Pod Insights So Money with Farnoosh Torabi 2011: Anthony O'Neal on Breaking Free from Debt and Building Real Wealth About this episode Anthony O'Neal https://www.anthonyoneal.com/, had $6.32 to his name on a Wednesday night. He needed gas. He was hungry. He ended up cutting two McDonald's double cheeseburgers in half — that was his food for the next two days. He diluted his sweet tea with water to stretch it. And in that moment, eating a cold half-burger in his apartment, something shifted in him. He thought: there has to be a better way.
Fast forward to his fortieth birthday. Anthony is on a private yacht off the coast of Italy. The chef comes out mid-dinner, not just to ask how the fish is — but to offer to catch that same fish again for him tomorrow. And Anthony thought back to that Wednesday night, that half-burger, that $6.32 — and he realized: he had found the better way.
Anthony O'Neal is a bestselling author, speaker, and host of The Table with AO. His new book, Stop Living Paycheck to Paycheck: The Proven Path to Break Free from Debt, Build Real Wealth, and Live Free on Any Income https://stoplivingpaychecktopaycheckbook.com/, is out in August.
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1:33 Speaker 03 So Money Episode 2011. Anthony O'Neal on breaking free from debt and building real wealth.
1:42 Speaker 04 You're listening to So Money with award-winning money guru Farnoosh Torabi. Each day, get a 30-minute dose of financial inspiration from the world's top business minds, authors, influencers, and from Farnoosh herself.
1:56 Speaker 04 Looking for ways to save on gas or double your double coupons? Sorry, you're in the wrong place. Seeking profound ways to live a richer, happier life? Welcome to So Money.
2:08 Speaker 05 This is why I teach financial freedom. If you have financial freedom, if you can get to zero, and then on top of zero, we start investing and saving. I think one of the biggest ingredients to miss building wealth is not being in position at the right time to take advantage of the wealth opportunity. And so that's what I see a lot of. A lot of people have a lot of good ideas, but they're drowning in debt, so they couldn't jump on this opportunity. Or they have no debt, but they didn't have any savings or no capital to take advantage of this opportunity. And that's the same thing with stocks. You know, a lot of people get scared when the stock market goes down. But Farnoosh, I actually love it.
2:48 Speaker 03 Yes.
2:49 Speaker 05 I'm like, wait, hold on, wait a minute. I've been saving for this. Let me go buy some more stocks. Let me go buy some, it's on a discount. So I think for me, my book and my brand, and even yourself, we want to help people not just get the financial freedom, but how do we put you in a position to where when the right opportunity comes, you can take advantage of that opportunity, and it will shoot your wealth a potential even higher and quicker because you were ready and in position.
3:18 Speaker 03 Welcome to So Money, everyone. I'm Farnoosh Torabi. You know that moment when you call your bank or you're online with your bank and you check your balance? And you discover a balance so low, it stops you cold? That happened to me in college at least once. I remember trying to buy something in the store with my debit card, and it wouldn't go through. It kept getting denied. I was so confused because I was working so hard that summer. I was actually making some money, but I was also spending as fast as I was earning and not keeping an eye on my balance until it's too late. Got back to my apartment, and lo and behold, my balance online was in the negative. And our guest today, Anthony O'Neil, can relate.
4:02 Speaker 03 He had just $6 to his name on a Wednesday night. He needed gas. He was hungry. He ended up cutting two McDonald's cheeseburgers in half. That was his food for the next two days. He diluted his sweet tea with water to stretch it. And in that moment, eating a cold half burger in his apartment, something shifted in him. He thought, there has to be a better way. Fast forward to his 40th birthday, Anthony's on a private yacht off the coast of Italy. The chef comes out mid dinner, not just to ask how the fish is, but to offer to catch that same fish again for him tomorrow. And Anthony thought back to that Wednesday night, that half burger, that $6, and he realized he had found the better way.
