1081 How to Create a Lasting Relationship & Build Intimacy w/Dr. Laura Berman

“The love that you have for yourself is the only predictor of the love you can receive.”Today's guest is Dr. Laura Berman, who is a leading expert in the field of sex and relationship therapy. She is a New York Times bestselling author of many books, including her latest “Quantum Love.” She is an award-winning radio host and has her own podcast “The Language of Love.” In this episode Lewis and Dr. Berman discuss how to become more connected with your partner, ending a relationship in a healthy way, developing your self-worth, healing trauma and how she was able to handle the grief of losing her son, and so much more! For more go to: www.lewishowes.com/1081Listen to Dr. Berman’s new podcast: The Language of LoveCheck out her website: https://drlauraberman.com/ The Power of Erotic Intelligence with Esther Perel: https://link.chtbl.com/732-podFind Lasting Love with Matthew Hussey: https://link.chtbl.com/811-pod Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy! Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Lewis Howes?

  This is episode number 1,081 with New York Times bestselling author Dr. Laura Berman. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week, we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. Gloria Steinem said, "Far too many people are looking for the right person instead of trying to be the right person." And Sam Keen said, "We come to love not by finding a perfect person, but by learning

• 0:43Lewis Howes?

  to see an imperfect person perfectly." My guest today is Dr. Laura Berman, who is a leading expert in the field of sex and relationship therapy. She's a New York Times bestselling author of many books, including her latest, Quantum Love. She is an award-winning radio host and has her own show, The Language of Love, that you can subscribe to as a podcast as well. And Dr. Berman is ready to help you create the fulfilling and passionate love life you deserve, regardless of your relationship status, gender, or sexual orientation. And in this episode, we discuss how to become more connected with your partner, how to end a relationship in a healthy way, how to develop your own self-worth, whether in a relationship

• 1:28Lewis Howes?

  or single, how to improve and keep your sex life alive, how stress affects men and women differently in relationships, the process of healing trauma, and how Laura was able to handle the grief of losing her son. Make sure to share this with someone you think would be inspired by this message. And a quick reminder to subscribe to the School of Greatness on Apple Podcasts, as well as leave us a rating and review of feedback of what you enjoyed most about this episode. Okay, in just a moment, the one and only Dr. Laura Berman.

• 2:03Lewis Howes?

  Welcome everyone to the School of Greatness. We have Dr. Laura Berman in the house. Sex and relationship therapist, experts. Very excited you're here. We're already starting the conversation. You've had a lot of experience over the years on working with people on how to understand their their language of love, their intimacy, how to interact with their intimate partner, how to understand their shame, how to communicate or what they want more in their sex life. I'm curious, what's the one thing that you would say that someone could do to feel better connected to their partner if they don't feel connected?

• 2:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 2:41Lewis Howes?

  What's the one thing?

• 2:42Dr. Laura Berman?

  Have sex. No, seriously, you know, it's interesting because when sex is working in a relationship, it's just one part of a whole beautiful working relationship. It's just one cog in the wheel. But when it's not working, that's when I see that there's a real disconnect. And so, you know, to a certain extent, it's about really prioritizing the actual act of sex in a relationship. But it's also, because I've done national research, for instance, on what the most sexually satisfied women have in common.

• 3:18Lewis Howes?

  What is that?

• 3:19Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's not the number of orgasms they have or how well endowed their partner is or anything else. It is the emotional intimacy and connection they feel with the person they're having sex with. That is their greatest predictor of sexual satisfaction.

• 3:34Lewis Howes?

  What if the man is emotionally connected to their partner, but the woman in the relationship is disconnected, you know, whatever it may be, looking away or not in the moment and not communicating, and they're disconnected?

• 3:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 3:48Lewis Howes?

  How does the male partner break through to the female partner?

• 3:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, it depends on why she's disconnected, right? Like, I find that for the most part...

• 3:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  When women are disconnected in a sexual situation, it is protective.

• 4:05Lewis Howes?

  What are they protecting from?

• 4:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  It could be anything. It could be vulnerability. It could be that they have a lot of inhibitions and they have stories about what nice girls do and don't do. It could be that they have a history of trauma and they're having some PTSD and they have to like really kind of

• 4:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  work to keep themselves present. It could be that they're disassociated. And they're not even in the, you know, building anymore, which is very common.

• 4:34Lewis Howes?

  They're out of their body. They're in another place.

• 4:37Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and that's what a lot of people, men and women do to, you know, it's a beautiful coping strategy that we do to survive sexual abuse, or any kind of abuse, but certainly sexual abuse because, you know, if you were present in your body while that was going on, like you're off somewhere in la la land to survive it, but then that becomes your sexual script, so you don't even really realize. So to come back into your body for lots of people can be really tough because then they start remembering things they don't want to remember.

• 5:05Lewis Howes?

  So how to get back in your body in a safe space?

• 5:08Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, I think it starts by getting back, learning how, you know, I call it like embodiment. I think most of us walk around out of our bodies most of the time and don't even realize it.

• 5:20Lewis Howes?

  Not connected to the body?

• 5:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  Not connected to the body. I mean, I'm someone like that. I'm always up here. You know, I'm very philosophical and I'm always thinking and I have to really, you know, work. I call it my yoni breath. You know, you take a really deep breath in. For you, it would be a bony because you don't have a yoni. You can do this through your butt. But you breathe in really, really deep and then you imagine light flowing from here through your body. But when you breathe out, you open that sucker as wide as you can.

• 5:50Lewis Howes?

  Sucker, you mean your butt?

• 5:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Your butthole in your case, yoni in a woman's case. So you go like this.

• 5:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  And you blow out, you blow out really hard and you push it open.

• 6:02Dr. Laura Berman?

  Now just try it, do it.

• 6:03Lewis Howes?

  No, I just did it when you're doing it.

• 6:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Now do a really hard breath.

• 6:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  Okay, and then let it rest gently open.

• 6:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  You see the difference?

• 6:14Lewis Howes?

  It's relaxing.

• 6:15Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, but do you see the difference? You're probably walking around like most people, tight-arsed all the time, right?

• 6:20Lewis Howes?

  Tight. I feel pretty relaxed, actually.

• 6:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  I know, so do I.

• 6:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 6:23Dr. Laura Berman?

  But...

• 6:24Lewis Howes?

  But if you're tied down there...

• 6:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  So, and it's real for...

• 6:27Lewis Howes?

  Allowing it to flow, the energy to flow.

• 6:28Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and also it sort of gets you back to your body. That's just like a...

• 6:32Lewis Howes?

  An exercise.

• 6:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and a little temperature I take. You know, am I walking around connected and open to guidance and grounding? Or am I somewhere else in my mind? Because I can very easily intellectualize. And so, a lot of even my work with myself, much less my work with everyone else, is about learning to be present in your body. And if you're someone who is really inhibited, or has a lot of anxiety, or a lot of trauma, you are not going to learn to be back in your body, nor should you in a sexual scenario. You know, so you start just noticing during the day, how often am I up here in the clouds, daydreaming and thinking about a million things? Or am I in my body?

• 7:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  Can I do a body scan and even notice what the sensations are there? You know, if I'm upset about something, instead of thinking about it, can I really go into my body and notice where I'm holding that feeling?

• 7:29Lewis Howes?

  The tension, yeah, yeah.

• 7:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know? And can I... you know, I have to educate people, and it's not just men, but you know, if you are... They don't often even know what they're feeling in their bodies, right? So if you're scared, you'll often feel tightness in your stomach or in your chest. If you're angry, you'll feel it in your back. If you're sad or you're scared, you'll feel it in your throat or behind your eyes. So sometimes it's about helping people kind of even identify how they're feeling. But I would say that most of the world is walking around, to some degree, not home.

• 8:06Lewis Howes?

  So we need to be in a process of healing, it sounds like. Healing the past, being aware of the past, reflecting on it, and then processing and healing in order to be more connected to our body and then connected to another person. Is that what I'm hearing you say?

• 8:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  If it's a result of trauma, I think as a culture, we don't support being in our bodies. We support the outside of how our bodies look, you know, but we don't really, and we talk about what our bodies can perform and do, athletic feats, or muscles, or whatever, or how to lose weight, you know, we relate to our bodies that way.

• 8:38Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 8:39Dr. Laura Berman?

  But are we really in our bodies?

• 8:42Lewis Howes?

  So how do we, how do we get in our body if we have resentment, anger, trauma, PTSD, stress, anxiety?

• 8:49Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or just habit.

• 8:50Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 8:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know, you were in a family where, like, my family was all intellectualizing and not really, you know, if you grew up in a family not comfortable with big feelings, or where your, your big feelings were not

• 9:01Lewis Howes?

  Accepted or, yeah.

• 9:02Dr. Laura Berman?

  Accepted or held, you learn not to have them. And how do you not have feelings? By leaving the building, you know? So it can be a great coping skill, because you can go through some major shit and sit and talk about whatever you want.

• 9:17Lewis Howes?

  Your body can be traumatized, or you can be emotionally, or physically, or sexually, or mentally abused, but then go somewhere else

• 9:24Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 9:25Lewis Howes?

  And allow it to happen.

• 9:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, or, well-

• 9:27Lewis Howes?

  And still function as a human.

• 9:28Dr. Laura Berman?

  And still function as a human. Yeah, you're not, you're certainly not necessarily allowing it to happen, but when you're powerless, certainly in those abuse cases, you leave, because if you stayed present, you wouldn't survive it. I mean, you couldn't, it was so terrifying and traumatizing. It's, it's such a beautiful coping mechanism, our minds and our bodies do, but, you know, there's so much beautiful work happening now with somatic experiencing, and John Levine, and all these people that are doing amazing work, which to some extent is learning to be back in your body, but they talk about how we as mammals are just like every other mammal. You see a dog- Freaked out about something. What do they do afterwards? They shake it off.

• 10:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  They're moving their body. They're present with their body and how that feeling and that experience affected them. And they're letting it pass through them and they're shaking it off. You know, we tend to hold or leave.

• 10:24Lewis Howes?

  And they have, it seems like they have shorter term memories.

• 10:27Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 10:28Lewis Howes?

  They can kind of move on quicker.

• 10:29Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, right. That helps.

• 10:30Lewis Howes?

  And we hold on to the memories of the pain of the past and amplify. And oftentimes, from my experience, blow it up is a bigger and bigger thing than it probably actually was from that event at seven or 12 or 15. Sometimes we make it the biggest pain in the world, which sure was painful.

• 10:49Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right.

• 10:49Lewis Howes?

  And it shouldn't have happened or whatever, but it's almost like the holding, the attachment of the pain becomes stronger than the actual pain itself.

• 10:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and I think that's also a coping skill. Like, I find that usually when people do that, when they're really committed to their trauma, it's because they've never had a place or a person that can hold it for them.

• 11:11Lewis Howes?

  Ooh, or to let it go or to share it.

• 11:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  To hold it.

• 11:14Lewis Howes?

  Uh, you know, my audience knows about my story of sexual abuse, so I won't go into it. When I was five, it happened and it took me 25 years to, to, to feel like I was safe enough to share it. And it caused a lot of reactions, a lot of negative reactions in me when I felt taken advantage of or abused in other ways. And when I finally had a safe space where I felt open enough to share, it's when the journey of healing started to happen. And I felt so much freer. I felt so much freer, more accepted, more loved, and I could accept myself.

• 11:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  But you don't realize that until you take that leap, right?

• 11:50Lewis Howes?

  It's the scariest thing, though.

• 11:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Oh, yeah.

• 11:52Lewis Howes?

  So how do people create a safe space in their mind and their body to be able to share any type of trauma? That is maybe making them disconnected in a, we're talking about a sexual experience, but also just disconnected in life.

• 12:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Oh, yeah. Um, you know, and I call it, like, it doesn't have to be, I mean, that sexual abuse is like what I would call a big T-trauma, right? But there are also those little T-traumas.

• 12:14Lewis Howes?

  You're ugly. You're not beautiful.

• 12:16Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right, yeah, you're not good enough, overcritical, never measuring up. Conditional love, abandonment, you know, all of those things. We hold on to and they become part of the lens through which we view the world.

• 12:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 12:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  And part of our belief system and then that is what starts a self fulfilling prophecy. So, you know, I think most of us who are struggling in our lives, and I'm sure you were too, even if on the surface you seemed great, you know, you weren't.

• 12:45Lewis Howes?

  I wasn't, I was suffering inside.

• 12:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  You were suffering and you were reactive and you were triggered and, you know, and I-

• 12:51Lewis Howes?

  Ego driven.

• 12:52Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and that's someone, you know, I would call that someone who is not friends with their shadows. Right? Why are they not friends with their shadows? Because those shadows are freaking scary and they don't want anyone to see them. They don't even want to look at them. They're like, it's like, you know, in those old houses, like that basement, there are some scary, I am not going down in that basement.

• 13:12Lewis Howes?

  Some spiders, some snakes.

• 13:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  Some monsters, some evil, serial, like who the hell knows what's down there? I'm not going down there. I know it's something bad and no one should go down there.

• 13:22Lewis Howes?

  What happens to us if we don't go into the basement of our shadows and become friends with our shadows?

• 13:27Dr. Laura Berman?

  You are often physically ill with chronic diseases and inflammatory diseases. You're reactive, you're stuck in ego, not that ego is bad, but when you're stuck there, you're easily triggered and you're not a very safe person to be intimate with. And what most people find, and you're saying, you know, you're describing the same thing, is when you open that basement door and you turn on the lights, you don't see anything scary. It's just these little parts of yourself that have just been longing. Like I always say that shame, when exposed to the light evaporates.

• 14:07Lewis Howes?

  Ooh.

• 14:08Dr. Laura Berman?

  It always evaporates and the scariest part is opening the basement door.

• 14:14Lewis Howes?

  It's so scary and it's something I try to do every year since I opened up about sexual trauma eight years ago now. It's something I try to think of, where else am I? Ashamed. Where else am I hiding something, whether it be to myself or to other people that I'm embarrassed by? Because when I address it, whether to myself, to a therapist, to friends, it doesn't have to be publicly, it can be. I don't think everyone should just share their shame publicly unless you're really ready for that. But when I do it, I just realize, oh, less and less things have control and power over me.

• 14:48Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right.

• 14:49Lewis Howes?

  And I'm in more control of my feelings, my thoughts, my reactions or actions based on an event that's happening in life.

• 14:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I agree.

• 14:59Lewis Howes?

  And it's a powerful feeling to be friends with your insecurities, shadows, fears, whatever you want to call it.

• 15:05Dr. Laura Berman?

  We all had them. You wouldn't have the light. I mean, if you think about like when my father was dying and he, you know, I had a very complicated emotion, you know, he was a real narcissist, a wonderful father in a million ways, but a real narcissist. And, you know, there was a lot of darkness in my childhood and a lot of trauma, much of which I didn't even really come to terms with until a few years before he died. And at the end of his life, I was his person, always, you know, taking care of him. And I said to him about two or three days when it was clear he was gonna go soon. I said, I just want you to know that I forgive you.

• 15:46Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 15:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  And he said, what for? And I told him.

• 15:50Lewis Howes?

  Everything.

• 15:50Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and I said, but if those, you know, those things that happened led me to make the most horrific mistakes in love, led me to feel like I was totally unworthy of love, changed the trajectory of my life and was so painful, but if those things hadn't happened, then I wouldn't have my son from my first horrible ex-husband. I wouldn't be helping the millions of people that I'm able to help and save their relationships and heal them. So not only do I forgive you, but I thank you because I know that on some level we both signed up for this on a soul level and, you know, you had to participate. So I not only forgive you, I thank you.

• 16:34Dr. Laura Berman?

  And he just kind of sat there and stared at me. And this was a man who my entire life, I'd never seen him apologize for anything to me or anyone else. And he looked at me, he's like, I am terribly, terribly, terribly sorry. I am so sorry.

• 16:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  And it was like this beautiful healing moment. But that's the truth. I wouldn't have that light if I didn't also have the darkness. And that doesn't mean we invite darkness, or we say that we deserved it, or that we asked for it. But that's one of the reasons it doesn't have to be scary. Because everything that we don't want to be with, we're already with on the light side. You know what I mean? It's already our expression in the world and our gift. But when you can't be with the darkness from whence it comes, then that's what drives you. That which you resist persists.

• 17:27Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. That's a beautiful story and full circle moment of your father apologizing. As you know, unfortunately, probably 90% of people that say, "I forgive you," don't get an apology in return. They say, "Screw you, I don't care, you're wrong."

• 17:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  You deserved it, right.

• 17:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, they don't get that kind of, that Disney ending that, you know, you almost got in that moment there. I'm sure it wasn't perfect, but... What should people think about when they forgive someone and they realize this is not going to happen for me?

• 18:00Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, I will tell you that when I went into that conversation, I did it for me. It didn't matter to me.

• 18:07Lewis Howes?

  What he said?

• 18:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  What he said, or whether, like, I thought to myself, "What is most important I say to this man before he dies?"

• 18:14Lewis Howes?

  So you don't regret it?

• 18:15Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right, it was for me.

• 18:16Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 18:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  And anytime you forgive someone, it should only be for you, because the lack of forgiveness hurts us so much more than it hurts the person we're not forgiving. And it doesn't mean you are ignoring what happened. You know, I love what Oprah, I heard her once say, is that forgiveness is not, doesn't mean that you, you know, that you, everything's rosy between you. It means that you accept that you can't change the past and that you're not going to be a slave to it anymore. And so I think, you know, if that person is not someone, and if my dad had not been on his deathbed, I would not have said that to him. No way.

• 18:55Lewis Howes?

  What would have happened if... He lived another ten, twenty, thirty years.

• 18:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  He wasn't going to, you know, it was clear that he was going.

• 19:02Lewis Howes?

  But what happened if you held on to this for a longer period of time?

• 19:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Then I would have gotten sick and I would have struggled and I needed, I knew that for me, you know, I waited until the very last minute, but I knew that I needed to forgive and release that from me because I was holding on to it. I didn't, I didn't in a million years expect him to say he was sorry. I was shocked and it wouldn't have mattered if he didn't. But I think it's telling that he did because he knew the spirit in which I was coming. And I don't think you have to have that, you know, if that person is really unsafe or is still in a really dark place, you don't have to have that forgiveness conversation with the person ever. You just have to have it within your own, you have to write, you

• 19:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  know, write them a letter that you never send, you know, have that conversation with yourself, have it with a friend or a loved one that you really trust or a therapist or whoever, but it's really about deciding to release that weight, you know.

• 20:03Lewis Howes?

  I've done an exercise in my last few relationships that I've ended, intimate relationships, where I wrote letters to them, but I didn't send them to them. And I wrote a letter forgiving them and forgiving myself for the things that I did that I wasn't proud of and forgiving them for the things that I felt like they did that were hurtful in the relationship as well, thanking them and then thanking myself for what they brought me, what they gave me, what they contributed to my life during that period of time, thanking myself for showing up in a powerful way, the way that I could, the best way I could, and then

• 20:40Lewis Howes?

  letting them go and then letting that go with that version of myself, that version of myself that did not work out.

• 20:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  Whatever it was, you did.

• 20:48Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, whatever was, I was, you know, that wasn't the best version of me in those moments that didn't work out, if that was the reason, letting that version of myself go as well with them in that relationship. Writing those letters, burning them, and then burying them in the ground. And that's been a powerful ritual. I can't remember who taught me. Someone, a therapist told me to write a letter of forgiveness and thanking them, but I was like, next step.

• 21:11Dr. Laura Berman?

  You improvised.

• 21:12Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I was like, okay, I'm gonna thank myself also, because I showed up in a powerful way. And I'm gonna let it go of that version that doesn't work and let them go.

• 21:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 21:19Lewis Howes?

  And that's been a powerful ritual.

• 21:23Lewis Howes?

  That has supported my healing journey after a breakup, because I think we need to heal.

• 21:28Dr. Laura Berman?

  Oh, we do. And the big, people make such a mistake, because they think, oh, the best way to get over someone is to get under someone else. And I'm just gonna, you know, I always like to say, the best thing you can do, if you've had a really serious relationship that's now ended. You know, wait for half the time that you were in the relationship. You know, maybe up to 10 years. If you were in a 30-year marriage, you don't have to wait 15 years. But like, wait. Heal. Integrate the learning, because every single romantic relationship is a soulmate, you know? Every person we're having a love relationship with, we're not really having it with that other person. We're having a relationship with ourselves through that other person.

• 22:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  So you are learning poop tons in every relationship. Your soul is learning so much, your heart, your mind. And if you don't give it time to integrate and to heal and to look at those shadows and to do forgiveness, then you end up making the same mistake again and again.

• 22:26Lewis Howes?

  Do you think people can heal in a relationship if they haven't fully healed from a previous relationship? Or do you need to be fully healed and let go of the past?

• 22:35Dr. Laura Berman?

  No, I wish any of us, none of us are fully healed. I mean, I think life is a process of unfolding and healing and shedding those layers of the onion and becoming more and more yourself, who you were meant to be, you know? And your truest self. But, you know, I don't think any of us, we'd be all single.

• 22:57Lewis Howes?

  Forever.

• 22:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  Forever, if we waited until we were all healed. But you should ideally wait to, until you're not mad at that person anymore, until you've forgiven them, to an extent forgiven yourself.

• 23:11Lewis Howes?

  What happens if you're holding on to the anger and resentment of another partner while you're in a relationship with a new partner?

• 23:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  That's a hot mess. And you see that, I mean, classic example is someone who was cheated on in the past, right?

• 23:23Lewis Howes?

  And then they bring that in the new relationship.

• 23:24Dr. Laura Berman?

  They bring it into the new relationship. I get calls like that all the time from like these sweet guys who are like, you know, "I love this girl so much, I would never do anything to hurt her." And she was really mistreated in the past and she just won't trust me and she accuses me of these horrible things and...

• 23:40Lewis Howes?

  It's the worst feeling.

• 23:41Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's the worst. But that she is not healed enough to be in a relationship yet. That's, you know, that doesn't mean you have to break up. I mean, if you want to stick around with her and be the one that she works through it with, as long as she is doing the work. Because you, I mean, and I say this to these guys all the time, you know, you're not, you could be the best person in the world and hold her hand 24/7, but you can't do this for her.

• 24:06Lewis Howes?

  No, you can't.

• 24:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  She has to be willing to do it. And if she's not, then stuck there you will be.

• 24:11Lewis Howes?

  You could sit there all day and be a puppy dog and say, "I'm here for you, I'll do whatever. You're on call 24/7 and it'll never be enough." Right? Because they still have to deal with the past and let it go.

• 24:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah. And usually, because I also get calls all the time or people reaching out saying, you know, "I, my hu, my wife and I divorced, or my husband and I divorced 10 years ago or three years ago, and I still can't get over it. I still, I don't even want to be with her, but I still can't get over it."

• 24:40Lewis Howes?

  Can't be with the person they were with.

• 24:42Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah. And what it is almost every single time is that it's not even about that person. It's about something that happened to them in childhood that this experience with the person reminds them of. So that person abandoned them, or left them suddenly, or cheated on them.

• 25:02Lewis Howes?

  Or was emotionally abusive, or...

• 25:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right. And they, and there's this... This unconscious wish that if I could just make it right with that person, then I am making my past right.

• 25:13Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, I can heal the past.

• 25:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and that's what we're doing, you know, and we keep getting into. It's a classic example is like the person who grew up in with an alcoholic parents. And says, I am never, ever, ever gonna date an addict. And then they end up dating someone who's an alcoholic and they're like, oh my gosh, I can't believe I did that, never. And they ask the person, you know, do you drink? Do you do drugs? Do you? No, no, no. Okay, they fall in love. That person's a gambling addict. Like again and again and again. And it's like un- and this is what I say to people. If you have a pattern like that, where you keep dating the wrong person, then the next time you're with someone on a date, and you feel like you've known them all your life.

• 25:57Lewis Howes?

  That's not the right person.

• 25:58Dr. Laura Berman?

  Run. When you feel butterflies in your stomach, that is your body's warning system.

• 26:04Lewis Howes?

  Every time or most times?

• 26:06Dr. Laura Berman?

  Most times. I wouldn't, I would never say every time about anything, but I would say most times. And so if, so if you're someone like that, go on two or three more dates with the person that you don't feel that immediately with. You know?

• 26:20Lewis Howes?

  Interesting.

• 26:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  Really date someone who's not your usual type type.

• 26:24Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 26:24Dr. Laura Berman?

  And do that internal work.

• 26:27Lewis Howes?

  Wow. Is this similar for same-sex relationships in terms of intimacy and sex? On the cha- the same types of challenges that are faced with?

• 26:39Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I mean, I usually, I tried to convince the public, my publishers on my last book about sex, and I didn't get very far, but I didn't want to say male or female. I wanted to say masculine or feminine or, you know, because in every relationship, whether it's two women together, two men together, men or whatever, there is like a yin and a yang. There's someone who's more in their masculine energy. And it doesn't have to be that the one in the masculine energy has a penis and the one in the feminine energy, you know, has a vulva. Like, it doesn't matter who, what the physiology is, because I know lots of heterosexual relationships where she's more in her masculine and he's more in his feminine. But you have to have that dichotomy in order to have the chemistry and the connection.

• 27:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  And also, so those same dynamics seem to unfold, but more along the masculine and the feminine than male or female.

• 27:30Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, okay. And I'm hearing you say that.

• 27:35Lewis Howes?

  The number one thing we can do to be better connected in a relationship is have better sex. Is be more connected during sex.

• 27:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or outside of sex. Because it doesn't even, I mean, yes, if you're more connected during sex, but it's really about, the predictor was more about the general sense of connection. In the case of women, in general, in the relationship, right? So like the most common thing I'll see, let's say, in heterosexual relationships who have been together for a while, is that uneven desire.

• 28:04Lewis Howes?

  Meaning one person has more desire and the other person's like, eh, I don't want, in sexual cases.

• 28:09Dr. Laura Berman?

  Sexual desire, right?

• 28:10Lewis Howes?

  One person wants sex more than the other person's tired or doesn't want it or not have the desire.

• 28:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  And more often than not, not always, that's the woman, right? Or the feminine, right?

• 28:18Lewis Howes?

  The feminine wants it more or doesn't want it?

• 28:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  Doesn't want it.

• 28:20Lewis Howes?

  Why is that?

• 28:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, for women, if we're talking about women, not just people and their feminine, for women, it's often hormonal and exhaustion. And we know that like for men, in general, stress does not diminish your libido. Financial or work-related stress is the only kind that will negatively affect.

• 28:38Lewis Howes?

  So if you're feeling work-related stress or financial stress, you're less turned on?

• 28:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, usually. Now, other kinds of stress with a mother-in-law or kid, whatever, like that won't affect as much. Women are affected by all stress. Then, once they have kids and busy lives and exhaustion, because our, it's not that our sexual desire doesn't come from a physical place, but we have less testosterone. We react differently to sex, excuse me, to stress, and to sex, but to stress. So like, it's only been in the past 20 years that researchers have even figured out that women, when chronically stressed, actually our testosterone levels go down. Because of this whole chemical cascade.

• 29:19Lewis Howes?

  Is the testosterone for women what cultivates the sexual desire? Or is it estrogen?

• 29:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  Estrogen helps, estrogen plays a role with response and lubrication and that kind of thing. But for both men and women, it's testosterone is the hormone of desire. And men have a lot more of it than women do. But certainly with stress, with kids, with life. And so this is what's interesting. I kind of call it the, sort of like a sex romance stalemate. Because. She doesn't have that natural drive. She's exhausted, she's juggling work and kids and life and whatever. He, the way that a man achieves emotional closeness in a relationship, the masculine, not even a man, is through the physical act of sex.

• 30:06Dr. Laura Berman?

  That physical connection is a huge part of what makes him feel emotionally connected to her. And women are the opposite.

• 30:16Lewis Howes?

  It's not the physical.

• 30:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's the emotional connection that makes us want to be physical.

• 30:20Lewis Howes?

  Basically, you're right, interesting.

• 30:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  And so she's less interested and less available. And then he's not even conscious of it, but he's less romantic and attuned and sending those sweet texts or, you know, and she feels that and is that much less interested in having sex. And then he's that much less romantic. And then she may eventually say, "You never send those sweet texts anymore." And if he's at all where, he might say, "Well, we haven't had sex in eight weeks." And she says, "You pig, all you care about is sex." But she doesn't understand that that's his way of feeling emotionally connected.

• 30:56Lewis Howes?

  So is it the man's responsibility or both?

• 30:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's both. It's about him, you know, it's about the masculine. It doesn't have to be him. The masculine understanding that if you want more of that physical connection, you have to, you have to find your emotional and romantic connection from a place other than the physical.

• 31:15Lewis Howes?

  So it's almost like you have to be something you're not.

• 31:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, you just have to learn different languages of love. I mean, is it really being something?

• 31:22Lewis Howes?

  It's not your natural state though, right?

• 31:23Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right. Is it really being something you're not to, you know, when it doesn't just come automatically to think about being romantic?

• 31:32Lewis Howes?

  You have to be conscious about everything.

• 31:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  You have to be conscious of it. And she, the feminine, has to be conscious that if, you know, she needs to love her partner in a way that will really land. And even if she'd rather be watching Bridgerton or doing the laundry or whatever else, or reading a book or FaceTiming or whatever, you know, most women who have low desire will say that once they get started, they really enjoy it. It's just, they don't have that spontaneous horniness. And, and that's a myth that we get from the movies, that spontaneous horniness is supposed to be the source of sex. And it is maybe for the first three months.

• 32:09Lewis Howes?

  Six months, yeah.

• 32:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, but after that, your sexual desire has got to come from a place other than spontaneous horniness.

• 32:15Lewis Howes?

  Really? For people that are married over five plus years, what's the studies or research saying in terms of how much sex they have? On average, obviously, everyone's different.

• 32:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  Everyone's different, you know, I think the incidence of what they call sexless marriages is pretty astounding. That's people who have not had sex for 10 months or more.

• 32:34Lewis Howes?

  Shut up. That happens?

• 32:36Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes, and it's like 30% of couples.

• 32:38Lewis Howes?

  After five or 10 years?

• 32:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  After, yes. And it's not just five or 10 years, you know, what happens, what I see happen time and time again, especially, well, with women. So it could be in a lesbian relationship or in a heterosexual relationship, is that as women, we weren't raised or cultivated, the culture and our families and our lives never allowed us to really create our own relationship with our sexuality. It's like a means to an end.

• 33:10Lewis Howes?

  It wasn't taught, right?

• 33:11Dr. Laura Berman?

  It wasn't even, it not only wasn't taught, it wasn't permitted, it wasn't joked about, it wasn't in, you know, silly movies, it just wasn't part of the culture. And, and so, what happens as a result is that...

• 33:25Lewis Howes?

  It's more of a shameful thing, right?

• 33:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, or a means to an end. It's a way to get the guy, it's a way to get a ring on it, it's a way to have a baby, it's a way to...

• 33:32Lewis Howes?

  To get what you want.

• 33:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  To get, it's a, it's a transaction. She's not thinking it's a transaction, but that's her, her sexuality is something outside herself.

• 33:40Lewis Howes?

  Not within herself.

• 33:41Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's not, yes, not this amazing, beautiful, life-giving, juicy gift, you know, it's this, it's a lovely thing and it's fun and it's exciting, but it's either a sense of power, or outcome, or some other means to an end. And that is like in epidemic proportions in my mind. And so, I think that's the reason is that, you know, I work with so many women, young women too, because they're doing the same thing on social media. They're putting their sexuality outside of themselves as a currency. You know, look at my butt as I pull my bikini, you know, between my crack and like, and that's fine, but...

• 34:24Dr. Laura Berman?

  Inside herself, that her sexuality isn't owned by her, it's a currency. And it's okay if it's a currency, if it's also owned by you.

• 34:33Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, as long as it's not a surface level only. And you're connected to yourself.

• 34:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  And those are the people who, once they have a relationship, or once they've had their kids, like, what's the internal motivation to have sex anymore?

• 34:48Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 34:48Dr. Laura Berman?

  They have to learn that.

• 34:50Lewis Howes?

  What happens to a sexless marriage most of the time? Are there some sexless marriages that are also connected emotionally and communication and supportive?

• 35:00Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, but kinda like roommates, like loving, affectionate, you know, hold hands, whatever. But, but usually, not always, but usually, couples can sustain that for a while. And then eventually, one of them meets someone.

• 35:16Lewis Howes?

  And feels something and then...

• 35:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  And it's like, oh my God, I forgot, or I didn't know you could feel this way, you know? And then they, they can't. In every relationship, the pain of being in the relationship has to be greater than your fear of leaving it.

• 35:29Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 35:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or you're not gonna leave.

• 35:31Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 35:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  And so...

• 35:33Lewis Howes?

  You'll deal with a certain amount of pain for a long time and say, okay, it's not what I want, but I'm dealing with this, and this, and this, and it's like, it's manageable.

• 35:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  And it's not, and you're thinking, oh, to leave this person, I've invested so much time, or we have kids, or we have, built a life, or, you know, I'm scared to get back. There's a million reasons people will stay, but they're scared of what's on the... They'd rather stay what, you know...

• 35:55Lewis Howes?

  What they're comfortable with.

• 35:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 35:57Lewis Howes?

  You know, something, my friend of mine, Jay Shetty, was talking about this with me a few weeks ago. He was like, you know what, we don't celebrate breakups enough. They're always like this bad thing, that everyone's sad about, oh, it's so sad you guys broke up, and heartbroken, and this. But if it's not working, and you've tried therapy, or you've done different exercises, and modalities of supporting one another, and you've, you know, created agreements and boundaries, and it's still not working, shouldn't we celebrate people saying, you know what? This was a great experience, let's move on so we can both find our next experience?

• 36:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I think that's...

• 36:31Lewis Howes?

  Shouldn't we celebrate and say, great job?

• 36:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, good job, what did you learn?

• 36:35Lewis Howes?

  For not holding on to this relationship for five more years in misery, but actually moving beyond it.

• 36:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  I agree.

• 36:41Lewis Howes?

  And, and not resenting each other because you held on to it for five more years, or whatever it is, right?

• 36:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  And so many couples stay together because of the kids. And I say to them, you know, what your kids need more than anything else is two happy parents and a model of what a loving relationship looks like.

• 36:56Lewis Howes?

  Separate.

• 36:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and they are not seeing that. They're learning how to love from you.

• 37:01Lewis Howes?

  Man.

• 37:02Dr. Laura Berman?

  So, it's, yeah, it's important. And I think the reason people are so uncomfortable with breakups and celebrating them is because, you know, there is just such fear of abandonment in almost every one of us.

• 37:13Lewis Howes?

  Of being alone?

• 37:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  Of being alone or of being left. And so they're projecting their own fears and sadness onto you, you know? And so I think it's true that celebrating it in a conscious way, like, here's everything I learned, here's everything I'm forgiving myself and the other person for, here's everything I'm carrying forward and the learning and the clarity that I now have about what I really want.

• 37:38Lewis Howes?

  You know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna send like balloons and cakes to my friends who go through breakups. If I'm friends with both of them, I'm gonna say, hey, you both get a balloon and cakes. I'm gonna write you both a letter and celebrate you both for making a conscious decision.

• 37:54Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 37:54Lewis Howes?

  To improve the quality of your life. If it didn't work together, it's okay, move on and grieve and take your time, but I celebrate you both.

• 38:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's brave.

• 38:05Lewis Howes?

  As I'm talking, hearing you talk about this, I think of the last 15 years of my relationships, I stayed in all of them too long based on fear of abandonment, my feeling of being alone. That was a big fear of mine, until I started to heal that past, the situations of really accepting myself as a lone individual and being okay if I'm not in an intimate relationship. And when I did that, I started to set myself free from relationships where I was like, okay, no, I'm not standing up for this and I can, I'm happy to be alone.

• 38:36Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes.

• 38:37Lewis Howes?

  And you're coming from a place of...

• 38:39Dr. Laura Berman?

  Wholeness.

• 38:39Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, as opposed to, I need this to work out, I need to hold on to something.

• 38:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  I agree. The worst line of, is that frickin' Jerry Maguire movie where he said, oh, makes me so mad. Because you are, nobody completes you. In order to have a really amazing relationship, you have to be your own delicious cake.

• 38:58Lewis Howes?

  Ooh, I like that. Give me a piece. Break me up a case, my own cake.

• 39:02Dr. Laura Berman?

  And the other person's icing or sprinkles, but your cake is still delicious.

• 39:06Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, they're the balloons.

• 39:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, whatever, right? But the cake, you're your own cake. You don't need them to make it sweet or anything else.

• 39:13Lewis Howes?

  Vanilla, ice cream inside, ooh, yeah. They're the chocolate sauce.

• 39:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  That's right, just the topping.

• 39:19Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 39:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  Not to minimize them, but that's how much you need them.

• 39:23Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm, and you should be the topping to their cake.

• 39:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes, exactly, has to be both.

• 39:27Lewis Howes?

  That's powerful. Yeah, I think it's so hard for, it was hard for me to accept myself and to love myself for so many years. And so unconsciously, I was staying in relationships way too long. Wasn't able to communicate my feelings or my needs and probably them as well.

• 39:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  Mm-hmm.

• 39:45Lewis Howes?

  We're both doing it unconsciously. How do we learn how to be more conscious in our relationships so that we can have scarier conversations?

• 39:54Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I think it really starts with your own internal work. And, you know, I learned that when I went through a horrible time, like 10 years ago, my mother had died of breast cancer. Within a year, I had gotten breast cancer at like 40 years old in the same breast that she had. And I had to, for the first time in my adult life, completely stop my life. Uh, cause I was going through chemo and everything else, surgeries and,

• 40:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  and my whole kids, everyone was breaking down around me. And, and so everything fell apart. And it was through that, you know, like they, with the whole metaphor of the butterfly, right? When the caterpillar is turning to a butterfly, you have to turn to mush. You know, the caterpillar literally turns to green mush. And then it is in the mush's DNA to become the butterfly. And then the butterfly has to come out like a teeny tiny little hole in the cocoon. And if you've ever seen that, they're struggling so much and you just want to open it up. But if you open it up to them, they don't really survive and their wings don't grow because it's the act of like pushing through that hole that squeezes the fluid out of their bodies

• 41:08Dr. Laura Berman?

  and sends the energy to their wings so that their wings can grow. And those are the butterflies that really turn, the caterpillars that turn to butterflies. And, you know, that is what tragedy does. You know, I call them an AFGE, another freaking growth experience. You know, these big tragedies that happen in our life that break us open into mush. You know, sometimes that has to happen. It's like the universe taps at your door and you don't listen. You know, this isn't working for you. You gotta slow down. What's happening? You're not facing some things. And then it scratches and then it knocks.

• 41:42Lewis Howes?

  And then the breakdown. The full breakdown.

• 41:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  And then mush.

• 41:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 41:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  And I think that, you know, that doesn't have to happen in order to do the healing. But that is how I learned and then started teaching other people. That, that if you heal yourself and you get really, really, you, you, you work on yourself and you get really, really clear on your thoughts and beliefs and your energetic frequency and you start to work with that. I can actually do couples therapy with one person now. Because if they start to train, change themselves and they're doing the healing on themselves, one of two or three things will happen. Either the other person will entrain to them energetically and come along.

• 42:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or they will flip out and eventually do their own healing and come along.

• 42:37Lewis Howes?

  Or they'll exit.

• 42:37Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or they'll exit.

• 42:40Lewis Howes?

  You gotta both be on the journey together. Otherwise, it's probably not gonna work.

• 42:47Lewis Howes?

  I heard a stat recently about pornography up big time in the last year. I think like 30% of like on Pornhub.

• 42:53Dr. Laura Berman?

  What is there else to do?

• 42:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, and just sitting around at home or whatever. And it's been a, I think the thought process is always that men are the consumers of porn. But isn't it true that women can also be addicted to porn? And what's the percentages of?

• 43:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  Much lower for women addicted than men addicted. And.

• 43:15Lewis Howes?

  Why are men more addicted to porn and women aren't as addicted to it?

• 43:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  I think it's.

• 43:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  A lot hormonal, but also, so any kind of, you know, the way that I look at sexual addiction, whether it's acting out sexually, or porn, or whatever, is that it's just like any other addiction. You're using that to not be with yourself. It's a coping mechanism. It's a coping mechanism to not feel the feelings you don't want to feel, or to distract yourself, or to fill that empty hole inside you. And it's endless. It's an endless hole, right? Anyone who's an alcoholic, or a drag addict, will, you know, in recovery, will tell you that. It's the same thing for sex addiction. So, I see women less, when they are, you know, trying to fill themselves up, or cope that way,

• 44:05Dr. Laura Berman?

  with, you know, from an addictive standpoint, it's usually more relational than porn, I have found. What men will do with porn, who are in that addiction place, they will just compulsively watch, self-stimulate, have a momentary relief of pain emotionally, and then start again. It's just like an endless obsessive thing, like drinking, or doing drugs, or anything else. And it's interesting, because Pornhub actually made their entire site, you know, that was their good deed for COVID. They made their entire site free.

• 44:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  And what I've also noticed is that with the incidence of porn, being so readily available online, that it is, women are watching it. But they are watching it, you know, just like I say to guys, don't watch porn and think that that's what women want, or what turn them on, or what real women look like. Or, don't use that as your sex education. I now find myself saying that so much more often to women as well. Because they are going on these sites and saying, oh, that's what men want. So they go and have sex on a first date, and they're like, choke me! You know, because they think, oh, that's what he must be watching, and what he likes. And it's not what she likes, and she doesn't really, you know, but she, so there's this whole skewed perspective.

• 45:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know, from people who are thinking that that's real sex, or what sex is supposed to be like, and it's not.

• 45:38Lewis Howes?

  How do we get comfortable talking about what we like in sexual intimate experiences? And not offending the partner, or... But also expressing how we feel and what we desire, without ruining the relationship?

• 45:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, ruining it. Well, I think you obviously want to be with a partner who, you know, it's su... Like, if you want no other quality in them, the number one you must have is that they're open to learning and can take feedback. Like, if they can't, you're screwed to have a relationship with them.

• 46:07Lewis Howes?

  A growth mindset they need to have, yeah.

• 46:08Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I mean, just forget it. Like, you're never gonna be able to resolve anything if they can't hear you and like, even if they're affected and reactive, they can work with that. You know, they don't have to be perfect. But if they are like, super reactive or defensive or so easily insulted that you can't have a real conversation with them, that relationship is probably not gonna work. But, I think the key is, you know, first and foremost, to know yourself what you want, which I find that a lot of women, believe it or not, don't. You know, they just kind of hope some guy will touch the right spot, you know?

• 46:43Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 46:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  So, really knowing for yourself what arouses you, learning your own body, knowing what you like. And then, and, you know, for all of you to do that, whether you're male or female. And then, you wanna have those conversations and that feedback, always in the positive. Like, what you want more of, what felt really good, you know, what you loved, what would really turn you on. And you wanna have that conversation outside the sexual scenario. Because, you know, feelings are running high and insecurities are running high when you're in this scenario.

• 47:19Lewis Howes?

  Right, so not when you're in the bed right after sex.

• 47:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know what?

• 47:22Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 47:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  Let's do it, let's do the postmortem.

• 47:24Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I didn't like this, I didn't like this, I didn't like this. You're like sitting there like...

• 47:28Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or getting small into more and more of a ball.

• 47:31Lewis Howes?

  Pulling a blanket over you, like hiding yourself.

• 47:34Dr. Laura Berman?

  No, you would, you know, like the next day or when you're, you know what I was thinking about last night? And it was so amazing and I loved when you did this and when you did that. You know what I was thinking? It would be really, really fun, you know, to try this. Or you know, when you were doing that thing, if you, like if you moved, if you stayed there longer and you did la la la, you know, then that would be great.

• 47:54Lewis Howes?

  So in a new context, share the positive feedback. Not in the context of it happening.

• 48:01Dr. Laura Berman?

  And you always frame it in the positive, what you want more of.

• 48:05Lewis Howes?

  Not, I didn't like when you did this, I didn't like you did this.

• 48:07Dr. Laura Berman?

  And don't do that. I mean, unless something is triggering you or hurting, you know.

• 48:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, this hurt me. Yeah, okay. You mentioned this with addiction, whether it be porn or any type of addiction. It's about filling an empty hole is why we have the addiction. Something that we're feeling pain from the past and we're trying to fill this empty hole. How do we fill an empty hole in a positive way?

• 48:29Dr. Laura Berman?

  Go into the basement.

• 48:33Lewis Howes?

  So what does that, what does that look like? What's a process, a step by step process?

• 48:37Dr. Laura Berman?

  Oh gosh. All right. So the first thing is recognizing that the hole is there. And you don't have to be an addict, every single one of us. I don't think we get out of our childhood without some holes in there. Doesn't mean we use substances or sex to fill them up. We might just be overly controlling or passive aggressive or any number of things. So it's recognizing it first of all, that there are some wounds that you don't want to be with, that you haven't wanted to look at and that you are hiding from the world and sometimes from yourself. And then it is about really doing that work.

• 49:14Lewis Howes?

  What does the work look like?

• 49:16Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know, for everybody, it is different, I think, you know, I'm a therapist. So obviously I don't think that all, you know, I'm a therapist who also believes deeply in therapy that doesn't involve talking, you know, my kids used to call me a talking doctor because I'm a talking therapist. But when it comes to trauma, if you have trauma in your history. I am a huge believer in somatic experiencing. And if you are someone who doesn't, who doesn't, like, I'm someone, as you can tell, who can talk about, you know, stuff all day long. I'm like every therapist's dream client, because I will talk for all 45 minutes. But not everyone is like that, right? So if it's hard for you to articulate your feelings, or, right,

• 50:01Dr. Laura Berman?

  or you don't even know how you feel, but you know you're in pain, that's another group that somatic experiencing is really good with.

• 50:08Lewis Howes?

  What is somatic experiencing?

• 50:09Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's basically going in more into the body than using words. So it's kind of bypassing the thinking brain. And they'll use movement, or art, or intuitive stuff. And I've had clients who are like so left-brain thinkers, and, you know, work for the police department, and, you know, and discovered that they are really gifted painters. Because they, you know, started painting out their feelings in somatic experiencing. And now they've become professional artists, you know?

• 50:41Lewis Howes?

  Would somatic experiencing also be something like Reiki, or tapping, or body talk, or, you know?

• 50:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  To some extent. My problem, I love all of those things. My problem with tapping, and I think it's a big problem, and with some of these other modalities, is that they are great for maintenance and like getting through stuff. But you have a huge risk. It doesn't eradicate the monsters in the basement.

• 51:10Lewis Howes?

  How do we eradicate them?

• 51:11Dr. Laura Berman?

  You have to face them. You can't tap them away. You can't dance them away. You can't positive speak them away.

• 51:19Lewis Howes?

  Can you paint them away?

• 51:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  You can't paint them away. You have to go, the only, you can't go around it, over it. And so much of the spiritual community frickin' does this, and it pisses me off. It's spiritual bypassing. You're basically bypassing, you don't want to feel the pain, so...

• 51:37Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know, tap it away. I don't want to feel it. Tap it away, tap it away. But it's still there in your body. You're tapping it away for the moment and then 10 minutes later, you're tapping again.

• 51:45Lewis Howes?

  So how do we fully let it go?

• 51:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  You have to go into the, you know, Jesus and the desert. You have to go into your dark night of the soul with support, with holding. You don't do it by yourself. You find a really good therapist or somatic experiencer or someone who understands trying to escape that and wanting to face it and who will work with you to not flood you with it all, all at once, but to really work through the pain.

• 52:20Lewis Howes?

  Gotcha.

• 52:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  Because every trauma, big T and little t, that we've had in our lives is stored in our system, is stored in our bodies, not just our brains. And if you don't release that, you're just literally, it's like, you know, a fire hose that you just keep putting a cover on, right? But it doesn't slow down the flow of the fire hose.

• 52:45Lewis Howes?

  Is it possible to heal the big T or little t in a moment? In a day, in a weekend experience? Is it an ongoing process, like to release the energy or it can still come back?

• 52:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  Everybody is different and it depends on the degree of what you're carrying, right? And for how long. But I find that when I take people like on a week-long odyssey of sorts, you know, where they really, in a supported environment, are really going deep and facing some real truths and releasing some real pain out of their bodies, emotional pain, that that's like a jumpstart. You know, it's like having three months of weekly therapy. You know, you go really deep, really hard, really fast with lots of holding and support. And then it's continual work because...

• 53:41Lewis Howes?

  Then is it more maintenance mode? Is it more...

• 53:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's more maintenance mode, but it's also, you know, healing is not a straight line. It's more like this, right? It's not like, you know, you're like this, but... You're sort of more like this, right?

• 53:56Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 53:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  And you're gonna dip down. So let's say you go through this. You had horrible trauma and then you were cheated on and abandoned. And now you're really facing it and the wounds from your childhood and all of that. And you do this really deep work and you're feeling like just lighter and clearer and more whole. And you're doing the tapping and the personal empowerment and the kumbaya stuff too. And you're finding a community and you get into a relationship. And you know, maybe that person gets sick. Or maybe the old girlfriend comes back. Or something happens, right? And that's gonna shoot you. But what's happening is that, you know, what therapists call it is peeling the layers of the onion away. You know, that I'm still peeling layers of the onion away.

• 54:40Dr. Laura Berman?

  And I'm a pretty together, conscious, happy, healed person. But something will happen or something will come up for me. And I'm like, holy crap, there's a whole other layer of the onion I gotta peel away. And it's not nearly what it was, you know? And once it's peeled away, I'm shining more brightly. I'm stronger, I'm wiser. You know, I always said like, the heart doesn't break, it just bends. You know, it recovers and you're stronger and wiser because of it. And every single one of us is gonna have a shit ton of heartbreak in our lives. So we can't be scared of it.

• 55:22Lewis Howes?

  One of the biggest things for me in my past has been the fear of rejection.

• 55:28Lewis Howes?

  I feel like that's pretty common for a lot of people. Is the fear of putting themselves out there, being vulnerable, asking for someone on a date or whatever in a relationship and them saying no. And that rejection being a very scary place. Why is rejection so hard for so many people? How do we overcome that fear of rejection so it doesn't consume us?

• 55:49Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right, it's really about what the rejection means to you, right? Like when that person says no, what does that mean to you? Does that mean that that person has issues or likes blondes and you're a brunette? Or does that mean that you're not enough? Because the person who fears rejection believes they're not enough. And every rejection is confirmation of that.

• 56:15Lewis Howes?

  Maybe they're not enough for that, what that person wants, but doesn't mean they're not enough.

• 56:19Dr. Laura Berman?

  Not at all.

• 56:19Lewis Howes?

  Right. So how do you compartmentalize that, okay, I wasn't enough for this person, otherwise they'd be with me.

• 56:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 56:27Lewis Howes?

  But I'm still enough as a human being.

• 56:29Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right, and I think part of it is talking to yourself, but it's also in really, you know, what I have found as someone who has had taught people my whole adult and professional life, you know, self-worth is a huge part of the work that I do. And what I've learned over that cancer journey and all the healing and the book, you know, and everything that came out of that is that self-esteem is not the same as self-worth. Self-esteem is, I love myself because I'm kind and I'm smart and I'm good at bowling and I, you know, am a great mother, whatever, right? Fill in the blanks. That's self-esteem.

• 57:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  Self-worth, which is really what we need, is, not that self-esteem is bad, but self-worth is, I am worthy of the most abundant love that exists, simply because I exist, because I am the unique expression of the universe's light that I am. There's not another human like me on the planet. And, and I found that, that that is not something that is found through words. It is something that is found through connecting with that higher essential self. You know, that one that when you say hello to yourself in your mind, you know, silently, the one saying hello is you that you know.

• 57:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  The one hearing hello is your true self, is your essential self. And when you start to really connect with that through meditation, through spiritual work, through personal empowerment work, when you start to really connect to your intuition and how powerful that connection really is, it's always there. It's not like you just tune into it, or don't, right? But it's always there. When you do that, it's really hard not to love yourself. I mean, it's really hard because you're like, holy crap. Like, this is, you know, you, do you know what I'm talking about?

• 58:31Lewis Howes?

  Of course.

• 58:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right?

• 58:32Lewis Howes?

  Of course.

• 58:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  So it's really hard. That, to me, is like where the worth really is. And we put these blocks on it because there are all these parts of ourselves that were abandoned or rejected or over criticized. And we've never challenged them, we've never looked at them. And we, because they're the monsters in the basement. And they're all like cholesterol on the artery that allows the light to come through.

• 58:59Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 59:00Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know?

• 59:01Lewis Howes?

  So how do we build self-worth and let go of self-doubt?

• 59:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  I think you have to do both simultaneously. You have to do your trauma work and whether that's big T or little t trauma. You have to do your wound work. And you can't tap it away. Not that tapping is bad. I love Nick Ortner. I love tapping, but it is not a solution. It is a strategy.

• 59:20Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 59:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  And then, at the same time, and this is what I do with all of my clients. You know, I'm doing this deep work with them, but I am also sending them to workshops. I'm having them learn meditation. I'm having them learn embodiment. I'm having them learn, you know, finding their own spiritual practice. Because everybody's different, you know?

• 59:42Lewis Howes?

  So these things are strategies? The workshops, the meditations, the tools?

• 59:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  They're cultivators.

• 59:47Lewis Howes?

  The cultivators.

• 59:48Dr. Laura Berman?

  Because they're not, the strategy would be more, you know, tapping or...

• 59:54Lewis Howes?

  Is breath work and meditation?

• 59:55Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes. Well, breath work actually is really good. That is a great one for embodiment. And it's a really good form of somatic experiencing by itself. You need the processing as well. So it's, it's, it's part of it. But, boy, will that move some stuff out of you.

• 1:00:11Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 1:00:12Dr. Laura Berman?

  And get those emotions that have been stuck flowing out, which is really good.

• 1:00:17Lewis Howes?

  So the solutions?

• 1:00:19Dr. Laura Berman?

  So the solutions are practice of meditation, breath work, you know, visioning, community.

• 1:00:29Dr. Laura Berman?

  Those are sort of, the strategies are things like top, you know, tapping or positive thinking or, you know.

• 1:00:35Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:00:37Dr. Laura Berman?

  That kind of thing. And, and then there is the real healing work of confronting, facing, turning on the light in the basement and facing your shame and realizing that those are just these sweet little innocent parts of yourself that just want to be seen.

• 1:00:55Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. How do we get to see our, how do we, I feel like a lot of us just do things to be seen and acknowledged, right?

• 1:01:03Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:04Lewis Howes?

  It's like, we all want to be acknowledged and seen and unfortunately, most people and valued and recognized for our gifts to the world. And most of us work so hard to be seen by other people and yet unfortunately, society in general doesn't see people until they die. And then they, and then everyone comes out and recognizes you when you can't hear it.

• 1:01:25Dr. Laura Berman?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:01:26Lewis Howes?

  And, uh.

• 1:01:27Dr. Laura Berman?

  Which is such a waste.

• 1:01:28Lewis Howes?

  Right? So, how do we become seen without people acknowledging us? If that never happens?

• 1:01:34Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right. Because it doesn't matter.

• 1:01:37Lewis Howes?

  How do we do that for ourselves, though?

• 1:01:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right. No, I think that's what the thing is. What, here's the two things I have found. One is that there are, you know them, there are millions of people who are seen on national television and.

• 1:01:49Lewis Howes?

  That don't love themselves, yeah.

• 1:01:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, or seen like crazy and given all the validation in the world and still feel like crap about it, but like drowning in their shadows.

• 1:01:58Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  Right? So, it's, it's just like money. You can have a billion, jillion, gazillion dollars and you're still not going to be happy if you don't face your shadows.

• 1:02:09Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  You're just not, and we all know people like that. So, that's one thing to recognize, is that we have this story that if I'm seen and acknowledged, then I'll be validated, then I'll be happy. But that's just a story and that's easy to disprove because you look at all the, these people that are being seen.

• 1:02:27Lewis Howes?

  Or suicidal.

• 1:02:28Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:02:29Lewis Howes?

  On drugs or addicted, yeah. So, how do we validate ourselves without the need?

• 1:02:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's about that connection.

• 1:02:34Lewis Howes?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:02:35Dr. Laura Berman?

  That's the only validation there, that's at all real.

• 1:02:37Lewis Howes?

  Hmm.

• 1:02:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  All the rest is just people's projections onto you. Oh, I'm gonna follow you because you have abs that I wish I had, or I'm gonna follow you because, you know, you seem really successful or whatever. It's just, um, it's not real.

• 1:02:54Dr. Laura Berman?

  And, and it's just projections that people are putting on to us, which is fine. You know, people make a good living out of other people's projections on to them. But that's not where the true value is found. The true value is found through that connection to your true self. Your essential self, the one that is this lovingly detached. Um, source connected, you know, call it whatever you want, God, Jesus, it doesn't matter to me. But like that source connected part of you that I for one never got until my 30s or 40. You know, I didn't grow up with any kind of understanding of that. And I don't think most of us do.

• 1:03:32Lewis Howes?

  What would you say is your true self?

• 1:03:35Dr. Laura Berman?

  My true self is. I am like, you know, the tip of my fingernail and my true self is as big as LA. You know, is, is just like yours, but not to talk about me, immense. And she's funny and loving and compassionate and um, really, really wise. And extremely loving. And it's like each of us is this, I always envisioned like, if you think of whatever, insert your word here. Spirit, God, universe, whatever. But you know, this immense, more immense than we could ever imagine, giant, like bigger than the universe light.

• 1:04:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  And each of us is just a little strand.

• 1:04:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  Of that light. And when you're connecting to your essential self, you're connecting to the part.

• 1:04:32Lewis Howes?

  Source.

• 1:04:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes, but your unique connection to source, your unique expression of source. And of course you're connecting to source as well. But the self-love piece, you know, it's just really hard to deny when you start to feel it.

• 1:04:49Lewis Howes?

  What's the biggest shadows you're still facing with? Or you haven't yet to let out of the basement?

• 1:04:55Dr. Laura Berman?

  I'm a recovering codependent. I will always, I think, be peeling layers of that onion away.

• 1:05:02Lewis Howes?

  Is that an attachment style? What's the difference?

• 1:05:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Well, an attachment style would be, yes, but they call it something different. So I would say I have an insecure attachment style by nature. So it's more of a tendency than a style. Most of these styles we have. But the codependent is, I'm not okay if you're not okay. Right? Or I will do anything not to be abandoned by someone. You know, not anymore, but like the pure codependent, right? Or I'll be a little more passive aggressive than aggressive. You know, that will be a shadow of mine that I have to keep an eye on. Setting boundaries, I have to keep an eye on. Because I'm much more likely to say yes to something so that I don't look bad or disappoint you or whatever than say no.

• 1:05:48Lewis Howes?

  What's that attachment style called?

• 1:05:50Dr. Laura Berman?

  Insecure.

• 1:05:51Lewis Howes?

  Insecure. How many attachment styles are there?

• 1:05:52Dr. Laura Berman?

  There's four. But they're really more like, one is avoidant, right? So someone who's got insecure attachment in its purest form doesn't feel the worthiness for themselves, but does for the other person. So they think highly of the other person and not of themselves. Someone who's, you know, more avoidant would be that they feel good about themselves, but not about other people.

• 1:06:25Lewis Howes?

  So they avoid them. They're like, yeah, okay.

• 1:06:27Dr. Laura Berman?

  And someone who's really...

• 1:06:28Lewis Howes?

  That's avoidant.

• 1:06:29Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, and someone who's really fearful will feel bad about themselves and you.

• 1:06:36Lewis Howes?

  What is that? What style is that?

• 1:06:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  That is a fearful attachment.

• 1:06:41Lewis Howes?

  Okay.

• 1:06:42Dr. Laura Berman?

  So that's someone who's like got serious trauma, you know?

• 1:06:46Lewis Howes?

  Yep. Is there one more? So there's four?

• 1:06:48Dr. Laura Berman?

  And then there's a healthier style, right? Where you're, that's what we're all going for, right?

• 1:06:52Lewis Howes?

  Is it called healthy?

• 1:06:53Dr. Laura Berman?

  No, I'm trying to remember the name of it.

• 1:06:56Lewis Howes?

  There's insecure, avoidant...

• 1:06:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  Insecure, avoidant, fearful.

• 1:07:01Lewis Howes?

  Crap.

• 1:07:01Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's coming to me. My brain is fried.

• 1:07:04Lewis Howes?

  It's alright.

• 1:07:05Dr. Laura Berman?

  I'll remember.

• 1:07:05Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, I'll find it later. But the fourth one is the one we're all looking to be.

• 1:07:09Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:07:10Lewis Howes?

  The attachment style we're looking for, is that right?

• 1:07:12Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I mean, look, it's not that there is one. It's, to me, it's more of an ability to understand your tendency. Because if you understand your tendency, that can be a roadmap to your wounds.

• 1:07:24Lewis Howes?

  Hmm, yeah.

• 1:07:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  And, and then...

• 1:07:26Lewis Howes?

  Why am I reactive? Why am I avoidant? Why am I feeling this way? Let's go back to the root.

• 1:07:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, like, when, and I'll often say to someone, you know, like, if someone calls into my show or email, you know, someone I'm not working with directly, they'll say, you know, I don't... They'll talk about something that's happening in their relationship. And I'll say, okay, let's go into this scenario. Here's what's, you know, something happened between the two of you. She didn't come home when she said she would. And this is the third time this week. And you found this other guy's number on her phone. So when you found the other guy's number, let's just go back there in your mind. You know, what did you feel in your body? Once again, embodiment, what did you feel in your body? And then I really walk them through the process of like imagining they're there in first person. And what do they feel? And I'll say, I feel tightness in my stomach.

• 1:08:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  I feel nauseous and like constriction in my throat. And I'll say, okay, just stay there for a minute. Really put your conscious attention on that. Maybe even make it a little bit bigger because you're in control. It's not going to take you over. And then once they really have a good handle on that. Alright, so I'm just going to ask you a question. And I want you to tell me the first thing that comes to your mind. When was the first time you ever remember feeling this way? Ever in your life? The earliest time you ever remember feeling these feelings? And it is almost always, well, it was when my mother, you know, when I came home from school, my mother was walking out the door with her suitcase. Or, you know, it always goes back to those earlier wounds

• 1:08:55Dr. Laura Berman?

  that we're just re-experiencing time and time again.

• 1:09:01Lewis Howes?

  Wow.

• 1:09:04Lewis Howes?

  That's why I feel like therapy is so good for people.

• 1:09:06Dr. Laura Berman?

  It's really good.

• 1:09:07Lewis Howes?

  Even when you're in a good place, I feel like.

• 1:09:09Dr. Laura Berman?

  Absolutely.

• 1:09:10Lewis Howes?

  Do it once every couple of months. You still be able to talk about whatever.

• 1:09:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes, and most people, you know, in historic, I'm seeing less and less of that, but historically, especially with couples, you know, 10 years ago, they would not come in until they were like ready to get divor, like final straw, ready to file for divorce, one last shot here. And now I notice.

• 1:09:33Lewis Howes?

  Sooner.

• 1:09:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  Much sooner, which is so much better for me as a physician.

• 1:09:36Lewis Howes?

  I want every relationship to start therapy within the first like six months of marriage.

• 1:09:41Dr. Laura Berman?

  I am, I am.

• 1:09:42Lewis Howes?

  It's like, cause then you create boundaries and agreements from the beginning.

• 1:09:45Dr. Laura Berman?

  Absolutely.

• 1:09:46Lewis Howes?

  And you don't have to get to the end.

• 1:09:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  And don't get, like, you should not marry every single couple who is committing, planning on making a marriage commitment or a life commitment. You should have.

• 1:09:56Lewis Howes?

  Couple.

• 1:09:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Couples therapy. And I'm not talking about the pre Kena with the priest or the rabbi, I mean, that's fine too, but I'm talking about like at least five sessions.

• 1:10:05Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, get clear on some basic agreements and make sure you're fully aligned, because maybe you haven't had those conversations.

• 1:10:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  And learn how to argue.

• 1:10:11Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:12Dr. Laura Berman?

  Successfully.

• 1:10:13Lewis Howes?

  That's a key.

• 1:10:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  And learn how to, you know, articulate your needs and come up with some agreements about, you know, not just about kids, sex, money, religion, you know, those things, but also just your dynamics, you know, get clear on them.

• 1:10:26Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:27Dr. Laura Berman?

  And set the foundation.

• 1:10:29Lewis Howes?

  That's huge.

• 1:10:32Lewis Howes?

  I want to talk about what happened recently in your life, very, very sad, your, your son passed away because of drugs that he, he bought on Snapchat from a drug dealer on Snapchat, right?

• 1:10:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:46Lewis Howes?

  And it's heartbreaking as this happened and I'm, and I'm just, I have no idea what this feel like, cause I'm not a parent, but I can only imagine.

• 1:10:54Dr. Laura Berman?

  I have never felt, I mean, I'm still feeling it, but I have never felt.

• 1:11:03Dr. Laura Berman?

  Pain so wide and deep. I've been through a lot of grief. I've been with my mother and my father and both my grandmothers when they passed and my, really the woman who was more of a mother to me than even my own mother when she passed. And I really understand grief. But I, the grief of losing, and I understood as a mother that there's nothing worse. I mean, I remember when my mother died, I remember saying, okay, it's at least the natural course of things, you know?

• 1:11:33Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:11:34Dr. Laura Berman?

  But to have your child go is something that I'm still wrapping my head around and I will be for a long time. And, you know, I am practicing what I preach. It's that, taking that deep trip into the dark night of the soul in the redwoods, you know, birthing and howling my pain into the mother tree and being held.

• 1:12:00Lewis Howes?

  Literally.

• 1:12:01Dr. Laura Berman?

  Literally.

• 1:12:02Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:12:03Dr. Laura Berman?

  And being held by, you know, some of my nearest and dearest friends who are also healers and understand grief, who I don't have to, you know, didn't have to take, don't ever have to take care of. Those are the ones that sort of, it's like that intense, same thing that I was saying earlier, that intensive week, and now it will be, you know, probably the rest of my life.

• 1:12:28Lewis Howes?

  Ongoing strategies to support when...

• 1:12:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  And waves, you know, just at the end of the school year, you know, on his birthday, on Thanksgiving, like, you know, there will be endless waves. But, and I'm a, you know, as you can tell, I believe 100% that we are all energy and energy doesn't die. I never really understood, you know, I didn't take it literally. I thought it was more of a metaphor when people said, "You keep them in your heart," you know? But what I have discovered is that if I put all of my conscious awareness, like if I get really, really quiet and I can loosen the constriction of my chest and I can go all the way into the center of my heart,

• 1:13:16Dr. Laura Berman?

  there's like a little seed, there was this unique brand of sweetness he had that even, you know, when he would come down as a sixteen year old, you know, and would not hug me, but tolerate me hugging him, you know, with his arms next to him, even then I could feel it. It's just this beautiful, sweet, silly, loving energy of his underneath all the teenage stuff. And that's right in the center of my heart. Like, he's literally in there, a piece of his, like, his energy is literally, like, you carry them in your heart, literally, not just figuratively. And that has been a revelation to me.

• 1:13:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  And also, just, I can't believe that the community that I have around me, not just of so many healers and friends that have reached out and support, but I have had to, as a recovering codependent, it's very hard for me to receive. And because I-

• 1:14:17Lewis Howes?

  To give up the control of, like, helping everyone else.

• 1:14:20Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or just worrying that I'm gonna be a burden, or that I'll inconvenience them, or that, you know, I just can't be, I was never allowed to be a burden as a child, you know? So, it's really hard for me to, so I bend over backwards not to be a burden. And, not to say that I'm never a burden, I'm sure I am, but I at least try not to be. And this, there was no frickin' way. I was like, bring it on, I will take whatever you have to give, like, that's it, I'm surrendered, like, I'm surrendered. You can, I will receive because I don't have any other choice. So, that has been a beautiful lesson. And I'm very, very thankful that I have done all of the spiritual work that I have because-

• 1:15:05Dr. Laura Berman?

  I would probably be in the ground with him if I hadn't. And, you know, I would have just not been able to cope. And so that, you know, it's going to be an ongoing. And also just the, I mean, I was astounded because what he died from, and we're still waiting for the toxicology reports, but the police have seen enough of this now to feel pretty certain and treating it like a murder. You know, that it was not an over- fentanyl poisoning. Fentanyl is a Chi- a synthetic opioid made in China. They bring it in through Mexico and then there are these labs in Mexico that press it or make it into Percocet, Xanax, into Coke,

• 1:15:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  into cannabis, into everything that you're buying on the street. And it's going, it goes into the Midwest, it goes into California, and then it spreads out from there. And it is twice as addictive as heroin. And it just takes like a teeny little seed or two of it to kill you. And the drug dealers are doing this. They're putting it in everything because it's twice as addictive as heroin. So they're making you basically into an addict when you take a Percocet or smoke a joint. And then you're their best customer or you die and they don't give a crap. And what I learned after his passing from, you know, as I was trying to put the pieces together, his best friend, you know, told me that he had,

• 1:16:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  that our son had screenshot on Snapchat a menu from a dealer. So I talked to my kids incessantly about, you know, nude pictures and saying things on there that could be, you know, like those were the kind, it never occurred to me that there could be drug, I mean, I'm an idiot, but it never occurred to me that there could be drug dealers on Snapchat. And that is where my son and this person connected. And he, you know, delivered the drugs to the house. My kid thought he- To your house? To my house. Oh, my gosh. My kid was up. I just said to my girlfriend, one of the silver linings of this pandemic is that both my teenage boys are safe and sound in their room. And I don't have to worry about them.

• 1:17:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  And I'd let them do more on gaming and social media because it's the only way they can connect to their friends. And as long as they did well in school, I wasn't going to put up a fuss. And what we've been able to piece together is he, he connected with this guy. Um, he, you know, snuck out, we were sleeping and met him in the alley or got the drug, you know, it was like 25 cent, you know, selling it for nothing. And, uh, got the drugs and thought he was just, you know, like we all did, thought he was experimenting. He's bored, he's a teenage boy, not able to play sports or go out or do anything. It's a Sunday after Super Bowl Sunday, you thought this guy's offering me, you know,

• 1:17:55Dr. Laura Berman?

  they, they think from what we've been able to piece together Percocet. And, uh, so, you know, I'll just pop it and see what happens. And my husband had just bought, brought him up a cheeseburger an hour before. And I was, went into his room to, uh, cause he'd asked me to come talk to him. He wanted to do an internship for the summer to, uh, beef up his college resume. He was applying to colleges. And so I walked in to have this, um, internship conversation and found him there. Oh, man. Yeah, so I'm still, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's the worst. It's the worst of the worst of the worst of the worst.

• 1:18:36Dr. Laura Berman?

  But, um, it's only because of everything that's come before that I know that it will get better and better. And it, and what has astounded me is the outpouring. I had to make a, um, I had to make a, uh, Facebook group because thousands of parents were reaching out to me saying that exactly the same thing happened to their kid. From social media or something. Great kid, great grades, good kid, you know, not like, and met someone on Snapchat or Instagram or it's usually Snapchat or Twitter seems to be, but I, you know, it's probably all it, um, and thought they were taking something.

• 1:19:16Dr. Laura Berman?

  I mean, in one occasion it was a mother who, whose kid had, yeah, were having trouble getting into the dentist and he was having a lot of pain. His friend gave him like a Percocet or, you know, he thought it was a Percocet or something and he died from that. Oh, no. So it's in everything and and the amount of parents who are going, I mean, it is worse than the pandemic, how many kids it's killing.

• 1:19:39Lewis Howes?

  Really?

• 1:19:39Dr. Laura Berman?

  It is really a big deal.

• 1:19:42Lewis Howes?

  And this has happened more in the last couple of years or last year?

• 1:19:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  There are 30,000 deaths in 2019 from fentanyl. And it has risen significantly, 20,000 deaths just in Los Angeles in 2020, since this year, 2021.

• 1:19:58Lewis Howes?

  Goodness.

• 1:19:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  So it's really ramping up.

• 1:20:01Lewis Howes?

  Not just with kids, but with everyone?

• 1:20:02Dr. Laura Berman?

  Everyone. Do not take anything that you get on the street or from a dealer. You know, you really don't know and it's not, and nobody knows. And so, and also, social media, heretofore, although I'm hoping that that's changing because we're kicking their butts as much as we can, but social media will not give the police any identifying information. We had the ad and the handle, the Twitter and Snapchat handle of this dealer. And they said, don't get your hopes up. All that they'll do is take the profile down and then they pop up somewhere else immediately with another profile name.

• 1:20:41Lewis Howes?

  Right.

• 1:20:42Dr. Laura Berman?

  So it's, so, you know, that really has to change.

• 1:20:46Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:20:49Lewis Howes?

  Well, I acknowledge you for showing up and the way you're showing up and sharing in such a vulnerable way because I can only imagine what this would be like. And I want to, if you're open to speaking from a place of relationships, how a partner could help someone who is going through and experience a traumatic event like this, whether it's a death of someone in their family, cancer, something very traumatic, how can a partner be there for them in a way that is supportive in a time of, that might be breakdown and mush mode and? Grief mode for a long period of time. What would you suggest that a partner do?

• 1:21:30Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:21:30Lewis Howes?

  Or friends?

• 1:21:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I think it's about showing up. It's about not saying, let me know if I can do something, or what can I do? Because that person is paralyzed.

• 1:21:43Lewis Howes?

  They can't say what they need.

• 1:21:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  They don't even know what to do.

• 1:21:45Lewis Howes?

  So, so how do you show up?

• 1:21:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  You show up with cookies, you send them food, you, you, you know, I, I've had friends who just, every morning, when they wake up, they send me a little green heart. That just lets me know, you know, texts me a little green heart, and I know that they're waking up thinking about me and my pain. You know, just let them know, whatever you can do, proactively do. Not to invade, you know, don't invite yourself over and park on their couch, you know, if, if that's not, if they're not that kind of person. But find some way to proactively show up for them, and keep checking on them past, oops, sorry, keep checking on them past the first week. You know, like the first week or two, everybody's really focusing, because at a funeral, whatever

• 1:22:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  else may be happening. But then it's the hardest part, I think, is after that.

• 1:22:36Lewis Howes?

  When everyone forgets, moves on.

• 1:22:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah. And, and I think for a partner, you know, and, and, and my husband has been going through the grief, obviously, with me, but he lets me do it my way, you know, and it's very different than how he's doing it, and, um...

• 1:22:53Lewis Howes?

  Don't force someone to cope in a certain way.

• 1:22:55Dr. Laura Berman?

  You have to let, everybody is so different. My 15-year-old, my 23-year-old, and my husband and I are all grieving in completely different ways.

• 1:23:04Lewis Howes?

  And don't make someone wrong for the way they're grieving, even if it seems like they're moved on quicker, or...

• 1:23:10Dr. Laura Berman?

  Or my 15-year-old's like, is something wrong with me? I'm not crying enough. And I'm like, no. Not at all, and you should know that I'm gonna be crying a lot. And that doesn't mean I'm falling apart. But that's just what's happening. There's no right or wrong. Everybody has to deal, you know, has to process it in their own way. I think it's about creating that room and not taking it personally. And if you can, if you're not the one who's also grieving with them, to create a container for them as the partner, you know, to make it okay for them to decompensate and where they don't have to take care of you.

• 1:23:45Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:23:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  And it's a lot to be with grief. I mean, it's a lot because people's own grief will come up, you know? And that's the other thing that I've learned through this process is that, especially with losing a child, I think, you know, it's one thing if you are a parent who's been sick for a long time, people are kind of expecting it. But I have realized that, and this is part of what got me over my difficulty receiving, is that it really helps people when they can help me. Like, it literally helps them.

• 1:24:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, so, okay. Bring me the cookies all day long. I'll take all the flowers.

• 1:24:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  I'll help you. Go ahead. Give me the help. But it does. Like, they're so helpless.

• 1:24:25Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, they can't do anything.

• 1:24:26Dr. Laura Berman?

  No.

• 1:24:26Lewis Howes?

  They can't help you with your pain. They can't understand it. So they're like, what do I do? Let me try something.

• 1:24:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:24:32Lewis Howes?

  So receiving is helping them and helping yourself.

• 1:24:35Dr. Laura Berman?

  You have to receive and not, you know, if you're not a good receiver, that something like this will make you one.

• 1:24:41Lewis Howes?

  Well, we have some cake out there. If you want a piece of cake, I'll give it to you.

• 1:24:44Dr. Laura Berman?

  I'll receive. I'll receive and all. I just keep saying, yes, I will receive. Yes, I will receive.

• 1:24:51Lewis Howes?

  Yeah, yeah. Well, I've got a couple of final questions for you, Dr. Laura, but I appreciate you being here and opening up about this because you have so much wisdom from your years of experience as a therapist in relationships that people need this information to support them in healing the past big T, little t traumas, on having better communication in their intimate partnerships. I've always said that, you know, the key to success in life is relationships. And the key to successful relationships is vulnerability.

• 1:25:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:22Lewis Howes?

  Intimacy.

• 1:25:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  You're right.

• 1:25:22Lewis Howes?

  And it takes going to the past. Sometimes to be healthy in the present until you're ready to heal that. So, thank you for explaining all this in a clear way. So we can hopefully open up the door to our basements and face our demons.

• 1:25:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  They're not demons, they're cute little babies.

• 1:25:40Lewis Howes?

  Cute little babies, little bunnies that just want the light. Let them out.

• 1:25:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, they just wanna be seen.

• 1:25:44Lewis Howes?

  That's a good way to look at it, little bunnies as opposed to snakes.

• 1:25:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:48Lewis Howes?

  You know, this is a question I ask everyone at the end. It's called the three truths question. So I'd like you to imagine for a moment a hypothetical situation.

• 1:25:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Okay.

• 1:25:57Lewis Howes?

  It's your last day on earth, many, many, many years away. You get to live as old as you want to live, but eventually you gotta turn the lights off. And you've accomplished every dream you have from this moment moving forward. Everything you've ever wanted to do, it happens. Family, relationships, business, career, it all happens. But for whatever reason, every written word or video or piece of content you put out into the world has to go with you.

• 1:26:22Dr. Laura Berman?

  Okay.

• 1:26:23Lewis Howes?

  So you can make all the things you want to make, but then it's all gonna go with you. So no one has access to your New York Times bestselling book, which I want them to get. No one has access to your content, they don't have access to this anymore.

• 1:26:33Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:34Lewis Howes?

  But you get to leave behind three lessons. And this is all you get, you would get to leave behind three things.

• 1:26:39Dr. Laura Berman?

  Okay.

• 1:26:39Lewis Howes?

  Piece of paper and a pen, you write down three lessons that you would share with the world. I call it three truths. What would you say are yours?

• 1:26:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  Oh my gosh, okay. I would say that

• 1:26:54Dr. Laura Berman?

  the love that you have for yourself is the only predictor of the love that you can receive.

• 1:27:06Dr. Laura Berman?

  I would say that no decision made from fear is ever a good one.

• 1:27:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  And I would say to embrace every broken heart. Because as Leonard Cohen would say, that's how the light gets in. And it's inescapable, it's gonna happen. And you can live your life fighting it and protecting yourself from it and still end up with it. Or you can live and learn and realize that with every heartbreak, you get stronger and wiser and brighter.

• 1:27:47Lewis Howes?

  Yeah. What does Rumi say?

• 1:27:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Um.

• 1:27:52Lewis Howes?

  Something about the light? And the wound is where the light enters or something like that? Is that Rumi?

• 1:27:58Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, I can't remember. I know Leonard Cohen said, "Don't be afraid of a broken heart. It's how the light gets in." You know, the cracks in your heart. But I think Rumi said something too.

• 1:28:10Lewis Howes?

  I think Rumi said, "The wound is where the light enters." Or something like that.

• 1:28:13Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah. It is totally true.

• 1:28:15Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:16Dr. Laura Berman?

  It is totally true. Because you have to, in tragedy and broken heart, you have to, your whole personality can't sustain itself.

• 1:28:23Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:24Dr. Laura Berman?

  You know? So you turn to mush so that you can become the butterfly.

• 1:28:27Lewis Howes?

  Exactly. Those are beautiful truths. Thank you for sharing those.

• 1:28:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  Thank you, I just came up with those.

• 1:28:32Lewis Howes?

  They're very beautiful. Very beautiful.

• 1:28:34Dr. Laura Berman?

  But they are truths for me.

• 1:28:35Lewis Howes?

  Those are beautiful. You've got a New York Times bestselling book, Quantum Love is your latest book.

• 1:28:42Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes.

• 1:28:43Lewis Howes?

  You've also got a podcast, The Language of Love, that just came out.

• 1:28:46Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:47Lewis Howes?

  It's a weekly show.

• 1:28:48Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:28:49Lewis Howes?

  You talk about a lot of things around love life, relationships, regardless of gender or sexual orientation.

• 1:28:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Answer questions.

• 1:28:57Lewis Howes?

  Answer questions, the juicy stuff. So if you like this content, go subscribe to The Language of Love and listen to more. I don't know if it's similar to what we're talking about here, or if you're doing a different style.

• 1:29:09Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah. Well, it's both. I mean, I consider myself sex, body, soul. That's sort of my thing.

• 1:29:14Lewis Howes?

  There you go.

• 1:29:15Dr. Laura Berman?

  So it's all intertwined for me.

• 1:29:17Lewis Howes?

  Yeah.

• 1:29:18Dr. Laura Berman?

  Not everybody understands that, but it is.

• 1:29:20Lewis Howes?

  Right. There you go. The Language of Love, if you want more information on that, go subscribe there. You're also over social media, Dr. Laura Berman over on all platforms, I think is, and Dr. Laura Berman official on Facebook, DrLauraBerman.com with all the information there.

• 1:29:38Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yep.

• 1:29:39Lewis Howes?

  Is there anything else that we should be aware of on? Checking out your information?

• 1:29:43Dr. Laura Berman?

  No, that's a good place to start.

• 1:29:45Lewis Howes?

  Where do you hang out the most on social media?

• 1:29:47Dr. Laura Berman?

  Instagram and Facebook. And my website always has all the links. I do a blog every week. Radio shows are up. I mean, the podcast is up there.

• 1:29:58Lewis Howes?

  Awesome.

• 1:29:59Dr. Laura Berman?

  Books are up there. Toys are up there.

• 1:30:01Lewis Howes?

  I love it, all the stuff. So make sure you guys go check out The Language of Love with Dr. Laura Berman. And I have, I want to acknowledge you before I ask you the final question. I acknowledge you for your incredible presence right now. And being present amongst a lot of pain and stress that you're going through, and uncertainty, and overwhelm. And I can't imagine what that would be like, but I acknowledge you for the decades of work you've done to be here.

• 1:30:32Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, thank you.

• 1:30:33Lewis Howes?

  To be able to share in a moment of pain and grief, and to be able to serve other people, and serve something greater, and grieve at the same time. That takes a very, that takes a lot of practice, a lot of skills, a lot of tools that you've developed over the years to be able to be in this position. So I'm really grateful that...

• 1:30:53Dr. Laura Berman?

  And harnessing my dysfunction, too.

• 1:30:55Lewis Howes?

  Absolutely.

• 1:30:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Because I was a really good, I was a really good compartmentalizer and disassociator. So now I can call on it when I need it.

• 1:31:03Lewis Howes?

  I need to do this interview, yes.

• 1:31:04Dr. Laura Berman?

  Talk to disassociate!

• 1:31:06Lewis Howes?

  And for those that are maybe thinking, "Why are we doing this interview at this time?" You wanted to do this. We reached out and said, "Hey, we understand, let's reschedule."

• 1:31:14Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, you know what? I, my people worked so, so hard, including my son who passed, you know, was helping me with the artwork. And, you know, it just seemed wrong. And when's the right time? I mean, for God's sake, like, when, a month from now is the right time?

• 1:31:31Lewis Howes?

  To launch a show.

• 1:31:31Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, or to move on. Like, there's no right...

• 1:31:34Lewis Howes?

  A year, 10 years?

• 1:31:35Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, what, what? You know, so I was just like, move it forward. And, um, and I do think, you know, for me, it has always been the biggest part of my healing. And what helps me the most is why I do it, is helping other people, so...

• 1:31:50Lewis Howes?

  Being in service, yeah.

• 1:31:51Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah, that's always it for me.

• 1:31:53Lewis Howes?

  It's healing and the show must go on.

• 1:31:56Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:31:56Lewis Howes?

  It's both and, right?

• 1:31:57Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yes.

• 1:31:59Lewis Howes?

  Can't stop life.

• 1:32:00Dr. Laura Berman?

  No.

• 1:32:01Lewis Howes?

  So it continues. Well, you're a rock star Laura and I appreciate you being here. It's been amazing. I have one final question.

• 1:32:08Dr. Laura Berman?

  Okay.

• 1:32:09Lewis Howes?

  What's your definition of greatness?

• 1:32:11Dr. Laura Berman?

  What's my definition of greatness? Um, authenticity.

• 1:32:17Lewis Howes?

  There you go.

• 1:32:17Dr. Laura Berman?

  Yeah.

• 1:32:18Lewis Howes?

  Dr. Laura, thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thank you.

• 1:32:21Dr. Laura Berman?

  Thank you.

• 1:32:22Lewis Howes?

  Thank you so much for listening to this episode. I hope you enjoyed it. There was a lot that we covered around relationships, healing, sex, therapy, all these different things. And I'm just so grateful that Laura was able to share a lot of this and also talk about her son the way she did, as I know she's going through a lot. So make sure to send her some love and some positive inspiration her way as she goes through her healing journey right now. And I'm just grateful that she showed up the way she did, willing to serve even during this process. Again, if you enjoyed this, please subscribe over on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Please leave us a rating and review. Let us know what you enjoyed most about this. And if you want to help others in your life and inspire the people around you, then just

• 1:33:04Lewis Howes?

  share this link with them right now, wherever you're listening to this podcast. Copy and paste the link and send it to a few people. Or you can use the link lewishouse.com/1081 for the full show notes and everything else that we talked about in this episode. And if you want inspirational messages sent to your phone, texted from me to you every single week, then just text me the word PODCAST right now to 614-350-3960. Again, text the word PODCAST to 614-350-3960 to get inspirational messages sent to you every single week. And I want to leave you with this quote from Helen Keller, who said, "The best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even heard, but must be felt with the heart." I hope you're feeling your heart today and every day.

• 1:33:48Lewis Howes?

  I hope you're connecting with it. I hope you're listening to it. I hope you're allowing yourself to experience the full range of emotions that this life and world has to offer. And I hope you're also constantly in a process of evolving and healing and growing yourself to become a better human being every single day. I'm grateful for you. And if no one's told you lately, I want to remind you that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And you know what time it is? It's time to go out there and do something great.