20 Pat Flynn: How to Let Go, Create Passive Income and Achieve Inner Greatness

Let go. Let go of your lame excuses. Let go of your crappy beliefs. Let go that it's hard to make enough money to live a great life. Let go that you have to work a million hours a month to build an amazing business. Let go that you have to be stuck in a […] Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  Let the class begin with Pat Flynn.

• 0:07Lewis Howes?

  Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin.

• 0:33Lewis Howes?

  All the greats out there, thanks so much for tuning in today. I'm so excited about this episode with my good friend, Pat Flynn. Now, Pat has been crushing it in the online world for the last five years. The guy's making over $60,000 a month on autopilot, basically. And he's going to be talking about how he built his business, his first dollar he made till now, he's making over $60,000 a month, how he does it, why he does it, the things he does to automate his business, and really what it creates for himself in his life. He's got two kids, a wife, and he really wants to spend a lot of time with his family and be at home during the day. So this is a very inspiring episode

• 1:13Lewis Howes?

  for those that ever feel like they're getting stuck. They're not sure how to break through from their financial goals. Maybe you're at a job that you really don't like that much. You say to yourself, ah, this is a good job. It's good security, it's good benefits. But really, are you living a full, passionate, empowered life of greatness? A lot of people that I interact with every single day are not living a life of greatness, and they're not going after everything they want. And it's usually because they're not willing to let go. So this is all about letting go, and I'm going to have him come on in just a second. But I want to have a quick quote for this episode, as I'm working on finding cool quotes for you guys.

• 1:58Lewis Howes?

  This one I found, it is by Steve Mariboli and it says incredible change happens in your life when you decide to take control of what you do have power over instead of craving control over what you don't. So that is the quote for today. We've had so many pictures that you guys have been posting on Instagram and tagging me of where you've been listening to the School of Greatness. So I just want to say thanks so much for everyone who's been posting stuff. A lot of you are by the beach, a lot of you are either working out or you're in the car and you're posting those type of pictures. So I appreciate each and every one of you who does that. And please keep uploading those and I'll give some shout

• 2:41Lewis Howes?

  outs here in the next couple of episodes to people who are posting pictures on Instagram of where you're listening to the School of Greatness podcast. And with that guys, let's the class begin with Pat Flynn.

• 3:05Lewis Howes?

  What is up everyone? Lewis Howes here with my good friend, Pat Flynn. What is up, Pat?

• 3:11Speaker 01

  Not much, dude. How's it going?

• 3:12Lewis Howes?

  It's going great. And I feel good because I have my voice back finally. I lost it recently in a leadership workshop that I was at and I was screaming at one point and I ended up losing it for about a week. So it feels good to be able to speak and actually hear from you. And we've been friends for a few years now. Seems like the people that started a few years ago, about four or five years ago, we've all kind of connected and have our own little, you know, masterminds every now and then. So it's been fun to see you continue to get bigger and bigger every single day. And your site is obviously smartpassiveincome.com. And you're most known for really talking about the money that you're making online

• 3:53Lewis Howes?

  and the type of lifestyle you're living through the type of passive income that you're creating. Isn't that correct?

• 4:00Speaker 01

  Yeah. And for those of you listening, you might hear that and be like, oh, well, this guy must travel everywhere or, you know, be able to sort of do what he wants all the time. When the fact of the matter is, I'm typically stuck at home because it's where I want to be. I'm with my family. I have two kids, three and a half year old son and a nine month old daughter. And, you know, this is, this is exactly where I want to be. And, you know, I'm very fortunate that I owned a number of businesses online that are Semi automated to automated in a way where you know, I don't have to be there in order for the business to run itself and I can, you know, play with my family all day. I mean, that's typically what I do every day is I wake up with my kids. I let my wife sleep in because she obviously has one of the hardest jobs in the world as a stay at home mom.

• 4:43Speaker 01

  And I just hang out with the kids all day and when they go to bed, that's when I, you know, turn on the, the business mindset and get stuff done after they're asleep.

• 4:51Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I always see pictures of you on Instagram like at SeaWorld with your kids or your kids are always dressed up wearing something goofy or whatever. It's

• 4:58Speaker 01

  Yeah, dude, it's like, and you don't see me taking that picture also dressed up goofy. But it, I love it because you know, I go to Target like two in the afternoon and nobody's there. I mean, I can find parking right in the front. There's no traffic. I'm like the only dude in Target because there are all the rest are moms. And you know, we go there and we get what we need and we're out and we save a lot of time that way. And you know, it's just so cool. I mean, I'm just so fortunate, mainly because I'm here to witness all my kids first, you know, every, every step, every throw up. I mean, that's not a good thing, but every, every sort of part of their life, I'm here and I'm so thankful for that. And that's sort of why I created smartpassiveincome.com is because you know, this, this sort

• 5:41Speaker 01

  of business lifestyle that I've come across almost accidentally with the first business that I started is just life changing. I mean, I would have never known that any of this was possible, that this kind of lifestyle was possible and the money too. If it wasn't for my fortunate layoff back

• 5:59Lewis Howes?

  Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on a second. Before you talk about what actually happened, I want to give people an insight of actually how much you're making every month through just online stuff. You've got a few different sites. The main one is smartpassiveincome.com, correct?

• 6:12Speaker 01

  That is correct. Yes.

• 6:13Lewis Howes?

  That's the main site and you're public with all your, the numbers that you make. That's part of your, your deal, right?

• 6:18Speaker 01

  Yeah, I guess it's part of my shtick, I guess you could say, but no, for real, it's like, I'm talking about how I make money online on SmartPassiveIncome.com and what it's done for me, the lessons I've learned when I've done right, a lot of what I've done wrong. But I show my income every month in a monthly income report, down to the penny how much I make, because I just feel like if I'm talking about this stuff, it's only right that I show the results of what I'm talking about and walk in the walk, not just talking the talk. And you know, it's like a company, you know, every quarter they share their earnings reports and they do that so that investors can, you know, make educated decisions whether or not to invest with them or not. And I'm not asking people to invest money with me, but as someone who's producing content online, I am asking people to invest time in me.

• 7:01Speaker 01

  And so I just feel it's only right that I do this. And it turns a lot of heads and you know, a lot of people are like, "Oh, my gosh, I can't believe you share how much money you make." But nothing, nothing bad has ever happened to it and only good things. And that's sort of why I've become known as this sort of the transparent, sort of authentic guy in this space that was typically, you know, people hiding behind, you know, certain avatars or just scammy.

• 7:23Lewis Howes?

  Sleazy, yeah.

• 7:24Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 7:25Lewis Howes?

  Now, okay, so tell me two things. What, when was the first month you made, you know, over a hundred dollars? Or let's say the first dollar and then the first time you made over a hundred dollars. And then how much have you made? Did you make this last month on Smart Passive Income or with everything?

• 7:41Speaker 01

  Sure. Well, my very first dollar, I remember it because I sort of have to tell the story about how I got started in order to...

• 7:49Lewis Howes?

  Go for it. Okay, go for it.

• 7:51Speaker 01

  Okay, so I was working in the architecture industry and I loved it. I never wanted to leave. I had worked so hard to get sort of my dream job coming right out, right out of college. Everything was going great. I actually was doing a lot of things that I didn't need to do to climb higher in the corporate ladder. And I got promoted. I was like the youngest guy to become a job captain, which is sort of the level above senior drafter. I was making $60,000 a month, which is pretty high for the architecture world. And life was going great until... Mid 2008, actually almost five years from, five years ago, I got pulled into my office. My boss told me, "Pat, you're one of the smartest, youngest guys we have. We have to let you go." Wow.

• 8:33Speaker 01

  And I was just like, those two things that you said should not be in the same sentence, unless there's like a never in there. But yeah, it was just, it was just ridiculous. Everything that I had worked so hard for was just taken away from me in a moment. And you know, I had just proposed to my girlfriend and she said yes. And so I had that, so it was going through my head. I was like really angry and just upset, disappointed and really angry at myself and the world. I just didn't know why this was happening because I had done everything right up to this point. And luckily, when I still had my job, I actually was studying for this exam. And I had such a hard time studying for it that I actually built a website to help me sort of keep track of my notes. And for over a year, I put all my notes on this website and I passed the test.

• 9:18Speaker 01

  I just let the site sit there because I had no more use for it. Well, after I got let go, or the notice that I was going to get let go, I got really interested in sort of what my other opportunities were. I actually tried to get back into architecture. Nobody was hiring. I actually contacted like plumbers and electrical, you know, electricians to see if there was anything I could do sort of related to architecture and there was nothing. So I actually stumbled upon online business and I listened to this podcast way back in the day where a guy was talking about how he was making a good living, like a six-figure income living by teaching people how to pass the project management exam, the PM exam. And that's when a light bulb went off because I had this website that, you know, I used to keep track of my notes and teach myself how to pass this exam. Maybe there was a way I could teach people how to pass this exam and get paid for it too.

