318 Michael Hyatt on Leaving the Drift & Getting Back Your Life

"When you get clear on the what, the how starts showing up." - Michael Hyatt If you enjoyed this episode, check out show notes and more at http://lewishowes.com/318 Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This is episode number 318 with New York Times bestselling author, Michael Hyatt.

• 0:07Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:33Speaker 00

  Welcome everyone to this special episode with my dear friend, Michael Hyatt. I just got back from San Diego where I was giving a speech at the Social Media Marketing World Conference. And had a great time connecting with so many people I've known for years in the online marketing, social media space. It was just a lot of fun to catch up. I feel like it's a high school reunion every time I go back there. And I got a chance to sit down with Michael Hyatt. He's a New York Times bestselling author. He's the former chairman and CEO of Thomas Nelson Publishers. And he has a blog that gets over a million unique visitors a month. And he's also an expert in the field of social media.

• 1:14Speaker 00

  His blog is ranked by Google in the top one-half percent of all blogs with more than 1 million page views a month. And Forbes Magazine named him one of the top 10 online marketing experts to follow. And one of the top 50 social media influencers. And Michael is one of those guys that just spews integrity and everything he create is of the highest value. And some of the things we cover today in this episode are what the drift is and why so many of us get caught in it. The three questions to ask yourself to live an intentional life. Why Michael puts himself as the number two priority in his life over everything else. And how your priorities can give you courage with every decision you make.

• 1:59Speaker 00

  We cover that and so much more in this episode, number 318, with the one, the only, Michael Hyatt.

• 2:12Lewis Howes?

  Welcome back on one of the School of Greatness Podcast. Very excited I got my good friend, Michael Hyatt.

• 2:16Speaker 02

  Good to see you.

• 2:17Lewis Howes?

  Good to see you, buddy. Very excited, New York Times bestselling author. And got a new book out called Living Forward: A Proven Plan to Stop Drifting and Get the Life You Want. We'll have it all linked up here in the show notes and also on the YouTube channel below. Make sure to check out this book. We're here in San Diego. We're at a social media conference. And when did I first meet you? Probably like four years ago, right?

• 2:39Speaker 02

  Yeah, it was probably about four years ago.

• 2:40Lewis Howes?

  And then, of course, you came to Nashville and stayed at my home.

• 2:43Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 2:44Lewis Howes?

  Got to meet my family.

• 2:45Speaker 02

  That was amazing.

• 2:46Lewis Howes?

  That was amazing. And I've been to Nashville twice with you, right?

• 2:49Speaker 02

  Oh, wow.

• 2:50Lewis Howes?

  We did like a Nashville Mafia.

• 2:52Speaker 02

  Which was a blast.

• 2:53Lewis Howes?

  Which I have the photo in my studio, which was awesome. And I came back and did your podcast for my book, so I appreciate you having me on there.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  You gotta come back again so we can do another Nashville media meetup.

• 3:03Lewis Howes?

  I'd love to. Maybe next year when my book comes out, we'll do it again.

• 3:06Speaker 02

  Okay, good. I'll host you.

• 3:08Lewis Howes?

  And when's your next book coming out? You don't know yet?

• 3:10Speaker 02

  Probably about a year and a half.

• 3:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, so around the same time.

• 3:12Speaker 02

  Yeah, good. Okay, great.

• 3:14Lewis Howes?

  So, Michael is an incredible leader in the online space, but you're also a publisher. You had a publishing company for a number of years, right?

• 3:21Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, I spent my entire career practically in the book publishing world. Most recently, as the chairman and CEO of Thomas Nelson Publishers. But I left that in 2011 to go stake my claim in speaking and online marketing and all that, something I'd always dreamed of doing.

• 3:36Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 3:37Speaker 02

  And I'm loving it. Five years, just past my five-year anniversary.

• 3:40Lewis Howes?

  You've blown up. You wrote a book called Platform, right?

• 3:42Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 3:43Lewis Howes?

  First one?

• 3:44Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 3:45Lewis Howes?

  And your audience has just blown up. Your blog is, I don't know, probably one of the top blogs in the leadership space. You're getting, what, a half a million visitors a month, somewhere around there?

• 3:53Speaker 02

  Yep, about a half a million.

• 3:54Lewis Howes?

  You've got a huge online marketing course called Platform University, correct?

• 3:59Speaker 02

  Right.

• 4:00Lewis Howes?

  And you're just doing an incredible job.

• 4:01Speaker 02

  Thank you.

• 4:02Lewis Howes?

  So, if anyone wants to learn how to become a leader in this space, follow Michael Hyatt. Now, you've got this book out called Living Forward. And you break it down with asking three questions, right?

• 4:11Speaker 02

  I do.

• 4:11Lewis Howes?

  And what are those three questions?

• 4:12Speaker 02

  Okay, before we do that?

• 4:14Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 4:14Speaker 02

  Can we talk about the drift? Cause this like sets the whole thing up.

• 4:18Lewis Howes?

  A lot of people are in the drift.

• 4:19Speaker 02

  A lot of people are in the drift.

• 4:20Lewis Howes?

  A lot of people. And what is the drift?

• 4:21Speaker 02

  Okay, so my wife Gail, we've been married for 38 years. In fact, she's flying in tonight, can't wait to see her.

• 4:27Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 4:27Speaker 02

  But after we'd been married about 10 years, we decided to go on a vacation in Hawaii and celebrate our anniversary. Except, we were pretty much broke.

• 4:34Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 4:35Speaker 02

  So, cashing all the airline miles, we got there, we rented a car, got a hotel, but we didn't really have any money left over for entertainment.

• 4:42Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 4:43Speaker 02

  But we decided to go snorkeling because the lessons were free. So we took our lessons, they took us out on the reef. Have you ever snorkelled in Hawaii?

• 4:50Lewis Howes?

  Yes, but not like far out.

• 4:52Speaker 02

  Oh my gosh, I mean it exploded.

• 4:54Lewis Howes?

  Yes, it's insane.

• 4:55Speaker 02

  So we said-

• 4:56Lewis Howes?

  I saw an eel when I was doing it and I kinda got scared, so I haven't been out-

• 4:59Speaker 02

  That would freak me out.

• 5:00Lewis Howes?

  It sounded like a little eel like hissing at me, so it was like, uh, I wanna go back.

• 5:04Speaker 02

  Well, we found out we could rent snorkeling gear for like 10 bucks for the whole week, so we said, okay, cool. So, next morning, we went to the lagoon that was adjacent to our hotel. It was, the water was crystal clear, totally calm, there wasn't another soul out there, it was really early in the morning. And we started paddling around, and it was like swimming in an aquarium.

• 5:21Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 5:22Speaker 02

  You know, all the fish, multicolored fish, the seaweed swaying in the sunlight, and we were just totally captivated. Finally, after about 45 minutes, I decided to look up. I went, oh my gosh. We had drifted, got caught in a riptide, and we were so far out to sea, thankfully we were together. We were so far out that the hotel looked like a postage stamp in the distance. Scared me to death.

• 5:46Lewis Howes?

  Like a mile away or something?

• 5:47Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know, I mean-

• 5:48Lewis Howes?

  It's far away.

• 5:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, far away, and Gail lifted up her head, she screamed, she said, what are we gonna do? We had a boogie board, thankfully. I said, we're gonna swim like crazy and try to get back. And I didn't even know you're not supposed to swim against a riptide. Fortunately, I think it had, you know, gone out by that time.

• 6:02Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 6:02Speaker 02

  But we swam hard for 45 minutes, maybe an hour, pulled ourselves up on the beach, collapsed, and we'd never been snorkeling again till last fall. I mean, such a scary experience.

• 6:12Lewis Howes?

  It's scary.

• 6:13Speaker 02

  But this is how most people live their lives.

