#ICYMI - World Series Slugfest, with Neil deGrasse Tyson

The 2017 World Series is the greatest slugfest in the Fall Classic’s history. After 8 different batters hit home runs in a record-setting Game 2, Gary O’Reilly and Chuck Nice searched for scientific explanations with Neil Tyson and weather expert William Patzert. Don’t miss an episode of Playing with Science. Subscribe to our channels on: TuneIn: tunein.com/playingwithscience Apple Podcasts: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/playing-with-science/id1198280360 GooglePlay Music: https://play.google.com/music/listen?u=0#/ps/Iimke5bwpoh2nb25swchmw6kzjq SoundCloud: https://soundcloud.com/startalk_playing-with-science Stitcher: http://www.stitcher.com/podcast/startalk/playing-with-science NOTE: StarTalk All-Access subscribers can watch or listen to this entire episode commercial-free: https://www.startalkradio.net/all-access/world-series-slugfest-with-neil-degrasse-tyson/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I'm here, but in fact, this is not my show.

• 0:15Gary O'Reilly?

  I know, but we like to get you into the

• 0:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, don't like put me all up front in the show.

• 0:19Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah, yeah, let's do that.

• 0:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm here to offer color commentary on whatever you guys talk about.

• 0:23Chuck Nice?

  See, and this is, this is how you know, uh, who you are in the realm of pop culture and science and life, when, uh, it's not even your show and they're like, "He's here, it's his show now."

• 0:37Gary O'Reilly?

  Headliner.

• 0:38Chuck Nice?

  Headline is here, it's his show now.

• 0:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You're blinded by the day.

• 0:42Chuck Nice?

  Well, that's right. Uh, my name is Chuck Nice and with me,

• 0:46Gary O'Reilly?

  Gary O'Reilly and this is Playing with Science and today, yesterday, we will take a special look at the 2017 World Series, a straight up slugfest between Astros and Dodgers. And that is Chuck, it doesn't matter. It's a series that so far has given us hot hands, home runs and triple-digit heat and that, by the way, is just the temperature.

• 1:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Chuck, those sound effects have no correspondence to anything that happens in baseball.

• 1:12Chuck Nice?

  I know, that just makes them so cool. Unless there's a, um, a bench clearing brawl, then, then that's when my that's when it works, but other than that, absolutely.

• 1:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, there's no

• 1:23Chuck Nice?

  There is no sound like that.

• 1:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Balls, the bat, nothing. The spitting, nothing.

• 1:27Chuck Nice?

  Oh, wait a minute, you just gave me a great idea. What I want to do now is actually dub a baseball game with my sound effects. So a home run would be like, and then people would be like, "Ow!", instead of the roar of the crowd. So here's what we want to, here's, I am happy. Here's what we want to know. Was it the 103 Fahrenheit game in game one or the high 90s temperatures in game two? That was responsible for all these dingers or was it just the baseball itself?

• 1:54Gary O'Reilly?

  You know, after game two, Dallas Keuchel, Astros pitcher, said, "A hundred percent of balls are juiced." "What if it's all fiction?"

• 2:02Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, well, here to give us some answers that we need, of course, we have, we need some proper home run hitting, some power hitting. You already heard him. We're talking about Neil deGrasse Tyson. And we also have NASA oceanographer and global weather expert, our good buddy Bill, Dr. Bill Patrick will be with us.

• 2:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Cool.

• 2:20Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 2:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Cool.

• 2:21Gary O'Reilly?

  And then stick around for part three because on today's show, we'll be taking your questions live about physics and baseball. And we get those two experts to stand up and give you the answers that you deserve.

• 2:32Chuck Nice?

  Yeah. So if you're a big fan of baseball or just a fan of the cosmos, or everybody is a fan of Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson. So if any of those things fall within your wheelhouse, go ahead and give us a call. Okay. At eight seven seven nine seven four seven four eight seven. I knew I, I knew I was missing something in that statement. I've only been doing radio for 20 years and I was like, somehow that statement seemed incomplete.

• 3:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, just give us a call. Yeah, smoke signals off.

• 3:02Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 3:04Chuck Nice?

  Give us a call. Figure out my phone number.

• 3:07Gary O'Reilly?

  Anything but a break through the window.

• 3:10Chuck Nice?

  There you go.

• 3:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  There's only 99 million versions of a phone, of a phone number.

• 3:14Chuck Nice?

  Absolutely.

• 3:15Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, the, the thing is that you've actually calculated that.

• 3:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, actually it's bigger than that. It's 10 digits.

• 3:19Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 3:20Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So that's, that's basically 100 billion numbers. Yeah.

• 3:24Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 3:24Gary O'Reilly?

  Someone, someone could get lucky. But that only if luck exists.

• 3:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But there's some numbers that don't exist, like 00000000. You gotta subtract those out. But it's basically 100 billion numbers. There's plenty of numbers for like everybody on earth.

• 3:36Chuck Nice?

  Absolutely.

• 3:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, for now.

• 3:37Chuck Nice?

  For now. And let's hope for a long while.

• 3:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, we hope for.

• 3:41Chuck Nice?

  Let's hope I'm not part of that number when we get to that number.

• 3:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, we will die long bef, we will go extinct long before that number becomes real. Unless of course, we colonize other planets. But that's a different show.

• 3:53Chuck Nice?

  Oh, that is a different show. And I'm sure that there's some people who'll be very interested in that. So speaking, um, Gary, do you want to get to, uh, the weather as you brought it up earlier?

• 4:03Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah.

• 4:03Chuck Nice?

  The fact that we had some serious, uh, October anomaly, I guess you want to call it in that.

• 4:10Gary O'Reilly?

  It's not, it's not an anomaly because I mean, game one back in Dodger Stadium seems so long ago, it was sizzling. 103 degrees Fahrenheit. Now that.

• 4:21Gary O'Reilly?

  Is due to possibly, maybe not, maybe yes, the Santa Ana winds. They come in, down slope winds come off the map and they are brutal.

• 4:29Chuck Nice?

  I don't ever remember.

• 4:31Gary O'Reilly?

  But they don't have humidity.

• 4:32Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 4:33Gary O'Reilly?

  And that.

• 4:33Chuck Nice?

  But it's a dry heat.

• 4:34Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah.

• 4:35Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 4:35Gary O'Reilly?

  So that's where we're gonna get a little bit of science to come in. And is that why we've got warm weather, hot weather? That's why we're seeing so many home runs in that stadium.

• 4:46Chuck Nice?

  I don't know. I think Dr. Tyson will have something to say about that because I've actually heard you speak about weather and how it affects the flight of baseballs with respect to humidity in particular. I don't want to get into it now, but I don't want to get into it now because I don't want to spoil it.

• 5:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I'm here for you.

• 5:05Chuck Nice?

  Ah, thank you.

• 5:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But I not being the meteorologist or the climatologist.

• 5:10Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 5:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I cannot speak of what on earth past wind across the place to make it that hot? Whose winds is it? I don't know. Santa Ana past winds or not?

• 5:20Chuck Nice?