• 10:02Speaker 01

  Well, I discovered just right after that, after I put an analytical tool on the site, that thousands of people around the world, like in 31 different countries, were already visiting my site every, every single day. And I had no idea this was happening. I had no idea why or how it was happening. But apparently I had just written so much stuff that Google ranked a lot of my stuff, number one, for relevant keywords for this exam. People found it. Then I started to learn about how to find out where people are talking about your site. So I saw that. I was mentioned on all these architecture-related blogs and forums. It was just out there and I didn't even know. So I turned around and immediately tried to monetize it. And the first thing I did was I put Google AdSense on the site because every blogger out there is like, oh,

• 10:44Speaker 01

  what's the easiest way to make money? Well, you put some code on your site, it generates some Google Ads. If anyone clicks on those ads, you get an income. And I remember spending an hour trying to figure all that out, putting a code on my site, having an ad pop up. Fifteen minutes later, I checked my account and it was like a dollar and eight cents in there.

• 11:01Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 11:02Speaker 01

  And it was the best feeling in the world. I mean, I could find that at the bottom of my couch cushions, right? But just to know that I was making money online and that was really the start of it. And my AdSense income started to grow, but it was when I got some good advice from some other people who were doing online business to write an ebook, a study guide for my audience there. And that's when things really started to take off. So in October of 2008, I had released an ebook, a study guide, to help these people pass this exam. And in the first month, selling this book for $19.99, I had made $7,908.55.

• 11:41Lewis Howes?

  Seven thousand in the first month?

• 11:43Speaker 01

  Yeah, about $8,000 in the first month. And mind you, this site had been up for a year and a half, so it wasn't like an overnight thing. But when I started to monetize it finally, it felt overnight. And it just was absolutely life-changing for me. And that's really when I knew what was possible. And it changed my whole perspective of online business. I mean, I thought it was just this scammy, snake oil-filled industry. And here I was, providing an ebook, a study guide for people, getting paid for it. And also getting a ton of thank you notes and even handwritten thank you letters from people just saying you've saved so much of my time. This is awesome. And that just showed me that there are ways to do business online in a way

• 12:25Speaker 01

  where everybody's a winner. And so that's when I started the Smart Passive Income Blog to sort of share my experience with my other website, which you can find at greenexamacademy.com and still sell that ebook five years later. It's still making money for me. And the coolest part about how I set this all up is it's very inspired by Tim Ferriss and the Four Hour Workweek. He has actually some diagrams and charts in there about how to sort of automate your business. And I took the same approach. So people can come to my site, buy the ebook, get it automatically delivered to them. And the only part where I'm involved in that equation is, you know, money coming into my account. And it's so cool because I can literally wake up in the morning and see more money in my account. And as crazy and scammy as that sounds, you know, just on the surface, again, because I'm providing all this value to people

• 13:07Speaker 01

  and getting paid back in return and it's automated, it just, it just happens. And now my income's just skyrocketed from that point. And, you know, I was, I was scared. I didn't know how long I was going to be able to keep this up. But when my boss called me back a few months later, he said he started his own new firm and asked me to come back and work for him. I was confident in my no thanks. And that's sort of was the point where I knew that this is what I exactly what I, what I wanted to do and I'll show other people how to do. And now I'm making, last month, let me see, I can give you the exact number

• 13:46Speaker 01

  of how, how much I made in May 2013. So just pulling up the report here. I made, I grossed $66,582.93. And the net income in May is $57,788.80. So, I mean, that's how much I was making in a month in architecture. And now I'm making-

• 14:13Lewis Howes?

  You mean a year?

• 14:14Speaker 01

  Or in a year, excuse me.

• 14:15Lewis Howes?

  I was like, wait a minute, that's a pretty good job.

• 14:17Speaker 01

  Yeah, no, that's how much I was making in a year in architecture. And here I am making it in a month and for significantly less time. Now-

• 14:28Speaker 01

  I mean, there's still a lot of effort involved, but you know, I'm getting paid for what I feel I deserve instead of before where I was working my butt off. And you know, the guy next to me who wasn't, you know, we were getting paid the same. So I'm, I just, that's why I appreciate online business and feel like it's definitely the way to go.

• 14:42Lewis Howes?

  Right, definitely. And you, you basically decided to choose yourself, which James Altucher talks about is, you know, no one's gonna choose you except for yourself from making whatever you want come true for yourself. And you put the energy and the hustle in, you spent a year and a half creating that content originally and then kind of had this overnight success where you gave something to that audience of readers that you could monetize. And then you got a taste and you never looked back.

• 15:08Speaker 01

  I got the taste, dude. I got the taste.

• 15:10Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, the taste is the most beautiful thing. I remember when I got the taste and it was like, holy crap. It was like, it's just a whole new world opens up and life is just amazing. Once you get that taste.

