731 Mindset of Becoming World Champion with Sasha Digiulian

“PASSION IS THE NUMBER ONE INGREDIENT TO SUCCEEDING IN ANYTHING.” Are you governed by fear? If so, it’s time to figure out if what you’re scared of is real or imaginary. What if there really isn’t anything to be afraid of? You might have some setbacks or “fall,” but at the end of the day you’ll be fine. In the face of stress, you can get overwhelmed by negative emotions, or you can look forward. You can instead focus on the task ahead. It’s all about your mindset. On today’s episode of The School of Greatness, I talk about fear with a champion climber who has learned to be mental tough by constantly pushing her limits: Sasha Digiulian. Sasha Digiulian first began climbing at 6 years old, in 1998. She has won the World Championships for Female Overall and has placed Silver in the Bouldering World Championships, as well as Bronze in the Duel. Sasha has been the undefeated Panamerican Champion 2004 to the present, and she is a three-time US National Champion. Outdoors, Sasha is the first North American woman to climb the grade 9a, 5.14d, recognized as one of the hardest sport climbs achieved by a female. She has done two. Sasha was the third woman in the world to accomplish this grade. Additionally, she has onsighted multiple 8b+’s, 5.14a’s, ascended groundbreaking multi-pitch routes of up to 1000 feet of 8c climbing, and has accomplished multiple First Ascents and 28 First Female Ascents around the world, including a First Female Ascent on the North Face of the Eiger. Sasha has learned to trust the process and the universe in order to quiet her anxiety. She says that the only way to get up a mountain is to think positively. She’ll find herself saying, “Just go, just go, just go” when she’s in a tough spot. So get ready to learn how to have the mindset of a champion risk-taker on Episode 731. Some Questions I Ask: What’s the highest mountain you’ve climbed? (20:00) How do you stay focused while climbing? (23:30) Are there more men or women in climbing? (27:00) How do you manage stress levels? (32:00) What’s your thought process during a climb? (46:00) What did you learn from your father’s death? (1:00:00) In This Episode You Will Learn: The difference between speed climbing, bouldering, and sport climbing (11:00) How Sasha got started in climbing (12:00) The largest distance Sasha has fallen (17:00) About Sasha’s scariest climb (34:00) The mantras that Sasha says while climbing (48:00) The three things Sasha’s parents taught her (53:00) The reason why sleep is so important (1:06:00) Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 731 with world champion Sasha Digiulian.

• 0:07Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:32Lewis Howes?

  Helen Keller said, "Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, ambition inspired, and success achieved." And Marcus Aurelius said, "You have power over your mind, not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength." I am so excited about this episode. Sasha Digiulian is a professional rock climber, who in 2012 became the first American woman to climb Grade 9A. After leaving high school, she took a gap year to travel and rock climb, concentrating on international competition and outdoor climbing.

• 1:15Lewis Howes?

  She won the gold medal at the World Championships, and she has climbed over 31st female ascents, as well as eight significant first ascents in South Africa, a big wall in Brazil in 2016, and the misty wall in Yosemite in 2017. Digiulian is a three-time national champion in female open, and she has won multiple female open Pan Am championships. From 2004 until the end of her junior career, 2010, she was the undefeated Pan American champion. And wow, I've been excited about this for a while because she inspires me to grow in my own life.

• 1:57Lewis Howes?

  When I watch her images, her videos, and watch her story over the last couple of years that I got to know her online, I said, "I've gotta have her in the studio and learn about the way she thinks." When you're climbing vertical alone or with a partner, and you're climbing this huge mountain vertical, that you're sleeping on the side of a rock, how do you stay mentally prepared, mentally tough, mentally focused, under all the conditions that are being thrown your way on a cliff, climbing thousands of feet? And I said, if I could learn some information, some wisdom from her own experience, and if we could translate that into our own life, if we can translate that into the challenges that we're struggling into the walls we're climbing and the obstacles we're constantly overcoming,

• 2:42Lewis Howes?

  then I thought this would be a very powerful episode, and it definitely is. Make sure to share this with your friends, lewishouse.com/731 with Sasha DeJulian. She's an incredible woman. Make sure to follow her over on Instagram and YouTube and all those places as well. And in this interview, we talk about how having an open mind helps with staying focused in your life. Also, how great passion creates the greatest climbers and the greatest achievers in life. Why negativity doesn't get you anywhere. I don't care how frustrated you are about something, the negativity you have in your life will only hold you back. It will

• 3:23Lewis Howes?

  not propel you forward. And how to trust the process when you listen to the universe, how to tap into that trust and intuition even more. Super pumped about this. Again, a big thank you to our sponsors for helping us make this one of the best and biggest podcasts in the world and spread the message of greatness, just like we have with our dear friend today. I'm super excited about this one. Let me introduce to you the one and only Sasha DeJulian.

• 3:54Lewis Howes?

  Welcome back everyone to the School of Greatness Podcast. We've got Sasha DeJulian in the house. What's up, girl?

• 4:00Speaker 01

  So excited to be here.

• 4:01Lewis Howes?

  I've been trying to get you on for, I think, a year and a half, I was saying earlier.

• 4:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:06Lewis Howes?

  We connected on Instagram, so this is our first time hanging out in person, but it's been fun to watch your journey. And I'm always curious and fascinated about connecting with people like yourself, because what you do is extremely difficult, and I could never do it. So I appreciate your artistry, your work ethic, and your skill level, because it's just so much. I can't even climb like seven feet on like an easy wall. I tried this last year, where it was like a big handles and everything. It was like, man, I suck. My mobility is horrible. Like, I can't stay close enough to the wall. I'm just like this big giant on there. So you are...

• 4:43Speaker 01

  It's all relative.

• 4:44Lewis Howes?

  It is, yeah, of course.

• 4:45Speaker 01

  That's my little...

• 4:47Lewis Howes?

  This is your thing, and you're a... You're a former world champion, is that right?

• 4:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 4:52Lewis Howes?

  And three-time, three-time USA champion.

• 4:54Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm.

• 4:55Lewis Howes?

  And what's the discipline called?

• 4:57Speaker 01

  So world champion, I was the overall world champion. So that's the combination of all three disciplines.

• 5:02Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 5:02Speaker 01

  Sport climbing, bouldering, and speed climbing. And for nationals, it's sport climbing. So nationals and Pan-Ams and slow competitions.

• 5:11Lewis Howes?

  What's the difference between the three? Can you, for those that don't know anything about climbing?

• 5:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, that's a great question. So speed climbing is basically the most adjustable form of competition climbing that you could describe to an audience. And that's whoever gets to the top of a homogulated wall wins.

• 5:27Lewis Howes?

  Artificial wall?

• 5:28Speaker 01

  Artificial wall, yeah. Yeah, so it's the same holds.

• 5:30Lewis Howes?

  How tall is the wall?

• 5:31Speaker 01

  It's 15 meters.

• 5:33Lewis Howes?

  15 meters, where's that?

• 5:33Speaker 01

  Which is about 45 feet.

• 5:35Lewis Howes?

  Okay, 45 feet?

• 5:36Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then sport climbing is also on, all of competition climbing is on artificial settings.

• 5:42Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 5:43Speaker 01

  So sport climbing is more of a difficult path that no one has ever climbed on before. And so it's new to every single competitor. So we're all on like a clean playing field.

• 5:53Lewis Howes?

  You don't get to practice beforehand?

• 5:55Speaker 01

  No, you don't.

• 5:56Lewis Howes?

  You just see the wall?

• 5:57Speaker 01

  You see the wall, and then you have one shot to get as high as you can. And then the tiebreaker, the tiebreaker is time.

• 6:04Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 6:04Speaker 01

  And then bouldering is similar, but it's a composite of different boulder problems. Normally, there's four to five boulder problems. And in each of these, there's rounds. There's like qualifiers, semifinals, finals. But bouldering is the shorter, more powerful form of climbing. So there's like normally about eight movements, and they're on shorter walls. Whereas sport climbing's on like 15 to 20 meter walls. It's like 45 to 60 feet. Bouldering is on like maximum 15 feet.

• 6:34Lewis Howes?

  Got it.

• 6:35Speaker 01

  Tall, because you don't have a rope. So if you fall, you fall onto what's like a gymnastics pad, yeah.

• 6:39Lewis Howes?

  Interesting, huh? Okay, so you started this when you were really young?

• 6:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, I started climbing when I was six.

• 6:46Lewis Howes?

  Did your dad get you into this, or did someone?

• 6:48Speaker 01

  No, no, so I went to my brother's birthday party at a local climbing gym. And he was turning eight. He was a hockey player, I was figure skating. We went, it was like this little group of boy hockey players and me. And then I grew up super competitive with my brother. And I think that like something that was like very engaging about climbing for me was that finally I found what I was better than my brother at.

• 7:16Lewis Howes?

  First try.

• 7:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, but so I I did well. I think I had a natural inclination to like do well on the at the birthday party, I mean, whatever that means. And so the gym employee told my mom, hey, Sasha seems to really enjoy this. You know, we have a junior team program. And that was this program that meets like each Wednesday and Saturday morning. And so I started going to that. It was like a group of youth kids that from the area I grew up in DC.

• 7:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 7:47Speaker 01

  And then one Saturday morning, I walked into the gym at seven. And they were holding a youth regional championships. That was how I like literally stumbled upon the world of competition climbing.

