Selects: Rockettes: Still Kicking After All These Years

Tune in to this classic episode to learn all about the legendary NYC Rockettes, who actually got their start in Missouri. See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:04Josh Clark?

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• 1:34Speaker 03

  Hey, everybody. Happy Saturday. I got a select for you. This is Chuck here of the Stuff You Should Know Podcast. Introducing Rockettes, colon, still kicking after all these years. This one came out January 1st, 2019, and it's about the Rockettes. And this is the time of year to talk about the Rockettes. I learned a lot about this organization, organization, this dance troupe, and their storied history. And I think you're gonna like it. So give it a listen and please enjoy.

• 2:06Speaker 04

  Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of iHeart Radio.

• 2:15Josh Clark?

  Hey and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant. There's Jerry. Happy New Year.

• 2:22Speaker 03

  You are too tall to be a Rocket, aren't you?

• 2:25Josh Clark?

  Just barely.

• 2:26Speaker 03

  Jerry and I can be Rockettes.

• 2:29Josh Clark?

  That's pretty good.

• 2:29Speaker 03

  And you can't.

• 2:31Josh Clark?

  No, it's true.

• 2:32Speaker 03

  Which is a shame because you have the gams.

• 2:35Josh Clark?

  I do, actually. I've got pretty decent legs.

• 2:38Speaker 03

  You know?

• 2:38Josh Clark?

  At least my calves are alright.

• 2:41Speaker 03

  What, no thighs?

• 2:42Josh Clark?

  They're a little tree trunky for my taste.

• 2:45Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah?

• 2:46Josh Clark?

  Yeah. I've got a bit of like a fertility idol thing going on, like up toward the hips and all that. I'm, yeah.

• 2:54Speaker 03

  Well, it's because of all those squats.

• 2:56Josh Clark?

  I was not expecting to talk about this.

• 2:58Speaker 03

  About your gams?

• 2:59Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 2:59Speaker 03

  Oh, well, I'll talk about my legs all day long.

• 3:02Josh Clark?

  Well, let's hear it.

• 3:03Speaker 03

  They're shapely.

• 3:04Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 3:05Speaker 03

  They're, uh, they're not, I gain all my weight between my waist and my chin.

• 3:11Josh Clark?

  Uh huh.

• 3:12Speaker 03

  Like, I don't, if you looked at my legs and my arms, you'd be like, that guy weighs 160 pounds.

• 3:20Josh Clark?

  That's hilarious.

• 3:21Speaker 03

  And then the rest of me comes along to bust that myth.

• 3:25Josh Clark?

  Step aside.

• 3:26Speaker 03

  Still have a nice little fanny.

• 3:28Josh Clark?

  Sure. Everybody knows that.

• 3:30Speaker 03

  Sorry, listeners in the UK.

• 3:32Josh Clark?

  Oh, yeah, that means something different over there, doesn't it? It's just so dainty and nice that little, little five-year-old kids can say fanny in the United States.

• 3:43Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 3:44Josh Clark?

  It's just the Brits who are sickos.

• 3:46Speaker 03

  But this isn't about our gams. This is about a dance troupe, a legendary dance troupe.

• 3:54Josh Clark?

  Yeah, about as legendary as a dance troupe can possibly be are the Rockettes.

• 3:58Speaker 03

  I think so.

• 3:59Josh Clark?

  I just said that sentence like Yoda.

• 4:04Speaker 03

  Can you do the voice?

• 4:05Josh Clark?

  No.

• 4:06Speaker 03

  No?

• 4:06Josh Clark?

  No. Not even going to try.

• 4:09Speaker 03

  Uh, but this totally surprised me digging into the research on this to, to learn that the legendary Rockettes of New York City and Radio City musical are not from New York City.

• 4:22Josh Clark?

  No, they're not. Where are they from, Chuck?

• 4:25Speaker 03

  Did you know this?

• 4:26Josh Clark?

  I had no idea, no.

• 4:27Speaker 03

  Yeah. So shout out to St. Louis.

• 4:30Josh Clark?

  Yeah. Uh, they, they were founded in the 1920s, 1925, to be exact, in St. Louis, Missouri, as the Rockets, the, the St. Louis Rockets, which I, I think they were trying to be a basketball team, maybe.

• 4:45Speaker 03

  St. Louis Rockets?

• 4:46Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 4:46Speaker 03

  Yeah, there was a choreographer named, uh, Russell, uh, Markert, which is, uh, I kept wanting to say Market, but that is an R.

• 4:54Josh Clark?

  Yep.

• 4:55Speaker 03

  And he founded them, like you said, in 1925, and he was, he was inspired by a British, uh, dance troupe named the, the Tiller Girls, uh, which was founded in the 1894 by John Tiller. And it was kind of a similar idea. He saw these Tiller Girls and he was like, "I want a high-kicking, glamorous, uh, theatrical dance troupe of my own."

• 5:20Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 5:21Speaker 03

  "So I'm gonna rip it off."

• 5:22Josh Clark?

  He did, actually. So John Tiller is, is, um, widely acknowledged as the, the creator of what's called precision dance, which is where you have a bunch of dancers who are really, uh, highly trained, really athletic, and really precise in their movements, um, that can move in such unison.

• 5:44Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 5:44Josh Clark?

  That, that you take a number, like, a number of different dancers and they basically become one thing that's, that can do things that an individual dancer can't do. And that's precision dance technique. And John Tiller literally invented it with, I think, four 10-year-old girls in the 1890s. And, um, he, he came up with some further refinements to it, like, when you put your hand around the waists of the people on either side of you, it kind of lends to the unity of the whole thing. Um, and, and, uh- Russell Maker Markert saw this and was like, this is amazing. If I can get some American girls with longer legs to kick higher, it'll knock everybody's socks off. That's a quote, by the way.

• 6:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, and there's a, there's something to that, that synchronicity of, uh, for me, for movement and sound, that just knocks me out every time. Um, when I go and see a choir, what's like a hundred people singing together.

• 6:44Josh Clark?

  And high kicking.

• 6:45Speaker 03

  Or, or a symphony, uh, just the, not only the sound, but the movement. When you watch a symphony, that's a big part of it for me.

• 6:53Josh Clark?

  Mm hmm.

• 6:53Speaker 03

  Uh, forget a choral symphony, like I'm on the floor, weeping. If you take me to a choral symphony. Uh, but there's something about that precision of, of all these people together. It's just really like, I don't know what it is about it. I mean, it's, uh, it's a collective voice or collective movement, but it's that precision that really just gets, gets me every time.