• 15:23Speaker 01

  Yeah, I mean, it's just, it's just amazing. And, and you know, again, just getting all the thank yous from people. That, that's really how I know that what I'm doing is, is sort of right. And to get paid for doing it is just awesome. Um, just, it's incredible.

• 15:37Lewis Howes?

  You know, it's amazing when we, when we actually let go and we allow ourselves to, you know, go after what we want as opposed to holding ourselves back and doing what we think we should do. And once we do that, a lot starts to come our way. So you're, you're continuing to grow the site. You've got other sites that you talk about where you monetize products, things like that. Where you share on smartpassiveincome.com, but you wrote a book recently called Let Go. And it's all about entrepreneurship. And what is it exactly this book is all about for people?

• 16:09Speaker 01

  Yeah. Well, thank you for letting me talk about it. And I really like, I, I saw what you were doing there as far as letting go. So that's pretty cool. Um, Let Go is, is a detailed, very personal account of my story from actually getting let go from my architecture position, but it's called Let Go, not just for that reason, but also because it goes over everything that was going through my head as far as letting go from everything I had worked so hard for in the past. From what I was conditioned to believe was the right path, um, sort of letting going of that, letting go. The fears that I had getting things started. I mean, I talk about all that. I get really detailed. And what's cool about the book is it includes multimedia as well. At the end of most of the chapters, there are videos that go along with each of those chapters that were actually shot on location

• 16:51Speaker 01

  for certain events that happened in my life. I also have interviews with people like my wife and my dad, who played integral roles, vital roles in my success and providing that support. And also, my dad actually initially gave me the advice when I got laid off to go back to school. And I had to make that tough decision to sort of disagree with him there, which was like, I was never supposed to do that. You know, my dad was always right. So that was very tough for me. But that interview is really funny because I actually asked him, well, how do you feel about it now? Like, your advice that you gave me before and where I'm at now? And so it's really interesting to hear from him, my wife, who, you know, I had just proposed to, and how she provided support and believed in me along the way.

• 17:35Speaker 01

  And just, you know, every sort of important sort of mindset, sort of thing that happened during the path, from getting over the fears to hooking up with other people in mastermind groups, to, you know, that first dollar and how important that was, to getting some actually some great advice from some of my customers at first, who told me that I should actually, you know, raise the price of my book, because I was selling it for way too low of a price. And just really, really interesting things like that. And so the book actually went on sale initially, three months ago, on a new platform on iOS called Snippet App. It's a really cool platform to sort of view multimedia.

• 18:17Speaker 01

  It's a totally different reading experience. You can actually see social media right in the chapters. So for example, you're reading a chapter, you can see a Twitter hashtag conversation right inside the book and actually add to it, which is really cool. And they're coming out with some other cool things like interactions with using the camera and polls and questions and stuff. If you're an author, it's definitely something to potentially check out. But I also repurposed it on amazon.com because, you know, not everyone has an iOS platform. And within a day, it shot up to number one in small business and entrepreneurship. So I'm really stoked to sort of have that be a part of my very first book writing experience. And now I'm writing more books. There's a traditional book on its way as well. I've hooked up with a literary agent as a result of this book and my podcast.

• 19:01Speaker 01

  Just, gosh, so many amazing things happening. And Louis, I have to thank you for also a lot of the inspiration to write my book because I saw what you were doing out there and putting yourself out there. So thank you for that. It's made a big difference.

• 19:14Lewis Howes?

  My pleasure, man. My pleasure. Now, you're 29 or you're 30?

• 19:20Lewis Howes?

  Or you're 28? How old are you? I think you're, okay, 30. So we're the same age. And you did all this in the last, you know, five years. But you had these beliefs about, you know, working, I guess, in corporate America before that. You talked about your dad and how, you know, he really encouraged you to either go back to school or go back and get a job or whatever it may be. Now, I want to ask you a question. How hard was it? And I know you cover a lot of this in your book and there's a lot of cool videos in there. But how hard was it to let go of these limiting beliefs and actually say, I'm going to work on my own? And I'm going to try this thing out. I'm going to go for it. When your parents, your family, maybe even your wife are telling you, you know, why don't you go back and get a job? Maybe it's time, when it's time for you to go back and get a job?

• 20:04Lewis Howes?

  Shouldn't you be looking? There's no security in working for yourself. You know, did you have a lot of fears that you had to overcome? And talk a little bit about that.

