#1547 Anthony & Polina Pompliano | BITCOIN BREAKS $103K: Wall Street Surrenders

Polina Pompliano, Author of ‘Hidden Genius’ and Founder of The Profile, and Anthony Pompliano, Author of ‘How To Live An Extraordinary Life’ and CEO of Professional Capital Management, discuss bitcoin, the economy, why everyone screaming about tariffs was wrong, what the signals were, China, UK, trade deals, stock market, and future outlook.=======================Today’s episode is brought to you by ExpressVPN, rated #1 by top tech reviewers like CNET and The Verge. Without ExpressVPN, third parties can still see every website you visit, even in Incognito Mode. ExpressVPN is an easy to use VPN service that works on all devices hiding your IP address. Get an extra four months free and protect your online privacy TODAY by visiting https://expressvpn.com/pomp =======================Core is the leading Bitcoin scaling solution, enabling you to lock in yield by locking up your Bitcoin. Simply lock it on the Bitcoin blockchain to secure the Core network, and get rewards. No bridging. No lending. Just holding. Still your keys. Still your coins. Now your yield. Start at https://stake.coredao.org/pomp=======================Pomp writes a daily letter to over 265,000+ investors about business, technology, and finance. He breaks down complex topics into easy-to-understand language while sharing opinions on various aspects of each industry. You can subscribe at https://pomp.substack.com/=======================View 10k+ open startup jobs:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://dreamstartupjob.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Enroll in my Crypto Academy: https://www.thecryptoacademy.io/

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:02Anthony Pompliano?

  What's up everyone? This is Anthony Pompliano. Many of you know me as Pomp. You're listening to the Pomp Podcast, which is my effort to find the most interesting people in the world and sit with them for hours while I ask questions in an effort to learn. So it would mean the world to me if you would subscribe to the show on your favorite audio platform, watch episodes on YouTube, and tell your friends and family about the podcast. My goal is to help millions learn from the world's most interesting people. So let's get into today's episode. What's going on guys? Today we've got a great episode with Polina Pompliano. She is the founder of The Profile and in this conversation, we get deep into the weeds and I share my honest opinion about what's going on with Bitcoin, why the economy is rocking, how I knew that all the people who are yelling and screaming about how bad the terrorists

• 0:46Anthony Pompliano?

  were going to be, how I knew that they were going to be wrong. I show you my exact process and we talk through what the signals were and how you can repeat the same process next time. All the economists agree on stupid stuff. On top of that, we also get into a little bit what's going on in China, the UK, all the trade deals, whether inflation's going to happen, and the stock market. Hope you guys enjoy. Here's my latest conversation with Polina Pompliano.

• 1:07Speaker 01

  Anthony Pompliano runs Pomp Investments. All views of him and the guests on his podcast are solely their opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Pomp Investments. You should not treat any opinion expressed by Pomp or his guests as a specific inducement to make a particular investment or follow a particular strategy, but only as an expression of his personal opinion. This podcast is for informational purposes only.

• 1:31Anthony Pompliano?

  Today's episode is brought to you by ExpressVPN. Have you ever browsed in incognito mode? Well, it's probably not as incognito as you thought. Google recently settled a $5 billion lawsuit after being accused of secretly tracking users in incognito mode. What was Google's defense? They said that incognito does not mean invisible. In fact, all your online activity is still 100% visible to a ton of third parties. That is, unless you use ExpressVPN. Without ExpressVPN, these third parties can still see every website you visit, even in incognito mode. That's your ISP, your mobile network, or the admins on your Wi-Fi network. But ExpressVPN solves that by rerouting 100% of your traffic through secure Encrypted servers, so third parties can't see your browsing history.

• 2:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Now, ExpressVPN is the best VPN because they hide your IP address, they make it super easy to use. It works on all devices, including phones, laptops, tablets, and more. And they are rated number one by top tech reviewers like CNET and The Verge. So if you want to use ExpressVPN and you want your browsing history to stay yours, which I want to have privacy just like you, then you got to use ExpressVPN. Protect your online privacy today by visiting expressvpn.com/pomp. That's E-X-P-R-E-S-S-V-P-N dot com slash pomp. And you can get an extra four months for free. Expressvpn.com/pomp. Go check them out today. Today's episode is brought to you by Core. You can earn yield on your Bitcoin by just holding your Bitcoin.

• 2:58Anthony Pompliano?

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• 3:41Anthony Pompliano?

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• 4:02Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, Plin, what's the first topic?