• 7:17Josh Clark?

  For sure. Well, that's what the Rockettes are known for. It's their, their trade is precision dance. They're as good as it gets with it. Although the Teller Girls are definitely still around. They still have Christmas specials themselves. Um, and they're doing their thing for sure. So it's, uh, it's not just an offhand thing to say the Rockettes are as good as it comes, as good as they come in, in precision dance. Cause the Teller Girls would probably say, um, I would dispute that statement.

• 7:45Speaker 03

  But they would say it with a British accent.

• 7:47Josh Clark?

  Right. I dispute that statement.

• 7:51Speaker 03

  Uh, so they were not as tall back then. The original, uh, height requirements were between five, two and five, six and a half. And now they went, we'll take your tallest dancer and make them our shortest dancer. Because I guess it's just, I don't know. I'm not sure why they did that. But now it's between five, six and five, 10 and a half. And it is not because they want to exclude people or, uh, any, or discriminate against people who are too tall or they feel too short. But it's so they can just all look, it's an optical illusion. So they can all look the same height because they take that five foot, 10 and a half inch dancer.

• 8:34Speaker 03

  Uh, although they don't have to be that tall, but they take whoever their tallest dancer is, put her right in the middle and then just stagger it out from there. And in the end, everyone looks. It's weird. Everyone looks to be the same height, even though they're not.

• 8:47Josh Clark?

  I don't understand how this works. It's just, I saw it so many different places that I'm convinced that it does work. I just don't get the illusion of it, how it works.

• 8:58Speaker 03

  Well, I think over four inches and 36 women, it's just so minute of differences as you scale down, that it would take, I guess, an extraordinary human to be like, that woman is an inch and a half taller than the one five people away from her.

• 9:17Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 9:18Speaker 03

  You know?

• 9:19Josh Clark?

  I got you. Yeah, I guess that's true.

• 9:23Speaker 03

  So you're just a normal person, is what I'm saying.

• 9:26Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 9:27Speaker 03

  You should feel good about that.

• 9:28Josh Clark?

  I fall for that optical illusion every time.

• 9:30Speaker 03

  Yeah, everybody should. So they started with the Missouri Rockets with just 16 women. And like I said, now they have 36. And they debuted in St. Louis, but then went to New York to perform Rain or Shine on Broadway. And that is where a man named S.L. Roxy, that was his nickname, Roethafel, which is an interesting name, that's where he saw them and said, hey, I gotta get in on this. This is amazing.

• 10:01Josh Clark?

  Yeah, so Russell Markert took the idea from John Tiller, and Roxy Roethafel said, hey, I want in on this jam. So I'm gonna grab a few of these dancers from St. Louis and bring them over to New York City. And we're gonna have them start dancing there, okay? And I know just the place for them. There's this new venue that's opening up in 1932, and they're gonna call it the Radio City Music Hall. And I'm going to make sure that these dancers are able to perform. And we're gonna call them the Roxyettes. How about that? Huh?

• 10:38Speaker 03

  Yeah, cuz it was nickname.

• 10:40Josh Clark?

  Right? And Markert said, that's fine. Just make sure you pay me some money for it.

• 10:44Speaker 03

  Sure. And he did get paid and got paid until 1971. It's hard to believe, but he worked for the Rockettes or with the Rockettes from 1932 to, or I guess even previous in St. Louis.

• 10:59Josh Clark?

  Yeah, 1925.

• 11:00Speaker 03

  All the way until 1971.

• 11:02Josh Clark?

  Yep.

• 11:03Speaker 03

  Really amazing.

• 11:04Josh Clark?

  Yeah, it is pretty amazing. That's a pretty long career. So they they opened Radio City Music Hall. I think they were part of a seventeen group act. And that was like such a hot ticket, something like a hundred thousand people wanted in. But there it's a sixty two hundred seat theater, which I think it still remains the nation's largest indoor venue. Which is really saying something because I guess it'd just be a like a theatrical venue because obviously.

• 11:35Speaker 03

  The largest indoor venue.

• 11:36Josh Clark?

  Sports venues have it beat by quite a bit, but.

• 11:41Speaker 03

  Oh, theatrical. Okay, I got you.

• 11:43Josh Clark?

  It has to. Yeah, it's either movie or theatrical or something, but it's the largest venue of its kind in in the United States, from what I see.

• 11:51Speaker 03

  Yeah, and for many years, they they I mean, they had specials every now and then, but it was sort of just a movie theater.

• 11:57Josh Clark?

  Yeah, and here's the thing, you could go see the movies. I think especially it started to take off in the fifties, like before they would have premieres for movies. And the Rockettes would like perform at the premiere. And then at some point, I don't know if it was Russell Markert or or Roxy Rothoffel or somebody said, well, why why just do this once? How about every time somebody comes to see a movie at the Radio City Music Hall? We'll have the rock the Rockettes perform before the movie.

• 12:26Speaker 03

  Can you imagine that? How cool that would be?

• 12:27Josh Clark?

  It would be pretty cool. I mean, like, imagine seeing that and then being like, okay, now for the movie. That's just be it'd be a different experience for sure.

• 12:37Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 12:38Josh Clark?

  But it was rough on the Rockettes because not all the movies were successes. So they would change the Rockettes show for each movie. So if a movie came along and it was just a terrible flop, this whole choreographed routine that they'd learned would be out the door in two days. And now all of a sudden, they had to learn a new one quick because there was a new movie coming in to replace that one.

• 13:00Speaker 03

  Oh, so they did a different routine for each film?

• 13:03Josh Clark?

  Yes.

• 13:03Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 13:04Josh Clark?

  Yeah, and sometimes they would have to learn it in a matter of hours, like around midnight before the next day's performances.

• 13:11Speaker 03

  I wonder if it was tied to the film.

• 13:13Josh Clark?

  Sometimes, I think, but not all the time. I think it was, I think it was in some cases, but I think more than anything, they would change the routine just because the people coming to see a different film would want to see a different routine.

• 13:27Speaker 03

  Okay, I gotcha. Well, that makes sense.