• 20:13Speaker 01

  Oh, gosh. I mean, the journey definitely wasn't easy. And, you know, I was, I was pretty fortunate to have a number of people who were supporting me a long way. But I know a lot of people who are met with those challenges of having family and friends who are just trying to pull them down. I mean, a lot of that is a result of them trying to sort of, you know, say that their own life is good because maybe they have corporate jobs that they don't like, but they're trying to defend themselves. Or maybe they've worked the same job for 40 years like my dad did. And then retired like what we were supposed to. And yeah, I was met with. Incredible amounts of fear and doubt. I mean, resistance played a huge role in trying to stop me. And I think anyone who's ever tried to do something sort of worth or life-changing

• 20:57Speaker 01

  has been met with that resistance. And I've sort of learned from that moment forward that whenever that resistance sort of comes into play and when those doubts come at you and you're up against that wall and it doesn't look like you can get over, that's actually a good sign that whatever you're sort of about to do is something worth doing. Now, for those of you out there who may be met with family members or friends who might be sort of negative about what you are potentially trying to do, my best advice would be to not really talk about what you're doing with them very much. I mean, especially with family, you can't get rid of family. They're always going to be there. So, I mean, don't give them an opportunity to put you down. And really, the best advice is to go out there, find people who have the same mindset

• 21:39Speaker 01

  as you, who are trying to do the same thing as you, or have done the same thing as you, who has the same mindset as you. That is how you sort of pull through those tough times. And, you know, part of the reason why it's so tough is because when you first start out, you're not seeing any results. I mean, we're so used to, you know, working X hours and getting paid X hours. And, yeah, we might be getting that paycheck every two weeks or so, but, you know, you know you're getting paid for that time you put in. I mean, when you're first starting out as an entrepreneur, you have no idea if what you're doing is going to pay off. But then you have to understand, especially when you start doubting whether or not this is secure or not, or worth going for. I mean, A, you never know unless you give it a shot. I mean, the only sure thing is if you don't take any action, nothing great will happen.

• 22:23Speaker 01

  Number two, you have to be somewhat confident in yourself. And maybe you don't know all the answers, but you have to be confident for the fact that you know you're going to try and figure it out. If, there's a quote from Henry Ford, that's my absolute favorite. It's "Whether you think you can or you can't, you're right." So, how you believe you are, or what the results might eventually become, plays a huge role in actually what those results actually are, and the reality of them. And thirdly, it's just...

• 22:55Speaker 01

  Gosh, I mean, I mean, there's the you just, I mean, those are, those are the biggest things, I think. And then really being sort of in tune with the small wins along the way. We see these big, big goals of trying to start a business or make X amount of money every year. You kind of have to take those big goals and make a lot of mini goals out of them because it's, it's, it's a long journey and it's hard. And it did take a long time for me, especially after I started Smart Passive Income. And I didn't really, I wasn't really getting results like I was used to with the other site for the first year and a half. You have to really reward yourself and be happy about those small wins along the way. Because when you do that, you're sort of making, it sort of is, is confirmation that you're making progress. But also that, you know, you can achieve stuff when you work at it.

• 23:40Speaker 01

  And, you know, it's just helping you stay motivated along the way.

• 23:44Lewis Howes?

  Right, you know, I meet probably two or three people randomly every week, wherever I'm traveling. We end up talking about what they're doing and what they're passionate about. And I get pretty much a similar story almost every time. They've been working somewhere for five to 10 years. They, they feel like it's a good job, but they really have this passion in something else, something more creative or something completely different from what they're doing. However, they're unwilling to take the leap, I guess, and let go of what they're doing currently to do what they really want to do. Based out of a lot of different factors. Sometimes it's, you know, security, they, you know, they don't, they don't want to make no money for a while because they're making decent money.

• 24:27Lewis Howes?

  Sometimes it's fear, sometimes it's just not enough pain. They don't want it bad enough. They don't feel like enough pain inside. It's like, I can't keep doing this because it's a decent job or whatever. It's okay, it's only, you know, killing me slowly as opposed to fast. So what do you, what do you say to people like that who are just like, you know what? I've got a decent job, but it's not something I really love. But I'm doing it because I want to get my family, make sure they're okay. And my parents tell me that I should be doing this. So I stick it out because of them and my partner and kids. What, what do you say to someone like that? Do you say, keep living that life or should they let go?

• 25:03Speaker 01

  Well, I mean, that's a fantastic question. I think that that sums up how most people feel. Because, you know, when it comes to job security, I mean, I thought my job as an architect was always secure.

• 25:16Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, you were the smartest guy, you were the hardest working, all those things, right?

