Why You Shouldn't Have A "Plan B" & The Ultimate Goal Setting Method w/Payal Kadakia EP 1224

https://lewishowes.com/abundance2022 - Join My FREE 5 DAY ABUNDANCE CHALLENGE Starting On 2/14/22Today’s guest is Payal Kadakia. She’s the Founder of ClassPass, the leading fitness and wellness membership. She’s also the Founder and Artistic Director of The Sa Dance Company, founded in 2009 with the mission to increase awareness of Indian Dance in the mainstream and serve as a platform for expressing the Indian-American identity through movement. She’s written a new book called LifePass: Drop Your Limits, Rise to Your Potential - A Groundbreaking Approach to Goal Setting. In this episode we discuss what gets in the way of people chasing big dreams, why you shouldn’t have a “Plan B” in life, the conversations everyone should have about money, the ultimate method for setting goals and so much more! For more go to: www.lewishowes.com/1224Get Payal's new book: https://www.lifepassbook.com/Mel Robbins: The “Secret” Mindset Habit to Building Confidence and Overcoming Scarcity: https://link.chtbl.com/970-podDr. Joe Dispenza on Healing the Body and Transforming the Mind: https://link.chtbl.com/826-podMaster Your Mind and Defy the Odds with David Goggins: https://link.chtbl.com/715-pod Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  When you're living your plan B, success is someone else's success. You're living inherently based on someone else's expectation of you. And therefore, you don't know what the end is.

• 0:10Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:33Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to this special episode, and thank you so much for being here today. And if this is your first time listening, I hope today's episode inspires you and helps you on your path to greatness. And I'd love to hear from you and know what your key takeaways are over on social media. Just message me at Lewis Howes over there. And if you're a regular listener of the show, then welcome back. I'm so grateful and inspired by your commitment to live greater, love deeper, and leave a legacy. Make sure to reference our show notes in the description for today's guest information and any mentioned links. And if you enjoy the show, make sure to tell a friend and leave a review over on Apple Podcast. This really helps the show reach more people and impact more lives as a result together. Okay, now it's time to dive into today's episode.

• 1:22Lewis Howes?

  Welcome back, everyone, to School of Greatness. Very excited for our guest, Pyle in the house. Good to see you.

• 1:28Speaker 00

  Thanks for having me, Lewis.

• 1:29Lewis Howes?

  So pumped about this. We got to connect through our good friend, Jay Shetty, recently. And obviously, I've seen your story for many years, the ascension of what you've created in the world. And I was talking with my boxing trainer this morning, telling him that I'm interviewing you today, and he goes, "Gosh, ClassPass was such a great idea." He's like, when you think about it, you're like, "Gosh, why did I create that?" You know, it's like, it's such a great idea and the impact you've made by building something for a decade that just recently sold, which is an amazing accomplishment. We were talking beforehand that, that most people have dreams, but they don't go for them, something you were saying. You have been going for your dreams your entire life, but why do you think most people have them and never go for their dreams?

• 2:13Lewis Howes?

  Why do you feel like a limited few actually do?

• 2:16Speaker 00

  I think it comes down to being inspired by different stories. I think you have to see it to believe it, right? That's one.

• 2:25Speaker 00

  You really need someone to follow and be inspired by. I know this sounds strange, but when I was younger, I didn't see anyone who really looked like me or who I think was this hybrid of different cultures and then also even different personalities. Like I knew I was analytical, but I was also very creative. And so like I would be one of those people who would be doing math homework, but I'd be watching like Beyonce and Britney documentaries because I loved that entertainment side and that creative side as well. So I think that's like a big chunk of it. And then at the end of the day, society has conditioned us a little bit to have fear of doing things differently. And we need to learn to listen to ourselves, to be very, very confident in our identities, right?

• 3:07Speaker 00

  Not care about what other people think of us, to not be scared of failure, to really push through those things. And a lot of it requires you to just start. And you can start in the smallest way, whether it's, you know, we were talking about it. Sports, you know, for me, it was dance. It taught me the tools of life. And I think we forget that sometimes it's the smallest things that we do that teach us those lessons for these great things that we do. Classless would not exist if I didn't learn how to dance in a small basement when I was five.

• 3:34Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 3:35Speaker 00

  Yeah, because so many of the lessons of how do you have discipline? How do you show up on time? How do you be prepared for something? How do you work through something when you can't do the step? Those are the same mentalities that you need when you're an entrepreneur who wants to go and build something big.

• 3:51Lewis Howes?

  What's more important in your mind? Is it the belief in yourself? Is it being clear in your identity? Or is it learning how to master goal setting?

• 4:00Speaker 00

  Great question. Those are all very different things and all important. But I think ultimately it's the belief. It's the belief in yourself, but I'm going to like change that a little to the why too. I think it's the belief in what you're doing ultimately. It is the passion. In your reason for partaking in anything that you do, that's going to push you through all those challenges, right? It's the energy that gets people to join you in the battle. It's the energy that gets you to keep going when you lose part of the battle. And that, to me, is the crux of it, is caring enough about what that impact is. And it's not just about you, right? If it's just about you, it doesn't resonate, you'll quit.

• 4:43Speaker 00

  And if it's something about, you know, just about being famous or having money, that's not worthy enough, and your soul will feel that. And you'll know that it's not worth to keep fighting. So to keep fighting, you just need that deep, deep why.

• 4:56Lewis Howes?

  So it's a belief in what you're creating, why you're doing it? Not just a belief that I want this for myself, but there's a deeper meaning behind it?

• 5:04Speaker 00

  100%.

• 5:05Lewis Howes?

  And so that's the first, is that one of the first things, is having that belief in what I'm doing first?

• 5:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, I think you need to have a calling, right? And I, you know, in my book, I talk about that as the first chapter, because to me, if you don't know what you're driving towards, you can't even get into what's holding you back. You don't know where you're going, right? And so if you know where you want to go, your true north, yeah, there's going to be a lot of things in the way, but you will fight your way through them.

• 5:33Lewis Howes?

  I think you, I think I read that you started ClassPass around 27, is that right, or 20?

• 5:39Speaker 00

  When I was 20, I think I was, yeah, 27 years old.

• 5:41Lewis Howes?

  27, okay, so from, let's say, call it 18 to 27, did you know what your calling was?

• 5:48Speaker 00

  So for me, it was all, always about dance. Like, my life revolved around this artistic expression that I actually found when I was three years old. I know it feels crazy, I know a lot of people don't always find their calling that early, but for some reason, when I was really young, my parents put me in like dance classes, and I'd perform at like family functions. And I know this sounds weird, because everyone's like, yeah, like, that was like a little thing that you did on the side. But I think when I would perform and I would realize that I was impacting other people and their hearts and they could feel what I was feeling, I started to realize what the impact of the sense of service could be, right? The sense of I was

• 6:28Lewis Howes?

  Through dance.

• 6:28Speaker 00

  Through dance. I felt like as a human being, I could impact other people, right? It wasn't, oh, do I want someone to tell me I'm a good dancer or do I do the steps right? It literally was this amazing environment for me to say, I impacted people. I made them feel something. And I think once you know that we have the ability, it's a power, right? As like a human being to feel like I have the ability to touch other people. And I discovered that at such a young age that to me, I always kept striving for that feeling in my life and to whatever I did, like that just trumped everything else.

• 7:04Lewis Howes?

  So it was more like striving for the feeling of connection and inspiration, but you used it through different mechanisms. It was dance for a while, but then it was other things, you know, class pass eventually.

• 7:14Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 7:15Lewis Howes?

  Now, why not, you know, why, if you knew you wanted to do dance, why go to MIT and not go to dance school and pursue dance as the main thing, the main calling?

• 7:25Speaker 00

  So I wish that, you know, I wasn't burdened to society's expectations too, but

• 7:32Lewis Howes?

  So you mean parents

• 7:33Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 7:33Lewis Howes?

  And cultural expectations that you gotta go to the best school and you gotta be this.

• 7:37Speaker 00

  I mean, my parents, you know, immigrated to America in the seventies, okay? Like, let's be honest, they sacrificed their entire life for me and my sister. I also felt a sense of duty to them, right? And, you know, they had literally, I mean, you see it when you're younger, just how hard they were working to like night shifts, like two shifts just to put food on the table. When you're around that, you're not just gonna go and jump off a cliff and be like, bye, you know? And I know they did it all for my education. So I knew I had to do something with that and I don't regret it. I think, you know, I look back and I feel like I had to learn to get off of that at some point. And that's the trick. Like, it wasn't about for me just jumping off without having a plan.

• 8:18Speaker 00

  I think what they did is they set me up to have the tools and the foundation to be able to succeed in my life, even though I didn't maybe see it at the time and I wanted to just go and do my own thing. You know, being at a corporate job or working at a place like Bain gave me an amazing network. It gave me so many great parts of this journey and like the skill set that I would need to succeed, even though I maybe wanted to go and just dance. That all being said, too, is it's interesting, you know, and I think this is still like a topic and something that I'm still trying to figure out is that we, especially as like immigrants, you know, or children of immigrants, we don't know how to necessarily like put our creative side first because we were taught to sort of put the business side and the

• 9:02Speaker 00

  part that's like whether it's the doctor's side or lawyer's side first. And so we don't fully know how to believe in our creative selves and say like, oh, this is okay to do because we've not seen many paths of people that look like us also succeeding in that in that world yet. So hopefully that's changing now, but that's another whole part of it. But yeah, for me, ultimately, it was really my parents and their and their, you know, guidance that I was listening to. But also, I think the most important thing is I spent my time wisely, so I never had to give up dancing, right? And I do believe.

• 9:35Lewis Howes?

  Kept doing it on the side.

• 9:36Speaker 00

  Kept doing it on the side, like even at MIT. I was that person who, second I would finish like my homework, I was dancing, I was like helping to put on a show. My life revolved around dance shows, dance performance, dance rehearsals. If I wasn't doing my homework, I was dancing. And everyone knew that. There was only like two things that were important in my life. And I think I was, I've always really been clear about that. And I think that's okay to be very, very clear on your priorities. So you go after that. And I didn't let anything else bother me. And I didn't, I missed family things, I missed friends' birthdays, but I was very clear on what my priorities were. And I knew I had to fight to dance my whole life. And ultimately, and you know, I think people don't always realize this, ClassPass came out of that because I wanted to take that fight for everyone else.

• 10:21Speaker 00

  Because people were fighting to have fitness in their life, right? Movement in their life. And I knew I had to solve that problem because I saw what my fight looked like and I wanted to make it easier for other people.

• 10:31Lewis Howes?

  Interesting, interesting. So for those, I guess, after MIT until you launched, what, five years then? Something like that?

• 10:39Speaker 00

  Six years, yeah, after MIT. I had two jobs in between that I worked at for three years each, yeah.

• 10:45Lewis Howes?

  And did you feel like those five, six years was your calling? You were doing your calling?

• 10:50Speaker 00

  No, not at all. I mean, I was split in two. I was faking who I was, right? Yeah, I mean, I was showing up to work, wearing like, I don't even know, like, business suits and all of that, acting like I loved what I did, but because, once again, I was supposed to do that and I got this great job, like, how could I not appreciate it, right? That's, that's sort of how you feel. But I would leave every night and go to dance rehearsal. And, you know, I think one of my favorite stories is I got my first bad review. Like, first time in my life, in my third year at Bain. And, and I think that, obviously, that's like...