• 6:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 6:16Speaker 02

  You know, they don't wake up in the morning and say, hey, you know, I think I'm gonna stop taking care of myself, start eating junk food, get really sick and maybe if I'm lucky I'll have a heart attack.

• 6:24Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 6:25Speaker 02

  Or they don't, oh, you know, walk away after getting married and say, I think I'll stop dating my spouse, stop connecting- And end up separated or divorced. That doesn't happen. They drift to that end because they don't have an intention to do anything different. And you see it in careers, you see it in health, you see it in marriage, you see it in parenting. And so if this book has a villain, it's the drift. Because living with intention, creating a life plan is the exact opposite. And probably 2% of the people in the world don't fall into the drift. They're living intentionally.

• 6:59Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 6:59Speaker 02

  They're creating their outcomes. But the main thing is that people never drift to a destination they would have chosen.

• 7:06Lewis Howes?

  What do you mean? I mean, you go to somewhere you don't want to be.

• 7:09Speaker 02

  You're gonna go someplace you don't want to be.

• 7:10Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 7:10Speaker 02

  You're gonna find yourself...

• 7:11Lewis Howes?

  You're not gonna land in success when you're drifting.

• 7:13Speaker 02

  I mean, it might happen, but it's very unlikely.

• 7:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 7:17Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 7:18Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Yeah, I mean, even the ones at the top 1% who are intentional can sometimes be in the drift for a week or a month.

• 7:26Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 7:26Lewis Howes?

  Get all trapped or something.

• 7:27Speaker 02

  I mean, it happens to me.

• 7:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Happens to all of us.

• 7:29Speaker 02

  You know, where I just, I mean, just recently, I just went through the book promotion here and so for six weeks, that was all I was doing.

• 7:36Lewis Howes?

  You were in the drift while you were promoting to not be in the drift?

• 7:39Speaker 02

  Exactly. I mean, so, you know, I wasn't working out like I normally do.

• 7:43Lewis Howes?

  You're having junk food a little bit here and there.

• 7:44Speaker 02

  I'm traveling crazy. Yep.

• 7:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 7:47Speaker 02

  So, you know, you just have to get back and dial it back in and swim for the shore and get more intentional.

• 7:51Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. Interesting. Okay, so for those that are in the drift already, is it too late for them?

• 7:57Speaker 02

  Absolutely not.

• 7:57Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 7:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's the cool thing. Yeah, so there's, at any point along the way, you can get intentional. And what Daniel and I advocate in the book is creating a life plan.

• 8:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 8:06Speaker 02

  Now, I don't know how much experience you've had creating strategic plans, but in the corporate world where I came from...

• 8:12Lewis Howes?

  That's all you do, huh?

• 8:13Speaker 02

  I mean, we'd go off for a three-day retreat with 70 people. We'd create this huge strategic plan notebook, and it would have timelines and resort lists and gants chants and all that stuff. We'd bring it home, put it on the shelf, never look at it again.

• 8:26Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 8:27Speaker 02

  So that's not what we're talking about.

• 8:28Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 8:29Speaker 02

  So with a life plan, you're talking about a brief, simple document that you create. You can't outsource it.

• 8:35Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 8:35Speaker 02

  But it's only about 12 to 15 pages long.

• 8:37Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 8:38Speaker 02

  But it covers every area of your life, and it really talks about what you envision for a better future. What are the destinations that you want to visit? What does perfect health look like for you? What does a great relationship with a significant other look like? What does your career or your business look like?

• 8:53Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 8:54Speaker 02

  And so we take you through that process in the book, and that's where the three questions come in.

• 8:57Lewis Howes?

  Amazing. Okay, so what are the three questions? What's the first one?

• 8:59Speaker 02

  I thought you'd ask that. Thank you. The first is, the first one is, how do you want to be remembered? Now, here's why this is such a powerful question. Stephen Covey said, "Start with the end in mind." Well, this is like the ultimate of that. This is like the last moment. The last moment. So, we invite you to act as if you were an invisible guest at your own funeral. Wow. So, there in the front row are your loved ones, you know, your family. Behind them are your friends, behind them, maybe your colleagues, people you work with, contractors, employees, whatever. And what would they say if they were asked to step up to the mic and give a eulogy? Now, for most people, it's a little scary because probably the people that mean the most to them, they just kind of know that maybe they really haven't been relating to

• 9:44Speaker 02

  them in the way they want to, and there's a gap between what they would like for that person to say and what they would really say. And so, for a lot of people, in fact, the gal we met in the lobby, Sherri, started crying when she was talking about it. Yeah. Because she said it was a very emotional experience for her. But here's the good news, you're not dead yet. So, what you can do is you can begin to influence those conversations today. Steve Jobs said, two years before he died, this was almost prophetic. Yeah. He said, "Death is the single best tool I've ever found for making the important decisions in life." Wow. Because he knew he was going to die. He did. Right? He did. And so, we take, we take you through these legacy statements, where you create these legacy statements in terms of how you want to be remembered by the people that are most

• 10:29Speaker 02

  significant to you. And it's a powerful, powerful exercise that's designed to do one thing, give you clarity about what's really important. Yeah. Because you can begin to inform those conversations now. My, there's always conversations at a funeral. You know, you're talking about the deceased, you're talking about what they meant to you, what was the legacy of their life? And sometimes we think legacy is for somebody like, you know, Margaret Thatcher, or Abraham Lincoln had a legacy, and Bill Clinton will have a legacy, and, but the truth is, all of us are going to have a legacy. Yeah. The only question is, is it going to be a good one or a bad one? What's the mark that we're going to leave in the world? So, back in 2005, my father-in-law died. He was a Air Force Colonel, had lived an incredible life, left behind this great legacy

• 11:14Speaker 02

  and his five children, including my wife, who was the youngest. And he and I were very close, he meant the world to me. And so he had this full military funeral where the jets were flying over and 21 gun salute, all this. I don't think they do that anymore.

• 11:28Lewis Howes?

  That's emotional.

• 11:29Speaker 02

  It was very emotional.

• 11:30Lewis Howes?

  The flag on the thing and everything.

• 11:31Speaker 02

  Yes, presented it to my mother-in-law. So then, fast forward to, at the end of the funeral, we go back to my house, all the relatives there, all the friends, and we're hauling out these photo albums. And we're just telling these stories. You know, we're laughing, we're crying, and we're talking about what he meant to us. And it dawned on me, we can begin to engineer those conversations today.

• 11:54Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 11:55Speaker 02

  By being intentional in the relationships that matter most. And so that first question is really powerful. How do you want to be remembered? Go to the end of your life, get clarity, because the truth is, we're not going to live forever. That's kind of the...

• 12:07Lewis Howes?

  We're not? I know it's... Technology can't advance that?

• 12:10Speaker 02

  Well, you know, hopefully, we're going to live longer, but probably not forever.

• 12:13Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Maybe in like a couple thousand years, someone will figure out a way to make us live a few hundred years.

• 12:18Speaker 02

  Forever, yeah.

• 12:19Lewis Howes?

  Forever, who knows? Anything's possible in my mind. Interesting. So what's your answer to the first question?

• 12:24Speaker 02

  Well, my answer to the first question, because I've written down these series of legacy statements, and said, I'll just tell you a few of these. Like, I talked about Gail, here's what I said about her. Here's how I want to be remembered. I want Gail to remember how I loved her, understood her, pursued her, and helped her accomplish her dreams. I want her to remember specific times that we shared together, times we laughed, times we cried, times we spent discussing things that were important to both of us, and times we just held one another and watched the sunset. Here's another one. This is one for my followers, because you and I, you know, have followers in social media, and I actually wrote a legacy statement about those.