  Oh, that Anna. She is such a classy girl.

• 5:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But the density of air is a very clear sort of physical thing that we can talk about when you're ready.

• 5:31Chuck Nice?

  Awesome. Awesome.

• 5:33Gary O'Reilly?

  So do we want to get to, as Dallas Keuchel said, these balls are juiced?

• 5:38Chuck Nice?

  Yes.

• 5:39Gary O'Reilly?

  Want to get on that? I mean, the.

• 5:40Chuck Nice?

  I believe Anna said that too.

• 5:42Gary O'Reilly?

  Hmm, sorry. So, okay.

• 5:44Chuck Nice?

  I'm so sorry.

• 5:45Gary O'Reilly?

  Let's get the good doctor to explain to us how it would be possible to juice a baseball in terms of the physics and what would be the ramifications there.

• 5:56Chuck Nice?

  Okay. Hey, Dr. Patzer, Bill, how are you, my friend?

• 6:00Speaker 03

  Hey, fellas.

• 6:01Chuck Nice?

  Hey, Bill's here. What the hell of a game, man. Hell of a game. Did you enjoy it? We know you're a Dodgers fan, right?

• 6:08Speaker 03

  Yeah, I'm a Dodgers fan, but I'm just exhausted, you know? It was like whiplash going back and forth.

• 6:14Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, yeah. Well, listen, they got, they got two more chances to pull this thing out. What are you thinking? What are you thinking? I know you're a fan, but are you still encouraged, sir?

• 6:24Speaker 03

  Oh, no, no, I'm, you've got to be optimistic, you know? I've been with the Dodgers for so long now, I can't give up on them.

• 6:31Chuck Nice?

  Wait, were you with them when they were in Brooklyn?

• 6:34Speaker 03

  Well, you know, when I was a kid, uh, my dad took me to see, uh, Jackie Robinson at Old Abbot's Field.

• 6:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So he's legit, he's legit, you're legit, okay.

• 6:42Speaker 03

  And so, uh, you know, uh, that was it, you know, I still remember the, the Emerald Field, walking out through the tunnel. You know, I can, uh, it's one of my earliest memories of baseball.

• 6:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, you're sounding like a Ken Burns documentary now.

• 7:02Chuck Nice?

  Good stuff, good stuff. So, uh, Doc, uh, uh, Bill, can you, can you talk to us about weather and the effect, uh, that it might have on a baseball game, especially when you're looking at a hundred and three degrees perhaps in a very dry, dry heat?

• 7:20Speaker 03

  Okay, well, very simply, uh, the higher the temperature, the better the ball carries because it's less dense. Uh, approximately for every one degree Fahrenheit increase in temperature, the ball travels anywhere between four and six inches farther.

• 7:38Chuck Nice?

  Really?

• 7:39Speaker 03

  So, for instance, uh, we saw those hundred degree temperatures last week, and, uh, you know, that's one explanation for all the home runs. But, you know, i- this is unbelievable, there's been twenty-two home runs so far in this, uh, World Series. It just broke a record, so there's gotta be a better explanation. I think it's the ball.

• 8:00Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, um, I'm gonna say no.

• 8:07Chuck Nice?

  So, you know, what's funny is when you said, uh, that, uh, air density and, uh, uh, four to, four inches or whatever you said. Six inches, possibly, yeah. Six inches, that Neil was sitting here and actually wrote down a frickin' four me.

• 8:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, I didn't, I should, just.

• 8:25Chuck Nice?

  But no, Neil, give us a little further breakdown on that, so.

• 8:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, a couple of things, so.

• 8:29Chuck Nice?

  Go ahead.

• 8:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Of course, the good doctor is correct. The, when you have warmer air, it's less dense than hotter air. We've always known that.

• 8:37Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 8:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's because, it's why hot air rises, in it's less dense.

• 8:42Chuck Nice?

  Right, it's dense.

• 8:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's how that works.

• 8:43Chuck Nice?

  Hot air is lighter, as they say.

• 8:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If it's less dense, that means there's less air resistance for anything moving through that medium. And certainly, that would be true for a baseball. But in addition, there's another factor, which is moist air is less dense than dry air. Because the moist air has the water molecule swapped in for what would otherwise be a nitrogen or oxygen molecule. And if you add up the weight of a water molecule, everybody who's in the water molecule, that, what's the chemical, some?

• 9:13Chuck Nice?

  H2O.

• 9:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  H2O, yeah, H2O.

• 9:16Chuck Nice?

  You have two H's.

• 9:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You have two H's, add that up. Add up their, like, atomic mass. It is less than either the oxygen molecule or the nitrogen molecule, which makes up the rest, the rest of the air. So, the more humid the air, even though it feels like it's thick to you.

• 9:30Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 9:31Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Anything moving through it will know differently.

• 9:33Chuck Nice?

  See, now, and that's the deal, because humid air feels thick when you breathe it in, and on your skin.

• 9:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 9:40Chuck Nice?

  It's counterintuitive to think that it would be less dense.

• 9:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, less dense.

• 9:44Chuck Nice?

  But.

• 9:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's why, but it's not an accident, why the greatest of the low-pressure systems.

• 9:48Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 9:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's where all the rain is and all the humidity is. That's where storms are. Low-pressure, not high-pressure.

• 9:54Chuck Nice?

  And, and I'm sure, Dr. Patzert, that being an oceanographer, you would know that that's exactly the case, right?

• 10:01Speaker 03

  Yeah, Neil's got it exactly correct. Moist air weighs less than dry air. The water vapors actually weighs less than the nitrogen and the oxygen.

• 10:15Chuck Nice?

  It's so counterintuitive to think that on a humid day, that you can knock a baseball farther, because the air is less dense, when you can actually feel the air as you breathe it in.

• 10:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, so, yeah, but, there are a few other counterintuitive things, like, heavy cream floats on skim milk.

• 10:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just want to be clear about this.

• 10:40Gary O'Reilly?

  Who actually came up with that experiment?

• 10:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, I didn't invent it. I mean, we've always known.

• 10:45Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, because cream always rises to the top.

• 10:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And that's why it's called skim milk. You skimmed off the cream that went to the top.

• 10:51Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 10:52Gary O'Reilly?

  All right. So, Doctor, Doctor Bill, Bill, what is the weather forecast for Dodger Stadium as of tomorrow, Tuesday evening? Because your Dodgers need a comeback the size of an elephant.

• 11:05Speaker 03

  Well, this morning I got up and it was in the low 60s and drizzling. And so tomorrow night...

• 11:11Gary O'Reilly?

  You are in Los Angeles, right?

• 11:13Speaker 03

  Yeah, it's gonna be almost 40 degrees cooler than it was a week ago. And so that should have a tremendous impact. And so that should really...

• 11:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So that would mean fly balls go, according to your numbers, about 20 feet less far. Yeah. And so anything that would have just hit the first few rows of the, of the audience, of the, you know, the fans, would drop short into the, into the...

• 11:43Chuck Nice?

  So we may not be looking forward to another home run slugfest.