• 11:27Lewis Howes?

  It's like a B+. Yeah, as opposed to an A+. I got a B+. That's like, my dream to get a B+.

• 11:35Speaker 00

  Indian Americans were like, 99, why isn't it 100? That's sort of the mentality we were raised in. But, you know, I had skipped a big client meeting to go do a dance performance. And, you know, I always think back to that. Like, I was trying to make both things work, and they were so different. It's not like anyone I was at work with was doing anything similar to what I was doing on the side. And so I had this huge performance and I, you know, I thought my boss was okay with me skipping it. I wasn't like a big part of it. And then it comes up in this review and she was like, are you serious about being here? And I was, and actually, my first reaction, and this is what I always go back to, was I'm going to prove to her I belong here and how great I am.

• 12:17Lewis Howes?

  And you probably work in 50, 60-hour weeks, at least. Yeah, you're probably like showing up first and leaving late anyways.

• 12:23Speaker 00

  Yeah, absolutely. And so it's like to feel like you didn't do enough.

• 12:26Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 12:27Speaker 00

  And so that's my first reaction, right? And so I spend like a little bit of time thinking there, like, how I'm going to prove that I'm amazing and I deserve to be like number one, 99%, again, or 100%. And then I realized, I don't even really want to be doing it. Like, she was actually right.

• 12:44Lewis Howes?

  Do you really want to be here? Yeah.

• 12:45Speaker 00

  I don't want to be there. You know, and so back to your question, I really, when I was going through those journeys, I mean, I didn't know, you know, I was doing what was right. Trying to live my passion through a side hustle, right, which I feel like most people know about. And I, but I was two people and it's kind of really hard when you're living your life, once again, just not feeling like you fit in either. And so then I made this first big leap in my life that I think was like the first decision where I was off track was to go to corporate America and work at, in the music industry, which was a great job, like it by no means is that a bad job. Most of my friends were just going off to like HBS or, you know, and doing something really crazy with their lives or staying on to be consultants.

• 13:30Speaker 00

  So I felt like I was taking a step back from that, finally, like from that professional career everyone was trying to tell me to do. And I went and built my dance company. That was actually my first startup is I started a dance company on the side. And I got off of work every day at five, six o'clock. I knew I would, which was something I never had before. And I got to go to dance practice, dance classes, rehearsals, and I knew I would make it. And I think that freedom of having just that time that was predictable for me from a thing I loved became really important.

• 14:04Lewis Howes?

  You're such an underachiever.

• 14:07Lewis Howes?

  You talk about plan A and plan B in the book. Do you feel like you were living in plan B then for those years?

• 14:13Speaker 00

  Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, I was trying to explore a plan A, you know, but I didn't really, I think I was always compromising.

• 14:22Lewis Howes?

  What happens when we choose a plan B or C versus going for what we feel like is our calling or what we feel like keeps speaking to us inside, which we think is plan A, maybe it's not, but we think it is. What happens to us spiritually, emotionally, physically, when we're living plan B?

• 14:39Speaker 00

  I mean, you're not living what you were meant to do and put on this earth for, right? At the end of the day, like whatever your dharma is, right, your calling is, is you were meant to be doing something. And honestly, like, once I started going for it, and I think this happens to other people as well, the world and your, will guide you through it. The universe helps you when you're there. And when you keep pushing it away. It's actually harder to feel any of the signs and back to like a feeling of stuck or whatever anyone might be feeling when you are in motion in place of going to where you're supposed to, like the world will lift you up, right? Like the signs of even like when people are like, how did you build ClassPass? And you know, we can talk more about it. Part of it was sometimes I felt like the universe was just opening the right doors for me.

• 15:23Speaker 00

  You know, I had to walk through and do the work, but I also felt that the things that were meant to happen, happened because I knew I was meant to build this company.

• 15:31Lewis Howes?

  You were on the right path.

• 15:32Speaker 00

  Totally. And I was doing what was like set my soul on fire, you know, at that time. And I think, you know, while I was still dancing on the side, all of that, I knew I had to fight this battle for the world, you know? And that was, you know, what my gift of ClassPass really was in doing that.

• 15:48Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I think the world, the universe really rewards you when you start taking those actions and maybe it gives you some kind of beginner's luck or but it should show you signs that, hey, we're going to reward you at least a little bit to know that you're on the right path. Sometimes it takes it away and it makes you go through the challenges to see if like, do you really want this that badly? What are you willing to do to overcome the challenge? But I think you, you should start to see that early on. Now, did you feel like, what is, where does identity play in then when you're living in Plan B? Are you truly living in your identity or and how does that affect your identity?

• 16:23Speaker 00

  You know, our identities are shaped from such a young age, right? And whoever we're around, the communities we build, all of that. And I think, first of all, I think for me, like I go back to the youngest phase of my life where I faced a lot of adversity for being Indian and it's scarring, right? Like it was one of those things for me where I never wanted my American friends to see my Indian side and in front of my Indian friends, you know, I was, I was completely, you know, Indian, right? So it was like, it was totally two different people.

• 16:57Lewis Howes?

  Split personality.

• 16:58Speaker 00

  Totally, absolutely. And I think that also happens with your Plan B, back to that, right? It's you just start going through your life. Because you don't know what success looks like anymore, right? When you're living your plan B, success is someone else's success. You're living inherently based on someone else's expectation of you. And therefore, you don't know what the end is. When you're living your own life, you know where you're going. And every part of the journey feels a little bit more like you're achieving something. And success is the journey. It's not about actually getting to an endpoint. And I think that's the difference. When people are always like, "How are you so happy?" And "How are you like keep going?" I'm like, "Because every day, I feel fulfilled." Because I am moving closer to something I wanted to do. If I was in like a day job that I did not like,

• 17:43Speaker 00

  I'd want to what? Only want a promotion, right? Or only want a salary raise? Because there was no other way to sort of reward me for how I was feeling.

• 17:51Lewis Howes?

  From the daily work of meaningful work, of being in the right place. That's why I tell my team a lot, I'm like, "Listen, guys, this is the mission we're on." "We're here to serve lives. We're here to help people improve the quality of their life through this content." If that's something you're excited about, awesome. We want to support you in your growth. If it's not something you're excited about, you shouldn't be here.

• 18:08Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 18:09Lewis Howes?

  Why are you struggling? Why are you doing something you don't fully feel aligned to?

• 18:12Speaker 00

  Absolutely. There's other jobs out there.

• 18:14Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and maybe you don't like 100% of what you're doing.

• 18:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 18:17Lewis Howes?

  But you should be in alignment towards the mission.

• 18:20Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 18:20Lewis Howes?

  And otherwise, go find something that you are more in alignment with, with your skills and your gifts.

• 18:26Speaker 00

  And you'll learn more from that and take it with you, right? At the end of the day, like even for me, like, working in the music industry felt a little bit off to me. But, you know, like, I got to meet like Daniel Ek at Spotify, like when Spotify was first being created. And me and him hung out and he like, once again, like when I started ClassPass, people were not entrepreneurs, right? Like, we were kind of talking about that early on with podcasts. Like, it's one of those things that no one around me was an entrepreneur. But there I got to meet someone like Daniel, who built an enormous, obviously, company that transformed our lives as well. And I think it brings you the right people when you're even a little bit closer to it. And so... Being in the music industry felt a little bit more creative and it felt a little bit more

• 19:06Lewis Howes?

  Closer to your calling.

• 19:08Speaker 00

  Closer, closer.

• 19:08Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 19:09Speaker 00

  Not fully there.

• 19:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 19:10Speaker 00

  You know, life is about kind of shooting the darts at, you know,

• 19:12Lewis Howes?

  Try things.

• 19:13Speaker 00

  And try things. And sometimes you get closer. I think the thing that people mostly get stuck on is they want to like circle around the same thing, but it's okay to go a completely different direction sometimes.

• 19:23Lewis Howes?

  I think it is. And I think it's okay if you're in, you know, your twenties when you're just trying different things and you're realizing, okay, this isn't what I want, you can eliminate that.

• 19:32Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 19:32Lewis Howes?

  Try it for six months or a year. I did so many little odd jobs when I was younger. I was a truck driver for three months.

• 19:38Speaker 00

  Wow.

• 19:38Lewis Howes?

  I was a bouncer at a nightclub on the weekends. I was doing random stuff.

• 19:41Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 19:42Lewis Howes?

  And I was like, okay, I don't want to be driving a truck for six hours a day.

• 19:45Speaker 00

  I don't want to be doing that.

• 19:45Lewis Howes?

  I don't want to be here around alcohol night because I don't drink alcohol. Like, so it's, but sometimes you just got a season in your life where you got to make money.

• 19:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 19:52Lewis Howes?

  So it's, okay, what can I do?

• 19:53Speaker 00

  100%. You know, actually, and you bring up a great point, like I think we forget the importance of money. Like, it is important.

• 20:00Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 20:01Speaker 00

  It shouldn't guide our decisions, meaning, you know, I really believe in this idea that, you know, you have to make money work for you. You don't work for money.

• 20:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 20:09Speaker 00

  Because...

• 20:10Lewis Howes?

  What does that look like?

• 20:10Speaker 00

  That means that you put a plan together. You know what your budget looks like and you make your life and plan for the future work to that. I, you know, was making great money. I had great jobs, right? But I was so...

• 20:23Lewis Howes?

  Making six-figure salaries probably, yeah.

• 20:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, great. I mean, I had great jobs. I was so frugal and the reason I was, and people didn't realize this. It wasn't just because like, people are like, oh, because you're Gujarati, which is a type of Indian, which is like, tends to be cheap. It wasn't because of that. It was because I knew that in the future I wanted to take a leap. I actually, at that point, had no idea I was going to go and try and be an entrepreneur. I didn't know if it was this idea of dance, but because I was so inspired from when I was younger to like, impact people, I knew there was going to be a point in my life where I was going to do something. And I didn't want money to feel like a constraint. Because I saw the way it constrained my parents, right? I've seen it in so many of my friends. And I'm like, I don't ever want to spend a dollar if it's not giving me something. Like, of course, I needed to sleep, I needed to eat, I needed to get to work.

• 21:09Speaker 00

  Like, that was what I needed to do. But everything else was, I was able to sort of like, I didn't travel, I didn't go shopping. Because I was like, I'm saving this to either put on a dance show or take a big leap in my life. Right. And that's what I did. So make your money work for your dreams. Right. And sometimes it's in the future, right? Like, I did that for six years. And by the time I got to the point when I wanted to start my company, I sat down with my dad, we went through my entire savings. We put down like a budget of what I was spending my money on. And we both realized that I had three years to go after my dreams. And that's amazing, right? A runway. A runway of three years before I would be like at dead zero. Yeah, I mean, my apartment was like $800. Yeah, you're living frugal on that three years. It's fine, though, but I mean, I made it work because, you know,

• 21:53Speaker 00

  the idea of being able to have freedom from money to go after my dreams for three years was incredible, right? And think about people who also, and this happens all the time, you might start a company, but you need to still make money on the side. That mental distraction is also really hard. When you're building a company. You need to go all in. You need to go all in, especially if it's, you know, businesses are different. Like, ClassPass is a bit of a different business than other businesses. But when it was something like ClassPass that I knew could be this transformative, I knew it required 180% of me. And if I was sitting there trying to be like, oh, how am I going to make money on the side to just pay my bills? Those few hours of my day, the stress of it, the, also just feeling like, once again, I'm living a Plan B there. It ends up affecting you, right? Going back to identity.