• 4:04Speaker 02

  All right, Bitcoin is sitting at $103,000. It looks like it's kind of taken over Wall Street. What's going on?

• 4:13Anthony Pompliano?

  First of all, before we talk about Bitcoin, bing bong, the Knicks 3-1. Let's just go ahead and get this out of the way. If the Knicks win one more game, they're going to the Eastern Conference Finals. Come on, bing bong, the Celtics, they came into Madison Square Garden last night. I went to the game, they were all hot, Jason Tatum, he's throwing up threes all over the place. The guy's good, he's good at basketball, but I just want to say, Jalen Brunson and the Knicks, they got a shot, we win one more game, we're going to be in the Eastern Conference Finals. All right.

• 4:45Speaker 02

  Anthony said that, and I was like, when can I go?

• 4:47Anthony Pompliano?

  The finals, Plin only goes to championship games. Imagine that being your reputation. She went to the World Series. If the New York Knicks go to the NBA Finals, I promise you, you will see Plin in the stands. She will go, she don't go to any other basketball games, but if the Knicks go to the finals, Plin will be there.

• 5:04Speaker 02

  Yeah, don't waste, don't waste the seat on me.

• 5:06Anthony Pompliano?

  Ah, yeah, well, in the, in the Eastern Conference or semifinals, it's not really worth it. Okay, let's get to Bitcoin though. Bitcoin also bing bong over 100K.

• 5:17Speaker 02

  Wait, what is the bing bong?

• 5:18Anthony Pompliano?

  Say inside thing, you gotta, you gotta be in the know to know.

• 5:20Speaker 02

  Nick, Nick or Walker?

• 5:22Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, that is, we won't go all the way.

• 5:24Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 5:24Anthony Pompliano?

  All right, so Bitcoin, now we're back to real reality. Bitcoin is doing very well, mainly because Bitcoin is very sensitive to global liquidity and global liquidity has been expanding. Not only did we see China panic and cut interest rates and print a little bit of money, a trillion yuan, but also we see in the United States that there are a number of things that the US continues to inch closer to that would be increasing of global liquidity. On top of that, countries all around the world. So as M2 money supply, global liquidity is all increasing, Bitcoin nicely follows. And so I think that Bitcoin will continue to grind higher here. Second thing that Bitcoin's got is Bitcoin is watching all these public companies keep buying it. They are assaulting, Bitcoiners are assaulting Wall Street.

• 6:08Anthony Pompliano?

  How many public companies do we need buying Bitcoin for there to be buying pressure on Bitcoin? Obviously, we're getting closer and closer to that. Third thing that Bitcoin's got going for it is that Bitcoin in particular is now transcending itself into becoming the benchmark rate. I've been saying this for a long time. Everyone used to say their quote unquote risk-free rate is bonds. That is going to go away. The quote unquote risk free rate is going to become Bitcoin. And it is for the younger generation already. Those younger people are going to grow older. The older people love you, but you're going to be gone. And so there you're going to have the new benchmark rate is going to be Bitcoin. And if that is the benchmark rate, then guess what? If you can't beat it, you gotta buy it. If you can't beat it, you gotta buy it. There are a lot of people who can't beat Bitcoin.

• 6:53Anthony Pompliano?

  And so guess what? They're buying it. It is the new benchmark rate. And therefore I think that is a 20, 30 year kind of time horizon that we're going to watch this kind of ascend to all of finance. We'll use Bitcoin as that benchmark rate. Naturally, that asset is going to keep going up.

• 7:08Speaker 02

  Yeah, I mean, it does seem like the Bitcoin industry is becoming more dominant. I think

• 7:14Anthony Pompliano?

  Because Bitcoiners were right, not just because they bought Bitcoin, but I think this is a very important point. You and I talked about this the other day.

• 7:23Anthony Pompliano?

  To understand Bitcoin, you have to look at the world through a lens that is very different than the lens that was the accurate perspective of the world 30 years ago. And so the reason why it is so controversial is there are some people who are left in the old world. They're looking through their binoculars, but their binoculars ain't showing them how the world looks today. Instead, there's a whole new group of people. It's like a new version of the binoculars came out. They put them goggles on and when they look through it, they see with clarity. But the people looking through the old perspective, they are wishing for a world that no longer exists. The new generation of people who understand Bitcoin, they are looking through a lens

• 8:07Anthony Pompliano?

  that accurately understands how the world operates today. And so that is the intelligence test of financial markets in this day and age. Do you believe in Bitcoin or do you not? If you do not, that's all I need to know. Because it tells me that you have not updated your worldview yet. But if you go and you talk to the Bitcoiners, people are like, oh, the Bitcoiners are insane. They have all these crazy views like, uh, they don't want to eat high carb, high sugar type foods. You're like, what does that have to do with Bitcoin? It's a whole worldview. It's a way of looking at what's happening around you, looking at society, looking at all this stuff. The ideas of decentralization, community notes on X and Bitcoin, dacked up.

