 1:18:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, I'm, I'm taking.

• 1:18:41Speaker 04

  I thought you were gonna do something else.

• 1:18:42Sean Fennessey?

  I think Van is dominating.

• 1:18:43Speaker 02

  Like, I'm taking the Force.

• 1:18:44Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:18:45Speaker 02

  Like, when I was a lad, the thing that more intrigued me about Star Wars than anything else was this idea that this, there was this thing that binded the universe together. And that accessing it would let you overcome any sort of evil that you were up against. And if Luke could do that, if he can get in tune with the Force, if he could listen to the Force, if he could operate by the will of the Force.

• 1:19:13Speaker 03

  He could turn his guidance system off.

• 1:19:15Speaker 02

  Exactly. And just shoot into and destroy the biggest, baddest thing that's ever existed. So the Force. And that more than anything has been the thing that as we move forward, we struggle with the most. Which is, which is how to deal with it and talk about it and make it make sense in a very cynical world.

• 1:19:32Speaker 04

  Frankly, the only reason that this, that's the only knock on the pick is that I think the Force has become a little bit of like a, a lightning rod inside of how fans talk about Star Wars and how Star Wars is made. And does everything need to be about the, a lot of this about the TV shows, to be fair, but like, does everything need to be about the Force? Should these characters be able to use the Force? Obviously, one of the big debates about, sorry to bring up Last Jedi again, was like Broomboy, which I loved and thought was awesome and a great reminder of how big the galaxy is. But that's not how everybody feels about it.

• 1:20:00Speaker 03

  I was gonna ask what the debate was.

• 1:20:03Amanda Dobbins?

  So you don't want enough.

• 1:20:05Sean Fennessey?

  When we did the Star Wars rewatchables episode, I proffered a theory that the decline of organized religion, interest in organized religion in America, dovetails neatly with the rise of Star Wars.

• 1:20:15Speaker 03

  You say it so evenly that it doesn't register how insane that moment was.

• 1:20:20Sean Fennessey?

  I feel very confident in it being at least an interesting theory.

• 1:20:23Speaker 02

  But I honestly agree with more, like, we could extrapolate. I think a belief in Superman, like, all of these things that are based in this sort of cultural purity, they go right along with the fact that we just don't believe in this version of mystical and mythical goodness anymore.

• 1:20:39Sean Fennessey?

  So that was what I was gonna ask you is, do you consider yourself a person who fears God?

• 1:20:44Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 1:20:45Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, and you can hold that with the Force?

• 1:20:47Speaker 02

  I can, and it was so funny back in the day when my grandmother, she, uh, she tried to get me off the Force. She joined a very popular type of Christianity, and she played this, uh, this video where it was like, George Lucas actually believes in the Force, and they think that the Force is real. And she was, she goes, "So if you believe in the Force and you watch Star Wars, you might go to hell." I was like, "Okay."

• 1:21:15Sean Fennessey?

  It's a teen mentality.

• 1:21:18Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I'll see you in hell.

• 1:21:22Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 1:21:23Amanda Dobbins?

  My turn.

• 1:21:24Sean Fennessey?

  You're up, Dobbins.

• 1:21:24Amanda Dobbins?

  So there are a few things I could do here, and I, I'm not, I'm not going big and grand and lightsaber and the Force. I'm not doing my wild card. I think I'm gonna have to play strategic.

• 1:21:37Amanda Dobbins?

  What happens if I break the draft?

• 1:21:39Speaker 03

  Oh.

• 1:21:39Sean Fennessey?

  Oh, shit. You can break the draft.

• 1:21:41Amanda Dobbins?

  I might be breaking the draft, so we'll see how you guys are feeling, but, um, problematic character.

• 1:21:46Speaker 03

  Oh, okay.

• 1:21:46Amanda Dobbins?

  Sean explained to me yesterday, and he was like, "Just Google it." And it turns out, when you Google it, you get a lot of men who are mad about The Last Jedi, writing about the Star Wars characters that they hate the most. And so, aside from Jar Jar, obviously, there are many cultural stereotypes embodied across the 11 films that people would have different issues with, but I don't have, like, a, a specific recall of all. Those slides, so I'm doing a problematic character that jumped out to me yesterday while watching The Phantom Menace for the first time.

• 1:22:20Speaker 04

  Nice.

• 1:22:20Amanda Dobbins?

  Which is Padme.

• 1:22:21Sean Fennessey?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:22:22Amanda Dobbins?

  Uh, because that is an age gap romance and I have some real issues with that. In addition, she is endangering her hand meetings with the Swisheroo.

• 1:22:31Speaker 04

  Sure, yeah.

• 1:22:32Amanda Dobbins?

  Including Sofia Coppola. So because of Padme, we might not get lost in translation. So get out of here, Padme.

• 1:22:38Speaker 03

  Why are you looking at me when you're yelling?

• 1:22:40Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't know.

• 1:22:42Sean Fennessey?

  This is a great thing. You haven't broken the game technically.

• 1:22:44Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:44Speaker 04

  Okay, but.

• 1:22:45Speaker 03

  Why would I have broken the game up?

• 1:22:46Speaker 02

  Because she's going.

• 1:22:47Sean Fennessey?

  The number of Skywalkers available.

• 1:22:49Speaker 04

  Jesus Christ.

• 1:22:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:50Speaker 04

  I've got some things I can do when I.

• 1:22:52Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:22:52Speaker 04

  So.

• 1:22:52Amanda Dobbins?

  But I mean, it's not, but yeah, it's got.

• 1:22:54Speaker 04

  Doesn't help you.

• 1:22:55Sean Fennessey?

  Interesting pick, though.

• 1:22:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, I had some questions and they weren't answered.

• 1:22:59Sean Fennessey?

  I, I think that's a flawed character, Padme.

• 1:23:02Amanda Dobbins?

  Um, also a flawed performance, but whatever.

• 1:23:05Sean Fennessey?

  Yes. I would argue not her fault.

• 1:23:07Amanda Dobbins?

  They're not giving anyone in that movie a lot to work with.

• 1:23:09Sean Fennessey?

  I think that's a George Lucas issue.

• 1:23:11Speaker 04

  Yes. I think the performance in Attack of the Clones is even worse, but yeah.

• 1:23:14Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:14Speaker 02

  So they're five years apart.

• 1:23:16Speaker 04

  Yeah, she's, she is a.

• 1:23:18Speaker 02

  He's, she's 14, he's nine. So when they come back to the next movie, he's 17, she's 22?

• 1:23:25Amanda Dobbins?

  Listen, you know that right now in 2026, people on the internet.

• 1:23:29Speaker 02

  On Naboo, yeah. What is the age of consent?

• 1:23:32Speaker 04

  I think he's older than 17. He's older than 17.

• 1:23:34Speaker 02

  Is he older than 17?

• 1:23:35Speaker 04

  He's like 18 or 19.

• 1:23:36Speaker 02

  So he's 18 or 19.

• 1:23:37Amanda Dobbins?

  There's power imbalance?

• 1:23:38Speaker 02

  There is power imbalance, although he is the most powerful being in the universe.

• 1:23:43Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, sure, but institutionally speaking.

• 1:23:45Speaker 04

  Midichlorian Jesus.

• 1:23:46Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:23:47Amanda Dobbins?

  Um.

• 1:23:48Speaker 02

  I'll allow it.

• 1:23:49Speaker 04

  You shocked me with that one.

• 1:23:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Thank you. Thanks so much. You know.

• 1:23:53Sean Fennessey?

  It's a hell of a take.

• 1:23:54Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:23:55Sean Fennessey?

  Um.

• 1:23:56Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:23:56Sean Fennessey?

  Well, that, that, that leads us to CR, right?

• 1:23:59Speaker 04

  CR on the, on the turn here.

• 1:24:01Sean Fennessey?

  CR, do you have a Skywalker?

• 1:24:03Speaker 03

  Yeah, I got Luke.

• 1:24:04Sean Fennessey?

  You got Luke.

• 1:24:04Speaker 03

  The Skywalker in some ways.

• 1:24:06Speaker 04

  Jack, can I request that you add an S to lightsaber to make it plural to really just reinforce that I have every lightsaber?

• 1:24:13Speaker 03

  Yeah, cuz somebody's gonna be like, ah!

• 1:24:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:24:18Sean Fennessey?

  Paper copies over here. Wow, paper, paper copies.

• 1:24:20Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go, okay, so first of all, just inspired by you guys, I'm gonna go wildcard Death Star.

• 1:24:25Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:24:26Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:24:26Sean Fennessey?

  Fantastic.

• 1:24:27Speaker 02

  That's a good one.

• 1:24:28Speaker 04

  I mean, it's a good one.

• 1:24:29Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:24:29Speaker 03

  Something that I think is now, like, obviously is crossed over into like, why?

• 1:24:33Speaker 04

  Why didn't you take in a vehicle?

• 1:24:36Sean Fennessey?

  It could have been eligible in both.

• 1:24:37Speaker 03

  I don't really think of it as a vehicle, it's more of a weapon.

• 1:24:39Speaker 04

  It's a battle station.

• 1:24:40Amanda Dobbins?

  It's a concept.

• 1:24:40Speaker 03

  Sure.

• 1:24:41Amanda Dobbins?

  It's a useful reference.

• 1:24:42Speaker 02

  Have you guys ever noticed Mallory's draft?

• 1:24:45Speaker 04

  I'm just curious.

• 1:24:45Speaker 02

  Like, her draft tactics, she shits on your draft, but she tries to glamour the audience.

• 1:24:49Amanda Dobbins?

  Not at all. We've been living like this for 10 years.

• 1:24:52Speaker 04

  I think everyone's doing great. Everyone's doing great. I just was interested in the strategy.

• 1:24:56Speaker 03

  I think of it more of as a weapon than a vehicle.

• 1:24:59Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:24:59Speaker 03

  Uh, and also, often, you know, it's quite stationary, I know it orbits, but, you know, like, in any case.

• 1:25:05Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:25:06Speaker 03

  Uh, it has sort of provided a lot of my favorite moments throughout Star Wars, both in New Hope and Return of the Jedi, and in Andor in some ways, I was just watching the Krennic interrogation scene of, uh, of Deirdre. Uh, and, um, I think it's one of the great inventions of this universe, is this idea of especially presaging some of the Cold War stuff that was really about to hit off, but this idea of a superweapon, this idea of a doomsday, this idea of like, everything lights out, um, I think they may have gotten a little flippant with its use in the sequels, or with the idea of the Starkiller base and what it does, but, uh, you know, I'm happy about that, and now...

• 1:25:48Sean Fennessey?

  Is that, is that the biggest flaw of The Force Awakens?

• 1:25:53Speaker 04

  That it's just note for note the same as...

• 1:25:55Sean Fennessey?

  That the Empire would be like, we're just gonna do this again?

• 1:25:56Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:25:56Sean Fennessey?

  Not that, not that the movie is the same as the first film, but the idea of the Empire just trying to build another thing.

• 1:26:02Speaker 04

  Planet killer?

• 1:26:02Speaker 02

  The third time they went with it.

• 1:26:03Sean Fennessey?

  It's the same thing.

• 1:26:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:26:04Sean Fennessey?

  Like, why do they think this is the only way to dominate?

• 1:26:07Speaker 03

  I mean, it's the weird thing is that they have the, two of the most powerful beings in the galaxy, and they're like, but we gotta build a space station.

• 1:26:14Speaker 02

  Well, the Empire, the Emperor is also obsessed with it. If he would have listened to Thrawn and invested into the advance...

• 1:26:20Speaker 04

  The Thai program.

• 1:26:21Speaker 02

  The Thai program, probably would have been better, more versatile weapon.

• 1:26:23Speaker 03

  Bullshit would have been if they Oppenheimer'd it, and the Republic was like, we have to build a space station, so that this can never happen again.

• 1:26:29Speaker 02

  Hmm.

• 1:26:30Speaker 03

  And then it just becomes nuclear, you know?

• 1:26:32Speaker 02

  But it's the folly of the Empire.

• 1:26:33Sean Fennessey?

  That would be Oppenheimer-ing it.

• 1:26:35Speaker 03

  Well, if you were like, we have to show them, you know, like, what we can do.

• 1:26:39Speaker 02

  Just Google Grand Admiral Thrawn.

• 1:26:42Speaker 04

  Thrawn is the best.

• 1:26:43Amanda Dobbins?

  Which movie is he in?

• 1:26:44Sean Fennessey?

  No movies.

• 1:26:44Speaker 02

  Books and TV shows.

• 1:26:45Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, okay. Well, I can't be responsible for that. Okay.

• 1:26:48Speaker 02

  He's an awesome villain.

• 1:26:49Speaker 04

  He's great.

• 1:26:50Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, good pick, Chris. You have another pick.

• 1:26:53Speaker 03

  For movie you're cursed with, I'm giving Amanda, uh, I'm giving her Phantom Menace.

• 1:27:03Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, that is absolutely the right move.

• 1:27:04Speaker 04

  Great one. So how do we mark?

• 1:27:06Sean Fennessey?

  Show your hand there.

• 1:27:07Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, he's fine. I mean, honestly, it's quite.

• 1:27:10Sean Fennessey?

  Clones might be worse, I think.

• 1:27:12Amanda Dobbins?

  I haven't seen Clones. And that's the one I haven't seen. And then I think philosophically and creatively, Rise of Skywalker is more bankrupt.

• 1:27:23Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:27:23Speaker 04

  Totally agree.

• 1:27:24Amanda Dobbins?

  Rise of Skywalker is the evil movie and Phantom Menace is the bad movie.

• 1:27:28Speaker 03

  Yes.

• 1:27:29Sean Fennessey?

  And this is just kind of boring at times. Attack of the Clones, I will cape for just because it just has some fun action.

• 1:27:34Speaker 04

  I think Attack of the Clones is a better story than Phantom Menace with easily the worst dialogue and performances in the entire franchise.

• 1:27:42Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I agree.

• 1:27:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's hard because like I know pod racing and Duel of the Fates, people will be like, but you have that.

• 1:27:48Speaker 04

  Duel of the Fates rules.

• 1:27:50Speaker 03

  Is Mason Attack of the Clones?

• 1:27:52Speaker 04

  Mason is in all the, is in all the replays.

• 1:27:53Speaker 03

  But he gets killed in Attack of the Clones, right?

• 1:27:55Speaker 04

  No, that's it. Revenge of the Sith. That's the Palpatine show.

• 1:27:57Sean Fennessey?

  Unlimited power!

• 1:28:01Sean Fennessey?

  That's when Alistar's doing the Emperor. That's of course what I said.

• 1:28:05Speaker 03

  Uh, so those are my picks.

• 1:28:06Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, thank you so much for that. Um, what a gift.

• 1:28:10Speaker 04

  Where did you think someone would first choose to curse someone? Was this about the spot midway?

