So True with Caleb Hearon
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Fall never arrives all at once. First the air, then the light. And slowly, the things you love begin to find each other. A jacket meets a dress. A hoodie slips beneath a blazer. An old cap finds a new scarf. Because you don't simply step into the season. You create it, layer by layer, until it finally feels like fall. Find fall your way at Ross.
I was on like a, I feel like it was like a Tinder date or something with this guy who was fully bald, but not bald in a way that was, like, in an intentional scary way.
Yeah. Um. Okay. His baldness was political.
You're like friends and family to me, specifically and.
Oh, Sandy. No, I love you.
Yeah.
I love you.
Are we recording?
Of course.
Oh.
Yeah, of course.
I would not have burped. Had I known.
You know our fans like that kind of stuff. You know that. We have a crude audience.
Phew. Okay, I'll, okay.
My audience-
I shouldn't have asked for the sparkling water ahead of record, what with everything going on with me.
It's gonna make you belch, yeah.
My audience, just so you know, I know you're kind of familiar, but just to catch you up, my audience is mostly, um, like-
My cousins.
Of course, lesbians, your cousins, um, we have learned over the course of the show, a lot of Latina women, um, gay guys, but a very specific type of gay guys. These are gay guys that are mostly lesbians.
Got it.
These are gay guys that are one strong wind away from transitioning. These are gay guys that already have a they in the mix.
We're gonna get an amazing crossover because my fanbase is basically, um, guys that follow me into a parking garage after a show because they used to watch me on Adult Swim.
Those are the guys I want to sleep with.
Or guys that would see me on, uh, this Viceland, short-lived Viceland talk show, and they would see you on the screen and they go, "I'm gonna have sex with her." They just kind of decide on their own. They decide-
Regardless of what she thinks about it.
They think I'm gonna have sex with her.
I'm gonna bang that hottie.
And so they'd let me know.
Yeah. That's beautiful.
Did you ever sleep with any of them?
Of course not.
You have self-respect.
Well.
No worries.
Hello. Hello.
I didn't, but I don't have self-respect.
Hey, two things can be true.
I didn't sleep with those men and I don't respect myself.
Who was it that said you can hold what the two opposing forces in your mind at the same time? Or no, wait, it's that you can't.
Yeah, hello, sorry. Who was it that said you could, mm, losing immediately?
Right, well, they were, no, if you hold two opposing thoughts in your mind at the same time, that's the definition of insanity, actually.
That's actually the definition of insanity. Another definition of insanity is doing the same thing and hoping for different results.
And I think it was Tim Allen who said that.
Yeah, Woody.
Woody, it was Tim Allen as Woody.
I believe, if I'm not mistaken, that was Tim Allen as Woody.
No, but in all seriousness, this was so much fun.
You're having fun already?
This was a great time.
This has been so fun.
This was an amazing episode. I love you to death.
Sandy, tell me what's going on with you for real. What is lighting you up right now?
Okay, well, what is lighting me up right now? Well, like I mentioned to you off cam, off pod.
Drawing, I'm into, I'm really into drawing with chalk pastels right now.
My experience of this-
Is that what you wanted me to say?
100%.
Okay.
My experience of this is that you said, "I've gotten into drawing things. I realize because I went to museums in Vienna that I can just draw anything, it doesn't have to be remarkable, like for me to draw it." And then you said, "I drew a banana that's really good." I want to let you know and be honest with you, in my head, I'm going, "It can't be, it's just gonna be a banana, it's not that special." That's genuinely where my head went. I mean, it's just a banana, it's not that special, but I'm gonna support my friend through this moment. And then you showed me the banana and I have to say, it's a remarkable banana.
Thank you so mu- I'm like, I've never been so proud of something.
I was moved by banana.
Thank you.
I was genuinely moved by banana.
It was simply a banana? Because, okay, like I said, this is kind of my theory, but I get so in my head about making art and about doing stuff because I'm like, well, I, oh, it has to be like this brilliant idea and it has to be like this amazing thing and I'm not trained and all this stuff. And then you go to a museum and you go- All the paintings are four things arranged on a table.
Hello.
Oh, it's an orange and a banana. And sometimes there's like a piece of fabric and they're just painting that. And that's enough.
Sometimes there's a cat eating like the bones of a fish with the head still on, on the side of the table.
Fine, that's not even that crazy.
Right, I could do that. I don't need to come up with this, oh, oh, a whole crazy thing.
Just draw, I can just draw banana.
Draw banana.
And everyone's moved by the banana.
And you drew a moving banana. And I don't want to even show it on here. I want people to just imagine a banana that moves them.
Cause you would be moved by it.
Sorry, I just was thinking about the banana.
No, I'm gonna be thinking about banana for days.
Yeah, I'm gonna, I gotta, I left it, so I bought my mom a set of pastels because I was like, I want her to get back into making visual art and she got really, she drew a pepper.
Pepper?
Yeah, a pepper.
What kind? Give me color.
Orange.
Orange pepper. I don't draw, you know, I'm not a draw, I don't have that ability. My brother was, I decided that drawing was silly when I was a kid because my brother was really good at it and I wasn't.
Right.
Do you know what I mean?
Yes, of course.
I would draw and he would draw and his drawings were amazing. He was a very naturally gifted drawer.
Mm-hmm.
And I just was like, this is fucking stupid. Drawing is dumb.
Drawing is dumb. And then what were you drawn to?
Drawing's out. I was into being sociopathic at student council meetings. I mean, as you know, it's a joke in the special.
Of course, of course.
But that really is where I turned my attention.
I got really obs, I would say when I found out I wasn't good at drawing, I got really obsessed with power.
And I'm not gonna say his name, but there's another guy from history that did the same thing.
And I hate being in the same campus as him, no pun intended.
You know what is weird?
I do. I don't wanna be associated with him at all. It fucking makes me sick.
And everyone's associating you.
Everyone's associating, for saying these two guys.
These two guys. You know what? It's crazy cause his, his stuff was good.
No, his drawings were good, actually.
They were actually pretty good.
I don't understand what, what those teachers were on about.
Yeah, and I hope everyone thinks twice because it turned into a whole fucking mess.
No, literally.
Encourage that, and that's why everyone goes, oh, participation trophies are, are a problem. All the kids these days are being coddled. Well, we haven't had another Hitler yet.
Yeah, we have, well.
There's some guys that are trying, for sure.
Yeah, but, but, but we don't, but then none of them are Hitler level yet.
They're not as prolific. No, there's no one as prolific yet.
No, it's true, it's true.
Since, there certainly before was. Wait, I have a question for you.
You directed my HBO special.
I did.
Model comedian.
And.
Model slash.
Uh, model slash. Um, I want to know what was the worst part of it?
I want to know genuinely what was the worst part.
Genuinely the worst part?
I'm always asking Michelle, my assistant, to insult me and she's always kind of coming up with like weak ones to save her job.
What? She just said I have one today.
What?
What is it? Yell it. Come to the mic? Michelle, what is your insult of me that you have today?
Ready with some to have.
Okay, what is the one you came up with?
Should I say now?
Um, uh, sometimes when Caleb and I share a like, a bathroom and, um, I go in after him, um, and use a toilet.
Um, sometimes there are skid marks there.
Oh, yeah, always.
I didn't experience that.
Oh, always.
When we were roommates.
We were roommates briefly. That's a really good one, Michelle.
That was really good.
I'm leaving skid marks in the toilet.
For sure. Because my thing is like, it's a toilet. Do you know what I mean by that?
That's where the skid marks should be.
I did this at Brittany Borowski's house. I left a skid mark in the toilet and, and here's the thing, people act shocked and I'm like, yeah, do you guys know what fucking goes on in there?
Yeah, don't you know what's supposed to go in the toilet?
That's where my shit goes.
That's where my shit goes. It's the container for my shit.
Well, that's why I feel, when I get embarrassed, when I fart in a bathroom and there's other people in there and I'm like, wait a second.
Wait a second.
Do you know what radically? Where else would I do that?
Hold on. This is the room for that.
This is where that comes, or like the most embarrassing thing. When you're in the bathroom and you're, someone's in the stall next to you and you have a plop. And it's like, that's why I'm in here. What could I be embarrassed about?
You feel like your turd hit the water too loud? And you're like, what the fuck?
You won't believe what I'm getting up to to make it quieter.
It is, it's worse than just shitting in the toilet.
Being ashamed of your shit in the shit room is crazy. And I refuse to participate.
You don't experience this?
No.
If you were in the stall next to someone and you shook up big loud ones.
And then I erase it. I erase it from my brain. I feel the shame in the moment. I feel it wash over me and then I go, let it keep washing.
I've, something that radically changed my life is refusing to have shame about anything. I have no shame.
I love that.
My, I, it's like, life is already so hard.
I feel that I apologize a lot for existing.
But you don't experience this?
Well, no, I just, I guess I mean embarrassment. Like, I have some, I have some shame sometimes around like, whatever. But like, I'm not gonna be embarrassed about anything that I can't control.
Okay? I take shits, I fart.
I'm fat.
I have an experience where, so I have like really bad stomach issues, as you know. And um, my burps are earth shattering.
Totally.
Earthquake type.
Do you mean just the volume and vibration? Or do you also mean there's like a?
The volume and vibration.
A scent involved?
Sometimes I'll burp and, and a friend rolls down a window in the car. For sure. Hannah and I will be driving and I burp and she just goes.
She just, zzzzzzz, just, you just feel it go down?
Yeah, and I can, I'll preempt it sometimes if I know, if I know. But the, the, the sound is very loud.
And I've just kind of had to accept, for a while I was like, you know, you convince yourself, I live in a building, no one can hear me. And then I hear someone like drop their phone. In the bill, in the, and I go, well, there's no denying. Literally one time I heard my neighbor cough.
And I said, well.
They've heard my burps.
Well, I'm fucked.
The, the burping thing is, the burp with a scent is why I had to stop eating gas station chicken.
I was addicted to gas station chicken for a while. And it was like the burp was having like a scent in a way that I was like, you can't do this anymore.
See, I'm like, that'll happen to me no matter what it is. And I just have to go, you know.
Sometimes I burp, sometimes it smells.
Sometimes I shit in it, leaves a mark in the bowl.