• 11:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, except, many of those home runs were off the top deck.

• 11:52Chuck Nice?

  Right, right.

• 11:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You know, they ain't about humidity there.

• 11:55Chuck Nice?

  Right, that's true.

• 11:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, that'd be a home run on any planet.

• 12:00Speaker 03

  So... There's definitely a mystery here. The number of home runs has been outlandish. So, you know, we're definitely gonna have to delve into this. There's more than physical volatility.

• 12:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, wait, but, but, let me ask you. Now, I didn't do these numbers, but surely it is possible that it's a normal statistical variation in home runs. So if you, if you look at every season's home runs for the World Series, and sort of fix it by number of games, because if you sweep in four games, then it's not as many games, you're not as many home runs. So you calibrate for that. So home runs per game, let's say.

• 12:37Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay.

• 12:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And if it fluctuates, some will be lower than average, some will be higher than average. Every now and then, you expect one that's higher than all the others. Just in a normal statistical fluctuation. And we know the human mind is not properly wired to understand and properly interpret statistical variations.

• 12:56Chuck Nice?

  That's true.

• 12:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We think something, like for example, someone's, they say, oh, he's got a hot hand in a basketball.

• 13:01Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 13:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  He's got a hot hand, give it to him again. Well, you've actually run the numbers on that. It's completely natural that if you, if you score at a certain percent, if you're like a forty percent shooter or fifty percent shooter, you'll have runs, five or six in a row, seven in a row, you'll have that. And, and so you'll think, oh, he's got a hot hand, give it to him. A normal statistical variation. So I don't, I didn't run the numbers for the home runs. Um, uh, perhaps you did, sir. Did you, have you done that or not? Or you're just figuring?

• 13:32Speaker 03

  Okay, Neil, you're absolutely right, but there's something on top of this. If we look over the past century, a half century, there's a trend in the statistics. We're hitting more home runs in the last half century.

• 13:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So is it a juice ball or is it juice players?

• 13:48Chuck Nice?

  I think, I was about to say, I'm gonna, I'm looking towards the players more than anything. When you look at the, uh, the size, the speed, the stature of these athletes today, and you look at the, the athletes fifty years ago.

• 14:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Look how skinny and little they were, most of them.

• 14:03Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 14:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In fact, it was a year when the LA Dodgers were in the series, and I don't, I think not a one of them was over six feet tall. What year was that?

• 14:11Speaker 03

  On the other hand, fellas, the pitchers are better, too.

• 14:14Chuck Nice?

  Well, that's true.

• 14:15Speaker 03

  There's no doubt about that.

• 14:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right.

• 14:17Gary O'Reilly?

  So we have a number of elements.

• 14:18Speaker 03

  I'm gonna be very serious here, all right?

• 14:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 14:20Gary O'Reilly?

  If you, if you look at, uh...

• 14:22Speaker 03

  For the average temperature in Dodger Stadium has increased almost six degrees because of global warming and the urban heat island effect.

• 14:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now, hey, do me a favor, Doc.

• 14:35Gary O'Reilly?

  Please explain that. Please explain the urban island effect for me, please.

• 14:40Speaker 03

  Well, you have twenty million people in Southern California, all that infrastructure, freeway, shopping centers. You actually, you see the same thing in all big cities. We actually create and capture our own heat. New York City is a good example.

• 14:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Especially, especially. You could be driving from New Jersey into New York City and most cars have an outside temperature on them now. Watch the temperature go up five to 10 degrees just by driving across the river into Manhattan. And it was another interesting fact that's mitigating that. Right now, you ever heard of Tar Beach? Which is rooftops where in urban centers. All right, well, the old days, the Tar Beach is black and now it's all painted silver. And so there's less heat retention now, it just gets reflected back to space. So you don't get quite as much of a temperature uptick on it. Plus, all the light bulbs are now going to LED, so they're putting out less heat. But, so that's humiliating some of that effect. But this six-degree temperature difference, that's a fascinating fact over the years.

• 15:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Over about how much time, how many decades is that?

• 15:41Speaker 03

  That's essentially over a century, Neil. And so, we're actually playing baseball in a warmer world.

• 15:49Chuck Nice?

  Gotcha. So, and, and, and, um, do you think that that has anything to do with the proliferation of home runs lately? Or is it just like Neil said, um, a statistical variation?

• 16:03Speaker 03

  Well, you know, there's the physics and, uh, of course, there's the human factor. These baseball players, both pitchers and hitters, are definitely the larger, they're stronger, and so, uh, the game has definitely got more physical.

• 16:19Chuck Nice?

  Let me ask you this then, uh, both you and Neil. You're saying both the hitters and the pitchers are stronger, so...

• 16:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We're just getting better.

• 16:27Chuck Nice?

  We're getting better, but, but with that in mind, with that in mind, if I'm throwing the ball faster and harder, does that mean that the guy who's hitting it, whether he's stronger or not, can hit the ball farther? Does it work like that?

• 16:41Speaker 03

  Okay, that's a good guess, an excellent point. Now, what's more important? The ball speed from the pitcher or the swing speed from the batter?

• 16:49Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 16:51Speaker 03

  Which one?

• 16:52Chuck Nice?

  Well, I'm gonna say, I'm gonna say bat speed, because if you can get around, if you can get around on the ball, you're gonna be a, you're gonna, you're gonna have an easier time of hitting the ball. If you can get around on the ball and make contact, you're gonna hit the ball farther.

• 17:03Speaker 03

  Right, so interesting thing is, is that, uh, even though the players are bigger, many of them are using smaller bats, so they must be studying physics. Because, uh, there's a trade-off there. The smaller bat, lighter bat, actually gives you more bat speed, which is more important than pitch speed.

• 17:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And also you get more bat control, so that the bat is not swinging you, you're swinging the bat. And also notice, almost all the bats now have the top tip hollowed out.

• 17:32Gary O'Reilly?

  Yes.

• 17:32Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so that part of the bat, they had judged, wouldn't, is not relevant to meaningful contact, and it's just dead weight.

• 17:40Gary O'Reilly?

  So they took the weight away?

• 17:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it's the worst kind of weight, it's the farthest from your, your, your angle point.

• 17:46Gary O'Reilly?

  Ah, okay.

• 17:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, and so if you take that away, the same force now swings the bat faster.

• 17:51Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, so if we look at the, the-

• 17:52Chuck Nice?

  That is gr- I never knew that!

• 17:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, did you wonder why the top of the bat was hollowed out?

• 17:56Chuck Nice?

  Did you know what?

• 17:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Did you stop and think about it?

• 17:58Gary O'Reilly?

  No, Chuck thought it was a fashion thing.

• 17:59Chuck Nice?

  No, I, no, I thought it was the same, in a, in a way I did, because, like, in a bottle of wine, there's something called a knuckler, and underneath the bottle of wine, it's a convex shape.

• 18:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, it's, it's, it's a, it's a, it's a punt, that's what they call it. Well, I get a knuckler?

• 18:12Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, see, you never served wine, you just drink it.

