452: Great Wolf Lodge, Nolan Wells, Erie Family Massacre & Anna Kepner Updates

Join Annie as she breaks down what’s happening in true crime this week.

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• 1:31Speaker 02

  Hey, true crime besties. Welcome back to an all-new episode of Serial Ashley.

• 1:54Speaker 02

  Hello, hello, hello, and welcome back to an all-new episode of Serial Ashley with me, your host, Annie Elise. Happy Thursday. I hope you are having a fantastic week so far that you're getting through it. We're almost at the weekend, so whether you're listening at home, at work, with your work bestie, maybe you're out running, wherever you're at, I hope you're having a good week and you are gearing up for the weekend. There has been, of course, no shortage in stuff going on this week, and lots of stuff to go through, lots of cases to talk about, a few that you have been DMing me about, and I've kind of just been sitting on waiting for more information, but more information has finally come in. And so, here to talk with you about those cases today. Also, just as

• 2:39Speaker 02

  a little PSA, released a deep dive on Monday and Tuesday of this week, so if you feel like you're in need of more content to binge, you can hop on over to my second true crime podcast feed, 10 to Life, or just scroll down a little in the feed on this one, and you will see the Monday episode. But we've got a lot to get into today. We have updates in the Nolan Wells case, some group text messages that have now emerged. David was back in court this week, D4VD, so more updates there. We also are going to talk about the horrific double murder at Great Wolf Lodge, the eerie family massacre, Anna Kepner updates. There is just a lot to go over, but I'm not going to do it alone. So, straight out of

• 3:24Speaker 02

  Page Six, and who wore it better? Welcome to the podcast, Amy Collet.

• 3:30Speaker 04

  Hello. Holor, I should say.

• 3:32Speaker 02

  Dare I say, your skin looks amazing. This is the first time I've actually really lurked at it up close.

• 3:38Speaker 04

  Thanks. It's a little swollen still, but...

• 3:39Speaker 02

  Is it?

• 3:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, but...

• 3:41Speaker 02

  It won't.

• 3:42Speaker 04

  Tight.

• 3:45Speaker 04

  I actually went to the movies last night with Taryn, and she just had it done. And when she came out of the car, I was like, that's what I looked like two weeks ago.

• 3:52Speaker 02

  Wait, you don't look swollen, though.

• 3:54Speaker 04

  It's a little swollen, but I'm...

• 3:55Speaker 02

  Oh, okay. That's not a dig. You just don't look swollen. Your jawline looks snatched. But your skin looks really good. It looks very glossy.

• 4:02Speaker 04

  Well, thank you.

• 4:03Speaker 02

  You're welcome.

• 4:04Speaker 04

  You look cute today.

• 4:04Speaker 02

  Well, I was just gonna say, why are you wearing my lurk?

• 4:07Speaker 04

  Why? Yeah, who stole my look? I thought you were gonna be wearing Lucos, and you threw me a curveball.

• 4:13Speaker 02

  I threw myself a curveball because I went looking for my Lucos, and I couldn't find them this morning, so I did a quick second best and found these little slip and slides and put them on.

• 4:23Speaker 04

  I almost wore my hoop earrings, too, so I'm glad there's a little difference.

• 4:27Speaker 02

  Hoop earrings are my thing. That's what's the quote for Mean Girls, where she's all... Did she tell you I can't wear hoop earrings? They said they're her thing. Well, you know what? I'm not really that surprised that we're matching, because when you have merch that looks this good, everybody wants to scoop it up. No, but as I always say, I hope you're having a nice day, because I'm about to ruin it, and Amy and I are saying that as well today.

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  This was a popular request. People wanted this design.

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  I know. They really wanted it, and it's one of our bestsellers right now. Almost sold out. Grab it while you can. AnnieElise.com. You can see it here. It's like QVC. You can see it here in the black, and over here in the ivory. No, I know. I love this design. It makes me so happy. Well, speaking of ruining days...

• 5:09Speaker 04

  We're about to.

• 5:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, should we get into it?

• 5:11Speaker 04

  Let's get into it.

• 5:11Speaker 02

  We're gonna start with the worst person in this lower western hemisphere. Did I say that right? Good. That's in our neck of the woods, backyard, stone throw away, all the different things you could say. We're gonna talk about D4VD. The predator that everybody hates, the sicko loser. What's a sycophant? I feel like I want to say that, but I don't think that's the right word. Doesn't that mean a slut?

• 5:39Speaker 04

  I have no idea. I've never heard that word.

• 5:40Speaker 02

  You've never heard the word sycophant?

• 5:43Speaker 04

  I've never in my life heard that. Am I living under a rock?

• 5:48Speaker 02

  Are you? Wait, really?

• 5:48Speaker 04

  No. Is that weird, guys?

• 5:50Speaker 02

  I really like that word, but I don't think it means what I think it means, which, big surprise, I use words out of context.

• 5:57Speaker 04

  Watch your mispronouncing it.

• 5:58Speaker 02

  No, it is sycophant. Hold on. Sorry, guys. We're getting derailed for a second. Let me, let me just search this. I don't even know how you would spell it. Let me do voice to text. Sycophant. It's just such a good word. Oh, wow. That's definitely not how I was gonna spell it. Okay, why is my internet so slow? Come on, Google. I need the definition.

• 6:19Speaker 04

  What were you thinking it might be?

• 6:20Speaker 02

  I thought it meant like, just loser, troll, scumbag, but I think it means something slutty.

• 6:26Speaker 04

  Sycophant or sycophant?

• 6:28Speaker 02

  No, sycophant. Okay, I was way off. A person who praises, flatters, or acts overly obedient toward wealthy, powerful, or influential people to gain an advantage or favor.

• 6:39Speaker 04

  Like a thirsty person?