I've got something bad going on in my toilet as well. Is this gonna be the whole episode?
Well, I was actually trying to talk to you about the HBO special and then Michelle gave her.
Right, right, right. Wait, what was the, oh, what was the worst part about?
The worst part about directing the HBO special. But it's encouraging that it's not that I left skid marks in our shared toilet.
No, I don't remember skid marks.
I did have a gonorrhea scare in our shared apartment.
Oh, that was true. That was true. I think you were getting, you were getting meds like day of special.
Yeah, we thought that I had gonorrhea when we were filming the special.
Did you not?
That was scary. I ended up not having gonorrhea. Yeah, I think I was just having a back problem.
Okay. Yeah, right. Cause you, you said your back hurt and you thought it was.
My back hurt. It was a couple, but then it was like my back hurt and like two other symptoms that were like gonorrhea.
And then.
And then it was like, I'm, I'm just maybe a little stressed.
Well, no, but then do you remember the day before? So it was like my back, I had, I thought I had thrown my back out from doing too much on a bicycle ride. I had done too much on a long bicycle ride.
Right, right, right, right, right.
But then I was like, I have these other symptoms. And then that day, my boyfriend at the time called me, we were open. And he was like, hey, sorry, I tested positive for gonorrhea. You might want to check on that. And I was like, fuck.
I have gonorrhea. And then I went to the, and you remember, I went to the medical clinic in Chicago, Illinois.
Yep.
And when I was outside about to walk in to get my gonorrhea test, a homeless man yelled at me, uh, repent. And I was like, I will.
Yeah, literally. As you're on the way in.
Close to it, yeah. I was like, you've caught me at a really good time.
Yeah, that's probably a good place to yell that.
Totally. Outside the STD clinic? I'm never closer to repenting as a than outside the STD clinic.
On my way in.
But then they cleared me. No gonorrhea.
That's pretty good.
That's beautiful.
But anyway, I'm glad that the skid mark situation wasn't too much for you when we lived together.
No, maybe it was, remember when we were doing the scooters?
And you were insisting, you remember this, yeah. So, so basically, you were like, I found this amazing coffee shop that I want to go. And let's like ride scooters there. And I was like, no worries. Of course, I find the scooter that seems to like have no battery and won't go at all. And you're just kind of like, you're, you're just kind of like on the way yelling at me, hurry up.
Hurry up.
And I was like, well, like, okay. And then I had to switch scooters. And then we get finally get the coffee.
Yeah. And by the way, we had a delightful conversation with the guy running the coffee shop.
Yes.
Wasn't he lovely?
He was great.
He was amazing. I think of him.
And he took so much care.
I think of him.
To make the coffees.
I will carry him with me always.
And then do you remember what happened next?
I sure do.
You said, you said, let's get back on the scooters. And I said, but we're holding the, we're going to hold the coffee and ride the scooter at the same time. You said, it'll be no worries.
Yeah. I said, that's no big deal, Sandy. Please don't be boring.
I believe we got not even halfway down the block and
you immediately dropped the coffee on the ground.
Because of course you can't.
Well, there was a bump. I never accounted for bump.
But how could you?
My plan was to do this.
That was my plan was that. This hand would really be the control, like we're, we're keeping control of things.
And then this hand would have in these three fingers, the cup, and then these two fingers, the other upside of the scooter. That would have worked for 20 miles on smooth ground.
I never accounted for bump.
Now, I, so then you dropped the coffee.
In a crazy comedic way.
And then
like I hit the bump and I was like, ah! It like fell everywhere.
But what was also comedic about it was how long it took for the coffee to be made.
And how long we had a conversation with the guy about how much he cared about the coffee.
How much effort and care was put into the coffee.
And we basically turned around.
Yeah, we went back.
We basically turned around. And then, no, you didn't. You said, I can't go back there.
Did I say that?
Yeah, you said, I, I can't tell.
Oh, we went to another coffee shop, didn't we?
Yeah, we went to a different. However, however, I did not drop my coffee. So then, so then you said, let's scooter to another coffee shop that's further away. So then I'm trying to do the balance and I look how big my hands are.
Yeah, we've got little hands.
Very small little hands. And so I'm like trying to balance them and you're on your way because you're not holding a coffee.
And then you're, you're berating me. You're berating me.
I don't like when people go slow.
Hurry up, hurry up.
Why can't you figure out the scooter?
Keep in mind, this is a, this is like a two week period where I'm forcing you to do scooters and bikes at every turn.
Which normally I don't mind.
No, you were actually really down with it.
But then you continued to tell everybody how much I hated you for making a scooter. But it wasn't about the scooter.
You did, you resented me.
I was only in the moment when I had to be balancing both.
And see, that is where, don't, wouldn't you say that we need to slow down, we need to stop doing so many things at once?
No, yeah.
I gotta do more things at once and they all need to be scooter related.
I'm actually not even big on scooters.
You're over it?
No, it was just a thing that was happening at that time in Chicago. I'm really big on bike.
Bike is great.
Bike is incredible. I love bike and I love going fast on bike.
Scooters scare me because there was a, a girl that sold me weed in Austin, Texas once.
And she really put the fear of God in me about the scooters.
She said, do not take the scooter. And then she started showing us these scars on her arm.
That she fell and like dislocated her elbow and she was like, the bone went through, the bone went through. And I was like, hey, please leave.
Totally. And guess what? Bad things happen in pursuit of beauty all the time.
I'm not going to live my life like that. People tell me this all the time. Caleb, don't ride the e-bike so fast. Don't ride the e-bike so fast.
Do you, are you wearing helmet?
Well, Sandy, the point is like, the point is you pursue beauty with reckless abandon when you have a lust for life the way that I do.
They know when to clap.
But we need your brain. But we need the brain. We need your precious brain.
I know. I love my brain. My brain is my most favorite thing about me. I'm completely obsessed with my brain. I feel so grateful for it every day.
And at the same time, carrying a helmet is annoying as fuck.
I mean, that is true.
Everyone should be wearing helmets, though. I really want to say, I'm a pro helmet guy. Everyone who gets on a bike should be wearing a helmet.
I'm so pro helmet in like the most virgin way. Like, when I lived here, I was biking everywhere and ruining my whole outfit, ruining my hair, carrying around a helmet all the time because I said I just...
Just, when it comes to helmets, do as I say, not as I do.
That's my thing.
And it's not that I don't trust myself, it's that I don't trust all these frickin' cars.
Well, this is what everyone says. You can trust yourself, you can't trust everyone else. I am a I'm a fucking operator. I don't know, it's just different with me.
Yeah. I thought you were gonna say I'm an optimist and I trust others, but no.
No. I trust others maybe less than most.
I'm very distrustful.
But you trust yourself enough to know you could get out of it.
I trust myself in a way that is beyond explanation.
I know that I can veer.
I know that I can veer. I know that I can move.
I trust myself pretty well in a car.
The bicycle, it gets murky.
Well, because I'm unprotected.
Yeah. I don't know. That can't be the worst part of directing the special, though. There had to have been something. There had to have been something. You know what I thought you might say?
When we got the first, the very first cut of the special.
Oh, yeah. And you were very upset.
And I texted you and I was like, "I hate this. I'm a hack. I'm a hack. I'm a hack. It's all over. Can't believe we did this." I remember, I texted Andy and I was like, "Wow, I just watched the first cut. I kinda wanna fucking kill myself." And I think you text me back and you're like, "Oh, that makes me sad. I'm really proud of it."
That was tough, I guess, because it was a little bit like, there's nothing I could really do about that.
Yeah. Well, it's also like, it was the first cut, Caleb. Like, we have a whole process to do. We have smoothing. We have like, we will do the stuff that needs to be done.
Yes. And because I didn't wanna cut anything before you saw it.
Because it was like, that's not my decision to make. So I was like, I'm gonna leave everything in, every riff, every, you know.
Which is correct.
Which is correct. You're a great director.
You directed it phenomenally. I wasn't thinking in the moment about anything other than how I felt about my performance.
What did make me feel better is you said, this is the best, the most I've ever liked how I look on anything.
So that was nice.
It was.
And I said, well, that's all I can really control.
No, you did a beautiful, amazing job. And I, I, I think that I later on apologized and made amends and clarified for coming to you so raw. That's a thing I've actually learned about collaboration is ultimately that was a compliment to you, that I feel so comfortable with you, that I would come to you that raw. But something I've learned is that, that you shouldn't do that. You should, I think you should process a little bit before you go to collaborators. Do you know what I mean?
Yeah, but I also do think, like, that was how you felt and I wanted to know. I mean, I feel like Hannah had a similar thing with her special.
Where she watched it and she was like, why am I talking so slow? And I was like, Diva, you talk really slow.
Like, to the point where like, sometimes we'll be at a restaurant and like, the waiter will start laughing because she'll be like, I'm thinking that what I'm, like, it's like, it's crazy.
It's long.
Can I also say?
I, the funny thing is, every stand-up I talked to before who's had a special, every one of them said, the first cut will make you suicidal. Maybe even do yourself a favor and don't watch it. Like, everyone tried to protect me and I, and I legitimately told myself I am different.
And then I, and then came the suicidal thoughts.
I, so it's like, everyone, everyone I have talked to hates the first cut.
This is why I could never do a special of my own comedy. I just don't think I could, I don't think I could watch myself for that long. I don't think I could see myself from every angle. I don't, I did like an interview recently and I found out my filler words.
Yeah. Fillers are big.
Just is my, is my big filler word.
I'm saying it all the time.
I said, you know, like a billion times in the special. That was a big thing for me. I mean.
I need a shock collar for saying like, I think. I'm trying to really, really stop.
But it's hard.
It's hard because it works.
It's good when there's a pause.
I also don't, I've always been of the mind with stand-up that like, I do stand-up for me and the people in the room. There were years at the beginning of my career where whenever I was offered, like, I think I turned down the Comedy Central taping like five times. Like, I was very opposed to filming stand-up. I was like, this isn't for, because you watch it and you notice things you would never notice in the room. In the room, you're having a fucking great time because you're just with strangers, listening to stories. And I have always felt that I don't do stand-up for other comics. I don't do stand-up for commenters on the internet. I do stand-up for me and the people in the room. And that is from improv, like, I took that from improv.