• 18:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But if you stick your knuckle to hold it?

• 18:17Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 18:19Gary O'Reilly?

  Are you thinking like there's a bat butter that turns up, holding a baseball bat?

• 18:24Chuck Nice?

  Yes, for the bat boy! It's for the bat boy, the bat boy, he hands it to you, grace of your bat, sir!

• 18:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  With his thumb in the dimple, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, wine balls actually feels like an armpit, it's actually funny, quite sensible.

• 18:36Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, let's, let's, let's take it to where we are now.

• 18:38Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, wait, wait, one quick other thing, I just wanna put on the table.

• 18:41Gary O'Reilly?

  Go for it.

• 18:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, uh, it must be at least approximately true, that however much better the pitchers are getting, because I remember, if a pitcher threw over ninety, that was newsworthy.

• 18:52Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 18:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Now everybody's throwing over ninety, okay? And so, if, I, to first approximation, pitchers are getting equally as better, is that the phrase? Equally gooder to, to, to batters. Because, that, nobody's batting four hundred or five hundred.

• 19:10Gary O'Reilly?

  Right.

• 19:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If you look at team batting averages, there's still the team batting average.

• 19:14Gary O'Reilly?

  Yes.

• 19:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Down around 250, 260. It's been that forever.

• 19:17Gary O'Reilly?

  Right.

• 19:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, uh, if, if batteries were getting better relative to pitchers, they'd be making more contact more often and getting more hits, and that's not the case.

• 19:27Gary O'Reilly?

  You were showing the numbers. I'm just.

• 19:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We were showing the numbers. Do you agree, Dr. Bill?

• 19:32Speaker 03

  Well, you know, I still want to know why we set a record here. There's been 22 home runs during the first, uh, five games. That's a new record for a world.

• 19:40Gary O'Reilly?

  And we had eight in game two. We had seven last night.

• 19:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. But isn't it true that every baseball game, some record is set? Most runs in the fourth, most runs in the bottom of the fourth with two men on in scoring position.

• 19:54Chuck Nice?

  Right. While, while the fat guy was eating a hot dog.

• 19:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 19:59Gary O'Reilly?

  But I want to bring it back to the, to the, the hitters.

• 20:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes.

• 20:02Gary O'Reilly?

  You've got Altuve, who's only five foot six. You've got people like Bellinger who are stick thin.

• 20:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:08Gary O'Reilly?

  So you're not looking at athletes who are juiced.

• 20:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 20:12Gary O'Reilly?

  Uh, there's got to be a lot.

• 20:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Not in that case.

• 20:14Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah. There's got to be an awful lot of talent that comes through there, and it's not about having big muscles.

• 20:20Speaker 03

  Actually, it is. Is that most power in a swing doesn't come from your arms. It comes from your legs.

• 20:28Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 20:29Speaker 03

  So it's a matter of coordination.

• 20:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And your hips swinging through the strike zone. Yeah.

• 20:33Speaker 03

  That's right.

• 20:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 20:34Gary O'Reilly?

  So it's generating, it's generating from the ground upwards.

• 20:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah. So baseball players.

• 20:37Speaker 03

  He's very solidly built with heavy legs and, uh, and he's got terrific bat speed.

• 20:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And.

• 20:43Speaker 03

  Quite of his size.

• 20:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And I think that's why, uh, many baseball players, relative to other sports, uh, perhaps not to football, but other, other sports, uh, they have chunky thighs and round butts, buttocks.

• 20:56Gary O'Reilly?

  I hadn't noticed, but now you've placed that thought in my mind.

• 21:00Chuck Nice?

  Well, I'm going to be honest. I've noticed every game.

• 21:05Chuck Nice?

  Hey, listen, we, we gotta take a break, guys, and, uh, uh, when we come back, we'll still be with, uh, Dr. Bill Patsard and Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson as we take your calls. Uh, the number is 877-974-7487. Thank you for being with us on our World Series edition of Science of Baseball here on Sirius Insight, Channel 121.

• 21:29Gary O'Reilly?

  Welcome back to Playing with Science on SiriusXM Insight Channel 121. We're getting to grips with the World Series and the science therein. All right, let me start with a wonderful quote by the Major League Baseball Commissioner. "Absolutely confident that the balls that we're using are within our established specifications." Discuss.

• 21:53Chuck Nice?

  What's the quote?

• 21:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Are they still stitched in South America? Do you remember where they're stitched?

• 21:59Chuck Nice?

  You sound like Trump, you gonna blame the Mexicans?

• 22:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, I'm just saying.

• 22:02Chuck Nice?

  Damn, go on, they can't catch a break.

• 22:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Mexico's in North America, by the way.

• 22:06Chuck Nice?

  That is true.

• 22:07Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But all I can imagine is whoever's doing the stitching says, "You know, they haven't hit much home runs lately, let me put some extra stuff in here." I'm just imagining that conversation wherever the stitching factory is.

• 22:22Gary O'Reilly?

  This goes up against what Dallas Keuchel said after game two and those eight home runs, where he says, "Obviously, the balls are juiced."

• 22:29Chuck Nice?

  Well, yes. And if I were Dallas Keuchel, I would say that too, which is a very sarcastic way of saying, "F you, I'm an awesome..."

• 22:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Are they saying that the balls are juiced just for this World Series, or that they've been juiced all year?

• 22:40Gary O'Reilly?

  That's just it.

• 22:43Chuck Nice?

  That is it.

• 22:44Gary O'Reilly?

  I mean, that's the quote that came out of...

• 22:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Haven't more homes been hit this year than any other year? I think so.

• 22:48Chuck Nice?

  I'm not sure about that.

• 22:49Gary O'Reilly?

  I think so, 6,100 and something...

• 22:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Far and away, the most number of home runs hit in any year of baseball. That's correct.

• 22:57Chuck Nice?

  Gotcha.

• 22:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And 53 of them was a judge.

• 23:02Chuck Nice?

  So let me ask you...

• 23:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All rise.

• 23:04Chuck Nice?

  That's right, all rise. By the way, all seven feet of them, god.

• 23:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Six, seven, six, seven.

• 23:12Chuck Nice?

  Six, seven, yeah. And in baseball, that's seven feet. So here's what I want to know, guys, because I hear this term, and I've heard it since I was a kid. How do you juice a ball? How do you juice a ball?

• 23:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, when I was a kid, I took apart a ball, and it's fun to do. You know, you unstitch it, so you remove the leather, and then under it is, if it's still made the same way it was when I was a kid, I don't see why it would be different.

• 23:38Chuck Nice?

  A million miles of string.

• 23:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I try to see how long the string was. It is like 100 yards. It's a string, it's a rubberized...

• 23:49Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I I don't know what to call it.

• 23:50Chuck Nice?

  It's like a rubber twine.

• 23:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Rubber twine.

• 23:52Chuck Nice?

  It's like rubber twine.

• 23:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's like rubber twine.

• 23:53Chuck Nice?

  Yeah.