4:47 Speaker 03 Anthony O'Neal is back on the show today. He is a bestselling author, speaker, and host of The Table with A.O. His new book, Stop Living Paycheck to Paycheck: The Proven Path to Break Free from Debt, Build Real Wealth, and Live Free on Any Income is out soon. I gotta tell you, this is not a money book. Anthony will be the first to tell you it's a book about freedom. Here we go. Here's Anthony O'Neal. Anthony O'Neal, my friend, welcome back to So Money.
5:15 Speaker 05 Man, my system, man, how are you doing? Man, I've been looking forward to this. When my team said, "Hey, you're going back on," I say, "Let's go."
5:22 Speaker 03 Same. When I got the email that you had a book coming out and you want to do more press, I was like, "Anytime, Anthony. You're welcome here anytime." Thank you for this newest book. I think it's really important timing, always important timing to help people with money, but especially with everything going on in the world. Your latest book is called Stop Living Paycheck to Paycheck: The Proven Path to Break Free from Debt, Build Real Wealth, and Live Free on Any Income. You could have written any book. You've written many already. Why did you want to focus on this piece and this audience, which, let's be honest, it's most people?
5:58 Speaker 05 Yeah. Yeah, you know, Pranush, when I think about this, this message, right, it's really, really important to me because I think, we know this, we're both in the money space, that the majority of people are living paycheck to paycheck. And I think it's not solely because they lack financial information. I think it's because no one really gave them a true, solid plan on, one, how to avoid or get out of the paycheck matter, but then, two, getting debt-free and having financial freedom doesn't start with just paying off the debt, doesn't even start with just maybe having a little bit of margin. It's about what are we doing? To progress and to build wealth. And so I remember what it was to be making, you know, sixty thousand dollars a year.
6:42 Speaker 05 And I didn't really have the right strategy. And I was living paycheck to paycheck. And so I said, let me write a book about my story, my journey, how I came from four loving parents, two biological parents and two stepparents, who were working class, middle class individuals, God fearing individuals, grew up in the church, were good people who raised good children without a good money system. And I have a lot of friends who are like, Anthony, how did you do it? Anthony, how did you? We remember when you was poor and homeless and living in the back of your car. How did you go from there to now doing what you're doing? I said, let me put it into a book where there's no fluff. Um, you know, and today's day and time, since you see it, I don't know if you get frustrated like me,
7:27 Speaker 05 but it's so many financial experts online today that are selling the wrong message.
7:35 Speaker 03 Yeah.
7:35 Speaker 05 And I just wanted to, to be able to deposit my proven system into, in a form of a book that can help millions and hopefully multiple millions down the road.
7:48 Speaker 03 And you really get honest. You talk about six dollars and thirty two cents. That was your balance in your one account at one point.
7:56 Speaker 05 Yes.
7:56 Speaker 03 What were you trying? Yeah, I mean, this is, um, would you say this is one of your more honest books?
8:02 Speaker 05 I would say this, and, and I mean, no disrespect to any of my previous books, but I think this is my most, this is my favorite book. Because this one right here really, it took me about three years to write this one. So when I came out with my book, I think it was about a year and a half ago, Take Your Seat at the Table, that was a good book, but I had this book already started before I wrote that book. But I really wanted to make sure that I could be vulnerable, that I could be honest, that I could be transparent. I even shared some embarrassing stories about myself in there with the money. And, you know, six thousand thirty two cents to my name, went through that, spent eight thousand dollars at a strip club at the age of twenty four. You know, so it's like, I really get honest about, hey, I had the.
8:45 Speaker 05 Money, but I didn't have the right system, nor did I have the right mindset.
8:49 Speaker 03 Yeah.
8:50 Speaker 05 So this book really shares from my story. And watch this, it doesn't say that you're gonna get rich overnight. I, I, I think a lot of people are selling that. This book is not a sexy book. It is a book that if you apply the principles, within about eighteen to twenty-four months, you will see a different financial situation.