Yeah, that was a big turning point for me in stand-up because I think that for a while I was very, you know, like, very anxious, so I would stick really to what I wrote. And then becomes the things where it's like, like, where they say, you know, oh, oh, you're gonna audition for this comedy festival, or we need a tape. And so then you get in your head of, I'm gonna set up a camera, so I can't do riffing because I'm just filming the set. Or I need to practice my type 5, so I can't riff. And I just, I'm not having fun. I'm not having fun and they're not having fun, and I need to just remember the most important thing is if the audience is having fun, then it's great. That's all that matters.
It's just for me and the people in the room, and that is the hard, that was the very hard thing for me about the special is watching it and going. The big thing I had to reckon with was regardless of how anyone who watches this feels about it, I, by the way, in the end, did love it and I'm very proud of it. It's probably my most special work, but, to me, but that I had to basically like make peace with the fact that this will never feel the way that it felt in the room.
Do you know what I mean? And it never could. It's, it's, there's a distance now. And it'll never feel, the tour felt amazing, the taping felt amazing. The taped put-out product will never feel the way that I felt in the room because I was there connecting with the people.
Yeah, and then it just becomes a different thing. Because I think that that's also part of the, I think, the process of figuring out how to film a special is, we had so many conversations about what do we want it to feel like and what is the vibe that we want the people, the audience, the audience at home to feel. Because they're not gonna be able to be in there. And I, like, I feel like, I remember the words you were saying, it was like cozy, intimate. I want it to feel like we're at a, like a house party. And I think that's like what it felt like. But it's, you always have to remember with a taping that it's actually for people to watch on a little screen. Or a big screen.
I think we did achieve the vibe.
I think so too.
Katie Birmingham.
This is such like, wow.
She did this too. Yeah, Katie did the HBO special. She did the podcast set.
I love her so much.
She's a prolific genius.
I know.
And I adore her and she's a fantastic human being.
She's such a good person.
She really is.
I mean, the fact that we had all those couches and chairs for the audience to sit on and it's like, you, it's more for the vibe than actually, actually seeing the chairs. But you wouldn't believe the amazing cute chairs that every single audience member was sitting on a cute chair.
That, that's the thing about Katie is like every detail, there might be a trinket in the far corner of the room behind the camera that we're certain will never be seen, but if we said it was important, Katie will get it right.
And it's also like, I'm sitting here and I'm feeling like I'm in a comfortable cozy living room. So then that affects the vibe of how we're talking and how it's perceived.
You've ever been.
I know. I would never be saying these things otherwise.
We typically have such a contentious relationship.
Yeah, we got in a big fight right before this.
We did.
Yeah, we had to hash it out over coffee.
Do you want to tell everyone what it was about?
I'm so bad at improv. You go.
This is what I cannot do. Oh yeah, let's talk. Yes, we were sitting at the coffee shop.
Yeah, you're, I mean, you're halfway there. That's just the truth of what happened so far.
And then you fill it in.
We're sitting at the coffee shop.
I can't, why can't I do it?
And yeah, you just brought up, you brought up some of my infidelities that you don't like, that I have been like hanging out with other people other than you, that you get really upset.
I don't like that you've been having sex with other people.
Yeah, well, and you brought that up.
I want it to be only me.
You brought that up and I felt bad.
I did actually, there, a true thing about us is that when we lived together for the special, which is funny of us.
That I was like, if you want to direct this special, you have to live with me for a week and a half.
And then I remember we said that we, then when people ask how we met, we can say we were roommates in Chicago.
Yeah, and it was beautiful.
It was. We were roommates in Chicago.
But I wanted to have sex in the apartment a couple of times.
You did, yeah.
And I did ask permission, which felt respectful.
I didn't know your level of exposure to gay men.
My brother is gay.
So I was like, I didn't know if you've dealt with this before.
Like, hey, there's a guy who's getting off work nearby and he wants to come over and have sex with me. So I am interested in doing that.
Ultimately, it's 4:30 PM in the afternoon.
Just want to make sure that's okay.
And that was fine for me. I think we've all watched a movie after.
Right? I think we watched, um, forgetting Sarah Marshall.
Oh yeah, I liked that guy.
Yeah, yeah.
That guy was cool. That guy was cool.
Yeah, and I was cool about it.
Yeah, you were cool. You were really cool about it. I miss that guy.
Who was he? We'll never know.
No, I know his name. I have his number. We've texted since then.
Cute.
Did he watch the special?
I didn't ask.
I didn't ask. I kind of hope not.
Only because that's kind of weird.
It is weird.
You know?
It is funny, the number of people that I've dated since the special came out, or like flirted with, or even become new friends with, that are like, "Oh, I'm gonna watch your special." And I'm like, "Just heads up, it's extremely revealing."
I mean, I feel that I've learned now that podcasts can be listened to by anyone. I feel-
This is the problem with them.
I feel that when they first started,
I was like, "Well, I'm just talking to my friend."
It's not true anymore.
No, it's not true anymore. And it wasn't true then.
It wasn't true then.
Honey, it was never true. They're out there forever.
It was never true. And then I was on Seek Treatment,
Hmm.
Cat and Pat.
And it's about sex and dating.
And I talked, well, now that I say it, then people are gonna go listen to it. But, you know, talking about losing your virginity and such.
And told the whole story. And then now I'll talk to people and it'll come up and they'll go, "Oh yeah, I remember that." And they describe it to me. And I'm like, "Ohhh." So, right, so you know that, too. Now everyone knows.
It's a problem. I didn't ever intend, I guess I intended, I didn't know that this podcast would develop the reach it's developed.
And I get texts, I've had to really think about the way I talk about things on here.
Because I get texts from people being like, "Hey, so that was like pretty obviously a story about me." And it's like, anyone could kind of put that together.
Like, it really, it's been rare because I do think I'm pretty judicious about like cutting stuff, or like not using names or identifiers.
But it's fucking hard because I want to talk about my life and unfortunately, my life involves other people.
I wish my life was just me.
Do you, though?
No. It's all about community.
How do you feel about people? Yeah, I have a question for you.
Do you think human beings are innately good?
You are not even ready for my answer.
Yes, I am.
Okay, so I've been reading The Dawn of Everything. Have you heard about this?
Oh, my god, have I heard of The Dawn of Everything? How far into it are you? It's hard to get through.
Conclusion.
You've read it all?
I'm in the conclusion.
Oh, my god, it's hard.
But it's taken me like two years. I had to take a long break.
I'm still working on it. It's like a-
Where are you at?
It's a specter that looms over me. I'm in the 200s area.
Yeah, I mean, I will say that that's where it starts to really get boring.
Yeah. So, season two, it gets really bad.
First two chapters, I'm like, my entire worldview has changed.
Every single thing about the way that we organize our lives, I walk down the street, I go, "Concrete everywhere. Why is that person, why are we not helping this person?"
"Why have we constructed a world in which we don't help this person that I'm seeing right in front of me who's, needs help?"
And we just walk because I have to-
I have to go.
I have to go?
To work?
Question mark. I have to go to my job?
Yeah, it doesn't make any sense.
What are you talking about?
We created a society where we have to go.
And then there, right, and then the, the chapter about farming-
Endlessly interesting.
Very interesting.
And then after that, I was like, I lost the plot a little bit.
Yeah, totally. Yeah, when we, I mean, we started, yeah, it really gets tough.
But you, you're in the conclusion.
And what has happened?
Well, you know, basically, the, the whole, for, for those who haven't read the book, or are unfamiliar, the, they posit a lot of questions at the beginning. Are humans innately good, or are we a force that has been corrupted by creating society? Or do we need society because we are innately, like, a animalistic, violent people and we need rules, et cetera?
Exploring all these things, exploring all these things. Conclusion? It's a little bit of both.
500 pages of, there's no answer to the question.
Damn, could see it both ways.
Could see it both ways.
Sometimes it's this, and sometimes it's this.
But case by case.
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Well, I have a take.
Which is that I don't, I didn't, I don't even need 500 pages of research. I don't even need to be that smart. Uh, we're innately good.
That's nice.
That's my opinion.
I think so too. I think that, that, uh, when we start to fear that we're not innately good is when it causes us to not be good. Do you know what I mean?
If we all were to collectively hold hands and believe that all humans are innately good, there would, I think, be no issue.
We're innate, my opinion is that we are innately good and over time we have created a society that is extremely abnormal and unjust.
And it has corrupted, it corrupts most of us instantaneously.
Most people, by the time they develop consciousness, have already been corrupted by a really evil, like malevolent society of selfishness, capitalism, like hetero patriarchy and racism. And so we immediately get, our innate goodness is immediately destroyed by that. And then we have to actually, the project of our lives is to work back to goodness.
But, all that having been said, I think the same thing of happiness about what you said. When you say, when we start to worry about...
What did I say?
You said if we, when we start to worry about if we're good is when things go wrong.
Same is true of happiness.
That is true.
If you start thinking about, "Am I happy?", stop it.
Stop it.
Stop, just quit that.
You're happy.
So that's suppression.
Yeah, hello. You're happy.
Oh, no worries, you're happy.
You're happy. Don't worry about that.
No, I think inspecting it endlessly makes it impossible to be. You should certainly look at like your feelings, but like constantly, endlessly, intricately digging through like...
Oh, could I do this one small thing and then I'd be happier?
Yeah. Stop. Stop doing that.
Stop doing that. Do you have a friend?
Yeah. Do you have a friend?
Me?
Yeah, I do.
How many, how many close friends do you think you have?
That's a good question.
Cause I think you have a lot.
I think that I do.
You have a really rich life.
Of beautiful friendships.
It is nice to come visit here where I'm like seeing old friends that I haven't seen in a long time and I'm like... Look at all these people I know that are nice.
Look at all these people that I love, even if I, like, last night I hung out with my friend Lex, who I've known for like, I don't even know how long. Twelve years, thirteen years.
Crazy.
And I haven't, I, we don't see each other that often, and every time we hang out, we're just like, I love you.
Look at that.
Yeah, we do a little catch up, who, who are you now?
Yeah. Who have you become?
Who have you become? Same old guy.
It's just fun.
It is fun.
I have good friends in LA, which is nice. I feel like that took a little while.