• 13:02Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 13:03Speaker 02

  So I said, I want them to remember my transparency, authenticity, and generosity. I want them to remember how I exceeded their expectations and gave them compelling, life-changing content and resources. Most of all, I want them to see in me... A model of a life worth emulating.

• 13:18Lewis Howes?

  Wow, it's pretty powerful.

• 13:19Speaker 02

  So just trying to get clear on what the end game is here. So that's the first question.

• 13:23Lewis Howes?

  I love it. Okay, so question one, get clear on the end.

• 13:25Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 13:26Lewis Howes?

  Okay, question two.

• 13:27Speaker 02

  Question two is what matters most to you? Now, most of us know what's important to our spouse or our significant other. We know what's important to our boss if we have a job. We may know what's important to our shareholders if we're running a company, or what's important to our society. But this is a question about what's important to you. Because the myth is, we can kind of do it all.

• 13:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 13:50Speaker 02

  Well, we can do anything we want, we just can't do everything we want. So we have to make decisions. And the truth is, our lives, where you're at right today and where I'm at today, is in large part a result of all the decisions that we made along the way and our priorities. So in this exercise, what Daniel and I help you do is identify the major life accounts. And we refer to them almost like a bank account. You know, like, you've got a relationship, if you're married, with your spouse. And that's like a bank account that can be overdrawn, you know? Or you can have a surplus in it, or you could be kind of spinning what you're bringing in.

• 14:23Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 14:24Speaker 02

  Same thing with your health, same thing if you're a parent, you know, same thing with your job, same thing with your career, your finances, all that. So all these life accounts, how do they stack up? What's the priority? So, for me, you know, this is just, I'm a person of faith, so God comes number one. But number two's kind of a surprise to people because I put myself number two. Then comes Gail, my wife, then my kids, then my job's like number five.

• 14:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 14:50Speaker 02

  So the reason I put myself so high on the list is it's like when you, I just flew in today into San Diego.

• 14:57Lewis Howes?

  Put your mask on first.

• 14:58Speaker 02

  Put your mask on first.

• 14:59Lewis Howes?

  That's it.

• 14:59Speaker 02

  That's exactly right.

• 15:00Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. I always tell people, you know, the most important person in the world is yourself.

• 15:04Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 15:04Lewis Howes?

  And if you're neglecting all of your needs first and giving to everyone else but not to you, then you're not going to go to serve more people.

• 15:11Speaker 02

  That, well, that's the key, what you just said, Lewis, because to me, the essence of leadership is service.

• 15:15Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 15:16Speaker 02

  I want to serve my wife, I want to serve my kids and my sons-in-law and my grandkids. I want to serve the people that work for me.

• 15:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 15:23Speaker 02

  But if I'm sick, I can't do that.

• 15:25Lewis Howes?

  Can't do anything, yeah.

• 15:25Speaker 02

  If my marriage is blown up, I can't do that. If my business is in trouble or I'm financially spinning out of control, I can't do that.

• 15:31Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 15:32Speaker 02

  So these priorities are really important to identify. Now, it really helps in kind of the warp and woof of life when you have to make some really tough decisions. Another example. In 2009, I was the CEO of Thomas Nelson. We were in the middle of the recession. It was brutal.

• 15:48Lewis Howes?

  Thomas Nelson is a publishing company?

• 15:50Speaker 02

  It's a publishing company, large. It was, at the time, it was seventh largest publishing company in the US, was acquired by Harper Collins, now a division of Harper Collins. And we were in the middle of the recession. It was hand-to-hand combat, and we were working like crazy, just trying to keep the ship afloat.

• 16:05Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 16:06Speaker 02

  And I was tired. I was wrung out. I wasn't spending as much time with my wife as I know I needed to, or with my family. And so I told the board, I said, "I gotta have a vacation, guys. Otherwise, I'm just gonna burn out." They said, "Great, do it." So, we decided, "We're gonna go to Colorado, deep in the Rockies, and just unplug and unwind." And we love Colorado, so...

• 16:24Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Did you go snowboarding or skiing, or were you just more hanging out, hiking?

• 16:27Speaker 02

  Yeah. It was, at this time, it was the winter.

• 16:30Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 16:31Speaker 02

  So, we were in a friend's cabin, really deep in the woods.

• 16:34Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 16:35Speaker 02

  But we kinda like fantasized about this for weeks and weeks and weeks. So, we're flying to Denver. We're gonna drive up into the mountains, and we had to stop in Dallas, change planes.

• 16:44Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 16:45Speaker 02

  And I made the mistake of checking my email.

• 16:47Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 16:48Speaker 02

  There was a message from the chairman of my board, and he said, "Hey, change of plans. I need you back in Nashville on Monday." He said, "We're coming in." He said, "We've got some issues that we need to resolve."

• 17:00Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 17:01Speaker 02

  I mean, my heart sank. And I just thought, "Ah." So, I handed my phone to Gail, and I let her read it, and of course, she was crestfallen also. But, to her credit, she said, "Honey, look, I know this is tough. You do whatever you need to do. I'll totally support it." I mean, she's always been like that. She was great.

• 17:16Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 17:17Speaker 02

  So, I remembered my priorities. You know, me, then Gail, and then the kids.

• 17:25Lewis Howes?

  And then the job.

• 17:25Speaker 02

  And then the job.

• 17:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:27Speaker 02

  So, I took a deep breath. Wasn't easy, but my priorities gave me courage. That's the key thing.

• 17:32Lewis Howes?

  And clarity.

• 17:33Speaker 02

  And clarity and courage.

• 17:34Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 17:34Speaker 02

  And when you have that, you can say no to the non-essentials, so that you can say yes to what's most important.

• 17:40Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 17:40Speaker 02

  So, I wrote back to chairman, and I said, "Hey, I understand. I really wish you'd postpone this meeting. I said, "If you can't, my team will be there to assist you. I'm going to Colorado, as we discussed. See you when I get back."

• 17:52Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 17:53Speaker 02

  So, I left. So I got back, I didn't check my email, but I got back from the end of that trip and I checked with my CFO when I got back. I said, hey, did the guys come in? You know, they came in from New York. And he said, um, yeah. I said, what was the meeting about? He said, uh, I don't know, but we totally could have handled it by email.

• 18:11Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my God.

• 18:11Speaker 02

  It was like a nothing meeting.

• 18:13Lewis Howes?

  No big deal. Yeah, yeah.

• 18:14Speaker 02

  No big deal. And I almost scuttled a much needed vacation. But see, when we have priorities, we can distinguish between the urgent and the important. And sometimes the urgent shows up like it's important, but it rarely is.

• 18:27Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 18:28Speaker 02

  But you gotta get clear on your priorities. So we literally in the life plan, have you come up with your life accounts? And then arrange them in, in order and they'll change based on the seasons in your life.

• 18:37Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 18:38Speaker 02

  Right?

• 18:38Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, when you're 20 or when you're 30, it's gonna be different potentially. Yeah. So it's a living document.

• 18:43Speaker 02

  It's a living document. You're gonna tweak it for the rest of your life. I was even working on mine today coming out.

• 18:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, there you go. I like it. Okay, so the second question, again, to recap, it's more about getting clear on the plan.

• 18:53Speaker 02

  That's right. So the first question is, how do you want to be remembered? The second question is, what's most important to you?

• 18:58Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 18:59Speaker 02

  The third question is, how do you get from where you are to where you want to be in every area of your life?

• 19:06Lewis Howes?

  So that's the game plan.

• 19:08Speaker 02

  That's the game plan.

• 19:08Lewis Howes?

  Yes, okay.

• 19:09Speaker 02

  And this is where it gets really fun.

• 19:11Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 19:12Speaker 02

  So, um, we break it into three parts. So we help you get really clear on what we call an envisioned future statement for each category. I'll give you an example here in a minute. Then we help you look at your current reality. Cause once you kind of envision the future and get really clear on where you want to go, now it's time to be brutally honest. You gotta admit where you are.

