34 Visual Poetry: How to Be an Entrepreneurial Artist with Nick Onken

If you can learn to create visual poetry, you can get anyone to believe in your brand and buy what you are selling. This is what travel and lifestyle photographer, Nick Onken, has mastered while capturing images of celebrities, major brands and beautiful moments in more than 60 countries through his unique style of powerful photography. Step […] Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 34 with lifestyle photographer Nick Onken. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:33Lewis Howes?

  To all the greats out there, thanks so much for tuning in. I appreciate you more than you could ever know. This podcast continues to take off each and every week, and I'm just excited about all the guests I get to interview and share with you, all of their wisdom, their knowledge, and their insights each and every week. All the messages you guys send me over on Facebook and Twitter, and the pictures you post on Instagram continue to inspire me to up my game and bring you even better guests each and every week. So thank you for all the love. I definitely feel the love coming from your way. I'm very excited about today's interview and today's episode. It's with my good friend Nick Onken.

• 1:16Lewis Howes?

  Now Nick is actually, one of my opinion, one of the best lifestyle photographers out there. And he actually shot all the images that you see on my site over at LewisHowes.com. He's the one who shot a lot of those, and there's a lot more that I haven't even posted. But he is a brilliant mind when it comes to lifestyle photography. And I'm very excited about this because any artist that I get to bring on, I'm excited about because art is something I love, something I appreciate, probably because I'm not that great of an artist or a photographer. You know, I'm pretty average when it comes to that type of art. I like to say that my art comes on the playing field or on the handball court, really when

• 1:59Lewis Howes?

  I'm in the zone as an athlete. That's where I get to create, you know, poetry in motion, I guess you could say. But today I've got a visual poet, my friend Nick, who really creates. Magical art with the camera and what he's able to do to capture this visual imagery and the emotions that he can evoke from the images he takes really inspires me and inspires people all over the world and he has worked with clients like Adidas and Nike and Coca-Cola and Powerade and Samsung and shoots celebrities like Justin Bieber and Usher and he's just a really inspiring guy living in New York City.

• 2:40Lewis Howes?

  And today I ask him a bunch of questions about what entrepreneurs can learn about design and branding and visual poetry for their business and also what it would be like for people to start looking at their lives from behind the lens, what they could create for themselves and what they could project to the world with a photographer's eye. So I'm very excited to share with you a lot of these different insights that Nick has and I think you're really gonna enjoy this episode. In the meantime, I want to make sure to give a quick shout out to our sponsor onit.com, which we're gonna be having Aubrey Marcus, the CEO of Onnit on very soon and I'm very

• 3:25Lewis Howes?

  excited about this because he has built a huge business himself and he's gonna give away the secret to how he's done so well marketing his company and it's pretty much different than everyone else does in marketing and I think you guys are really gonna enjoy that episode as well. So, and you guys all love a nice little discount. So with that guys, I'm very excited to introduce to you my good friend, the life baller and lifestyle photographer, Mr. Nick Onk.

• 4:08Lewis Howes?

  What is up everyone and welcome back to the School of Greatness. Classes in session today with my man, good friend Nick Onken. What's up, brother?

• 4:17Speaker 01

  What up?

• 4:18Lewis Howes?

  We are, uh, we've been having a little chat session. You know, I have this amazing view that all of my guests get to look at in the studio and it's looking over all the Hollywood Hills, downtown LA, you can see the Sunset Strip, Hollywood Strip, all the good stuff. It's just fun to connect, man.

• 4:35Speaker 01

  It's rough. I mean, that view.

• 4:37Lewis Howes?

  It's fun to look at the view and just connect on life and talk about all the fun things we've been up to. Nick's been up to some amazing things lately and, uh, one of our conversations has been about emotional intelligence. We're having a lot of intimate connection time as bros, so it's been a lot of fun. But for those who do not know Nick Onken, he is, in my mind, he's one of the top lifestyle photographers in the world. Really creative and I call him a life baller. So he's had clients, his clients have been Adidas, Nike, Coca-Cola, Old Navy, Powerade, Samsung, and a bunch of other cool celebrities like the Bieber, Justin Bieber. And what I want to know first is what is about photography that really inspires you?