Because I feel like I moved there for work, and so most of the people that I met were through work, but that doesn't necessarily a good friend make, just because we are working together.
No, in fact, it can be really challenging.
Sorry.
Sorry, guys, that can be really challenging.
Yeah, but no, I have, I, well, the, um, my friend Sarah always talks about, she's like, she's like, there's tier one, there's tier two and tier three, and when we first met, I was kinda like, tier three, tier two cusp, I've made it to tier one now with her.
Nice, that's huge.
I helped set up her engagement.
Yeah, that's tier one.
Yeah, tier one, I set up, I set up the picnic and then, and then frankly ruined it, because I wanted to watch.
Her fiance said, you're in charge of setting up the blanket, but then you have to leave, because I know, I was like, do you want me to hide behind a tree and take pictures? She was like, no, because if I know you're there, then like, I won't be able to be in it. And I was like, totally, totally, I'm still gonna hide. I wanna watch.
You're like, totally, you'll never know I'm there, you're in a deli suit, yeah.
They, where I hid is, I thought they were walking one way, so I hid, I ran up a hill and I, me and my friend Gabby, and we were hiding up there, and then they actually were walking that way, and then we dove into the bushes.
What kind of sitcom ass?
It was so weird, we dove into the bushes, and I was like, they saw us, they saw us, and then, um, finally, we're like, waiting over there for a long time in the bushes, we don't see them come out, we're like, alright, well, let's just go the other side of the bushes, we come out the side of the bushes, they're walking that way, and I immediately started running back into the bushes, and Sarah was like, okay, like, I saw you now. We really saw you this time.
We really, really fucking saw you, please stop going in the bushes.
That's so cute.
It was really cute.
That's one of the most adorable things I've ever heard.
And by the way, no one was mad.
No one was mad that we ruined it.
That's sweet, that's how it should be.
I know, I was really afraid, cuz I would got greedy.
Yeah. You've tried to have too much.
I tried to have it all.
You literally tried to have it all, and it's not the nineties, so women can't do that anymore. Women used to be able to have it all in the nineties.
I know, you can't have kids anymore.
No. Women can't have kids anymore. We end the episode on that.
That would be a really fun way to start ending our episodes. You know, we always have this really natural build where it kind of goes, we do this and this. And then it's like, tell people where they can find you and thank you so much. I think it'd be really fun to actually just start ending the episodes with being like, so anyway, yeah, I thought maybe I was depressed for a little bit.
Do you have like a tag at the end of the episode?
Do we? No. No.
I didn't know if, you know, sometimes-
Like a jingle?
No, well, sometimes the companies that we work for will be like-
At the beginning of the episode, it has to be like, blah, you know, whatever. They're like, I think we now we have one that's like, wave or something.
And I didn't know if they had an end one as well.
But-
Well, we could make one.
Seems not. Yeah. Yeah, I'm always trying to find new ways to give.
To everybody.
You don't do like, because you know how sometimes podcasts at the end, they'll do credits?
How do you mean?
They'll be like, this episode was, they always kind of, it was interesting because they, I don't know. I always go, you could just put that in there.
You, you should put it in the description because no one listens to that part.
Nobody listens to it.
And also, I don't believe in giving people credit for their work.
I agree.
Or fair pay.
Well, I did like the cover art for a podcast and then they credited me at the end of every episode. And I thought that was really nice, but I was like, I think I might be overkill.
Yeah. Throw it in the comments.
Yeah, every time.
Throw it in the descrip-
This is a good photo.
S-Town.
Serial.
Whoa, you did the art for that?
Yeah, I did.
The podcast was huge.
Yeah, your name is really out there.
Not Serial, S-Town. S-Town was the serial spinoff.
I know S-Town. S-Town was fucked up.
That actually really depressed me for a while.
S-Town actually really fucked up my life for a good amount of time.
That was crazy. I should go back and listen to that again.
It's one of the only podcasts I've ever listened to because everyone was talking about it.
Watches and clocks?
And everyone was talking about it and I listened to it on like a series of road trips that I was taking at the time. And I, for a couple of weeks, was like, Like, I really was dysregulated by it.
It was not a good listen. It was beautiful you did the artwork for it.
Thank you, thank you. I've done a lot of random photo jobs you wouldn't expect. I've done a Bill Nye book.
Covers, insert photos of like a children's science.
A Bill?
Of Bill.
What was he doing, beakers and stuff?
Yeah, we had beakers, we had. We had beakers that we filled with different colors. We put dry ice in the beakers. We had, he brought like, he brought a lot of bow tie options.
That's classic Bill.
Classic Bill.
He's not just the science guy, he's damn near the bow tie guy.
And say that.
The amount that he wears bow ties.
Bill Nye?
Bow tie guy.
He should do a show called Bow Tie.
He should.
Anyway.
Yeah. I've done a lot of stuff like that you wouldn't expect.
What's the, what, what do you, what is the most random job you've done?
Like a photo job?
I'm really opening it to anything.
Um.
Recently, I did a very random one for like a, a running headphones company. They, like, you know, those headphones that are bone conduction? They just go over your skull?
They wanted, they were doing a tie-in with the LA Marathon and they wanted photos of the headphones in front of a bunch of LA landmarks.
Cool.
I said, that sounds pretty easy.
You're an LA girl, that's easy for you.
Hardest job I've literally ever had. That was, that was harder than truly any job I've ever done.
Wow.
Why would it be? What would you think?
I can imagine, because it's a photo of headphones.
First, yes, it's a photo of headphones, they look weird.
And, and they want a photo of headphones which are this big and a building, which is a big, that's a big thing.
Yeah, they're like, do the photos in front of the Hollywood sign.
It's like, huh.
Yeah, that was one of them.
I couldn't get that one. I tried.
I really tried. And then the other thing is, it's the most trafficked, most touristy, busiest roads in all of LA.
And the only way I could get photos was I had to balance the headphones on top of my car.
So I'm parking illegally in the most chaotic, buses are almost hitting me.
People are honking at me, everyone's screaming at me. I'm like trying, because you know, to get a, I'm like, my back's hurting, I spilled an entire water bottle in my car.
Oh, Sandy.
This big, and then I couldn't, it got trapped underneath the floor of my car.
What did?
The water.
I couldn't get it out. I had to pay so much money to a guy because then there was a smell in my car. I couldn't get the water out. I had to remove the floor of my car. I had to pay a kid. I paid a kid that I found on Google Maps to remove the floor of my car. Because the water had gone under everything and was just sitting in there. I'm out money.
You've lost, you've lost millions doing this photo shoot.
I lost so much money doing that. And then they pay, it takes them months to pay me.
Yeah, always.
Finally, I, and I spent two straight days, entire day, driving around doing this. I'm in pain. It's a thousand degrees. I finally see what it is that they've made. It's a GIF where there, it's about three seconds long. And it's just all the photos like, and I was like, you can't even see where I went.
Yeah, they should have used AI.
You're right. If only they used AI, my car wouldn't smell bad.
Whoa, and then some kid from Google wouldn't have gotten a job.
Literally.
Some kid from Google fucking Maps.
Shout out Auto Taco Details with a Z on Google Maps. If you live in the Los Angeles, Echo Park, Silver Lake area, he will come to you.
Water trapped in your floorboard, he will come over, rip it out.
He will, he charged me so little money to do that, that I paid him extra because I was like, it took an entire day.
Cause we just came over and I was like, there's a smell in my car. I can't, I thought we'd just vacuum it out. And he was like, we have to remove the seats.
It helped a lot.
There was so much in there.
I was putting the floor of my car in the dryer. Put the floor of my car in the dryer.
I put the floor of my car in the dryer. It's so fucking funny, dude. That is so funny.
Removed the seats, the floor is in the dryer.
Yeah. Questions?
Eh, no questions. By the way, you want to know my hot take?
David S. Pumpkins hilarious.
It's one of the most brilliant pieces of media in a decade.
I actually get pissed off when people are like, I don't understand what's funny about it. It's literally so funny.
What's there not to laugh about?
Oh, oh, it's a haunted house and everything's scary. And then there's just a guy that's like, me describing the floor.
Yeah, I have seen you on the podcast.
By the way, the most popular sketch that's happened on SNL in forever. This is actually funny.
One of the only sketches they've had breakthrough in like two decades and you're like, oh, I actually liked it.
My hot take is it's funny.
No, it's incredible and it's Tom Hanks.
And Bobby Moynihan, the funniest ever.
So let's take one of the most iconic actors of many generations.
Yep. Put him in a hilarious suit, by the way.
Put him in a hilarious suit and have him be a fucking freak. Yeah, that's awesome. Sorry.
Tom Hanks on SNL is actually kind of good.
Yeah, I can't remember anything much outside of that one.
I'll tell you one.
Oh, tell me.
Black Jeopardy.
Oh, yeah.
When Keenan, when Keenan goes, uh, this is what you can do with, uh, this is what you can do with thin women. And he buzzes in as like a MAGA guy. It's, you know, the whole sketch is like, what do black people and MAGA have in common? And Tom Hanks buzzes in as like a MAGA guy and he goes, not a goddamn thing.
And Keenan goes, you goddamn right. It is so fucking funny.
It's one of the best moments of the show. What's exciting you right now? What's giving you hope and optimism and excitement? What are you looking forward to?
Good luck.
It's actually, and I, it's hard. That's really hard.
It feels like a time where it's hard to retain optimism.
That's completely okay.
Tell me.
My building.
We, there's 16 units, my building. And we've all become really like close, good friends.
This makes me want to cry.
And it's become, we have like a sort of informal tenants association. I would like to formalize it, but I think we're, we're still kind of like, not wanting too much retaliation from the landlord, but I do want to have a meeting with the LA tenants union and figure out how to like, formalize it.
I can connect you with some people.
That would be literally amazing.
They're good. They're, they're good. They have a good organization out there.
They're really good, especially the one in my neighborhood is like so solid, but it's just been really, really life-affirming and nice to say, oh, like I have this building of people around me at all times and we're all just always down to help each other and because. Our landlord is negligent of the building and doesn't really care about it. We have become basically stewards of the building and we care about it. And we're working to beautify it in ways that he would never spend money to do.