• 6:40Speaker 02

  I guess. Well, he is that, too. No, I don't know why I love the... Okay, what's an example of a sycophant?

• 6:47Speaker 04

  Like, I know a lot of those kind of people.

• 6:49Speaker 02

  We're doing an English lesson today. Okay, an example of a sycophant is the yes-man employee, an office worker who constantly praises the CEO's poor ideas, laughs loudly at mediocre jokes, and always agrees with management.

• 7:03Speaker 04

  Sounds like me.

• 7:04Speaker 02

  I was just gonna say, Jess, where are you? Jess is the, like, office bubbly person. Is she a sycophant? Teacher's pet, and the kiss-up, kick-down colleague, someone who acts charming, submissive, and deeply complimentary to senior executives while treating administrative staff, interns, or subordinates with arrogance and contempt. Well, that's not Jess.

• 7:27Speaker 04

  And that's not David.

• 7:28Speaker 02

  That's not David. Well, maybe. I don't know.

• 7:31Speaker 04

  David's just sick.

• 7:32Speaker 02

  Well, but he played the public for a fool, for a fiddle. What's with today's, like, today's theme is thesaurus, or like euphemisms or cliches, yeah. But he did kind of play the public and like, act like he's this tortured artist, poet, loser, when really he was something else. And it's, I think, because he was after the money, obviously. So, anyway, sorry, guys. That was a very long English lesson, but we do have an update in the David case, because on Monday, October 19th, David was back in court for a status hearing, and a lot of people were expecting something pretty big to happen at this hearing. Some thought that we would finally maybe get an official trial date. Others were speculating that

• 8:15Speaker 02

  maybe David might actually take a plea deal, especially now that he is represented by a public defender. However, neither one of those things happened. The entire hearing lasted less than five minutes, and honestly, I'll get to this in a minute, the most interesting part about the hearing was, I think, what happened before the hearing began with a totally different defendant. So, not much really happened at all in his hearing. Both sides agreed to aim for a trial in February of 2027, possibly moving into March, not, you know, not waiving his right to a speedy trial. However, an official start date has not been set, but another status hearing was scheduled for January 11th. Now, the one thing I will

• 8:55Speaker 02

  say that people did notice about this hearing was David's appearance and his overall demeanor, because he reportedly looked very different than how he had looked in his past hearings. In other hearings, even the prelim a couple of months ago, he seemed kind of happy. He was smiling. He was joking with his attorneys, and really just seemed like he didn't even have a single care in the world. However, this time, people who were in the courtroom said he was the complete opposite. His face was clean-shaven. He wasn't wearing his glasses. His hair had gotten longer. Some people said he even looked like he had some gray hair in there now, but he was sitting kind of like, hunched over, slouched down a little

• 9:34Speaker 02

  bit in his chair, and his facial expressions reportedly looked depressed, sad, and almost hopeless, which I love that for him.

• 9:44Speaker 04

  I was just gonna say, well, when you have that much evidence piling up against you...

• 9:47Speaker 02

  Yeah. Things that mean a lot to me, this, him looking hopeless. We like this. So, he barely spoke during the hearing, other than responding to the judge with a very quiet, "Yes, Your Honor," like a little mouse. So, maybe...

• 10:02Speaker 04

  I like that analogy.

• 10:03Speaker 02

  I do too. Like, you're a loser. You're a rat.

• 10:05Speaker 04

  Yeah, a rat.

• 10:06Speaker 02

  You know? So I don't know. Hopefully, reality is starting to set in. Although, I would argue, if reality truly is starting to set in, maybe there will be a plea deal on the horizon, because maybe his ego is now starting to subside a little bit, and he doesn't think he's going to get away with this at trial, so he's gonna cop to a plea. We'll see. But as of right now, January 11th is the next date to watch, and technically, the trial should start within 90 days of the final status hearing, because a person's right to a speedy trial, and we know he didn't waive that right. However, as we all know, court dates get pushed back all the time, so while February, March is the goal for the trial right now, we will see if that actually happens. But like I said, one of the more interesting parts about all of this, while I was like

• 10:51Speaker 02

  on pins and needles, waiting for the update, is apparently while his hearing was waiting to begin, there was another defendant, and I don't know all of the details, so please don't scream into your AirPods right now, I need to research it, but there was another person who was facing the judge, who I guess like had killed four people in four hours, or some sort of killing spree.

• 11:13Speaker 04

  Oh my gosh.

• 11:13Speaker 02

  There's some sort of four and four situation, so people were like captivated by that, because it appeared that there could be a potential serial killer in LA.

• 11:20Speaker 04

  Oh, okay.

• 11:21Speaker 02

  Something like that. So, maybe I'll research more of that, too. But anyways, you know, you know what I like the most?

• 11:28Speaker 04

  What?

• 11:28Speaker 02

  Hopeless David. And it reminded me of something like-

• 11:31Speaker 04

  Hopeless Mousy David.

• 11:32Speaker 02

  Where, what's the movie where they go, there's hope for Harry. Hope, hope for Harry.

• 11:37Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 11:38Speaker 02

  Is it, what's Kate Hudson's mom's name? Goldie Hawn? Hope for Harry.

• 11:42Speaker 04

  Oh, yes. Banger Sisters.

• 11:45Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 11:46Speaker 04

  Oh my gosh, that's such a classic.