• 13:29Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 13:29Speaker 03

  So, in the 1940s, they were one of the first groups to sign up for the United Service Organization and go and perform for the troops. And in the 1950s is when things really started to kind of take their toll. Like, they were performing sometimes up to five times a day. And so, they said they built a dormitory there, which, you know, they could live in. I don't think they were required to, but it really was to accommodate the fact that they were working almost around the clock, rather, because learning these new routines, like you said, and then performing up to five times a day. Really grueling stuff.

• 14:09Josh Clark?

  It was basically the prototype for Google.

• 14:11Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 14:12Josh Clark?

  Like, just making it so your employees didn't have to leave.

• 14:15Speaker 03

  Oh, interesting.

• 14:18Josh Clark?

  You know what I'm saying?

• 14:19Speaker 03

  Yeah, just go sleep in your pod.

• 14:20Josh Clark?

  So, the Rockettes, their fame started to grow pretty, pretty quickly. And they, they made like a few steps, if you'll forgive the pun, along the way that kind of cemented them as a, as much a piece of America as apple pie, or baseball, or moms, or what have you. So, the 50s were also big for the Rockettes, too, because they joined the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade in 1957, I think.

• 14:54Speaker 03

  Yeah, that was the big, the big move.

• 14:57Josh Clark?

  Yeah, because they went from just a group that you either had to go to New York or go off to war to see, to, "Oh, they're in my living room now. These girls are high-kicking on my television, and I'm just loving life."

• 15:12Speaker 03

  All right, so let's take a break. It's the 1950s. Good times are ahead, and then dark times come in the 70s, because it's New York City in the 70s, and everything was kind of awful then. So, we'll be back right after this.

• 15:37Speaker 05

  First thought is like, wow, how are we going to do all this?

• 15:40Josh Clark?

  Hey, this is Josh and Chuck from Stuff You Should Know.

• 15:43Speaker 03

  That's Alan Goya, planning engineer at AT&T, and he's talking about Intuit Dome, home of the Los Angeles Clippers, where every seat, screen, phone, and transaction is connected with AT&T fiber and 5G, redefining the fan's experience. And Alan's master plan made it all possible.

• 15:59Speaker 05

  It was going to rival anything that was already built. And that takes quite a bit of people and different teams to all be on the same page.

• 16:06Josh Clark?

  That includes field services manager Drexel Jones. His team made sure it all came together and held up on game day.

• 16:13Speaker 06

  Through what Alan's whole crew designed, we connected the event visitors to the world.

• 16:18Speaker 03

  And after years of hard work and collaboration, it was opening night.

• 16:22Speaker 06

  To actually see the whole stadium light up and data's flowing is a beautiful thing.

• 16:26Speaker 05

  What the fans experience is incredible. It gave me a lot of pride.

• 16:29Josh Clark?

  AT&T, connecting fans to what they love.

• 16:33Speaker 07

  Connecting changes everything. AT&T.

• 16:39Speaker 03

  You know, you're never done decorating your home. You know what I mean?

• 16:42Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 16:43Speaker 03

  Yeah, because it's a process. There's always something you could do or buy or update. The only question is, what's next? For us, our animals just wear out our rugs so quickly. It's usually a new rug.

• 16:53Josh Clark?

  Well, Chuck, whether you need a rug or whatever is next for you, you can go to Wayfair. It's the smart place to get it.

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• 17:11Josh Clark?

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• 17:37Josh Clark?

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• 18:14Josh Clark?

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• 18:45Josh Clark?

  Okay. Hey, before we get started, Chuck, I want to say, we put on a pretty good stage show ourselves.

• 18:52Speaker 03

  We've been done too.

• 18:53Josh Clark?

  And we've got some coming up, you know, plug, plug.

• 18:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, there's no high kicking involved.

• 18:58Josh Clark?

  There could be if people demanded it. I would be willing to do a little high kicking.

• 19:03Speaker 03

  So are we talking about some shows?

• 19:05Josh Clark?

  Yeah, let's do that real quick.

• 19:07Speaker 03

  All right, so we're going out west for our annual sojourn in January, where we go to Seattle, and we go to Portland, and then we end up at SF Sketch Fest, like we always do, in mid-January.

• 19:19Josh Clark?

  Yeah, and I've got an end of the world live show on Friday at Sketch Fest, and you have a movie crush on Saturday at Sketch Fest, right?

• 19:28Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm doing a matinee show at 1 o'clock on Saturday, January 19th, with Busy Phillips as my guest.

• 19:35Josh Clark?

  Nice, and my show is Friday, the 18th, at Cafe du Nord, and I am my own guest. Fine solo. And then I have another one in Brooklyn on the 24th at the Bell House, too.

• 19:47Speaker 03

  Oh, I thought you already did that one.

• 19:49Josh Clark?

  No, uh-uh. It got postponed to January 24th.

• 19:52Speaker 03

  Oh, great.

• 19:52Josh Clark?

  Yes, so you haven't missed it. There's still time for you to come.

• 19:55Speaker 03

  Fantastic.

• 19:58Josh Clark?

  So that is our little plug. How about that?

• 20:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, and of course, our big Stuff You Should Know show is at the Castro on, when is that, Thursday night?

• 20:07Josh Clark?

  That is Thursday, the 17th.

• 20:10Speaker 03

  Yeah, so come see us at the Moore in Seattle, Revolution Hall in Portland, at the Castro in San Francisco.

• 20:16Josh Clark?

  Yep.

• 20:16Speaker 03

  Check out our individual little shows, our cute little individual shows.

• 20:22Josh Clark?

  And there's plenty of information on sysklive.com.

• 20:25Speaker 03

  That's right. So now it's the 70s.

• 20:30Speaker 03

  New York is, uh, is suffering.

• 20:34Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 20:34Speaker 03

  Which is crazy. When you look at pictures of New York City in the 70s and early 80s even, just hard to believe how bad things were there.

• 20:44Josh Clark?

  Yeah, it was pretty rough. And actually, it's funny, like, you can thank Rudolph Giuliani for, I guess, cleaning up the town, if you want to call it that.

• 20:52Speaker 03

  Okay.

• 20:53Josh Clark?

  Have you ever heard that?

• 20:55Speaker 03

  What, to thank Rudolph Giuliani for cleaning up the town?

• 20:57Josh Clark?

  Uh huh.

• 20:58Speaker 03

  Uh, sure.

• 20:59Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 21:00Speaker 03

  Good for him.

• 21:01Josh Clark?

  So, um...

• 21:02Speaker 03

  I saw him in the park one day.

• 21:04Josh Clark?

  You did? What was he doing? Talking to a duck?