And it's like little ways that life can be difficult. And then you just go, should I ask for help? Should I not ask for help? And then I go, I'll just text the group chat. Like, what, you know, I bought something on Facebook Marketplace. A gorgeous little piece of furniture, by the way. Have you ever heard of a gossip bench?
Of course, I love gossip bench.
Like the most incredible thing ever created. Why are we not innovating like this anymore?
Two-sided, beautiful.
Why are we not innovating?
You need a unique space for it, though.
You need like a unique.
For my entryway.
Put on my shoes.
Nice, gossip bench.
Really, really good. And it was like, I could probably bring it in, but it's kind of delicate. I was like, should I try to just like bring this in my house by myself? And I said, let me just, I don't want to bother the neighbors. I'll just text and see if anyone's home. Three people immediately, I'll be right there. And everyone's like, help me bring it in.
This is one of the beautiful things about, this is, actually, what you've just said is a really, really good example of why to organize with your neighbors.
Because in my building, they're trying to remove all the door staff. And we have come together and started a group chat. And like, it's, I live in a big building, so we haven't gotten everybody. But we've got a lot of people and we signed petitions to like, try and stop it. TBD on if we're successful or not. But that's what's happened. Is it, it starts from this place of crisis of like, we need to stop this thing that is happening. Uh-oh, big problem. And then as time has gone on, it's turned into this really beautiful thing of like, hey, I have to go out of town for three days. And at the very last second, my flight's in like three hours. My dog walker backed out. Can anyone in the building help with my dog? I'm so sorry, I can like this, that and the other. I can pay you. People responding and being like, I'd be happy to help. You really don't have to pay me.
Literally, like me and some of my neighbors, we just have keys to each other's apartments. And it's literally like my neighbor will say, oh, I'm working late tonight. Can you go feed the cats? I'm like, of course.
Oh, of course. Why would I not? I'll walk right there.
I live in the building.
And then I know the next time I have that issue, they'll do that for me.
And it's beautiful. And for us, it started also in crisis. We had a crazy roach infestation.
And the building was treating it unit by unit.
As opposed to just like the whole building at once. So the roaches would just kind of.
Migrate and then migrate back.
We'll go over there. And so we all had to like get on a group chat to try to coordinate our exterminations. And then it was like, oh, wait, the exterminations aren't even working. I'm doing research.
I'm buying the roach gel. By the way, if anyone is dealing with German roaches, you get this gel.
It's called, by the way, Vendetta.
Hello. Hello, and I do have one.
Vendetta plus.
Yeah, a plus, extreme.
Vendetta. Extreme Vendetta.
Nighttime cold and flu. Vendetta nighttime cold and flu.
Literally. And so I just was like, I'm putting it in everybody's apartments, whether you like it or not. And now we're all friends, basically.
Yeah. No, I have actually, I had an interaction with a roach yesterday that changed things for me.
People are laughing in the studio. I, you may or may not know, you may or may not have heard me talk about this in my life. I don't know if I've brought it to your attention. Basically, I've been on a journey called 75 Caleb. 75 Caleb is like 75 hard, except it's easy and it's for Caleb.
75 hard, you know this? 75 hard is this psychopathic self-harm ritual wherein people like, it's like you have to work out twice a day for 45 minutes. One of them has to be outside. You have to drink a gallon of water a day. You have to, it's like really intense. No sugar, no alcohol, no whatever.
So 75 Caleb's been this thing that I've been on. It's barely happening at all anymore at this point. It's completely fallen off. Like I'm back on diet soda. I'm not really reading as much. I did smoke two hits of a joint the other night, which was supposed to be part of it. But I'd say we're 40 something days in. Pretty fucking cool, Caleb. Good job, Caleb.
Good job, Caleb. And you know what? I think that it's fine if you have a diet soda.
All told, it was like 38 Caleb and that was beautiful. But
in any case.
I'm trying to stop with the diet soda, too.
Look, it's like, yeah, I will say, by the way, just so people know. I look, I'm a guy who has a diet soda or soda zero every single day. Went on seventy-five Caleb, but it turned out to be thirty-eight Caleb. And by the way, the first time I had a diet soda after that, I kind of didn't feel very good.
No, okay, this is the thing, is I'm literally like, all of a sudden, I feel like I've woken up to realizing like, wait, drinking this thing that's entirely made of chemicals and looks a color it shouldn't look makes me feel bad.
Yeah, just because it's zero calories doesn't mean it's necessarily a-
Well, I was gonna say, there was a time where I was like, you know, not doing so well with the eating.
And it was like, what would I eat? Uh, grapefruit and diet coke on an empty stomach at all times. Would you believe I developed a stomach disorder?
Would you?
Take a look at what happened. My stomach lining has evaporated. And I feel sick all the time.
And it's like, hmm, I wonder where I could have, uh, gotten that.
Oh, oh, oh, just the, the acid and the chemicals burning a hole through my insides at all times.
And then now I have one and I, even just looking at it, I'm like, this is not right. I should be having water. Like, and I never thought about, like, chemicals ever before.
And now everything, well, you, plastic is getting it. I, I feel like I'm developing like, plastic-based OCD.
I'm entirely plastic.
You are, you're a plastic.
I'm plastic, but there's gotta be so much, like, when they're like, oh, there might be microplastics in your testicles. I'm like, my testicles are plastic. Like, I'm sure, trust me, I'm doing what you're not supposed to do.
They say you're supposed to eat a credit card a day.
Yeah, and I do, pretty much. I'm sure I do.
I'm sure I have so many plastics in my body. I don't control what they put out.
Do you think that they're, okay, conspiracy theory, conspiracy theory, what if the plastic makes us immortal?
I hope so. I wanna live forever. I'm having so much fun.
I know, I am really scared of death and I would like to keep going, even, I don't know. We'll see.
I only, can I tell you, I only get, like-
My biggest source of sadness is that I can't be alive forever. My biggest source of sadness is that I can't do things forever. Like, when I'm having a beautiful night with my friends, I go home and get sad because it had to end.
I get this way sometimes also when I'm like, oh my god, there's so many, um, things I wanna do, and movies I wanna see, and books I wanna read, and places I wanna go. I can't do it all.
There's only just one life we have.
Time being limited is incredibly fucked up. Unless, we consume so much plastic.
Right. Because it might preserve us.
God, I hope.
Because if the plastic's going in our brain...
Forever brain.
Also, can I say?
Boom.
I love forever brain.
Plastic forever brain?
Plastic forever brain.
Plastic forever brain with Sandy Honig?
I... There's this thing, like, when people talk about living forever, where they're like, well, it would be sad, because then all your loved ones, you would have to watch all your loved ones die.
No, they're alive too.
I go, no, they live too.
Yeah. Oh, you're thinking the fantasy, it's just me?
Yeah, grow up.
I'm imagining something that's not real and fake.
By the way, if it was just me, I would take it, but... It's not what I'm after.
You're like, I'll make new friends.
Yeah, for sure, it would be a delight. I mean, I don't wanna lose my loved ones all in front of my eyes many times over.
But if that's what is offered to me...
Yeah, would you take the deal?
I would take the deal.
Right, deal or no deal?
Deal.
I would totally take the deal.
Is that Howie Mandel?
Howie Mandel.
Howie, I'll take the deal.
Howie, I'll take the deal, open the briefcase, and then close it, after I take the deal. What?
You should host a game show.
So that'll never happen.
I would love to host a game show.
I fundamentally disrespect Unscripted.
But what's this?
This is not Unscripted.
I... yeah, right, I forgot, I'm reading off my script.
No, I mean-
Wait, wait, hold on, let me just check my next line.
Hold on. No, I disrespect this as well. I mean, I literally, I avoided having a podcast for so long, and then it basically happened to me, kind of.
Yeah, they made you have it.
I don't want to host any sort of game show. If I was gonna do anything, maybe I would have a formalized version of a talk show.
But I would do it my way, where I don't have to be fake.
Like, if they brought on a guest I didn't like, I'd be able to be like, so, you're in this movie, and like, probably no one's gonna see it, like, I would wanna be real like that.
Yeah. I've... I feel the same way, and then I basically was thrust into hosting duties several... I was like, wait, this is the only thing anyone seems to want me to do, which I found interesting. I said, it's the thing-
Well, you're naturally charming.
Well, thank you.
Yeah, it seems to come easy to you.
Does it come easy to you? I'll get back to my cockroach story.
Being naturally... oh, wait, right.
Does charm come natural to you?
I think so.
Do you feel effortlessly charming? Be honest, cuz I think you are.
Oh, thank you. I feel like, um, probably, I think that I don't feel that way. I find, well, no, I'm not gonna say bad things about myself.
Because I'm trying to change the neural grooves of my brain.
Well, just keep in mind, you're talking about my friend Sandy. Just try to keep that in mind.
It's so hard, but I'm gonna say, yeah, I find myself, I think that I'm cute and charming.
You're very cute and charming.
Is it effortless, though?
Um, maybe, yeah.
You think so?
Well, I don't know, because then, like, uh, I'm so anxious all the time, and I'm like, maybe it's not effortless. Maybe I'm kind of changing myself at all times to be what people want me to be.
Well, cuz it's like, I can be.
I don't think you're changing yourself at all times. I think you're always Sandy. I don't think that's true at all.
I am always Sandy, and that, like, yeah, maybe I don't wanna always be lingering in pain. And I wanna just have fun and laugh with my friends.
And even people that aren't my friends. I think that's where I go, I have a hard time, if I'm not having a good time with someone, I have a hard time not still acting like I'm having a great time.
Right. I've gotten better at that. That's a hard thing.
It's hard, because what am I gonna do? Sit there, like, with my arms crossed? I find this a lot on dates.
If I'm on a date and I'm not vibing, what am I supposed to do? Sit there and go, I'm having a terrible time, I'm gonna leave?
Well, yeah. Not, you don't have to say I'm having a terrible time.
Five hours, then we have to break up.
No, hard limits on dates. Hard limits on dates. I, I'm really a big fan of hard limits on dates. Forty-five minute drink. First date, forty-five minute drink, and if it's going great, then you keep going, but really, like, setting up parameters.
What do you say?