• 22:37Speaker 00

  When you're in environments that don't make your identity thrive, you end up losing your confidence a little bit. And that is sometimes the worst spiraling effect that happens. And I think I've been always really good about starting myself with either my dance friends or people I really love and I know are going to support me. And I'm very okay with like, getting rid of the people who don't serve me and my future. Right. And I think that's a very hard thing to do. But you have to protect yourself in order to be able to create the impact in the world. It's not about being selfish. It's about actually protecting your mission so you can impact other people and give greatness to the world.

• 23:15Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 23:16Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 23:16Lewis Howes?

  I think a lot of people may seem like that's so extreme to be that frugal for that many years.

• 23:21Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 23:21Lewis Howes?

  To work so hard for five, six years to save all your money, to give yourself a few years of runway. But these are decisions people need to make. Okay, do you want to spend all your money and live kind of month to month?

• 23:31Speaker 00

  Totally.

• 23:32Lewis Howes?

  Or have a couple of months of savings because you're enjoying your life?

• 23:35Speaker 00

  Absolutely. And if you aren't, that's great.

• 23:37Lewis Howes?

  That's great.

• 23:37Speaker 00

  Totally. It's just be conscious about it, right?

• 23:39Lewis Howes?

  Know what you're doing.

• 23:40Speaker 00

  Exactly. Be very, very, make it something you consciously do. So once again, money is not running you, you are running it. Like you said, like that is a great way. I know people who live like that and who are very happy.

• 23:51Lewis Howes?

  Exactly.

• 23:51Speaker 00

  I just knew that it's like for me, as someone who I, once again, I didn't know if I was going to be an entrepreneur or artist or what. I just knew I was gonna have to take a leap and I felt like I was doing a lot of it because of I needed to have enough money, right? Because that was the biggest thing my parents really wanted for me. It wasn't really this idea of six. I had checked every box for them. I went to a grade school, all of that. It was no longer about.

• 24:12Lewis Howes?

  You worked a corporate job.

• 24:12Speaker 00

  Yeah, like it was not about that. It was about having enough money, you know? And I, once again, I didn't know where those three years were going to take me, but I was gonna try. And I always knew I had a good, I did have a plan B after that.

• 24:23Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. Yeah, you can go back and work corporate.

• 24:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly. I had a plan B, but I knew I wasn't going to think about the plan B until three years were up.

• 24:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you were out. In the book, you tell people they need to know their numbers. What does that mean? Are you checking your financial numbers every day, every week, monthly? What does that look like? And why is it important to know your numbers?

• 24:42Speaker 00

  I mean, once again, without knowing your numbers, money will just disappear or you don't, you can't track it, right? And once again, you can't come up with a plan. And so, you know, especially, and I say this to women, I think even more, because sometimes it's harder, I feel like, for them to even sometimes get into the numbers, right? Whether it might be somebody, if they're not the breadwinner in the family, it is so important because money can make you feel like you're trapped if you don't have enough conscious like knowledge about it, right? And so, at the end of the day, you have to know what's coming in, what's going out, how are you growing your money over time? And if you don't know these things, like there are lessons online that you can learn, you know? There's tools like Mint and apps like, you know, Learnvest where you can actually put, you know, your knowledge into this, you know?

• 25:26Speaker 00

  And really figure out how to make your money work for you, right? I think that's such an important part of it. Yeah, I mean, you know, money, like I said, can be very constraining for people and it can also be the dream. But a rich life is not money. And we just talked about that, right? It's really about waking up every day and loving what you do.

• 25:44Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 25:45Speaker 00

  So you want to actually be able to earn that over time.

• 25:47Lewis Howes?

  What would you say were the three best financial investments you made in the last decade?

• 25:52Speaker 00

  Ooh, that's hard. Well, obviously, class fast. My time, honestly, is, I guess it's not a financial investment, but to me, that was, right? Like, to me, foregoing those three years to build my company is a big one.

• 26:04Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 26:04Speaker 00

  Let's see, I just recently invested in Ollipop, which is like a really fun, fun brand that I like. And I invested in one of my friend's, Deepika Muthialla's new, it's called Lip Tinted. And it's a beauty brand about, you know, different skin types and different skin colors to be able to really transform what the makeup industry looks like.

• 26:24Lewis Howes?

  That's cool, that's cool.

• 26:27Lewis Howes?

  What else around money should we be aware of? Since you're someone who has, seems like you were very organized around money since corporate days and then building this company and selling this company. It seems like you've been very disciplined and organized and smart with your investments, hiring people the right way, all that stuff. What else should we know about managing or mastering money for ourselves?

• 26:50Speaker 00

  I think you have to be comfortable talking about it.

• 26:52Lewis Howes?

  Yes, I say this all the time. I think people are so afraid to just talk about money. Why do you think people are so scared of it?

• 26:59Speaker 00

  I think because there's so many expectations on it. Because we think, for some reason, society has made that like a marker of success. So it becomes like this taboo thing to talk about, right? It's funny, right? Like, if you think about followers, we all see that, right? It's just like a different currency, right? So I think there's a little bit of that. I think people, it's complicated, right? At the end of the day, like, it's a little bit complicated. You're like, wait, how do I do the math on this? Like, I don't know. But no, you know, once again, back to your earlier question, you don't need to know it every day. I think it's just a matter of having the knowledge of it and not letting it sort of, you know... Run between your fingertips and get away from you to a point where you're like,

• 27:40Speaker 00

  "How did I end up here?" Right? You want to be in a place where you're planning where it goes. I mean, especially if you're working so hard, it's so important to know where every single one of those dollars goes. And I think that goes to my other point is, after talking about it, and especially I think in relationships, talk about it, because I think like-

• 27:57Lewis Howes?

  Talk about money in relationships.

• 27:58Speaker 00

  Yes, because I think, you know, especially like when you get married or any of that in a family, people also have different like ways that they were raised and that they they value money differently. And I think it goes down to what does money mean to you? Like, my husband loves cars and I'm like, I realize that. I'm like, great, I don't really value that, but you value that. And like, you know, and sometimes he'll be like, "Cars mean the same thing to me as dance means to you." And I'm like, "Okay," like I, it took me a second to like, fully understand that, but I was like, "It's really a passion for you," you know, and I, and I had to understand that, like, that's something he loved, right? Instead of being like, "Wait, why are we spending money on that?"

• 28:31Lewis Howes?

  Why are we spending this much money on a car?

• 28:32Speaker 00

  And for him to be like, "Wait, why are you like, spending money traveling around, dancing, whatever?" It's a really important conversation to have, you know, because you don't, it, it, of course, like when it comes to time and stuff, people are always supportive, but when you come, when it comes down to numbers, you really need to know how it's working, and especially I think, once again, back to the mom thing, like, if you need help, right, and I think that's a very hard thing for women to ask for is help, because they want to do it themselves or they don't want to spend the money. I love like delegating and outsourcing things that I feel like are not fulfilling my time. Especially, of course, you got to be in a position to do so, and I understand that. And there was a time in my life where I definitely was not in a position to do that. And then there's another time in my life where I was like, "Okay, like, how will I be able to really add the magic to the world I want to?

• 29:15Speaker 00

  What do I not want to be doing?" Right? And whether that's asking my mom to do it, right, or a cousin to do it, you have to also learn how to make that work so people can, you know, come and help you. And I think it's a very hard thing for people to do.

• 29:27Lewis Howes?

  It's very challenging. So what was the conversation you had with your husband Nick around money? That worked well? And what conversations did not work well around money?

• 29:36Speaker 00

  I think usually when, you know, someone's like, wants to buy something and like, you immediately like, are like, "No, we can't spend on that," right? I think those were the worst because it's like stifling someone's dreams. And, you know, both of us work really hard, so it's like, why couldn't you afford anything, right? I, for me, it came down to, and I realize this for me, he doesn't want to track them as much as I do the money. So I realized, let me put all of this together and I set these goals for us like right after we got married. I'm like, let's get all of our money. Let's get, I need all the information. If I have all the information and like set a budget, I'll feel a lot better about it.

• 30:09Lewis Howes?

  You'll have more peace of mind.

• 30:10Speaker 00

  Totally. So I'm like, you can like, you can do whatever, but I just need to know that like, I need to know where it's going and how I can actually track it. Like, at any point, you could have a lot of money or a little money, you still need to know where it's going. And so I think for me, like, it came down to having a place where we could track it. And, you know, we now like, we have like a family office that helps us. And I think what's nice, we check in with them quarterly, we go through the numbers. And I think just having that conversation, and even for him to just be like, okay, this is what we spent on, this is what we didn't spend on. It's good and it's made me feel better. Just, like I said, it comes down to knowing the numbers.

• 30:43Lewis Howes?

  That's it.

• 30:43Speaker 00

  That's me though, you know, like, and I think everyone needs to know what they need. But once again, the more you know the numbers, for me, it gives me the freedom to dream. And I think that's what you forget, is that knowing where the money goes allows me to be like, okay, I have this much money to dream on, right? Like, these are sort of pacts I've always kind of had with my life. I'm like, okay, like, I'm gonna save because there's gonna be something I wanna spend on, right? And I agree with you, like, you don't wanna live your life not living it and not enjoying it. But at the same time, you wanna know where your money's going, so you don't end up in a position in the future where you can't go after what you love.

• 31:15Lewis Howes?

  Right, exactly. You don't have to not have the cup of, you know, the latte or something every day. If you wanna go spend that $5 or go out with your friends on a weekend or something. But just know that every dollar that's not being saved or being invested in your potential future dream is gonna take it longer to actually start.

• 31:31Speaker 00

  Exactly. And that's just so if you're in a job that you might not like, it's not about quitting tomorrow, you know? Actually, this is, it's funny, even, you know, when I started writing this book and, you know, my husband, he's like, you know, all these little girls always come up to me and they'll be like, I'm gonna quit my job.

• 31:45Lewis Howes?

  I don't think it's a smart idea.

• 31:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 31:47Lewis Howes?

  I don't think it's, unless you're like, have got something on the side coming in.

• 31:51Speaker 00

  Right, well, there you go. And, you know, and that was one of the things, he's like, you know, you should make sure you tell them, like, the way you budget, the way you, like, I'm so into every one of these details. It's, it's really risk calculation.

• 32:02Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 32:03Speaker 00

  Right? It's not taking a risk. It's about knowing, okay, I'm gonna go this way. And then when I get that information, I'm gonna either go this way or this way. And it's about being calculated about that so you know where you can keep taking more risks. And you know, I got to the point where I could take more and more risks over time, right? Like even when I think about my life, like being to going to corporate America was like a little risk. I mean, I still had money coming in. It wasn't like the greatest hour, but I had money coming in, which allowed me to go and explore something. And that felt good, so I kept just doubling down on that, right? And I think that's why I always say, go back to like, just get started. Because if you don't know how to like even start feeling the confidence in whether it's money or identity, any of those, you just will get stuck in where you are.