• 21:06Speaker 03

  No, he was, he was doing like a photo op, but I had friends in from, uh, from another country even, I think. And I said, "Hey, guys, this, this is the mayor of New York over there." And they were like, "Oh, that's nice." And I went, "It's kind of a big deal to just walk around and see the mayor of New York."

• 21:21Josh Clark?

  Did they say, "Oh, whatever, Chuck?"

• 21:24Speaker 03

  I think they're Australian, actually.

• 21:25Josh Clark?

  Yeah. Oh, that was my Australian impression.

• 21:28Speaker 03

  Oh, that was good then. Yeah.

• 21:29Josh Clark?

  Thank you. That's pretty, that's a great story, Chuck.

• 21:32Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's fine. But, uh, for them, they didn't understand fully that the mayor of New York City is, is, uh, it's, it's quite a big deal to see him just out and about in the city.

• 21:43Josh Clark?

  I, I have a similar story. I was watching, um, one of the first few seasons of Law and Order on my television one day, and there was the mayor of New York City, Rudy Giuliani.

• 21:54Speaker 03

  Interesting.

• 21:55Josh Clark?

  But I knew it was a big, a big deal.

• 21:58Speaker 03

  I got another story.

• 21:59Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 22:00Speaker 03

  Did you know, in the Michael Bay film Pearl Harbor, that they comped in... Bruce Willis's John McClane character from Die Hard in one hospital scene.

• 22:10Josh Clark?

  How?

• 22:11Speaker 03

  Just digitally.

• 22:12Josh Clark?

  That's an anachronism.

• 22:14Speaker 03

  I know.

• 22:15Josh Clark?

  That doesn't make any sense. Did they really do that?

• 22:17Speaker 03

  Yeah, you can look it up. Pearl Harbor, John McClane, and there's like screenshots of John McClane in his white tank top, just briefly for a blip in the background of one of the hospital scenes in Pearl Harbor. It's so weird.

• 22:33Josh Clark?

  So you know, there's a nude woman in the window of one of the buildings that the rescuers fly by?

• 22:39Speaker 03

  Oh, really?

• 22:40Josh Clark?

  The Disney movie from the 60s?

• 22:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, all these weird movie Easter eggs. Just bored editors, I guess.

• 22:47Josh Clark?

  That's exactly what it is. Bored juvenile editors.

• 22:50Speaker 03

  All right, so it's the 1970s.

• 22:52Josh Clark?

  In New York.

• 22:53Speaker 03

  None of this has happened yet that we're talking about.

• 22:56Josh Clark?

  The rescuers did.

• 22:57Speaker 03

  The rescuers did, but there was no Die Hard. There was no Pearl Harbor movie.

• 23:01Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 23:01Speaker 03

  Except for Tora, Tora, Tora, but no bad Pearl Harbor movie.

• 23:05Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 23:06Speaker 03

  No Rudy Giuliani. He was alive.

• 23:10Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 23:10Speaker 03

  But he was not the mayor of New York City in the 1970s.

• 23:14Josh Clark?

  Not as far as we know.

• 23:15Speaker 03

  Who was that? That was Ed Koch.

• 23:16Josh Clark?

  He was the 80s, I think.

• 23:18Speaker 03

  Oh, was he?

• 23:18Josh Clark?

  Maybe late 70s.

• 23:20Speaker 03

  All right, we'll get that straightened out.

• 23:22Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 23:22Speaker 03

  But New York City is going down the toilet, including, believe it or not, the great Radio City Music Hall, much like our own legendary Fox Theater in Atlanta, was facing shutdown and demolition, potentially.

• 23:38Josh Clark?

  Yeah, there was a rough transition from some of those old movie palaces after people stopped, well, going to movie palaces and moved out to the suburbs. A lot of those beautiful places were left out in the cold, and some of them didn't, well, a lot of them didn't make it, but some of them almost didn't make it. Like you said, the Fox and Radio City. And apparently it was going to be turned into a parking lot, and Belushi himself got onto the news desk at Saturday Night Live and was railing against the demise of Radio City Music Hall. And the Rockettes, too, had said, hey, hey, hey, hey, this is our home. This is an iconic. Let us help like go raise awareness and funds to to save this place.

• 24:21Josh Clark?

  And they did. They were successful. They got it put on the National Historic Register of Historic Places. And it has a landmark designation, not just the building. There's 1,200 buildings in New York with the landmark designation, but only 110 interiors have the landmark designation. And Radio City Music Hall is one of them, which means that its interior is so amazingly beautiful. That is a protected landmark in the United States.

• 24:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, I've never been in there.

• 24:48Josh Clark?

  I haven't either.

• 24:49Speaker 03

  I've been to Carnegie Hall, but never Radio City. It's on the list for sure, but it's interesting because they they tried to. Their whole deal was is they wanted exclusive movie bookings. Like they they were they were to be the only theater in town that would be showing a particular movie. So that that limits their their pool immediately. And then they really prefer G rated movies. They had really strict screening criteria, so that just it narrowed down their their movie pool so small that they would go weeks and weeks at a time where nothing happened there.

• 25:26Josh Clark?

  Yeah, so they would just shut down because again, remember like the Rockettes are a dance troupe that you would see before you saw a movie. So if they're not showing movies, they're not showing the Rockettes. And at this time in the 70s, the Rockettes said, OK, we're we're our talent is being wasted here. At least let us go take the show on the road while you guys are sitting around waiting for another movie to come along. And they actually they gained that right because they're union dancers, we should say. We'll get into that a little more later. But they managed to get the right to take the show on the road. And they really started to make a name for themselves in the 70s in places like Tahoe and Vegas.

• 26:03Speaker 03

  Sure.

• 26:04Josh Clark?

  Apparently made a huge fan out of Sammy Davis Jr., who would come see the same show like night after night when they when they play in Vegas or Tahoe or whatever. He was just fascinated by the Rockettes.

• 26:14Speaker 03

  Love that.

• 26:15Josh Clark?

  For sure.

• 26:15Speaker 03

  Little Sammy. What a great guy. We should do a show on him.

• 26:19Josh Clark?

  Apparently, he also, oh yeah, I'm down with that. He also surprised them on stage once by joining them on stage for a dance number, which apparently he knew because he'd seen the show so many times.

• 26:30Speaker 03

  Wow.

• 26:31Josh Clark?

  Which, that's a pretty Sammy thing to do in Las Vegas.

