Algorithmic Commerce

Judd Apatow joins Scott to discuss the changes he’s seen to the TV and film industries as well as the role media plays in our society. Judd also shares his thoughts on money, education, and family. Judd is an American filmmaker and has directed films including Knocked Up, This is 40, Trainwreck, and The King of Staten Island. Follow him on Twitter, @JuddApatow. Scott opens with how the potential TikTok Global deal could position Walmart as the leader in the commerce space. Office Hours: what’s coming for the marketing agencies, linking social feedback to investing platforms, and why it’s not up to businesses to save the Earth. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Scott Galloway?

  Episode 28. The sun's gravity is 28 times that of Earth. The atomic number of nickel? 28. 28 is the sum of the toshian function for the first nine integers. I am not impotent. I am in toshian. True story. I crush up Cialis and snort it. Why? Because I can. Go, go, go.

• 0:30Scott Galloway?

  Welcome to the 28th episode of the Prop G Show. Today's episode, we speak with Judd Apatow. Judd Apatow is one of the greatest filmmakers of our time. He's the founder of Apatow Productions, where he produces and directed films, including The Forty Year Old Virgin, Knocked Up, Trainwreck, and The King of Staten Island. We discuss the changes he's seen to the TV and film industries. He's probably one of the seminal influences in that change and the role media plays in our society. Okay, what's going on? Kind of what's going on can be something we could ask every fucking day for the last, I don't know, the last six months. By the way, did anyone in 2015 say, I know where I'll be in five years? I don't think anyone could have guessed this shit. Anyways, the TikTok shitstorm continues. What

• 1:14Scott Galloway?

  does this Oracle Walmart deal mean for business? Trump approved the tentative deal between ByteDance, TikTok's parent company, and Oracle, and the US Department of Commerce delayed the potential TikTok ban until September 27th. Vanessa Pappa said in a statement that both Oracle, and by the way, Vanessa is the head, I believe, of US TikTok, that both Oracle and Walmart will take part in a TikTok global pre-IPO financing round, in which they can take up to a 20% cumulative stake in the company. NPR reported that ByteDance is expected to own about 80% of TikTok global, but since 40% of ByteDance is owned by US investors already, specifically General Atlantic Partners and Sequoia.

• 1:55Scott Galloway?

  TikTok Global said it is majority owned by American investors post this deal, thereby sort of satisfying or getting to the end state, if you will. Walmart said in a statement that it has tentatively agreed to purchase 7.5% of TikTok Global, as well as enter into commercial agreements to provide its e-commerce, fulfillment, payments, and other omni-channel services to TikTok Global. Walmart CEO Doug McMillan will serve as one of the five board members. What else is going on? Meanwhile, Microsoft, left at the altar, is licking its TikTok wounds and batting its eyelashes in the video game space. Take that TikTok, I'm sleeping with this dude. Anyway, Zenimax Media, the parent company of game publisher Bethesda Softworks, is

• 2:39Scott Galloway?

  being acquired by Microsoft for $7.5 billion in cash. By the way, that's kind of a rounding error for Microsoft, who probably has enough cash to buy Airbus on its balance sheet. This deal puts Bethesda, one of the industry's largest privately-held game developers and publishers in the world, under the Xbox brand. Xbox Game Pass has over 15 million subscribers. Wait, hold on, what is that? What is the name for a subscription product as opposed to buying a console and handsets and games, or even downloading games? Would you sign up for a group of services? Hello, Microsoft, the ultimate rundle. The ultimate rundle of the company that's been probably the most valuable company for the longest over the last two years, has been largely driven on, you guessed it, a

• 3:24Scott Galloway?

  rundle, specifically Microsoft Office, which is the, the gangster, monogamous relationship between the corporate world and Microsoft. What is the premier rundle for the consumer world? Amazon Prime. What is the premier rundle recurring revenue bundle for the corporate world? Microsoft Office. And what do you know, they're moving to the subscription model across video games. With the addition of Bethesda, Microsoft will grow from 15 to 23 creative studio teams. Studio teams, don't know what that means. In other news, remember last week we talked about how Quibi failed to get off the ground? By the way, who was the original hater of Quibi? And I got shit for it, including hearing from their CFO saying, "You're not helping, it's bad karma to be trashing a company before it even launches." Quibi made absolutely no fucking sense. I mean, come on.

• 4:09Scott Galloway?

  The best line, the best line at the Emmys. Was Quibi one of the best award for dumbest idea that cost a billion dollars? Anyways, the Wall Street Journal reported that Quibi is also considering raising more money or going public through a merger with a SPAC. By the way, if a SPAC acquires Quibi, then we know we have literally, the canary's not dead in the coal mine, it's an ostrich that has an epileptic seizure and then throws up Chrissy Teigen as Judge Judy and then dies. That will make absolutely no sense. What's going on here? What's going on here? Okay, Quibi never made any sense. Old Hollywood model, ton of money on production, try and get buzzed. They never found anything that got any traction. Not enough capital to compete with the deepest pockets in media.

• 4:54Scott Galloway?

  Not exceptional technology. Just, I mean, the list goes on and on and on. And if you think about the difference between Quibi and TikTok, it's illuminating. It's illuminating. Light up, you light up my life, you bitch. Anyways, TikTok, what's it about? It's about what a lot of companies have done, or the companies, quite frankly, that have added the most shareholder value have basically arbitrage other people's time and assets. Let me, let me monetize your car. 96% of automobile time is unutilized, meaning it's parked or sitting fallow. Probably somewhere between 30 and 50% of apartment time, at least in urban centers, they are not occupied. I know that my place in New York pretty much sits empty all the time as I'm in Florida

• 5:39Scott Galloway?

  or I'm on the road or, you know, doing very important things, doing very important things. See above crushing up Cialis and snorting it. Anyway, anyway, fallow assets and also leverage your consumer base. Get your consumers to create content. Get your consumers to connect with each other. Get your consumers to create content and then stick on top of it, whether it's Facebook, relationship interactions, or YouTube content that's uploaded to YouTube, put on top of it an algorithm. Now, what is exciting? What is exciting?

• 6:11Scott Galloway?