• 11:48Speaker 02

  Hopeless David. Hope, hope, hopeless David. Love that for him. Now, into the next update, we have kind of a strange update in the case of Nolan Wells, and this is one where I saw a lot of stuff coming out last week, wasn't quite sure what I was going to report on, but a lot of you have been asking me when I put my question box up on Instagram of, what cases do you want me to cover? It's Nolan Wells, Nolan Wells, Nolan Wells. We've done a deep dive into the case, maybe a freshie is due, but let me give you this update. So last week, a nearly 300-page forensic report was released, and in it, there are text messages between Nolan's friends from the days after he disappeared back in July. And for those of you who are unfamiliar with the Nolan Wells case, first,

• 12:29Speaker 02

  I will link it in the show notes, but on the 4th of July this last summer, Nolan went missing from the boat. He was at a boat party with his friends in, on Horn Island. They all left. He apparently, according to his friends, stayed back and hung out with a girl that he met, but then he never returned. His phone was still on the boat with his friends. They then found him the following day, deceased in the water. And there's been a lot of speculation from day one, that there was some sort of foul play involved in this, that either his friends were involved, that there was some sort of horrible accident that took place, and then a cover-up after the fact. And so, pretty much from day one, people have just been saying that there's something shady, there's a cover-up, especially

• 13:12Speaker 02

  because when a second autopsy was ordered by his family, an independent one, when they received Nolan's remains, there were certain organs that were no longer a part of his body, which I've also heard is kind of standard when a medical examiner is doing an autopsy to remove certain things. Again, lots of information, I'm just trying to give you the Cliff Notes version, so you know what I'm talking about now with the update. So as I said, the text messages have been released, and the report was put together by a company that was hired by Nolan's family, and it includes messages from 29 Snapchat group chats, as well as private messages pulled from his phone. Now, most of the usernames are redacted, but some of those conversations are pretty interesting, and a lot of people say, you

• 13:55Speaker 02

  know, does point to foul play. So on July 5th, the day after Nolan disappeared, and just as the search was getting started for him, one person wrote, quote, and remember this before they found his body, "Nolan, where the fuck are you, dog? Coast Guards are on the search for you, man." Someone else claimed that Nolan had gotten off the boat with another guy and started walking toward the boat, which apparently then raised some questions in the group. One person replied, "There is def some sus shit going on," which, for all my boomers like me, that means, I know you're like dying as I try to like say this, it means there is definitely some suspicious shit going on. Another pointed out that thousands of people had been on the island, yet nobody seemed to know who Nolan was last with. So it seemed like some of them were still hoping that maybe he

• 14:39Speaker 02

  had just overconsumed, and he was passed out somewhere, and that everybody would hear from him, and it would be okay. But one person suggested that he may have been drugged. And as the case started getting national attention, one other person wrote, quote, "All I keep seeing is white folk made it home, and the one black kid didn't." Another person then said, "It ain't never been like that with us, bro." Now, what a lot of people are finding particularly interesting was that the following morning on July 6th, the group started talking about what they should do if the police wanted to question them. One person said that everyone should ask for an attorney, saying that it didn't mean that they were guilty, but that they needed to, quote, "protect themselves from potentially biased officers," and they told the group not to speculate and to stick

• 15:24Speaker 02

  to the facts. Another person replied, "We have nothing to hide." And look, I think a lot of people are seeing these text messages and creating, I don't want to say creating a narrative, well, I guess it is that, creating a narrative that these text messages allude to them trying to build a cover story, or trying to act as though they are a concerned friend, when really, they already knew what happened, then that they're covering their own asses by saying you need to get a lawyer, which, for the record, if you are ever questioned or are arrested, guilty or not, get a lawyer. Protect yourself immediately. That is the number one thing. And I know, a lot of the time, people think it makes people look guilty if they lawyer up. I myself have been in

• 16:07Speaker 02

  that camp at certain times, but it really is the best option to protect yourself. So now, as we're going through all of this, a Mississippi grand jury found that there was no criminal wrongdoing in Nolan's death. That was last month. And according to some legal analysts, nothing in these newly released messages would necessarily change that conclusion. However, Nolan's family, who has had questions from day one, they still have questions, especially wondering why he would have stayed behind on that island by himself. His father had said back in July, that he didn't believe that Nolan would have done that, saying, quote, "It just doesn't, that's not his character." So, I don't know, these text messages, to

• 16:48Speaker 02

  me, they aren't that suspicious to me. I think that people, in that one where they said, where is it, I want to quote it exactly, where it said, "Oh, where, all I keep seeing is white folk made it home, and the one black kid didn't," and the person replying, saying, "It ain't ever been like that with us, bro." I feel like he's saying like, you know, "It's never been a thing of race with us. We're all friends. It wouldn't have been like that." So, I, and I know a lot of people may disagree with me, I personally, with these text messages, don't see anything that makes me believe that foul play was involved. That being said, there also were a lot of Snapchat messages that were deleted. Some have said, and well, I should say, experts have said, they were unable to determine

• 17:31Speaker 02

  if they had been manually deleted from Nolan's phone, or if they were recalled, if they were the disappearing messages. It's hard to say, it's just that the fact that they're gone, that to me, is almost more compelling that something is afoot here, if messages were in fact manually wiped from his phone. But the context of these messages, it doesn't really indicate to me that there's some sort of cover story in play. And I read all the messages, and like, I'm just paraphrasing a few here for you guys, or not even paraphrasing, quoting a few for you, but what I will paraphrase, is there were a lot more where they did say things like, "Nolan, where are you? We're worried about you. Hey, guys, have you heard from Nolan?" And that's what people are suggesting indicates that they were trying

• 18:14Speaker 02

  to build this alibi and this cover story, as though they already knew, but they were like covering their tracks. I don't think that is the case, but I could be wrong.

• 18:24Speaker 04

  I mean, from the few text messages you shared, it sounded pretty typical of, hey, man, where are you? The Coast Guards are looking for you. Like, that seems like something a friend would send.

• 18:34Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 18:34Speaker 04

  But, I mean, and isn't, I've never had Snapchat, but isn't the whole purpose of Snapchat, that the messages- Like are only they're only visible ones or they disappear after a certain amount of time or something like that?