• 7:58Lewis Howes?

  Wow. The rest is history. You just kept pursuing it.

• 8:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's when I I went to the first competition. I was seven. I competed in eleven and under. I won my category, kind of like.

• 8:10Lewis Howes?

  First competition?

• 8:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, I I mean, like, like beginner's luck. And then I started competing at a youth level. I started competing. My first international competition was actually the North American Championships in Mexico City. When I was, I think I was ten or eleven.

• 8:29Lewis Howes?

  That's pretty cool.

• 8:30Speaker 01

  And then that was my first like big international competition to win. And then I started competing for the US national team when I was sixteen, because that's your eligibility for competing for the US on like the World Cup circuit. And then did the World Cup circuit. Won the World Championships. Then I started transitioning my career more to outdoor climbing.

• 8:52Lewis Howes?

  So after you won the World Championships, how old were you then?

• 8:54Speaker 01

  I was eighteen, just turning nineteen.

• 8:57Lewis Howes?

  Eighteen, that's starting to get like old in the competition world, right?

• 9:01Speaker 01

  It is, like it's on, it's definitely, I mean, in your competition prime. I would say that you're about sixteen to twenty, twenty-two.

• 9:10Lewis Howes?

  Okay, so you won the World Championships. Was that always the goal as a kid? Was like to go be on the USA team, win the World Championships?

• 9:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, my goals as a kid was like win Nationals. Or like climb five fourteen, which is a number in climbing that climbing's on this grade scale of five point scale. So as you progress up the numerical scale, it becomes numerically more challenging. So that's like, yeah, exactly.

• 9:37Lewis Howes?

  So five. .0 would be what?

• 9:39Speaker 01

  5.0 is super easy. It's like a slab, like a.

• 9:44Lewis Howes?

  It's like you can walk up.

• 9:45Speaker 01

  Yeah, it's like, like walking on like a VersaClimber or something.

• 9:48Lewis Howes?

  Oh, really?

• 9:48Speaker 01

  And then.

• 9:49Lewis Howes?

  So I could do that?

• 9:49Speaker 01

  You could definitely do like higher grades than that.

• 9:53Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 9:53Speaker 01

  And then as you get into 510, that's when it starts getting like more technically challenging. So like the grades break into subcategories of A, B, C, D. And that's 5.10A and then 5.10B is harder than 5.10A. And then it goes up to 515 and.

• 10:14Lewis Howes?

  5.15.

• 10:15Speaker 01

  5.15, yeah.

• 10:16Lewis Howes?

  That's like the hardest grade. Is that like straight up?

• 10:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, that's like, basically like there's like very minimal holds. And it's at like a challenging angle. And I mean, the beauty of climbing is you fall a million times before piecing together something that you're working on. So while it seems like, I mean, one question I get asked a lot is, do you ever fall? And it's kind of ironic to me because I, I fall all the time. I'm not free soloing. What my discipline is is free climbing. So free climbing and free soloing, the difference is that I have a rope. So if I fall, I fall into the rope and I'm totally safe.

• 10:53Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm. But you fall and hit a rock still, right?

• 10:58Speaker 01

  Ideally not, like you fall into air or like you kind of like pendulum softly into the rock.

• 11:03Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 11:04Speaker 01

  Yeah. So if you're lead climbing, you have different points of security along the way. And you're basically clipping a carabiner into the rock, which is in a bolt. And then you clip your, your rope into that carabiner. And then if you fall, you basically fall to your lowest, your, your carabiner that's below you.

• 11:23Lewis Howes?

  Three feet, six feet?

• 11:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, it could be like 60 feet. It could be 20 feet or it could be 10 feet. Could be like, like 60 feet would be like a major fall.

• 11:31Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 11:32Speaker 01

  Um.

• 11:33Lewis Howes?

  Have you dropped that far before?

• 11:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, it definitely takes like big rope falls. Yeah.

• 11:37Lewis Howes?

  60 feet?

• 11:39Speaker 01

  Ideally, you're like falling in air and that's like.

• 11:42Lewis Howes?

  So you're not gonna fall and then hit the rock.

• 11:44Speaker 01

  Right.

• 11:44Lewis Howes?

  You're falling and you're just like in air.

• 11:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, and a lot is trusting your climbing partner because it's the blayer's responsibility to give you a good catch. So.

• 11:54Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 11:54Speaker 01

  Being able to give like into the dynamicism of the rope.

• 11:58Lewis Howes?

  How do you get back, if you're falling into air, I'm assuming like the angle, I don't know, you're just like going upside down, I feel like.

• 12:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 12:05Lewis Howes?

  That's happening. So how do you actually get back to the rock?

• 12:08Speaker 01

  So if you took like a really big fall, you would ideally have what's called a jumart to ascend the rope. And that's like you just put it into the rope and you climb up on the rope. If it's not too big of a fall, or if you can reach the rock, then you just kind of pull on the rope yourself. But in order to successfully send a climb, kind of like surfers send a wave, you have to start at the bottom and reach the top without falling.

• 12:34Lewis Howes?

  Whoa.

• 12:35Speaker 01

  So where there's like what I've gotten really into over the last few years is big wall climbing. And that's multiple rope lengths on top of each other. So you could be spending like multiple days on the cliff face. And in order to successfully free climb something, you need to not fall once. So if you start from the bottom and you reach the top, maybe it's like 3,000 feet or something, then everything in consecutive order has to be done perfectly.

• 13:05Lewis Howes?

  What if you fall once, it won't catch you and bring you back down?

• 13:07Speaker 01

  Then you have to go back down.

• 13:08Lewis Howes?

  All the way back down?

• 13:10Speaker 01

  So you have to go back down to the last pitch.

• 13:12Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 13:12Speaker 01

  And each pitch is broken up by rope lengths. Yeah.

• 13:14Lewis Howes?

  How far is that?

• 13:16Speaker 01

  Could be like 150 feet or so.

• 13:18Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 13:19Speaker 01

  Really depends. Yeah.

• 13:21Lewis Howes?

  So if you fall 150 feet, is that even, people do that?

• 13:25Speaker 01

  Oh, well.

• 13:26Lewis Howes?

  You wouldn't fall that far.

• 13:27Speaker 01

  You wouldn't fall that far. That's like the length of the entire pitch. Hopefully you don't fall 150 feet. That'd be bad.

• 13:33Lewis Howes?

  If you fell six feet, you'd have to do the whole 150 feet?

• 13:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, you'd have to.

• 13:35Lewis Howes?

  To go back down?

• 13:36Speaker 01

  All the way.

• 13:37Lewis Howes?

  No.

• 13:37Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 13:38Lewis Howes?

  Come on.

• 13:38Speaker 01

  And that happens all the time.

• 13:39Lewis Howes?

  Shut up.

• 13:41Speaker 01

  So you like, you learn a lot about patience and like the process. Because it's kind of like putting together a jigsaw puzzle. You have all of these different pieces, all these like blank cliff face sequences to put together and try and figure out. Okay, how do I get through this one passage that's like really challenging?

• 14:01Lewis Howes?

  And make it without falling?

• 14:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, then put them all together.

• 14:04Lewis Howes?

  What's the longest, so the natural progression for climbers who are competitive is to go on the the world circuit ranks and try to win championships and do the artificial climbs, the indoor climb, it's mostly indoor, I'm assuming?

• 14:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, indoor.

• 14:19Lewis Howes?

  And then once you've maxed that out, the transition is to go into outdoor?

• 14:24Speaker 01

  That's a really natural progression, yeah, because climbing by nature is an outdoor sport. And that's where you can really push the envelope of human capacity, because it's like there's this limitless horizon of what you can possibly achieve and places that you can climb cliffs to ascend.

• 14:44Lewis Howes?

  What's the highest mountain you've climbed?

• 14:47Speaker 01

  I climbed the north face of the Eiger in Switzerland, and that's, I think, about thirteen thousand feet.

• 14:52Lewis Howes?

  Wait, you climbed thirteen thousand feet from the bottom? Or was it like you were halfway up already?

• 14:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, from the bottom.

• 15:00Lewis Howes?

  From the bottom, you climbed thirteen thousand feet?

• 15:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:02Lewis Howes?

  How long does that take?

• 15:04Speaker 01

  Actually, we did that particular route in three days.

• 15:08Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 15:09Speaker 01

  And it was a first female ascent up one of the climbs, I did it with a climbing partner that we ended up what's called bivying, so you sleep on the side of the mountain. And then you're you're just kind of like fully engulfed in the process of climbing big walls or big mountains, which I love because it kind of mutes all the surrounding chaos of our daily lives.

• 15:32Lewis Howes?

  And nothing else matters?

• 15:33Speaker 01

  Yeah, you have to be present.

• 15:35Lewis Howes?

  So this is a three day climb with one other person?

• 15:38Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:38Lewis Howes?

  And you were the first female to complete it?

• 15:40Speaker 01

  Mm-hmm, yeah.

• 15:41Lewis Howes?

  The first female ascent, is that what it's called?

• 15:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, first female ascent, so a lot of my career in outdoor climbing is doing first ascents or first female ascents.

• 15:51Lewis Howes?

  First ascent for any human?

• 15:53Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 15:54Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 15:55Speaker 01

  That's that's the goal.

• 15:56Lewis Howes?

  That's really cool.