• 1:28:14Sean Fennessey?

  When it got to Chris, I started thinking about who I would curse with what. So it seems like about that time, right? Because you don't want it to be nasty upfront. There's so much we love about Star Wars. But now we've cleared the deck on a lot of old favorites and we'll think about how we can also wound our competitors.

• 1:28:31Amanda Dobbins?

  This episode is brought to you by Apple and AT&T. Scroll long enough and you'll hear it all. Miracle diets, fitness trends, you name it. But with iPhone and Apple Watch, you get meaningful insights from a very trusted source: your body. You can track sleep quality, cardio fitness and more, then unpack all the information in the Health app on iPhone to get a picture of your overall health. These health insights are developed with clinical experts from start to finish. Find out more at apple.com/health. Apple Watch is not a medical device and should not be used as a substitute for professional medical advice.

• 1:29:03Amanda Dobbins?

  I guess I could curse someone, but the wild card of it all. Now, I really, I am.

• 1:29:09Sean Fennessey?

  Do you have, did you have a long list of wild card potentials?

• 1:29:12Amanda Dobbins?

  I had more than one, but I'm gonna take John Williams.

• 1:29:14Speaker 04

  There we go. That's what I thought.

• 1:29:16Amanda Dobbins?

  Like, which is just like an absolute no brainer.

• 1:29:18Sean Fennessey?

  Love it.

• 1:29:19Amanda Dobbins?

  These, I mean, these movies don't exist without lightsabers of the first, but they also do not exist without that score, which is like, honestly, probably the greatest, certainly classical music of our lifetime. But he's, he's one of one. It will live on. If you have not seen John Williams performing, or like conducting symphony orchestras, performing his work, there's a whole series that he did in Vienna, which we just like watch in my house and my children love it. And then like I, you know, the music itself can bring me to tears, honestly, more than the movies can. So.

• 1:29:54Speaker 04

  That's why I started crying talking about Biner Sunset earlier.

• 1:29:58Amanda Dobbins?

  It's just, it's an insane accomplishment that totally changes the way that we understand like popular music from the last 50 years.

• 1:30:07Speaker 03

  You really wonder what would happen if it was another.

• 1:30:09Speaker 02

  If they missed, yeah, or if somebody else was doing it, yeah, if he wasn't just the fucking man of our lives.

• 1:30:14Speaker 04

  I think it's the single, the, the, this one, one of my favorite podcasts that I've ever done and been a part of was the, the sounds of Star Wars binge mode episode during the Star Wars runs where we talked about score, but also just in general, the soundscape of Star Wars. And I think there's no greater shorthand to that emotional connection than like when you hear the force theme kick in, or you hear a lightsaber fire up. It's just the sounds of Star Wars take you to that place right away.

• 1:30:37Sean Fennessey?

  Just hearing R2 sounds.

• 1:30:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, the beeps and boops. No droid category, I think, is very devastating here, by the way. But of course, they could be selected in certain categories.

• 1:30:44Sean Fennessey?

  Droids are eligible in other categories.

• 1:30:45Speaker 04

  John Williams' score was what I was alluding to earlier, when I said I was really torn between two things and a top wild card. The force was, was up there as well, but yeah, I think this is a great pick.

• 1:30:53Amanda Dobbins?

  What an absolute legend.

• 1:30:56Speaker 02

  Okay, I have to take a Skywalker now. I've waited long enough.

• 1:31:00Speaker 04

  Why? The cat, why at this point? The category's so thin.

• 1:31:04Speaker 02

  Well, I mean, if the category's thin now, if I, if I fucking wait, then I'm gonna get left with fucking Sheemi Skywalker.

• 1:31:10Sean Fennessey?

  Cause you're left without Skywalker.

• 1:31:11Speaker 04

  No, I've got some things I can do. I feel fine.

• 1:31:13Speaker 02

  I'm gonna take Rey.

• 1:31:15Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm. Eligible.

• 1:31:16Speaker 04

  A character you don't like. A character you don't like.

• 1:31:20Amanda Dobbins?

  I was like, I, you, you sat there in a fucking coliseum.

• 1:31:25Speaker 04

  I don't think you should be allowed to take her.

• 1:31:27Amanda Dobbins?

  And you were like, Rey is not a Skywalker. You said it over and over again.

• 1:31:31Speaker 03

  Because there's a debate.

• 1:31:32Speaker 04

  You're saying.

• 1:31:33Speaker 03

  She's just, she's a Skywalker.

• 1:31:35Speaker 02

  She's one.

• 1:31:35Speaker 04

  Wait, so you're saying not eligible?

• 1:31:37Sean Fennessey?

  And I'm saying she is eligible. That I was wrong when I said that to Amanda.

• 1:31:40Amanda Dobbins?

  But you never corrected that.

• 1:31:41Sean Fennessey?

  I'll apologize to Amanda for not correcting that.

• 1:31:43Amanda Dobbins?

  She's fucking late. You already threw a tantrum about me recalling the conversation.

• 1:31:46Sean Fennessey?

  There's only one person throwing tantrums on this podcast and we all know who it is, Amanda.

• 1:31:50Speaker 02

  Yeah, it's, it's, it's a very thin category, but like, if this is the last mid-rounder that you can get.

• 1:31:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:31:57Speaker 02

  This is the, I mean, you're, you know, after this, there's like, there's none, there's none left. Like, I mean, I don't know what you guys do, so I'm gonna, I'm gonna take Rey. Interesting, I like her.

• 1:32:06Speaker 03

  We're gonna see.

• 1:32:08Speaker 04

  This is shameful, what you're doing right now.

• 1:32:11Speaker 03

  Many people are saying.

• 1:32:14Speaker 04

  Because it's not credible, you don't like her and you don't like the movie she's in.

• 1:32:18Speaker 02

  She's gonna, we're gonna see more of her, okay? I, I like her, I think she means a lot. By the way, can I say something? Can I say something? A lot of young.

• 1:32:25Amanda Dobbins?

  You are talking about her the way Trump talked about Tim Cook yesterday.

• 1:32:31Speaker 03

  He never bothered me and I will say that.

• 1:32:34Speaker 02

  I think for a lot of young lady Skywalker, like Star Wars fans, that she represents a lot to them. She's cool, I like Rey.

• 1:32:42Sean Fennessey?

  He does.

• 1:32:43Speaker 02

  I like Rey, I'm taking Rey. That's, that's my Skywalker right there.

• 1:32:46Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 1:32:46Speaker 02

  Just don't know who else is on the board that could even be like.

• 1:32:49Speaker 04

  Well, you're gonna find out.

• 1:32:50Sean Fennessey?

  You were gonna say Rey was your problematic character. That's where I thought you were going.

• 1:32:53Speaker 02

  I thought Rey was there too.

• 1:32:54Amanda Dobbins?

  Why? Because she's not really fleshed out and what they do, I mean, what they do with her in Rise of Skywalker is unforgivable, but I don't think it's Rey's fault.

• 1:33:02Sean Fennessey?

  I think just even the explanation of her lineage.

• 1:33:04Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:33:05Sean Fennessey?

  Is so janky.

• 1:33:06Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:33:06Amanda Dobbins?

  I mean, I agree.

• 1:33:08Sean Fennessey?

  You know, and it's like, it's, she's the daughter of a failed Palpatine clone.

• 1:33:12Speaker 04

  A Strangcast, yeah.

• 1:33:13Sean Fennessey?

  You know, it's just a very odd retcon, like such a, that's the best they could do with that idea?

• 1:33:19Amanda Dobbins?

  In the same way that you're putting like all the failures of, you're separating the failures of Rise of Skywalker from Ben Solo, from Kylo Ren. I'm separating it from Rey.

• 1:33:29Sean Fennessey?

  Right.

• 1:33:29Amanda Dobbins?

  When, the moment when she gets the lightsaber and forced Rey kids, we already, I already said.

• 1:33:33Sean Fennessey?

  We've lost the television, it's back.

• 1:33:35Speaker 04

  Cheer it up.

• 1:33:35Sean Fennessey?

  I, I, good, good pick, I think. Yeah. I'll apologize to you again.

• 1:33:39Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 1:33:40Sean Fennessey?

  For not letting you know that I had changed my mind about that.

• 1:33:43Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 1:33:43Sean Fennessey?

  Only because I didn't think there were enough Skywalker characters that would be eligible to make the game continue. Fortunately for Mallory.

• 1:33:50Speaker 04

  I do still have to select a Skywalker.

• 1:33:51Sean Fennessey?

  You do.

• 1:33:52Speaker 04

  I will not be doing it now. Now that Rey is off the board, I'll be waiting probably until the last round.

• 1:33:56Sean Fennessey?

  It seems wise.

• 1:33:57Speaker 04

  There are some things I can do there. Um, let's see. Some exciting possibilities here. I will take, I think, the clear number one draft pick and problematic character. I'll take Jar Jar.

• 1:34:09Sean Fennessey?

  Wise.

• 1:34:09Speaker 03

  Because you think he's the most problematic, or you just love him so much?

• 1:34:12Speaker 04

  All of the, no, no, no, sorry. God. I think problematic, but also I think clearly the poster character for that idea.

• 1:34:21Sean Fennessey?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:34:22Speaker 04

  Inside of the franchise. And, um, you know, are there some fun little Jar Jar moments in the animated canon that have warmed me to him over time? You know, are there a lot of fun Jar Jar theories? Love what they've done with Jar Jar in the, uh, in the Little Lego shorts. I mean, Jar Jar is, not, not only does he go in the Senate, let's be clear. Jar Jar's responsible for the Emperor. Remember? He's like gaslit and manipulated into not, into presenting the motion that allows Darth Sidious to become the Emperor.

• 1:34:54Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 1:34:54Speaker 04

  So in addition to all of the other, you know, the tropes and the, the racist caricatures and just the really bad dialogue and storytelling in Phantom Menace, Jar Jar is also responsible for fascism and tyranny reigning across the, uh, Galactic Empire for decades on end. And so I don't see how Jar Jar couldn't be the top pick in this category. Happy to have him on the squad.

• 1:35:19Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, solid pick.

• 1:35:21Speaker 04

  I will not be doing an impression.

• 1:35:22Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, definitely number one.

• 1:35:23Speaker 03

  There's also like three or four other super kind of racist characters in those vehicles.

• 1:35:27Speaker 04

  You can certainly select them. But thank you for saying clearly the number one. I appreciate it.

• 1:35:30Speaker 02

  There's six categories or five?

• 1:35:31Speaker 04

  Seven.

• 1:35:32Speaker 02

  Seven. What the fuck am I doing? I'm trying to see what else is on the board.

• 1:35:37Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, I have two picks.

• 1:35:39Amanda Dobbins?

  You need both movies.

• 1:35:40Speaker 03

  Vansley wasn't picking.

• 1:35:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, Van, you haven't picked a movie.

• 1:35:43Sean Fennessey?

  Which is challenging because you're about to receive a movie in another category.

• 1:35:47Speaker 02

  Go for it.

• 1:35:48Sean Fennessey?

  Because of the strength of Van Slate.

• 1:35:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:35:51Sean Fennessey?

  I am cursing him with The Rise of Skywalker.

• 1:35:54Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, good.

• 1:35:54Speaker 04

  Oh, wow, okay.

• 1:35:55Sean Fennessey?

  Which, to me, is just desserts for the Last Jedi haters.

• 1:35:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:35:58Sean Fennessey?

  That movie exists because of the Last Jedi haters. It exists because Disney forced J.J. Abrams to make that movie too fast with a script that was not ready, and that they forced all these ideas into the frame, and then they fucked up Star Wars movies for seven years. That is a fact. The movie, I think we can all agree, is ultimately a failure.

• 1:36:18Speaker 04

  Of course.

• 1:36:20Sean Fennessey?

  And...

• 1:36:21Speaker 03

  Was Trevor Rose supposed to direct that?

• 1:36:23Speaker 02

  He was.

• 1:36:23Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 1:36:23Speaker 02

  And he was gonna do a whole, what, Duel of the Fates?

• 1:36:26Speaker 03

  But then they were like, Ryan's gonna direct it, and then they were like, actually, J.J.'s gonna direct it.

• 1:36:30Speaker 02

  They lost their nerves.

• 1:36:31Sean Fennessey?

  They botched it. I'm only giving it to you because your board is really good. And I'm kind of annoyed with how good you've been doing.

• 1:36:38Amanda Dobbins?

  I was thinking about giving it to you also because you...

• 1:36:41Speaker 02

  It's upsetting.

• 1:36:41Amanda Dobbins?

  You don't like Last Jedi. You're not...

• 1:36:44Speaker 04

  Can I ask that?

• 1:36:45Amanda Dobbins?

  And Rise of Skywalker happened because of the... So I'm not blaming you personally.

• 1:36:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, cuz I didn't do it.

• 1:36:50Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, you didn't do it, but it's not good.

• 1:36:53Speaker 04

  Can I ask like a process question in terms of how this will be presented? Because you're like, I did this here because I want to hurt Van because his squad is so good. But it's listed on your team. So when people very quickly are looking at this, at like, on Instagram...

• 1:37:04Speaker 05

  It will be corrected, so whatever movie you're cursed with...

• 1:37:08Speaker 04

  That will be placed on your individual...

• 1:37:09Speaker 05

  Exactly, I'm just leaving this up for order purposes right now.

• 1:37:11Sean Fennessey?

  That was going to be my recommendation.

• 1:37:13Speaker 02

  I could make a true argument that if you're cursed with that movie...

• 1:37:18Speaker 04

  You've lost.

• 1:37:18Speaker 02

  That your entire board...

• 1:37:20Speaker 04

  I think it's a great... I mean, yeah, Rise of Skywalker is a scandal. Genuinely a scandal.

• 1:37:24Sean Fennessey?

  It is a scandal. I think actually when we came out of the movie, we were like a little gobsmacked. We were like, what just happened?

• 1:37:32Speaker 04

  We stood still on the sidewalk for 45 minutes, unable to move.

• 1:37:35Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, that was tough. That was tough. It's too bad. Anyway, I gotta pick something else.

• 1:37:43Sean Fennessey?

  So I've got...

• 1:37:44Speaker 04

  You've done your movies.

• 1:37:46Sean Fennessey?

  So I need a vehicle, a problematic character, and a wild card, huh?

• 1:37:49Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:52Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 1:37:53Sean Fennessey?

  I think, I'll tell you what I think is the coolest vehicle after the Millennium Falcon. I'm gonna take it right now.

• 1:37:58Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:37:59Sean Fennessey?

  It's called the Tie Advanced X1. It's Darth Vader's Tie Fighter.

• 1:38:03Speaker 02

  It is good.

• 1:38:04Speaker 04

  You're going very specific.

