GameStop CEO: The Machines Are Already Smarter Than Us | Ryan Cohen

Ryan Cohen is the CEO and Chairman of GameStop and the co-founder of Chewy. This was recorded live at the Silvia Investor Summit in New York. In this conversation, we break down how AI is changing work and hiring, his concerns about where humans fit in an automated future, and the rise of the retail investor. We also discuss Neuralink, how he talks to shareholders, his biggest failure, and the legacy he wants to leave. ====================== Arch Public is an agentic trading platform that automates investment strategies across Stocks, Commodities, ETFs and Crypto. Whether you’re rotating into AI & Gold, allocating to the S&P 500, or accumulating Bitcoin, Arch Public executes your plan 24/7 without ever taking custody of your assets or funds. Sign up today at https://www.archpublic.com, and start your FREE automated trading strategy! ====================== Uphold is the easiest way to buy and sell crypto unlike any other platform allowing you to trade in just one step between any supported asset. Check them out at https://www.uphold.com/pomp/This video includes a paid sponsorship with Uphold. I’m compensated by Uphold for promoting its products and services and may receive commissions from referrals. Terms apply. Not available in all jurisdictions. Digital assets are risky and may result in the total loss of your capital. ====================== 0:00 - Intro0:30 - AI risks & how GameStop uses AI3:04 - How Ryan spends his time6:05 - Hiring in the age of AI7:45 - Why Ryan wants to learn Chinese8:55 - Robots, UBI & human utility13:53 - Neuralink & brain-computer interfaces17:50 - Retail investors vs Wall Street21:10 - Greatest strengths & weaknesses23:05 - Shareholder communication & ignoring the noise28:04 - Biggest failure29:45 - Legacy & final thoughts

• 0:01Speaker 00

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• 0:30Speaker 01

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• 1:00Speaker 02

  I don't think that the machines would ever attack us, but I think ultimately there's a risk that we get so fed up by how productive and how much smarter the robots are than us that we end up attacking the machines and then they attack us and it ends up being man versus machine. Whether that ends up being World War III, I don't know, but I do get a lot of concerns over artificial intelligence.

• 1:30Speaker 03

  So when I think about the rise of artificial intelligence, you run a company that has a lot of physical stores. How do you think about any company, regardless of whether they are an AI company or not, can use this stuff internally to become more productive for themselves as a CEO, for their employees, et cetera? Like, are you guys mandating anything? Are you encouraging the use of this technology in any way?

• 1:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're using a lot of that across the entire org and it's, I'm super fascinated at how quickly the technology is developing. Every single time I think one company is in the lead, another company comes out with a more advanced model.

• 2:19Speaker 02

  I get very worried about the technology. It's hard to not imagine the worst outcome in terms of high unemployment and ultimately, I don't think that the machines would ever attack us, but I think ultimately there's a risk that we get so fed up by how productive and how much smarter the robots are than us that we end up attacking the machines and then they attack us and it ends up being man versus machine.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  Whether that ends up being World War III, I don't know, but I do get a lot of concerns over artificial intelligence.

• 3:08Speaker 03

  What do you think is the most likely concern you have to actually come into fruition? Is it something that is like physical security or is it more of like cyber? Yeah, there's hacks, there's like that type of stuff.

• 3:20Speaker 02

  The, the pace at which the technology is developing and how, how much smarter the machines are than humans. It really puts us in a position where we have very little utility. And ultimately, if that leads to high unemployment, that affects consumer demand and obviously that that can have a domino effect that is not good, but it's hard for us to compete against the machine. So it's ready to advance. Like everything that we can do, the machine is better at, so.

• 4:05Speaker 03

  So it's interesting. I was talking earlier with Jordy Visser about, he's got this theory of like machine time versus human time and the machines are speeding up. And every executive I talk to pretty much is like, I feel like things are moving very quickly here. You mentioned, you know, new models are coming out at a fast pace, et cetera. How do you think about spending your personal time right now? Like, do you change what you're doing inside the business? Do you change what you're doing, you know, in your time off from the business? Like, how is that evolving with the rise of all this technology?