• 15:57Speaker 01

  So I, I mean, climbing, like, it brings you everywhere because there is basically a place to climb around the world in every remote location you can think of. Except for barren deserts or

• 16:11Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 16:11Speaker 01

  Normally, there's some sandstone there.

• 16:13Lewis Howes?

  There's something.

• 16:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 16:14Lewis Howes?

  There's something to climb. So now, when you do these first ascents, you always go with someone else, or what are you doing alone?

• 16:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, I always go with someone else and often, because you need a climbing partner. So, the climbing partner that you have is who you're doing these climbs with. So, normally, you're climbing together, or your climbing partner is just pulling you and supporting you. And then often, I go with a film crew too. Because a lot of, I mean, professional climbing, like, how you make a living is through your endorsement deals. And then a lot of what we do is content creation, yeah.

• 16:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. If you don't have the content, then it's like, maybe you get one or two photos or something, and that's it, right?

• 16:51Speaker 01

  Yeah, what's, what's interesting is like, in today's world, I mean, social media has shifted the whole lens and landscape of what professional climbing looks like, because now, instead of just talking about my adventures, I can share them on like a live basis, which is really cool.

• 17:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, your Instagram's amazing. It's so inspiring. It's just like these epic shots of you like thousands of feet up, you're just like, oh my gosh. It's crazy. How do you stay focused when it's like, okay, I'm about to climb this next step, but it's, it's a scary moment.

• 17:25Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:26Lewis Howes?

  Like, this, I don't know, there's uneven footing, or

• 17:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know, that's a good question.

• 17:30Lewis Howes?

  There's nothing, have there ever been a place where you're a thousand feet up and there's nowhere to grab?

• 17:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, sometimes you, um, you encounter parts of a climb that you don't think are physically possible for you. And a lot goes into like, kind of whittling down all the little pieces and trying out different ways that you can find a solution.

• 17:50Lewis Howes?

  Because you'll try it and you'll fall a bunch.

• 17:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 17:52Lewis Howes?

  A few feet or whatever.

• 17:53Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly, and you keep like pulling back on.

• 17:55Lewis Howes?

  No way.

• 17:56Speaker 01

  Trying something else. Fall, pull back on, try and find like a little credit card size, like protrusion in the rock to like dangle off of. And then if that doesn't work, then you either like just keep banging your head on it, or like train harder and return.

• 18:13Lewis Howes?

  What happens if it doesn't work? Do you just go back down?

• 18:16Speaker 01

  Yeah, sometimes.

• 18:16Lewis Howes?

  Shut up. It's gonna be a thousand feet in the air.

• 18:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, you could be like, I can't do this right now.

• 18:21Lewis Howes?

  And there's fifty feet to go.

• 18:22Speaker 01

  Yeah. You can literally be stopped if you're like on like a three thousand foot climb, you can be stopped by six feet. Because like if something doesn't go, if you can't physically do it, a move, then that can be like the end all. But I think a lot of what climbing taught me is like, there's often a solution. You just have to kind of like open your mind up to different possibilities. And a lot of climbing, what's so intriguing about the sport physically to me is that it can be the smallest difference in body positioning that makes all the difference. So it's like a very upper body, um, hand strength oriented sport. But you're really using your entire body, like your core, your hips, normally the driving force.

• 19:03Speaker 01

  You've ideally like using your footwork really well because you have to balance on like tiny little nubbins and shift your weight and allocate so that you can exert enough force to move up the wall.

• 19:16Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. I feel bad now when I have these twenty foot artificial walls with huge handholds and I can't even get up half the time.

• 19:24Speaker 01

  But like the artificial walls can be really challenging.

• 19:26Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 19:26Speaker 01

  I mean, yeah. So a lot of pro climbers train indoors. Like I train at a climbing gym in order to prepare for my outdoor climbs. I even built a gym at my house.

• 19:38Lewis Howes?

  No way.

• 19:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 19:39Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 19:40Speaker 01

  It's fun.

• 19:41Lewis Howes?

  That's really cool.

• 19:42Speaker 01

  It's like no excuses. Every room in my house has like some sort of training equipment.

• 19:48Speaker 01

  Do I live in a gym? Or is my house turning into a gym?

• 19:52Lewis Howes?

  That's amazing.

• 19:53Speaker 01

  Balance.

• 19:53Lewis Howes?

  That's really cool.

• 19:54Speaker 01

  Work-life balance.

• 19:55Lewis Howes?

  What's the key to being one of the greatest climbers? Like what's the principles and the fundamentals? I'm hearing footwork, I'm hearing total body core, everything, but what's like the real principles?

• 20:07Speaker 01

  I mean, not to be, not to be cheesy or anything, but I think just being really passionate about it. Like, in my opinion, you can succeed at whatever it is that you really will yourself to want. And if you love what you're doing, then just naturally you're gonna do it a lot. And put in the hours of practice and engage your mind and your body and perform optimally.

• 20:32Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 20:32Speaker 01

  And like, I love the climbing community so much. There's just this interconnected nature of it around the world. Like, I could go to Spain and have like this Spanish family that I connect with through this overarching passion. Or I could go to Madagascar or South America, like wherever it is. There's always this climbing community that you can connect with because you're both, you're all doing something that you really love.

• 21:03Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 21:03Speaker 01

  I think passion, in my opinion, is the number one ingredient to succeeding in anything.

• 21:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Is it more male dominated or female dominated?

• 21:13Speaker 01

  It's definitely male dominated. And the background of climbing, I think it's just like, the background of climbing was traditionally many men were doing it. And now there are definitely a lot more women getting into climbing, which is like amazing. I love to see it, and especially on the gym front.

• 21:32Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 21:33Speaker 01

  Climbing has been exploding at its seams.

• 21:35Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 21:36Speaker 01

  From the gym industry, like gyms are popping up in urban locations around the world. But the transition from outdoor, from indoor climbing to outdoor climbing is still like, I think more men are making that transition than women. But as I go to more popular, what's called like sport climbing areas, then I'm seeing more women. I think that like, women just need to see other women doing it and be like, oh yeah, that's like, why not? And that's what I feel strongly about, like first female sense and first sense in general is like, you don't need to be held back. If you see, if I see that a woman has done something,

• 22:16Speaker 01

  I can be so much more inspired and connected to that than if I see a male has done it because maybe it's less relatable. But the beauty of climbing too is that women and men are both capable of achieving the same heights.

• 22:31Lewis Howes?

  The same climb.

• 22:32Speaker 01

  So to speak, yeah.

• 22:33Lewis Howes?

  I almost feel like women have more of an advantage because of, you know, being tinier, smaller, and the strength in that size, right?

• 22:41Speaker 01

  Yeah, uncertain climbs, certainly. Like, women have a tendency to have really good technique. I mean, like, obviously men too, but yeah, and like hip mobility. Climbing is a strength to body weight ratio sport, so the stronger you are, then that's really good, but you also wanna be in total like body control and awareness. So it's kinda like, I mean, in your ideal state, it's like a dance with the wall.

• 23:10Lewis Howes?

  Did you take dance lessons?

• 23:12Speaker 01

  I used to do ballet and I did figure skating. I competed in figure skating and that was kinda like, so I'm dual citizen with Canada and like my whole family is like skiing, skating, winter sports. So I'm the only person in my family who climbs, actually.

• 23:28Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Did figure skating help you to be a better climber?

• 23:32Speaker 01

  I think ballet and figure skating gave me good body awareness. Like, another sport that has a really good crossover is gymnastics.

• 23:41Lewis Howes?

  Did you do gymnastics too, or no?

• 23:42Speaker 01

  I didn't, no, but I love watching gymnastics.

• 23:45Lewis Howes?

  Can you do backflips and everything?

• 23:46Speaker 01

  Uh, no, sadly.

• 23:50Lewis Howes?

  No?

• 23:50Speaker 01

  I don't think it's like, I don't know, I've tried.

• 23:54Lewis Howes?

  Have you ever tried to do just like a pull-up?

• 23:56Speaker 01

  A pull-up?

• 23:57Lewis Howes?

  Pull-up challenges?

• 23:58Speaker 01

  Oh.

• 23:59Lewis Howes?

  Just like, how many can you do?

• 24:00Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, we do a lot of pull-ups in training. A lot of times are weighted pull-ups because that's a quicker way to gain strength.

• 24:06Lewis Howes?

  Like, holding like a hundred pounds between your legs, it's crazy. How many pull-ups can you do just free, uh, just free body?

• 24:14Speaker 01

  In a row?

• 24:14Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 24:15Speaker 01

  Probably around like thirty to forty.

• 24:16Lewis Howes?

  Wow, that's amazing.

• 24:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 24:19Lewis Howes?

  It's inspiring. You've gotta be able to do that, though. You need that endurance.

• 24:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, you need, um, so something that I installed at my house, for instance, is a tread wall. And that's like a treadmill, but it's a rotating wall. So you could climb like thousands of feet in one session. Without actually vertically gaining.

• 24:37Lewis Howes?

  It's a wall that moves.

• 24:39Speaker 01

  It moves, yeah. And then you can set different climbs on it. And you can take off holds, change them out. And then you can change the speed at which the motor goes.

• 24:49Lewis Howes?

  That's amazing.

• 24:49Speaker 01

  From a notch of like one to 10. So that's something that I use a lot.