• 1:38:04Sean Fennessey?

  Which I think is super fucking cool. And you know what? He does get blown out of the frame by Han Solo in A New Hope.

• 1:38:10Speaker 04

  And he goes, "What?"

• 1:38:10Sean Fennessey?

  I can't deny it.

• 1:38:11Speaker 04

  And he kind of rotates.

• 1:38:12Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah. But even still, it's just something I enjoy. I enjoy him like getting behind the wheel there. Just real Top Gun Maverick vibes where it's like, "Fine, I'll do it myself." You know? And, uh, I just think that's a really cool vehicle. So that's my pick. You could've gone any number of directions. You could've gone broad with a certain style of vehicle. But if I had to choose one to jump into, if I wasn't piloting the Millennium Falcon, it would be this one.

• 1:38:36Speaker 04

  Okay. That's good.

• 1:38:38Sean Fennessey?

  Okay. Mallory, you're up.

• 1:38:42Speaker 04

  Okay. I didn't necessarily think I was gonna do this here, but I'm mostly, I'm gonna curse someone with Attack of the Clones, because I don't wanna be cursed with Attack of the Clones. And I actually would be like genuinely fine with any of the other movies that someone sent my way, because this will take, I think, clearly the bottom three, Phantom Menace, Rise of Skywalker, and Attack of the Clones off the board, means I can't receive one of the worst three movies. So I think strategically it's sound for me to just avoid being able to receive this. Who do I wanna give it to? So Amanda has been cursed with a movie.

• 1:39:13Sean Fennessey?

  Van is been cursed with a movie.

• 1:39:14Speaker 04

  So Sean and Chris are your options. I got her. Oh, geez. Sheesh. Wow, okay.

• 1:39:19Sean Fennessey?

  This is like an anxiety dream.

• 1:39:20Speaker 04

  Life comes at you fast. Yeah. Okay, so let's see. Chris has Luke Rogue won The Death Star and has given Phantom Menace. Sean has Empire Leia, Ben, I do, and the Tie Fighter. I do think I have to curse Sean with this. You gotta counterbalance having Empire clearly the best movie, I think. So Sean will be receiving Attack of the Clones, which I think is the...

• 1:39:39Sean Fennessey?

  Clones. As I said, I just...

• 1:39:40Speaker 04

  What happens in that?

• 1:39:42Speaker 03

  Nothing.

• 1:39:42Speaker 04

  Okay. And again, slices up a pair and sends it to Padme in midair. You remember that? There's the...

• 1:39:48Sean Fennessey?

  There's like espionage, chase through.

• 1:39:50Speaker 02

  But there's also...

• 1:39:51Speaker 04

  Obi-Wan.

• 1:39:52Speaker 03

  Is that where Dooku comes in?

• 1:39:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, Dooku.

• 1:39:54Sean Fennessey?

  Dooku enters the frame, General Greed enters the frame.

• 1:39:56Speaker 04

  Camino, Detective Obi-Wan.

• 1:39:58Speaker 02

  But in the movie theater, when Obi-Wan, when Yoda was getting busy with his lightsaber, people were going crazy.

• 1:40:04Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, that was sick.

• 1:40:05Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:40:06Sean Fennessey?

  I don't know. I think, I mean, it's not, it's by no means great.

• 1:40:08Speaker 04

  The performances and dialogue in that movie are appalling. Every scene between Anakin and Padme in that movie is appalling.

• 1:40:13Sean Fennessey?

  Could have been worse.

• 1:40:14Speaker 04

  How many times have you said to your, to someone in your life, "Hold me like you did by the lake in Naboo"? Is that something you guys say to people?

• 1:40:20Speaker 03

  Yeah, all the time.

• 1:40:21Speaker 04

  No?

• 1:40:21Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:40:22Sean Fennessey?

  That's what you say to your lightsaber?

• 1:40:24Speaker 04

  Exactly. Right, right.

• 1:40:29Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, is it, is it a man?

• 1:40:31Speaker 04

  No, it's a man.

• 1:40:32Speaker 02

  So I gotta take a movie now?

• 1:40:34Speaker 04

  You don't have to.

• 1:40:35Speaker 02

  Um, yeah, I'm going to. Now,

• 1:40:39Speaker 02

  this is tough for me because in my heart, there's a movie that I want to take, but I can't justify taking it above the other two films that are still there. So I'm gonna take, which I think is now become an underrated movie, Return of the Jedi.

• 1:40:56Speaker 03

  Mm-hmm. I believe so. I believe you're right.

• 1:40:58Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, I think, I think it's now become an underrated movie. I think Return of the Jedi, coming after, um, Empire Strikes Back, was a movie that it was easy to criticize with, because the Empire is so brilliant. Jedi is a fantastic film. It completes the flawless arc of Luke Skywalker. You have Sarlacc pit. You have all kinds of different things in that movie that are super duper iconic. You know, people are hit or miss on the Ewoks. I love them. I like watching the Ewoks. I liked indoor. I liked the forest race. I liked a lot of the stuff, all of the stuff.

• 1:41:35Speaker 03

  Admiral Ackbar?

• 1:41:36Speaker 02

  Admiral Ackbar, all of that stuff in Jedi, to me, works. And if I, if I gotta draft here, I'm gonna get one of the original trilogy.

• 1:41:43Sean Fennessey?

  Uh, I think this is kind of a no-brainer, right?

• 1:41:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:41:46Speaker 04

  I don't agree.

• 1:41:47Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, interesting.

• 1:41:48Sean Fennessey?

  Well, you're a Sith girl.

• 1:41:49Speaker 04

  I'm shocked and I feel personally betrayed that you didn't take Sith here. I was a star, it's really sad.

• 1:41:55Speaker 02

  Can I be real with you?

• 1:41:56Speaker 04

  What happened?

• 1:41:56Speaker 02

  If it was about my heart, that's the movie that I'm taking.

• 1:42:00Speaker 04

  Follow your heart at Star Wars. What is, literally, what is more about following your heart?

• 1:42:04Speaker 02

  But you can't compare, you can't compare it to Return of the Jedi.

• 1:42:07Speaker 04

  Return of the Jedi is, uh, forty minutes of Jabba the Hutt and like Boba Fett going down sad into the Sarlacc pit like a fucking cuck.

• 1:42:18Sean Fennessey?

  All of that stuff is awesome.

• 1:42:19Speaker 04

  And then ninety minutes of the Ewoks.

• 1:42:21Speaker 02

  You're glamoring the audience.

• 1:42:22Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:42:22Speaker 02

  It's Jedi, motherfucker.

• 1:42:24Speaker 04

  This is, I, I honestly would have, not only would I have taken Sith before that easily, I would have taken Force Witches.

• 1:42:29Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, but you didn't.

• 1:42:30Speaker 04

  I'm surprised.

• 1:42:31Amanda Dobbins?

  You took a new hope in the second pick in the draft.

• 1:42:34Speaker 04

  I don't get it. I can't believe you didn't take Seth. I just can't believe it.

• 1:42:36Speaker 02

  All right. Jedi.

• 1:42:37Sean Fennessey?

  I think that was the correct pick.

• 1:42:38Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:42:38Speaker 02

  Don't agree.

• 1:42:39Sean Fennessey?

  And actually, your, your strategy is waiting on movie paid off.

• 1:42:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:42:42Speaker 04

  Get it?

• 1:42:42Speaker 02

  You, you got one of the OG trilogies still all the way down there.

• 1:42:46Sean Fennessey?

  I don't know. I mean, I, I think you did good.

• 1:42:50Speaker 02

  Amanda.

• 1:42:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Yes. Okay. So going along with, no, I looked at the exact name.

• 1:42:57Amanda Dobbins?

  But in Return of the Jedi, yes. Okay. So it's a speeder bike and I believe the correct model is the 74Z speeder bike. This is my son's favorite part of Return of the Jedi.

• 1:43:08Speaker 03

  This is such a fucking dangerous vehicle though.

• 1:43:10Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah. And they look, they, it looks very cool. So that's what I'm taking.

• 1:43:13Speaker 03

  You don't always have to ride it in such a heavily wooded area.

• 1:43:15Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't have to be specific. Okay. I pick speeder bikes.

• 1:43:18Speaker 02

  You know what? The speeder bike, the fact that Leia was on that bitch going crazy.

• 1:43:22Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:43:22Speaker 02

  Is the first time I was like, it's probably force sensitive because like it, it just.

• 1:43:27Sean Fennessey?

  I thought you were gonna say women should be allowed to drive.

• 1:43:35Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay. So that's my vehicle. Speeder bikes.

• 1:43:37Speaker 04

  Nice. Speeders are fun.

• 1:43:39Sean Fennessey?

  What is the vehicle called that Anakin and Obi-Wan race in at the beginning of clones? That like the car, the hover car.

• 1:43:47Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, I don't know.

• 1:43:48Speaker 02

  Oh, the hover car. Yeah, yeah. I see what you, I know what you mean. I'm not sure.

• 1:43:50Sean Fennessey?

  You guys don't know? Neither of you know? Well, then it must be really obscure.

• 1:43:54Speaker 02

  I mean, there's an iconic Star Wars vehicle that's still on the board.

• 1:43:57Sean Fennessey?

  A couple, I would say.

• 1:43:58Speaker 04

  I, I agree.

• 1:43:58Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:44:01Sean Fennessey?

  Okay. Now it is Chris's turn, right?

• 1:44:06Sean Fennessey?

  Chris, what are you, what are you missing now, bud?

• 1:44:07Speaker 03

  Hero.

• 1:44:09Speaker 04

  Or villain.

• 1:44:09Speaker 03

  Hero vehicle and problematic.

• 1:44:13Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go, God, I don't wanna be redundant.

• 1:44:17Speaker 03

  I'm gonna go Cassian Andor for hero, even though I already have Rogue One. But.

• 1:44:22Amanda Dobbins?

  But you mean Cassian Rogue One because Andor's not.

• 1:44:26Speaker 03

  I know, I know that he's like sort of plays the wall a little bit. The Jin is the hero of Rogue One, but you know.

• 1:44:31Amanda Dobbins?

  I know that too.

• 1:44:32Speaker 03

  Jin's dad.

• 1:44:33Amanda Dobbins?

  I was thinking that.

• 1:44:34Speaker 03

  Is the architect of our demise. So, you know, I think that.

• 1:44:38Speaker 04

  Also the, the architect of us. Being able to defeat the Death Star.

• 1:44:40Speaker 03

  It's true. It's true. It's the plans that he leaves behind, but.

• 1:44:44Sean Fennessey?

  His name Galen or so.

• 1:44:46Speaker 04

  Probably Stardust.

• 1:44:48Speaker 03

  Yeah, Cassian for Hero. It's like I don't have a deep attachment to Jin and I don't have a deep attachment to any of the remaining people really. Like Poe or whatever.

• 1:44:59Speaker 03

  What do you think of that?

• 1:44:59Sean Fennessey?

  Couple more interesting heroes out there.

• 1:45:01Speaker 04

  I'm surprised by some of the characters who have not been selected in Hero. I will, I will say that. Has everybody taken their hero and villain? No, I haven't. So I won't, I'm afraid from speaking further.

• 1:45:11Speaker 03

  And.

• 1:45:13Speaker 04

  And of course I can name all of them, so.

• 1:45:15Sean Fennessey?

  This has been nicely distributed amongst the three trilogies, I'll say.

• 1:45:18Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I'm kind of avoiding the prequels to some extent, but.

• 1:45:22Speaker 04

  So you're, you're a little worried you're too Rogue One heavy and not spread out across the board enough.

• 1:45:26Speaker 03

  I mean, I don't really care, but yeah, I just really like Cassian and even like his introduction is so dope in that movie.

• 1:45:33Speaker 03

  For Vehicle, sorry, my scrolls are not stapled.

• 1:45:40Speaker 03

  Oh, you know what? I'll do problematic character. Java.

• 1:45:45Speaker 04

  Good one.

• 1:45:46Speaker 03

  Human trafficker.

• 1:45:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:45:48Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:45:48Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:45:49Sean Fennessey?

  What do you think about the idea that he's also an Italian stereotype?

• 1:45:53Speaker 03

  I hadn't thought about that. That never occurred to me.

• 1:45:55Sean Fennessey?

  His last name ends in a vowel.

• 1:45:57Speaker 02

  Ah, that's tough. He's supposed to be a big fat mobster.

• 1:46:01Speaker 03

  His last name?

• 1:46:02Sean Fennessey?

  He's a gangster.

• 1:46:02Speaker 02

  He's a gangster. He's supposed to be a big fat mobster. Yeah, it's tough.

• 1:46:05Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:46:06Sean Fennessey?

  That is the idea of the character.

• 1:46:07Speaker 02

  That represents a whole secret society.

• 1:46:10Speaker 03

  But I think Java is like when it's just like, he's like a, you know, he's a bookie. You're like, alright Java. But then when he's got Slave Leia by the chain, like that's like a little problem.

• 1:46:20Speaker 02

  That's tough.

• 1:46:20Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:46:21Speaker 04

  But how, how often did you jerk off to that when you were younger? Be honest.

• 1:46:24Sean Fennessey?

  What was it that he was getting out of that?

• 1:46:26Speaker 02

  Out of what?

• 1:46:28Sean Fennessey?

  Leia chained up.

• 1:46:29Speaker 02

  He was licking her. Remember he licked her with the tongue?

• 1:46:31Sean Fennessey?

  Was that the primary objective?

• 1:46:32Speaker 04

  It was all about the titillation.

• 1:46:33Speaker 03

  Like the implication.

• 1:46:34Speaker 04

  His lightsaber, if you know what I mean.

• 1:46:36Speaker 03

  The implication is that she is his concubine.

• 1:46:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:46:39Sean Fennessey?

  Right, but what, how would that have played out?

• 1:46:41Speaker 04

  You mean, do you mean how does a hut have sexual intercourse? Where it's pleasure centers?

• 1:46:47Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is there like a?

• 1:46:50Speaker 04

  I don't know.

• 1:46:50Speaker 03

  Is he even attracted to someone?

• 1:46:52Sean Fennessey?

  Where's the hut phallus? You know, like that's what I'm saying.

• 1:46:55Speaker 02

  There's something, because they're baby huts.

• 1:46:57Sean Fennessey?

  That's right.

• 1:46:58Speaker 03

  Maybe for him it's more about like, it's like romanticy. It's like he's, he's like a human being is like winged fairy to him.

• 1:47:06Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:47:07Speaker 03

  You know?

• 1:47:09Amanda Dobbins?

  You're right.

• 1:47:10Speaker 04

  Love to read Jabba, big like guy.

• 1:47:11Sean Fennessey?

  So Jabba is your problematic character?

• 1:47:14Speaker 03

  Okay. I was gonna, yeah, that's my problematic.

