2020: The Four Step System for Handling Whatever Comes Next

Getting into college was supposed to be the hard part. So why are so many kids arriving on campus and falling apart? That's the question that's driven Ana Homayoun's https://anahomayoun.com/work for 25 years. She's an educational consultant, author, and today she's back on So Money to talk about the paperback relaunch of her book, now retitled Getting In Is Not Enough: The New Blueprint for Student Success Beyond Grades and College Admissions. https://anahomayoun.com/getting-in/ We originally built this book around one idea: that grades and test scores don't teach kids how to actually run their lives. But when Ana sat down to revise it for the paperback, she realized the AI-driven workforce made the argument even more urgent — and that the four pillars she teaches (systems, connections, perspective, and acceptance) aren't just for teenagers. They're for anyone navigating a messy transition, whether that's a 22-year-old moving back home after graduation or a 52-year-old rebuilding a career from scratch. We talk about why friend groups shouldn't live in one place, why "choices" is the most stress-reducing word in the English language, and why Ana thinks parents often struggle with disappointment more than their kids do. Plus: her honest take on where AI genuinely helps, where it gets in the way, and what it means to build an entrepreneurial blueprint of your own. How's midlife going? Fill out Farnoosh's survey https://www.jotform.com/build/262556781257063 and help shape the podcast in 2027. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy https://acast.com/privacy for more information.

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• 1:28Speaker 03

  So Money episode 2020, The Four Steps System for Handling Whatever Comes Next.

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  You're listening to So Money with award-winning money guru Farnoosh Torabi. Each day, get a 30-minute dose of financial inspiration from the world's top business minds, authors, influencers, and from Farnoosh herself. Looking for ways to save on gas or double your double coupons? Sorry, you're in the wrong place. Seeking profound ways to live a richer, happier life? Welcome to So Money.

• 2:02Speaker 05

  I think every parent in America today is dealing with their own set of circumstances, whether they're caregiving for their parents, whether they're navigating, you know, personal health issues, whether they're navigating job, job issues, woes, all of these things, we're all dealing with stuff. And so how we react to things and how we process is a result of the pillars that I talk about, right? Do we have systems in place to reduce the emotional load? Do we have connections that help us navigate a disappointment or distress, right? Like, and bring joy to our lives? Do we have an expanded perspective that like, yeah, this one time slot, there's four other options that could work here, and the person is helping me find a solution? And do we have an acceptance for ourselves and others?

• 2:45Speaker 03

  Welcome to So Money, everybody. I'm Farnoosh Torabi, kicking off the week with an episode on how to be more resilient. You know, starting with college kids, getting into school was supposedly the hard part, right? But why are so many young adults arriving on campus and falling apart? I just spoke with a friend over the weekend who said her daughter's transition to freshman year, despite the fact that she's intelligent and social and was looking forward to college, was the worst, quote unquote, "the worst." They had to go up to campus many times to just make sure she was okay. And this is not a singular incident. This is happening across the country.

• 3:29Speaker 03

  Young adults are arriving on campus not as prepared as we hope they would be. And this is a question that's driven my guests' work for 25 years. Anna Holmeyun is an educational consultant, author, and she's back on the show today to talk about the paperback relaunch of her book, which is now retitled Getting In Is Not Enough: The New Blueprint for Student Success Beyond Grades and College Admissions. Initially, Anna built this book around a very foundational idea that grades and test scores don't teach kids how to actually run their lives. But when Anna sat down to revise it for the paperback, she realized the AI-driven workforce made the argument even more urgent,

• 4:13Speaker 03

  and that the four pillars that she teaches in her book, including systems, connections, perspective, and acceptance, aren't just for teens. They're for anyone navigating a messy transition, whether it's that 18-year-old headed to college, the 22-year-old that's moving back home after graduating, or someone in midlife rebuilding a career from scratch. We talk about why friend groups shouldn't live in one place, why choices is the most stress-reducing word in the English language, and why Anna thinks parents often struggle with disappointment more than their kids do. Plus, her honest take on where AI genuinely helps, where it gets in the way, and what it means to build an entrepreneurial blueprint of your own. Here's Anna Holmeyun.

• 5:00Speaker 03

  Anna Holmeyun, welcome back to So Money.

• 5:03Speaker 05

  It's always great to be here.

• 5:06Speaker 03

  You have released the paperback version of your most recent book, Erase the Finish Line, has a new title, new cover. Tell us about this refresh.