• 5:19Speaker 01

  Wow, that's a big one. I would say the biggest thing is, uh, that I, that got me in to photography was the travel aspect of it. I love traveling. It's one of my biggest passions and, um, photography fits right into that. And I created a career doing both and that's been the amazing and inspiring journey that I've had. Being able to go over to over 60 countries and ended up working into writing a book on travel photography. And a lot of great things have come out of it, but travel and, and experiencing other cultures and being able to document that and, and find the joy in the, in the world around us is, has been inspiring and is.

• 6:01Lewis Howes?

  What's been the biggest lesson or biggest fascination about the 60 countries you've journeyed to? What's been the biggest thing you've learned about the world or yourself or anything?

• 6:10Speaker 01

  I'd say the biggest thing is we have it good here. I mean,

• 6:14Lewis Howes?

  The US is. A nice lifestyle.

• 6:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, we're truly blessed to, I, I'm very blessed to be able to do a job that I love and to be able to make money and make a living at it and to travel and to create, get to create whatever I want to create. A lot of other countries don't have that opportunity. It's, it's very limiting in other countries and that's, I feel like that's why you see a lot of immigrants that come to the US and they do really well because they realize the opportunity that we have here. Uh, the value of hard work and that's the thing I appreciate about being from the US and um, the world, traveling the world has actually shown that to me. I mean, I've been everywhere from Africa to India and Europe and Asia.

• 6:58Speaker 01

  And have seen many, many different walks of life and religions and it's opened my, it's shaped my point of view tremendously to experience that kind of stuff.

• 7:09Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. It's, you know, if you work hard here and you work smart, you can make a good life for yourself in the US.

• 7:15Speaker 01

  Hundred percent, hundred percent.

• 7:17Lewis Howes?

  So, we have a, I mean, I haven't traveled as many countries as you. I've been around a little bit, uh, Europe, South America and things like that, but that's the same feeling I have every time I come back. I mean, I was just in Spain, it's beautiful country, amazing people, but it's also like, man, we have it good. You know, we have it, we're so blessed, I'm so blessed. It's just an amazing opportunity. Like, everything is better. It just seems like that way. I mean, in some ways it's not, but in a lot of ways, it seems like things are, let's say, uh, more efficient or more, uh, lenient or just like the, you know, everything.

• 7:53Speaker 01

  So much more opportunity.

• 7:54Lewis Howes?

  Cleaner, you know, opportunity, yeah. Easier, it seems like. So, it's, uh, it's amazing life. We are blessed, man. So you got into photography originally because of travel as well, right?

• 8:05Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 8:06Lewis Howes?

  You wanted to do both. You were traveling and you wanted to document, you wanted to do all these things together, right?

• 8:09Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, the, uh, the traveling aspect of it really opened my eyes to, to photography. Uh, I was a graphic designer before. And I, the way I got into photography was that I, I bought a digital camera to shoot photos for my design work and to integrate them in and have that as an asset. That's when digital photography started coming on the scene and, um, Eventually, I was, uh, my friend had just gotten back from Africa. He's building a network, a computer network for a nonprofit out there. And I, he got back and he was telling me about this and I was like, man, I wish I could do that. I wish I could give my time and do something that I, you know, that I love. But graphic design, you don't really have to be there.

• 8:51Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 8:52Speaker 01

  So I was like, what could I do? And at this point, I had a few photos that I had thrown up at my design website. And I approached, I was like, well, why don't I pitch the idea of a photo library uh, to one of my nonprofit design clients? And so I did, and they were like, yeah, that sounds great. Let's do it. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, let's do it. Yeah, let's do this.

• 9:13Lewis Howes?

  You've never done it before?

• 9:14Speaker 01

  No.

