Why Mark Nawaqanitawase Is Leaving the Roosters After Winning It All

Mark Nawaqanitawase stood on Bronte Road as a fan in 2019, looking up at the Roosters on the Leagues Club balcony. 7 years later he was up there with the premiership. Mark sits down with Mark Bouris to talk about the grand final, his journey to league, his childhood growing up in Burwood, where he gets his skills from, why he’s heading to Japan, and the choice ahead of him for next year’s Rugby World Cup: Australia, Fiji or Italy? For more content like this: Subscribe to the Mentored newsletter here: https://the-mentored-platform-pty-ltd.myklpages.com/l/WWJGc5 Join our exclusive Mentored community: https://mentored.com.au Executive Producer: Samuel Morgan Head of Production: Jonah Mclachlan See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Mark Nawanga Tinawazi. Did I get that right?

• 0:03Speaker 01

  Pretty much, yeah.

• 0:04Speaker 00

  Pretty close, pretty close. Marky Mark. How you going, mate?

• 0:07Speaker 01

  Not too bad.

• 0:08Speaker 00

  Welcome to Straight Talk.

• 0:09Speaker 01

  Thank you very much.

• 0:10Speaker 00

  Congratulations.

• 0:11Speaker 01

  Congratulations.

• 0:12Speaker 00

  No, mate, no, I didn't do any, I just watched. Congratulations on, on everything, by the way. Like, congratulations on the furor you've created around, you know, your playing style of football, the pleasure you bring to everybody who watches the game of football, the media just dining out on you immensely because you do some of these crazy stuff that is just perfect for the media. I mean, they must be loving you. Every time I, I, mate, I, I don't know whether the algorithm works out that I'm a Roosters supporter or whatever, and I'm just getting flooded with stuff about you. It's just coming one, even where people put your face on other people's faces and stuff like that is crazy. Have you seen this sort of as mental?

• 0:55Speaker 01

  It's honestly, it's, yeah, it's been crazy.

• 1:00Speaker 01

  I can't believe, like you said, some of the AI stuff that's, that's been going out there has been wild.

• 1:06Speaker 01

  But yeah, it just seems to be at the moment, everywhere you look.

• 1:09Speaker 00

  Can I tell you something funny? So the other day, Nick and I were talking about, Nick Politis and I were talking about you, and this is before the grand final, and we're just, we're talking about a whole lot of things about, you know, you leaving and, you know, how do we get you back and all that sort of stuff. As we do, Nick and I walk every Saturday for an hour or two and we talk about everything to do with the club and other stuff as well, but everything about our players, our team, everything. And this was just as the quarterfinals were starting, just right at the beginning of the playoffs. And I said to him, Mark's not only popular, and I don't want to embarrass you, but Mark's not only popular with footy supporters and Roosters supporters, but like, the women love him.

• 1:54Speaker 00

  And I said, you know, how can you just be born like that? You're a bit like Sunny Bill, like, you know, everything's perfect, you know, like, like, it's like you've been shaped by the gods or something at Mount Olympus, but, and that was what I said to Nick. And I said, but you know what?

• 2:09Speaker 00

  I keep thinking how Mark looks like Tom Jones when Tom Jones was young. And I don't even know if you know who Tom Jones is.

• 2:15Speaker 01

  I'm not aware of Tom Jones.

• 2:17Speaker 00

  Okay, do you know, I'm looking at our producer, there's also a young guy. Well, anyone who's listening, Google or however you look these things up, whatever search engine you use, look up Tom Jones, the Welsh singer, who lived in America for a long time. One of the most famous singers of the seventies and eighties. And he was an absolute heartthrob on the stage, like an absolute heartthrob. Like, women would actually take their underwear off and throw it at him on the stage. And, and Mark, you are, no joke, a dead ringer for him in your face. And so I, I just, I wanted to leave you with that. I had to say it. Look up Tom Jones. I guarantee you'll agree with me. So mate, how do you feel after the grand final?

• 3:00Speaker 00

  Like, I mean, obviously we won the premiership, the boys and the girls, fantastic for the Roosters. But how do you feel personally, like as a life goal at your young age?

• 3:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh mate, it's been, it's been, it's been a crazy week. Obviously, you know, we've had a lot on to do with the grand final. But it's, it's been both amazing and sad, I guess, for some players.

• 3:27Speaker 01

  But yeah, for me personally, I've, you know, I've enjoyed all my moments in the NRL. But yeah, to win the premiership with the Roosters, it was a pretty surreal feeling that night, going up to the balcony at the Leagues Club.

• 3:43Speaker 00

  Overlooking the street where all the fans were.

• 3:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's funny, not many people know this, but literally six, seven years ago, 2018, 2019.

• 3:51Speaker 00

  I know this story, actually, go on.

• 3:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's that one, I was actually down there.

• 3:55Speaker 00

  As a fan?

• 3:56Speaker 01

  As a fan, looking up and I was, I'd love to be up there one day.

• 3:59Speaker 00

  Standing in Bronte Road?

• 4:01Speaker 01

  Standing, yep, standing there. And then actually, what happens? The announcer goes, oh, can everyone give three cheers to Nick Politis? And then everyone just starts turning around. I'm like, what's happening here? And he's standing right next to me. And Nick was right there. And then, yeah, to, to be up there the other night and, you know, Nick was up there as well, was a pretty special moment. You know, something I won't ever forget. But like I said, it's a proud moment because I, I feel like I, I could see myself, you know, getting there one day.

• 4:33Speaker 00

  How old were you then?

• 4:35Speaker 01

  I was 18, yeah, 18 or 19, yeah.

• 4:38Speaker 00

  And you went there, that was after the 19 or 18 grand final?

• 4:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think the one, when he was down there was a 19.

• 4:45Speaker 00

  Grand final, yeah.

• 4:45Speaker 01

  19 grand final. So, mate, I still remember rushing into my car and driving as quick as I could to Bondi. You know, my, my best mates are massive Roosters supporters and I was converted. Chris Georges, Matt Georges, lovely Lebanese family.

• 5:02Speaker 00

  Johnny Georges' kids.

• 5:03Speaker 01

  Johnny Georges' kids. So, yeah, we rushed out there and, yeah, wanted to get there in time to see, see the boys pull the trophy.

• 5:11Speaker 00

  So you, you're a mad Roosters, like, because if, if you're an equivalent supporter of them, they are literally the maddest Roosters supporters.

• 5:19Speaker 01

  See, they're pretty much a lot. Yeah, you could, honestly, you could thank them for, for switching me over to the Roosters.

• 5:26Speaker 00

  It's pretty mad.

• 5:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, they, you know, quite early on, I actually went for the West Tigers, growing up with my family. And then I met, I met Chris in, what, year nine, year 10? And they brought me to, to a lot of games for the Roosters and I just, you know, I had to turn, especially when Sunny Bill was around again the second time. And yeah, it was, yeah, it was amazing. And then they won the two premierships and I was like, oh, thank God I switched over.

• 5:51Speaker 00

  When, when, last, not this, not 26 season, but 25 season, I think you scored the most tries of a winger in a season for that year in 25?

• 6:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, I won the, the Ken Irvine try scoring medal that, that year, yeah.

• 6:06Speaker 00

  Ken Irvine, Ken Irvine being a prolific winger, try scorer. And did you think at that stage going into 26, that we had the side to win the comp? Or did you just think it's going to be hard grind, we'll see what we get there? Were you really confident?

• 6:22Speaker 01

  Ah, yes, I'm going to say it. And I don't mean to be arrogant, but I, I believed we did. I actually thought we would do pretty well last year.

• 6:29Speaker 00

  In 25, yeah.

• 6:30Speaker 01

  In 25, you know, to go out early against the Sharks, I was pretty gutted because I thought, I thought we built a really good team, you know, early on, a lot of people doubted us, but, you know, what I could see and what I was feeling as we were going, I thought, you know, well, we could actually do something here. So I had a lot of confidence going into this year, you know, with, with the team that we had, the style that Robbo was, you know, had, had pushed on us and just the belief we all had with each other, it was a good feeling and

• 7:02Speaker 01

  I, we, we got it done, so.

• 7:04Speaker 00

  And can, could you share with us, because, I mean, I happen to know this, because I'm a good mate of Robbo and he's explained it to me, but do you mind sharing with us something that most people don't know? Was Robbo's discussion with you as a team

• 7:23Speaker 00

  about this concept of being a warrior?

• 7:28Speaker 00

  But also where, where he talks about Holloway, Max Holloway, the, the famous UFC fighter, and his fight against Gagey, where Holloway stands in the middle of the ring, I think it might have been the last round, and basically says to Gagey, who's a great UFC fighter, so let's throw it down now and let's just go toe to toe. That process, I mean, I don't know what they call it, but there's, there's a word for it. But what was Robbo trying to explain to you guys and get you guys to start to own?

• 8:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, obviously we had a few themes throughout the year, but I guess the, the Max Holloway fight was a big one for us, especially at that moment. It pretty much, it came down towards, obviously, the last round for Max Holloway. And you see him, you know, point to the centre of the, of the, of the octagon.

• 8:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 8:21Speaker 01

  You know, for us, we use that as a, you know, as a component or as a motivation to, you know, call the other teams into the centre and, once they get into the centre, they just start throwing hands at each other. No blocking, just literally just.

• 8:38Speaker 00

  Toe to toe.

• 8:39Speaker 01

  Toe to toe. So we had the mentality, if we called a team to the centre and we go toe to toe, you know, we felt we could, you know, first it's respect, but at the same time, you know, we, we can go all the way.

• 8:53Speaker 00

  Is it like total belief?

• 8:55Speaker 01

  Total belief, 100%. You know, belief in each other, belief in our system and, yeah, just again, calling them out to the centre and having to dig.

• 9:06Speaker 00

  And that's interesting because, you know, we, we had the reputation from last year in 2025 as probably having, being, having the most errors in a statistical sense. And it's, it's slightly a function of the style of footy we play. We have live ball, it's sort of a function of the footy we play. And you can't really, when you play that style of footy, you can't really go back to, you could go and play like Penrith or Melbourne do, but they don't throw the ball around. I mean, and I don't want, no disrespect for those clubs, but it's a bit boring. But we have a team like guys like you and Toops and all the other players in the side who can score tries from various places, but you've got to get the ball to them. So live ball sort of sometimes means you, you can have a bit of loose ball.

• 9:52Speaker 00

  You can, you can make some mistakes. But I remember Robbo saying to me, Mark, it's not so much when we make a mistake, it's our response to the mistake. So drop the ball, 10 metres out from our try line, they get possession back or they get six again. How important is that process of believing in yourselves that, okay, we made a mistake, but we're now going to, we're now going to put it back on them?

• 10:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, it's, it's huge. And, you know, for us, I think that's what won us the comp. You know, we were down in a lot of circumstances in some games, but I know for a fact, we had a lot of belief, even if we did lose the ball, if we, we were going to defend the next set, no matter what, even if it was six against right on our line.

• 10:42Speaker 01

  We just had that confidence and belief in, in our system and each other that we'll defend it right. And we can do, we can stop anything and we can, can just go again, which is similar to what you said, that, you know, the Max Holloway part, just stepping in the middle, no matter what, and just keep going, keep fighting, believing what you, you know, and it will, it will work out.