• 5:16Speaker 05

  Well, I'm super excited about it. So when we went to do the paperback, we realized that so much had changed around the workforce and AI, and actually makes all of the work in the book all the more relevant, right? So I redid the intro and made it very focused on AI and the workforce, and what do parents really need to understand today to support their kid, young adult, as they navigate these new spaces? And then, you know, these stories, I went back and I interviewed my students from 15 to 20 years ago and told their stories of what really helped them navigate a post-graduation world. So it's really exciting for me. This year marks 25 years of being Ivy educational consultant,

• 6:00Speaker 05

  which I'm really proud of. And I'm proud that I really actually enjoy my work, and it is so rewarding. Just yesterday, I was doing an organizational workshop with an incoming high school freshman. She was so delightful, and I was doing all the things, and we just had a real connection, and she was seeing it. And I was like, yeah, this is why I do my work. So I still meet with students, and it's why the work is so just rewarding, and seeing the impact is lovely. And now, in the age of all this technological change, because remember, when I started, there was no Instagram, Snapchat, Twitter, all the things, never existed, X, you know?

• 6:43Speaker 05

  So it's, there's been a lot of change over the years.

• 6:46Speaker 03

  So much, and even in just the last year, you could say, right? So just to refresh everybody on the premise of Getting In Is Not Enough, which used to be called, or the hardcover is called, Erasing the Finish Line. This idea that we, as families, as households, we kind of usher the young student to college with the notion of just get good scores, get good grades, work for the transcript. College is very competitive, but then kids, you found, got to college and lacked a lot of the more important skills that got them to class, got them finishing the semester, and got them feeling good about their, you know, their lives in college, which is very complex, right?

• 7:31Speaker 03

  The ups, the downs, the failures, the wins. And so kind of tell us about what it was that you felt was missing from that path to college, where now we're saying, you know, just getting in, congratulations, but getting in is not enough.

• 7:46Speaker 05

  Right. Well, here's the thing, right? We have so many students, and my office is located in Silicon Valley. You live in Montclair, New Jersey. These are places where people talk about college admissions a lot. I was just walking my dog, and these two moms were walking by, and she was like, this school is a good school, and that school is a good school. And I was like, oh, my gosh, I totally understand that it becomes this whole conversation that is all-enveloping. And what gets lost in this conversation, though, and that what happens, and, you know, I've been working with students now for 25 years on executive functioning skills, is what are those underlying skills that all people need to thrive, not just in college, but beyond?

• 8:30Speaker 05

  And the book's premise came out because one of my former student's parents emailed me. He was in his late 20s. He was in my first book, That Crumpled Paper, was due last week. And she said, he's really thriving in the workforce, and so much of it is based on things he learned in your office. That's what he's telling me. So I was really curious. And what we know is that there's such this focus on grades, test scores, and college admission, that we lose sight of the, how do you build systems that work for you, that so you can organize, plan, prioritize, and get things done, right? And be adaptable when things don't go as planned. That adaptability is actually really key. How do you connect with others across differences? How do you, and this is great for people who are middle, are older,

• 9:15Speaker 05

  in our middle age or our later years, how do you adapt when things change? There are so many people that are my age that are now realizing that the career that they started either doesn't exist or doesn't exist in the way that it did when they first started their career, and there needs to be a new pathway for them. And so how they react to that is really important, also for modeling for their kids, right? And the craziest thing is, I've been thinking about this a lot now that I am of that age, because my own parents did a really good job when they were in their early 50s of navigating change. And I didn't even realize it at the time. Like, I kind of realized it, but they were so good at it.

• 10:00Speaker 05

  And they're still like, they're in their mid-70s. I've talked about them before. They're busy, they have hobbies, they're learning new things, they're curious. So this idea of getting in is not enough is actually not just about, you know, how do you help your child? But also, how do you help yourself as you're navigating this next stage? Which oftentimes, in the same time as your child's going through puberty.

• 10:20Speaker 03

  Yes. Oh, my gosh, is it hard? And so let's make that bridge and talk, because most of my audience, I mean, we may have kids in this cohort, but a lot of us are also curious to learn how we too can create the framework so that we can get in.