I say, hey, I, you're so cool. I've loved chatting with you. I would love to get a drink on Tuesday night. Uh, I have a thing that I have to go to in the Lower East Side. Do you wanna get a drink nearby at seven? And I maybe don't say the specific time that my thing is. Sometimes it's a real thing, sometimes it's fake.
And I go on the date and if it's fun, I keep going. Sometimes when there's a real thing, if it's something that I could invite them to, like not like an intimate friend thing, but like a bigger thing, I'll be like, why don't you come to this with me? But first dates, part of the problem with dating and why so many of my charming, beautiful, amazing friends are not doing it, is because we only have a conception of dating that is extremely like taxing and brutal, where you have to agree to an entire night with a stranger. No, you can get a 45 minute drink and say, I would love to get to know you. And then at the end, you can have one drink and say, this was so much fun. I really should get to my next thing. I loved meeting you. And if they say, hey, I'd love to do it again, you go, I'm kind of getting more of a friend vibe.
And I understand it's different for women, so maybe there's different ways to approach it, but yeah.
I'm having a horrible flashback. Did you see it in my eyes the whole time?
I saw something happening.
As soon as, I just had like a, like a really crazy memory resurface.
Was it where you were the punished or the punisher?
Oh, the punished.
Because I remembered I tried to do this once.
Okay, tell me about it.
I tried to do it.
This was back when I was in my straight era.
I was never really in my straight era, but.
When I, when I just was engaging more on the straight side.
All straight, by the way.
Whole room heterosexual.
Full het.
No, no B at all? That's it.
Yeah, I was gonna say, there should be at least one shoulder shrug in the room.
Yeah, I think that everyone is bi.
My situation.
Or fluid. I don't know if I like bi.
I would love to hire gay people. It'd be powerful, but I.
They don't work hard.
People need to show up on time. Yeah. I've said this many times. I need people to show up on time. I need them to care about their jobs.
Gay people are grifters. They're late.
They, I know.
They're liars. They're sneaks. They're cheats.
I'm a gay person who has lied, cheated. I've grifted every job I've ever had.
At my day jobs, I was grifting these people and they really needed my help.
They really hired me to do a job and I really was coming late and leaving early. I'm gay people are malevolent, wonderful, charming, fun people to go out with.
So fun.
They cannot be on the payroll.
They take advantage. No, it's not like these guys are doing a great job. I mean, these people, these people disrespect me at every turn. They sometimes don't do things I ask.
But it's as close as we can get.
They live a responsible, Christian life.
Yeah. Whether they would say that or not, that is what they're living, yeah.
It's true, it's true.
Sorry, you tried to do a-
Sorry, I just was shoved back to-
You tried to have boundaries.
Yeah, I were. So when I once tried to have boundaries, I was on like a, I feel like it was like a Tinder date or something with this guy who was fully bald, but not bald in a like way that was like in an intentional scary way.
Yeah. Okay, his baldness was political.
But you know when you see a guy, you know how like-
There's circum- there's circumstantial baldness and there's political baldness.
Well, that's what I mean. It's like, you know how in nature, when an animal like bares their teeth to show dominance? So it's like how men will like show their scalp to assert dominance.
Yeah. There's circumstantial baldness and then there's baldness that votes and honey, his is at the ballot box.
Oh, my God, I just had another flashback. To another one, another one. Oh, my God, that was crazy too. That was crazy.
It's the fireplace.
Oh, my God, but this one was basically, I was trying to do that.
I had a show nearby.
I was going to a show. This was at the annoyance theater. Were you ever in New York during the annoyance?
I was not.
It was a good time. It was like two years. And I was like, I'm gonna have a drink with this guy at a bar nearby and then my out will be, I have to go to the show.
The whole drink, he's being scary.
At one point, he's showing me a D Outward music video on his phone. And I believe he maybe like showed me porn? I don't remember actually, and I was scared.
I was scared for my life and I was trying to get out of it and he just kind of kept following me to each new place. And then I texted Mitra, who was also going to the show and I said, I need you to accident, or maybe it was Alyssa. I'm trying to remember. They've both saved me from scary situations. Yeah, but it's hard to remember which one.
But- One of them came in and they were like, "Oh Sandy, the show's starting early, we have to go." Because it was right next to the theater. And I was like, "Ah, gotta go." And he was like, "I'd love to come." And he continued to come.
And he followed us into the... I was literally like so trying to get away from him.
Came with us. I immediately get into the theater and run into the green room and close the door. I just leave him out there.
And he's... I see him bald head shining in the audience. Spotlight on the bald. And I just was like, "I don't know what to do, this guy." Like, well, it was so... Yeah, no, it does... I guess maybe it doesn't work as well.
It's really scary.
I will always acknowledge that being a woman dating men is of course different. And I don't know what to do.
I don't remember how I got out of it. I think, I think he even texted me after being like, "I had such a great time, I would like, love to see you again." And I was like, "Did you not clock when I ran away and hid?"
Yeah, "Did you not see the fear in my eyes and movements?"
"Don't you recall when I left you to die in the basement? And I ran away and locked the door?"
"Do you not remember when I did everything I could to get you killed?"
"Do you not remember when my dear friend so obviously came in and lied to try to save me?"
"Sandy, look, the comedy show's starting early!"
"The show's starting early? That's never happened."
Pardon? It's basically like a fucking movie when the friend calls and goes, "Your dog is sick."
Yeah, it's like, "Come on." People are sick. I mean, yeah, I don't know. I've... The number of times I've gone on a date where it was like, "Clearly, you're a dud. Clearly, I'm a life-saving force at the table. Clearly, I am like being effervescent and asking a million questions and making this interesting just so I didn't waste 45 minutes of my time." And then these men will text me afterwards and say, "I had an amazing time."
Well, of course they did, because you're a delight.
Of course you did. You didn't pay for the ticket and I still put on the show.
Literally, that's how I feel. I go, they go, "Oh my god, I had so much fun." I go, "Yeah, cuz I'm a professional comedian."
Yeah, "You had a great time because I do this for a living and you're a dud."
Yeah, I can, I can talk to a silent audience.
Yeah, and I have. And then, honey, I'll do it again. And I'm not talking about dud where I mean like, "Oh, you're a sweetheart who's nervous." I've gone on multiple dates with the sweetheart who's nervous. I will, I will see that through.
Cuz you can bring it out of it.
I'm talking about boring, uninteresting, like self-centered... Like, yeah, it's a different thing where I'm like, "You were a bad time because you haven't decided that learning how to interface with another person is worth your time in this life? And you think that we had an amazing date? That's shocking."
Shocking.
Shocking to me. So, my cockroach story.
Yes, so sorry.
Don't be sorry. I love the day that we're having. And I would do anything for you in any lifetime. Basically, pretty much at the, I want to say the hour and minute and second that I announced that I was gonna be doing 75 Caleb, which resulted in 38 Caleb. They put up a sign on my block that they would be opening a Taco Bell. But I want to say 271 feet from my front door.
That's really, really tough.
271 feet, and I'm almost certain that's right because I once talked to a guy on Grindr who was about at that place.
He was at the Taco Bell.
What's your order, by the way?
My Taco Bell order? I won't be having one anymore, and here's why. I see that they're putting in the Taco Bell, and I feel a feeling that can only be described. Do you, like, if you were, if it was like Vietnam during the war, and your child had gone away to serve, and then you got a knock at the door and saw an officer in their best uniform, that's how it felt when I saw the Taco Bell sign go up. I knew what was coming for me, I knew it wasn't good news. They don't drop by in a uniform to let you know everything's going well.
So I said I'm prepared-
Yeah, just wanted to let you know, he's-
Is that the time of his life?
He's actually killing it.
He's killing so many people. We're winning, we're winning, by the way. Yeah, he's not doing drugs in the woods, he's not dead. So that's how I felt when I saw the sign go up. And then, last night, in a moment of what can only be described as pure weakness, I decided, I got off a city bike, and it was about 10:00 PM, and I said, "I'm gonna stop and get Taco Bell for the first time."
You said 74 Caleb.
I said 74 Caleb, I said 38 Caleb.
Right, right, right.
I said, "Hey, look, I'm gonna get a little something from Taco Bell, I haven't eaten since lunch, I'm gonna get one chicken quesadilla and one soft taco." Now, what was my order before that? Thank you for asking. My order in the past has been a chicken quesadilla, a cherry Pepsi, two soft shell tacos, and maybe a beefy five-layer burrito.
Ooh.
Enough food to feed six to seven youth sports teams. So, I said, "I'm gonna get one chicken quesadilla, one soft taco, no soda, call it." I walk into the Taco Bell, feeling weak, feeling embarrassed already, feeling ashamed that I've even walked into the Taco Bell. Immediately, over my foot crawls the biggest cockroach I've ever seen in my life.
And you said it's a sign.
I still.
No, right.
Walked further into the Taco Bell. On the phone with my friend, I said, "Oh, my god, the biggest cockroach in the world just crawled over my foot in this Taco Bell." As I'm saying that, I start typing on the screen, quesadilla.
It's screen now?
It's screen. I start.
God.
We've lost our way.
I start typing quesadilla onto the screen, and then I just got hit with a moment of clarity, where I was like, "You need to turn around and leave this Taco Bell." And I said to my phone, my friend on the phone, I said, "Hey, I'm sorry. I'm sorry I'm being weird. I just realized I have to get the fuck out of this Taco Bell." And I turned around and left the Taco Bell.
And went home and ordered Popeyes.
So, look.
Life is worth living.
Oh, wow.
Yeah, it's beautiful.
That's kind of, there was this video that.
Can I tell you one more thing?
Popeyes was cold. Popeyes showed up cold.
Well, if you order it.
I was way too hungry, didn't even put it in the air fryer, ate it cold.
What are you gonna do?
Well, probably at some point sink medical help, but at this moment, I'm gonna eat cold Popeyes.
That also probably had a cockroach in it.
I have kind of no self-respect and I don't heat up food.
Oh, wow. The third time you said you don't have self-respect on the show, by the way. Obsessed.
I know, I have to work on this.
Just every day start saying it.
I have self-respect. I know, that's the crazy thing about affirmations, is they, you do it and you go, "I'm a sociopath because I'm speaking to myself in the mirror, being like, I'm okay."
And then guess what? It works.
I have been told I'm one of the greatest manifestors of my generation.
And I don't believe in it.