• 25:19Speaker 01

  And I got let go. And so that's just changed my whole mindset. And that made me feel like whether I succeed or fail, I want it to be because of something that I did or didn't do. You know, I want my results to be my own, no matter what. And so that's why I feel it's very important. A lot of people, you know, probably deserve to get paid a lot more and they don't just because of the way that the system works. And that's depressing to think about, too. But, you know, when people are deciding whether or not to make that jump, my question is, why does it have to be a jump? Why can't you just put your toe in the water a little bit, you know? And there's a really cool book called Secrets of the Millionaire Mind by T. Harv Ecker. And there's a number of different testaments in there that I actually

• 26:02Speaker 01

  have printed out and put on a frame next to my desk because I read them. One of them is, I always think both. You know, we always think there's only one or the other. Why can't you have both for a while? And this was even said again in Chip and Dan Heath's most recent book, Decisive. They call it oaching. If you've read the book, you know what that's about. If you haven't, that sounds a little weird. But it means that, you know, when people are trying to make decisions, we always feel like it's either A or B. But there's a lot of other things in between. And so, you know, why not give it a shot, but continue to have the job that you do have so that you can test the waters and you're not putting yourself in a position, perhaps, that might be dangerous to your family, especially if you have a family. I mean, if you don't have a family and other responsibilities, you can take

• 26:45Speaker 01

  bigger risks, but you don't need to take those bigger risks, especially at first. Although bold actions will always get you bigger and bolder results. I mean, that's another thing to think about. But, you know, a lot of people who I tell that to are like, okay, well, I'm going to try both. But I mean, I don't even have time in my day to even work on my business. I work eight to six. I have a family. And so when I get home, I spend time with them because I only have a couple hours before they go to bed. I mean, what can I do? And my advice for you, if that's the case... Is, you know, that there's a sort of saying in the personal finance industry when it comes to saving money and building wealth over time, and that saying is pay yourself first. And what that means is before you pay your bills, or you spend any money, you know, put some of your paycheck away in an account that's specifically for you. I mean, you've

• 27:29Speaker 01

  probably heard that advice, advice over and over again, because those small savings and investments add up. And when it comes to building your business and trying to find time to do that, if you're already giving your time away to others, you know, you're going to have very little or no time, or even brain power left for yourself. I mean, it's really hard to work on your own stuff after you've worked on other people's stuff. So why not take the same approach as that personal finance advice and work for yourself first? And that might mean having to wake up a little bit earlier and work on your business first, even just an hour a day dedicated to your own stuff, to yourself, even before the kids are awake, before you feel bad that you're not spending time with them, work for yourself first. And, you know, you're up in the morning, perhaps, a little earlier, and excited to work on your business, instead of tired and worn out at the end of the day,

• 28:14Speaker 01

  you're actually getting up motivated, because you know that that's the only time you have, instead of getting up dreading the long work day ahead. And, you know, you might not be a morning person, but how bad do you really want this, you know?

• 28:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. I mean, there's a great quote out there. What is the quote? Let me pull it up really quick. I share this pretty much every couple of months on my, my Facebook page, and it says, entrepreneurship is living a few years of your life like most people won't, so you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't. And it really comes down to the willingness to sacrifice and take action. And if for a couple of years, you've got to wake up a few hours earlier, or if you've got to spend less time with your, your family, or whatever it may be, if you really have no extra time, if you want to live an amazing rest of your life, then you've got to spend a few years where you're hustling a little harder, and putting that energy into building something

• 29:08Lewis Howes?

  and starting to create wealth for yourself, and an asset that you can create wealth with. So.

• 29:13Speaker 01

  Right. I mean, whether that's a business you want to create, or you want to get really good at a sport, or whatever, I mean, you just have to put that extra time in. And that's a great lesson.

• 29:25Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. The only time, the only time.

• 29:30Lewis Howes?

  Greatness comes before hustle is in the dictionary. You've got to hustle. You've got to be willing to put it out there. So that's definitely what it is. I feel, I feel like people in general, uh, obviously a lot of the listeners here are greatness achievers, but most people in general, um, they aren't willing to sacrifice because they want to have time with their friends. They want to have time during happy hour in the weekends. They want to think about their vacation, but you gotta be willing to sacrifice if you want to achieve greatness and really get what you want. Pat's making 60 grand a month on average. Some months you're making more, some months a little less, but you've spent the last five years being consistent to get there. Now, I don't know about you guys, but if I knew I could spend five years and being consistent

• 30:12Lewis Howes?

  and follow a model that worked and really jumped in, let go of all the limiting beliefs that I did have and the fears. If I knew I was going to make 50, 60, 70, a hundred grand a month in five to 10 years, wouldn't you be willing to put in the time and a little bit of extra effort and sacrifice to do the work? I mean, Pat doesn't even, I'm assuming Pat, you don't even feel like you have to sacrifice because what you do is something you love and you get to spend a lot of time with your family still. So it's not like you're giving up all this time and energy. You're, we, we chat online at like 1 a.m. You're up at 1, 2 a.m., you know, working when your family's asleep. I'm still up because I don't sleep. So we're, we're G-chatting, we're on Skype, you know, talking about the latest and greatest.