  About this potential deal, this kind of platypus weird, cronyist deal called Oracle, Walmart and TikTok. By the way, I think there's about a 50 or a 51% chance it never goes through. I think she is just playing us. Let me just leave it there. I think he's just playing us. But anyways, let's assume it does go through. What is the most exciting thing about this deal? Walmart, or specifically, specifically, media has become algorithmic media in that it's no longer about Jeffrey Katzenberg trying to find the best Hollywood talent, paying them a shit ton of money, finding someone to write an original script and then hoping that show gets traction and then trying to sell ads against it. That era may be over or crowded,

• 6:54Scott Galloway?

  if you will. It's about trying to figure out an algorithm on top, again, of user-generated content, micro-content. Content that has a seven production value that I love, because it's been able to figure out I love it, is better than The Crown, which I say I've watched and I haven't, and I haven't. I'm lying. I haven't. I just haven't watched The Crown. Let me come out of the closet as someone who says they've watched The Crown and has not. Anyway, anyway, what's exciting, and you're going to use this term over and over, hashtag prof G, I own this term. The next thing, the next thing in the world of commerce that Walmart could pull off with TikTok? Algorithmic commerce, or specifically, Acom. What do we mean by

• 7:38Scott Galloway?

  that? What do we mean by that? Just as TikTok throws thousands of videos at you and then registers what you like, what you watch, all the way through, what you don't like, what you comment on, and then begins to calibrate in on the type of content that will get you addicted, that will get your lips around the crack pipe of algorithmic media. Walmart could potentially, with the TikTok algorithm, start layering in commerce. And I always thought the gangster move in retail would be zero-click ordering. And that is, that is, Amazon has a patent on one-click ordering. It was supposed to be this huge unlock, and it was a huge unlock, where you just press the button, click on the product, and boom, it's on its way to your place, 48 hours or less for free. But what's even bigger? What's more gangster

• 8:23Scott Galloway?

  with a capital G? Zero-click ordering. Now, what do we mean by that? We use a series of inputs. Again, signal liquidity, signal liquidity, another term from the dog, signal liquidity, to facilitate.

• 8:37Scott Galloway?

  Acom, Algorithmic Commerce. Walmart figures out a way with the TikTok algorithm to put in front of you a bunch of choices, say around grocery. And it asks you for 10, 15, 30 minutes to look at a bunch of different brands, different recipes, different food items, up, down, sideways, Goldilocks, I love it, I hate it, it's okay, it's not my weight class, whatever it might be, whatever it might be. And they start to zero in and they look at, they look at your previous purchase history and they start merchandising grocery before you know you want it. And they send three boxes twice a week to you. Maybe they even figure out cold storage at your house so you don't have to be home. And twice a week you get three boxes, two boxes with the brands and foodstuffs that you love or that you're gonna love.

• 9:21Scott Galloway?

  And then one box that you put the stuff back in that you don't want. And they use that as a means of calibrating. Oh, they didn't want Lagunitas IPA. They like Stella Artois. Oh, they don't like this type of dry pasta. They like this. And then they calibrate it using voice. And voice is sort of the weak link right now. They're gonna need to partner, maybe with Google or someone else. But between the website, between some sort of algorithm served to them and some sort of media that asks you to spend some time and figure out what type of foodstuffs you like, they could move to zero click. They could leapfrog the Seattle behemoth. They could say, all right, we know what food you want. By the way, we're Walmart. And if you exit and you exit with us, the shit show that is retail,

• 10:06Scott Galloway?

  where we have to acquire customers, we have to get you into the store, we have to spend a bunch of money, we have to blow dry our hair, we have to put on a nice red dress every time we want you to come back into the store. If you commit to us for a year, two years, five years, and you say, all right, I'm a family of four, I'm gonna spend 200 bucks a month on grocery, Walmart can give you the best deal in the world. And that is if you can enter into a monogamous relationship, they can recast their company of subscription revenue, get a higher multiple in the marketplace and reward the consumer with unparalleled value. And, and when I say value, I'm not just talking about cost. I'm talking about the real value here. And that is consumers don't want choice. One of the biggest mistakes we make as marketers is thinking that choice is a good thing. No, it's not. Consumers don't want more choice.

• 10:50Scott Galloway?

  They want to be more confident in the choices they Make, what do I do when I go to dinner? I turn to the person I'm with or the waiter and I say, order for me. I don't make decisions around anything, anything unless I feel it's important. I subscribe to the research. You only have a certain number of good decisions every day. Save that calorie burn for decisions that matter and try and outsource every other decision in your life. So where are we headed with this? Acom Walmart with the TikTok algorithm and some other third parties could potentially start taking key consumer categories. I think they should start with grocery and say, we're going to zero click ordering. And if we can figure out a way to get enough signal liquidity such that we can calibrate

• 11:31Scott Galloway?

  on within, say, 10% error rate and give you the best deal in grocery and get it to you perhaps before you even know you want it. So there's no choice, there's no decision, there's no being home at a certain time, there's no going onto the website and having to order. There's no having to bomb into the click and collect, or maybe you bomb into the click and collect because that's easier for you. Oh my gosh, oh my gosh, we're talking about Walmart adding 50, 100, 200 billion dollars in market cap. And then we talk about a serious counterbunch. We talk about a Joe Frazier kind of counterpunch. We talk about Andrea Agassi like service return from Walmart. Acom, Acom hashtag, registered trademark, Galloway Prof G, algorithmic commerce is

• 12:16Scott Galloway?

  coming your way and Walmart and TikTok are the ones that could do it. Doug, are you hearing me? Doug, are you hearing me? Stay with us. We'll be right back after this break for our conversation with Jed Apatow.

• 12:30Scott Galloway?

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• 12:59Scott Galloway?

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• 13:40Scott Galloway?

  Welcome back. Here's our conversation with Judd Apatow, an American filmmaker and comedian. He has produced and directed films, including Knocked Up, Trainwreck and The King of Staten Island. He's also a very, I've gotten to know Judd a little bit. He's also very committed to our Commonwealth or our country and is spending a lot of time trying to help certain candidates and trying to think about messaging. And he's very passionate about America and ensuring that his kids have the same opportunity that our generation had. Anyways, here's our conversation with Judd Apatow. Judd, where does this podcast find you?

• 14:18Speaker 02

  I am in Santa Monica, California. Fearing for the fires right now.

• 14:25Scott Galloway?

  So your family's safety and natural disasters are important, but let's get to the really important issue. How the hell did you end up on the Prop G show? I'm still trying to figure out what series of bad decisions led you to here right now.

• 14:41Speaker 02

  Well, I'm going to tell you, you know why? Because I remember. I was watching CNN and you were being interviewed by Anderson Cooper. I think it was the first time you were being interviewed by him. And he seemed both very excited by your knowledge about the issues surrounding colleges and COVID, but. He also seemed quite amused to have found someone that he enjoyed listening to. And that somehow led me to noticing that you were doing the podcast with Kara Swisher, the Pivot Podcast.

• 15:20Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 15:21Speaker 02

  And then I was like, I wonder what else Scott's up to. And like a good researcher, I looked up podcasts and saw that you have this one. That's how Judd Apatow rolls. That's, that gives you a sense of how I use the internet.

• 15:35Scott Galloway?

  All right. So you're, you're my most successful stalker by a long shot. So I want, I want to get your sense. You strike me as a thoughtful guy. I want to get your historical sense of where we are as it relates to two, two subjects, comedy and then media. So let's start with comedy. Is there an arc to the history of comedy and any observations around where we are now? What is the evolution of comedy? Where are we now?

• 16:00Speaker 02

  Well, financially, I have a couple of theories about it. One is that there used to be a belief in a system in Hollywood where the studios were buying spec scripts. So if you were a young comedy writer, you wouldn't create a TV show. You would try to write a movie for a big comedy star.