• 4:36Speaker 02

  Well, everything we're doing at the business is AI, I've heard. And it's been that way now for at least the past few quarters. I spend all my time on GameStop at this point, or a majority of my time and focused on making the business as productive as possible.

• 4:57Speaker 03

  Have you changed anything? Cause you would have told me that six months ago, but has anything changed in that time period?

• 5:03Speaker 02

  In terms of my time?

• 5:05Speaker 03

  Yeah, like, let's just say, like, let's do a day in the life of Ryan Cohen, right? You have a lot of responsibilities. You have, obviously have employees, you have product, you have to deal with, you know, financing, balance sheet, kind of corporate development type stuff. You got to deal with shareholders, although you don't really do a lot of talking to the shareholders is what I gather. How do you think about spending your time? And then inside of that, I'll give you maybe an example for me. I built a custom piece of software to start to merge together a bunch of information and systems we have so I could just be more efficient because now, you know, I masquerade as a software engineer and can vibe code stuff. Like, have you built any tools internally? Are you changing what you're doing on a day to day basis?

• 5:49Speaker 02

  Generally, I avoid meetings. I, I keep my calendar pretty open so that I can work directly with the teams. And I like to avoid all the noise of middle management and work directly with the people that are doing the work. And AI increases my productivity and it also gives me visibility. What's really interesting about the technology is if you would have said to me a few years ago, what are one of the most valuable skills to have? I would have said being a programmer, being a Java programmer, like the most advanced Beth coders code in Java.

• 6:34Speaker 02

  And we're, we're at a, we're at a point where you don't have to have that level of specialization anymore. That level of specialization, whether it's coding or having zero coding skills, you can use AI to identify a root cause to code. And you're at the same level as the most advanced programmers. That's, that's just absolutely remarkable.

• 7:06Speaker 03

  In this world, one of the things that I think every CEO or company is trying to figure out is, okay, I want to go and hire someone.

• 7:15Speaker 03

  I can't give them a written test because who knows, they'd be using AI to do all kinds of crazy stuff there. It's a little hard even to give them like a project. One of the things we've done is we've started to implement trials. Like you just come in, you start working with us for four weeks. Let's see how it goes and kind of see if you like us, we like you, are you productive? Do you fit in culturally, et cetera? How have you changed the hiring process or like the evaluation of talent? Given that now the talent has, you know, some tools that maybe could make them amazing at interviewing, but then they get inside the business and, you know, aren't all they're cracked up to be?

• 7:48Speaker 02

  The, the level of specialization required for tasks is no longer becoming a competitive advantage or a qualifier anymore, prerequisite. So really the best performers are the ones that are most motivated. They're the hungriest, they're the most responsive, they're available right away to come in for an interview, they want to work immediately. Those are the things that I look for generally. People who have a chip on their shoulder, they have something to prove and they just want to win.

• 8:32Speaker 03

  Do they all want to get, do they all want to get paid half cash, half stock?

• 8:40Speaker 02

  I like that.

• 8:41Speaker 03

  As a no comment. Okay.

• 8:45Speaker 03

  What's something that you're trying to get better at as an executive? Like, I find it very fascinating that, you know, people historically have, I think they're fascinated by you. I think they're fascinated by the approach of the business, et cetera. But I think I've gotten to know you well enough at this point where you are constantly trying to improve yourself. So what's like the latest mountain you're trying to climb?

• 9:06Speaker 02

  I want to learn Chinese.

• 9:08Speaker 03

  You want to learn Chinese?

• 9:10Speaker 02

  Yes.

• 9:10Speaker 03

  Okay. Why do you want to learn Chinese if we're months, if not a year away from some sort of like auto translation, you know, type technology that you don't even need to know a different language, but could speak them all?

• 9:24Speaker 02

  There's over a billion people in China. It's an important language to know.