• 10:42Speaker 03

  To whatever next level step, you know, experience we want to have, especially as midlifers with so much on our plates. You talk about systems, you talk about connections, perspective and acceptance. These are like kind of the four pillars that you write about in the book. Very applicable to the young student demographic going into college and graduating from college, but especially anyone who's kind of in a transition phase and looking to kind of level up or change. So let's start with the systems. This is like where the executive functioning organization mastering comes in, right?

• 11:18Speaker 05

  Right. You want systems based on executive functioning skills that work for you. So what I like to say is everybody has to have a system that they can return to, that they can get back on track with. And so whether that requires you to get outside help is okay, right? Like, so whether you work with an organizer or there's just somebody that helps figure out what, what works for you in terms of organizing your life, planning, prioritizing and getting things done, and also adapting when things don't go as planned. And why this is so important as we get older is that actually, you know, when we're younger, we're building our executive functions. But as we get to middle age, we're trying to hold on to them. So that also includes our cognitive flexibility, our ability to be flexible when like something doesn't go as planned.

• 12:03Speaker 05

  So think of, if you're traveling and you get delayed or plans change, like how do you react? How much time and energy does that take, right? Think about your emotional regulation when, you know, your day goes upside down. How much time and energy does that take for you to get back on track? So this idea of having systems also allows us to be, re-regulate ourselves emotionally so that we can move forward, right? So that we don't get super bogged down in any one thing. Now, it doesn't mean that you don't process disappointment or you don't get frustrated. It's just that you're able to move through it much more effectively without thinking like

• 12:43Speaker 05

  any one thing is the be all, end all, that just like takes away not just your day, but your week, your month, all of those things. And we've seen that happen a lot of times and I have a lot of empathy for people. We're all going through a lot.

• 12:56Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 12:57Speaker 05

  And so it's not like a thing like from a place of judgment. It's absolute non-judgment. And it's also like, hey, how can we help each other? But also, how can we get systems in place that support us to get back on track when things don't go as planned?

• 13:11Speaker 03

  You know, hearing this, it's like very much akin to the advice I have read and I've heard about people who've like neurodivergence. This is all very helpful to them and helpful to everybody else who's not neurodivergent. Because to your point, life is a lot. And just today, as we're recording today, I had three appointments, all of which, you know, something came up for that person. Whether it was like they forgot, they overslept, or they got the date wrong. And, you know, they had a tech issue, it was like, we felt like Mercury was in retrograde. But no, I think Mercury's in retrograde every day. And you, and I was thinking like, what did I do when I got those shifts in my schedule?

• 13:56Speaker 03

  And I think I took them as opportunities to kind of like reset and get a coffee or, you know, just catch up on stuff and not, you know, not get too overwhelmed and swept up by it.

• 14:12Speaker 05

  And yeah, you did great. But like, if you're neurodiverse, it can also feel like a rejection every time someone cancels on you last minute. And there is that rejection sensitivity. So figuring out how you can regroup, reframe and get yourself the support you need, that it's not about you when something like that happens, even though it's disappointing or like it's reshuffled things. And, you know, feeling like no one thing is the be all, end all. And, and that's the way to, to look at it. You got a coffee, you looked at it as an opportunity, right?

• 14:45Speaker 03

  Yeah, yeah. It's an opportunity and life happens. And also to have empathy, because how many times have I been there where I thought the meeting was at noon, but it was really 11:30 and, you know, you just can't go back in time and you just got to apologize and, you know, be honest about it. How can parents set their kids up for success in this area while they're in high school? You know, just even just this one aspect of being emotionally okay with rejection or accidents in your schedule or people not kind of doing what you thought they were going to do. And it affects you because you can't control life.

• 15:22Speaker 05

  No. I think that we need to help kids be comfortable with things not going as planned a little bit more. So not always, right? Like, we don't want everything to not go as planned. But when things don't go as planned, ask open-ended questions. What was the most disappointing part about this? You know, what is something that can help you move forward? What is something that you're looking forward to, right? It allows them to verbalize what was disappointing. Well, this person didn't call me back or these plans that we made, I was really looking forward to them. And that's okay. But when you verbalize them, it allows you to process them, right? What are you disappointed, what, what do you need to help me move you forward? You know what? I would just like you to sit with me. Or I'd like to just, you know, just like veg out and watch a movie.

