Pod Insights Scamfluencers ENCORE: Jho Low: How to Buy Friends and Influence People | 216 About this episode We’ll be back soon with new episodes. In the meantime, enjoy this episode about Jho Low, the fraudster who charmed Hollywood’s elite while allegedly stealing over $4 billion from one of Malaysia’s sovereign wealth funds.
Jho Low, a Malaysian-born businessman, will do anything to climb the social ladder. After attending Wharton business school, he establishes himself as a globe-trotting playboy with a celebrity entourage. He uses his money to get near Leonardo DiCaprio, Miranda Kerr, Paris Hilton, Britney Spears, and Kim Kardashian. But the source of Jho Low’s seemingly endless cash is a mystery…. Until one of his former associates decides to blow the whistle.
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
Transcript Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:00 Sarah Hagi? Audible subscribers can listen to all our episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free right now. Join Audible today by downloading the Audible app.
0:08 Scaachi Koul? We'll be back soon with all new episodes of Scamfluencers, but today, we're revisiting one of the wildest heists in modern history. The story of Jolo, the Malaysian financier who allegedly stole $4.5 billion from his country's sovereign wealth fund and blew it on parties, picassos, and Hollywood movies.
0:28 Sarah Hagi? When we first covered Joe a few years ago, he was already a fugitive wanted by Interpol, hiding somewhere overseas while governments around the world tried to claw back the stolen funds. Well, he is still a fugitive, but now he wants clemency.
0:42 Scaachi Koul? According to The Wall Street Journal, Jolo has formally asked President Trump for a pardon. A DOJ website lists a pending request for a pardon after completion of sentence filed under Joe's legal name. If granted, it would wipe out all US criminal charges against him, even though he's never stood trial or served a single day in prison.
1:04 Sarah Hagi? You know what? He's gonna be okay. Something tells me he's gonna be just fine.
1:09 Scaachi Koul? Well, in his pardon request, Joe reportedly told US authorities that he can help make deals happen. He even tried to take credit for a recent prisoner transfer between Malaysia and the US, even though Malaysian officials say Joe wasn't involved. The White House said that the request isn't on their radar, but Trump has already pardoned other white-collar criminals this term, so nothing's off the table.
1:31 Sarah Hagi? If anyone can get pardon, it will be Jolo.
1:34 Scaachi Koul? He's very powerful. Well, meanwhile, Malaysian officials said that their investigation is still ongoing and that Joe should not be pardoned. So with this brazen new chapter in mind, we're revisiting the story of Jolo, the billion-dollar whale who stole a fortune, vanished, and is now asking the president to make it all go away.
2:01 Sarah Hagi? Sarah, what is the nicest gift a man has ever bought you to express his romantic interest? Thank you for asking. I'm gonna take you all the way back to grade five. Wow. It was Secret Santa, and a guy gave me some used markers. And I thought that was really sweet. He definitely had a huge crush on me. Oh, that is nice. Did it work? Yeah, obviously. Oh. Okay, well, I only ask because today I have a story that made me rethink what it means to splurge on a crush. It's January 2014 in New York City. An Australian supermodel, Miranda Kerr, is walking through midtown Manhattan.
2:45 Sarah Hagi? With her piercing blue eyes and high cheekbones, Miranda sticks out anywhere. But tonight, she's especially striking. It's just after midnight, and she's wearing a full-on ball gown. She's just come from a formal event, but she's now headed to a restaurant to meet a friend. It's an old-school Korean barbecue spot, the kind with laminated menus in the window. She scans the room and spots her friend sitting at a table with a group of other people. They just came from a long night singing karaoke, and they are feasting. Miranda takes a seat next to someone she's never met before. He's a Malaysian-born businessman with a round face and rimless glasses. He goes by the name Joe Lo.
3:27 Sarah Hagi? Miranda and Joe get to talking, and she learns that he's a multimillion-dollar investor in companies like EMI Music Publishing and the Park Lane Hotel. She's intrigued. Miranda's 30 years old, and she's getting tired of photo shoots and runways. She wants to make the shift into being an entrepreneur, starting with her skincare line, Cora Organics. Joe seems impressed by Miranda's business savvy. He keeps complimenting her, and they spark an unlikely connection. They talk all night, and the next morning, Miranda sends products from her skincare line over to Joe's apartment. She's convinced that she's just met her angel investor. But Joe is no angel. His fortune comes from a scam that takes billions of dollars from Malaysian citizens.
4:10 Scaachi Koul? Miranda has no idea that the kind, soft-spoken man sneaking his way into her life will soon be facing serious charges in multiple countries for a brazen, international embezzlement scheme.
4:27 Speaker 02 Confidence, it's listening to your gut. It's moving forward even when the path ahead is unclear. For nearly 160 years, Pacific Life has helped people keep their promises, building confidence for generations. Whether you're confident in your financial future or just beginning to envision it, we're here to help. Ask a financial professional how. Pacific Life, the power of a promise. Pacific Life Insurance Company, Omaha, Nebraska. And in New York, Pacific Life and Annuity, Phoenix, Arizona.
4:57 Scaachi Koul? I'm Gemma Whelan, and in the new season of The Spy Who, we tell the story of the original femme fatale, the spy who was Mata Hari. A famous dancer turned World War I secret agent, accused of seducing Allied officers to uncover their plans. But was she a temptress or a scapegoat for French failures? Follow The Spy Who now, wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also listen to the full season of The Spy Who Was Mata Hari, early and ad-free on Audible.
5:30 Scaachi Koul? From Wondery, I'm Scaachi Cole.
5:32 Speaker 03 And I'm Sarah Haggy.