• 32:46Lewis Howes?

  What would you say are the three questions around money everyone should have with their partner that they're looking to get married to?

• 32:53Speaker 00

  Oh, those are great.

• 32:54Lewis Howes?

  Before you get married, what are three topics or questions around money we should have?

• 32:58Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 33:00Speaker 00

  How did your parents spend money?

• 33:02Lewis Howes?

  Ooh, okay.

• 33:03Speaker 00

  Right? Because so much of this, right? Like my parents, I think, you know, spent money differently than, you know, whether it's Nick or other people's parents that I know, you know? I think, and everyone's very different in this, right? And it's just, it just depends on your situation, obviously, and what your income level is, right? I think that is one. Two is, what are your dreams? Like if you could have anything, like if you were rich in the world, like what do you want, right? I think it's like knowing what you're dreaming towards of like the life. Pretend money wasn't a constraint. What's like the most lavish life you would want? Because I think it's so important to know what that is, because a lavish life to someone could be like, I wanna go to Bali and travel all the time.

• 33:45Speaker 00

  And for someone else, it could be like, I just wanna work all the time and like be in my house. I mean, one of my favorite things like with me and Nick, it's like we both love working. So we would travel, but we're those two people like on our computers, like working. We'll go out and then we'll keep working. And like that works for us because, but I literally was like, wow, if I was with someone who didn't wanna go back and like work or just wanted to just travel without working, like it would not work for us.

• 34:07Lewis Howes?

  Relaxing all day, it doesn't work for you.

• 34:09Speaker 00

  It just doesn't. I mean, sometimes it works for me for sure, but you know what I mean? It's like finding someone who's on the same wavelength. And then, third, I think it comes down to knowing what parts of...

• 34:26Speaker 00

  I would say your expenses either are something that you can let go of or that you would either want to expend more on. And I know like that's a bit more of a deeper exercise. But knowing, like I said, knowing that like cars were important to Nick. And then dance was or being like, okay, like food is really important to you. But like if you're not matched on a lot of those, like you're just going to spend in a crazy way. So it's really knowing what parts of the budget are important to one another.

• 34:51Lewis Howes?

  Did you guys create like a money vision together?

• 34:54Speaker 00

  We kind of did, I would say. Like it was something that we early on, I think with our, once we got like, once we got some like a financial planner and I think of course, like either you can have a third party do this or you do this yourself. I think it's important to be like, you know, where do you want to live? When you're older, right? Like how many kids do you want to have? What kind of lifestyle do you want? And look, by the way, I and I talk about this so much in my goal setting method. Having a long-term goal is great, but like usually you iterate and change as you go. And so while I like having pie in the sky, like dreams of what we want to do, you have to have very actionable things, like what do you want to accomplish in the next year? And sometimes it's really just having that annual conversation. I think we do this every annually, we go through all of our numbers and we set the budget for the coming year.

• 35:39Speaker 00

  And I think that's a really important exercise to do in your own life or in your family life. So you both are set and you're set even in your own goals of what you want to accomplish. Something might change midway and that's okay. But at least you've set your intention in terms of money through the year.

• 35:53Lewis Howes?

  Right. A lot of people feel stuck and I think it's because they don't set goals correctly. They don't know how to set goals. They set them, but they don't work. So what is your method around setting goals? And how can we set them correctly?

• 36:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, well, it's a, it's a long method that I have. So yeah, I mean, we can, we can do part of it right now. The first thing I always ask people to do is reflect because I feel like we. We don't remember that the last year of our lives or like the last where we are today comes from who we were. And it's so important to just kind of know what we're feeling today. Because you need a center. Where are you starting from? And so the first step in the process is I ask everyone to always reflect, right? And I do that to myself. I reflect back on what has my life been recently? What are like the words, right? Is it like anxiety? Is it balanced? Is it good stuff? Is it bad stuff? Like what are the words that keep surrounding my brain and defining, you know, what I am today?

• 36:51Speaker 00

  Then I ask people to dream because it's the same thing. It's about knowing what words and emotions and thoughts. And like, once again, I really like not anchoring on like accomplishments and achievements, which is like usually what we do. Like we'll be like, oh, in this last year, I got a raise and I got married and blah, blah, and had a kid, like any of those. It's really just like, what did I feel in this last year?

• 37:12Lewis Howes?

  Did you feel joyful, abundant, healthy, alive?

• 37:15Speaker 00

  Right, right, exactly.

• 37:17Lewis Howes?

  Connected, all those things.

• 37:18Speaker 00

  Right. And then I, and then I think the most important thing to do is to look ahead.

• 37:23Lewis Howes?

  Why is the feelings first before that? Why is the feelings and the energy of what you felt more important than the accomplishments?

• 37:30Speaker 00

  I mean, at the end of the day, that's what makes you happy, right? It's not, it's not some sort of thing you checked off which came. It's the journey of getting there, hopefully. And our emotions are important to listen to, you know, especially like, I think we forget how important they are to everything we do, the instincts that they give us, the importance of, of them in every part of who we are. And ultimately it drives our happiness. We, we tend to push them aside so much, you know, especially if we talk about things like money or, you know, these practical things. We put money or we put emotion aside a lot. But how are they not a part of your goals and checking in with who you are? When you're like, oh, here's what I want to do in the new year.

• 38:15Speaker 00

  If you don't check in with yourself on where you are today, right? And if you're just measuring yourself by these big things, you have actually no idea where you're gonna, where you even want to go as a human on that journey.

• 38:27Lewis Howes?

  So you make decisions based on emotions?

• 38:31Speaker 00

  So first

• 38:31Lewis Howes?

  What if you can't trust your emotions because they're all over the place?

• 38:34Speaker 00

  Well, yes, they're all over the place, but at the end of the day, you know what? You know if a certain emotion was prevalent, right? So it really comes down to like, did you feel happy this whole year? Or did you feel lonely this whole year? Like, what was like the prevalent emotion, right?

• 38:49Lewis Howes?

  Not the moment to moment emotion.

• 38:50Speaker 00

  It's not that moment, right? And that's why it's really about reflecting on the whole year and saying, okay, here's what I predominantly felt throughout the year. And then the next step is pretend it's a year from now.

• 39:01Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 39:01Speaker 00

  And you were looking back on the year. What words would you have hoped you said? Right? And I think so it's kind of doing the same exercise. And what would you want to have said about your year? What, you know, what few words do you hope are the prevalent words going through your mind? Through that year and right? So now we're not anchoring ourselves on like, I'm going to run a marathon or I'm going to get a raise. You're anchoring yourselves on like, you know, hopefully great words, you know, of I want to feel abundance and I want to feel power or joy or whatever. And it could be anything, but it's about anchoring it. You know, one of the words I remember I always needed in these and sometimes I'm always still working on is always like this idea of home. Because I've always like been traveling and moving. So I'm like, how do I work on this idea of home without?

• 39:46Speaker 00

  It wasn't about buying a home, right? Which would have been the thing. It was about the feeling of home. How do you create a feeling of home?

• 39:54Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 39:54Speaker 00

  And that was like a very different way to set goals for me, right? And I think this happens in relationships too. It's like very to be like, okay, I'm going to date. I'm going to do this. And even for me, and when I first started actually doing this process, I actually met my husband Nick like a month after I did it, which is like the craziest thing.

• 40:11Lewis Howes?

  The process of what?

• 40:12Speaker 00

  The process of creating a life path method. The first time I did it.

• 40:15Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 40:16Speaker 00

  That was actually when I met him. And it's because instead of being like, oh, I need to not be single and like find someone.

• 40:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 40:23Speaker 00

  I changed like the word of love in my mind to being like, I want to find a long-term partner. And I just like meditated on like a different idea. And word in my head, it was longevity in my head.

• 40:37Lewis Howes?

  What were you thinking before that?

• 40:38Speaker 00

  I think I was just like, find someone like who will be there, loyalty or passion. You know, like it was just not, it wasn't, and I remember I had the word passionate like in as my last year word. And like, it was great. Like I think I was like meeting people and whatever, but like it wasn't, it wasn't a long term.

• 40:54Lewis Howes?

  Wasn't stability a long term?

• 40:56Speaker 00

  Wasn't stability. Stability was my other word in my, for my, for my coming year. And I want a longevity and, and stability. I didn't want like passion, you know, or I wanted something. I mean, I want a passion too, but like, you know, in a different way, you know, it was like, it was this interesting anchor in my head. To be like, wait, I'm looking and I'm then therefore seeking the wrong things and people. But I never even realized I was doing that because it wasn't a conscious thing. Cause in my head, it was just date and find somebody.

• 41:23Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 41:24Speaker 00

  So all of this was just like, but I didn't even know what I was really like, what I wanted to put my intention into. And so, you know, after you do all the dream words, the next step of the process is actually about tracking your time. Which is another whole part of the process that so many of us don't do.

• 41:40Lewis Howes?

  So look into the future. I like, this is, I like to tell people to imagine it's New Year's Eve.

• 41:45Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 41:45Lewis Howes?

  And be in the moment.

• 41:46Speaker 00

  In the year, yeah.

• 41:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. And a year ahead.

• 41:48Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 41:48Lewis Howes?

  What would you have liked to have felt and created in that past?

• 41:50Speaker 00

  The same, right, exactly.

• 41:52Lewis Howes?

  So let's pretend you're a year from now, whatever that year is, so the step four of a life, life path method is, what were you saying?

• 41:58Speaker 00

  So step one is reflecting, step two is dreaming. So now we're on step three, and so this is all about focusing now.

• 42:04Lewis Howes?

  Okay. This is step three is focus.

• 42:06Speaker 00

  Yeah, step three is focus and we're gonna, we start by doing a time diagnostic. So writing down all the areas that you spend any significant of time on, right?

• 42:16Lewis Howes?

  Your schedule, managing your schedule.

• 42:18Speaker 00

  Yes.

• 42:18Lewis Howes?

  Knowing your schedule.

• 42:19Speaker 00

  Knowing your schedule. So it's like, what are the, you know, what are the 10ish areas? That take up most of your time in your life, right? And this could be anything from like watching TV, social media. And obviously like bigger chunks of work, I think it's important to break down, right? Cause sometimes it's creative work, sometimes it's administrative work. What are you really spending so much of your time on? Because you need to, once again, where are you today? What are you doing? If you really want to create change in your life, you need to know what's taking up your time today.

• 42:48Lewis Howes?

  Exactly.

• 42:48Speaker 00

  A lot of people have, don't, like, don't even know that they're like, wow, I spent hours doing.

• 42:53Lewis Howes?

  Nothing.

• 42:54Speaker 00

  Or taking care of my pet, whatever, and not even realize how many hours I do, right? Or whatever, exactly, even nothing. But like, there is something you're doing that. Is it on your phone? How many hours are you spending on, like, just checking emails or social media, whatever it might be? Write that down because you don't know if it's serving you or not at that moment, right?

• 43:13Lewis Howes?

  I dare people to track the last 365 days of how long they were on their phone.

