Short Stuff: Death Cap Mushroom

The death cap mushroom lives up to its name. It’s a mushroom cap that causes death. Find out why. See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:04Josh Clark?

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• 1:58Speaker 02

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• 2:09Josh Clark?

  Hey, and welcome to the short stuff. Josh here, Chuck here, Jerry No here, Dave No here. That's okay, because like I said, it's the short stuff.

• 2:18Speaker 04

  Good evening, everyone. We are Deathcap Mushroom.

• 2:22Josh Clark?

  Yeah, that's a great one.

• 2:23Speaker 04

  It's a metal band, right?

• 2:24Josh Clark?

  For sure. Even just Deathcap would work, too. Deathcap for Cutie even would be cool.

• 2:30Speaker 04

  Oh, man. I like those guys.

• 2:32Josh Clark?

  Yeah, they're great. Did you like Postal Service?

• 2:35Speaker 04

  I love the Postal Service more than Deathcap.

• 2:38Josh Clark?

  It's just the one dude from Deathcap, right? Isn't his solo project?

• 2:43Speaker 04

  Not solo. Ben Gibbard, he linked up with someone else. It's like him and another guy. I can't remember the other guy. But, man, I love that Postal Service record.

• 2:50Josh Clark?

  Okay, good, good. I'm glad you did. I'm glad they made it, then.

• 2:53Speaker 04

  Me, too.

• 2:54Josh Clark?

  So, we're not talking about Deathcap for Cutie. We're talking about Deathcap Mushrooms Not For You, I think, is the main message here.

• 3:01Speaker 04

  Not for Cuties or anyone?

• 3:03Josh Clark?

  No. And the reason they call it Deathcap Mushroom is because it can kill you if you eat it. It's not necessarily an automatic death sentence, but apparently the fatality rate from eating this mushroom is 10 to 15%. Of people who eat it, die.

• 3:21Speaker 04

  That's, that's, in this House of Works article, they're like, you know, that's pretty low. I'm like, not to me.

• 3:26Josh Clark?

  No, that's, I mean, that's really high. Look at white button mushrooms, buddy. It's almost like zero. And I think the people who do die from eating white button mushrooms ate too many at once and choked to death.

• 3:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, this is why I don't eat mushrooms at all.

• 3:42Josh Clark?

  Oh, you don't, huh?

• 3:43Speaker 04

  No, it's a texture thing. They're too slimy for me. I've tried.

• 3:46Josh Clark?

  Oh, no. You gotta wash the slime off. And I'm not expecting you to actually try this, but I know exactly what you're talking about. You wash the slime off, you dry it, you lick the top of it, put some salt on it, and eat it raw. And it's got a nice sturdy crunch almost to it, and I love those.

• 4:04Speaker 04

  You know what's funny? I don't think I've ever mentioned not liking eating something where you didn't say, no, no, no, you're just doing it wrong.

• 4:12Josh Clark?

  I like eating everything.

• 4:14Speaker 04

  All right, so there was an outbreak in 2016 in the Bay Area of San Francisco where 14 people consumed, well, the death cap mushroom.

• 4:24Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 4:24Speaker 04

  Got really, really sick. One very sad story of a child suffered permanent neurological damage. And the question is like, how did these things get here? Because they did not originate here. That's one of the questions.

• 4:37Josh Clark?

  Are you setting me up to answer it?

• 4:40Speaker 04

  Well, sure. Do you have the answer? Because I do.

• 4:43Josh Clark?

  I have a general answer. Apparently, so it's a ectomycorrhizal fungus that engages in symbiotic relationships, mutualism, with specific kinds of trees. And in Europe, they're typically beech trees or oak trees. And it lives in the roots, the main part of the fungus. And it trades nitrogen that the mushroom draws from the soil to the oak or the beech tree in exchange for sugars and water and carbon. And they do this by basically connecting their roots to the tree roots. And everybody's happy until you come along and eat one of the death caps.

• 5:23Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think we did a whole episode on mutualism, didn't we?

• 5:26Josh Clark?

  Surely we did.

• 5:27Speaker 04

  Or symbiosis or something.

• 5:28Josh Clark?

  Yeah. But I didn't answer your question. The answer seems to be that somebody imported a tree from Europe at some point.

• 5:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 5:36Josh Clark?

  That had a death cap mushroom, mycorrhiza, in its roots. And surprise, death cap mushrooms are in North America.

• 5:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, and they know that it wasn't a native species because, you know, that could be possible, that there's just like a California, North America version.

• 5:53Josh Clark?

  Sure.

• 5:54Speaker 04

  But it would be genetically different somehow. But the ones that we have over here are exactly the same. It's the same mushroom. I think the first known sightings were in 1938 at the Del Monte Hotel in California. There's a lot of these in California.

• 6:08Josh Clark?

  Yeah.

• 6:09Speaker 04

  And then five, six, seven, eight years later, at the Cal Berkeley campus. And now they're kind of all over the place. They're on the East Coast. They live in the pines in the East Coast. But those oaks on the West Coast, all the way up to Vancouver, I believe, but they've also found them outside of Europe in Western Russia, southern Scandinavian coasts and North Africa.

• 6:34Josh Clark?

  Yeah, they go, I think also on the West Coast of the United States, they grow all the way down to LA County.

• 6:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:40Josh Clark?

  Which is how Cheech Marin accidentally ate one.

• 6:43Speaker 04

  Oh, did he really? Or is that a joke?

• 6:45Josh Clark?

  That is a joke.

• 6:46Speaker 04

  Ah!

• 6:47Josh Clark?

  I'm sorry.

• 6:48Speaker 04

  So mad at you.

• 6:49Josh Clark?

  You could have said like, I know it was.

• 6:53Josh Clark?

  You have to say it really weird like that.

• 6:55Speaker 04

  Seems so likely that Cheech Marin might have accidentally eaten one of these.

• 6:58Josh Clark?

  I think he kind of went straight with that whole Nash Bridges gig that he got. And Tommy Chong is like, no, man, I still eat whatever I find on the ground.

• 7:08Speaker 04

  Speaking of Nash Bridges, and maybe I shouldn't say this, I'll tell you off air.

• 7:12Josh Clark?

  Oh, I can't wait. Is it about Don Johnson?

• 7:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:14Josh Clark?

  Okay.

• 7:16Speaker 04

  All right. So should we take a break or should we talk a little bit more about it?

• 7:19Josh Clark?

  Let's take a break.

• 7:21Speaker 04

  All right, we'll be right back with more on this death cap mushroom.

• 7:39Speaker 04

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• 8:42Speaker 04

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• 8:54Josh Clark?

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• 9:52Speaker 04

  All right, we're back. And this is something I don't fully understand, but the death cap mushroom is an invasive species in California, where it grows in very beautiful woodlands and forests. It is not considered such on the East Coast, where it grows in more urban settings, like urban parks. But it still could be invasive. Like, I don't understand what the death is.

• 10:10Josh Clark?

  It's very easily contained in an urban area. You've got your park, but then, you know, you say like, "Hey mushroom, try to, try to spread from this park."

• 10:20Speaker 04

  Jump that street?

• 10:21Josh Clark?

  Yeah. Deal with this sidewalk, then the street, then the sidewalk, then the building, then another sidewalk, then the street, then a sidewalk, then a sidewalk, then a sidewalk, then a sidewalk. And the mushroom goes, "Okay, fine, I'll just stay here."

• 10:32Speaker 04

  All right. So I guess I just didn't fully-

• 10:34Josh Clark?

  Does that make sense?

• 10:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, I guess I didn't fully understand what invasive meant. I thought invasive just meant if it was there and not great for the area, it didn't mean it had to be like, super widespread.

• 10:43Josh Clark?

  I didn't either, but that's what I took from this description of it. So that's my take, I should say. That's not like the-

• 10:49Speaker 04

  I thought that was a quote.

• 10:51Josh Clark?

  It was, of Anne Pringle, the Letters in Science Rubinstein Professor of Botany and Bacteriology at the University of Madison, Wisconsin.

• 10:59Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 11:01Speaker 04

  Look at you.

• 11:02Josh Clark?

  Yeah, we should say shout out to How Stuff Works for helping us with this article by writing it, and they interviewed Professor Pringle about this, and she was very helpful.

• 11:13Speaker 04

  Yeah, there's a couple of toxins when it comes to the death cap. One of them is a phthalatoxin, and you're talking, you know, what you would expect, dehydration, diarrhea, vomiting, nausea, but eventually electrolyte imbalances and kidney damage. But the really bad booger in there is amatoxin, and that will stop cell function. It targets a transcription of RNA by RNA polymerase 2, which we've talked about before. And that basically causes cell death. It prevents the cell from making the proteins and cell components that it needs to be a cell.

• 11:52Josh Clark?

  Right. So that's always bad, and apparently it goes very quickly to your liver and just starts destroying your liver. And apparently, people go to the emergency room, sick on, basically, after eating a death cap mushroom, will find that the doctors want to give them a liver transplant if one is available.

• 12:11Speaker 04

  Oh, wow.

• 12:12Josh Clark?

  That's how bad it can get. And one of the reasons why it can get so bad is because after the initial, like, nausea and vomiting and horrible, like, I shouldn't have eaten that mushroom that I found in that field sensation, it goes away. And you think that you're fine, but actually, in reality, that amatoxin is just destroying your body, and then by the time you start to feel those effects, you're in really big trouble.

• 12:38Speaker 04

  Isn't liver one of the longer waits? Or am I making that up?

• 12:42Josh Clark?

  Longer waits?

• 12:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, wait, W A I T S for transplant.

• 12:48Josh Clark?

  I don't know. No, I don't think so, because you can cut off, like, a chunk of your liver and donate it, because I don't know if it grows back or else it, just a little bit can perform a lot of function. One of those.

• 12:59Speaker 04

  I'm thinking kidneys.

• 13:01Josh Clark?

  No, I don't think, I don't think so. I think it's liver.

• 13:05Speaker 04

  All the organs are readily available.

• 13:08Josh Clark?

  Right.

• 13:08Speaker 04

  For transplanting?

• 13:09Josh Clark?

  For sure. I mean, it's so easy to get. When you just walk in and they try to give you two livers most of the time.

• 13:15Speaker 04

  I could have, maybe this is a while ago, I could have sworn I read reports of like, people dying on the liver transplant list.

• 13:21Josh Clark?

  Oh, I believe it, but I don't think that, I don't think liver's the least available.

• 13:25Speaker 04

  Okay, I got you.

• 13:26Josh Clark?

  But I could be wrong, but I, yeah, I think everybody dies on the organ transplant list waiting. Or I should say, not everybody on the list dies, but I'm saying for any organ, there are people dying on the waitlist.

• 13:38Speaker 04

  I got you. Yeah, boy, that's a nice correction. So the takeaway from this is don't eat the death cap mushroom at all. You need to, and if you're a forager, you really gotta know what you're doing. You shouldn't be like, hey, I saw this on Top Chef, like I can go out in the woods and just pick stuff and eat it. You gotta be really familiar with the fungi where you are, and if you aren't, just don't try it. Don't risk it. It's not worth it.

• 14:02Josh Clark?

  No, I think we should issue a general COA for us here. Don't, even if you think you are familiar with your local mushrooms, don't try it. We are not telling you under any circumstances to go try this. Okay?

• 14:14Speaker 04

  I think foraging is wonderful, but, so I'm not gonna say that personally.

• 14:19Josh Clark?

  Well, I'm saying.

• 14:20Speaker 04

  You're welcome to. Just know what, just know what you're doing.

• 14:23Josh Clark?

  Tort reform now.

• 14:28Speaker 04

  There are all kinds of resources, if you're interested in stuff like that, that can very clearly tell you, like, what's safe and what isn't, but you should still take a buddy who's done it before, I think. You can identify, according to Dr. Pringle, who can't eat just one. It has olivaceous with coloring with green tinge, and a mature death cap has a brown, brown striations on the cap.

• 14:53Josh Clark?

  And don't forget fairy rings around the stem, which.

• 14:56Speaker 04

  Who can forget the fairy rings?

• 14:57Josh Clark?

  Right. Goes without saying that that's just a bunch of fairies forming a circle by holding hands.

• 15:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 15:04Josh Clark?

  So I saw one of the things Chuck about this, the reason why people eat these is because they taste good.

• 15:11Speaker 04

  Oh, interesting.

• 15:12Josh Clark?

  So people are caught by surprise when all of a sudden they start puking because the fact that it tasted good, I think, indicated to them that this is fine to eat.

• 15:21Speaker 04

  Well, you know who's never gonna get sick by eating a bad mushroom?

• 15:23Josh Clark?

  I do.

• 15:24Speaker 04

  And has two thumbs and is podcasting with you right now?

• 15:27Josh Clark?

  I do.

• 15:28Speaker 04

  This guy right here.

• 15:29Josh Clark?

  Oh, that's not who I was gonna say.

• 15:30Speaker 04

  Oh, Cheech Marin?

• 15:33Josh Clark?

  You got anything else? I got nothing else. George's stuff is out.

• 15:40Speaker 00

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• 15:56Speaker 02

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• 16:12Speaker 03

  Zepbound is a prescription medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, OSA, and obesity to improve their OSA. Zepbound is approved as a 2.5, 5, 7.5, 10, 12.5, or 15-milligram injection. Zepbound contains trisepotide and should not be used with other trisepotide-containing products or any GLP-1 receptor agonist medicines. It is not known if Zepbound is safe and effective for use in children. Don't share needles or pens, or reuse needles. Don't take if allergic to it, or if you or someone in your family had medullary thyroid cancer, or if you've had multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. Tell your doctor if you get a lump or swelling in your neck. Stop Zepbound and call your doctor if you have severe stomach pain or a serious allergic reaction.

• 16:57Speaker 03

  Severe side effects may include inflamed pancreas or gallbladder problems. Tell your doctor if you experience vision changes before scheduled procedures with anesthesia, if you're nursing, pregnant, plan to be, or taking birth control pills. Taking Zepbound with a sulphonal urea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. Side effects include nausea, diarrhea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and worsen kidney problems.

• 17:19Speaker 02

  Talk to your doctor. Call 1-800-545-5979, or visit zepbound.lily.com.

• 17:26Speaker 00

  This is an iHeart Podcast. Guaranteed Human.