• 18:46Speaker 02

  Yeah, and I don't know if there have been updates over the years, but when I first had Snapchat, when I was twenty-two years old, which was do the math seventeen years ago, oh my god, that was it, where they would just disappear and basically Snapchat was known as like the app that you would send nudes on because like you would send a nude and it would disappear. Now, I believe it has evolved where Snapchat is teen and young adults' primary form of messaging.

• 19:14Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 19:15Speaker 02

  And and for anybody who has a Gen Z kid, please let me know in the comments, but where I don't know if they have new features now where not everything disappears, but I know like, for example, right now, if I was on Snap, I would just be like Snap with no context and post it, or like they aren't posting with caption and like it's just a like a tool to communicate.

• 19:32Speaker 04

  Isn't that part of like the Cornell seven, they have the Snapchat, so those obviously were recovered records, so like, I guess, why aren't these recovered?

• 19:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, I think, I don't know, I would imagine, I need to dig into Snapchat a little bit more. I don't know, I feel very Gen Z with my headband.

• 19:46Speaker 04

  About MySpace, because then I could definitely speak to that.

• 19:48Speaker 02

  I could too, and I could tell you how to code a webpage with the characters and with the music on MySpace, like nobody's business, like HTML coding, that's what we had to do back in the day, and I did it.

• 19:58Speaker 04

  The kids have it easy.

• 19:59Speaker 02

  They have it easy.

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  Do they?

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• 21:58Speaker 04

  Well, we have another update in another case, and this one is on the Anna Kepner case, and if you remember, this poor girl, she was eighteen years old, went on a Carnival cruise with her family and was killed while on board. She was found by a staff member from the ship. She was underneath a mattress covered in life vests, and her stepbrother was arrested, and now we're going to probably going to be waiting a little bit longer for her stepbrother, Timothy Hudson, to go to trial. So back on August twenty-fourth, Timothy's attorneys filed a motion asking for more time to prepare for what's called a Miller hearing, which is basically a hearing for the court to decide if adult sentencing is appropriate for a juvenile defendant, even if they are being tried in adult court.

• 22:42Speaker 04

  So Timothy's trial had already been delayed once, but this motion then pushed it back again, and after it did, the trial was postponed to start on November second. Well, fast forward to Thursday of last week, his attorneys filed another motion asking to push the trial back to January of twenty twenty-seven. According to the filing, there was one outstanding issue that they needed to work through before Timothy could make a final decision about whether or not to plead guilty or go to trial. But here's the thing, they didn't say what that issue actually was, or why they couldn't get it figured out before the trial date that was already set. But apparently prosecutors were fine with giving them more time because they didn't really oppose the request. So I'm wondering, does that mean Timothy is considering some sort of a plea deal?

• 23:27Speaker 04

  Or maybe the issue is they just haven't been offered anything to take? Who knows? But if you remember, there was also some family drama a few months ago with some of the family members not cooperating with the investigation. So I'm wondering, is that still something they're trying to figure out? Again, we have no idea. That motion that was filed doesn't give us much to go on, other than the fact is that there is something that they are still trying to figure out. But either way, the judge did grant them this request, and Timothy's trial is now scheduled to start on January twenty-fifth, twenty twenty-seven. He also has until January fifteenth to enter a guilty plea, so we'll wait and see what happens with that.

• 24:05Speaker 02

  I would be surprised if this went to trial. I'm hoping that it does, because I think more information will come out, obviously so much of it is under seal right now because of the minors involved, but I would be shocked if it goes to trial. I think he will accept some sort of plea deal, just because there is so much evidence against him.

• 24:23Speaker 04

  And that's kind of what I was thinking, too, is I'm thinking, there's all this evidence against him, and if I remember correctly, he was sent to live with other family members because he was considered a threat.

• 24:33Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 24:34Speaker 04

  And so there's, again, to your point, more that I'm assuming is going to come out, which would be a reason for him to probably take a plea.

• 24:41Speaker 02

  I think, too, the family, even the family that is still siding with him, they're advising him, I would imagine, and I would think that maybe they'd be like, you know, Timothy, there's so much evidence, you like, don't put our family through a trial, let's not go through this, you need to own up to what you did, let's get like, if they offer a plea deal, let's take it, and maybe something like that.

• 25:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 25:03Speaker 02

  But I don't know, I could be wrong. Look at friggin' Aiden Fucci, and I know I always reference that case, but like, his mom not only helped cover up for him, but he also went to trial and pretended to be crazy on all of the jail calls.

• 25:13Speaker 04

  Well, and his family's split, so who knows who's telling him what?

• 25:17Speaker 02

  I know.

• 25:18Speaker 04

  So we will keep you guys posted.

• 25:20Speaker 02

  All right, so this next case, it started going around earlier this week, and it's absolutely insane. You may have seen the footage pop up on your Instagram or maybe even your TikTok. It looked like it was from, it looks like CCTV footage, but it probably is from like, not a Ring cam, but some sort of neighborhood camera. A lot of you have sent it to me, I saw it as well, when I first saw it, I sent it in our Slack, our group Slack, and I was like, what the hell is this? Like, this is so crazy. But on Friday, October sixteenth, a woman named Bella Torres was home with her one-year-old daughter while her husband was out grocery shopping. And then she said, out of nowhere, a complete stranger opened her front door and just walked right into her house. And the footage that you may have seen was her fighting this guy off in the driveway,

• 26:05Speaker 02

  and then the husband pulling up. But it has gotten so many people talking, so let me elaborate a little bit on the incident itself. According to Bella, the man asked if he could use her bathroom, but before he could even finish asking, he charged her and he grabbed her by the neck. She said that he wrestled her to the ground, kicked her one-year-old, and demanded that she take her clothes off. Now, somehow Bella managed to get back to the front door, which was still open, by the way, and she started screaming for help as loudly as she could. Thankfully, one of her neighbors heard and they called the police, but it didn't stop there, because Bella continued fighting this man all the way out through the front door onto the driveway. And what's crazy about this is you see them fighting in the middle of the driveway in

• 26:50Speaker 02

  broad daylight, and that's when he allegedly told her that he was on drugs and that her, quote, boyfriend had sent him there. He claimed that he had met who he thought was her boyfriend on Reddit, and that the boyfriend told him that Bella would actually be in to what he was doing, which, here's the clip of that, and for anybody who's listening to the audio only, you probably do want to hop over to YouTube after this and watch the actual video, but I'm going to play that clip for you now.

• 27:17Speaker 07

  What the is wrong with you? I'm on drugs. What the is wrong with you? My boyfriend sent me. Yeah, right. Tell me who's in this. Right, right. And what's his name?

• 27:35Speaker 07

  And what's his name? I don't know. He's in my picture.

• 27:40Speaker 07

  What's his name?

• 27:42Speaker 07

  I'm already.

• 27:43Speaker 02

  Now, as she was fighting this guy off in her driveway, Bella's husband pulls up in his truck, saw what was happening, immediately gets out of his car and then starts chasing the guy down the street. However, the man managed to get into a car that was parked down the block and then drove away. Bella ended up sharing what happened on social media and according to court records, one of the suspect's own relatives then contacted the police. So investigators were able to identify the man as 20-year-old Adrian Iola. He was arrested within 24 hours. However, here's where this story takes an entirely different turn because Adrian's attorney is now claiming that this entire thing was just a giant misunderstanding. According to

• 28:25Speaker 02

  him, Adrian went to Bella's house because her husband had allegedly posted something on Reddit about her being interested in a sexual role-playing scenario, which this is not uncommon. Okay, it's something that really does exist where women have this sexual fantasy of being assaulted in their home and trying to fight somebody off and being subdued. And it's basically they'll say, here's the safe word, or they will say, no matter how much I resist, or say, stop, don't stop unless I say the safe word. And it is something that exists. However, conversely, it is also something that exists as a way of targeting

• 29:06Speaker 02

  your partner, your enemy, your spouse, whatever it is, because what case was it? Was it, I want to say the Michelle Hadley case, but I could be wrong. Was it that?

• 29:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:15Speaker 02

  Where people, spouses, or just ex-friends, enemies are posting these fake solicitation ads for this, saying, this is my wife, like people are alleging here, or this is me, come attack me. And it's obviously not that person at all. So when that person, when the perpetrator goes and attacks them, even though the person being attacked is yelling, stop, fighting, and screaming, they think it's all part of the role play. And obviously, the victim doesn't know the safe word because they are not the one who posted about wanting this. It is so dangerous, so scary, and like a huge freaking nightmare. So now his attorney is saying, oh no, her husband actually posted this, and that's why Adrian went along with it. His

• 30:00Speaker 02

  attorney said, quote, "He understood from the victim's boyfriend that this is something that they did and that the victim was consenting to it." However, the judge said, "I don't care if her husband said that he could go in there and do that. That is not a defense. That is problematic." So he ruled that there was probable cause for multiple felony charges, including suspicion of sexual assault and aggravated assault. And obviously, there are still some pretty major questions here. And it is kind of a he said, she said situation, as of right now, at least, because Bella says that Adrian was a complete stranger to both her and her husband. But because Adrian claimed that her husband sent him, the investigators ended up actually seizing the husband's cellphone, probably, of course, to see if there were

• 30:41Speaker 02

  any real Reddit posts, any sort of exchange of information, comment threads, or anything that would corroborate Adrian's story. Police are also pursuing search warrants for Adrian's vehicle, home, DNA, and other evidence as they're trying to piece together exactly what happened and whether there's any truth to what he's claiming. As of now, Adrian has been released on a $25,000 bond, and Bella says that she is taking steps to keep her family safe. However, I'm very interested to see where this investigation goes because there is a huge difference in these two version of events. And regardless of what anyone may or may not have posted online, Bella herself says that she never consented to

• 31:22Speaker 02

  anything. So I'm going to keep following this closely. Obviously, the proof is going to come out in the digital evidence, one way or another, whether the husband helped or not. But I will say this, too. When I went to the comments section of a few different reposts of this CCTV footage, a lot of people said it looked like when the husband pulled up, he was pulling up really slowly, not super urgently, that even when he chased Adrian down the street, he was kind of going at a slow pace. Now, I don't know that that indicates guilt one way or another. I think maybe he was pulling up to like, who's she talking to? Like, in my situation, be like, is she fighting with the DoorDash delivery guy? Or like, maybe he was trying to just reconcile what was going on. But people, at this point,

• 32:07Speaker 02

  believe maybe the husband was involved in something here. However, first of all, any husband that would do that, period, is a sick-ass monster, especially when your one-year-old child is in the home. But again, we don't know that he, this could all be a lie made up from Adrian as a cover story. So I'm going to dig into this deeper. There will be an update soon, but like.

• 32:26Speaker 04

  I was gonna say, I'm very curious.

• 32:28Speaker 02

  I know.

• 32:30Speaker 04

  Not, I know I'm getting into the weeds here, but like, what time of day was it that the husband was coming home? Like, did he always come home all the time? Because that feels very coincidental that in the short minute or two that this is all going down, you're pulling, I mean, thank God.

• 32:46Speaker 02

  Well, and did Adrian, if he was parked a block away, or down the block, I should say, did he have the address? Was it a random home? Why did he park far away and walk down multiple houses unless he was checking other houses to see if it was unlocked? And maybe footage will come out proving that.

• 33:02Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're right.

• 33:03Speaker 02

  I think at the time of this recording, there's not a lot of information. Maybe there will be at the time this episode releases. As of right now, though, there's not. But I definitely will keep you updated.