• 43:19Speaker 00

  Oh, my God.

• 43:19Lewis Howes?

  It shows you like the weekly. You were on your phone like four, five, six hours a day on average this week.

• 43:24Speaker 00

  Screen time.

• 43:25Lewis Howes?

  Check the whole year. I bet it's a month or two of your time.

• 43:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:30Lewis Howes?

  On your phone.

• 43:30Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 43:31Lewis Howes?

  Throughout the year.

• 43:31Speaker 00

  It's a lot of time. You're right, it's probably a month or two.

• 43:34Lewis Howes?

  It might be a month. I mean, if you're spending, what?

• 43:37Speaker 00

  That's a lot of time.

• 43:38Lewis Howes?

  You're spending, say you're spending six hours, six hours a day or eight hours a day.

• 43:42Speaker 00

  Apple definitely has this information for us if we want to get it, yeah.

• 43:45Lewis Howes?

  I mean, just say you're doing 20 hours a week, which is probably more, it's probably 30, 40 hours a week in seven days. So you're doing 40-hour weeks, 52 weeks. Wow, what's the math?

• 43:54Speaker 00

  What is it? Sorry, say that again.

• 43:56Lewis Howes?

  You're doing 40 hours a week on your phone.

• 43:58Speaker 00

  40 hours times 52.

• 44:00Lewis Howes?

  I don't know what that is.

• 44:00Speaker 00

  Yeah, you're at like 2,000.

• 44:02Lewis Howes?

  Hours. You need a calculator or something. 2,000 hours, how many days or weeks is that? I don't know.

• 44:06Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 44:07Lewis Howes?

  Something.

• 44:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, let's see, 2,024.

• 44:11Lewis Howes?

  There we go.

• 44:11Speaker 00

  We're at like, okay, let's just say, yeah, you're at, yeah, you're close to, oh, my God, we're close to, we're close to what, 10 times 10, 100 days.

• 44:21Lewis Howes?

  Three months.

• 44:22Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 44:22Lewis Howes?

  Three months of your year on the phone. Isn't that crazy?

• 44:25Speaker 00

  That's too much, that's way too much time.

• 44:27Lewis Howes?

  Isn't that crazy to think about?

• 44:28Speaker 00

  That's too much, yeah. It's a little bit less than that, but yeah, it's three months.

• 44:30Lewis Howes?

  Even if it's two months.

• 44:31Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 44:32Lewis Howes?

  And you got to think about, do I need to be on my phone this much? I mean, maybe if you're working and that's part of your work, then I get it, but it's like, what are those extra hours?

• 44:39Speaker 00

  It's, well, so that's like what the important thing is.

• 44:42Lewis Howes?

  Knowing your numbers of your schedule.

• 44:44Speaker 00

  Of knowing the numbers. It's just knowing what you're, what you're giving a lot of your time to, right? And so, once you know that.

• 44:52Speaker 00

  Then, I think the whole part is knowing if those words are serving you or not. So, the next step in the process is to actually rate those words. So, giving them like a 1 to 10. So, 1 means like-

• 45:02Lewis Howes?

  What type of words would you say around this?

• 45:03Speaker 00

  Um, yeah, so things like family, right? Um, hobby, health, yeah, fitness.

• 45:08Lewis Howes?

  Fun, adventure, travel.

• 45:09Speaker 00

  Yeah, and you can be like, here's what you- travel, right? Exactly, I mean, I- fun is a bit more like, I wouldn't, because it's like not as specific. It'd be really more like, working, commuting, right? That's like a great word, it's like, how much time do you spend reading, maybe, you know? But there's also, like I said, cooking, whatever it might be, sleeping, you know? Those are all the things that take up a big chunk of your time. And then, the next step is to rate them. So now, it's all about finding out-

• 45:33Lewis Howes?

  Step 4?

• 45:34Speaker 00

  This is step, this is actually step 3B.

• 45:37Lewis Howes?

  Rate, rate them, yep, I love this, I love this approach.

• 45:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, so now you're thinking about, does that time area serve my dream words?

• 45:46Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 45:46Speaker 00

  Right? Because that's, where are you trying to get to? We already established that, right? We established the feelings and emotions you're aiming for, for the year. So, you rate them on, you know, hey, like, is being on my phone for X hours a day actually serving my time, right? And serving my dream words, right, in the future? Is doing this part of my job serving my dream words? And this is literally, it's not, you're not gonna do anything yet. You're literally just, once again-

• 46:12Lewis Howes?

  Assessing it.

• 46:12Speaker 00

  Assessing, it's just knowing, right? Because, once again, you, until you know, you can't make a plan, right? And that's really like, so much of this, and as we're even talking about it, like, I think it's about being self-aware about where you are right now, to be able to get to where you, where you want to go. If you don't check in with where you are right now, it's kind of impossible to know where you're going to go.

• 46:31Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and you may not be able to change everything overnight, but it's like, okay, in 6 months, I could get to this point, and then I can make different changes.

• 46:36Speaker 00

  Absolutely.

• 46:37Lewis Howes?

  Right, okay, so that's-

• 46:39Speaker 00

  So, you rate them.

• 46:40Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 46:40Speaker 00

  Now becomes the fun part. Now we get to go and pick. Four to five areas of our life that we're gonna focus on for only the next three months. So this whole thing is a quarterly goal-setting process. And the reason I do that is because three months is like a long enough time to make change. It's not a week, but it's also not a year where, you know, you set... It seems so far away that you don't do anything, and it also doesn't give you enough time to change. Right? So now you're, you know, you're not kind of stuck in this place where you made a commitment to yourself for a New Year's resolution and, you know, I always think about this one, like pretend you're like, "I'm gonna run a marathon." Like, three months in, you're like, "I actually hate running."

• 47:16Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 47:16Speaker 00

  What are you gonna do? Like, you feel like a failure then, because you quit on something. So I like the idea that this is sort of quarterly, and obviously, like, I feel like seasons are quarterly. I mean, a lot of companies use quarterly as like a financial metric and all of that. So it sort of works in the world, right? And so it's a three-month goal, so you get to pick, right? So you're like, based on your ratings, you're like, "Okay, I'm gonna focus on these areas." And I also think it's important that you pick a small amount of areas, because you can't change everything at the same time.

• 47:43Lewis Howes?

  Too much.

• 47:43Speaker 00

  It's too much. And I think, you know, so...

• 47:45Lewis Howes?

  A couple of things.

• 47:46Speaker 00

  You can change a couple of things, but if you're like, "I'm gonna do every single part," you're gonna fail at all of them. And then, once again, this goes back to what I was saying earlier. If you don't get started in making progress anywhere, you end up feeling like you've failed at everything. Once again, like lowering your confidence, inability to like be yourself, take the Plan A. Like, it kind of all, you know, goes on top of each other and makes you feel like you can't move.

• 48:07Lewis Howes?

  Inadequate, yeah.

• 48:07Speaker 00

  Inadequate.

• 48:08Lewis Howes?

  I mean, it's hard to be perfect at your diet and work out three times a day and, you know, do all these things at once.

• 48:13Speaker 00

  Totally. So you have to choose what's important to you right now, based on how you're feeling. And that choice is up to you. It is actually no one else's choice. It's just hard to sometimes get there, so that's why I've designed it in a way that gets you to this place of being like, "Okay, like, based on how I'm feeling, based on how I spend my time, based on how these areas are serving me, I am going to now choose these four to five areas to go after." And then you set mini-goals that are very measurable and actionable in all of them. So then I go down and my whole thing is like, don't pick number... Don't say things like "more or less." You have to be very specific. Like, "I'm going to eat three healthy meals a week," you know, or... Right for 30 minutes, you know, it has to be very specific.

• 48:57Speaker 00

  If they're not measurable, there are things that you're never going to know that you did or not. And I think it's, you know, and in the book, I take people through like each of these advice tips that I have because I think you also forget to think about the how. You always kind of get stuck on like the end game of where you want to go. Like, okay, I want to like become a chef. It's like, great, where are you going to start? You know, where, do you need to go grocery shopping? Do you need to look at recipes? I want to learn tennis. It's the step like sometimes in a quarter might just even be find an instructor. It's not even about like becoming a tennis player, even playing tennis. Sometimes the hardest part is just even finding where you're going to go. And it's okay if in your three months, all you did was find the person you're going to end up going to class with the next month, right? Or the next three quarter period.

• 49:40Speaker 00

  But that's the whole thing is it's about just making progress towards where you want to go instead of not getting started at all.

• 49:46Lewis Howes?

  What's the next step?

• 49:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, so now, once you've picked the areas, you start setting goals. So you'll end up with four to five, you know, four to five areas. You should have just done your life.

• 49:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, exactly. This is very similar to how I approach it because I, as an athlete, you know, we would be, I would go into the football practice. I remember when I first started playing football as a sophomore in high school. And what I noticed right away in the locker is each one of us in our lockers, when we're getting our pads on and getting ready for the practice, had a piece of paper, which was the exact schedule and timestamps of what we were doing that day for practice.

• 50:24Speaker 00

  Yeah, there you go.

• 50:25Lewis Howes?

  So we knew exactly on the minute what we're going to be doing to prepare us for the week's goal.

• 50:30Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 50:31Lewis Howes?

  And for the seasonal goal. So everything I do is based on a season as well.

• 50:34Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:35Lewis Howes?

  Or quarterly seasonal because sports are a season.

• 50:36Speaker 00

  Totally.

• 50:37Lewis Howes?

  And, you know, I, I'm obsessed by my schedule.

• 50:41Speaker 00

  Same.

• 50:42Lewis Howes?

  And scheduling in the most important things first and then working around that.

• 50:46Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 50:47Lewis Howes?

  Not vice versa and putting like the things that are important last.

• 50:50Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:51Lewis Howes?

  Doing them first. And I think that's what's really important, you know, for me, Spanish is really important to learn. So I'm scheduling it every day.

• 50:57Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 50:58Lewis Howes?

  I usually do the hard things in the morning.

• 50:59Speaker 00

  Totally. I love that.

• 51:01Lewis Howes?

  Working out is something important, so I schedule them. I did it this morning at 7:30.

• 51:04Speaker 00

  And those are things that you sometimes like. Can let go if like other things end up becoming more important.

• 51:10Lewis Howes?

  More important, absolutely.

• 51:10Speaker 00

  But if you are like, no, I have to do this. It's, this isn't up to somebody else. Like, people know, like, I work out every single day. It's not a optional thing. This isn't a, oh, because I have time. It's like, no, no, this is a part of the work for pile. Like, this is my work, you know, a part of my day. It's not gonna change.

• 51:28Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 51:28Speaker 00

  And I think it's, you're the only person who can make that pack with yourself.

• 51:31Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. And that's why I think, I love that you're talking about the time and knowing your time and your schedule. Because for me, it's schedule is everything.

• 51:37Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 51:38Lewis Howes?

  And tracking your schedule.

• 51:39Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 51:40Lewis Howes?

  And seeing it. So you talk about start setting these goals.

• 51:42Speaker 00

  So now we're gonna, yeah, so now, within each focus area that we have, so you end up with like four to five focus areas. You set many goals, right? So there's like, let's say you set three goals, really tight goals within each. So as I was saying, it might be, I wanna take up tennis, right? So it literally might be, let's go and, you know, research, find three instructors online. Read about them, look up the prices, sign up for a class.