• 9:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 9:15Speaker 01

  No, I had no clue what I was doing. And now I look back on it, I just kind of laugh. But you know, part of that was just taking the step and really doing into something that I wanted to do and that I loved. And from there, I went to four countries in Africa. I went to Zimbabwe, Uganda, Kenya, Burundi, and then four countries and Europe after that. And Africa really, really rocked my world. Like I, I didn't even know how to function for two months, three months after I got back.

• 9:43Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 9:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, just because what you see there, if you see in the developing world for the first time, uh, especially Africa, and you see the way people live and you see it breaks your heart. You know, you just wanna help people and, and I don't know. It like coming back and operating in a world that we live in just makes you feel so off balance and like, how do we, you know, live in so much excess? And all these questions and, you know, it, it took me a little while to get through that and, and readapt and you learn. I learned so much from that experience and it translated into my wanderlust

• 10:27Speaker 01

  and the curiosity of the world and to. Make me want to travel more.

• 10:32Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 10:33Speaker 01

  So the photography and and I got back and I got some really, you know, great images and the client was happy and it really opened my eyes to the possibility of doing it as a career, which I had never even considered or thought before. And that was that was eye opening in and of itself because I was married to doing design. That was what my first like that was my passion. That was what I was what I loved doing. And this just opened it up a world of possibility.

• 11:03Lewis Howes?

  Wow, amazing. Now, when I think of a photographer, I think of a storyteller. So how do you tell an amazing story through a single picture?

• 11:14Speaker 01

  Whoa, great question. A lot about it is point of view and what you see or what I see, how I see the world and and your vision. Vision is such a key component to this and point of view because you're telling what you're seeing. And to be able to go into a moment and tell what's going on and tell the elements in one frame is such a huge challenge. And you're you're solving problems is in in the moment is what you're doing. You're constantly solving problems as as a photographer. And so telling that story can come in different ways. It could be it's as a photographer, it's your reflection of

• 11:59Speaker 01

  who you are and what you bring to the table. And for me, I think the biggest concept constant was is in my vision and what I evoke is is the joy. Finding joy in in people around the world and and evoking that joy and and that happiness.

• 12:15Lewis Howes?

  Nice. I love it. So what is about? How can you tell a story that brings someone to tears? Or inspire someone to take action or?

• 12:28Lewis Howes?

  Buy your products or whatever it may be. How can you like evoke this emotion? What is it about the image? Or is it the purpose behind your intention? When you take the picture? Is it the the setting? Is it the person itself you're taking it of? Is the landscape? Or is it like a combination of everything? Is it the love you bring to it? What is it that brings people to tears?

• 12:50Speaker 01

  I feel like it's the the moments of authenticity. And that's what really what my vision and and my vision in my actual photo photography is is moments. And authenticity and just that you feel like you're there. You feel like you're feeling that that photo or that emotion. Or you feel like you're connecting with the subject. Uh, especially my travel work. I feel like it's a very it's you connect with the subjects. You connect with the with the people and the moments that are happening. Whether it's a landscape or a kid playing on the street. And that connection comes through my connection with that that subject and capturing that frame and capturing the moment.

• 13:34Speaker 01

  And, you know, the more you go embark on, the more I embark on journey, the more I grow, the more I learn. And the more I can evoke vision and evoke emotion from the uh, the people that I'm photographing.

• 13:52Lewis Howes?

  How do you decide what your subject matters are?

• 13:54Speaker 01

  In different in travel photography, it's kind of almost a serendipitous wandering. Where I'll walk around or be with a camera in any certain situation. And anything that's kind of in a photogenic that captures my eye. And whether it's like color or to a person or the type of person or the kids playing on the street or a beautiful landscape, whatever I'm kind of attracted to. I go and I I and I see a lot of times when I'm walking down the street, I almost see moments. And in a in a frame. And so I will walk around and capture that moment. Or I'll walk around if I see somebody and connect with them.