• 11:04Speaker 00

  Because it's funny, it's a belief system. So, and the more you do it, then you start to believe it more because you're sort of confirming the belief in your mind. But it starts from somewhere.

• 11:16Speaker 00

  How good is Robbo at this sort of stuff? I mean, how good is he?

• 11:19Speaker 01

  The best.

• 11:20Speaker 00

  Getting in your head?

• 11:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 11:21Speaker 00

  And I don't mean, it's not like a fake thing. He actually believes it too.

• 11:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. The way he can put a team together, um, you know, through, through our minds, um, you know, a big thing's culture, right? Um, and I reckon this ties into the culture in terms of, um, you know, creating that belief with each other. Um, and Robbo is massive on it, um, in terms of, you know, thinking outside the box with certain, you know, um, certain, or clips of, of Max Holloway or different themes, um, you know, to, to bring us together. Well, and, and yeah, he just, he's a, I don't know, he's a wizard. Like it just, you can feel, you can feel where we go from the start of the year to, to where we were at the end, just through his, um, you know, his mindset and, um, you know, the way he makes us think.

• 12:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, he's, he's honestly one of the best coaches.

• 12:14Speaker 00

  Does he say, I don't know, the week before, ring you up or re, ring each player up or text them and say, look, I've been thinking about something and connect with you. Does, is that something that happens or he just lets you live your own life and all the, all the activity actually happens at training? How, how does he connect with individuals, like in your case?

• 12:32Speaker 01

  I think for everyone's different. Um, so like some boys he might connect with outside of footy. Um, but for the most part, most of us, well, I know for a personal, um, in a personal way, all the footy gets done at footy. Um, cause at the same time he wants you to have your own time.

• 12:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 12:51Speaker 01

  Keep footy, footy and your off field stuff off field. Um, but yeah, look, some people are different. He can connect with them, um, whether it's, you know, especially our leaders and our spine who, you know, have a quite important role, they might have to do a bit more with Robbo.

• 13:08Speaker 00

  Um, so more strategic stuff.

• 13:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, more, more strategic stuff. So, um, they might seem a bit more and, um, like I said, everyone's different. Um, he's pretty much just sees me at training or, or just the games, says a few words and, um, keeps it simple because it's more simple it is, I guess for me personally, the, you know, the, the better it will be. So.

• 13:27Speaker 00

  Well, coming from rugby, because I, I, I remember, I remember sitting and having lunch with your manager, Milan.

• 13:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:35Speaker 00

  Um, and we were at Beppe's.

• 13:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, that's right, we were there, yeah.

• 13:38Speaker 00

  Yep, you were there.

• 13:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 13:40Speaker 00

  And that's a while ago now, it's like three years ago, but you just come off the, uh.

• 13:43Speaker 01

  The World Cup.

• 13:44Speaker 00

  World Cup, yeah. And prior to that, you'd play, you played in the Olympics, did you, the Sevens?

• 13:48Speaker 01

  Not yet. I did eventually, it was Commonwealth, I did the Commonwealth Games.

• 13:53Speaker 00

  Commonwealth Games. And, um, like I didn't know much about you and other than what I'd seen on clips.

• 13:59Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 13:59Speaker 00

  But how important is your manager Milan Bley been? Like, like.

• 14:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh.

• 14:04Speaker 00

  That process.

• 14:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 14:05Speaker 00

  Maybe you could explain how that all works.

• 14:07Speaker 01

  Um, look, I'm very fortunate, um, or they, I've got, I've got two, two managers, um, and, and obviously Milan, Milan is one of them. Um, Andrew is the other one. Um, but Milan to me, um, I've got a real special connection with him. Um, to me, he's more than just a manager. Um, you know, he, I had a, I wouldn't say a dark moment, I had a, you know, a, a part of my career, I was, you know, not where I wanted it to be. And, um, I feel like he came in and, and, you know, helped, um, you know, helped support me, um.

• 14:39Speaker 00

  What was that period?

• 14:41Speaker 01

  Oh, it was just what, twenty, twenty twenty-one, twenty, start of twenty-two, I wasn't, you know, really where I wanted to be, um, with my career, not getting picked as much, um.

• 14:52Speaker 00

  Was it the way you're playing or?

• 14:54Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, I think so, a little bit of that. It was, I, I feel a bit of, um, I would say now, a bit of unprofessionalism. Um, you know, I was quite young, um, you know, I was only what, two, my year and a half into my professional career, which I was learning, um, you know, and, you know, I, I do, I take those, those time as a lesson, um, which, you know, he, you know, he did come in and, and teach me that, um, you know, which I was grateful for. And, you know, it kind of real switched, um, once, you know, once we got working together properly, you know, he supported me through every game, um, trainings, you know, whether it's giving me advice, um, or even just off field stuff, you know, um.

• 15:38Speaker 01

  He's actually a financial advisor firsthand, so he does, he does all that stuff for me. Um, but yeah, like I said, he just, he supports and cares me like a brother. Um, and yeah, he pretty much, you know, him and Andrew got me involved with, uh, with senior.

• 15:53Speaker 00

  But did you know they're going to, did you, is, is, because most people don't understand how this works, the relationship between a player and a manager?

• 15:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:00Speaker 00

  And they're all managers are different, of course.

• 16:02Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 16:02Speaker 00

  But did you know, did he say to this man, I reckon you should go and play with the Roosters?

• 16:07Speaker 01

  They, the way they.

• 16:08Speaker 00

  Switch codes?

• 16:08Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, they just said like, what are your thoughts on league? That's, that's the question. Yeah, just what's your thoughts on league? And, you know, at the time I was, um, honestly, at the time I was honestly strictly union.

• 16:20Speaker 00

  Had you played any league at that stage?

• 16:22Speaker 01

  The last time I played league was twenty twelve, I was twelve years old. So, um, I was strictly on a union, uh, mindset. And then obviously they, he brought it up about, you know, what, what are your thoughts? And I said, yeah, well, I, I put in mind, what, maybe one day, who knows? And then, um, I think they got in touch with, with Robbo and.

• 16:45Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 16:45Speaker 01

  And Nick and that. And then it was a casual meeting, um, just to, just to get a, uh, a thought out of it. So I, I went along and, and wanted to meet Robbo and just see what he had to say. And, you know, I came out of that meeting a bit more interested than I, than I thought I would be. So, um, yeah, that led to a few things. Um, obviously I went to the World Cup in twenty-three.

• 17:08Speaker 01

  And it wasn't until after the World Cup where I, all that kind of meeting stuff happened real quick. Um, met Robbo a couple more times. Obviously we all had lunch, uh, one day and, and yeah, started to get really serious and, and then I signed.

• 17:23Speaker 00

  But did, did you, were you looking at, um, at that point at wingers and how, maybe like how Toops was playing? Like, were you looking at our style of footy and thinking, well, maybe I can be similar to Toops under the high ball, et cetera?

• 17:38Speaker 01

  Uh, definitely. And that's, I guess, the meetings with Robbo at the start, very early days. Um, I guess that's what kind of triggered me into actually taking some more interest in it. Um, he was very good at, um, explaining to me how it would look, um, you know, when, if I was to join.

• 17:56Speaker 00

  In terms of our style of play?

• 17:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 17:58Speaker 00

  And get down to the other.

• 17:59Speaker 01

  Use me.

• 18:00Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:00Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, it was very interesting, which I, you know, I loved the way that he, you know, he put it out there. And, um, it's funny how it ventuated because my first try in the NRL was exactly what we pictured, um, crossfield kick. Um, and yeah, just up there. And it was, it was a good moment because that's, that's what we talked about. And it's the, you know, the first thing that happened in my NRL, um, career was, was what we talked about. So.

• 18:26Speaker 00

  What was that, um, was that a Penrith game? I can't remember now.

• 18:28Speaker 01

  No, uh, I debuted last round of twenty-four against the Rabos.

• 18:33Speaker 00

  Right. The, the next year against Penrith.

• 18:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 18:37Speaker 00

  I remember, because I want, I want to ask you about this. I remember the next year against Penrith might've been like game three or four, we played at a Parramatta Stadium.

• 18:46Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 18:46Speaker 00

  And I remember looking at you and thinking to myself, um, I wonder if Mark Yetta's gotten used to the, not only the physicality, because you're not playing in the front row of rugby union, playing in the backline rugby union, and not only the physicality, but the intensity of rugby league. When, and as I thought that, I saw Nathan Cleary look at you standing under the goalposts and dropped a kick on you. And I could see you were a bit buggered. You, you, you, you looked like your legs had gone to, to into lead, just part of that?

• 19:27Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 19:28Speaker 00

  And Nathan must have seen it. Cause I mean, I'm, I'm looking as a spectator, watching you, because I was watching you the whole game. Cause I was thinking to myself, the intensity rugby league, it must be hard to make the transition.

• 19:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:38Speaker 00

  And I want to ask you about that in a second.

• 19:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:40Speaker 00

  But I remember, do you remember that when Nathan did it and they scored? Nathan kicked the ball to you?

• 19:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, I, I remember.

• 19:44Speaker 00

  You couldn't get up.

• 19:44Speaker 01

  Get up, actually, yeah. Len Martin, I think, got over.

• 19:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, you got it, yeah. And, uh, you couldn't jump up quick enough or you, because you, your legs looked like they were dead.

• 19:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:52Speaker 00

  What did you, did you feel during that period, that rugby league, the intensity rugby league in terms of, because you're a big dude, so therefore your, um, and your muscularity is going to sort of, on one hand is a very important thing, is a great advantage, but a disadvantage if you're, if you're not conditioned for the events.

• 20:08Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 20:08Speaker 00

  Um, did you feel that, when that happened? Did you think to yourself at that moment, after that score was tried, shit, um, my legs, I need to be more conditioned to this?

• 20:17Speaker 01

  Mate, I'll, I'll be totally honest with you.

• 20:19Speaker 00

  Um, I remember seeing it.

• 20:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, mate, I felt it. I felt it honestly for the first like eight rounds.

• 20:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:26Speaker 01

  That, um, you know, I wasn't yet conditioned. Um, and it actually, it reminded me of my preseason in November. I actually had thoughts, I was like, shit, have I made the right decision here? Um, because I was not conditioned for the kilometres and just the.

• 20:44Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:44Speaker 01

  Like we said, the intensity, um.

• 20:48Speaker 01

  You know, that league brings.

• 20:50Speaker 00

  Cause you're always taking the ball out of the, of the fifth tackle, you're taking it back, you're running it back.

• 20:54Speaker 01

  Going back for kick, sorry, kick chase to tackle.

• 20:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 20:58Speaker 01

  And then you're just, you're constantly moving nonstop.

• 20:59Speaker 00

  Yeah. And we're in rugby league compared to the rugby union.

• 21:02Speaker 01

  Yes, it's you're a lot more involved and, and the ball in play time is a much longer in league than it is in union. So, um, yeah, it took me eight, like, I'd say eight rounds for me to actually feel confident. Um, in my conditioning, um, so.

• 21:19Speaker 00

  What do you do to condition it? Was it just a matter of getting game time or other stuff? Did you do other stuff?