5:33 Scaachi Koul? And this is Scamfluencers.
5:43 Scaachi Koul? Joe Lo presented himself as an over-the-top party boy, but behind the scenes, he was an economic genius who's been accused of manipulating the complex world of international banking to steal billions. He used the money to buy friends and power, but ultimately, he couldn't buy loyalty. In its inevitable and absurd demise, Joe's scheme led to the largest asset seizure in US history, forced Leonardo DiCaprio to return an Oscar, and even brought down the Malaysian prime minister. I'm calling this episode, "Joe Lo: How to Buy Friends and Influence People."
6:21 Scaachi Koul? Before he becomes buddies with Leo DiCaprio, Joe is just another awkward teenager trying to get into a nightclub. And he and his wealthy boarding school buddies pushed their way to the front of the line outside Chinaway. It's one of London's hottest clubs, and the VIP lounge is always packed with celebrities, models, and footballers. It's almost impossible to get in, but Joe is eager to impress his friends, and he's come up with a plan to get them inside. One of Joe's classmates is a member of the Brunei royal family. So Joe sent the nightclub a forged note with letterhead from the Brunei embassy asking to reserve a table. When Joe shows up, it's probably not what the club was expecting.
7:04 Scaachi Koul? He's a short, dorky teenager, but the plan works, and Joe and his friends are welcomed inside the club. Joe's family is well off by most standards, but a lot of his classmates are the sons of literal billionaires. Joe's father is a mere millionaire. He made his fortune in the garment industry, but he's always dreamed of launching his family into the billionaire class. He's a relentless social climber who's been known to fly Swedish models to parties, and he's been training Joe to ingratiate himself with the uber wealthy by offering a good time. Joe is super awkward, but he still manages to make friends with the well-connected nepo babies at his London boarding school.
7:42 Sarah Hagi? It really does suck when you're like the millionaire and everyone else is a billionaire, and you're just like...
7:48 Scaachi Koul? So hard.
7:49 Sarah Hagi? Like, I had to work so hard to get to where I am.
7:52 Scaachi Koul? I know, and it's like, nobody appreciates it because they have a literal billion dollars.
7:56 Sarah Hagi? Mm-hmm.
7:57 Scaachi Koul? Well, after high school, Joe enrolls at the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton Business School. He wants to learn how to be a proper businessman, but Joe still doesn't have charisma, and he really doesn't know how to talk to women. He quickly discovers that when his social skills fall short, money can talk for him. He's always been obsessed with America and its wild parties and celebrities, especially Paris Hilton. He actually spends a lot of time watching her movie, House of Wax, over and over again, which annoys the hell out of his roommates. Luckily for Joe, his father wires him tens of thousands of dollars just to play around and party with. He takes rich friends to Atlantic City's Trump Plaza Hotel and Casino to gamble.
8:41 Scaachi Koul? He even invites his classmate Ivanka Trump to join him, but she reportedly refuses. For his 20th birthday, Joe decides to go big. He rents out one of Philadelphia's hottest clubs, and he calls up a bunch of sororities to invite them to the party of the year. People eat sushi off nearly naked Models and a Marilyn Monroe impersonator sings "Happy Birthday" to Joe. There's just one thing, the party costs $40,000. And Joe's already spent his dad's party with hotties money. So Joe negotiates with the club. And months later, he finally wears them down and gets away with paying just a fraction of what he owes. He's learning that it's better to ask for forgiveness than for permission.
9:25 Scaachi Koul? Joe's fellow students don't know that he's a fraud. He becomes known as the Asian Great Gatsby. Rumors swirl that he's a Malaysian prince and Joe doesn't deny them. As graduation looms, he starts planning for how he can take his college party connections into the real world and make good on his father's investment. During his last semester, Joe sets up his first company. He calls it the Winton Group, which Joe says is short for win tons of money. And that's exactly what he set on doing by any means necessary. After graduation, Joe returns to Malaysia where he was born and raised. He sets up an office for the Winton Group in the Patronus Towers in Kuala Lumpur.
10:07 Scaachi Koul? It's the most expensive office building in the entire country. Joe's goal is to have a thriving investment firm, but he's learned that perception is everything. So he convinces a local bank to give him a loan to renovate his office. He installs a waiting pool, toilet seats that automatically adjust to the height of the user, and whiteboards that print out what you write on them. Unfortunately, it takes more than a fancy office to be successful. The Winton Group does not take off and Joe spent all of his money on the office. Plus, he's in a ton of debt from the bank loan. He stops paying rent on the office and after a few months, he's evicted. But Joe still has connections. Plus, he's very persuasive.
10:48 Scaachi Koul? So he decides to start connecting wealthy Middle Eastern investors with Malaysian businesses. He'll serve as a broker and collect fees after the deals are done. At one point, Joe facilitates a real estate deal with the Malaysian government that's worth a half a billion dollars. But when Joe asks for his broker fee, he's turned down and this pisses him off. He feels like he spent his life catering to wealthy people and now he's being boxed out. Common broke struggles. This is what happens to people like us. Us millionaires amongst the billionaires.
11:23 Sarah Hagi? Yeah.
11:24 Scaachi Koul? While Joe may have been stiffed on a fee, but the Malaysian development project is ripe with opportunity. Joe switches gears and comes up with another get-rich-quick scheme. But first, he'll need to raise a lot of money. So he sets up a bogus investment group. He calls it the Abu Dhabi Kuwait Malaysia Investment Company. Very official. And he gives free shares to his rich friends to make it look like the group has important investors. Then he creates a bunch of shell companies in the Seychelles to mask his ownership. Eventually, he's able to convince a bank to loan him tens of millions of dollars. He uses this money to buy a construction company, which he immediately sells to a Malaysian businessman at a huge markup. He later brags to friends
12:07 Scaachi Koul? that the deal was worth more than $100 million. Joe's finally found his way into the stratosphere of extreme wealth, and he did it by using other people's money. Now, he's got his eye on an even bigger payday, and he's going to use the coffers of an entire country to make it happen.