• 26:34Speaker 03

  High kicking, well, his kicks weren't so high.

• 26:37Josh Clark?

  Run out on stage unbidden, uninvited.

• 26:40Speaker 03

  He's a little guy.

• 26:41Josh Clark?

  He was.

• 26:42Speaker 03

  He was the littlest Rockette, I imagine.

• 26:44Josh Clark?

  Wow, but he was too.

• 26:45Speaker 03

  So, they're doing their show on the road here and there, their make and ends meet. Radio City is struggling, even though it was designated as a landmark. The eighties were not super kind to Radio City either.

• 26:59Speaker 03

  They very famously appeared at the halftime show of the Super Bowl in eighty-eight. They're trying to change with the times. They're dancing it in the nineties at different places, and they're always doing their Christmas deal throughout all this, after, you know, they started doing that in, what was that, fifty-seven?

• 27:16Josh Clark?

  Thirty-two.

• 27:17Speaker 03

  Oh, they did the Macy's Parade in thirty-two?

• 27:20Josh Clark?

  Oh, no, I'm sorry, I thought you meant the Christmas Spectacular. Yeah, the Macy's Parade was, the Thanksgiving Parade was fifty-seven.

• 27:26Speaker 03

  Yeah, so they've got their holiday stuff, their Easter specials, their Christmas specials. They're dancing it, inaugurations for George W. Bush.

• 27:37Speaker 03

  In fact, they came under fire for dancing at Trump's inauguration.

• 27:41Josh Clark?

  Well, the dance troupe almost was split asunder over whether they wanted to do that or not.

• 27:46Speaker 03

  Yeah, it was a big deal.

• 27:47Josh Clark?

  It was a huge deal, actually, and they had revived the Easter extravaganza. They renamed it the New York Spring Spectacular the year before, and they said they took a year off, and I don't think they ever went back to it because of all the controversy over two thousand and sixteen and the inauguration. It was just such an unusual experience for the Rockettes.

• 28:09Josh Clark?

  Like, they're just like America personified, and for there to be a huge national conversation about, you know, them performing at an inauguration, it was a big deal for the organization, for sure, especially for the dancers who are like career Rockettes.

• 28:23Speaker 03

  Yeah, exactly. Should we talk a little bit about just being a Rockette?

• 28:29Josh Clark?

  I think we should, man.

• 28:30Speaker 03

  Because we've done it.

• 28:32Josh Clark?

  We have, I mean, there was a brief time, although we've basically entered Diana Lohan territory now.

• 28:40Speaker 03

  Who's that?

• 28:42Josh Clark?

  Lindsay Lohan's mom, she very famously lied about being a Rockette.

• 28:46Speaker 03

  Oh, really?

• 28:47Josh Clark?

  Yeah, she said that her, she has a background in show business. She was a Rockette for a while and some journalist went and dug around and they found out that she was definitely, they had no record whatsoever of her, under any name, maiden or married, ever being a Rockette.

• 29:04Speaker 03

  It's always amazing to me when very provable or disprovable public lies are told by people like that, or like politicians who say that, you know, like they've fought in a war when they didn't, like that's happened.

• 29:17Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 29:18Speaker 03

  It's just, I don't know why people say things like that, that's like, no, we kinda can go check that really easily.

• 29:24Josh Clark?

  Yeah, even, but even without like, you know, the checkability of it to, to just like, you know, lie in an interview like that to puff yourself up, I guess, it's just, like, I, I don't understand the psychology of it, is it just because you don't feel like you're giving the interviewer enough of what they need, or do they, did they lay some sort of trick that led you into it, or, I don't understand it either.

• 29:47Speaker 03

  Yeah, I wonder if people start to believe these lies, like if you make up a story about yourself and you just stick with it for so long.

• 29:54Josh Clark?

  Mm-hmm.

• 29:55Speaker 03

  It's weird psychology.

• 29:57Josh Clark?

  Yes, human psychology is indeed quite weird.

• 29:59Speaker 03

  Didn't you have a web show called Psychology is Weird?

• 30:03Josh Clark?

  Nuts.

• 30:05Speaker 03

  Psychology is nuts.

• 30:06Josh Clark?

  Mm-hmm. Little, little short-lived video thing.

• 30:08Speaker 03

  Yeah, go check that out, everyone.

• 30:10Josh Clark?

  Oh.

• 30:11Speaker 03

  We'll take a break.

• 30:26Josh Clark?

  Everyone has a story to tell. What's yours? The moment you met your partner, landed that promotion? For people living with a rare disease, life can feel divided into before the diagnosis and all the after moments that follow. On Voices of Vivgard, Vivgard is also known as its generic name, Efgartigimod alfa Fcab. You'll hear powerful stories from people facing challenges and embracing a life with a rare disease.

• 30:50Speaker 03

  Join host Andra Stratten as she guides listeners through honest conversations about life after diagnosis. You'll hear how each guest worked with her care team on their treatment plan, as well as their personal challenges, setbacks, progress, and moments of connection.

• 31:02Josh Clark?

  These stories reveal that life is bigger than a moment, a condition, or a tough day. Listen to Voices of Vivgard on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

• 31:19Josh Clark?

  Buy smart, drive for less, and trade for more. That's Toyota affordability. And it all starts with a great deal on a truck from your local Toyota dealer.

• 31:28Speaker 03

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• 31:41Josh Clark?

  Or discover Toyota's off-road lineup, including the iconic 4Runner and Land Cruiser, designed to go beyond the everyday. And with Toyota's proven reputation for quality and reliability, plus hybrid power on many models, you can get more for every mile and drive for less along the way.

• 31:57Speaker 03

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• 32:21Josh Clark?

  World Mental Health Day takes place in October, and it's really meant to be more than just awareness. It's about actually taking the next step and getting support if you need it.

• 32:31Speaker 03

  But a lot of people still talk themselves out of therapy. They think it's too expensive. They're not sure if it'll actually work. They don't know how to find the right therapist, or they just get overwhelmed trying to navigate the whole system.

• 32:41Josh Clark?

  And that's exactly what Rula is built to fix. Rula makes therapy feel a lot more approachable, a lot more human. You can find a therapist who actually fits your needs, not just whoever's available. And with insurance, sessions average around $15 copay.

• 32:55Speaker 03

  Yeah, you can sign up in just a few minutes. You can get matched with the right provider and even book something as soon as the next day.

• 33:00Josh Clark?