• 21:24Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, I, you have a whole preseason, right? To get your body to a certain point, but, um, I feel game fitness is a totally different thing. So, um, yeah, I was doing some things on the side, you know, some extra bike. Um, extra walk bike sessions just to maybe help with more kilometres in the legs. Uh, but for me, the game fitness was the, was the main thing as long as I was playing. Um, it gave me more opportunity to, to feel the, the pain, the, you know, the, the physicality of, of league. And I guess that's what gave me the confidence after playing a few games that I, oh, I can actually do this. Uh, you know, I've, I've felt the pain before and you just get used to it as you, as you play more games.

• 22:07Speaker 00

  Could you, could you, did, did you think to yourself, Nathan, uh, begged you? Did you, did you think to yourself, he, he worked it out?

• 22:14Speaker 01

  A hundred percent.

• 22:14Speaker 00

  Cause he was, I could see him watching you.

• 22:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, I, mate, there, there, there was a few things in, you know, those first few games where I reckon, um, you know, the, uh, the other teams would have seen me. Uh, struggling a bit, um, so, yeah, I'm glad, um, I could, I could, I'm glad I worked out the conditioning part eventually. Cause yeah, it could lead to a few more tries for other teams.

• 22:35Speaker 00

  Did you get shocked what it's like for a winger to take the ball back on the first tackle? After the fifth tackle, after their fifth tackle, so now off the back of the kick. Um, because you know, you're running into heavy traffic and a lot of times, you know, they're gonna say, well, let's, we'll kick to this new guy.

• 22:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:51Speaker 00

  And, uh, we'll put a couple of forwards in, in his way.

• 22:54Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 22:54Speaker 00

  Did you get shocked about the, the, the physicality of it?

• 22:58Speaker 01

  I, I wouldn't say I got shocked, I just, I was, honestly, that's the, the one thing when I was coming over to league, that was the one thing everyone talked about was. Oh, you're gonna have to run it, uh, like the forwards on, on, um, you know, after you receive the ball. And I was, okay, um, it's actually the one thing I wanted to become really good at from the start. Um, especially cause Robbo, that was the one thing that I guess he wanted to, um. One of the parts where he thought I would, not, yeah, struggle, uh, at the start, or there was one of the parts at the Roosters, you have to be really good at. Especially as a winger. So for me, that was, I wouldn't say I was shocked about it, I was kind of prepared to just take it full on.

• 23:43Speaker 01

  And, um, it's funny because my first ever run in a league game. So I played a New South Wales Cup game to start as a Roosters against, uh, the Bulldogs. And, um, it's funny cause my first ever run was literally a twenty metre tap. So they all had, they were all standing, ready to go. And all I could hear was, go get this, go get him, he's, go get this union, like, they were just into me. And, um.

• 24:11Speaker 00

  Like sledge?

• 24:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, sledging. And it was, it was just, um, I, it was funny because out of any, any other way to have your first carry in league. My first way was a twenty metre tap when they're all ready to go.

• 24:23Speaker 00

  All, all lined up.

• 24:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:24Speaker 00

  To nail you.

• 24:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, literally. So, no, I, I, I loved it. I've loved that part of the game, um, you know, receiving the ball and just tracking it back up.

• 24:36Speaker 00

  Cause I, I reckon Mark, towards the end of twenty six season.

• 24:41Speaker 00

  You were, your, your, let's call it hit ups were equivalent to a, a forwards hit up. So I mean, you, you, you sort of learned very quickly, um, how to sort of get a little bit lower, how to fall on your front. How to make post, um, contact meters, you're doing a lot of post contact meters.

• 25:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:01Speaker 00

  And like how to drive through these tackles. You have become a huge asset for us in terms of getting this extra meters, um. Like, and which by the way, what Tubbs always, has always done for us too. Was there any inspiration you got from Tubbs? Tubbs, cause he doesn't say much, okay? Did he ever say to you, mate, this is what you've got to do?

• 25:18Speaker 01

  Mate, he was the one I learnt off pretty much straight away. Yeah, him and, um, and, and B Moss, Brett Morris.

• 25:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 25:24Speaker 01

  You know, they, they were a big part at the start of, you know, when I first moved to wing. Um, and, and having those carries, they're the ones, you know, taught me, um. You know, your best carry, um, where you can add certain parts to it. Cause you can't, you can't just run straight all the time, you know, you have to have some tools and, and tricks to, to be able to get past certain defenders, um, certain situations. So, you know, I, I learnt heavily on, on Tubbs and, um, and, and Brett Morris especially, um. Just to, to find my, I guess, my best carry, um, so I felt very confident, you know, twenty six. That, um, I could do those carries, um, well, and, um. You know, and, and help the team as much as I can to get a few extra meters.

• 26:07Speaker 00

  Because everybody sort of concentrates on your spectacular stuff, but what they forget about is that grind stuff. That, that's, that stuff is the, uh, meat and potatoes.

• 26:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:16Speaker 00

  Of rugby league, or at least our, the way Roosters play.

• 26:18Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 26:19Speaker 00

  You know, it's the meat and potato stuff, um, you know, the, it's particularly, we know, when, when we're under a bit of pressure, um, in, in terms of, um, field position. Particularly when you play teams like, um, Canterbury have great kickers or Penrith.

• 26:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 26:32Speaker 00

  Who will kick the shit out of you, they'll, they'll just push you back so far, Nathan's so good at it. You've got to have someone that can get you out of trouble. And, um, and especially if you're on the back foot, which sometimes it, you know, it does happen. So I, I can't avoid now talking about the other Mark, that's you, the other part of you, is a spectacular mark. So, mate, like, I don't know, but I think equally against Penrith one, I don't know when it was, it was this year, I think when we played them at Paramore. But, um, was it that, was that the game when you, uh, ran down the sideline and, uh, you, you, I think you kicked the ball with your left foot. The ball bounced just before the try line, but, uh, bounced back in.

• 27:13Speaker 00

  And then you somehow miraculously, you kept running down there and you just grabbed the ball before it went over the, uh, dead ball line and.

• 27:20Speaker 01

  Oh, the Bulldogs.

• 27:21Speaker 00

  Bulldogs.

• 27:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, Bulldogs, yeah.

• 27:22Speaker 00

  So like, I mean, this, this stuff's get played over and over and over again.

• 27:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 27:26Speaker 00

  Um, do you ever look at that and think to yourself, oh my God, I'm glad that turned out all right?

• 27:32Speaker 01

  Honestly, yeah, that's a few things, uh, you know.

• 27:36Speaker 00

  But it, it can't be luck though, because it, it used to happen a lot, like it happened often. I used to think maybe it was a bit lucky, but then I think he's done it to something similar. Now, where do you get all these little tricks from? Like, uh, the kick with the left, your left foot, are you left foot or right, right foot?

• 27:49Speaker 01

  I'm right foot.

• 27:50Speaker 00

  Right, cause you kick your left foot ball, because you're running down on the right side, you kicked with the left foot, the ball somehow bounced.

• 27:57Speaker 01

  Out in, yeah.

• 27:58Speaker 00

  But, but, which, you know, that part may be a bit of luck, but some, what you did do is you managed to grab the ball.

• 28:04Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 28:04Speaker 00

  Before it went over the, over the sideline, dead in, um, over the dead ball line.

• 28:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:09Speaker 00

  And, and ground it. That, um, uh, eye hand coordination that you have and maybe ball, ball, uh, foot coordination. Is that something you've always had?

• 28:20Speaker 01

  Uh.

• 28:21Speaker 00

  And as a kid.

• 28:22Speaker 01

  Coordination? Like, I felt, I feel like I've been coordinated, yeah.

• 28:26Speaker 00

  It is naturally thing. Did you play soccer or something like that as a kid?

• 28:29Speaker 01

  I played everything, um, growing up, you know, I, I literally played every sport you can think of. Um, I grew up in a street with my cousins across the road, so we were constantly outside, whether it's basketball, cricket, soccer, footy.

• 28:43Speaker 00

  All day, every day after school.

• 28:45Speaker 01

  Honestly, literally, it was the best, like, the best, uh, best lifestyle ever. You'd literally just come back from school and start playing something outside with your cousins, um.

• 28:56Speaker 00

  Where did you grow up?

• 28:57Speaker 01

  I grew up in Burwood.

• 28:58Speaker 00

  Burwood, yeah.

• 28:58Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:59Speaker 00

  And so you lived, your cousin lived across the road?

• 29:01Speaker 01

  Yeah, my whole family lived in the same street. No, no, no, no, a few houses up from my cousins. We had a, an auntie in between and then my family were across the road, so. And then, and then there was neighbours, we had heaps of neighbours who had kids as well, so we all just, as you do back, or back in the days, it doesn't happen much, often these days.

• 29:16Speaker 00

  No.

• 29:17Speaker 01

  We used to run around the streets, um, run, we used to run around the streets, so. You just, that's how you get coordinated is experiences, I feel, so, um, I felt like I, you know, did a lot of sports. Did a lot of things where I experienced it and I, you know, I can, I've, okay, I can do that, I can do this, you learn from it, um.

• 29:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I just, I feel like that's something that's helped me, I guess, in situations on the field where I, I know what I can do. Um, you know, I know where my body can, can go, or how I can shape myself to, to put myself in a situation. Yeah, it's a bit complex, but.

• 29:56Speaker 00

  No, no, but you see, but it's, it's a, it's not a thing where you just go, uh, I just have a crack at this. It's, it's more about, you know, you can do it.

• 30:04Speaker 01

  Confidence in what I, what I know I can do, yeah.

• 30:06Speaker 00

  Cause I, I heard a story about before the grand final, someone told me this, that, um, uh, Robbo gave everybody sand. Do you want to talk about the sand that, that he gave to everybody, uh, at the field, at the oval? What, what happened?

• 30:17Speaker 01

  Um, I guess, you know, like we've mentioned before, Robbo's very good at, you know, the culture stuff or just, um. You know, the team, the team first things and, um, you know, the, the sand, um. The boxes of sand we all had was, was from Bondi, um.

• 30:34Speaker 00

  So you all got a box of sand from Bondi Beach?

• 30:36Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 30:36Speaker 00

  Who gave it to? Did you pick it up yourselves or Robbo?

• 30:38Speaker 01

  Robbo, Robbo.

• 30:39Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 30:39Speaker 01

  Robbo and Dana, um, I think they went the day before, got some sand and filled up these jars for us.

• 30:45Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 30:46Speaker 01

  Uh, you know, where, you know, he wanted to bring a piece of our home with us to the field. Um, and, and doing that, he asks you to, you know, go to, go around to some moments where you're gonna have your feet planted. Um, and where you're gonna have an impact, uh, in the game. So, you know, each individual, whether it was the props who, you know, might have sprinkled some in the middle of the field where, you know, that's where they're gonna do most of their work. Um, the half backs, you know, not too far from the sideline, but, you know, if where they're gonna kick or something like that. Um, for me personally, I, I put it in.