• 16:04Speaker 05

  Like, imagine that kid who Friday night thought they had plans and then they get canceled on, something like that, right? So then what, what would help you move forward? And then, you know, all of the things help them think about, you know, what's important to you right now. Because the way that we can model it is also to not get more stressed out or more excited than them and really just help them work through rather than try and solve and fix, because we can't solve and fix. We can't, we can help ask open-ended questions so that they can start feeling some sense of agency and competence. But experiencing disappointment is a part of life. And, you know, one of the articles recently in the Wall Street Journal was about sort of the helicopter parent that now takes over the job search

• 16:49Speaker 05

  and talks to the parent, talks to the employer about conditions in the employment place. I mean, can you imagine when we first started out that our parents would call? My parents had nothing to do with anything. My parents didn't even know what kind of company I was working at, basically.

• 17:04Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 17:05Speaker 05

  But yeah, so they're becoming overly, and because it's like they're trying to shield from disappointment. And I think when I come from a place of empathy, it's like, let's think about all the challenges and uncertainty that's coming in the information overload of the news today. And how parents are just like, can I just take care of this one thing for you, right? Can I just make this one thing easier? Can I make your job search easier and go to the job fair?

• 17:31Speaker 03

  My gosh, you know, I'm laughing a little bit because when you were talking about, you know, the Friday night plans getting upended when you're 16, that's, you know, not great. But I'm like, wait till you're 46. It's the best.

• 17:45Speaker 05

  Oh, you're not available? Oh, gosh. I'm so sorry.

• 17:48Speaker 03

  Oh, no. I was just about to get on, you know, into the shower.

• 17:53Speaker 05

  Out of my pajamas.

• 17:55Speaker 03

  No. Which brings us to the next pillar, connections. They are important, but you say that we've sort of been trained to go about connecting with people in not the most human or productive way. You know, networking advice, I'm, you know, I'm using air quotes. I remember one of the best pieces of advice you gave, I think it was you, was saying like kids need, and adults too. We need friend groups and connections in different shapes and sizes. You know, putting all your relationship, kind of like, you know, what do you call it? All the relationships.

• 18:32Speaker 05

  In one place.

• 18:33Speaker 03

  In one place. Right.

• 18:34Speaker 05

  It can be very isolating if something doesn't go as planned. So there's two things, and I think this is really important for parents as well. Because a lot of times is that you have kids, your friend group tends to be within your children's like school or social circle, or that might be one of your friend groups, right? And then you might have your college friends, or you might have your work friends, or you might have all these other things. But the thing about it is, is that making sure that you have people, and this seems very simple. And if you have these people in your life, you're like, oh my God, that's so self-explanatory. But you have people that if something really great happens to you, like you win the Lotto, like that level of great, right?

• 19:16Speaker 05

  You would call them and they would be like, I am so excited for you. And that's all they would say. They would not be like, there would not be a twinge of like, ooh, but what about me? No, it was like, I am so excited for you right now in this moment. Good for you. Right? We need those supporters in our life. And I think we don't help kids understand that that's the friends we're looking for. The ones that get excited when good things happen to us. Because I think so much back to the Getting in Is Not Enough book is that when we have this underlying hyper-competitiveness about college, it creates this, you know, frenemy type situation where this person getting in means I don't get in or I have less of a chance of getting in. It's like the scarcity mentality that kids are trained in.

• 20:01Speaker 05

  And it makes the friendships transactional. Because, oh, well, if that person gets this, then I can't, or whatever. And so, and that leads to a lot of the loneliness that I see with old, with young adults. Like, we know that young adults are among the loneliest generation. And I think part of it is you go back to this idea of how were they trained in middle school and high school around grades, around being smart, around, you know, quote un, being smart and getting those grades? And, and how are people identified by their AP classes and, and all those things? And that just creates that transaction. So first is like, hey, I'm really, you know, like something great happened. You were, whatever, a goal that you wanted was achieved.

• 20:43Speaker 05

  And again, who are the people that are excited for you? Adults and your peer group, right? And that's how we want to really help kids reframe friendships. And how they are a friend, by the way, to others as well.

• 20:56Speaker 03

  Yes, yes. And, and for the adults in the room, you know, I think it's a natural process in life where as the older you get, I hear this from a lot of women in particular, your friend group shrinks. And that may seem like you're getting less social or more isolated. But actually, what, how would you interpret that? I think that's, that might be a positive.

• 21:17Speaker 05

  Well, I think as long as you're feeling like those are authentic people you can count on, that's great. I also think people need to be open constantly to new friendships. I mean, I think and new relationships, because there is a warmth of discovery that you don't have to put yourself out there constantly and we all have a limited time and energy. But this idea of like, I have fully formed friendships by 40 and like, I'm not going to make new friends.