9:10 Speaker 03 Well, listen, time flies. Eighteen to twenty-four months may seem like not overnight, but it is, it is relatively quick.
9:18 Speaker 05 Yes.
9:18 Speaker 03 You talk about systems and you talk about mindset. I want to sit with the mindset for a little bit because even your own story of making these choices in your early twenties, regrets, a lot of that was probably your, at the time, understanding of what it meant to kind of live it up, live it up with your hard earned money. What were the messages that you were getting? What were the messages you wish you had received for your mind?
9:43 Speaker 05 You know, I was getting the message of, man, go after the American dream, right? And, and it bothers me that I was sold that my entire middle school and high school and the beginning of my college career, hey, get out, go to school. If you go to school, two things gonna happen. You're gonna get a scholarship, get a full ride, or number two, take out debt. Then when I get on to the college campus in two thousand and two, not only did I take out debt, but I also took out credit cards. So the world was teaching me, go after the American dream and get that credit score and, and consume things. I risk, I really do wish someone would have said, hey, get your grades right. Get a scholarship for sure. If you don't get a scholarship, you can go to a community college.
10:27 Speaker 05 Hey, as a matter of fact, you're going to school to get an education, an education that will hopefully land you a job. Well, your job is to get a paycheck. How come no one taught me anything on what to do with the paycheck? What, what is interest? And how can I actually earn interest? What is a credit card? And how should I have even managed a credit card at the time if I wanted to get one? What is homeownership? Like, how do I set myself up in the next four to five years? After graduating in high school to be a homeowner. What what is a small business? Like, what is an entrepreneur? Like, I wish somebody really sat down with me and taught me how to build wealth, how to build financial freedom rather than just consume.
11:10 Speaker 05 Because then what happened to me was, I thought in order to get married, to find a wife, I had to spend money, a lot of money on her. I thought that if I wanted to be accepted by, you know, the community, that I had to look cool. I thought that the only way to be successful in life is to consume nice things to portray that you are successful. But I had no idea that I need to live below my means. I had no idea that if I got approved for a thirty thousand dollar car, I should go out and just buy me a cash car in the beginning of my teens, right? So those were the things that I wish I would have been taught. But because I had to go back to the mental, because I watched my family work hard and live paycheck to paycheck.
11:53 Speaker 05 I watched my family never be a homeowner until I was an adult. I thought that it was normal to live paycheck to paycheck. I thought that it was normal to have some struggles a little bit. That if you're not struggling, that just means that you ain't doing something right. But as long as you got a roof over your head, Anthony, clothes on your back and food on your table, you are okay. And that was the mindset that I had. And it wasn't until I started getting around different people that I realized that, man, I turned surviving into the norm when I believed that I should have been thriving, but no one taught me how to thrive.
12:36 Speaker 05 And I had to change the mental that, hey, yes, you can have the nice house or a newer home. You can have nice clothes. You can drive a newer car. You should have money in your savings and money in your portfolio for a good future. So I had to change that mentally.
12:54 Speaker 03 Yeah, the company you keep.
12:57 Speaker 03 We just had guests on the show, two women who have a podcast called Debt Heads.
13:03 Speaker 05 Wow.
13:03 Speaker 03 And they talk about debt and how it's kind of like an American true crime story. This idea that, you know, our, how we get into debt. Yes, of course, we have choices we regret. But also, there is a system that is working overtime to make sure that we get into debt and that we stay in debt. Can you talk a little bit about that? You know, because I want people to walk away from this. So many people feel guilty, right? They feel, they feel they made all the bad choices.
13:33 Speaker 03 They weren't proactive. They didn't seek out the right education, the guidance, the community. They didn't learn from their mistakes. And of course, yes, accountability is a big piece of this. Also, at the same time, there is a billion dollar industry that is incentivized, that is rooting for your, you could argue, for your indebtedness. What do you have to say about, to those people? Or what do you want people to know about this system that's working in conjunction with your efforts?