• 8:50Anthony Pompliano?

  The same thing, it's decentralized intelligence, it's decentralized computing. It's the power of the crowd, right? Those ideas, one is all about information, the other is all about economic freedom. And so you go around and you look at this stuff. Well, imagine on the, uh, computing side, Bitcoin built a decentralized network, right? It's the strongest computer network in the world. Amazon, Google, all these companies, they're copying it. They're doing the best they can. They're building POPS all around the world. They're trying the best they possibly can to go ahead and have a decentralized, even they all own it, but having that resilient infrastructure around the world. Then you go and you look at things like, uh, trade. Then you go look at things like supply chains. Then you go look at things like medicine, right?

• 9:32Anthony Pompliano?

  You keep going through this and you see these commonalities that go throughout society. And so to me Bitcoin is the intelligence test. If you have the old perspective on the world, which is an outdated perspective, and you have not updated your mental software yet, you will not understand Bitcoin. But if you have updated your mental software and you understand that the world operates differently today than it did 30 years ago, and we better understand what's happening. One, you will be sympathetic to Bitcoin, but also two is it will put you in a position to better understand all of the world around you. And that, my friends, is why when stocks went down 20% earlier this year, and I was on here and I kept saying it over and over and over and over and over and over

• 10:16Anthony Pompliano?

  and over and over and over again, that stocks were going to go back up and that everyone who was freaking out was going to look ridiculous in hindsight.

• 10:28Anthony Pompliano?

  Here's hindsight. They look ridiculous. People were talking about the Great Depression.

• 10:32Speaker 02

  Hold on, let's, before we get to that, let's just address what's going on in crypto right now. So Coinbase just became the first and only crypto company to join the S and P 500. DeFi Technology started trading on the NASDAQ. MicroStrategy keeps just buying more and more. The Trump family's Bitcoin mining venture, American Bitcoin, is set to go public. David Bailey and a holding company Nakamoto raised $710 million and announced a merger with Kindly MD to establish Bitcoin Treasury. I mean.

• 11:04Anthony Pompliano?

  Bitcoiners are assaulting Wall Street. Do you ever read, uh, you ever read the book Barbarians at the Gate?

• 11:10Speaker 02

  Yes, actually I did.

• 11:11Anthony Pompliano?

  Guess what? The Bitcoiners are at the gate. That's what's happening right now. And here's the big secret is everyone wants to draw a line in the sand. And say Bitcoiners, you're on one side. Traditional Wall Street, you're on the other side. Face each other like old Civil War, march across the field, fight it out. There's one winner. That's not what's happening. The Bitcoiners are walking into Wall Street and the Wall Street bankers are putting their arms around the shoulder of the Bitcoiners. And they're saying, let's go win together. Cause guess what happens? When MicroStrategy is buying more Bitcoin, the Wall Street banks, the investment bankers, they're making money. When all of a sudden you see Coinbase getting to the S and P 500.

• 11:54Anthony Pompliano?

  The pensioners, the index funds, the S and P holders, they're all making money. And so the beauty of this is it's not a zero sum game. For Bitcoin, the Bitcoiners, the publicly traded companies associated with Bitcoin. As they win, Wall Street is going to win too. Wall Street is not stupid. They understand if there's somewhere where money can be made. The economic incentive will bring them there. And that's why you see Wall Street embracing this. You don't raise hundreds of millions of dollars as a public company unless somebody on Wall Street is getting paid. You don't actually build these companies into multi-billion dollar businesses without Wall Street helping you do it.

• 12:34Speaker 02

  I think finally like the incentives are aligned, if you will.

• 12:38Anthony Pompliano?

  Wall Street didn't like Bitcoin until Wall Street figured out how to make money with Bitcoin. Now they're like, oh, y'all got a way for us to make money? We love Bitcoin.

• 12:45Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 12:46Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And so that is ultimately what we're watching happen here. Again, remember I said community notes and Bitcoin dapped? Guess what? Wall Street Bitcoiners, dapped.

• 12:56Speaker 02

  Someone get him off the internet.

• 12:57Anthony Pompliano?