• 21:42Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 21:43Speaker 05

  I think that's also really limiting. I think to be really clear, I have met, I have amazing people I know in their 70s that I talk to regularly in their 60s. And I have amazing people I know in their 20s and 30s that I talk to, that I get so much value from those. And by value, I mean like, I enjoy their time, I find it humorous, I find joy in our time together. And we shouldn't lose sight of that.

• 22:09Speaker 03

  I have some amazing friends who are 10, 20 years older than me. And I just, I don't, I don't know what it is about why I became friends with them. I think I credit them for wanting to be friends with me, you know? Like, maybe I wasn't seeking, you know, a friend that was my mother's age. But they, you know, credit to them. They, they had the patience to be my friend because, you know, I feel like they're more grounded. Like a little bit, a lot more perspective.

• 22:40Speaker 05

  Perfection. Yeah. That brings us to the perspective piece of expanding that there's no one way. And I think as people get older and they see life happen, they're like, yeah, you know, there's no one way to be successful. Or what we thought of as a success in our twenties might not be what we want anymore.

• 22:59Speaker 03

  So speaking now to the person who is trying to make a career shift, they see what's happening with AI. There's a rumble of fear there. They've applied to a lot of jobs. They're not hearing back, so there's that sense of rejection. How do they maintain perspective and stay calm in all of this?

• 23:18Speaker 05

  I'm not going to say it's easy, especially given if you have like family obligations, financial obligations, bills, we got bills to pay. I also would hope that people are, get a little bit more, like expand the notion of what they are willing to do in terms of, you know, like different careers, try different things out. I know one person that I know, you know, just left advertising and it really has always been interested in financial advising. So is, you know, joining a team where he's taken a Series Seven and 63 and doing all of that stuff, which is a lot of work to get certified to be and go through that financial planning piece.

• 24:01Speaker 05

  And I think that, you know, being open to what are the things that actually interest you in this moment is important. I mean, I talk a lot sometimes about my mom, who when she was in her early 50s, she became a real estate agent and she, from tech, and she loved it. She was always into real estate. That was her true love. I've told it on the podcast before, we used to go to open houses all over on a Sunday, like as a hobby. And she has helped so many families find a home over the last 20 plus years. And she's still really active. I mean, like, I think that that, to me, is the greatest example of being open. And yeah, you're going to have to start at a different level. Like, that's the other thing, like openness and expansion and perspective.

• 24:42Speaker 05

  You have to probably start at a different level than where you're at right now. And not feeling shame around that, being okay with being a beginner or a near beginner or advanced beginner. And I think that's real good modeling for the kids in your life, whether, or the younger people in your life, that you are able to do that and adapt and, you know, learn and be excited about something new.

• 25:06Speaker 03

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• 28:56Speaker 03

  Although you're hearing so many kids going back and living at home after college,

• 29:01Speaker 03

  no, not, it's not maybe their first choice or their fifth choice to do that, but here they are. A lot of this is, of course, driven by the economy. And how does that 22-year-old keep perspective, right? How do they not define themselves by this circumstance of, you know, like, I guess it's not meeting their expectations? And how do they, how do they work through that?

• 29:28Speaker 05

  It's all about choices. So I, it's so funny that I have actually talked to my neighbor who's 23-year-old is working in AI for a company. He leaves at like 6:30 in the morning. He comes home at 7 o'clock at night. It took him about a year after graduation to find a job, right? In San Francisco, where I've lived for a number of years. And at first he was like, I'm dying to like find an apartment. And I was like, really? I mean, the apartments are really expensive and your location is great and your parents have a great situation, whatever. And I just saw him last week and I was walking my dogs and I ran into him and he's like, yeah, you know, and he's accepted it. Not because like, he doesn't look at it as a, like a failing, right?

• 30:12Speaker 05

  He looks at it as a choice. And he can save money, but it comes with trade-offs because you live with your parents, right? And so you truly are living with your parents. Or you can think about, you know, really paying in that where he's, you know, living and working is really high rent, probably with multiple roommates, where you're barely there. He's like, he, I know when he gets, you know, when he's leaving for work in the morning because I see him when I walk my dogs. So I am like, he's taking the trade-offs and he's given a pragmatic thing that takes away any of the, you know, shame and concern. And I have to say, because you and I are around, we graduated college around the same time, I feel like this generation does not think the way we did around living at home.

