Bob Katter on Taking Down Prime Ministers, 50 years in politics & Australia Selling Itself Out

Bob Katter is one of Australia's longest-serving politician with 51 years in parliament and one of the most recognisable figures in the country. In this conversation, Katter reveals how he brought down Prime Minister Julia Gillard over the live cattle export ban, explains why he left the National Party, Australia's problem with selling out, rise of One Nation and details the structural collapse he's witnessed across rural Australia. He discusses the deregulation that decimated sugar, dairy, tobacco and other agricultural sectors, and why he believes politicians today simply won't govern. You can subscribe to the free Mentored newsletter here: https://lnkd.in/e7C8akgj https://the-mentored-platform-pty-ltd.myklpages.com/l/WWJGc5. Join my exclusive Mentored+ community: https://mentored.com.au/become-a-member/ https://mentored.com.au/become-a-member/ See omnystudio.com/listener https://omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Bob Cadder, welcome to Straight Talk, mate.

• 0:01Speaker 01

  You've got a pretty big reputation these days.

• 0:04Speaker 00

  You have too.

• 0:05Speaker 01

  I'm sacrificing a day in Parliament. This is a

• 0:08Speaker 00

  Oh, my God.

• 0:08Speaker 01

  To come here, you know.

• 0:09Speaker 00

  Thank you.

• 0:09Speaker 01

  I mean, heavens. What a sacrifice.

• 0:12Speaker 00

  It is a sacrifice and I, by the way, I'm much appreciative and I'm, hopefully we get in camera with your hat. I mean, I have to tell everybody that as, as he walked up, so many people, there's a couple of tradies at the front door here, recognise him, young blokes. Um, I don't know if it's the hat that's recognisable or the, the gait on him, the swagger, but they recognise him and, uh, you know, people put their hand out to shake his hand and I was sitting with my son and the, and my son, my oldest boy who's 45, he said, dad, there's Bob Cadder. And, um, so one of the most recognisable politicians in Australia. And part of the reason for that, Bob, is that I think you've been in Parliament maybe 50 years.

• 0:48Speaker 01

  Fifty, uh, 51 years.

• 0:50Speaker 00

  51 years of Parliament.

• 0:52Speaker 01

  That is a reflection upon my intelligence. When I went in there, I unturned 50,000 acres, good country up in the Gulf.

• 1:01Speaker 01

  Didn't know any money on it. I was negotiating 20 million for my own mining company, 20 million then money.

• 1:06Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Look at me now. My wife said, you'll do a will. So I have, I gave all my earthly possessions to my son, my six rifles. That's all I own now, six rifles.

• 1:21Speaker 00

  So where, where is your area?

• 1:22Speaker 01

  Um, well, you know, my homeland is Concurry, Mount Isa, and as I say, family went there. Well, I'm living in Charter's Towers where my family went, I don't know, 180 years ago to Charter's Towers, Gold Rush Town, you know. Um, and, uh, so I'm sort of back where we started from.

• 1:40Speaker 00

  So you, uh, I, I did watch something on, I think, I don't know which channel it was, on one of the TV channels, the, the, the free air shows. And I remember, and I, I didn't realise this, but, um, you have Lebanese heritage.

• 1:52Speaker 01

  Oh, mate, look, I, I burr up when people, no, no disrespect to yourself, but I burr up. I mean, yeah, a great grand father, yeah.

• 2:02Speaker 01

  The eighteen seventies or eighteen eighties, I know nothing about it.

• 2:07Speaker 00

  You didn't meet him.

• 2:07Speaker 01

  And, and you know, it, it really burst me up. Um, all my knowledge, my father's knowledge, my grandfather's, it's all Australian, you know, we really know, know nothing about.

• 2:19Speaker 00

  Never done it.

• 2:20Speaker 01

  But, but. And, you know, similarly with, I don't know, Irish and Welsh and bloody everything, other bloody thing that everyone's got in the fin. Bit of comic here, my, my sister decided to do a family tree. I said, are you quite mad? If you're an Australian, you chop it down and burn it as soon as possible. I'm not ashamed. Um, seen two month later. Um, how's the family tree going? Great grandfather was the assistant gardener at Government House. How about that? Um, in three generations in Australia, we hadn't made it past unskill labourer.

• 2:56Speaker 01

  That's a very great commitment to being a nobody. But, um, um, the second time I visited her about a month after that, so how's the family? History going? She said, that was stupid speech you gave in Mount Isa last week. How's the family tree going? About time you did something about crime here in Townsville. How's family speech?

• 3:20Speaker 01

  Lasted a month.

• 3:22Speaker 00

  Why, why do you think you've been in politics for so long? But like, I mean, you've probably had plenty of opportunities to do other things.

• 3:27Speaker 01

  Look, you know, why all my fortune got shot to pieces was, um, I got in there because, you know, Joe was making Whitlam bleed. And I think there were thirteen or sixteen of us went in that year that had nothing to do with politics.

• 3:45Speaker 00

  Talking about Jobi Okpetersen?

• 3:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, I'd been asked to stand down from the local branch of the country party, utterly disinterested and uninterested. And so they stood me down. Um, but Whitlam got me interested in January. And, and it's just another thirteen or sixteen, I can't remember now, that went into politics and got elected to parliament in that election. Because Bajoki Peterson was making Whitlam bleed. And we felt it was our job to get behind him, you know?

• 4:13Speaker 00

  So, you were talking about the country party?

• 4:16Speaker 01

  Country party.

• 4:16Speaker 00

  What was country, what became the National Party, but was?

• 4:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, but it was very much country party.

• 4:20Speaker 00

  Country party backing up in Queensland in those days?

• 4:23Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 4:23Speaker 00

  And did you do it though to support Jobi Okpetersen in Queensland with the country?

• 4:28Speaker 01

  Well, it was more, I suppose. To get at Whitlam and to get at Whitlam was to back P. Jockey Peterson, you know.

• 4:35Speaker 00

  We're talking about the seventies, so early seventies. Um, and obviously it is fifty odd years ago, but um Whitlam is what pretty interesting that you should say that. Because if we look at today, you remember this, most people won't. But during that period, OPEC in nineteen seventy three decided to stop the production of oil. And we had this concept called stagflation.

• 5:00Speaker 01

  Seventy five.

• 5:00Speaker 00

  Yep, the period, Whitlam's period. And of course, Whitlam was one of the biggest spending governments in our history.

• 5:08Speaker 01

  None of it, yeah, but none of it on development. It was all just taking money off people over here and giving, making a big man of myself, giving money to people over there.

• 5:17Speaker 00

  Redistribution of wealth.

• 5:18Speaker 01

  Redistribution of wealth.

• 5:20Speaker 00

  And, and, and when I look at today, because of course oil prices tripled during that period. Uh, during the early seventies through to late seventies. And we had this thing called stagflation when inflation was going that way. And the economy was going that way and they couldn't control it. And at the same time, the Whitlam government was spending like a drunken sailor.

• 5:40Speaker 01

  M- Mark, I was wrong in saying that. I said he took money off people over there, gave people that. He didn't. He gave the money to the people that he didn't have. He borrowed it.

• 5:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  And, and that's inflation went through the bloody roof. In one quarter, we had twenty four and a half percent inflation in one quarter.

• 5:59Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 5:59Speaker 01

  Um, and it was scary. It was really scary.

• 6:02Speaker 00

  And what most people don't realise, Bob, and you will remember this too, is that we actually had unemployment went very high during that period. Cause I remember my dad lost his job during that period and I remember it well. I was like in my late teens. And my dad lost his job and where I'm worried about today, given oil prices are high again. And um we have a spending government again who spend more money per, per capital or pu- pu- as a percentage of GDP than we've ever spent in our history. What worries me about today is that unemployment will get out of control again if we don't get control of what's going on.

• 6:33Speaker 01

  You see, it's hidden now. There's all sorts of ways you can get dull money. Um, and people take advantage of that. If you're, someone's going to give you some money for doing nothing, well, you'd be stupid not to take it, wouldn't you? Um, and they live at home now. They don't get married and. You know, make a home for themselves. They can't afford to anyway. Um, but the structural collapse of the country, I was knocked out for about two months. Dog tried to chew my foot off and every, excuse my language, smart ass, of course, said, how's the dog? It's a dog, but, uh, and then I got what they call long flu.

• 7:14Speaker 01

  I was out again for two months. When I came to, I went down to see Rebecca Sharky and, and.

• 7:19Speaker 00

  Who's she? Who's she?

• 7:20Speaker 01

  She's a member of parliament for Adelaide Hills, federal parliament, independent. And I said, I mean, is this country completely imploding? She said, yeah, where have you been? Like, you know, you're an idiot for not knowing it. And then I went, saw Andrew Jason as parliament resident. He's the independent member for, um, Orange and New South Wales. And, um, he said, he looked at me like I was a moron as well, you know, like, where have you been? I went, everyone knows the country's got, but see, there's nothing happening that increases the wealth in this country. And there's plenty happening that decreases the wealth. We only have three sources of income, iron ore, coal and gas.

• 8:03Speaker 01

  There are a hundred and twenty billion on average, the three of them. The next thing down might be beef or gold, fifteen billion. They're a hundred and twenty billion. The next thing down, beef or gold is fifteen billion. So you've got the big three. Well, the, we gave the gas away for six cents a unit. We're buying it back.

• 8:25Speaker 00

  Can you explain that to everybody, how it is?

• 8:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, you have to apply for a permit to, um, take gas. Um, a mining permit is called, and the government decides how much they're going to take out of the mining permit. Um, now there's no restrictions on, um, foreign investment in Australia. Um, so it was quickly sold off to foreigners, the entire gas reserves of Australia. So Australia gets six hundred million.