• 16:24Scott Galloway?

  Right.

• 16:25Speaker 02

  And there was a whole economy of that. And you would read the trades and every day you'd, you'd hear, oh, this person sold this script for $300,000. Oh, this person sold this script for a million dollars. And that happened for a long time. Sometime around the writer's strike, it was as if all the studios said, let's not do that anymore.

• 16:43Scott Galloway?

  Yeah.

• 16:44Speaker 02

  We don't want to spend that money. We're not getting enough movies out of it for how many scripts we're buying. And that certainly hurt comedy because when Netflix and streaming started, most comedy writers instantly staffed up on this explosion of new shows. And also Netflix and places like that changed the rules. The rule used to be that you had to climb up the ladder of comedy writers to get the opportunity to create your own show.

• 17:13Scott Galloway?

  Right.

• 17:13Speaker 02

  A young person could never create their show until they had run a show.

• 17:17Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 17:18Speaker 02

  And so it might take you 10 or 15 years to get that opportunity. Right now you could create a show for a streaming service right out of college if you had a great idea and a great script. And that changed everything. And as a result, a lot of comedy writers don't even consider writing comedies for theaters, for movies, because there's such an incentive to stay in streaming. And that's really hurt the comedy business in a big way.

• 17:42Scott Galloway?

  So why has streaming hurt the comedy business? It sounds like that's a good thing, that if you're a talented kid right out of college and you come up with a good idea, you have kind of direct to, I don't know, direct to consumer access through these streaming video platforms. Why has Netflix, or have they been bad for comedy? And if so, why?

• 18:00Speaker 02

  Well, I don't think it's hurt comedy in terms of television comedy, but in terms of film comedy, you know, where the Farrelly brothers would make something about Mary, the Farrelly brothers of today will create a TV show. So we're not getting those movies, we're not getting those giant movie stars, because there's not an ecosystem that really supports that.

• 18:26Scott Galloway?

  So you just released The King of Staten Island. You've been doing what feels like a movie every year for about the last 20 years. How, look at your most current, your most recent release, in terms of the financing, the business, the economics, the distribution, how is The King of Staten Island different than, or how are the semantics, or the, you know, the algebra of it, if you will, versus one of your early films? What is different now? As someone who has to pull this together and actually make it happen, how have things changed? How have the inputs changed?

• 19:01Speaker 02

  You know, for me, it's been very consistent, because I've directed all of my movies for Universal Studios. I've worked with the executives there for the entire time. So there's an enormous amount of consistency in our relationship. And I think when you're a creative person, the hardest part of it is if someone really doesn't understand what you do. So for instance, I improvise a lot. If I'm working with a new person, they might look at the footage and go, what the hell are you doing? What is all this babbling? Where's the movie in this? But when I work with people over and over again, they've seen the process step by step. So they understand our approach to shooting. And that goes for budgeting and

• 19:43Speaker 02

  promotion. And we have a pretty consistent approach, which is, I believe the audience wants to see new people and hear new ideas. So I think that the hook usually Is new talent. And in a lot of ways, that makes the movies more affordable. We've made movies with established talents that gets paid a lot of money. But for a lot of my movies, it's someone's first starring role. And as a result, i- it's a good financial bet. And we have learned, you know, from bridesmaids and Trainwreck and King of Staten Island and a lot of movies, that people get really excited to see a fresh face.

• 20:24Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 20:24Speaker 02

  And so that makes the whole thing affordable.

• 20:27Scott Galloway?

  That feels like it's sort of zigging when everyone's zagging because my, my impression of the motion picture industry was there was a small number of bankable stars that's got 110% of the, of the compensation and the fruits. And then it was very hard to bust through. You think there's a market, or I guess you've proven there's a market that's more about the work and, and introducing the audience to new actors and that that seems to be working.

• 20:50Speaker 02

  I always felt like it was like when you discover a new band.

• 20:53Scott Galloway?

  Yeah.

• 20:54Speaker 02

  And you hear a new song. So the first time you heard, you know, Smells Like Teen Spirit, you got so excited about Nirvana, you kind of lost your mind. You couldn't believe it existed. And I think there is a version of that when you see somebody in Superbad or

• 21:07Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 21:07Speaker 02

  in, in any of these movies. And that, that is a hook. It's a marketing hook to discover a new person you love. And I think, you know, with TikTok and all these new stars, I think we're seeing that young people, they don't need it to be the established star. They don't, they'll connect to like a new kid they, they just saw five minutes ago. And it's very, very different. It doesn't mean that the established stars aren't great and some of them are way better than everybody else. And that's why they have those careers. But, you know, for comedy, there's a lot of, you know, young people with a lot to say.

• 21:42Scott Galloway?

  So you've mentioned, just in the last few minutes, we've mentioned Universal, movie theaters, Netflix, TikTok. It strikes me that talent, talent's currency and power is only going up every year. And you get to dictate which platforms, you have the credibility where if you say, well, I want to try something on with this company and this platform, people sort of line up to support you. Or at least that's the impression I get. Who would you bet on or against in terms of companies, platforms, technology?

• 22:10Speaker 02

  I think that, you know, it's changing so fast. You know, we were the first people to go into production on an original movie at Netflix with the, this Pee-wee Herman movie Pee-wee's Big Holiday. They didn't even have a department to make movies. They didn't even know how to give us the money at the time. Like, how does this work? Do we set up an account? I mean, they really didn't have production people.

• 22:32Scott Galloway?

  Ten mo me.

• 22:34Speaker 02

  And we did a show called Love on Netflix, which was one of their first half hour.

• 22:39Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 22:39Speaker 02

  Comedy. And we felt at the time that that was a great platform for us to be on. I have a deal, a first look deal with HBO. So, you know, I'm looking to develop things for HBO Max at this point, and they've been a great partner.

• 22:53Scott Galloway?

  You sure it's not HBO Go or HBO Now or HBO Joey Bag of Donuts? What is HBO Max? Can you explain it to me? Can Judd Apatow explain to me the difference between all the HBO, fill in the blank here? What is HBO Max?

• 23:05Speaker 02

  I always laughed at how many different HBO apps there were, to the point where I did even call HBO and go, this is, this is a mess. This doesn't make any sense. And they said, we're about to clear it all up. And I think that they did.

• 23:17Scott Galloway?

  Yeah.

• 23:18Speaker 02

  And now, you know, they need new content on there so that they can compete. But the people at HBO have always had the best taste. You know, the first job I ever had, I worked for Comic Relief, which was a benefit for the homeless.

• 23:32Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 23:33Speaker 02

  Hosted by Robin Williams and Billy and Whoopi. So I've worked with them since 1986, and they've just always consistently had incredible executive talent to pick shows and help you through that process. So I always bet on HBO. Obviously Netflix is doing amazing things. I have a relationship with Universal and Comcast. I haven't done anything for Peacock yet, but I'm looking to have that experience because I'm sure that they'll, you know, ultimately do well. They haven't started doing a lot of original content. I would assume that's happening right now.