• 9:30Speaker 03

  Okay. Is that, should we read into a large adjustable market that you and your business may not be in, but potentially could be interested in?

• 9:40Speaker 02

  No comment, but it's, it's an important language to know.

• 9:46Speaker 03

  You know, Ryan Cohen is the most interesting person to interview because he could just say no comment to every question. And it's still entertaining. You know, the guy's got like, he's got a gift here.

• 9:56Speaker 03

  When you think about the future, we've had a couple of conversations in private of kind of where all this is going. And maybe let me paint you an extreme example, and then you tell me kind of how realistic you think that is. I could see a world where I get out of my self-driving car that was part of like a Tesla robo taxi fleet. I go to walk into my house, the door automatically opens because it recognizes my gait and maybe my biometrics. And then as I walk in, all of a sudden the humanoid robot that cooked me dinner and has been watching my kids, helps me, you know, sit down at the dinner table. And you just play this example out and it's like, everything is automated, everything is robotics, everything is, you know, this like utopia.

• 10:39Speaker 03

  Is that kind of how you see this all playing or do you see a different future?

• 10:45Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, anything right now that is a desk job, the machine is far superior. Any computer work, when it comes to the actual like robots, physical labor. I mean, we're still not there yet. We're probably less than a few years away. And then the robots are going to be better than us at physical work also. So ultimately it comes down to what is our utility? How do we as humans ultimately end up being productive? And what does the workforce look like?

• 11:28Speaker 02

  And, you know, if you look at, if you look at technology, technological advances in the past, they, you know, everyone says that we end up rebalancing the workforce and we end up learning other skills. But I'm, what I want to understand is what, what ends up being our utility? What's the machines are doing all the things that you just mentioned?

• 11:56Speaker 03

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• 13:20Speaker 03

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• 14:02Speaker 03

  Go to uphold.com to learn more. Uphold.com. Go check them out today. Is there one of those machine slash robotics things that you think will have the biggest impact? Or like you're most excited about?

• 14:18Speaker 02

  Excited about a lot of it.

• 14:22Speaker 02

  But, you know, I don't, I don't like the idea of universal basic income. And I don't think that that's good for people's mental state. Like people do a lot better when they're earning as opposed to when something is given to them. So I want to know when it's all said and done, my brain usually like I go straight to the ninth inning. And I want to know, what are we doing?

• 14:53Speaker 03

  I'm sure you're familiar with the neuro link technology or like a brain computer interface.

• 14:58Speaker 02

  Yeah, a little bit.

• 14:59Speaker 03

  How many successful implementations of that technology in a human has to happen before you'd sign up?

• 15:14Speaker 02

  How many would it take before you sign up?

• 15:18Speaker 03

  I'm doing the interviewing, Ryan.

• 15:22Speaker 03

  You go first and then I'll tell you my answer.

• 15:28Speaker 03

  And I know you're trying to calculate how many have done already. What?

• 15:33Speaker 02

  I'd like to have some data and in terms of successful outcomes. So now your turn.

• 15:44Speaker 03

  So you're trying to learn Chinese. I'm just learning corporate bullshit. That's a no comment. I think that it's got to be for me, probably millions. And I think that it is very different if, you know, I've got hopefully a somewhat functioning brain. I'm not, you know, impaired in any material way. So the like risk reward is probably different than let's say, you know, if you had some sort of injury, if you had some sort of medical situation where could it be like a zero to one moment? You know, all of a sudden you could speak better or, you know, something like that. I think it's a different calculation. But for like the average healthy person, I think people are going to want to see probably millions

• 16:25Speaker 03

  of implementations before they're like, okay, this is like no longer kind of fringe contrarian. This is just like full on consensus. This is safe. This is good. You know, and almost like I'm falling behind, right? If everyone else starts to get it and I don't, then I'm going to be behind. I think that's a huge catalyst for people to start to do it.

• 16:43Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 16:46Speaker 02

  I could be in interviews and there's so much stuff I want to say and I have to stop myself from saying it. So it'd be good.

