Scams Hitting the Slopes w/ Sam Sanders

Journalism genius and podcast favorite Sam Sanders (Vibe Check, The Sam Sanders Show on KCRW) joins Laci to take down the latest scam hitting the ski slopes. While they may not agree on taking a spin on the ski lift, they’re both all in for cozying up with drinks by the fire and rocking those snow bunny fits. Today’s scheme has it all—Jay Peak, a snowy retreat just 20 minutes from Vermont; Green Cards; mountain makeovers; a man with chilling, soul-piercing eyes; Resorts World; and a sprawling biotech facility set to produce advanced medical devices from dialysis machines to artificial organs. How’s that? Stay schemin'! Check out The Sam Sanders Show on KCRW. Listen to Sam Sings! In honor of Grammy weekend with Billie Eilish’s vocal coach Doug Peck. Sam Sings! with Celebrity Vocal Coach Doug Peck CON-gregation, catch Laci's new TV Show Scam Goddess, now on Freeform and Hulu! Follow on Instagram: Scam Goddess Pod: @scamgoddesspod Laci Mosley: @divalaci Sam Sanders: @samsanders Research by Kathryn Doyle SOURCES https://web.archive.org/web/20241204104720/https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2024/02/05/the-rural-ski-slope-caught-up-in-an-international-scam https://www.skimag.com/ski-resort-life/east-coast/how-jay-peak-owners-defrauded-investors/ https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/28/travel/jay-peak-vermont.html https://www.wcax.com/2022/04/13/kingdom-con-history-vermonts-biggest-fraud-case/ https://www.newenglandskihistory.com/Vermont/jaypeak.php https://www.floridabulldog.org/2018/11/key-biscayne-businessman-orchestrated-200-million-rip-off-against-foreign-investors-seeking-green-cards/ https://pnxborderlaw.com/2018/09/09/sec-files-complaint-against-joel-burstein-for-conduct-related-to-the-jay-peak-eb-5-fraud/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:43Speaker 02

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• 2:30Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess, back with another episode of the podcast all about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Sometimes we love them, sometimes we hate them. Again, I will remind you, this is also still a comedy podcast. Don't know why I have to do that now, but I feel as though. Y'all already know I'm very what? Yes, I'm excited, I'm elated, I'm thrilled. Congregation, we have a friend of the show back in the building. Listen, we got a real journalist today. Y'all know I pretend to be one. That's my scam, okay? I'm doing it on Scam Goddess, the TV show. Am I not doing journalism real good? It seems as though I'm a journalist. I think I am now. I think I went to the School of Life for journalism, but he went to school, actually.

• 3:16Laci Mosley?

  Listen, this is a savvy, intelligent, hilarious king who I fell in love with the second I met him. He's also a fellow Texan, okay? From New Braunfels, to be exact. I don't know if I've ever been to New Braunfels, but I am from Texas, okay?

• 3:31Speaker 04

  I was born there and then I left.

• 3:33Laci Mosley?

  Okay, I'm from Terrell, so it's one of those.

• 3:35Speaker 04

  Oh, okay, yeah.

• 3:36Laci Mosley?

  Me and Jamie Foxx on Wikipedia. That's our claim to fame. You might know him from the awesome podcast, Vibe Check, a weekly podcast where your favorite group chats, they come to life and it's always a vibe. Plus, he has a new entertainment show coming out on KCRW, which just dropped this past Friday, where he got to speak to Billie Eilish, y'all. Billie Eilish's vocal coach, himself.

• 4:01Speaker 04

  Not Billie, just the coach.

• 4:02Laci Mosley?

  Okay, but listen.

• 4:03Speaker 04

  But he had some tricks of the trade.

• 4:04Laci Mosley?

  But who's cooking up the voice, okay? Yes, I'm talking about the one and only Sam Sanders.

• 4:10Speaker 04

  It is so good to be back.

• 4:11Laci Mosley?

  It's so good to have you back.

• 4:13Speaker 04

  You know, since I was on your show the first time, at this point, years ago, we talked about Pastor Gucci.

• 4:18Laci Mosley?

  Yes, we did.

• 4:19Speaker 04

  Never forget. But since then, you came and helped out Vibe Check at a live show we did last summer at the Ford Theater. Such a kiki.

• 4:27Laci Mosley?

  That was such a kiki. It was such a blast.

• 4:29Speaker 04

  It was a good crowd. They all loved you. We're so glad to have you.

• 4:31Laci Mosley?

  Thank you. I had a good ass time. We were dancing, acting a fool, like the crowd was amazing. And since we talked about Pastor Gucci, um, I actually did an episode of Scamglass, the TV show on Bishop Lamore Whitehead.

• 4:42Speaker 04

  Really? What's the latest on him?

• 4:45Laci Mosley?

  So he, right now, he is a guest of the state.

• 4:48Speaker 04

  That's, I love that.

• 4:49Laci Mosley?

  Yes. He's, uh, he's neighbors with, uh, P. Diddy.

• 4:53Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 4:54Laci Mosley?

  He's at, yeah, he's at that same, I actually went and visited that, uh, jail.

• 4:58Speaker 04

  Girl.

• 4:58Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and I mailed him a letter. No word, no word on if he got back.

• 5:03Speaker 04

  That's nice of you.

• 5:05Laci Mosley?

  No, it wasn't like a sweet letter.

• 5:08Laci Mosley?

  It wasn't hate mail, but it wasn't like, hey boo, I know they don't got Gucci in jail, but I hope, you know, no, no, no, it wasn't. It was like, come talk to me, criminal.

• 5:20Laci Mosley?

  It wasn't very, it wasn't mean, but it wasn't nice. Um, but yeah, so right now, he's the guest of the state, and so.

• 5:26Speaker 04

  Is he snitching on, uh, Mayor Adams? Cause they were tight, right?

• 5:29Laci Mosley?

  You know what's interesting is when I did further research in Brooklyn and I was in Canarsie, and I spoke with victims of his, um, it became ever more clear that he was always dropping Mayor Eric Adams' name, which we laughed about on the show and we were kinda like, I don't know if he's really connected. At that time, we didn't know that allegedly Mayor Eric Adams was out here, first of all, being a Turkish city girl.

• 5:52Speaker 04

  Literally whoring himself out for a seat upgrade.

• 5:56Laci Mosley?

  And a nice hotel suite.

• 5:57Speaker 04

  Okay, all right, that makes it a little better.

• 6:00Laci Mosley?

  Okay, that's why you blackmail the fire chief, okay? Cause, cause you know.

• 6:04Speaker 04

  It's so wild. I also found out in reading about Eric Adams, just a sidebar, he still like goes to the club every night.

• 6:10Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah. No, I told, free before 11, Mayor Eric Adams is there, okay?

• 6:16Speaker 04

  Unc should not be at the club.

• 6:18Laci Mosley?

  He's in there popping bottles until.

• 6:20Speaker 04

  Oh, cat daddy.

• 6:22Speaker 04

  Why is he there? Itty-hoo.

• 6:23Laci Mosley?

  He's done, and then even him like walking around with Luigi Mangione in that big perp walk that they did. The fact that he was behind Luigi, I was like, sir, first of all, you have charges. Like you.

• 6:35Speaker 04

  You're fighting some stuff too.

• 6:36Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 6:36Speaker 04

  You got some allegations as well.

• 6:38Laci Mosley?

  You shouldn't really go in there because they may not let you out.

• 6:39Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 6:40Laci Mosley?

  Like, so I don't know why he was like, we're tough on crime. And he actually said some things that were damaging to the state's case because he called Luigi Mangione a murderer and a killer. You can't say that if the person has not been adjudicated.

• 6:51Speaker 04

  It's all alleged.

• 6:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it's all alleged. And it's like, you're the mayor, you dummy. And then he canceled all of his like Martin Luther King Day celebrations in New York so that he could fly to the inauguration.

• 7:03Speaker 04

  Of Trump.

• 7:03Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 7:04Speaker 04

  He's sucking up to him, sure, I'm sure.

• 7:06Laci Mosley?

  He's trying to get one of them pardons.

• 7:08Speaker 04

  You know what? He might get it because Trump would love to do it and then be like, I love the blacks. I love the blacks.

• 7:15Laci Mosley?

  He's the only DEI I like. He's the only good DEI we ever did.

• 7:19Speaker 04

  And Eric would be up there with his little Timu gold chain being like, yeah, boss.

• 7:23Laci Mosley?

  Literally, that man has no squirrels.

• 7:26Speaker 04

  When is Pastor Gucci out?

• 7:28Laci Mosley?

  Um, I think it's episode five.

• 7:32Speaker 04

  No, of, of the state.

• 7:33Laci Mosley?

  Oh.

• 7:37Laci Mosley?

  Now that to be seen.

• 7:40Laci Mosley?

  My episode of his television scam got us to be out on Hulu, you know, maybe this week, but, but as far as.

• 7:45Speaker 04

  Long before he's out.

• 7:46Laci Mosley?

  Long before he's free.

• 7:47Speaker 04

  All right, so your app comes out for sure before he gets out.

• 7:50Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but before he gets freedom. We, we will release it on Freeform.

• 7:53Speaker 04

  I can't wait to watch it.

• 7:53Laci Mosley?

  About his freedom, we don't know.

• 7:55Speaker 04

  Okay, okay.

• 7:57Laci Mosley?

  But, um, yeah, so it's so funny that we, we were talking about him and now he's in jail. But, oh, the last thing I was going to say is that at the time, we were kind of making fun of him always name dropping Eric Adams. But now the more that I see the, the people that Eric hangs with, I'm like, maybe him and Pastor Gucci were friends and he just distanced himself. Because as soon as Diddy went to prison, he took the key to the city back from him and was like, I don't know him. And it's like.

• 8:21Speaker 04

  See now. I just feel like at some point, we're gonna find out more and more about Eric Adams and his just general scam life.

• 8:32Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 8:33Speaker 04

  It feels scammy.

• 8:34Laci Mosley?

  Oh, it is.

• 8:35Speaker 04

  You're the expert. It's scammy, huh?

• 8:36Laci Mosley?

  For sure.

• 8:36Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 8:37Laci Mosley?

  Like, none of it looks above board.

• 8:39Speaker 04

  None.

• 8:39Laci Mosley?

  You know, allegedly. I mean, even when he had that video that we showed where he was like casing the kids' room and telling them where to look for drugs. In a baby doll's butt and a gun under the pillow. It was so unserious.

• 8:52Speaker 04

  It's too much.

• 8:53Laci Mosley?

  He's just such an unserious guy.

• 8:54Speaker 04

  He's an unserious man.

• 8:55Laci Mosley?

  Like, if you're at the club at that age.

• 8:56Speaker 04

  Come on now.

• 8:57Laci Mosley?

  Papa, what are you doing in the club?

• 8:58Speaker 04

  Nothing good happening for you.

• 8:59Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 9:00Speaker 04

  Nothing good.

• 9:00Laci Mosley?

  And then women don't want you. I remember being in a club at that age and like if we saw like a 50-year-old or like somebody, you know, of that age.

• 9:07Speaker 04

  All they can do is buy you a drink. That's all you're gonna let them do.

• 9:09Laci Mosley?

  And, and we would only go, we weren't even taking drinks. You had to have bottle service. We would come stand, be beautiful by your table, drink the horrible alcohol with pineapple juice. And then once you ran out of, you were next to the next table.

• 9:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, listen.

• 9:21Laci Mosley?

  We're not going home with you, Mark.

• 9:23Speaker 04

  Listen, I'm 40, so I'm like unc-adjacent. I already know the rules. I don't go out past 9:00 unless there's seats at the place.

• 9:33Laci Mosley?

  I mean, you look so good, though. I feel like you could still be out here in the street.

• 9:36Speaker 04

  My godson calls me unc, so I'm like, you know what?

• 9:38Laci Mosley?

  Oh, he wrong for that.

• 9:39Speaker 04

  And my thing is like, I should not be anywhere after 9:00 PM where I can't sit down.

• 9:44Laci Mosley?

  Big facts.

• 9:46Speaker 04

  I'll go if I can sit, but if I gotta stand around these 20-somethings in stilettos.

• 9:51Laci Mosley?

  And the age range needs to be similar to mine. Like, I'm not close, I'm not 40 yet, I'm not close yet, but, you know, I'm not, I'm also not 22.

• 9:59Speaker 04

  There you go, right?

• 10:00Laci Mosley?

  You know what I mean? So like, if the girlies are in there giving like, we just got out of college, I don't need to be here.

• 10:04Speaker 04

  Yeah. Like, I am, I'm, I'm, I'm done with club energy. I want lounge energy, cause that implies seating. But what I really like now, I ain't got no kids, but I love it when my friends with kids invite me to like the bars that also just have like a little fucking playground.

• 10:20Laci Mosley?

  Millennials need help.

• 10:21Speaker 04

  That's all. All of my white friends who are parents of young kids, all they wanna do is take that toddler to a bar and have other friends join them while they drink and watch.

• 10:30Laci Mosley?

  The bar having childcare is wild.

• 10:31Speaker 04

  They love it. It is a high art in Los Angeles.

• 10:34Laci Mosley?

  Of course they love it, but I'm still like bringing the baby in the bar.

• 10:38Speaker 04

  High art in Los Angeles. You know that Firestone bar on La Brea? It used to be a Firestone tire shop. Now it's a big old bar and they have skee ball machines there. I go there a lot because I like skee ball. I saw some people there. It's a bunch of adults and some dude had brought his like five year old and just let her run feral. She was climbing up the skee ball machines.

• 10:59Laci Mosley?

  Cheating.

• 10:59Speaker 04

  She was looking for pins to write on the windows.

• 11:01Laci Mosley?

  That's a baby criminal.

• 11:02Speaker 04

  And he was like, I don't give a fuck. I'm drinking, I'm drinking my IPA.

• 11:06Laci Mosley?

  He was like, she'll be fine.

• 11:06Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 11:07Laci Mosley?

  She takes care of herself, okay?

• 11:09Speaker 04

  Anywho, that's my energy right now.

• 11:11Laci Mosley?

  Well, Sam, we always ask, I mean, I think we kind of got into it, but like, what is your relationship with scams? Do you love them? You hate them? Is there anything you're fixated on right now? Have you run any you can talk about? It could be anything.

• 11:20Speaker 04

  I am, my energy right now in 2025, post-Trump inauguration and Trump 2.0 is just radical acceptance of all things. And what I'm trying to practice radical acceptance around right now is the fact that like, a lot of the American government and federal government as we know it, that was low key a scam and Trump is just pointing that out.

• 11:42Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he's just taking advantage of it.

• 11:44Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 11:45Laci Mosley?

  In a louder way than other people have. You know, we, we see Nancy Pelosi sell nothing facts. We know she's been doing that forever. Everybody, everybody used to just be classier about their crime. And now he's just like, no, I'm doing crime. Buy my meme coin two days before the inauguration.

• 11:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 12:00Laci Mosley?

  We're criminals. What's up?

• 12:01Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, and what he's done that I find so remarkable, because I used to cover politics. I covered him in the 2016 election and I was on the road chasing Bernie and then Hillary and Trump. And I remember the narrative around his first term was like, well, you know, he's not going to be able to supersede like the laws and the constitutions and the rules. And what he's proven is that most of the time, rules are just norms.

• 12:30Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 12:30Speaker 04

  They're suggestions.

• 12:32Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 12:32Speaker 04

  They're suggestions.

• 12:33Laci Mosley?

  It's a social contract.

• 12:34Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 12:35Laci Mosley?

  That we've all decided that we were going to abide by to have a society. But scammers are always like, look, I didn't make that up and I don't want to abide by it.

• 12:42Speaker 04

  There you go.

• 12:43Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 12:44Speaker 04

  And like, he is a, he, he's just playing chicken. With every law ever written down in American history. And you know what? He's good at playing chicken.

• 12:54Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 12:55Speaker 04

  Because he ain't got no sense.

• 12:56Laci Mosley?

  Not at all.

• 12:57Speaker 04

  He won't stop.

• 12:57Laci Mosley?

  No, never.

• 12:58Speaker 04

  He won't stop. Anywho, so I'm just like, accepting the scamification of our government right now and being like, you know what? It is what it is. I don't want everyone to feel the awful effects of what might happen.

• 13:12Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 13:12Speaker 04

  But a lot of folks who thought he was gonna lower their price of eggs, thought he was gonna help them.

• 13:18Laci Mosley?

  Real quick.

• 13:19Speaker 04

  Like, get ready.

• 13:20Laci Mosley?

  We were just talking about that. I mean, I feel like you're, what'd you got, radical acceptance?

• 13:26Speaker 04

  Radical acceptance.

• 13:26Laci Mosley?

  I call it choosing delusion for myself. It's like, I just can't deal with this right now. I'm choosing delusion. And y'all know on this podcast, I like to let y'all be delulu so we won't live in the reality of life for too much, you know? Let's all escape with scammers.

• 13:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's enough for Trump. Let's deep breathe it out.

• 13:45Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Breathe in the scam, exhale the gun. Okay?

• 13:53Laci Mosley?

  We're all just gonna, you know, touch grass. Literally, I've been rubbing so much grass, so many different types, Kentucky blue. You know, even crab grass, I don't discriminate, you know? You know? Get out there, pick a flower. Yes, it's a weed, but it looks like a flower to me.

• 14:08Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 14:08Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, that's what we're doing. We're choosing delusion.

• 14:11Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 14:12Laci Mosley?

  Everything's fine.

• 14:13Speaker 04

  Everything's fine. Listen, I have my little auto donations set up for the groups that are in the fight. And I told all my friends, let me know when it's time to march and put them pussy hats back on. But until then.

• 14:25Laci Mosley?

  Oh, you put on the coochie hat? Oh, y'all not catching me in the coochie can go. I won't be there. I will not be there.

• 14:33Speaker 04

  I wanna do it for one selfie and then take it off. I need one selfie of it.

• 14:39Laci Mosley?

  I'm actively not gonna be there. I want you to know, I chose not to go. I want you to know I was available.

• 14:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 14:44Laci Mosley?

  I'mma drive past it. And be like, "Look at me not going."

• 14:50Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 14:50Laci Mosley?

  No. I gotta check out. Look, as a black woman who's been black womaning for a long time.

• 14:56Speaker 04

  And y'all told us.

• 14:58Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, y'all got it for a few years.

• 15:00Speaker 04

  You, y'all can let someone else carry that baton for a while.

• 15:02Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and y'all, I believe in you. You know, that's why, do I give you a motivational speech, okay? I'm gonna read what Viola Davis said in The Help. "You is kind, you is smart, you is important." You know, "You is coochie, get out there, fight, fight for your right, okay?" And I'll be supporting you from afar.

• 15:20Speaker 04

  From afar.

• 15:21Laci Mosley?

  With vibes and manifestation.

• 15:23Speaker 04

  We like that.

• 15:24Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I'mma burn Insta on Instagram Live, and that's how y'all gonna know I support you.

• 15:30Speaker 04

  Listen, stay safe at the house.

• 15:31Laci Mosley?

  Listen.

• 15:32Speaker 04

  Stay safe at the house.

• 15:33Laci Mosley?

  The house is becoming the safest place, okay? Because every time I look outside, I'm like, "Oh, no."

• 15:38Speaker 04

  Especially in LA. Let's, okay, let's not even go there.

• 15:40Laci Mosley?

  Anyway, child, again, choosing delusion. We're all choosing delusion, okay? Sky.

• 15:48Speaker 05

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• 17:21Laci Mosley?

  So let's get into our first segment here, historic hoodwink. This is where I will regale Sam with a famous con, caper group of criminals. We'll see what they're up to. And speaking about choosing delusion, we're going to talk about one of the most delusional activities that only a certain sector of the population really does, unless you live in the area, you know what I mean? So we're talking about how the US government seized control of two snowy mountains from perpetrators of the Kingdom Con, the biggest fraud in ski industry history. So scams are now hitting the slopes.

• 17:56Speaker 04

  For me, skiing is just a world that I'll never know about.

• 18:00Laci Mosley?

  I want to know so about.

• 18:02Speaker 04

  When I was a kid, I found out that Sonny Bono died while skiing.

• 18:06Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, them trees begin, people.

• 18:07Speaker 04

  He just skied into a tree. And as soon as I found that out, I said, well, I'll never do that.

• 18:10Laci Mosley?

  Liam Neeson's wife went out the same way.

• 18:12Speaker 04

  And I never have. You ain't never seen me on a motherfucking, oh, can I?

• 18:15Laci Mosley?

  Yes, of course.

• 18:17Speaker 04

  It's not gonna happen.

• 18:18Laci Mosley?

  I mean, but like, the accidents are, they're not high, but when you hear about a famous person, yeah. I just don't feel like I'm gonna ever be professional enough to be on like a real slope. I go on the bunny slope, where you know what I do? I would get like a real like fire-ass Montclair fit. And I would get the skis and I'd be out in the snow.

• 18:38Speaker 04

  Get your pictures.

• 18:39Laci Mosley?

  And I'd give the girl some wushes, some wushes. And I'd be like, move the camera so it look like I'm wushing. And then I'd take that shit off and go inside by the fire. Like, no.

• 18:45Speaker 04

  See, all I want is like, the cozy cardigan to be by the fire all day.

• 18:49Laci Mosley?

  Just two-handing my cup.

• 18:51Speaker 04

  Drinking some strong Irish coffee, getting fucked the fuck up by that fire.

• 18:55Laci Mosley?

  Just sipping it so slow.

• 18:56Speaker 04

  No, girl, gurgling it, drinking it.

• 18:58Laci Mosley?

  Oh, gurgling? No, you gotta sip it slow and sit here at the crackling fire and think about your life.

• 19:02Speaker 04

  True, true, true.

• 19:03Laci Mosley?

  You gotta think about how richness is hurting you.

• 19:07Speaker 04

  It's so painful, this richness.

• 19:11Laci Mosley?

  Okay, listen, y'all don't know my problems. As a Richie.

• 19:16Speaker 04

  As a Richie.

• 19:17Laci Mosley?

  So, the scams have hit the slopes. So, we're talking about this old ski spot. So, Jay Peak is a snowy mountain in Vermont, 20 minutes from the Canadian border. And they opened for skiing in 1957. And people see, that's the kind of slope I'm talking about. I would never be on that slope. That's the slope with the, look, that's the slope with the murder trees.

• 19:38Speaker 04

  Oh, that's it? Oh, yeah, that's too steep.

• 19:40Laci Mosley?

  No, I make one wrong move.

• 19:41Speaker 04

  No, no, no, no, no. Trees will cut you.

• 19:44Laci Mosley?

  No, no, no, no, no, no.

• 19:45Speaker 04

  There's no guardrails. There's no seatbelts.

• 19:49Laci Mosley?

  See.

• 19:49Speaker 04

  There's no bumpers on the side.

• 19:51Laci Mosley?

  I understand this as a white people activity, though, because when y'all leave the house, it's not as dangerous for y'all. I leave the house, I get in my car, I'm like, I hope I come back. I get pulled over, I'm like, ooh, I hope they don't kill me.

• 20:01Speaker 04

  And let me tell you what feels like a Jordan Peele movie. The, like, black ski weekends.

• 20:07Laci Mosley?

  You know they stay in the house. They're in the house playing King Cup and, and, and spades. And they take that one picture, like I said, in the Montclair.

• 20:16Speaker 04

  In the Montclair, then they're back inside.

• 20:17Laci Mosley?

  And then they're back inside. Okay, they're not hitting the slopes.

• 20:21Speaker 04

  I didn't do my hair for this shit.

• 20:22Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 20:22Speaker 04

  A helmet? No.

• 20:23Laci Mosley?

  No, they're not snowboarding. Not hanging ten. No, their asses is in the house, they just want to tell people they black and they can get to the ski place.

• 20:31Speaker 04

  That said, if anyone listening is planning a black ski weekend, invite me and I can sit in the cabin the whole time.

• 20:36Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 20:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, pay our way.

• 20:38Laci Mosley?

  The last time I saw, like, a black, and it almost was like, it was black and gay ski weekend, they were in the house playing their own game of traitors. They were not skiing.

• 20:45Speaker 04

  They were not skiing.

• 20:46Laci Mosley?

  I never saw a video of them skiing.

• 20:48Speaker 04

  Come on, no, they weren't skiing. They get it.

• 20:50Laci Mosley?

  They might get on a lift to really, like, give the girls a moment. But then they gonna wait till they lift circle all the way back.

• 20:56Speaker 04

  All the way back down.

• 20:56Laci Mosley?

  And they gonna get off, and they gonna go home.

• 20:58Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 20:59Laci Mosley?

  You know, I'm sure some of y'all are out there, like, really skiing.

• 21:02Speaker 04

  There's like one black skier who's like, nah! I'm like, okay. Good for you.

• 21:06Laci Mosley?

  Good for you.

• 21:07Speaker 04

  Bless it.

• 21:08Laci Mosley?

  Good for you. He's probably adopted. He got two white parents. Like, he's not really one of us. But you know, you still black if you adopt a used to a black, but if you out there skiing like that, you know. And good for you. Good for you for going through life with less worries.

• 21:22Speaker 04

  We are limitless. We can do whatever we want to do.

• 21:24Laci Mosley?

  We contain multitudes.

• 21:25Speaker 04

  Yeah. I don't contain that multitude, but you do, and good for you, sir.

• 21:29Laci Mosley?

  And for the large population of this audience that is white, don't you take this information nowhere else, okay? These are not stereotypes that you can now proliferate, okay?

• 21:37Speaker 04

  We can say it, you cannot.

• 21:38Laci Mosley?

  You never heard any of this.

• 21:39Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 21:39Laci Mosley?

  Fast forward, we gonna put a note in, in the footnotes.

• 21:43Speaker 04

  And if you ever see me on a ski, a ski slope, no, you didn't.

• 21:47Laci Mosley?

  No, you didn't.

• 21:48Speaker 04

  No, you didn't. Yeah.

• 21:50Laci Mosley?

  Listen, you just, you saw nothing.

• 21:53Laci Mosley?

  So, um, this place opened in 1957, and people started skiing the cute craggy summit in the mid 60s using a new chairlift and Vermont's only tramway, which was cutting edge at the time, right? This is like 57, right? So this is like 60s and 70s and like, you know, you got hippies out doing the summer of love. And then I guess you got like bougie people doing the winter of ski.

• 22:16Speaker 04

  Winter of ski.

• 22:18Laci Mosley?

  So in the 1970s, the Hotel J opened with 48 slope side rooms.

• 22:24Speaker 04

  That's cute.

• 22:25Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, that's cute, right? You got a little view. That's where I would be inside. Real ski bums knew and loved the mountain, but it was located in Vermont's Northeast Kingdom, a chronically impoverished area, not exactly a luxury getaway like Aspen. So this was like, they said ski bum, so remember when I said like, either you live in the area and you ski, or you're rich and you ski, there's really no in-between?

• 22:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:47Laci Mosley?

  So I'm figuring ski bums are like, you know, real ski heads. I feel like they like lube they boards up every night with, with the ski lube.

• 22:55Speaker 04

  They're in it. It's like the same energy as dudes who like live on a houseboat year round.

• 23:01Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 23:02Speaker 04

  They're, they're, they're committed to the bit.

• 23:05Laci Mosley?

  And like, there are people who come in and surf and they're doing it like very expensive like, but the houseboat guy, you know, he out there tanning as fuck because he always in the sun.

• 23:13Speaker 04

  Always.

• 23:13Laci Mosley?

  And he, you know, lubing up his, his boards.

• 23:16Speaker 04

  May have a job, may not, doesn't matter.

• 23:18Laci Mosley?

  Doesn't matter.

• 23:18Speaker 04

  Doesn't matter.

• 23:19Laci Mosley?

  He's not clocking in nowhere.

• 23:20Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 23:20Laci Mosley?

  Hair long as fuck.

• 23:21Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 23:22Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, barefoot as hell and, and tan is all get out. So these are real ski bums who love this mountain, but they know it's kind of like a little ratchet.

• 23:31Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:31Laci Mosley?

  It's not Aspen.

• 23:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 23:33Laci Mosley?

  So in 1984, Jay's Peak, like the owner of it, brought ski enthusiast Bill Stenger on as a resort general manager. So he's got this 48, you know, view like hotel, slope side rooms. Now he brings on this guy, Bill Stenger. And he just looks like.

• 23:51Speaker 04

  He could scam something.

• 23:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he also just looks like one of those guys who's like an active participant in the church, but then one day he might be a family annihilator. You just, you know, or like, or he got like a secret in the basement.

• 24:05Speaker 04

  There's a secret somewhere.

• 24:06Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he's not an annihilator. They tend to have like more Cro-Magnon for his like little more exercise. It's given like something in the basement that they find and they, yeah. But they were like, he was always active in the church and yeah.

• 24:17Speaker 04

  I bet he was.

• 24:18Laci Mosley?

  So for the next 20 years, Bill became obsessed with an ambitious redesign that would make the resort viable year round, even when the snow melted in the summer. So this could bring tourist dollars to the area and keep him from laying off seasonal workers.

• 24:32Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 24:33Laci Mosley?

  Because they care so much about the seasonal workers.

• 24:35Speaker 04

  They care so much.

• 24:36Laci Mosley?

  They hate laying them off.

• 24:37Speaker 04

  We hate it.

• 24:38Laci Mosley?

  My god.

• 24:40Speaker 04

  It hurts us more than it hurts you.

• 24:41Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, we would keep you on year round if there was a way for us to make way more money than you ever do.

• 24:48Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

• 24:49Laci Mosley?

  So by the early 2000s, Jay Peak Resort was renowned among hardcore skiers for its deep snow and tough slopes. But the amenities were dated and needed refurbishment stat. So they started getting more skiers because they were like, oh, the people really hitting trees over here because.

• 25:06Laci Mosley?

  I feel like they-

• 25:07Speaker 04

  This is that tree shit.

• 25:08Laci Mosley?

  I feel like they heard about people hitting trees and they were like, that's where we need to go.

• 25:12Speaker 04

  We need to do that.

• 25:13Laci Mosley?

  We tired of these bunny slopes at Aspen.

• 25:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, I want danger.

• 25:15Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, we're real skiing girls, okay?

• 25:17Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 25:18Laci Mosley?

  If I don't see three ambulances when I pull up, I'm not skiing there.

• 25:23Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 25:24Laci Mosley?

  So one news account called the area shabby, unchic, and seedy.

• 25:29Speaker 04

  Seedy? Oh, no.

• 25:32Laci Mosley?

  Very rude, very nasty.

• 25:34Speaker 04

  Drag them, yeah.

• 25:34Laci Mosley?

  I feel like once you say shabby and unchic, you really don't have to throw in seedy, like you already kicking them.

• 25:38Speaker 04

  We get it, you got us, yeah.

• 25:40Laci Mosley?

  And nasty.

• 25:42Speaker 04

  Nasty.

• 25:44Laci Mosley?

  Filthy rotten, like it's okay, we get it.

• 25:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 25:47Laci Mosley?

  Ah, so every few years, Bill found an investor for his dream mountain Reno project, right? Usually like a Canadian banker who liked to ski, but every time the investment would fall through. So he's probably finding like a hardcore skier who's like in the nasty, seedy-

• 26:03Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 26:04Laci Mosley?

  Lounge at a hotel.

• 26:05Speaker 04

  Mm.

• 26:05Laci Mosley?

  And they're, and they're, they're guzzling their Irish whiskey.

• 26:08Speaker 04

  There you go.

• 26:09Laci Mosley?

  And he's got him, he's got him on the second guzzle.

• 26:11Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 26:12Laci Mosley?

  And he's like, you know, you could get a part of this place, man.

• 26:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:15Laci Mosley?

  You know, this place is hardcore.

• 26:16Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:17Laci Mosley?

  It's real.

• 26:17Speaker 04

  Trees, you hit them.

• 26:19Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. You saw, you saw how many ambulances we had outside. Get in on the ground floor.

• 26:23Speaker 04

  Live on the edge.

• 26:25Laci Mosley?

  Literally.

• 26:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 26:26Laci Mosley?

  People are going off it all the time.

• 26:27Speaker 04

  Uh-huh.

• 26:29Laci Mosley?

  So, you know, then they're like, oh, I'm, I'm interested, but every time he would kind of get them to that point, the investment money would like fall through. But Bill kept trying. And then finally he figured out the key to easy investor money in an economically depressed area was cash for green cards.

• 26:48Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 26:49Laci Mosley?

  We've heard of cars for kids, we have cash for green cards.

• 26:53Speaker 04

  That, that turned bleak real quick. Woo!

• 26:58Laci Mosley?

  He's like, this investing thing isn't working. Okay, let's skip to something else. He pivoted hard.

• 27:03Speaker 04

  He really did.

• 27:04Laci Mosley?

  He pivoted like them slopes dudes. That's why people fly out of them.

• 27:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:08Laci Mosley?

  So Bill raised money using EB5 visa programs, which channeled foreign investments into businesses that created jobs for Americans. So especially like in rural or poor parts of the country. So they were trying to use this to build up those areas by, you know, if you want to move to like the rusty, dusty, seedy, shabby, unchic place. We'll let you be a citizen and we'll give you some money.

• 27:34Laci Mosley?

  So for $500,000 in 2008, which today has been raised to $900,000. $40,000, yeah.

• 27:42Speaker 04

  Inflation, y'all. They're right. The eggs are too damn expensive. It's the inflation.

• 27:46Laci Mosley?

  It's the inflation.

• 27:47Speaker 04

  It's real.

• 27:48Laci Mosley?

  That's why it just costs more to come here now because of the eggs. Don't think about it too hard.

• 27:53Speaker 04

  I can't. I can't. I had eggs today and was like, should I be doing this?

• 27:57Laci Mosley?

  Are you rich?

• 27:58Speaker 04

  Girl, them eggs was... No, those eggs had been in my trunk.

• 28:01Laci Mosley?

  Are you some sort of bearin?

• 28:02Speaker 04

  Those eggs had been in my fridge before Trump got elected.

• 28:05Laci Mosley?

  Yo, Rich, lock the door. We finna rob Sam. We finna rob Sam.

• 28:10Laci Mosley?

  You came in and talked about, oh, I had eggs.

• 28:12Speaker 04

  I had eggs.

• 28:13Laci Mosley?

  Oh, were they poached? You throw a little caviar on top?

• 28:16Speaker 04

  Girl, I'm country. I scramble my eggs in bacon grease. That's what I do. That's what I do.

• 28:21Laci Mosley?

  He's got money for the grease of the pig as well.

• 28:26Laci Mosley?

  Okay, we know who we're dealing with now. You know you can't get out of this building without a key.

• 28:31Speaker 04

  Oh, my God.

• 28:33Laci Mosley?

  I'm gonna just walk you to your car.

• 28:34Speaker 04

  Just be on the safe side.

• 28:35Laci Mosley?

  I just want, just on the safe side.

• 28:36Speaker 04

  Looking out for me. Looking out for me.

• 28:37Laci Mosley?

  Always looking out for you.

• 28:38Speaker 04

  Always.

• 28:39Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You walk in front. I walk in back. Because I got your back.

• 28:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 28:43Laci Mosley?

  Not just because that's probably where you keep your wallet, but just that, you know, I'm helping you out, Mr. Mr. Incredible Edible Egg. So I can't believe that he came out as a rich guy for eating eggs whenever he wants. So basically now it's $900,000 and foreign investors and their families become eligible for green cards as long as that money succeeds in creating at least 10 jobs.

• 29:09Speaker 04

  American jobs.

• 29:10Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 29:10Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 29:11Laci Mosley?

  So essentially they pay to cut to the front of the line at US immigration. Since 1990, 10,000 green cards have been set aside each year for people willing to invest. And recently, the program really started to pop off.

• 29:26Speaker 04

  So basically, if you are rich and not from America, if you promise to invest in a business that puts jobs in rural America, you can just cut the line?

• 29:36Laci Mosley?

  Yes, because it makes investors and their families like, so it's like basically chain and immigration is our whole family would be able to come over. You're eligible for the green card if you pay this amount of money and you promise that you're going to create at least 10 jobs.

• 29:49Speaker 04

  Oh, so you pay the government a flat fee and then you promise to invest in this case in the ski slope thing? Okay, interesting.

• 29:57Laci Mosley?

  Yes. So in 2015, the developers behind Manhattan's Hudson Yards raised at least 1.2 billion in EB5 financing for their luxury shopping mall condos and office tower. You've seen that place.

• 30:12Speaker 04

  An abomination.

• 30:13Laci Mosley?

  It's very ugly.

• 30:14Speaker 04

  What is it? There's a name for it. What is it called?

• 30:17Laci Mosley?

  Ugly?

• 30:18Speaker 04

  Hudson's Yards is cursed. It's cursed.

• 30:21Laci Mosley?

  Why did they make it like that?

• 30:22Speaker 04

  Tell me what that's called, though, because I want listeners to be able to Google it.

• 30:25Laci Mosley?

  It's like honeycomb?

• 30:26Speaker 04

  It's like an alien contraption. The vessel. Hideous. Listeners, Google it right now. The vessel, Hudson Yards. I want to run away from it.

• 30:35Laci Mosley?

  Were they trying to be ironic because it's like aliens, like like they're trying to be like illegal aliens?

• 30:39Speaker 04

  Something, something. Anywho, anywho.

• 30:42Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it's hideous. Um, but so it's the most expensive real estate development in US history at the time. A Waldorf Astoria was completed in Beverly Hills using EB5 financing as well.

• 30:54Speaker 04

  Really?

• 30:54Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. And a Chinese themed hotel complex and casino called Resorts World went up in Las Vegas.

• 31:02Speaker 04

  Girl, that's where I saw Katy Perry a few years ago.

• 31:04Laci Mosley?

  She would be there. Every time there's a scam, Katy Perry is somewhere nearby. I'm not even joking.

• 31:11Speaker 04

  You know she got into it with the Catholic nuns over real estate, twice?

• 31:15Laci Mosley?

  Oh, and do you also know that when they were doing that Leggins Lulu LaRoe scam?

• 31:20Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 31:21Laci Mosley?

  She was performing at the Lulu LaRoe.

• 31:23Speaker 04

  What? Oh, she's.

• 31:25Laci Mosley?

  Katy Perry loves the crime check.

• 31:26Speaker 04

  She's caught up in it. She's caught up in it.

• 31:28Laci Mosley?

  She said, "Make it to cash."

• 31:31Laci Mosley?

  And I'll be there like a firework.

• 31:36Laci Mosley?

  She always somewhere nearby. I'm gonna just start assuming she's there.

• 31:39Speaker 04

  I will say, it's a good show. It's a good show.

• 31:43Laci Mosley?

  She got my nerves now. But I have seen her live earlier in her career.

• 31:46Speaker 04

  Early Katy's great Katy, but then you realize a lot of early Katy was also a scam because all of her big kitchen back in the day, Dr. Luke.

• 31:54Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 31:56Speaker 04

  Yeah. Let's move on from that real quick. Oi, oi.

• 31:59Laci Mosley?

  And fast. Back to the delusion. So this Las Vegas project was financed through almost a billion dollars in EB-5 funding. In 2016, Jared Kushner's family used the program to build a 50-story Trump branded luxury apartment building in New Jersey.

• 32:19Speaker 04

  I would not trust the 50th floor of a Trump building.

• 32:22Laci Mosley?

  Hell, no.

• 32:23Speaker 04

  That's a little, it was ugly, too.

• 32:24Laci Mosley?

  You know it's ugly. You know it's gold.

• 32:26Speaker 04

  Oof, oof.

• 32:28Laci Mosley?

  Like, he's like, I don't know, like, like if Liberace was just somehow.

• 32:35Speaker 04

  Trump has big Liberace energy.

• 32:36Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but worse.

• 32:38Speaker 04

  Yeah. Did you watch The Apprentice? The movie?

• 32:40Laci Mosley?

  I did not watch the movie. I did watch the sh- okay.

• 32:43Speaker 04

  The movie's good because it shows you that, like, all of Trump's come up was with the gays.

• 32:49Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 32:49Speaker 04

  The queens taught him all he knows. It's kind of hilarious.

• 32:52Laci Mosley?

  But at the same time, like, we have better taste than this.

• 32:55Speaker 04

  That's true.

• 32:55Laci Mosley?

  Like, this, we would have told you no to this penile shape, this gold penis building. Like, what were you thinking?

• 33:02Speaker 04

  What were you thinking?

• 33:03Laci Mosley?

  He was like, "They're gonna love it. It's gold. Looks like a penis. They're gonna love to stay here. In my gold penis. Everyone stays here. They love it. So good. Best penis ever. That's gold."

• 33:15Laci Mosley?

  By 2006, Bill had raised 18 million dollars from EB-5 investors for job creating programs at the ski resort, but hadn't gotten it off the ground yet.

• 33:25Speaker 04

  So he takes in all this money, but he has yet to actually hire anybody for these jobs?

• 33:28Laci Mosley?

  Okay, but we'll be working on it.

• 33:30Speaker 04

  Okay, allegedly.

• 33:31Laci Mosley?

  Allegedly.

• 33:31Speaker 04

  Allegedly.

• 33:32Laci Mosley?

  Okay, you know, you gotta get the money first.

• 33:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 33:35Laci Mosley?

  You get a green cards.

• 33:36Speaker 04

  Uh huh.

• 33:37Laci Mosley?

  And then once you get the money, then you're working on it.

• 33:39Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 33:40Laci Mosley?

  You know how, you know how these things work.

• 33:42Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 33:42Laci Mosley?

  So here's Bill selling the dream of green card investments at Jay Peak, which is the mountain.

• 33:48Speaker 07

  If an EB-5 visa is something that you're interested in for yourself or your family, there's no better regional center in the United States to associate with than the Vermont Regional Center.

• 33:57Speaker 04

  He was selling it.

• 33:58Laci Mosley?

  He was selling it. He looks legit. He's out in the snow. He's like, it's really a ski center. Um, and if you're looking for this visa, no better place.

• 34:08Speaker 04

  That's insane.

• 34:10Laci Mosley?

  When the resort's owner suddenly died, Bill saw his opening and set out to find a new buyer for the resort, someone who would share his vision for the future of the mountain. So remember, he was brought on, but he was never the owner of the resort. He was just trying to get the funding because he wanted to like update it so it wasn't gonna be unchic no more.

• 34:30Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 34:30Laci Mosley?

  And nasty.

• 34:31Speaker 04

  Make it year round, all that stuff, yeah.

• 34:32Laci Mosley?

  And seated.

• 34:33Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 34:34Laci Mosley?

  So when the owner dies, Bill's like, I see an opportunity.

• 34:39Speaker 04

  Cause you know, scammers always the opportunity. Yeah, that's my first thought. Oh, they passed. What can I get?

• 34:48Laci Mosley?

  That is horrible.

• 34:49Speaker 04

  It's kind of horrible.

• 34:50Laci Mosley?

  He had the funeral plotting. He's just there shaking hands like, yeah, this is so sad. You want my business card? Oh my gosh, I'm torn apart. Yeah, so we've got all these EB-5 visas that you could really get involved in. You know what would really honor his legacy? Is if you invested in Jay Peak.

• 35:07Speaker 04

  Mm hmm.

• 35:08Laci Mosley?

  That's actually what he told me when he died, is that he wanted.

• 35:10Speaker 04

  His last words in the hospital.

• 35:12Laci Mosley?

  Get more investors at the funeral. That's what he said.

• 35:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 35:16Laci Mosley?

  I've literally gotten an email like that before. Y'all know if you really are OG listeners to the podcast. I told y'all when my scam dentist died, they sent out an email. And in the same email, it was like, he died, but he would want y'all to keep y'all's cleanings. Um, that was what he would have wanted.

• 35:29Speaker 04

  That's what he would have wanted.

• 35:31Laci Mosley?

  That's true, that's what he was thinking about.

• 35:32Speaker 04

  Listen, listen.

• 35:33Laci Mosley?

  I never went back, but I'll never forget that email. I'm like, you can't tell me that he died in the same email telling me to keep my appointment. What's wrong with y'all?

• 35:39Speaker 04

  Come on, come on now.

• 35:40Laci Mosley?

  What's wrong with y'all?

• 35:41Speaker 04

  That's rough.

• 35:42Laci Mosley?

  So disgusting.

• 35:46Speaker 05

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• 37:20Laci Mosley?

  So, the buyer he finds turns out to be a pretty gnarly dude. So gnarly is like ski slang, okay? So, buying J-Peak with its own money. So we have Ariel Kyros. This is Ariel Kyros.

• 37:37Speaker 04

  Oh, those eyes look...

• 37:38Laci Mosley?

  Those eyes are...

• 37:39Speaker 04

  Those eyes scare me.

• 37:40Laci Mosley?

  They're also like so magnetic, though.

• 37:43Speaker 04

  That's a word for it.

• 37:43Laci Mosley?

  They're kind of like ocean ass.

• 37:46Speaker 04

  What ocean?

• 37:49Speaker 04

  The Antarctic?

• 37:52Speaker 04

  Oh my god.

• 37:53Laci Mosley?

  Those eyes are definitely steal your soul. We can't look at them too long. Cause I feel like I just made a deal with the devil.

• 37:58Speaker 04

  It's like looking at Prince. You can't do it too long or he'll get you.

• 38:00Laci Mosley?

  He'll get you. Yeah, no, no, no, no. But also, I'm like, what does my soul entail if I do sell it to you, Mr. Eye Man?

• 38:06Speaker 04

  How much is my soul worth?

• 38:07Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, cause in these times, I might need to go ahead and say that.

• 38:11Speaker 04

  He is wearing the J Peak vest, which is kinda cute.

• 38:15Laci Mosley?

  He looks like he's legit.

• 38:16Speaker 04

  You know?

• 38:17Laci Mosley?

  The eyeballs are not giving it to me. Yeah, he can't, he can't look at people in the face like that. Get him off the screen. Oh my goodness. So this is Ariel Kuros, right? He owned a condo near J Peak, that mountain. He never really went skiing, but he did project an air of wealth. Maybe through his eyeballs. I don't know. So Ariel grew up in Harlem.

• 38:40Speaker 04

  He did? Huh. Okay. Interesting.

• 38:46Laci Mosley?

  And he said that as a child, he sold Chicklets gum to classmates to make money.

• 38:51Speaker 04

  Scammer.

• 38:52Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. I've always said that on the show.

• 38:53Speaker 04

  If you got it in you, you got it in you. If you're selling snacks in school.

• 38:56Laci Mosley?

  Scammer.

• 38:58Speaker 04

  In the same way that like, boys who like, fuck with animals when they're kids, they're gonna be a serial killer. If you, if you're selling Chicklets to your classmates, you're gonna be a scammer.

• 39:09Laci Mosley?

  Yes. If you're selling anything at school, Hot Cheetos, gum, lemonade on the street. Why do you see your school as a business opportunity?

• 39:18Speaker 04

  Also, where are the parents?

• 39:22Laci Mosley?

  Why are you taking your baby, have you not noticed that you take your baby to Costco every other week? And then all of a sudden, they're out of everything that you bought?

• 39:29Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah. It's wild.

• 39:32Laci Mosley?

  That's why they have two working parents.

• 39:34Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 39:34Laci Mosley?

  Probably a few siblings, so they're not paying attention. Ooh, it's definitely divorced parents.

• 39:38Speaker 04

  And the other one can't tell, and he just tells both parents, well, I need Chicklets. Momma did, Momma did get it for me.

• 39:43Laci Mosley?

  And it's definitely giving like guilty divorced dad who like, he takes his kid to the park so people can see him with the kids.

• 39:49Speaker 04

  Just gave the kid his Costco card. He's like, go on, girl.

• 39:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, just go in there.

• 39:52Speaker 04

  Just go. Just do what you gotta do.

• 39:54Laci Mosley?

  Have fun. I'll pick you up in a bit. I got a date.

• 39:55Speaker 04

  Whatever mom says about me isn't true. I love you.

• 39:58Laci Mosley?

  I love you.

• 39:59Speaker 04

  It wasn't my fault.

• 40:00Laci Mosley?

  That's why I see you.

• 40:01Speaker 04

  She cheated. She cheated.

• 40:03Laci Mosley?

  That's why I see you every sixth week of the month. Cause I love you. Now go in the Costco and run it up. Text daddy when you're done.

• 40:14Laci Mosley?

  So Ariel seemed like a successful businessman. He wrote his emails in all caps.

• 40:21Laci Mosley?

  You know how.

• 40:22Speaker 04

  See.

• 40:22Laci Mosley?

  You know how when you say successful.

• 40:25Speaker 04

  Yeah, all caps. Was it in a Comic Sans font? Like, what the hell?

• 40:30Laci Mosley?

  Not only he gotta use like Ariel or like, what's a successful businessman?

• 40:33Speaker 04

  I'm a Garaman kinda guy. Times New.

• 40:36Laci Mosley?

  It's dated, but.

• 40:37Speaker 04

  But it it it conveys the right energy.

• 40:40Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 40:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 40:41Laci Mosley?

  But he wrote his emails in all caps, so he was always yelling at you via email. It was like, we'll circle back. Success. That man's successful.

• 40:53Speaker 04

  Looking forward.

• 40:56Speaker 04

  Regards.

• 40:57Laci Mosley?

  It's like, oh my God, what is happening?

• 40:59Speaker 04

  Cheers.

• 41:01Laci Mosley?

  Poor Rich, he's like my ears.

• 41:05Laci Mosley?

  He also worked from a huge Miami office, so of course Bill.

• 41:09Speaker 04

  No scams in Miami.

• 41:10Laci Mosley?

  No, never.

• 41:11Speaker 04

  Scam free. Everyone knows.

• 41:12Laci Mosley?

  Everyone knows.

• 41:13Speaker 04

  Everyone knows.

• 41:14Laci Mosley?

  Huge Miami office, scam free.

• 41:17Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 41:18Laci Mosley?

  I have everything about like a lot of corporate, uh, office culture in Miami. And I don't know if this has shifted, but when I first got out of college, like one of my friends moved there to work, you know, in a business office. I think it was like a real estate firm, but like, but one of the bigger ones. So it wasn't like, um, them Sunset ladies who be wearing, going to the, you know, appointments in a club dress.

• 41:38Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:39Laci Mosley?

  It wasn't giving club dress.

• 41:40Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 41:41Laci Mosley?

  But like where she would work and other people would work, cause I was sometimes just be in Miami. I lived there for a little while. The suits that they wear, so tight. You could count the change in their pockets.

• 41:52Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:52Laci Mosley?

  I'm like, where y'all getting these tight ass suits that's so tight?

• 41:55Speaker 04

  And everyone is like dressed as if and walking around as if they could do a bump of coke right there. Like they're all cocaine ready.

• 42:06Laci Mosley?

  Like you work at Ernest and Young, why do you have a BBL? What is the purpose of that?

• 42:13Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 42:14Laci Mosley?

  What are y'all doing?

• 42:15Speaker 04

  What are y'all doing? What are y'all doing?

• 42:17Laci Mosley?

  So Miami office is always gonna be sus to me.

• 42:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, I get that.

• 42:21Laci Mosley?

  What are y'all doing in here? And why?

• 42:22Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 42:24Laci Mosley?

  But this portrays a sus to Bill. So in reality, Ariel's network at the time was around five million dollars. And to buy Jay Peak, Bill needed 26 million.

• 42:34Speaker 04

  So he didn't have that.

• 42:35Laci Mosley?

  No, no, he didn't have half of that. So the key was that 18 million that Bill had already raised from investors was what he could use to get to that 26. So they needed 26 million total to buy the mountain.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  To buy the mountain, okay.

• 42:50Laci Mosley?

  So Ariel only has five.

• 42:52Speaker 04

  This is Miami with the dead eyes.

• 42:53Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, dead eyes Miami man.

• 42:55Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 42:55Laci Mosley?

  He has five, but Bill has already raised that 18, remember?

• 42:59Speaker 04

  Huh, okay.

• 43:00Laci Mosley?

  So Ariel claimed that he needed to verify the money's existence from Bill. So Ariel convinced Jay Peak's previous owners to put it all in an account at Raymond James Financial Services, where his former son-in-law, Joel Burstein, worked.

• 43:19Speaker 04

  Wait.

• 43:20Laci Mosley?

  So Ariel said, Ariel said, I need to know that y'all have the funds before I give you all of my

• 43:27Speaker 04

  Of my five.

• 43:28Laci Mosley?

  way more than five funds.

• 43:30Speaker 04

  Ah, uh-huh.

• 43:31Laci Mosley?

  So he says, put it in Raymond James Financial Services, so we could all look at it, right?

• 43:36Speaker 04

  But his son-in-law?

• 43:38Laci Mosley?

  But that's his son-in-law, who is black.

• 43:41Speaker 04

  He's a little cute.

• 43:42Laci Mosley?

  He is cute. I guess he did say son-in-law, because I was like, now where did he come from?

• 43:46Speaker 04

  He's giving poor man's Damon Wayans Jr.

• 43:49Laci Mosley?

  But maybe like corporate Damon Wayans Jr.

• 43:52Speaker 04

  But not nearly as cute, like 40% as cute.

• 43:54Laci Mosley?

  If Damon Wayans Jr. was a congressman in DC.

• 43:59Speaker 04

  If Damon Wayans Jr. was on city council in DC.

• 44:04Laci Mosley?

  Damn.

• 44:06Laci Mosley?

  If Damon Wayans Jr. was an alderman in Chicago.

• 44:11Speaker 04

  If Damon Wayans Jr. worked in the office of New York Mayor Eric Adams.

• 44:16Laci Mosley?

  If Damon Wayans Jr. was a front-facing client serviceman at Bank of America.

• 44:25Speaker 04

  That's it. That's it. That's, there we go. Nailed it.

• 44:29Laci Mosley?

  He helps you open the account. He helps you close it.

• 44:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, no?

• 44:32Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 44:33Speaker 04

  And he has a, and he has a very strict script.

• 44:35Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah.

• 44:36Speaker 04

  Has to read the script.

• 44:37Laci Mosley?

  He does.

• 44:37Speaker 04

  I'm sorry, this is what it says.

• 44:38Laci Mosley?

  And if there's any deviation, he has to go talk to his manager.

• 44:41Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah.

• 44:42Laci Mosley?

  He's not gonna try to work it out for you.

• 44:43Speaker 04

  No, no, he's talking to the manager.

• 44:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, no.

• 44:45Speaker 04

  That's his energy. Yes, yes.

• 44:47Laci Mosley?

  So strong.

• 44:48Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 44:49Laci Mosley?

  So in the hours before closing of the sale, Joel, our Damon Wayans Jr.

• 44:54Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 44:55Laci Mosley?

  Who, not as hot. We love Damon Wayans Jr. Joel retitled the accounts in Ariel's name and transferred the money to us through a series of accounts, right? So stepson.

• 45:08Speaker 04

  Stepson of Miami.

• 45:10Laci Mosley?

  Stepson of Ariel in Miami.

• 45:12Speaker 04

  Took all the money from the other investors.

• 45:14Laci Mosley?

  Changed the name of the account.

• 45:16Speaker 04

  Moved it around.

• 45:17Laci Mosley?

  Moved it around. Then Ariel used, this is Miami man.

• 45:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 45:21Laci Mosley?

  With the I's.

• 45:22Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 45:23Laci Mosley?

  Ariel used 13.5 million of it to make the initial payment to purchase the resort from the owners. So remember, this is Bill's money.

• 45:30Speaker 04

  He moved the money to say that it was his and then paid it.

• 45:33Laci Mosley?

  He said, "Bill, if you really got 18 mil, put it in this bank account and don't worry that my stepson-in-law used to work there or work there."

• 45:43Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 45:44Laci Mosley?

  Don't worry about that, sweetheart. Just put it there so we can both look at it, so I can make sure you have it. Then, once the money was there, the stepson-in-law, he extracts the money, changes the name on the accounts, and then basically puts it in Ariel's control.

• 45:57Speaker 04

  So then he can be like, "Oh, I got 13."

• 45:58Laci Mosley?

  Now, remember, Bill didn't own the resort. Bill needed another investor. He only had 18 mil to buy it. So he's like, "Buy it with me."

• 46:04Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 46:04Laci Mosley?

  Ariel's like, "Okay, bet. Yeah, we gonna buy it together. Just let me verify by you giving me all the money." And so then, he goes past Bill and buys Jace Peak from the original owners with Bill's money.

• 46:18Speaker 04

  Hold on, no, he, okay, so Miami takes that money from the investors, then goes back to those same investors and says-

• 46:26Laci Mosley?

  So Miami, Ariel-

• 46:29Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 46:29Laci Mosley?

  He, Bill, Bill was like, Miami Ariel, you got that energy, you talking in all caps. You got an office in Miami.

• 46:36Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 46:36Laci Mosley?

  You look legitimate, okay?

• 46:38Speaker 04

  You look legitimate.

• 46:38Laci Mosley?

  Your eyes are like the depths of hell.

• 46:39Speaker 04

  You got that pinky cocaine fingernail, I trust you.

• 46:42Laci Mosley?

  Literally, you're always yelling via email, I know you're a good guy. So he's like, Ariel's like, okay, why fucks with you, like, I'm down, but I got lots of so much money, definitely more than 5 million, how much money you got? Cause it's gonna cost 26 million to purchase this, right? So Bill's like, oh, I got money, money. And he's like, okay, Bill, verify that money by transferring it to this bank that I have no affiliation with, so that I can see the money is real and that we investing together, and then I'm gonna put my money in there and then it's gonna be a pool of money, cause remember, we gonna buy this from the owners together. So then, he has the step, ex-son-in-law, whatever, who is Damon Wayans-

• 47:18Speaker 04

  Hoodrich, Damon Wayans Jr.

• 47:18Laci Mosley?

  Hoodrich, Damon Wayans Jr.

• 47:20Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 47:20Laci Mosley?

  Who doesn't look as sexy.

• 47:21Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 47:22Laci Mosley?

  He has him change the account names and funnel all the money out so that Ariel has access to it. Then Ariel bypasses Bill and goes to the original owners of Jay's Peak-

• 47:32Speaker 04

  Whose money he had moved over to his own side.

• 47:36Laci Mosley?

  No, he took the money from Bill, who he was supposed to buy the Peak with.

• 47:40Speaker 04

  And then goes-

• 47:41Laci Mosley?

  So then he moved past Bill and was like, hey, investors, I have the money to buy Jay's Peak.

• 47:46Speaker 04

  So y'all come with me-

• 47:47Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 47:48Speaker 04

  F Bill.

• 47:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, fuck Bill, don't even worry about Bill.

• 47:50Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 47:52Laci Mosley?

  Bill's so poor.

• 47:53Speaker 04

  That is some, like, higher level scamming.

• 47:56Laci Mosley?

  Yes. And Bill's already scamming because he's like, y'all get these EB-5s and then I'm gonna get y'all-

• 48:03Speaker 04

  Bill's trying to hustle green cards.

• 48:04Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he's the green card man.

• 48:06Speaker 04

  None of them are on the up and up.

• 48:07Laci Mosley?

  Bill opens up that ski jacket and it's just like Hustleman, just tons of green cards. He's like, you want one? You got 500K? Let me throw you one, let me throw your family. I got you, you in yours.

• 48:18Speaker 04

  Damn.

• 48:18Laci Mosley?

  So he's basically scamming a scammer.

• 48:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 48:20Laci Mosley?

  And then buying something that Bill has saved up his scam coins for with Bill's money.

• 48:27Speaker 04

  Bill, you got pla- Bill, you played yourself.

• 48:29Laci Mosley?

  Woo, Bill, you played yourself. So then Ariel uses thirteen point five million of Bill's scammer green card money, right? To make the initial payment to purchase the resort from the original owners. Ariel had brought Jay Peak using its own money, which obviously is illegal. But the sale went through. He made Bill CEO and gave him a fifteen percent ownership stake in the resort.

• 48:53Speaker 04

  But is that even real? Did that ownership stake?

• 48:56Laci Mosley?

  He gave him a cut of his own stuff.

• 48:58Speaker 04

  Of his own scam, man, layers.

• 49:00Laci Mosley?

  So Ariel consolidated Jay's Peak's finances at Raymond James, which was the bank where, remember, Bootleg Damon works at, right?

• 49:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:09Laci Mosley?

  So that's where Bootleg Damon, AKA Joel, could buy treasury bonds and secure margin loans to cover up the missing EB5 investor money. And they were off to the races with an extreme, like, mountain makeover. So now they can finally make over the mountain, they own it, and then they covered up the fact that there wasn't money by Joel being like, oh, we actually put that money in bonds. It's in bonds, it's stocks, so it's still there, it's just not in the account, but it's like the vibe of the money is there.

• 49:37Speaker 04

  The vibe, yeah.

• 49:38Laci Mosley?

  We're doing a vibe check on the money.

• 49:39Speaker 04

  Trust us, this is wild.

• 49:41Laci Mosley?

  Yes, so this is the extreme mountain makeover. They're finally gonna make it like, it's not gonna be unchic, it's not gonna be seedy and nasty anymore, it's gonna be sexy. In two thousand nine, Jay Peak's first big EB5 project, so now what they have said they were gonna do with the green cards, they started. It's a fifty-seven suite tram house lodge. It opened up in two thousand nine with its boutique feel and themed decor, taking its place among the most appealing slope side hotels in the ski industry. So now we have like a bad bitch, like, hotel.

• 50:17Speaker 04

  Love it.

• 50:18Laci Mosley?

  It's sexy.

• 50:19Speaker 04

  Love it.

• 50:20Laci Mosley?

  It's chic.

• 50:21Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 50:22Laci Mosley?

  The seeds are gone.

• 50:23Speaker 04

  Yes, yes, it's like legit now.

• 50:25Laci Mosley?

  Yes, so soon after, the resort added two more hotels.

• 50:29Speaker 04

  Where'd they get all this guy?

• 50:30Laci Mosley?

  They're expanding.

• 50:31Speaker 04

  Where the money coming from?

• 50:32Laci Mosley?

  They got a skating rink.

• 50:33Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 50:34Laci Mosley?

  Indoor.

• 50:35Speaker 04

  That's a lot.

• 50:36Laci Mosley?

  And that's like a big skating rink.

• 50:38Speaker 04

  That really is. I went ice skating once and that was enough. Fell on my ass so many times.

• 50:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 50:44Speaker 04

  You just fall on your ass.

• 50:46Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 50:46Speaker 04

  Everyone's like, oh, that's cute. No, it hurt.

• 50:48Laci Mosley?

  I hugged the side of the rink. It gets some bruises. But I would get out there and do a little. I could do a little something.

• 50:53Speaker 04

  OK, OK, OK.

• 50:54Laci Mosley?

  Not a lot, though, and then I would fall.

• 50:56Speaker 04

  It's cute.

• 50:57Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. And so they had this indoor skating rink, right? That was called Ice House.

• 51:02Speaker 04

  Uh huh.

• 51:03Laci Mosley?

  They had the Golf Club House, a $27 million indoor water park called the Pump House.

• 51:09Speaker 04

  Oh, wow, I see it. That is epic.

• 51:12Laci Mosley?

  And it's indoor, so they can just turn the heat up during the cold. Y'all can still get wet.

• 51:15Speaker 04

  Who the hell needs a water slide inside in the middle of some ski slopes? These people were just burning money.

• 51:20Laci Mosley?

  They were like, we have everything here. OK, you want snow, you want, we got snow.

• 51:25Speaker 04

  Did they build a zoo? What the hell? Yeah.

• 51:27Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. They might.

• 51:29Speaker 04

  Right? And the elephants are over here.

• 51:32Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, they're cold. But we got blankets for them, OK?

• 51:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:37Laci Mosley?

  They're fine.

• 51:38Speaker 04

  This is wild.

• 51:38Laci Mosley?

  So they also had a climbing gym.

• 51:40Speaker 04

  Are you, this, white chaos.

• 51:43Laci Mosley?

  White chaos. They said, what are all the things that white families love to do? And can we put them in one place?

• 51:50Speaker 04

  In one place.

• 51:51Laci Mosley?

  Like, at this point, I'm waiting for them to say zipline. And like, you know, they're like, what are all the white activities?

• 51:56Speaker 04

  Station. My god. My god. Too much.

• 52:01Laci Mosley?

  They said, look, any white activity, cornhole. Y'all, we got cornhole. We have, if you want it, we have it. White people. They had multiple condo complexes and multiple bars and restaurants. So Jay Peak was going so well. Area bought nearby Burke Mountain, too. This man is just buying mountains.

• 52:19Speaker 04

  So he keeps finding money.

• 52:21Laci Mosley?

  Well, cuz.

• 52:22Speaker 04

  Allegedly.

• 52:22Laci Mosley?

  Cuz everybody's going to the water park slash ice skating rink slash ski resort.

• 52:27Speaker 04

  Funds. They're bringing in.

• 52:28Laci Mosley?

  Slash zoo, slash trust fall center.

• 52:32Laci Mosley?

  Okay, they even have a place where you can cosplay denying, you know, people of color bank loans. You can do everything white people want to do there.

• 52:39Speaker 04

  Everything.

• 52:40Laci Mosley?

  Don't worry about it.

• 52:42Speaker 04

  They got a customer service room where you can just go yell at somebody for half an hour.

• 52:46Laci Mosley?

  Okay, and then when you call the manager, the manager actually comes, you can yell at them too.

• 52:50Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 52:51Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, you've heard of like-

• 52:52Speaker 04

  They have manager reenactors.

• 52:53Laci Mosley?

  Yes, you've heard of those rooms where they like break stuff and it's like you destroy, they have that, but it's for just like management reenactment. So you can yell at somebody.

• 53:01Speaker 04

  You can yell at somebody.

• 53:02Laci Mosley?

  You can say, uh, do you know who I am?

• 53:04Speaker 04

  Do you know who I am?

• 53:05Laci Mosley?

  That's what it's called.

• 53:06Speaker 04

  Then you can record it and play it back when you have a bad day.

• 53:09Laci Mosley?

  Okay, everybody's cruising for a bruising in there, okay? That's therapy. They got everything you need. So, they bought another mountain, which I didn't know you could just be buying mountains like this. This is wild to me. I don't think you should be able to own a mountain. I think that mountain should just be, uh, land.

• 53:25Speaker 04

  I think mountains should be free. I think beaches should be free. I don't believe in private beaches. I don't believe in it.

• 53:30Laci Mosley?

  I don't believe in it right now.

• 53:33Laci Mosley?

  When I have egg money like you, Sam, I will believe in a private beach. Because I have to get the pores off my sand.

• 53:39Speaker 04

  Can I tell you something about my eggs? 7-Eleven eggs.

• 53:43Laci Mosley?

  Okay, now that's crazy.

• 53:44Speaker 04

  It was the closest, I wanted eggs, it was the closest spot that I could walk to, I got eggs at 7-Eleven.

• 53:49Laci Mosley?

  The only other thing you could do in 7-Eleven that would make me even more questionable was get sushi or something. Or one of those rotated hot dogs. I'm like, Sam, let's pray.

• 53:58Speaker 04

  There was a 7-Eleven in DC during my time that had amazing beef patties. Like Jamaican beef patties.

• 54:03Laci Mosley?

  Okay, you know what? But I feel as though that was something that-

• 54:06Speaker 04

  And they knew what the fuck they were doing.

• 54:07Laci Mosley?

  They were doing that on the side, and that was not something 7-Eleven approved of. They were just like, we're gonna sell beef patties.

• 54:13Speaker 04

  And they had them, they had them on the little hot dog rollers.

• 54:16Laci Mosley?

  No, they didn't.

• 54:16Speaker 04

  They had it next to the rolling hot dogs, like the Jamaican beef patties.

• 54:20Laci Mosley?

  Welcome to 7-Eleven, Winata.

• 54:21Speaker 04

  That was a good scam.

• 54:22Laci Mosley?

  That's a good scam.

• 54:23Speaker 04

  That's a good scam.

• 54:23Laci Mosley?

  Listen, my mama had chili day at Dairy Queen. She was making chili. Dairy Queen don't sell chili.

• 54:30Speaker 04

  She's like, we're doing chili, damn it.

• 54:33Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it was popular.

• 54:34Speaker 04

  And I bet they loved it.

• 54:35Laci Mosley?

  They loved it.

• 54:36Speaker 04

  Because she probably made great chili.

• 54:37Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my mom makes a fantastic, because I'm like, is that money going to Derrick Queen, mom? Are you just having your own chili day at Derrick Queen where you're selling chili?

• 54:44Speaker 04

  Let it happen.

• 54:46Laci Mosley?

  I loved it.

• 54:46Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 54:47Laci Mosley?

  I feel like that's what your DC 7-Eleven was doing. They always selling them beef patties at 7-Eleven.

• 54:51Speaker 04

  Not 7-Eleven approved.

• 54:52Laci Mosley?

  I went to Oxtail, I went to 7-Eleven, got me some Oxtail.

• 54:56Speaker 04

  That 7-Eleven's jerk chicken is popping, popping, okay?

• 55:00Laci Mosley?

  And they sell gas. That 7-Eleven has never sold gas. No, you just go in and they give it to you in a red can.

• 55:06Speaker 04

  Right.

• 55:06Laci Mosley?

  You say how much you want. No, that's not a thing.

• 55:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, no, no.

• 55:11Laci Mosley?

  Don't worry about it, sweetheart. So JP is going so well, he don't even got, he was like, let's get more mountains, okay? And he was gonna develop that as a property too. At Bill's urging, he had even acquired a plot in the town of Newport where Bill lived, with plans to build a vast biotech facility that would manufacture sophisticated medical products, another pivot.

• 55:31Speaker 04

  That was a turn. Wow.

• 55:33Laci Mosley?

  How y'all going from water parks and indoor, you know, way ice skating to medical products?

• 55:39Speaker 04

  That's a lot.

• 55:41Laci Mosley?

  Including dialysis machines and artificial organs.

• 55:46Speaker 04

  Can't nobody do that yet. What year was this?

• 55:50Speaker 04

  What year was this?

• 55:51Laci Mosley?

  After 2009.

• 55:52Speaker 04

  Girl, ain't nobody had that skill yet.

• 55:58Speaker 04

  We can barely 3D print guns now.

• 56:00Laci Mosley?

  Listen, they're gonna make portable heart lung pumps and synthetic livers. Now, it will be made out of leftover plastic from the water slide.

• 56:12Laci Mosley?

  But don't worry about that.

• 56:15Laci Mosley?

  Don't worry about that.

• 56:17Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 56:18Laci Mosley?

  With such grand plans, Bill and Ariel predicted that the projects could create about 10,000 new jobs, which you know what that means.

• 56:26Speaker 04

  10,000, so they can get more of that EV5 money. This is giving, this is giving hints of Theranos at this point.

• 56:35Laci Mosley?

  I mean, they did actually build a thing. Elizabeth had an office and she had a tiny thing that didn't work. And then the machine was spitting blood everywhere.

• 56:45Laci Mosley?

  But, but at least the water slide worked and, and the bar definitely was serving cocktails.

• 56:49Speaker 04

  True, true.

• 56:50Laci Mosley?

  You could definitely skate in the ice.

• 56:51Speaker 04

  Okay, you could do that, but like, they weren't making the organs.

• 56:53Laci Mosley?

  You could punch a manager at the therapy center.

• 56:57Laci Mosley?

  But then, but making organs.

• 56:58Speaker 04

  That's, that's a bridge too far.

• 56:59Laci Mosley?

  I just don't know how we got there. Neither of y'all are given like organ inventor.

• 57:04Speaker 04

  None of that.

• 57:05Laci Mosley?

  So you type in all caps, you cannot make anything that I want put in my body.

• 57:10Speaker 04

  That part.

• 57:10Laci Mosley?

  You don't know how to work a caps lock.

• 57:12Speaker 04

  That part, yeah.

• 57:13Laci Mosley?

  So with such grand plans, they predicted these projects were gonna really bring in the coin. And of course, that means more EB5 investors because they're saying 10,000 new jobs. And you know, you only had to have 10 new jobs to get the visa. So 10,000.

• 57:27Speaker 04

  They want to do it a thousand times over.

• 57:28Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 57:29Speaker 04

  Scam.

• 57:30Laci Mosley?

  Bill flew around the world wooing investors with the promise of green cards. And in total, he raised 350 million dollars.

• 57:42Speaker 04

  God damn.

• 57:43Laci Mosley?

  350.

• 57:44Speaker 04

  I'm in the wrong line of work.

• 57:46Laci Mosley?

  We gotta start making artificial organs.

• 57:48Speaker 04

  We could have a really good pitch deck.

• 57:50Laci Mosley?

  Oh, for sure.

• 57:51Speaker 04

  And imagine us in a room working some rich people to be like, we can get you a green card too, come on.

• 57:55Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and we, yeah, we also, strasvutse, we'll, we'll get you a green card.

• 58:01Laci Mosley?

  And make organ.

• 58:02Speaker 04

  Yes, yes, yes. That's very good.

• 58:04Laci Mosley?

  It's like, why are they speaking in English but with a Russian accent?

• 58:07Speaker 04

  You should have been in Enora. Now I'm imagining Enora, part two, Jungle Boogaloo. Starin' Lacey.

• 58:15Laci Mosley?

  Boogaloo is wild.

• 58:17Speaker 04

  They go, listen, they're like, we didn't left Queens, uh, we in Canarsie now, bitch.

• 58:22Laci Mosley?

  Canarsie, okay, what's up?

• 58:26Speaker 04

  Wait, I want that so bad.

• 58:28Laci Mosley?

  I feel like all we need is like an old white dude that we dress up and we give him the script. And then we just, we're there, but we just say that we're like assistants.

• 58:36Speaker 04

  We're assisting.

• 58:37Laci Mosley?

  We're just assistants.

• 58:38Speaker 04

  Coffee, but we're pulling the strings.

• 58:40Laci Mosley?

  Guys, we don't give, they don't give us a lot of responsibility. We're just here for coffee. Sam's the driver.

• 58:47Speaker 04

  I'm a, I'll be a very good driver.

• 58:49Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 58:50Speaker 04

  Big shade, I don't say shit.

• 58:51Laci Mosley?

  And we just go on Craigslist and get this guy. There's so many out of work actors. We could definitely get a guy, you know, we might have to blackmail him. One of us is gonna constantly have him at gunpoint because you know he'll get wised up and try to steal our business from us.

• 59:06Speaker 04

  I'll do it. I'll just get him in, you know what, I will just, I'll get him in a situation where he's gonna give, I'll find a way to get him to like, either send really inappropriate texts or nudes. Then I'll be like, I got you, girl.

• 59:19Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 59:20Speaker 04

  You're mine now.

• 59:21Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. We own you.

• 59:22Speaker 04

  Yep. Now, what country do we go to first to scam people to get this money?

• 59:29Laci Mosley?

  Where do we go first? I feel like we gotta go someplace random, like, let's go to Poland.

• 59:34Speaker 04

  I was sitting here thinking, where would I want to like go on vacation?

• 59:38Laci Mosley?

  Oh, no.

• 59:39Speaker 04

  It's like, ooh, South Korea, it's fun over there.

• 59:40Laci Mosley?

  We need people to wanna come to America.

• 59:43Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 59:43Laci Mosley?

  Okay?

• 59:44Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 59:44Laci Mosley?

  Cause if we go to the UK, they're like, it's very,

• 59:45Speaker 04

  We're good over here.

• 59:46Laci Mosley?

  It's very rotten over there.

• 59:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, we're not doing that.

• 59:49Laci Mosley?

  We don't wanna go.

• 59:49Speaker 04

  Wait, let's do, okay, I feel you on former Soviet bloc. Who has the best food in the former Soviet bloc?

• 59:57Laci Mosley?

  Oh, okay.

• 59:58Speaker 04

  Where are the best pierogies?

• 59:59Laci Mosley?

  You are still trying to go on vacation now.

• 1:00:01Speaker 04

  I am, I know, I know, I know. Anywho, back to the, back to the work, okay.

• 1:00:04Laci Mosley?

  But we're gonna work on our, our favorite work.

• 1:00:06Speaker 04

  We'll figure it out, we'll figure it out.

• 1:00:07Laci Mosley?

  We got it.

• 1:00:07Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:00:08Laci Mosley?

  So, we could do, we could be like, um, that black man who ruined his whole legacy. Remember, um,

• 1:00:13Speaker 04

  Most of them.

• 1:00:16Speaker 04

  I can say it, I'm a black man.

• 1:00:18Laci Mosley?

  Tiny hands, miracle hands, little hands.

• 1:00:22Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 1:00:22Laci Mosley?

  Special hands.

• 1:00:23Speaker 04

  The doctor, Ben Carson.

• 1:00:24Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, we could be like him, we'd be like, we are actually his children, and we also have tiny miracle hands.

• 1:00:30Speaker 04

  Fun fact, when he was running for president, he ran for president briefly in the 2016 cycle, and I followed that man for a week.

• 1:00:38Laci Mosley?

  Because you're his son.

• 1:00:40Speaker 04

  That's what I'm sure all them people thought. But let me tell you something, when you see him actually in the flesh doing his thing, you're like, you're a few cards short of a deck. Something's a little off.

• 1:00:53Laci Mosley?

  He was good at the tiny miracle baby hand surgery.

• 1:00:57Speaker 04

  I think, and this is what I think about a lot of medical professionals who have access to the drugs, I think they take some of those drugs. Something about him made it seem like he like was getting too high on the supply for too long. Something wasn't firing in the top. Something wasn't firing, anywho, I digress.

• 1:01:12Laci Mosley?

  I'm sure having,

• 1:01:13Speaker 04

  I hope you're okay.

• 1:01:14Laci Mosley?

  Magic baby, he's dead.

• 1:01:16Speaker 04

  He died?

• 1:01:16Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:17Speaker 04

  Damn.

• 1:01:18Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, of COVID.

• 1:01:20Speaker 04

  Shit.

• 1:01:21Laci Mosley?

  Am I, am I wrong?

• 1:01:22Speaker 04

  He probably did.

• 1:01:25Laci Mosley?

  Oh, I'm thinking of Herman.

• 1:01:30Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 1:01:33Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 1:01:37Speaker 04

  Dead. This goes to show, if you're a black man and you start supporting Trump, you're gonna start to all look like the same kinda ugly.

• 1:01:51Speaker 04

  That's what you get. Ben Carson, Herman Cain, doesn't matter, we don't like you.

• 1:01:56Laci Mosley?

  Same guy. But also Ben Carson is our dad and he taught us tiny baby miracle hands. And that's why we're gonna sell organs, okay? It works. Don't think about it too hard.

• 1:02:07Speaker 04

  The plane landed, we're good.

• 1:02:08Laci Mosley?

  We're good.

• 1:02:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:02:09Laci Mosley?

  So here's how Bill described the situation in 2012.

• 1:02:13Speaker 07

  I think about it this way.

• 1:02:14Laci Mosley?

  Vermont life.

• 1:02:15Speaker 07

  I won the Powerball.

• 1:02:17Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:02:18Laci Mosley?

  Wow.

• 1:02:18Speaker 07

  I have a half a billion dollars to work with.

• 1:02:20Speaker 04

  Oh my god.

• 1:02:21Speaker 07

  So what I've had the pleasure of being able to do is help create the blueprint of how that money can be invested. Vermont politicians were also eager to show their support.

• 1:02:34Laci Mosley?

  So...

• 1:02:35Speaker 04

  This is what I'll never get. If I had access to half a billion dollars, I'd stop.

• 1:02:42Speaker 04

  I'd be like, no, I'm good. Cut me off 15 million, I'll invest it, let it grow. Let me go to, I don't know, Colorado and just sit my ass down.

• 1:02:50Laci Mosley?

  The thing is, is that now you owe half a billion dollars to people. So now you have to start proliferating more investments. The thing for me is though, if I invested in you and we got to this half a billion dollars total, why are you telling people you won the Powerball and that you're gonna invest it some more? No, this is not chain investment. You're supposed to go do the thing.

• 1:03:10Speaker 04

  With, right now with that money.

• 1:03:11Laci Mosley?

  So that I can make money off of it. Not like you gonna keep investing down the line. What is that?

• 1:03:15Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:16Laci Mosley?

  What are you talking about?

• 1:03:17Speaker 04

  The greed knows no limit.

• 1:03:18Laci Mosley?

  Also, he slipped up saying he won the Powerball. Like, isn't this supposed to be investing?

• 1:03:21Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:22Laci Mosley?

  Like, if I ever went to, like, my investment firm and I was like, okay, I wanna put this money in, you know, these different stocks and they were like, we won the Powerball. I'd be like, what do you mean by that?

• 1:03:31Speaker 04

  What do you mean? What do you mean? You're scamming me.

• 1:03:33Laci Mosley?

  You didn't win anything. This is still my money, right?

• 1:03:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:36Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Mm-hmm.

• 1:03:38Speaker 04

  I feel you.

• 1:03:39Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. Oh yeah, still your money.

• 1:03:40Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:41Laci Mosley?

  I didn't win nothing. I mean, I won with you because we are gonna win together.

• 1:03:46Speaker 04

  It remains to be seen if we're gonna win together.

• 1:03:49Laci Mosley?

  Anyway, my dad, Ben Carson, was telling me...

• 1:03:51Speaker 04

  Or was it Herman?

• 1:03:54Speaker 04

  Who's to say?

• 1:03:55Laci Mosley?

  Okay, who's to say?

• 1:03:55Speaker 04

  Who's to say?

• 1:03:56Laci Mosley?

  Who's to say? So, um, obviously Bill presented fraudulent job and revenue projections for the projects to encourage further investment. Now Ariel, Mr. Eyeballs, he misused $200 million of the funds they had raised and Joel covered their tracks.

• 1:04:12Speaker 04

  How did you misuse that much? What were you doing?

• 1:04:15Laci Mosley?

  Well, he was illegally mingling funds designated for specific projects. Okay, so Ariel funneled much of the money through a variety of shell companies and remember he's still got Damon Wayans Jr.'s.

• 1:04:27Speaker 04

  Running the money for him.

• 1:04:28Laci Mosley?

  John from memory.

• 1:04:29Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:04:30Laci Mosley?

  You know, stepson-in-law who works at the bank. So, he was funneling the money through a variety of shell companies and back into his own pocket for personal use. So, some of these uses were $50 million that he spent on luxury purchases such as a condo at Trump Place, New York.

• 1:04:48Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 1:04:49Laci Mosley?

  He and two partners, so he went back to Gold Penis and he bought a condo. He and two partners used EB5 investor money intended for their non-existent biotech firm to pay themselves for the distribution rights for the products that they were never gonna make.

• 1:05:05Speaker 04

  Wait, they paid themselves distribution rights for the 3D organs that they hadn't even made yet?

• 1:05:12Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:05:13Speaker 04

  Honestly, hats off to you motherfuckers. Goddamn.

• 1:05:17Laci Mosley?

  Sounds like a lot of paperwork.

• 1:05:18Speaker 04

  A lot of paperwork. My mind don't work like that. That's a skill.

• 1:05:21Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, I hate sending emails and they were really on Excel like, alright, we gotta get these lives.

• 1:05:26Speaker 04

  If I get a Gmail that has like more than two or three in the like chain, I can't read it no more.

• 1:05:32Laci Mosley?

  Oh, no, I'm at probably like 300.

• 1:05:33Speaker 04

  I'm sorry, someone has to call me. Someone has to call me. I can't open up the...

• 1:05:36Laci Mosley?

  People text me all the time and they're like, hey, did you see this? And I'm like, no. I mean, Jess is sitting right here and she's like, always like, hey, Lacey, did you see this email? I'm like, no. I got to the point of executive function left.

• 1:05:48Speaker 04

  It becomes a different language after like two replies.

• 1:05:51Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:52Speaker 04

  It's not English.

• 1:05:53Laci Mosley?

  I had to choose to...

• 1:05:54Speaker 04

  That ain't nothing, no, I can't do that.

• 1:05:55Laci Mosley?

  My lawyer was yelling at me the other day because I included somebody in an email they definitely should not have been copied on and she was like, what the hell is this? And I was like, ooh.

• 1:06:03Speaker 04

  I don't speak email. I don't know how to do it.

• 1:06:05Laci Mosley?

  I was like, my bad, I thought I started a different thread. She was like, no, you literally just gave up financial. I was like, ooh, well, good luck with that.

• 1:06:11Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:06:12Laci Mosley?

  You got it.

• 1:06:13Speaker 04

  That's why I'm paying you.

• 1:06:14Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, great, you got it. Go ahead, finish that. So eight years after Ariel bought Jay Peak, officials from the Securities and Exchange Commission, the SEC, raided the mountain resort and accused Ariel and Bill of defrauding forty, or foreign investors of $200 million. So remember, 200 million is actually the number that Ariel has siphoned into shell companies.

• 1:06:36Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:06:36Laci Mosley?

  So once he got to siphoning, the SEC was like, wait a minute.

• 1:06:39Speaker 04

  What's going on here? And all that they could seize was Jay Peak because nothing else had been created yet?

• 1:06:44Laci Mosley?

  No, we just got distribution rights, we got vibes.

• 1:06:47Speaker 04

  We got vibes, we got artificial organ vibes.

• 1:06:50Laci Mosley?

  Yes, you know what I mean? It is artificial, so who's to say what?

• 1:06:54Speaker 04

  Believe the organ is there, maybe it is.

• 1:06:57Laci Mosley?

  So the biggest financial fraud in ski industry history is what they did, right? As well as it being the biggest fraud in the state of Vermont.

• 1:07:05Speaker 04

  Well, that ain't saying much, it's Vermont, it's tiny.

• 1:07:07Laci Mosley?

  I mean, I feel like they're doing more fraud in Vermont, they're just better at it.

• 1:07:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, whenever I think of Vermont, I think of Bernie Sanders first, because I was there with him. Then I think of, remember, all Olivia Pope wanted was to get to Vermont with her white president.

• 1:07:20Laci Mosley?

  She did, and they ran scams, didn't they? They stole the election.

• 1:07:22Speaker 04

  That was a scam show.

• 1:07:24Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm, I loved it.

• 1:07:25Speaker 04

  It's so good.

• 1:07:26Laci Mosley?

  So they seized 81 million worth of assets from Ariel, including Jay the Peak and the nearby Burke Mountain that he had just bought.

• 1:07:35Speaker 04

  They seized the mountain.

• 1:07:36Laci Mosley?

  They seized the mountain.

• 1:07:37Speaker 04

  That is biblical. That is biblical.

• 1:07:41Laci Mosley?

  And you know the SEC don't come in because they give a fuck about morals. They're coming in because they're seasoned, that's all, that's just a cute word for government theft.

• 1:07:48Speaker 04

  Imagine you're in the cabin in your Montclair, doing your photo shoot with your cocoa, and they're like, hey, hey!

• 1:07:56Laci Mosley?

  SEC!

• 1:07:57Speaker 04

  The mountain too! Put the yellow tape around the mountain!

• 1:08:02Laci Mosley?

  Get off the water slide now!

• 1:08:05Speaker 04

  Stop petting the winter giraffe at the zoo. Got to go. Got to go.

• 1:08:11Laci Mosley?

  Put down that pina cuff freezing. We have to combine the tropical and the cold, okay? Put it down.

• 1:08:17Speaker 04

  Put it down, put it down.

• 1:08:19Laci Mosley?

  Let go of that manager.

• 1:08:23Laci Mosley?

  The jig is up.

• 1:08:26Laci Mosley?

  So, obviously Ariel, he pleaded guilty to federal criminal charges, including wire fraud, money laundering, and obstructing investors. If he had not touched the money, I don't know if the SEC would have got caught on to this.

• 1:08:38Speaker 04

  Let Damon Wayans take the fall for you, but he had his hand too much in there.

• 1:08:41Laci Mosley?

  But also, the fact that they came to the tune of 200 million when they had raised 500 million, that number is the exact amount of money that you were funneling to shell companies.

• 1:08:49Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:08:49Laci Mosley?

  So, it's your fault.

• 1:08:51Speaker 04

  Yep.

• 1:08:51Laci Mosley?

  Y'all could have kept criming for a little more time. You should have just built out the other mountain and did legitimate things with the money that you stole.

• 1:08:58Speaker 04

  This is why I can never be like, a real official scammer froster. Cause as soon as I got the first check from the first scam, I'd be like, "I'm out."

• 1:09:07Laci Mosley?

  I'm like, "This is so wonderful."

• 1:09:08Speaker 04

  This is great.

• 1:09:09Laci Mosley?

  We did it.

• 1:09:10Speaker 04

  Damn, I made $700.

• 1:09:12Laci Mosley?

  You know how many like, artists and people in professional industry started in crime, and then they were just smart enough to get out of crime?

• 1:09:19Speaker 04

  Jay-Z.

• 1:09:20Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:21Speaker 04

  He set up, got enough.

• 1:09:22Laci Mosley?

  I love Jay-Z and Parkland Entertainment. That is all alleged. Um, we don't know for sure.

• 1:09:27Speaker 04

  He rapped about it.

• 1:09:28Laci Mosley?

  He did rap about it, so you know what? You know what? Those raps were fake. They were just stories, guys. Um, but if, but you know, if I were to listen to an allegory like Jay-Z's, it's like, you do a little bit of crime to get your investment, because it's not like he was born with a silver spoon. He's born in the Marcy Project.

• 1:09:46Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:09:46Laci Mosley?

  So, he did his investment.

• 1:09:48Speaker 04

  And then, when you can level up, you level up to legality.

• 1:09:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 1:09:53Speaker 04

  Level up to legality. Yes. That is the teachable moment of this episode. If you can, level up to legality.

• 1:10:01Laci Mosley?

  And they had leveled up to legality. They turned 26 million dollars into this huge multimillion dollar company.

• 1:10:07Speaker 04

  And it was profitable.

• 1:10:08Laci Mosley?

  They owned hella mountains.

• 1:10:09Speaker 04

  They owned mountains, and that wasn't enough.

• 1:10:11Laci Mosley?

  That wasn't enough.

• 1:10:12Speaker 04

  I don't get it.

• 1:10:13Laci Mosley?

  Men can own mountains and be like, "No, now fake organs."

• 1:10:17Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:10:18Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, they needed to go to therapy, because I don't know why y'all went into fake organs. And Bill just wanted to keep raising money. I think he just liked traveling the world. He was a people person.

• 1:10:26Speaker 04

  He liked making the pitch.

• 1:10:27Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 1:10:27Speaker 04

  He liked the crowd.

• 1:10:28Laci Mosley?

  Because he liked making his videos. He made a lot of videos.

• 1:10:30Speaker 04

  He wants people to listen to him.

• 1:10:32Laci Mosley?

  That's what it is.

• 1:10:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, man.

• 1:10:34Laci Mosley?

  You know, when you get older and it's like, maybe his grandkids aren't very interested in what he wants to talk about. So he just goes to meetings and everyone's like, oh, Bill.

• 1:10:45Laci Mosley?

  And you know, at that point, he's so rich. So the girls are gassing him. Wherever they're having their little Scotch by the fire and they're like, oh, Bill, what a wonder can he? So how many of those visas can I get? Like, you know, like.

• 1:10:58Speaker 04

  He loves it, the attention.

• 1:11:00Laci Mosley?

  Cause he can't raise, he was like, I feel like I hit the powerball. It's like, how much money do you need to raise before y'all start cooking up one of these fake ass organs?

• 1:11:05Speaker 04

  Thank you. Didn't make one single kidney. Not a single fucking one.

• 1:11:08Laci Mosley?

  Liver, not a heart.

• 1:11:10Speaker 04

  Not even a gallbladder.

• 1:11:11Laci Mosley?

  Could have made a spleen. We don't even need those for real.

• 1:11:14Speaker 04

  Make a fingernail, anything.

• 1:11:16Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 1:11:17Speaker 04

  Couldn't do it.

• 1:11:18Laci Mosley?

  Couldn't do it. Couldn't do it. So Ariel was sentenced to, get this, you want to guess how many years he was sentenced in prison?

• 1:11:25Speaker 04

  He ain't gonna get that much because he's rich already. Two?

• 1:11:27Laci Mosley?

  Five.

• 1:11:28Speaker 04

  Okay, all right. That's something.

• 1:11:30Laci Mosley?

  They threw the book at him.

• 1:11:31Speaker 04

  Sure did. It's probably like the Martha Stewart prison, I'm sure.

• 1:11:34Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yes, of course. He's gonna get time served. And I'm sure that, you know, Damon Wayans.

• 1:11:41Speaker 04

  Damon at Rikers. He is at Rikers.

• 1:11:46Laci Mosley?

  No, no. I need Damon in the Fed and they need to have like a fun buddy comedy in the Fed. They play tennis. They think about their next scheme.

• 1:11:55Speaker 04

  All right.

• 1:11:56Laci Mosley?

  You know, I don't, I don't want to see Damon Wayans bootleg. I don't want to see him down bad either. Um, and then Bill was sentenced to eighteen months for submitting.

• 1:12:06Laci Mosley?

  Yes. So I will say that Bill did get scammed already. Oh, look, Bill was with Bernie Sanders.

• 1:12:13Speaker 04

  Speak of. That's hilarious.

• 1:12:15Laci Mosley?

  That's why you can't be taking too many pictures with folks because then they'll pull the picture up and be like, this you? And it's like, this man asked me for a photo. I didn't know he was robbing everybody.

• 1:12:24Speaker 04

  Literally.

• 1:12:25Laci Mosley?

  And.

• 1:12:25Speaker 04

  Although this is a sidebar, um, Bernie Sanders' wife.

• 1:12:30Speaker 04

  Had a mini scam scandal years ago. They had appointed her to be president of a small college in Vermont. Within three years or so, they ran her out of town because she, through some kind of way, had spent all that university's money. They were broke. They said, "You got to go. We ain't got no more money." Let's do that episode whenever you're ready.

• 1:12:54Laci Mosley?

  Somehow she spent all their money.

• 1:12:57Speaker 04

  You never heard about this?

• 1:12:58Laci Mosley?

  No, that's wild.

• 1:12:59Speaker 04

  She ran a whole college bankrupt.

• 1:13:02Laci Mosley?

  And how, nobody noticed? They weren't like, "Oh, the computer lab, oh..."

• 1:13:07Speaker 04

  What was her name? Jane Sanders. Jane Sanders, college president.

• 1:13:10Laci Mosley?

  They stopped having pizza in the quad. Like, nobody noticed. I just don't understand how she had access to all the funds where they were.

• 1:13:17Speaker 04

  The New York Times article says, "Jane Sanders and the Messy Demise of a Vermont College."

• 1:13:24Laci Mosley?

  Taking a whole college down is a feat.

• 1:13:27Speaker 04

  Can we do this limited series?

• 1:13:29Laci Mosley?

  We might have to come back and see what Jane was up to.

• 1:13:31Speaker 04

  Jane, what was you doing, girl?

• 1:13:33Laci Mosley?

  Jane, and listen, are they still married?

• 1:13:36Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:13:36Laci Mosley?

  You know, he's stuck beside her.

• 1:13:38Speaker 04

  Listen.

• 1:13:39Laci Mosley?

  And what, they got good PR because I never knew about it, okay? So, Bill, I feel like 18 months, he should have got longer, but at the same time, I feel like, one, Bill wasn't stealing the money. He was raising it and lying.

• 1:13:53Speaker 04

  But he was the original scammer in all this.

• 1:13:54Laci Mosley?

  Yes, and he was stealing visas that people were waiting in line for, for sometimes many, it takes years to enter the country legally. He's bumping these people up the line, taking their money. But he was using it for the resort, you know? We saw the waterside.

• 1:14:10Speaker 04

  We did. It was there.

• 1:14:12Laci Mosley?

  It was there.

• 1:14:12Speaker 04

  The indoor ice skating rink, it was there.

• 1:14:14Laci Mosley?

  It was there.

• 1:14:14Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:14:14Laci Mosley?

  You know what I mean? He, he had all the things for the girls. You know, there were so many ambulances, like, they made sure that that place was popping, okay? But he did get scammed as well because Ariel stole his money and then bought.

• 1:14:28Speaker 04

  If a scammer gets scammed, is it even a scam? It's like when you put two negative numbers together, it's a positive?

• 1:14:34Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I mean, it's also just like the SEC coming in and seizing the mountain. It's like... What are y'all doing with it?

• 1:14:41Speaker 04

  Come on.

• 1:14:42Laci Mosley?

  So Bill served nine months in prison and was released March 2023. He was also banned for life from the EB5 program, obviously. We need to ban you for life. Don't come back over here.

• 1:14:56Speaker 04

  Do not.

• 1:14:57Laci Mosley?

  So Jay Peak remained open, but under federal receivership.

• 1:15:02Speaker 04

  Wait, wait, wait. That takes the fun out of it. Yeah, let's go to the slopes. It's the government slopes.

• 1:15:08Laci Mosley?

  The government slopes.

• 1:15:09Speaker 04

  Oh, my goodness.

• 1:15:10Laci Mosley?

  So fall of 2022, the area was purchased by Park City-based Pacific Group Resorts. Now, remember that they bought it for 26 million, right?

• 1:15:21Speaker 04

  Mm-hmm.

• 1:15:23Laci Mosley?

  The feds sold it.

• 1:15:24Speaker 04

  For how much?

• 1:15:25Laci Mosley?

  Seventy-six million.

• 1:15:27Speaker 04

  Feds got the last laugh.

• 1:15:29Laci Mosley?

  Hell, y'all making a come up.

• 1:15:31Speaker 04

  Fed said, "We got it. We gonna recoup."

• 1:15:34Laci Mosley?

  Now, when, because that's my thing about restitution and like, they don't make you pay restitution, but it's rare to me that I have done research and found out that the feds make a profit off of something and then give it back to the investors.

• 1:15:48Speaker 04

  Did they give it back to them?

• 1:15:50Laci Mosley?

  It doesn't say.

• 1:15:51Speaker 04

  I hope they didn't. I hope, I hope some bureaucrat in a windowless cubicle in DC got a little cut of that money. I'd rather them have it than like Bill in Miami.

• 1:16:05Laci Mosley?

  True, and I mean, the investors were also committing fraud. They knew that you're not supposed to be able to skip the line to get a visa for you and your whole family for $500,000.

• 1:16:15Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, no. All of the profit from this sale should have gone to Luann in HR at the SEC. Give her a break. She just out here working.

• 1:16:28Laci Mosley?

  What about the workers?

• 1:16:30Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, them too.

• 1:16:31Laci Mosley?

  They can have a little cut. You know, they ain't never gonna get the workers a cut. No, no, no, no, that's impossible. Oh, goodness, Grish. I mean, how do you feel about the scam?

• 1:16:39Speaker 04

  I mean, it confirms for me a thing that I've thought my entire life as a black man who has never skied. Skiing is a scam.

• 1:16:48Speaker 04

  It's, come on. What y'all doing? What y'all doing? You're gonna break your fucking leg. You know, the, the, the white folks aren't wearing suntan lotion, so they get burnt. You get burnt, you get hypothermia, you spent too much goddamn, damn money, and you broke a, a bone. That's a scam. And then you wanna keep going back.

• 1:17:07Laci Mosley?

  And for as much as it costs, the fact that they don't pay the workers who work there a living wage, like they, the last time that I looked this up, they were on strike. And so like the ski lift lines were so long because they were like, anybody can do this. And now they're, all the rich people are waiting in a line?

• 1:17:23Speaker 04

  Yeah. Waiting in a line to ride them little janky ass ski lifts up the mountain, knowing good and well those ski lifts don't have seat belts.

• 1:17:31Laci Mosley?

  Right.

• 1:17:31Speaker 04

  It's all a scam.

• 1:17:32Laci Mosley?

  It's all a scam. A cue for me? No, a cue for you. I don't wait in lines.

• 1:17:36Speaker 04

  Have you seen the videos of folks falling off ski lifts? It happens.

• 1:17:39Laci Mosley?

  Damn.

• 1:17:39Speaker 04

  They don't have seat belts, Lacey. Have you seen it?

• 1:17:43Laci Mosley?

  I thought they had like a little belt, like, like.

• 1:17:45Speaker 04

  That's not a seatbelt.

• 1:17:46Laci Mosley?

  Like a roller coaster.

• 1:17:46Speaker 04

  It's not a seatbelt. It's like, it's just, it's at will. It's voluntary.

• 1:17:53Speaker 04

  All of skiing isn't, see, look at that. Dangerous.

• 1:17:58Laci Mosley?

  And I love that.

• 1:17:59Speaker 04

  If you choose that, then it's on you.

• 1:18:00Laci Mosley?

  This was the culture. They were like, yeah, y'all go sit up here on this piece of metal.

• 1:18:05Speaker 04

  Let's ride this Costco bench up a fucking mountain.

• 1:18:08Laci Mosley?

  A rocky ass mountain.

• 1:18:09Speaker 04

  And then get down the mountain on two.

• 1:18:12Laci Mosley?

  Sticks.

• 1:18:13Speaker 04

  Two by fours. God damn. It ain't for me.

• 1:18:19Laci Mosley?

  This is an activity for the rich.

• 1:18:20Speaker 04

  Ain't no seat belts on that one?

• 1:18:22Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, no, they don't. You're not locked in. No, you gotta, you gotta hold on.

• 1:18:26Speaker 04

  See? We know. We know.

• 1:18:29Laci Mosley?

  We know. Now, now, I'm, I'm not gonna lie to you. I will, I will be there soon.

• 1:18:32Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:18:33Laci Mosley?

  I gotta get there, okay? I just need to know what's up. I love a good scam. I wanna be, I wanna just get walks. I wanna shuffle around, take a picture.

• 1:18:40Speaker 04

  Tell me how it feels.

• 1:18:41Laci Mosley?

  Then I'm gonna be in the cabin. I might, I might ride the, the, uh, seatbeltless, uh, metal, uh, plywood.

• 1:18:48Speaker 04

  That's on you. That's on you.

• 1:18:50Laci Mosley?

  But I'm gonna ride it all the way around. I'm not getting off.

• 1:18:53Speaker 04

  I'm like, I'll take it back down as well.

• 1:18:56Laci Mosley?

  I just wanna see the sights. That's enough for me. Thank you so much. It was such a lovely time. Yeah, what's, what's, what's, we're looking at ski lifts. What's a ski ticket cost on average? Ski lift tickets. Let's just see. So $300, and that's just the lift.

• 1:19:11Speaker 04

  Oh, girl.

• 1:19:12Laci Mosley?

  That's just the lift to go, that's not the resort, that's not the, the, you know.

• 1:19:16Speaker 04

  I'm paying you to break my goddamn leg.

• 1:19:20Laci Mosley?

  That's not the equipment, that's not like all the jackets and things and helmets and such. That's just to get on the seatbeltless metal.

• 1:19:29Speaker 04

  Come on, that ain't for me. That ain't for me. Skiing is a scam.

• 1:19:34Laci Mosley?

  Alright Sam, I'mma hold you to that because I feel like I'mma see you on some slopes like whee.

• 1:19:37Speaker 04

  We're gonna be like some black alumni weekend ski thing. Yeah, we'll just be there.

• 1:19:42Laci Mosley?

  Listen, we need someplace to talk about our new business venture.

• 1:19:45Speaker 04

  What is a, what is a, what is a horny-toy school in Vermont? Is Dartmouth in Vermont? Burlington seems cute. Middlebury has a good language program. I would go up there for ski weekend and then stick around and learn Spanish.

• 1:20:00Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, claro que sí.

• 1:20:02Speaker 04

  You speak Spanish?

• 1:20:03Laci Mosley?

  Sí, yo no puedo decir.

• 1:20:04Speaker 04

  Teach me.

• 1:20:05Laci Mosley?

  They know here, but I'm like, I need to re-up, I need to get back with that mean ass owl. I learned from being a kid and just being around Spanish speakers. Yeah, but...

• 1:20:14Speaker 04

  If you don't use him, his face changes. The app icon gets like grizzled.

• 1:20:18Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but I learned from speaking it, so it's like I need to go back and like get back into grammar, you know?

• 1:20:24Speaker 04

  I need someone to just like to sponsor me to be in Mexico for six months. Listeners, sponsor me. I'll go down to Mexico City and learn it.

• 1:20:31Laci Mosley?

  And it's for all of you, because then we're also gonna learn about our artificial organs in Mexico because, and then we gonna bring back that technology.

• 1:20:38Speaker 04

  There you go. Yeah, we're working for y'all.

• 1:20:40Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 1:20:41Speaker 04

  We're working for y'all.

• 1:20:43Laci Mosley?

  Quieres organs or no?

• 1:20:48Laci Mosley?

  Oh, Sam, thank you so much for being here.

• 1:20:50Speaker 04

  This was delightful.

• 1:20:51Laci Mosley?

  This was such a good time.

• 1:20:52Speaker 04

  Let me tell you what's never a scam, hanging out with you.

• 1:20:55Laci Mosley?

  Oh, same. I need to do it more now that I'm back stateside. I haven't been in the, in the US in a minute.

• 1:21:02Speaker 04

  Good.

• 1:21:04Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, it was. That was, that part was relaxing.

• 1:21:07Speaker 04

  Let me tell you, as I said earlier, America's a scam right now.

• 1:21:10Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I mean, it's always, it has been, but now it's being revealed to all, you know? And then I never run out of material, unfortunately. But we always ask, where would you like to be found? Anything would like to remote?

• 1:21:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, so you mentioned it earlier when you introduced me, my new show, The Sam Sanders Show from KCRW. We have a very special episode coming out in honor of Grammy Weekend.

• 1:21:32Laci Mosley?

  It's out, you can hear it.

• 1:21:33Speaker 04

  I got to interview Billie Eilish's vocal coach, Doug Peck. This man is amazing. He's vocal coached Billie Eilish. He's also vocal coached Patti Lupone and Hayley Williams of Paramore.

• 1:21:45Laci Mosley?

  Okay, these are voices.

• 1:21:46Speaker 04

  He's worked with some heavy hitters.

• 1:21:47Laci Mosley?

  Patti Lupone and Hayley Williams, those are voices.

• 1:21:49Speaker 04

  And so he tells me all about what that's like. But we also had him sit down with me in a studio with a piano. And he walks me through, for the benefit of all y'all, some vocal coaching.

• 1:21:59Laci Mosley?

  Ooh.

• 1:21:59Speaker 04

  So I do some little vocalizations with him. And he teaches me some tips and tricks that like you can also use to be out here singing like Billie Eilish.

• 1:22:07Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 1:22:08Speaker 04

  It was so fun. So you can find that on YouTube or in podcast feeds. Just look for The Sam Sanders Show. It's there and a bunch of other episodes as well. And then, of course, you know, my sisters over at Vibe Check, Zach and Said.

• 1:22:21Laci Mosley?

  Love them.

• 1:22:21Speaker 04

  We have Akiki every week. And that show, Vibe Check, publishes episodes every Wednesday.

• 1:22:27Laci Mosley?

  Yes, get into it. And y'all, you can watch Scam Goddess, Free Form on Wednesdays. And it's out now on Hulu. There's a few episodes out on Hulu as well. So come with me to cities all across America as I investigate scams and get the tea on the scammers and even meet some scammers, which is terrifying. You can also buy my book, Scam Goddess, wherever books are purchased. And watch Going Dutch, yes, on Fox. Which is like you have one more show, you're missing one. Yeah, he gave me a salute, was like, oh, you're missing one. Yes, watch Going Dutch. It's on Fox on Thursdays, next day Hulu as well. So get into the shows, y'all.

• 1:23:06Speaker 04

  You stay working.

• 1:23:07Laci Mosley?

  For the scams. I mean, listen, I knew the times were about to be rough. I was like, let me get all my black people jobs before they take away the black jobs.

• 1:23:14Speaker 04

  Before the tariffs come up in here, all that stuff. Oy, oy, oy, oy. Just wait till the egg tariffs hit.

• 1:23:20Laci Mosley?

  Oh, my goodness. And the only one, Sam's gonna be eating eggs. I'm gonna be at his house.

• 1:23:24Speaker 04

  Seven eleven eggs.

• 1:23:26Laci Mosley?

  That's still so wild. All right, congregation, y'all get out there and... Get yourself an aerial view, you know, from the mountain top.

• 1:23:37Speaker 04

  Let's get a pitch deck together and get some investors lined up. You and me could work a room.

• 1:23:41Laci Mosley?

  We could.

• 1:23:42Speaker 04

  We could work a room.

• 1:23:42Laci Mosley?

  Everyone, get a pitch deck together. It doesn't matter about what, okay? Get on Canva.

• 1:23:47Speaker 04

  Just believe.

• 1:23:48Laci Mosley?

  Just believe.

• 1:23:49Speaker 04

  Just believe. Believe as Elizabeth Holmes believed in herself. She's still my favorite scam of all time.

• 1:23:55Laci Mosley?

  She's one of my favorites, too.

• 1:23:56Speaker 04

  Because she literally was like, if I just wear the turtleneck and deepen the voice.

• 1:23:59Laci Mosley?

  And she, and it works still.

• 1:24:00Speaker 04

  It worked.

• 1:24:03Laci Mosley?

  Yes, y'all get out there. Now the new Silicone Valley drip is like a pullover and like some expensive white shoes that no one can really tell. Get some Common Projects and a pullover.

• 1:24:11Speaker 04

  And like some J. Paul curls.

• 1:24:13Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:24:14Speaker 04

  Zuckerberg has gone full Paul Curly-ian.

• 1:24:16Laci Mosley?

  He has, but we know he's rich already. If you're not, you gotta just do the pullover and just like khakis that somehow look very expensive, you know? Get out there, walk slow, talk even slower, take up space. Love this for you.

• 1:24:31Speaker 04

  We love it, we love it.

• 1:24:36Laci Mosley?

  This has been an Earwolf Production in association with Team Coco. Scam Goddess stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Our producer is Scott Zani, and our audio engineer is Rich Garcia. Research for the show is done by Kate Doyle. Stay scheming.

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