• 19:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 19:30Speaker 02

  Then the next question you ask is, what are the specific commitments you're willing to make that'll take you from where you are to where you want to be? And we keep it really simple. We don't, you know, come up with this complicated plan that you're all gonna figure out. Cause that's not usually how things show up.

• 19:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 19:44Speaker 02

  You know, usually you get just enough light to take the next step.

• 19:47Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 19:48Speaker 02

  And as you take those things open up and you get clearer on the path. But for these people that think they've gotta get totally clear before they're gonna take a step, before they're gonna start. You know, they're gonna be disappointed. You know, that's pretty much just an excuse for not getting started.

• 20:02Lewis Howes?

  Right, right. Okay, interesting. So, how do you set it up for people to create this?

• 20:06Speaker 02

  Okay, so let me give you the... So, again, we really believe that writing is important, even if you're not a writer. Because, um, somebody once said, I can't find the source of this, but thoughts disentangle themselves, passing over the lips and through pencil tips.

• 20:21Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, interesting.

• 20:22Speaker 02

  So, there's something about our thinking that when we have to write it, we get clarity for ourselves. And so, for example, here's another example with my health. I love this one. And again, this is my envisioned future. It's not present reality.

• 20:37Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 20:38Speaker 02

  Okay, I'm moving toward it. Okay, so I say, "I'm lean and strong, possessing vibrant health and extraordinary fitness." And notice we write it in the present tense, because there's power in that. Like, you're already there.

• 20:48Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 20:49Speaker 02

  And I said, "My heart is strong and healthy, my arteries are supple and clear of obstructions, my autoimmune system is in excellent condition, I'm disease, infection, and allergy resistant, I have more than enough energy to accomplish the tasks I undertake. This is because I control my mental focus, work out six days a week, choose healthy foods, take supplements as needed, and get adequate rest." So, that's my envisioned future statement, just for my health account. Okay, so I have great clarity about what I want in my health.

• 21:21Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 21:21Speaker 02

  And I've got a similar kind of statement for my...

• 21:23Lewis Howes?

  Business.

• 21:24Speaker 02

  Business.

• 21:24Lewis Howes?

  Relationships.

• 21:25Speaker 02

  Yep, everything.

• 21:26Lewis Howes?

  Amazing, okay.

• 21:27Speaker 02

  And so, then you gotta kind of go back from that and say, "Okay, that's the future, great. I'm excited about that, you know, woo." But, where are you today?

• 21:35Lewis Howes?

  Yes.

• 21:35Speaker 02

  You know, maybe you're a couch potato, and you haven't worked out in six years. And, you know, you gotta start where you are.

• 21:41Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 21:42Speaker 02

  But getting clear on the future is important, and a lot of people bail on that. They don't give themselves permission to dream. And the book, "We Give You Permission to Dream."

• 21:49Lewis Howes?

  Why do people not give themselves permission, you think?

• 21:52Speaker 02

  I think people go to why, or excuse me, go to how before they go to what.

• 21:56Lewis Howes?

  How am I gonna do this?

• 21:57Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 21:57Lewis Howes?

  How would I even achieve that?

• 21:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, you see this in business, right?

• 22:01Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 22:01Speaker 02

  You know, you see people, they say, uh, you try to get them to dream about their business. They go, well, I couldn't do that. I'm not good in front of a camera. Or I couldn't do that because I don't have the capital to invest in it. Forget the how. When you get clear on the what, the how starts showing up.

• 22:15Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 22:16Speaker 02

  So, vision before strategy every time, all the time.

• 22:19Lewis Howes?

  What would you say is your vision for your business right now, moving forward?

• 22:24Speaker 02

  Well, it's a big vision.

• 22:25Lewis Howes?

  Okay, what is that?

• 22:26Speaker 02

  So, financially, we want to do a hundred million dollars. But we want to do it in a highly profitable way with a hundred employees. And really as an online training company, continuing to do the stuff that we're doing.

• 22:40Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, amazing. By when?

• 22:42Speaker 02

  It's probably a ten-year plan.

• 22:43Lewis Howes?

  Ten-year plan, yeah. I believe it. I mean, in what, four years or five years when you got started in 2001?

• 22:49Speaker 02

  No, it's 2011.

• 22:50Lewis Howes?

  2011. 2011, you've already grown so much.

• 22:52Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're almost at eight figures now.

• 22:53Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing. It's great.

• 22:55Speaker 02

  So, we've doubled every year since we started.

• 22:57Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing.

• 22:58Speaker 02

  So, knock on wood.

• 22:59Lewis Howes?

  What do you think's been the key to that in five years doing that?

• 23:03Speaker 02

  You know, I think a lot of it is just hiring really great people.

• 23:07Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 23:07Speaker 02

  I think if, if you don't, if you don't think you need a team, your dream's not big enough.

• 23:13Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 23:14Speaker 02

  And so, for me, what I love about having a team is that it allows me to get more and more focused on what only I do well.

• 23:23Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 23:23Speaker 02

  Because like when I began, I didn't do everything.

• 23:25Lewis Howes?

  You did it all.

• 23:26Speaker 02

  And I was a, you know, handicapped CEO. I didn't know anything.

• 23:29Lewis Howes?

  Uh-uh.

• 23:29Speaker 02

  You know, so I'm trying to find the FedEx box, and I'm trying to book my own travel, and I'm trying to do all this stuff.

• 23:33Lewis Howes?

  Taking me thirty minutes doing this and that, yeah, yeah.

• 23:35Speaker 02

  Totally inefficient. It's just not my gifting. Today, because of all these people helping me. I'm able to focus on the three things that I do best, which is create content, deliver the content, and be the visionary for the company. Kind of create the picture for the future. And if it's not that, I don't get involved. Somebody else does it.

• 23:55Lewis Howes?

  And also building relationships probably, right?

• 23:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, building relationships is key too.

• 23:59Lewis Howes?

  Okay, interesting. What do you think people try to just do too much? They don't focus on their core three or four things that they do?

• 24:05Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, I think what happens to a lot of guys is they kind of see the dream and become a successful solopreneur.

• 24:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 24:12Speaker 02

  But they choke when it comes time to hire people because it's too much risk.

• 24:17Lewis Howes?

  That's interesting because I'm building my team out right now. We've got about 10 people, half here in LA and half around the country. And it's a challenge bringing new people on to the mix and then training and then just connecting as you grow. How did you learn? I guess you were a CEO of a bigger company already. But if you're a solopreneur and you're trying to grow into having five people on your team or 10 people, how do you learn that skill to manage the team?

• 24:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, part of it is get all the education you can. Read the books, read John Maxwell on leadership. Get all the training you possibly can. Be humble and honest. Hire a coach. I mean, I'll tell you, I really believe in coaches. I think you can go further faster with a coach. You can avoid making your own mistakes by learning on somebody else's mistakes. And so that's one of the key things.

• 25:04Lewis Howes?

  I believe in a coach too. I use a coach for a lot of my speeches. Before every speech, I call my coach. And I just feel like I get so grounded and clear on the intention of what I'm going to create.

• 25:13Speaker 02

  And objective feedback.

• 25:14Lewis Howes?

  Yes, and I feel like, man, I always think after the speech, wow, I did a really solid job. And if I didn't have the coaching beforehand, I don't think I would have done as well.

• 25:23Speaker 02

  Yeah, because you don't see things that the coach can see. I'll give you a good example. When I was the CEO at Thomas Nelson, I had this great executive coach by the name of Eileen. Brilliant. She gave me some of the best stuff I've ever learned. So one time she's sitting in a financial review meeting where all the divisional managers are coming in. They're presenting their numbers for the last month, how they did. So at the break, she calls me aside. She's like, can I talk to you for a minute? I said, sure. She said, are you pissed off? And I said, no. She said, "Well, you might want to tell your face."

• 25:53Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 25:53Speaker 02

  And I said, "What are you talking about?" And she said, "You never smile." She said, "It's intimidating."

• 25:58Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 25:59Speaker 02

  And when people are intimidating, they're not going to be forthcoming. They're going to be hiding stuff. And they're just, there's just not going to be the trust you need.

• 26:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 26:06Speaker 02

  She said, "You've got to smile."

• 26:09Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Now you smile all the time.

• 26:11Speaker 02

  And now I smile all the time.

• 26:12Lewis Howes?

  You have a great smile. Yeah, yeah. Interesting. Okay.

• 26:15Speaker 02

  But that's the kind of thing you get by having a coach.

• 26:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 26:18Speaker 02

  So I, but I do think that the, the place that people get stuck as business developers or business owners is, it is some risk hiding, hiring somebody.

• 26:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 26:29Speaker 02

  Right? Am I going to hire the right person? Am I going to be able to cover the overhead? I don't want to build the overhead too big, too fast. And all that I get is an art. But almost every time I've hired somebody else, you know, if I've done the timing right and I've really thought through the plan, my income has gone up.

• 26:43Lewis Howes?

  It pays off.

• 26:44Speaker 02

  Because I can keep getting more narrow in my focus and, and really stay in my unique ability.

• 26:48Lewis Howes?

  Hmm. That's interesting. What would you say are like two or three things you do every single week with your team or every month that is essential in creating better unity and moving things forward?

• 26:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, a couple of things. Um, one is that I meet with my team once a week.

• 27:03Lewis Howes?

  The whole team?

• 27:04Speaker 02

  No, just my direct reports.

• 27:05Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 27:06Speaker 02

  So, and then all of them are meeting with their direct reports.

• 27:09Lewis Howes?

  Sure, sure.

• 27:09Speaker 02

  So, we've installed in our company something called the four disciplines of execution. You familiar with that?

• 27:14Lewis Howes?

  No.

• 27:14Speaker 02

  Dude.

• 27:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Tell me.

• 27:16Speaker 02

  It's the bomb. Yeah. They call it 4DX. The four disciplines of execution. So, you come up with in each department, your wildly important goals, your WIGs.

• 27:27Lewis Howes?

  Uh huh.

• 27:27Speaker 02

  And everything is built around that. And they talk about the difference between lead measures, uh, and lag measures. So, there's leading measures that tell you, you know, kind of predict the future. But like when you get your financial statements to tell you what happened last month, that's a lag measure. It's already happened. You can't influence it. But a lead measure that's telling you, for example, how many leads you're generating or how your conversion is, that's a lead measure. And you want to focus on that. But the book is fantastic. So we have those meetings in the company every week with all the employees. I meet with what I call my executive team. I mean, it's not that big, but once a month to go through the financial statements. And I really want everybody to be good at financial management so we stay out of trouble.

• 28:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 28:10Speaker 02

  And we're looking at, for example, at a 16-week cash flow. You know, what the futures. So if we can spot problems in advance, we can fix them. You know, keep the ox out of the ditch that way.

• 28:21Lewis Howes?

  I love it. I love it. What, are you meeting with the team at all? Are you guys a group call as well? Or do you guys?

• 28:28Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, I mean, there's just a lot of interaction. I mean, I especially interact with our content team and all day. And we're in Slack, you know, so, you know, all over that. We do meet as an entire company once a quarter. And I do training on that, leadership training. We also go through the financials because every person in our company gets a bonus based on the performance of the company.

• 28:47Lewis Howes?

  Really? So the whole company knows everything that you're making, everything that's coming in?

• 28:50Speaker 02

  Exactly. Because their bonus is pegged to that. We don't have any caps on the bonuses. So as high as the company can make money, they can continue to make bonuses.

• 28:58Lewis Howes?

  That's great. And why do you keep writing books? You've written eight books now, is that right? Why do you continue to write them? What's the value in writing books in your mind?

• 29:07Speaker 02

  I don't, lead generation. You know, well, actually, it's a couple of things. That's a main thing, but it also establishes your authority. I mean, you've seen this with your own.

• 29:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it's been a game changer.

• 29:19Speaker 02

  Total game changer. There's nothing that credentials you in this culture, not a PhD, not a hit movie. I mean, that's going to come and go. But you write a book and all of a sudden, you know, you're somebody.

• 29:31Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 29:32Speaker 02

  You know, people really respect that.

• 29:33Lewis Howes?

  Now, are you still someone today when everyone's writing a book and everyone's self-publishing? You're still?

• 29:38Speaker 02

  There's still a mystique about that.

• 29:39Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 29:40Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:41Lewis Howes?

  Huh.

• 29:42Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 29:43Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 29:44Speaker 02

  And so for me, I mean, I've got the next five books mapped out that I want to do.

• 29:46Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 29:47Speaker 02

  Yeah. And right now, we're, I was just telling you before we started, we're about to go shop a three-book deal.

• 29:51Lewis Howes?

  Three-book deal, yeah.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  So my plan is to release, and this will be, the first one won't be out for 18 months, but to release a new book every year.

• 29:59Lewis Howes?

  Why every year? Is that too much?

• 30:00Speaker 02

  Because I've got a lot of books I want to write.

• 30:01Lewis Howes?

  Wow, okay.

• 30:02Speaker 02

  More than that would definitely be too much, and that's kind of borderline too much.

• 30:05Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah. Interesting. Can you say what they are, the ideas?

• 30:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, so my next book is going to be a book around goal setting. I've got that course, Five Days to Your Best Year Ever.

• 30:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 30:16Speaker 02

  And so I'm doing a book called Life Score. And

• 30:21Lewis Howes?

  You came up with a test called that too, right?

• 30:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, so we did an assessment that just blew up.

• 30:25Lewis Howes?

  Right?

• 30:25Speaker 02

  And so people want to know what their number is.

• 30:27Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 30:28Speaker 02

  And then how do you move the number? So that's going to be the next book. Then I'm doing a book on productivity. After that, I'm doing a course on productivity this summer.

• 30:34Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 30:35Speaker 02

  And the tentative title on that's called Free Time. Because that's, we're not going to try to help you do more. We're going to try to help you do less so you can live more.

• 30:43Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 30:43Speaker 02

  Right?

• 30:44Lewis Howes?

  I like that.

• 30:44Speaker 02

  And then the third book is going to be a book, the working title on it's called The Intentional Leader, but it's just a book on leadership.

• 30:49Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. Going with John Maxwell.

• 30:51Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:52Lewis Howes?

  I like it.

• 30:52Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 30:53Lewis Howes?

  Don't they have a book called Intentional Living?

• 30:54Speaker 02

  He does.

• 30:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, so intentional leadership.

• 30:56Speaker 02

  But my company's been called Intentional Leadership.

• 30:58Lewis Howes?

  Right, right, right.

• 30:58Speaker 02

  Long before his book.

• 30:59Lewis Howes?

  Exactly, yeah, yeah, it's great. Who do you look up to the most? Or who do you watch like pretty closely that you're like, wow, they're just doing a great job with what they're doing in this space?

• 31:08Speaker 02

  Other than you?

• 31:09Lewis Howes?

  Other than me, yeah, yeah.

• 31:11Speaker 02

  Well, John Maxwell on leadership is just amazing.

• 31:15Lewis Howes?

  He's crushing.

• 31:16Speaker 02

  He's a good friend.

• 31:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 31:17Speaker 02

  And I published him in Thomas Nelson for more than a decade. But I look to a guy, I think Pat Flynn is killing it. I just love the consistent quality of the content. His book, Will It Fly? Incredible. You read that?

• 31:31Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I skimmed it, yeah.