• 24:08Scott Galloway?

  So HBO, let's talk a little bit about HBO. And first off, HBO for me, I have such Just incredible goodwill for HBO. I think of when that soldier from The Sopranos is browsing images of his time on the shore and hangs himself. One of the characters that you worked on, Hank from The Larry Sanders Show, I think is one of the great characters in original scripted television. I think Game of Thrones is still singular in terms of how, I imagine, I don't know if it's a creative executive who actually pitches these things, but imagine someone trying to pitch that and get it done. And I just think HBO had such balls to greenlight that thing. I think HBO, I even think of Six Feet Under. I used to feel real emotion watching

• 24:50Scott Galloway?

  Six Feet Under. I love HBO. And now I see them, what I would describe it as junking it up with The Big Bang Theory and, you know, all these different sitcoms. I just think they're literally taking this Hermes bag or Porsche 911 and turning it into a Pontiac Aztec or, you know, a Brooklyn Messenger bag. I just think it's the worst strategy ever. And Apple perceives that they're, they're leaving this unbelievable positioning as the premier luxury brand and all the media and is going to fill that. I think HBO is screwing up. What are your thoughts?

• 25:27Speaker 02

  I don't agree. I have to say that so much of, of what this is about is the personal taste of a few key executives.

• 25:39Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 25:40Speaker 02

  Sometimes you go on different streaming services and you think, who's choosing these things? And then on other services, you know, you'll watch like I May Destroy You on HBO and you think, my gosh, they've done it again. Another really brilliant show. And I think that that ultimately wins out. Definitely over the years HBO has been all about being very curated. So, you know, we have the best stuff. And I think that they're stuck in a place where due to new habits, people also want a lot of stuff and they want the great HBO stuff, but they also want to watch all sorts of stuff from the Warner Brothers library. And I think people will develop that habit and I'm sure they're nervous. They don't want to be watered down. They don't want their greatness watered down because now everything

• 26:25Speaker 02

  Warner Brothers ever made is on the same app. But I think ultimately people will realize that. They have an enormous amount of great new shows and I'm sure it's odd for them. They succeeded so well in the cable business, but we've watched as that's slowly disappearing. I don't know, what do you think is going to happen with the actual cable business?

• 26:48Scott Galloway?

  Oh, it's being unbundled and picked apart. There's just no getting around it. Affiliate fees are going down and then you have these organizations with infinitely deep pockets. At some point, I mean HBO was getting an Emmy for every 75 million dollars in original scripted budget. And Amazon, it cost them 350 million to get an Emmy, right? HBO is much better than Amazon, but at some point, if Amazon can throw, you know, billions. Netflix is going to spend 14 billion. I think HBO is going to spend, I don't know, two or three. At some point, the capital wins and.

• 27:21Speaker 02

  I don't think that's true, though. I think that is the mistake.

• 27:25Scott Galloway?

  You don't think, so Judd Apatow doesn't eventually, when they, when they put a big enough check and enough, create a freedom in front of you, you don't think over time, because there's something unique about HBO. HBO, at least my understanding is they have this culture and this secret sauce that attracts and retains talent like yourself. And I don't, so I guess my question would be, one, what is that in addition to individuals who just have great taste? It's got to be something about the culture, the way they treat you. And two, you don't think eventually just the deepest pockets win here? You think HBO or the smaller guys can't hold out?

• 27:59Speaker 02

  I, I think that you, you could look at movie studios through the ages and say, you know, a lot of them had similar amounts of money. And there were certain studios that were making some of the great movies of all time and other studios that made mainly garbage. And that's always about who gets to pick and who has the relationship with the talent to try to shepherd ideas.

• 28:18Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 28:19Speaker 02

  And so, yes, you can get way more stuff at a place with deeper pockets, but it is ultimately about creativity and talent and that relationship. And when you have a good idea, sometimes someone can really ruin it. I always tell the story about going into Fox. With the cast of undeclared, this show I did about college in 2001. And, you know, they made a lot of promises about letting me choose the cast. Because I said, it's all in the casting. But when everyone auditioned in front of the executives to get approval, they instantly said no to Jason Segel being the lead. Then I said, what about Seth Rogen as the lead? And they said, no.

• 29:00Speaker 02

  And that's how networks and studios can destroy things. Because they don't see it. I did a pilot for ABC in 2001 or 2002 that starred Amy Poehler, January Jones, Kevin Hart and Jason Segel. And not only did they turn down the pilot, I didn't get one call where they said, you know what, this pilot isn't exactly right. But, man, we should do something with this Amy Poehler person. Or should we get something else going with Kevin Hart? Like, they just didn't see it at all. And so, yes, it helps to have more money and take more shots. But if you don't have that person that knows which ones to do, it doesn't matter.

• 29:40Scott Galloway?

  So you work most, I would say your stuff is mostly about, it has influence, it makes cultural statements. But I, I think mostly your stuff is about, I don't know, love, connections, family, joy, if you will. I want to bring it down to you. I, I've been following you on Twitter and you speak a lot about media, kind of the 24-hour news cycle media, specifically Fox. What are your thoughts around the role that news media and the Murdochs and Fox and CNN are playing in our society today? What, what would be your observations around media's role in our society right now?

• 30:17Speaker 02

  I think Patty Chayefsky was right about everything. If you watch Network again, he basically predicted what was going to happen. You know, there's a great book that Dave Itzikoff wrote about the making of Network and how Patty Chayefsky felt afterwards. And he was very frustrated because he thought that people didn't really pick up on the terrifying prophetic message of it. That it became a, a bit of a sketch joke. You know, I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore. And people didn't really obsess over what he was saying, which is when multinational corporations control the news, it will distort reality and people will get taken advantage of. And I think we see that. The Brian Stelter book hoax really clarifies how that happened,

• 31:00Speaker 02

  which is, you know, very simple, which is the money is in.

• 31:06Speaker 02

  Agreeing with Trump, you know, there's an ecosystem there where if the network goes hard against Trump, their audience gets mad, so they don't want to. And at the same time, Donald Trump is directly calling them and complaining when he doesn't like the coverage. And at the same time, you have these hosts who are literally talking to Donald Trump on the phone. Sean Hannity, according to the book, is talking to Donald Trump all the time.

• 31:31Scott Galloway?

  Yeah.

• 31:31Speaker 02

  And filling his mind with ideas. And there's a little weird system there where a lot of times he'll pick up on those ideas and make them his causes. And it's pretty terrifying. There's a story in the book about Tucker Carlson going to Mar-a-Lago with the sole purpose of trying to get Trump to take COVID more seriously. And how scary is it that that's how the world works right now? Even at this moment, the first clips of Bob Woodward talking to Donald Trump just were released, where Donald Trump is admitting that he downplays the virus, that he did it in the past, and he continues to do it.