Do you do, do any kind of affirmation?
Sure, I'm telling myself things all the time.
It's how I get through the world.
I go, "You're incredibly brave. You're so strong, Caleb. Caleb, you can do this. Caleb, you actually like that thing on your calendar that you have to do."
Caleb, you are charming and hot and people love you. All the time I tell myself these things, and it's made a beautiful life for me.
See, fair, I go, "I'm late, I'm late, I'm late. Everyone's mad at me. My apartment's disgusting."
I'm late, I'm reviled.
I'm, I'm late, I'm disgusting, I've never looked worse. It's.
And yet, you're a delight, you're hot, you're gorgeous, people love to see you.
You were late to see me today, and do you know what I felt? Fifteen more minutes to be excited to see my friend Sandy. That's what I thought.
I was late. Well, that's the thing is because my new thing is setting alarms so that I don't be late.
Um, and I set it for PM, of course.
Well, but also I think that you were living in the moment and you were having fun.
That's true. I was having a delightful lunch with my dear friends, Anna Bones and Sabina Meshky.
And today I was in a space where I could be okay with that.
There are a lot of days I'm not. A lot of days I would have punished you.
In the past.
But then we said, we said it was always supposed to be 12:15.
In every universe, we were gonna get coffee 15 minutes after we said we would.
There, you know what? If we had met at 12, something bad, the universe was preventing something bad from happening.
There was probably a 15-minute line at that coffee shop at 12.
And by getting there at 12:15.
I saved us.
We avoided it entirely.
Or a gunman or something.
Equivalent situation.
There was probably an active gun situation. There was an active shooter at that coffee shop at 12.
It had all been cleared up by the time we got there at 12:15.
Yeah, because if we had showed up, he would have gone through with it.
But because we weren't there, he said.
He said, well, there's no really no targets.
He walked in, put his gun, and he was like, oh, man.
Ah.
Fuck.
Who was here?
Yeah, fuck.
Did we keep that in the special?
Uh, yeah.
I thought it was funny.
I love talking about active shooters. I don't know. It's just like.
Oh, oh, the thing that happens.
Sorry, it's a huge fear of mine. It's happening all the time. I'm not allowed to joke about it.
Oh, sorry, the thing that I fear all the time going out in public.
I'm completely terrified of an active shooter situation. I'm gonna talk about it to take power away.
Yeah, if you don't want me to talk about it.
Make it stop happening.
Take the guns away, yeah.
Make it stop happening. It's happening everywhere.
Every once in a while, this is a really sick and true thought that I have, and we might cut this.
There will be a day where I realize, I haven't heard about a really bad mass shooting in a while. Maybe those are over.
I know, and then then.
And then, of course, it's never over.
And then you open the phone.
Yeah, it's never over. But there are days where I go, wow, we haven't had one of those in like a while. Nice.
But usually it's just because maybe we didn't hear about it.
Well, and I'm saying really bad. I'm saying like, I'm not even counting when just like three or four people get killed.
And that's where we're at.
We're at a place where I'm like, when they say there was a mass shooting and they only got three or four people, I go, I only actually lives in my brain now.
I'm like, oh, it wasn't 20 or 50.
It's so fucked.
That's fucking crazy.
It's crazy.
It's not because I see that and I still try to like muster some like human like heartbreak over it because I'm like, I want this to be a novel. I want this to be a unique thing for my brain to be experiencing. But yeah, if it's not like 10 plus people, I kind of go like, oh, we haven't had a big one in a while.
I know. And I actually don't want to cut that because it's reality. It's so scary and it happens all the time. And I'm like, yeah, so I think about it all the time.
It's really not good.
I used to refuse to go to movies on premiere nights.
Same.
I was like, I won't go to the first big night.
Well, I'm always casing the joint.
I get in and I'm going, I'm making it my plan.
Fake dead.
That's my big plan.
Sorry. You just, you like fake dead in a section they haven't even gotten to yet?
Someone stands up too fast to go to the bathroom and I.
Like the shooters, the shooters only work in the right side of the room.
No, a guy that's.
He looks to the left and you're like this.
I've drawn X's on my head.
He looks to a side of the room, he hasn't even looked at it yet, you're in a chalk outline. Of yourself.
I've popped the blood capsule in my mouth that I bring with me.
You like squirt ketchup on yourself, he's like, babe.
It's a guy that's not even a shooter, he just got up to go to the bathroom too fast.
No, it gets really, one thing that gets really hard that I noticed is like when I was depressed and didn't care if I lived or died, life was actually pretty easy.
And not scary at all.
I was like, oh my God, like.
You said do it.
I was like, yeah, fucking God, I would love that, like somebody do it.
When I was really, really dealing with like chronic illness, I was like. If it happens, it happens.
Look.
And then, once you like being alive.
I've had a good life.
Yeah. Oh, yeah, that was a big part of my depressive era was like, you did a good one.
You had a good, you had a better life than a lot of people.
Yeah, I was like really in it with the, with the illness when, after the first season of Debra's. And I was like, hey, I got to make a season of a TV show with my friends.
Would it be, at, at least I have that.
Yeah, that's beautiful.
And so sad.
Yeah, and then once you start to like being alive, it gets so annoying because it's like, oh, my god, I fucking have to go to the dentist. I literally want to live.
I like want to have my same teeth in like forty years. That's so annoying.
It is annoying. Do you have a good dentist?
Do you have a good dentist?
I have an amazing dentist. And I'm not saying his name, but he's in Kansas City.
Okay, I love that.
And I love him and his whole staff.
I used to have an amazing dentist and then unfortunately he passed. But then they continued to email me from the clinic, but they never changed his name.
From the emails.
And then I kept gaslighting myself, being like, did he not actually die? And did I like have a false memory of him dying? But then I opened the email and it's like after his pa, you know, it's.
But I'm like, let's change the Gmail name.
Let's change the Gmail name in a big way.
Yeah, cuz like, cuz you keep kind of making me think my sanity has gone.
I will say my dentist, uh, staff has gotten really obsessed with like my career.
In a way that's extremely Kansas City.
So every time I come in, you know, I go in like every three, four months when I'm in town. And every time I come in, it'll be like people popping out of rooms that they really shouldn't be popping out of. To be like, we saw the Devil Wears Prada too.
They're like covered in blood.
You were truly, like someone, someone's like writhing in the chair and they're like, we saw it.
Pulling the teeth.
Truly, it's crazy. And I'm like, okay, thanks, you guys.
My old dentist, my brother and I used to go to the dentist together.
Uh, and then for some reason, the dentist thought we were married.
We kept being like, why does everyone in the dentist's office think we're married? It's totally normal for two adult siblings to go to the dentist together.
We're obviously adult siblings who do dentists at the same time.
Yeah, all they're seeing is Jake Honig and Sandy Honig. So then, you know, they're going, hey, okay, so your husband's still in there. But, you know, and I was going.
Oh, this couple that got a sitter for the kids so they could come at the same time.
That's sweet.
Obviously, clearly, yeah. That's so funny.
He also was so enthusiastic. He would like, when he would check my teeth, he would have the little, you know, the thing where he kind of like pokes it to see if they're good. He would go, oh, yes, really good, amazing, gorgeous, gorgeous. He was like.
Oh, fuck.
He would be like, oh, amazing, oh, incredible. And then finally, when I went, he never did anything to my teeth. I went to another dentist in LA and he went, who was your last dentist? We have work to do.
He goes, oh.
He was literally like, your last dentist was like, I don't understand why he didn't do anything.
Oh, I fucking love that.
Sandy, what's so true to you?
Oh, okay, um, I was trying to think about this and then the only thing that was coming to mind for me is just immediate because this is what I'm experiencing on this trip right now to New York.
I think that we should all collectively agree to not wear good, nice shoes.
Yeah, stop.
Stop.
Shoes can't be cute in New York.
No, let's stop the outfit here.
Because I'm in pain.
And I'm traveling and I don't want my bag to be that heavy.
Yes, I only can wear cute shoes if I'm carrying to the event and home from the event.
And even barely then.
And if the event is mostly sitting.
I don't understand. And then I'm like, do I have particularly bad feet? Or is everyone experiencing this and they're just silently in pain?
They're powering through it.
To what end?
I don't understand. We've got to stop.
I was about to say, we have but one foot, but we have two.
We have but one foot.
But we do have but two feet.
You know.
If we're lucky.
Most of us, yeah, if you're lucky.
And I just, I'm wearing my absolute ugliest shoes on this trip.
Of course, we're getting it.
But I'm like, whatever, every other trip I go on, if I don't bring these shoes, I am in so much pain.
And do you know what is the worst part of all this?
Even accounting for everything that you've just said that I've just vehemently agreed to, I think we both know, the shoe makes the fit.
I know, it's like, that's the thing that sucks.
And unfortunately, it breaks the fit.
Because I'm literally, I'm looking a mess this entire trip. I bought a really, really cute little skirt from this store. Have you ever been to Lagoon in Bedside?
It's the cutest thing I've ever seen, I just want to shout out. And I bought this little skirt and I was like, I literally can't wear it on this trip because all I have are my absolute ugliest sneakers.
And they're so ugly. You see them over there?
It's not stopping any of the, oh, I saw them earlier, I clocked them. It's not stopping any of the girls in Brooklyn.
Most of the girls in Brooklyn are wearing some busted ass shoes with some busted ass clothes as well. There's a lot of people dressing busted as fuck in Brooklyn.
That's how I used-
And I legitimately love them, they're my family.
That's how I used to be.
But I'm just like, if we all collectively agree
to wear ugly shoes.
Then we, nobody, you're so right, it does make the fit.
It does, it makes or breaks the fit, the shoes are everything.
When I learned about shoes.
I literally was like mortified for all the years that I've gone wearing sneakers.
I didn't even know you could have more than one pair.
And by the way, my mom came into my apartment, now that I have like four pairs of shoes.
She came into my apartment and went,
"A lot of shoes."
Well, I don't know if I'm allowed to say this, but keep in mind, your mom has a lot of stuff in her house as well.
Well, and by the way, her, the way that she has shoes is if she finds a pair of shoes that she likes, she will buy six of the identical pair.
Love her.
Keep them in the closet.
Because she goes, "I know I like them and I know they're not gonna make them forever."