• 30:56Lewis Howes?

  And that's when a lot of us get work done. You know, especially if you have a family, you're getting work done when your family's asleep. So.

• 31:01Speaker 01

  Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I don't watch TV anymore. I mean, maybe I watch Dancing with the Stars and that's it or whatever, but, um, you know, I sacrifice a lot of those types of things in order to live the life that I want to live. And I feel like, you know, yeah, I mean, it's hard. I mean, you have to make sacrifices and not everyone will. And that's why not everyone can do this. And sort of this is, this is sort of, you know, the, the, the hard work that is required upfront is sort of a nature's sort of filter for getting rid of the people who don't deserve that success.

• 31:34Lewis Howes?

  It's like there's a big wall in front of all of us and those that figure out and have the strength to climb all the way to the top and get over, it's like a clear path after that. It's just that freaking strenuous hard work to climb up there with the sweat when your muscles are freaking, uh, just, you know, have no energy, no strength left until you get to the very top. Then once you're up there and the view is good and then you just crawl down and you just walk the rest of the way. Um, because you've got all this leverage, you've got this experience, you've got this knowledge, you've got time that it took to get there and all that works in your favor after you get over that hump and over that wall.

• 32:11Speaker 01

  Yeah, totally. And, and, and, you know, you might not, you, you might get halfway up and fall back down, you know, you're gonna fail.

• 32:18Lewis Howes?

  Oh, yeah.

• 32:18Speaker 01

  You know, a lot. Every successful entrepreneur I've talked to, um, has, has shared many failure stories. I mean, I have a ton, um, but they're only learning experiences if you think of them that way. I don't know why society just, you know, we, we sort of go, go through school thinking failing is like the worst thing ever, you know, we always try to avoid it. When we, you know, we get a big fat red F on our papers, just telling us how much of a failure we are and how, how dumb we are, when really failure is good. I mean, we don't want to fail, of course, but when you come across it, you know, okay, what I just did didn't work, time to pivot and try something else.

• 32:55Lewis Howes?

  That's it. And failure is necessary in order to be extremely successful. And all the most successful greats in the world have experienced far more failure than any of us because they had to keep learning how to get to the top and it doesn't just come easy, obviously. So.

• 33:12Speaker 01

  Again, if it did, everybody would be giving it.

• 33:13Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. Well, what's your big, what's your big goal in the next 20, 40 years for you? What's like the biggest dream you have? What's, what's the reason for doing everything you're doing? And what's the biggest dream you have that you want to accomplish?

• 33:27Speaker 01

  About 20 to 40 years ahead. Wow, I thought you were gonna say the typical, what's your five year plan, but 20 to 40.

• 33:33Lewis Howes?

  I'm talking like, what's your big dream? What's the big dream over the next, you know, later part of your life?

• 33:40Speaker 01

  Well, really, it's just, everything I do is centered around my kids right now. I mean, they're my everything, and I want to be here for everything along their journey, and I want them to be incredibly successful. And I think the better example I could be for them as far as being successful, the better their life is gonna be, and the more options that they will have as well. I mean, I want them to just do whatever it is they want to do and be happy and sort of understand that they can do things the way they want, and as long as they can enjoy themselves but also provide value to the world somehow, great things are gonna happen and their life is gonna be good. And, you know, so I know that when I pass way down the road, hopefully, you know, they're gonna be around and I'd love, I'd love to have a little bit of myself in the way I sort of feel about the way business

• 34:24Speaker 01

  should be run and life should be lived in them as well. So that's my, I guess, my super long-term goal, and to hopefully help them understand those values so they can pass it on as well. I mean, I would love, you know, as far as other goals, I would love to have a number of books out, like traditionally published books. I'd love to just be known as something worth knowing, you know, not because of something that I either didn't do or something that, you know, was a fault of mine, but something that, you know, like I contributed somehow to society.

• 34:54Lewis Howes?

  Sure.

• 34:55Speaker 01

  And, you know, and it doesn't have to be for the entire world, but maybe just a specific part of that world. And, you know, as long as I feel like I've impacted somebody's life, then I will, you know, live a happy life. And, you know, I know if I do that, I will have good money, I will be happy, I will get to live by that lake like I want to when I'm older, and just go fishing every day.