• 52:08Lewis Howes?

  Yep.

• 52:09Speaker 00

  It's so simple, but like, honestly, most people would probably be like, I've wanted to play tennis for years. And never do any part of the process. Even if you ended up in three months with just some, like a first class that you signed up with. That is progress.

• 52:20Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it's something.

• 52:21Speaker 00

  Right. You know, and I think people forget to think of it that way. And that's why it's really important, right? It could be like, I wanna write a screenplay. Okay, great, where are you gonna get started? It might be, hey, like, I'm gonna go be inspired and read three other screenplays. And like, like I said, back to numbers. It's like, read three, write for 30 minutes every other day. You know, it's about being very specific on it, right? Write 10 pages.

• 52:43Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 52:44Speaker 00

  And then you actually feel like you can check something off, which we all like to do.

• 52:49Lewis Howes?

  See progress.

• 52:50Speaker 00

  See progress. But you're also not like setting yourself up to never do it, right? Because in those 10 pages, you're gonna learn so much about yourself.

• 52:56Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 52:57Speaker 00

  Right? But writing nothing, you're never gonna get there. And writing 100 pages probably feels too daunting.

• 53:02Lewis Howes?

  Too much.

• 53:03Speaker 00

  Right. So now you're giving yourself something really, really concrete to do.

• 53:07Lewis Howes?

  Okay, and the next step?

• 53:09Speaker 00

  So then that's it. So it takes, now you go through and you go through writing all the steps. And at the end, you have a whole.

• 53:14Lewis Howes?

  Plan.

• 53:15Speaker 00

  You have a whole plan. You have 10 to 15 goals.

• 53:17Lewis Howes?

  For the next quarter.

• 53:17Speaker 00

  To go after, for the next three months.

• 53:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 53:19Speaker 00

  Bite-sized goals. And sometimes like the goals will feel really small, like it'll be like cook dinner three times.

• 53:24Lewis Howes?

  Right, right.

• 53:24Speaker 00

  They feel small, right? And like, they're not crazy, audacious like goals that we might be used to. But those are the important little bite-sized goals that actually. Build huge things like whenever I even think of ClassPass like I said I was telling you like it was a dance class it was like getting good in one dance class that taught me the skills and the toolset right to really get to being a great entrepreneur and it was like every day at the office that taught me to be a better leader the next day so it's not I set out my dream to build a ClassPass I set out to solve a problem but it was the lessons along the way and the little goals that actually allowed me to take bigger and bigger steps right when you get it.

• 54:05Lewis Howes?

  What are three of the biggest lessons you learned from dance that helped you become a great entrepreneur?

• 54:09Speaker 00

  Uh I think the first one is discipline just knowing that when my teacher is like this is the way you do a step and I can't get it it's about figuring out how I'm going to keep practicing to keep getting to the place where I can you know I can actually get to that get to that point uh to teamwork I think when you dance with a group of girls and you know we always performed as a group and like every formation had to be super tight it was really about knowing how do you how do you work with people right how do you transform together how do you make sure that you bring people up with

• 54:50Speaker 00

  you when they might not be at the same level and a lot of that and I think the third one I think for me specifically came back down to learning about where I came from especially Indian dance I think I didn't know enough about my roots and I think this also once again helped my identity flourish for me was learning just the beauty of like the women I come from in India and I think that's been like such an important journey for me and I think for anyone who like plays a sport whatever like you get a lot of that from just you learn so much about yourself when you put in effort and energy and learn about you know the essence of something that you're doing.

• 55:31Lewis Howes?

  Let's go back to identity. What, how do you shape your identity now? What do you think about, when you think about yourself in terms of identity?

• 55:38Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 55:40Lewis Howes?

  And how can identity really support your growth versus how could it hurt you?

• 55:44Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, like I said, you either split yourself into minutia of, you know, different parts of who you are, because let's be honest, the world wants to label you. It's just easier for people to understand things, right? I mean, you're like in the content world, like, you know, it's just easier, right, for things to be clear. So people want to naturally label you and...

• 56:06Lewis Howes?

  Should we be labeling ourselves?

• 56:08Speaker 00

  No, because none of us fit in a box. We're all different.

• 56:13Lewis Howes?

  So how do you shape your identity then? When you, when you talk about your personal identity, what do you say to yourself?

• 56:17Speaker 00

  Even for myself?

• 56:18Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 56:19Speaker 00

  I mean, it's hard. I mean, it's like, you know, we were, you know, we were talking about this, like, I will always, I like to be known for the work I've done, obviously. Like, I think work that's especially timeless, like, to me, like, that is like something, and I, I try and want to define myself personally by the work I do. And like, I have this thing, I'm like, create timeless things. Like, that is really what, to me, my identity is, if I think about it, like, holistically, whether it's a child, to, you know, a company, or, you know, art, create timeless things. But it's still hard, right? We want to, it's easier for people to be like, oh, she's an entrepreneur, she's a woman, she's a mom, she's a wife, right? Like, it's, it's very easy to do that. And, and look, that, that helps us because, in a way, it gives us a community, right? It gives us sort of that, that place to go.

• 57:03Speaker 00

  I think the important thing is not to get stuck in that and not to close our minds when we're in that world, right? So even like, I was in like, sort of that MIT Business World, and I was so lucky that I had a creative world, that from dance, that was so different than my day to day. That inspired me to be like, wait, people like classes, obviously, you know, and other things with their life and time. Or I would have sort of been stuck in the same exact thoughts and process that I was surrounded with. And I think we forget that, is that we are allowed to grab from different types of our identity, right? So even like for me, when I talk about my dance identity or my Indian identity, I'm allowed to grab from that and my American identity. I truly did for 10 years. It's like a very big part of me too. It's how do I become?

• 57:48Speaker 00

  I'm a South Asian American. I'm not Indian and I'm not American. I am a combination of the two, right? And I think it's about letting those things flourish. And I'm not just a businesswoman and I'm not just a creative. I'm combined, both. And all of those parts made me the person I am and also made me apt to be solving the problem I did, right? And I think that's how you have to think about it, is all these pieces of us are going to come together to help us conquer whatever problem that we are meant to solve in the world. And it's about pulling from all of it versus shutting any one of them down because we feel uncomfortable. And sometimes, it's like I said, it's about embracing the community.

• 58:30Speaker 00

  It's about learning from the art of the roots of something that you came from, even though we sometimes don't want to, right? We want to like, we want to put it aside, but you will be more proud of it as you get older. Even when I was growing up and I was learning some of these Indian like folk dances, I didn't like them. I wanted to do more of like the

• 58:47Lewis Howes?

  Hip-hop or

• 58:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, or like Bollywood at the time. Yeah, exactly. Hip-hop, jazz, Bollywood. But now, looking back, I'm like, I love those, you know? I love those more, in a way, because they gave me such a depth to who I was, which like at the time when I was young, I was like, I don't want to do this.

• 59:02Lewis Howes?

  This is boring.

• 59:03Speaker 00

  Yeah, you know? So it's one of those things where I think you learn to appreciate it over time too. And I think a lot of people do that as they get older. You're like, oh yeah, like I used to do that when I was younger, because so much of our identity once again is shaped when we're younger. But at the end of the day, it's about not getting stuck and not letting anything define you. And you know, actually so much of this goal-setting process of what I love is you can totally change who you are every three months. You can set a whole new group of goals. So you don't have to get stuck in the life you are living and like the dreams that you have. You are allowed to try something new. You could be an author, right? You can be an actress if you want. And you might like it or not like it, but you're the only one who should choose that.

• 59:44Speaker 00

  And you should try it, go for it, and say no if it's not for you.

• 59:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. We were talking about this before, about how

• 59:54Lewis Howes?

  You know, when I interview like these gold medalists who are like win the Olympics gold at like sixteen and they realize that's probably the biggest moment I'll ever have. Right? Like winning gold medal in front of a world platform of a billion people watching.

• 1:00:09Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:00:09Lewis Howes?

  How do I recreate that feeling of a gold medal ever again?

• 1:00:16Lewis Howes?

  Liz Gilbert talks about this from her book, You Pray Love, where she's like, you know, it was probably like one of the biggest books I'll ever do. Maybe I'll be able to recreate that. But how am I gonna sell ten million books in like two years ever again, you know, whatever it might be? How have you been able to shape your identity now after selling ClassPass for a massive amount? This being your baby for a decade? Where does your identity go now?

• 1:00:42Speaker 00

  It goes back to the root of who I am. And I think it's funny, especially writing this book during this time. I actually have had so many times where I'm like, wow, I feel like I here I am the same same person like a decade ago, right? Going through so many of the same things. There was a point where I was like, wow, I feel split, like my identity is in my corporate job. Do I want to build a company? What do I want to want to do? I didn't know I was gonna be an entrepreneur. But I knew I had to seek out that inspiration and seek out a lot of it. And I think I'm right back there. I'm at this part in my life where I need to go back to what drives me. What do I love to do? Who am I? Ask myself some of those really hard questions, which you know,

• 1:01:23Speaker 00

  are obviously easier to say sometimes, but absolutely, like I've realized like I need to do the work on myself again. Like so much has happened to me, right? And I think as much as, you know, I was in, when I was starting the company, it's this is like the book and I talk about this so much is like, I was very in control of things. When you build something massive, like a lot of stuff, a lot of stuff happens to you as well, right? It just, it just naturally does because of the immensity of what you've built. And so much of like this process is like, how do I hang on to the things that I love and want to do? So there's like a sadness, obviously, in it. It's a very bittersweet moment. But at the same time, I'm also so ready to go and kind of do this work and map out this next decade of my life. Because I know there is so much more, but.

• 1:02:08Speaker 00

  I'm going back to dance because that's what I love and I feel like it just grounds me and like my calling. It makes me feel like I can, that's my first place where I know I can like feel like I have impact and like just the world and I know there's, there's more ahead, but I have to kind of go back to that.

• 1:02:24Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Have you reflected on the past year yet?

• 1:02:26Speaker 00

  On the past year? Yeah, I actually was, I was just doing it. I mean, here's the thing, I became a mom during COVID, which was not easy. So, you know, these last few years have been tough, you know, it's just like one of those things, I think this past year for me was like a lot of celebration, but there was like loneliness too, because you're, you know, I have a kid and like some of my, my family can't come and see him and things like that. So, so like, like you said, like there's good words and bad words, you know, that are not, I don't even like to say good and bad, but it's really just different types of emotions that are always there. And so I'm like, how do I take those things and set them for the coming year?

• 1:03:00Lewis Howes?

  Have you started dreaming yet? Or are you still kind of in reflection mode?

• 1:03:03Speaker 00

  I'm, I'm a little bit in, in a bit of both, I would say. Like I'm, I feel like I like to do it like right when the year is ending. So like during that winter break is like the best time to dream. I mean, I'm always dreaming, but I think my dreams for the coming year, they're less specific in the sense of like, oh, I'm going to go and do this. And because I'm, I think a lot of it even comes down to doing the work on myself. Like I'm, you know, after, after this book comes out and all that, I'm like, I wanna, I know I need to do work on myself. And that might require like a creative retreat and like time with myself, which is sometimes so hard to find, but I really need to do it because I can't cure myself sometimes in the, in the craziness of-

• 1:03:40Lewis Howes?