• 16:53Speaker 03

  Nobody's listening or watching. Nobody's listening or watching.

• 16:58Speaker 02

  Like a retard on retard off button.

• 17:05Speaker 03

  Look, this is as much as funny as it is, like if you start to think about the processing power of your brain, we, I'm always a fan of, I think Naval Ravikant says like work like a lion. You know, kind of like go through the day, you're conserving energy. And then in these moments, like it's like a full on sprint. And when you think about that, our brains kind of do that. And whether people are worried about doom scrolling or, you know, watching some stupid TV show, or just like going for a walk and not really thinking about anything, shower time, right? People get ideas in the shower or whatever, your brain kind of needs the, I'm not fully, you know, at capacity. I don't know how that works with the brain computer interface. Like, is that enjoyable?

• 17:45Speaker 03

  If you just like have a constant stream of intelligence in your brain, maybe you do want to off button, right?

• 17:53Speaker 02

  That would be very helpful. My brain sometimes works too quickly. And if I get it into like second or third gear, it ends up being more productive. So I'd like a slow down switch.

• 18:05Speaker 03

  Okay. So retard on retard off button. Got it. What goes on in your brain before the computer interface? Like, what do you think about all day?

• 18:17Speaker 02

  Everything that can go wrong.

• 18:22Speaker 02

  How to create more efficiency.

• 18:27Speaker 02

  Anything that can interrupt my plans between now and judgment day.

• 18:32Speaker 03

  What do you, what do you think happens on judgment day?

• 18:40Speaker 02

  A lot, there's a lot of different possible outcomes.

• 18:44Speaker 03

  Listen, if you're gonna bring it up, I think it's fair game, right?

• 18:49Speaker 03

  All right, let's, let's talk about, uh, public markets and like the rise of the retail investor. Uh, most people in this room are what I would call like an independent investor or self-directed investor. And one of the things I think is fascinating is not only do they want more control over their finances, but they are changing the way that the market works in a variety of different ways. In one hand, you could argue that you're taking money away from some of these larger players. And so things like voting, proxies, things like that could, you know, be swayed. But maybe more importantly is when I talk to a lot of folks on, uh, hedge fund teams, they're now talking about like, we're trying to see what people are talking about on X. We're trying to see where the momentum in retail is, and then the institutions are following that energy, which is very different than I think kind of the, the mainstream narrative of like,

• 19:34Speaker 03

  the retail investor is, you know, dumb money and there's smart money at Wall Street. What do you see that developing into? Like you, you are probably one of the people closest to this. You've been a big beneficiary of that energy. How does this play out over the next couple of years in your vision?

• 19:52Speaker 02

  What we've seen is there's probably been more cases where retail investors have been right and then retail investors have been wrong. And so like, it's exactly what you said. People look at basically retail as being dumb money. And, you know, then you look at hedge funds as an example. And I guess they're supposed to be considered the smart money, but they all underperform the S and P 500 and they have access to arguably more data. They have greater access to management teams and they underperform.

• 20:36Speaker 02

  So it's really hard to speak and to like make stereotypes in general and like talk about a basket of retail investors versus institutional money. But in general, I mean, if you look at, we have a, we have an incredible shareholder base at GameStop. Now, uh, I don't know how many companies that are traded in the S and P 500 have that kind of community that, that we have. And what's interesting is, you know, you look at a lot of these shareholders

• 21:15Speaker 02

  and they underwrote GameStop basically just based on believing in me. Like that was their diligence, which is admirable. Cause like an institution would look at it and say, this doesn't make any sense. But they ultimately believed and you look at the financial results of the company today and it looks a lot different than, than it did in the past and, uh, than it did in, you know, 2021 or 2020, what the company was losing a lot of money. So in a lot of ways, retail investors have a lot of advantages that the institutions don't have because they can invest in a lot of stuff that the institutions won't.

• 21:58Speaker 02

  And that creates a competitive advantage itself.

• 22:02Speaker 03

  So I'm messaging with some people on your team right now. And I told them, I thought I was going to get you to explain judgment day there for a second. That would have been, uh, that'd have been great, but I want to ask more personal questions. If I was to talk to your team, what would they say your greatest strength and your greatest weaknesses?

• 22:22Speaker 02

  Would have to ask them.

• 22:25Speaker 03

  No, you gotta, you gotta give me something.

• 22:29Speaker 02

  You know, I look, like words can be very deceiving. So when I look at people, I really try to filter out the words and just look at their actions because, uh, some people just have a way with words and whatever, whatever I tell you is what I want you to believe, but it doesn't necessarily mean that that's the truth. So am I the best, am I the best person to answer that question?

• 23:00Speaker 03

  Lied to us, lied to us, Ryan.

• 23:04Speaker 02

  They better not have nice things to say.

• 23:06Speaker 03

  Your team better not.

• 23:08Speaker 02

  Means I'm doing something wrong.

• 23:11Speaker 03

  All right. When, uh, I saw a tweet that you put out where you were asking for engineers and you said, work directly with me, but then you said onsite in Grapevine, Texas. Are you living in Texas? Are you living in Florida? Are you living in California? Are you living somewhere remote around the world where you don't want to tell us?

• 23:29Speaker 02

  No, I'm, I'm generally, uh, in Florida, but I'm, I'm all over the place also. Um, and I'm hiring mobile engineers to work directly with me. So you know, anyone?

• 23:44Speaker 03

  Well, they want to know half cash, half stock.

• 23:47Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 23:49Speaker 03

  I mean, if you, if you offer it, then you got, you gotta also pay it, right? How many times, how many jokes do you think people have made to you about half cash, half stocks in the last six months?

• 23:59Speaker 02

  It wasn't a joke, but there's been a lot of them.

• 24:04Speaker 03

  It's the greatest non-joke of all time. Um, all right. When, uh, when you think about, uh, corporate communications, another thing that I think you guys have done a great job, you, you do have a communications team. They are very good. Uh, but you, I think, understand better than most how to communicate directly to the people in this room, communicate directly to shareholders online. Are there any things that you've learned? Like, let's do a little reverse here. You, you mentor me. What would you tell me as the CEO of a public company on how to communicate with shareholders? The Ryan Cohen way?

• 24:37Speaker 02

  Judge us by our results and our financial performance. And so we've stayed away from, uh, storytelling, uh, and, and really focused on our, uh, on the performance of the business. And, um, there's,

• 25:02Speaker 02

  I try not to get distracted, I guess, by, by noise. And like, if you look at, uh, most public company executives, the CEO and the CFO, they spend the majority of their time on investor relations and public relations. And when you think about what value that actually adds to the earnings capacity of the business, aside from placating shareholders, and, and that's the irony is that if you invest a lot of the time with shareholders, they're going to like you, but that's not going to make the business more efficient. Uh, and it's not going to maximize value for shareholders.

• 25:43Speaker 02

  So when I think about my time in terms of productivity, the best time that I could spend is focusing on like doing real work and actually focusing on the business, whether that's talking to the gearing team, talking to suppliers. But I mean, I, I think about, that's the, it's the most valuable commodity we all have is our time. And it's finite and we want to use it as productively as possible.

• 26:15Speaker 03

  So when you're thinking about those financial results, there's obviously many different things that can contribute to that. You can grow revenue, you can cut costs, you can acquire things. There are many stories told about your business, about you, about your approach. Sometimes it is coming from you guys, other times it's coming from others. Do you just ignore kind of all that noise? And you just say, look, the results will speak for themselves and you're willing to be misunderstood for periods of time in between? Or do you think that addressing rumors or, you know, maybe misstatements is important?

• 26:54Speaker 02

  No, it's, uh, definitely the former. And the, I guess, like a lot of people want to be liked. And so it's easy to get distracted by the noise. And so it goes back to your original question in terms of like, how would my employees describe me? I hope they don't like me. Like my, my father was the, the best operator I have ever met. He didn't miss a day of work, clocked in at 6:00 AM, 6:00 PM, knew every single skew. It was costs, it was margin, communicated directly with suppliers,

• 27:38Speaker 02

  hated people who were doing desk jobs, only liked the people who were doing physical work. And employees liked him very much. Like his employees really didn't like him. He made his employees cry most of the time because it's business. And if they weren't doing a good job, he wasn't shy about it. So I don't have the, the desire to like, to be liked. I think that when you want to be liked, I mean, it doesn't take you very far in life. Ultimately, what people are going to like is, is, is the business, is the business doing well? They're going to like the results.

• 28:19Speaker 02

  So that's, that's what I spend my time on. And how anyone kind of feels along the way is, doesn't really make a difference.

• 28:27Speaker 03

  Where does that come from, you think? Like, why, why do you not care if people like you?

• 28:33Speaker 02

  Cause why should I?

• 28:37Speaker 02

  Like me if I do a good job. You know when you're most liked? You're most liked when you're dead. That's when people really like you.

• 28:45Speaker 03

  That is true. You know, my father used to always say, uh, there's nothing more fun than winning. So if you just win, then everyone has fun, right?

• 28:53Speaker 02

  Yeah. So when I'm no longer here and I'm six feet under.

• 28:59Speaker 03

  What?

• 29:00Speaker 02

  It doesn't matter.

• 29:02Speaker 03

  It's fair. Probably true. What's a failure that you think you've learned from? The great Ryan Cohen, the almighty power. You probably screwed up once or twice. What do you think you've learned from?

• 29:16Speaker 02

  Well, I've screwed up many times. Um, I mean, investing in GameStop was a screw up.

• 29:25Speaker 03

  Dude, give the, uh, I'm going to give the quick synopsis, then you tell us the failure you learned from is, uh, for those that don't know, Ryan kind of bought into GameStop, thought it was fun. Then somehow they asked him to be on the board and then they were like, uh, okay, now you're going to be the CEO. And so fast forward, now he's the CEO of GameStop, but that was not his plan to, uh, to start.

• 29:44Speaker 02

  Yeah. I mean, uh, so that was a mistake. I've made a lot of mistakes.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  But when I end up, uh, in a situation, like, you know, taking over GameStop failure wasn't an option. If it was, I was going to go down with the ship. So when you're in a position where, uh, there's no exit hatch, that's when, that's when greatness is achieved. That's when you get like maximum productivity and results of people is when you're in survival mode and there's no plan B. So I don't know, maybe I subconsciously put myself in situations like that, but that's when, uh, that's when you get the best results in life.

• 30:37Speaker 03

  I apologize in advance. You know, a reporter's right in the story right now. Ryan Cohen's biggest failure is investing in GameStop. A hundred percent. My last question for you is, uh, what do you want your legacy to be? When you're six feet under?

• 30:53Speaker 02

  Once you're dead, people pretend to care for like a few days and then everybody moves on. So, uh, my dad would say, uh, you know, you, you only, uh, you only go around, you only go on the right one. So you might as well enjoy it. So I don't know. I think that legacies are overrated.

• 31:17Speaker 03

  But you're still going to have one. So what do you want it to be?

• 31:21Speaker 02

  Turning around GameStop?

• 31:24Speaker 03

  Here lies the man that turned around GameStop.

• 31:30Speaker 03

  All right. What can people in this room do to help you? Other than laugh at all your jokes and enjoy your entertaining interviews?

• 31:40Speaker 02

  Bet against us.

• 31:47Speaker 03

  Here lies the man that turned around GameStop after everyone bet against them.

• 31:52Speaker 02

  Right. Exactly.

• 31:54Speaker 03

  All right. I appreciate you doing this. I know you've got a very busy schedule. It sounds like so, uh, thanks for taking the time to, uh, to beam yourself in from, uh, Texas, Florida, the moon, wherever you are. We'll do it again soon.

• 32:08Speaker 02

  Always a pleasure.