• 24:53Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 24:54Speaker 01

  And why it's like helpful in my house.

• 24:57Speaker 01

  And then I have like a hangboard, which is where you hang from your fingertips normally with like added weight. Or train, what I'm currently training right now is one arm pull ups.

• 25:06Lewis Howes?

  You do them?

• 25:08Speaker 01

  I'm like, close, but I can't.

• 25:10Lewis Howes?

  With like just fingertips?

• 25:12Speaker 01

  I can like do it when I'm. Um, yeah, I do it on a climbing hold. Because that's the most applicable.

• 25:18Lewis Howes?

  What about if you just grabbed a bar? Do you think you can do it?

• 25:22Speaker 01

  I think that I'd be close. I think that I can hold the locks. Which is like holding certain positions, but I'm too weak still to do.

• 25:29Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 25:30Speaker 01

  A full one arm.

• 25:31Lewis Howes?

  You're too weak? How is that even possible?

• 25:33Speaker 01

  I'll blame it on the boot. It's added weight.

• 25:35Lewis Howes?

  There you go. There you go. How do you manage stress levels when you're in a difficult situation?

• 25:41Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 25:41Lewis Howes?

  On a wall?

• 25:42Speaker 01

  So I've definitely been in really stressful situations where one time on one of my first big walls, I was climbing and we got to a point where we got off route. And we had to untie and basically make a decision of if we were gonna simul climb our way to the top.

• 26:03Lewis Howes?

  What's that mean?

• 26:04Speaker 01

  Simul climb is when you're connected to your climbing partner and if you fall, then you know, like you both go down.

• 26:10Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 26:11Speaker 01

  But there's the off chance of the other climber being able to hold you both. But it, you know, it's like, it's not likely. And this is like, not a scenario that I would normally get into, but it's just the extreme situation of what climbing brings you to the moment. And it was because we were doing a big wall and on big walls, normally you have to get to the top after a certain point because you can't rappel down the entirety of a route.

• 26:37Lewis Howes?

  Oh my god.

• 26:37Speaker 01

  Um, and so when you get to the summit, then there's normally a rappel line that you go down or it's like a hike. And we had about like a hundred vertical feet left in front of us. And we couldn't find any sort of gear to secure it to you. The rock was super malleable and loose. And then the other option was to continue to the top, just like free solo. And free soloing is not something that I do on a regular basis. Like, I'm actually quite not in favor of free soloing. Our community has lost a lot of people. And it's also like, if you fall, it's a mathematical certainty that

• 27:13Lewis Howes?

  You're gonna die.

• 27:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly. But in this situation, it was kind of like, this is our reality. So, in that moment, there's no room for thinking about like, what could go wrong? Because that's just all this negative energy that's gonna be compounded and make that chance more likely. So you have to, really, like, I had to just focus on my breath and be like, I'm getting to the top. And just like, think positively and channel all of my concentration energy towards climbing and reaching the summit and, and

• 27:46Lewis Howes?

  How high up were you at this point?

• 27:48Speaker 01

  We were about like a thousand feet.

• 27:50Lewis Howes?

  Thousand feet.

• 27:50Speaker 01

  Off the ground.

• 27:51Lewis Howes?

  So you did free solo or you didn't?

• 27:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, we had to free solo. And this is like one of those situations where like, risk mitigation of like, fear and irrational fear, rational fear. This was like rational fear to have of like, I can't fall. And then also navigating loose rock. And this was in the Dolomites in Italy.

• 28:11Lewis Howes?

  How steep is this?

• 28:12Speaker 01

  This is pretty vertical.

• 28:13Lewis Howes?

  It's like vertical?

• 28:14Speaker 01

  Yeah, and I was climbing and my left hand and my left foot broke. And like, I could feel the weight of this rock just like fall into this blank wisp of darkness. And there's like, kind of like this mind-body convergence of, I just, kind of like, I think I tapped into that flow state of just getting to the top.

• 28:37Lewis Howes?

  Wait a minute. Your left hand and left foot broke, what do you mean? Like

• 28:41Speaker 01

  Like the rock.

• 28:42Lewis Howes?

  The rock broke.

• 28:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:43Lewis Howes?

  So you're climbing and it's like, the epic movie scene where it just falls back and you're hanging from one arm.

• 28:48Speaker 01

  You're like, ah, yeah.

• 28:50Lewis Howes?

  And you're a hundred feet from the top, a thousand feet up.

• 28:52Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 28:53Lewis Howes?

  And if you would have, if the other hand would have broke as well, you'd be dead.

• 28:57Speaker 01

  That's it, yeah.

• 28:58Lewis Howes?

  Shut up. That's crazy.

• 29:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:01Lewis Howes?

  So wait a minute. There was two options. You could free solo. Or you could do the other one, which was

• 29:06Speaker 01

  Simul climb, which is being connected to each other.

• 29:08Lewis Howes?

  But if one person falls, then you both die.

• 29:11Speaker 01

  Right.

• 29:12Lewis Howes?

  Essentially, right?

• 29:13Speaker 01

  If the other person can't.

• 29:14Lewis Howes?

  If they can't hold it, but you're vertical, who's gonna be able to hold it?

• 29:16Speaker 01

  It's gonna be difficult.

• 29:17Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 29:18Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 29:19Lewis Howes?

  So you both decided to free solo.

• 29:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was kind of like, you know, in climbing, this is a really rare situation like that's happened to me. That was probably one of the most extreme situations that I've been in in climbing, but you have to just confront what the reality in front of you is sometimes and make decisions based on, I will always make the most safe decision. And that's why this scenario was so rattling to me because I don't free solo. And we kind of, we had to in that situation and it's kind of like

• 29:57Speaker 01

  you have to make do with what you have.

• 30:00Lewis Howes?

  Could you not have gone back down?

• 30:02Speaker 01

  It would have been really, yeah, not, not really on this particular climb.

• 30:06Lewis Howes?

  Thousand feet down, like, it's really hard to do that, right?

• 30:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, so.

• 30:10Lewis Howes?

  Can't rappel down, like, from that point?

• 30:12Speaker 01

  Not, no. Normally, when you're on a big wall, it's hard to bail after a certain point.

• 30:18Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 30:19Speaker 01

  Because you go through a lot of terrain that's really divergent. And in the Dolomites particularly. And somewhere like Yosemite, you can always, like, bail down. You don't have to get to the top. You can get back down or more vertical, like, clean faces. You can do that, but

• 30:37Lewis Howes?

  Not here.

• 30:37Speaker 01

  Certain mountains, you have to kind of like, once you're in it, you're in it. And you have to commit.

• 30:43Lewis Howes?

  And you know that going into it, like, there's no coming down after 500 feet or whatever, right? After certain terrain. So you know going into this climb that, like, we have to make it to the top.

• 30:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, it was also nearing nighttime and so, like, you want to get to the top to get off of the actual mountain.

• 30:59Lewis Howes?

  So how long were you guys, I guess, climbing until you? Are failing until you had to make this decision.

• 31:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, we didn't fall there. We just were trying to find like points of security like a bolt or somewhere where we could put a piece of equipment.

• 31:16Lewis Howes?

  And like.

• 31:16Speaker 01

  Um, like a friend or a cam is what it's called and that's like a.

• 31:21Lewis Howes?

  A bolt.

• 31:22Speaker 01

  A device, yeah, that you use for child climbers use that and you put this device into a fissure and there's different sizes that match up with the different size of the slot in the rock and that's that is just as safe as a bolt if you know what you're doing and how to place it. Yeah, exactly.

• 31:38Lewis Howes?

  Fail, you'd be hanging.

• 31:39Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:40Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 31:40Speaker 01

  But when you're on really malleable rock that could break.

• 31:43Lewis Howes?

  It's not secure.

• 31:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:44Lewis Howes?

  Holy cow. Okay. So how long were you thinking? Like you can't find a space to to lock in or to plug in whatever it is. How long is that until you had to make a decision either way?

• 31:56Speaker 01

  Yeah, probably under an hour for sure.

• 32:00Lewis Howes?

  So you're trying to find a thing for an hour?

• 32:02Speaker 01

  Yeah, because sometimes you can just get lost on like a particular cliff face. If it's big and with a lot of the climbs in the Dolmets, like it's it's not that clear of the path and a lot is route finding and like the hardest part of our climb, the physically and technically most challenging was earlier on in the day and we got through that part um quite quickly. But then the more adventurous aspect of it, which actually is where stuff gets really dangerous was where we ended up getting to the summit at about like nine PM and having to sleep at the top that night.

• 32:41Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 32:42Speaker 01

  Unprepared.

• 32:43Lewis Howes?

  Unprepared, no tent or anything.

• 32:45Speaker 01

  Hailing. Yeah, it was really cold. It's like probably the coldest night of my life.

• 32:48Lewis Howes?

  So are you hanging from your, are you hanging from your rope for this hour? Are you holding on to the side of the rock for an hour?

• 32:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, well, so like we were at the last anchor that we saw.

• 32:58Lewis Howes?

  Uh huh.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  And so an anchor is like you are secure.

• 33:01Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, so you can hang.

• 33:02Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 33:02Lewis Howes?

  Like holding on.

• 33:03Speaker 01

  You don't have to like.

• 33:03Lewis Howes?

  Hold on.

• 33:04Speaker 01

  Be like searching on the rock while traversing around.