• 14:37Speaker 01

  I'll walk over to them and interact with them. And a lot of times, you know, a lot of times it's kids because kids have so much joy. And there's so much in the developing world, there's so much fun to interact with and it's inspiring. And so that's what I'm creating when I'm walking around.

• 14:56Lewis Howes?

  What do you think inspires people more? Photos of people, places or things?

• 15:02Speaker 01

  That's an interesting question. I mean, I think that's, I think, I feel like it's subjective to the viewer. Because some people are more captured by seeing photos of people and others are more captured by beautiful landscape. I'm captured by both and creating both, especially in my travel work.

• 15:20Lewis Howes?

  Beautiful people in beautiful landscapes.

• 15:22Speaker 01

  Even better.

• 15:23Lewis Howes?

  There you go. Double whammy, baby.

• 15:25Speaker 01

  Yeah, and that's part of what I get paid to do.

• 15:29Lewis Howes?

  Now, I call you, I think of you as a visual poet. And that's what I think that you do. You create this like poetry and images. So how important is design, branding and visual poetry, visual poetry for entrepreneurs or business owners? And can one photo make or break your product or the perception of your business to the world?

• 15:57Speaker 01

  Uh, yeah, a hundred percent. I mean, I have a background in, in design and branding, so it's been such a huge importance to me. And especially like what you're communicating as a brand, as a person, as an entrepreneur, of who you are and what you represent. And so much of it is subconscious. And when you're creating a brand, you want to convey subject or subconsciously, what you want people, how you want people to perceive you because branding is, is. Perception and you get to create that perception. So what you're communicating, whether it's through graphics or through photography, photography communicates what, who you are, what you do, what you're all about, what your product's all about. And that was a

• 16:42Speaker 01

  big thing, especially with the charity that I work with, Pencils of Promise. That was a big thing that I brought to the table when I met with Adam Braun, the founder, and I really saw that he understood the importance of branding and communication. And him and I really gelled on that and I was able to collaborate with him and travel to four different countries or three different countries for them and, and create materials and photographs that illustrate and communicate what work is being done over there and the hearts that are being touched and the kids that are receiving from what they, what Pencils of Promise does, building schools for kids in the developing world.

• 17:22Lewis Howes?

  Right. I mean, I understand the, the value of it. And the more we talked and hung out over the last couple of years, I saw that, you know, I really wanted to increase my perception of my brand on my website. And so I hired you to be my photographer and we did like a two day shoot. And since I've updated my site, obviously the design had a big play in it, but the photos impacted the design as well. And since then, I think it's been, I don't even know how long, six months or so, I continually get comments from people every single day in a week say, like, you have the best looking website, like in your space. It's like the best looking, it differentiates from everyone else. Like it's amazing. It's the standard. And I put a lot of credit, obviously to the design, but the photos bring the design to

• 18:05Lewis Howes?

  life. So I see the value in really finding the images that you want and the design you want to build a perception for your product, your company, or your personal brand. So I'm right with you. So what, what's the one picture that got away that you wish you could go back? If you had the opportunity to capture?

• 18:27Speaker 01

  That's a, that's a tough to pinpoint one. I feel like there's, sometimes there's a lot of moments that you miss along the way and it just hits in a, in a passing by kind of fashion. You like see it out of the corner of your eye and you're like, I don't know my camera and you're like.

• 18:42Speaker 01

  I wish I had my camera just then. Specifically, I couldn't put a name on on one, but it does happen all the time when you're just like, oh, that would have been an amazing photo and no camera to capture it.

• 18:55Lewis Howes?

  Where's one photo that you would like to capture then? Like, where's a place or an idea or a dream in your mind that you have that you're just like waiting for that moment to happen to capture the perfect moment?

• 19:09Lewis Howes?

  Do you have that vision?

• 19:10Speaker 01

  Um, I have a place that I would love to capture. It's Ha Long Bay in Vietnam. Uh, something about just the the blue waters, the high cliffs and the old Vietnamese boats. And the water, I would love to go there and experience and create something out of that.