• 8:57Speaker 01

  For their gas, six hundred million. Quito exports the same amount of gas and it gets twenty nine thousand million for the same amount of gas. We gave the gas away. So gas is gone. Too bad. So sad. But because the gas is foreign owned and the government won't rein in or in any way involve itself in the marketplace, well, we're going to buy our gas at international prices, which is now about nineteen dollars a unit. Where our competitors, Russia and, for example, in fertilizer, Russia and America are getting this for six dollars. We're paying nineteen dollars, they're getting this for six dollars.

• 9:37Speaker 00

  For our own gas.

• 9:39Speaker 01

  Our own gas, we have to pay nineteen dollars. Um, now, West Australia, God bless them, they have a reserve resource policy. And in fact, the Prime Minister, when I raised it with him, um, the next day he came out and said, it may be that we have to, um, introduce a reserve resource policy on new gas, he said. Um, um, in Australia the next day, but, I mean, I'm sure that he spoke to a couple of imbecile ministers about it. Um, and nothing has happened and nothing intense happened. So Mount Isa announces the closure of two of their three operations, the fertilizer plant and the copper stream.

• 10:24Speaker 01

  They announced the closure of both and they go and give six hundred million to a foreign corporation to keep it open.

• 10:29Speaker 00

  That's the government gave six hundred.

• 10:31Speaker 01

  The government gave, federal government gave. Uh, and I might add, Liberal state government, Labor federal government, um, Liberal Labor that runs Australia, um, they gave six hundred million to the foreign corporation to keep the doors open. We want them to close the doors, get rid of Bling Corp and open it up to Australian ownership. There were two Australian groups that wanted to buy it. And I mean, like, it's the fourth biggest industrial undertaking in Australia. Um, and, um, probably about fifty thousand jobs are dependent upon that place directly and indirectly. And, well, you know, the government props a foreign corporation up.

• 11:15Speaker 01

  With people's tax money.

• 11:17Speaker 00

  Is that per annum, six hundred million, is that six hundred million per annum?

• 11:20Speaker 01

  Six hundred and forty million. It's over the next two years effectively. Um, but I think everyone knows that they'll come back again next year, ask them for more money. So it'll effectively be pretty close to annually.

• 11:36Speaker 00

  So you you were a country party member?

• 11:38Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 11:39Speaker 00

  And and particularly in this, at the state level.

• 11:41Speaker 01

  Always be such term when you say country and remember, you know.

• 11:46Speaker 00

  Do you, did you, when, what was the change over to federal politics? What was the thing, reason to change over feds?

• 11:52Speaker 01

  Um, what happened was I was running the show. We lost that election and a lot of people said that was, of course, I was running the show. Put that aside for the moment, but I was running the show and like call Neil Turner. His background is like didical to my own, right down to the point of barroom brawling.

• 12:14Speaker 01

  But Neil came back in the state house and he said, what are you going to do? And I said, well, I said, someone's got to go to Canberra. He said, well, it's obviously you. I said, yeah, well, I don't want you to notice it, but I'm running the show here. He said, you have noticed that actually. So I said, I can't go to Canberra unless you're prepared to step up and run the show here. He said, no, I'd like to be, I want to be premier. I'm determined to be premier. Well, that goes aside. And he said, would have passed your mind, of course, that if we control Queensland, you'll be the federal leader? Well, it has crossed my mind. Anyway, um, thanks to the stupidity of the premier is a very nice bloke.

• 12:55Speaker 01

  And I'd put him there to get us through the elections. He was a harmless sort of bloke, you know, and uh, wouldn't rock the boat. And the media, you know, would be kind to him. So we put him up front and he's a good bloke, don't get me wrong. But anyway, through his. Towering political incompetence, Turner lost that vote by two votes.

• 13:14Speaker 00

  Oh.

• 13:14Speaker 01

  And he rolled his way and left State Parliament and I'm left stranded in bloody Canberra with no power base behind me. Um, so that's, that's how it ended up. Yeah.

• 13:25Speaker 00

  How important is Queensland, Queensland votes at a federal level? Like, is it more important than we give it credit for in the, in the lower states and the same in South Wales?

• 13:34Speaker 01

  Um, well, you know, it's getting pretty big, you know, eight or nine million people now.

• 13:40Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 13:40Speaker 01

  But then again, you know, Sydney is eight or nine million people. Um, um, yeah, no, it's very significant now and each passing year it gets more significant explosive growth on the Gold Coast and in Brisbane.

• 13:55Speaker 00

  In that regard, I mean, you've got the Cadda Party now as opposed to, as opposed to the Nationals. Um, you left the Nationals.

• 14:02Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 14:02Speaker 00

  Maybe we just cover off that off. What, I mean, most people see you as a country party slash Nationals guy. Why, why did you leave the Nationals? What happened and when?

• 14:12Speaker 01

  If you start where I live in Charters Town, it's a cattle town and Julia Gillard cut off live cattle exports. The price of cattle dropped clean and half. Just about every cattle in Australia was technically bankrupt at that stage. And that was where I believe I had no alternative but to switch my vote. It was a balance of power situation. Um, there are only two votes in it. I switched my vote and support from the Liberal Party to the Labor Party on condition that they got rid of Gillard and put Rudd in.

• 14:47Speaker 00

  Oh, really?

• 14:48Speaker 01

  Um, yeah. So.

• 14:50Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 14:50Speaker 01

  So I held a press conference in the morning, 10 o'clock that night. Julia was gone and Rudd was in. And I said to Elba, I said, did I really get rid of the Prime Minister? She said, absolutely. There was nothing on when you call that press conference in the morning. Um, there's nothing on for three or four months. And he said, the phones just went white hot and she was gone that night. Well, in fairness to my judgment, within nine days, Kevin O'Sullivan was in Indonesia trying to repair the damage that had been done, within 13 days. The market was reopened. Within two months, the price of cattle had doubled.

• 15:27Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 15:27Speaker 01

  And I'd rescued all of my brothers in the cattle industry. And I'd had, well, I got a single vote off any of them that election. You know, I mean, you just wedged into two party politics and you're stupid. But anyway, that's the way it was.

• 15:41Speaker 00

  Maybe.

• 15:42Speaker 01

  I almost got beaten that election. I went within about two percent of being beaten, yeah.

• 15:46Speaker 00

  Maybe you could just explain to the people listening, because, you know, like you just mentioned Indonesia. I mean, the live cattle export, the issue was, as I understand, is that Indonesia likes us to send live cattle to them so that they can slaughter them their own way.

• 15:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, they grow them out. We send little calves to them.

• 16:01Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 16:02Speaker 01

  And, you know, they have a backyard industry. They feed food scraps to two or three, you know, moo cows. And they grow them out and then, you know, process them.

• 16:12Speaker 00

  Their arbitrage process, whatever you call it.

• 16:14Speaker 01

  Very cheaply. And, you know, they produce a lot of the world's leather from that market. And, you know, I've found them excellent people to deal with nothing like that Middle Eastern or North African crouch. And they might share some sort of religion, but I think it's a hell of a lot different religion.

• 16:31Speaker 00

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 16:32Speaker 01

  In Indonesia than it is over there. So, but, but now you asked me a question. Why did I get out of the national party?

• 16:38Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 16:39Speaker 01

  Well, they had nothing to do with the destruction of the wool industry. That was a keating special.

• 16:47Speaker 01

  They had plenty to do with the live cattle because Susan Lay, who was to become the federal leader, she moved for the abolition of the live cattle trade. And the ALP felt that was a good invitation and they were being pushed by the, you know, wokeys and to ban live animal exports. So that, the LNP had plenty to answer for on the live cattle decision. But it was taken by Gillard. And for that, she was sacked as prime minister. I know because I sacked her. But, so there was live cattle. Move our charters to us. The next town the electorate is Ingham and that's sugar all the way up the coast.

• 17:29Speaker 01

  Um, John Anderson deregulated the sugar industry. Fifty percent of our sugar went on the home market at a, an agreed upon price. It was an arbitrage, arbitrated price. So we said, we want this amount, you know, government said, you'll get that amount and. Um, we got a fair, so we had a forty percent of our sugar went on the home market at an acceptable price. So we could ride the ups and downs of the world market for sugar. John Anderson, you know, free marketer, replacement for brains, in my opinion, you know, you don't have to think if you're free market. Um, he, he abolished all the marketing arrangements,

• 18:13Speaker 01

  all of the sugar mills. Now, this is like the fifth biggest export company country, industry this country's got. Starts in Northern New South, it's very big in Northern New South Wales, and goes all the way to North of Cairns. Um, you know, it's one of the big industries of this country.

• 18:31Speaker 00

  Um, still, still?

• 18:32Speaker 01

  He, no, no, no, not now. It's, it's been given a mortal blow. Um, all of the sugar mills were owned by the farmers. Now all the sugar mills are foreign owned. Um, but that's the only start of it. They're using their muscle power because there's no arbitration price. So they got a monopoly. I won't go into that, but they got a monopoly. So they just use the monopoly to force.

• 18:55Speaker 00

  Price down to farmers?

• 18:56Speaker 01

  Sugar prices down.

• 18:57Speaker 00

  And the farmers suffer.

• 18:58Speaker 01

  More and more, um, you see barbed wire going up, they put cattle there and, you know, like cattle are about one twentieth what you get out of sugar. And if you've got cattle.

• 19:06Speaker 00

  In terms of yield?