• 31:24Speaker 01

  I put it in the two corners where I was, where I was gonna score. Um, I obviously put it in, in the middle a bit, you know, with those yardage carries that we talked about. But um, for me, I, I put most of my sand in those corners. Cause I felt, you know, that was where I'm gonna impact the game the most. And it's funny, cause I ended up scoring in both corners.

• 31:47Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 31:48Speaker 01

  So it's uh, it's, it's funny how it all worked out.

• 31:51Speaker 00

  Yes, it's, someone told me that you said that um, you still have a few tricks up your sleeve before the game. The, like, in other words, and I got quite excited when I was told that, just be, just when I got to the game and uh, cause I thought, wow, what, cause I'm, cause I'm, you know, everybody's hoping you're gonna do something great. Um, you know, sometimes you need something great in order to win a game and you need that moment. And uh, when that person told me that, I thought, wow, I wonder what else he's got up your sleeve. But that um, um, sort of oozing confidence thing before a grand final. Where does that come from? And did you say that?

• 32:27Speaker 01

  I did say that.

• 32:28Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 32:28Speaker 01

  There was a few things I, I wouldn't usually say, but.

• 32:31Speaker 00

  Well, were you just trying to make your mates, your, your, your, your playing mates feel good or, or you actually believe it?

• 32:36Speaker 01

  I was just, yeah, I was just in the moment, um, I can't remember who asked me. But there was another one as well. I got asked at the Dali Em's and I remember that one was, oh, Mark, um, what's your favorite try in your career? You know, obviously you're very lucky to score a few tries. And I said, my next one.

• 32:53Speaker 00

  Good. Good answer, good answer.

• 32:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, it worked out well, didn't it? Um, you know, it's, I don't know, I just, um, yeah, I was confident in the, in those times, obviously having a bit of a laugh as well, um. But yeah, I don't know, just, I just, that's the way I felt, um. Feel like I did have a few more things to, to show and it just happened, yeah.

• 33:15Speaker 00

  I wanna move on rugby in a second, but just, just one thing, which is a bit of phenomenon with you, at least it stood out to me, was your mum and her sister at every aim. Maybe explain the relationship with your mum. Your, your, it looks like it to be a really special relationship to me.

• 33:33Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:33Speaker 00

  Yeah, and, and her sister as well. Your auntie, they're two bones, they stand out, you can't miss them, um, they're, they're definitely Mark fans.

• 33:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:42Speaker 00

  But just explain the, the importance of them and uh, maybe the impact they have on you in terms of how you play.

• 33:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, uh, family for me is massive, um. You know, I've grown up, I grew up in the same street of, with all my family, um, so, um, everyone, you know, means a lot to me, um, and, and has made a massive impact on, you know, how I've grown up and literally to, they've made me who I am today, so, um, you know, whether it's my auntie, my grandparents, my cousins. Um, you know, I love them, um, they support me in everything I do and, you know, it's cool to bring them along the journey as well. Um, you know, some of the experiences that we've had over the past few years has been amazing. Um, but actually all my other family actually have been Ruas's fans.

• 34:28Speaker 00

  Oh, really?

• 34:29Speaker 01

  Ages, yeah, yeah. So it's quite funny that I ended up, you know, switching over, so they've absolutely loved this journey, um. But my mum, she's, yeah, she's my, she always says that she's my number one fan and I love her to death, um. She does a lot for me, um. We've been through a lot together, so that's why we have this, you know, this good connection, um. Yeah, I couldn't thank her enough for, you know, the sacrifices, you know, when we were little, um, you know, for the most part, she was a single mum, um, bringing up us three kids. Um, but we had a wonderful family system around us that, you know, also helped.

• 35:13Speaker 00

  You had a village.

• 35:14Speaker 01

  Yeah. What do they say? It takes a village to raise a.

• 35:17Speaker 00

  Raise a good kid, yeah.

• 35:18Speaker 01

  So, um, but, you know, the, the things I know she's been through and, and done, um, you know, I owe a lot to her, um, and I just wanna make her happy, uh. Yeah, don't want her to be sad, so.

• 35:32Speaker 00

  I think you are, I think you're doing a good job of that.

• 35:35Speaker 01

  I'm trying, I've, you know, I feel like I make her happy, yeah, especially this last few weeks.

• 35:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 35:39Speaker 01

  She's absolutely loved it, um, for someone that was a, um, a league hater. Well, mate, I've never, she's a turncoat now, she's.

• 35:48Speaker 00

  Don't worry, we're working on it, make sure you come back. So, so like, uh, just on that, your surname is, um, uh, obviously, um, Pacific Islander surname. Where's it, where's that come from?

• 35:59Speaker 01

  Uh, it's from Fiji, so my, my father, um, who I'm actually not that close with, so.

• 36:05Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 36:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, um, yeah, it's his, yeah, Fiji, I, I love my.

• 36:09Speaker 00

  He's a, he's a, he's a full Fiji.

• 36:10Speaker 01

  He's full Fiji.

• 36:11Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:12Speaker 01

  Um, so he's from, uh, Nandrang and Navassa, which is a, a province in Fiji near Singatoka. Um, my village is Nalambalamba, um, and the province where I'm from, uh,

• 36:27Speaker 01

  they would, they would say in history, um, is a very good rugby province, so a lot of rugby, um, a rugby legends come through there, um.

• 36:37Speaker 01

  They call it the rugby factory, actually.

• 36:39Speaker 00

  Really?

• 36:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:39Speaker 00

  The province?

• 36:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's, it's the rugby factory, cause um, again, a lot of legends, a lot of, you know, talented, or actually there's players all over Fiji that are amazing. But there's quite a few that have come from, uh, Nandrang, uh, and Navassa, so.

• 36:54Speaker 00

  Have you spent much time there?

• 36:56Speaker 01

  In Fiji?

• 36:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 36:57Speaker 01

  I, I, I grew up my whole life. You know, you have school holidays at the end of the year, Christmas, New Year's.

• 37:03Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 37:04Speaker 01

  My, most of my childhood, I was over there for like five weeks in the village.

• 37:09Speaker 00

  Right.

• 37:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:10Speaker 00

  Oh, serious?

• 37:10Speaker 01

  Like seriously, like that's, it was.

• 37:12Speaker 00

  And they play touch football, I guarantee they're playing touch football and footy all the time.

• 37:15Speaker 01

  And touch football, volleyball, um, or just running around, hiding like tips or.

• 37:20Speaker 00

  No shoes.

• 37:21Speaker 01

  Mate, there's no shoe, like if you see the village,

• 37:25Speaker 01

  if you, yeah, like I, I would love people to experience it, like that's what I grew up with, it was the village, you know, I never, you know, we, we weren't the, you know, the, uh, you know, we, we, yeah, weren't the wealthiest family, so we, we didn't stay in resorts or, or hotels or like that. We were literally would, mum, mum and dad would, um, fly us over. And then we just go straight to the village and just live in the village, like as if we were, you know, from there.

• 37:51Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 37:52Speaker 01

  Which we are from there, but, um, it was honestly the best, you know, you really,

• 37:58Speaker 01

  you know, you, you don't take anything for granted, or you realise not to take anything for granted after what you see there and, and what you experience, but um, yeah, I had some of the best memories coming from, from the village.

• 38:10Speaker 00

  Is it sort of humbling?

• 38:12Speaker 01

  A hundred percent, a hundred percent, um.

• 38:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, some of the, yeah, some of the things you see and you realise like how they can be so happy with having, you know, not.

• 38:22Speaker 00

  Very little.

• 38:23Speaker 01

  I reckon it's made me who I am today, um, you know, to not take anything for granted, um, cause, you know, you could, you could literally have nothing, so.

• 38:33Speaker 00

  But they, they're still seem to be happy, you know, it's funny, I remember we're going over there like a long time ago with one of my sons. He, he was playing for a team in Sydney, he had to play against some teams in Suba and, and, uh, the kids they were playing against was rugby union, the kids they were playing against had no shoes. And uh, my son's team gave them all the boots.

• 38:49Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 38:50Speaker 00

  Um, so uh, they gave, so the, the two teams could play against each other with boots on, but they could kick goals, no shoes on. Like, I'm, like, amazing, like, and, and after the game, they sang songs, Christian songs. Doesn't matter, they still, they sang songs, they sounded like a choir out of St Mary's Cathedral or something, like they were professional.

• 39:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:11Speaker 00

  Um, did you, did you sort of experience that sort of thing?

• 39:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, um, I, um, you know, it, uh, religion over there is, is very strong, um. So every Sunday, actually, you had to go to church.

• 39:23Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 39:23Speaker 01

  No matter what, Sunday was the day of the Lord, so you, you could only go to church and that was it, um.

• 39:29Speaker 00

  You can't do anything else.

• 39:29Speaker 01

  Can't do anything else, but, um, all you did was sing hymns all day and, and, um, and pray, but um, yeah, some of the, the hymns and, um, just the way they all, you know, the whole church sing together, it's, it's amazing. Amazing to see and, and be a part of, um, yeah, some memories I won't ever forget.

• 39:48Speaker 00

  It's amazing, the games that are coming up, the, the, the test matches are coming up.

• 39:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 39:54Speaker 00

  We've got Tonga, Suba, Fiji, um, Australia, obviously, New Zealand. Um, we, what, what do you think about that? That's Robbo's now coaching the Lebanese side, I think.

• 40:05Speaker 01

  Czech, Czechs.

• 40:06Speaker 00

  Czech, no, Czechs coaching, Robbo's coaching the French side.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 40:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 40:10Speaker 00

  So what do you think about that series?

• 40:12Speaker 01

  That's amazing, um.

• 40:13Speaker 00

  Particularly for Pacific Islands.

• 40:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh, uh, I, I love, especially when I was in Union and watching from afar, I love, um, what the players from the Pacific Islands have done in terms of going back to play for their, for their countries. I think some of the support we see just from them, you know, the impact from them moving. Um, some of the crowds that they bring in, the, the, you know, the hoo-ha that goes on, it's, it's hilarious and it's great for the, for the gamer, I reckon. Um, so it'll be exciting to see, um, you know, I'm excited to see Tonga versus Samoa.

• 40:47Speaker 00

  Oh my god, how good are some of the, like the teams there?

• 40:50Speaker 01

  And some of the teams as well, like they're absolutely stacked.

• 40:52Speaker 00

  The Farhu White alongside, um, uh.

• 40:55Speaker 01

  Fisher Harrison.

• 40:56Speaker 00

  Fisher, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's not a bad front row.

• 40:59Speaker 01

  That, the whole, that whole pack, the middle's there, it's scary to.

• 41:03Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 41:03Speaker 01

  To, um, to face, um, but yeah, all the teams, all the teams are stacked with, with players and. Um, you know, there's a good buzz around. Um, but yeah, like I said, I'm, I'm especially excited to see that Tonga Samoan game. Cause I know there's a big rivalry between the two countries.

• 41:19Speaker 00

  Yeah, I, I love watching the um, Pacific Island Games, especially when the guys come out of NRL and they go and play for them. Like it's, it's an amazing vibe.

• 41:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:28Speaker 00

  Um, and like you see some of the, some of the countries and like you'll see a sea of red. Every one's got red, literally everyone's got red.