• 23:54Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And it's it's just wrapped and wrapped and wrapped. And wait, you keep doing that and then there's something else in the center. There's like a little spalding in the center. Piece of gum?

• 24:03Chuck Nice?

  Like a tootsie pie?

• 24:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 24:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So, yeah. There's a whole thing in the center that when I took apart has liquid in it. So I thought that was interesting.

• 24:14Chuck Nice?

  Oh, my God. I did not know that. Now that is really, now we gotta get somebody on to talk about the anatomy of a baseball. Cause that, if that's still the chase, that's amazing.

• 24:23Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, maybe we'll get a caller on later on and they'll give us quite literally the insight that we are looking for.

• 24:29Chuck Nice?

  Hey, Dr. Bill, do you know anything about the anatomy of a baseball and what's what's inside and how you would use it?

• 24:33Speaker 03

  The material is made in such a way that when the bat hits it at a certain mile per hour, there's a compression of the ball. It actually compresses on the contact and then when it leaves the bat, it expands again. And so the material is supposed to be in such a way that that compression does not change. And so there are actually physics and balls are tested. But I have a new theory.

• 25:01Chuck Nice?

  Ah, like a new theory?

• 25:03Speaker 03

  What's different about these balls, these World Series balls?

• 25:06Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 25:07Speaker 03

  They're actually stamped with World Series in gold on the ball.

• 25:11Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 25:13Speaker 03

  And so they're different. And so my theory is it makes it more difficult for the pitcher to control.

• 25:19Chuck Nice?

  Gotcha.

• 25:20Speaker 03

  It's perhaps slipperier.

• 25:21Chuck Nice?

  Because you you've actually, it's kind of like when they take, when they scratch a ball. Or i- is that what you're saying? So the embossing? So is it embossed or is it printed on? So, cause that would have a different effect. Okay, so, and so it is like scratching a baseball?

• 25:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, no, wait, wait, wait. If it's embossed, then it's more to grip. But if it's, if it's printed on, then it smooths over the texture that's otherwise on the leather.

• 25:43Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 25:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But it seems to me the fact that the leather is painted white does that anyway? Isn't that right, Bill? What, where are you coming at me with this?

• 25:52Speaker 03

  Yeah, well, of course it is. That's why every time the ball hits the dirt, you know, they're always changing out the balls all the time.

• 25:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 25:59Speaker 03

  Contrast when we were kids, you know, we used the ball, the same ball for weeks. But they don't want to give the pitcher an advantage. The ball gets scuffed or gets dirty, it can actually affect the spin of the baseball.

• 26:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so-

• 26:13Speaker 03

  How much it curves or drops or lifts.

• 26:15Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So what you're suggesting is that it's not that the ball is juiced, it's that the ball is less controlled by the pitcher, thereby giving advantage to batter?

• 26:24Speaker 03

  Exactly.

• 26:26Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay.

• 26:27Gary O'Reilly?

  Ah, that's, so that's the approach of why we're getting this, it's what would seem an excessive number of home runs.

• 26:33Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So if I, I would, I would recommend, I would say that if that were true-

• 26:37Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah.

• 26:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You would also have more hits and generally more ball contact with the bat.

• 26:41Gary O'Reilly?

  True.

• 26:42Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so, but, but that's harder to track. I mean, it's surely out there somewhere, but it's not as obvious as a home run count.

• 26:48Chuck Nice?

  But it might be, it might, if, if that is the case, then that might be feasible to, that, that, that's the case.

• 26:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You'd expect all bat contact statistics to go up.

• 26:56Gary O'Reilly?

  Right. So, apart from the, the World Series logo on the ball, what else can we do? Raise the stitches? Can we play with the circumference? Would that change as long as it was within the parameters that were, uh, major league happy?

• 27:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, I don't know, the top-

• 27:13Speaker 03

  It hasn't changed. The ball weighs about five ounces.

• 27:16Gary O'Reilly?

  Uh-huh.

• 27:16Speaker 03

  And it has been, you know, for decades. And so that really hasn't changed. And they claim that the stitch count has not changed either.

• 27:24Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, but Bill, there's a, of course, since these are measurements, there has to be some tolerance of a low end and a high end of what the weight of the ball is and what the diameter of the ball is.

• 27:34Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah.

• 27:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And we learned, we did a golf show recently, and if you look up the rules for a golf ball, there are parameters within which the golf ball must fall.

• 27:42Gary O'Reilly?

  Right.

• 27:43Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But the precision of those numbers seem pretty low.

• 27:46Gary O'Reilly?

  It's not exact.

• 27:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's not exact, right. It's not an exact dimension. So maybe the set of balls are at the high end of the size and the low end of the weight.

• 27:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Maybe those would conspire to being easier to hit. And then the same force would hit it faster. Would you, how about that?

• 28:06Speaker 03

  This is like the JFK thing.

• 28:08Chuck Nice?

  I love it.

• 28:09Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah, that's why we're here.

• 28:10Chuck Nice?

  This is what, this is what happens when, when you give four geeks in a room talking baseball. I love it.

• 28:16Speaker 03

  Now, here's another theory.

• 28:18Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, here we go.

• 28:19Speaker 03

  Did you notice the way they were calling the balls of the strikes last night?

• 28:22Chuck Nice?

  Hmm, say that again, I missed it.

• 28:24Speaker 03

  Did you notice the way they were calling the balls of the strikes last night?

• 28:27Chuck Nice?

  In, in what respect? No, I didn't. Go ahead.

• 28:29Speaker 03

  Well, I thought an awful lot of the, the called strikes were definitely outside the strike zone.

• 28:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so here's what Fox should do. That little rectangle they have there, that should be a morphable shape. And as the umpire starts calling strikes that we all know are balls, you deform that rectangle to be the strike zone for that umpire.

• 28:51Chuck Nice?

  Oh my god, that's awesome.

• 28:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then you publish.

• 28:54Speaker 03

  What a conspiracy theory, man.

• 28:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, wait, and then you publish each umpire's strike shape.

• 29:00Chuck Nice?

  Yes.

• 29:00Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Strike zone shape.

• 29:01Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 29:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And then you'll know, you know, where, where, where you should swing and where you should.

• 29:06Chuck Nice?

  Look at this guy's strike zone. It's like the continent of Africa. He's all over the place.

• 29:11Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah. So the thing is for each individual batter, that strike zone is going to be different.

• 29:17Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  In principle, but I don't think I saw the bat, the, the strike zone change when Altuve, all five foot five Altuve. It seemed to me that rectangle was the same size.

• 29:27Chuck Nice?

  It does.

• 29:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  If they changed it, I didn't notice it.

• 29:28Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay.

• 29:29Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But Bill, did you notice that they changed the, the size of the rectangle?

• 29:33Speaker 03

  That's a good, that's an excellent point. It, it seems like the, the size should change with the height of the batter.

• 29:40Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But I, I, but I didn't notice that.

• 29:41Gary O'Reilly?

  No, I didn't either, but, I mean, you would, so now.

• 29:44Speaker 03

  Well, this is Fox, you know, guys, you know.

• 29:47Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, but, but if, with the guy, the guy behind the plate, the umpire, is calling that, and he's, obviously he's going to be looking at it a different way. Or not, I don't know, it's just.

• 29:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, I mean, the strike zone's a strike zone. Yeah, and, and of course, they know if, if the pl, the batters tell each other as they go back and forth to the bench, whether the inside is, they're calling inside strikes, or outside strikes, or high strikes, or low strikes. So there's, there is shared knowledge of that umpire for that game.

• 30:15Gary O'Reilly?

  Goes back into the beehive.

• 30:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah, goes, goes back in. And by the way, uh, uh, this is an obscure reference, forgive me, but in the movie Chicken Little.

• 30:21Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay.

• 30:23Chuck Nice?

  Now, let me tell you something right now, that was an understatement, this is an obscure reference.

• 30:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so there's a, there's a scene where Chicken Little is in a baseball game.

• 30:30Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 30:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's really cute because the helmet is really large and it's sort of spinning on his head. And Chicken Little comes up to bat, and Chicken Little is so little, that the strike zone has vanished to nothingness. So that every pitch that comes is a ball. And so, they just said, "Don't swing, just let, let the ball go."

• 30:46Chuck Nice?

  Right, exactly. And then he got hit in the head and spent the rest of the game with a concussion. No, I'm joking.

• 30:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Saying that the sky's falling.

• 30:55Chuck Nice?

  Excellent. Well, speaking of balls and strikes and home runs and strike zones, uh, let us go to a clip of game four. And, uh, this is Jock Peterson's homer, uh, off of Musgrove. It was a three-run shot that, uh, brought the score Dodgers, um, six, uh, Stros one. And the reason why I wanted to, uh, play this is because of the uniqueness of this swing. And so, let's hear it and then I'll ask you guys the question.

• 31:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  High fly ball, back at the wall, it's gone! Jock Peterson is second in the series. And the three-run shot makes it six-one, A and the ninth.

• 31:43Chuck Nice?

  So, when you hear him, when you hear him make the call, the first thing, first of all, the, the crack of the bat sounds not like the normal crack of a bat. It's not the sweet sound of a homer. It's not that sweet sound of a homer, it's like a regular, it's like a clop more than that crack, it's like, you know. The other thing is, when you look at his swing, his swing is almost straight or high. And then the ball looks like it bounces off the top of the barrel. And I think Joe Seale calls it and he goes, "High fly ball." Because that's what it looks like, but then it just keeps sailing. So I wanted to talk about and ask you guys about different swings and how they create a homerun.

• 32:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Let me tell you what I know and then I want to pass off to Bill on this, because he's, he, if he saw Jackie Robinson play, my boy's got some baseline of references here. So, uh, if, if you, if you take a level swing.

• 32:35Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 32:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Then if you're gonna hit a home run, Mm-hmm. Then the bat is not coming through the strike zone in the direction the ball leaves the bat. Okay. So you're not transferring as much power of your swing to the ball as you possibly could. Okay. So what happens is, people who swing for average tend to have horizontal swings. Gotcha. Because then you just punch singles into the, into the outfield. Right. Or through, and you have more control of where it's gonna go. Exactly. If you want to look at the sluggers, and it's why most great sluggers also strike out a lot. Okay? Their swing is not horizontal. It is almost up at a 45-degree angle. Right. And then, when you make that swing, and you connect. Right.

• 33:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The bat is following the ball in the direction the ball is going. Gotcha. And the farthest you can ever project anything is at a 45-degree angle. Uh-huh. So, um, so, at a given speed, if it goes higher than that, it'll fall short of where it would've landed at 45 degrees. And if it goes lower angle, it'll also fall short. So, so if you swing up, like swing for the bleachers, as they say. Yeah. And you make contact, you will hit it farther than any other time. Now, in the case that you described. Yeah. Um, we only heard the audio on that. Did that just drop in, in the first few rows of the, of the stands? No, that just kept sailing. No, no, but it said, well, how far back did it go? It, uh, well, it was a home run, I can't tell.

• 34:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All I can say is that it would've gone farther if you didn't take a horizontal swing.

• 34:07Gary O'Reilly?

  Game, game four's in Houston, so it's in, it's under the roof.

• 34:10Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yeah.

• 34:11Gary O'Reilly?

  So that may well have another effect. We talked about Santarana's, the yes, no, maybe situation. But, so you're saying, Neil, that a 45-degree angle in terms of my swing is the best angle to approach to get the maximum transference of power?

• 34:25Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But it's harder to hit a moving object if your bat is at a 45-degree angle and the ball's coming in horizontally. Right. If you, if you swing. That's, that's why these guys strike out. Right? Uh, you know, Mickey Mantle had, you know, held the strikeout record for many years, until, I forgot who broke his record. Um, but these sluggers are known for striking out, and that's why. So Bill, what can you add to that, or subtract?

• 34:47Speaker 03

  Okay, well, you're, you're right, Neil, but it can happen a couple of ways. Is that you can swing up into the ball like you described. The optimum angle, I think, is somewhere between, uh, 32 and 40 degrees.

• 35:01Speaker 03

  For in terms of.

• 35:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So why is it a little lower than the than the pure physics angle of forty five?

• 35:08Speaker 03

  But if you swing straight into the ball, remember the ball can come off the bat not necessarily purpose, you know, exactly at the same, in the middle of your bat in the sweet spot. It can also lead the bat at an angle. And so you don't have to swing under the ball to hit a home run. That's why you get these balls that where the guy is swinging like he looks like he's aiming for a single and the thing just carries. Well, that's that's what this home run was. Off the bat at about thirty two, thirty four degrees.

• 35:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, you can watch also the people hit home runs on a low pitch. They just sort of golf it. They don't even look like they're swinging hard. You ever see these kinds of home runs?

• 35:53Speaker 03

  Right.

• 35:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It just goes down to get the ball and it just goes.

• 35:56Speaker 03

  And it just goes.

• 35:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And.

• 35:57Gary O'Reilly?

  That's the mark of a real talented athlete when they make it look as if it's easy.

• 36:02Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right.

• 36:03Gary O'Reilly?

  It's just the simplest thing in the world to do.

• 36:05Speaker 03

  There's a certain amount of luck involved.

• 36:06Gary O'Reilly?

  Well, don't start on luck. Don't start on luck.

• 36:09Speaker 03

  It's hard to make that ball come off your bat at thirty two degrees.

• 36:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, the luck is, of course, because like as we all know, you are you are you are in the record books in the Hall of Fame by not getting hit seventy percent of the time.

• 36:27Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You're a three hundred batter, you're in the Hall of Fame, and so, yeah, there's certainly luck in that.

• 36:33Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, so imagine now, as I'm making contact with, we'll call it a ninety mile an hour ball coming my way, there must be a point where the wood on the bat gets dented, there's an indentation. Does that then alter the flight path as it leaves?

• 36:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, the thing is doing the most deforming is the ball. But you'd expect some deforming of the bat itself. And in fact, an aluminum bat is more of an elastic collision than a wooden bat is. So in other words, you can deform the bat and it will come back to shape.

• 37:03Gary O'Reilly?

  Uh huh.

• 37:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But some of that energy is absorbed into the grain in the wood of the bat of the wooden bat. That very same swing on a. Aluminum bat, you will deform the aluminum and it'll pop right back and it'll leave the bat at a higher speed than would, than it would for a wooden bat.

• 37:19Gary O'Reilly?

  So it gets a spring, it comes against a springboard.

• 37:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's a springboard effect, right, if it's for an aluminum bat. If, if the majors switch to an aluminum bat, everything will go farther and faster and, and there's a concern about the safety of the pitcher. Because right now, a fast swing right back to the pitcher, they can just, just get their glove on it. With an aluminum bat, that will not be the case.

• 37:41Chuck Nice?

  So you'd have a lot of pitchers leaving on stretchers.

• 37:44Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, you are so strumming the chord for Chuck right now.

• 37:47Chuck Nice?

  Man, you're just making me love baseball even more. That's, that's the game I wanna see.

• 37:52Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Wait, wait, wait, so Bill, so why is it thirty-two degrees and not forty-five?

• 37:55Speaker 03

  Well, it, uh, it, that's, uh, I think they've calculated, that's the optimum angle in terms of, uh, given the particular distance.

• 38:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I, I, I don't, I can't agree with that even. I don't, uh, how, uh, no.

• 38:10Gary O'Reilly?

  I think that's a definite disagreement.

• 38:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right, I, I, okay, so, so you sounded really sure about that and I'm only talking just a pure physics calculation. So the burden of proof is on me. I will go home and try to figure that one out, see what's different.

• 38:28Gary O'Reilly?

  Break a few windows in the background.

• 38:29Speaker 03

  I think forty-five is probably right, but you have to, uh, put the friction of the air into the calculation.

• 38:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, right.

• 38:37Chuck Nice?

  So that's what it is, okay. All right. So in a vacuum, forty-five, and here on Earth with atmosphere, thirty-two degrees.

• 38:44Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  We'll see.

• 38:45Chuck Nice?

  So we'll see.

• 38:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I still, I'm still skeptical, but I'm gonna find out. If that's so, I have to learn why. And by the way, before we end the, uh, go ahead. Okay, later on, when we come back, make sure I tell you about how much baseball players spit onto the field, because I did a calculation on that.

• 39:02Chuck Nice?

  No, make sure we don't talk about it.

• 39:04Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just watch it, oh my god, okay.

• 39:06Gary O'Reilly?

  All right, we'll take a break, uh...

• 39:08Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I can't even drink water now.

• 39:09Gary O'Reilly?

  The angle of release will be peer-reviewed during the break.

• 39:13Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, exactly.

• 39:14Gary O'Reilly?

  Right, this is Playing with Science, we'll be back after this break. This is Sirius XM Insight, don't forget, you're up next, eight seven seven nine seven four seven four eight seven, that's the number you dial to talk to the guys.

• 39:28Gary O'Reilly?

  Welcome back to Playing with Science, that number once again, 877-974-7487. They are the digits that get you on air with us, so don't be shy, punch those numbers. So Neil, you have information about something that upset Chuck prior to the break?

• 39:46Chuck Nice?

  Yeah, I'm so excited to hear about your spit fest, yes.

• 39:51Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You want that now?

• 39:52Chuck Nice?

  You know what, I want to get it out of the way.

• 39:55Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, you're gonna tease us?

• 39:56Chuck Nice?

  I want it, it sounds so disgusting, I just want to get it.

• 39:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Let's remind everyone who we have on the phone.

• 40:01Chuck Nice?

  Oh yeah, that's right, yeah, sorry. Yeah, we are also joined by Dr. Bill Patrick, Dr. Bill, say hello.

• 40:07Speaker 03

  Hey, yo guys.

• 40:09Chuck Nice?

  How do you feel about spitting, Dr. Bill?

• 40:11Speaker 03

  Well, you know, it's part of the game.

• 40:14Chuck Nice?

  So guys went from...

• 40:16Speaker 03

  You know, a lot of the guys used to chew tobacco, now it's bubble gum or pumpkin seeds.

• 40:23Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 40:24Speaker 03

  And it creates saliva, you know, and it releases tension, and you know it's manly.

• 40:29Gary O'Reilly?

  That's it?

• 40:32Chuck Nice?

  Okay, that's great.

• 40:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I did a calculation, and because the, as the, you know, between, not between innings, but while, you know, the pitcher is scratching his nuts, the camera looks at various players, the outfielder, the coach, players, and I noticed that the camera stays on them for about five seconds before it goes to another player. And about a third of the time, a player is spitting in those five seconds.

• 41:01Chuck Nice?

  Even in the dugout, which I find disgusting.

• 41:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Even in the dugout.

• 41:04Chuck Nice?

  Yep.

• 41:05Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I said, if a third of the time, a player is spitting every five seconds, and there are 25 players on a team, there's 50 players on a field, and they play for three hours, how much spit is on the field?

• 41:18Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 41:19Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So I ran that calculation.

• 41:20Chuck Nice?

  All right.

• 41:21Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Okay, so, and I tweeted this like five years ago, I tweeted this, right? Players and coaches of a three-hour baseball game spit at least six gallons, 24 liters of saliva onto the field.

• 41:36Chuck Nice?

  That's, first of all, all I can say is...

• 41:39Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  That's nasty.

• 41:40Chuck Nice?

  That is nasty, and you need to do better things with that big brain.

• 41:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Like cure cancer, you know, stuff like that.

• 41:50Chuck Nice?

  Exactly.

• 41:52Gary O'Reilly?

  I'm guessing your flight was delayed.

• 41:55Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Nah, that's a...

• 41:56Speaker 03

  That's a lot of game duration.

• 41:58Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, there's one assumption I made that may have to be adjusted. I assumed that every spit was the volume of one cubic centimeter of fluid.

• 42:09Chuck Nice?

  Why would you... Is that the normal spit?

• 42:11Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, then I tried it. I tried spitting and I wasn't getting one cubic centimeter. I was getting like half that.

• 42:16Chuck Nice?

  Okay.

• 42:16Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So if this is wrong, then it's...

• 42:18Chuck Nice?

  It's three gallons.

• 42:18Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  It's three gallons, not six gallons.

• 42:20Chuck Nice?

  That's not nasty at all.

• 42:23Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Well, that's different.

• 42:24Chuck Nice?

  There you go. That's totally different. Three gallons is a lot of... Mmm. Let me tell you something. That's just a day at the dentist.

• 42:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Also, some players will spit the shells of their... Of their sunflower seeds. And those are not technically a cubic centimeter of spit. So, so there is some slop in this calculation. But basically, it's a nasty feel when you're done.

• 42:50Gary O'Reilly?

  Do you know what to be on cleanup?

• 42:51Speaker 03

  Just take a look at the, uh, the essentially dugout. You ever see the camera pan to the floor of the dugout?

• 42:59Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, after a game when they walk out? It is nasty. It is just nasty.

• 43:02Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 43:03Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Yes, yes, yeah.

• 43:04Gary O'Reilly?

  Okay, let's clean this up.

• 43:06Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I've actually seen triple X theaters that look better than that.

• 43:10Gary O'Reilly?

  All right. Going back, as I am inclined to, this current World Series. Jose Altuve turned up last night and started to sort of put the bat on the ball. At five foot six, is he predisposed, Neil and Bill, please jump in on this, to hit up under... And he's got the power. We know he's got the bat speed. But because of his size, is he more inclined to hit under and through?

• 43:34Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I don't know. Bill, what's your reading on this, on this guy?

• 43:38Speaker 03

  I don't know. It's, uh, it's an interesting... You know, the short guys in baseball go way back, uh, even back in the, uh, the 40s and the 50s. They actually had, uh, midgets on many major league baseball teams, all right? Because they were harder to pitch to.

• 43:56Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Oh, get out of here.

• 43:59Speaker 03

  What was his name, uh...

• 44:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And who... How tall was Pee Wee Race? Was he really Pee Wee?

• 44:06Speaker 03

  I can't remember how tall Pee-wee was.

• 44:09Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:10Speaker 03

  He was a great player.

• 44:12Chuck Nice?

  Oh, yeah. Okay, well, uh...

• 44:14Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  But scientifically, would it...

• 44:16Speaker 03

  Pee-wee stepped up, you know? And when Jackie came into the bigs, you know? Pee-wee Reese was there. He was an interesting guy. He was from the south. So, uh, he might have been a short guy, but he was a big man.

• 44:29Chuck Nice?

  Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

• 44:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right. But scientifically, would it work? So, consider this. If, in fact, you have to shrink the strike zone for a shorter player, that means that the total cross-sectional area of a pitch that you would swing in is smaller.

• 44:45Chuck Nice?

  Right.

• 44:46Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And this means there's less scatter in what you have to be swinging at in order to protect the strike zone. This must mean, I would think, that he has to get better pitches to swing at, at that size. I'm just spitballing here, but I'm just... If, in fact, he has a smaller strike zone, then the ball just can't go all to hell and high water.

• 45:07Chuck Nice?

  I saw what you did there with that spitball.

• 45:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  The spin.

• 45:11Chuck Nice?

  That was good.

• 45:12Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Just playing the chucks. Funny bone on you, really. So, that's my... If I were to invent a reason why he's doing so well at this, and dovetail that with Bill's memory that they used to use midgets in a baseball game because it's harder to pitch to them, you'll get on base more. By the way, what is Altuve's walk percentage? How often does he get on?

• 45:35Chuck Nice?

  I do not know.

• 45:36Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  No, I'm out of my comfort zone now.

• 45:38Chuck Nice?

  Who was telling us that?

• 45:39Speaker 03

  You know, he's just an outstanding athlete. The guy has terrific arm speed. You know, here's an interesting fact for you. You know, it's about 60 feet from the pitcher's mound to the plate, and it takes about four tenths of a second for the ball to get there, less than a half a second.

• 45:58Chuck Nice?

  Wow.

• 45:59Speaker 03

  And it goes, you know, anywhere between ninety and a hundred miles an hour. And now, the interesting thing about is, is that the, of course, the ball only weighs five ounces. And the bat weighs anywhere between thirty-two and thirty-six ounces. It's about three, but the bat speed is only seventy miles an hour, not ninety miles an hour. Okay? And, and, and so, uh, the, because of the weight of the bat, you need less speed. So arm speed or bat speed is less than, uh, pitcher's speed. But, uh, for every one mile per hour that you increase your bat speed, the ball goes

• 46:44Speaker 03

  eight feet farther. That's kinda interesting, huh?

• 46:47Gary O'Reilly?

  So, so.

• 46:49Speaker 03

  Eighty miles an hour rather than seventy miles an hour?

• 46:53Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You go another, you'll go another eighty feet.

• 46:55Speaker 03

  Eighty feet, exactly.

• 46:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  This is where not only how fast.

• 46:58Speaker 03

  A guy like Altuve, he's got great bat speed.

• 47:01Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  So it's not only how fast you're swinging your arms, it's the wrists, uh, uh, flick right as you come through.

• 47:07Gary O'Reilly?

  So there's a snap at the end, yeah.

• 47:09Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Right, there's a, there's an extra little bit you can give to it to, to rotate that thing around.

• 47:13Gary O'Reilly?

  That's it. It's interesting, we, we find this with, uh, different sports, that the swimmers, when they swim, they kick, they have that really flexible ankle, so they can kick on that.

• 47:22Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Floppy feet.

• 47:22Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah, basically. And, and we did this with the golf show. Remember how all of the, the strength of the core to be so strong, the power, to, to get that from the central axis to come through? Amazing.

• 47:35Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And one other thing, just before, we're running short on time.

• 47:37Gary O'Reilly?

  Yeah.

• 47:37Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  I wanna re-give a tweet that I gave a couple of years ago.

• 47:40Gary O'Reilly?

  Go ahead.

• 47:41Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Actually, earlier even this year, I've repeated it. Just the, the minimum speed necessary to reach home plate.

• 47:46Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, I love that.

• 47:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  From the pitcher.

• 47:48Gary O'Reilly?

  Go ahead.

• 47:48Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  And so, and so I wanted, I re, I re-refered my calculation. So, uh, thirty miles an hour. If you throw the ball any slower than thirty miles an hour, it will bounce before home plate. No matter the angle. No matter the angle. So you have to throw it at thirty miles an hour at forty-five degrees from the sixty feet, six inches away, then it'll reach home plate. It'll reach the catcher behind home plate. And anything lower than that, so twenty-nine point five miles an hour? Well, I mean, so there's some slot there because certain pitchers have longer arms and release points. Okay, gotcha. So there is a little bit of variation. Yeah, yeah. Little bit. Twenty-five miles an hour is not making it. Not gonna make it. Not gonna make it.

• 48:24Gary O'Reilly?

  Chuck, even you could read the seams on that.

• 48:25Speaker 03

  Oh, Neil, is that why you never made it to the big?

• 48:28Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Why?

• 48:29Speaker 03

  You're over thirty?

• 48:30Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  You know, I went into one of those pitching things, and the fastest I was able to throw it is sixty miles an hour, and I said, "I'm unworthy." Nicely done.

• 48:40Gary O'Reilly?

  Oh, my God. Dr. Bill, what a pleasure, sir. Thank you for being on board today.

• 48:45Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  Thanks so much, man.

• 48:46Speaker 03

  Okay, go Dodgers.

• 48:47Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  All right. And of course, thank you to Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson. Dudes. Playing with some... Did your mama know you were playing with science?

• 48:54Gary O'Reilly?

  She's gonna find out when you get home.

• 48:57Neil deGrasse Tyson?

  She knows I'm playing with something.

• 48:58Gary O'Reilly?

  All right. That's it from us. This has been Playing with Science on SiriusXM Insight Channel 121. Hope you've enjoyed it. From Chuck and myself, hey, bye-bye.