  They understand exactly now how to take this new thing. It's a shiny toy that brings new clients, new revenue, new profits.

• 13:08Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 13:09Anthony Pompliano?

  If you go to a Wall Street bank and say, I can bring you clients, revenue and profits. Guess what they say? Why don't you sit down here, young man? We have a nice little spread for you. We could eat over a nice meeting where we try to take your soul.

• 13:19Speaker 02

  Oh, my gosh.

• 13:20Anthony Pompliano?

  Because ultimately that is where this is all headed is Bitcoin is going to ascend into the depths of the traditional financial world because they can't live without it. And that is the part that makes people in the traditional world uncomfortable. But you can't stop the truth.

• 13:38Speaker 02

  I mean, yeah, I guess almost every alter- what started as alternative assets have become more mainstream assets over time.

• 13:48Anthony Pompliano?

  100% that's true. But Bitcoin is even more important than your traditional alternative assets. Because it is ultimately going to eat into the store of value. And so as that continues to happen, capital gets sucked into the hardest money in existence. And Bitcoin is the hardest money. And so as soon as you understand that, bam, you updated your goggles. You see the new world for what it is. You completely changed the way that you look at a bunch of different things. And that is the intelligence test of where we're headed. And I think that's why you see all of these companies, people trying to buy Bitcoin, Coinbase getting into the S and P. All those things you just mentioned. It all comes back to guess who's driving all of that?

• 14:31Anthony Pompliano?

  Bitcoiners who see the new world for what it is. And they are the barbarians at the gate. That is our generation's version. And it's a hell of a sight to see. I know most of these people. Hell, yes. Let's go. I love seeing them be ambitious and go on assault.

• 14:49Speaker 02

  Yeah, I know. Okay, let's talk about the economy at large. The S and P 500 officially turned positive on the year. We're now up over a thousand points since April's low.

• 15:03Anthony Pompliano?

  Bing bong.

• 15:04Speaker 02

  And then, before you bing bong, then JP Morgan drops its US recession call after US-China trade truce.

• 15:13Anthony Pompliano?

  Bing bong. I've been telling you guys, three weeks ago, four weeks ago, we're talking about literally less than a month ago, these people were yelling and screaming about the Great Depression. Get out of here. This was the easiest call. There are many things I've done in my career where I've come out publicly and I've said something and I'm like, ah, it's like, you know, 60% odds. I think that's right. I'm trying to be pretty clear about where I think the odds are. This was like a 90% confidence call. This was the easiest thing in the world to understand.

• 15:41Speaker 02

  Why? Because you think tariffs are...

• 15:43Anthony Pompliano?

  There's no, there's three things. One, when I looked at what happens when tariffs get put in place, there are still people who are arguing with me about what happens with tariffs, even though the same thing that happened in 2018 is happening now. Tariffs are deflationary. How do I know that? We've been putting tariffs on for months now. We started in February. It is now May. Inflation has been crashing this entire time. People, oh, don't worry, inflation's gonna come. No, it's not. Inflation is not coming. And so when you think about that, you can say that if inflation is at 1.5%, the whole thing is you have a bigger worry of deflation, of economic slowdown when you put tariffs in place.

• 16:23Anthony Pompliano?

  So yes, you start trying to be theoretical about individual product prices and stuff. That's not how it works. And so that was one big thing was I actually went and I did the work and I published it publicly. I went product by product by product and showed the prices, showed the chart changes, showed the inflation metrics, and people still were like, I don't believe you. That was one. Two. If you can turn around market sentiment with a couple of posts on social media, you ain't gonna have a real recession. And that was very obvious because there was multiple times on the way down where a single tweet, a single interview on television would all of a sudden you would get these like relief rallies. And it was like the market wanted to go higher on news. Nothing fundamentally changed on the way down.

• 17:07Anthony Pompliano?

  Nothing fundamentally changed on these relief rallies other than words. If words can create a downturn, words can create an uptrend. And so naturally it was just, this is all fear induced. And when the fear dissipates, which it will, enthusiasm will come back twice as hard. Pretty easy to see. Third thing, I literally tweeted, how many times? Study reflexivity. The faster it falls, the faster it'll come back. You only got to see it one time in your life, you never unsee it. And so if something falls quickly, it's going to come rallying right back because that's how reflexivity works. And so here we go. We now are higher than liberation day. We still have tariffs in place for all the people who are like, oh, they walked back to tariffs.

• 17:47Anthony Pompliano?

