A Star Wasn't Born w/ Justin Halpern

CONgregation, Laci is joined today by producer and writing genius Justin Halpern (Abbott Elementary, Harley Quinn). Together, they listen to the music and dig into the story of this week's scammer, Mike Smith, a suburban dad and aspiring musician who made $10 million by creating thousands of fake listeners to stream his (also fake) music so he could rake in the royalties. Plus, in this dad-centric episode, Laci asks: Are love, credit, and tax accountants a scam, a scheme, or the real thing? Stay schemin’! Keep the scams coming and snitch on your friends by emailing us at [email protected]. Follow on Instagram: Scam Goddess Pod: @scamgoddesspod Laci Mosley: @divalaci Justin Halpern: @justinshalpern Research by Kathryn Doyle SOURCES https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/streaming-fraud-fake-streams-mike-smith-1235500686/ https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/north-carolina-musician-charged-music-streaming-fraud-aided-artificial-intelligence https://www.wired.com/story/ai-bots-streaming-music/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RpxiEuGuUw

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Cash flow crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds, up to $200,000, right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. With flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment, get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  This January, bare-knuckle fighting championship takes over the ocean. The inaugural Brew's Crew sails from Miami to the Bahamas aboard the Norwegian Jewel. Three straight days with pool-deck bare-knuckle fights in the Caribbean. Mess of parties, beach events, DJs, cigars, tequila tastings, and non-stop action. The lineup reveals coming soon. Cabins are disappearing fast, and the prices won't stay this low. Reserve your spot with just $200 down at bkfsea.com.

• 1:00Speaker 02

  Buick knows confidence changes how you move through the world. That's why Buick designs SUVs with striking style and was named the most dependable mass-market brand by J.D. Power. From the head-turning Buick En vista to the seven-passenger Enclave, experience the Buick SUV lineup at buick.com. Buick: Exceptional by Design. Buick received the fewest reported problems in its segment in the J.D. Power 2025-2026 U.S. Vehicle Dependability Studies, based on 2022-2023 models. For J.D. Power 2026 award information, visit jdpower.com/awards.

• 1:49Laci Mosley?

  What's poppin', congregation? It's your girl, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess, back with another installment about the podcast about robbery, fraud, and those who practice it. Sometimes we love them, sometimes we hate them, but we will always laugh at them because this is a comedy show, but never the victims, hey? Congregation, what am I? Excited? Yes, thrilled. Thank you for the call and response. I am thrilled to have our guest today. He is a new member of the church. This is his first time at service, so please give him a warm welcome, even though he's probably already been welcomed into your homes and your lives for a long time. He is the hilarious Emmy-winning co-showrunner of Abbott Elementary.

• 2:32Laci Mosley?

  He co-developed the acclaimed animated series Harley Quinn. He gained initial fame from creating the Twitter feed and bestselling book, Shit My Dad Says, A Man, and is releasing a novel called Get Lost, a fast-paced and hilarious thriller about a young woman who reluctantly teams up with her deadbeat dad to find her missing mom. When does he sleep? And he is a dad? Y'all know dads could be scams, but obviously, Justin Halper is not. And congregation, please get up out of your seats. Stand up in your cars at the red light. And welcome, Justin Halper, to the show. Hello, Justin.

• 3:12Speaker 04

  Hello. Thank you for having me. What an intro. Wow.

• 3:15Laci Mosley?

  Thank you for being here.

• 3:16Speaker 04

  I'm very excited to talk scams.

• 3:18Laci Mosley?

  I'm really like trying to do intros as a metaphor in my own life for my own funeral. I hope someone does my intro to my funeral like this.

• 3:28Speaker 04

  Wow, that would be...

• 3:29Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 3:30Speaker 04

  That would really be like an amped way to start a funeral. I feel like usually people go low, but I think pumping up a funeral...

• 3:37Laci Mosley?

  I don't even want my casket to be there when people arrive. I want it to be announced who's dead, and then they roll out the casket with music.

• 3:46Speaker 04

  Like the beginning of like a Lakers game?

• 3:47Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 3:48Speaker 04

  Where they're like, "At five foot nine..."

• 3:50Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 3:51Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 3:52Laci Mosley?

  "At five foot nine, about to be six foot under."

• 3:58Laci Mosley?

  "Lacy Moses." You know, yeah.

• 4:00Speaker 04

  That's pretty great.

• 4:01Laci Mosley?

  Like a little reel of my greatest hits.

• 4:04Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah. Maybe the lights go dark first and then...

• 4:07Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and then we get some build-up music.

• 4:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 4:09Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 4:10Speaker 04

  But now I want to go to a funeral. Now I really want, yeah. You can outlive me by about 30 years, but I still want to try.

• 4:16Laci Mosley?

  Oh, who knows? Who knows? And Justin, you might need to be responsible for writing my intro. You're very good at writing.

• 4:23Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 4:24Laci Mosley?

  That much is for sure. All the Emmys and accolades and shows that I watch and love. So, uh, yeah.

• 4:30Speaker 04

  I found the one thing I can do.

• 4:32Laci Mosley?

  That was the whole scam here, was to get you here, so you could write my...

• 4:38Laci Mosley?

  No, but I want to know about your relationship with scams. And lately on this show, I've been asking my guests their opinions, their expert opinions on three random topics. And I want to know for each topic, is it a scam to you? Is it a scheme to you? Or is it a real thing? So is it a scam, a scheme, or a real thing? The first one is tax accountants. Scam, scheme, or real thing? And I will define that a scam is like in arguably a grift. A scheme is a little scammy, but legitimate. And then a real thing, obviously, is a real thing.

• 5:15Speaker 04

  Uh, I would say if you make over $5 million a year, it's a scam.

• 5:19Laci Mosley?

  Ooh.

• 5:21Speaker 04

  And not the rich person getting scammed. It's, it's all of us, everyone else getting scammed.

• 5:28Laci Mosley?

  I know where you're going.

• 5:29Speaker 04

  Under that, I'd say a real thing.

• 5:31Laci Mosley?

  Oh, it is a scam when you get richer. Because then it's harder to tax you.

• 5:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's impossible.

• 5:39Laci Mosley?

  And the IRS is criminally underfunded. And like, when you get so rich that you could just send U-Haul trucks to the IRS and be like, try to find the needle in the haystack.

• 5:48Speaker 04

  Yep, you send a thousand pages of documents, all reporting losses. That is a total scam.

• 5:55Laci Mosley?

  I am so poor. Don't look at me on my yacht, I'm poor.

• 5:57Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 5:58Laci Mosley?

  This is my poverty yacht. I'm so poor, I have to live on water.

• 6:01Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 6:01Laci Mosley?

  I can't even board land.

• 6:03Speaker 04

  Yeah. I'm always floating back and forth.

• 6:05Laci Mosley?

  I have to be in Greece. There's nowhere else I can go.

• 6:08Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:08Laci Mosley?

  Because of my poverty.

• 6:09Speaker 04

  Also, if you have to send your money to another country on a one stop, then that means that you're, you're a scam.

• 6:15Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, a dream of mine.

• 6:17Speaker 04

  To, for your money to live somewhere else?

• 6:18Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yes. I'm trying to get to Switzerland. I'm definitely trying to get to the Caymans. Uh, like, I remember visiting the Cayman Islands. And I think that they're probably the least friendly tourist spot in the islands, in that area. And I was always wondering why. And then I was like, oh, because they don't need tourism that bad.

• 6:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 6:41Laci Mosley?

  They have everyone hiding their money there. They were like, listen, little white girl, we not gonna braid your hair and put puka shells in it. We don't give a fuck.

• 6:49Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 6:49Laci Mosley?

  And I love that for them.

• 6:50Speaker 04

  Yeah, they have no kids' clubs there. There's no, yeah, they don't give a shit.

• 6:56Laci Mosley?

  Kids, fuck your kids.

• 6:57Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right.

• 6:59Laci Mosley?

  We're not your kids, Justin.

• 7:00Speaker 04

  No, mine too. Let's just.

• 7:07Laci Mosley?

  Oh my goodness. Okay, my next question for you, scam scheme or real thing, Justin? Credit.

• 7:13Speaker 04

  Oh, that's a scam.

• 7:14Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:15Speaker 04

  That's a total scam. Because it just preys on people who can't afford to pay off their bill every month.

• 7:21Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm.

• 7:21Speaker 04

  And then they use all that money that they get, all those late fees and stuff, to, you know, subsidize all the other bullshit they do. That's a scam.

• 7:28Laci Mosley?

  Right? And it was invented in the 80s.

• 7:32Speaker 04

  Anything invented in the 80s is a scam.

• 7:34Laci Mosley?

  Anything invented in the 80s, you know somebody was on cocaine when they made it.

• 7:38Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 7:39Laci Mosley?

  And they're like, what about this? Numbers. We make numbers.

• 7:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 7:42Laci Mosley?

  And those numbers aside, who we give the houses to? Hey, everybody? Sounds great.

• 7:47Speaker 04

  That's right. In the 80s, you did cocaine, you either created Die Hard or a scam. That's it.

• 7:53Laci Mosley?

  I would rather create Die Hard, but maybe I would love also to make a scam.

• 7:57Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's just true.

• 7:58Laci Mosley?

  It might be the best time for scams. I mean, Madoff was doing well in the 80s, you know?

• 8:02Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 8:03Laci Mosley?

  And he made off with everybody's money.

• 8:04Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 8:05Laci Mosley?

  So maybe. I, I, I happen to agree with you on that, for sure. Uh, the last question, scam scheme, real thing, love.

• 8:14Speaker 04

  Oh, real thing.

• 8:15Laci Mosley?

  Oh.

• 8:16Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right. That's right. It's a real thing. Doesn't mean we all get it, but it's a real thing.

• 8:23Laci Mosley?

  Damn. Maybe you can't have none, but Justin, Justin over here saying like, it is real. Y'all don't know about it, but I do.

• 8:31Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 8:31Laci Mosley?

  Oh, that's beautiful. Why do you think so?

• 8:35Speaker 04

  I've been happily married and in real love for, for, well, I should know this if I'm happily married, uh, 16 years.

• 8:42Laci Mosley?

  Wow.

• 8:43Speaker 04

  And I, I 100% feel it's a real thing.

• 8:46Laci Mosley?

  16 years?

• 8:48Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 8:49Laci Mosley?

  That is a long time.

• 8:52Speaker 04

  It is a long time. It does feel like a long time. We were at a wedding and they do that thing where it's like, oh, if you've been on the, been married more than five years, get off the dance floor, you know, to see. And they keep going up and up every year. And I was like, damn, we're one of the last ones here.

• 9:05Laci Mosley?