• 19:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, uh, income for the area. Uh, I mean, town like Innisfar, twenty eight thousand people go to size of Julia Creek if you switch to cattle. Now, the other issue is bananas. John Anderson wrecked the sugar industry. He then issued an import permit for foreign bananas. And under the advice of the great leader we had in the banana industry, Robert McCoy, he said, let's get someone powerful in on our side. And we don't know any powerful, he said, Dick Pratt. He was the richest man in Australia at that stage. I said, you know, Dick Fradd, he said, yeah, I like an organised meeting. So anyway, I rang Dick. Dick was in a fury. He pressed a button.

• 19:51Speaker 01

  Now I want a meeting with the Prime Minister before Tuesday. I, I want the meeting before Tuesday, he was really angry. So he and Rob and Kai went in to see Howard. And Howard had had a gut full of Anderson, little Lord Fauntleroy. You know, captain of King's College, the most exclusive and expensive school in Australia. Speaks with a plum in his mouth. Extremely handsome and he's looking at imaginary mirror, combing his hair all the time. And, and, and, you know, like Howard worked in his daddy's, daddy's, you know, um, um, petrol station.

• 20:25Speaker 00

  Norwood.

• 20:26Speaker 01

  Voucher attendant to work his way through here to first. So you can imagine how I'd liked Anderson, um, and, but he didn't do anything about it. You know, John was terribly good to people. He didn't do anything about it.

• 20:39Speaker 00

  John Howard, that is.

• 20:40Speaker 01

  Yeah, but he was watching Anderson destroy rural industry after rural industry after rural.

• 20:46Speaker 00

  But why was Anderson doing this?

• 20:47Speaker 01

  And, and, you know, uh, um, Ellen Jones, um, he was really banging the drum. You know, like this bloke is completely destroying agriculture in this country. But let me finish, right? I'm just taking you on tour of my electric, right? So issues an import permit for the barns. And Howard at that stage had had a gut full of him, right? And he hauled him in and made him reverse the decision. And he said, you can't tell me what to do. And Howard said, I will go down to the governor tomorrow and advise him that the cabinet will be, every single person will be abolished, each position will be made vacant.

• 21:28Speaker 01

  And then I'll give him piss paper, the new cabinet, your name will not be on it. At least that's what I'm going to do tomorrow morning. So under that threat, Anderson had to reverse the decision. It was Howard's, overruled him and reversed the decision. So banana survived. The next town is Mariba, uh, two thousand people employed in the tobacco industry. Fifty percent of all Australian cigarettes had to have fifty percent Australian tobacco. Myrtleford in Victoria, three thousand, uh, employees in the tobacco, we're two thousand. So he abolishes that rule. Yeah, goodbye, two thousand. Four hundred farmers bankrupt, two thousand people are out of their jobs. Being kicked out of their homes.

• 22:13Speaker 01

  But then we go, the next industry is the flower industry, who are very big in flowers. He allows flowers in from overseas, carrying disease with them, right? So goodbye flower industry. Then maize, corn, he deregulates corn industry. There's thirty million dollars worth of silos there, they're all empty. Now they're gone, there's no silos there. We just drive down the road, the next set of silos are peanuts, they're all empty. The peanut industry is gone. And it just, industry after industry, cactus, grapes, he destroyed all of them. He just left a pathway of absolute dreadful, dreadful fellow.

• 22:57Speaker 01

  You know, pursuing some ideological.

• 22:59Speaker 00

  Well, what was that? What is the ideology?

• 23:01Speaker 01

  The ideology is free market, you know, the free market will look after us all. Well, that's all very well if you are an F wit and don't do your homework. Because if you do your homework, you know that every country on earth, the average is forty six percent. Forty six percent of a farmer's income comes from the government. In Australia, it's only four percent. So if you're free market, we're up against a thirty six percent head start. And we're running a hundred meter race and we're giving our opponents thirty six meters head start. I mean, jeez, I could beat Lefred Christie. If I do a thirty six meter start, but the final one was dairy. These people get up at five o'clock in the morning, they go to bed at up.

• 23:46Speaker 00

  Toughest job.

• 23:47Speaker 01

  Right? They're the hardest working people. They're not very well educated or anything like that, you know, they're just hard workers, you know. And.

• 23:57Speaker 01

  And he deregulated the dairy.

• 23:59Speaker 00

  Anderson again.

• 24:00Speaker 01

  And that was the final straw for me. I just couldn't walk down the street anymore. I didn't think that I could win this seat. And I checked out, no independent ever got re-elected. They got elected, but they never got re-elected. So I'm walking in my open grave, but that was better than walking down the street and looking people in the eye. Knowing that I was a party to their destruction. It was my party, political party was doing it. It was the National Party that destroyed, except for Wool, that was the ALP. But all the others were destroyed by the, not by the Liberals, by the National Party. And I left, you know, but I asked Andrew G, he recently left the um National Party. And I said, why'd you leave?

• 24:43Speaker 01

  And he said, I was brought up country party. I sent a net out about cars for the country party when I was six years of age. My dad ran for the country party. He said, so I'm country party. Every single principle that we had, the National Party is party to the exact opposite principles. You know, we were formed to get statutory marketing arbitration for our dairy farmers. Um, that was why the party was formed. Now, the party was the party that abolished the right to arbitration for every single agricultural industry in the country. Pitting us and then removing the bars on imports, pitting us against people

• 25:26Speaker 01

  whose average subsidy level is forty five, forty seven percent. Um, so that is the fate of agriculture in Australia. Um, Wool is gone, destroyed by the Labor Party. Um, sugar, all the sugar mills are foreign owned. More and more, they're buying the farms because the farmers are going broke, being screwed by a monopoly position. Woolworths and Coles have now gone up probably about eighty five percent of the market. In fact, the only market they haven't got a little town in. Way out suburbs, they don't want, you know, um, um, so there's only two people to sell your produce to in Australia. And needless to say, I think Queensland and New South Wales

• 26:10Speaker 01

  have lost six federal seats, have vanished, because the population is just going down, down, down. My homeland, the Midwest, four little towns, I'm Clonkarrer, Heundun, four little towns, we had twenty six thousand, we now got six thousand.

• 26:28Speaker 00

  Because there's no business.

• 26:29Speaker 01

  Seven thousand.

• 26:30Speaker 00

  Because there's no jobs, there's, there's no point living there.

• 26:32Speaker 01

  Well, they closed down the wool industry.

• 26:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 26:34Speaker 01

  Then the, it was the A L P that sold the railways, um, she closed down the railways and sold off the mineral part of the railways, um, and, um, a lot of corruption was involved there, uh, not by the minister, but by the head of the railways. And, uh, so, you know, the railways are gone, the whole wool industry is gone. And, you know, like cattle, you, you, we had five wool station properties, um, wool cockies. Now you've got not even one cattle cocky. He, he would just have an overseer on four or five stations, you know, because you really only need people there when you're mustering for, you know, a couple of months a year.

• 27:17Speaker 00

  And let them wander around the rest of the time.

• 27:18Speaker 01

  So there's just no work for them out there. And rural Australia is closing down. They're fleeing to the cities. There's no work out there. Uh, there's no chance of making a quit out there. So they're all just taking off.

• 27:30Speaker 00

  Well, how do you feel as a quintessential proper country party guy from the early days, from the, you know, and, and, and grew up in those environments where you knew all the farmers, you knew all the suppliers, you knew everybody in town?

• 27:44Speaker 01

  I, I, I knew them all when they were committing suicide.

• 27:47Speaker 00

  Oh, really?

• 27:48Speaker 01

  My suicide rate in Australia was between Melander and Atherton, which was the biggest derying area in Australia, which was right in the heart of the electorate I represent.

• 27:57Speaker 00

  Is that, is that through, um, um, being remote or is it just through?

• 28:01Speaker 01

  No, no, no, the deregulation. They were on sixty two cents a litre. On the Friday, when Anderson introduced deregulation, um, they were on twenty seven, twenty six cents on the Monday.

• 28:16Speaker 00

  Why are these guys accountable?

• 28:17Speaker 01

  Sixty two cents, they're on twenty six cents.

• 28:19Speaker 00

  But why, why aren't these individuals who have these ideologies that they're trying to impose on? People have been working hard through generations to establish just a life. They're not rich. They're just, they're putting their kids through school and all that sort of stuff.

• 28:32Speaker 01

  No, I drive, no Mercedes Benz's.

• 28:34Speaker 00

  No.

• 28:34Speaker 01

  But then again, there was none of them being foreclosed on either, you know, in the dairy industry. Um, uh, but their lives completely destroyed and they're simple minded, uneducated people, nice, good people, you know, but, you know, they still don't know what's happened to them, you know, that what the ones that are left, I think still paid L and P. You know, they think it's country party, poor Pecos. Well, no one cares about them because there's only about thirty of them left now, you know.

• 29:01Speaker 00

  Wow, serious?

• 29:03Speaker 01

  Thirty eight.

• 29:03Speaker 00

  Thirty eight?

• 29:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, I was addressing a meeting and I said, we had turned fifty four now, he got fifty eight. And the state member is member of our party as well. He said, try forty eight, Bob. And the lady behind him said, try thirty eight, Shane. That's all that's left.

• 29:21Speaker 00

  How do you feel about that though, as someone who's been in politics for so long?

• 29:24Speaker 01

  I have an inner rage. I mean, Jesus told us we're supposed to love our enemies. Well, you know, the judgment I'm passing upon John Anderson could not be worse. He will go down in history as one of the worst politicians in this nation's history.

• 29:42Speaker 00

  And?