• 35:18Lewis Howes?

  Sure, nice. What's your, what's your definition of greatness then?

• 35:22Speaker 01

  Greatness to me is sort of the equivalent of inspiration, I feel. And I feel like the more someone can inspire, the more great they are, or the greater they are. There's a really good quote by someone named Colin Hightower, and that is, "A true measure of your worth includes all the benefits others have gained from your success." And so I feel like greatness is really proportional to how much you can inspire based on what you do and how well you do it. That's why people like Michael Jordan, he was such an inspirational person. That's why he was a great basketball player. I mean, they're good at what they do, of course, and they're great because of that,

• 36:05Speaker 01

  but more so because of the fact that they inspire. And you know, there are people out there who are wonderful athletes as far as skill, but they sort of lack the personality, or they just, you know, they don't give back for all their success. And the people who do are greater than I feel those who might even be more skilled, but just don't appreciate the fans and stuff like that.

• 36:30Lewis Howes?

  I actually want to ask you one more question. That's usually my final question, but I want to ask you, since you're the Smart Passive Income Expert, let's say someone's starting, realizes they want to start making money online today. In your opinion, what's the best way for them to get started in building an online business? If they have never seen your site or know anything that you've talked about, what's the best thing, what's the first step they should take?

• 36:58Speaker 01

  Well, even before creating a website and creating a brand, which is obviously very important, you have to find a problem. You have to find a pain, or a desire, or some really big struggle that a certain group of people have that you feel you can contribute to, that you can be their solution for. When you do that, I mean, a lot of people create these businesses thinking they're solving a problem. And they start with their product, or they start with their brand, or getting into a specific market just because they feel like it's what's needed. When really what's needed is you going and actually having conversations with people in that specific niche with those problems to determine Exactly what their pains are so you can figure out exactly how to solve them.

• 37:43Speaker 01

  And if you can do that, you know, you're going to change people's lives and that's when your life changes too. And so, you know, really it's about the mindset of trying to find that particular market and what those pains are, you know, sort of just, just, just really getting deep into why people feel the way they feel. And, you know, I have a great podcast episode, number 46, where we talk a lot about sort of mining the sort of issues that some people have, you know, getting five, six, seven levels deep, you know, into questions to, to understand really what people sort of are looking for and why people feel the, the way they feel so that you can provide the exact solution that they need. And when you can, when you can truly understand the problems and really get into those problems

• 38:28Speaker 01

  that people are having and the pains that they're having, the solution sort of creates itself and there's no more guessing because you know.

• 38:35Lewis Howes?

  Right, exactly. What, what number was that on the podcast?

• 38:38Speaker 01

  Forty-six. SmartPassiveIncome.com/session46.

• 38:42Lewis Howes?

  Nice, yeah. And Pat's got a, one of the top 10 business podcasts actually on iTunes right now and he's got over, I think, three million downloads or something crazy like that. So make sure to go subscribe to Smart Passive Income Podcast on iTunes and you can check it all out at SmartPassiveIncome.com. But also check out the really cool new book that he has called Let Go and you can see it on his, on his blog, SmartPassiveIncome.com. You'll see a big image of it on the right-hand side there and it's all interactive. Again, you get to see all these cool videos and interviews and behind the scenes, interactive, cool stuff that you don't get in a normal book. So make sure to check that out, check out the blog, subscribe to the podcast.

• 39:25Lewis Howes?

  There's a lot of interesting, if you want to learn about how to make money online, this is the podcast that you need to be listening to. I've been on there a couple of times and share some good stuff on webinars and LinkedIn, but there's a lot of great guests on there and Pat dives deep into building a passive business online. So make sure to check that out. And with that, thanks so much for, for coming on, my man. Is there any final words you wanted to mention?

• 39:50Speaker 01

  No, I mean, just, just, just hustle like Lewis and I do and, you know, good things will happen.

• 39:58Lewis Howes?

  There you go. I appreciate it, brother. We'll talk soon, man.

• 40:01Speaker 01

  Thanks for having me on. Appreciate it.

• 40:13Lewis Howes?

  There you have it, my good man, Pat Flynn. Make sure to go check out his site and his podcast, SmartPassiveIncome.com. And also, please keep leaving us your feedback and reviews over on iTunes. Love seeing the reviews and the feedback coming in and all the ratings you guys are sharing with us. Thanks so much for all that love. And you're gonna get all the show notes over at SchoolOfGreatness.com. Until next time, guys, I hope you have a fantastic week and make sure to do something great.