• 30:56Speaker 05

  Because I have talked to multiple friends my age who were like, oh, absolutely not. That would have been out of the question. Versus you talk to young people today, they're like, well, actually, it's a good option, given, depending on where you live, right? Depending on where you live and what your situation is. Like, if you're living at a high cost of living, sitting and you have a family situation, it may make sense. And you're working long hours. To me, it may make sense and then save up for, for something else.

• 31:26Speaker 03

  I mean, there is such an opportunity in staying home. It's maybe not the lifestyle that you envisioned for yourself, but financially, you can make some real leaps in those years of staying home. The rent that you're not paying, investing that, or just saving that. I mean, you, I, gosh.

• 31:44Speaker 05

  As long as you do that, right? And then what other thing happened is the lifestyle creep of like the travel or like, I'm going to quit my job for a year and go travel. Well, which is great if people can do that, but like, and that's their choice. But also, look at what your long-term goals are and what the trade-offs are and what all of those things are and about making choices. Again, I think that the minute you, you realize that you have choices and you're actively making a choice, whether that is to live with your parents after college and save money, whether it is to rent a place in another city, whether it is to, whatever it is, you do have choices. And that reduces the stress and it takes away the shame that you, or guilt that you might feel somewhere else. And this is true for adults, like, you know, adults that are in middle age or retirement

• 32:30Speaker 05

  years as well. Choices.

• 32:32Speaker 03

  Choices. And then acceptance, your fourth pillar. We tend to use a lot of external markers to source our sense of self-worth, title, salary, our institutional affiliation. I think with, with kids, teens, it's like where you go to college feels like, you know, a rubber, like you're just stamped that school and whatever comes with it. And I know kids have such anxiety about that because, you know, maybe it wasn't their dream school, maybe it wasn't their first choice, and now they feel kind of cornered into that persona of like, oh, you're the kid that goes to XYZ school.

• 33:12Speaker 05

  I actually think parents struggle with this even more than kids do. I have seen this in a lot.

• 33:17Speaker 03

  The parents of the teens, you say?

• 33:18Speaker 05

  Yeah. So there's a couple of things that happen. One, where parents are like, where my kid goes to school is a, you know, is a reflection on my own parenting. Was I a good parent? Did they get into a good school? That's one. Second, Is, you know, when a kid doesn't get into whatever school, I will say so many times, the kid has moved on and the parent needs coaching and counseling about things. Like, the kid is like, okay, well, these are my choices. So these schools want me and I want to go here. And the parent is stuck back here and they actually need, and that to me

• 34:01Speaker 05

  is the thing that we as adults never got a lot of the emotional regulation and the coaching and the moving forward and all the things that I talk about in the book that we are now helping kids see, which makes them process disappointment more effectively. And we as adults have a little bit of work to do sometimes. Like yesterday, I was dealing with a parent who didn't get the fall time slot they wanted. And, you know, it was because they filled out the form wrong and

• 34:32Speaker 03

  You know, time slot, meaning what?

• 34:34Speaker 05

  Well, students who work with us have a have a time slot. And so fall scheduling ends up being a game of Tetris, right?

• 34:40Speaker 03

  Your firm.

• 34:41Speaker 05

  At our company, at Green Ivy. So it's a game of Tetris. We do it every year. We have a whole form, we have a form, people start filling it out in May, like, it's a whole thing. And if you don't, like, we do everything to make it so simplified. Like, this isn't our first rodeo. It's year 25 people. But the reaction that the person had to not getting this one time slot was not, you know, did not match the actual situation. Because honestly, I was like, oh, you have these choices, actually, we can help you figure out, you can get this time slot, but it might not be this. But you know what I mean? So there were options. And, you know, I felt like I was, I was navigating a level of disappointment with an adult that with a

• 35:25Speaker 05

  child would have been, or a teenager would have been easier to move forward with, if that makes sense. So that's what I see a lot of. It's like, and I like to think that everybody has things that they're dealing with behind the scenes that may make the presenting problem, not the actual problem.

• 35:40Speaker 03

  Is this a high functioning Silicon Valley parent problem, though, mostly? Or you would say this is like every average parent in America today?