• 29:42Speaker 01

  They say he's found God, but I hope God's found him because I don't know where he's gone.

• 29:47Speaker 00

  What are the people like John Howard? Do you ever still have conversations with John Howard?

• 29:51Speaker 01

  Um, I, I had a lot of time for John, you know, and he suffered great pain in what he saw was going on with agriculture in Australia. But, you know, since all the national party were all country members of parliament, they came from, you know, rural areas. He thought, well, there couldn't be a, I think there's a problem, but. They're not seeing a problem. They're still voting for the, you know, National Party. Well, you know, but in the end, and I think Alan Jones had a lot to do. You commentators, you don't realise how much power you got. But I think, you know, whatever Jones has done or not done in other areas,

• 30:31Speaker 01

  I think he had a lot to do with how becoming aware that this bloke was destroying agriculture in this country.

• 30:38Speaker 00

  Aside from what Alan Jones is, you know, currently dealing with. I mean, one of the things he was great is prosecuting a, a, a strong position for, for the underdog. He was always very good for that.

• 30:48Speaker 01

  Absolutely, absolutely. I mean, he, you know, with this terrible thing that's happened, I don't know whether it happened or not. I'm not being judgmental, but, but outside of that, I thought he's one of the greatest fighters for the Australian people. And he also had, you know, that great passion, um, you know, for the Australian people.

• 31:09Speaker 00

  Well, who are the fighters now?

• 31:11Speaker 01

  No, well, that's what I'm saying here. I've come over to see you.

• 31:15Speaker 00

  What about Matt Canavan?

• 31:16Speaker 01

  There's fewer you people left. Well, you know, a bit like Barnaby Joyce, you know, and, you know, Barnaby and I would agree on everything, you know. We both go to church on Sunday, which is pretty rare these days, but we'd agree on everything. And, but, you know, I said to Barnaby, and I wasn't trying to hurt him. I said, you've been the second most powerful man in Australia for six years. Tell me one single thing that you did in those six years. And it was really sad because he couldn't think of anything. He, he raised the Rockhampton Weir. I said, you had nothing to do with that and you know, know it and you shouldn't have raised it.

• 31:57Speaker 01

  Um, and he felt a bit, you know, upset that he'd raised it because he thought I wouldn't know of it. But, you know, I don't say that in rage or anger, but you know, I say it in sadness with Barnaby, you know, like Matt Canavan is another one, you know, I, I doubt whether I've ever heard Matt say anything that I've disagreed with. Um, I'm very disappointed that he used the attention of Australia.

• 32:25Speaker 01

  And he spent the whole time begging One Nation, well, you know, being my guest, they've taken two of our four seats off us and handed them over to the Liberal Party. And they're running around saying, oh, we're the alternative. No, you're not. You you are destroying the alternative. Um. You're just a running dog, a puppet on a string for the Liberal Party.

• 32:44Speaker 00

  Just on that, because, you know, like, uh, you just mentioned Barnaby and, you know, and you've just mentioned, as you said, One Nation taking seats and especially over there in South Australia recently. But, um, do you think that Matt's strategy around, um,

• 33:01Speaker 01

  Attacking them.

• 33:01Speaker 00

  Trying to hang them out to dry. That's the One Nation is a good strategy?

• 33:05Speaker 01

  I wouldn't have played it that way, but I'm not sure that he's wrong. I mean, if you've got bad out there, I'm not, you know, I use the word evil with Penny Wong and with Tony Burke. But I wouldn't use the word evil here, you know, and I most certainly wouldn't use it against Barnaby.

• 33:23Speaker 00

  And Pauline's not evil as such.

• 33:26Speaker 01

  Um, no, I I wouldn't describe her as evil. But, um, I wouldn't say that she's a good person either, you know, and I won't apologize for saying that, you know. Um, you know, you've got to say, I'm I'm fighting. When my people get hurt, I get angry, right? I'm fighting to get bloody the coalfields, the Galilee Basin coalfields open. I want the bloody tunnel so we can open up the massive, um, uh, mineral province beyond Cairns. You know, I mean, I'm out there because I know that people are suffering and they don't have to suffer.

• 34:06Speaker 01

  And it will get worse unless these things happen. Um, that is not a characteristic of One Nation. Um, uh, they point out some evils out there and that's good. And I think you've got to give a full marks on the migration, whether she was right in the past or not, she may certainly right now. So you give a full marks on that, but, you know, if anyone thinks that it's going to be where Australia should go, well, you know. I mean, I said flippantly and I probably shouldn't have said it, but I said, look, people are so desperate now. There's a doors, what they call doors, you know, cameras when you're going to Parliament. And it was a doors interview. I said, mate, they're so desperate now. They're voting for One Nation. You know.

• 34:50Speaker 00

  You think so? You think the vote for one nation is more a.

• 34:53Speaker 01

  Desperation.

• 34:54Speaker 00

  Yeah, like a.

• 34:54Speaker 01

  Not the slightest doubt in my mind. Um, it's not affection for their policies or, and I don't even know what their policies are outside of, you know, stopping people from coming to country. And good on them for that. Good on them for that. And that is very relevant now. But, yeah, I, um, they're not going to open the Galilee. They're not going to build that tunnel to open up that giant mineral province. They're not going to build the Bradfield Scheme or the Clarence River diversion, which is like the Bradfield Scheme for New South Wales. It doubles the agricultural production of New South Wales. New South Wales produces half of Australia's agricultural production.

• 35:36Speaker 00

  Really?

• 35:37Speaker 01

  And it will double agricultural production in New South Wales. Every drop of water that's diluted by the class will be used for irrigation. Whereas only about a tenth of the water at present moment is used for irrigation, buybacks and, you know, oh, you can't do this and you can't do that. And privatization, it, you know, a lot of water rights are just traded as a commodity and the stock market in Sydney. Um, they don't use it. Um, they just trade it. Um, and Bridgeman was one of the great leaders in Australia, in my opinion. You know, he used to get dressed like a government conferences and he, he said, you know, and he quoted one of the big corporations.

• 36:21Speaker 01

  And they said, as always, the greatest asset we have in our portfolio are water rights. They grow in value every year. And the wonderful thing about them is you don't have to use them. What a terrible quote. But Bridgie quoted that from their annual report to shareholders.

• 36:39Speaker 00

  Wow. It, it, Bob, you've served under so many.

• 36:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:45Speaker 00

  Leaders, it's called leaders.

• 36:46Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 36:47Speaker 00

  Maybe that they didn't lead very well, but you've served under so many. Who's some of the, I mean, apart from Joe? Bioki Peterson, who were some of the great at a federal level? Who were some of our great leaders?

• 36:57Speaker 01

  Well, you know, Leo Hiltshire was the coordinator general in Queensland. I never ever figured out whether Queensland Miracle was Leo or whether it was Joe. And they both claimed it was the other black gentleman, both very humble people. But so, you know, Leo would be right up there. But, you know, when you come back federally, Jack McKeown created the beef road scheme. You know, our property was 260 kilometres from Richmond. And no one had ever put cattle on it. The neighbouring property, Motomai myself bought 500,000 acres.

• 37:40Speaker 01

  There was never been a head of cattle on either place. 500,000 acres, 24 inch rainfall. Most of New South Wales doesn't get 24 inch rainfall. And no cattle have been on it. Well, the beef road scheme changed all of that.

• 37:54Speaker 00

  So access.

• 37:55Speaker 01

  Once you could get, so you couldn't drive anymore, you know, on horseback. And you couldn't get them out on a road. The roads weren't fit to take cattle. So McKeown introduced the beef road scheme. And for example, we bought those properties for, this is ridiculous, I know, $24,000.

• 38:19Speaker 00

  No.

• 38:20Speaker 01

  Half a million acres for sale for 180 million now.

• 38:26Speaker 00

  You should have kept it.

• 38:27Speaker 01

  My partner cries all the time. He says, you hungry bastard, you sell for 28 million.

• 38:33Speaker 00

  Well, you made three grand, you made four grand.

• 38:36Speaker 01

  24,000, it's something for 180 million. But that was the beef road scheme.

• 38:42Speaker 00

  So that's McKeown.

• 38:43Speaker 01

  The cattle out.

• 38:44Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 38:46Speaker 01

  And you could get the cattle in, and that was McKeown. McKeown.

• 38:51Speaker 01

  Set the world price agreement in sugar, which almost doubled our income for sugar. He introduced the arbitration for milk. And at the address, he's only twenty eight years of age. The two thousand turned up for the meeting. And he said, look, as for me, I am sick and tired of living on a dirt floor in a galvanized iron shed, eating rabbits, and I'm not going to do it anymore. So from now on, it gets sold through the marketing corporation. And you do not sell fresh milk outside the marketing corporation. And three of them said, you won't tell us how he can sell our milk. He said, oh, I haven't explained it properly. If you just come out the back of the tent, there's a big, huge market.

• 39:35Speaker 01

  Um, and, and we'll just see if we can, you know, get on each other's wavelengths, yeah? So he took, they went out the back through him for him. And Kieran bashed the hell out of, left all three of them semi-conscious on the ground. Anyone else want them explained to them properly? Shut up. But the Anthony's did exactly the same thing. These are the two great founders of the country party.

• 39:57Speaker 00

  Doug Anthony.

• 39:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, his father, Larry.

• 40:00Speaker 00

  Larry Anthony.