• 32:12Speaker 02

  Now, we know when he downplays the virus, people don't wear masks, they don't social distance, and they die. So you could say, instead of having 200,000 deaths, maybe we could have had, let's say, 80,000, like other countries. We could have maybe had 120,000 less deaths. Fox will not report that as if it's one of the biggest scandals, tragedies, horror shows in American history. All of those hosts will find a way to downplay it. And I think it's been completely destructive to our society.

• 32:51Scott Galloway?

  What about the role of, so I agree with you that Fox, and I think people on the other side would say, well, MSNBC and CNN are playing to the same. Tribal instincts just on the other side. What about social media? Because if I would imagine, I don't know about you, but I have a fraction of the followers that you have, but I find a lot of bots in my feed just trying to incentivize. There's just so much rage. There's clearly actors that are likely being sponsored from, I think, from our adversaries. And just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean I'm wrong. But don't you think that, so if Fox is the spark, don't you think social media is the fuel? What is your, what is your, on Twitter, you're active, I see you on there a lot. What is your view of Twitter?

• 33:37Speaker 02

  I have to say that, you know, when it started, it was a fun way to talk about comedy and promote shows. And I definitely have, unfortunately, a gut instinct that, that this is like Germany in, in the late 30s. And, you know, when you think, why didn't people scream and try to stop this? I've always felt like, there's all sorts of things I try to do to support candidates I believe in, to do benefits for causes I believe in. But I think everyone should be screaming fire at this moment. And I have been for years because everything that's happened is basically what I assumed

• 34:20Speaker 02

  would happen with somebody like Donald Trump and the current Republican group of people. And so, you know, clearly, Facebook is designed to reward shock value. And at some point, we've realized that the people who own these businesses could care less about the destruction of our country. They just don't care. And I'm always shocked by it. I always wonder why someone like Mark Zuckerberg doesn't just cash out. He's made enough money. And why does he still need to be in charge of it? What are you trying to hold on to? What, what contribution do you think you are making to the world? You've, you know, caused elections to come out wrong.

• 35:03Speaker 02

  You've done things that have led to genocide. Why do you want to be in the chair anymore? It didn't work the way you thought it was going to work.

• 35:11Scott Galloway?

  Yeah, it's we interviewed Sundar Pichai, the CEO of Google, and I think Zuckerberg, I think these guys all look at themselves in the mirror, most of them, every morning, and say, hello, wealthiest, most powerful man in the world. I think they they do want to be the most powerful person in the world. I do think the Sundar at Google, I wondered if if they got broken up, that it would just be almost like a relief for a guy like that. He's a product guy. I don't, I think, deep down, he is, he is troubled by some of the stuff that's going on. But, yeah, I agree with that. I can't understand what it is at some point when they say, OK, maybe I need to start focusing on the harm I'm doing and how to how to reduce that harm. So you're you're involved.

• 35:49Speaker 02

  It's shocking, though. I mean, it is shocking, because sometimes I'm around these people, you know, in in Hollywood, you meet these people sometimes. You know, for instance, like Lachlan Murdoch.

• 35:58Scott Galloway?

  Yep.

• 35:59Speaker 02

  You know, he can, at any moment, say to the entire network, we can't downplay the this virus. Like, just hundreds of thousands of people are dying. And we can't have our opinion hosts talk this bullshit anymore. But he really makes a choice not to do it, and he does that to monetize the anxieties and the feelings of the audience. And that is a that is a person that you will see at a party. That is, you know, Fox News isn't a machine. It is, it is run by a man who makes the choice, and he'll make that choice today, to not say that Donald Trump is a mass murderer. Donald Trump made a choice,

• 36:43Speaker 02

  knowing it would lead to tens of thousands of more people dying, because he thought it might lead to people not blaming him for what was happening, or not even understanding how bad things are. That that's the biggest scandal in American history. He will not make the call to say, we need to handle this accurately. And I'm shocked, as a human being, that there are human beings who think like that, who don't care about, because it used to be about, you know, taxes, or it's crony capitalism, how much is Trump and his friends stealing from the government through all their contracts, and how they give away public lands and all that stuff. Now it's just death.

• 37:25Speaker 02

  And yet, there are still very few of those people who go to the wall to do something ethically. I can't believe it.

• 37:32Scott Galloway?

  In a capitalist society, it's very tempting to make incremental decisions that lead you down this rabbit hole of bad decisions. More money means better healthcare, better opportunities for your kids, broader selection set of mates. In a capitalist society, money does a lot of wonderful things. I've seen you talk a little bit about money and morality. Do you think we suffer from sort of a gross idolatry of the dollar? What is the role that our capitalist system and money plays in our decisions and morality?

• 38:02Speaker 02

  I do think that the Republicans have tried to promote a culture of every person for themselves. And if we don't look at these problems as problems that need to be solved together, then the human race won't survive. If basically we're saying every person needs to get as much money as they can and then do nothing to help other people, then what chance do we have of solving climate change? I'm in California right now. The whole state's on fire. And people act like this isn't the future for the entire country. Hurricanes

• 38:43Speaker 02

  and fires and flooding. So if we won't wear masks, and we can't get a government that is unified to say, you know, there's a lot to do, but if everyone, I don't care if you're in the boonies alone in Wyoming and you haven't seen a person in a month, if all of us wore a mask for the next six weeks, we would save tens of thousands of lives. If we can't get people to agree on that, how are we gonna agree to do all the much more difficult things that will save our country from being completely on fire and underwater? And I think that this worship of money and trying to get bigger and bigger and bigger, you read the news every day and...

• 39:27Speaker 02

  Kanye West is so upset that people don't think he's worth as much money as he thinks he's worth, which is the same as Trump. There's no pride in not having money and just helping people. And I think that that's a destructive message for the world. And that's why all of the protests are so encouraging, because we have to hope that the next generation has a different set of values and wants to join together to solve these problems. Trump wants us divided, but it has to be solved together.

• 40:00Scott Galloway?

  Talk a little bit about money and education. You and I can send our kids to wherever they might be fortunate enough to get into. If your kid comes in the top 1% of income-earning households, 77 times more likely to go to an elite college. Talk a little bit about education, like how things have changed since you and I went, and what, you know, any thoughts on what we can do to get it back, such that a kid from Long Island, or myself, a kid from Westwood with a single mother can get into a great school? Because I get the sense neither you nor me would get into USC or UCLA now.

• 40:35Speaker 02

  Absolutely not. And I think that one of the big issues is, you've been talking about, a lot of people have been talking about, which is this pride in how many people you reject.

• 40:49Scott Galloway?

  Yeah.