13:59 Speaker 05 Well, the very first thing I would say is, don't feel guilty of something that you were not taught, because the system taught us to consume and to look at debt as it being normal. And so, let's look at the system, right? They reward you with a 800 credit score to borrow money. But your credit score has nothing to do with the financial portfolio that you have invested. Your, your credit score has nothing to do with how much money you have in your savings account. Your credit score doesn't have anything to do with how much money and income you have. You can be a homeowner and have, you know, all this equity that doesn't go towards your credit score, but they reward you for how much debt you have, how often you use the
14:43 Speaker 05 debt, how low you can keep the debt below 30%. But they'll penalize you if you're someone like myself, who doesn't even borrow from a consumer perspective, right? And so, the system is, is rewarding you staying in the system, but they're not going to reward you if you're staying out of the system. And so, what I want to encourage people is, hey, learn to Game, right? And this is what I talk about in the book. Money is a game and you're either a piece in the game or you're the player in the game. And if you can learn how to play the game, for an example, I talk about how, yeah, you do need a sum of a credit score to make sure that you're not paying high car insurance rates and make sure you get the lower interest rates on your mortgage. Well, how do you get a credit score?
15:28 Speaker 05 Play the game. No, you don't have to borrow money. You can go out there and find different kind of programs out there that will put something on your credit report and you never borrowed anything for it. You may pay them $5 to report your Netflix account. Now that gets your credit score up. Now you're paying low car insurance. You're getting the lower interest rates, but you're not getting in debt. You're not playing their game, but you are playing the game. And so I think for me, we gotta be smart in how we're approaching this financial situation. But everyone, there is a system that is designed to keep us as consumers, not as owners.
16:05 Speaker 03 Brilliant metaphor. Now you have an escape plan in your book.
16:09 Speaker 05 Yes, ma'am.
16:09 Speaker 03 And there are five phases.
16:11 Speaker 05 Yeah.
16:11 Speaker 03 You spent a lot of time on phase one in the early days, early foundation, you know, getting the clarity.
16:17 Speaker 05 Yes.
16:18 Speaker 03 A lot of people want to skip to just make my money grow, Anthony. Okay, I get it.
16:24 Speaker 03 Why is that impulse problematic? And what does skipping ahead actually cost people?
16:28 Speaker 05 It costs them a lot. You know, I share this as well. One of my good friends, she is an ER doctor. And she came home one day, I was at her house with her husband because her husband is a good friend of ours and we play golf together. And it was about five of us sitting there and she came home very frustrated. And on this one particular day, she's never done this before, but she came down and sat down with her husband and all the other guys. And she said, y'all, I need some help. I said, what's up, sis? And she was like, man, I'm frustrated. And I said, why are you frustrated? She said, because I'm an ER doctor. And so she's the, what they call like a second string ER doctor that when there's something extremely emergency, like a gunshot wound or something that is life threatening, she is the ER doctor that deals with that stuff.
17:12 Speaker 05 Or on this one particular day. She didn't say exactly what happened because that's client privilege. But she said, man, this one particular client, and I have a lot of clients that come in in this section and they are screaming, fix me, like fix me. And she says, man, families are screaming, fix him, please fix him and et cetera, et cetera. And she says, Anthony, I get discouraged because as an ER doctor, I can't fix you. My job is to get you stable to where you can live. Once I get you stable, once we get your heart beating and we're not worried about if your heart's going to stop, then I can come back in and assess, okay, what is the issue with your body? Once we identify what's the issue with your body, then from there, we call in a specialist
17:57 Speaker 05 who specializes in that. Bringing that over to money, it's oftentimes we'll get ourselves into all this debt, but then tomorrow we want to be rich and that it just doesn't happen. So there is a system to where, hey, you need to get your income stable. And that's why I spend so much time on this book because Stop Living Paycheck to Paycheck is not a book that's going to teach you how to be out of debt tomorrow and rich next week. No, I need to first start with your mind. We need to first lay down a solid foundation so that way on the next phase, which is clear the ground, you know, it's when you're clearing the ground and getting ready, it's like, hey, I'm ready. I have a solid foundation to lay off of. And it's simple.