• 40:00Speaker 01

  Did exactly the same thing with bananas. All bananas will be sold through the banana corporate. But in their case, they had a little bit of Sicilian in the family tree. All sense in bed, broken legs, filing cases. And everyone got the message that they sold through the banana grass corporate. And it was sort of funny that, you know, the sort of Sicilian background, because Doug was six foot two, he was six foot three, and he had a big hook nose. You know, typical European nose, his blonde hair and blue eyes. But and there was a heart that was pure Sicilian, I wouldn't have crossed Doug's. But, you know, he was the one that created the wool industry. You know, we were in desperate trouble.

• 40:45Speaker 01

  Every wool girl was technically bankrupt. And he introduced the wool scheme. And then we went back to. Being the juggernaut of the Australian economy under Doug Anthony. So you're asking me who? Well, I'm telling you about the heroes, you know, Doug Anthony and Jack McKeown. When Bajoki Peterson was elected, we were a coal importing country. It's hard to think of that.

• 41:10Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 41:10Speaker 01

  We're a coal.

• 41:10Speaker 00

  Import, really?

• 41:12Speaker 01

  And when they said they're going to build this huge coal port in this big railway line, never end screaming. Oh, it's, you know, corrupt thieves, you know, um, corruption. And, uh, and I, I, um, it wasn't actually for thieves, the first port and railway line. But I thought it's bloody madness, we're a coal importing country. Well, we're going to bet two thousand million, like most of state budget is going to be on a bet that we can become a coal exporting country. And I interviewed Bajoki Peterson and Leo Hillshire, the corner general. But I mean, you're going to go out and spend the entire Queensland budget on a bet that we could become a coal exporting country. Did you have any piece of paper saying they'd buy the coal?

• 41:58Speaker 01

  And Leo said, oh, no, it wasn't like that, you know, we knew that we could sell the coal. That's not the question I'm asking you, Leo. Did you have a piece of paper that said someone's got to buy the coal?

• 42:08Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 42:09Speaker 01

  No, no, no, he said, you don't understand. He dodged the question, he wouldn't answer because they had not one single contract. I asked Bajoki Peterson the same question, and it's the same like, Leo, you know, be ducking and dodging and weaving, right? But they, they put out two thousand million dollars on a bet, the whole Queensland budget for one year, on a bet that we could become a coal exporting country. Well, we did. We've become the biggest coal exporting state within seventeen years on earth. Well, you know, if you looked at Joe's background, you could have seen that. He was almost as big as thieves as a contractor, everyone thought he was a farmer, no, he wasn't. He was a machinery contractor. Yeah, he was a big farmer too, but that was a sideline, you know?

• 42:52Speaker 00

  So it's, it's interesting you should say that because when you, the people you named, um, it wasn't so much about their, um, warm fuzzy sort of leadership style. You talked about.

• 43:05Speaker 00

  What they'd achieved, like you actually like concrete achievements.

• 43:08Speaker 01

  Yes, yes.

• 43:09Speaker 00

  Concrete achievements.

• 43:10Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 43:10Speaker 00

  And you talked about one individual characteristic, which seemed to cut across all of them. And that is the individual characteristic of having courage as a polit- political courage. You know, like, like it's something that where you're spending the whole Queensland budget on one item. That takes a lot of courage.

• 43:27Speaker 01

  Yeah. You know, I was wedged into the Blackfellow portfolio in Queensland. And, uh, you know, I'm related Blackfellas, you know, if you live in small country towns, you cussing brothers, they call them. And I've always identified as often as not as a Blackfellow. I'm dark, I'm a gumfellow on curry, I'm saying Murray from the curry, you know, we're all a bit dark. Anyway, forget about that. But when I was put in the portfolio, I realised that these people are not allowed to own land.

• 44:00Speaker 00

  What?

• 44:01Speaker 01

  They're not allowed to own land. Oh, the tribe owns it or the government owns it or they're holding it in trust for the people. Cause we love the Blackfellas and we just want to look after it for them, you know.

• 44:13Speaker 00

  But we don't trust them.

• 44:15Speaker 01

  But we won't allow them to piss paper, says I own my own home. And, and, but I, I sort of asked them what they wanted. Really, at the end of the day, they wanted the whitefellas out. Everything was being administered by whitefellas out of Brisbane. And they were farmed out from Brisbane onto the pomperouse and dolmetsches and, you know, cow and yarmas. Um, so whitefellas running everything in these places. If we had to pay a squillion dollars to the whitefellas to go out there, live in the middle of nowhere and do this job. Um, but anyway, they wanted to run things themselves and they wanted the whitefellas out. Right. That was obvious to me, but even if they hadn't said that, I'd have still think, hey, this is wrong.

• 44:59Speaker 01

  You know, whitefellas in Brisbane giving all the orders.

• 45:02Speaker 00

  Makes sense.

• 45:03Speaker 01

  Yeah, this is wrong. So, um, you know, I determined that we're going to change it. But the head of the department. As an evil person, you know, not in the business of running people down if I can avoid it. So I'll just leave it at that. And but Pachocky Peterson put the sunshine out of his, well, and out of me. And so what am I going to do now? And a great lady called Pearl Logan, probably the greatest lady of the last century. If twenty three percent of Australia lived in small towns that didn't have secondary schools, unless you were rich, you couldn't go to a boarding school. So, you know, ninety percent of those people that lived, that twenty three percent,

• 45:48Speaker 01

  never got a secondary education. Wow. She got the remote area allowances and the isolated children's allowances through. So we got equality of education for what was then about a fifth of the Australian population. But anyway, a great lady. But anyway, she decided devout Presbyterian, remember all the community areas in Queensland, I can't speak for, but then most of my brother cousins are in Queensland, not in Northern Territory. We got ten times more First Australians in North Queensland, they got Northern Territory. So that's where they all are. But, you know,

• 46:28Speaker 01

  am I going to sit idly by and allow this to continue? No way, I say. And featured in the Australian, who's going to win out of Kettering this head of the department that Pachocky Peterson's in love with? Yeah, well, I won. Did you have to take Joe on? Um, I was sort of very humorous. The Deputy Premier, his daughter married one of the leaders in the Torres Straits. And this bloke had a lot of illegitimate children from the First Australians. And but he was thinking it was funny and I may have in the fight. But then suddenly, when his daughter married one of the leading people up in the Torres Straits,

• 47:11Speaker 01

  he didn't think it was funny at all. And he came down on my side. But, but in the end, George Mai, I've only met seven truly great people in my life. Probably George Mai would be the first one I'd say. And George put all his faith in Jesus. George. George Mai was the legendary leader.

• 47:34Speaker 01

  You know, he's bigger than Ben Hur in the Torres Straits. Wow. And I don't think George liked white fellas a lot.

• 47:42Speaker 01

  It was my impression. And, but, but, you know, he's, you know, very deeply religious. Um, that Marbo case was never run by Marbo was Father Saleh, Anglican priest and George Mai, who was, you know, the thickest thieves that were on that case at all stages. The famous Marbo case. Yeah, yeah, but those were the two that run them. Why they had that tremendous people, they were good people backed Marbo case. Uh, was because it was led at the end of the day by two people of towering moral courage uh, and leadership, Father Saleh and. As in a priest.

• 48:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, here's Anglican priest called Mer Island and George Mai. Uh, and they're very, very close. Um, and, um, but George is very religious. Um, and, um, you know, you never went to a meeting up there, he didn't sing hymns and say prayers. It's just very nice, you know, and in fact, I Christianity is practised in the islands like it's not practised anywhere else on earth. Is that right? Yeah, all the preachers, it's about fifty preachers in Cairns, you know, all from the Torres Straits. So they'll have their own sort of little religion, they're all Christians. But anyway, very attractive people, very attractive. But no, I just gotta add this. This is just terrible, I have to tell you this.

• 49:13Speaker 01

  I had about three hundred and fifty meals in the Torres Straits. I had to go up, down, stay overnight, you know, stay up there for a week, whatever. And I never touched any food from the mainland at all. It was taro, sweet potatoes, mangoes, bananas, but seafood, you know. Grown and caught locally. Fish, fish, you know, um, chugong, um, turtle, um, whatever. Um, so it was, they were totally self-sufficient. The last time I went up there, I measured in the supermarket on Mer Island. Uh, one seventh of the entire shelf space, space was rice. That's what poor people eat.

• 49:57Speaker 01

  Uh, and I did not touch in my seven meals up there, a single scurry of food from the islands. The greenies said, oh, we must protect the barrier reef. Oh, we must protect all of the, uh, the seas for the first Australian people. What's that mean? I will have to close down all the freezers, uh, and all the commercial fishing in Torres Strait. Well, hold on a minute. That's what they get their money from. That's where their incomes come from. Oh, yes, but, you know, they wouldn't want us to destroy the environment, um, and the sea. Um, and, um, so they took away their income and then they took away their source of food.

• 50:42Speaker 01

  Um, you know.

• 50:46Speaker 00

  That's cultural vandalism.

• 50:46Speaker 01

  Is that evil?

• 50:47Speaker 00

  Uh, I think that's cultural vandalism. I mean, their culture.

• 50:50Speaker 01

  Oh, no, I think it's worse than that. I think what you're looking at, what they call it, the Nazis in Germany. Um, you know, where you're annihilated race.

• 50:59Speaker 00

  Genocide.

• 51:00Speaker 01

  Genocide. Now, I think you're looking at in neon lights genocide in the Torres Straits. Um, and the people responsible for that, you will burn in hell. You know, you've got some weird ideology that there's no relationship to human beings or human values. Uh, um, you'll burn in hell. Um, I hope and pray there is hell because that's where I want you to go. You're smooth-talking, double-degreed, uh, Brisbane, you know, uh, Canberra. Um, I hope you burn in hell.

• 51:38Speaker 00

  Yeah, that's interesting because it is, it, I mean, that's has probably destroyed because you, as you say, like, part of the culture of those people is that what they catch, what they produce.

• 51:46Speaker 01

  Completely.

• 51:47Speaker 00

  And it's their food.

• 51:48Speaker 01

  Completely.

• 51:49Speaker 00

  Like, and sharing their food.

• 51:50Speaker 01

  Their right, their right to. Food has been taken away, but by the time you get food from the mainland up to the Torres Strait, it costs a bloody fortune. I mean, you know, the Melbourne Airship only goes out from Thursday Island once or twice a week. I mean, the cost is colossal.

• 52:08Speaker 00

  It's probably not nutritionally right for them either. So like they're, you know, in terms of what they're eating, they're probably not eating anywhere as well as they used to eat.

• 52:15Speaker 01

  Well, you know, this is for the first Australian settlements and, and, you know, I can't speak with authority about other areas, but clearly I can speak about authority for North Queensland. Um, there is no doubt in my mind that the first Australians would have been annihilated. And I'm not going to go into who picked the fight first, you know, but one mob had rifles and the other mob didn't. So we know how this was going to end up. And they would have been all annihilated, except the Christian missionaries, the Anglican Church, pulled them in and reserved three and a half million acres for them in all those community areas, you know, so. And, and then they set up market gardens in all

• 52:58Speaker 01

  of those areas. Well, when I became minister, we kept the market gardens going. Um, but um, we just went in, filled out a form and unless the council disagreed with it, or someone disagreed with you getting.

• 53:15Speaker 00

  Someone objected.

• 53:16Speaker 01

  A frail title, you got a frail title. And they call them cataclysm. I honestly had nothing to do with it. I asked them what they wanted to do. I put it before the committee and it was a really smart committee. Mick Vivers played for Australia.

• 53:34Speaker 00

  Oh, I remember, yeah, I remember.

• 53:36Speaker 01

  Mick sent his money home and bought all the neighbouring dairy farms, his richest courses. This is on the Gold Coast, stone's throw from service paradise. Um, so Mick was really. Super intelligent bloke, Dougie Jennings, wouldn't be part of the O V Jennings, his father's O V Jennings, he says father gave a million dollars and go away. So he went up to Gulf Country and made twenty eight million in cattle.

• 54:02Speaker 00

  Killed it.

• 54:03Speaker 01

  I don't mean, Dougie is a smart, tough bloke. So Jennings was on the committee. Um, now the bloke is the commentator for rugby league in Australia. And he was also the headmaster of the biggest school in Queensland. But you know, they're all smart blokes and achievers, you know, on the committee. And so they, I says what the black fellows want, it's just up to you blokes. And everyone said, yeah, kick the white fellows out and let them run their own show. Yeah.

• 54:34Speaker 00

  I love it.

• 54:34Speaker 01

  It was unanimous decision and that's the way we went. Well, they've now gone under the Local Government Act and it's so restrictive that it makes a mockery. They've all got white fellows back in running everything now. Um, and, you know, that famous film of Rajak Kifflings. If, you know, watch everything that you have ever built smashed to pieces and have to try and put it back together with a broken, worn out hands. Yeah, yeah, that's what we were at at the first moment.

• 55:07Speaker 00

  So Bob, what frustrates you most in Australia now? Just generally in terms of the political structure, what the political structure allows to happen. What frustrates you most?

• 55:19Speaker 01

  I really appreciate you giving me a bit of time on your program. Because before the Senator Kim Carr left, and I didn't know Kim. I've never spoken to him in my life. He said, Bobby, I want you to come down for a cup of tea. He'd already announced his retirement, but he was the leader in the Senate off and on for about twenty years. Highly respected on both sides of the House. And I want you to come down. So when I went down, made me a cup of tea and he said, Bobby, politicians today won't govern, you'll never be able to get them to govern. They don't govern anymore. I said, when did you come back in conclusion? He said, two years ago. So you've beaten me. I come back in conclusion five months ago.

• 56:02Speaker 01

  You know, it's not that they're bad guys or good guys or that they're greenies or that they hate black fellows or whatever, you know, got nothing to do with it. They're just incapable of governing.

• 56:16Speaker 01

  We're trying to get goods in, do much at the present moment, you know, with this fuel crisis. And, um, you know, I mean, it's sort of silly even ringing up. I've got a bloke dying, you know, and he said, oh, well, you know, we've done our best with the, um, uh, um, the body that oversights drug use in Australia, pharmaceutical, um, uh, uh, mob. And we've done our best, you know, and I'm pretty confident they'll come our side. Um, and I said, hey, I've got somebody dying here, yeah? Um, and I'm gonna pin it on you, um, your boss, I'm gonna pin it on him. Because what else am I gonna do?

• 57:02Speaker 01

  You know, and it's no use me doing it afterwards, I'm not doing it to hurt you. I'm doing it to try and get, save this bloke's life. And he said, well, I'll make a decision tomorrow, you know, and I think it'll be favorable. Well, it wasn't favorable. So, you know, um, there's only so many people that I can destroy. And, you know, I hope Jesus won't judge me harshly, but I did destroy the deputy premier of Queensland. Um, Gordon Chalk. And I did destroy Jackie Trad, deputy premier of Queensland. I did destroy Micah Hearn, premier of Queensland.

• 57:41Speaker 01

  When I came down here, um, yeah, um, I was not, I can't claim Anderson scalp. But, um, I most certainly made a contribution, you know? Jonesy probably made the biggest contribution. And John Howard, you know, John Howard just had a gut full of me. And, uh, and I got a lot of time for John, a lot of respect for John. Um, you know, he's your standout, just an ordinary sort of bloke, just trying to do good for Australia. Um, that was the way I always saw him and an honest bloke too, you know? He, he just didn't think he should loyal, misrepresent. Uh, anyway, forget about that. But, uh, yeah, well. What about the current mob?

• 58:26Speaker 01

  What about the current mob? Well, you know, um.

• 58:30Speaker 01

  I'm a little bit jaundiced here because Elba and I went in about the same time, you know, and I just, when those blokes are getting on well with you, you know, we're heavily involved in rugby league. He's likeable. And he's just an ordinary knockabout Australian, you know, he's been out to Ewondon twice and he just sat in the pub like, you know what I mean, with a rich Gracie or, or, you know, blokes worked in the railway or, you know, um, contractors or whatever, you know, he was right at home talking to any of them, you know, and, um, and he's that sort of bloke, you know, um, but his party, um, if I was saying who had the power, I'd

• 59:13Speaker 01

  say that Penny Wong and Tony Burke had as much power as he, Scott, stroke Flibber second on their side, which is a bit unfair to Tanya, but all the same, um, you know, he's got terrible difficulties in taking the country where he'd like to take it. What about Chalmers, his treasurer? Um, you know, I hesitate because I don't know him and I don't think he counts for anything. And so I just sort of, um, and, um, I mean, I know nothing bad about him and, you know, nothing good about him. Um, but you know, I mean, clearly the superannuation.

• 59:54Speaker 01

  And I said, Kevin O'Sullivan's been really stupid, you know, and I suspect there's a problem there. I won't go into that. But, um, I said, we have got to get some off that. All of Australia's savings going superannuation, all they're doing is selling shares backwards and forwards to each other. Um, uh, or, or property and, and that accounts for about 80% of the expenditure. Um, you know, there's a bit, bit of housing, but very small bit, but, uh, it's just contributing nothing. It's, it's just been taken off the Australian people and they're playing Monopoly with each other. And, um, he said, John Maynard Keynes said, we're so re- well, we're so re-. The famous economist.

• 1:00:39Speaker 01

  Said this early on, yeah. Um, um, but so we've got no money for development. It's useless me saying, oh, will you please build a dam or build this tunnel or build, you know, railway line to open the Galway, because they've got no money to spend. Now, when I say they've got no money to spend. Queensland's got massive income from coal tax. Uh, the coal tax in Queensland is twice that in New South Wales.

• 1:01:07Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 1:01:08Speaker 01

  Twice that in New South Wales. And of course, it will close down the industry. So what the current Premier is saying, and I don't know whether he's wrong on honesty, this bloke. But what he's saying to the backbenchers, just sit tight. The tax will close the mines, already three big mines have already closed. It was the A L P introduced this massive tax revenue thing, because they got to pay for the Olympic Games. They got sixty two thousand million dollars.

• 1:01:40Speaker 00

  Unbelievable.

• 1:01:41Speaker 01

  Olympic Games. And what will they get out of it? It won't create a single job in Australia, just a big excitement machine for the politicians. Uh, but anyway, um, so the coal industry will be strangled to death by that tax. But Christopher Lee will be long gone, fucking, it crashes down.

• 1:02:02Speaker 00

  I mean, you're, you spend time down in Canberra. Um, and most people don't really have a sense of this when you go down to the mothership. What's it like, um, having to hang out in Canberra? What, what does, what does Bob Cadda do?

• 1:02:14Speaker 01

  It's interesting. When I went down there, the first night I was in Canberra, um, and, um, um, I went down to the bar. You know, wherever in congregation you talk to people. And, um, knowing you where the bar was, but after about an hour, I found out where the bar was. And there were two blokes there, they weren't journalists and they weren't politicians. They weren't staffers, I really didn't know they were. Um, so when does everyone come into the bar? And blokes say, well, no one comes in the bar. In Queensland, you can't move in a public bar. It is absolutely packed at Parliament House. And, you know.

• 1:02:51Speaker 00

  It's a public bar in Parliament House.

• 1:02:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, and no one goes there, right? In Queensland, you can't move, it's packed to the gun walls.

• 1:02:58Speaker 00

  But just with, with government people or anybody?

• 1:03:01Speaker 01

  No, in the Queensland case, only politicians.

• 1:03:05Speaker 00

  Only politicians.

• 1:03:06Speaker 01

  Unless they bring one of their staffers in, but he can't go in by himself. So, um, just interesting comment, you know, that they don't talk to each other.

• 1:03:14Speaker 00

  So there's no camaraderie, you don't think that?

• 1:03:16Speaker 01

  No camaraderie.

• 1:03:17Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:03:18Speaker 01

  They all hate each other, they all carry a knife to stab each other in the back.

• 1:03:21Speaker 00

  Yuck.

• 1:03:22Speaker 01

  And I mean, what's happened in the national party, I mean? It's really disgusting. It's just, you know, constant warfare. Who's gonna be the boss? You know, and cause Von Rib didn't make it as boss, so he's rolling his wagon, leaving, you know. And um, um, one other same thing, but I mean, um, they just spend their time, you know, hacking each other to pieces. It's a pity they didn't spend a bit of time criticizing the government.

• 1:03:51Speaker 00

  What do you think about the Liberals at federal?

• 1:03:53Speaker 01

  And I've been unfair to Karen, Karen Vanney, you know, um.

• 1:03:58Speaker 00

  I think he's got pretty good morals, Matt, and um, well, time will tell whether he can make a difference or not.

• 1:04:04Speaker 01

  You know, every time I've heard him speak, I thought that's good, you know.

• 1:04:07Speaker 00

  He speaks well. He's very good on his feet.

• 1:04:09Speaker 01

  But, you know, he understands the problems and, but, you know, has he got the personal force to build a dam? I don't know. If I had to say, I'd say no, he hasn't got the personal force needed. You know, to do that, well, I put the first solid standalone solar system in Australia. It is fabulous in remote areas, right? It is monumental craziness. And I speak with authority, I put the first ones in, in Australia. It is monumental stupidity in a city. Um, uh, but, you know, if we're talking about, you know, I don't know, um, way out in the Boondocks,

• 1:04:50Speaker 01

  um, in New South Wales, uh, yeah, no, it's good sense in a remote town or location. Um, very good sense. Um, but so I put the first solar system in, uh, in Australia. We put the first porn and fish farm in, in Australia. That industry will be bringing a well over a thousand million a year now, that industry. But, you know. I come from backgrounds, you know, where um I had to build my own bloody fences up on St Francis. I had to find where I could put get water, you know, from underground up on

• 1:05:33Speaker 01

  St Francis. I I walked about two hundred kilometres trying to get a road in, you know, so he could get in and out of the bloody place. Um, and but, you know, I did it all myself. But, you know, these people are brought up not to sort of know how to do any of those things. And, you know, Dailly and I get on extremely well, you know, and she's very conscious of the fact that they lost five thousand jobs when the underwear industry left Sydney and Brisbane, five thousand jobs went to China. Um, and she's very conscious of that, you know, and she wants those jobs back. Or Dailly will say,

• 1:06:13Speaker 01

  I want underwear industry back. And I'll say, I want dams so my people can have an income. And we're saying the same thing. Not surprisingly, I've just come from a meeting in Dice Office.

• 1:06:25Speaker 00

  Is it fair to say then that we are not protecting jobs in this country by protecting industries?

• 1:06:32Speaker 01

  Well, I think um it's infinitely worse than that. I mean, you removed the protection for the garments industry. So all the garments industry is gone. You removed the protection on the motor vehicle industry. So the motor vehicle industry is gone. Um, um, you um allowed the oil to be exported for nothing. And uh and you allowed all the refineries to close in Australia. So now you have to import petrol.

• 1:07:05Speaker 00

  And now look where we are.

• 1:07:06Speaker 01

  Sixty two thousand million dollars a year. It is twice as big as any other import.

• 1:07:15Speaker 01

  Three times as big as any other import, except for motor vehicles. Um, it's twice as big as motor vehicles. Um, and also there's the little matter of my horse died and I'm going to have to walk to the supermarket. You know, unless I can buy another horse, you know, um, this is serious stuff. Uh, and I'm not Robinson Crusoe, there's about 20 million other Australians in the same boat. But, you know, what's the government doing about it? Well, if they're doing something, I'm not aware of it.

• 1:07:47Speaker 00

  Um, and you should be, when you're there, you're not seeing anything.

• 1:07:51Speaker 01

  Well, you know, I would say that the minister would be one of the biggest gooses I have seen in politics in 51 years. I mean, and I've seen a lot of gooses.

• 1:08:04Speaker 00

  Is this Bowen?

• 1:08:05Speaker 01

  Well, he, the.

• 1:08:06Speaker 00

  Is he from Chris Bowen?

• 1:08:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I, I haven't been questioned by him the last four days. Um, but the day before that, he told everyone, you know, there was question after question on. He told everyone there was no problem.

• 1:08:21Speaker 00

  I heard.

• 1:08:21Speaker 01

  I think he quoted the figures, you know, that, uh, you know, there's no clauses or anything. Um, and, um, um, well, I would expect nothing more or less from him. Um, but, you know, as I say, Elbow, I, I don't think he's strong enough to override Berkey or, or, um, Penny.

• 1:08:45Speaker 00

  Penny Wong.

• 1:08:45Speaker 01

  Uh, Wong.

• 1:08:46Speaker 00

  What do you think? What is it that, does, is Burke have something like he somehow seems to be able to, you know, for cause of his own electorate, he seems to be able to, um, influence, um, the prime minister or the party at least in relation to his own.

• 1:08:59Speaker 01

  He's a quiet machinery man.

• 1:09:00Speaker 00

  Is he?

• 1:09:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. Um, and, you know, quiet machinery man do all right in politics. Um, um, I was just with, um.

• 1:09:11Speaker 01

  No, um, um, but, you know, Prime Ministers like Morrison, he was just a quiet machinery man, you know, and he became Prime Minister. Um, uh, I mean, there's nothing necessarily wrong with that. I mean, John Howard was, you know, couldn't, could be argued. But, but yeah, I'm, I'm interested in how we turn this around. And

• 1:09:33Speaker 00

  Yeah. How do we turn around?

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  Well, you know, the only vehicle I've got to offer the Australian people, uh, is a voice. Um, and that, don't underestimate the power of the voice. Um, uh, you know, the pen is mightier than the sword. And that's a pretty good saying. Um, but, you know, outside of that, there's, you know, five or six people sitting on independents who are genuinely representing the people and their electorates. And they just coalesce, coalesce naturally. It may not be a party, but I mean, I've just come from meetings of the five

• 1:10:15Speaker 01

  of them, you know. Um, so, um, you know, they work together. Um, and, um, maybe if that number becomes fifteen or twenty, um, then you'll see difference. If in Queensland our party can get eight seats, thanks to Pauline Hanson, when we cut back from four to two. And if she touts herself as the answer, in Queensland, we could have had the balance of power. And she destroyed us. She's a puffin on a string for a very rich person. Uh, now, that would be the way that I would see it. And, um, she's done great work on migration. But, um, what does she contribute to Australia? Well, she stopped us from getting

• 1:10:58Speaker 01

  eight seats, which I think we could have got at the next election. Um, I heard Robbie Caddis speaking, he said, we'll get the balance of power, whether it's next election or it's ten years' time. And that's still a pretty good call. And she's got to think about this. And thank goodness Barnaby's there. But she's got to think about this. You know, we'll get three hundred thousand. We're going to run in every seat in Queensland. And we won't get candidates in all seats. Well, I think we get a couple hundred thousand last election. But, uh, if we're running in all seats, we'll go over three hundred thousand. Well, if we decide not to give her the preferences, she's gone. But I don't think she was the front of the queue when they in and out cleverness, you know.

• 1:11:40Speaker 00

  Do you think Barnab, do you think Barnaby can sort of steel up that group? Do you think Barnaby is gonna give it what it needs?

• 1:11:46Speaker 01

  Well, I'm hoping and praying to the good lords, you know, that, that he can. Um, and they're pretty good egos, both of them, you know, I'd be curious to see how they sit in the same room together.

• 1:11:59Speaker 00

  That would be interesting.

• 1:12:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:12:02Speaker 00

  I'm gonna interview her in a couple of weeks' time, which is gonna be interesting. I'm actually gonna go and interview her and James, her chief of staff guy. Um, but I'm, I'm, I'm looking forward to it.

• 1:12:12Speaker 01

  He has, you know, maybe he's calling all the shots there, I don't know.

• 1:12:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:12:17Speaker 01

  There's no way Barnaby will be bending to him, I wouldn't think.

• 1:12:20Speaker 00

  Yeah, it's gonna be interesting to see how this all unfolds. I mean, Australian politics is at a really, at a real big inflection point right now. Liberals are sort of waning, One Nation looks and making a lot of noise and there's changes going on there. Independence like yourself, thank God we've got independence like yourself. And I have to ask you, Bob, there's no retirement from you coming soon.

• 1:12:42Speaker 01

  No, no, you know, I mean, I got all my faculties, I'm writing my second book.

• 1:12:47Speaker 00

  You certainly demonstrated that today.

• 1:12:49Speaker 01

  Uh, you know, I mean, this sounds egotistical, but I had to battle my ways with about forty one people this morning wanting photographs. And it's lovely.

• 1:12:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:12:58Speaker 01

  But you, you sort of gotta walk over here or walk over there or go walk backwards or, you know. And, and it's demanding physically.