• 41:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 41:37Speaker 00

  Um, and in one point in time was, you know, if you go back in years, it was just usually um, New Zealand, um, you know, like the, they'd have a, the black and white jerseys. That was really all we ever saw. But now the, across the board. And some of the talent coming out of these places is amazing. Do you think your rugby league or your, your, just your contact sport, physical ability comes from your dad? I mean, you're built like your dad.

• 42:02Speaker 01

  If you ask my mom, she would, if you say to my mom, she would say that's all me or her.

• 42:07Speaker 00

  But is your dad a big guy?

• 42:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, he's pretty big.

• 42:10Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:11Speaker 01

  Yeah. One six, six two, bit wider than me.

• 42:15Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:16Speaker 01

  Well, now he is, but um, yeah, I like obviously genetics, right? Uh, plays a big part.

• 42:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:21Speaker 01

  Um, I don't know, the Italian side, my, my Italian side might have the finesse, so I don't know.

• 42:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:27Speaker 01

  But yeah, definitely, I, I reckon does play a big part, genetics. Um, obviously Fijians are, you know, some, some of the very blessed, um.

• 42:35Speaker 00

  Like they're amazing athletes.

• 42:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:37Speaker 00

  Some of the athleticism of Fijians, like if you just watch them at lunchtime, like you can go and stay in a hotel. The staff at lunchtime, having their lunchtime, they stay, go and play touch.

• 42:45Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 42:46Speaker 00

  And the athleticism and the things that they're doing are freakish.

• 42:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:50Speaker 00

  Like they do throw them ball, especially their ball movement.

• 42:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:53Speaker 00

  Which is something that you're really good at, like your ball movement, particularly your.

• 42:57Speaker 01

  That's where I learnt it.

• 42:58Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's where you learn it. Like playing touch and stuff like that.

• 43:01Speaker 01

  Literally, especially in Fiji, um, you know, they just love to throw the ball around and um.

• 43:07Speaker 00

  And have fun with it.

• 43:08Speaker 01

  Have fun with it. Yeah, yeah, it's built, it's built over there early. Um, you know, from when you're young, you're seeing the older guys do it. Um, you know, especially over there, rugby is number one sport.

• 43:20Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:20Speaker 01

  So everyone watches the, the Flying Fijians or especially when I grew up, I was watching the sevens. Um, you know, and they've had some absolutely amazing athletes. Um, William Ryder or Jerry Tuai, it was a bit closer to this, uh, it's a bit more recent, um. But just the way they could move and, and, and throw the ball around, you know, all the young kids watch that. And then they go out and do the exact same thing. Just try to, they just try and try and try. Which I guess they learn and as they get older, they hold on to it. And I guess that's why they get to produce um, some players who can do it on the field now.

• 43:55Speaker 00

  And rugby is sort of like second to religion over there.

• 43:58Speaker 01

  Oh, it'd be pretty close to.

• 44:00Speaker 00

  It'd be like PNG, PNG like, well, probably it's number one. Footy, rugby league is number one of the, um, PNG, like for the whole nation, the whole nation. The league, even, I think even in Fiji, I don't know if he still is the prime minister, but Rambuka, who was your prime minister, um, he was, uh, he, he played for Fiji too.

• 44:16Speaker 01

  Yes, that's right.

• 44:18Speaker 00

  It, it, it.

• 44:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:19Speaker 00

  Back, we're going back in the seventies or something like that. Let's talk about rugby union for a sec now. Um, World Cup's coming up next year.

• 44:28Speaker 00

  I've had Les Kiss on the show actually, and uh, you know, I'm interested to know, does Les Kiss ring you up and say, hey mate, um, one of the things we're going to do in our, uh, our game from now on is we're going to get our halves to kick on the, not on the fifth tackle, but just kick at any stage across to you. Is that a conversation?

• 44:45Speaker 01

  Uh.

• 44:46Speaker 00

  Cause they don't do that. Normally the wingers don't get the ball much.

• 44:49Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 44:50Speaker 00

  Unless, unless it's kicked to you from the opposition.

• 44:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, um, well, I haven't, I've only had one or two chats with Les, nothing, nothing in particular in terms of game yet. Um, I haven't really gone too far with, with international footy stuff yet. I'm just solely focused on, on the Japan stuff and seeing what, um, actually my new coach, but I'd say my new coach and that, that's what they intend to, to bring into the game.

• 45:18Speaker 00

  In, in, in the Japanese side. So which side are you going to be playing for in Japan again?

• 45:21Speaker 01

  Uh, they're called the uh, Saitama Panasonic Wild Knights.

• 45:25Speaker 00

  So maybe you just explain something because what probably most people don't realise is that big corporations over there own the clubs.

• 45:31Speaker 01

  That's right, yeah.

• 45:32Speaker 00

  And um, and it's a big deal, like it's a status thing between the big corporation like Panasonic, who want their team to win against other corporations. It's a status thing. It's a big deal. Um, and they pay quite well. So you're paying for the Panasonic side.

• 45:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 45:47Speaker 00

  Um, and what position will they have you in? Will you be on the wing?

• 45:50Speaker 01

  Um.

• 45:51Speaker 00

  Or maybe moving closer?

• 45:53Speaker 01

  Wing or fullback maybe.

• 45:54Speaker 00

  Or fullback, okay.

• 45:55Speaker 01

  Um, yeah.

• 45:56Speaker 00

  But, but they're totally different positions of rugby union though. They're much different.

• 46:00Speaker 01

  I can move around everywhere. If I'm on the wing, I can move left or right.

• 46:04Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 46:05Speaker 01

  Um, fullback, a fullback's pretty similar in terms of, you know, you're at the back, but especially the wing spot, you can, you can roam the whole field.

• 46:15Speaker 01

  Add value wherever you think is best. Um, so.

• 46:18Speaker 00

  So first you'll play in Japan.

• 46:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:20Speaker 00

  So you'll sort of get your leg, rugby union legs back.

• 46:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:24Speaker 00

  And uh, you know, make sure you, you, you roll the ball back when you get tackled, but you're not used to.

• 46:29Speaker 01

  I know. Oh gosh.

• 46:31Speaker 00

  Well, cause I, I saw Joseph Sawalik, um, but he took a while to get that right.

• 46:36Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 46:37Speaker 00

  Cause you tend to want to fall on the ball.

• 46:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:39Speaker 00

  Cause there they play the ball when rugby league play the man.

• 46:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 46:42Speaker 00

  Like it's a big difference.

• 46:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, a hundred percent. No, that's actually, it's, I'm funny, I'm interested to see, you know, the first week that I'm over at Union to see how it goes. Um, in terms of remembering the rules and, and just even the habits, the old habits of placing the ball back.

• 46:59Speaker 00

  And do you think the game has moved ahead of you a little bit? I mean, do, do you think the, because rugby league is evolving all the time.

• 47:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 47:05Speaker 00

  Um, and if you ask, if I had asked you five years ago, if you were playing for us in five years ago, you would see the big difference between five years ago and today in rugby league?

• 47:13Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 47:13Speaker 00

  Do you think rugby union has um, moved ahead a bit? Do you think you need to adapt your prior rugby union experience to a, a different type of game?

• 47:22Speaker 01

  I'll say no. I'll say no now. Um, no, I, I feel like I can, you know, I think I'll, I think I'll be fine. I don't think much has changed. It's hard to say because I haven't gone yet, but I'm confident once I get over there, I'll be able to learn it. Uh, or revisit what I used to know. And then if I need to add anything else in terms of, if the game has evolved a bit,

• 47:50Speaker 01

  I have confidence that I can pick it up.

• 47:52Speaker 00

  Do you think you've learned anything out of rugby league as a defensive, in a defensive sense? Cause there's a lot of defence in rugby, rugby league for all players. Whereas in rugby union, most of the defence is happening in the ruck.

• 48:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:02Speaker 00

  Um, do you think you're going to be able to bring something to rugby union in relation to your, what you've learned about defence?

• 48:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, um.

• 48:09Speaker 00

  Tackle, Baff's tackle style?

• 48:10Speaker 01

  Uh, tackle style, I think the, the biggest thing that I learnt coming over and what Robbo's taught me is, um,

• 48:20Speaker 01

  just the, just my like defensive reading.

• 48:22Speaker 00

  Read the defence.

• 48:23Speaker 01

  Just read the defence.

• 48:24Speaker 00

  Where to stand.

• 48:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, where to stand, um, and what to, what, what you see is going on, where you can make a decision on that. Um. Honestly, I had no idea of that stuff before.

• 48:36Speaker 00

  When you first started.

• 48:37Speaker 01

  Honestly, like, coming from uni, yeah, I just, I came in and then I figured out, oh, there's actually a, a, there's actually a way to actually do this. So I've learnt so much from Robbo in that aspect, um, which gives me more confidence on the field because I now know where to put myself, so I can put myself in the best position to make a better tackle.

• 48:58Speaker 00

  Yeah, as, as they're attackers and you're sliding, you've got to make sure you stick to one spot.

• 49:03Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 49:04Speaker 00

  And as opposed to coming in.

• 49:06Speaker 01

  Well, if I, if I don't know where I'm, if I don't know where to start, you're going to be in the worst spot if, if, if someone does get the ball on the outside of you.

• 49:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 49:14Speaker 01

  Now I know where to put myself and then I can read what's going on as well. So that if they do decide to do one thing, I'm, I'm in a good spot to, to.

• 49:22Speaker 00

  Like, like taking intercept for example.

• 49:25Speaker 01

  A hundred percent, like taking intercept.

• 49:27Speaker 00

  Against the Dolphins.

• 49:27Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 49:28Speaker 00

  That was so good.

• 49:30Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, but that's.

• 49:31Speaker 00

  Did you worry you were going to get run down by the fullback?

• 49:34Speaker 01

  Nah.

• 49:36Speaker 00

  Hammer was coming after him.

• 49:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I thought about him. I was like, oh, just be careful, Hammer will be somewhere.

• 49:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, well, because he's running, he's running diagonally, just he had an edge on you.

• 49:45Speaker 01

  But once I, I got to halfway and I was like, oh no, I'll be, I'll be sweet. Um, then I saw, I actually, if you, if you watch it really, I actually, I took a left turn to go towards the post.

• 49:56Speaker 00

  Yeah, I saw that.

• 49:56Speaker 01

  I took a left turn and I was, I was jogging and then I, as I turned left, I kind of saw Hammer that was, he was, you know, he was peaving after me. So then I actually go back and I turned it on a bit more just to, to make sure I got there, um, enough. But yeah, I definitely had thoughts of him. Um, yeah, he's going to be.

• 50:13Speaker 00

  Cause he's quick.

• 50:13Speaker 01

  Oh mate, he's rapid.

• 50:15Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:15Speaker 01

  He just glides.

• 50:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:17Speaker 01

  He, he doesn't, it's not like.

• 50:18Speaker 00

  It's unfair.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  It's honestly, he just glides. It's, it's actually great to watch. Um, it's great to watch.

• 50:25Speaker 00

  So, so in your, I'm, I'm sorry, that was me diverting, because I couldn't, I couldn't resist actually talking about the intercept. But defensive positioning, you've learned from rugby league.

• 50:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, defensive positioning, yeah.