18:40 Speaker 05 When it comes to our money is you gotta have a clear vision, followed by the clear vision, you gotta know your why. Because if your why doesn't make you cry, then you'll never accomplish the vision. If the vision is, I want to get, it is, you know, it is.
18:55 Speaker 03 So true. You gotta, gotta go to the dark places, I say.
18:58 Speaker 05 You have to. Yeah. If you don't go to the dark places, if you don't cry, then the parnus, you're not going to accomplish what you want to accomplish.
19:06 Speaker 03 Yeah, you need that fire in your belly. You talk about stability. I want to spend some time on this because first of all, again, I just really appreciate that you're focusing on how to get to zero.
19:16 Speaker 05 Yeah.
19:16 Speaker 03 When you're in the negative, because so much of the conversation is like how to build millions. And yes, of course, that's exciting and but for most people, the Dream is not to wake up and be a millionaire. The dream is to wake up and not have any more debt, right? Any more eating away at their paycheck. And so what would you say is the equation, the calculus for stability? And I want to know specifically, like, how much should be? How much paycheck do you need to be making? Really, in America today, to kind of make it so you can stabilize? What's your debt situation? Like, should you even borrow for, you know, a car or a mortgage?
19:54 Speaker 05 Yeah.
19:55 Speaker 03 How much did you have in savings? At what point do you start to think about your retirement and investing? So maybe just like, give us a little bit of like, the pie or the math.
20:06 Speaker 05 Yeah.
20:06 Speaker 03 For stability today in America.
20:09 Speaker 05 I think for stability today, one of the key determining factors of that is going to be really about where you live. So from a broad perspective, I say everyone should be striving to make at least six figures, right? I saw a study that said recently that you now need 1.46 million dollars to retire from a healthy perspective. While I understand that number, I think that number changes for everybody. Because not everybody desires a certain kind of lifestyle. And so for an example, let's say if you live in Fayetteville, North Carolina, where I'm from. Well, if you're making $60,000 a year there, you are doing well off because the cost of living is much cheaper in Fayetteville. But now, if you take that same $60,000 and come to where I'm at in the DMV area, you're going to be struggling to live and survive.
20:54 Speaker 05 So I tell everyone, strive for six figures. That's the very first one when it comes to the income. Number two is, now that you're making six figures, we need to create margin. So now, we need to keep your cost of living about 70 to 80% less than what you're bringing in a month. So this will put you at, I need at least three to six months of net pay sitting inside my high-yield savings account, just in case of emergency. If I had to really be, have a solid number, I would say everyone should be striving for six months. Because we're seeing right now, if life was to hit you, if you were to lose a job, it's taken on average about 98 days to find another job. Now, if you have six months of your average net pay coming in,
21:39 Speaker 05 now what happens is, goes back to the mental. There's a book that talks about, we have two sides of our brain, the slow, the slow side and the fast side. If I have six months, I'm going to operate off of my slow side and I'm going to make better decisions for me and my family. If I have only a thousand dollars in my account, well, now I gotta operate off of my fast side. I'm going to make some decisions that, that may hurt me down the road. So six months is a solid one. Then from there, as you have your six months, now what I want you to do is, I really, really, really want you to be investing anywhere between 12 to 15% of your income into the portfolio.
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26:08 Speaker 05 Now, this is gonna vary. This is gonna go anywhere from your 401K to index funds, IRAs, and including HSA's. And I don't hear a lot of financial people in the world really talking about the power of an HSA account that's attached to a high deductible health insurance policy. Because we gotta start educating more in that. Like, if you're in your 30s and you're healthy, why are you paying for a PPO plan? Where you can get a high deductible plan and invest the money, the rest of that money into an HSA account. And so that's the key thing for the pie. And then the last thing is, I think when it comes to generating income, what I'm telling everyone, don't just only invest 12% to 15%. I want you to also look into starting a business. Now, let's pause right there. When it comes to starting a business,
26:52 Speaker 05 what I'm telling this generation is, instead of starting from the ground up, start saving money to acquire a business. Because within the next five to 10 years, we're gonna see a huge shift of these older individuals who own these small companies wanting to sell, or they'll just let it go because they don't have the bandwidth and the time or the energy to run the company anymore. And so if you are in a position to where you're consumer debt-free, you have a good savings account, and you have some money to where you can potentially go buy a company that already has an income statement, that already has a customer base, that already has a proven system. Now you can take their old model,
27:34 Speaker 05 this older company with the age of tech and AI today, take that up a notch, and now you're sitting with a seven-figure business that you didn't have to start from the ground.
27:44 Speaker 03 This is actually, there's a company, my husband works for this company called TeamShares. This is what they do. They raise money to help out the small business owner who doesn't have a succession plan. They're about to retire. They want out, but they don't want the business to go away. So they come in and they make the existing employees shareholders as well, the TeamShares becomes a majority shareholder. But then the employees get trained up. They become stakeholders. There's now a legacy for this business. And I think to your point, with this big company Which is just backing up your point here. You know, if this big company is right, is like, is pursuing this in its own way, as individuals, we can do this too.
28:26 Speaker 03 I think about all the, I think about what can AI not displace, right? You still need an HVAC system, you still need to eat, you still need to
28:33 Speaker 05 There's so many.
28:34 Speaker 03 Get your car tuned up, you still need your, your house cleaned, you know, there's all these hard work, hard workers out there, businesses run by hard workers. There is no succession plan, but maybe you can give them a lifeboat.
28:45 Speaker 05 Yeah. And that's the thing, you know, that's one thing we've really been talking about because this is why I teach financial freedom. If you have financial freedom, if you can get to zero, and then on top of zero, we start investing and saving. I think one of the biggest ingredients to miss building wealth is not being in position at the right time to take advantage of the wealth opportunity. And so that's what I see a lot of, a lot of people have a lot of good ideas, but they're drowning in debt, so they couldn't jump on this opportunity. Or they have no debt, but they didn't have any savings or no capital to take advantage of this this opportunity. And that's the same thing with stocks, you know, a lot of people get scared when the stock market goes down, but for me, I actually love it.
29:29 Speaker 03 Yes.
29:29 Speaker 05 I'm like, wait, hold up, wait a minute, I've been saving for this. Let me go buy some more stocks. Let me go buy some, it's on a discount. So I think for me, my book and my brand and even yourself, we want to help people not just get the financial freedom, but how do we put you in a position to where when the right opportunity comes, you can take advantage of that opportunity and it will shoot your wealth a potential even higher and quicker because you were ready and in position. But here's the thing that I have learned, and this is your show, so cut me off whenever you want me to shut up. But it's what I see is people get to zero. They see a little bit of margin. When they get to zero and they see a little bit of margin, their apartment goes up, their house goes up.
30:13 Speaker 05 They get a new car. Now they're starting to go back to the living paycheck, the paycheck, because they got freedom. They got a taste of that. They see they have more money coming in. It's like, OK, wait, I have some more money coming in. I got a little bit of margin, so I can go get a new house. And what I tell everyone is when you get to zero and you see your income going up and you have some margin, do not change anything you've done for the next 12 to 24 months. Because I want you to take advantage of that margin and start investing it. And I promise you, over those next two years, you're going to see some opportunities come up that's going to expand your wealth building opportunity. That you're going to thank yourself that you didn't spend it on a liability or something that's just a perishable item. So that's what one thing I just really wanted to say. Make sure I communicate.
30:57 Speaker 03 Lifestyle creep is a real thing.
30:59 Speaker 05 It is.
30:59 Speaker 03 You have this data point in your book that really stopped me in my tracks. We know that there is the wealth gap. But you say that, and this is a, this is a recent study, that by 2053, the median wealth of Black Americans is projected to fall to zero.
31:16 Speaker 05 Yeah, zero or negative. Yeah.
31:19 Speaker 03 Can you unpack this for me? I mean, I know that there are some serious racial inequities when it comes to building wealth in this country. I thought we were addressing some of them. So this is really working backwards. What's, what's, what's happening?
31:31 Speaker 05 Well, I would definitely say we are, we are addressing. Let me be honest with that. I'm saying this as a, as a Black man, proud Black man, that there are things that I would say is being addressed. But there are a lot of things that are not. And so for us, one thing I am speaking to my particular community about is in 2053, they're saying that African Americans would have zero to negative net worth. Zero negative net worth simply means that we don't really have the opportunity, because of our current financial situations, to take advantage of some of the wealth building opportunities. And so, for an example, within my community, we sometimes tend to be last to certain things due to prior situations. So what I'm trying to teach my community is this.
32:15 Speaker 05 Hey, we have to play the game and we got to play it. Because sometimes it's not unfair. If I'm just being honest, it's not fair. It is totally unfair sometimes. So let's get ourselves in position to where when a company comes available, we can buy it. Let's get ourselves in position to where we can narrow the wealth gap. Because here's the truth. I cannot ask my white brothers and sisters to stop making money. That's the only way we can close the wealth gap is if they stop making money and we continue making money. That's not going to happen and that's not fair to my brothers and sisters of the opposite race. What I want us to do is how do we narrow it? And we're going to narrow it by generation. So my generation, what can we do to narrow it?
32:56 Speaker 05 How do we pass something down differently, which is non-debt to the next generation? Then they narrow it, then sooner or later, five generations down the road, we could be closer on an even playing ground. And so I don't really, I don't really like the wealth gap. I have to close the gap because I think that's just somewhat impossible. But we can put a plan in place and say, you know what? I'm going to start the generational change in my family and I'm going to not pass down debt. I'm going to pass down wealth. I'm gonna pass down businesses. I'm gonna pass down land and opportunities. And watch this, not just land, opportunities, wealth and businesses, but even a knowledge that I've gained alone these years of living. So that way, my great, great grandchildren have clear direction
33:40 Speaker 05 on what's been working for our family and how to proceed that. And if we do that, 2053 would just be a stat, but it won't be an actual thing that we are living and experiencing.
33:50 Speaker 03 Well, all the while, I can't help but think about the families that are dealing with the sandwich.
33:58 Speaker 05 Yeah.
33:58 Speaker 03 Complexities of they're raising their own families, their children and their aging parents, who didn't read your book. They didn't, you know, they are struggling. They are paycheck to paycheck. And so now you have this sort of multi-generational intertwining. And where do you prioritize? How do you prioritize? I completely empathize with the people who say, I want, I need to help my parents because they helped me to some extent and it's just culturally what we do or I want to do it. I will sacrifice my own retirement to make sure my parents have a place to stay and live and eat. So what would be your message to these people who are really stuck?
34:37 Speaker 05 Isn't it funny? Every time we get on the airplane, the very first thing that the pilot says to us is, put your oxygen mask on, even if you have your child next to you. And some parents say they have a hard time with that. I said, well, think about it. If you do not put your oxygen mask on first and you put theirs on, they're living, you die, you actually put them in a worse situation. Then you just making them wait two seconds. And I think that what I would tell people, because I I saw my mother be that oxy- oxy, uh, not oxygen, but that sandwich, uh, uh, individual, because she was worried about my grandmother, her mother, but then also worried about her three kids.