  The chaos of day to day.

• 1:03:41Speaker 00

  Yeah, exactly. Change your pace, you know, change, try something new and I know I need to do that, you know. I talk a lot about that too. It's, it's one of those things where when people don't know what their calling is, you sometimes just have to put yourself in different environments, right? And it's usually within you already. So that's why like it's a combination of the two for me where I need to- Clear the noise so I can hear myself. And then also try new things to allow myself to see how I feel while I'm doing that, right? It's like you saying like, "I don't want to be a truck driver." It's like, you just have to sometimes put yourself in different situations to be like, "Am I enjoying how my identity feels in this, right? Does this feel right or wrong?" And I have to be careful, and I think we all do, is, you know,

• 1:04:23Speaker 00

  I don't want to ever be in a place where I'm like, "Oh, do I need to create ClassPass again?" That's not what, you know, that's not what's going to be amazing. What does that even mean, right? Like, creating another company like that. To me, it was always about the impact on people's lives. Do I want to continue to impact people's lives? Absolutely. Will I? I know I will. Will it be a few hundred people? Will it be billions of people? I don't know yet. But that's the journey I'll go on as I go.

• 1:04:48Lewis Howes?

  There's a lot of people that are inspired by you, a lot of women that look up to you as well. And they see you with the results you've created with this, you know, impactful company that's helped a lot of people around the world. They see you as a mom, you know, as a wife. They see you with, you know, healthy, young, all these different things. Do you have any insecurities still?

• 1:05:08Speaker 00

  Do I have any insecurities?

• 1:05:10Lewis Howes?

  And if so, how are you navigating those? Because you seem extremely comfortable in your own skin and confident, and you know what you want, and you're accomplished. Is there anything that you struggle with?

• 1:05:23Speaker 00

  I mean, I think this is probably one of the hardest times in my life because I don't have an exact answer of what I'm working on. And I think my life has been defined by my work, you know, whether it's dance or ClassPass for a very long time. And honestly, like, even right now, like, I'm questioning everything. Like, where do I want to live? Yeah, absolutely. Like, I don't know, my husband knows this obviously too, but like, I'm like, "Do we want to be on the East Coast, West Coast?" Like, you know, and I've realized that I'm like, "I'm OK with throwing everything out the door to rebuild" because this is an opportunity too. And even though, like, it's really hard, though, like, to kind of wake up and not know every day, like, "I'm going to have this meeting and do this," and where it's going to lead,

• 1:06:08Speaker 00

  because I'm so used to having a little bit of that structure, structure in my life. But that's really hard. And I think, you know, and as much as it's, as much as...

• 1:06:21Speaker 00

  It's like an honor to be this like figure for, you know, especially young women. It's also a lot of pressure, you know, and I think when you have to make decisions like in the spotlight in any way and there's like only a few of you doing it, it's a lot of pressure, right? And you want to make sure you continue to inspire, but you also need to be authentic to yourself, you know? And I think even for me, like, there was a long time, this is gonna sound strange, but like, I thought I couldn't dance because I thought the tech world would judge me.

• 1:06:49Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 1:06:50Speaker 00

  You know, and it was a really weird time for me because I felt I had to be somebody for like the girl boss tech world. And inside I was this like artistic human being too. And I had to hide her for a little bit. So I got trapped in that like many times and, and that's kind of, you know, the stuff I'm even working through now is, wow, like, when did all this happen to me, you know? And it comes down to everything where society almost starts putting a lot of stuff on you. I think anytime you start, you know, you build something big, it's, the world starts trying to tell you who to be and how to define yourself and how do you continue to make sure you're centered in all that you do? And yeah, I mean, I have to go back to that all the time and, and really remember

• 1:07:33Speaker 00

  that I'm allowed to be me in all these environments. And I still am the daughter of, you know, immigrant parents who have like expectations and things like that, whether it's like being a mom or a wife and you have to really work through a lot of that.

• 1:07:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. I, I believe that there are three main fears that most of us have. The fear of failure, the things that hold us back from actually going after what we want. The fear of failure being one, the fear of success. You were talking about kind of the pressure, the weight of success

• 1:08:00Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:08:01Lewis Howes?

  that some people have, which, what, which makes them not go after what they want.

• 1:08:04Speaker 00

  Sure.

• 1:08:04Lewis Howes?

  Because they're afraid of that responsibility.

• 1:08:05Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:08:06Lewis Howes?

  And the fear of judgment of other people or, or other people judging you and their opinions. Which one of those three fears do you feel like was, is, is the hardest for you to overcome? Fear of failure, fear of success, or fear of judgment?

• 1:08:21Speaker 00

  Probably fear of judgment, I would say. I think I've worked my way through fear of failure by failing many times in a way. And honestly, I'm like, just not scared. It's so funny, like, if something happens with the company or anything, you're like, okay, what do you do? Like, I just know how to, how to... How to deal with that?

• 1:08:38Lewis Howes?

  And in your book, you said failure is a data point, not an endpoint.

• 1:08:41Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 1:08:41Lewis Howes?

  Which I always say, failure is feedback.

• 1:08:43Speaker 00

  Yeah, same thing. It's information.

• 1:08:45Lewis Howes?

  To help you get to success.

• 1:08:46Speaker 00

  So I'm not, I'm not really scared of failure anymore. I mean, it's hard to do it when you're like more public, obviously, you know? But I've learned to kind of work through that and I, you know, I, that one is hard. Fear of success is also, yeah, I mean, there's the responsibility thing. But I, for me, like the way I've always been able to kind of, when I go back to my why there, I'm like, it's, I'm doing things for the right reason and so it's success no matter what. So I feel like I get there. But I think fear of judgment, and I have, I feel like I've built a really good toolkit. Like I said, like I know how to set boundaries, whether it's even like, like I have a block on my social media, like in terms of time, all of that. Like I feel like I know how to control my thoughts and stuff.

• 1:09:29Speaker 00

  But at the same time, it creeps in, you know? And you really, that's kind of what, like the cleanse you sometimes need to do is that. And it really comes down to-

• 1:09:38Lewis Howes?

  What type of cleanse?

• 1:09:39Speaker 00

  Cleansing of people, cleansing of, of social media. Like just cleansing of the things that trigger your mind into the same sort of thought patterns. And you know, sometimes it's like hanging out with completely new people is sometimes the best thing you could do. Who don't know you, right? Or who aren't putting in any type of expectation on you. When you hang out with like same people who are in a certain industry or a certain like type of friend group, you don't realize that you are absorbing their expectations. And I've always loved having like, like I said, I have always had a very, very group of friends. Like super business-y ones, super creative ones, you know, like just all in different fields. And I love that because I absorb from everyone to be able to like kind of become who I am.

• 1:10:24Speaker 00

  And sometimes like you really need to change. I actually think the reason, like going back to even what's hard right now is COVID's been really hard. Cause we haven't been able to do that. And I think like, I'm one of those people who absorbs energy from people and like who I'm around in my surroundings. It's like that empathy and that feeling, I create my art that way. I feel like create products that way. And it's been hard to just not live, you know, and see people and to absorb that energy. That kind of gives you that like extra pep in your step, you know? I think that's been an interesting and challenging time, but yeah.

• 1:10:55Lewis Howes?

  Are there, are there any other fears that you feel like have you've struggled with or have held you back?

• 1:11:00Speaker 00

  I mean, through my life, um-

• 1:11:03Lewis Howes?

  That are maybe not in one of those categories.

• 1:11:06Speaker 00

  Yeah, you know, I think you always feel like, are you good enough? You know, I think like, I know, I don't ever be like, oh, have I done enough, any of that? But I think it's just like, there's always like, you know, when I was pitching investors, you know, once again, I'd be like, am I smart enough? And it's like, I went to MIT, am I smart enough? But you still are like, I'm a woman, am I smart enough to people in the room? I'm, I'm 411, I'm this like, small human being compared to everyone in that room. Are they gonna respect me as much as they would respect somebody else? You know, but I have always learned to just, if I do good work, that will always shine through. And I think I stuck to that mantra through this whole thing. Cause there was a lot of people who said no to me, you know?

• 1:11:51Speaker 00

  Did I ever think it wasn't going to work? No, cause I knew I was just going to.

• 1:11:55Lewis Howes?

  Figure it out.

• 1:11:56Speaker 00

  I was going to just fight, you know, cause I cared so deeply about it. But it was hard when you're in these situations where people either doubt you, don't understand you, can't see it, right? And you have to just kind of get back up and fight the next day.

• 1:12:13Lewis Howes?

  How do you learn to not doubt yourself when you go through a struggle or a challenge? What is your toolkit or strategies to believing in yourself when other people are saying no to you?

• 1:12:26Speaker 00

  Um, so first of all, always go back to like, the deep why, right? That you have, I think like, for me, I was setting out to, once again, like, give dance and this feeling of greatness to so many people. Going back to that, like, just spark you and kind of get you back up. The doubt is about controlling your mind, right? It's about controlling your thoughts.

• 1:12:48Speaker 00

  A lot of times, like I said, I think, you know, and I go through this also in depth with like, this situation with my mom, where she really wanted me to obviously like, get married and all of that, and I get it, right? And I understand that from her perspective. And it just was something that I was like, I was focusing on different things in my life. But you know, something I did, and I remember a lot during that process when I was building ClassFest, and there was so much good stuff happening, bad stuff happening at the same time. Every morning, I would, I would share a quote. And this was like, actually before like, there was like Instagram and stuff. This is just Facebook, and I would share a quote every morning. And the reason I did it is because it forced me to wake up in the morning. The first thing I did was like, go and scroll quotes. What a great way to start with like, a positive thought.

• 1:13:33Speaker 00

  And then I would post the quote, which like automatically it comes back to you sort of like during the day because people are commenting on it or whatever it might be. And I think it was a lot of just changing my mindset to that positive thought constantly. So when the doubt was there, when either like I said, I would set boundaries and be like, I'm not going there with you. And if it sometimes means like not seeing certain people, you have to do that. And then on the other end is controlling your thoughts with what do you want to think about? Right? So the, to me, like the antithesis to doubt is positivity. Right? And it's like, I'm not going to listen to that. I'm going to focus on the positive, not the negative of the situation. So that person might be like, oh, I don't think there's a market here. I'm gonna be like, I'm gonna, there is a market here. I'm going to class right now and I'm gonna go. Right?

• 1:14:17Speaker 00

  And so I think it's one of those things that's about focusing on the positive and pushing through it and letting the, letting the negative go, go away. And you know, to me, like this is about life too. I talk a lot about this too. Like a life of yes is so much better than a life of no. And, right? And when you have so much good stuff to say yes to, there's, you don't even have time to say no. Right? Like there comes a point where you're just like, I'm just doing everything in my life that I love. Like I don't even have time to say no. And like, it's so obvious instead of that guilt you might feel to be like, I have to miss this. You don't even have time for it because the yes is so obvious. And so like so much of this, and even in the life path method, it's about designing it.