  I actually love that. And perhaps if I ever trick someone into getting the government involved in a relationship with me. We'll do that because I inadvertently actually did that for my friend Taylor Mishak. I was making cards for like, I did this like whole wedding decoration in her trailer and stuff. Because while we were shooting Going Dutch, the first season, she had to fly home, get married, and fly back. And so her husband came with her on the way back. But we, obviously, you know, when you book a flight, you'll book a job. And sometimes I guess when you book a wedding, you'll book a job.

• 9:40Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 9:41Laci Mosley?

  And she was like, this venue is way too expensive. Y'all gonna have to get move some stuff around so I could at least get home. So they gave her like an extended weekend. So I decorated her trailer and got a bunch of like bridal stuff and gifts and things. But then when I asked people to sign cards, I had three different cards. There was one for the cast, there was one for the crew, and then there was one for anybody who had been married over 10 years.

• 10:10Speaker 04

  And how many was that? Was that like a large section? Or was it, you're surprised to find out a ton?

• 10:15Laci Mosley?

  It was. But, but it was, it was funny because I had to do what your, your friends did at their wedding. Where it's like, if you've been married for five years, get off the dance floor. I had to literally hold the card up to people and be like, hey, how long have you been married? Okay, hold, sign this one, not that one.

• 10:31Laci Mosley?

  But then for like people who had long lasting marriages, like sign this one with.

• 10:34Speaker 04

  So were they signing or were they writing a little message too?

• 10:37Laci Mosley?

  They were writing a little message.

• 10:38Speaker 04

  So what group wrote the best messages?

• 10:40Laci Mosley?

  Oh, it was absolutely the people who had been over married over 10 years. Joe Morton wrote the best mess. Like, he's just a poet and a genius and a savant. He doesn't really watch TV, he just lives life.

• 10:54Speaker 04

  That's shocking. I can't do that.

• 10:57Laci Mosley?

  I can't either. I love TV.

• 10:59Speaker 04

  Me too.

• 10:59Laci Mosley?

  He's like doing falconry. And I'm like, you sure you don't want this VPN? Because even though we in Ireland, we can tell everybody we in New Jersey, so you can download these shows.

• 11:09Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, my, my bad. I did watch a lot of Abbott from New Jersey.

• 11:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, that's right. Listen, any way we can get it.

• 11:16Laci Mosley?

  Okay, it's still, I think it's still counted as a stream.

• 11:18Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, it counts. I think I still see something from it.

• 11:23Laci Mosley?

  Oh my goodness. Well, thank you. I love, I love those opinions. Have you ever been scammed, Justin?

• 11:27Speaker 04

  I'm sure many, many times. I've been part of scams.

• 11:31Laci Mosley?

  Oh.

• 11:32Speaker 04

  Yes, yes, I-

• 11:34Laci Mosley?

  Wow, you jumped from victim to participant real quick.

• 11:37Speaker 04

  I know, I know. I, I was, sometimes, one time, I used to work in an internet company. This company called Break.com, which doesn't exist anymore. It was like a video sharing company. Maybe you remember?

• 11:47Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 11:48Speaker 04

  And, yeah, that's probably better.

• 11:50Laci Mosley?

  But you started by calling it an internet company, which already told me it was a scam.

• 11:53Speaker 04

  Yeah, right, right, right. And-

• 11:55Laci Mosley?

  Break.com.

• 11:56Speaker 04

  Yeah. And they would be like Coca-Cola would like wanna place their ad on the video page and they would promise they'd say, okay, you're gonna get 100,000 views and you pay us money for those 100,000 views guaranteed. But what we would do on our side is we would go to, we had to deal with this super nasty porn site. And on their site-

• 12:17Laci Mosley?

  Super nasty porn is crazy.

• 12:19Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right.

• 12:19Laci Mosley?

  Porn itself already sounds bad.

• 12:21Speaker 04

  I felt necessary, yeah, that's right. I felt necessary to clarify that's what this porn site was. It wasn't just one of your mom and pop porn sites.

• 12:28Laci Mosley?

  No, no, no, no, no.

• 12:29Speaker 04

  One of your nice, down the middle porn sites. This was nasty.

• 12:33Laci Mosley?

  This wasn't your suburban porn site.

• 12:34Speaker 04

  No, no.

• 12:35Laci Mosley?

  This was super nasty, okay?

• 12:36Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 12:36Laci Mosley?

  And so y'all had to deal with them?

• 12:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, and so what we'd do is on their page, on their site, it would be like, uh, gangbang of four chicks and two, like, whatever. And it'd have a thumbnail of that. But then when their users would click it, it'd be like Coca-Cola, the brand blah blah. And so, and then it would, we'd get all these views, right? We'd get like a, because nobody's gonna actually click on a Coca-Cola ad, but they will if they think it's a gangbang. And so, uh, my job was to put that video up and then send it to the porn company.

• 13:08Laci Mosley?

  Not the gangbang video, the Coca-Cola.

• 13:09Speaker 04

  No, no, no, I didn't put up the gangbang video. I was on the A side of that. Um, and-

• 13:15Laci Mosley?

  Wow, Justin, you were the original bot.

• 13:17Speaker 04

  That's right, yes.

• 13:19Laci Mosley?

  That's, see, that's kinda botting I can appreciate. Now it's just random and they're just under everything and they're saying random stuff. I would appreciate being tricked out of, you know, what, what if my super nasty porn, uh, affliction ended because of a Coca-Cola?

• 13:35Speaker 04

  You think we brought people to the light?

• 13:40Laci Mosley?

  This is how I stopped doing super nasty porn watching.

• 13:43Speaker 04

  I'm gonna say they weren't holding that when they clicked the ad. They were holding something else. But-

• 13:50Speaker 04

  It was, uh, yeah. So then, actually, the way we got caught, and by the way, it wasn't my idea. I was just pushing the buttons. But, um, the way we got caught is the, the, the company was like, "Hey, how come people are only watching our ad for .004 seconds?"

• 14:06Laci Mosley?

  Oh damn, they started looking at the reach.

• 14:08Speaker 04

  Because people would click it, see it wasn't what they thought it was, and then click out.

• 14:11Laci Mosley?

  And then they went back. They weren't, they weren't Coca-Cola.

• 14:14Speaker 04

  No, no, they were, or they were, but not in that moment.

• 14:17Laci Mosley?

  But not in that way, or in that moment.

• 14:19Speaker 04

  No.

• 14:20Laci Mosley?

  Oh, wow. I mean, but, but I think that they couldn't get upset about that, because this, to me, like, it is scamming the, the nasty porn watchers, but for the company who paid for the advertisement, they got the views.

• 14:34Speaker 04

  That's true.

• 14:35Laci Mosley?

  What if you finish your session, and then all of a sudden, you're jonesing for an ice cold Coke?

• 14:39Speaker 04

  Maybe people are, nobody's in a better spot to take, uh, in advertising than maybe the person who clicked on that ad. Like, they're susceptible to anything in that moment. They're really open.

• 14:50Laci Mosley?

  They are really open, and in more ways than one.

• 14:54Speaker 04

  The jerk-off demographic is really underutilized.

• 14:57Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, if someone had advertised to me while I had my cootie out, yeah, that's, that's like memorable. That's a memorable experience. I'll never forget it, because I'm very vulnerable in that moment. I'm gonna remember everything.

• 15:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 15:10Laci Mosley?

  You, you got your lotion and your tissue, and you, and you, and, and what, maybe you're in the bathroom hiding from your bed? Adrenaline is up. You're gonna remember.

• 15:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're gonna know. And then afterwards, you're gonna want maybe a Coca-Cola.

• 15:24Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 15:25Speaker 04

  Yeah. So maybe you're right. You know what? Maybe it wasn't a scam. Maybe this all, maybe this is all legit.

• 15:31Laci Mosley?

  I mean, I think break.com was, was giving everybody a break.

• 15:34Speaker 04

  They were. Until they went out of business, but yeah.

• 15:38Laci Mosley?

  I think we should bring them back.

• 15:41Speaker 04

  It is a business model there, for sure.

• 15:43Laci Mosley?

  It is.

• 15:47Speaker 00

  OnDeck is built to back small businesses like yours. Whether you're buying equipment, expanding your team, or bridging cash flow gaps, OnDeck's loans up to $400,000 make it happen fast. Rated A+ by the Better Business Bureau and earning thousands of five-star TrustPilot reviews, OnDeck delivers funding you can count on. Apply in minutes at ondeck.com. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 16:15Speaker 01

  This January, bare-knuckle fighting championship takes over the ocean. The inaugural Brew's Cruise sails from Miami to the Bahamas aboard the Norwegian Jewel. Three straight days with pool-deck bare-knuckle fights in the Caribbean. Mess of parties, beach events, DJs, cigars, tequila tastings, and non-stop action. The lineup reveals coming soon. Cabins are disappearing fast, and the prices won't stay this low. Reserve your spot with just $200 down at B K F S E A dot com.

• 16:47Speaker 05

  Chevy is called the heartbeat of America for a reason, and Silverado keeps its rhythm. You feel it in the Turbo Max engine with best-in-class standard torque and available Z71 off-road package that keeps you rolling when the road turns rough. And the most functional truck bed with best-in-class cargo space. They're trucks that work as hard as you do, so you can do more of what you love without missing a beat. Chevrolet. Together, let's drive. Based on latest competitive information, excludes other GM vehicles.

• 17:18Laci Mosley?

  Oh my gosh, tangent, but we'll get into the story. But that also makes me think of like how, you know, certain websites, like porn websites, have like communities and comment sections.

• 17:28Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 17:28Laci Mosley?

  And I'm like, who is bonding over this? Who finishes whatever they're doing to themselves and is like, I need to leave a comment?

• 17:36Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah.

• 17:37Laci Mosley?

  I have thoughts.

• 17:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, exactly. That I couldn't keep to myself. But I needed other people to know. Also, when you finish doing that, the ability to do anything usually is pretty tough. So the magic, you know.

• 17:50Laci Mosley?

  Right. Which makes me think these are like, super type A people.

• 17:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 17:54Laci Mosley?

  Who like, maybe schedule their diddling in their day. And there's like, "Time to diddle. Alright, seven minutes out the window."

• 18:02Laci Mosley?

  "Time for me to leave a response."

• 18:03Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:04Laci Mosley?

  "I really enjoyed this video. I thought we got great to the point."

• 18:08Speaker 04

  I think it's people on both ends of the productivity spectrum. It's the people who probably don't get anything done an entire day, and the people who are like, the CEOs of companies.

• 18:17Laci Mosley?

  You're absolutely right. I think it's exactly that. It's how they always say that if you are miserable, you either have not enough money, or way too much.

• 18:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right. Yeah. If you're leaving a comment on a porn video.

• 18:31Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, you're on that spectrum.

• 18:32Speaker 04

  Too much time, or not enough.

• 18:33Laci Mosley?

  Or not enough.

• 18:34Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 18:36Speaker 04

  Sometimes I think about this one comment I saw once on a porn video, and it just said, "Hey, great job."

• 18:42Laci Mosley?

  Oh.

• 18:43Speaker 04

  And I thought, wow, they, like, I was like, they must think that the person in the porn went back and, I guess, read the comments.

• 18:50Laci Mosley?

  They might have. People look at their views, and people like, you know, wanna make sure that they're spreading, you know, the, disseminating the, um, the, the work.

• 19:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 19:00Laci Mosley?

  The, the products. Oh my gosh, I sound like such a prude. But, the work, the, the pornographic cinema.

• 19:09Speaker 04

  Pornographic cinema, yes.

• 19:11Laci Mosley?

  No, but, but, but I, I think that's lovely. You did say, Justin, there, that love is not a scam.

• 19:16Speaker 04

  That's true.

• 19:16Laci Mosley?

  And so, that was very sweet of them to say, "Good job, guys."

• 19:19Speaker 04

  You know, might have cheered up that person. They were having a tough day. They went and looked at the comment section of the porn that they're in.

• 19:24Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. You know what? You guys get on Apple Podcasts and leave me a good job. And five stars, okay? Break.com isn't here anymore, okay? But if it was, I, I would advertise on it. I would love for it to be like, "Nasty sex binge before it scam got it." And then, maybe you would listen to the podcast afterwards. But let's get into my favorite segment here. Historic hoodwings. This is where I will regale Justin with a famous con caper scheme. Maybe it's a group of criminals, a single actor, a couple. We don't know yet. And we'll get his opinions all throughout. So, today, keeping up on our dad theme.

• 20:04Laci Mosley?

  Because we've talked about all the things that dads love.

• 20:06Speaker 04

  Yeah, we got porn and then I think something else.

• 20:09Laci Mosley?

  Coca-Cola. Love being tax accountants.

• 20:14Speaker 04

  It really is a dad-centric start to this.

• 20:17Laci Mosley?

  Making up credit in the 80s, definitely someone's father.

• 20:22Laci Mosley?

  So we're talking about a suburban dad and aspiring musician, Mike Smith, who made $10 million by creating thousands of fake listeners. Was he also a brick, a brick.com? Justin, was this you? No, no, I'm playing.

• 20:40Speaker 04

  Wow, I wish.

• 20:41Laci Mosley?

  Were you Latino?

• 20:42Speaker 04

  No, but I wish I could pull off that hat.

• 20:45Laci Mosley?

  I don't know, Justin, it's giving. You might have had a tan and you had some biceps.

• 20:51Speaker 04

  That is the best I've ever looked.

• 20:56Speaker 04

  By the way, why, every photo musician, they can never look at the camera. It's always like off into the distance.

• 21:01Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, musicians are the only people who can get away with fedoras. It's still icky.

• 21:05Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 21:06Laci Mosley?

  It's still icky. But when a musician wears it, it's like, oh, are you Santana? Like, we'll let this happen. Other than that, stop wearing them, especially if you're approaching people for threesomes. I told you, it's always a really beautiful woman who approaches me and a man in a fedora in the corner like, yes. And I'm like, no, her, sure, you, no.

• 21:27Speaker 04

  Well, that's why he's gotta send her over.

• 21:29Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but also he could not wear the fedora.

• 21:32Speaker 04

  Yeah, but I feel like once you're into threesomes, you have to have some kind of hat. You can't, you can't just have your regular hairstyle.

• 21:39Laci Mosley?

  But I feel like that's not the hat that convinces me you're good at threesomes.

• 21:42Speaker 04

  No, I don't know why I'm defending this hypothetical guy in the threesomes.

• 21:46Laci Mosley?

  Are you a fedora owner, Justin?

• 21:47Speaker 04

  I'm not, but I'm bald and I like hats.

• 21:51Laci Mosley?

  I like hats too. But I also love that he's posed in front of this graffiti wall, holding his guitar, looking like he's mid-strum. It's really giving. It's giving, Jason. It's giving Jason Maras.

• 22:04Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 22:05Laci Mosley?

  I agree, Jess. It's also giving Jason Derulo. I feel like he could do a flip. Look at all that white he got on. You know he can do a flip.

• 22:14Speaker 04

  Has he got a vest on, too?

• 22:16Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. A white vest over a white t-shirt with white pants. Is that not Jason Derulo? Okay. I bet you he could do a flip and the fedora stays on.

• 22:28Speaker 04

  See, that's the kind of guy I want in a threesome.

• 22:31Laci Mosley?

  Okay, okay, okay. Now you're, don't, don't, don't make me like that.

• 22:37Laci Mosley?

  Now, if I get into the situation, Justin, I'm going to call you. They're like, I didn't, I can't believe it.

• 22:42Speaker 04

  It happened. He did a flip right in front of me. Now all three of us are naked.

• 22:45Laci Mosley?

  And the hat was on and I was like, okay, give me your hotel room key. I'll come. Okay, I'll be there. So this, this suburban dad, an aspiring musician, Mike Smith, he made $10 million by creating thousands of fake listeners to stream his also fake music. So he could rake in the royalties. So Mike was a dad in his 40s who wore tight shirts and owned a chain of urgent care facilities.

• 23:10Speaker 04

  Oh, man, that was not where I thought that was going. Wow. Really, anybody but, anywhere but there.

• 23:19Laci Mosley?

  Oh, you didn't think it was gonna go from tight shirts to urgent care?

• 23:23Speaker 04

  Tight shirts and also rescued dogs.

• 23:26Laci Mosley?

  Right? Like, I don't know if I wore tight shirts and I'm like, I think I have strep. And then just the tightest-shirted man.

• 23:34Speaker 04

  This is such a specific kind of person in their 40s, really, though. As a man in my 40s, you have to make the decision that you're never gonna wear anything super tight again. You have to.

• 23:45Laci Mosley?

  I know you have a good bod.

• 23:46Speaker 04

  I don't, but thank you.

• 23:48Laci Mosley?

  I know you do some type of recreational sport. What is it?

• 23:50Speaker 04

  No, I don't, no. It mostly just looks like I have cancer. But I... But I don't, and I appreciate and support everyone who does. But I don't, but I look like I do. And, and so that's why I wouldn't wear it. That's why if something looks tight on me, it's simply just because I'm, I'm deathly skinny. But this man, I think, he obviously works out probably no more than two days a week, but none of them are leg day.

• 24:18Laci Mosley?

  No, no, no, you know those calves are skinny.

• 24:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, they are. But I think he like feels good enough to try to wear that tight shirt. And I think as a guy in your 40s, you have to just transition out of this shirt.

• 24:28Laci Mosley?

  I mean, there are people who accept that they're in their 40s and they hang out with people of their own age and their own ilk because they enjoy the camaraderie of talking about things with people your own age. And like, my little sister moved to Los Angeles to go to grad school. And I realized, like, cause I was like, oh, I was, I was going out of town again to shoot Going Dutch in Ireland. I do that for like four months a year. And I was like, oh, I don't know anybody. Like, I need to find some friends for her because I'm gonna be gone and I don't want her to be alone. And so then I started thinking like, who are my friends in their early to mid 20s? And I was like, I don't know anybody in their early to mid 20s.

• 25:10Laci Mosley?

  I literally had to ask friends and then be like, can your cousin, you wanna do a cousin date with my sister so they can meet and they could, they could be friends? Like, I didn't know anybody. But that guy, that guy in that tight ass shirt, he knows all the people in their 20s and probably some club promoters still.

• 25:27Speaker 04

  Yeah, and that's probably really problematic. I don't know that he's probably had one good interaction with one person in their 20s.

• 25:34Laci Mosley?

  I don't know. Sometimes when I was in college, there would be an old person and like, there was this, this football player who, ex-football player who owned a chain of check cashing places.

• 25:46Speaker 04

  Well, see, I didn't think he was going there either.

• 25:48Laci Mosley?

  See? And, and that's the same with him. He's a tight-shirted man who owns some urgent care. So maybe that's the formula is you gotta have one thing that don't go with the other. And then you stay in the pocket. And he was in his 50s. He would take us to the clubs, he would take us everywhere. And, uh, you know, one time, uh, he did trip and fall. And that's when I really realized how old he was. Because when he tripped and fell, like, we were all out and drinking and stuff. But if it had been a younger person tripping and falling, I think we all would have laughed and been like, "Oh, bitch, get up." The gasp and the silence when this old man fell, we was like, "Oh, my God, is he gonna die? Is he dead?"

• 26:29Speaker 04

  By the way, that was his nightmare. Because he would have felt so much better if everyone laughed. But the fact that you were seriously concerned about his health, that's what that, that, nothing is more sobering than people recognizing how old you are.

• 26:42Laci Mosley?

  Right. When you start tripping and people are concerned if you're okay and not making fun of you, yeah, you turned a corner. You've turned a corner. And so, you know, he got the tight shirts on, he's got the urgent care. And this is when he decided to start self-rising, or self-financing a rise to music stardom, because tight shirts and urgent care were not enough for him. So, he lived in a big house in Charlotte, North Carolina with his six kids and wife, until that stopped inspiring him. And he got a divorce.

• 27:10Speaker 04

  I didn't know we had to be inspired to stay married.

• 27:13Laci Mosley?

  I mean, you've been married for 16 years. I think you've been inspired.

• 27:16Speaker 04

  I guess that's true. You're right.

• 27:18Laci Mosley?

  And, and Mike, Mike said, "I'm not inspired by my family no more."

• 27:24Laci Mosley?

  Y'all ain't got the riz no more, okay? They stopped wearing tight shirts. He was like, "I'm out of here." "You fruit of the loom ass bitches, I can't be with you no more." So, he reconnected with and married his college girlfriend, which reminded him how much he liked a jam session back in college.

• 27:44Speaker 04

  You're describing the saddest man in the world.

• 27:48Laci Mosley?

  He should've stayed with his family.

• 27:49Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 27:51Laci Mosley?

  Because he went and married somebody who encouraged his corniness. And I'm sure his friend in college, who is unmarried at this age, was like, "Mm, you know what? He got them urgent cares. I'm gonna ignore the fact that his nipples are rock hard in every room we go into, cuz I need financial stability in a person of my own age." And then she was like, "Yeah, baby, get, get back into jamming."

• 28:12Speaker 04

  Duh, man.

• 28:13Laci Mosley?

  We do the garage.

• 28:15Speaker 04

  No one's ever been more divorced than this guy. This is, wow.

• 28:20Laci Mosley?

  That does feel like a divorced man's hobby.

• 28:21Speaker 04

  Yeah, no one jams but divorced dads. They're the only people who jam.

• 28:25Laci Mosley?

  Divorced dads jam and dads who have been married and you know for like 40 years, they put like together boats and bottles.

• 28:34Speaker 04

  Yes, yeah, and intricate train sets.

• 28:37Laci Mosley?

  Intricate train sets, yes, and that gives them the thrill up their leg that they need. So he knew how to play the guitar, banjo, piano, drums, bass, mandolin, and the dulcimer?

• 28:49Speaker 04

  Wow, I've never heard of that.

• 28:50Laci Mosley?

  I don't know if I've heard that in my ear or heard of it at all, but and he always thought that he could be a star. So this newly.

• 29:00Laci Mosley?

  God, Justin, don't laugh at him.

• 29:02Speaker 04

  I'm sorry, keep going.

• 29:03Laci Mosley?

  He could be a star, Justin.

• 29:04Speaker 04

  He could, you're right.

• 29:05Laci Mosley?

  So this newly divorced guy used the money from his medical business to fund his music career because he thought treatment, treating people for ailments, that wasn't enough for the world. He said, fuck that, I actually need, my music is gonna heal y'all even more.

• 29:23Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 29:23Laci Mosley?

  Even more.

• 29:24Speaker 04

  Not my urgent care.

• 29:27Speaker 04

  That's gonna rack up the bills to pay for this.

• 29:31Laci Mosley?

  He decided he was the Patch Adams of music. Say, all y'all need is a little music, y'all gonna be okay.

• 29:39Laci Mosley?

  So Mike linked up with a music publicist named Hay, best known for promoting.

• 29:44Speaker 04

  Wait, what?

• 29:45Laci Mosley?

  His name was Hay, this is Hay.

• 29:47Speaker 04

  Yeah, that is absolutely Hay.

• 29:50Laci Mosley?

  He looks like Hay.

• 29:51Speaker 04

  Yeah. He looks like he's made of hay.

• 29:55Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, like this is the straw man.

• 29:57Speaker 04

  When has this guy ever been introduced into a story and things got better?

• 30:01Laci Mosley?

  Why do I feel like I'm on like the Wizard of Oz? Like we've got Mike, he's Dorothy in the two tight shirts, we've got Hay, he's giving me like.

• 30:09Speaker 04

  The Cowardly Lion a little bit?

• 30:11Laci Mosley?

  Cowardly Lion or Scarecrow.

• 30:14Speaker 04

  Yeah, oh yeah, you're right, Scarecrow, a little of both.

• 30:17Laci Mosley?

  He's giving Scarecrow as well, and Hay was best known for promoting a false rumor that Rihanna had hooked up with Jay-Z to boost attention for her 2004 song, "Pond Replay."

• 30:28Speaker 04

  He is famous for that?

• 30:29Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he's a famous industry liar.

• 30:33Speaker 04

  Wow, I didn't know that you could, like, is that a business?

• 30:37Laci Mosley?

  I mean, what is Perez Hilton?

• 30:38Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, but this guy just did it once.

• 30:41Laci Mosley?

  That's what TMZ used to be, and now they want to be real journalists.

• 30:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, you're right.

• 30:44Laci Mosley?

  TMZ knows if you're dead before you do.

• 30:49Speaker 04

  I hope so.

• 30:49Laci Mosley?

  We used to not trust them, and now when they pop up, I'm like...

• 30:52Speaker 04

  Now they're the most trusted. I'm like, I'll wait to see what TMZ says.

• 30:57Laci Mosley?

  That's how you know our news outlets are fucked by the government, when you're like, "I'll wait to see what TMZ says." And sadly, that is a real thing in my brain. I kept seeing rumors that Erica Kirk was at Coachella, and I was like, "Mm, I'll wait to see if TMZ has a video before I believe this." So, SMH Records. Shaking my head is what that sounds like to me.

• 31:20Speaker 04

  Me too.

• 31:20Laci Mosley?

  But in this case, it's, uh, Mike and Hey. I don't know what the S stands for, we'll find out.

• 31:28Laci Mosley?

  They started a music label called SMH Records, and plan to work their way through the industry as producers, while also making Mike himself a star. Mike had the money to open the label, sign artists, and produce their albums, because remember, he left people who needed healthcare behind.

• 31:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, sure, as we all do as a country.

• 31:46Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 31:47Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 31:47Laci Mosley?

  To make money being a star.

• 31:49Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 31:49Laci Mosley?

  Yes. And this is SMH Records' social media page.

• 31:54Speaker 04

  It's pretty sparse.

• 31:56Laci Mosley?

  Uh, yeah, and...

• 32:00Laci Mosley?

  Y'all need to get my king sway off of here, okay?

• 32:04Laci Mosley?

  Get him off of here, don't do my king like that. T.I., he belongs on this page, that makes sense to me.

• 32:08Speaker 04

  Oh, that's rough.

• 32:09Laci Mosley?

  Is that a... What's that old man's name? The light-skinned one who's old? People are gonna get really mad about this. Not Mr. Worldwide.

• 32:19Speaker 04

  Mr. Worldwide?

• 32:20Laci Mosley?

  No, uh, he's a old, like a Motown crooner, with light green eyes, who had a weird sex album recently, but he's in his 80s.

• 32:32Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 32:33Laci Mosley?

  Damn, I know somebody is screaming right now. Smokey Robinson.

• 32:39Speaker 04

  Wait, he has a show here?

• 32:40Laci Mosley?

  He does. Smokey Robinson has a show here? It's a channel.

• 32:43Speaker 06

  Smokey's Soul something or other, yeah.

• 32:45Laci Mosley?

  Oh, Lord.

• 32:46Speaker 06

  He hosts a channel on Sirius XM.

• 32:48Laci Mosley?

  Wow.

• 32:49Speaker 06

  That's our coworker.

• 32:49Laci Mosley?

  Y'all listen to Smokey still.

• 32:52Speaker 04

  And we brought him up because we love him.

• 32:54Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, and it might get weirdly horny, but don't worry about that.

• 33:00Speaker 04

  There's not another way to get horny in your 80s. It's only weirdly horny.

• 33:03Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but I'm happy for them because I hope to be weirdly horny in my 80s. So SMH got a distribution deal with Capitol Records subsidiary. And a Universal Music executive left a senior vice president position to be their chief operating officer. So they got some real backing behind this.

• 33:22Speaker 04

  And with these meetings that they were taking with Hay and the other guy?

• 33:26Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, Mike and Hay and maybe S. Maybe it's ZS. We don't know who S is. So Mike and Hay made two albums together. One was called Fear of a Pink Planet.

• 33:39Speaker 04

  Is that about women?

• 33:43Laci Mosley?

  Maybe.

• 33:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 33:45Laci Mosley?

  Maybe that would be a good insel bop album.

• 33:47Speaker 04

  That feels like a good insel. That's like a clavicular bop. Like, that's a...

• 33:51Laci Mosley?

  And it was inspired, like, it was credited to this group called Pink Grenade, which also feels like men being afraid of like,

• 33:58Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 33:59Laci Mosley?

  what if a coochie was a bomb?

• 34:01Speaker 04

  Well, what if it was?

• 34:01Laci Mosley?

  That's what women leadership feels like to them. Oh, no, we have a coochie bomb, boss. Oh, no. And then they had another album called When Music Worlds Collide, which is...

• 34:15Speaker 04

  It's not as catchy.

• 34:16Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 34:17Speaker 04

  The other one was catchier.

• 34:18Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, Fear of a Pink Planet, I might tune in.

• 34:20Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 34:20Laci Mosley?

  But When Music Worlds Collide feels bad. And credited to Mike and Hay and the Bay Area hip-hop artist DJ King Tech.

• 34:32Speaker 04

  So that's not one of the Bay Area hip-hop artists I've heard of?

• 34:35Laci Mosley?

  No, I have not heard of King Tech.

• 34:36Speaker 04

  It goes E40?

• 34:39Speaker 04

  And then DJ.

• 34:42Laci Mosley?

  Then it goes DJ King Tech.

• 34:43Speaker 04

  Yes, those are the top two Bay Area artists.

• 34:46Laci Mosley?

  I would throw in, um, oh gosh.

• 34:48Speaker 04

  Too Short.

• 34:49Laci Mosley?

  Too Short, and you can't forget, um, Wuss's face with the pant hammer, MC Hammer.

• 34:56Speaker 04

  Oh, that's, that's true. I think he certainly wouldn't forget it. Yeah.

• 35:00Laci Mosley?

  No, and I'm scared of him. People don't know. Don't let them funny pants fool you. That man was a gangster.

• 35:05Speaker 04

  Is that true?

• 35:05Laci Mosley?

  Yes, and very feared and respected.

• 35:07Speaker 04

  Really?

• 35:07Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 35:08Speaker 04

  You're being serious?

• 35:09Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 35:10Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 35:11Laci Mosley?

  MC Hammer was, he, he was out here at Hammer Time, but then everywhere else, they were like, it's the Hammer, run! Like, yeah.

• 35:19Speaker 04

  That's like hearing like Mickey Mouse fuck people up. Like, that's crazy. Wow.

• 35:23Laci Mosley?

  It is comical. That's why I love that sketch in The Chappelle Show where, uh, it was Wayne Brady and he was like, it's Wayne Brady, bitch. And everybody was like, it's Wayne Brady, run away! Like.

• 35:33Speaker 04

  Wow, I didn't know that.

• 35:35Laci Mosley?

  So, both of these albums had tons of features, including one from Parliament Funkadelic drummer Jerome Brayley, and uncredited monologue from Johnny Depp on one song. Johnny Depp went on there and did a monologue.

• 35:49Speaker 04

  Did he know he was doing it for, like, did they take it from a movie or he actually went on and just did a monologue?

• 35:54Laci Mosley?

  You know, sometimes in our careers, sometimes you just show up places and they tell you you're gonna get money and then you just, you just do it. One time I was on camera and they were like, we'll give you $5,000 to open this ruler. And I was broke at the time. I don't know how I got this job. And I thought maybe they was gonna kill me when I went. And, but I was like, gotta risk it. And I went and they just wanted me to comically open some very complicated science thing for a tech conference. So it was probably to be like, look at this hot dummy who can't understand this complicated ruler. Look at her, how dumb and hot and on TV she is.

• 36:30Speaker 04

  Man.

• 36:30Laci Mosley?

  I wasn't the only one who did it. Cecily Strong did it too. They told me.

• 36:33Speaker 04

  You both opened, you both opened for this tech company?

• 36:36Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, it was filmed. It only took 30 minutes.

• 36:40Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 36:41Laci Mosley?

  I don't know what they did with it.

• 36:42Speaker 04

  I gotta get a new agent.

• 36:43Laci Mosley?

  It was probably on Nasty Boy.

• 36:45Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 36:47Laci Mosley?

  I'm right in front of a Coke commercial right now.

• 36:49Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 36:50Speaker 07

  Robbery.

• 36:53Speaker 00

  Cash flow crunch? OnDeck's small business line of credit gives your business immediate access to funds, up to $200,000, right when you need it. Cover seasonal dips, manage payroll, restock inventory, or tackle unexpected expenses without missing a beat. With flexible draws, transparent pricing, and control over repayment, get funded quickly and confidently. Apply today at ondeck.com. Funds could be available as soon as tomorrow. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business loan may be issued by OnDeck or Celtic Bank. OnDeck does not lend in North Dakota. All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

• 37:23Speaker 01

  This January, bare-knuckle fighting championship takes over the ocean. The inaugural Brew's Crew sails from Miami to the Bahamas aboard the Norwegian Jewel. Three straight days with pool-deck bare-knuckle fights in the Caribbean. Mess of parties, beach events, DJs, cigars, tequila tastings, and non-stop action. The lineup reveals coming soon. Cabins are disappearing fast, and the prices won't stay this low. Reserve your spot with just $200 down at B K F S E A dot com.

• 37:53Speaker 05

  At GMC, ignorance is the furthest thing from bliss. Bliss is research, testing, testing the testing, until it results in not just one truck, but a whole lineup. The 2026 GMC Sierra lineup, featuring the Sierra 1500, the Sierra Heavy Duty, and the Sierra EV. Because true bliss is removing every shadow from every doubt. We are professional grade. Visit gmc.com to learn more.

• 38:24Speaker 07

  And fraud.

• 38:26Laci Mosley?

  The Avila brothers, songwriters and producers best known for their work with Usher, recorded one of his songs with Billy Ray Cyrus and Snoop Dogg. That makes sense to me because Snoop Dogg just be doing anything.

• 38:38Speaker 04

  Yeah, he'll do whatever.

• 38:39Laci Mosley?

  He be doing anything.

• 38:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 38:42Laci Mosley?

  And so the song is called Lipstick. It's a song about Kim Kardashian and features Ashley Holmes, who was famous for being one of the Real Housewives of New Jersey. And let's just hear a little bit of Lipstick. Jonathan Hay and Mike Smith.

• 38:59Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 39:00Laci Mosley?

  Lipstick, pink grenade.

• 39:06Speaker 07

  Hey. I hope my mom didn't hear this song.

• 39:13Laci Mosley?

  What?

• 39:16Laci Mosley?

  What?

• 39:25Laci Mosley?

  They're also doing foot fetish stuff?

• 39:27Speaker 04

  There's a ton of foot fetish shit in this.

• 39:33Laci Mosley?

  Oh! And she's licking a white phallus?

• 39:42Laci Mosley?

  Okay.

• 39:43Speaker 04

  Wow. That's... Yeah.

• 39:48Speaker 04

  Is that what you did for the tech company?

• 39:54Laci Mosley?

  I know you want your ruler in my pool.

• 39:57Speaker 04

  It's a little bit of the, like, low mama lip gloss vibe.

• 40:01Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, my lip gloss is popping. Maybe that's what they were going for.

• 40:04Speaker 04

  But it's all about sucking a dick.

• 40:07Laci Mosley?

  Dipstick, which...

• 40:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, which is like a... Nobody even says that. It's like, ah, your 1940s dipstick. Like, that's... Nobody uses that phrase.

• 40:17Laci Mosley?

  And it's meant to be grotesque, but it's actually kind of, like, funny.

• 40:22Speaker 04

  Why is she stepping on lipstick over and over again?

• 40:24Laci Mosley?

  Because she's gonna put it on her toes so she can put the toes on the dipstick. With the lipstick.

• 40:29Speaker 04

  Has a music video ever been made for less than this?

• 40:33Laci Mosley?

  They've cut back to the shot several times.

• 40:36Speaker 04

  There was... It's literally taking place in, like, one room, in one part of one room. Like, the other part of the room is probably, like, people in cubicles.

• 40:44Laci Mosley?

  Right, and you're so right about dipstick being so outdated. It's giving, like, "I know you want my pouch on your paddy whacker." Tonight.

• 40:55Laci Mosley?

  What are we doing? And why? So...

• 40:58Speaker 04

  They wrote this.

• 40:59Laci Mosley?

  I would hope so.

• 41:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 41:01Laci Mosley?

  So, now, if only Mike's music had been good. This system would have worked. We have another song that we want to show you, Justin.

• 41:12Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 41:12Laci Mosley?

  If you're okay with it.

• 41:13Speaker 04

  Please.

• 41:14Laci Mosley?

  It's called "Let's Take It Naked." Maybe it's better. This song is crashing my computer. Hold on, here we go. Okay. "Due to our strong personal convictions, we wish to stress that this film in no way endorses a belief in the Illuminati."

• 41:31Speaker 04

  I've never seen a warning like that before.

• 41:35Laci Mosley?

  It's like the beginning of a VHS tape.

• 41:39Laci Mosley?

  Uh.

• 41:40Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 41:40Laci Mosley?

  Oh. It's her again.

• 41:45Laci Mosley?

  Okay, it's a lot of cocaine.

• 41:48Speaker 04

  Yeah, so much cocaine.

• 41:49Laci Mosley?

  But like, not in the way that you would think, uh, people would do cocaine.

• 41:53Speaker 04

  No. It's like he's doing cocaine with a crazy straw, though. Like a straw from a children's birthday he grabbed.

• 42:00Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, like a milkshake straw to do cocaine.

• 42:03Speaker 04

  It's like, come in this Swans and have a big sundae straw.

• 42:06Laci Mosley?

  We don't need to see anymore of Let's Take It Naked. It's actually crashing our computer, which makes sense. It's so bad, it's imploding things.

• 42:14Laci Mosley?

  So, let's get to the rap reality competition show. You knew that was coming up next, right, Justin?

• 42:19Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 42:20Laci Mosley?

  Mike and Hay have to do-

• 42:22Speaker 04

  Does the Zeus Network come up anywhere in this?

• 42:24Laci Mosley?

  Baddies!

• 42:25Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:28Laci Mosley?

  It's terrible for the world. Obviously, I've seen it.

• 42:32Speaker 04

  I have to say, Quinta Brunson will not let me watch anything on the Zeus Network.

• 42:36Laci Mosley?

  Oh.

• 42:36Speaker 04

  She's banned me from looking at it.

• 42:38Laci Mosley?

  You know what? And I appreciate that Quinta did that.

• 42:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 42:41Laci Mosley?

  You know, we both worked on a black lady sketch show. That's how we met. And, uh, she's protecting you from a gaze that only black people should see.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  She said that I shouldn't see it.

• 42:51Laci Mosley?

  It's shameful and we don't need you to think about any of us that way. Too many wigs flying and, and all, all they do is give them ladies tequila and the occasional Dorito. And tell them to street fight. And I feel like now I'm selling it.

• 43:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, you just did the worst job of not getting people to watch the Zeus Network.

• 43:12Laci Mosley?

  I'm gonna admit it. I do, I have, I've seen the things. But for me, it's cathartic, because I was like, if my acting career ever, or any of my performing careers went south, I feel like I could get on Baddies.

• 43:23Speaker 04

  But yeah.

• 43:23Laci Mosley?

  I'd be okay.

• 43:24Speaker 04

  Can you slap the shit out of someone?

• 43:26Laci Mosley?

  Oh, that wouldn't be my role. I feel like there's no one on that show who, like, it's, it's like very prideful to like win a fight and stand on business.

• 43:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 43:35Laci Mosley?

  I feel like I could sit on shenanigans and, and I could run away. Like, like every fight would just be me running away, like, no! And if they happened to catch me, I'd be like, ah! Ow, ow, my body, ow. Like, I feel like that would be good for me. So, the rap reality competition show. This is where Mike continues to pour money into his dreams, even though these songs were objectively terrible and somewhat terrifying. So, and they don't even turn to be good, bad, they're just bad.

• 44:01Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:02Laci Mosley?

  So, next, he fully self-financed a rap reality competition show called One Shot. He made it himself with no network attached in 2014, and we have a little bit of the trailer of One Shot. I'm guessing that Eminem was popping and he was like, "You only get one shot."

• 44:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 44:19Laci Mosley?

  We set up one stage. Let's get it. We set up one stage. With one chance to impress our celebrity judges. Lot of work. Each week, MCs move on. One will go home with 100K and a record deal. The others just go home. Sway, King Crooked and King Tech. Did that man break his neck? Crown one undisputed king of the mic. DJ Khaled. This is the start of them fulfilling their dreams. Who will make their one shot count? This is reality, it's our life. One Shot premieres 27 September at 7 on BET. On BET, I knew I had heard of One Shot. God damn it, it got me.

• 44:53Speaker 04

  By the way, that is a who's who of people who will do anything for money. That is like, yeah, DJ Khaled.

• 45:02Laci Mosley?

  I feel like, Justin, when you're writing the eulogy for my funeral, we can definitely get DJ Khaled on the mic to say, "We the best."

• 45:08Speaker 04

  Oh, yeah, absolutely.

• 45:09Laci Mosley?

  Or, "We was the best." Heavy on the "was."

• 45:12Speaker 04

  We could, yes, we can get TI there, too.

• 45:14Laci Mosley?

  Oh, for sure. You can die whenever you like. Yeah, we, yeah, yeah, we got it, we got a whole lineup coming. So, Mike and his main collaborators, or collaborators, Crooked, Teen Kek, and Sway Callaway, oh my God, it's my.

• 45:32Laci Mosley?

  They held these nationwide auditions and they got TI, RZA, The Game, Tech N9ne, Twista, and DJ Khaled to do the guest hosting. Crooked says that they filmed nearly 80% of the show themselves and used that footage to create a sizzle reel and sold it to BET before completing the production.

• 45:50Speaker 04

  Sure.

• 45:50Laci Mosley?

  Me too was like, yes, we love these shenanigans. For the winner of one shot, they promised $100,000 in a deal with SMH Records.

• 45:58Speaker 04

  Oh, God.

• 45:59Laci Mosley?

  The coveted. So because he paid for it, Mike got seated at the judges' table, though he's barely in the trailer, and it's often unclear why he's on the show at all. He wanted to be in front of the camera as well.

• 46:12Speaker 04

  Did he wear his fedora?

• 46:13Laci Mosley?

  There he is, in the corner. Not wearing his fedora, but definitely looking out of place.

• 46:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, no, he does.

• 46:21Speaker 04

  I mean, that's a pretty motley crew.

• 46:23Laci Mosley?

  But you know what? He probably took inspiration from Diddy, because Diddy used to always be in his artist music videos unnecessarily, and everyone had a problem with it. Like, that was the thing that Suge Knight talked about. He was like, if you don't want your producer in your music video, come to Death Row Records.

• 46:40Laci Mosley?

  They knew he was a menace for a long time. So around the time the production on the show started, Mike and Hay got in a fight. Hay started to suspect that his buddy's finances were not all in order. He and other SMH employees sent their business associates a 111-page document accusing Mike of financial mismanagement. Mike replied with one sentence. How would you reply, Justin?

• 47:06Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 47:07Laci Mosley?

  To your business partner, who's now outed you to the entire company, saying that you're mismanaging finances? What's one sentence that would just shut it all down?

• 47:17Speaker 04

  I mean, did he reply with his bank statement?

• 47:20Laci Mosley?

  Wow, Justin, you're a real class act.

• 47:24Laci Mosley?

  He said, "You got a tiny penis."

• 47:27Speaker 04

  Oh, well, that's the next best thing. Yeah. You got, I like when you call it a penis. You got a tiny penis.

• 47:35Laci Mosley?

  His words for phalluses are interesting.

• 47:37Speaker 04

  Dipstick and penis. Shlong, like.

• 47:43Speaker 04

  This dude has never referred to a dick.

• 47:46Laci Mosley?

  No, he's never sexted.

• 47:49Speaker 04

  No, no. Or he has, but it's ended very quickly.

• 47:55Laci Mosley?

  I'd love to be the speculum in your half smear. Like, I feel like, it's like when we found out Prince Charles was calling Camilla to talk about, "I'd love to be your tampon." It's giving that, like, sir, what?

• 48:07Speaker 04

  Check out my hard weener.

• 48:09Laci Mosley?

  Oh, weener's terrible.

• 48:11Speaker 04

  Yeah, that's right.

• 48:11Laci Mosley?

  Weener's awful. So, the show aired its only season, shocker, on BET in 2016, which feels too close to the present, even though it's 10 years ago. It didn't turn Mike into a star, but at least he made up with his friend Hay and they kept trying, so...

• 48:27Speaker 04

  The friendship out of it, is it?

• 48:28Laci Mosley?

  No, they made up.

• 48:30Speaker 04

  Good, I'm glad.

• 48:32Laci Mosley?

  He said, "You had a tiny penis," and Hay was like, "What?"

• 48:34Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, you had a ti- you had- do you think they had a real heart-to-heart after that?

• 48:38Laci Mosley?

  Love is real, see? Just, love is real. So, let's get to the fake listeners that sparked all of this. In 2017, Mike started to use fake email addresses to create bot accounts on streaming platforms that could play his music on repeat. Now, he's started to get some traction with the royalties. The bot accounts started running up the streams. At one point, he had 1,040 accounts, each one streaming approximately 636 songs a day, with his music accruing about 661,440 streams a day. And the average royalty per stream was half a cent.

• 49:15Speaker 04

  Whoa.

• 49:15Laci Mosley?

  So, yeah, this is back, yeah. So, Mike estimated he was earning about $3,307.20 a day.

• 49:23Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 49:24Laci Mosley?

  So, like, $99,216 a month, and over 1.2 million a year.

• 49:30Speaker 04

  Damn.

• 49:31Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, this is making me think differently about Dipstick. Should we write a song?

• 49:35Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:36Laci Mosley?

  Pattywhacker?

• 49:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, Pattywhackers, we have you stepping on lipstick.

• 49:40Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 49:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:41Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, some- something, something in that area.

• 49:44Speaker 04

  Yeah, this, this feels like I, I'm, I've turned a corner on this guy. I feel like this doesn't seem like someone with a tiny penis to me at all.

• 49:52Laci Mosley?

  No. Or maybe.

• 49:54Speaker 04

  Yeah, or maybe the tiniest penis.

• 49:56Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, he needs to distract from the penis.

• 49:58Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 49:58Laci Mosley?

  It's constantly calling to him, like, "Make more money."

• 50:02Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah.

• 50:02Laci Mosley?

  I'll get bigger.

• 50:03Speaker 04

  Yeah. I'll never be big. Make as much money as you can.

• 50:06Laci Mosley?

  And then they'll think I'm big.

• 50:07Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 50:08Laci Mosley?

  So between 2017 and 2024, he had as many as 10,000 active bot accounts streaming the music. 2018, he and his boy Hay released, Tiny Penis Hay, released the jazz album. They've moved on to jazz. They love Negro genres.

• 50:23Laci Mosley?

  They're trying them all. They're like, black people have been very successful with this. We can't do hip hop. Let's try jazz. A scoopity bop bop a dee. And it hit number one on the Billboard charts. Their jazz album.

• 50:34Speaker 04

  What?

• 50:35Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. But the next week, it wasn't on the chart at all. There were no tweets or online comments about the songs on the album. Hay looked at Spotify's dashboard for artists and saw that listeners appeared concentrated in faraway places like Vietnam.

• 50:50Speaker 04

  Well, jazz is huge in Vietnam.

• 50:51Laci Mosley?

  Oh, they love it in Vietnam. A scoopity bop bop a dee. Yes. That's how they won the war.

• 50:57Speaker 04

  That is how they won the war. It was through jazz.

• 50:59Laci Mosley?

  It was through jazz.

• 51:00Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:01Laci Mosley?

  That's what the movie La La Land is all about.

• 51:04Speaker 04

  It's about how jazz won the Vietnam War.

• 51:06Laci Mosley?

  Yes.

• 51:06Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:07Laci Mosley?

  For the Vietnamese.

• 51:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, yeah, that's right.

• 51:09Laci Mosley?

  So that's when he started getting notices from distributors and companies that handle the licensing of indie artists' music, flagging their music for streaming fraud. Meanwhile, Mike was celebrating, finally making it big because he had something on Billboard charts. And they don't know how, but he did. And also, it's the jazz Billboard charts. I feel like it's probably pretty easy to scoop.

• 51:29Speaker 04

  It's like Branford Marsalis and no one else. Yeah.

• 51:33Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. And maybe like Miles Davis just keeps coming back up the charts.

• 51:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:37Laci Mosley?

  You know?

• 51:37Speaker 04

  And then Mike.

• 51:39Laci Mosley?

  Bitches Brew just is constantly a hit, you know? Yeah, and then Mike.

• 51:43Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:43Laci Mosley?

  Everyone's like, Mike? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it goes Miles Davis, Disney Gillespie, Mike.

• 51:49Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:50Laci Mosley?

  The greats.

• 51:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 51:51Laci Mosley?

  So Ella Fitzgerald, Mike.

• 51:54Speaker 04

  Mike and Mike.

• 51:55Laci Mosley?

  So Mike is celebrating, right? June of that year, he shared a photo of his Spotify stats on Instagram with 214,875 monthly listeners. And Mike loves to be specific. We've got his money down to the cent here. And he said he had more than 72,000 listeners on that specific day. And the caption was, "That's crazy."

• 52:18Laci Mosley?

  And thanks to everyone who listens. Truly grateful. Look how humble he is.

• 52:25Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 52:26Laci Mosley?

  He's so humble.

• 52:27Speaker 04

  He's so humble.

• 52:28Laci Mosley?

  He said, that's crazy.

• 52:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, well, you put in the work.

• 52:31Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, that's not crime. That's crazy.

• 52:34Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 52:35Laci Mosley?

  Thank you for listening.

• 52:36Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 52:37Laci Mosley?

  Bots. So fraud flags start popping up. And Mike needed a new tactic to keep from getting caught. A billion fake streams for one song looked suspicious.

• 52:48Speaker 04

  Sure, from Vietnam.

• 52:49Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, from Vietnam.

• 52:51Speaker 04

  Well, there's like four million people there total.

• 52:54Laci Mosley?

  Who love jazz.

• 52:55Speaker 04

  Yeah, who do love jazz. That's undeniable.

• 52:57Laci Mosley?

  And they need to listen to it billions of times a day. So, but a fake billion fake streams spread across tens of thousands of songs is more difficult to detect. So, artificial intelligence songs were still a new thing in 2018. And Mike got in early, working with the CEO of an AI music startup to create hundreds of thousands of fake songs to send to streamers. Once again, AI, improving the planet.

• 53:21Speaker 04

  Wow, he was really ahead of the game.

• 53:22Laci Mosley?

  He really was when it comes to crime. He was like, AI definitely a scam. Let me get involved.

• 53:26Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 53:26Laci Mosley?

  So in 2024, Mike had made $10 million with this scheme. And that's when he finally got arrested by the FBI.

• 53:34Speaker 04

  Dang, flew too close to the sun. Wow.

• 53:36Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, fake, the industry, music industry has so many scams going on.

• 53:41Speaker 04

  I know. I'm like, why is he any worse than anything else?

• 53:44Laci Mosley?

  And I would be on his side if he wasn't using AI. You poisoned a black people in Memphis to do Scooby Doo bop bops from Vietnam. So we can't be serious. And now we have his mugshot here.

• 53:56Speaker 04

  No Fedora in the mugshot.

• 53:57Laci Mosley?

  No, but he looks really alert.

• 54:00Speaker 04

  Yeah, he does. He looks the most awake anyone's ever been.

• 54:04Laci Mosley?

  This was quite the sobering experience for him. Because he's looking directly in the camera. It feels like the Mona Lisa of scams, like the eyes follow you around the room.

• 54:13Speaker 04

  Wow. That, do you think they raided his house?

• 54:18Laci Mosley?

  What were they gonna get? Probably the computers and stuff.

• 54:20Speaker 04

  Yeah, maybe.

• 54:21Laci Mosley?

  Oh, man.

• 54:22Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 54:23Laci Mosley?

  And the AI songs have largely been scrubbed. But much of the music Mike released is under his own name and still wildly like available. The AI music startup isn't named in court documents, but it was probably booming.

• 54:36Laci Mosley?

  And that finally is how Mike Smith became a famous man, which is what he wanted from the start. So he got famous from being arrested for making AI music and making millions off of it.

• 54:47Speaker 04

  Is he still in jail?

• 54:49Laci Mosley?

  Uh, well, he was arrested in 2024.

• 54:51Speaker 04

  Oh.

• 54:51Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, so you know, it's 2026. Uh, he made music history as the first person in the United States to face criminal charges tied to streaming fraud.

• 55:00Speaker 04

  Who stole more music, him or Elvis?

• 55:03Laci Mosley?

  Ooh.

• 55:04Speaker 04

  Wow.

• 55:05Laci Mosley?

  We gotta ask, we gotta ask Big Mama Thornton. No, that's a ooh on the right side of history.

• 55:09Speaker 04

  Okay, thank you.

• 55:10Laci Mosley?

  Justin.

• 55:10Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 55:11Laci Mosley?

  You better be making a show with a black woman.

• 55:12Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 55:13Laci Mosley?

  And know that, that Elvis was ripping off everything.

• 55:16Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 55:16Laci Mosley?

  He was a hound dog, but that was Big Mama.

• 55:20Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, I think Big Mama Thornton was the name that they gave her in Dreamgirls, and that's not actually her name. But, uh, we, we all, we all know where I'm getting with this. Um, yeah, but yeah, so he was, he was really thieving hardcore. Arrest documents say he fraudently inflated his streams on platforms like Amazon Music, Apple Music, Spotify, and YouTube Music. Poor guys, poor all of them. Can, think of the Bezos.

• 55:42Speaker 04

  Can anyone look out for YouTube?

• 55:44Laci Mosley?

  Can anyone look out for Q Ball Jet? No shade, Justin.

• 55:48Speaker 04

  They, they, listen, any kind of bald representation, I'll take it.

• 55:54Laci Mosley?

  You got Professor X.

• 55:55Speaker 04

  That's right, it's, it's, yes, yes. It's always good when, when Professor X is the first bald man people think of. The made up character. Think of a cool bald guy. Well, I can't think of any that are real. Let me go to Professor X.

• 56:11Laci Mosley?

  Damn, you right, you right. I could have thought of a real bald guy. Yeah, my dad's, they're bald.

• 56:18Speaker 04

  Okay, that's something.

• 56:19Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 56:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 56:20Laci Mosley?

  And you're pulling it off. A lot of white people can't pull off bald.

• 56:23Speaker 04

  Thank you.

• 56:23Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 56:24Speaker 04

  I appreciate that.

• 56:25Laci Mosley?

  Looks like you moisturized your head a little bit, too.

• 56:27Speaker 04

  I, you know, not as much as my wife would like, but some, yeah. Gotta do a better job of it.

• 56:33Laci Mosley?

  Looks hydrated, though. I see a little light coming from the ceiling.

• 56:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, a little shine.

• 56:36Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, that's good. So there have been reports that Smith's music, Mike, uh, Mike Smith, also popped up on SoundCloud, Pandora, Tidal. Now you got Beyonce.

• 56:47Speaker 04

  You knew she'd make an appearance.

• 56:51Laci Mosley?

  Honestly, Beyonce performed one of the songs. I want to hear one of the songs. Okay, and, uh, part, part four, part three. No, part three, part three. Yeah, part three, give us some scam AI. So, um, and even Boomplay, a popular streaming service in Africa. So in responses, like Spotify said, its preventative measures like caught Smith early, minimizing the royalties they paid out to just $60,000 for Smith's own music and the AI-generated tracks. Now, I love that Spotify is saying that they caught this early, almost in a way that like they were the fraud stoppers. But I feel like it was more that Spotify was like, we don't like to give people money. So we had to look into why we had to give him some.

• 57:32Speaker 04

  That's what it was.

• 57:33Laci Mosley?

  And stop that.

• 57:34Speaker 04

  It was just, it, red flags came up when they had to pay someone.

• 57:39Speaker 04

  That's what it was. There's nothing to do with anything other than that.

• 57:42Laci Mosley?

  It's a corporation, it's corporations, dude, we can't be out here.

• 57:45Speaker 04

  Somebody burst into someone's office and said, do you know we're paying someone?

• 57:49Laci Mosley?

  Like a lot, like a wage.

• 57:51Speaker 04

  Can somebody fucking stop this?

• 57:53Laci Mosley?

  They're fucking living off this wage, bro. No, we gotta get after it.

• 57:58Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 57:59Laci Mosley?

  Pandora also said that they paid out $1,500 in royalties to Smith. Why Smith, Robert Pandora, we love them.

• 58:16Laci Mosley?

  It's really quite easy to pull off this kind of scheme. You can look up videos on how to make fake music on YouTube and guides for creating bot listeners on Reddit. What's surprising is that Mike Smith is the only individual who has been caught for it. That might be because a lot of powerful businesses are also engaging in this kind of fraud. Or at least benefiting from it. So there's really no reason to stop it. Mike was to piss somebody off.

• 58:41Speaker 04

  Yeah, I think it was, it just like, he didn't cut them in, it's the mafia. It's like, they didn't get their cut, it wasn't financially worth it for them.

• 58:49Laci Mosley?

  Right, exactly. He should have just made some phone calls with some of these larger companies and, and made them in on the scheme.

• 58:54Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 58:55Laci Mosley?

  Cause maybe this helped with quarterly reports.

• 58:57Speaker 04

  Absolutely, he becomes the CFO.

• 59:00Laci Mosley?

  Investors, like, are looking, they're like, look at our, we are in the black and rising. And billions of people in Thailand love our platform.

• 59:08Speaker 04

  Number go up.

• 59:09Laci Mosley?

  Number go up.

• 59:11Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 59:11Laci Mosley?

  That's probably why they're quiet about it, number go up.

• 59:13Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:14Laci Mosley?

  Yeah.

• 59:15Speaker 04

  They don't care how number go up.

• 59:16Laci Mosley?

  They don't care how number go up. Who number go up?

• 59:19Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:19Laci Mosley?

  Number go up.

• 59:20Speaker 04

  Exactly.

• 59:21Laci Mosley?

  So, the Dow's at 50,000.

• 59:25Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 59:26Laci Mosley?

  Why y'all worried about the war? And food? And the straight who move? And then people getting kidnapped on the streets.

• 59:33Speaker 04

  Dow's at 50,000.

• 59:35Laci Mosley?

  The Dow's at 50,000.

• 59:36Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:36Laci Mosley?

  That mean something to you?

• 59:39Speaker 04

  We all know what that means.

• 59:40Laci Mosley?

  We all know what that means.

• 59:42Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:42Laci Mosley?

  Every day, I'm like thinking about the Dow.

• 59:44Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:45Laci Mosley?

  And if it's not at 50,000, I'm distressed.

• 59:46Speaker 04

  I'm like, what's happening? Yeah.

• 59:48Laci Mosley?

  Why am I even alive?

• 59:50Speaker 04

  I don't even want to live in a world where the Dow's under 50,000.

• 59:54Laci Mosley?

  Uh, the ghetto.

• 59:55Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 59:55Laci Mosley?

  Not everything else. No, no, no, no, no.

• 59:57Speaker 04

  No.

• 59:57Laci Mosley?

  The Dow. So, streaming fraud, some have argued that Mike Smith is actually the Robin Hood of streaming fraud. The little guy playing the same game the big labels play every day. I mean, ain't that why Drake suing his label? Because he said that they were streaming, uh, Ain't Like, They Ain't Like Us? He said the label was running up the streams. He said, I know, because we did it with my songs. And they were like, how you gonna sue about that? How you gonna sue when you was like?

• 1:00:26Speaker 04

  Yeah, when you're a part of the lawsuit.

• 1:00:29Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, I know, because y'all did it to me, and I'm also been doing it to everybody else.

• 1:00:32Speaker 04

  That's why I'm popular. Wait, did I say that?

• 1:00:34Laci Mosley?

  No. Anyways. So, label streamers and distributors and rights holders all make money on the royalty stream, whether the song and listeners are real or not. Damn, do we all need to start making fake music?

• 1:00:47Speaker 04

  Well, here's the thing, though, about calling him Robin Hood. There's another, the other part of Robin Hood is that he gave the money to the poor.

• 1:00:53Laci Mosley?

  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Minor DJs.

• 1:00:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, that part seems like it's missing.

• 1:00:59Laci Mosley?

  But you know what? He was giving his music to the ear poor.

• 1:01:03Speaker 04

  Oh, that's true. That's true. For all the people who had to live in a world where, like, because at that time, the Dow wasn't at 50,000.

• 1:01:10Laci Mosley?

  No.

• 1:01:11Speaker 04

  So, we were all needing something.

• 1:01:13Laci Mosley?

  And that's why he had to shut down his medical clinics.

• 1:01:14Speaker 04

  Right.

• 1:01:15Laci Mosley?

  Because.

• 1:01:15Speaker 04

  Did he shut them down?

• 1:01:17Laci Mosley?

  I don't know, but it doesn't seem like.

• 1:01:19Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's probably not also operating those.

• 1:01:20Laci Mosley?

  He must be getting this money from somewhere, so. But he wasn't there anymore to see him, obviously. So in current music, like the current music economy landscape, subscription and ad dollars for music and streaming are pooled in one big pot. And royalty money is allocated based on each artist's share of the total streams. Bot streams generate money for whosever behind them and leave less in the royalty pool for others, which does not sound like Robin Hood to me. It sounds like robbing artists.

• 1:01:48Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:01:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, you robbing the hood.

• 1:01:49Speaker 04

  I was kinda with the scam until that part.

• 1:01:52Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, especially like smaller artists that already get so little for the streams, like. So Spotify itself has been accused of doing this, stacking their playlists with cheaply licensed music to rack up plays and take money out of the royalty pool. I'm gonna stop you there because every rap, listen. Before there was Spotify, before we had, what is the one that I'm thinking about that's like orange? SoundCloud. Before we had Spotify, before we had SoundCloud, we had rappers with CDs in the back of their trunks.

• 1:02:25Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:02:26Laci Mosley?

  So now, maybe Spotify is just creating a space for the rappers with the CDs in the back of their trunks to get their music into the world.

• 1:02:37Speaker 04

  Yeah, I mean, I remember, you know, walking down Hollywood Boulevard. People handing me their CDs.

• 1:02:42Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. I remember like a thing where we used to call people SoundCloud rappers.

• 1:02:47Speaker 04

  That, yeah, that's right.

• 1:02:48Laci Mosley?

  Yeah. In a way, I deeply identify with that because I think starting an acting career is just like starting a rapper career. Like, we are SoundCloud rappers. I was trying to get people to come to my improv shows. Or watch my, watch me in the show. I'm in it for 30 seconds. At minute 1548. Don't miss it. Tonight on Fox.

• 1:03:08Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's, it, it's tough because they've given them this opportunity, but then they also pay them dog shit.

• 1:03:15Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, but you know, Mike Smith was a true fraudster. Even the actual businesses he used to bankroll for his music label, reality show, and fake bot streams. Oh no, they were also a scam. And Justin, we're getting to the end. We're getting back to his, his medical businesses.

• 1:03:34Speaker 04

  Does he end up in one of his own urgent cares?

• 1:03:38Laci Mosley?

  I feel like if he did, he'd be like, get me out of here.

• 1:03:40Speaker 04

  Yeah, no.

• 1:03:41Laci Mosley?

  Get me out of here.

• 1:03:42Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:03:43Laci Mosley?

  All he got is tongue depressants and Q-tips and nobody has a medical degree. Help.

• 1:03:49Laci Mosley?

  Well, the same year, One Shot aired on BET, Mike and his company, Cali- Carolina Comprehensive Health Network, sounds legit to me.

• 1:03:58Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:03:59Laci Mosley?

  Lots of words. Carolina, you know where you are.

• 1:04:02Speaker 04

  Which is a place.

• 1:04:03Laci Mosley?

  It's a place.

• 1:04:04Speaker 04

  Health.

• 1:04:04Laci Mosley?

  And we can verify that. Comprehensive, so they can do.

• 1:04:08Speaker 04

  They can do it all.

• 1:04:09Laci Mosley?

  Whatever you need.

• 1:04:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:04:10Laci Mosley?

  Health.

• 1:04:11Speaker 04

  Which is being alive.

• 1:04:13Laci Mosley?

  What you want to go there to leave with.

• 1:04:15Speaker 04

  Don't want to be sick.

• 1:04:16Laci Mosley?

  No, you want health when you leave, for sure.

• 1:04:18Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:04:19Laci Mosley?

  And network.

• 1:04:20Speaker 04

  Which is a lot of things together.

• 1:04:22Laci Mosley?

  It's a lot of things together.

• 1:04:23Speaker 04

  That's right.

• 1:04:23Laci Mosley?

  And you need it.

• 1:04:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, a comprehensive network.

• 1:04:26Laci Mosley?

  Mm-hmm. They were accused of Medicare and Medicaid fraud.

• 1:04:30Speaker 04

  No.

• 1:04:30Laci Mosley?

  In two separate lawsuits.

• 1:04:32Speaker 04

  See, I didn't see that coming at all.

• 1:04:37Laci Mosley?

  Whistleblowers in some of his clinics said that they were told to carry out tests and procedures that were not medically necessary and then submit false reimbursement claims.

• 1:04:49Speaker 04

  See, this is why I always have a rule that I'm not gonna go see a doctor who's also a jazz musician.

• 1:04:59Laci Mosley?

  I don't know, it might like, they might be, they can improvise, you know what I mean?

• 1:05:05Speaker 04

  You know what, that's true. It's the medications that they don't prescribe.

• 1:05:09Laci Mosley?

  Scoopity-ba-ba, azithromycin, I don't know, it could, it could be a thing. One of the two losses claimed that SMH Records directly benefited from this fraud. Well, duh. By September 2015, Carolina Comprehensive Health Network, I was gonna say Compromise Health Network, which is what it is now. Had allegedly paid SMH, so he's paying himself, Robin Peter to pay Paul from his own businesses, $150,000. In September of 2020, Mike settled one of the fraud cases for $900,000 while the other one was dismissed. As for streaming fraud, Mike is out on bail. And has pleaded not guilty.

• 1:05:53Laci Mosley?

  He could get up to 60 years in prison if convicted.

• 1:05:57Speaker 04

  Wow, that feels like a bit much to me.

• 1:05:59Laci Mosley?

  Mm hmm.

• 1:06:00Speaker 04

  60 years.

• 1:06:02Laci Mosley?

  Well, he's scheduled to be sentenced by a judge on July 29th, 2026.

• 1:06:08Speaker 04

  And that Judge, Judge Branford Marsalis.

• 1:06:12Laci Mosley?

  Oh, man, I hope that judge went to school at the comprehensive university network. And that he doesn't face any jail time because this is pretty creative. And when you think about it, like, yes, the artists are being harmed, but it's not like the music business is harming them first. You know? That's like if you, if you get robbed, that's like if, if your car gets the tires taken off of it. And somebody comes in later and steals your air freshener, you know?

• 1:06:42Speaker 04

  Yeah, it's like it already wasn't a working car.

• 1:06:44Laci Mosley?

  Yeah, we were more worried about the tires. So, uh, Smith, Mike, Mike Smith has also agreed to forfeit over $8 million in royalties he gained from using bots to stream. And he's going to be paying that out from 2017 to 2024. And I bet you he's probably figured out how to get his fake AI streaming service back up so he can make some money to do so.

• 1:07:08Speaker 04

  I'm, I, I think this guy and AI haven't seen the last of each other.

• 1:07:12Laci Mosley?

  No, no, instead of SMH, maybe it's S and P 500.

• 1:07:17Speaker 04

  Yeah, he's ahead of his, that's right. He's just ahead of his time.

• 1:07:21Laci Mosley?

  He is.

• 1:07:22Speaker 04

  He was just like a click too stupid.

• 1:07:24Laci Mosley?

  The only thing that I wish he would have done is like not use AI to make the songs. I think it's a complete waste and we don't need it. But, and obviously he was covered on the show many times, so I'm not going to hop on some soapbox at the end here. But I wish that he would have just made terrible songs all day long.

• 1:07:45Speaker 04

  I mean, that's what everybody else does.

• 1:07:48Laci Mosley?

  Right?

• 1:07:49Speaker 04

  Yeah, I wonder if it's just like the, the amount he needed to make in order to spread these streams across so many songs. And then finally he was just like, I can't make them fast enough.

• 1:07:58Laci Mosley?

  He could have kept remixing, I want my lipstick on a dipstick.

• 1:08:02Speaker 04

  That's true, the most remixed song of all time.

• 1:08:06Laci Mosley?

  There's a jazz version, it's great. It's actually very classy. My lipstick on his lipstick.

• 1:08:17Speaker 04

  Wow, I'm just floored.

• 1:08:20Laci Mosley?

  It's Tuesday night.

• 1:08:23Laci Mosley?

  My mouth is right. I don't know.

• 1:08:27Speaker 04

  I'd be like, we put that up on Spotify and we see what happens.

• 1:08:30Laci Mosley?

  I think we do and we remix it.

• 1:08:32Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:08:32Laci Mosley?

  And we also rap.

• 1:08:36Speaker 04

  It does feel like AI use is the real like shit thing he did. But like, I mean, I don't think you, this is just a personal opinion. I generally don't think you can scam up.

• 1:08:49Laci Mosley?

  Whoa.

• 1:08:51Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:08:52Laci Mosley?

  That is a huge bomb to drop at the end of this show.

• 1:08:54Speaker 04

  I know, but I think it's like, like you just said earlier, though, like, think about everything the music industry has done to performers. Like, if you're scamming the music industry, is it really a scam if you're scamming someone more powerful than you?

• 1:09:08Laci Mosley?

  So you do agree you can scam up?

• 1:09:10Speaker 04

  I wouldn't consider it a, I mean, in the technical term of scam, maybe, but like, in the spirit of scamming, I don't think it's a scam.

• 1:09:20Laci Mosley?

  Wow, you just threw me on a roller coaster. At first I thought we were gonna have to fight.

• 1:09:27Laci Mosley?

  And Justin, I was like, oh my God, I'm gonna have to break his glasses. Kick him a little bit.

• 1:09:32Speaker 04

  You'd be right, too.

• 1:09:33Laci Mosley?

  But no, that's like the most ethereal way to say it. It's not a scam. I say scam up, but you're right, it's not a scam if you're scamming up. It's really only a scam if you're scamming down.

• 1:09:44Speaker 04

  That's right. The power dynamics have to be taken into account.

• 1:09:47Laci Mosley?

  Yes, I say that all the time, but I've never phrased it that way and it really was a shocker. Sure, some people crash the cars. I'm sorry, y'all. Bill it to Justin's insurance.

• 1:09:56Speaker 04

  Yeah, which is a scam.

• 1:10:01Laci Mosley?

  So I was like, yes, it is. But, oh my goodness, thank you so much for being here, Justin, and for offering so much.

• 1:10:07Speaker 04

  Thank you so much for having me. This was so much fun.

• 1:10:09Laci Mosley?

  And would you like to tell anyone where you can be found and where they can watch, see, read?

• 1:10:14Speaker 04

  Yes, I have a novel coming out called Get Lost that comes out July 7th. I think it is a fun beach read. One of the characters is a big scammer.

• 1:10:24Laci Mosley?

  Oh, I love a beach read.

• 1:10:26Speaker 04

  Yeah. Yeah, it's a fun kind of father-daughter story. Father's a, yeah, kind of a big scammer, a little bit of a piece of shit. And him and his daughter have to find the missing mother.

• 1:10:38Laci Mosley?

  I love that. I'm definitely going to be beach reading this.

• 1:10:41Speaker 04

  Thank you. Yeah, I, I'm excited about it. And if, if you watch Abbott Elementary.

• 1:10:48Laci Mosley?

  If you watch Abbott, if you've heard of it, if you watch it.

• 1:10:52Speaker 04

  Please watch Abbott Elementary and Harley Quinn on HBO Max. And that's all I got.

• 1:10:57Laci Mosley?

  Yes, absolutely. And y'all, when you're taking Justin's book Get Lost to the beach, bring Scam Goddess as well to the beach.

• 1:11:06Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 1:11:07Laci Mosley?

  I don't know if I'm a beach read. I might be more of a, um, a hospital waiting room read. You know, those wait times are long.

• 1:11:15Speaker 04

  Yeah. My book you can read in like.

• 1:11:18Laci Mosley?

  You get lost with some sand under your toes with Justin. And then when you get sunburned, you gotta go to urgent care. You bring Scam Goddess.

• 1:11:26Laci Mosley?

  And you'll love it. You'll love it the entire way. Um, guys, you can watch Going Dutch streaming now on Hulu. New episodes on Thursdays. And you can watch the first season of Scam Goddess on Hulu as well. Get into that. I might have something else in store for y'all soon. And congregation, I want y'all to get out there and stay licking them nipsticks.

• 1:11:58Speaker 07

  Scam Goddess stars and is hosted by me, Lacey Mosley, AKA Scam Goddess. Our producer is Jessica Cisneros and our audio engineer is Rich Garcia. Research for the show is conducted by Kate Doyle. Stay scheming.

• 1:12:14Speaker 01

  This January, bare knuckle fighting championship takes over the ocean. The inaugural Brew's Cruise sails from Miami to the Bahamas aboard the Norwegian Jewel. Three straight days with pool deck bare knuckle fights in the Caribbean. Massive parties, beach events, DJs, cigars, tequila tastings and nonstop action. The lineup reveals coming soon. Cabins are disappearing fast and the prices won't stay this low. Reserve your spot with just $200 down at B K F S E A dot com.

• 1:12:44Speaker 02

  Buick knows confidence changes how you move through the world. That's why Buick designs SUVs with striking style and was named the most dependable mass market brand by J D Power. From the head turning Buick Invista to the seven passenger Enclave. Experience the Buick SUV lineup at Buick dot com. Buick, exceptional by design. Buick received the few reported problems in its segment in the J D Power 2025 2026 U S vehicle dependability studies based on 2022 2023 models. For J D Power 2026 award information, visit J D Power dot com slash awards.