• 19:28Lewis Howes?

  So imagine there's an exhibit at the MoMA. And you get to have one picture in it. And the next 20 years of your life. You're capturing moments. What would this one picture be in the MoMA of yours?

• 19:46Speaker 01

  Oh, my God.

• 19:47Lewis Howes?

  If you could have any image in the world. People, smiles, places, landscape. Moments, sports, action. A single. Tree, what would that image represent? For your perfect dream, your your your vision that everyone would see at the MoMA?

• 20:11Speaker 01

  I would probably say moments of joy, maybe moments of joy from around the world. Whether that image is specific, maybe it's a collection of images that kind of. Maybe maybe it's a collection of images of of that joy that I found around the world. I really don't have like a specific one image.

• 20:33Speaker 01

  That's such a tough question because every day I'm creating and every day, every every day is new moments and a lot of the way I see the world is is kind of stumbling upon those moments and evoking those moments naturally. So having something in specific in mind isn't necessarily the way I operate, uh, because so much of it is being in the moment and being present.

• 20:57Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, that's true.

• 20:59Speaker 01

  And and and creating out of experience. But that's my point of view. I mean, everybody, every photographer has a different point of view and and a different method of working and in a different way. And for me, I love experiencing, I love living life fully in the moment and uh, and creating what's around me.

• 21:19Lewis Howes?

  Right. What's the most powerful thing that someone can focus on as a photographer? That leaves the biggest impact. Is it perspective, framing, the lighting, color of the picture, depth of field, or something else?

• 21:34Speaker 01

  Uh, it's vision. Vision is the key. Um, and some, it takes a while to develop a vision too, when you're exploring your photographic journey, because once you find your vision, then the rest of it, framing, um, color, composition, it's all just tools to get what you want. And and ultimately, having the vision and the point of view and your voice is what's the most important. So you can use any tool. I mean, whether it's a film camera, digital camera, type of film, a post-process, a, you know, type of production, anything, those are all just tools to achieve what you want, what vision, what you want for your vision.

• 22:13Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. What can someone learn about being behind a camera for 24 hours about themselves?

• 22:20Speaker 01

  Can you like span upon that a little bit more?

• 22:23Lewis Howes?

  So say I'm a, I've given a challenge. I'm an entrepreneur, I'm an athlete, or I'm anyone. And you say, I want you to get behind this camera and shoot for 24 hours. Shoot whatever you want, but you can't stop shooting, or you can't stop looking to shoot something. What can they learn about themselves by looking through a lens at the world? For twenty four hours.

• 22:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, so you get to learn how to see, you get to learn how to observe and create what you want to create. You get to learn to find the moments and the details of whatever you're experiencing. You get to learn what you like, what you don't like, what you're attracted to, what you're not attracted to.

• 23:04Lewis Howes?

  Huh. What is it about photographers? What skills do they have that a lot of people lack? Maybe great photographers, I should say, because there's a million photographers, but.

• 23:13Speaker 01

  I mean, I would say the biggest thing is problem solving. And especially when you get into the commercial world and you get on set and you're running big productions and you're on location and you're trying to figure out how to light something or how to. There's so many different variables and moving parts. You've got to problem solve and figure out how to achieve your vision. You gotta achieve what you want in that photograph. So problem solving is number one.

• 23:40Lewis Howes?

  Now, you're an artist at heart, but really you have to become a business person to, you know, grow a business, photography business and stay alive and like make money. So do you feel like your art or your craft is tarnished sometimes or reduced? Because you are set on timelines, because you have restrictions, because you work for companies that hire you, big brands that have like all these limitations. Do you feel like it holds you back or how do you break through all the different moving parts in order to create this magical art still?

• 24:14Speaker 01

  Well, I think that's it's art versus commerce and that's the, that's the, that's the biggest dilemma. And that's what creative entrepreneurship is, is figuring out how to build that medium. And for me, it's always been doing the advertising, the commercial work that's not as fun creatively because it's been so watered down as, as the concepts get. Go from like the actual visual concept to the client kind of chipping away and you know, putting their brand values or their expectations or whatever they you know, the control and especially as the money, the budgets have shrank, they get more controlling of of the creative. So that gets a little bit knocked down as to the end product, you

• 24:54Speaker 01

  know, the the clients and the and the ad agencies still want my vision sprinkle on their on their concept. But so that's more of how to make money. And sometimes you just gotta suck it up, do it, and then go to the bank and then go create your own, create your own destiny, create your own art, do editorial work. And that's kind of the balance of the two. And it's, you know, the new vision for me is to to really start honing in and and combining those two and being able to do creative jobs that pay the same amount as as other, not as creative jobs.

• 25:30Lewis Howes?

  Right. That's the dream, right? So what is your dream as a photographer? What do you want people to experience? And what do you want them to feel every time they look at your work?

• 25:39Speaker 01

  Well, I wanna, I wanna to evoke the the visions of the brands and the the personalities and the celebrities and the magazines and editorials that I work with and encounter.

• 25:52Speaker 01

  Whether that's a doing a personal story with a celebrity for a magazine or shooting brands and advertising campaigns, I want it to be, I want to invoke more vision from the from each of those.

• 26:07Lewis Howes?

  What's a life baller?

• 26:11Speaker 01

  Great question. It's something we've talked about so much. But to me, a life baller is somebody who lives a life that they love, a job that they love, they make enough money to sort of to excel and they give back to the world. I think that those components and and having vision, having joy and and living life to the fullest.

• 26:34Lewis Howes?

  So what's your definition of greatness then?

• 26:37Speaker 01

  Life ballers.

• 26:37Lewis Howes?

  Is that what it is?

• 26:39Speaker 01

  I mean, if you have every component of like being successful, loving what you do and giving back to the world and being completely happy, I mean, that's greatness. Inspiring others to do what they love and to create and to be the best that they could be. That's greatness.

• 26:59Lewis Howes?

  I love it. What's next for you, man? What do you have going on in the future?

• 27:02Speaker 01

  Well, coming up here, um, been, been working on reinvigorating the shop talk blog that I started a long time ago, but shifting it into a completely new vision of, of talking about creative entrepreneurship and, and emotional intelligence and how those two intertwine and, and doing creative inspirations and interviewing other life baller artists in any, any sort of arena, whether it's fashion designers or directors or artists, painters, other photographers, anything kind of in that creative realm of people that are doing succeeding and interviewing in them and evoking their vision and hearing their stories and their struggles of how they got to where they are. Because creative entrepreneurship is, it's, it's not an easy thing.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  It's a, it's a, it's an amazing thing to be able to, to make a living at what you do, but it's not the easiest track. There's a lot of things through the journey, a lot of struggles, a lot of emotions that you go through to get to the, the point where actually making a living and being successful at doing art. So the new blog is going to kind of feature that and feature different things of the way I live my life through travel, through fitness, through, you know, health and probably even more stuff. The, the vision's growing, so planning on trying to launch that in the next few months. And I'm very excited about it.

• 28:18Lewis Howes?

  I want to ask a couple more questions. What has you learned about yourself lately that you thought was never possible?

• 28:24Speaker 01

  What did I learn about myself? I, it's, it's been, the last few months have been an amazing journey. I've just been taking this leadership training through emotional intelligence and. It's amazing how much we ourselves hold our own selves back from our true potential and from being unstoppable. And a lot of what I wanna, you know, it takes me back to the creative, like the, the journey of building this creative business is all the emotions that you experience going through it. And had I taken this thing like 10 years ago to learn and to be able to understand what I was going through, what I have been going through, and it, it happens every day in any sort of business and entrepreneurial world

• 29:07Speaker 01

  where you're, there's struggles and there's like getting to the next level and there's, you know, everything in that realm and, and the creative world is so, creative entrepreneurship world is directly tied to that because your, your product is your vision, which is personal. It's your art. And when you're selling your art, it has effect, it, it affects you personally, whether some people are hiring you or not hiring you, you're getting jobs, you're not getting jobs. It, it affects you either way. And it's on an emotional level. And to learn to, to be way more aware of those emotions and how to shift now, shift out of the, the negative, limiting beliefs, the negative conversations that you have so much going,

• 29:51Speaker 01

  going through this journey, because it's so much of it is tied to your, your personal well-being.