• 35:48Speaker 05

  I think every parent in America today is dealing with their own set of circumstances, whether they're caregiving for their parents, whether they're navigating, you know, personal health issues, whether they're navigating job, job issues, woes, all of these things, we're all dealing with stuff. And so how we react to things and how we process is a result of the pillars that I talk about, right? Do we have systems in place to reduce the emotional load? Do we have connections that help us navigate a disappointment or distress, right? Like, and bring joy to our lives? Do we have an expanded perspective that like, yeah, this one time slot, there's four other options that could work here and the person is helping me find a solution? And do we have an acceptance for ourselves and others, right? That, that,

• 36:31Speaker 05

  you know, we're moving through, hey, I made a mistake. That's okay. Nobody's sitting in it. Let's just move forward.

• 36:38Speaker 03

  We haven't really spent much time on the AI piece of all of this. And for, you know, from where you sit, what is the most important message you want to give both young adults and also midlifers around this AI reality that we're living in today?

• 36:54Speaker 05

  Well, I think so much of the technology over the years has brought us some fear, right? Anything you've, we've talked about over the years has this level of fear built in, like, everything's going to go away, nothing is going to exist. And I think one of the things is to really step back and double down on the, the human side of relationships and connection. Because at the end of the day, and you have an amazing local podcast, you know, that those in-person connections, that walking down the street, that being with people is what still makes all the difference. And so in the age of AI, actually, the executive functioning skills are going to be all the more important. How are you emotionally regulating? How are you able

• 37:38Speaker 05

  to be flexible when things don't go as planned? How are you able to connect with others across differences? Right? And then also thinking about how we can help people really fit in their life in a way that's meaningful, and then figure out where they're using AI or technology in a way that's supportive of their life, right? And not taking away from critical thinking or not taking away from, you know, all of the things that make us human. And yet, there are things that can be helpful. I mean, there are so many parts of AI that have already existed and have made things helpful. For example, voice to text. I've worked with students who

• 38:18Speaker 05

  are dyslexic for years. And when we first worked together, they would have to drive down to the Reading Center for the Blind and Dyslexic, they would have to check out a tape, and they would have to put it in a cassette recorder to listen to a textbook that somebody else had read into a microphone. Now, so much of this is available for download at the touch of your fingertips. You can now say something into text and then, or, or, or record it, and then it organizes all your notes for you. These are things for people with learning differences that are a life changer, a game changer. And so there are so many things that are tools that are helpful that I also don't want us to lose sight of. All of these things are good or bad in this,

• 39:01Speaker 05

  like, very black and white moment. And I think that that is very true for a lot of things, where people are like, this is all good or all bad, there's no in between. And I think of it more as a nuanced question. I do think younger students should avoid using it, especially as they're building critical thinking and writing skills. Because the writing is important. And AI makes these mistakes, and AI doesn't understand nuance. And you do need to read through things and all these things. So it can get you through the first step, but the expertise is going to get you through steps two, three, and four.

• 39:35Speaker 03

  And touching, you know, sticking with AI for a second here, and maybe this will be our last question, for the woman in transition who's in midlife, who's applying for jobs, and so much of the job application process is automated, it is AI driven. You had an example, the former editor at L, 52 years old, recently posted about, I think, what, spent 16 months job hunting, 150 applications, and no luck. What does a story like that signal to you in terms of like, how we can, with this AI stuff, you know, kind of circumvent it, or, you know,

• 40:17Speaker 03

  try to make the best of it so we can get the job?

• 40:21Speaker 05

  Yeah. I mean, I think there's a couple of things going on, and I don't want to pass any judgment, because what a stressful position to be in.

• 40:28Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 40:28Speaker 05

  And I'm glad she, she named it and she talked about it. It went viral on Instagram. You know, she's 52, she's applied to all these jobs, and she has not, you know, not landed something. And she had really high powered roles. I think that's the challenge as you get higher and higher up, there's fewer roles. And this idea of figuring out how to expand your perspective of how you're hiring, and what types of jobs you're hiring. And then, is there a way that you can, you know, both of us have run our own small things, or big things, right? Like, like, small, big things, if that makes sense. Like, we've created our own things. I think we need to talk about those things sooner with women and with people in

• 41:08Speaker 05

  general, that what is the other thing that you can do, or things that you can do that might support you as well? I don't have the answers for, and not everyone is, by the way, meant to run a business. Like, running a business is its own special animal. There are plenty of people who are like, that's not my thing. But there are ways to have that entrepreneurial spirit, to build your own blueprint. So if you're applying for all these jobs and it's not working out, maybe figuring out how to change how you're applying, or how you're letting people know, or how you're engaging with the job process. Because I think one of the things I've found in the hiring side, is that a lot of people just, sometimes they'll just like, apply to jobs, and I'm not talking about this woman at all, but they'll just apply to jobs,

• 41:53Speaker 05

  thinking that, oh, it's so easy, I'm just going to do one click. But one click is a lot of people doing that. Right?