  But do you understand that the UK, we basically went to the United Kingdom and we said, hey, come over here. Get over here, boy. And when they came over there, you know what we did? Said, sit down right here like a grandpa, right? Talking to his grandson. And when he said, you know what I think's gonna happen here? You're gonna take your tariff of 5.5%. You're gonna lower that bad boy down to under 2%. And then you know what we're gonna do? We're gonna take our tariff of under 2%. We're gonna jack that bad boy up over 10 to 10%. So we got them to lower their tariffs and we raised our tariffs. And then we said, you know, all of our producers that you don't want our products coming into your market? You're gonna stop that nonsense. You're gonna let our producers put those products into the market now. And guess what happened?

• 18:30Anthony Pompliano?

  That is a great deal for America. There's now a more even playing field when it comes to international trade. And so anytime that you can do that, guess what happens? Regardless of what the facts are in the economy, the people who are critiquing this stuff, they're on one side of the political aisle. It's all getting politicized. I don't care about the politics. Throw all of that out. I don't care if you're left, right, if you're up or down. All I care about is did the United States get a better deal? In the UK case, objectively, yes. And Now it looks like we're gonna get the same thing in China. So people like, oh, they walked back the Chinese tariffs. No, we have a 30% tariff on China right now. 30%.

• 19:14Anthony Pompliano?

  China's tariff on us is 10%. We also are going to get access to the Chinese market. Historically, they were flooding our country with tons of products.

• 19:22Speaker 02

  We think we will?

• 19:23Anthony Pompliano?

  100% book it. Done. We absolutely are going to do it. Cause guess what? We put 145% tariff on them and they panicked. They cut rates, they printed money and they came to the negotiating table after saying that they wouldn't do it. And so at the end of the day, the United States of America, we have the position of strength. All these people who are on the internet who are yelling and screaming about their academic textbooks, they're morons. They have no clue how the world actually works. And that's why you got this huge fear-induced politicized entire approach to this. Guess what happens? So far, it looks like this administration, who by the way, does things on a daily basis that I disagree with, that does things that I'm like,

• 20:08Anthony Pompliano?

  ah, I wish the right idea, bad execution, right? Same thing I used to say about the Biden administration. Sometimes they had good ideas, sometimes they had bad ideas. Sometimes they had good executions, sometimes they had bad. I don't care about the political stuff. But what I do know is that they called their shot, their Babe Ruth, they walked up to the plate, they pointed a center field and they hit a home run. And they're gonna probably do it a couple more times. And you gotta give them kudos because they are leveling the playing field on an international trade basis. And that is good for us. That's what we wanted. And frankly, that's what most of the country, majority of the country voted for that specific thing. Pro-America policy. People, look at the border. The border is the craziest thing to me. If you look at the chart of the illegal crossings into the United

• 20:53Anthony Pompliano?

  States, it took them like four weeks to close the border. Four weeks. It's the most, I thought that they were gonna close the border. That blew away any expectation that I had. Four weeks? Maybe it was five weeks, whatever the number, it was like weeks to do it. That is crazy to me that for four years it was open and they shut it like that. Now, same thing's happening here and it goes back to this idea of our society in general is separating into people who have one of two approaches to the world. They come to their life from a position of strength. They understand the power of strength. They understand the importance of personal agency. They understand that you can have an impact on the environment around you.

• 21:37Anthony Pompliano?

  They are all about action, not about always constantly complaining and being a victim. On the other side, there's a bunch of people in society who have been, unfortunately for them, taught that the way to maneuver through life is to be a victim, is to complain about everything, to not act, to take the approach of weakness when you're approaching situations. That's society at this point. Everyone wants to say political party. At the end of the day, I don't care. The political parties are swapping back and forth, right? What was Republicans now Democrat was Democrats now Republican. Who cares about all that stuff? Either you're somebody who believes in coming to your life from strength and personal agency, and you believe you can act on the world, or you are somebody who sits back and says

• 22:20Anthony Pompliano?

  that the world acts on me, I'm a victim to whatever my circumstance is, and I cannot change it. We went from a president who unfortunately was in that camp of I cannot change the world around me because they weren't doing anything. They were letting all this stuff happen. China in the negotiations literally said, we knew that there was a trade deal in place that we signed with Trump in his first term. When Biden took office, we knew he was weak, whatever the, I'm paraphrasing, but we knew he was weak and we violated the trade agreement. We knew that he wasn't going to do anything. Now we go back to a position of strength. There ain't nobody violating any trade deals.

• 22:57Speaker 02

  Yeah, that's interesting. Well, I

• 23:00Anthony Pompliano?

  Do you agree?

