Building Value Beyond the Bottom Line

In today’s episode, I sit down with Matt Uhler, founder of Amped Success, to discuss what makes a business valuable and how entrepreneurs can position themselves for a successful exit. Matt shares why financial data matters just as much as perceived value, how certain tax strategies can hurt a company’s valuation, and what buyers and sellers should understand before making a deal. We also discuss the importance of communication, service, and keeping your word in an unpredictable business environment. Matt reflects on overcoming childhood adversity, the power of asking better questions, and how small changes in perspective can create opportunities for personal and professional growth. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Welcome to Office Hours. I'm David Meltzer and we are live here at Sirius XM Studios in Las Vegas. And we have the number one business broker in the world here with us today. His name is Matt Uhler. And he gives the heart set, the mindset and the handset on how to get the most out of your business and for your business. Founder of AMP Success, business broker and coach, incredible podcaster as well. I've been able and blessed to be on that. Matt Uhler, welcome to Office Hours.

• 0:25Speaker 01

  Thank you, David. It is truly an honor.

• 0:27Speaker 00

  I want to start somewhere different. The thousands of companies that you've evaluated. And value is so important to me. My entire mission is based off of value. My name was given to me by my mom, the beloved David servant Meltzer, to be of service to others and provide value. In understanding value of business, though, I'm always aware of perceived value. And it's really important to understand as you're transacting, buying businesses and selling business, what perceived value is compared to quantitative or bottom line value. The best business brokers I know are able to articulate to the buyer and the seller,

• 1:08Speaker 00

  a meeting of the minds of perceived value. Very rarely does a business sell for its bottom line unless there's a desperate situation. What are some of the lessons you've learned about perceived value in coordinating two different parties, a buyer and a seller, to believe in that perceived value?

• 1:26Speaker 01

  Well, it's a great question. You know, perceived value, when it comes to businesses, so much, so much of what I look at is data. Right? And, and even a buyer who might love a deal. Sooner or later, their accountant, their attorney, the father-in-law, somebody's going to come in and say, listen, let's look at the math. And not always, but almost always. And so I always start with the data piece. And then the perceived value, which I would call the artistic value when it comes to valuation. It's like the art and the science. The art is how formulated is the recipe of the business? How duplicatable is it? Is it, is there opportunity? Is it on an uptick? Is it on a downtick? I mean, there are so many things that come into valuing a business other than just the math.

• 2:09Speaker 01

  But it usually starts with the math. And then the perceived value, of course, is there are almost always no comps. There's nothing to comp it with. And so it's really what's it worth to the buyer? And what's it worth to the seller? And if we have a meeting of the minds, we have a deal. And if we don't, everybody goes home.

• 2:24Speaker 00

  And you help buyers and seller prepare for that.

• 2:27Speaker 01

  I do.

• 2:28Speaker 00

  Which is very important because a lot of times even the math isn't right. And they want to exit, but the math won't justify it.

• 2:34Speaker 01

  It's honestly probably one of the biggest challenges we face when we start working with business owners, is helping them understand how important the math is. Because again, if it's off, I mean, I just, I'm working with a client right now, where literally one, one move that their accountant suggested to help them minimize taxes, dropped the value $2 million. And so they fortunately were in a position to amend returns and all of that, but it gets meaningful.

• 3:00Speaker 02

  I think it's so interesting. You talk about data, of course, I'm like very interested in data. You know, I, I've been working in the world of AI for a little over a decade.

• 3:11Speaker 00

  Which is like 100 years for industrial work.

• 3:13Speaker 02

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. And AI dog years. One of the things, though, in the early days of AI, we didn't have the models we have today. It was very much kind of a replication of human pattern recognition. And so I'm really interested in some of the patterns that, I mean, I would imagine they're in your upcoming book. So some of the patterns that you've recognized for, like for people who are building a business, let's say they're one to five million in revenue. Right? They have a dream now, oh my gosh, maybe one day I'm going to be able to sell this thing. I'm curious what patterns you've recognized, maybe positive patterns, because I'm a positive person. Yeah. But then also, because I heard you sneak in that you, you, your book has taken a turn. So I would love for you to weave that into if you can.

• 3:57Speaker 01

  So from a pattern standpoint, there's,

• 4:01Speaker 01

  and this may fall into the negative side of things, but so many, so many business owners are so focused on trying to minimize taxes. And, and they don't realize that oftentimes minimizing taxes jeopardizes the ability for the buyer to obtain financing or for it to make financial sense and all these crazy things people come up with. And realistically, the seller of a business is saving 30, 40 cents on the dollar and losing many, many dollars by that move. And so, so that's one pattern that I see that, that is not so positive. But certainly a positive attribute that I do see with a lot of business owners is they put their heart and soul into these things. And, and literally they become, and oftentimes the biggest asset they own.

• 4:44Speaker 01

  And so it means a lot. And it's a super important decision and one I don't take lightly because it's, it's very significant. And then on the buyer, usually it's the biggest financial decision they're making. So that pattern is, it's important for everybody involved.

• 4:59Speaker 02

  Amazing. Thank you.

• 5:00Speaker 01

  And then the twist on the book, if I, if I can, so the, the book started out as a business book. How do you buy, sell, finance and partner in businesses? And one of the things that I've learned is, is my upbringing was colorful and tragic in a lot of ways. And I'm finding that.

• 5:18Speaker 00

  We call that normal.

• 5:19Speaker 01

  Yeah, normal. Yeah, just like everybody else. Yeah. I had a very safe childhood up until I was three.

• 5:26Speaker 01

  It was very normal. Married parents, the whole nine yards.

• 5:30Speaker 01

  But anyway, I'm, I'm just learning that I've always put that in my past, you know, I'm not a victim. It's not, it's just, I dealt with it, I moved on. But I'm realizing that people really want to hear about that and they want to understand like, you know, adversity is something we all deal with and learning how people move through adversity is important. And so my book has taken a twist where it's really starting from some of my upbringing and the challenges I had and how I used business as a tool to kind of escape

• 6:01Speaker 01

  a lifestyle I did not want.

• 6:03Speaker 03

  Jackson is now an eight-year-old Ewing sarcoma survivor, two years cancer-free. The chemotherapies that he received, they are all, except for one, older than my husband and I. There has been no new treatment for Ewing sarcoma that has been successful.

• 6:19Speaker 04

  Millions across America are waiting for new breakthroughs.

• 6:22Speaker 03

  So we're waiting for an MRI right now, hoping that it's going to come back normal.

• 6:27Speaker 04

  Is curing childhood cancer allowed by OMB, by the Office of Management and Budget? Help protect research that Congress already funded. Go to unitedforcures.org today. Paid for by United for Cures.

• 6:43Speaker 05

  One thing, you know, when I sit amongst these brilliant people and I listen, one theme that always comes up is wisdom and advice, always. And some people, like the, the, the Voss, the first guy, said, guys, people don't take advice. So I have two boys that are going, one's first year in college, other one's going into college next, a couple of months.

• 7:12Speaker 05

  What advice would you give to yourself if you were going back to college and you're entering into college? What would you give yours, what advice would you give your, yourself going into college? In this work environment, in this business environment?

• 7:26Speaker 01

  Yeah. And honestly, whether it was college or anything else, I mean, what I tell, what I tell my kids, I've got four kids, my wife and I have four kids. And it is do what you say you're going to do. You keep your word and you give it everything you've got. And to me, that's like in life, we don't know what's coming and the twists and turns.

• 7:48Speaker 01

  But, but those core values, I think are crucial these days and probably always to, to just feel good about what you did, whether it worked or not, whether you succeeded or failed. You told the truth, you did what you said you were going to do, you gave it everything you had.

• 8:05Speaker 05

  If you had a crystal ball, though, you know, and you can, you know, predict the future. And this is like one thing I would, don't want to miss if I'm in college. So I got college.

• 8:15Speaker 00

  Now, did you go to college?

• 8:16Speaker 01

  I did not go to college.

• 8:17Speaker 00

  So it's even a hard.

• 8:18Speaker 05

  Okay, so, but, but the, the University of Barnes and Noble.

• 8:22Speaker 00

  Right.

• 8:23Speaker 05

  I'm just, you know, I, I love that, right? Because you don't have to have a college degree to be successful, obviously, right? But I'm saying, but my boys are going to college. So if you go, if you had your crystal balls, you know, what would I do if I, if I had that opportunity?

• 8:36Speaker 01

  From a standpoint of occupation or?

• 8:38Speaker 05

  Yeah, just where you're, you're predicting the future, go, this is what I would, you know, look into when I was in school.

• 8:43Speaker 00

  Oh, wow.

• 8:43Speaker 01

  I think communication and service is where it's at. And AI is still just amazing and trying to figure out exactly what that's going to, what that, how that's going to shape our economy and, and community. But I think service is something that from a standpoint of people willing to give more than others might, you will rise above. And then the ability to communicate with people is also crucial. So again, from a standpoint of focus, that's what I would be focusing on and asking my kids to focus on.

• 9:16Speaker 00

  And because it's my show, I have to interject on this one because I see so many parents that want that crystal ball. And they want to use the security that they want for their children and guiding them in that crystal ball. And so one of the lessons I learned from my mom, that you, besides you can do whatever you want to do after graduate school, which was her advice, but literally just telling our children, I don't care what you do when you go to college. But whatever you decide to do, whatever classes you decide to take, sports you decide to play. If you do your best, learn lessons and have fun, you'll be the best at whatever you're doing. And I text that to my children every day, along with, I'm proud of you, I love you and I always have your back.

• 10:00Speaker 00

  It's do your best. If you want to be a gamer, do your best, learn lessons and have fun. You want to learn at Barnes and Noble, like Noel, then she did her best, learned a ton of lessons and had fun doing it. And I think our next generation, if they follow that intention, they'll gain the most out of every experience, college or not. And because it's moving so fast, it's so hard to tell kids what's going to be working, what's not going to be working.

• 10:28Speaker 05

  Because if you told them four years ago, you'd be wrong.

• 10:31Speaker 00

  Right. Yeah. And I'm wrong all the time. And I fall into this, I tell this story about just recently, my daughter bought her first house at 24 years old and dumb ass is like, don't lock in the interest rates are going down, which we heard the real estate guy said, they will go down, but there's a blip right now. And meanwhile, they went up and here you are, supposed to, you know, have this great knowledge. We don't control.

• 10:55Speaker 05

  Thanks dad.

• 10:56Speaker 00

  It cost me because I paid the difference. Anyways.

• 11:02Speaker 00

  Really? Sorry.

• 11:03Speaker 06

  Yeah, so I have a similar background, yeah, from an abusive family. And so I turned that around in what I do now. So, so many people right now are struggling also with any kind of abusive experience personally, family-wise and so forth. And you came to create amped success. So what is like this one tip that you can give people that are right now still in a victim mode of what has happened to them, right? Into what can I create and change in my future, right? From whatever I have learned, that resilience piece

• 11:46Speaker 06

  that you are definitely have underneath, right? So can you share about that?

• 11:52Speaker 01

  Yeah, there's so much there for me. And, and it felt like such a long road for me to, to experience something different than what I had experienced growing up. And a lot of it started out, and David's great about this too. You know, the, the power of the questions we ask ourselves, right? And if, if I'm asking myself the question, why is my life so miserable? And how can it get worse? And what if this happens? Or that, that's going to affect how I feel and what I see. And when I'm willing to ask myself, you know, what can I do today to make a difference? How can I make myself feel better? What's going to be important today? What am I grateful for? What were my wins yesterday? I mean, all of those things help to change the trajectory a little bit. And, and we see it all the time where you can take

• 12:36Speaker 01

  two, two kids from the same family and, and end up with completely different realities as far as their life. And I think it starts with baby steps, being willing to look a different direction and go and take a different path than the one that, that we were taught. And so, yeah, the, the advice, just to be clear, would be start asking yourself different questions that lead you in a direction that you want to go, as opposed to the habitual questions which we learned growing up.

• 13:04Speaker 00

  Matt Uhler, asking the right questions and giving the right suggestions to business owners around the world, thousands of different companies with different scenarios, but yet empowering those business owners and buyers to have a awareness of true value. Matt Uhler, from adversity to achievement. Thank you so much for joining us on Office Hours.

• 13:25Speaker 01

  Truly an honor, David. Thank you.

• 13:28Speaker 00

  We are blessed here on Office Hours.