• 41:59Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 42:00Speaker 05

  So what are the different ways that you can expand and get creative around it? I mean, you, you know this around the work that you do.

• 42:06Speaker 03

  And this has been true before AI, right?

• 42:09Speaker 05

  A hundred percent.

• 42:10Speaker 03

  Like,

• 42:10Speaker 05

  Is it even more true now?

• 42:12Speaker 03

  It's more true now. It's almost like with back, going back to college, when they, when they created that general application, like, college applications skyrocketed, you know? And so, gosh, that was a mistake.

• 42:25Speaker 05

  The common app, the common app has now become even more than you and I, when you and I applied, that they're now taking away some supplement questions. So yes, applications are skyrocketing. Same kind of message is how do you differentiate? Like, how do you, and I don't have, pretend to have all the answers here, but I also know, when I talk to most people about how they've landed their job, most of the time, it comes from a friend of a friend, or a connection passing on, or flagging up a company, or all of these things. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but I am saying that it is happening more than others, more often than we realize. And that is that human connection of who is that, you know,

• 43:07Speaker 05

  what is that ability for us to make that human connection, maintain that human connection, have non-transactional relationships, so that when we are, you know, asking for, you know, who knows what, and who knows who, everybody is like, how can I be helpful? And then on the receiving side, if you're a person that is able to give,

• 43:29Speaker 03

  Yeah.

• 43:30Speaker 05

  Give, because you don't know. Like, it's not a tit for tat, like, oh, I didn't get anything back for this.

• 43:35Speaker 03

  It's not a zero sum game. It's not a zero sum game. The world is abundant.

• 43:39Speaker 05

  Yeah, but also, and also, like, you know, it doesn't, I want to remember that somebody was like, I don't want to introduce anyone to my network, because I think that if it doesn't go well, it's a reflection on me. And I was like, I think you need to like, lower the bar here a little bit. Because it's, you do want to have discretion, right? Absolutely. But you also want to give opportunities to people. So, you know, you can frame things in a different way to the person that you're making the introduction with.

• 44:08Speaker 03

  Yeah. One of the first money philosophies, I think, that was ever stated on this show, I think it was David Bach, he was like, I was like, what's your money philosophy? He goes, be a go giver, not a go getter. Be a go giver. And I don't think he was quoting himself. He was quoting another, you know, person. But I never forgot that. It's so true. And because you, what you get, you get what you give. And I said,

• 44:34Speaker 05

  Well, shout out to David Bach, because I read Smart Moon and Finish Rich when I was 22, 23 years old. And I, that totally changed my framework. And the idea of the entrepreneurial life, being able to create your own blueprint, is all the more ready when you have the financial pieces behind you, which is why I think like, so money and the, the conversations you have are so important.

• 44:57Speaker 03

  Yeah. All right. Anna Holmeyun, thank you so much. I'm so glad your book is getting a refresh and so, so relevant. It was relevant then, it's so relevant now. And I love that we were able to bridge it from young adults to midlife, everyone in between, everyone, check out Getting In Is Not Enough, The New Blueprint for Student Success Beyond Grades and College Admissions. Thanks so much.

• 45:23Speaker 03

  Thanks so much to Anna Holmeyun for joining us. Our book again, Getting In Is Not Enough, The New Blueprint for Student Success Beyond Grades and College Admissions. I'll see you back here on Wednesday. I hope your day is so money.

• 45:49Speaker 00

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  Hey, we're Nick and Jack, hosts of The Best One Yet. Behind every episode, there's research, emails, spreadsheets, and our shared Google Doc, the headline hammer. With Google Workspace with Gemini, Google's AI is built right into the premium versions of tools we already use, like Gmail, Docs, and Sheets. No new tools or extra logins, just personalized AI for the way we work. That means less time on the work around the work, and more time finding the stories worth talking about. Get AI tools for work. Upgrade to Google Workspace with Gemini at goo.gle/workspacewithGemini. That's goo.gle/workspacewithGemini.