12:27 Scaachi Koul? Nearly a year later, in August of 2009, the new prime minister of Malaysia is sailing on a yacht on the French Riviera. His name is Najib Razak. He has bright white hair, a matching mustache, and a seemingly permanent frown. Najib is on the yacht with an up-and-coming Malaysian businessman, Joe. Najib's stepson, Riza Aziz, went to boarding school with Joe, and their two families grew close in the years since. Najib has been impressed with Joe's supposed economic prowess, and he's recently started managing a fund that he thinks Joe can help him with. It contains more than $1 billion. Technically, the fund does not belong to Najib. It belongs to the Malaysian government. And the goal of it is to create jobs
13:10 Scaachi Koul? and boost economic development in that country, mostly by investing taxpayer money into things like green energy and tourism. And Najib, as the prime minister, essentially has full control over it. He gets to sign off on investments and have final say on its board members. He decides to rename it One Malaysia Development Burdah, or One M D B for short. And even though this money doesn't belong to them, Najib and Joe already have some big ideas about how to invest it and how to spend it. Which is why they've set up a meeting today with two Saudi businessmen. One of them is a literal prince. He's actually the owner of the yacht that they're on. It's got a swimming pool, a movie theater, and a helipad.
13:53 Scaachi Koul? These two men run an oil extraction company called Petro Saudi International. And because one of them is a Saudi prince, they are extremely well-connected to the royal family. It seems like they've got access to loads of cash, and Najib and Joe decide they want in on it. We can't know exactly what was said during that meeting on the yacht, but it does seem like some plans were hatched while these men were lounging off the coast of Monaco. Because about a month later, in September, the two companies, Petro Saudi and OneMDB, announce a $2.5 billion deal together. According to a press release, the deal would strengthen the relationship between Saudi Arabia and Malaysia, and, quote, "make strategic investments in high-impact projects." But none of that actually happens.
14:39 Sarah Hagi? It's very bold to put out a statement announcing this whole thing, knowing very well you will not be going through with it, and not even thinking about the consequences of people finding that out.
14:50 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, it's almost impressive. And after all is said and done, OneMDB uses this deal as a guise to transfer more than $1 billion of Malaysian government money into a Swiss bank account. Najib and Joe lie and tell the banks that this account is owned by Petro Saudi for use in their joint venture. You know, to work on high-impact projects, whatever that means. But the truth is, the owner of the account is just one person: Joe. He and Najib are planning to use the money not to enrich the people of Malaysia, but to pamper themselves. And now that he's got the cash in hand, Joe wants to live out the dream of every formerly uncool teenager: partying with hot celebrities.
15:35 Scaachi Koul? It's 2010, about six months after the Petrosadi deal goes through. Kim Kardashian is in Vegas to party with Joe and a bunch of his friends. Kim originally met Joe when he paid her $50,000 to go to his birthday party for two hours. And since then, the two have been BlackBerry messaging. Kim doesn't know how Joe has all this money, and neither do the tabloids, who call him "The Whale." They describe him as a mysterious playboy known for dropping insane amounts of money at New York City clubs like Pink Elephant and One Oak. He's been flying Paris Hilton around the world and paying her to party with him. There are rumors that Joe owns the five-star L'Hermitage Hotel in Beverly Hills, has several multimillion-dollar properties, owns a Bombardier jet, and is close friends with Leonardo DiCaprio.
16:20 Scaachi Koul? And Sarah, I am devastated to say that all of those rumors are completely true.
16:26 Sarah Hagi? I know they're true, because I remember him being mentioned in tabloids, but I had no idea it was this, you know?
16:33 Scaachi Koul? Oh, yeah.
16:34 Sarah Hagi? It's very common that billionaires buy celebrity time.
16:38 Scaachi Koul? Yeah.
16:38 Sarah Hagi? But fake billionaires? That's good. I mean, what a breach of trust.
16:44 Scaachi Koul? Well, after the party in Vegas, Kim and Joe go to dinner and then out clubbing. Joe gets them into a private baccarat room. He hands Kim a stack of chips and tells her to go have fun. Joe loves to gamble, and he isn't afraid to throw around huge stacks of cash. Like at Paris Hilton's 29th birthday party earlier that year, Joe lost $2 million in under 10 minutes without breaking a sweat.
17:06 Sarah Hagi? Cool.
17:08 Scaachi Koul? Well, Kim uses the chips Joe gave her to play some games. But she's been partying all night, and she's fading. Around 5:00 AM, she's ready to call it. But someone at the party reportedly persuades her to just grab a cup of coffee and stick around. Joe is known for gifting people cash at the end of the night. And when Joe finally decides it's time to turn in, he tells Kim to keep her chips. Kim later tells the FBI that the chips are worth $350,000. She flies home on Southwest with a trash bag full of $100 bills.
17:41 Sarah Hagi? It's so great when you hear stories about Kim Kardashian, pre-Kim as we know her. You know what I mean? It's like, she was just a girl like us, like we all are.
17:50 Scaachi Koul? Who wouldn't do this? Well, Joe is spending so much so fast that his pot of OneMDB cash is already drying up. He may have invested some of the money into hotels and real estate, but it's not enough to make up for the jet setting, partying, and gambling. So Joe convinces Prime Minister Najib to give him $800 million through OneMDB. Is Joe going to use this money to invest in the people of Malaysia? No. Instead, he's going to find an even more over the top way to attract famous friends, by helping them make a movie.
18:30 Scaachi Koul? On January 24th, 2023, in Ducksbury, Massachusetts, Patrick Clancy called 911. He had found his wife Lindsay badly injured and his three children dead and dying. What followed would become one of the most searing and complicated cases in recent memory, raising hard questions about motherhood, mental illness, and how far our justice system will go to understand what really happened. I'm Candace DeLong, host of the podcast Killer Psy. In our latest episode, we take you inside the case of Lindsay Clancy, the postpartum psychosis defense, the courtroom battle, and the trial that just ended in a stunning mistrial.
19:14 Scaachi Koul? Follow Killer Psy wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can listen to all episodes of Killer Psy one week early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts.
19:31 Speaker 04 Hey, I'm Cassie DePecce, the host of Against the Odds from Audible Originals. In each episode, we share thrilling true stories of survival, putting you in the shoes of the people who lived to tell the tale. In our latest series, we track the story of Hugh Glass, the real-life revenant that inspired the 2015 film starring Leonardo DiCaprio. In 1823, Glass was brutally mauled by a grizzly bear in present day South Dakota and left for dead. His survival depended on trekking through 350 miles of wilderness alone with grave injuries. But he was driven by his thirst for revenge. Follow Against the Odds wherever you get your podcasts. Audible subscribers can binge all episodes of Against the Odds early and ad-free right now. Join Audible in the Audible app or by subscribing on Apple Podcasts.
20:18 Speaker 03 And I feel like a legend.
20:23 Scaachi Koul? It's 2011 at the Cannes Film Festival in France, and Joe Lo is at a star-studded party with his good friend Leonardo DiCaprio. The two have grown close over the last few years. Joe even affectionately calls Leo "L-Dog." The two bros spend long nights partying and hatching plans. They want to start a billion-dollar fund to produce movies, develop an eco-friendly resort in Belize, and even create a theme park in Asia based on Leo's films.
20:51 Sarah Hagi? That's so great that they want to do all this stuff that will ruin the world and environment by creating a theme park and, you know, jet-setting around the world and partying on yachts. But at least they will open an eco-friendly resort in Belize.
21:07 Scaachi Koul? Leonardo DiCaprio is an environmentalist, okay?
21:09 Sarah Hagi? That's true, he is.
21:11 Scaachi Koul? Well, at the Cannes party, the drinks are flowing, Kanye West is performing, fireworks are exploding, and it's all to announce the financing of Leo's passion project with director Martin Scorsese: a new film called The Wolf of Wall Street. In the movie, Leo will play Jordan Belfort, a stock fraudster known for his lavish parties and outrageous spending. This event is estimated to cost around $3 million, and the movie hasn't even started filming yet. But the financiers want to make a splash, and one of them is Najib's stepson, Riza Aziz. He's the co-founder of a new production company called Red Granite Pictures. Leo and Scorsese had been struggling to secure funding for the movie, and Red Granite
21:53 Scaachi Koul? was looking to get into the business. So Joe offered to give Riza the money to cover the film's $100 million budget. Joe's name is kept out of the press, but that doesn't stop people from speculating about where Red Granite got the money to bankroll the movie and throw such an outlandish event. It's all feeling very suspicious. The Wolf of Wall Street himself, Jordan Belfort, is at the party with his girlfriend. And Sarah, will you read what he said to her about the party?
22:21 Sarah Hagi? Yeah, he says, "This is a fucking scam. Anybody who does this has stolen money. You wouldn't spend money you worked for like that." Game recognize game.
22:31 Scaachi Koul? Listen, ballers notice ballers in the club. Well, meanwhile, Joe and Ajib have been coming up with more and more schemes to take money from OneMDB and deposit it into their own bank accounts. They get away with it, in part by paying off the bankers they work with. Like, when Goldman Sachs handles a bond transaction for OneMDB that's worth almost $2 billion, Joe gives the bankers $190 million as a thank you, even though the bank would normally only take home about $1 million for a transaction like that. With so much money rolling in, it's easy for the bankers to look the other way. But the people of Malaysia are starting to ask questions.
23:14 Scaachi Koul? And no matter how many offshore accounts Joe creates, he won't be able to hide his identity forever. It's an unusually hot November night in Las Vegas in 2012. The largest luxury suite at the Venetian Hotel is packed. It's Joe's 31st birthday and the party is raging. But actually, this is only the pre-party. Joe strolls through the suite in his tuxedo, schmoozing up his celebrity friends. He waves to Alicia Keys and her music producer husband, Swiss Beats. He hugs former Fugees rapper, Pras Michel, before hurrying off to talk movie ideas with Benicio del Toro and El Dog. Before long, a security team escorts them all to the main event. Joe has turned an airplane hangar into his dream venue.
23:59 Scaachi Koul? One side is a circus with trampolines, a Ferris wheel, and a carousel. The other side is decked out like a nightclub, with cigar lounges and plush white couches for guests like Kim Kardashian and Kanye West to cuddle on.
24:12 Sarah Hagi? Oh my god, this is so, like, high school rich kid. And those popular kids are like, "Yeah, I mean, he throws great parties, of course we're gonna keep him around."
24:21 Scaachi Koul? Well, there's also a stage where Jamie Foxx is emceeing. He plays a video of Joe's friends from around the world dancing to the hit song, Gangnam Style. The crowd erupts when Psy takes The stage to perform it live. Guests are then treated to an hour and a half of live performances from Pharrell, Busta Rhymes, and Q-Tip. Ludacris and Chris Brown debut the song "Everyday Birthday."
24:49 Scaachi Koul? Joe Low is pulled onstage as a giant faux wedding cake is wheeled towards him. The top of the cake bursts open and out pops fucking Britney Spears. She serenades Joe with her rendition of "Happy Birthday." Joe stands onstage looking out over the sea of famous faces, the hundreds of so-called friends he's bought with his millions. But very few of these guests know Joe personally. It doesn't seem to faze him. And actually, the money and power have started to go to his head. By 2013, about four years into his scheme, he's allegedly stolen more than $1 billion from the 1MDB fund. He's found that if he's footing the bill, he can basically do and say whatever he wants.
25:33 Scaachi Koul? At one point, he reportedly tells British model Roxy Horner that she needs to lose weight. And while recording his own vanity project in a music studio, he dares to call Busta Rhymes his bitch to Busta's face.
25:46 Sarah Hagi? For that alone, he deserves prison.
25:48 Scaachi Koul? Under the jail.
25:48 Sarah Hagi? To me, this is when he becomes a true villain.
25:51 Scaachi Koul? This is really when the harm happens, yes. You don't say that to Busta Rhymes.
25:55 Sarah Hagi? No!
25:56 Scaachi Koul? But while Joe is partying, malicious politics are changing. Najeeb's political party has been in power ever since Malaysia gained independence in 1957. Now, the opposition party is gaining supporters, and Najeeb's grip on power is slipping. Voters are starting to see how much he's spending. And it doesn't help that Najeeb's wife is famous for her diamond shopping sprees and collection of Birkin bags. Sarah, will you please describe what Rusma looks like?
26:23 Sarah Hagi? Okay. So, this is a woman who has the oddest hair I've seen in a very long time. It's an ink-black helmet of hair. She looks like a- Hey Arnold character. It's crazy. It's so big. And it's like, is that a wig she bought? Is that something people did for her? You know, she's definitely got that botoxy look. Respect.
26:47 Scaachi Koul? I hope I look like her when I grow up. Well, Rusma needs to keep up appearances. And in order to do that, Najib needs to stay in power. Joe is also rooting for Najib to keep his elected position, since their scam relies on government funding. Joe realizes he needs to step in. And he decides the best way to help is to throw a huge party. Joe flies to Penang, Malaysia, to host a series of events to drum up political support for Najib. They offer free food and beer. They have raffles and give away bicycles and other prizes. Joe even pays Busta Rhymes and Ludacris to come perform. Sarah, can you describe this photo of Joe and Busta from the event?
27:26 Sarah Hagi? Well, if you ask me, he looks like Busta's bitch, because he's pushing him around on a bike rickshaw. And Busta looks confused.
27:34 Scaachi Koul? He does. But unlike his celebrity friends, the people of Malaysia are not easily distracted by Joe's lavish spending and star-studded events. On election day, they make it clear that they want Najib out. For the first time in 44 years, his party loses the popular vote. But they still end up winning more parliamentary seats. So Najib is able to remain in power. Voters are not happy about it. Within hours, they fill the city streets in protest. Across the globe, in the US, Joe is still spending like crazy. One M D B is $10 billion in debt. But Joe has a Playboy reputation to maintain. And he's about to turn his sights on a new prize: the heart of a supermodel.
28:17 Scaachi Koul? Even though One M D B is starting to fall apart in Malaysia, Joe is riding high in America. The Wolf of Wall Street opens in December 2013 and becomes a smash hit. Leo wins the Golden Globe for Best Actor in a Comedy. He even thanks Joe in his speech. Joe, I think Joey, Riz, and Joe, thank you for being not only collaborators, but taking a risk on this movie, truly. Shortly after this, Joe decides to start seriously courting Miranda Kerr. He invites her to join him for the Super Bowl in New Jersey, and then he starts wooing Miranda with expensive gifts, even though he has a longtime girlfriend in Malaysia.
28:55 Sarah Hagi? So he has this longtime girlfriend back home in Malaysia, and he's publicly trying to court Miranda Kerr and various hot women. Something tells me she's OK with this because of money, perhaps?
29:10 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, maybe. To the world, Joe is presenting himself as a thriving businessman. But behind the scenes, he's scrambling to keep everything afloat. In Malaysia, the political blowback against OneMDB is reaching a fever pitch. There are suspicions that Najib has been using the government fund as his own personal piggy bank. And it doesn't help that Rusma is always on outrageous shopping sprees. The former prime minister, who held office for more than two decades before Najib took his place, publicly denounces Najib. He calls for a full audit and investigation of OneMDB. The company's board discovers that $2.3 billion have been moved out of the fund and into a Cayman Islands company. They demand that OneMDB return the money immediately.
29:54 Scaachi Koul? But Joe comes up with a new trick. He uses shell companies to transfer money around and make it look like the fund has more money than it does. And this actually works, at least for now. At this point, the public still has no idea that Joe is involved in the fund or that he's been using its money to do things like finance the Wolf of Wall Street. But he must be feeling the pressure. He tries to keep his cool in front of Miranda. For Valentine's Day, he gives her a heart-shaped diamond necklace worth over $1 million. He then invites her aboard his new super yacht, Equanimity, which he bought with a $250 million loan from Deutsche Bank. He also sends a very special gift to her house in Malibu. Not a dozen roses or even a car.
30:35 Scaachi Koul? With a bow on it, Joe sends Miranda a grand piano worth more than $170,000. It's made of clear acrylic, so you can see the hardware through it. Miranda showed it off in a video for Vogue.
30:46 Sarah Hagi? My grandmother had a grand piano, and so I've got a grand piano.
30:54 Sarah Hagi? So at this point, is she actually his girlfriend? Or is he still just buying her very expensive things so that people wonder?
31:00 Scaachi Koul? We don't really know for sure, but it is clear that he's like really courting her. Like, for Miranda's 31st birthday, Joe throws her a 90s-themed party. He flies Salt and Pepper, Mark Morrison, and Vanilla Ice to New York City to perform. Jamie Foxx emcees and swizzbeats Leo and Miranda's ex, Orlando Bloom, are amongst the 100 or so attendees. The weekend of birthday festivities concludes with a Miami-style party on a yacht on the Hudson River and a helicopter ride to hit the baccarat tables in Atlantic City. But even with all that, Miranda and Joe's romance won't survive the year. And neither will the secret of Joe's involvement in OneMDB. As more banks and businesses get involved, it leaves room for someone to crack.
31:43 Scaachi Koul? And when they do, a scrappy British journalist is waiting to publish the whole story.
31:50 Scaachi Koul? It's October 2014, and Claire Rucastle-Brown is sitting in the lobby of a hotel in Bangkok. Claire is a London-based journalist in her early 50s. She has kind eyes and long hair with bangs. She kind of reminds me of like a high school art teacher, like the cool one. She was born on an island off Malaysia when it was still part of the British Commonwealth. And now, she runs a website called The Surawak Report. It's dedicated to exposing corruption in Malaysia. And Claire is good. Malaysian politicians have even labeled her an enemy of the state, a badge she wears with pride. She's here in this Bangkok hotel to meet a source. He's a Swiss banker and a former employee of Petro Saudi, the company OneMDB did Their first billion dollar deal with. She's expecting someone with Swiss banker vibes.
32:35 Scaachi Koul? Bald, glasses, shrimpy. But the man who approaches her is six foot six with black hair and a very 90s goatee. Claire later says that her first instinct was to run. She thinks she's been tricked and he's here to rough her up. But it turns out he's actually her source, Javier Justo. Javier tells Claire he was hired as the director of Petro Saudi after they signed the One M D B deal. Petro Saudi promised him a big salary, but they only ever paid him about half of it. He got pissed and he quit. On his way out the door, he copied one of their servers full of damning evidence. He tried to blackmail the company to get the money he was owed, but they refused to pay. And he figured he'd leverage the server another way by giving it to a journalist like Claire
33:20 Scaachi Koul? for a price. Javier promises Claire that the information on the server can bring down One M D B and it's hers for $2 million.
33:28 Sarah Hagi? I mean, that is a lot of money and obviously is not very ethical, but yeah, at the same time, it's either she pays or someone else does and gets the story.
33:40 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, someone will pay for it. But Claire needs reinforcements, so she decides to contact Tong Kue Ong, the owner of a Malaysian media outlet called The Edge. Unlike most Malaysian media companies, The Edge isn't afraid of political blowback. The site posts frequently about One M D B. Claire convinces Tong to meet with Javier and three months later, they sit down with him at the Fullerton Hotel in Singapore. Javier explains that the server can prove that One M D B was putting hundreds of millions of government dollars directly into Jolo's personal bank account. Tong thinks a bombshell like this is worth the price, so he agrees to pay the $2 million. And one month later, Claire runs an article with the headline, "Heist of the Century."
34:23 Scaachi Koul? It's picked up by news outlets around the world. Word of Joe and Najib's rampant corruption is out, and now their scheme is about to come crashing down.
34:36 Speaker 05 Hi, I'm Kenia Perez. And I'm Malcolm Gladwell. We're back for season two of our Audible original podcast, The Unusual Suspects. We'll sit down with extraordinary guests from the worlds of art, film, literature, comedy, and wellness to hear from their unexpected stories of success. And who do we have this season? Well, we'll talk with Grammy winning artist Anderson Paak, athlete Rich Roll, portrait artist Amy Sherald, Oscar Winning director Ron Howard, legendary writer David Sedaris, and many more. These conversations are more intimate than last season, wouldn't you say? I would. Listen to season one of The Unusual Suspects wherever you get your podcasts, and sign up for a free trial Audible to listen to season two in the Audible app or by subscribing to Apple Podcasts.
35:24 Scaachi Koul? I'm Gemma Whelan, and in the new season of The Spy Who, we tell the story of the original femme fatale, the spy who was Mata Hari. A famous dancer turned World War I secret agent accused of seducing Allied officers to uncover their plans. But was she a temptress or a scapegoat for French failures? Follow The Spy Who now, wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also listen to the full season of The Spy Who Was Mata Hari early and at free on Audible.
35:57 Speaker 03 And I feel like a legend.
36:03 Scaachi Koul? I don't know where Najib is when he reads Claire's article, but I like to imagine him with his wife, Fressma, on one of her legendary shopping sprees at Hermes. She's trying on silk scarves, but Najib suddenly can't stop staring at his phone. His world is being rocked by a blog post. Najib's been in power for six years, and behind the scenes, his OneMDB scheme has floundered. The fund is $11 billion in debt. And now Claire's article has completely exposed the scam. There's nowhere to hide. But Najib still has the power of his office, and he's desperate to keep it. He cracks down on the press and issues harsh penalties on free speech, especially on social media. He arrests five executives from The Edge and threatens to hold them indefinitely
36:48 Scaachi Koul? under a new law that was created for terrorists.
36:51 Sarah Hagi? Oh my god, way to make things so much worse for yourself, buddy.
36:56 Scaachi Koul? He's proving everybody's point. Well, three months later, Najib bans The Edge from publishing altogether, but it doesn't stop Claire from reporting from London. Four months after her first explosive article, she teams up with reporters at The Wall Street Journal. They reveal that Najib put $681 million
37:14 Scaachi Koul? of 1MDB funds into several of his personal accounts. Against Najib's best efforts, the news still reaches Malaysia and people call for his arrest. He denies the claims as Malaysian investigators raid the 1MDB offices. But Najib is not going to go down without a fight. When he gets word that the Malaysian Attorney General is looking to press charges, Najib fires him and puts out a statement that the AG is sick and cannot continue serving. He then promotes government investigators into positions where they can't continue the probe, effectively shutting down the investigation. The next day, a fire breaks out in the police headquarters and tons of important documents go up in smoke.
37:54 Scaachi Koul? Najib has managed to build a wall around himself in Malaysia, but a scam this massive and this international quickly gets the attention of authorities all over the world, and he can't stop them all.
38:08 Scaachi Koul? After Claire cracked open Joe's money trail, hungry investigators all over the world start coming for him. Through Interpol, Singapore puts out a red notice for Joe and his associates. The US government also files a civil suit in California. It accuses Riza's company, Red Granite, of using the movie The Wolf of Wall Street to launder money. Joe swears he's innocent. He flees the US in hopes of escaping extradition, and he eventually makes his way to China with his wife and two-month-old baby.
38:35 Sarah Hagi? Joe has a baby? I mean, it's crazy to think that while this was all happening, he ended up marrying that woman and having a two-month-old baby.
38:45 Scaachi Koul? Yeah, men get away with the craziest shit. As Joe's scheme starts to crumble, many of his famous friends abandon him like rats from a sinking ship. They turn his lavish gifts over to the US government to avoid being implicated in his crimes. Leo returns a Picasso, a collage by Basquiat, and Marlon Brando's 1954 Oscar for On the Waterfront. Miranda returns $8 million in jewelry and offers to give back the piano. But when the government examines her house, they realize they'd need to knock down walls to retrieve it. They decide it's just cheaper to leave it.
39:21 Sarah Hagi? I mean, does that just mean that if something's big enough and it's stolen, you might not have to give it back? I'm liking this loophole.
39:30 Scaachi Koul? While not everyone turns their back on Joe, Alicia Keys and Swizz Beatz decide to keep traveling and partying with him. Swizz even attends a birthday party that Joe throws in Thailand for his older brother. Joe manages to pay Nelly, Neo, and Nicole Scherzinger to perform. And even still, it's a modest affair by Joe's standards.
39:48 Sarah Hagi? That is so crazy that these people see what's happening and they're like, you know what, let's just milk him. Like, let's see how far we can go with using this billionaire's money, knowing that he's a thief.
40:01 Scaachi Koul? Well, here's the natural progression of that. Joe also allegedly pours some money into Donald Trump's reelection campaign, hoping that he will drop the investigation against him. It goes nowhere. The evidence and the global outrage continue to mount. In May 2018, Najib loses his bid for reelection. The news comes in around 2 a.m. as he sits in his mansion, surrounded by family. He's shocked. He actually thought he couldn't lose after he spent millions bribing government officials. For the first time since Malaysia became a democracy, the opposition party is in power. Najib and his wife, Rasma, try to flee the country on a private jet. But others in the government leak their plans and protesters mob the airport.
40:45 Scaachi Koul? Days later, Najib is resting at home after a trip to his mosque, when over a dozen cop cars surround the property. Police storm the house, looking for evidence. And that night, they raid six of Najib's other houses. They seize 35 bags of cash in 26 currencies, totaling about $30 million U.S. dollars. They find 25 bags of gold, hundreds of Hermes handbags, and even more watches. Two months later, Najib is arrested.
41:14 Sarah Hagi? That is insane. This man is leading a country and he...
41:20 Scaachi Koul? Not anymore.
41:21 Sarah Hagi? No, but it's so crazy that a world leader was so brazen. Like, that's just what you could see. Forget the stuff that's hidden away.
41:28 Scaachi Koul? That's in the floorboards, yeah.
41:30 Sarah Hagi? Well, two years after the arrest, Najib is convicted in Malaysia. He's fined $46 million and sentenced to 12 years in jail. His stepson, Riza, reaches a settlement to pay the US $60 million in assets. He also agrees to testify against Najib. Goldman Sachs is ordered to pay nearly $3 billion for conspiring in the OneMDB scandal. Individual bankers are also charged, and one gets a 10-year prison sentence. At this point, this is the largest international kleptocracy case the US has ever pursued. And since Joe fled the United States, the government has seized about $900 million worth of his assets. That includes houses, a hotel, a private jet, and a mega yacht.
42:14 Sarah Hagi? But Joe still has cash hidden in accounts all over the world. He's wanted in Malaysia, Kuwait, the US, and Singapore. And even after being the center of a nearly $5 billion global fund, Joe remains at large, possibly at a baccarat table near you.
42:32 Sarah Hagi? Okay, so, based on Malaysian intelligence, it seems like Joe is in Macau in China, but he is very much free, Sarah. How does that make you feel?
42:42 Scaachi Koul? As a millionaire, how does that make you feel?
42:45 Sarah Hagi? That is so crazy. This guy, who is so visible, he has been in so many photos, been so many places. This is such a high-profile thing that happened. It involved some of the most famous people in the world and a world leader. And this guy is just maybe nearby in Macau? I'm so floored that he's just out. He's out here. He's out here, man, yeah. He got away with it. I am surprised you're so shocked. You are usually very cynical about what happens to these people. Well, this is the thing. This is so hype. Like, how did they just not catch him, like, physically catch this guy? I mean, the thing about the Jolo case is that I don't think he's gonna be able to,
43:28 Sarah Hagi? like, quietly sit in Macau with his wife and baby for very long. Like, he's gonna try to scam again because I think it's pathological for someone like him. And the money will run out. The way he's spending it, even if there are all these shell funds that he has, the money will run out, and he's gonna have to, like, steal some.
43:45 Scaachi Koul? More. Who knows? Like, this guy seems so resourceful. I mean, he's he again, this guy's out here. If you were a famous person hanging out with Jolo, at what point would you have been like, mm, this all seems like bullshit? I need to stop spending time with this guy.
44:00 Sarah Hagi? You know, I whenever I think of situations like this, I think of how they play out in much, much lower stakes. Like, there's so many people you know, friend groups, you know, where there's just one terrible person who has one specific thing to offer, and no one can drop them, you know? And so imagine that guy, but he has billions of dollars he's willing to spend on you.
44:23 Scaachi Koul? I feel like I might be that guy, so I'm open to being a billionaire if I have to be that guy. I also know that guy, and I'm open to that guy being a billionaire.
44:31 Sarah Hagi? If you were that guy, I don't think you are because you'd have to have more to offer, no offense. But.
44:39 Scaachi Koul? Nice. Not untrue.
44:42 Sarah Hagi? It also kind of frames wealth in a very specific way because I think it's very easy to see celebrities and famous people as like, you know, they're going to be rich forever. They're so rich. They have so much money. And they do, but the thing is like, they still aren't at the very, very top, unless they are very savvy business people. So to me, it kind of shows that like, this is just one example, but you look at pictures from Cannes during the film festival, they're all on billionaire yachts, getting paid to just hang out with people. It's like a very common, normal thing that people don't think about because everyone just assumes, oh, they have millions of dollars. They don't need more money, but of course they do.
45:23 Scaachi Koul? I feel like the lesson for today is that the real scam isn't getting someone to pay you to just hang out, and you and I need to figure out how to get it on that racket.
45:32 Sarah Hagi? Listen, people hang out with us, and we have very little to offer them. I think that says a lot about our character.
45:38 Scaachi Koul? If you at home are very rich, and you love swarthy, Gumby and Poki duo teams, Sarah and I are happy to sit. At a Chili's with you for any amount of money.
45:51 Sarah Hagi? Listen, if you're offering me food, I'm there.
45:55 Scaachi Koul? Okay.
45:56 Sarah Hagi? You know how many situations I've been in because of a free meal? Or like an hors d'oeuvre?
46:01 Scaachi Koul? Right.
46:01 Sarah Hagi? It's not a meal.
46:02 Scaachi Koul? Okay, so the real moral is that Sarah and I will do anything for a little crudité. A little crunchy crunchy on a tiny plate, we're there.
46:10 Sarah Hagi? You give me tuna tartare on some crunchy thing, I'm there.
46:15 Scaachi Koul? Well, I'll brush my hair for the event.
46:20 Scaachi Koul? Follow Scamfluencers on the Audible app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to all episodes of Scamfluencers ad-free by joining Audible.
46:29 Scaachi Koul? This is Jolo, how to buy friends and influence people. I'm Sachi Cole.
46:34 Sarah Hagi? And I'm Sarah Haggy. If you have a tip for us on a story that you think we should cover, please email us at [email protected] . We use many sources in our research. A few that were particularly helpful were 1MDB, The Inside Story of the World's Biggest Financial Scandal by Ran Deeparamesh in The Guardian, Tom Wright and Bradley Hope's book Billion Dollar Whale, and the New York Times article, Joe Low While Connected in Malaysia Has An Appetite For New York by Louise Story and Stephanie Saul.
47:05 Scaachi Koul? Rachel Borders wrote this episode. Additional writing by us, Sachi Cole and Sarah Haggy. Our senior producer is Jen Swan. Our producer is John Reed. Our associate producers are Charlotte Miller and Lexi Peery. Our story editor and producer is Sarah Enney. Eric Thurm is our story editor. Sound design is by James Morgan. Backtracking by Will Tavlin. Additional audio assistance provided by Adrian Tapia. Our music supervisor is Scott Velazquez for Freeze on Sync. Our coordinating producer is Desi Blaylock. Our managing producer is Matt Gant, and our senior managing producer is Ryan Lor. Kate Young and Olivia Richard are our series producers. Our senior story editor is Rachel B. Doyle. Our senior producer is Ginny Bloom. Our executive producers are Janine Cornolo,
47:45 Speaker 05 Stephanie Jens, Jenny Lauer Beckman and Marshall Louie for Wondery.
47:59 Speaker 05 He lurks in shadow. He slips into dreams. He casts no reflection. Audible presents Bram Stoker's Dracula: How You've Never Heard It Before with a new full cast audio thriller starring Jonathan Bailey as Dracula, Ella Purnell as Mina Harker, and an A-list cast, including Maggie Gyllenhaal as Van Helsing, Amy Lou Wood as Lucy, David Johnson as Dr. Seward, and many more. When Mina's fiance Jonathan Harker vanishes in Transylvania, Mina pieces together letters, diary entries, and chilling testimony to hunt the predator stalking those she loves,
48:40 Speaker 05 only to discover Dracula's already hunting her. Audible's Dracula invites you to welcome literature's most shadowy figure into your home. Listen to the new audiobook adaptation of Bram Stoker's Dracula, only on Audible.
Previous Kyle Sandler: The Alabama Startup Scam | 215 Next ENCORE: Rod Blagojevich: All the Governor’s Men | 217 Page updated October 30, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated