Pod Insights Personally Resurrection, Episode 8: San Francisco, 2022 About this episode The final chapter in our series on Daryl Allen. We end the story where it started.
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The creation of this podcast was made possible thanks to the financial support of the Conseildes arts de Montréal, le Conseil des arts et des lettres du Québec, and the Canada Council for the Arts.
Transcript 10,839 words · 7 speakers
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0:31 Speaker 01 This is a CBC Podcast.
0:35 Speaker 02 Welcome back to Resurrection. This is the final episode of our series on Daryl Allen. We start where we ended last time, with a box.
0:48 Speaker 03 I mean, I had no idea Jonathan was going to go and die on me.
0:51 Speaker 02 When Daryl died, he left half of his plays with his partner Jonathan. Jonathan died in 2017.
0:58 Speaker 03 I'm guessing his family just, you know, anything they didn't have a connection to, they would have just tossed.
1:03 Speaker 02 I feel like I'm on a roll. I might try to just call him today.
1:07 Speaker 04 You have one saved message.
1:12 Speaker 05 Hey, Dane, this is Jeff Houston. I have found a box of materials. It's typewritten plays. They're about 25 pounds. Words. I want to know if you want to send them to you, but I want to talk to you first because my daughter made a promise to my brother that these are being taken care of. So I want to know what your intentions are.
1:37 Speaker 02 Here we are. After years, it feels like the universe is rewarding me for the work that I put in a Daryl's archive. I started with a single script from Daryl's lover, Dan. Then Dan gave me Daryl's love letters. Then I met Janet, and she had her half of the scripts. And now the other half of the scripts are so close to being mine. All I have to do is convince Jeff that I'm worthy. For the last time in this series, this is Resurrection. My love letter to Daryl Allen.
2:21 Speaker 05 Hello?
2:22 Speaker 02 Uh, hi, is this Jeff?
2:24 Speaker 05 Yes, it is.
2:25 Speaker 02 Hi, Jeff, it's Dane calling back. How are you?
2:29 Speaker 05 Hi, um, I'm doing okay. Um, listen, this, um, I guess I told you, uh, in the voicemail that this box of stuff, it's about, um, a little bit under 25 pounds. I just, uh, weighed it on my
2:44 Speaker 02 Jeff loves to chat, and I mean, true chat. He's the kind of guy I could grab a beer with and chat all day long. I have to rein him in a little to get things started.
2:53 Speaker 05 I'm Jeffrey Houston, and I'm Jonathan Houston's identical twin brother, born and raised here in Indiana, small town, and I've been married for 51 years, and we have three daughters, nine grandchildren, and one recent great-grandchild.
3:13 Speaker 02 Ask Jeff about the scripts.
3:15 Speaker 05 My brother was in ill health, and he had these manuscripts with him, and he talked to my oldest daughter, and he said, "If I pass away, I want you to take these, because I trust you will take care of these and find some home for them."
3:31 Speaker 02 Jeff takes this request from his brother seriously.
3:34 Speaker 05 He thought that they were pretty special, and he wished that when he went, that a university or somebody that was interested in publicizing these manuscripts would come into ownership of them.
3:48 Speaker 02 I, of course, am neither a university nor a publisher, so Jeff is gonna press me a little bit.
3:55 Speaker 05 And, uh, so what are your plans, then?
3:58 Speaker 02 Uh, yeah, so the, the important question here. Um, so I may not be part of a university or a publishing house or a theater company, but I genuinely care about this story. And by now, I know how to show people that I care. I get to know they're a part of the story. I asked Jeff about his brother, about Jonathan. Can you just tell me what kind of a person? He was.
4:28 Speaker 05 He could be kind of stubborn. Of course, he was my brother. I loved him. He was my twin brother. He had a great sense of humor, hilarious. He had a hilarious sense of humor. And he was a very giving and empathetic person. And I think he emphasized a lot. Uh, he became involved with the AIDS activism. He was very active politically. He worked phone banks. He volunteered a lot of time.
4:56 Speaker 02 Ask about their childhood together.
4:58 Speaker 05 Well, our home life was an unhappy childhood. And I know that sounds depressing, but my, both my parents were what I would consider alcoholics. John was a very hard worker. We, we picked up pot bottles for two, three cents of the pot, a pot bottle, mowed lawns, shoveled sidewalks, anything. We kids felt kind of insecure in that we always thought, you know, if mom and dad got divorced, we'd be out on the streets a little. So that insecurity was there all the time too, you know?
5:31 Speaker 02 Was there a moment that he came out to you or?
5:34 Speaker 05 Yeah, maybe two years after we got prejudiced, when he went over to South Bend. Um, that's when he announced it to my wife and I. And I believe my wife's attitude was it was something he was, he would just go out of, you know? He would move on to something else. Uh, we didn't discuss it a whole lot, you know? Um, I, John was always welcome in our house, anything like that, you know? There was never any issue there or anything.
6:04 Speaker 02 A few years after Jonathan came out to his brother, he and Daryl got together. Did you ever meet Daryl?
6:10 Speaker 05 Oh, yeah. Yeah, I met Daryl a few times. He was here a few times. Uh, they traveled together. And they stayed with us some of the time. Um.
6:22 Speaker 05 I know, um, when the whole AIDS thing first started, uh, they did not stay with us. They stayed at a hotel just because nobody knew, it might have hurt John's feelings, but nobody knew at that time how it spread or what would happen or anything. And we had kids, so it was like, we gotta be careful, you know?
6:43 Speaker 02 Yeah.
6:44 Speaker 05 Now, I mean, we know so much more now than we did back then.
6:47 Speaker 02 I like Jeff. He's friendly, easy to talk to. I'm not including these clips to paint him as a bad guy. I think he's a good guy. I'm including these clips because this was the reality of the time. Homophobia, especially during the AIDS crisis, it was so brutal because it came from everywhere and everyone. It came from the good guys, too.
7:09 Speaker 05 But I met Daryl and I liked him a lot. He kind of reminded me of, of somebody from around here. He had fit into a small town.
7:16 Speaker 02 Did their relationship make a lot of sense for you?
7:18 Speaker 05 Oh, I think so. I think they're very happy together. I think my attitude was that, well, he's settled down and he's found somebody. Cause I think everybody deserves to be happy, you know?
7:28 Speaker 02 And I think Daryl and Jonathan were happy, even during the hard times. Did you ever talk to him about Daryl's death?
7:36 Speaker 05 John told me that he was basically kind of losing his mind. He, he kind of got like Alzheimer's and all, uh, didn't he? Um, like, it was like brain cancer almost.
7:48 Speaker 02 When Daryl started getting sick, Jonathan got involved in AIDS activism.
7:53 Speaker 05 Yeah, I think that's when he really became involved and that like went to see the AIDS quilt, I know, in Washington DC and spoke on different panels. Just, ah, education more than anything else, you know, cause people didn't know what was going on.
8:11 Speaker 02 Daryl's death was hard on Jonathan. He struggled with substance use.
8:15 Speaker 05 He started using methamphetamines.
8:18 Speaker 02 Jonathan moved around after Daryl's death. He left Boston and ended up in Portland, Oregon. He was having a really hard time.
8:25 Speaker 05 He cashed in two 401ks and really it ruined his health and he lost his job. And I thought, this man is going to end up either dead or in jail. And thank goodness, he finally had like a wake-up call. He got busted for a small amount of possession and that just finally straightened him up enough that he came back to Indiana from Portland.
8:49 Speaker 02 When Jonathan came back to Indiana, he did something very, very gay. He took all the shit he'd been through and he made meaning out of it.
8:58 Speaker 05 And then let me tell you one thing, I really want people to know this. He helped scores of people by sponsoring them with a group called NA, which is Narcotics Anonymous. He helped so many people and even when he had a heart attack, they were having meetings in his intensive care room, you know? He helped a lot of people. At his funeral, some of these people came and said he literally saved their life, you know? So in that way, he did a lot of good, honestly.
9:33 Speaker 02 I wish that the queer narrative wasn't always taking tragedy and trying to spin it to gold. Jonathan had a tough life, but he made meaning out of it. And he had his time with Daryl. Did he have any other partners after Daryl passed?
9:49 Speaker 05 Um, nothing serious, no. No, not really. I just don't think that there was any, um, no, nothing.
10:03 Speaker 02 Oh, man.
10:06 Speaker 05 Mm-hmm. I think that Daryl was kind of the love of his life, you know?
10:13 Speaker 02 Yeah.
10:14 Speaker 05 Uh-huh.
10:15 Speaker 02 Ah, all the losses that happened during the AIDS crisis.
10:20 Speaker 05 Yeah, oh, I hear ya.
10:27 Speaker 02 Well, this may not come as a shock to you, but based on our chat, Jeff decides I'm worthy. Okay, so it is Boxing Day, December 26th, 2020, and I have this big ol' cardboard box that has arrived from Jeff. Let's see if we can break into this.
10:58 Speaker 02 This box is filled to the brim with scripts. Some are bound, some are held together with paper clips, some are stuffed into big brown envelopes. "But Far Different" by Daryl D. Allen, comedy in two acts. The process of opening the box enchants me. Oh, man. "But Far Different," act one, scene one. I worked so hard for so long to piece together the tiniest scraps of Daryl's life, and suddenly I had this box filled with his words, filled with him. Well, here's a big ol' folder that says, "Mustang: The Vietnam Trilogy." It's like information overload.
11:38 Speaker 02 Ooh, we got another big envelope. A Shakespearean revel. I don't know how to describe what I felt in this moment. I pulled out script after script, title after title. "Fortune in B Minor," a compilation. There's one called "Riverside," seen as the interior of a back. "The Vietnam Trilogy, Part One: The Duality of Daffodilies." Later, I'll learn this play is actually called "The Duality of Daffodilies." But like, come on, seriously expect me to nail that pronunciation on a cold read? "Persephone Rising," in Dayton. They control Halloween. The end upside down and backwards. It's called Richard. Do you ever get the feeling the world is passing you by?
12:23 Speaker 02 Enter Metzo. Don't dance. Male and female Hamlet.
12:28 Speaker 02 Well, that's it, you guys. That's what we got in the box. A whole bunch of scripts, a lot of scripts, like five or, five or six or seven or eight. It's not eight different plays, you guys. It's 13 plays, 13, a prime number. I love prime numbers. What if I had never started this podcast? Would anyone have ever read any of these scripts again? I'm excited to read some of them myself and also share them with Janet. Signing out for now. We've got 13 scripts to get through. This is a dream for a little history dork like me. Hand it a box of scripts that haven't been read in decades? Well, I think it's been far too long since we had a research montage.
13:13 Speaker 02 Bring in the music, Matty.
13:17 Speaker 02 I spent about six months reading through the scripts. It's work, but it's also fun and I want to stretch it out to savor it. When I'm in the mood to spend some quality time with Daryl, I pull out a script with my coffee on a Sunday morning, or I take a script to a park and cozy up under a tree. Guys, some of these scripts are wild. There's one that's set inside a computer.
13:42 Speaker 06 Fourtran in B minor.
13:44 Speaker 02 Another follows a gay couple living in post-apocalyptic America.
13:48 Speaker 06 Where am I? What am I doing here? This place is horrid. It frightens me. Fear coddles me and terror chills like wind.
13:57 Speaker 02 One of the best parts about diving into these scripts is that each one provides a little window of insight into Daryl, into who he was. There's an absurd comedy set in small-town Kansas. The end. Upside down and backwards. In the play, a leprechaun handpicks one of the men in the town and decides that he'll give the man the secret to world peace. Oh, I can just picture it now. You are addressing the United Nations. What an ovation. But the man turns out to be too much of a, uh, complete dick to be willing to take the secret. A perfect example of the human race. Oh, you think you're so smart. Think you're...
14:41 Speaker 06 I have all the answers.
14:43 Speaker 02 I can't help but feel like this is a commentary on some of the insensitivity that Daryl faced in his hometown growing up. Then, there's a comedy of errors set in a cabin in California.
14:54 Speaker 06 But far different.
14:55 Speaker 02 In this play, the main character ends up professing his love to both a man and a woman.
15:01 Speaker 06 You two came in like a truckload of turkeys.
15:04 Speaker 02 It results in a hilarious threesome, but I can also hear Daryl explaining his bisexuality in his own words.
15:11 Speaker 06 And now I have to go back once again and face all of you. All the hazards and all the intrigues and all the games and all the evasions and half-truths and lies and the hurt and the joy of it all.
15:24 Speaker 02 Then, there's the prequel to Mustang. Mustang was part of a trilogy, and the first script.
15:31 Speaker 06 The Duality of Daffodil Dillies.
15:33 Speaker 02 proves to be just as dark and challenging as Mustang. There are also some stylized plays. A review of Shakespeare. It includes a monologue I remember performing in university. "Get thee to a nunnery. Why wouldst thou be a breeder of sinners? I am myself indifferent, honest, but yet I could accuse me of such things that it would be better my mother had not borne me." And another of Noel Coward. You've no idea what the tiniest little inferiority complex can do to people. But, out of all of the scripts, there's one that I find absolutely captivating. Persephone Rising. It was written in the 70s. Here I am, nearly 50 years later, and it's still resonating with me. I find myself laughing out loud in some sections.
16:17 Speaker 02 Don't you know that if you have a single handsome man of 21 years old in any office in San Francisco, that the odds are probably 100 to 1 that he's gay? In other sections, I get emotional. In all our life together, you've never allowed me to finish anything I've tried to say, and I so desperately need to now. When I finish reading Persephone Rising for the first time, I'm left with a strong feeling that this play should be shared with the world. And this gives me an idea, a big idea, on how to end this story. Suddenly, after years of work, after years of always digging deeper, always looking for more, I see the ending, clear as day.
17:01 Speaker 02 I give my producer, Matt, a call to explain what I'm thinking. Do you remember at the beginning of the Pandemic, when I became obsessed with playing Zelda Ocarina of Time.
17:14 Speaker 02 Yes, that's right. To explain the ending of this extremely serious, years-long heartfelt project of mine, we have to look to the greatest cultural object produced in the last century, nay, the last millennium, The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time. Okay, so at the beginning of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, you're playing the character of Link, and Link has to go around and he has to collect three magical artifacts, three parts of the Triforce. And when he puts those three artifacts, like, on their pedestal at the Temple of Time, it opens this gateway where he can move between the past and the present. And that's what I feel like we're doing with this project, because we started
17:56 Speaker 02 off, and Dan started it all, by giving us the first piece of the Triforce, which was like Daryl's script to Mustang and the letters. Triforce Part One, from Dan, the love letters and the script to Mustang 01. And then, we have gotten the box of materials from Jeff that has the other half of Daryl's scripts, which to me is the second part of the Triforce. Triforce Part Two, from Jonathan, his box of scripts. And the third part of the Triforce, to me, is the other half of the scripts, which Janet has with her in Sonoma, California. Triforce Part Three, Janet's half of the scripts. So, I want to take our two pieces of the Triforce to her piece of the Triforce.
18:41 Speaker 02 We're gonna unite the three parts of the Triforce. And I feel like that's going to open up the Temple of Time for us, and we're gonna be able to walk back and forth through the past and the present. Is that the nerdiest thing I've ever described? In real talk, though, this means we're going on a trip. We're going to the city where this whole love story started. What I'm trying to tell you is we're going to San Francisco, baby.
19:09 Speaker 02 We plan our trip to San Francisco. It takes some time for us to make the trip happen. It's still the middle of the pandemic, but eventually, we end up here.
19:21 Speaker 02 Okay, well, it is Sunday, May 29th, 2022, and I am currently in the Montreal Airport.
19:32 Speaker 02 We're going on a little trip.
19:34 Speaker 05 Good morning, everyone, from the flight deck, flight 2445, service to San Francisco.
19:41 Speaker 02 We're just cruising in the highway. We just landed. We're in a taxi cab. And we are headed to
19:51 Speaker 02 the Castro District, center of gay history. For our San Francisco trip, we've got a crew of three. Me, you already know me, and my producer, Matthew Carriatsemary, who you met back in Kansas. He's waiting for us at the hotel. But I also brought along our sound editor. And in the taxi with me,
20:13 Speaker 02 the other Matt. Matthew Rogers. Matthew has done most of our sound editing and has written almost all the music you've heard in the whole series. He's coming to San Francisco to help out. And just to have some gay fun. Oh, look at that hot man. Oh, they're everywhere. There's hot men everywhere. Onto the hotel to meet up with Matt Kay. Hi. Hi.
20:36 Speaker 05 Welcome to Bex's Motor Lodge.
20:38 Speaker 02 Reddit will later tell me that Bex has been a gay cruising destination for decades. Seems like the right spot for our trip into Daryl's past. With the three of us united, we head off to grab a burrito and plan our next few days. Okay, Matts, um, do you remember the theme, the San Francisco theme, that you wrote for the very first episode? Da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da. Da, da, da. That one, right? Yeah. I'm just creating our musical transition. Oh, and then it's gonna, like, end it in? I love that.
21:22 Speaker 02 Welcome to the final chapter, San Francisco.
21:34 Speaker 02 Hello, world.
21:37 Speaker 02 It's Monday morning. We're in our hotel in the Castro district in San Francisco, City of Angels. And I'm a morning person, so I'm up and raring and ready to go.
21:54 Speaker 02 That's the sound of Matt turning over in bed. Matt! No. Matt, it's time. No. Matt. Time for what? Matt, get up. Why? We're going to go explore gay history. Okay. What are we doing today? We're gonna go walk around San Francisco, walk around Castro. Are you gonna go now? Nope.
22:18 Speaker 02 Well, someday soon, we're gonna start this little journey.
22:23 Speaker 02 After rousing Matt with some coffee, we're ready to start. So Dane, where are we going? Okay, so I thought for a while about where we would start off our San Francisco gay walking tour. And here, we're just gonna head out of our hotel, start kicking off our day here. I went back into the letters that Daryl had sent to Dan, and I found a passage that said, "Boy, am I ever glad the two of us decided to go to the Nines that evening."
22:48 Speaker 06 "Boy, am I ever glad the two of us decided to go to the Nines that evening. It must be fate, especially..."
22:55 Speaker 02 Daryl and Dan met at this French restaurant in San Francisco called The Nines. The Nines has been closed for a couple decades, but we managed to find the intersection, the exact cross street, where this restaurant used to be. So we're gonna start there, exactly where Daryl and Dan faithfully met 43 years ago.
23:10 Speaker 06 "I love you and measure each day by thoughts of you. I'll write more tomorrow."
23:16 Speaker 02 Uh, I think our Uber's about to drop us off at the corner of Powell Street and Broadway, which is the intersection where the Nines used to be. So, we're blown up here. Yeah, this is perfect. Thank you. You're wonderful. Thank you so much. Hey, why don't we talk into a nook here out of the wind a little bit? Okay, so we are on Powell between Broadway and Vallejo. This is right where the Nines used to be.
23:45 Speaker 06 Can you describe what the building looks like?
23:48 Speaker 02 It's one of these typical San Francisco apartments that has the fire escape on the outside. That it just reminds me of like a Tennessee Williams play. Almost exactly forty-three years ago, Dan was waiting for a table for himself. Daryl was behind him in line. Daryl asked to join Dan at his table and
24:09 Speaker 02 thus begins our entire story.
24:11 Speaker 06 My dearest Danny, I love you.
24:14 Speaker 02 Part of me wanted to come here just to talk about these weird little moments in our lives. Like completely random moments that you would never think would completely reshape your life, but then they do.
24:25 Speaker 06 It makes me feel so good to talk with you, receive your letters and know that a very wonderful man loves me.
24:31 Speaker 02 Like what if Dan had been ten minutes later? What if Daryl had been ten minutes later? What if Daryl had seen a friend on his way over? Like what if any of these things had happened that had thrown off that sequence of events? Like Dan and Daryl never would have met. Dan never would have dated him, never would have become close to him, never would have gotten the script, never would have given it to me.
24:49 Speaker 06 That still blows my mind away. It's amazing how one week can completely change one's life and dreams.
24:56 Speaker 02 But then the same with me, you know? I met Dan at this gay bar in Montreal five years ago and you know, what if I hadn't gone to the Pride Parade that year? I considered not going. It's just all these little moments that I don't know if I believe in fate, but they do add up in a bit of a fateful way.
25:14 Speaker 06 I think of you so very, very much. I love you, Daryl.
25:19 Speaker 02 This is the other interesting thing coming back forty-three years later is things change. Everything changes, you know? Like there's, the restaurant is not here anymore. We're in, like it's We're in physically the exact location where they met 43 years ago. Like, I can picture it in my head, but the building's gone, the people are gone. Like, everything has changed. This is what I wanted to explore in San Francisco. How much has changed? And how much has stayed the same? When we open up the Temple of Time and walk between the past and the present, what's different and what stood the test of time? We start by regrouping at the hotel. Okay, so, right now, it's Monday, early afternoon.
26:02 Speaker 02 We are in our hotel in the Castro district in San Francisco, the city of love. The plan for the day is to go track down some locations that were meaningful to Daryl while he was living here. And I found these hand-drawn maps that Daryl made for Dan back in 1979. He drew this map of the Castro district. So our plan for today is to trace Daryl's steps, all of the locations. He has all these bars marked on these maps. We're gonna trace his steps of where he used to hang out in San Francisco and see if any of these establishments still exist. So Dane, we've made it to Castro district. What are we gonna do here? Yeah, we're here in the Castro.
26:45 Speaker 02 The Castro is like a very famous gay neighborhood in San Francisco, in like all of US gay history. It's the neighborhood where Harvey Milk kinda came to fame as like the first openly gay elected official in California. But it's also where Daryl lived, and this is the time when he was really exploring sex and relationships with men, kind of leaning into that side of his bisexuality. So we have this hand-drawn map he put together from 1979 that charts out 20 of his favorite places in the Castro. They're all in kind of a one-block radius. So we're starting at the corner of Market and 16th, and we're gonna walk around this one-block radius and just kinda see if we can feel what it was like for Daryl, see if we can imagine the paths that he walked while he was living in the Castro.
27:29 Speaker 02 So, let's get a little... Get a little gay. Yeah? We're in the Castro, it's gay. Who can count how many pride flags we see? One, two, three, four. Daryl's map of the Castro lists bars, restaurants, cafes, brunch spots. It's a little roadmap to 1979, and we're ready to follow it. It's super cute. Very gay. Hello.
27:57 Speaker 02 Oh my god, there's so many hot people. Oh, I think you might have heard me say that.
28:07 Speaker 02 Um, what's it feel like to be here? I just feel like, kind of at home and like a little sense of like relief and like a little weight off my shoulders. I, every time I see like a, two men walking in the street, holding hands, like, it just makes me happy. And it's interesting to think about how it's been kind of the place for decades, you know? We start by looking for a bar called Men's Room. Let's see, we're at the corner of 18th and Noe So, right, what's that bar called?
28:45 Speaker 02 Last Call, Last Call Bar. The bartender tells us that the Last Call Bar used to be the Men's Room. This is a bar where Daryl used to drink. But it has been like a staple of the Castro. It's been, it's been a local hangout for as long as I remember, like, late into like the 80s, 90s, yeah. I want to thank the bartender for sharing his story with us. Do you want a tequila shot?
29:11 Speaker 05 I'm not pretty on tequila.
29:14 Speaker 02 Neither are we.
29:17 Speaker 05 You know, it's cute, it's cute when you're your age, it's not cute when you're my age.
29:23 Speaker 02 Now, look, you might judge us for doing tequila shots on our very professional research trip, but I know that Daryl would not have judged. Although, our walking tour is turning into a tiny bit of a bar hop and it's starting to show in the recordings. Here's my thoughts on The Shining, make sure you're rolling for this. Drunk Me has very strong opinions about Stephen King. I think that the book of The Shining is amazing and Stephen King wrote it beautifully. We're having a little bit of fun at the Castro. We find that some spots are gone, but some are still here. We find number 14 on Daryl's map, Moby Dick. And he describes it as a young stud bar. We find number four. Cove Cafe. A breakfast spot. Number 12 is still around too, the Sausage Factory.
30:07 Speaker 02 The Sausage Factory is a great name for a gay bar, but it's an even better name for a Pizzeria.
30:18 Speaker 02 I kinda want an entire pizza, but we can't really take that break right now. We're closing in on the last spots on Daryl's map. There's one bar we saved for the end. It's a famous one, Twin Peaks Tavern. And it's special. Janet, Daryl's ex-wife, had told us we could use Twin Peaks to find something important. We're here. We're at Castro and Market, very busy intersection. We're right in front of the Twin Peaks Tavern, which was the last item on the map that we had to visit. We saved it for the end because we knew that it was still gonna be here. The Twin Peaks is kind of a famous bar here.
30:58 Speaker 02 And we came here at the end because Janet gave us an exercise we were supposed to do at the Twin Peaks. She wrote this down for us, so let me pull it up here. "When you are in the Castro, stand in front of the Twin Peaks Tavern. Look across Market Street and up Castro. On the right, past an existing parking garage, should be a green Victorian house with three levels of windows, which I think is right there." That's the building Daryl lived in when he first moved to San Francisco on his own at the end of 1973.
31:39 Speaker 02 His apartment was the windows on the top floor left. So we came here. We wanted to experience what this was like for Daryl and kind of imagine his life here in the 70s and 80s. And I feel like being right here in this spot, this kind of noisy and sometimes imperfect spot, we can actually start to do that. Like, I can imagine him up there in his apartment, having a nightcap, typing out a play on his typewriter. I can look across the street and see the cove where we went for breakfast. And it's the same place where Daryl used to go for breakfast. And I can imagine him having one of those stacks of pancakes that we had. I can imagine him, you know, maybe traipsing up the road,
32:23 Speaker 02 a little drunk, arm around the shoulders of some guy who he's taking back to his place to have some fun with. I don't know, I can just start to imagine the paths of Daryl's life here. And I did a little bit of math and I figured out that since Daryl and Dan met here in 1979, there have been about 15,000 days that have passed. And for me, it's fascinating to stand here and just think about all the paths that all of the different queer people have walked on this street. Not just Daryl, not just Daryl going to a bar, going for breakfast, or going back to his place, or typing out a play at a cafe. It's all of the queer people who've walked these streets
33:07 Speaker 02 and had meaningful moments in their lives.
33:13 Speaker 02 I don't know, I've worked on this project for five years and it's taken up a lot of my life. And a part of me always wonders, you know, if Daryl was here, what would he say? And I think he would say, you know, "Dane, you've spent so much time making meaning out of my life and trying to make meaning out of other queer people's lives.
33:37 Speaker 02 What do you want to do with your life? What are your next 15,000 days gonna look like? What are the paths that you're gonna walk?" And I don't know the answer to that question. I don't think there's a super nice way to tie this all up.
33:54 Speaker 02 I'm just gonna go out and try to, you know, maybe fall in love, maybe make some art. But for right now, I think what all of us are gonna do is go into Twin Peaks and have a couple of drinks, maybe too many drinks in Daryl's name, and try to imagine what it was like in there for him, having shots, having beers. We head into Twin Peaks. I have far too many martinis, extra dirty with extra olives because I love sodium. Next up on our trip to San Francisco, we unite the tri-force. We're gonna meet Janet in person. And that's coming up right after this break. See you on the other side.
34:44 Speaker 00 Cheers to fall savings at Whole Foods Market, home of higher ingredient standards. This Halloween, share chocolates and candies made without that spooky high fructose corn syrup. Throwing a party? Make it easy with a Berry Chantilly Cake. Ready to cook pizza? No antibiotics ever chicken wings. And sushi made fresh daily. Fall gatherings never tasted better. Save through November 3rd at Whole Foods Market.
35:11 Speaker 04 Hi, I just had to tell you that I think your podcast has changed my life.
35:18 Speaker 03 Season one of Sold a Story hit a nerve. It was about teaching kids to read. We have gotten this wrong in New York and all across the nation. Now we're back with a new season. This time, we go beyond reading.
35:30 Speaker 04 I've literally been told by my district that I should not be teaching math. I should be facilitating math.
35:37 Speaker 03 I'm Emily Hanford. Go to your podcast app and follow Sold a Story.
35:43 Speaker 02 Recording. This is take 61. Hey, everyone. Hello, hello, hello. We are currently driving.
35:54 Speaker 02 We are driving out of San Francisco. We're going about an hour north of the city to Sonoma. Today is the day that we are meeting Janet in person. Never met Janet in person before, so that's exciting. And we're going to be doing an interview, a Skype call with Janet and Dan. And Janet and Dan, despite both knowing Daryl very well, they've never met each other before. They've never talked to each other before. So we're going to have that conversation and see what comes of it.
36:23 Speaker 02 Hurrah, baby. We drive about an hour north of San Francisco, into the small town of Sonoma, down a few small-town streets, until...
36:38 Speaker 02 Hello.
36:40 Speaker 02 Hello.
36:41 Speaker 03 Hi there. Oh, it's a mask. Nice to meet you, Mask.
36:44 Speaker 02 It's me, a mask.
36:46 Speaker 03 My glasses are fogging up. Come in.
36:48 Speaker 02 Okay, how are you?
36:49 Speaker 03 I'm good. I'm good.
36:51 Speaker 02 Hello.
36:52 Speaker 03 It's a person.
36:53 Speaker 02 You're real.
36:54 Speaker 03 I know.
36:55 Speaker 02 You're plush. This is amazing. I want to hug you.
36:57 Speaker 03 I want to hug you too, but...
36:59 Speaker 02 It's okay. Next time.
37:00 Speaker 03 Hi, guys.
37:01 Speaker 02 Next life.
37:02 Speaker 03 Matt and Matt.
37:03 Speaker 02 Matt and Matt. This is Matt. This is, uh, also Matt. After two and a half years of friendship, finally, Janet and I get to meet in person. And Janet calls it for what it is.
37:15 Speaker 03 It's a little awkward. Okay, come on in. Um, I don't know, you know...
37:19 Speaker 02 It is a little awkward.
37:21 Speaker 03 Yeah.
37:22 Speaker 02 There's a lot of expectation baked into this moment. Plus, we're trying to be COVID cautious. Janet's inner 70s with some pre-existing health conditions. So, we're all wearing masks and we choose not to hug or shake hands or anything, but after a few minutes, we all start to settle and things start to feel more comfortable. Some might say too comfortable. Should I take off my hat, let the mullet out?
37:47 Speaker 02 I'm trying to grow a mullet right now. They're in again. Did you know that?
37:50 Speaker 03 I was gonna ask you why.
37:52 Speaker 02 They're in. You're gonna start seeing them everywhere.
37:55 Speaker 03 Well, you know, the thing is, when they were in the first time?
37:59 Speaker 02 Yeah?
37:59 Speaker 03 I'm sorry, they were mullets. And they're still mullets.
38:03 Speaker 02 No, give me a man with a mullet and a mustache. That's all that I need. Okay, so we're having our first fight, which is a really great way to start off this interview. Uh, I'm gonna call Dan now. I get ready to call Dan, who's waiting for us in his apartment in Montreal. Now, just before we get into this interview, just a heads up. We decided to leave all the windows open during the interview. This was for increased air circulation to reduce any COVID risk. But it means you can sometimes hear traffic and the occasional wind chimes from the outside. Janet, before we do this, what do you want out of this interview?
38:39 Speaker 03 Uh, to give you what you need to tie it off. I've already gotten what I need.
38:45 Speaker 02 Hmm. After a few minutes, we're all set up and ready to go. Janet, for the very first time, is about to chat with Daryl's ex-boyfriend, Dan Wiley, the man who gave me Daryl's scripts in the first place. The man without whom this project would never have happened.
39:02 Speaker 03 Hi, Dan.
39:04 Speaker 02 Hi Janet, pleased to meet you.
39:06 Speaker 03 Pleased to meet you. I was trying to remember whether we ever met and I don't think we did.
39:11 Speaker 02 No, we've never met. Daryl, I remember him talking a lot about you.
39:17 Speaker 03 Mm-hmm.
39:18 Speaker 02 And always with love. It was always from a place of love. And as Daryl and I got to know each other better, I heard a little bit more about your story and how you got together and how you might have always been together had he not been a bisexual man. Very pleased to meet you.
39:37 Speaker 03 Pleased to meet you too.
39:38 Speaker 02 Very, very emotional for me.
39:41 Speaker 03 It's hard for me to call you Dan because Daryl always called you Danny.
39:47 Speaker 03 And, and I heard a lot about you too. So, um, so whenever I say something to Dane, I say, "How's Danny?" Because that's the way I think of you.
39:58 Speaker 02 For me, it's funny to see two people who I know so well, who I associate with Daryl, meeting each other for the first time.
40:06 Speaker 03 It's hard to put a single descriptor on an emotion at a time like this. It's happy, but it's also sad. And it's also, what's the word for what might have been?
40:25 Speaker 03 I'm thinking about what, what a person could have done had that person not died.
40:31 Speaker 02 Completely agree with that. I think, and not all, but I think some good people die far too young. And that they had a lot more to give to the world and to us. And I know Daryl was extremely sick towards the end. And he was the type of person though that would, was always so kind that he was most probably taking care of Jonathan just as much as Jonathan was taking care of him in the sense of trying to make sure he would be okay after he was gone.
41:03 Speaker 03 He takes care of everybody. I had a dream a month after he died, where he was sitting at a table with my brother and Jonathan and me at a table in the Twin Peaks Tavern in San Francisco. But we were drinking coffee, believe it or not. And... It was as clear, I mean, it was as clear as if I had lived it. And he just said to us, all three of us, he said, I'll always be with you. I'll always be with you.