• 23:01Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 23:02Anthony Pompliano?

  You do agree?

• 23:03Speaker 02

  Yeah. Okay. No, I do think that

• 23:07Anthony Pompliano?

  You hate that I had you say that, huh?

• 23:11Speaker 02

  He's gonna clip that.

• 23:13Anthony Pompliano?

  First time she agree with me in like three years.

• 23:15Speaker 02

  No, that was, that was quite the speech there. All right. No, what I was gonna say is, um, I used to think that like economic policy and like things like that couldn't necessarily be politicized because it's the economy, it's numbers, it's facts. But now I see how, for example, Scott Besant, you know, went to Geneva, he talked with China and trade negotiations. And they decided to reduce the tariff on goods from China from down to thirty percent from one hundred and forty five percent. And China's gonna reduce it, like you said, to ten percent down from one hundred and twenty five percent. Now, what I'm seeing is some headlines being like, oh, look, like, we're doing a great job with the negotiations.

• 23:57Speaker 02

  And some headlines being like, oh, we're walking it back. It's like, well, is it a negotiation or is it a walk back? And it's like, I, I think that's kind of what you see with, um, how you wanna see the world.

• 24:09Anthony Pompliano?

  Show me one person who thinks that, uh, we are caving, we are backtracking or any of this stuff. Who's ever done high stakes negotiations? Show me one person. The odds are nearly zero of them who are saying that because they've never actually been through these types of negotiations. It was like, it was like a meme when the tariff started. People were like, oh, I went back and I read the art of the deal and, uh, he's anchoring.

• 24:35Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah.

• 24:35Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And then a bunch of people like, no, he's not, he's stupid, he doesn't know what he's doing, whatever. Listen, there's a lot of things that you can comply, you can pick up any single person in the world and you can find amazing things they do and you can find stupid things that they do. Right? Again, throw all the politics out. If there's one thing that this guy has hung his entire career on, it's negotiating. And people always be like, oh, he had this one negotiation that didn't win. Like, nobody bats a thousand, right? I'm not even saying he's gonna bat a thousand on the trade deals. We actually may end up doing a deal with some country somewhere that I think is a bad deal. Right? But. That UK deal, I never thought we'd get that.

• 25:10Speaker 02

  So you're saying that it's not, it's still not free trade, but it's freer trade.

• 25:16Anthony Pompliano?

  What I'm saying is that free trade is a lie. I've been saying that for months now, is that the United States, it's like we went to, we went and took a nap. Right? We, we went in the morning, we went and talked to all the countries and we said, hey, you guys want a free trade? Free trade, free trade? Yeah. Okay. Great. Okay. We're going to do free trade. Amazing. That's basically World Trade Organization, all these things that we signed. We then went to a little siesta, started sleeping. We woke up an hour later, all the other countries got together and decided that free trade thing, we ain't going to do that. But we woke up and just pretended like the free trade thing was still going on. We're still doling out money. We're still doing all this stuff, whatever. All these other countries, they had tariffs on us. They were subsidizing their producers. They were manipulating their currencies. They were doing all this stuff.

• 25:59Anthony Pompliano?

  By the way, it shouldn't be political because Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, Bernie Sanders, all these people have been saying this for 30 years. Donald Trump is a Democrat running the Republican Party. That's why the working class went from the Democrat Party to the Republican Party is because you had somebody who was a strong, position of strength type leader, who has the same democratic principles that the Democrats used to have, and now he's running the Republican Party. And so I actually think that if I was the Democrats, the way that I would talk about it is I would say something to the effect of the Democrats invaded the Republican Party and took over. Cause that's basically what happened.

• 26:36Speaker 02

  They would never.

• 26:37Anthony Pompliano?

  Of course they wouldn't say that, of course, because to them it's more important about the optics of it. But that's basically what happened, right? Is you have people who are Democrats, Elon Musk, Democrat, Joe Rogan, Democrat, Donald Trump, Democrat, right? Just go Tulsi Gabbard, all of them.

• 26:51Speaker 02

  I mean, I think the pharmaceutical drug prices is a very democratic move.

• 26:56Anthony Pompliano?

  That is like the, the most anti-free market thing in the world is to basically put in a most favored nation policy for pharmaceutical drugs. By the way, it's, it's great, right? It is going to drive down costs in America. It will increase prices elsewhere, but it is going to drive down prices in America. And if you have a pro-American policy, then you should want the cheapest prices here in America. Help the person who needs medicine, who can't afford it in America. Great idea. But you are manipulating the market. And so the second you start to manipulate the market, you are going to create issues elsewhere. But whether people like it or not, those issues aren't going to be in America because we're going to get the drug prices down. To your point, that is a very Democrat-type policy.

• 27:41Anthony Pompliano?

  But it's the Republicans that are doing it. So just take away all the political parties. Just start talking about this idea of, is it a good idea or is it not? Is it a good idea to shut the border? Whoever's going to do it, duh, yes. Is it a good idea to go to countries and say, whatever you do to us, we're going to do to you, unless you allow for free trade? Duh, of course. Is it a good idea to get pharmaceutical prices down? Duh, of course. And see, you keep going through all these things. And what you say is, this is basically better execution of the Democrat policies the last 30 years. We're now just seeing it happen. And the world has shifted where somehow now you have a bunch of people who identify with the Republican Party,

• 28:26Anthony Pompliano?

  who are actually encouraging this stuff. And so that is like a mind bend that somehow now we're seeing a bunch of stuff that was talked about for 30 years actually get put in place. And so, again, I keep coming back to this. I don't care which political party is in office. All I care about is, is the life of the average citizen getting better or worse? That's all I care about. And inflation has to come down. The stock market should go up. We should see things like pharmaceuticals, gas prices, food, et cetera, not keep exploding higher. We should leave people alone. We should make sure that they're safe when they go out in their neighborhood or they go out in to their school, all this stuff.

• 29:10Anthony Pompliano?

  It's pretty simple, basic stuff. And then just let people live their lives and be happy.

• 29:15Speaker 02

  Speaking of walking statements back, EY, that was Ernst & Young, isn't it? No, just EY?

• 29:23Anthony Pompliano?

  I don't know.

• 29:24Speaker 02

  EY chief economist.

• 29:25Anthony Pompliano?

  They should change their name to Bing Bong.

• 29:28Speaker 02

  UI Chief Economist Gregory Daco in this Bloomberg article says, "The temporary US-China tariff reprieve is a notable de-escalation, but it won't avert a slowdown. Front-loaded demand, elevated price pressures, and acute policy uncertainty will still weigh on hiring and spending."

• 29:45Anthony Pompliano?

  Stop it. Stop it.

• 29:47Speaker 02

  What do we think?

• 29:47Anthony Pompliano?

  Stop it.

• 29:48Speaker 02

  Does he not have a point?

• 29:49Anthony Pompliano?

  No, he doesn't have a point. This is completely wrong.

• 29:52Speaker 02

  Why?

• 29:52Anthony Pompliano?

  Because they're thinking about it theoretically from an academic perspective. That's not how the world works. You know how I know Ryan Peterson, Flexport CEO? Thirty-five percent jump in ships already coming from China to the United States. What's going on, guys? I hope you're enjoying this episode. Before you continue, I want you to know about a brand new show called From the Desk of Anthony Pompliano. I sit down at my desk every single morning and I explain what I think about current events. It's a great show that hopefully will keep you informed and entertained to a little bit. And so if you go all the way over to the other channel, From the Desk of Anthony Pompliano on YouTube, Rumble, X, and every other platform, From the Desk of Anthony Pompliano is a show that'll keep you informed about all things financial markets, general business, pop culture, and of course Bitcoin. I'll see you guys over there. Now, let's get back into this episode.

• 30:37Anthony Pompliano?

  It ain't even been a week yet.

• 30:38Speaker 02

  Explain to the people what Flexport is.

• 30:40Anthony Pompliano?

  It's been like four days. They're a freight forwarder, like a tech-enabled freight forwarder. So they see all the data. Thirty-five percent jump in the number of ships or containers coming from China to the United States. It's been four days. He predicts that there is going to, there's such a long line of pent-up demand that there's literally going to be no space available on these ships very shortly here. So if you think about that, what do you mean there's going to be a slowdown? There's going to be a massive boom. And so that is really where we have to start positioning ourselves. Is you have to update your mental model of what's going on. We went through the fear component. It was very easy to see we're going back. Now, here comes the momentum. You better be ready, because here comes the boom. Stock all-time highs by the end of the year, Bitcoin all-time high by the end of the year.

• 31:24Speaker 02

  Oh, God.

• 31:25Anthony Pompliano?

  I said it when we were down 20%. People thought I was crazy. When it happens, y'all will remember. I've been bullish this whole time.

• 31:32Speaker 02

  If you guys clip that for the internet, just cut me out.

• 31:37Anthony Pompliano?

  I've been bullish the whole time. There's, if, look, I say a lot of things that end up being wrong, whatever, this time.