• 33:06Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 33:07Speaker 01

  But yeah, so this is like not to scare you because this is like I've been climbing for 20 years and this has happened once.

• 33:13Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 33:14Speaker 01

  But I guess the point being like there are extreme circumstances that if you are pushing your envelope in outdoor climbing, sometimes you face extreme.

• 33:24Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 33:24Speaker 01

  Risk. And sometimes you face risk that actually isn't risk and it's more like you're high up off your last protection piece and it seems scary to let go and fall, but you're actually gonna be totally fine. And that's where I would say that I classify like rational fear and irrational fear. So like that you can get down to the root of like why am I scared of falling? And maybe that's because the irrational fear would be, it's just like a scary airfall. And then the rational fear would be like, well, there's this huge ledge beneath me and I could break my leg. Then it's like, yeah, you have like a right to be scared. And so it's a lot about like choices and trusting your gear, trusting your climbing partner, trusting yourself.

• 34:07Speaker 01

  And not thinking about negative circumstances. Like sometimes you just have to act.

• 34:11Lewis Howes?

  So you got a hundred feet to go.

• 34:14Speaker 01

  Back to this.

• 34:15Lewis Howes?

  About a hundred, a hundred feet to go. You're like, okay, we're gonna free solo. That means you unclip from everything.

• 34:20Speaker 01

  Yeah, you coil the rope and carry it.

• 34:22Lewis Howes?

  You carry it up. But as you're looking up to this top, a thousand feet up, and you're seeing, okay, I'm about to free solo this. Do you see the route you're gonna take? Like, do you see it before you take it? Or is it just a one step at a time, looking for the next hold?

• 34:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, so like this last stretch of the climb was actually really easy terrain. So we knew that we were capable. It's just like the rock was really loose. And finding the right way that's gonna be like the most solid rock. And also you don't wanna get off route, but you don't really know where the route is. So you're just kinda like navigating this sea of limestone.

• 35:03Lewis Howes?

  But you can feel different holds, like it's sturdy holds for you. You can feel it. It's not like there's nothing.

• 35:09Speaker 01

  So kind of like, um, with professional skiers or professional surfers, professional rock climbers, you learn how to read rock faces. So I can look up at a cliff and see the most accessible way to get to the top. And that's based on like what what protrusions in the rock you see, where you see like different angles, curvatures. You just kind of become an expert at reading that because that's what you're doing all the time.

• 35:39Lewis Howes?

  Wow. And so when your left hand and left foot like broke off and you're hanging, did you have a fear that you were gonna die then? Or was it like this sense of calm? You you got this.

• 35:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, I know. This was one of my first big wall experiences and I was definitely freaking out for a moment. And what was a really big turning point for me was the point that I was like, all of the, like, whatever I want to say to my climbing partner, whatever, like, blame or anxiety or negativity that I feel about this situation. He's in the exact same situation. He can't help me. Only I can help me get out of this and that's by being in control of myself. So it's kind of like, like on a more micro level, like, negative energy and negative thoughts and doubt doesn't get you anywhere.

• 36:34Speaker 01

  The only way to actually progress up the mountain or the climb or whatever it is, it's like, by thinking positively, by thinking about what you can do to get out of a bad situation and thinking like forward. So, I mean, that was kind of like the situation had to be in control.

• 36:55Lewis Howes?

  What's your thought process before going into a big climb or a first ascent? What do you visualize the day before, the morning of?

• 37:04Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 37:05Lewis Howes?

  And throughout the entire climb?

• 37:06Speaker 01

  So before a big wall, something that I really like to do is laying out everything that's in my pack. So like if I need my sleeping bag or sleeping mat and like my lunch for on the wall, normally I'll bring like, I actually make my own bars. So I'm allowed to bring like some bars and like beef jerky or turkey jerky and I normally crave like salty foods on the wall, not not sugary.

• 37:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 37:30Speaker 01

  Especially if you're doing something like Alpine, because it's cold and you kind of want like heartier stuff. And then like your climbing gear, I'll always lay out like my different layers that I'm bringing. So like a soft shell, a down jacket, a Gore-Tex shell. And then I'll put it all in and then it's like, okay, I'm ready to go. And then it's super exciting because normally you start super early or like this summer I was doing what was called the Canadian Trilogy, which were three of the most challenging big walls in the Canadian Rockies. And I wanted to do the first female ascent of them and the second ascent. And some of the days were like eighteen plus hour days. And so you're kind of like-

• 38:08Lewis Howes?

  And you sleep on the wall?

• 38:09Speaker 01

  No, I was doing them all in, I wanted to do them each in a day. So we would leave at like five or five thirty in the morning, hike for about four hours, get to the base of the climb, then you're on the climb for about like twelve hours.

• 38:24Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 38:25Speaker 01

  And then you come back down and then you're hiking out into like the early dawn. And

• 38:31Lewis Howes?

  You belay, you belay down or you climb?

• 38:33Speaker 01

  You rappel down, yeah.

• 38:34Lewis Howes?

  It's called belay or rappel?

• 38:35Speaker 01

  Rappel, yeah.

• 38:36Lewis Howes?

  What's belay?

• 38:37Speaker 01

  Belay is when you're, um, when you're belaying your climber. So you're, the climber is going up, then you have your belayer who's supporting you.

• 38:44Lewis Howes?

  Got it, got it. Okay, cool. This is crazy. This is a whole nother world.

• 38:50Speaker 01

  I mean, yeah, like we have a little, I mean, climbing's growing, but there are still a lot of people who are unfamiliar of even the fact that climbing is a profession.

• 38:59Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm, yeah. And so what do you think about on the climb? Cause you, you map everything out, you lay it out, you prepare that. But what's the, the thought process? Are you daydreaming? Are you just present in the moment and just thinking of the next positioning for your hand? Are you thinking about family? I mean, what's going through your mind for eighteen hours a day? Cause you gotta think about something.

• 39:21Speaker 01

  Um, yeah.

• 39:22Lewis Howes?

  You sing to yourself? Do you listen to podcasts?

• 39:26Speaker 01

  You know, it's interesting because it really depends what portion of the climb I'm on. On the most difficult parts of a climb, I'm really present and I'm thinking about what each next movement. And it could be like I'm narrating to myself, okay, right hand, turn, undercling, left hand, grab this, shift your hip, move your foot, like play by play.

• 39:47Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 39:48Speaker 01

  And then if I'm on a more easier section, then I'm, you know, my mind can kind of wander a little bit, but I'm probably less in tune with like that flow state of when I'm optimally just like firing and I'm only thinking in the present, my mind and my body are kind of like converged together. And I think that that happens a lot when it's like the like, Eight hour mark and you've been climbing and you hiked before that for four hours and you're just like fatigued, but something is like pushing you through it and you're just like in it. And then a lot of big wall climbing is also systems. So, setting up your belay

• 40:29Speaker 01

  system to help your partner, or like hauling up your bag, or organizing your rope, like there's a lot of management that goes into it. So sometimes you're like thinking like, this damn rope is tangled and I'm like hanging here and I was like, why is it windy? Like, there's all sorts of things that you can be thinking of, but I also sometimes like, kind of like have little mantras that go through my head.

• 40:52Lewis Howes?

  What are those?

• 40:52Speaker 01

  Fun through like, you can, you can, or like, hold on, hold on. Something like that.

• 40:57Lewis Howes?

  Don't, don't, not let go, let go. Just let go, relax.

• 41:02Speaker 01

  Let go, let go, yeah, no.

• 41:04Lewis Howes?

  Hold on.

• 41:05Speaker 01

  Hold on.

• 41:05Lewis Howes?

  You can.

• 41:06Speaker 01

  You can.

• 41:07Lewis Howes?

  You'll just say it over and over.

• 41:08Speaker 01

  Or like, just go, just go, just go.

• 41:11Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Do you say it out loud or internally?

• 41:13Speaker 01

  Kind of like internally, yeah.

• 41:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Who taught you the power of mantras?

• 41:19Speaker 01

  I think it was just like trial by error, like trial by fire. I don't, I haven't really learned any formal coaching on mantras, but I really do believe in listening to the universe. And I think that if you open yourself up to what the universe is trying to say to you, then there's this timing and process to life that makes sense. If you let it, it makes sense. So, everything in my life, I mean, I feel like, when I look back, I'm like, oh, that makes sense. The timing or the situation that that negative experience led me to a positive experience. It's kind of interesting, like.

• 42:04Speaker 01

  I think that makes me less anxious if I just trust the process. Even right now, I have this air boot on because I have a fractured fibula and it's like, when I did that, it was after, I mean, I was training for the New York City Marathon and I was on a climbing trip through Europe and then Jordan and then back to Europe. And so I had this pain in my leg and I was like, I don't know why my leg is so painful, but I'm just gonna keep charging on and I was like hiking with a heavy pack and climbing and.

• 42:33Lewis Howes?

  And running, training for running?

• 42:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, training for the marathon, like not listening to my body. But then I got to Germany and I got an MRI and I learned that it's a stress fracture. So I was like, oh, good thing that my pain tolerance isn't negligible at least.

• 42:48Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 42:48Speaker 01

  But then with, I was given this air boot and I arrived to this series of like conference in Miami with the International Women's Forum. And I had all of these kind of like blossoming business ideas. That I needed to be in one place to actually like, take advantage of and organize, I think, just like, give my life a little room to breathe and be home and get grounded again.

• 43:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 43:12Speaker 01

  So then I saw this air boot as like life's way of saying, slow down and listen to your body and just be still. And I think now I'm in a much healthier mindset than I was when I was like not stopping traveling, because I was like on the road for like about four months straight. Um, up to this point of like, okay, now you're gonna like.

• 43:36Lewis Howes?

  Chill.

• 43:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, like.

• 43:37Lewis Howes?

  One point.

• 43:38Speaker 01

  Come inward and get your life, just like let it chill a little, be home. My house is in Boulder, but I'm like never there. And I love Boulder.

• 43:48Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 43:49Speaker 01

  I have a cat who's like, hey, welcome to my house.

• 43:54Lewis Howes?

  When you have a good cat that can take care of itself, it is like a dog, it is chill.

• 43:59Speaker 01

  She's super personal.

• 44:00Lewis Howes?

  That's the best, that's the best. What's the greatest challenge you feel like you've had to overcome in your life?

• 44:06Speaker 01

  Oh, man. Um, I think one a one big challenging chapter of my life was I was a full-time student at Columbia. And I was also managing my professional career as a climber.

• 44:18Lewis Howes?

  Living in New York City?

• 44:19Speaker 01

  Living in New York City, yeah. And I love New York City. It's probably my favorite city in the world. But it's not like a city where you can really climb outside a lot. I was traveling about like Thursday evenings through Monday evenings. I would be like in Beijing for a signing for Adidas or like in Japan for a competition. Just like, kind of like always living on the plane half of my week. And doing my schoolwork on the plane, but also like think trying to manage being a full-time student while also maintaining my career. And not letting my physical performance slip too much, but also having to recognize the backseat that climbing was gonna take

• 45:03Speaker 01

  for this particular timeframe was kind of mentally and physically challenging. Cause I think like, as athletes particularly, we're really hard on our bodies and on ourselves. Like if we're not getting the physical performance that we want out of ourselves, then I had to learn how to be just like kinder to myself. And be like, it's okay, you have a lot going on, but you don't really like notice that in the moment. So you're like, why am I not performing at this level that I was last year? And you don't really comprehend like the obvious like, oh, maybe it's because you're like doing this, this, this, and this. On top of it all. So having graduated from school, I felt like I had this like big weight off my shoulders

• 45:48Speaker 01

  to really just focus in on my climbing career again.

• 45:52Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 45:52Speaker 01

  Which was nice and I'm so thankful that I went to school though. Because I grew up in a family that Like academics were number one. And climbing, climbing was something that my parents were really supportive of me doing that because that's what I was passionate about. But they never provided any sort of like, they weren't like, if you don't win nationals, that's like, you're terrible type thing. They were more like, you need to get straight A's at school.

• 46:22Lewis Howes?

  And then you can.

• 46:23Speaker 01

  And then you can take off time to go climbing.

• 46:25Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 46:25Speaker 01

  Um, but they really saw like this, like academics and athletics balance converge really well. And so I think that what I'm really thankful that they pushed on me was just the importance of putting my best self forward. And like, my dad was always like, have fun, try your hardest and be safe. And that was like the three things that I was like, have fun, try your hardest. Didn't matter if you like won or lost, as long as you like put your best self forward and then like be safe was like parent denominator.

• 46:59Lewis Howes?

  That's great, yeah. Always be safe, right? Well, who was more influential in your life growing up, mom or dad?

• 47:05Speaker 01

  I would say that my mom and I had a closer relationship. Just we are probably more similar. My dad played football and was really into watching hockey games. I grew up going to the Capitals games. We had season tickets. I like, I love hockey.

• 47:22Lewis Howes?

  My buddy played with him for ten, eleven seasons, Brooks Like?

• 47:25Speaker 01

  Oh, oh, yeah. I know of him.

• 47:27Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 47:28Speaker 01

  I'm a big hockey fan. And then when I was in New York, the Rangers were like the team that I'd root for, but the Caps were always, I mean, when they won the Stanley Cup, I was like, this is amazing.

• 47:38Lewis Howes?

  Crazy, yeah.

• 47:38Speaker 01

  But um, my mom actually learned how to blame me. So she would come to the gym and blame me when I was training and then like my coach would tell me what to do and she would be there to support.

• 47:49Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing.

• 47:50Speaker 01

  But I never once like shared a contract with my parents, nor like asked them for any like professional help. And I think that that was a little bit of like me proving myself in this niche sport that when I grew up, like professional climbing wasn't something that was what I aspired to do because professional climbing wasn't really like a thing. It was like professional climbers, people that I looked up to, like lived in their vans in Yosemite and like were dirtbags. And that's not to like knock that culture. It's just like they weren't sponsored with like.

• 48:29Speaker 01

  Like well supportive contracts and living wherever they wanted and traveling around the world.

• 48:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 48:35Speaker 01

  That's kind of been like a new thing.

• 48:38Lewis Howes?

  What has brought that to, I guess, to brands to be more invested in?

• 48:43Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 48:44Lewis Howes?

  What is that? Is that different content than people are putting out there? Is that movies? Is that?

• 48:49Speaker 01

  I think that that's access to content. Like, we now have so many platforms to share content.

• 48:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 48:55Speaker 01

  And also, I mean, the gym industry is definitely leading this this fitness trend of like, climbing is this social form of exercise that's a really great all-body sport. Climbing is like this gateway to the outdoors.

• 49:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 49:13Speaker 01

  That is similar to skiing, like, families go on ski vacations. And you can do a destination climbing vacation, like.

• 49:20Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 49:20Speaker 01

  You can bring your family to Spain and go climbing or go to Yosemite. And then also, I think it's just like, people who are spokesperson, spoke people of the sport of climbing, doing their job of like, trying to reach a broader audience. Like, for my career, I just really want to inspire more people to know about what climbing is. And even if they don't climb, just like, see my career as like, you can do whatever you're passionate about, and even if it's not a profession already, you can create that path.

• 49:53Lewis Howes?

  And make a living off of it.

• 49:55Speaker 01

  Yeah, exactly.

• 49:56Lewis Howes?

  Because you're making a full-time living doing your passion, even though it's not like this popular

• 50:00Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 50:00Lewis Howes?

  big mainstream sport or activity or, you call it a sport?

• 50:04Speaker 01

  Yeah, a sport.

• 50:05Lewis Howes?

  Even if it's outdoor and there's no like competition, it's still?

• 50:08Speaker 01

  Yeah, because there is competition, but, but yeah, adventure sport.

• 50:11Lewis Howes?

  Adventure sport.

• 50:12Speaker 01

  It's really the category of climbing, like, climbing, I mean, my contracts are what put me through Columbia.

• 50:18Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 50:19Speaker 01

  Now, yeah, you, you can be a climber and make a good living off of the sport like any other, I think, like, high-end elite athlete. But it's definitely a new, a new discipline of, I mean, it's a new sport.

• 50:33Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 50:34Speaker 01

  And it's, uh, we have really purist roots. And there's sides of climbing that are really anti corporate sponsors. And then there's like a new age that's really accepting of like, we want to grow our sport. We accept these bigger companies being involved because that means more exposure and more support to giving back and conservation and our nonprofits, like.

• 50:59Speaker 01

  The more you educate people to care about the environment because they're being interactive with it. Then I think the more inclined they are to protect it as well. And as a climber, like, we naturally have this affinity for the outdoor spaces. And for conservation, because that's our natural playground.

• 51:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, wow. Do you have a lot of friends who've died from the sport?

• 51:22Speaker 01

  I do have.

• 51:23Lewis Howes?

  Like, close friends, or?

• 51:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah. We've definitely suffered some significant losses in our community and. And, I mean, there are certain people that I've lost that have really rattled me in ways that have either been close friends or just people that I've, like, looked up to and seen as like, like, Dean Potter, for instance. His death, he was always known as like, the safe and calculated climber, even though what he was doing was so extreme. And then, I think, like, he died base jumping, but it really put the climbing community at like this point of like, no one's indestructible, and we're all mortal.

• 52:08Speaker 01

  And I think that that's, that's really my, um, my issue with free soloing is that it just takes one mistake. And like, that's it.

• 52:19Lewis Howes?

  How many people are free soloing a year?

• 52:23Speaker 01

  Hmm, not many. A very slight, a very small percentage.

• 52:27Lewis Howes?

  Twenty, is this, a hundred, is this?

• 52:29Speaker 01

  I think you'd probably need to do like, more like a percentage of climbers, and that's probably like 1%.

• 52:34Lewis Howes?

  1%, yeah.

• 52:35Speaker 01

  Of like, you know, like, Alex Honnold, obviously, probably a lot of people have seen Free Solo. That's such an anomaly.

• 52:42Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 52:43Speaker 01

  Like, even Tommy Caldwell in the film, who was my hero in the film, spoke so candidly about what free soloing is, and, and he's like, one of the great all-time legends in climbing, but he doesn't free solo. Because, I mean.

• 53:00Speaker 01

  If I fall, it's okay. Maybe I break something. But the, having gone through personal loss from like family to friends, I know that, like, I don't wanna put my family through my own passing.

• 53:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 53:17Speaker 01

  I wanna be there and I, um, I've just like seen firsthand what loss can do to a family. And that's really hard to comprehend, like, why I would selfishly decide to do that to,

• 53:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 53:30Speaker 01

  to my friends and family.

• 53:31Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, cuz you're already at a risk, but you're just taking calculated risks and being as safe as you can.

• 53:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. Which like, after that story I told you, people were probably like, yeah, right. But like, that was one time in like, you know, my like 20 years of climbing. I've definitely had like risky situations that were maybe similar. But I think a lot is like knowing how to use your equipment, being as expert as you can about your systems and knowledgeable and why like, with climbing, there's like this endless potential of growth and wisdom that you can get from the mountains and for climbing that you stay humble because, I mean, the mountain doesn't care like what's gonna happen to you.

• 54:16Lewis Howes?

  Doesn't have feelings.

• 54:16Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:17Lewis Howes?

  No emotion.

• 54:18Speaker 01

  No emotion coming from it.

• 54:19Lewis Howes?

  It's a rock.

• 54:20Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:20Lewis Howes?

  Solid rock.

• 54:21Speaker 01

  Solid rock.

• 54:23Lewis Howes?

  Now, you lost, you've lost many friends, but you said you also lost people in your family. Your, has your dad passed away?

• 54:29Speaker 01

  Yeah, he had a stroke in 2014 and never woke up from it.

• 54:35Lewis Howes?

  And what was that like for you and your family? And did it change your path down your career in a, in a different way? Or to just confirm to go down it in a deeper way?

• 54:46Speaker 01

  I think, um, when I lost my dad, it brought a lot more awareness to being present in the moment and just appreciating the people in my life. I had just gone on a trip from, we drove from Montreal back to DC where I grew up. My dad and I, and then I took off to, I was taking off to Wyoming. And I was going there on a climbing trip and what was really interesting was that I was like a clear bluebird day and my flight, he brought me to the airport and my flight was canceled. And it was delayed twenty-four hours and he was like, hey dad, can you pick me up? And they're like, Kim, pick me up at the airport. We went and spent the night, watched the Kings versus the Rangers. It was the year that they were in the playoffs together.

• 55:31Speaker 01

  Got burgers, then the next morning he brought me to the airport and I took off to Wyoming. And it was like, then two weeks later, my mom called me from the ambulance and was like, dad just had a stroke. And I was out climbing, I drove straight to the airport and I was like, I'll be there for when he wakes up. And there was like this week in the hospital, just waiting, not knowing what's gonna happen. And then he never did come to from that, but it's like moments like that where I look back and I'm like, that's so interesting that why was my flight canceled? Or like, you can kinda like think about that and then no matter what you believe, you can just like see moments as like having appreciation for them.

• 56:14Speaker 01

  And I think that in my life, over the years, I've definitely fine tuned like, I have a lot of comfort and self-confidence through climbing and that's like a part of my identity and it's given me a lot of direction with my life. But then appreciating like who my friends who are the closest to me are and my brother, my mom and I have a really close relationship and some of my cousins, my aunts and uncles also like, where they're all in Canada. So that's kinda like where I call home when I say like I'm going back for Christmas, I go to Canada. My mom's in Montreal and we grew up at the house in Montreuil. But I think just like maintaining contact with the relationships that you have

• 56:58Speaker 01

  and not just like taking people for granted is important. And that's something that, I mean, even as the years go by, I become more appreciative of it. Because once you're, I mean, you know, like, once you're in a more public sphere.

• 57:17Speaker 01

  You have to kind of filter like the intention of people sometimes. And I think that that makes me more appreciative of the grounding, like loving forces in my life.

• 57:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 57:30Speaker 01

  And like, that's where I feel the most whole.

• 57:32Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Would you say that was one of the biggest lessons you took away from his death, or?

• 57:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think that appreciating the moment. And being aware that nothing is certain, like things can change.

• 57:49Lewis Howes?

  Was he a healthy guy? Was he?

• 57:50Speaker 01

  Yeah, there was no lead up. I mean, it was just like this, he was at the coffee table in our dining room with my mom, my brother, and then he fell over and the ambulance came actually right away. We lived in Old Town, Alexandria, Virginia.

• 58:07Lewis Howes?

  Like 10 minutes away or something, yeah?

• 58:08Speaker 01

  Super quick. But it was a hemorrhagic stroke, I think is what it's called. And there was like excessive bleeding in his brain, which shot all neurological functioning and...

• 58:20Lewis Howes?

  And you saw him a couple of weeks before. He's healthy, he worked out, or he was ate pretty healthy, or?

• 58:25Speaker 01

  He was like a big, he was Italian, so he was like always throwing the steaks on the grill and like probably ate way too much red meat and...

• 58:32Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha.

• 58:32Speaker 01

  Like there were probably like health concerns that you could look at in retrospect. But from our state, everything was fine.

• 58:41Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, seemed fine, yeah.

• 58:42Speaker 01

  Yeah. But he was really stressed. And that's another thing, it's like...

• 58:46Lewis Howes?

  Stress.

• 58:47Speaker 01

  He was running his own business and like, I think that stress is such a killer, like it's... I mean, literally, you know?

• 58:56Lewis Howes?

  I had a friend on a couple of weeks ago, Robert Greene, who came out with this, a new book. And it took him five years to complete the book and he had a stroke when he finished it. And he says a lot of it, he thinks was due to the stress that he put himself through. Cause he put, had so much pressure that he created for himself.

• 59:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:14Lewis Howes?

  To have this perfect book, you know, and his, his legacy. He worked out every day, he ate very clean, but the stress, he thinks is what caused, caused the stroke, which is a reminder and a wake up call for us to never allow the stress to ruin and run our lives. And to, to manage the stress.

• 59:32Speaker 01

  Oh, yeah.

• 59:33Lewis Howes?

  Us being in control of it, you know, and I think it's our responsibility to be aware of it. You know, if it's happening for a long periods of time, we really get to reassess and reflect and be aware on how we're gonna shift it. And take ownership over that stress level.

• 59:48Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 59:48Lewis Howes?

  Through meditation, or through sleeping more, through reshifting our focus on what we're, you know, what we're stressing on, so.

• 59:57Speaker 01

  I'm such a proponent of sleep. Like, I, I could not believe more in the necessity of eight hours.

• 1:00:05Lewis Howes?

  Sleep is crucial. I was just listening to an interview this morning with LeBron James on Tim Ferriss's show, actually. And he was like, I need eight, nine, 10 hours of sleep, otherwise I'm gonna nap throughout the day. Because as an athlete, you need to be focused.

• 1:00:19Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:19Lewis Howes?

  Mentally, and your body needs to recover, obviously, but you need to have the mental clarity, and if you are lacking sleep, you're not gonna have the mental clarity.

• 1:00:28Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:00:28Lewis Howes?

  And that's, that's the key.

• 1:00:29Speaker 01

  And then I'm like sick, like boom, if I don't get enough sleep, if it's like more than two days, like I'm out.

• 1:00:36Lewis Howes?

  You're sick for a few days, yeah, you need to recover. Your body's shutting down. Now, when you're on the side of a mountain, sleeping, because you do some climbs where you have to bring like the whole tent. What's it called?

• 1:00:48Speaker 01

  A port-a-ledge.

• 1:00:49Lewis Howes?

  Port-a-ledge. Not a porta- potty?

• 1:00:51Speaker 01

  Not a porta-potty. They have to like figure out how to go to the bathroom up there.

• 1:00:55Lewis Howes?

  How do you even do that? With someone else and you're?

• 1:00:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, first of all, you get to know your climbing partner really well. If you, so, you want me to break it down?

• 1:01:07Lewis Howes?

  Break it down, the sleeping on the side of a mountain.

• 1:01:09Speaker 01

  Okay, great.

• 1:01:09Lewis Howes?

  Where it's like?

• 1:01:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, so the port-a-ledge is like a four foot by six foot, basically like a hammock that you set up and you secure on three points on the wall. Three points of security ideally. And you sleep with a harness on. I normally take the leg loops off my harness, so it's like a waistband. And you, you, you sleep in the sleeping bag, like I've

• 1:01:34Lewis Howes?

  Thousand feet up, two thousand feet.

• 1:01:36Speaker 01

  Not ever rolled off, but you know, like, you have to secure it so it's flat out from the wall. But yeah, when you wake up, you like look down, and you've got like thousands of feet of cliff below you.

• 1:01:46Lewis Howes?

  Crazy. Do you sometimes think when you wake up, like I'm in my bed in, in Colorado?

• 1:01:52Speaker 01

  Um.

• 1:01:53Lewis Howes?

  You have to remind yourself?

• 1:01:53Speaker 01

  I never sleep that well on the port-a-ledge.

• 1:01:55Lewis Howes?

  You're like just in and out constantly?

• 1:01:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, a little bit like, um. I mean, it's not comfortable, like sleeping on a hammock, isn't that comfortable? Kind of wake up and you're like, oh, I can't really move around or like, kind of like have this illusion that you're like falling, but you're like not falling. But the views are amazing, the views are totally worth it.

• 1:02:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, wow.

• 1:02:18Speaker 01

  So the reason you do that is like, because when you're doing a big wall and if it's like over a certain amount of feet, then maybe you need multiple days to do it. In order to successfully do a big wall from the bottom to the top, you have to do everything consecutively.

• 1:02:35Lewis Howes?

  Crazy.

• 1:02:35Speaker 01

  So you sleep and then you like continue on. Maybe you're doing like eight to twelve hour days of climbing and then sleeping on the portal ledge, eight to twelve hours of climbing, like making your way consecutively.

• 1:02:48Lewis Howes?

  It's crazy.

• 1:02:49Speaker 01

  It's like, it's, I mean, it's not crazy.

• 1:02:52Lewis Howes?

  You're in the.

• 1:02:53Speaker 01

  You're in it, yeah, I like, like.

• 1:02:55Lewis Howes?

  From the outside.

• 1:02:56Speaker 01

  What you do is crazy to me.

• 1:02:58Lewis Howes?

  But from the outside.

• 1:02:58Speaker 01

  I could never do it.

• 1:03:00Lewis Howes?

  I know, just the side of a mountain like that, that's nuts. What's your vision moving forward with all this? Doing these crazy ascents all over the world and being a global citizen and being, being a female championing this mindset and this vision that you have, what's, what's your mission?

• 1:03:20Speaker 01

  That's a great, that's a great reflective question because I would love to do a first ascent on every continent around the world, I think that.

• 1:03:29Lewis Howes?

  A first time for any human, not man or woman, but anyone.

• 1:03:34Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:03:35Lewis Howes?

  A first ascent on every continent.

• 1:03:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, so that's one, one of my like more like endemic climbing goals, I think that climbing creates the space for exploration and, and connectedness. That like I just went to the Middle East for my first time in October. And living and growing up in this Western world, we are fed kind of like these like ideas of what other parts of the world look like. And I think that it's not until you actually travel and immerse yourself in a different culture that you see so many human commonalities. And that is what enables us to be better global citizens, like. You learn about the world through traveling and through experiences.

• 1:04:22Speaker 01

  And so with climbing, I'd like to travel to more places and really bring climbing to places that may not actually have climbing already. And then also educate more people about what our sport is. Serve as an ambassador and spokesperson for our sport as it grows into all these different spaces in the Olympics, in the outdoor space. Try and encourage people to conserve and protect our environment. And I work with the Women's Sports Foundation, I'm on the board. And the whole concept is equal pay and equal play for women in sports, so bringing more attention. I've also got this like series that I do, it's 10 a.m. on a Tuesday.

• 1:05:06Lewis Howes?

  I've seen that, yeah.

• 1:05:07Speaker 01

  Yeah, so each Tuesday. It runs on Outside TV and then I post it to my YouTube channel too. But the whole concept was like, bring people into my world a little bit more and provide this behind the scenes glimpse of what my life looks like on a day to day basis.

• 1:05:25Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:25Speaker 01

  So.

• 1:05:26Lewis Howes?

  It's pretty cool, yeah.

• 1:05:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, I like creating content. A lot of what I do is doing video projects and working with other people. And I don't really know beyond that.

• 1:05:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:39Speaker 01

  It's kind of like what's exciting and intimidating is that if you asked me five years ago, what are you going to be doing today in 2018? I have no idea. I had no idea to have like the awesome opportunity to be talking with you.

• 1:05:52Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 1:05:52Speaker 01

  So, yeah.

• 1:05:54Lewis Howes?

  So you're present to what's happening every week, every month, but also excited about potential in the future too, yeah?

• 1:05:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, I think there's like a certain roadmap that you can have that gives you a sense of direction. But then you can't, you can't really like put every sort of pin in the road or like

• 1:06:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:10Speaker 01

  stoplight that's going to go.

• 1:06:11Lewis Howes?

  That's cool. Is there any question you would like to answer that maybe people usually don't ask you that you wish they did?

• 1:06:18Speaker 01

  Oh, that's a good question.

• 1:06:20Lewis Howes?

  Or anything you think we should know about you that maybe most people don't know about?

• 1:06:24Speaker 01

  Oh, well, most people know, but my favorite color is pink.

• 1:06:27Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 1:06:28Speaker 01

  Um, I also have a superstition. I always have to paint my nails pink before I like an achievement that I wanna do. And, I mean, I imagine that I'm a dual citizen with Canada. A lot of people don't know that, actually, because I competed for the US team.

• 1:06:44Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, smart move, yeah.

• 1:06:46Speaker 01

  Thank you. The Canadians wouldn't think so. Well, I guess I could talk a little bit about my next year's plans. Like, I have a trip through South America in the spring, and then I have a, I have a climb in Central Africa that I want to accomplish in July, and I climb up El Cap in Yosemite in the fall, and then, kinda like, these other sporadic trips throughout the year. But that's kinda like, on the horizon, so.

• 1:07:12Lewis Howes?

  Are these part of the first ascent in every continent? Is this part of them?

• 1:07:16Speaker 01

  Um, yeah, so, well, in Central Africa, it'd be a second ascent and first female ascent.

• 1:07:20Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 1:07:21Speaker 01

  And in Bolivia and Argentina, it'd be a series of first ascents and some first female ascents, and just overall exploration. There isn't much climbing in Bolivia that exists already, so, something that I think that climbing has this amazing capability of improving and bolstering the ecotourism landscape.

• 1:07:41Lewis Howes?

  Cool.

• 1:07:41Speaker 01

  Of underdeveloped regions in the world. So, like, we did that in Indonesia. I did a sea kayaking and climbing trip where the whole mission was to develop the ecotourism industry and create an alternative for the economic infrastructure to counter the mining industry that was really destructing the natural environment and the natural community there.

• 1:08:04Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  So, we went to, like, rural islands in Indonesia, um, like Suma and Malo, and it was a really moving project to be a part of, so, I'd like to replicate that, that, kind of, like, that trip in different areas around the world.

• 1:08:20Lewis Howes?

  That's cool. How can people support you and your mission and? Follow you.

• 1:08:26Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, I'm on Instagram. Sasha D. Joy, just my name. Stay in tune with like the content. Normally, if I have like a call to action, I'll throw it up on my website. It's just myname.com or on social media. I try and keep that current.

• 1:08:41Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, the Instagram is inspiring. You got a lot of amazing photos and videos there. So make sure you guys check that out. We'll link it all up here. Final couple of questions for you. This one's called the three truths. And if it was your last day, many years from now on Earth, and you got to choose the day that you got to leave.

• 1:08:57Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:08:58Lewis Howes?

  You get to choose the day, any day in the future, but you got to finally pick a day. And you get to leave behind three things you know to be true about all of your experiences in life. I call it the three truths.

• 1:09:08Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:09:08Lewis Howes?

  Lessons that you would share with the world.

• 1:09:10Speaker 01

  Like philosophies?

• 1:09:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Your lessons, your truths. And people want to have access to any other content that you've ever created. And this is all they would have access to, are these three truths.

• 1:09:20Speaker 01

  Oh, great.

• 1:09:20Lewis Howes?

  What would you say are yours? What would you share with all of us?

• 1:09:24Speaker 01

  Kindness. I think that like, no matter who you are, no matter like what you've accomplished, just human kindness is so important and that's what connects us all. Passion, that's like such a driving force in my life. And what I think that no matter if it's sports or music or arts, like just find your passion and live your life by that. And I think, gosh, third one of like my lasting legacy. Perseverance. No matter what, what sort of like doubt you face with or negativity, roadblocks,

• 1:10:07Speaker 01

  like you can always achieve what you want if you will yourself the most. And I think that like, the universe is on your side. So persevere and believe it and be a good person. So, yeah. Kindness, passion and perseverance.

• 1:10:25Lewis Howes?

  Well, I gotta acknowledge you Sasha for a moment because it's been inspiring to watch your journey over the last couple of years. I just feel like you, you're constantly showing up consistently and doing and challenging yourself. You're not just doing the easy thing, you're doing the hard thing. And you're inspiring people through your message. You're inspiring all humans, but also women who maybe feel like there are certain challenges in their life they don't feel like they can overcome. You're helping them and inspiring them to do that in their own life. So I acknowledge you for all of that and I acknowledge you for constantly paving the way and doing the challenging things and being a good person and living with passion because I feel it and it's inspiring. And thank you for being here. I appreciate this. I'm glad we got to make this finally happen.

• 1:11:08Speaker 01

  Me too. No, thank you so much for having me here. It's such a pleasure.

• 1:11:12Lewis Howes?

  My final question is what's your definition of greatness?

• 1:11:14Speaker 01

  My definition of greatness is just loving what you do every day.

• 1:11:20Lewis Howes?

  Sasha.

• 1:11:21Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:22Lewis Howes?

  Appreciate it. Thank you.

• 1:11:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, thank you.

• 1:11:34Lewis Howes?

  And there you have it, my friends. I hope you enjoyed this, all about the world championship mindset. How to overcome challenges, how to trust your intuition, how to face adversity head on to achieve what you want. This is a powerful example of how Sasha has been doing this in her life over and over, constantly tackling new challenges, new obstacles that have never been done before. And she is doing them and I hope you got some inspiration to apply this to your life with whatever you are going through right now. Make sure to share this with your friends, lewishouse.com/731. Tag at Sasha DeJulian as well. It's D I G. I U L I A N.

• 1:12:18Lewis Howes?

  Let us know what you thought about this episode and interview. Make sure to follow her journey as it is a very inspiring one. And to bring us back to the beginning, Helen Keller said, "Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, ambition inspired, and success achieved." And Marcus Aurelius said, "You have power over your mind, not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength." As always, I love you so very much, and you know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.