• 29:57Lewis Howes?

  So based on what you've learned so far in the last few months, and knowing all the connections you have in the creative entrepreneurial world, what are the biggest things that holds creative entrepreneurs back, photographers, or any type of artist that wants to create something and also make a living with it? What's the biggest thing that holds them back from being successful or reaching their, their goals or having it all? Creating art, having money, having time, and all that? What's, what's holding them back?

• 30:26Speaker 01

  I think the biggest thing is self-trust and, and value, because you have to have the value to create the vision to be able to get to where you want to be. And you really have to believe in yourself and you really have to believe in your art. And that's why... It that struggle is so strong is because when you're getting hired or you're not getting hired, you're just getting tussled back and forth between that self-trust of, am I good enough? Am I not good enough? If I, why, if this person's not hiring me, am I not good enough? Or what's wrong with me, you know? And then you get on this hive when people are hiring you, you're like, ah, this is amazing. I'm on top of the world. And then it's just such a roller coaster ride.

• 31:08Speaker 01

  And, you know, entrepreneur, the freelance creative entrepreneurial world is so feast or famine. And you'll just be balling for a month and then have like two months without work. And so getting through that is, is very emotional. Uh, especially as your overhead gets higher and higher, you have a lot more stress and, and wondering if, if, you know, when that next job or paycheck is coming.

• 31:32Lewis Howes?

  So how does someone break through that? Or how someone manage their emotions about what they tell themselves or feel daily? Or what they react to from other people or circumstances? How does someone manage that?

• 31:44Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 31:45Lewis Howes?

  As a creative entrepreneur, how would you manage that?

• 31:47Speaker 01

  Well, I'd take this emotional intelligence and leadership class up ahead of time. So you can actually really understand what those.

• 31:54Lewis Howes?

  But based on what you've learned, what, what could you share?

• 31:57Speaker 01

  Yeah, based off of what I've learned, it's, it's really A about vision and knowing exactly what you want. I mean, when I became a photographer, when I decided I wanted to be a photographer, I knew the end goal. So I did whatever it took to get to where I wanted to be. And then that is the biggest key, the biggest key.

• 32:12Lewis Howes?

  It didn't matter if someone's like saying no or rejecting you, you're like, okay, how do I figure out how to get there? Right?

• 32:17Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 32:17Lewis Howes?

  What's the next path?

• 32:18Speaker 01

  Yeah. What's the next path? Who do I talk to? Who do I learn from? How do I learn the gear? How do I learn this? How do I, you know, do I, I gotta go out and hustle? I gotta go out and create what a portfolio of, of work that people want will convince people to hire me.

• 32:32Lewis Howes?

  You gotta invest in a website, a really nice one and like get an agent and do all these things, right?

• 32:37Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, there's so many things. And when you have the vision of the end goal, then you'll do all those things. You'll figure it out. You'll figure out what you want to do, whatever it takes to get there.

• 32:47Lewis Howes?

  So when you're getting, when you were getting knocked down or just things weren't happening at times, how did you react to yourself? What did you tell yourself? Were you giving yourself positive reinforcement or were you beating yourself up? And then moving on, like, what were you doing?

• 33:00Speaker 01

  Um, sometimes it's a back and forth thing and, and the first part of my career was a lot different than when I saw some, I saw a lot of success and then it plateaued a little bit and you get, a lot of times you get used to being comfortable. So when you're, the first part of it was very uncomfortable. So you kind of get used to like the buildup and being told no and like, and you're just like on to the next one, on to the next one, on to the next one. And then you get comfortable and you get in this rhythm of like acceleration and just through the waves of business, it's not always going to be completely a hundred percent up. The business is going to ebb and flow and that's something that I experienced and you really have to shift and trust that things are going to be okay and things are going to be taken care of.