• 40:50Speaker 02

  You know, a joke I was telling on stage doing stand-up, but it is true, is all those kids who cheated to get into college, all of them did well at that college. So their families had to go through all these terrible criminal acts to get them there, but none of them failed. And so then the question becomes, do we think that only the kids who are brilliant at math and English and get perfect scores and everything deserve a high level of education? Because when I look at my kids and their friends, most of them are either great at math or English and the arts. So say you can barely pass math. And it's a nightmare for you. Well, then, right off the bat,

• 41:34Speaker 02

  there's fifty colleges you will never get into. But in the arts, you might be better than every single person at Yale, or Harvard, or Cornell. And so the whole thing doesn't really make sense. We're asking these kids to be generically perfect to get access to the type of education they deserve. And that's the thing that infuriates me. And I think that all of that doesn't serve kids. It also doesn't serve special kids and interesting kids. I noticed so many young people who don't do well in school, who are so gifted and so interesting and funny. They can make such a giant contribution, but because they don't do well in these settings,

• 42:16Speaker 02

  they won't get a chance to get the education that they deserve. And it's pretty tragic that it's meant to make people the same, I think. I watch, you know, like those TED Talks of Ken Robinson,

• 42:33Speaker 02

  you know, about this issue. And I think it really hurts kids. And they're all under such stress to get into these schools. I've never pressured my kids about that.

• 42:43Scott Galloway?

  I always thought of the core of your work as family. You have kids. You're about to become, it sounds like you have two kids, you're about to become empty nesters. Is that right?

• 42:53Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 42:54Scott Galloway?

  What, if you could distill, if you had any advice for people or parents who are still in the thick of it, or have young kids, give us a few observations, or even if you're willing, some advice around not only good parenting, but just enjoying the ride. I get the sense you think a lot about parenting.

• 43:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, absolutely. And that doesn't even mean I know if I've done anything right. But there are a few things that have stuck out over the years. One simple piece of advice that I heard from somebody was, your kids are Are mainly going to copy how you behave. Mm hmm. And so, you know, we think of all these rules, should we punish them or not punish them? And what do we tell them? And it really isn't that much about what we tell them. Most of it is they see you in your life, how you handle stress, how you handle problems, how you treat people. And they're just gonna copy your basic approach to life, whether they know they're doing it or not.

• 43:55Speaker 02

  And for me, you know, I just try to teach them about kindness. I think that that's the most important aspect, their compassion and their kindness. And I try to take the pressure off as much as I can. But at the same time, one element that I never thought much about as a young parent that I realize is very important is your kids need to have a passion. They need to have something they wanna pursue. So you could be a parent and have a great kid, but sometimes your, your great kid doesn't wanna get off the couch and do anything. Yeah. And when I was young, you know, my parents had financial problems, my parents got divorced, and it made me really wanna work hard to be able to take care of myself. Yeah.

• 44:39Speaker 02

  And I think that you, you have to find a way to light a fire under your kids so they figure out what they love and wanna pursue it very aggressively. Because if you don't work hard, you really won't achieve those goals. But it is very difficult. There's so much going on, there's so much more anxiety and depression. The social media is really destructive. There's, I think all these kids have too many friends. You know, when I was a kid, I had like two friends. Yeah. And maybe we would go visit two other friends. Our parents didn't know where we were, there were no cell phones. And I didn't know if anyone else was having fun without me. I didn't compare my life to anyone else's life. And I went about my day.

• 45:23Speaker 02

  I think being connected to too many young people is really hard for a kid. You're tracking their happiness and their struggles. And you're, you know, the way you do as a friend, you're living their life and their pain and their joy. And if you're doing it with ten or fifteen kids instead of four, I think it's very stressful.

• 45:44Scott Galloway?

  You know, what, when you think out five or 10 years professionally, what boxes are left for you? What, what's, where do you want to be in five or 10 years? Or what do you want to have done that you haven't already?

• 45:55Speaker 02

  Well, as a creative person, I think it's helpful to try to take the pressure off yourself. Because it's hard to get into your flow state or your creative space. If you are nervous about how you're going to do, or how you're going to be perceived, or you know, can I keep this thing going? So I, I started playing a trick on myself a long time ago, which is that it's already over. And that's helped me.

• 46:21Scott Galloway?

  You're done.

• 46:22Speaker 02

  When we did Freaks and Geeks, I had a real sense that it was a special show, and it accomplished all of the creative hopes I ever had. And that, at least in, in my head, that I had accomplished my goals once. And then lately, I've, I've added a, a new dimension to this, it's over theory, which again, is just a mind trick to not lock up. Is, I like to think of myself as a rock star, whose best years are decades behind him, but every once in a while bangs out a good record. So I'll think of, you know, Bob Dylan, who had a record this year, there was a great album.

• 47:05Speaker 02

  And every once in a while, when you least expect it, he puts out Time Outta Mind. And, and there's no expectation that I have to crank out a ton of stuff and have it all be of a certain level. Now, by the way, this is a trick, because I am trying to do that. I am trying to make a lot of stuff and have it be great. But I have to, you know, play this trick on myself. The only thing that I haven't done that I think a lot about is theater.

• 47:33Scott Galloway?

  I was gonna say Broadway.

• 47:34Speaker 02

  Yeah, exactly.

• 47:35Scott Galloway?

  That's what's next.

• 47:36Speaker 02

  I love to write a play, I love to write a musical, I'm writing a few things for animation. I haven't done that since I worked on The Critic a very, very long time ago. But that is an experience I've never had, which is writing a play, listening to the audience, hearing them laugh, making adjustments. I've always felt like no one's really replaced Neil Simon in the theater, and there's a real hole for a certain type of human comedy in the theater, and it'd be nice to get a chance to attempt that at some point.

• 48:06Scott Galloway?

  Talk a little bit about flow for you and the creative process. Are there certain types of bidets, certain ceremonies, certain substances, certain relationships you call on, certain muses? How do you get into flow?

• 48:20Speaker 02

  I've always been interested in how the brain works and how the mind works. It's funny, because I just interviewed John Cleese, who has a new book about creativity, and I interviewed him about his book. And then Jeff Tweedy from the band Wilco has a book called How to Write One Song, coming out in October, that I read. And I'm always interested in how creative people get in the mental space so their creativity comes out. And a lot of it is about understanding that your right brain is creative and your left brain is the critic, and you can't do the work at the same time. So you have to

• 49:01Speaker 02

  set aside a lot of hours without interruption, where you could just goof off and spew whatever comes into your mind and not judge it. And then maybe on another day, read it and go, did anything good happen in that moment when I was vomiting out all this babble? That's been the main lesson for me, is to separate right-brain days from left-brain days.

• 49:29Scott Galloway?

  Judd Apatow is an American filmmaker and comedian, the founder of Apatow Productions, where he produced and directed films, including Forty Year Old Virgin, Knocked Up, Funny People, This is Forty, Trainwreck, and, most recently, The King of Staten Island. He joins us from his home in Santa Monica. Judd, stay safe, and thanks for all your good work, brother. It's just nice to speak to somebody who's doing nice things for nice people. And despite being a Trojan, I just am tremendously, I don't know, impressed by the life you've built for you and your family.

• 50:02Speaker 02

  I appreciate that, and thank you for everything you're doing with all the podcasts. And I- I want more. I was saying, how do I get the link to all these interviews from the secret colleges and stuff? So that's all I want.