• 33:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, I'm interested to hear more about that.

• 33:13Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 33:14Speaker 04

  All right, we have a quick update before we get into our next story. Last week, we talked about David Privat and how he was on trial for the murder of his niece back in 2017. Well, that trial has officially ended in a mistrial due to jury misconduct. About two days into deliberations, it came out that at least seven jurors were discussing things about the case and about David that weren't presented at trial, including claims about his criminal history and whether or not he was racist. The judge determined that all seven of those jurors needed to be removed, and there were not enough alternatives to replace all of them, which then led to the mistrial decision. So as of now, that's the end of this case, and there will obviously be more in the future when they reschedule. But.

• 33:57Speaker 02

  I know. I kind of think maybe we do need to do a deep dive into this because it's been wild, this whole thing.

• 34:02Speaker 04

  Well, I was gonna say, this has gone on for so long.

• 34:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 34:05Speaker 04

  And then now this.

• 34:05Speaker 02

  I know.

• 34:06Speaker 04

  And seven jurors, I feel like, were the rules not clear? Because that's a lot of people to be breaking the rules in such a serious case.

• 34:14Speaker 02

  Will they retry it now, especially because that one charge had ended up being dropped?

• 34:18Speaker 04

  Oh, that's a good point.

• 34:19Speaker 02

  Remember, like, what's gonna happen?

• 34:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 34:21Speaker 02

  I don't know.

• 34:22Speaker 04

  Well, I hope that that little girl gets justice regardless.

• 34:27Speaker 02

  Yeah.

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• 35:59Speaker 04

  Well, just when we thought we were done with these cases, which we were hoping we were. Unfortunately, we were not because we have another family annihilator case that happened in Pennsylvania just a couple of weeks ago, and this time eight people were killed. So on Friday, October 9th, police in Erie, Pennsylvania responded to a home on Perry Street just before 5:00 PM after witnesses reported seeing a man firing a gun then going inside a house. When officers arrived, they found two women dead in the street. There was no gunfire, no screaming, no movement coming from inside. The police chief later described it as an eerie silence. SWAT was eventually called in and shortly after 7:00 PM, officers went into the home where they found six more victims, including two children

• 36:44Speaker 04

  along with the suspected gunman who appeared to have also taken his own life. Now, a few days later, on Monday, October 12th, the coroner released the names of six of the eight victims. They were 44-year-old Michelle Stone, her 24-year-old daughter Angelina, who was actually due to give birth any day, Michelle's two sons, 19-year-old Jonathan and 21-year-old Matthew, 37-year-old Laura Roberts, and 51-year-old Twila Tanner. The two youngest victims were a five-year-old boy and a one-year-old girl, whose names were not officially released. However, at a memorial for the family, a man named Julius identified the little girl as his daughter, Amariana, and said that Angelina was the mother of both children. So sad.

• 37:29Speaker 04

  And the man accused of killing all eight of them was identified as Matthew Stone, Sr., Michelle's husband, and the father of Angelina, Jonathan, and Matthew, and the grandfather of the two little ones. And when I read that, my heart just broke because, I mean, obviously killing your wife is horrible, your children, but when I read grandchildren, that just like hits differently because I just feel like grandparents and grandchildren, it's such a sacred, innocent relationship.

• 37:57Speaker 02

  They say that grandparents love their grandkids more than they even love their own children. Moms even actually said that to me at one point, like, no offense that she loves Theo and Emmy more than she loves me. And like, there is, to your point, it's sacred, it's just a different kind of love.

• 38:11Speaker 04

  I mean, they're like the exception to all the rules, as I know. It's so special. So that was just heartbreaking to learn. Now, as investigators started digging into the family's history, they learned that Matthew had allegedly been extremely controlling for years. According to relatives, he controlled the family's finances, controlled when they could and couldn't leave the house, and had a history of domestic violence. In fact, back in 2019, Matthew was charged in a domestic violence incident involving Michelle, but those charges were ultimately dropped after she had changed her statement. And get this, police said that the gun involved in that incident was also the exact same handgun that he used to kill his entire family now, seven years later.

• 38:50Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 38:51Speaker 04

  I know. Relatives also raised concerns about Matthew's mental health and possible drug use, although investigators were not able to confirm a diagnosis or determine whether drugs had played a role in all of this. But when detectives searched the home, they described it as extremely filthy, with plumbing that didn't appear to work and bottles filled with urine throughout the house. And then investigators learned that Angelina, who again was nine months pregnant, had actually reportedly been planning to move out after giving birth. She had sent text messages saying that her father was kicking her and her brothers out, and that he had been physically abusive towards her brothers. And when detectives searched her bedroom, they found that almost all of her things had already been packed into bags and boxes. So now, given all of that, with all of that in mind, let's talk about what

• 39:36Speaker 04

  the investigators were able to piece together about this actual shooting itself. So at approximately 4:39 PM, Angelina called her aunt Laura Roberts through Facebook Messenger. They talked for about two minutes, and when they hung up, Laura said that she was on her way. And within 10 minutes, Laura and Twila Tanner arrived at the house. Investigators later found audio and video evidence that showed the moments leading up to everything. And they said that in that footage, they could hear muffled gunshots coming from inside the house shortly before the two women got there and started pounding on the front door. Matthew Sr. then allegedly came outside and shot both women as they ran toward him before going back inside. Just three minutes after the women arrived, the city's ShotSpotter

• 40:18Speaker 04

  system detected the gunfire. And by the time the officers had responded, police believed that everyone was already dead inside. Now, even with everything that the investigators uncovered, they still don't know exactly what happened inside that house between Angelina's phone call and the shooting, or what possibly had caused Matthew to kill his whole family. Was it mental illness? Was it drugs? Was there some sort of family conflict? Was this planned out? And while Angelina had been making plans to leave, police haven't yet established that that is, is the reason or could have been the reason that had anything to do with what happened. But the fact that she was getting ready to welcome yet another

• 40:58Speaker 04

  child, and had her things packed, was seemingly trying to make a change for herself, it's just so sad that this all happened right then.