35:20 Speaker 05 And as a child, I remember us, I remember the lifestyle before my grandma came to live with us. And before my mom started providing for my grandmother, our lifestyle was a little more comfortable. When grandmother came in, we lost our own rooms. And there were certain things that we had to do with my sister standing in the room with me and my brother now. That was a little uncomfortable. Um, we weren't able to go out as much because we had an extra expense. I had to help my grandmother. So this is what I recommend to everyone in that situation. And this is gonna be tough, right? It's gonna be real tough for people and and I may get some pushback on it. Uh, but for me, I I put my parents on a budget. Like, hey, this is all that I can give you. And I say it respectfully.
36:04 Speaker 05 You had the same amount of time as me to do good with your money. My responsibility is to pass down inheritance to my children's children. It's not to pass it up. And I think oftentimes what we tend to do is pass it up. And then that's why we have these generational curses and issues going on, because we're not passing it down. And so I will always make sure that I am in a healthy place. So that way, when I get of age, watch this, Pranush, I don't, I don't, I'm not gonna be a burden to my kids, because I saved, I invested, I maxed out my retirement options. So when I get to 80 years old. And I do need some help. Well, my home is paid for. I have enough in my portfolio that all my kids have to do is just help me
36:49 Speaker 05 use my money the right way. That my money will pay for help, right? I don't have to move in with them. I can just have full time help at my house because I was thinking ahead of time. Now, I'm not a burden to my kids and to my grandchildren. But the only burden it is is just them watching me get older and and them having to give me a little bit of time to help me do my stuff. But I should not be older, need them help, need their help financially, and need their help from a physical perspective. Now I'm robbing from my grandchildren. And I don't want that. And so I would tell everyone, man, take care of yourself first. Put your parents on a budget, put your kids on a budget,
37:31 Speaker 05 and make sure that you are doing what you need to do to make sure that you will be okay in the future.
37:36 Speaker 03 To wrap, Anthony, take me to the moment when you got to zero.
37:41 Speaker 05 Man.
37:42 Speaker 03 What were you doing? What did you think? What?
37:44 Speaker 05 I was in, I was in Nashville, Tennessee, in a one bedroom apartment. I remember that day. I had just paid off my Acura TL. And this is gonna sound so odd, right? I was so happy, but at the same time, I was so confused.
38:07 Speaker 05 Because I worked so hard to get to zero that I didn't know what to do next after zero. Like I had, I was like, oh, free. Man, all I had was just my rent. I just had, but at the same time, I was like, but what, what do I do next? Like, what's next? Like, becoming consumer debt free and hitting zero is not the end all be all. That's just the starting ground to build something amazing off of. And so I remember that day, man, it was seven o'clock at night. It was a Friday. I had just got paid. I paid the last car note and I cried. Man, I was, I went out with some friends. We went to Ruby Tuesdays and I had a Long Island iced tea that night.
38:51 Speaker 03 Oh, my God.
38:52 Speaker 05 And.
38:53 Speaker 03 As one should.
38:54 Speaker 05 Yes, you know, working that hard. And they was like, man, how you feel? I said, I feel good. They're like, what you gonna do now? And that's when I went home. I was like, I don't know what to do now because all I know was how to pay the bills. I didn't know how to pay myself and to build something for myself. And that started a new journey in my life, man.
39:16 Speaker 03 I'm so grateful for you to be on this show, to share your story. You've written this amazing book. Please write more books so you can come back. But also, even without a book, you're welcome to come back on the show. You're the best storyteller. You speak with such integrity and honesty and care. We appreciate you. Thanks so much, Anthony O'Neal.
39:35 Speaker 05 No, thank you.
39:38 Speaker 03 Thanks so much to Anthony O'Neal for joining us. His book is called Stop Living Paycheck to Paycheck. The Proven Path to Break Free from Debt, Build Real Wealth, and Live Free on Any Income. Check out his YouTube. Check out all of his books. I'll see you back here on Wednesday, and I hope your day is so money.
40:08 Speaker 06 Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work around the work and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithgemini. That's goo.gle/workspacewithgemini.
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