• 50:18Scott Galloway?

  Dozens and dozens of people think I need more Scott. Yeah, that's, that's, that happens a lot. All right, John, take it easy, boss.

• 50:24Speaker 02

  All right. Take care. Bye bye.

• 50:29Scott Galloway?

  We'll be right back.

• 50:33Scott Galloway?

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• 51:16Scott Galloway?

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• 51:40Scott Galloway?

  Support for the show comes from Vanta. As AI adoption grows, so does your company's security risks and requirements. New frameworks, audits, and vendors keep piling on, but your team isn't getting any bigger. Most compliance tools promise automation, but you're really stuck doing all the work by hand, chasing screenshots, validating controls, and playing catch up.

• 51:58Scott Galloway?

  When audit season comes around again. Vanta works differently. The regentic trust platform is built to scale with you, not slow you down. With over 1,400 automated tests across 400-plus integrations, Vanta collects evidence and monitors your controls year-round, cutting your audit prep by 82%. Plus, you can access the Vanta agent everywhere you work, whether your team is in Vanta every day or living in tools including Claude or Cursor. Want proof? Over 16,000 fast-growing companies like Ramp, Rider, and Harvey save time and resources while scaling fast with Vanta. Learn more at vanta.com/profg and get $1,000 off. That's spelled V-A-N-T-A dot com slash prof G for $1,000 off.

• 52:56Scott Galloway?

  Okay, it's time for Office Hours. As a reminder, we're here to answer your questions about business trends, big tech, career advice, and whatever else you'd like to ask. The dog, if you'd like to submit a question, please email a voice recording to [email protected]. Question number one.

• 53:14Speaker 03

  Hi, Scott. I'm Helen, a Brit living in New York and loving what I'm learning from you about life in the US. In the last couple of weeks, you've spoken very accurately about the decline in influence of the marketing services groups like WPP and Omnicom. At the same time, you've predicted the continued rapid growth of consultancies, who in many respects, offer very similar services. I would love to know why you believe the dramatic difference in fortunes has happened and what you think the marketing services groups should do to turn it around. Thanks.

• 53:46Scott Galloway?

  Thanks, Helen, and welcome to the United States. My parents made the same decision you made, and that is they immigrated from Glasgow, Scotland, and London, England, to the United States. And I think they would probably say it was the best decision they ever made, other than having an adorable little son. But anyways, welcome to New York. I hope you're enjoying it. So if you think about the big three, and I'm advising one of them right now, or informally advising one of them. They have some outstanding assets, and they have some less outstanding assets. And if you look at Google and Facebook, they add or shed the value of WPP, Omnicom, IPG, and Publicity every day or gain it, which means they're sort of irrelevant. I think you're going to have across the media landscape or media agencies, good bank, bad bank.

• 54:31Scott Galloway?

  I think they're going to split up. I think the investment bankers are going to dust off or sharpen their pencils in that some of the assets, specifically the data assets, they have very strong analytics companies, they have consulting firms. There are some really great assets. There are also high cash flow assets that are shitty businesses, specifically media businesses or anything tied to what I call the advertising industrial complex. So they'll go good bank, bad bank, and they'll put those high growth, call them 21st century assets into the good bank, and they'll take their traditional agencies and media buying, which quite frankly are shitty businesses, but they still spin off a lot of cash flow, but they're kind of slowly declining, and they'll put them into kind of a bad bank. Now, now, what does that mean?

• 55:16Scott Galloway?

  What does that mean? There are still great assets within these firms, and it still might be a decent place to invest or work because I think their stocks have been beaten down so badly that they're probably, there may even be an investment opportunity there at some point, but it's definitely an activist play. I think if they don't get their stocks up soon, you're going to see an activist come in and force them to split into good bank, bad bank. So what does that mean? If you're working one of these agencies, ask yourself, okay, what is driving my business? If, at the end of the day, the thing that deems success for me and my company is based on this traditional brand algorithm of a mediocre product wrapped in brand associations that we pound away at using cheap broadcast media, you're fucked. Find another job.

• 56:00Scott Galloway?

  If my company is about zeros and ones and advice around strategy, advice around supply chain, advice around how to turn data into information, into decision making, then you're going to be just fine. But look for ad agencies or acting analysts, look for WPP, IPG, Publicity, and Omnicom to be six to seven separate companies within the next 24 to 36 months. Britt, welcome to the greatest city on earth. Next question.

• 56:28Speaker 04

  Hi, Professor Galloway. Good to see you on Public, the social investing app. I have a question for you regarding how apps like Public and Common Stock give feedback on trades and investing memos. Common Stock is currently trying to decide how to display their like button. Right now, instead of the number of people being displayed as likes, it's the total amount of money those people have that is displayed. It's anonymous and frankly, it's fun. The idea behind dollar amounts for likes is that it weighs feedback towards people who are wiser investors. So, dollar amounts are being used as a proxy for investing knowledge. But there are downsides. You could have a trust fund baby who inherited a million dollars, yet they know nothing. That person's like is completely outweighing a much smarter investor

• 57:13Speaker 04

  who started from nothing and grew their portfolio to a hundred thousand dollars. What do you think about dollar amounts as a measure of social feedback on an app like Public or Common Stock?

• 57:23Scott Galloway?

  What an interesting question, Nathan. Thanks very much. So, according to Crunchbase, Common Stock got about a $10 million seed for social investing. Users can link any brokerage to share holdings by percentage, get real-time alerts when friends buy or sell, copy each other's trades and invest together, and even compete to see who performs best. So, putting a trading platform on top of social or putting social on top, that seems like a neat idea. And according to Common Stock in a blog post, "We're making market knowledge social, smart, trusted, and transparent by enabling users to link a brokerage and verify their track record." I think this is really interesting and my answer would be, okay, so a couple of things. One, I think someone who has a million dollars in Apple likely has done more diligence on Apple

• 58:05Scott Galloway?

  than someone, than someone trading on Robinhood who has purchased a fractional share. And what we've seen lately is it doesn't seem like the experts get it any more right than the non-experts. I do believe that over the long term or even the medium term, the people, the quote-unquote "experts," the people who do diligence, the people who spend a lot of time doing bottoms-up valuation, that they will outperform quote-unquote "the non-experts" or the retail investors. Having said that, I would just suggest they do both, that they have the number of people who like a stock or like an investment strategy. But I think another means of saying, alright, this is what the bigger holders believe. I don't see anything wrong with that. I think this plays into gamification. I think it's another signal.

• 58:49Scott Galloway?