• 1:47:17Sean Fennessey?

  And we're back to Amanda.

• 1:47:18Amanda Dobbins?

  So I have hero or villain, and I can curse someone. And I don't really feel that strongly about any of the remaining movies to curse people with. And also my options are Mal, who would be excited to get the third movie Sith something. Can't remember the full title.

• 1:47:37Sean Fennessey?

  It's tough.

• 1:47:38Amanda Dobbins?

  And, and I don't want to curse Chris because I already took Han Solo away from him. So I might just let that shake out and instead take hero or villain.

• 1:47:52Speaker 04

  Well, some major characters still on the board.

• 1:47:56Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, does Yoda count as a hero?

• 1:47:59Sean Fennessey?

  Yes.

• 1:47:59Amanda Dobbins?

  That's who I pick.

• 1:48:00Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:48:01Amanda Dobbins?

  I pick Yoda.

• 1:48:01Speaker 03

  I always kind of thought Yoda was kind of boring.

• 1:48:03Speaker 04

  You could have also picked Yoda as a villain.

• 1:48:05Speaker 03

  No, I just said that's why I didn't pick him.

• 1:48:07Speaker 04

  Let Pampi rise.

• 1:48:08Sean Fennessey?

  I'm not really a Yoda guy either.

• 1:48:10Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 1:48:11Sean Fennessey?

  Nothing against him.

• 1:48:12Amanda Dobbins?

  Uh, he's, he seems wise, even, you know, even if you have all the wisdom in the world, you can't always do the right thing in Star Wars. That's what we learned. That's the complication of Star Wars.

• 1:48:21Speaker 04

  You can't always sense the Sith rising.

• 1:48:24Amanda Dobbins?

  And he trained some important people and also my sons really like him. So at this point, I'm just, I'm just drafting for the boys.

• 1:48:31Speaker 03

  He's very, he's very powerful. If baby Yoda had been in the mix here.

• 1:48:34Amanda Dobbins?

  Right, but you know, as we have learned, thanks to Mallory and Joanna, they're not, no, but we have learned that they are the same species, which is something that I have now heroically explained to a four-year-old.

• 1:48:45Sean Fennessey?

  Can you name another member of that species?

• 1:48:48Amanda Dobbins?

  No, but there's one more.

• 1:48:49Speaker 04

  Because we, we talked about it.

• 1:48:50Speaker 03

  It's three people count as a species now?

• 1:48:53Sean Fennessey?

  Well, there's more than that.

• 1:48:54Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, we only know about three. We don't know very much about them. We know that Yoda, they live to be at least 900 years old.

• 1:48:59Speaker 02

  They're old.

• 1:49:00Amanda Dobbins?

  And.

• 1:49:02Speaker 02

  Inherently force sensitive as a race.

• 1:49:04Amanda Dobbins?

  Right, and we only know about three of them. I can't name the third person.

• 1:49:07Sean Fennessey?

  Cincinnati.

• 1:49:08Speaker 02

  Yaddle.

• 1:49:08Speaker 04

  Yaddle.

• 1:49:09Speaker 02

  She's a lame Joe Burrow, guys. Yaddle's her name.

• 1:49:13Speaker 04

  The women who've forgotten again.

• 1:49:15Speaker 03

  Is Yoda getting by on his sentence construction? Like, does Yoda actually have that much to offer? But he just puts it in such a unique way.

• 1:49:25Sean Fennessey?

  I mean, he fucked up.

• 1:49:27Speaker 02

  Yoda is sitting in front of.

• 1:49:29Speaker 04

  There's a lot of.

• 1:49:30Speaker 02

  Yoda, Yoda fucked up. Okay.

• 1:49:32Speaker 04

  Yoda and Mace, they're both like.

• 1:49:34Sean Fennessey?

  They are responsible for the fall of the Republic.

• 1:49:37Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 1:49:38Sean Fennessey?

  Straight up.

• 1:49:38Speaker 02

  Yeah, Yoda.

• 1:49:39Sean Fennessey?

  I got some notes for Yoda.

• 1:49:40Speaker 04

  Oh, no question. The greatest teacher failure is beautiful lesson.

• 1:49:43Amanda Dobbins?

  Hasn't the Republic fallen three times?

• 1:49:46Sean Fennessey?

  Yes, but this was.

• 1:49:47Amanda Dobbins?

  And he's only responsible for one of them, so it's not just Yoda.

• 1:49:50Speaker 04

  He missed the rise of Palpatine.

• 1:49:54Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 1:49:54Speaker 04

  Darth Sidious is like in meetings with him regularly on his Google Cal and he's like, "I feel none of this." Very tough. And then he pieced out to Dagobah. Embarrassing.

• 1:50:03Sean Fennessey?

  Bit of a flaw in film.

• 1:50:04Speaker 03

  Governor, you must, you know.

• 1:50:06Speaker 04

  Embarrassing. And then, perhaps honestly, worst of all, when he's training Luke on Dagobah, he's like, "Don't go save your friends." That is some dark, gnarly shit.

• 1:50:15Speaker 02

  And Luke doesn't listen.

• 1:50:17Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:50:17Speaker 02

  Because it's in his, in his nature to go save his friends.

• 1:50:20Sean Fennessey?

  Part of why Luke is great. Part of why the echo in The Last Jedi is so good is because he's committing to saving his friends.

• 1:50:25Speaker 02

  He doesn't listen to Yoda. He goes to save his friends. Everything in Dageous saves friends, and then he does nothing.

• 1:50:30Sean Fennessey?

  When you're young, you're idealistic, you're willing to take chances. That's the whole premise of the movies.

• 1:50:35Speaker 02

  Got it. Okay. Uh, I'm gonna take problematic, problematic character. And I'm inspired by CR's pick of Jabba the, Jabba the Hutt.

• 1:50:45Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 1:50:46Speaker 02

  Okay, so in my problematic character, I'm gonna take Emperor Sheev Palpatine.

• 1:50:51Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 1:50:52Speaker 02

  Okay, and because I didn't, when, when we were talking problematic.

• 1:50:55Amanda Dobbins?

  Which one is that?

• 1:50:57Speaker 02

  He's the greatest villain in film history.

• 1:51:00Amanda Dobbins?

  They keep, and they just keep upping the ante, like so is Galactus, you know? But like.

• 1:51:08Sean Fennessey?

  They didn't really follow through on that, it was fantastic for.

• 1:51:11Amanda Dobbins?

  There's like a pre-Emperor and then there's an Emperor and then...

• 1:51:15Speaker 03

  Well, he's a Senator, then he's an Emperor.

• 1:51:17Speaker 04

  He's the Chancellor, yeah.

• 1:51:18Speaker 03

  Senator-Chancellor-Emperor, but it's all the same dude.

• 1:51:20Amanda Dobbins?

  And then somehow he returns.

• 1:51:22Speaker 02

  Now, let me make my case. So, he's clear villain, but let me make my case for specifically problematic. Number one, a big-time groomer. Grooms a young Anakin Skywalker, from the point that he is legitimately an elementary school kid. Grooms and lies to Darth Maul, making him think that he was a Sith. When guess what? He really wasn't. Super mean to Darth Vader, which they don't really get into. Has Darth Vader, makes Darth Vader, like, has him in a weird relationship where he has to rely on him. And he, like, makes him turn against his own family, the whole thing. Then so problematic, so addicted to power, that he can't allow anybody else to have power. He has to have it eternally.

• 1:52:07Speaker 02

  So, he puts himself in a cloning situation, his consciousness is something else, uses a Sith cult to bring himself back at the end, because he can't get rid of it. He's not just a villain, but he's also a bad person.

• 1:52:18Amanda Dobbins?

  He's like, he's a boomer bad boss, is your argument. Yeah, yeah, he won't get out of the way and...

• 1:52:23Speaker 03

  He's in a three-story house.

• 1:52:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, I almost had that joke earlier, I'm glad you got that one off.

• 1:52:30Sean Fennessey?

  That's not the first to make that joke.

• 1:52:31Speaker 02

  Yoda, you can make an argument for Yoda, too.

• 1:52:34Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I was actually thinking about him in this category as well.

• 1:52:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:52:37Sean Fennessey?

  So, I like that pick. Even though he's not historically amongst the culturally insensitive, although you could say he's culturally...

• 1:52:43Speaker 02

  No, no, no, he's racist!

• 1:52:45Sean Fennessey?

  But what is...

• 1:52:45Speaker 02

  No, no, no, he's, he's, he's, no, he's also a racist.

• 1:52:48Speaker 03

  Who is, Yoda or Palpatine?

• 1:52:49Speaker 02

  Sidious, like, Palpatine does not allow non-humans to be in the Empire. He is a racist against aliens. The only one that is in the Empire is Thrawn, and he makes a special case for Thrawn. Thrawn is like the Jackie Robinson of the Empire. He makes a special case for Thrawn, because Thrawn is so brilliant. The whole Thrawn story is fucking amazing, how Thrawn got... But there are no aliens that are allowed to be in the Empire.

• 1:53:17Sean Fennessey?

  But they didn't integrate the Empire after Thrawn.

• 1:53:21Speaker 02

  Because maybe Thrawn didn't, you know, become an L M V P. But, but what I'm saying...

• 1:53:26Sean Fennessey?

  He couldn't get on base.

• 1:53:27Speaker 02

  Yeah, Sidious is also, he's like notoriously a racist.

• 1:53:31Sean Fennessey?

  Um, solid pick, Ian McDarmid?

• 1:53:34Speaker 03

  The longest serving.

• 1:53:36Sean Fennessey?

  One of the more extraordinary thirty-five year performances in movie history? Fifty year, I mean, how many, he was in movies for.

• 1:53:43Speaker 03

  It'll be fifty in twenty.

• 1:53:46Sean Fennessey?

  How old was he when he first portrayed the Ember?

• 1:53:48Speaker 02

  He was like in his forties, early forties or thirties or something. He looked a lot older than what he actually was.

• 1:53:53Sean Fennessey?

  Really amazing.

• 1:53:53Speaker 02

  Cause when he came back in the prequels, I was like, hey.

• 1:53:56Sean Fennessey?

  I absolutely love him in the prequels. I think his over the top portrayal of that guy is so, some of the most fun shit in those movies.

• 1:54:03Speaker 02

  The Jedi are trying to take over.

• 1:54:05Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, um, who's next?

• 1:54:07Speaker 04

  Mallory. I am. I will be happily selecting my vehicle now. I'll be taking the X-Wing, which is somehow still here despite being one of the most iconic ships in Star Wars. If I, if we were picking specific vehicles and we had to, I would pick the T sixty-five B, AKA Red Five, Luke Skywalker's X-Wing, but.

• 1:54:23Sean Fennessey?

  You're just taking them all?

• 1:54:24Speaker 04

  Taking them all. Why not? The X-Wing, I would like you to use a picture of Luke's X-Wing, Jack, if at all possible. Uh, that would be great, but I'm taking them all.

• 1:54:31Speaker 03

  People are like, I'm, I'm having a hard time visualizing.

• 1:54:34Speaker 04

  Taking them all. The X-Wing is, is iconic. Every time that it opens and closes, fantastic. You got your Astromech with you for the ride. The best. No one is taking a droid.

• 1:54:42Speaker 02

  Hate on Mando and Grogu, or, or Mando, the show, the first season of that, at the end, when that X-Wing is crawling up.

• 1:54:51Speaker 04

  It's incredible moment.

• 1:54:52Speaker 02

  I stood up and went, that's fucking Skywalker.

• 1:54:55Speaker 04

  It's the best.

• 1:54:55Speaker 02

  And it was nuts. That's how iconic the vehicle is. You know that that's what Luke is riding around in.

• 1:55:00Sean Fennessey?

  Story in popular culture in the last six years. That was the shit that we were like, this matters.

• 1:55:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:55:06Sean Fennessey?

  A TV show or sitting alone in our apartment during COVID. That's not ideal.

• 1:55:09Speaker 04

  Got our action figures at home. Great stuff.

• 1:55:11Sean Fennessey?

  Um, okay. Who's next?

• 1:55:14Speaker 03

  You.

• 1:55:14Speaker 04

  You are. You're on the turn, man. You got two.

• 1:55:16Speaker 03

  Your last two.

• 1:55:17Speaker 04

  You have to, oh no, you've cursed Van, right? So you have.

• 1:55:19Speaker 03

  That was tough. You have problematic character.

• 1:55:23Speaker 04

  And wild card.

• 1:55:27Sean Fennessey?

  Um.

• 1:55:29Sean Fennessey?

  Gosh.

• 1:55:32Sean Fennessey?

  Problematic character.

• 1:55:35Sean Fennessey?

  I think I'll take Newt Gunray as my representative from the Trade Federation.

• 1:55:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:55:41Sean Fennessey?

  Which is a character who was portrayed in a movie in 1999 that is one of the most blatant anti-Asian stereotypes I've ever seen in the history of cinema.

• 1:55:52Speaker 02

  Right.

• 1:55:53Sean Fennessey?

  And also. Blockades back in the news.

• 1:55:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:55:58Sean Fennessey?

  You know?

• 1:55:58Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 1:55:59Sean Fennessey?

  And their strategy, which was shameful, and they were obviously pawns of the Emperor, didn't work out. I'm hopeful that everything works out in our world. I can't say for sure if that's gonna happen.

• 1:56:11Speaker 03

  We've only been podding for a couple hours. We could add a couple of different flips in the story, you know?

• 1:56:14Sean Fennessey?

  You think that's possible?

• 1:56:15Speaker 03

  I feel like every day brings something new, man.

• 1:56:17Sean Fennessey?

  Does Hacksaw have you on speed dial?

• 1:56:19Speaker 03

  Me and Pete have not spoken.

• 1:56:20Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, ever? You're sure? Okay.

• 1:56:23Speaker 02

  He looks like a Phillies fan.

• 1:56:24Sean Fennessey?

  He sure does.

• 1:56:26Speaker 03

  No, he looks like a Chipper Jones fan.

• 1:56:27Sean Fennessey?

  He does look like a Chipper Jones fan.

• 1:56:28Speaker 02

  Fucked me up with that one.

• 1:56:30Sean Fennessey?

  These are facts.

• 1:56:30Speaker 02

  Tough.

• 1:56:31Sean Fennessey?

  I...

• 1:56:32Speaker 02

  I like Chipper.

• 1:56:33Sean Fennessey?

  Wild card, I'm going Boba Fett. Now...

• 1:56:35Speaker 02

  Ah, I cannot believe he lasted this long.

• 1:56:37Sean Fennessey?

  Boba Fett, I think the TV shows have undermined his legacy somewhat. I would argue even the prequels have undermined his legacy somewhat. There's the famous Patton Oswalt bit where he explains, "You know, you love Boba Fett, one of the coolest characters in Star Wars." And George Lucas is like, "Yeah, when we see him in the prequels, he's a kid." Like, I had...

• 1:56:56Sean Fennessey?

  And you're like, "What?" Which is an amazing Patton Oswalt riff, but to your point about Return of the Jedi, Boba Fett in Return of the Jedi, that was the coolest movie character of all time when you were seven. That was... That, I mean, am I crazy? Like, was that not like, who is this and what is their deal?

• 1:57:14Speaker 03

  I do think that there is a degree to which he, like, get, the Sarlacc pit.

• 1:57:18Speaker 04

  He gets embarrassed.

• 1:57:19Speaker 03

  Eggjet happens real early.

• 1:57:21Sean Fennessey?

  But we know he survives.

• 1:57:22Speaker 04

  Now we know.

• 1:57:23Sean Fennessey?

  We know he survives.

• 1:57:25Speaker 02

  He's nothing, you know, but I, I love him. I love Boba Fett. It was one of the, it was also kinda like the mystery. There were, as much as they gave you in Star Wars, there were still mysterious characters. Bounty hunters, what do they do?

• 1:57:36Sean Fennessey?

  And what if I said he was really like a, an exploration of male frailty, you know, and just the idea of, you know, unable to really express yourself, hiding behind the mask, you know, using tools to make yourself seem more powerful. He is but a man, is he not?

• 1:57:49Speaker 04

  He's but a man, the son, the clone son of his clone of, he's a, yeah.

• 1:57:54Sean Fennessey?

  That's exactly right, which I didn't know when I was seven, and I'm not sure I liked it.

• 1:58:01Speaker 04

  He was just a clone, an unaltered clone of me. Very normal. Very normal.

• 1:58:05Sean Fennessey?

  Let's say.

• 1:58:06Speaker 04

  Yes. Yeah.

• 1:58:07Sean Fennessey?

  They cloned you.

• 1:58:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:58:09Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 1:58:09Amanda Dobbins?

  I think that would be unwise for everyone because don't the clones like get itchy? Like, aren't they even meaner versions?

• 1:58:15Speaker 03

  It's like a Waymo.

• 1:58:16Amanda Dobbins?

  So no one needs that, right?

• 1:58:18Sean Fennessey?

  There's definitely like a, yeah, there's an aggression.

• 1:58:20Amanda Dobbins?

  No one needs like, like, you know, other mommy Amanda, but like it already exists, but imagine it like at the next level.

• 1:58:26Sean Fennessey?

  But would you say this is my son or my daughter? If it was a pure clone of you?

• 1:58:30Amanda Dobbins?

  No.

• 1:58:31Sean Fennessey?

  You wouldn't, you wouldn't say that?

• 1:58:32Amanda Dobbins?

  No, I would, I would try to, to nuke it, you know, there could only.

• 1:58:36Speaker 02

  You're gonna kill the clone?

• 1:58:37Amanda Dobbins?

  There can only be one me. Yeah. It's immediately a threat to me.

• 1:58:41Sean Fennessey?

  Wow.

• 1:58:41Speaker 03

  That's some crazy like Ellen Ripley shit.

• 1:58:45Sean Fennessey?

  True.

• 1:58:45Speaker 03

  You know what? The other day, this is not specifically about clones, but it is about autonomous, you know, like fleets of things.

• 1:58:54Speaker 03

  Standing not in a crosswalk, but it was a, was trying to cross Hollywood Boulevard by my house and a Waymo was coming. And the Waymo sensed me.

• 1:59:04Speaker 04

  Yeah, it stopped.

• 1:59:04Speaker 03

  And it stopped. And I was like, one day it won't stop, you know, like one day the, the software update will be like for maximum efficiency, we have to keep going. And I'm like, that's when it gets real.

• 1:59:15Sean Fennessey?

  But the question is, you were not using a crosswalk. So who was, who would be in the wrong in that circumstance?

• 1:59:22Speaker 03

  But one day the Waymo is gonna be like, I didn't see him.

• 1:59:26Sean Fennessey?

  Well, the Waymo won't say anything.

• 1:59:29Sean Fennessey?

  He's not a he.

• 1:59:30Speaker 02

  Then there'll be a whole fucking cultural debate about whether or not the Waymo was right or whether or not you were right.

• 1:59:35Speaker 03

  Do Waymos have feelings?

• 1:59:36Sean Fennessey?

  You gotta consider like the Waymo's trauma in the aftermath of murdering you in the street. Like, how are they gonna go on Waymo-ing all around the city?

• 1:59:42Speaker 03

  The Waymo ended CR month.

• 1:59:46Sean Fennessey?

  Wow, that's a horror movie.

• 1:59:49Speaker 04

  Uh, well, it's time for me in the last round of a draft about the Skywalker saga to select my Skywalker family member. And I think it's fitting that we're talking about machines, because I will be selecting Anakin's chosen son, the son he built by hand, C-3PO.

• 2:00:10Sean Fennessey?

  Not R2.

• 2:00:11Speaker 04

  And R2. I'm about to expand my case.

• 2:00:13Speaker 03

  No, wait, Mallory, you can't keep putting plurals to just take all lightsabers and all...

• 2:00:18Speaker 04

  I can by the rules of the draft. It's up to, Sean could have said you have 51 lightsaber.

• 2:00:22Sean Fennessey?

  The people who are listening at home to the show will see this as a lean.

• 2:00:25Speaker 03

  You can't just be like droids.

• 2:00:27Speaker 04

  No, no, I didn't say droids. Anakin built, I will limit it to C-3PO if, but I think that's eligible.

• 2:00:34Sean Fennessey?

  I draft the Republic.

• 2:00:35Speaker 04

  You could do that, you know?

• 2:00:37Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 2:00:37Speaker 04

  You could. Van drafted the Force.

• 2:00:40Speaker 02

  And Wild, he drafted lightsaber.

• 2:00:42Speaker 04

  Exactly. And this has been allowed the whole time. Listen, Anakin built C-3PO. He built him. So I think at a minimum, for sure, 3PO is an eligible pick. He's Anakin's son. He built him with his hands. Now, I think he then adopted R2 as his adopted son.

• 2:00:59Speaker 03

  Is that the interpretation of the creator-creation relationship that we're accepting here?

• 2:01:02Speaker 04

  Ray was allowed to be selected. She says out loud, "I'm a Skywalker," right? And that was deemed eligible. Basically, like, it's my adopted family.

• 2:01:10Speaker 02

  She has the last name.

• 2:01:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:01:12Speaker 02

  C-3PO's name is not C-3PO Skywalker.

• 2:01:14Sean Fennessey?

  I don't accept this. I just don't think this is valid. There's no one who feels this.

• 2:01:20Speaker 04

  Yes, Anakin built 3PO.

• 2:01:21Speaker 03

  Well, that makes him God. And this is not a Christian society.

• 2:01:25Sean Fennessey?

  You can build a table. It's not your son.

• 2:01:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, they do. Absolutely. The Kyber Crystal calls to them.

• 2:01:30Speaker 03

  Why couldn't you just say the lightsaber is Skywalker?

• 2:01:33Speaker 04

  Because he crafted him to be a member of his family.

• 2:01:35Speaker 03

  But they're not family members. They're droids.

• 2:01:37Speaker 04

  Oh, well, this is a little bit of like...

• 2:01:39Speaker 02

  A little racial.

• 2:01:40Speaker 03

  Okay, so is every single...

• 2:01:41Speaker 04

  That's like saying, that's like saying the pig is not a member of your family.

• 2:01:45Speaker 02

  It was a little chipper. It was a little chipper. It was a little racial.

• 2:01:49Speaker 04

  A son of the... No, no, because it's about the nature of the relationship.

• 2:01:53Speaker 03

  Do you think that he treats them like family?

• 2:01:55Speaker 04

  Like a brother? No.

• 2:01:56Speaker 02

  He treats them like shit.

• 2:01:58Speaker 04

  No, no, no, not R2. R2 and Anakin, that's a tight bond.

• 2:02:02Speaker 02

  R2 and Anakin is a tight bond, that's also not who you drafted.

• 2:02:05Speaker 04

  I draft, I'm trying to draft both of them, 3PO and R2 together.

• 2:02:08Sean Fennessey?

  This is an inanimate object.

• 2:02:09Speaker 04

  As adopted members of the Skywalker family.

• 2:02:11Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, so why did you start with C3PO?

• 2:02:13Speaker 04

  Because he built him by hand.

• 2:02:14Amanda Dobbins?

  And he didn't build R2 by hand?

• 2:02:16Speaker 04

  No, R2 came to him via Padme.

• 2:02:18Speaker 02

  I could argue that.

• 2:02:19Amanda Dobbins?

  So that, okay.

• 2:02:20Speaker 03

  That's just like, gee, he got a gift. That's like, Padme was like, here's a robot.

• 2:02:24Speaker 04

  It's a story about found family. And those are the closest relationship.

• 2:02:28Speaker 03

  I don't think you would allow any of us to have tried this earlier.

• 2:02:30Sean Fennessey?

  Now, the answer is no.

• 2:02:31Speaker 03

  So why don't you try and pick up the other Skywalker that you knew you were gonna have to draft?

• 2:02:36Speaker 04

  I've got one more thing to attempt here, I'm not done yet.

• 2:02:38Speaker 02

  Okay, let's see, let's see, I'm so into this.

• 2:02:40Amanda Dobbins?

  Let's delete 3PO from the screen that we're all looking at.

• 2:02:42Speaker 04

  Listen, I believe that 3PO and R2 should have been eligible. I actually think it's a shame to get through the draft without any droids on the board.

• 2:02:51Sean Fennessey?

  You could have asked me beforehand if they were, and I would have told you no.

• 2:02:53Speaker 04

  But you told Amanda that Rey wasn't eligible, and then Rey was eligible, so your word is nothing.

• 2:02:57Sean Fennessey?

  Amanda and I have a long partnership that's full of lies, you know? This is a very different circumstance.

• 2:03:01Amanda Dobbins?

  That's not how it survives.

• 2:03:03Speaker 04

  I, I think that I should have been allowed to make the pick, however, okay. But, let me say something that is irrefutable, which is that.

• 2:03:09Speaker 03

  This is gamesmanship. She started with something she knew was gonna get rejected, so that we accepted this thing that's also.

• 2:03:15Sean Fennessey?

  We'll see, we'll see.

• 2:03:16Amanda Dobbins?

  No, no, no, no.

• 2:03:16Sean Fennessey?

  Go ahead, go ahead.

• 2:03:17Amanda Dobbins?

  I'm not afraid.

• 2:03:18Speaker 04

  Anakin was conceived by the Midiclorians. They are his father. That is canon.

• 2:03:26Speaker 03

  Absolutely not.

• 2:03:27Speaker 04

  That is canon.

• 2:03:28Speaker 03

  That's like saying, no.

• 2:03:29Speaker 02

  I'm having so much fun right now, I'm back in college.

• 2:03:33Speaker 04

  That is canon.

• 2:03:34Speaker 02

  It's like.

• 2:03:35Speaker 04

  You guys are, that's a violation of canon if you say that that can't be a pick.

• 2:03:38Sean Fennessey?

  Midiclorians are also an inanimate object. They are not a corporeal form on the earth, they're family member, family member.

• 2:03:45Speaker 02

  You can't say, you can't say the Midiclorians are a Skywalker.

• 2:03:47Speaker 04

  No, no, Midiclorians are alive. What are you talking about?

• 2:03:50Speaker 02

  They are.

• 2:03:50Speaker 04

  They're alive, definitely.

• 2:03:52Speaker 03

  Well, so are cells.

• 2:03:53Amanda Dobbins?

  What are they?

• 2:03:53Speaker 03

  They're like, they're little symbi, they're little things that exist in symbiotic ways.

• 2:03:58Speaker 04

  Anakin has the highest Midiclorian count, and he was conceived into their atoms. Wygon Jin says, conceived by the Midiclorians. That is canon.

• 2:04:06Speaker 03

  Does he not have parents?

• 2:04:07Speaker 04

  According to who? Shmi and the Midiclorians.

• 2:04:10Speaker 02

  Now, I could also argue that it's actually.

• 2:04:12Sean Fennessey?

  Who are the parents of Midiclorians? What are their names?

• 2:04:15Speaker 04

  Why does that matter?

• 2:04:18Speaker 03

  Well, explain how they're part of a family.

• 2:04:19Speaker 04

  Why would they be midichlorians?

• 2:04:20Speaker 03

  Why wouldn't they come forward?

• 2:04:22Speaker 02

  You know what would have been interesting? It would be interesting if you'd have chose Palpatine because some people say that it was actually Palpatine.

• 2:04:26Speaker 04

  Well, that's there's some comics canon that supports the like, yeah, what Palpatine. But he used, he used midichlorians.

• 2:04:34Speaker 02

  No. Can we, can you just draft shitty Skywalker?

• 2:04:37Speaker 04

  That's insane.

• 2:04:39Sean Fennessey?

  You misplayed the game.

• 2:04:40Speaker 04

  No, no, no, I'm fine with me. That's fine. I told you yesterday I'd be fine with me. I don't understand genuinely why the midichlorians are not eligible.

• 2:04:47Sean Fennessey?

  Midichlorians are not a person. This is family member. This is meant to be a person.

• 2:04:50Speaker 04

  Midichlorians are alive. Why? I don't understand.

• 2:04:54Sean Fennessey?

  They may not be alive, but they are not a person.

• 2:04:57Speaker 03

  Have we ever seen a midichlorian?

• 2:04:59Speaker 04

  It says family member.

• 2:05:01Amanda Dobbins?

  Right, that's not a family member. That's not a family member.

• 2:05:04Speaker 04

  Of course, Anakin's father.

• 2:05:06Amanda Dobbins?

  Even by the definition of found family. No, it's a macro discussion.

• 2:05:09Speaker 03

  You had a much better argument than you did.

• 2:05:11Amanda Dobbins?

  And I think you and the Star Wars canon, much like Christianity, are disrespecting me as a contribution.

• 2:05:17Sean Fennessey?

  Because any person who comes forward and says, I stand with Mal on this, I don't ever want to talk to.

• 2:05:22Speaker 04

  I just think this is a violation of canon and I think it's, it's a shallow, narrow view of what family is. 3PO not being eligible is, is tragic. What a, what a meaningful bond that spans the entire saga.

• 2:05:33Amanda Dobbins?

  Star Wars is a, is an entire saga about bloodlines and it's kinda weird. And even the midichlorian stuff, when they're testing his blood, I was like, what is going on here?

• 2:05:43Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:05:43Amanda Dobbins?

  This is a little strange.

• 2:05:45Speaker 04

  Oh, why John steals the blood?

• 2:05:46Amanda Dobbins?

  And many of our problems with Rise of Skywalker are that they reintroduced the bloodline stuff into what was like an opening.

• 2:05:54Speaker 04

  No, no, no, no, no, no, no. You're making my point for me. The problem with Rise of Skywalker is that it, once again, all had to be just about Palpatine and Skywalkers and those two names. I am trying to combat the crimes of Rise of Skywalker by broadening our view and our understanding of what family is. And the bond that you would make with the droid, like R2, or choosing to build and bring 3PO into the world.

• 2:06:16Sean Fennessey?

  A midichlorian is not a personhood, period. It's over.

• 2:06:18Speaker 04

  Family. You don't think droids in Star Wars are people?

• 2:06:21Amanda Dobbins?

  No, they're not.

• 2:06:22Speaker 04

  Somehow we did.

• 2:06:23Amanda Dobbins?

  Enough debating.

• 2:06:24Speaker 04

  Terrible.

• 2:06:25Amanda Dobbins?

  When life begins in Star Wars.

• 2:06:26Speaker 02

  We've done it a couple of times.

• 2:06:28Speaker 04

  I'm fine with me.

• 2:06:30Sean Fennessey?

  You made a valiant effort, but your mock outrage over your bad idea will not be held up in this court.

• 2:06:36Speaker 04

  It's not mock outrage. Droids in Star Wars are main characters.

• 2:06:39Sean Fennessey?

  Of course they are. They were eligible in other categories, not in Skywalker family member. Because they're not people from the family.

• 2:06:44Speaker 04

  Wait, hold on. You don't think a pet is a family member?

• 2:06:47Speaker 03

  No, I actually would. You can't trap him with this.

• 2:06:50Sean Fennessey?

  I would have entertained it if you had brought it to the table beforehand and discussed it with you. I don't know where I would have gone, but things that are not alive are definitely not on the table.

• 2:06:59Speaker 03

  Yeah, like in that sense, isn't Anakin's tie fighter a family member then? Like, because, or, you know.

• 2:07:06Speaker 04

  No, because it's not the way he thinks of it. He thinks of that as a tool. Though he does have some tight relationships with some of his ships. Yeah, he does.

• 2:07:12Speaker 03

  Right.

• 2:07:12Speaker 02

  And his saber. Did anybody bring that up? The saber, by your definition.

• 2:07:17Speaker 04

  The kyber crystal.

• 2:07:17Speaker 02

  Oh, the kyber crystal. It kind of is a little bit of a.

• 2:07:20Speaker 04

  But he's saying, R2, you're my brother. 3PO, I built you with my head as a creator.

• 2:07:23Speaker 03

  He never says that, does he?

• 2:07:25Speaker 04

  Through his actions.

• 2:07:26Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 2:07:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, you ever heard of show don't tell?

• 2:07:29Sean Fennessey?

  There's clearly no evidence that he identifies them as family members.

• 2:07:32Speaker 03

  Show not tell.

• 2:07:33Speaker 04

  Not true.

• 2:07:33Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 2:07:34Speaker 04

  Not true.

• 2:07:34Speaker 02

  Well, he definitely loves R2-D2.

• 2:07:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, this is like brother.

• 2:07:38Sean Fennessey?

  You know what I love? All my Blu-rays. They're not alive and they're not in my family.

• 2:07:42Speaker 04

  I think if you polled every listener of The Big Picture.

• 2:07:44Amanda Dobbins?

  Can we meme that one just so we have it for reference?

• 2:07:47Speaker 02

  He says, let's get out of here and goes, don't forget the droids.

• 2:07:50Speaker 04

  Of The Big Picture would say, if you said, does Sean consider Blu-rays family members? They would say yes.

• 2:07:54Speaker 03

  He does not consider them animate objects.

• 2:07:56Sean Fennessey?

  I'm saying for the record, as the owner of said Blu-rays, they're not in my family.

• 2:07:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:08:00Speaker 02

  All right, easy pick for me. Amanda Phantomis.

• 2:08:02Amanda Dobbins?

  No, I already have.

• 2:08:03Speaker 03

  I already gave her Phantomis. I did that like 20,000 minutes ago.

• 2:08:10Amanda Dobbins?

  And I said that that was better than receiving Rise of Skywalker, which is what you got. So I got the bad movie instead of the evil movie.

• 2:08:17Speaker 03

  You have to curse.

• 2:08:17Amanda Dobbins?

  Congratulations to Rise of Skywalker for its big picture evil movie designation.

• 2:08:22Speaker 02

  I have to curse you with the movie that I don't really hate that much.

• 2:08:24Speaker 03

  You have to curse me.

• 2:08:25Speaker 02

  I have to curse you, yeah. I have to curse you with Solo.

• 2:08:27Speaker 03

  That's fine.

• 2:08:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean.

• 2:08:29Sean Fennessey?

  Is that the last one on the board?

• 2:08:30Speaker 03

  No.

• 2:08:31Speaker 04

  No. I have not been cursed yet. There are a few, a couple of movies left.

• 2:08:34Speaker 02

  Ah, you can't curse anybody with that. That's that shit.

• 2:08:37Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 2:08:37Speaker 03

  It would be, it would be more of a curse for me. I'll tell you that.

• 2:08:40Speaker 02

  Revenge of the Sith would be more of a curse for you?

• 2:08:42Speaker 03

  I'd much rather watch Solo than Revenge of the Sith.

• 2:08:43Speaker 04

  You already made the pick.

• 2:08:44Speaker 02

  I, I already made the pick. I'm good with the pick. I like, he's wrong, but yeah, I'm gonna curse him with, I'm gonna curse him with Solo. Solo, you know, whatever.

• 2:08:54Speaker 04

  CR.

• 2:08:54Speaker 02

  I can't curse you with Revenge of the Sith. I like the movie too much. This is my weakest pick, but I don't fully understand the category. So, yeah, this is my weakest pick.

• 2:09:03Amanda Dobbins?

  You feel differently about the movies than, than other people do. So what is a curse to us is not a curse to you?

• 2:09:09Speaker 03

  I have Solo ranked number eight. So it's not, it's not my favorite movie, but it's certainly not in the bottom.

• 2:09:14Sean Fennessey?

  For clarity, the game theory is, is that some categories have scarcity and some categories have too many options.

• 2:09:19Speaker 02

  I feel you.

• 2:09:20Sean Fennessey?

  Right? So Schmie, someone was always gonna get Schmie.

• 2:09:23Speaker 03

  Well, she probably was sitting there for two hours being like, when I pull out C-3PO and they all go, oh my god.

• 2:09:28Sean Fennessey?

  But by the same token.

• 2:09:29Speaker 04

  Schmie is the mother of anarchy, Skywalker.

• 2:09:32Sean Fennessey?

  But by the same token, someone was always gonna get cursed for the movie that someone else thinks is pretty cool.

• 2:09:35Speaker 02

  That someone else thinks is cool, yeah.

• 2:09:37Speaker 04

  We don't have Star Wars without Schmie. Just throw that out there. We do not have Star Wars without Schmie.

• 2:09:41Sean Fennessey?

  If I were you, I would have led with that.

• 2:09:42Amanda Dobbins?

  This is also the theme of The Da Vinci Code, but for, for the bible.

• 2:09:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:09:46Speaker 03

  Alright.

• 2:09:47Sean Fennessey?

  What is the theme of?

• 2:09:49Amanda Dobbins?

  It's in the loop.

• 2:09:49Speaker 04

  Schmie deeply wronged by Qui-Gon, who was like, I'm just gonna leave you here.

• 2:09:52Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:09:53Speaker 04

  Yeah. I feel pretty good about the Schmie pick.

• 2:09:55Sean Fennessey?

  Okay, so you've got Solo as your curse pick.

• 2:09:57Speaker 03

  Yep.

• 2:09:58Speaker 04

  Amanda has to curse me.

• 2:09:59Amanda Dobbins?

  I have to curse now.

• 2:09:59Speaker 04

  She's the only one who hasn't cursed anyone and I'm the only one who hasn't been cursed.

• 2:10:02Sean Fennessey?

  The two films that are left on the board are Revenge of the Sith and The Force Awakens.

• 2:10:05Speaker 04

  Just FYI, two movies I love.

• 2:10:07Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 2:10:08Speaker 02

  This is a big win for me on this.

• 2:10:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:10:11Amanda Dobbins?

  I'm just not gonna give in to you on the Sith stuff.

• 2:10:15Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:10:15Speaker 04

  I like, really like both of the movies.

• 2:10:17Amanda Dobbins?

  So I'll do, I'll do Force Awakens, which, you know.

• 2:10:21Speaker 04

  Now I've got Kylo on my team in some capacity. Thrilling.

• 2:10:24Amanda Dobbins?

  There we go.

• 2:10:27Sean Fennessey?

  Is that the final pick?

• 2:10:28Speaker 04

  No, CR has this vehicle, right?

• 2:10:30Speaker 03

  Uh... I think I'll do, I'm gonna do Luke's, uh, Land Speeder from New Hope. The one that he's tooling around.

• 2:10:37Speaker 04

  Isn't that ineligible because Amanda picked speeders?

• 2:10:40Speaker 03

  But she picked the ones from Return of the Jedi.

• 2:10:42Speaker 02

  She picked a specific speeder though, she did.

• 2:10:44Sean Fennessey?

  She picked speeder bikes.

• 2:10:45Speaker 04

  Correct.

• 2:10:46Sean Fennessey?

  Speeders.

• 2:10:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:10:47Speaker 03

  The desert land speeder.

• 2:10:48Speaker 02

  So that pick is in, right? That pick is in. That's final. No one picked the Star Destroyers?

• 2:10:54Speaker 03

  Eh, I think they're okay. They're, they're cool the way they start movies.

• 2:10:57Speaker 02

  Iconic, yeah.

• 2:10:57Speaker 03

  Are they even that like, did they have any handling? Like?

• 2:11:01Speaker 04

  They're like crashing into each other.

• 2:11:03Speaker 02

  They're space battleships, bro.

• 2:11:04Speaker 03

  They're cool. They're cool.

• 2:11:06Sean Fennessey?

  We saw them get fucked up in Rise of Skywalker, right?

• 2:11:09Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, they get fucked up sometimes there, but they're kind of indicative of what the Empire is. This like big cock show.

• 2:11:15Speaker 03

  I like Gold Leader's thing. I can't remember what that's called. Uh...

• 2:11:18Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 2:11:20Sean Fennessey?

  If I didn't take Boba, I wanted to take Slave One. I always thought that was a really cool ship.

• 2:11:23Speaker 04

  Had to be renamed.

• 2:11:25Sean Fennessey?

  Is it not called Slave One anymore?

• 2:11:26Speaker 04

  They had to rename it in recent years.

• 2:11:27Sean Fennessey?

  What did they call it?

• 2:11:28Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:11:29Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:11:30Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:11:30Sean Fennessey?

  It's a fucking spaceship.

• 2:11:32Speaker 02

  Talking about Chipper Jones over here. You're talking about I love Slave One.

• 2:11:34Sean Fennessey?

  What did they rename it?

• 2:11:35Speaker 02

  How do you feel about Slave Two? Uh, like, so...

• 2:11:40Speaker 04

  I think they call, yeah. The fire spray.

• 2:11:42Speaker 03

  John's still holding out hope for...

• 2:11:43Sean Fennessey?

  They really don't call it that?

• 2:11:44Speaker 03

  Benny offered voices.

• 2:11:45Speaker 04

  Not for long.

• 2:11:46Sean Fennessey?

  They, they woke up Star Wars?

• 2:11:48Speaker 02

  So the walkers also, other vehicles that I...

• 2:11:51Speaker 03

  Or ATATs.

• 2:11:52Speaker 02

  The ATATs.

• 2:11:53Speaker 04

  Walkers are here.

• 2:11:54Sean Fennessey?

  ATSTs.

• 2:11:54Speaker 02

  Yeah, didn't get, didn't get...

• 2:11:56Speaker 04

  My husband was sure that you guys would immediately go for the ATATs.

• 2:11:59Sean Fennessey?

  I like that.

• 2:12:00Speaker 03

  I feel like Death Star was brought down by four people with some string.

• 2:12:03Sean Fennessey?

  Well, this was related to not to spoil Mando, but this was the ATAT situation at the beginning of Mando. I was like, what's going on here?

• 2:12:08Speaker 04

  Yeah. Interesting. You got yourself set. If you had taken Death Star in wildcard, then you, or in vehicle instead of wildcard, you could have taken droids and we would have some fucking droids on the board.

• 2:12:16Speaker 03

  You could have taken...

• 2:12:18Speaker 04

  But we don't.

• 2:12:18Speaker 03

  A real Skywalker instead of trying to make inanimate objects on some family members.

• 2:12:22Speaker 04

  I have the mother who allowed the entire canon of Star Wars. Right, and that's how you've spoken about her, as do the rest of the Star Wars fandom. This is great. Yeah. Okay, so let's see.

• 2:12:34Sean Fennessey?

  There's, there's, there's many honorable mentions we can go through here.

• 2:12:37Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:12:37Sean Fennessey?

  Do you want to talk through some of them?

• 2:12:38Speaker 03

  I'll just say that, uh, I had Uncle Owen as a problematic character.

• 2:12:42Speaker 04

  Okay, say more.

• 2:12:43Speaker 03

  He was hiding a child.

• 2:12:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, sure.

• 2:12:46Speaker 03

  Why was he doing that?

• 2:12:47Speaker 04

  Didn't want to let Luke be who he was. Wado, not selected on the problematic character.

• 2:12:53Sean Fennessey?

  Wado, one assumes, would have been pretty high up there.

• 2:12:55Speaker 02

  Saul Greer?

• 2:12:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, Saul would have been a great pick.

• 2:12:57Speaker 02

  The fucking terrorist. He was like, he's like- Good guys?

• 2:13:04Sean Fennessey?

  He's a really interesting character. To me, he's one of the examples of the ways Star Wars can be interesting. That's like a confrontation with what your idea of revolution is. I like that.

• 2:13:11Speaker 02

  Right. I mean, I fuck with him, but like, let's be honest, Saul lost it at a certain point, right?

• 2:13:17Sean Fennessey?

  It seemed, yes, they could indicate that he went over the other, over the line.

• 2:13:22Speaker 03

  Krenex is a good villain.

• 2:13:23Speaker 04

  Krenex is a good villain. Maul?

• 2:13:25Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, no Darth Maul.

• 2:13:27Speaker 03

  Well, nobody took Mace, nobody took Krygon, right?

• 2:13:29Speaker 04

  Krygon is still here. Nobody took Stormtroopers as a wild card. Again, nobody's taking droids as a wild card. It's just, I think, very surprising.

• 2:13:37Sean Fennessey?

  Storm Jupiters?

• 2:13:37Speaker 04

  Storm Jupiters.

• 2:13:39Speaker 03

  Nobody picked Poe or Finn.

• 2:13:42Sean Fennessey?

  Nobody picked Chewbacca.

• 2:13:44Speaker 04

  Chewbacca not being picked is tough.

• 2:13:46Speaker 03

  I like Chewbacca.

• 2:13:47Speaker 04

  That's on you guys.

• 2:13:47Speaker 03

  But I don't really know what's on his mind.

• 2:13:48Speaker 04

  I think if we had hero and villain as two categories, Chewie would have been selected, certainly as a hero.

• 2:13:53Speaker 03

  You would have Chewbacca the entire time, just like, ah, this sucks.

• 2:13:55Sean Fennessey?

  It's actually super tough when I get asked to do Chewbacca. Cause I'm like, I have to do a podcast, I can't do that to my voice.

• 2:14:04Sean Fennessey?

  Chewie not being picked, that's tough. I don't-

• 2:14:06Speaker 03

  If I could go back, honestly, like, I feel like Cassian, I kinda had a little bit of like a, I blacked out and I was like, I don't know what to pick here. I think I would have gone back and done Chewie if I could do it all.

• 2:14:16Sean Fennessey?

  What about Snoke?

• 2:14:18Speaker 03

  Honestly, I didn't think he was that bad when I was watching Last Jedi again. I was like, this is actually pretty cool.

• 2:14:24Speaker 04

  Once again, it's a Raza Skywalker problem at the end of the day.

• 2:14:27Sean Fennessey?

  What about General Grievous?

• 2:14:29Speaker 04

  Grievous, I thought could have, could have been picked, certainly. Uh, Hawks could have been picked.

• 2:14:33Speaker 02

  Hawks could have been picked.

• 2:14:34Speaker 03

  They fucked that character up.

• 2:14:36Sean Fennessey?

  In the third one, they fucked him up really bad. That pivot too, that turn with him is terrible.

• 2:14:41Speaker 03

  Yeah. He was like, I'm a good guy too.

• 2:14:44Sean Fennessey?

  Captain Phasma?

• 2:14:45Speaker 04

  Phasma, not a very good character.

• 2:14:47Amanda Dobbins?

  I had the hologram messages on my, could have been wild card.

• 2:14:50Speaker 04

  Holograms could have been picked as a wild card.

• 2:14:51Amanda Dobbins?

  That's, I, those are useful.

• 2:14:52Speaker 04

  Force ghosts, force ghosts are pretty fun.

• 2:14:53Sean Fennessey?

  Force ghosts, that would have been good.

• 2:14:54Speaker 04

  Jedi temples could have been picked.

• 2:14:56Sean Fennessey?

  Sure.

• 2:14:57Speaker 03

  If we were gonna do any kind of-

• 2:14:58Speaker 02

  Blasters?

• 2:14:59Speaker 03

  I was also thinking about her hero, I had Wedge in there.

• 2:15:01Speaker 04

  Sure, Wedge.

• 2:15:02Sean Fennessey?

  One of your old guys, one of your original guys.

• 2:15:04Speaker 04

  I feel like I have Wedge on my team in a way because I have X-wings, so that's fun.

• 2:15:08Speaker 03

  Which I have Wedge. You've argued that I wouldn't be allowed to have Wedge since you've drafted the entire Ariel.

• 2:15:12Speaker 04

  Probably, yeah.

• 2:15:13Sean Fennessey?

  Do you think Mace Windu is problematic?

• 2:15:15Speaker 02

  How so?

• 2:15:17Sean Fennessey?

  Well, he's just, in the same way that Yoda fails, he's just kind of a fool.

• 2:15:21Speaker 02

  He is a fool.

• 2:15:22Sean Fennessey?

  And-

• 2:15:23Speaker 02

  He's a, he's a, he's a-

• 2:15:24Sean Fennessey?

  He's the only really strong black character in the prequels, and he's made to be a fool.

• 2:15:29Speaker 02

  Well, I mean, they were all fools. You know what? We, we call them fools, but at the same time, they are insanely powerful. Sidious is like, just almost doubly powerful than what Mace Windu is. I mean, maybe not doubly, but like Sidious is just like, a once in a lifetime dark force creation.

• 2:15:47Speaker 04

  The hubris and arrogance of the Jedi, you know? Attachment's bad. Is it?

• 2:15:51Speaker 02

  And they stopped listening to the will of the living force.

• 2:15:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:15:54Speaker 02

  And they started, they became kind of like bureaucrats for the senate. So they lost their way, which is probably another reason why they weren't listening to the will of the force, which is why they probably couldn't see what Sidious was, Qui-Gon Jinn was talking about. Listen to the will of the living force.

• 2:16:07Sean Fennessey?

  Like Daryl Morey, right?

• 2:16:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, exactly.

• 2:16:09Speaker 03

  Too much faith in analytics.

• 2:16:10Amanda Dobbins?

  Did you guys ever see the clip from like 15 years ago when they had Ewoks on the Today Show for Halloween? But the Ewoks showed up really drunk and then started moonwalking.

• 2:16:19Speaker 04

  Did they sing?

• 2:16:20Amanda Dobbins?

  And on big and cursed sick.

• 2:16:22Speaker 02

  What?

• 2:16:23Amanda Dobbins?

  Have you never seen this?

• 2:16:24Speaker 02

  No.

• 2:16:25Amanda Dobbins?

  This is the best minute of two minutes of daytime TV that I've ever seen in my life.

• 2:16:29Speaker 03

  Were like the puppeteers drunk or?

• 2:16:30Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, the, the, the Ewoks. I don't actually know what was happening. I don't know about the substance intake of the people who were in Ewok costumes.

• 2:16:39Speaker 02

  Oh.

• 2:16:40Amanda Dobbins?

  But they started misbehaving and it's-

• 2:16:42Speaker 03

  I've never seen this.

• 2:16:43Amanda Dobbins?

  It's, it's really, I thought about it in Wildcard, I'm glad I took John Williams, but it, it's the single best like viral video of my time.

• 2:16:51Speaker 04

  John Williams was definitely a better pick in Wildcard, you made the right choice. No one took Back to Tanks, you know? That would've been a fun one.

• 2:16:58Speaker 02

  Truck Ewoks on Today Show.

• 2:16:59Speaker 04

  Cantina bands?

• 2:17:00Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, yeah, so everybody's in their costumes.

• 2:17:02Sean Fennessey?

  Is that cutting into John Williams?

• 2:17:05Speaker 04

  Could be.

• 2:17:05Speaker 02

  How have I never seen this?

• 2:17:06Speaker 03

  Jawas never got picked?

• 2:17:07Speaker 04

  Jawas, yeah.

• 2:17:08Sean Fennessey?

  Jawas, yeah.

• 2:17:09Speaker 04

  Tusken Raiders?

• 2:17:10Sean Fennessey?

  Would you have considered Tusken Raiders problematic characters?

• 2:17:12Speaker 04

  I had them on my problematic list, yeah.

• 2:17:14Sean Fennessey?

  Jawas are problematic?

• 2:17:15Speaker 03

  The way they're treated, yes, yeah.

• 2:17:17Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:17:18Speaker 03

  Sterminated.

• 2:17:20Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:17:21Speaker 02

  Why are they doing this?

• 2:17:23Speaker 04

  So.

• 2:17:24Speaker 02

  Al Roker is.

• 2:17:24Speaker 04

  The speeder and speeder bike, that's fine. Speeder and speeder bike.

• 2:17:27Sean Fennessey?

  I think they're two different vehicles.

• 2:17:29Speaker 04

  Interesting.

• 2:17:30Sean Fennessey?

  You don't think they're two different vehicles?

• 2:17:31Speaker 02

  Why?

• 2:17:33Speaker 03

  Like, one you ride.

• 2:17:34Speaker 04

  Sure, yeah.

• 2:17:35Speaker 03

  You straddle.

• 2:17:36Sean Fennessey?

  There's like other swing.

• 2:17:36Speaker 02

  Ma, have you ever seen this?

• 2:17:39Speaker 04

  I don't think so.

• 2:17:40Amanda Dobbins?

  They were funny, oh, here's where he moved.

• 2:17:43Sean Fennessey?

  You know what I was thinking about taking in Wildcard?

• 2:17:46Speaker 02

  What the fuck?

• 2:17:46Amanda Dobbins?

  It's all about the Today Show!

• 2:17:49Speaker 04

  You said Boba, but Mandalorian armor.

• 2:17:51Speaker 03

  Uh, Mos Eisley's spaceport.

• 2:17:54Speaker 03

  In Wildcard.

• 2:17:56Speaker 04

  Lot of great planets, specific.

• 2:17:57Speaker 02

  I'm sorry, I apologize.

• 2:17:58Amanda Dobbins?

  Maybe it was my today.

• 2:17:59Speaker 02

  Bad podcast.

• 2:18:01Sean Fennessey?

  We don't have rights to air NBC content on our airwaves.

• 2:18:03Speaker 04

  No one took Tatooine?

• 2:18:04Amanda Dobbins?

  It's really funny.

• 2:18:05Sean Fennessey?

  I was gonna take ILM.

• 2:18:07Speaker 02

  Oh, it's a good one.

• 2:18:08Amanda Dobbins?

  That would've been a good, a good you pick.

• 2:18:10Sean Fennessey?

  Would've been a dorky pick, but it would've.

• 2:18:11Speaker 02

  No one took George Lucas?

• 2:18:13Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah.

• 2:18:14Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 2:18:15Sean Fennessey?

  Could've gone in a wild card.

• 2:18:16Speaker 02

  Who'd have thought of a wild card?

• 2:18:17Sean Fennessey?

  What's all George up to? Aside from opening a museum?

• 2:18:19Amanda Dobbins?

  Well.

• 2:18:20Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, can't wait for that.

• 2:18:21Amanda Dobbins?

  That seems like it.

• 2:18:22Sean Fennessey?

  I heard nice things about the museum.

• 2:18:23Amanda Dobbins?

  Oh, good, okay.

• 2:18:23Sean Fennessey?

  I'm excited.

• 2:18:24Speaker 04

  I'm glad they're opening in September. Can't wait.

• 2:18:26Sean Fennessey?

  That's what they say.

• 2:18:27Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah, but they've said that many times.

• 2:18:28Speaker 02

  On SC's campus, right?

• 2:18:29Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 2:18:30Speaker 04

  Cool.

• 2:18:31Speaker 03

  I don't know what you're doing otherwise.

• 2:18:32Sean Fennessey?

  You won't go? You won't go to the museum?

• 2:18:33Speaker 03

  I'll check it out, sure.

• 2:18:34Sean Fennessey?

  Okay.

• 2:18:35Speaker 03

  Yeah, I like museums.

• 2:18:35Sean Fennessey?

  You think he has a nice life?

• 2:18:37Speaker 03

  Uh, George Lucas? Yes, I think he has among the best lives.

• 2:18:40Speaker 02

  What is he up, six, seven billion or something like that?

• 2:18:42Sean Fennessey?

  I'm not sure.

• 2:18:43Amanda Dobbins?

  Doesn't he own, like, most of Marin County?

• 2:18:45Sean Fennessey?

  Is that a fact?

• 2:18:46Amanda Dobbins?

  I mean, no, it's not, but, um, and it's probably through various LLCs if he does.

• 2:18:50Sean Fennessey?

  I'd like to go to Skywalker Ranch.

• 2:18:52Speaker 04

  Same. Same.

• 2:18:54Sean Fennessey?

  Would you go?

• 2:18:55Speaker 03

  Uh, yeah, sure. I'd like to, there's other ranches I'd like to visit first.

• 2:18:58Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, well, Dutton, obviously.

• 2:18:59Speaker 03

  Well, the 466 is Taylor's Ranch in Texas.

• 2:19:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:19:02Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah, like, what, like, 600 acres or something?

• 2:19:05Speaker 03

  It's like half Texas.

• 2:19:06Sean Fennessey?

  Let's slow down for a second. You and Taylor are sitting together.

• 2:19:09Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:19:10Sean Fennessey?

  Two men.

• 2:19:10Speaker 03

  Trying to come up with a new idea for Star Wars.

• 2:19:13Sean Fennessey?

  Now, that's something.

• 2:19:14Speaker 03

  And it's about how women have gotten a little ahead of themselves.

• 2:19:17Sean Fennessey?

  That actually.

• 2:19:19Speaker 03

  Me and Taylor shared it in Star Wars.

• 2:19:20Speaker 02

  His movie would be awesome.

• 2:19:21Sean Fennessey?

  I'm not against it.

• 2:19:24Speaker 02

  5.2 billion. Yeah, his movie will be awesome. His movie would actually be awesome to me.

• 2:19:28Speaker 03

  It would, it would, it would scandal a lot of people.

• 2:19:31Amanda Dobbins?

  I'd watch all of the Star Wars films for this podcast, except for Attack of the Clones, which I didn't get to.

• 2:19:38Sean Fennessey?

  What if, what if he made a lioness in space?

• 2:19:41Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 2:19:42Sean Fennessey?

  And your son was like, I need that.

• 2:19:44Amanda Dobbins?

  I need to watch that, or I need to be a lioness, or I need a lioness in my life.

• 2:19:50Speaker 03

  Oh, well, I'll tell you what. A lioness in your life will do wonders for you.

• 2:19:54Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 2:19:55Speaker 03

  I, I think.

• 2:19:56Amanda Dobbins?

  I'm raising them, I'm raising both my sons to appreciate strong women, so.

• 2:19:59Speaker 02

  Ah, it's amazing. Quick question for Sean.

• 2:20:02Speaker 04

  Wait, wait till they meet Beth Dutton.

• 2:20:03Sean Fennessey?

  Interesting.

• 2:20:04Speaker 04

  Wait till they meet Beth Dutton.

• 2:20:06Speaker 02

  Sean, there are five directors that are worth over a billion dollars.

• 2:20:11Sean Fennessey?

  Uh huh.

• 2:20:12Speaker 03

  James Cameron.

• 2:20:13Speaker 02

  Can you name them? That's one.

• 2:20:14Speaker 03

  Steven Spielberg.

• 2:20:15Speaker 02

  That's two.

• 2:20:16Speaker 03

  George Lucas.

• 2:20:17Speaker 02

  Three.

• 2:20:18Sean Fennessey?

  Five directors that are worth over a billion dollars.

• 2:20:21Speaker 03

  Personal net worth?

• 2:20:23Speaker 02

  Net worth is over a billion.

• 2:20:24Amanda Dobbins?

  Can I ask what your sourcing is on this?

• 2:20:26Speaker 02

  I'm looking at this article that's from businessinsider.com.