• 41:07Speaker 02

  I'm sure more information would come out, but my mind automatically goes to if her bags were packed and she was leaving, there was some sort of altercation. She called her aunt, they rushed over, and she brought backup with her, like another family member with her, but that they were already walking into some sort of confrontation.

• 41:24Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:25Speaker 02

  Yeah. So maybe, maybe he wanted the brothers out, but he didn't want her to leave. I don't know. And yeah, maybe mental illness was at play because that is so many people to kill and choose to kill. I don't know. It is horrible.

• 41:37Speaker 04

  And was your grandchildren, again, like, was it like, was that part of the plan? Or were they just unfortunately there at the wrong time?

• 41:43Speaker 02

  Right.

• 41:43Speaker 04

  But obviously devastating. Something that I had never heard of was the ShotSpotter system, which, I mean, it sounds like it's not in all areas, but that seems helpful for law enforcement. I mean, I had no idea what that even was. I had to look it up.

• 41:59Speaker 02

  I wonder how many false reads they ever get from like fireworks or firecrackers, or if there's like a certain radius you can't be within like a theme park or something like that, because it would set it off. I don't know. I don't know enough about it.

• 42:10Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't either.

• 42:11Speaker 02

  I feel like we should reach out to Derek about this case because I know he and Steph, I think it was him and Stephanie, yeah, they just did a deep dive on crime weekly into it. And I'm sure, I would be curious to hear his perspective.

• 42:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:24Speaker 02

  Okay, well, this next case is also coming out of Pennsylvania. It's one all of you have been tagging me in and DMing me about, and it's a family who had been staying at a Great Wolf Lodge Resort in the Poconos for several weeks. But on Monday, October 12th, police were called to one of the rooms after a woman had called 911 saying that she was trying to take her own life. That woman was 27-year-old Metallica Rose Harrison. And on that 911 call, she told the dispatcher that she was, quote, "too weak to stab her own neck," saying she needed police help. She reportedly said that she had knives, but that they weren't working, and that she needed someone to help her die. But when the dispatcher asked Metallica if she was alone, she then said something that changed the situation

• 43:07Speaker 02

  completely. She allegedly said, quote, "My husband and son are already gone in the bed. They're already gone. I'm sorry." And at no point during that call did she ask for help for either of them, not for her husband or her son, only to help aid in her taking her own life. When officers arrived, they found Metallica's husband, Charles, and their three-year-old son dead on the mattresses inside the room. Charles had suffered multiple stab wounds to his chest while her son was stabbed once in the chest. Metallica had cuts on her left wrist and superficial puncture wounds around her neck, and she allegedly told officers that she, quote, "wanted to be with her husband and son." She was immediately

• 43:49Speaker 02

  taken to a nearby hospital for treatment. And according to the criminal complaint, she made some pretty disturbing statements during the ambulance ride to the hospital. She reportedly told the paramedics that she had taken medication to thin her blood, and she was frustrated that her blood was clotting when it wasn't supposed to, which, if your blood is thin, it's easier to bleed out. It's not going to, you know, obviously, like I just said, clot itself and protect itself. And she also allegedly said, "Every day I worked so hard to be the best person, the best mother, the best wife. It wasn't supposed to end like this. I was supposed to have my happy family. That's what I envisioned since I was a child." However, when a detective later tried to question her at the hospital, she wasn't

• 44:31Speaker 02

  interested in talking at all. After being read her Miranda rights, Metallica allegedly told the detective that she was, quote, "suicidal, not stupid," and refused to answer any questions, being like, "Yeah, I may want to take my own life, but I'm not stupid. Obviously, I'm not going to cooperate. I'm not going to answer any of your questions." Metallica was ultimately charged with two counts of criminal homicide, and she was denied bail. Now, as investigators started looking into what happened inside that hotel room, they recovered two knives from the bathroom, including a large butcher knife and a smaller knife, both with teal handles. Employees at Great Wolf Lodge confirmed that neither of the knives belonged to the resort, meaning she must have brought these from like a block set at home or something like that, or stole, had stolen them from somewhere else along

• 45:16Speaker 02

  the way. And something else that the investigators had learned was that the family hadn't just been at Great Wolf Lodge for a weekend getaway, they had actually checked in back on September 21st. They had been staying there for almost three weeks, and they were extending their stay all along the way. In fact, they weren't even supposed to check out until October 13th, which was the day after Charles and their son were found dead. And they were reportedly paying around $300 per night for this room. So they were spending quite a bit of money for an extended period of time. And obviously, the police wanted to know what was going on that led this family to spend nearly three weeks spending that kind of money to basically

• 45:57Speaker 02

  now be living at this resort. So they started looking into the family's finances. And on Wednesday, October 14th, investigators searched their home, where they recovered four journals, a laptop, financial records, and 10 more teal knives similar to the ones that were found at Great Wolf Lodge. So again, assuming it comes in like a block set of 12, the, you know, the wooden block you have on your kitchen counter, and she took those with her all the way back in September, which means clearly there was a plan in motion from the start. They also started talking with relatives, and some of the things that the relatives had to say about Metallica were pretty concerning. Charles's mother and sister reportedly described Metallica as, quote, "dominant and controlling," claiming that she had isolated Charles and

• 46:42Speaker 02

  their son from his family over the years that they were together. But Charles's mother also told investigators that Metallica never wanted to get pregnant, and that she actually resented their three-year-old son because she felt like he had taken away the time that she got to spend alone with her husband, as though she was jealous of their son, that he was like impeding on their relationship. Metallica's stepmom later told investigators that Metallica had recently cashed out her 401K as well, supposedly because they were planning to remodel their kitchen. But obviously, that's something people have a lot of questions about. You're cashing out your 401K, you're grabbing the kitchen knives, you're going on this three-week vacation at the Great Wolf Lodge to...