• 31:43Speaker 02

  And so did you so here's here's what I think about people, people who believe this stuff. I think that it's very hard to change somebody's belief about something. So when they get data that contradicts it, they're not gonna, they're not gonna change their mind completely. They're gonna walk it back, but still in a way that aligns with their view of the world. Are you saying that you were a not willing to change your mind or B that I guess because you used to think tariffs were bad, but then you changed your mind to

• 32:14Anthony Pompliano?

  I thought that tariffs were inflationary. That's what the economics professor in college told me. That's what every single economist that I knew told me. That's what every single investor told me tariffs are inflationary. It was like the 12 commandments and tariffs are inflationary. You just regurgitated over and over again.

• 32:28Speaker 02

  What caused you to change your mind?

• 32:29Anthony Pompliano?

  Throw in a Hail Mary, maybe an Our Father, and then tariffs are inflationary. Like that's you just grew up. That was a staple.

• 32:35Speaker 02

  By the way, if you guys are wondering why Anthony has a scar on his forehead, it's because our one and a half year old attacked him.

• 32:42Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, me and that little boy, we gonna talk. He did. He did slice me real good. It looks much better now than it did.

• 32:47Speaker 02

  But I was like, what did he slice you with?

• 32:48Anthony Pompliano?

  His toy. I was laying on the floor and he whacked me and then he laughed. You know, he's definitely my son.

• 32:54Speaker 02

  He's mostly a pacifist.

• 32:56Anthony Pompliano?

  Yeah, of course. Um, tariffs are inflationary.

• 32:59Speaker 02

  But what caused you to change your mind?

• 33:01Anthony Pompliano?

  I went and I looked in 2018.

• 33:04Speaker 02

  What was the impetus?

• 33:05Anthony Pompliano?

  Because I saw all the economists agree on something. The second I saw all the economists agree, I said, they're wrong. That is that. Look again, update your mental software, new way to look at the world. The second that all the economists agree on something, immediately take the other side. It's very simple. As soon as there's consensus.

• 33:22Speaker 02

  Why? Because they're academic?

• 33:23Anthony Pompliano?

  They're all academic, but they never agree on anything. They always disagree. So the second they all build it, what it means is it's actually a sign that they're not thinking that we have now outlawed dissent. They all fell in line. As soon as we outlawed dissent, you know dissent is correct. Remember when you couldn't say that the lab leak theory was true? Now guess who's saying it? The government's saying it. But literally, it was outlawed. They outlawed dissent. If you said anything other than the bat.

• 33:53Anthony Pompliano?

  Is the virus, you were literally kicked off the internet as soon as you saw dissent is outlawed. I said, oh, I would never forget zero heads got kicked off Twitter. I turned to plan. I said, that's true. Easy. As soon as you outlaw dissent, it is true. And so here, easy. I'm just telling you guys what I did. All the economists agreed, bam, they're wrong. You could tell me anything. You literally could tell me that all the economists say the sky is blue today. They're wrong. Because in a group of people that big, somebody looks up in the sky and says, hmm, I actually think it's white because there's a lot of clouds.

• 34:32Anthony Pompliano?

  Right? And then there's debate, there's dissent, there's all, but that's not what was happening. Every single one of them all came out and they all put on their nice little suits and ties. They went on to television and they all said, you know, I'm the professor of whatever university. Of course tariffs are inflationary. This is horrible. Great Depression in 1929.

• 34:52Anthony Pompliano?

  Shut up.

• 34:54Anthony Pompliano?

  What do you guys know? You guys were wrong and it goes back to, we've seen this over and over and over again because the same people who said that tariffs were inflationary, the same people who said that inflation was going to be transitory, who are the same people who said that the virus came from a bat. You just go all the way back.

• 35:10Speaker 02

  I remember the confidence of the inflationist transitory people.

• 35:13Anthony Pompliano?

  That was again, so easy. The second they all started saying it, you're like, they're wrong. Duh. You can't print trillions of dollars and not get inflation.

• 35:21Speaker 02

  Yeah. All right. On that note, it's been a pleasure.

• 35:26Anthony Pompliano?

  All right. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. It just felt good to rant a little bit today, you know? In, uh,

• 35:33Anthony Pompliano?

  as a reminder, I appreciate your time. I appreciate you guys watching, but uh, Knicks 3-1, one more win.

• 35:39Speaker 02

  Ding bong, ding dong.

• 35:41Anthony Pompliano?

  It's like ding dong. All right. See you guys next time.