• 50:37Speaker 00

  Yeah, that, and that's important. Um, is it, is it as important in rugby union though? Cause you don't see too many winger tries in rugby union.

• 50:44Speaker 01

  Yeah, I reckon it will be.

• 50:47Speaker 01

  It, um, defensive positioning, yes, especially like I said, to put yourself in the right, in the best possible spot to make a tackle.

• 50:56Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, does that, like, does that make sense?

• 50:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, it makes sense to me.

• 51:00Speaker 01

  If I say, for example, you're running at me, right? I'm pretty much in the perfect spot to make it an easier tackle, right?

• 51:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 51:07Speaker 01

  If I had no idea what I'm, if I'm watching the ball and I'm, I'm actually standing over there and I forget that you're there. Defensively, that won't be good because if they pass it to you, you've already, you've got the space and more meters and the tackle is going to be harder for myself. Whereas now, like I said, defensive, okay, positionally, I should be maybe one step

• 51:32Speaker 01

  away from you. I'm still able to do this job here if, if he, if he holds the ball. But at the same time, I'm, I'm close enough to you to be able to still make a, a good tackle. Rather than what I said before, if I'm putting myself in a bad spot, then I have to work extra hard. And then the tackle percentage decreases because it's a harder tackle. Yeah.

• 51:55Speaker 00

  Yeah, something I've always been very curious about. So you've got a mother of Italian heritage, which obviously qualifies you to play for Italy and they've got a rugby union side. You've got a dad, Fiji, which qualifies you to play for Fiji, which by the way, I love watching Fiji in the sevens. They're amazing.

• 52:12Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 52:13Speaker 00

  They're just built for sevens. I don't know what the deal is, but they're amazing. And of course, got Australia. And the, the discussion is, because you've been very cagey about telling me whether or not Les Kiss can choose you or not. Um, the discussion clearly is, um, who will Mark choose? Do you get, I mean, obviously you've got to wait for an offer from everybody. You can't choose. They've got to offer you.

• 52:36Speaker 01

  Well, uh, well.

• 52:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, oh mate, it's a, it's a, obviously a touchy subject at the moment, so.

• 52:43Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  I don't know what to say.

• 52:44Speaker 00

  Well, it was good to go through three choices.

• 52:46Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, I, I look honestly, I, I'm, I'm very, very lucky to be in a position where um I'm eligible for a couple of countries, um.

• 52:58Speaker 00

  Is it a hard decision?

• 52:59Speaker 01

  It's, oh, I don't know, decision. I, I, I'm, I don't have to make a decision just yet, so I'm not even, literally, I'm not even thinking about it.

• 53:07Speaker 00

  Um, ah, bullshit.

• 53:11Speaker 00

  Come on, Mark. Uh, I'm not thinking about it, you've got to be kidding me.

• 53:15Speaker 01

  Look, I get it.

• 53:16Speaker 00

  It must be driving you crazy.

• 53:17Speaker 01

  Oh, fuck.

• 53:18Speaker 00

  Uh, but I know some journalists, listen, I know some journalists who knew you were coming on the podcast today, hell, they knew, I don't know, but they've, I didn't tell him. And they've been driving us mad to find out who you're gonna play for, like, uh, and I'm said, well, I'm, I'm gonna, I'll at least ask him the question, but Sammy's, our producer's on to me with this one, but uh, um, so oh, you know, you're not gonna, um, break news here, I get that, but um, but, but what are the sort of things? Well, you, you, it's funny, you said you, you have a great affiliation with your memories of being in Fiji as a kid.

• 53:50Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 53:51Speaker 00

  Um, but equally, you love growing up in Berwood.

• 53:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, uh, mate, like, I, I love all my cultures.

• 53:59Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's a tough one.

• 54:00Speaker 01

  My, my Italian culture is very strong.

• 54:02Speaker 00

  Talked about that much, just talk about the Italian culture.

• 54:04Speaker 01

  Yes, well, I've grown up, I've grown up in a household where I've had Fijians in my house everywhere. Um, and then I have my Italian side, my nonno, uh, my nonna.

• 54:15Speaker 00

  Cause I remember you saying, okay, now I get it, now, okay, they, they're living in the same street.

• 54:19Speaker 01

  Yep, yeah, yeah.

• 54:19Speaker 00

  Nonna, nonna grandparents.

• 54:21Speaker 01

  Yep, um, so my mum and my, my auntie, so they're the only two that came from my, my grandparents, um. They're all fluent in Italian, so I've grown up with Italian.

• 54:34Speaker 00

  People speaking Italian.

• 54:35Speaker 01

  People speaking Italian, I've grown up with people speaking Fijian, and then obviously, I'm, I'm Australian, so I've grown up in Australia and um, I, I, I actually love, not many people know how, um,

• 54:51Speaker 01

  how, oh, how can I say it, how, not how cultured, but how much those Italian and um Fijian values and, and parts of, oh, I don't know how to say it.

• 55:01Speaker 00

  The way their culture operates.

• 55:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, like, uh, um, there's a lot of Italian in my life and a lot of Fijian, I don't know, how can I say?

• 55:07Speaker 00

  No, no, I get it, cause, and it, it's just on the, on the Fijians, so you've already explained that, like, you, you know, growing up, playing footy and all that sort of stuff, all the sporting stuff and

• 55:15Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:16Speaker 00

  how chilled they are, et cetera, but the Italians sort of bring, uh.

• 55:20Speaker 01

  Food.

• 55:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 55:21Speaker 01

  There's, been the food, the language, um, mate, there's, there's so much, there's, both of them have brought into my life.

• 55:28Speaker 00

  Is your mum and your auntie and your, uh, grandparents, are they, were, particularly grandparents, were they very Italian, like?

• 55:35Speaker 01

  Uh, like, I won't be, um, stepping on grapes.

• 55:39Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 55:40Speaker 01

  But, but I, I, I would, um, consider myself a ta, like, very Italian.

• 55:45Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 55:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:46Speaker 00

  Really?

• 55:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 55:47Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's why it's unfair, you know, you've got the good looks, unbelievable sporting, you've got the Italian sort of um genetics as well. It's unfair for every bloke who's playing footy at the moment, or anyone in your, your age or category, it's just completely unfair. Plus, you played State of Origin, you've won a grand final, uh, you've only been doing it for a couple of years, um, you've, uh, you can play, do everything you, you, anything you put your hand to, you seem to be able to do. Um, and on top of that, you're, you're a pretty good kid, like, you're, I mean, as a young man, you're, like, you're a credit to your family. And, uh, and on top of that, you have great family, like, they're lovely people, so like, it's just unfair. Do you realise how unfair it is for everybody else?

• 56:29Speaker 01

  I don't know, I'm just like.

• 56:30Speaker 00

  And now, and then the worst part of it is you've got to choose who you're gonna play for, which country you wanna represent.

• 56:35Speaker 01

  Well, yeah, I, I don't have, well, like I said, I don't have to choose right now.

• 56:39Speaker 00

  No, when do you, when do you have to choose, by the way?

• 56:41Speaker 01

  It's, it's not, I'll choose, like, I'm lucky enough, so I should say I'm very lucky, um, to have the opportunity to play for all three teams.

• 56:49Speaker 00

  Right.

• 56:50Speaker 01

  It's not like, it's not my, you know, does that make, I'm not, like, I'm in debt to the countries, right?

• 56:55Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 56:56Speaker 01

  I say in debt, I mean, like.

• 56:57Speaker 00

  No, no, I get that.

• 56:58Speaker 01

  It's a blessing to be able to represent any of them, um.

• 57:01Speaker 00

  There's gonna be people in all these countries who love rugby union and are gonna be desperate to see where Mark's gonna make his call for.

• 57:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 57:07Speaker 00

  Me, as an Australian, I definitely, desperately want you to play for Australia.

• 57:10Speaker 01

  Well, I, I've previously played for, for the Wallabies already, so, um, yeah.

• 57:15Speaker 00

  That does make you eligible to play for the others, you can put your hand up to play for Fiji or, um, Italy, not, we're saying you've already played for Australia.

• 57:21Speaker 01

  So, yeah, I've, I've played for the Wallabies, um, and then I've, it's been, it's been, it will be three years in August next year, July, August, where would make me eligible for, for all three.

• 57:34Speaker 00

  Yeah, so you, yeah, okay.

• 57:35Speaker 01

  There is a stand down.

• 57:36Speaker 00

  Period, like a three period.

• 57:38Speaker 01

  That's right.

• 57:38Speaker 00

  So if you play for the Wallabies in, and two years ago, you must play for the Wall, Wallabies, Wallabies again, yeah.

• 57:43Speaker 01

  That's right, if I, yeah, if I wanted to play in the World Cup and I only had two years stand down, I'm only eligible

• 57:51Speaker 01

  for the Wallabies for the World Cup.

• 57:52Speaker 00

  Cause I remember when Sonny Bill, um, wanted to leave us, he gonna play for, um, you know, play for the All Blacks, which is, you know, it's a, it's a big deal. Um, and it was an amazing

• 58:04Speaker 00

  amazing opportunity that he could do that, you know what I mean, for us as a club.

• 58:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 58:08Speaker 00

  At the Roos, it's amazing opportunity for us to do that, um, you're now thinking about, you're potentially playing for three countries, any one of three, any one of three countries, can't have played for all, there's not, not three marks, but play for any one of those three countries. What is the, what is that, um, desire that a rugby league player has, and there's been a few of them have done this in the past, that they wanna go from playing rugby league to representing a coun, country in rugby union in a World Cup? What, what is it? Doesn't matter who you play for, but what is that?

• 58:38Speaker 01

  The World Cup?

• 58:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, um, let's not pick a country, but why do you wanna play in the World Cup?

• 58:42Speaker 01

  Yeah, uh, no, for sure, I, um,

• 58:46Speaker 01

  well, growing up, the Rugby World Cup's one of the biggest events in, in rugby, um.

• 58:50Speaker 00

  It is a world game.

• 58:51Speaker 01

  It is a world game, yeah, and, um, I was very lucky enough to already go to the, um, to the World Cup. I represented the Wallabies in twenty-three in France, and, um, the experience that I had there, um, I would say is one of the major reasons why I wanna go back and or come, it's in Australia next year, but why I wanna be a part of it, um, just the atmosphere, um, the way the world gets around it, like I said, it's a world game, and, um, you know, in France in twenty-three, it was just amazing to see literally the small countries, Portugal, Georgia, um, Uruguay, just

• 59:32Speaker 01

  everyone in, in Europe just get around it, you know, you, you could have a, a stadium packed and it would be filled with all different nationalities. Um, and, you know, just running out there, I just, you know, feeling the, the buzz and, um, seeing the you know, seeing some of the passion that, you know, the fans over in Europe bring, I don't know if you've seen some of the games, they cheer all day. Like, the whole eighty minutes of a game, they'll be up dancing, cheer, which is, you know, it's cool to see, um, but just, just being part of the World Cup and, uh, you know, if you, you're going around and just everyone, it's just like a, a buzz, which I'm excited for in Australia, for people to see and feel, you know, it's gonna be a massive event.

• 1:00:17Speaker 01

  Um, and I, I think that's what I, I, I love about, just the, the buzz and the feel and being able to, you know, play the thing that I love in front of everyone, um, it, it's exciting.

• 1:00:29Speaker 00

  Do, do, do you think it's because, Mark, you have had so many, growing up, have had so many wonderful, um, diverse experiences, like, living in Fiji, living in Berwood, Sydney, um, uh, having Italian influences on you, having Fijian influences, influences on you, having Australian influences on you. You've had so many of those experiences that you, you, you love experiences.

• 1:00:56Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:56Speaker 00

  The opportunity to experience this.

• 1:00:58Speaker 01

  A hundred percent, yeah, definitely, I think that's a, I think that's about,

• 1:01:04Speaker 01

  you know, I'd, yeah, definitely love to live my life with these new experiences, um, or new experiences or exciting experiences, yeah. And I guess, yeah, the Rugby World Cup's gonna bring another one, um, the league obviously was an experience in itself and. Yeah, I'm sure, sure there'll be more experiences.

• 1:01:22Speaker 00

  Did you, but in the decision making, if you don't mind me getting away to that, how much weight do you put on making a decision to play for a, a country that will win? Or could win? Cause you know, in the decision making to play for the Roosters, you made a decision that this is a club that can win.

• 1:01:38Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:01:38Speaker 00

  Cause winning is a part of the experience.

• 1:01:40Speaker 01

  It's a, it's mate, that's a hundred percent what makes the experience.

• 1:01:43Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:01:43Speaker 01

  Um. So yeah, it's, it's if not the, it is up there as the most important decision. Um.

• 1:01:51Speaker 00

  It's particularly if you disregard it.

• 1:01:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:01:53Speaker 00

  Like if you say, oh, well, I'm going to play for this country, but the country you could have played for actually wins it.

• 1:01:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:02:00Speaker 00

  Or does better than the other, the other teams.

• 1:02:02Speaker 01

  Yeah. I know it's, it's definitely important because that it can, it has an effect on, on, on a lot. Um, you know, I could, oh, imagine I didn't go to the Roosters.

• 1:02:13Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:02:14Speaker 01

  Imagine I went to a.

• 1:02:15Speaker 00

  Another club.

• 1:02:16Speaker 01

  Another club, maybe not as successful. Um.

• 1:02:19Speaker 00

  Let's say when it's St George. Well, yeah, I'm serious.

• 1:02:22Speaker 01

  A hundred, a hundred percent.

• 1:02:24Speaker 00

  It could have.

• 1:02:24Speaker 01

  It can affect a lot of things, you know, and it has to do with environments and, um.

• 1:02:32Speaker 01

  You know, that, that has an effect on you as an individual. Yeah. So going to a, a successful, um, you know, potential winning team. You know, as like I said, has an effect on, on a lot of things. Um. So when it comes to making a decision, you have to really, um, really think about that.

• 1:02:48Speaker 00

  Well, cause you know, you're only twenty six and you know, God willing, you've got, you know, ten more years in you, for example, if you look at tubes. Um, and, uh, or D C E, he might have eleven years in you. You guys still playing. He's got, he's got more than that. He's gone whole. He's, he's got, he knows how many years he got in. But because you know, you, you make your money in sport over a ten to fifteen year period.

• 1:03:13Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:03:14Speaker 00

  Um, and, uh, and you've got to make as much as you can.

• 1:03:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:16Speaker 00

  Because that's got to last you for the rest of your life.

• 1:03:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:19Speaker 00

  Subject to you not, that, that makes it, I'm assuming that you can't earn the same money post footy that you can during footy and that, that's not always the case, but let's assume that for a moment. So how much money you can make is quite important.

• 1:03:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:33Speaker 00

  Um. So therefore the decision as to which team you play, probably to some extent, how well you play and whether that team wins it or not, could have some impact on, you know, what you're worth.

• 1:03:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:46Speaker 00

  When you come, if you, if you decide to come back to rugby league.

• 1:03:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:48Speaker 00

  I mean, you could do a, a justice of Wally and like justice on amazing money, on amazing time period with a strong rugby unit. And you know, you could potentially get something similar to that. Um. But I don't know if rugby union ever do that again, because that, that's like one of the one offs.

• 1:04:05Speaker 01

  Hmm.

• 1:04:06Speaker 00

  I, I mean, I, they've got new leadership there. They've got new chairman there. They've got new manager, um, C E O there. And they don't have as much money as they used to have. Um, and they probably don't necessarily need a marquee player like that anymore. So maybe you could do that sort of thing. So, cause where I'm going with this is, um, what do you do post World Cup?

• 1:04:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. I've still got another year in Japan.

• 1:04:28Speaker 00

  Yeah. And then post rugby union.

• 1:04:31Speaker 01

  Well, that's, that's the question. That's another question everyone wants to know. Um.

• 1:04:34Speaker 00

  Well, I definitely want to know that.

• 1:04:35Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:04:37Speaker 00

  Nick wants to know it.

• 1:04:38Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, mate, look, um.

• 1:04:40Speaker 00

  He asked me to ask you that question.

• 1:04:41Speaker 01

  Yeah. I'm, I'm signing with no. Look, mate, honestly, you know, we just talked about experiences. I, um, I want to see how this first year goes in Japan.

• 1:04:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:04:52Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:04:53Speaker 00

  You get paid good money in Japan though, don't you?

• 1:04:56Speaker 01

  Uh huh.

• 1:04:56Speaker 00

  It's pretty good money.

• 1:04:57Speaker 01

  You get.

• 1:04:58Speaker 00

  For the amount of footy you play.

• 1:04:59Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, okay. For that, yeah, it's honestly, it's ridiculous. Um.

• 1:05:05Speaker 00

  Cause I remember when Craig Wing was playing, when he was playing, I can't remember who he played for, but it was one of those similar name corporations.

• 1:05:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:11Speaker 00

  And he made great money for the amount of football he had to play. It extended his football, like football life career.

• 1:05:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:05:17Speaker 00

  And like you look at wing today, he looks like he's twenty.

• 1:05:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:20Speaker 00

  Looks like he's never played a game for.

• 1:05:21Speaker 01

  Still looks.

• 1:05:21Speaker 00

  Oh, no, it's amazing. It's ridiculous. He'd look, he'd be forty now, I'd say, but he looks like he's twenty two, twenty three.

• 1:05:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:28Speaker 00

  He's got no injuries on him, but he's made a lot of money out of rugby in Japan.

• 1:05:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:05:32Speaker 00

  Um, how much is Mark thinking about

• 1:05:39Speaker 00

  career as opposed to country or, um, clubs or winning grand finals? How much of, in your thinking process and your decision making is career involved? Or is that something you just leave it to Milan?

• 1:05:54Speaker 01

  Well, uh, it's important. It definitely is important. Um. I think, I think certain stages of your career, it can be, it, it, it will change on how important it is.

• 1:06:07Speaker 00

  Particularly as you get older, I guess.

• 1:06:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. As you get older, um, see, I, I'd like to consider myself still not, it's not the most important thing for me right now. Um, see, I, I'm.

• 1:06:21Speaker 00

  Longevity is not the most important thing for you.

• 1:06:23Speaker 01

  I wouldn't like the money thing. The money thing is not, not the most important thing for me right now. Like I'm very blessed to.

• 1:06:29Speaker 00

  I can tell you now it is for Milan.

• 1:06:31Speaker 01

  Well, it's a good account of that, isn't it? Um, like, yeah, um, but I'm, I'm lucky. Um, I feel like I'm lucky. I, I get looked after in a very good way. I'm not saying that I, you know, it's not like, it is important, but it's not for me. The thing that I'm looking forward to in the next two years is, is again, the experience of that. I can't wait to travel. That's what Japan um, opens up for me is, like you said, it's a shorter season. The work is not as much as what an N R L season would be. Um. So I get to, um, to travel a bit more, which is a big thing.

• 1:07:07Speaker 00

  And experience the country.

• 1:07:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:08Speaker 00

  It's something completely different to Fiji, completely different to Italy and completely different to Sydney.

• 1:07:13Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly right. So a, a lot of people do get, you know, caught up in all what's he actually like, what's his main reason? I'll be honest with you, my main reason, obviously I'd love to go to the World Cup, but after that it's, I want to travel. And, um, going to Japan is, is a great fit for that. Um, cause like I said, the, the season's shorter. Um, the holiday time is much longer, um, and it's in, you know, it's, the time period is actually summer Europe. So it's a, it's a different, um, holiday time that I've been used to. So it comes back to the experiences thing. I'm just, um, I'm, I'm in it for the experience of the lifestyle and where I could, you know, what I can do. Yeah.

• 1:07:56Speaker 00

  And what, what does, does, do you talk to mum about it?

• 1:07:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:00Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:08:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. Um, my mum, as my mum just, as long as I'm happy, that's the main thing.

• 1:08:06Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:08:06Speaker 01

  Um, like I said, I'm, in terms of the career stuff, I'm very, very fortunate to be looked after, you know. You know, Japan, they, they, they, they will be looking after me, but for me, it's the, it's the, what they bring in terms of the holiday stuff and the, um, the less work stuff in terms of compared to league.

• 1:08:27Speaker 00

  Well, physically too, you're not getting belted.

• 1:08:29Speaker 01

  Uh, literally it's, it will be. I don't know how to say it's, that's that for me is the, what, like what, what got me.

• 1:08:39Speaker 00

  It's like gold.

• 1:08:40Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:08:41Speaker 00

  It's gold. Do you ever think to yourself, wow, look at all these options I have? Like, and I can just optimize my options and how lucky I am or how blessed I am.

• 1:08:53Speaker 01

  Yeah. Actually, I was talking with Jonah, I think.

• 1:08:55Speaker 00

  Yeah, Jonah, sorry.

• 1:08:56Speaker 01

  He said a good point. He's like, um, something that I'm, you know, I'm proud of, I, I felt proud of is that, you know, I, I know exactly what I want to do. Like, I get to choose what I want to do, um, which is a good feeling. Yeah, it's rare.

• 1:09:12Speaker 00

  Not for a twenty six year old, it's rare.

• 1:09:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'm, I'm very fortunate that I can, I can literally, I can do whatever I want to do. Um, which is weird to say, but, um, I do think how lucky I am to have opportunities wherever I want. Um.

• 1:09:34Speaker 01

  It's crazy to think that even, you know, that it has happened like that, you know, a little kid from Berwood. You know, wanting to be a, a footy player. Now I'm literally living the dream and I get to do whatever I want.

• 1:09:46Speaker 00

  Do you have, do you have a moment? So like, I remember one of the great sensations of rugby union, particularly on the wing was John Loma. And, uh, like I said, I'm watching him and, uh, yet

• 1:09:59Speaker 00

  his career was cut short and, um, he never really played out a long pool of time, like, you know, everybody expected him to. He looked like the most robust person in the world.

• 1:10:10Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:11Speaker 00

  Um, but do you ever think to yourself, oh, well, you know, there are, there are some things that I've got to be careful of. And make sure that I maintain myself or preserve myself in order not to run into the same sort of, um,

• 1:10:27Speaker 00

  sort of ditch that he ran into in the end.

• 1:10:30Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:30Speaker 00

  Being the greatest sensation that like, he was literally applauded like you are. I mean, they could give him the ball. And if he was thirty meters from the line, no one could tackle him. He was just too big.