• 2:20:30Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay, well.

• 2:20:32Sean Fennessey?

  Is Tyler Perry one of them?

• 2:20:35Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:20:35Amanda Dobbins?

  Tyler, sure, right? Then that's a good one.

• 2:20:39Speaker 02

  This was from December 19th, 2025, so it's fairly recent.

• 2:20:42Sean Fennessey?

  One billion dollars. There's another, this is a person who is a filmmaker second.

• 2:20:48Speaker 03

  Is it gonna be like Brad Bird or something?

• 2:20:50Speaker 02

  It's a, this is a, a, a big gigantic director. That directs a big gigantic property.

• 2:20:58Speaker 03

  Cameron, we said, Lucas, we said, Tyler Perry, we said, and Steven Spielberg.

• 2:21:02Speaker 02

  I wouldn't have thought about this guy. There must have been something in his deal.

• 2:21:05Amanda Dobbins?

  So it's a man, you're saying? Yeah. They won't let women direct films either.

• 2:21:10Speaker 02

  It's not the little affair.

• 2:21:13Sean Fennessey?

  They just won't let women have a billion dollars. That's really the issue.

• 2:21:18Sean Fennessey?

  Gosh, it's gotta be so obvious that it's slipping in.

• 2:21:20Speaker 02

  It's not that obvious, because when I saw that, I was actually surprised, but it makes sense when you think about it. It's, it's, when I saw it, I was actually surprised, but I was like, huh. He has that much bread, but it must have been in the deal for these movies that he made, that he had some kind of crazy backend or first dollar girls.

• 2:21:37Speaker 04

  Not like Todd Phillips, is it?

• 2:21:38Speaker 02

  Mm-mm.

• 2:21:39Speaker 04

  Okay. I feel good that it's not.

• 2:21:41Speaker 02

  Jack, do you know?

• 2:21:43Speaker 05

  We were gonna guess J.J. Abrams?

• 2:21:45Speaker 02

  No, no, no. It's Peter Jackson.

• 2:21:46Speaker 04

  I was, oh, damn it. Oh, of course. When you said it before.

• 2:21:50Speaker 02

  Yeah. Like, when I saw that, I was like, because I don't know what the structure of his deal was.

• 2:21:55Speaker 03

  Well, he also has Wita or whatever, the Weta.

• 2:21:57Sean Fennessey?

  Weta, yeah.

• 2:21:58Speaker 02

  Weta, and he's got the Hobbit movies, and so he's made a lot of money and done a lot of stuff. Yeah, Peter Jackson.

• 2:22:02Sean Fennessey?

  That's really interesting. Great trivia. I love trivia like that.

• 2:22:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 2:22:05Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, that's wonderful. Um, okay, how many of you guys have a billion dollars?

• 2:22:10Speaker 04

  None of us, sadly.

• 2:22:11Sean Fennessey?

  No?

• 2:22:12Speaker 03

  Working on it.

• 2:22:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, not yet.

• 2:22:13Sean Fennessey?

  What if we put all of our wealth together? Could we buy the Skywalker Ranch?

• 2:22:17Speaker 04

  Don't think so. No, probably couldn't even buy a teacup.

• 2:22:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, I don't think we could buy the Skywalker Ranch.

• 2:22:21Speaker 02

  Trailblazers, yes.

• 2:22:23Sean Fennessey?

  How does everyone feel? You ready to recite your picks?

• 2:22:25Speaker 03

  I feel like I started strong, I wobbled in the middle and finished fine.

• 2:22:30Speaker 02

  Wobble with it.

• 2:22:33Speaker 02

  I feel like I did pretty good. I feel like there are a couple, there are a couple of choices in there that like, you know, whatever.

• 2:22:40Sean Fennessey?

  I think you guys brought great creativity to the categories. I feel like I kind of was.

• 2:22:45Speaker 02

  Some of us maybe too much.

• 2:22:47Sean Fennessey?

  Well, one tried.

• 2:22:48Speaker 04

  Tried.

• 2:22:49Sean Fennessey?

  All right, I'll read mine first, since I picked first. In movie, I selected The Empire Strikes Back. In Skywalker family member, I picked a living person named Princess Leia. In hero or villain, I chose Ben Solo, AKA Kylo Ren. In the movie I was cursed with, I received Attack of the Clones from Mallory.

• 2:23:07Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 2:23:08Sean Fennessey?

  In vehicle, I chose Darth Vader's TIE fighter, which is called the TIE Advanced X-1. In problematic character, I picked Newt Gunray, who runs the Trade Federation, who is a terrible stereotype. And in wildcard, I chose one of my favorite characters of all time, Boba Fett.

• 2:23:26Sean Fennessey?

  Mel?

• 2:23:26Speaker 04

  Pretty good. In movie, I selected A New Hope. As my hero, in hero or villain, I selected Obi-Wan Kenobi. My wild card, lightsabers. Problematic character, Jar Jar Binks. I received from Amanda, not really a curse. Thank you. Star Wars, The Force Awakens. My vehicle, X-Wings. If you made me pick specifically, it would be Red Five, Luke's T-65, but X-Wings more broadly. And then my Skywalker family member is the matriarch who allowed us as pop culture fans, as lovers of story, to talk about this at all. Schmee, thank you.

• 2:24:11Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 2:24:12Sean Fennessey?

  I honestly don't remember this person at all. Okay. Van, your third?

• 2:24:17Speaker 04

  Pretty good.

• 2:24:18Speaker 02

  Darth Vader in hero or villain, probably should have took him in Skywalker. Maliafalk in the vehicle. The Force in wild card, Ray Skywalker. Skywalker family, remember? Remember, member. Return of the Jedi, a movie, felt like that was a steal. Darth Sidious, a groomer of children, a liar. And problematic character. And was cursed with just a fucking whammy.

• 2:24:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:24:42Speaker 02

  Star Wars, The Rise of Skywalker, that fucking hurts.

• 2:24:46Amanda Dobbins?

  In Skywalker, family member, I have Han Solo. In movie, I have The Last Jedi. In problematic character, I have the elder person in the age gap relationship and also questionable leadership tactics from Padme Amidala. Wild card, I have John Williams' vehicle. I have speeder bikes. Hero or villain, I have Yoda. And then I was cursed with the Phantom Menace, which I think is quite poor. So that was effective.

• 2:25:13Speaker 03

  In Skywalker, family member, I took Luke Skywalker. In movie, I took Rogue One. In wild card, I took the Death Star. In movie, I've been cursed with, I was given Solo, a Star Wars story. Hero or villain, I took Cassian Andor. Problematic character, I took the man who needs a Rico charge, Jabba the Hutt. And in vehicle, I took Luke's speeder from A New Hope that he drives around the desert in.

• 2:25:38Speaker 04

  Fun stuff.

• 2:25:39Speaker 02

  Fun.

• 2:25:40Speaker 04

  Only question about the presentation of it is like, because the swap on the movie we were cursed with-

• 2:25:45Amanda Dobbins?

  So we're just gonna do graphic design now?

• 2:25:47Speaker 04

  Well, I am curious about this because like, I think Rise of Skywalker, it- Where Sean chose to hit Van with it was like part of, I think, the power of the pick. Like, it looks like a really high.

• 2:25:57Speaker 03

  You should do, you should have like a little fuzzy mic.

• 2:26:00Speaker 04

  Same with Vantam Menace.

• 2:26:02Speaker 03

  And you just walk people through everybody's pick and then do an extended monologue about.

• 2:26:05Speaker 04

  It's tricky.

• 2:26:06Speaker 03

  Why you tried to pick both a pile of metal.

• 2:26:09Speaker 04

  It doesn't affect me. A pile of metal. The droids are indelible and inextricable from the spirit of Star Wars. Bryce Skywalker.

• 2:26:16Sean Fennessey?

  As competitive and obnoxious as I am through all of these experiences, I do not know the winner of any of the last 10 drafts. Like, I literally couldn't name them. So while I do respect your concern for clarity in terms of the picks. We've kind of evolved beyond.

• 2:26:29Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:26:30Amanda Dobbins?

  Yeah.

• 2:26:30Sean Fennessey?

  Winners, losers.

• 2:26:32Speaker 04

  Agree.

• 2:26:32Sean Fennessey?

  Victors.

• 2:26:32Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:26:33Speaker 04

  Feel great.

• 2:26:33Speaker 03

  I agree.

• 2:26:35Speaker 04

  Had a blast.

• 2:26:35Sean Fennessey?

  This was a good one.

• 2:26:37Speaker 02

  It was a great one.

• 2:26:37Sean Fennessey?

  Thank you, guys.

• 2:26:38Speaker 04

  What fun. Star Wars. Pretty cool.

• 2:26:39Sean Fennessey?

  Mando and Grogu, we will, we'll just do this all over again immediately after it's released.

• 2:26:44Speaker 03

  And we just don't know the plot of this movie, or like even the logline.

• 2:26:47Sean Fennessey?

  I think that we do now because of what we saw.

• 2:26:49Speaker 04

  They're hunting Imperial remnants, right? They're trying to get a warlord. That's the logline.

• 2:26:55Sean Fennessey?

  That may come up. I don't want to spoil it for anybody who's excited about the film.

• 2:26:58Speaker 02

  How was the Doomsday trailer?

• 2:27:00Sean Fennessey?

  I didn't like it.

• 2:27:02Speaker 04

  Oh, oh, well, no.

• 2:27:04Sean Fennessey?

  But that doesn't mean other people won't like it.

• 2:27:06Speaker 04

  That's upsetting.

• 2:27:07Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:27:07Sean Fennessey?

  Did you read about it?

• 2:27:09Speaker 02

  Read a little bit.

• 2:27:09Sean Fennessey?

  Did you read about it?

• 2:27:11Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 2:27:11Amanda Dobbins?

  Did you watch it?

• 2:27:12Sean Fennessey?

  It's not available.

• 2:27:13Amanda Dobbins?

  I thought that they, oh, they didn't release it?

• 2:27:16Speaker 03

  They're not releasing it yet.

• 2:27:16Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 2:27:19Sean Fennessey?

  It doesn't do anything you really haven't seen before.

• 2:27:21Speaker 03

  Is Downey's accent good?

• 2:27:23Amanda Dobbins?

  I don't think he spoke.

• 2:27:24Sean Fennessey?

  Yeah, I don't think he spoke either. Or if he does, it's very quiet.

• 2:27:27Speaker 03

  I just didn't know if it was like high Latvian or, you know, like kind of a new take on it or what.

• 2:27:32Sean Fennessey?

  You mean like, does he sound like Roger Rabbit or something?

• 2:27:38Sean Fennessey?

  I mean, I look forward to both of your thoughts and yours as well, Chris.

• 2:27:41Speaker 03

  It's okay.

• 2:27:41Sean Fennessey?

  Will you be seeing Doomsday?

• 2:27:42Speaker 03

  I will be seeing Doomsday.

• 2:27:43Speaker 04

  Will you see it in Dune on the same day?

• 2:27:47Speaker 03

  Sure, if it comes to that, yeah.

• 2:27:48Sean Fennessey?

  Will you pay the Infinity Vision upcharge?

• 2:27:51Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah, for sure. I've been looking forward to a new way of watching Marvel movies.

• 2:27:55Sean Fennessey?

  I read it's roughly $300 more than your average ticket. Is that okay? Okay. Any closing thoughts?

• 2:28:01Speaker 04

  Just great to share Star Wars with friends. Truly.

• 2:28:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 2:28:05Speaker 04

  What a treat. Really hope Mando movie's good and that they let Grogu shine in the way that earns him an Oscar.

• 2:28:12Speaker 03

  We just don't know.

• 2:28:13Speaker 04

  Ghostling, Starfighter. Next year, right?

• 2:28:16Speaker 02

  With the biggest star in the world.

• 2:28:17Speaker 04

  Won't have to wait long, so that's exciting.

• 2:28:18Speaker 03

  But like, no more shows?

• 2:28:21Speaker 04

  We're getting a second season of Ahsoka, pretty soon.

• 2:28:23Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 2:28:24Sean Fennessey?

  Is that the last one that's in production?

• 2:28:26Speaker 04

  Hmm.

• 2:28:27Speaker 03

  To my knowledge.

• 2:28:31Speaker 02

  You're doing it right now.

• 2:28:31Speaker 04

  Well, I mean, Shadow, the mall show is on right now. Shadow Lord, so the animated shows continue and they're excellent. The mall show is really good. Really good. It is.

• 2:28:40Sean Fennessey?

  Thank you guys for making the time for this. Uh, you can listen to Van Lathan on Seven Pods.

• 2:28:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, a lot of podcasts.

• 2:28:47Sean Fennessey?

  Mal can hear you on

• 2:28:49Speaker 04

  House of R.

• 2:28:49Sean Fennessey?

  House of R and other pods. CR, have you, is this your first pod?

• 2:28:53Speaker 03

  Yeah, this has been exciting. I've been wondering what it's all about.

• 2:28:56Sean Fennessey?

  They're real natural. It's really exciting. Uh, Amanda, where will we, where will we find you?

• 2:29:01Amanda Dobbins?

  Um, you know, just, just catching up on all this, on all of these tabs I have open. The tabs are chronological order, Skywalker family, what does Saw Guerrero do? And drunk Ewoks on Today Show, so if you need me.

• 2:29:13Sean Fennessey?

  All good queries.

• 2:29:14Speaker 03

  I can't wait to see your algorithm next.

• 2:29:16Sean Fennessey?

  The next time you see Amanda, she will be on this feed talking about The Devil Wears Prada 2. And so for all that luster about the Phantom Menace.

• 2:29:23Speaker 03

  Have you seen it?

• 2:29:23Amanda Dobbins?

  No, as of, as of this recording, I don't know when this is airing because we might be doing a little future recording here.

• 2:29:30Speaker 03

  Oh, okay.

• 2:29:31Amanda Dobbins?

  Well, I have seen it when people are listening to this.

• 2:29:33Sean Fennessey?

  You will.

• 2:29:33Amanda Dobbins?

  Okay.

• 2:29:34Sean Fennessey?

  And I'll be there for it.

• 2:29:36Amanda Dobbins?

  I have my outfit ready, so that's all that matters. Yeah.

• 2:29:39Sean Fennessey?

  I think we're seeing it at a Burbank AMC, so I don't know what you need to wear. Oh, I see. Okay. I'll be dressing up for the screening, because that's something that I do.

• 2:29:45Speaker 03

  You should do that.

• 2:29:47Sean Fennessey?

  I'll be, I'll be in a, in a ball gown. Um, thanks so much to Jack Sanders. Thanks to Lucas Cavanagh. Thanks to everybody at home. We'll see you next Friday for The Devil Wears Prada 2.