So I'm gonna just, and you run through shoes.
I do this sometimes with shirts and pants.
I go, there's a, there's a pair of pants I've bought several times from Levi's. And I'm like, just in case they ever stop making it, I've got two backups in the closet.
I should have done it. I have a shirt that I'm in love with right now and everyone will know what shirt it is because it's a plain white t-shirt I've been wearing every single day. But I love it and I almost, it was cheap. I almost bought multiple copies of it.
Copies.
And I didn't, and it's fucking sold out now.
Copies and sold out.
I'm about to write to the company and say, "You need to make more copies of this shirt and send them to me, please." I'll post that you did it, please.
I've gotten really obsessed with if I find, like, I have this jacket that I've had for 15 years.
It's the best thing I've ever owned.
I know it.
The green.
You were getting alterations on it because it was like truly ripped in every place.
Yes, but instead what I did, instead of alterations, is I found, and by the way, I'm loving the backing up. But um, the, I found the identical jacket, it was like a vintage jacket that I got for like four cents at a, like a Goodwill bins. Found the identical one on eBay, it took months, ordered it, now I have a brand new version. It's not as good, of course, because it's like brand new. But all my friends make fun of me, of course, because they say I'm going cartoon character mode.
Well, when something works, it works.
And by the way, we all end up wearing the same thing, honey, dirt.
Say that.
Who cares if my shoes are ugly? We're all going in the same place, six feet under.
Six feet under.
Love?
How do you want to be buried? Or not?
I legitimately do not, I'm not, and this is gonna sound like a bit, I'm not fully convinced that I will die.
And, and if I-
There might be a cure soon. I, I don't understand-
I just don't see a world without me.
Does that make sense?
Well, of course, because you're you.
I like do not see a world without me.
Because how could you? Because you have only known a world with you.
For a long time, I was obsessed with the idea of a world without me. I was like, let's, let's make it a reality, quick. And then I got to a place where I was like, this world needs me.
It is true.
I need me.
People really need you.
I need me in this world, and I don't see a way that the world could go on without me, and also my greatest fear is that it will when I pass, if that makes any sense.
I guess it always does, huh?
It does, no matter who goes. No matter who you are, the world goes on, and that is scary to me. And I also will say, I think I'd like to be cremated, but that scares me because I touch and feel my body now and I go, "They're gonna burn it."
But then I don't know, the idea-
I worry about cremation for the environment. It can't be good, right?
Cremation?
I think better.
Burial is the worst.
Burial's the worst. But what about just throw me in the, in a hole?
Throw you in hole? Throw you in a hole is, I guess, probably best case.
Yeah, for the environment, as far as environments go.
You know what I just learned about?
Tell me about it.
They can compost your body now.
They can compost your body, they can make you tree, they can make you jewelry. And I know this because when my dad died, one of the funniest things that happened is, uh, we were at the funeral home and they were telling us all the things we can do with his ashes.
And they go, you know, we could even, there's things we can do now, we can put your loved one's ashes into a piece of art. He's being very sweet and thoughtful. He goes, we could put your loved one's ashes into a piece of art. And my grieving grandmother goes, "No art!"
And we go, "Okay, girl, they're not gonna make us do a painting with dad." Like, chill, relax, like, we won't put him in the painting.
Wait, I'm really laughing right now at the idea of, like, if there was a guy who was in charge of making that art, and like, he made like, the worst, ugliest paintings, and then you put you have...
He paints a banana, it sucks.
Like, it's like, so ugly and bad. Like, you know the woman that, like, fixed the painting of Jesus and made a monkey?
Like, if it was like, that kind of thing?
And then you kind of like, had to put it up?
Yeah. You're like, "Well, that's dad."
They, you know what they can do now? They can turn your loved one into a Samsung Frame.
I would actually love that. I would love that. Now, I think my best case, I don't think it's gonna happen for me. I'd love to be like, stuffed and presented.
Like, they put me in a museum or something, they like, stuff me and put me in a museum. And I'm just standing. I'm sitting like this.
A couple from another country's having a fight in front of me.
Someone's hanging their bag on your wrist. They're like, "Oh, can you hold this?"
There's like, three 15-year-olds, uh, sitting, charging their phone on a bench right there, and I'm just...
Oh, they put the charger in you?
They can turn your loved one into a charging hub.
I'm a charging hub.
Yeah, they can, they can put USB C and USB.
Yeah, my dick is a charger.
Yes, well, it could be fun if you're kind of.
I'm naked, by the way.
So if you, they can turn your loved one into kind of like a, a coffee table, but you're like this.
So you can also hold drinks.
Drink for him. And I make this face.
Yeah, and you go, thanks, buddy.
Yeah. Hey, cheers. Yeah, I think it'd be fun, that'd be fun to get stuffed and put, and put on display.
Yeah. Oh, my God, a fuckable me.
Right?
Oh, my God. They put me on all fours.
And they put in like a fake robot hole that's really fun to fuck. Sorry. You wouldn't want to fuck my actual hole forever, it would like decay.
But if you put in like, a basically like a flashlight.
Yeah, flashlight.
Like latex hole.
Mm.
Aftermarket. You put an aftermarket hole on me?
I would love to someday be a bottom. I've bottomed before, but it wasn't for me.
So I could be in, a bottom in the afterlife.
Yeah, that's so sweet.
I think we've been recording for two hours.
Wait, hold on, let's play a game.
Cause we have to cut half of it.
Yeah, let's, we have to cut a lot of it. We're, I'm trying to decide if we'll cut Michelle saying that I leave skid marks in the toilet. I'm not embarrassed of it, but I think it makes her look bad. Do you know what I mean? Like, it makes her look like an ungrateful and unfaithful employee. Like, future employers might see her do that and go, this girl cannot be trusted.
Right, because she might tell if I have skid marks.
That's one thing about all three of these people, the guy's earmuffs, they don't appreciate how good they have it. Like, they don't understand, like, another employer would, like, berate you and, like, do all these kind of things, like.
And you only do that on pod.
I only do that on pod as a joke, like, in real life, I'm such a sweet boss and, like, the three of them have no appreciation or respect for, like, how bad things can actually be.
Yeah. Well, you should show them, teach them a lesson.
They act with, like, impunity, they act like crazy and they don't realize, like, someday you might have to work for someone who actually sucks. Sandy, I'm gonna read you 15 statements. You're gonna tell me as quickly as you can. You're gonna tell me as quickly as you can if what I just said is true or false.
And if you get 10 or more correct, we're gonna give you 50 US dollars. And as the show has grown, we have not raised the number. Are you ready? There are eight planets in our solar system.
False.
True.
Ah!
Wait, how many do I have to get right?
After the first question, you have to get 10 or more correct. Wells Fargo is the oldest bank in the US.
False, it's the bank of New York. Michael Keaton is the oldest of seven children.
Sure, true.
False, he's the youngest.
He's the youngest.
The show Lucifer was never nominated for an Emmy.
False, it was one time.
For what? What is it?
Uh, Lucifer? I don't know, that's a chance type thing. New Haven's nickname is the Elm City.
I'm from there and I don't know.
Count that, count that for her. Sea otters have the, sea otters have the densest fur of any animal in the world.
Sea otters, false.
True. The human heart has three chambers.
False, four.
Ottawa.
Ottawa is the capital of Canada.
Uh, false.
True. There are no.
There are no mammals that lay eggs.
False, five species.
It's gotta be one or the other. As soon as I, because what it is, is as soon as I say it, I know, as soon as I say true, I know it's false.
The current president of NYU is Richard Beck.
No, false.
False, it's Lynda G Mills.
Yes, I knew that one.
Fisher Price was originally a clock manufacturer.
False, it's always toys. The Dead Sea Shore is the lowest point on land on earth.
That's true. The smallest bone in the human body is in the foot.
False, the ear.
Ear.
Jenna Fisher, Jenna Fisher is from Kansas City.
False, St. Louis.
She's from, of course, St. Louis.
Connecticut, Connecticut is the 48th largest state in the US.
That would, wait, that would be real, wait, 40th largest?
So that would mean it's the second smallest? True.
That is true. How'd she do?
Did you know I'm from Connecticut and that's why it was Connecticut based?
Yes, all the trivia is guest, uh, guest specific. And you'd hit a very strong six. Strong six.
But what about the ones where as soon as I said it, I knew it was wrong?
Yeah, yeah. What about the ones where I gave an answer and felt Caleb's energy shift?
What about the one where you said the foot and I immediately went, it's the ear?
Ear. Fuck, it's ear.
Ear, it's the ear.
Fuck, it's ear.
Because I'll say the way you say it, you sound so convincing.
Yeah, thank you. That's really beautiful. Thank you.
That's why you should host a game show.
I work really, really hard on this show.
Yeah, I know.
It is so hot in here.
Can you tell that I'm like, I'm completely sopping wet?
I'm dripping with sweat. This is why we're, see, you understand the studio is charming, but we need to move. Sandy, please tell people where they can find you and how they can support you.
Oh, my gosh. Okay, well, you can find me, um, I guess on fucking Instagram. I don't know. I have a new short film that's coming out that I'm, that I wanted to talk about.
How long can I talk about it?
Say it now.
Okay, it's called Utopia Air. It's gonna premiere on this thing called Chunks. That's gonna be, I'll have a link. But basically, Chapo Trap House Podcast produced this comedy anthology, and they commissioned six brand-new short films, comedy freaky deaky, and they let me do one.
I can't wait.
And I'm really happy with it. I've been trying to make it for like, three years.
I love it.
I'm so excited. I can't wait to watch.
I'm really excited. My friend Phoebe did all the animation. She's like, unbelievable. We've been trying to work together on something forever.
Because she did a lot of animation on Debra's, and she's really talented. And I was like, I just need to get money, and then we can do something.
Hell, yeah.
I can't wait for people to watch it. Well, go follow Sandy. Sandy, we love you. Thanks for doing it.
Fall never arrives all at once. First the air, then the light. And slowly, the things you love begin to find each other. A jacket meets a dress, a hoodie slips beneath a blazer, an old cap finds a new scarf. Because you don't simply step into the season. You create it, layer by layer, until it finally feels like fall. Find fall your way at Ross.
Page updated October 29, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated