SC EP:1238 I Know What I Saw

Mike writes "Wes, I spoke with you a while back about a sighting my buddy had while hunting, and about a non-visual encounter I experienced. My buddy has finally agreed to talk with you about it, and we'd both like to speak with you at the same time. What would be the best way for us to set that up?" Spoke to both Mike and Joe. Joe's encounter takes place in Colorado back in 2018. Joe describes seeing this creature while hunting. Mike also had a strange encounter in Texas.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:03Speaker 00

  It looked like somebody was bent over and had their head in the window of the deer blind and it either heard me or smelt me and he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up and that, that shocked me.

• 0:24Speaker 00

  They don't make people that, that big.

• 0:31Speaker 01

  The way it moved, almost as if it was gliding across the beach. I've never seen anything move like that in my life.

• 0:45Speaker 01

  They were screaming at each other in gibberish.

• 0:49Speaker 01

  It sounded like a language and they were chuntering away, back and forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards.

• 0:56Speaker 01

  I know what a bear looks like and there is no way on this planet that what I saw bears.

• 1:14Speaker 02

  911, what are you reporting? Jesus Christ, you better... Karen, see ya! Hello? Get somebody out of here. What's going on now, sir? That son of a bitch is about six foot nine, I don't know. Do you see him now, sir? Yes, I'm looking right at him, uh-oh.

• 1:34Speaker 01

  This is Karen from New Zealand and you're listening to Sasquatch Chronicles and I'm thankful that I probably will never have one of these encounters.

• 2:12Wes Germer?

  Welcome to the show. Tonight we'll be speaking with Mike and Joe, and I got the email originally from Mike talking about this encounter, and his good friend Joe. And the incident took place in Colorado. We're going back to 2018, and Mike had sent me these still shots of what Joe had actually captured with his phone, and I'll let the guys go into it. If you've had an encounter, and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected], and if you get a chance, check out sasquatchchronicles.com.

• 2:52Wes Germer?

  You can become a member and get additional shows. Let's jump into it tonight. I want to welcome Mike to the show. Mike, thanks for coming on.

• 3:03Speaker 04

  Good to be here, Wes.

• 3:05Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's good to have you. And I know we have Joe as well. Joe, thank you for being here.

• 3:11Speaker 05

  Yep.

• 3:12Wes Germer?

  And I'd kind of like to start with Joe. I know we're going back to 2018 in Colorado. If you would, would you start from the very beginning? What were you doing and what happened?

• 3:25Speaker 05

  We was on an elk hunt. It's a yearly elk hunt we do. We've been doing it probably at that point at 15 years we had been doing it. I got certain places I hunt in the morning, certain places I hunt in the evening. This was going to be an evening hunt. And I usually walk, you know, two or three miles uphill. And my second half, I turn around and come back and walk that same, not the same area, but like come back to the camp on a downhill, make it easy. And they were doing some logging this year, and I just wanted to go see what they were cutting because it's going to affect the hunting for a few years. So I just wanted to see what they were logging. And, you know, the closer I got, I could hear the chainsaws and the machinery's running. And I was probably still a quarter mile out from where they were logging from. And I had my GPS out in my hand, and I was just trying to get my bearing of

• 4:10Speaker 05

  where I was going and just trying to see where the logging line was going to start at. I've walked this probably hundreds of times, same area, and I'm just walking and then I kinda look up and I caught something on my eye and I'm like, "Man, that don't look right." And the more I looked at it, I'm like, you know, there's bears there and I've got a bear license. I'm like, "Well, maybe this is a bear." And next thing you know, this thing kinda turns around and just looks at me, you know? And it's, you know, at first I couldn't tell if it was standing up, sitting down, but after it turned and looked at me, I'm like, "Oh, my God," you know, he's trying to process, "What did I just see?" And when I looked at him, I'm like, "Well, this ain't a bear."

• 4:52Speaker 05

  Because if it were a bear, I'd have probably shot at it, you know, "This ain't a bear." And it's probably between 25, 30 yards out. And then I've noticed it's kinda sitting down and sitting down, it's eye level height with me, so put a height on that, I don't know how that would be. And then it turned, it turns kinda back towards where the trees are being cut. And at this point, I'm realizing, I'm seeing something I've never seen before. So I dropped my GPS, I grabbed my phone out of my pocket and I pull up and I start recording. I reach down, I grab my GPS, I get some video of it from where I'm at. And I just start walking off real quick, heading towards the guys that are cutting trees out there.

• 5:32Speaker 05

  And as I come around the corner, I didn't even know I actually caught video of it a second time from a different angle. I caught video of it from a second time. And I just walked on off. And I'm still, at this point, I'm like, "What did I see?" You know, was it a person in a costume? And I'm thinking, "There's no way there's a person in a costume at this time of year because the bear season's open and it's rifle season for bear." I'm bow hunting, but the rifle season for bear is open. I'm like, "There's nobody in the woods with this kinda suit on that's that crazy because they're gonna get shot." And, you know, I'm just still walking, I pull the video back, I watch the video, I'm like, "What did I see? What did I see? What did I see?"

• 6:14Speaker 05

  I don't know how to explain it, I know what I saw, you know? Then after that, the thing is, when I get back to camp, how do I tell my friends what I just seen? You know, because some of them are pretty brutal. Some of them would, would, would, but you know, bite into it and go with it, but most of them are just gonna beat me up. So I kinda walked out to where they were cutting the trees. I never did find the guys cutting the trees, but I found the tree line and I wanted to see what a, what a timber cutting started and I had the rest of the evening on a vent for and got back to camp and I kinda mentioned, I said, hey y'all, I saw a bigfoot and then the joke started and then I pulled the video out and some of them were like, oh my God. And then some of them are still, well, it was a bear. And I'm like, man, if it was a bear, I'd have shot it.

• 6:58Speaker 05

  If it was a bear, I would have known, you know, it had a face. It definitely had a face when it looked at me. And uh, it stayed, it stayed sitting down. It never stood up. It was either sitting on a log on a stump. But it was kinda like, I feel like when I first saw it, I kinda felt like it was watching towards where the trees were being cut. You know, it was a lot of chainsaws running, a lot of machinery running, a lot of beeping. But it's probably three, 400 yards out. It was like it was watching them or listening to them and then I just walked up behind it.

• 7:30Wes Germer?

  And Joe, I know that Mike actually sent me the still shots of this thing and you know, when I looked at it, I was like, oh, oh, he did capture something. Will, will he send me the full video?

• 7:44Speaker 05

  I can send you the actual video. Now this was a shorter version. I've since lost the whole version because I'm like three phones out since then. But I got like a, I think it's 18 or 14 second clip of it. But I definitely can send you that.

• 7:59Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I can't wait to check out the video. So tell me, Joe, this thing turns and kinda looks at you. Would you describe the face, kind of what you remember?

• 8:10Speaker 05

  I couldn't tell you if it was hairy, but it was the same color as the fur. But I can make out eyes, cheeks, you know, nose, mouth. I can make all of that out. And you can almost in the video, if you, if you go back and forth for a couple of seconds at that time where it's like turning the head, you're gonna see the eye sockets, nose and the kind, you're gonna see the space, the face, the facial features. And like above the eyes, the crown of the head went higher than any kind of, you know, like a kinda gorilla-ish. A gorilla's head's real tall above its eyes. And then when I run around the corner, my phone's still videoing. When you catch it a second time, you get a real good frontal view, like from chest high.

• 8:54Wes Germer?

  I think what's interesting is you see this thing, Joe, and it kind of turns and looks your way and then looks back at whatever it's doing. It obviously knew you were there, but it didn't really seem to care.

• 9:07Speaker 05

  Other than just acknowledged me, there was no more interaction. Just it just turned, looked at me, didn't care about me, you know? And then on the second view, it's just looking straight at me. So I just didn't get up, didn't raise my arms up, didn't do anything, just kind of just, oh, look, there's somebody.

• 9:28Wes Germer?

  And I know you were there just kind of scouting around. After seeing the saint, do you leave?

• 9:34Speaker 05

  I finish hunting. I had a goal to where I wanted to be at at a certain time. And then I get there, then I turn around and I got enough time to get back to camp before dark.

• 9:45Speaker 05

  It's a trek that I've done for years and I've been very successful hunting that area, Elkhorn. I know where I want to be till about a certain time and I know how much time, because I don't like being in the woods in Colorado in the dark because it's so cold. We're from South Louisiana and that's a different kind of, that'd kill you kind of cold up there.

• 10:05Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's real cold up there in the Colorado mountains. What did you think about Bigfoot prior to ever seeing this thing?

• 10:13Speaker 05

  The only thing I've ever Bigfoot, when I was eight, nine years old, went to Arkansas, and I had a vivid dream of a Bigfoot. And I don't remember exactly what it was. He either jumped on the car or threw a rock at us in the dream. And from that point on, I've been in the woods since I was three. And from that point on, I've always, you know, I can say I was a believer, but I didn't say there's no such thing. Because I've watched all the shows and the, I don't know if it's, what's the name of the film in California? I've always watched that film. And I'm a believer that they're there and have never seen one. And

• 10:51Speaker 05

  Never had any other instance that I said that could have been one or heard one or anything. And I had family members over the years tell the stories about central Louisiana that they've had a thing that they've seen. And my daddy had an uncle that had a story and just never dismissed it, but till till I seen what I seen, you know, 100% doubt, I saw something I can and I cannot explain. And 100% no, it was not a bear. Seen too many bears, I've shot bears and uh, it was very peaceful, it was very calming. You know, as soon as I seen it, I didn't freak out that second. And then when it looked at me, you know, I'm thinking, man, you know, I can't be seeing what I'm seeing and then

• 11:36Speaker 05

  you try to process something in 14 seconds and it's just a little hard. I'm like, what do I do? You know? So my thing at that point was let's just let me just get to these people. Maybe one of these guys are playing around, maybe somebody's trying to scare these people. But I never did get to the actual guys that were logging. And uh, still to this day, when I go back like last night, I watched the video again last night. It all comes back and I seen what I seen.

• 12:04Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you know, from what you saw in the face, what you remember, and just the whole way it acted, its behavior, did it remind you more of a man or did it remind you more of an animal?

• 12:18Speaker 05

  It was less of an animal and it was super calm. It like it didn't even startle. I've startled animals, I've startled coyotes and different animals and bears. Where where you both see each other at the same time, you kind of jump back or you got a reflex or flinch. There was nothing there. When it swung and looked at me, it just saw me. You know, like yep, somebody's right there and just turned his head back towards the noise. But it was more, it was more humanoid like a gorilla like than anything else. Just the top half of the head just reminded me so much of a gorilla. Cause it was just extended up, just like a cone almost, but not, you'll see in the video.

• 13:03Speaker 05

  And uh, it just wasn't startled. That's just, that's what was weird, you know? Every other animal you usually see in the woods either runs, shocks us, freezes. It was none of that, it was calm.

• 13:18Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it's behavior reminds me much more of a human, the way it just kind of turned and looked at you than was like, whatever, and went back to what it was looking at. And you're right, a normal animal, you would startle it. And this thing didn't seem to be startled at all. And Mike, I wanted to ask you, your, your portion of it, of what happened to you, is it in this area?

• 13:39Speaker 04

  Okay, my, my port is it's a, it's not even over there with him or where he was hunting this, this, my deal happened in North Texas. We were about 20 miles from the Oklahoma border. It was a place called Bellevue, Texas. And I would go deer hunting up there with, with some relatives there every year. And this one particular year, we get up there, we, we, we were actually staying in, the people we were hunting with had, it's kind of rolling hills up there, a lot of open area, just rolling hills with a lot of cattle and mesquite thickets and like scrub boats, but a lot of mesquite thickets. So we get to their house and we're staying in a camper,

• 14:22Speaker 04

  basically out in the middle of a cow pasture. And they had a pole out there, which that's where we got our power and our water was out in this, it was, we was all hooked up, you know, we had power, water, everything. So we stand out in the middle of this pasture. And when we get there, this particular year, we get to the camper and the guy's wife comes over there and she, you know, we talked for a little while and she goes, oh, hey, by the way, y'all need to, y'all be careful out here. She goes, we just, we not long found a calf and it was skin, like skin out inside out. And she goes, I don't recall her telling me that anything like organs or meat was, was missing

• 15:02Speaker 04

  off of the calf, but it was just skin inside out, laying out in the pasture. And I'm like, jeez, I mean, you're only gonna do that if you got hands. Like, um, so on that note, so we, we proceed, we start our hunting stuff. And there was different areas that he would take us. So he would bring them to this one area and they would have three stands that he would, that we would be hunting. And they were about 200 yards apart. And when I say a stand, so it's a, the deer stands were box stands that were elevated about four or five foot off the ground. So this one particular area, there was three in a row about 200 yards apart.

• 15:45Speaker 04

  So he, um, he puts me out at the first one and then the next two guys go to the next one. So I'm, it was on an afternoon, I'm making an afternoon hunt. And he goes, look, you just, you walk across this, the edge of this cow pasture, just follow the edge of the woods. And you're gonna get to a right away that cuts through the woods. It was a, a power line. Uh, these huge tall power lines that cut right through the, through the mesquite thicket. And he goes, you turn in on that power line right away. And he goes, we walk down that right away and you're gonna walk right to the box stand. I'm like, okay. So I get down there and I'll, I'll get to the right away. I'm walking down it and it's about the width of the, the right away was almost, I'm gonna just say it was about 20 yards across. That's as wide as it was, 20, 30 yards across.

• 16:30Speaker 04

  So I'm walking down there, walking, walking. I get to the box stand, I get in it. And I got woods to a thicket to my left and kind of a thicket to my right. And I noticed on my right also at the edge of the thicket, I, I could see what looked like a little levee. So it was a pond right there. And then in front of me, I could just see like a open, like a little pasture area in front of me. So I'm making my afternoon hunting. A little while later, I see a bobcat comes out. So shoot the bobcat, went out there, got him, drug him, put him underneath the, the stand. I get back in it, so I continued hunting. And a little later on, um, some does came. So I shot at one of the does and she ran off. I saw, I saw where she went, so I'm, wait until it gets dark.

• 17:14Speaker 04

  I'm gonna go look and see if I can find some blood or something. So a little while before dark, I'm, I, I notice something. I could, I smelled something. I'm like, what's that smell? And I just, I couldn't quite grasp it, but it was kind of strong. And I'm like, man, what was that? It hung, it hung there for a little while, then, then it was gone. So anyway, it gets dark. I get down, I go out toward the front of the stand and I go look, I could never find no blood. So I'm like, okay, I look, look, I said, I'm, I'm gonna come back after a while. I'll bring one of the guys with me and we're just gonna double check me, you know, make sure that I apparently didn't miss or whatever. So I grabbed the Bobcat from under the stand.

• 17:54Speaker 04

  I turn around and I'm walking back out down this 20, 30 yard wide, right away back toward the pasture where I came in. So I get about halfway down that, I'm just gonna call it a trail. I get about halfway down before I get to the pasture. And it's, the, the trail was kind of flat, then it like dipped down and then it was, then it would like come back up and then you would get toward the pasture. So I get toward where it dips down and I, it was, I was like, God dang. It, it had, it was the same smell that I was getting from the stand, but way stronger. And here's the weird part. You, it, it wasn't like you walked into it and you gradually started smelling it.

• 18:39Speaker 04

  It's like, oh, it kind of smells something and then it gets stronger. It, it wasn't that way. This is, it was weird. It was like you walked into this wall of this smell. Like you opened the door and it hit you. And I walked about, I'm just gonna say 10 feet and I walked out of it like a wall. You was in it and out it. It was no gradual getting away from it. It was like, that was the weird part. And I'm like, what the hell is that? And if you ask me, well, um, cause I know, you asked me, what did it smell like? The best way I could explain it is it smelled like a stockyard. So I just, and I didn't sit there and go, oh, that's a Bigfoot or nothing.

• 19:22Speaker 04

  Cause my mind, you know, especially back then, uh, my mind just didn't work that way. I was aware, aware of Bigfoots and all that, but that did, um, so I, I, I just, I'm like, okay, I'm out of here. I kept going, walking, I walk, I'll get all the way back to the fence, across the pasture. I get to the fence where they gonna pick me up and my, my cousin met me there. He was at the next stand down. So he met me at the fence. I didn't tell him a word. Say, "Hey, man, I got a bobcat. You know, I shot at a doe, you know." I said, "It's gonna be a little bit for..." The fellow was gonna come pick us up. I said, "You wanna come walk back down in there with me? And we'll look to see if we can find some blood." He goes, "Oh, yeah, man." So, I left the bobcat there and kept my gun on my rifle on my shoulder and we walked back down in there.

• 20:04Speaker 04

  We get to that right of way, walking back down that trail, and we get to that bottom, little bottom area, and there, well, it hit us. And he goes, "Dude, you smell that?" And I'm like, "Yeah." I said, "I didn't wanna tell you nothing. I just..." And it was still there, still as strong. And he goes, "Bro, it smells like a sail barn." And if you know what a sail barn is, it's it's where people bring a lot of cattle and hogs and just livestock for auction. He goes, "Bro, it smells like a damn sail barn." So, we walk in there, we went, and we went look for the, um, to see if we could find blood. Never find no blood from the deer, so apparently I missed it.

• 20:48Speaker 04

  So, we turn around, walking back out, the smell is still there, strong as hell. At that point, when we get back to the, you know, I never, and we never heard anything. I mean, I shone my light in the thicket right there, where I could never see anything, never heard nothing. So, we get back to the fence and we talking, and I said, "That's the point where I was like, "Bro, I think that might, it might be a bigfoot hanging around." And obviously, he's laughing at me. Still, to this day, I mean, he would just, he just don't believe in it and he'd just make fun of me. But I said, "Dude, I'm telling you..." And he's like, "Dude, that's some damn, it's a hog. It's hogs that came through there." And I'm like, "You gotta understand, this was probably almost 20 years ago that this happened at this point, probably 17 years ago.

• 21:33Speaker 04

  And back then, especially in North Texas, they didn't have the hogs like they do nowadays. They were not there. And, and toward the end of the years where we stopped tonning up there, the hogs did finally move in, but they did not have them then. And I've been, I've killed hogs. I've been around a trail or full of them that were caught, and we would, we would kill them and clean them, and wild hogs, and they didn't smell that strong. They didn't smell like that." You know, I've been right up against dead ones. I've been with javelinas, which is your South Texas version of a hog. And they got a little musky smell when you get close to them, but it sure as hell wasn't like this.

• 22:17Speaker 04

  And I've been hunting all my life and, you know, I've never seen a bigfoot personally, but to me, I think there was one hanging there. Now, the rest of that story goes.

• 22:30Speaker 04

  One of my other cousins who was also there was hunting in that middle stand one afternoon. So like I said, there was three in a row. He was hunting in the middle one, which was 200 yards from the one where the smell hit me that night. So he's hunting on an evening hunt. He ends up shooting a little buck. Shoots it, kills it, and it got dark on him. So he's out there in the dark by himself and he's waiting for this fellow to go get him. And once he gets back to the camp, he starts telling me, you know, he's like, hey, Mike. He said, oh, this was during the rut. And for people that don't know what the rut is, that's when, you know, the bucks are chasing the does. It's mating season for the deer at that time when we were there. And a lot of times when bucks are chasing does,

• 23:14Speaker 04

  they make this grunting sound like brat, brat, brat, kind of thing. I've never, obviously, been hunting, you know, hunt deer at night. So to tell you how much that goes on at night, but it does go on during the daytime. I'm sure it's a lot less at night.

• 23:31Speaker 04

  So he asks me, he goes, man, does the bugs grun at night? And I'm like, well, I'm thinking they do, bro, but, you know. He goes, because, man, I went to go get my deer. And he said, there was something out there. And he said, I could never see it, but he said it was loud and it was just like this brat, brat. And he said, and this guy's been hunting, very experienced hunter, been hunting all his life. He goes, and he's heard deer grunt. I think he was just kind of trying to feel me out on. He goes, it scared the hell out of me. And he said, I hurried up, I grabbed my deer and it was about 100 yards for him to get to his gate. And he said, I drug it back to the gate. And he said, man, he said Ricky couldn't come quick enough to pick me up. He said, it scared me. So if you want to know what my opinion is.

• 24:16Speaker 04

  I think it was that same thing from 200 yards down that whether, you know, I'm sure it had to have here in shot. It's a rifle shot, but probably knew there was a dead deer there. It was probably maybe coming to try and take it, see what was going on. But I think it was that same thing that I smelled and he never, he didn't lay eyes on it, but he's this weird sound that he heard, you know? So that's kind of, you know, my, my story on, on, on what happened up there in North Texas.

• 24:48Wes Germer?

  Let me ask you, Mike. I mean, you and Joe are experienced guys out there and you pull up to this ranch and she starts telling you this story about this calf that was killed and it was skinned inside and out. If you don't believe in Bigfoot, the only other thing that would do that would be a poacher. And I don't see a poacher doing that. I mean, a cat's not going to do that. I don't think you guys have bears. Do you guys have bears in Northern Texas?

• 25:17Speaker 04

  There was not bears up there. And as far as, man, this, this was so rural. As close as neighbors, and when I say close, a half a mile would be his, his, his, his parents. And this is very rural. And could it be a poacher?

• 25:33Speaker 04

  Uh, yeah, but I, I'm not sure I would understand what the point in poaching a calf and just skinning it. Um, shooting it and leaving it just to shoot it and leave it? Maybe if you're a poacher, I could maybe understand that, but to skin one inside out, like I, that part I would not understand.

• 25:53Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you would burn up a lot of time on someone's property. I mean, what's the point on skinning the animal, especially a calf on someone else's property? You know, most poachers I know, I don't know personally, most poachers I've ran into, they're hunting, but it's out of season and they're actually eating it. So I don't think a poacher in like the United States means the same thing as like. You know, people hunting game in Africa or, you know, poaching elephants or it's the same word, but I think it has a different meaning because like I said, I've run into poachers, but it's always out of season and they're killing to eat. It's not just killing to kill.

• 26:35Wes Germer?

  Not that I agree with it. And you know, I have family and friends in Dallas, in the Dallas area, and I go down there a lot. I'll probably be down there sometime this year before it gets too hot, but you sneak on someone's property in northern Texas and you shoot their calf, they're gonna shoot you. I mean, the people in North Texas, they will shoot you if you go on their property and, and kill their calf.

• 27:01Speaker 04

  Exactly. You will get shot. And, and, and again, if you're gonna be a poacher and you're gonna do some, something like that, this is just my opinion that you're gonna typically, that person's gonna do it from a vehicle. And if you're gonna do something dumb like that, they're gonna shoot it from the vehicle, kill it. If that's just their intent and then just, they're gonna take off and leave. You're not gonna, you're not gonna shoot it or just, because she didn't say anything about bullet wounds. You know, she said this thing was, it was just skin inside out. Like it wasn't, she didn't mention, you know, and, and her husband, they've, they've lived there all their lives and they had never seen anything like this.

• 27:40Wes Germer?

  Yeah, it really doesn't make sense. Did you ever follow up with her as far as like, hey, did anything else ever happen on that property?

• 27:48Speaker 04

  No, and I never really talked to her that often. She, she just never came around much. Mostly it was Ricky, the, the feather. And man, you know, all the years we hunted up there, he, he never, ever, I mean, he was a pretty straightforward guy. You know, I think if he would have heard something or saw something, he would, he would have definitely have told us. And the only thing that ever, that ever came out of his mouth about something like that, it was just a joke he was playing. And there were some fellas that would stay right behind his house in a tent and they were from further south Texas, but they would come up there and pay him to hunt. And they would go up there, stay in tents and they were hunting the area, kind of behind where our camper was.

• 28:27Speaker 05

  They had some thickets back in there and Ricky, he was letting them hunt back there. And he just said one, he said, man, them guys were some spooky fellows. He said, I told him, uh, you know, never go around the creek back there. And he said, one night I went and messed with them in their tent. And I said, man, that's a good way to get killed, man. People get scared, they're gonna start shooting. And he goes, yeah, he said, I, I thought about that after that probably wasn't a good idea. But, um, he was just messing with them guys just as far as that little bit went. But he never led on to us that there was anything that he had ever saw. He had nothing, like nothing.

• 29:02Wes Germer?

  Let me ask you, Joe, I know that you're an experienced guy, just like Mike. And you know, when eyewitnesses report this smell, it's 99% of the time, exactly how Mike describes it. You walk into it, take a couple of steps and you walk out of it. Which is weird because that's not really how smell works, you know? It's like, oh, something stinks and you're looking for it, looking for it. And as you get closer to whatever stinks, the smell gets worse. This isn't how this smell works at all. It's exactly how Mike describes it. Being kind of an experienced guy out there, what's your take on that? When you hear people walk in and out of this smell?

• 29:47Speaker 05

  The two stories I've heard from my family, I said, I was a local where we hunt at in Louisiana. The story that they had, if there was a smell with their account with Bigfoot. And like they said, it was a smell they couldn't explain. And their story was, and it was this, this was, this would have probably been in the twenties or thirties. It was a, an older guy's uncle had an experience with one. And the one he seen actually said he was walking through the woods, whatever he seen. And he said it was a female, actually had a dead hog under its arm as it was walking. And then I think it was my daddy's uncle, which I didn't know the guy because they would

• 30:28Speaker 05

  have been long dead by the time I was around. He had an encounter with one and it had a smell. And you know, the stories are too far back to remember them now, but that's the two other stories I've heard in my life. But, uh, back to my story. I made friends with some locals up there in the first couple of years. So these people I got a 20 something year relationship with. When I got back to town from my experience, her name's Ms. Pam, I told Ms. Pam, I said, Ms. Pam, I seen a Bigfoot. And all she did was smile and she goes, yeah, we know they're up there. And she said, we get plenty of stories, plenty of people see them. And, uh, and I kind of like, you really don't want to tell nobody because of the jokes and this and that. And she kind

• 31:12Speaker 05

  of understood it, but she reassured me and still to this day, we talk about it that they're up there because they lived there. And it happened about 45 miles south of their house is where it happened. And her and her husband, there was no doubt in their mind when I told them and showed them the videos that, yeah, you saw what you saw. Mine had no smell. I didn't smell anything out the normal. And there might've been a downwind thing, but it's, you know, it's just crazy. I know what I seen, can't explain it, you know? When I seen what I seen, I kind of got shook up and you know, I just felt real weird. It's kind of like sick feeling. And I don't know why that came over me. It's hard to, it's hard to explain.

• 31:55Wes Germer?

  Yeah. You know, after seeing this thing, did it change your opinion as far as going out there hunting? I guess it really wasn't aggressive. It just kind of looked in your direction and looked away. But how did it affect you as far as wanting to go back out there? Or did it?

• 32:11Speaker 05

  I'm gonna tell you what it actually did to me. I've always been afraid of the woods. And I mean, since I was hunting, my first time deer hunting on my own was somebody said, here, get right here to stand 300 yards down. It's on the left in the tree.

• 32:26Speaker 05

  From that point on till probably that encounter, I have always been afraid in the woods. You know, when I got on the stand, I lifted my feet up so they weren't hanging off into the dark. You know, when I walked out, I shot my flashlight. I would talk to myself like I was two people. I was always afraid of the woods. I'm not really afraid of the woods. I was afraid of running into somebody and just, you don't. I'm more afraid of people in the woods than anything. I've seen mountain lions. I've seen bears. They really don't scare me. But I found after the encounter, I really have no more fear in the woods. I've lost my fear. I can stay on a tree till 10 o'clock at night and walk out, you know, with a flashlight and I don't have the fear no more.

• 33:09Speaker 05

  And I don't know if that encounter reassured me that I'm okay. But no, but before that point, I was really afraid of the woods. Now in my tent at night, because we tent camp in Colorado, we hear things. And I, we had a friend about two or three years ago, videoed one night in his tent. He was scared and you could hear the rocks clacking, cackow, cackow. And it went 360 degrees around our campsite. And I've heard things walking around our campsite at night and I've had things. I had, I've had a cow step on my tent one night, a cattle cow. So you, we get weird things like that happen. And we find formations in the woods with something stacked rocks up, a stacked weird things up and just random.

• 33:54Speaker 05

  And I've got pictures of that somewhere as it be to find them, but we find things in the woods that just, just little weird things that are unique and they're stacked up perfectly. And how do you, how do you point that off? Pack rats or wood done it, you know, just some crazy things like that. But no, I do not have any more fear in the woods since that encounter.

• 34:16Wes Germer?

  Yeah, well, it definitely sounds positive, which is a good thing. You know, I ask everyone on the show, what do you think Sasquatch is? What do you think, Joe? What do you think that these things are?

• 34:27Speaker 05

  I got a brother that's real smart and he's real versed in the Bible. And a lot of people, and I'm probably gonna say it wrong, revert this back to Nepulins. Nepulins. And I did some research on that. I don't think they of this world, if you want my opinion. After doing research and I think that from a different dimension, it sounds crazy, different dimension. You know, they disappear, they there. I don't, I don't know, but

• 34:56Speaker 05

  I don't, I really don't know, but I seen what I seen, can't explain it. And what sucks is when you see him and it's hard to talk to somebody about it because of the joking and the laughing. Some people like Mike, I'm glad Mike called me that night when he saw that I posted it one time. He's somebody that you can talk to that's not gonna be the other side of, man, you crazy. What you man, what you was smoking? I don't drink, I don't do drugs, you know? And I'm a normal person. And, and I gotta live with this. That's the hardest part. I gotta live with what I seen. Because even like we was at a function last night and when I brung it up that this was gonna happen today, there's a million questions. And then you get questioned on everything that you say and then and all you can revert to back is I seen what I seen and I can't explain it.

• 35:42Speaker 05

  And I'm not a religious person. And my brother pretty much explained it the best. And when you read it, you know, maybe that's what we're seeing. And I'm, I listen to Clear Channel at night and listen to a lot of stories and a lot of people revert back to Nepulins or whatever you call them.

• 35:58Wes Germer?

  Yeah, the, the Nephilim. What makes you think it's an interdimensional creature? Not that I disagree with you, but what makes you feel that way?

• 36:07Speaker 05

  Because of everybody's encounters, kind of like the same, you know? Where did it come from? Nobody else sees them. They're never on game cameras. Which, everything's on game cameras, you know? They're never on game cameras. Everybody's video's blurry. Mine's pretty clear compared to everybody else's. And, you know, I've been in the woods my whole life. I've covered thousands of miles. And I come across this one, one time. You know, I've never seen a foot track, a print. I've seen, I've had seen things. makeshift shelters made in the woods. I've got some pictures of those that I found. You might want to see that. If I could dig some of those up, I'll get them to Mike to send to you. I have seen stuff like that, that's unexplainable.

• 36:53Speaker 05

  But I don't think they have this world. That's the only way I can explain why you can't catch them, you can't see them. Nobody's ever got one. Nobody's ever run one forward. They gotta be interdimensional or some, you know? They just appear when they appear.

• 37:08Wes Germer?

  Yeah, there's a lot of weird things that go on. And sometimes in people's encounters with these creatures, and it makes me wonder what they are. You know, you come across any other animal on the planet. And they're gonna probably flee from you. And when it comes to predators, if they don't flee. You're in trouble. And I think out of all my years hunting, I've only come across one black bear, and it was by mistake. But it wanted nothing to do with me. Thank God, because I would have lost that battle. And I didn't realize black bears could move that quick. You know, we were talking earlier about. This thing's behavior, just kind of looking over in your direction and looking back. At the tree line. It almost sounds more human-like than any other animal I've ever run into.

• 37:54Speaker 05

  It had no worries of me at all. There was no shock in the face. There was no shock in the body language. I was, I was shocked a little, you know? Like I said, I dropped my GPS on the ground to grab my phone. And you know, and you're trying to play this quick in your head. What am I looking at? What am I looking at? What am I looking at? It had no concern of me. And almost every video you see, there is no concern of the human. Once the encounter happens, they acknowledge and they just kind of walk off or do what they do. Now, I'm the one that kind of briskly ran off, but it never, it never left. And I've been back to that spot to try to find the exact same spot because

• 38:35Speaker 05

  I had the GPS trail, but I never could find exactly where it was sitting at. Because they did do some logging there in the trees were different the next time I went.

• 38:45Wes Germer?

  You know, Joe, through all your experience of being out in the woods, have you ever seen these balls of light that we talk about on the show?

• 38:54Speaker 05

  It was there in New Mexico, we seen some lights that I can't explain. There was three lights in a triangle shape. And this is totally different from what we're talking about now. But I had, we had a witness, and you know, I had a thermal scope with me, and we cannot pick these lights up on the thermal scope, which I can get a 747 at 40,000 feet with my thermal scope. And that's the only lights experience I've ever had. I've never had anything in the woods light wise, anything, anything else that's ever happened in the woods. I've never ran across a smell that was, that kind of scared me. I've heard noises, I've heard screams, I've heard things like that over the years that, you know, I

• 39:35Speaker 05

  wrote them off as coyotes or boxers or cats. But no, I've never seen lights. I have seen things stacked that, like I said, those things I find, like somebody positioned things for you to find it. Yeah, a person could have done it. But I found things like that. And I found shelters that were made. I probably found shelters four times in my life. Kind of like a lean to a person would make, but more rough. Like a person would take a saw and cut trees and branches and shape them and try to geometrically make it look like, like if you were stick building a house. These things were like, they just grabbed whatever they can grab and kind of just stacked them up into like a pyramid or a T P T P style.

• 40:16Speaker 05

  Just for like a, a quick shelter. There was nothing that was humanly cut. But it was definitely strategically stacked.

• 40:26Wes Germer?

  Let me ask you, Mike, kinda going back to your encounter for a moment. What do you make of that smell of you walking into it and walking out of it?

• 40:36Speaker 04

  Um, I have not, excuse me, I have not ever smelled anything like that before. And what do I think it is? And why do some people smell them and some, some don't? I think it's possibly that it's maybe something they put off when they are unsure or something, or they get scared, or they may, maybe they're scared. Um, and it's, uh, I don't wanna say almost like a skunk does when they threatened or scared of something, you know, they spray, they just may be able to emit this and they don't smell like that all the time. I, I really, that's my best guess on it. I, I don't know. But like I said, I've, I've been around, I've been around a lot of hogs in my life and I ain't never smelled like that, especially that strong.

• 41:21Speaker 04

  They didn't have the hogs up there like they do nowadays. It just, they, they weren't around. And, and something else I couldn't explain that, um, not that this would be, I wouldn't think it'd be Bigfoot related, cause it'd be, I mean, I know they're supposed to be fast, but I don't know. But when we first started hunting up there, we'd be driving down these country roads, or you know, either early in the morning or, or in the dark coming back after the hunt. Those country roads were loaded with rabbits, loaded with cotton tail rabbits. The first couple of years we went, and then it just seems like toward the end, you know, middle of toward the end, when we stopped going up there hunting, you, if you saw one, you were lucky.

• 42:03Speaker 04

  And I, I don't know if that would be more attributed to, you know, to a coyote explosion population, but which I didn't see it personally. Um, you know, hunting, I mean, we would see a few here and there. I just thought that was something that was odd, like the rabbits vanished. It was odd, man. Um, cause like I said, those roads were, they were covered in them, uh, first couple of years. But yeah, as far as, you know, smelling anything like that in years past, you know, uh, I've heard some weird stuff, uh, like Joe was just saying, I've heard some, you know, I guess I could call it a scream, I just was not up there, just, I, I do, we do an awful lot of hunting in Mississippi. I'd say about 30 minutes east of Natchez, we, we do a lot of hunting. I've heard some stuff, you know, on our place that.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  In broad daylight, not in the dark and you're just coming, it would be coming through the woods and it would be just this high pitch. And just, and it would just keep going and you could tell it, it was, it was not in one spot, it was moving through the woods. It's just this high pitch.

• 43:05Speaker 04

  I just kinda wrote it off because you know, I do believe in Bigfoot, obviously, but I'm not one of those guys that like, everything I hear or see, that's gotta be a Bigfoot. That's not me. I don't, I just don't operate like that, but um, so I kinda wrote those things off as, man, that's could be a bobcat or, or, or we got a lot of gray foxes. Cause it wasn't nothing that like rumbled my chest or went right through me to sound, you know, but it was, it was pretty loud and it was weird. Something that I didn't hear often, that's for sure. That's kinda the only experiences um, that I've ever had, you know, on my place in Mississippi now. Yeah, I know, I'm sure you've seen this video, um, and this, this video came from about probably thirty minutes from where we hunting up there.

• 43:47Speaker 04

  It was in the Homochita Forest and this guy walked up on one and it was kinda in a swampy area and it was, it was stooping down. I think the guy might've been hog hunting. It was in daylight and the thing was stooping down and had an old rotten tree in front of it. It was kinda in the water, it was an old cypress tree and the, the Bigfoot was peeling the bark of it like he was trying to get in there digging stuff or grubs or whatever. And then when the thing stood up, the guy took off running. I, I know you had to have seen that video, but that was very close to where we hunting. It was in the, in the Homochita Forest in Mississippi. Now I've talking, I've talked to actually a game warden up there about two weeks ago.

• 44:28Speaker 04

  Just to feel him out, man, I said, man, if, if these guys, if anybody, they, if they heard some stories, they're gonna know. So I asked him and he was just, I don't think he was hiding anything from me. He said, he had, he's, you know, he's grown up there. He said, I've never seen nothing, you know, in my life, but he said, there was one story where of, of a man had told me that he had one behind his house. And he didn't elaborate on it. He just said, yeah, I talked to a guy not too long ago, said he thinks he's got one behind his house and you know, rooting around back there and. That was the only Bigfoot story he could tell me? He did tell me that, I was just telling Joe this earlier. He said he was standing on the edge of a, not to get off the Bigfoot subject, but this is UFO related. He was, him and a coach was standing on the edge of a football field by, by a school.

• 45:13Speaker 04

  And it was, it was dark, but he said, you know, they had the stadium lights and stuff. And he said, there was this, I don't know, 40 foot tree line, 40 foot high tree line right in front of him. And he said, all of a sudden they could see this object coming over the top of the trees. And he said, you could tell it was moving because it was over the tree. So you could tell it wasn't just sitting there, it was actually moving, but it was very, very slow. And he said it was triangular shape and it was either black or very dark in color. And he said it was humongous. He didn't give me a scale, but he just said this thing was freaking huge. And he said, as it come over the top of the trees, he said, it, there was no sound. No sound from this thing at all. And he said, you know, a lot of people tell you, ah, they see them and then just they take off and they gone.

• 45:58Speaker 04

  He said, not this one. He said, it just like it evaporated. It was gone. And he said, they both saw it, but I just thought that was weird.

• 46:11Wes Germer?

  That is interesting and I appreciate you sharing that, Mike. Have you ever seen the balls of light when you've been out in the woods?

• 46:19Speaker 04

  I haven't. Uh, now my dad, um, now this happened when I was just a little boy. So my daddy and a good friend of his was frogging one night. Now, you know, we live in South Louisiana, so there's a lot of marsh out here. So they was in some duck ponds one night and they were frogging, catching frogs. And it was in a little mud boat. So they going along and he said, all of a sudden out of nowhere, it's just, he didn't say it had a shape to it as in like a triangle or nothing like that. He said it was like a ball of light, but he said it was huge, big. And he said it come out over the pond where they were. And he said it was whatever, five, you know, five, 10 foot off the water. And he said, it was following them. He said, they would, they would move in the boat as they frogging. And he said, it would, it was following them and they, they would stop, it would stop.

• 47:04Speaker 04

  And they'd take off again and it would take off and it just kept doing that. And he said, it did it for, for quite a while. And he said, the next thing you know, kinda like I was just telling you, this one didn't evaporate. He said, it just, it just shot off into the sky and it was gone. That's the only ball of light story I have. I, I haven't seen anything like that personally.

• 47:24Wes Germer?

  Yeah, you know, Mike, you were talking about one of those creatures. It was on video where it's kind of in a swamp and it's tearing apart the bark on a tree. I remember the first time I watched that I was like, that's real. That's one of them. And it's interesting that it's in an area where you guys hunt. Let me ask you, what do you think Sasquatch is? What's your take?

• 47:46Speaker 04

  Yeah, so I've got a lot of things on that, man. I've always believed in them all my life. Probably the first time I ever saw anything big fur related would have been, I guess, in the 70s when I was a little kid, the passing Gimlin film. It was like coming to a, they must have made a little short movie about it because it was coming to a movie theater in down here where we live. Um, so that was my first thing on it. And I can remember me asking my dad about it. My dad said, he never said, oh, that's not real. He just said, oh, that's, that's over there in Northern California. We ain't got that over here. I guess he was trying to not scare me because we, we hunted, you know? So then as years went on, like I said, I always believed in it. And then in the past 10 years, I really started reading more on it and watching all these, you know, now with the internet,

• 48:31Speaker 04

  there's so much information. And then a lot of years ago was when I came across your site. And I just, it was your site for what it was, it was always my favorite. I just kept, because there's a lot of them now, but I always kept going back to, you know, your show. And I learned a lot from it. So as far as, you know, once you start reading in the Sasquatches, it's not just like it's a big, there's so much to this deal, man. Because you got all the cloak and stuff where they look like they can be like the Predator movie where it's pixelated, right? Um, I don't know what that's about. Can they turn it on and turn it can, or is that just another creature that's, that's just

• 49:10Speaker 04

  stays in? I don't know. I do think they flesh and blood, my modest opinion. I know they bleed because of all the stories I read and there's enough stories out there where people have shot them. And there was blood. So.

• 49:26Speaker 04

  Can they be from, from out, can they be part of the UFO thing? Very possible, because a lot of people say they see unidentified, like flying saucers, or whatever you wanna call it, UFOs, or they see lights and then these things appear. So, could there be some correlation with that? Yeah, absolutely, I think, I mean, because nobody knows. Are they living, are they living, are all living in caves or underground? Well, I know a lot of Mississippi don't have caves. So where, where are these things, where are they going during the day? Why are they not seeing more? Because there's a lot of sightings in Mississippi, man. I'm talking a bunch. I really don't know what these things do. Where, you know, where they staying all the time? Because it ain't just one, there's several of these things.

• 50:06Speaker 04

  And I, I think they're more on the, could it be like a human ape cross? I'm, I'm gonna say there's a good chance on that. I think they're more on our end than the ape end. I think they're actually more, from, from everything I'm seeing and reading, I think they're more intelligent than we are, for one thing. They can do more things, like with the infrasound thing. And I think that's probably what happened to Joe and him not even realizing it. Because he was telling me how nauseous, nauseous. He said, "Bro, after the fact, not like instantly, like after the fact." He goes, "Dude, I got so nauseous." And, and I'm like, I don't even know if I mentioned infrasound to him at that point. But I was like, he probably, he probably got hit with it and didn't even know it.

• 50:48Speaker 04

  So, yeah, I, I think they're more on, on a human line. What they are, nobody, and when, when, you gotta watch how you see, when, when you say, "nobody knows," because I think somebody out there knows. I think the government knows all about these things, and they have been for a long time. They probably have. Not only just dead bodies, but who knows, man? They may have, I mean, I don't know what they're doing, but I guarantee they know these things exist. There's a million reasons why, I mean, I can understand why they don't wanna just come out and, and say, "Hey, man, um, you know, Bigfoot's a real," and what, what that would do to the economy is crazy. It's gonna, it's gonna trash everything. Nobody's gonna wanna go in the woods, so there goes your hunting industry.

• 51:32Speaker 04

  All your, your national parks, nobody's gonna wanna go out there. They're gonna have to stop logging, you know, because they're gonna try and protect these things. And now you got a smart humanoid thing out there that's, so they're gonna protect all these, so all the logging industry's gone, because these things are everywhere. I mean, it's, it's gonna, it's gonna, it would trash everything, if you think about it. It would crash the economy.

• 51:55Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I think the opposite would happen. You know, if I said, here's a GPS location of a family group. Are you guys gonna say no? Are you guys gonna be like, yeah, let's go check it out? And I'm not saying to shoot one. I'm just saying because the curiosity of it. I think the public's curiosity of being, hey, let's go see one would overtake the fright of I'm never going in the woods again. I'm never doing this again. And when it comes to the lumber industry, I guess it depends on what kind of an animal this thing is, if it is a normal, natural animal. And I could be wrong. I mean, to your point, Mike, I mean, you could be a 100% right. And I

• 52:37Wes Germer?

  do think that they're very physical. You know, if you took Mike's theory and combined it with yours, you both could be right.

• 52:45Speaker 04

  Right. I mean, it depends on you. There's gonna be both sides of society. Some of them's gonna be curious and gonna, I'm gonna want to go check it out. Some of them's gonna want to try and kill it. That's obvious. But then you're gonna have the ones that are scared, you know, and they're not gonna want to go nowhere. Because if anybody does any kind of reading and you see

• 53:05Speaker 04

  how many missing people are in these national parks? If some, and I'm talking about a lot of people, anywhere from kids to grownups, there's a lot of people come up missing in national parks and then, and then just in the woods in general, but national parks a lot. So can you attribute all that to Bigfoot? Absolutely not. I mean, some of it's gonna be weather related. Some people just get lost or whatever, or get hurt, you know, fall down or clear whatever, break, you know, and they just end up dying out there. But so the effects of it could go out of the way. But I mean, I think a lot of people that come up missing out there is because of these things. Not all of them, but I think a lot of them. And I also think that Bigfoots are like people in a

• 53:50Speaker 04

  way, as far as the sense that you got good people and you got bad people, meaning you got murderers. So on Bigfoots, I think it's the same thing. They're not all the same. They don't all look the same. And they got different personalities. Some of them are friendly. And some of them, I think you get them in the wrong and they will kill you. You know, now, would they do with you? Do they actually eat you? I don't know all that. But do I think some of them will kill you? Absolutely.

• 54:18Wes Germer?

  Yeah, like I said, you could be right. I mean, it's, it's one of those sayings. I, I think it would crash economy if it was a normal, natural animal out there running around. But I don't think that's why it's being covered up. And you kind of said it earlier. So you think it's more of a, something that leans more closer to us than an animal?

• 54:42Speaker 04

  I do, man. I, I do. Um, I think they have a lot more towards us than an animal. They, they have their own language. We don't understand it. And is, is it something that old or ancient? I, I don't know what it is. Um, some of the best ones that I've heard is, is from, I think it was from the sixties with, um, was from Northern Cal, I think, uh, in the Sierras, the Sierra sounds, is that it?

• 55:06Wes Germer?

  Yeah.

• 55:07Speaker 04

  Ron, the Ron Moorhead stuff where they, then you can hear them talking, man, that, the voices are weird. So I mean, they have their own languages. I don't know, man. I just think they're, and they can avoid it. I, I think they've studying us more than we studying them, if you want my honest opinion. If you've been in the woods long enough, even though you've never seen one, I guarantee you, they've seen you. That's just my opinion on it.

• 55:33Wes Germer?

  Yeah, I agree with you, Mike. I think they've been watching us more than we've been watching them. And it's been a real pleasure having both of you guys on. And Joe, thank you for coming on. And if you would send that video, I'd sure appreciate it.

• 55:47Speaker 05

  Yeah. And while, while we were sitting here, I found a couple of those, those shelter pictures and I'm gonna go back on some older phones and try to find some of the other ones that were shaped like teepees. But, uh, we'll keep in touch. It was pretty neat.

• 56:00Wes Germer?

  Yeah, thank you again, Joe. And thank you, Mike, for coming on and kind of setting this whole thing up today. Like I said, I really enjoyed chatting with both of you.

• 56:09Speaker 04

  Yep. But thank you, Wes.

• 56:12Wes Germer?

  And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is [email protected]. And if you get a chance, check out sasquatchchronicles.com. You can become a member and get additional shows. Until next time, everyone.

• 58:21Speaker 02

  ...