  And it's not just about starting. Rula helps you stay consistent and actually make progress because taking care of your mental health isn't a one-time thing. So if you've been thinking about therapy, don't talk yourself out of it. This is a really easy way to take that first step.

• 33:12Speaker 03

  So turn off the talk track that's keeping you from progress and head to rula.com, that is R-U-L-A dot com, to find a therapist the easy way.

• 33:43Josh Clark?

  And we're back.

• 33:44Speaker 03

  Yes, so we were going to tell everyone about our experience as Rockettes

• 33:50Speaker 03

  because we're Dinah Lohan.

• 33:51Josh Clark?

  So here's the thing. If you're a Rockette and you've been doing this for 10 years, you're a pretty long-lived Rockette. Although I think I saw one woman who is a Rockette. And if I'm talking weird all of a sudden, it's because I am stalling, everybody. Looking for her name and I'm not finding it, but I think it's Lindsay Howe. I'm almost positive her name's Lindsay Howe. I believe she has been a Rockette for 14 years.

• 34:22Speaker 03

  That's a long time.

• 34:23Josh Clark?

  That's a very long time to be a Rockette because as you will soon learn, being a Rockette is extremely difficult and very demanding. And inside of show business and out, they're widely seen as probably some of the best professional dancers in the business. And certainly some of the most disciplined professional dancers in the business as well.

• 34:44Josh Clark?

  But it's really hard to do for a really long time. And one of the main reasons why is because their work schedule is extremely grueling. But, but with Lindsay Howe, she would make the same amount of money that a first year Rockette would make.

• 35:01Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 35:01Josh Clark?

  Because they're all paid the same, they work the same hours, they do the same work. Some of them are kind of promoted as like the faces of the Rockettes. The company, I think Madison Square Garden Company that owns Radio City Music Hall and the Rockettes are really protective of their image. And like they, they aren't free to just kind of talk to the media or whatever. There's some that are kind of like you and you and you, you're the Rockettes. You're the face of the Rockettes. But other than that, everyone does the same amount of work, same amount of hours, same amount of pay. And one of the reasons they do that is because the point of the Rockettes is not to have standouts. It's not like other dance troops or other Broadway troops or anything like that. There's not meant to be stars. The Rockettes are the star and they're meant to be one

• 35:46Josh Clark?

  single unit that moves and works and lives together.

• 35:50Speaker 03

  Yeah, and they're, they're unionized, so they make their, they make most of their money over the holiday season. So they walk out after a couple of months with about 40 grand in their pocket, which isn't bad, you know, for a couple of months' work. But it is, like you said, super grueling. If you want to become a Rockette, you're not required to. But there is something called the Rockette Summer Intensive Dance Program, where you can go, you can enroll, you can spend six hours a day learning, learning everything over the course of about a week. All the choreography, how to, how to get in that shape, stay in that shape, how to prevent injuries.

• 36:34Speaker 03

  And sort of the business of it all.

• 36:37Speaker 03

  Like I said, you don't have to do that, but they do place a lot of Rockettes if you attend that intensive dance program.

• 36:44Josh Clark?

  Well, some. I saw out of a thousand that have taken it, 60 have gone on to actually become Rockettes.

• 36:49Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 36:50Josh Clark?

  Because it's very tough to become a Rockette, too.

• 36:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, and I mean, I get the feeling that's that has less to do with the program than just how hard it is to to make that cut.

• 37:00Josh Clark?

  Right, right, exactly.

• 37:01Speaker 03

  So, not only do you have to be fit enough to kick those famous kicks up to 1,200 times a day through all these shows, but there's one, there's one clothing change. You got to do all these costume changes, but there's one in particular in between the Parade of the Wooden Soldiers and New York at Christmas, that you have to be completely changed out in 78 seconds.

• 37:28Josh Clark?

  78 seconds, and these costumes are not like, super easy to take off. The Wooden Soldier one in particular are pretty complex. So 78 seconds probably goes by extremely fast.

• 37:41Speaker 03

  Yeah, and there's, there's 36 Rockettes total performing onstage, but there are 80 certified Rockettes total overall. You have a morning cast, an afternoon cast, and then you have for each of those shows, you have four swings or extras per. So like if someone's like, "I just twisted my ankle, I can't do this."

• 38:04Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 38:05Speaker 03

  They have four women waiting in the wings for each of those morning and afternoon shows.

• 38:10Josh Clark?

  Yeah. So the thing is, though, is they're working six days a week, or the Rockettes are performing six days a week. If you have two casts, rather than work all, work both casts six days a week, they'll, they'll alternate to give one another a day off. And they'll do that on days sometimes where there's four performances in a day, which means that if you're a Rockette, there are days, and I've seen also sometimes they're back-to-back days, where you're, where you're doing four performances in a single day, four 90-minute performances. And that's when those 1,200 kicks that you mentioned, Chuck, comes in. Because some of those shows have 300 high kicks, and we're talking eye-level kicks.

• 38:52Josh Clark?

  And if you do four of them in a day, you've just kicked at eye level 1,200 times in a day. And from some of the articles I've read, that is about as much as your body can possibly take.

• 39:04Speaker 03

  Yeah, I mean, they they all in the interviews I saw, there was that great New York Times article where they really sort of dive into a day in the life of a Rockette during the holiday season. And they all kind of are like, there's no way to prepare your body for this. Like, we are in the best shape that a dancer can be in. And it just destroys us to the point where like, one of them said that just taking their stockings off at the end of the night is laborious. And, you know, with their commute, depending on where they come from, some of them are are awake and either commuting or or rehearsing or performing 20 hours in a day. Just grueling, grueling stuff.

• 39:44Speaker 03

  But across the board, they also all say that it's the the only job that they want. It is a great sorority and sisterhood and an honor to be one of these, over the years, 3,000 women who have made that cut.

• 40:00Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 40:01Speaker 03

  You know, never like, well, it's really not worth it in the end.

• 40:04Josh Clark?

  Yeah, no, the the, I mean, at least the ones who are allowed to speak to the media certainly have a lot of positive things to say about being a Rockette and like how familial it is and how you're just hanging out with your best friends. And it is a great gig for a dancer, especially as one of these articles pointed out, if you're a dancer who doesn't sing.

• 40:24Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's a rare thing to get that kind of a gig. I think it's one of the few for jazz and tap dancers where singing's not involved.

• 40:32Josh Clark?