• 1:10:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:41Speaker 00

  Um, and he just literally, I've, I've seen him run over the top, literally run over top of opposing players, like a steam train. And everyone talked about him, like they talk about you. Um, yours is more skill based. He was more power based, but it doesn't matter. But he didn't sort of see it out to the end.

• 1:10:57Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:58Speaker 00

  Through injuries and stuff like that. Um, do you ever think about those sorts of things?

• 1:11:02Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:11:04Speaker 01

  Like it, it, it's, those things can happen. Yeah. Do I think about it? Yeah. You think about here and there, but, um, for the most part, I'm, um,

• 1:11:14Speaker 01

  I don't know, I'm pretty free with it. Um. I, I feel, I feel I'm, I've got, I've got the right people around me to not think about those things. Um, who give me confidence just to enjoy the good parts of it. You don't, yeah, if that makes sense, don't think of the bad parts. Um.

• 1:11:33Speaker 00

  That's a mindset thing.

• 1:11:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think that that's a mindset thing. Yeah. Um, where I don't really worry about that stuff. Maybe I'm quite optimistic.

• 1:11:44Speaker 00

  That's a good thing.

• 1:11:44Speaker 01

  Or yeah, look at life a bit more positive. I think people would say, um, who've.

• 1:11:50Speaker 00

  Glass half full.

• 1:11:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:51Speaker 00

  Nine and a half empty.

• 1:11:53Speaker 01

  Exactly. Um.

• 1:11:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, I don't know, I don't know.

• 1:11:59Speaker 00

  I remember when we had a lunch, I can't remember where it was, we had a lunch and it was the beginning of this year. And I was talking to Dale Cherry, Cherry Evans, who I'd never met before, but I was talking to him and and I was also talking to Reece, what Rob's now, Hooker, number nine. And I said to them, they'd only been with us like two weeks. And I said to them, what is the biggest difference that you noticed in our club, Roosters, compared to say where you were? And they both come from, had come from different clubs. And one of the things they said was the wrestle sessions. He said, they said the intensity of wrestling.

• 1:12:39Speaker 00

  Is that something you noticed when you came to our club in beginning in twenty four, end of twenty four?

• 1:12:45Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:47Speaker 00

  And maybe you can explain that to the audience, what that means, intensity of wrestle sessions.

• 1:12:51Speaker 01

  Wrestle sessions, mate, all sessions, but yeah, particularly the wrestle sessions.

• 1:12:58Speaker 01

  In my personal experience, I came from Union where there was no wrestle. So coming straight in and I actually had one of my first sessions. I was with Jared Wery, Hargreaves and Dylan Napa. So it's something I won't ever forget. You know, they were, they were great because they, I could see how much they wanted to, to teach me. But at the same time, oh, it was, it was torture because they are, you know, the biggest, bruttiest guys.

• 1:13:32Speaker 00

  And have skill.

• 1:13:33Speaker 01

  And have skill. But the things they taught me that day, you know, just to see how hard they, they worked, whether it was the littlest drill or, you know, whether it was a big drill where we're all involved. The care, the standard, the standard is so high, you know, yeah, that I had to, I had to make sure I had to keep, keep that standard. And, you know, the wrestle sessions, Robbo loves wrestle too much.

• 1:14:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, because well, but wrestle is around the defence.

• 1:14:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:05Speaker 00

  It's a, it's a sort of like a brutal. It's about a bit of brutality. I mean, legitimate brutality though, nothing bad with it, but it's about being brutal.

• 1:14:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:16Speaker 00

  In terms of how you pin someone to the ground or how you, you know, you grab hold of them or how you secure the ball, et cetera.

• 1:14:23Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:14:24Speaker 00

  I mean, I, the, the two guys I taught with Reece and Daley, they just said it was more brutal than they'd ever experienced.

• 1:14:33Speaker 00

  And, and one of the things that Roosters were good for is, is defence. I mean, sometimes we don't hold the wall as well as we should, but our defence is pretty bloody good. Our defence in that grand final, the first half was close to a hundred percent. I don't think we had any errors or if we had, might have won, but that's like one of the best performances we've ever had. In the first half, second half was pretty good too, but the first half was amazing.

• 1:14:57Speaker 00

  Those preparation processes, like being, getting prepared through wrestle sessions. How important is that, outside of all the fancy stuff, but how important is that for having improved your game?

• 1:15:10Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, definitely.

• 1:15:13Speaker 01

  Defence, that's the, that's the biggest part of my game that I've, I've had to improve and I will always continue to improve. But, yeah, wrestle sessions like that, or like at the Roosters.

• 1:15:25Speaker 01

  Mate, they, they built, like you said, they build, I say they build toughness.

• 1:15:31Speaker 01

  And obviously at the same time, the skill of, you know, just tackling.

• 1:15:36Speaker 00

  Locking people.

• 1:15:37Speaker 01

  Locking people up, creating an extra second for us in defence.

• 1:15:41Speaker 00

  Especially when there's a six again.

• 1:15:42Speaker 01

  Correct, yeah. Being able to, you know, being able just to get the right grips on somebody. So when you're on the ground, you can, like I said, add an extra second to the tackle.

• 1:15:51Speaker 00

  Get your side to get back.

• 1:15:52Speaker 01

  Get the boys back in the right spot so we can get up there and.

• 1:15:55Speaker 00

  Get back off the line.

• 1:15:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, those, those sessions during the week, you know, we take the lessons from the week before. And we'll work on what we, oh, we can add, we can add an extra, an extra grip maybe on the shoulder or seeing where players, you know, some certain players run a certain way. So find yourself in a good spot. And then, you know, the coaches will show us where it's best too. So you can, you know, when you get to the game, you, you can, you can do it. But for me personally, yeah, it's, it's honestly, it's, it's made me tougher, made me more confident in, in, again, putting myself in the right positions to be effective.

• 1:16:36Speaker 01

  But at the same time, it's like, it's your job, you have to be able, you have to be good at it, you know, for the team. Because, you know, we pride ourselves at the Roosters on defence, you know, building that Bondi War. You know, the twenty thirteen, twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen, all those defensive years were amazing. I'd like to think that, you know, defence won us, you know, a lot of games this year.

• 1:16:59Speaker 00

  Totally.

• 1:17:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:01Speaker 00

  I saw a stat, not that, Phil Gould gave me a stat years ago, that said that teams that win grand finals, usually on average, for a year, have no more than two points scored against them on average per game.

• 1:17:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:17:14Speaker 00

  And that's, it all comes down to defence. How good is it having Rob Toy inside you?

• 1:17:21Speaker 00

  Hey Bobby, I mean, seriously, or, or sometimes outside you when you're like, you're served up a couple of tries.

• 1:17:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh mate, honestly.

• 1:17:29Speaker 00

  He's a beast.

• 1:17:31Speaker 01

  He's.

• 1:17:32Speaker 00

  And how strong is he?

• 1:17:33Speaker 01

  Muscle, they call him Muscleman for a reason.

• 1:17:35Speaker 00

  That's what they call him, do they?

• 1:17:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, they call him Muscleman. Bobby, honestly, he's, you know, without him, my career wouldn't be as, you know, my, my stint in League wouldn't be as good. I absolutely love him to death, but you, the Roosters have got a real special one with him. He's, honestly, it's funny how we worked on, on the field together.

• 1:17:58Speaker 01

  You know, he, he did a lot of the defensive.

• 1:18:01Speaker 00

  Oh, he's amazing on defence.

• 1:18:03Speaker 01

  Stuff for us, especially like me on our, our connection. Mate, I, there was times out there where I literally didn't have to worry about making a tackle because I knew Bobby was there going.

• 1:18:15Speaker 00

  Well, confidence in your colleague is so important in the game, because if you're not confident in you're going to come in.

• 1:18:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, correct. So we, that's why I said we build a really good connection where, you know, Bobby might have had to do a bit more defensive

• 1:18:31Speaker 01

  work and then I, I'd make sure I'd back it up for him in the attacking, in the attacking way. So I felt like we, we built a really good connection, you know, off the field, you know, I love him to death and will, will love him, you know, forever. But on the field, I felt like we, as a, as a little unit on the edge there.

• 1:18:51Speaker 01

  You know, I'm pretty confident to say we're, we're pretty.

• 1:18:56Speaker 00

  Lethal.

• 1:18:57Speaker 01

  Pretty lethal.

• 1:18:58Speaker 00

  It was lethal.

• 1:18:59Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:18:59Speaker 00

  And, and what about having someone like Teddy keep looping around that side?

• 1:19:03Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:03Speaker 00

  You know, he could see, if he could see that was the open side or even if it was a blind side, but like he'd always loop around that side.

• 1:19:09Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:19:09Speaker 00

  And, you know, like the confidence you get for someone like Teddy.

• 1:19:12Speaker 01

  Yeah. Oh, I think, obviously Teddy's, obviously Teddy's amazing player already.

• 1:19:20Speaker 01

  Honestly, the whole team's stacked, but yeah, just having Teddy there, you know, for us, especially Bobby, who was young, who was still so young. And then obviously me, I was, you know, still learning the game in last year or, yeah. But the confidence he's brought us, you know, and to, to, to let loose and just play our footy. He, you know, over the past years, he's given us both confidence. I think once they realise, you know, maybe we should get those boys a bit more ball and, you know, he, he would swing around a lot more for us.

• 1:19:56Speaker 01

  Just so we can, we can all help each other, you know, what, do what's best for the team. So, yeah, he's, he's been amazing and given us a lot of confidence to Bobby and I. You know, it's, it's crazy because Bobby and I both watched him.

• 1:20:12Speaker 00

  As kids. I know, that is crazy when you think about it.

• 1:20:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, so it's been, yeah, it's been amazing. And there's, mate, there's a whole lot of them on the team that have helped, yeah.

• 1:20:21Speaker 00

  We could go through the whole lot and that's why we won the grand final, I guess, because we did have the best team.

• 1:20:24Speaker 01

  We won the grand final.

• 1:20:26Speaker 00

  It's pretty bloody amazing. I guess, Mark, I've got a lot longer than I normally go, mate, but then thanks for your time. First and foremost, I want to congratulate you on winning the grand final, well done and, and the team. And at an individual level, you played a brilliant game and then all the lead up games to it as well. Congratulations on, well, good luck, I should say, on going to Japan and what you're going to do in Japan. And, and the final two things I want to leave you with is I, I sincerely hope you end up playing for Australia. When you do make that decision finally sometime next year. And equally, mate, Nick asked me to tell you this, and you know, Nick's not well at the moment. So if you, if you have any respect for the old fella, yeah, I'll put a bit of pressure on you.

• 1:21:12Speaker 00

  He said, make sure he comes back to us.

• 1:21:15Speaker 00

  So posting, poster all this, make sure you come back to the Roosters, mate. And, but honestly, like, it's been a great pleasure to have you in our club, have you in our side. Have you playing State of Origin and everything else you've done for Rugby League and good luck for what you're going to do for Rugby Union. Thanks, mate.

• 1:21:32Speaker 01

  Thank you very much, mate. I appreciate it. Thank you.