  And so, the question I was around rich people is the narrative used to be, well, they're just better. They're better people, they're smarter, they're more worthy than us, right? And now, the narrative is, no, they're just lucky. Everyone is rich, which is born lucky. And the answer is yes. Everyone I know that is very wealthy, who wasn't born into money, wasn't smart enough to be born into money, works their ass off and is very smart. I also know a lot of people that work their ass off and are very smart and are not rich because their parents didn't get them into Harvard, or they weren't born in the right zip code, or they haven't had the opportunities and the connections that rich dad can get rich kid of rich dad. So it is both. Unfortunately, our society, it looks as if that the latter

• 59:33Scott Galloway?

  is playing a bigger role in people's trajectory, specifically as filtered through the nozzle of higher education where we're basically sending the children of rich kids and freakishly remarkable 15 to 17 year olds. But I'm getting off track. I think it's a neat idea. I think as long as you have both, I think as long as you're transparent about it, it's interesting. And no doubt about it, socializing, if you will, or putting a social component on top of a traditional business is a great idea because Schwab is probably not going to go there. Right? Anyway, thanks for the question. Next question.

• 1:00:04Speaker 05

  Hey, Prof G. My name is Jesse. I'm a copywriter in NYC. Love the podcast. So I'm scared shitless of the climate crisis. These wildfires in Cali are freaking me out. But from stranded fossil fuel assets to a looming insurance crisis, it seems like this could hit us economically even harder than COVID. And that's before the climate really gets bad. This is something I haven't heard you talk much about, and I'm curious about how you look at the problem. So I have a two part question. What are you hearing from investors and execs that they're not saying publicly? Do they realize how serious this is? And based on what you're hearing, do you think there's a place for activism to push businesses in the right direction, besides the obvious of getting Biden and Harris in the White House? Thanks for all your wisdom.

• 1:00:48Scott Galloway?

  Thank you, Jesse. Aren't you a sexy beast with that low, shattery, whispery voice? Oh. Anyways, California fires reported that since the beginning of the year wildfires have burned more than 3 million acres in California. To put that into perspective, the size of Connecticut is about 3 and 1/2 million acres. I think six of the 20 biggest fires in the history of California have happened in the last 24 months. Climate change efforts in Trump's America are pretty anemic slash zero. Trump responded to a climate question during a recent news briefing saying, It'll start getting cooler. You just watch. Oh, okay. Then proceeds to say, I mean, literally, what a fucking idiot. I know I alienate about, I don't know, 49% of my audience, but seriously, like, okay, orange Hitler slash fucking idiot equals

• 1:01:32Scott Galloway?

  our president. Anyways, then proceeds, then it goes on to say, I don't think science knows. Well, that's the definition of science. It knows more than anything else we know. That's the whole point. That's the definition of science. The best ideas we have. Forbes rounded up a few companies that are focusing on climate initiatives. Microsoft said that by 2030, they'll be carbon negative and by 2050, Microsoft will remove from the environment all the carbon the company has emitted either directly or by electrical consumption since it was founded in 1975. Nike, Nike will power owned and operated facilities with 100% renewable energy by 2025. Walmart said it's aiming to have zero greenhouse emissions across their global operations by 2040. So here's the thing. I think it's great. I think these

• 1:02:16Scott Galloway?

  companies should be lauded for their efforts. However, however, I don't think that it is business that needs to be reformed. And I was talking about this on my other podcast, Pivot, co-hosted with Kara Swisher, that we need to focus on the disease, not the symptom or the other side of the coin. And while we sit around talking about how big tech, and I'm guilty of this, needs to be reformed, waiting on their better angels to show up is not a great strategy. Thinking that the Business Roundtable announcing that we need to start talking about stakeholder values instead of shareholder values. Yeah, okay, big fucking deal. At the end of the day, most companies are going to be very focused

• 1:02:55Scott Galloway?

  on profits. And if they decide to take a much more sustainable complexion, a big company can do that. A small, medium sized company needs to just try and stay alive. And it's hard for them to disarm unilaterally. You're not going to have fundamental change on climate from corporations unless it's regulated by the EPA, the FDA. You have to have the government step in and say, all right, all right, everyone in this category is going to have sustainable supply chain. Everyone in this category is not going to spew shit into the air. Everyone in this category is going to pay a fine for the externalities they cause. I think there's incredible digital exhaust, if you will. I think we are choking on the pollution. From these algorithms that create rage. So fine, the government should step in at

• 1:03:40Scott Galloway?

  a minimum, start taxing it. I'll actually like the idea. And when I run for Florida Senator in 2022 as an independent, it could happen. It could happen. A chicken in every pot, a Cialis in every cupboard. Galloway 2022. Anyway, I think one of the things I would run on is some sort of algorithmic tax. And that is if you use an algorithm to serve up an ad, you pay a tax because it used to be an individual who was creating copy and doing creative and starring in an ad and they paid payroll taxes. The company paid a payroll tax on them. So do we need to reform big tech? Yeah. Is that going to get us there? No. What we need to reform is government and our regulatory bodies such that they do the work and figure out creative

• 1:04:24Scott Galloway?

  solutions, forward leaning solutions that address the externalities, similar to the way we've taxed polluters, we've put emission standards on cars and have demanded, demanded, at least to a certain extent, and it used to be a Republican issue, that we would like to will our children and grandchildren an environment that is, is extraordinary as the environment that we have come to enjoy. But at the end of the day, this has got to be about government. And the problem here is there are so many dumpster fires that are a function of our own short-term thinking. It's all about an arbitrage. We've been taking shit out of the ground, turning it into fuel and arbitraging that value add or turning it into from oil to petroleum. And unfortunately,

• 1:05:07Scott Galloway?

  we decided not to pay for the emissions or the externalities. And now we're choking on the shit. We've got to get better at figuring out the externalities, coming up with creative solutions such that future generations can do what I do with my kids and that is go boogie boarding on the weekends and go outside and marvel at what an extraordinary place this is. And by the way, I want to be clear, I am not an environmentalist. I think after our species is

• 1:05:32Scott Galloway?

  That basically the earth is going to belch for about 10 or 20 years and it's going to be as if we were never here. I am not an environmentalist, but I do believe that if you do believe in science, which most of us should, as it's the best ideas, it's not an opinion, you have to acknowledge what is going on here. And it makes sense to have a better government that puts in place the taxation and the regulations that recognizes the externalities from pollutants that are both digital and analog. Thanks for your question. Keep sending in your questions. Again, if you'd like to submit a question, please email a voice recording to [email protected].

• 1:06:12Scott Galloway?

  Our producers are Caroline Shagrin and Drew Burrows. If you like what you heard, please follow, download, and subscribe. Thank you for listening. We'll catch you next week with another episode of The Prop G Show from Section 4 and the Westwood One Podcast Network.

• 1:06:33Scott Galloway?

  So, last question. Advice to your 25-year-old self?

• 1:06:39Speaker 02

  Advice to my 25-year-old self? You're better looking than you think you are. That's the main thing I would tell my dad.

• 1:06:47Scott Galloway?

  It's only because we get so fucking ugly as we get older. Yeah, you'll look back and realize you weren't that fat.

• 1:06:53Speaker 02

  You know what? You were more attractive than you thought. You really didn't give it the college try to get out there. You hid in the house most of the time, but now that I look at the pictures, it wasn't bad.