• 1:14:59Speaker 00

  So like the yes is so obvious, you don't have to question it. You don't have to feel like you need to even do the obligations because your list of stuff you have to do trumps everything.

• 1:15:10Lewis Howes?

  Right. Yeah.

• 1:15:11Speaker 00

  You know, and you believe in it. And that's the mentality everyone really needs to live by. And it's because if you take care of yourself, you're serving the human race.

• 1:15:21Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 1:15:22Speaker 00

  And I think that's the part people don't always get. Like I, I think about it. I'm like, imagine if the years I was building ClassPass, I was focused on all the things like I was guilty, like I felt guilty about and obliged about. And, and I did probably feel selfish during that time. To be very honest, I felt selfish because... I had to focus on my stuff, but I wasn't focusing on me. I was focusing on building this company. This company would not exist and have changed the people's lives it did. If I wasn't quote-unquote selfish, right? And I hate using that word because it's not selfish. What I was doing was taking care of myself so I could be in service of other people.

• 1:15:56Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 1:15:56Speaker 00

  I know that's a very weird way of thinking about it, but that's how I always thought about it. And honestly, we all should design our lives that way. We are taking care of ourselves so we can take care of others. Whether that be our family, our friends. If you're not the best version of you and doing the things that are truly pulling you forward in your life, you are not showing up as a great person to everyone else and giving what you are meant to be.

• 1:16:21Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:16:21Speaker 00

  And I think we forget to think of it that way. And we think giving is a very transactional thing. Of like, oh yeah, like I showed up here and I gave you my time, right? It's, are you giving them the best version of you in that time? Like the happiest version of you, you know, or like the best version you could be?

• 1:16:37Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm, I love that. How has the best version of you come out since you had your son?

• 1:16:46Speaker 00

  Oh my God, it's so amazing watching a kid grow up and like a baby grow.

• 1:16:51Lewis Howes?

  And what's the biggest lesson you've learned about being a mom the last year and a half?

• 1:16:55Speaker 00

  Um, it's much harder than I thought. I will be honest, you know, I think nothing prepares you for, for motherhood. It's, it's like having a startup again in a way, you know, but it's a 24/7 job, right? And I think as an ambitious woman too, like just realizing what that is, is hard. And how, you know, you, you want, need to still prioritize your own time and your own goals and ask for help when you need. Like I very much, I used to always do that and like be careful of my time. I became even like more thoughtful about it. Really? Because you just have to know exactly You know, what hours you have, like, and sometimes that it's not as predictable with the kid. That's the hard thing. Like, I was used to having predictable schedules.

• 1:17:38Lewis Howes?

  You have to be more flexible.

• 1:17:39Speaker 00

  You have to be more flexible, absolutely. But, you know, you make it work and, you know, but there's nothing like the joy of seeing this thing you create, like, just start growing up in the world. I mean, he's just started talking and singing and it's amazing to know that, you know, you're there to guide their life. Like, I think it's like, it's interesting when you're a parent. It's made me reflect a lot on like what my role is in his life. And like, this word "parent," right, is such an interesting word. But like, my job is to guide him towards his fulfillment in life, right? And I really think it's about thinking about that. And there are times where I've caught myself like wanting him to do things like, "Oh, he needs to talk, he needs to walk," like going into like the type A-ness that I want to. And I'm like, "No, I need to enjoy this time."

• 1:18:23Lewis Howes?

  He needs to be reading faster than any other kid and be at MIT now.

• 1:18:27Speaker 00

  You know, but it happens to all of us, right? And you compare yourselves and you look at other kids and you're like, "Oh, wait, should my kid be doing that?" And I've learned to just be like, he is on his own journey and I'm here to support him and raise him in the best way and environment I can. And what I want to just give him is a lot of love. That's like the number one thing.

• 1:18:46Lewis Howes?

  That's what we need the most.

• 1:18:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:18:50Lewis Howes?

  Oh, man. I'm excited about this book and these strategies for people. It's called "Life Pass: A Groundbreaking Approach to Goal Setting."

• 1:18:58Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:18:58Lewis Howes?

  "Drop Your Limits, Rise to Your Potential." And this will be out right when we drop this episode. So I want to make sure that everyone gets a copy and gets a few copies for your friends as well. Because I think people get confused around goal setting and how to do this for themselves. And you really break it down for us and share some amazing stories. And again, talking about identity, I love that you talk about identity right away. I'm actually working on a book right now and I think identity plays a big part in our lives.

• 1:19:25Speaker 00

  Wow, yeah.

• 1:19:27Lewis Howes?

  So there's so many great examples and lessons in here. And I think, again, I love the part where you said, "Failure is a data point, not an endpoint." I think so many people are afraid to fail as opposed to seeing it as information, as a data point, feedback, whatever you want to call it.

• 1:19:40Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:19:41Lewis Howes?

  To give you the tools now and what you need to grow into to accomplish what you want. So so much good stuff in here. So make sure you guys get a few copies, share with your friends, post about it.

• 1:19:52Speaker 00

  You should do the goal-setting together. It's always fun to have somebody that...

• 1:19:56Lewis Howes?

  Find someone to do the accountability with you on the goal-setting.

• 1:19:59Speaker 00

  Exactly.

• 1:19:59Lewis Howes?

  And leave a comment on this video, or wherever you're listening to this, make sure to leave a comment of the part of this interview you enjoyed the most. And I want to ask you a couple of final questions.

• 1:20:08Speaker 00

  Of course.

• 1:20:10Lewis Howes?

  This is called the three truths question.

• 1:20:12Speaker 00

  Oh, boy.

• 1:20:13Lewis Howes?

  So I'd like you to imagine a hypothetical scenario.

• 1:20:15Speaker 00

  Alright.

• 1:20:16Lewis Howes?

  You live as long as you want, but it's your last day on Earth. So you get to live as long as you want to live.

• 1:20:21Speaker 00

  Where am I going after this? I'm really into astrophysics, so...

• 1:20:24Lewis Howes?

  You're going wherever you want to go. Wherever you go after is what you want to do, whatever you believe in. But it's your last day on Earth.

• 1:20:30Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 1:20:31Lewis Howes?

  And you've accomplished all of your dreams and everything you want to do in life, you've made come true. But for whatever reason, you've got to take all of your work with you to the next place. All of your messages, your content, the book, anything that's out there, we don't have access to your information anymore.

• 1:20:46Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 1:20:47Lewis Howes?

  But you get to leave behind three things you know to be true from all of your life experiences.

• 1:20:51Speaker 00

  Like three messages?

• 1:20:53Lewis Howes?

  Three lessons that you would share with the world. And this is all we have to remember you or your content by.

• 1:20:59Speaker 00

  Okay.

• 1:21:00Lewis Howes?

  What would you say are those three truths that you would share with the world?

• 1:21:03Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 1:21:06Speaker 00

  First, I would probably leave some Indian music behind, because I really love Indian music, and it's the most meditative, amazing thing in the world. And I feel like there are so many parts of my life I listen to it, whether it's like Gharban or Garba, which is like a type of Gujarati folk dance. And I feel like it calms me, and I just feel like it should never be lost. And the world will get so much from it because it's timeless.

• 1:21:30Lewis Howes?

  What lesson would that be, if you had to leave a lesson behind?

• 1:21:34Speaker 00

  Let's see, what's like the lesson from the music? I think it's about listening to your soul.

• 1:21:38Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, oh, that's good. Okay.

• 1:21:44Lewis Howes?

  Truth number two?

• 1:21:48Speaker 00

  The only thing constant is change. To learn to be flexible and adaptable.

• 1:22:00Lewis Howes?

  Three.

• 1:22:03Speaker 00

  You are unique and no one in the world is made up in the same way you are. So live your life on your own path.

• 1:22:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, those are beautiful. I love those. I want to, uh, I want to acknowledge you for a moment for the incredible journey you've been on. Again, I think it's, I think growing up with, I didn't grow up with immigrant parents, but for someone who did, I know how challenging that is to go chart your own path and your own destiny.

• 1:22:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:22:30Lewis Howes?

  Against the norms of what your parents want or your, your culture wants for you from relationship of a certain time, career, school, all these different things.

• 1:22:41Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:22:41Lewis Howes?

  And going against what your friends might think or comparing you or what, thinking you're going off some crazy dream or whatever it is. And living your truth around dance and around being an entrepreneur to solve problems. I think it's really inspiring that you did what your soul, you listened to your soul and you went after it.

• 1:22:58Speaker 00

  Yep.

• 1:22:58Lewis Howes?

  Even when it wasn't popular.

• 1:23:00Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:23:00Lewis Howes?

  Even when people, you know, thought you were a little weird in the tech world.

• 1:23:03Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:23:04Lewis Howes?

  Corporate world, tech world.

• 1:23:05Speaker 00

  Never fit in.

• 1:23:06Lewis Howes?

  You didn't fit in and I think that's a really inspiring that, not that we always need to break the mold or something, but you did what you felt like your soul was telling you to do. And you listened to it and you leaned into it. And I think that's really inspiring to, to hear that story and then that's what you've been on and you're still doing it. So I think that's really cool. I also want to acknowledge you for, uh, creating something that is mission based and not self-based.

• 1:23:29Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:23:29Lewis Howes?

  But thinking, how can I solve this problem for me, but hopefully for others as well? And for now, learning these lessons, sharing it to the world with your book. So I really acknowledge you for, you don't have to make this book. You've made a ton of money. You don't have to work any ever again if you don't want to. So the fact that you're actually sharing your wisdom and knowledge with people who might be struggling, I think is a really powerful and inspiring thing. So I really acknowledge you for showing up every day.

• 1:23:53Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:23:54Lewis Howes?

  Uh, on your journey as you reinvent yourself and your identity and your goals and all this stuff.

• 1:24:02Lewis Howes?

  How can we be of best service to you besides getting a copy of the book? Where can we go to follow you and find you?

• 1:24:08Speaker 00

  Yeah, I'm on Instagram. I'm at Payal, so P-A-Y-A-L, not PayPal. As we were talking about earlier.

• 1:24:14Lewis Howes?

  At Payal.

• 1:24:15Speaker 00

  I'm at Payal on Instagram. You can follow me there. I share my dance journey there.

• 1:24:20Lewis Howes?

  I love the videos over there.

• 1:24:21Speaker 00

  Yeah, I mean, you know, like you said, I'm just living my life as a person and a soul on this earth. And I just want to keep creating timeless things, as I said, you know? I think that's really it. It's about living a life that I love and not letting anything hold me back. And that's what I want for the world through my book.

• 1:24:39Lewis Howes?

  Inspiring, okay. Final question, what's your definition of greatness?

• 1:24:43Speaker 00

  Oof.

• 1:24:47Speaker 00

  Oh, God, okay, hold on. Definition of greatness. It's doing what you love so well and not caring about what anyone else thinks.

• 1:24:57Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, there you go. Wow, thanks so much, appreciate it.

• 1:25:00Speaker 00

  Thank you, thanks so much for having me.

• 1:25:03Lewis Howes?

  Thank you so much for listening. I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's show with all the important links. And also make sure to share this with a friend and subscribe over on Apple Podcasts as well. I really love hearing feedback from you guys, so share a review over on Apple and let me know what part of this episode resonated with you the most. And if no one's told you lately, I want to remind you that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.