• 33:46Speaker 01

  It's not always the easiest thing.

• 33:47Lewis Howes?

  What if a year, two years goes by and you haven't made any money and you're broke and living back with parents?

• 33:55Speaker 01

  That won't happen.

• 33:56Lewis Howes?

  Does it, does that mean you haven't shifted the right way?

• 33:59Speaker 01

  Yeah, you're probably, your, your conversations in your head are probably talking yourself down and, and telling yourself you can't do it. And you know, a hundred percent is possible a hundred percent of the time and you can create that. You get to create what you want to create. Like if I, if I started not getting certain jobs, there's other jobs that I can go and create to pay the bills.

• 34:21Lewis Howes?

  Right. Shifting, being aware, being present.

• 34:24Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 34:24Lewis Howes?

  Doing whatever it takes, problem solving. That's what you said is the biggest thing you learned is problem solving, right?

• 34:29Speaker 01

  You know, yeah, on set and even in business because you're, you're trying to figure out what you need to do next. And there's always something that you haven't encountered and you have to like problem solve to get it done, whether it's like figuring out your brand or figuring out, figuring out your portfolio.

• 34:42Lewis Howes?

  Website or whatever.

• 34:43Speaker 01

  All of it. Yeah. And then the new ventures and I mean, I just, my, my brain is just like, I keep getting new ideas of things that I want to do. And then, you know, trying to create that and then you like creating the time for everything. Um, this is another whole problem solving.

• 34:59Lewis Howes?

  Other topic. Yeah. Well, where can we find you online, my man?

• 35:04Speaker 01

  My website is nickonken.com, N-I-C-K-O-N-K-E-N.

• 35:11Speaker 01

  Same on Instagram and Twitter, Nick Onken, Facebook, Nick Onken.

• 35:16Lewis Howes?

  Everywhere. And the new site's coming out soon, so make sure to get on his list, his newsletter, and check out his stuff. It's gonna be having some amazing articles, interviews with other life ballers, with some amazing visuals. That's all gonna be intertwined in the mix. So, I love your site, I love your work, I love you brother, and thanks for coming on the School of Greatness channel.

• 35:38Speaker 01

  Thank you.

• 35:48Lewis Howes?

  And there you have it guys, I hope you enjoyed today's episode with Mr. Nick Onken, the life baller himself. I enjoyed this conversation so much because I think you can always learn something from someone that's outside of your expertise. And it's always fun for me to bring on authors and Olympic athletes and things like that, but when I get to bring on artists who really are master of their craft, that's when I get to learn something new about myself, and how I can apply their skills, their information, to what I'm doing in my life, my sport, and my business, and my relationships. So I'm so happy and blessed to have Nick on.

• 36:27Lewis Howes?

  Make sure to give a quick shout out to Nick on Twitter or Instagram, @NickOnken. Share this episode, please, with your friends. Go on schoolofgreatness.com, check out the show notes for this episode, you'll see some other cool photos on there as well, and all the other good stuff about Nick Onkens at schoolofgreatness.com. Please share it with your friends over on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Google+, anywhere you want to share it and get the word out, I'd be super grateful. And if you have not yet, please go over to iTunes and leave us a review and rating over on iTunes. We'd love to get more reviews and ratings from you guys and get your feedback over there. In the meantime, I've got another big

• 37:11Lewis Howes?

  episode coming up next week, so stay tuned, get ready for the next episode of greatness, and make sure to go out there guys today and do something great.

• 37:27Speaker 02

  I wanna kill the world Oh

• 37:41Speaker 02

  I wanna kill the world Oh

• 37:54Speaker 02

  I wanna kill the world Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh Oh