• 1:13:07Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:13:07Speaker 01

  And, um, well, you know, probably walked about two kilometres today.

• 1:13:12Speaker 00

  Yeah, probably tough stock though, mate, you know, like.

• 1:13:14Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, hardy peasant stock and.

• 1:13:19Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:13:19Speaker 01

  You know, small people from.

• 1:13:21Speaker 00

  They're the best, mate.

• 1:13:22Speaker 01

  Uh, where you do it all yourself, um, whether you like it or not. Um, and a bit funny on the other side of my family, you know, the mother's side. But, um, um, uh, I just wrote my second book and I used the Annalise as a good example, you know. They almost perished in the Buddy Western Desert, Dashing Gold, because they knew nothing about it. And then they became big, um, people in Brisbane. And they went from Western Australia, Brisbane, as far away as they could get from, you know, Western. And, um, uh, did it right, you know, um, um, uh. Shoe repairs and bootmakers and but everyone's riding horses, they've become big saddles and

• 1:14:06Speaker 01

  then there's dollies and stables and big shopping centre in Paddington and very wealthy. Till great grandad, to quote my mother, had an affair with a floozy.

• 1:14:18Speaker 00

  Having a floozy for a while.

• 1:14:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, left a family fortune and um but um uh but you know, the only thing, you know, they knew they were important, well, no one else knew they were important, but so I'd sort of run around the Masonic Lodge and Labour unions, you know, um but I said, yeah, I suppose, I don't know, and um Christian Porter was Henley, that's Bob Cadder, as long as serving, and the other one should have been Prime Minister, but chose another pathway and we'll leave it at that, so um.

• 1:15:01Speaker 00

  There's no, there's no early, there's no retirement, early retirement plans.

• 1:15:04Speaker 01

  No, I, I have no justification to retire, you know, um, I'm mentally agile and I have enormous accumulated knowledge, um.

• 1:15:15Speaker 00

  That's for sure.

• 1:15:16Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, and um, um, you know, I've got no way I can justify just shelling my rifle and walking out of the tree.

• 1:15:24Speaker 00

  You also know where all the creaky boards are too, you know, you've been around long enough to know where all the creaky boards are, you know, every single step in the joint.

• 1:15:31Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:15:32Speaker 00

  And you're every predecessor before that.

• 1:15:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, and um, I'll give you one example of that, I've never been able to use a computer. And the reason for that was in the Fitzgerald Inquirer in Queensland, we're trying to weed out, there was some really bad corruption and we had to weed it out and that's bloody awful. Uh, but they were putting up child pornography on the good coppers, the ones that had tried to rein in the uh, the um, and um, you know, like, I think there were eight or nine of them suicided the good coppers, um, twenty of them became, twenty odd became alcoholics, um, all of them were kicked out of the police force. These were the good guys

• 1:16:17Speaker 01

  that had the courage to stand up and try and overcome the corruption. In the meantime, the leader of it all, um, isn't.

• 1:16:28Speaker 01

  Got a nice house in the most expensive address in Australia and a very courageous journalist said, um, senior sergeant, um, I'm still scared to use his name, you know, those senior sergeant, you're living in the most expensive address in Australia. Um, you've got two top of the range Mercedes Benz, your wife doesn't work and you've done all that on eighty thousand dollars a year as a senior sergeant. Could you explain this to the people of Australia?

• 1:16:57Speaker 00

  How do you go?

• 1:16:58Speaker 01

  Well, I s- I said, I'm getting away from you. You are definitely, I'm going to get caught in a ricochet.

• 1:17:06Speaker 01

  He's just one of those blokes that, you know, journalists with immense courage and uh, Christian conviction for the sake of a better word. Um, yeah, but yeah, the bigger picture is absolutely disastrous.

• 1:17:21Speaker 00

  So thank God we've got people still around like you have the history of the joint. But importantly, you know, I, I guess what I wanted to say to you, Bob, especially out of this conversation is, uh, I think, and it doesn't get said enough, we should thank you for your, like your continued conviction about your principles and your values. I mean, like you've never, you'd never moved from those um, principles and values. And, and that's what we need in our politicians. You're not fungible. You're not a changeable. You're not saying, oh, I'm going to change this because it's suitable and it's more popular to go down this way. You s- you've got your position and you stay your, your road.

• 1:18:00Speaker 01

  Yep, yep.

• 1:18:01Speaker 00

  And I want to say thank you for that.

• 1:18:03Speaker 01

  And before we conclude, I just want to paint a picture for you.

• 1:18:07Speaker 00

  Please do.

• 1:18:08Speaker 01

  We built the Bradfield Scheme. Dr. Bradfield, but Sydney Harbour, which is your water supplier here. Um, the University of Queensland, um, the Underground Railway System, which won the world prize for engineering. Uh, let's just say a year a bit about engineering, but the Bradfield Scheme diverts the water from my electorate where it rains all the bloody time under it, it's rainfall, a little bit of that water puts it out where it never rains. My homeland, Western Queensland. Um, and that creates with a bit of adjuncts, sixty thousand million dollars a year.

• 1:18:42Speaker 00

  That's a lot of money.

• 1:18:43Speaker 01

  That is the total expenditure of the Queensland Government every year. It will create that every year. Um, Clarence River is not far behind. It will double.

• 1:18:57Speaker 01

  Agriculture in the biggest agricultural state in Australia, the Clarence River diversion. Um, now that's the water schemes. The Galilee Basin coal will double coal production in Queensland, which is a big coal producer, the New South Wales. Um, so there you go. Now, I've just reeled off three items.

• 1:19:19Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:19:19Speaker 01

  Like around hundred and twenty billion dollars a year. What's Queensland government spending the money on? Jalen Fitzgames.

• 1:19:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:19:26Speaker 01

  Jalen Fitzgames.

• 1:19:28Speaker 00

  Well, that's, that's sort of, um, that says it all, you know, right there and then.

• 1:19:32Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:19:33Speaker 00

  And it's all sitting, and it all sits in the, in the, in the coast. It doesn't go anywhere near the regions.

• 1:19:38Speaker 01

  Yeah, and, you know, the country party, we always describe ourselves as the owner operator party, you know? But when you divert that water, you create seven thousand farms. Now, for every farm, you have a contractor, electrician, plumber, whatever, right? And electrician, he retired at thirty nine. He bought acreage on the Birken river, which cost a fortune. And he goes for a trip overseas every year. So we're going to refer from this, that you don't want your kids to be lawyers, you want them to be electricians.

• 1:20:15Speaker 00

  Yeah, they are, that's for sure.

• 1:20:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:20:17Speaker 00

  And plumbers.

• 1:20:18Speaker 01

  So, so, you know, I mean, there'll be seven million people move out of cities into country New South Wales and country Queensland. And the third one is the bridging scheme in Western Australia, Ernie Bridge. Bridge is very close by the one, but he had a Bradphil scheme or Clarence River diversion scheme for the north of Western Australia and for that Northern Territory area as well, bridging. So you had the bridging scheme to that channel. And, um, well, that moves, as I say, seven million people out of the cities. And their owner operators, they, you know, they've got nice houses and nice gardens and, you know, like ten acres of land or whatever.

• 1:21:02Speaker 01

  Um, and, uh, uh, so you've got the farmers, but you've also got all the people that, you know, will make a very good living off the farmers. And, um, um, it'll be a much richer and happier Australia. Um, and, um. The bloke who wrote that beautiful song, you know, to kick off the 200 years celebrations, we've done us proud to come this far, um, um, a hundred, 200 years to where we are. And every time I said that, one of the people running for us was First Australian, she was a real character. She was super beautiful, but real character. She said, you know, I'd, you know, I'd sing the song in a pub, you know, she'd bash the hell out of me, start screaming, you know, the little skinny thing, you know.

• 1:21:45Speaker 01

  And she said, bullshit, 50,000 years.

• 1:21:51Speaker 00

  Trumped, yeah, trumped.

• 1:21:52Speaker 01

  Well, well, yeah, anyway, but, um, um, I, I, I'm definitely shutting up on this note. Um, I was the unit historian for the 49th Battalion. We're at war in Borneo, then we're at war in, in, in Vietnam, and then we're at war in Iraq. The first war in Iraq. And, um, anyway, I was the unit historian for the 49th Battalion. And I went up to the Colonel, I said, look, we covered ourselves in glory in the First World War. The Second World War, not quite so good. This is only 17 or 18 years after the war had ended, you know. And he said, what do you want to do? I'm only going to go down to the RSL and ask around and get the true story. Well, we might have been a fallback battalion, but then again, we mightn't have been.

• 1:22:37Speaker 01

  He said, you're all right, Cutter, you don't need finishing, do you? Colonel, we go, no, well, if not. And anyway, you're down the RSL, you know, it's about a hundred people there. Hey, what do you know, anything about the 49th in the war? And Black yelled at, yeah, mate, come down here. He said, 49th. I said, yeah, yeah, I'm the unit historian for the 49th. I'm, I'm certain commander with 49th. He said, um, 49th, he said, mate, they were the worst hit of all. When they relieved San Onofre, the bottom of the Cacada Track. Um, he said, there are only 28 of them able to walk out unassisted. I said, 28, sorry.

• 1:23:19Speaker 01

  So you know how many men left Port Moresby? 783 men left Port Moresby. 28. He said, 28. And their average age was 18, more than half of them were 17 or 16.

• 1:23:35Speaker 01

  That's my country.

• 1:23:37Speaker 00

  Bob Keller, what a great red finish. Thanks very much, Brian. Appreciate it.