• 47:26Speaker 02

  Plot to kill your husband and son. I mean, what's going on here? And I do want to take a second to talk about Charles and all of this because his friends and loved ones have shared some very sweet things about him. They described him as an amazing dad who was always willing to help someone out, no matter what, saying that he was just one of those genuinely kind people who loved making other people smile. And it's absolutely heartbreaking that both he and his little boys lost their lives in such a horrible way. And I think about the little boy who was probably so excited to be at Great Wolf Lodge, going on water slides, having this long vacation with his mom and dad, having so much fun, only to then be attacked by the person he should have been able to trust the most.

• 48:07Speaker 02

  As of right now, Metallica remains behind bars awaiting her preliminary hearing. I will keep you updated as we learn more about this case. I also have started digging into it personally, just a little bit over the last few days. There is some other information under the surface. I still need to verify it though. So I know I always say it. I would expect a deep dive.

• 48:30Speaker 04

  I mean, the one, the one thing I was thinking before you had shared the comments from the family was, again, like, I wish I could get in the minds of these people that think this is the only way out. Like, just leave your family. Maybe you'll be looked at as a horrible person, but like, move on and start a new life. But then, okay, if there's a jealousy element, then that wouldn't have been a solution for her. But I also am just thinking, if Jer said to you, let's go stay at the Disney Resort for three weeks.

• 49:00Speaker 02

  That'd be a red flag.

• 49:01Speaker 04

  Number one, that would be like, what the hell? That is such a wild thing to do. But then also, if depending on your financial situation, I would imagine you'd be like, that's a very extravagant, I mean, three weeks anywhere is extravagant, let alone at this resort where I'm sure everything's expensive.

• 49:18Speaker 02

  Well, let's total that up.

• 49:19Speaker 04

  What was that conversation, like, like between them that he felt like that would, you know, was she like, let's just live life? And which is sad to even say that, but you know, and like, let's live it up and go on this big trip and take our son and spoil him. I mean, I just, that feels like strange. Three, again, three weeks anywhere is a long time.

• 49:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, doing the math.

• 49:41Speaker 04

  There's a big plan, so she had it out.

• 49:42Speaker 02

  Doing the math, not even including food or anything like that, $6,300 in just hotel stay.

• 49:48Speaker 04

  That's, I mean.

• 49:49Speaker 02

  That's a lot of money.

• 49:50Speaker 04

  I don't, I actually don't know if I've ever taken a three-week vacation and stayed at a resort somewhere.

• 49:56Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 49:57Speaker 04

  Or even like went to multiple resorts for three weeks.

• 50:00Speaker 02

  I know.

• 50:00Speaker 04

  That's so expensive.

• 50:01Speaker 02

  It is very expensive. I know. So like I said, probably going to do a deep dive into this case. Um, so obviously a lot to take in this week. It was, you know, a lot of tough cases. They always are. So let us know if there is a particular one you want us to research more and do a deep dive into, and we certainly will. And as a reminder, you can get your fall merch. Right now, we're going to be closing the merch shop pretty soon, but you can grab it now. AnnieElise.com, we have hoodies, sweatshirts, t-shirts, tumbler, all sorts of stuff. And as a reminder too, buying the merch is very similar to participating in like, listening to the ads, listening to the podcast. By having these sponsors, by selling this merch, it allows us to donate to really great causes.

• 50:46Speaker 02

  And I don't think I even told you this yet. Yesterday, I totaled up what we've been, what we have donated so far this year, $111,000.

• 50:55Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 50:55Speaker 02

  I know, too. Child Rescue Coalition, which you guys know is a huge part of our life. They help protect children. They help protect children from predators, the local children's hospital, private GoFundMes and rewards that have been set up through families. So many different causes and.

• 51:11Speaker 04

  That's amazing.

• 51:11Speaker 02

  I know. And we wouldn't be able to do any of that without you guys listening to these episodes, watching, bearing through the ads. I know sometimes they're tough. Buying the merch, all of that allows us to contribute to such meaningful causes. So we don't share a lot about what we donate. I don't know. For me personally, it's always kind of like, I don't know, I don't like to talk about it. It's more of a private thing, but we couldn't do that without your support. So it's because of you and like, you know, you should feel equally proud that together we were able to do this. So.

• 51:39Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 51:39Speaker 02

  Thank you, guys. Um.

• 51:41Speaker 04

  May I make a little announcement as well?

• 51:43Speaker 02

  Ooh.

• 51:44Speaker 04

  Oh, no.

• 51:44Speaker 02

  Ooh, what?

• 51:45Speaker 04

  We, we've been getting a lot of messages for great, like, case recommendations and people have been reaching out and sharing their stories. And so I just wanted to let everyone know the best place to do that is the website.

• 51:56Speaker 02

  Yep.

• 51:56Speaker 04

  And we have a new form up now. So if you are personally wel- um, willing to share your story too, there's a place for you to, um, submit that. But we definitely want to hear from anyone that has any type of recommendation or something that, um, has weighed heavily on their heart. But that's the place to do it and the best place to have our team review it.

• 52:16Speaker 02

  Awesome. Thank you. Yes. Good, good call. Good call. I thought you were going to make an announcement like, slide into my DMs. I'm looking for a holiday date, which, that too, that too. Um, all right, guys. So thank you for tuning in. And until the next one, be nice. Don't kill people.

• 52:34Speaker 04

  Don't go on long vacations or see that as a red flag and question it.

• 52:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know. Just do the right thing. There. Look at that. So easy. Do the right thing. All right. Bye.

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