• 31:33Speaker 02

  I bought 10 copies of it and gave it to all the guys at my mastermind.

• 31:36Lewis Howes?

  That's great.

• 31:38Speaker 02

  But yeah, I mean Tony Robbins, Tony constantly inspires me.

• 31:41Lewis Howes?

  What about someone not in this space? Just someone in general who's like building a brand? Maybe it's not an online brand, but just building a brand that you're like, wow, they're just doing a great job. Maybe it's a celebrity or politician or someone in a different space. You're like, man.

• 31:54Speaker 02

  I can't think of one.

• 31:55Lewis Howes?

  Can't think of one?

• 31:56Speaker 02

  No, sorry.

• 31:57Lewis Howes?

  That's okay, that's okay. What is the biggest challenge for you right now in your business?

• 32:02Speaker 02

  I think the biggest challenge is to not over commit on my time because I've got so much stuff I want to do.

• 32:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:10Speaker 02

  And

• 32:10Lewis Howes?

  So many opportunities, right?

• 32:12Speaker 02

  There are. And I think that scarcity shows up for me in kind of a funky way. And it's like, there's not enough time. So I've got to do it all this year.

• 32:20Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:21Speaker 02

  And my team keeps saying, there's plenty of time.

• 32:24Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:25Speaker 02

  Slow it down, let's just really focus. And the thing I don't want to do either, I want to build a company that doesn't swallow people whole.

• 32:32Lewis Howes?

  What do you mean?

• 32:33Speaker 02

  I mean, I want...

• 32:33Lewis Howes?

  They have a life.

• 32:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, they have a life.

• 32:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:35Speaker 02

  You know, so I want for my people, I mean, I think my success is measured not in how big my company gets, but whether I create an environment for the people that are working in it. So they can have work-life balance. They can realize their own dreams, their dreams with their family, their dreams for their own careers.

• 32:51Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 32:52Speaker 02

  And if I can't help them do that, I want to help them move on to someplace else that can do that.

• 32:55Lewis Howes?

  That's good. Who was the most influential person in your life growing up?

• 33:01Speaker 02

  Strangely, my dad. Yeah, and he went through a really dark period. When he was really drinking a lot and alcoholic and... It influenced me kind of in two ways. I mean, early on, like when I was in grade school, my dad was my constant companion. We fished, we played baseball, built model airplanes, all that. But then his life started coming at him, he... And I didn't know this at the time, but he was really suffering from this severe war injury that he got in the Korean War. And I remember at one point in my life, I looked at him when he was passed out, and I said, "I will never be like that."

• 33:41Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 33:42Speaker 02

  And that became the driving force of my life. And I overcorrected. He was in the drift, right? I overcorrected and became driven. And I think that's why I'm so committed in this book to living a designed life. You know, you can be, you can drift, you can be driven, or you can design. And I think living a designed life is so critical. By the way, one thing I didn't finish on this. All this takes to create a life plan is just a day, to set a day aside and do it. And that's really what we recommend. We walk you through the whole day to do it. But if you think about the fact that the average person spends five hours shopping on the internet to buy a car, that doesn't include the negotiation or the test drives, but just to buy the car. The average bride spends 21 days planning a wedding.

• 34:26Lewis Howes?

  At least, probably, right?

• 34:27Speaker 02

  I know.

• 34:28Lewis Howes?

  More.

• 34:28Speaker 02

  I have five daughters, as you know.

• 34:30Lewis Howes?

  Oh, I know.

• 34:30Speaker 02

  Four of them are married.

• 34:31Lewis Howes?

  Gosh.

• 34:32Speaker 02

  So I've been through this four times.

• 34:32Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh. That's like a year of your life. Just a wedding planning.

• 34:37Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh, unbelievable. But... To spend a day thinking through what it is you want out of life, doesn't seem like a lot to ask.

• 34:46Lewis Howes?

  No, it's not much at all.

• 34:47Speaker 02

  So we'll walk you through that.

• 34:48Lewis Howes?

  I like that, I like that. What would you say is the biggest lesson your dad taught you?

• 34:53Speaker 02

  I think the biggest lesson, my dad continues to teach me this, he's 82, he's in good health. He's the most positively optimistic person I've ever met. Even though he suffers from chronic pain. But we go over there typically to his house, my mom's house, once a week. And, I mean, they're just, they don't complain, even though they could.

• 35:16Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 35:16Speaker 02

  They're just positive and upbeat. I remember there were times when I was going through some business crisis or something, I didn't know who to call, so I called my dad, I said, "Dad, here's the situation." And my dad said, "Well, son, I don't understand anything about that. But here's what I do know, you're gonna do fine." Said, "You just hang in there, you're gonna do fine, you've got what it takes." And to hear that from your father is one of the best gifts you can ever get.

• 35:39Lewis Howes?

  It's pretty powerful. Wow. What about when you were a CEO of a publishing company, what was the biggest lesson you learned through that process of being a CEO?

• 35:50Speaker 02

  Well, I think, um, a lot of things. I mean, I think that, you know, when I became a CEO, I really did wonder if I had what it took. I had 650 employees.

• 36:01Lewis Howes?

  Oh my gosh.

• 36:01Speaker 02

  We were doing a quarter of a billion a year.

• 36:03Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 36:04Speaker 02

  Lot of pressure. And, you know, you kind of have to put on the face of confidence, like, you know what you're doing. But you go home at night, and in the darkness of the night, you're thinking, "It's only a matter of time before they figure out, I don't know what I'm doing." But you know, I've spoken to CEOs all over the world, all CEOs feel that way.

• 36:22Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 36:22Speaker 02

  Yeah, the ones that don't are the ones you need to worry about. But most people that are in positions of significant leadership have that kind of self-doubt. But the good thing about it is it keeps you humble.

• 36:32Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 36:33Speaker 02

  And it keeps you hungry. And it keeps you alert.

• 36:37Speaker 02

  And so after a while, I learned to embrace it. You know, just go, you know what? This is good. This is kind of how my body set up. It's kind of like what I do public speaking now, and I always get nervous before I speak. Do you get nervous?

• 36:49Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, sometimes.

• 36:50Speaker 02

  Less nervous now than I used to, for sure.

• 36:52Lewis Howes?

  The book tour, it really helped me get over a lot of it. Yeah. I just did a speech after speech after speech. So I kind of felt like, okay, I got a lot of the nerves out. But if I don't speak for a few months and I get a big speech again, it's like, ew.

• 37:03Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 37:03Lewis Howes?

  I forget what this is like.

• 37:04Speaker 02

  Yeah. And so, you know, I just, I kind of had this mantra that I rehearsed to myself before I go up on stage. I've got several of them, but one of them is just, this is my body's way of preparing me for peak performance.

• 37:14Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, feeling the nerves.

• 37:16Speaker 02

  Yeah, feeling the nerves. I'm just like, I've learned to embrace it.

• 37:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 37:19Speaker 02

  And just go, oh.

• 37:21Lewis Howes?

  Get ready.

• 37:21Speaker 02

  That thing's showing up again.

• 37:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 37:23Speaker 02

  And so now I kind of reinterpret it as being excited. You know, occasionally, that didn't work.

• 37:27Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 37:27Speaker 02

  But most of the time it does.

• 37:28Lewis Howes?

  Okay. And what about from the last five years? What's the biggest lesson going on your own, not having this big company behind you, but starting kind of from scratch and a new phase of your life? What's the thing, the lesson you've learned?

• 37:43Speaker 02

  I think that there's always more. There's always another level you can go to. Because I really thought, I remember when I first started, I thought if I can just get my company to a million dollars a year.

• 37:54Speaker 02

  And then, you know, you kind of hit that mountain and you realize, oh, my gosh, there's a whole mountain range over there. You know, and then it was five million and then, you know, whatever. But I just think that realizing that there's always another level. And there's always another level for me to grow. And that's, I remember having this conversation with somebody, I won't mention her name, but you and I both know her. And she said, how, when is enough enough? And I said, well, first of all, that's a great question.

• 38:16Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 38:17Speaker 02

  But, you know, certainly in terms of material things, I don't need any more stuff.

• 38:21Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 38:22Speaker 02

  You probably don't either.

• 38:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. You've got a great home and.

• 38:24Speaker 02

  Yeah, I got a great home and I've got, you know, all the toys. I mean, I get bored of that stuff.

• 38:28Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 38:28Speaker 02

  That doesn't really challenge me anymore. But I'll tell you what really does challenge me and why it'll never be enough. No matter how big my company gets is because I like what has to happen to me in order to grow to that next level.

• 38:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 38:44Speaker 02

  You know, because I have to, I have to develop new capabilities. New intellectual capabilities, new emotional stamina, whatever it is. But that's like why I, I keep pressing for the next level.

• 38:55Lewis Howes?

  I love that. I love that.

• 38:56Speaker 02

  That's why I hate, by the way, the word retirement.

• 38:58Lewis Howes?

  What are you going to do when you retire? That's what I don't understand.

• 39:00Speaker 02

  I mean.

• 39:01Lewis Howes?

  What do people do when they retire?

• 39:03Speaker 02

  Die.

• 39:04Lewis Howes?

  I don't get this.

• 39:05Speaker 02

  Most of them die within five years after they retire.

• 39:07Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 39:08Speaker 02

  Do you know Dan Sullivan?

• 39:09Lewis Howes?

  Uh, the coach or?

• 39:10Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 39:10Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 39:11Speaker 02

  Yeah. So, um, I'm in Dan's Strategic Coach Program. Phenomenal program, by the way.

• 39:16Lewis Howes?

  That's what I hear.

• 39:17Speaker 02

  And Dan is 71 years old. Dan has a 25-year plan for his life.

• 39:22Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 39:23Speaker 02

  And one of his basic principles that I love is he says, you've got to create a future that's bigger than your past. Now, think about the people you know. There's people that you and I both know that their past is bigger than their future.

• 39:35Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 39:35Speaker 02

  It's like they're still living in the glory days. You know, probably people we went to high school with.

• 39:39Lewis Howes?

  A lot of former pro athletes.

• 39:40Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 39:40Lewis Howes?

  Live in the past of like what they did 10 years ago.

• 39:42Speaker 02

  That's right.

• 39:43Lewis Howes?

  And they never create something powerful moving forward.

• 39:45Speaker 02

  And it's just a matter of time before they die.

• 39:46Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 39:47Speaker 02

  But if you can reverse that and say, no, I'm going to create a future that's always bigger than my past. And how can I do that? Because the truth is, we're not dead yet, so I still think we have a purpose here.

• 39:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. Interesting.

• 39:59Speaker 02

  In fact, I think if we're not dead, we probably haven't fulfilled the purpose for which we were created.

• 40:02Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Okay. So you're always trying to create something bigger?

• 40:05Speaker 02

  Yep. And by bigger, I don't mean more money.

• 40:09Lewis Howes?

  Deeper impact.

• 40:09Speaker 02

  Deeper impact, more reach, more significance.

• 40:13Lewis Howes?

  Creativity for yourself as well, probably, yeah.

• 40:15Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 40:15Lewis Howes?

  Interesting. What's something you really want to learn over the next five to 10 years that you haven't learned yet?

• 40:23Speaker 02

  I just want to become a better and better content developer. And develop my skills there in speaking and delivering video and all that. I mean, every time I see something that somebody else has done that's really great. You're like, "Oh, I want to do that." Wow, like I just deconstructed.

• 40:40Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 40:41Speaker 02

  So, yeah, I think that's a never-ending quest.

• 40:43Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, it's cool. Okay. Okay, so it's the last day. Actually, no, it's not the last day. You're actually the invisible guest at your funeral. Better yet, your father comes back and is at your funeral fifty, however many years from now, and he's about to go up to the mic and say something. What do you want him to say? And how many people are there?

• 41:06Speaker 02

  I hope a lot.

• 41:09Lewis Howes?

  So what does he walk up and say? What would you love for him to say?

• 41:12Speaker 02

  You know, my dad tells me this a lot. But what I'd like him to say is, he was proud of me. That he felt like he was amazed that I realized my potential. That he's proud of me for loving Gail, my wife, for all these years. For being committed to my family. For making an impact in the world. You know, that I was a good steward of what I've been given. That's really what I'm looking for. You know, that I leave nothing on the field. That I played full out, that I died with my boots on, and that I gave it everything.

• 41:55Lewis Howes?

  That's cool.

• 41:56Speaker 02

  You're gonna make me cry.

• 41:56Lewis Howes?

  I like that, yeah. What about your daughter? What would your daughter say, or one of your daughters?

• 42:01Speaker 02

  You know, it's kind of interesting because one of the things that Gail did for me about eight years ago is that she had all of my daughters record about a five-minute thing for me.

• 42:15Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh. I'd be like in tears, probably, if I had five daughters.

• 42:18Speaker 02

  Well, she, get this, she did it. She had my five daughters.

• 42:22Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 42:23Speaker 02

  She had a couple of my grandkids. She had my best friends.

• 42:28Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 42:29Speaker 02

  And then she took my favorite music. And so she'd have one of them say something and play a song. So then she sent me out into the woods.

• 42:35Lewis Howes?

  Like in tears.

• 42:36Speaker 02

  And I was like, for three hours, I was just... I should play one of them for you sometime. I mean, I was just in tears.

• 42:43Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh. What was this for? A birthday or Father's Day?

• 42:46Speaker 02

  It was when I turned 50.

• 42:47Lewis Howes?

  Wow, amazing.

• 42:49Speaker 02

  And I just occasionally I'll just still listen to it and just cry like a baby.

• 42:53Lewis Howes?

  Oh, my gosh.

• 42:55Speaker 02

  But I think, I think, I mean, you ask what the girls would say or what one of my daughters would say. I, I think there's one thing I, I learned as a dad of daughters, and I don't mean this in a sexist kind of way. But as it turns out, girls like to talk.

• 43:12Speaker 02

  And I spent a lot of time listening.

• 43:13Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 43:14Speaker 02

  And I think it really honed my skills as a listener. And so I, I can remember when one of my daughters, um, she just broke up with her boyfriend. And I mean, they, they had been together in Switzerland at this school and they had been really meaningful relationship.

• 43:31Lewis Howes?

  It's tough.

• 43:31Speaker 02

  And so he, he broke the relationship and she came home and I just held her hand and she just cried. And I just think just being with her. I didn't say anything. But I can tell you these various times when I would sit with my daughters and they would pour out their heart and I wouldn't say anything. And they'd get up and give me a big hug and they'd say, Dad, that was so awesome. Thanks for your counsel. I'm like, I didn't say anything.

• 43:55Lewis Howes?

  Wow. What are you really listening for when you're listening to someone?

• 43:59Speaker 02

  I'm listening for their heart.

• 44:02Speaker 02

  Because here's what I can do if I'm not careful. I can go into CEO fix-it mode.

• 44:08Lewis Howes?

  Coaching?

• 44:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, like, okay, I gotta figure it out. You need to take these three steps. And I mean, they throw things at me when I start that.

• 44:16Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 44:16Speaker 02

  And, and Gail's really helped me with that, too. I remember one time I started doing that with her when I came home from the office and she said, she got really mad. Pointed her finger at me and she said, let me just tell you something. You may be the CEO of Thomas Nelson, but you're not the CEO here.

• 44:28Lewis Howes?

  Wow, interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 44:30Speaker 02

  I said, yes, ma'am.

• 44:32Lewis Howes?

  I love that. What's something, final few questions. What's something that you're really proud of that you haven't really talked about much? Or maybe not a lot of people know about?

• 44:40Speaker 02

  Wow.

• 44:44Speaker 02

  Well, I don't like to talk about this, but I do like giving. You know, I think that's part of my responsibility as somebody who's has means is to be a philanthropist.

• 44:57Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 44:58Speaker 02

  And so, again, it's not something I talk about. I've never said that, but I've never been asked that directly in question. But yeah, that's important to me to give to causes that are really meaningful.

• 45:07Lewis Howes?

  Sure. And do you give a certain percentage every year or is it more just when you feel?

• 45:11Speaker 02

  I keep trying to up it.

• 45:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 45:14Speaker 02

  Yeah, so, yeah, so I've, you know, started at 10% and have just continued to raise that.

• 45:19Lewis Howes?

  Do you feel like the more you give financially, the more you earn?

• 45:23Speaker 02

  Totally.

• 45:23Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 45:24Speaker 02

  No, I don't do it for that reason.

• 45:25Lewis Howes?

  Right, but it's just a call.

• 45:26Speaker 02

  But it's just, but it's just a, it is a kind of an interesting thing that happens.

• 45:30Lewis Howes?

  Every really, you know, Tony Robbins, he said that when he does that.

• 45:34Speaker 02

  What he's on your show, I heard that.

• 45:34Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, he always makes more and a lot of people say that like the key to actually generating wealth is giving wealth away.

• 45:39Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 45:40Lewis Howes?

  So.

• 45:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, my own philosophy is you just, you know, again, I'm a person of faith. I just think

• 45:44Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 45:45Speaker 02

  God is extravagant in what he's given to us. And he's constantly giving.

• 45:50Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 45:50Speaker 02

  And so I want to be that kind of person that's constantly giving. And, you know, mostly behind the scenes, but I just, I love the thought of that.

• 45:59Lewis Howes?

  If you could have one word tattooed on your forehead that was reversed, you saw in the mirror in the morning or every time you're in the mirror, you had to get a tattoo, what would the word be?

• 46:09Speaker 02

  Um.

• 46:10Lewis Howes?

  Or phrase?

• 46:11Speaker 02

  Yeah. Well, it's kind of cliche because of everything we've been talking about, but it's be intentional. You know, design your future, but I think just be intentional.

• 46:22Lewis Howes?

  That's cool. I like that. Okay, this is the last couple of questions. Again, it's the last, since you brought the whole funeral into this, since your last day and you're about to pass. This is 50, 60 years from now. You're about to pass. Everyone's there. They're all happy and joyful moment. And every book you've ever written is erased. All this stuff is deleted. They've created your courses, everything. And your great, great, great grandson or granddaughter comes and says, we have a piece of paper. You just write down the three things that you know to be true about your life and your experience. The most important, the most important things. We can't have access to any more of your books. We don't know the life plan. We don't know all these things. But what are the three most important things? And that's all we'll remember you by from these three things. So you write down.

• 47:07Speaker 02

  What would you say?

• 47:08Lewis Howes?

  No pressure. No pressure. Yeah, yeah, sorry.

• 47:11Speaker 02

  Well, this is something I've said before, but I want to say it. It's not, it's this. It's you're, you're not as smart as you think you are. But you have more potential than you can possibly imagine. So I think it's really important to stay humble and aggressive, be an aggressive learner. That's probably the second thing, if it's not encapsulated in the first one, is just commit yourself to lifelong learning. I think that's the thing I saw in my father that was so impressive. My dad's always been the kind of guy, he joined the Marine Corps when he was 17, didn't finish high school, except by GED while he was in the military. But he's always been an incredibly aggressive learner. So if he decided he wanted to learn something, he'd go buy all the books and just start poring through them.

• 47:56Speaker 02

  And I saw him do that time and time again. So I think be an aggressive learner. And I'd say the third thing is make it your life goal to love well the people that matter most. Because at the end of the day, I mean, that's what people are going to be. They're right.

• 48:16Lewis Howes?

  That's it.

• 48:17Speaker 02

  So nobody says, you know, everybody points this out. Nobody says, gee, I wish I'd spent more time at work. Or I wished I'd written one more book.

• 48:24Lewis Howes?

  Or made more money.

• 48:25Speaker 02

  Or made more money.

• 48:26Lewis Howes?

  Can't take it with you.

• 48:27Speaker 02

  No, you can't.

• 48:27Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I love that. That's good, three truths. What are you most grateful for in your life recently?

• 48:36Speaker 02

  I just think the privilege of living at this time, at this moment, where we have things like the internet.

• 48:44Lewis Howes?

  It's amazing.

• 48:45Speaker 02

  Where we can build these businesses, have the kind of freedom to create, kind of create the life, design the kind of lives we want. I just think it's the most amazing time. And I wonder, will they be saying this 100, 200 years from now?

• 48:57Lewis Howes?

  Probably.

• 48:58Speaker 02

  But it's just, I just feel so grateful for that.

• 49:02Lewis Howes?

  That's cool. Before I ask the final question, I want to make sure everyone goes and gets the book, Living Forward. And you go to MichaelHyatt.com to get all the information there, subscribe to your newsletter. Where are you hanging out the most online for people to connect with you personally?

• 49:15Speaker 02

  Uh, probably Facebook today. Yeah, Facebook.com forward slash Michael Hyatt.

• 49:19Lewis Howes?

  There you go. Awesome. And before I ask the final question, I want to acknowledge you, Michael, for your incredible intentional leadership because again, I've told you this many times before, that you are like this, the top person, I think, when I think of integrity and being intentional and grounded. And you're such a symbol of inspiration, I believe, for me and for so many people. I mean, just the person, Sherry, who we met in the lobby here, you know, just so many people love what you're doing. It's because you live such a great life and you're a great example for the rest of us. I want to acknowledge you for your constant ability to learn, to grow, and to give unselfishly to so many people. So, I acknowledge you for that.

• 50:01Speaker 02

  I appreciate that. Thank you.

• 50:02Lewis Howes?

  Of course. Final question is what's your definition of greatness?

• 50:08Speaker 02

  My definition of greatness is somebody

• 50:14Speaker 02

  who makes a huge contribution in the lives of others, somebody who actually stands for the greatness of other people.

• 50:23Speaker 02

  And somebody who's persistent and won't give up on other people till that greatness is manifest in them. And I think all of us need somebody like that, somebody who will stand for that when we're in a dark place, when we're wondering if we've got what it takes, but somebody that can stand for us and say, you know what? I believe in you, Louis. I'm standing for you.

• 50:46Lewis Howes?

  All right. Thanks so much.

• 50:48Speaker 02

  Thanks, guys. Appreciate it.

• 50:49Lewis Howes?

  Great to be with you.

• 50:52Speaker 00

  There you have it guys, I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you found it helpful, please let me know and tweet me @lewishouse and @michaelhyatt to let Michael know what you thought of this interview as well. You can share it over on Twitter, on Instagram, on Facebook and post it out. The show notes and full video interview is back at lewishouse.com/318. I am off to St. Louis today to speak at my alma mater, Principia College and Principia High School. I'm very excited to go back to St. Louis where I spent a number of years there in high school and really developed myself as a young man growing up in my teen years there and in my early college years. You know, I learned so many things while being

• 51:36Speaker 00

  in St. Louis and going to Principia and so I'm really excited to go back to check out the campus, to see some of the old professors that had to put up with me with never showing up to class and always wanted to just go play sports, but I'm really excited to give back and to help a community that really helped me in my years when I was struggling and trying to figure things out. So I'm very excited to be in St. Louis. Again, thank you guys so much for being here. Make sure to share the show notes at lewishouse.com/318 and you know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.