  But also, not just like a a good gig, a good paying gig, too. Like 40 grand for a couple of months of performances. A lot of the Rockettes, they don't live in New York. They'll come live in New York during the the the season when they need to rehearse and then do the Christmas spectacular, and then they go home. So they might live in New York from September to the end of December, and then they go back home. And wherever home is, 40 grand probably goes a lot further than it does in New York, unless they live in San Francisco, in which case it's probably, it goes even faster. But it's a really good paying gig. They also have benefits because their union and their contract workers, they Have year round benefits.

• 41:16Speaker 03

  Yeah, that's great.

• 41:17Josh Clark?

  And forty grand. So they can go work as Pilates instructors, as nutritionists, as all the other stuff that they do during the year normally. And then they come back and they they're a Rockette. But what something I thought was pretty cool was even if you're say a tenth year Rockette. You get invited back, like once you're a Rockette, you're in as a Rockette, but you still have to audition in April like everybody else.

• 41:40Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 41:41Josh Clark?

  So you audition in April and if you make the cut. You start to go get in shape and then rehearsals, I think, start in September. And rehearsals are six hours, six days a week for basically the six weeks leading up to the performances, which run from mid-November till. I I saw December thirty first. I also saw tickets available for a January first show, so I don't know if they extended it or not.

• 42:06Speaker 03

  Yeah, and it's it's funny, like it's forty grand, sounds like a lot of money over a couple of months, and it is, but. When you break it down per show, it it breaks down to about a hundred and thirty-five bucks a show.

• 42:15Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 42:15Speaker 03

  Which all of a sudden it doesn't seem.

• 42:19Speaker 03

  Like great money.

• 42:20Josh Clark?

  No, but that's what you make as a standard cast member for a Broadway union dancer.

• 42:26Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:27Josh Clark?

  Or actor or variety performer, I think, is the they're they're part of. So, no, it doesn't seem like much, but. That's another reason why the Rockette gig is so good. You get overtime on those days when you do a third and a fourth show. You're getting overtime pay. And there's multiple shows in in on multiple days, so you can. I mean, if a a another actor at a different gig, working the same. Days over the same period would not make that amount of money, that forty grand, because they wouldn't have any overtime, they wouldn't have that many shows.

• 43:00Speaker 03

  Yeah, and I don't think anyone like dreams of going to Broadway to become rich and wealthy. Like, part of the allure of Broadway is you're with the best of the best and. You can say, I danced, or I sang, or I acted on Broadway.

• 43:14Josh Clark?

  With Bryan Cranston.

• 43:16Speaker 03

  I saw him on Broadway.

• 43:17Josh Clark?

  Yeah, I saw Michael McKeon on Broadway.

• 43:20Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah.

• 43:21Josh Clark?

  An accomplice. The audience was the accomplice. That was the big twist.

• 43:25Speaker 03

  Oh, well, you just ruined that one.

• 43:28Josh Clark?

  Was it good? It was great. It was one of the greatest stage performances I've ever seen. I saw Lenny live onstage.

• 43:38Speaker 03

  Derek St. Hubbins.

• 43:40Josh Clark?

  Yeah, this is before I knew him as anything but Lenny. I was like eight.

• 43:44Speaker 03

  Oh, so this is a while ago.

• 43:45Josh Clark?

  Mm hmm.

• 43:48Speaker 03

  Cranston is in something new on Broadway now, I think, too.

• 43:51Josh Clark?

  He's in Network.

• 43:51Speaker 03

  Right. Oh, man, I want to see that.

• 43:54Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 43:54Speaker 03

  I bet that's good.

• 43:55Josh Clark?

  I saw that it was described as, get this, Chuck, get ready for this.

• 43:59Speaker 03

  Oh, boy.

• 44:00Josh Clark?

  Electrifying.

• 44:02Speaker 03

  Really?

• 44:03Josh Clark?

  A kid.

• 44:03Speaker 03

  A Broadway show described as electrifying?

• 44:05Josh Clark?

  His performance was electrifying.

• 44:07Speaker 03

  I don't think I've ever heard that word used for the theater.

• 44:12Speaker 03

  So another thing, though, about the Rockettes, even though they do make most of their money over those couple of months, and then they have the rest of the year to, in a lot of cases, be like a dance instructor or something like that, or a fitness instructor.

• 44:26Speaker 03

  They increasingly are working more and more, more and more months out of the year, whether it's as ambassadors for the Rockettes or doing like video things for YouTube. They are increasingly called on to do other, other things.

• 44:43Josh Clark?

  Yeah, a lot. So what is the woman who came along as the lead choreographer and director and really kind of punched, punched it up even further? Her name is Linda Haberman, and she took over, I think, in like the mid 2000s, maybe 2008. And she kind of brought like this whole new, not new, it's not a whole new thing. She just kind of, she made it a little more pro feminist, a little more like you go girl kind of vibe to the Rockettes than they had before. They were seen, you know, rehearsing in the rehearsal gear rather than like full costume. And it was just kind of like, the intent I get was to make them more.

• 45:26Speaker 03

  People?

• 45:27Josh Clark?

  Yes. Yes, because one of the great criticisms of the Rockettes is that they're nothing but like teeth and legs, just a bunch of women.

• 45:35Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 45:35Josh Clark?

  Uh, out there kicking, like forming one large uber woman who can kick her legs amazingly high and has like the, the whitest gleamingest teeth ever you've ever seen. Um, and that, that it was really kind of a just objectification of women like to, like by definition. And, uh, Linda Haberman like really kind of took that and, and tried to unravel it quite a bit. And she also took the show. So we should talk a little bit about the show. It's a, it's depending on who you are, it's either like just beloved traditional Americana, kitschy, um, offensively sexist, who knows? But I think the first two are kind of the predominant views of it.

• 46:19Josh Clark?

  It's kitschy and sweet, or it's, it's, you know, endearing Americana. Um, and Linda Haberman kind of took that and tried to punch it up into the 21st century a little more. And there's like way more visual effects than there were before. Um, there's like a 3D component, I think, to this year's show or, or recent year's shows. Like the whole, the whole theme is like a girl wants a video game and her mom is kind of showing her, um, you know, why that's not so great because it's a violent video game. There's, um, there's a lot of kind of updating that's, that the Rockettes have undergone in the last few years, and that was largely from what I understand Linda Haberman's doing.

• 46:57Speaker 03

  I think she was the one that, uh, digitally inserted John McClane from Die Hard.

• 47:01Josh Clark?

  She was. He swoops in in the, the New York folly section.

• 47:06Speaker 03

  No, I'm glad they updated things because this was a, a prime case of like a beloved American tradition that, uh, could use some refreshing and, and you can highlight them as humans and individuals and still you can have both, you know? And you can still have that desired effect of uniformity and precision that they're known for, you know?

• 47:27Josh Clark?

  Right, exactly.

• 47:28Speaker 03

  But they don't have to be just like faceless and nameless, you know?

• 47:32Josh Clark?

  No. And I read a few like feminist critiques of the Rockettes and they seem to have been... Kind of outdated. Like, I really feel like Linda Haberman

• 47:42Speaker 03

  She did it.

• 47:43Josh Clark?

  Did a good job at like, yeah, she, she kind of took those, those critiques and, and changed them in a lot of ways.

• 47:49Speaker 03

  That's great.

• 47:50Josh Clark?

  Um, one of the other criticisms is that it wasn't until 1985 that the Rockettes had their first woman of color as a member of the, their cast, of their troupe.

• 48:01Speaker 03

  Oh, yeah?

• 48:01Josh Clark?

  The first woman of color was a Japanese woman named Setsuko Marahashi. And in 1985, she joined. In 1988, um, the first African-American woman joined. Her name was Jennifer Jones. And the reasoning, apparently it was Mark, uh, Markert, who was like, no. From all I saw, it had nothing to do with racism. It was the idea that it was going to disrupt the visual unity

• 48:29Speaker 03

  Right.

• 48:29Josh Clark?

  of the dance line. If there were, um, you know, differing skin colors in this dance line. And apparently he was so, um, nutso about it. Like, you, you would get in trouble if you had a suntan. Like, that's how, that's how, he wanted everything to be homogeneous and in unison. Well, regardless, in the 21st century, in the late 20th century, that, that sentiment didn't hold up. And I guess shortly after he died is when they started, um, adding women of color more to the Rockettes troupe.

• 48:59Speaker 03

  Yeah. And then they saw people of color in that same dance line and they went, oh, it's still awesome and synchronized and looks great.

• 49:06Josh Clark?

  Exactly.

• 49:07Speaker 03

  And from his grave, he went, no.

• 49:09Josh Clark?

  He started rolling around in it.

• 49:12Speaker 03

  Oh, goodness.

• 49:13Josh Clark?

  So you haven't seen a Rockettes Christmas spectacular, huh?

• 49:17Speaker 03

  You mean live in person?

• 49:18Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 49:19Speaker 03

  I have not.

• 49:19Josh Clark?

  I have not either. Are we going to go now?

• 49:22Speaker 03

  I think we should. I want to know if any Rockettes listen to this show.

• 49:26Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 49:26Speaker 03

  That would make me super, super happy.

• 49:28Josh Clark?

  It would for me as well.

• 49:30Speaker 03

  Uh, and the only other small tidbit I have is they have microphones in their heels of their shoes.

• 49:35Josh Clark?

  I saw that too. They used to, they used to play recordings of their, um, tapping, right?

• 49:42Speaker 03

  Oh, I don't know. That, that does not surprise me.

• 49:45Josh Clark?

  Yeah. And then they figured out how to do the actual, like, broadcast the actual tapping. So, we're gonna go, one day Chuck, we're gonna go see the Christmas spectacular, we're gonna go see the live nativity with the real camel and donkeys and the wooden toy soldier, um, march where they fall down like a domino in slow motion. It's pretty amazing stuff. Uh, and if you want to know more about the Rockettes, then go to Radio City Music Hall and find them there. How about that?

• 50:13Speaker 03

  That sounds great.

• 50:14Josh Clark?

  Uh, well, since I said that, then it's time for Listener Mail.

• 50:18Speaker 03

  Uh, I'm calling this, "I Was A Search And Rescue, Um, Victim Volunteer." So, this guy, his dad, I'm gonna summarize the beginning of it, um, cause it's kinda long, but his dad lives in, uh, the Upper Peninsula of Michigan and is a member of the local, uh, SAR team. And so, they were like, "We need someone to play the victim here." And he was like, "I'll do it." This guy's son. So, here's what happened. He set off into the heavily wooded area and did, he said, "I did everything I could to think of to try and fool the dog and the handler. I ran in circles, went back over my own trail, I threw off my hat, I even found some garbage and rolled around in it to mask my scent."

• 51:00Josh Clark?

  Wow.

• 51:01Speaker 03

  Uh, "Once I had done everything I could think of to try and fool the dog and handler that would be tracking me, I found a nice comfy spot up, uh, in a bush on a hill where I could just watch the dog and the handler try and track me. I thought I'd done a pretty good job, but once I called the handler and let him know I was in position, it was all over very quickly. Uh, I sat back and everyone was shocked to watch the dog basically retrace my trail, step by step, uh, every move I made, all those circles, uh, finding my hat even, that I'd thrown off, even getting into that pile of garbage that I'd rolled around in." I love that this dog is just basically making a fool of poor Ryan up there in the mountains.

• 51:44Speaker 03

  So, he said, "Needless to say, the dog found me in short order. Uh, I gave him lots of praise, uh, for the great job he had done. Thankfully, I was never in any real danger, so my experience, uh, was a lot more enjoyable, obviously, than when people are in, uh, real need of a search, uh, search and rescue dog." Uh, thanks for the great episodes, guys. Keep me company on overnight shifts. And make it all go by quicker. So if you read this on the show, can I get a shout out to my girlfriend, Taryn? She would be thrilled to hear her name get called out on the show.

• 52:15Josh Clark?

  I think that just happened.

• 52:16Speaker 03

  Yep. So that is from Ryan. I like the gusto that Ryan put into trying to fool this dog.

• 52:23Josh Clark?

  Rolling in garbage.

• 52:24Speaker 03

  And I equally love that this dog was like, whatever. So, thank you, Ryan. Thank you, Taryn, for listening.

• 52:31Josh Clark?

  And thank you to the sar dog.

• 52:33Speaker 03

  Sure. Scruffy.

• 52:34Josh Clark?

  If you want to get in touch with us, you can go to our website, stuffyoushouldknow.com. You can find all of our social links there. And you can send an email to chuck, jerry, and me at [email protected].

• 52:50Speaker 04

  Stuff You Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts, iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

• 53:06Josh Clark?

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