41:35 Speaker 03 So he has been.
41:38 Speaker 05 It's a beautiful memory.
41:39 Speaker 03 Mm hmm.
41:40 Speaker 02 I remember when I was back home in Nova Scotia in Truro during the pandemic, living with my parents and caring for my grandmother, who had been moved into palliative care. I remember it was Christmas Eve and I was walking home up a hill. And I was like so, it was like the most depressing Christmas Eve of my life. Like I'd spent the most of the day at my grandmother's, just caring for her while she was quite ill. And then my mom came in and did a shift. So I was walking back to my parents' place and I was just so sad. And I like sat on this rock at this lookout that looks out over the valley in Truro. And I was just like crying.
42:22 Speaker 02 And at that moment, I kind of felt this presence. And I like looked behind me, there was no one there, but I felt like it was Daryl there, just putting a hand on my shoulder and saying, you can get through this. It's okay. You're here, you're doing the right thing. And there have been a few moments throughout this project where I've just felt a bit of a presence. And I don't know if I fully believe in that, but you know.
42:51 Speaker 03 Well, I do.
42:54 Speaker 05 I know Daryl did.
42:55 Speaker 03 Mm hmm. So we'll hold the belief until you get there.
42:59 Speaker 02 I, I mean, I'm much, I'm much closer to being there now than I was at the start of this project.
43:04 Speaker 05 Can you tell me a little bit about what Daryl shared about me to you?
43:10 Speaker 03 Um, let me think.
43:14 Speaker 03 Well, he, I remember that he raved about you. He just thought you were the best thing since sliced bread.
43:23 Speaker 03 And it was always Danny, it wasn't Dan. And I don't, what I don't remember is any specifics about your life. I just remember that he thought you were great and attractive and talented. And he said, "Well, you were much younger than he was, but what did that matter?" And that, truly, I wish I had more memories, but that's about what I have. But it was like, I knew this wasn't just a passing fancy. It was important. And I got that.
43:57 Speaker 06 We became family, even after we, I mean, I know that I hurt Daryl. And being young is not necessarily an excuse for how you handle a breakup, but...
44:09 Speaker 03 But it's an explanation. It may not be an excuse, but it is an explanation.
44:14 Speaker 06 Yes.
44:15 Speaker 03 Because I hurt him too at times, and it was, I was young.
44:20 Speaker 06 But I've always been thankful that he was able to forgive me. And we became a family. Richard and Jonathan and me and Daryl spent some wonderful, wonderful times together.
44:34 Speaker 02 What do you two think he would want his legacy to be? That's what we're exploring with this project.
44:46 Speaker 03 Support for younger playwrights. Especially, I don't want to categorize, but especially playwrights that might have a few strikes against them. Meaning they're a minority, or they happen to be queer, or they're a woman even. I don't know. But first of all, young playwrights. And second of all, those who need a leg up.
45:18 Speaker 02 Yeah. Yeah, I think we've got that. He wrote something very similar in a letter that you gave to me as well. But I'm curious if you two have any, any lessons, any messages? In speaking to the younger generations, what do you want us to share through this project?
45:45 Speaker 03 Try not to make the same mistakes we made.
45:49 Speaker 03 Whatever those are.
45:57 Speaker 06 It took Daryl a while, but he found his true self.
46:05 Speaker 06 And he lived his truth to the fullest. And I think he would want young people
46:14 Speaker 06 to not have to go through some of the hurts that he had to go through in order to find his true self.
46:26 Speaker 02 Now that Janet and Dan have had a chance to get to know each other and to share some thoughts and memories of Daryl, it's time to do the thing we came to San Francisco to do. It's time to unite all three pieces of the Triforce. Since the beginning of this podcast series, I've always said that Daryl wanted his plays to be produced, to be staged.
46:46 Speaker 03 His line always was, "Plays are written to be played."
46:50 Speaker 02 Hmm, to be played.
46:51 Speaker 03 Played.
46:52 Speaker 02 I like that. After years of work, I've managed to collect all of Daryl's plays. With the copies from Dan, Janet, and Jonathan, we have the scripts for all Daryl's work. Before traveling to San Francisco, I shared the scripts with Dan and Janet. I've scanned those and uploaded them to a drive that we all share. All three of us have taken a few weeks to read through all of Daryl's scripts and decide on one or two scripts that we think could work if they were staged, if they were played today. And we're talking about Daryl's legacy. Maybe we can end off the podcast by seeing if there are any artistic directors out there listening who might be interested in putting one of these plays on stage.
47:37 Speaker 03 Seems a very good idea.
47:41 Speaker 02 Dan, Janet, and I pretty easily agree on two scripts that stand out in Daryl's work. I told you, both of you in advance, there was one play that I absolutely loved that I think absolutely needs to be staged. So maybe we start there. And that play is "Persephone Rising." I quoted- Persephone Rising at the beginning of this episode. The play follows. Two women in San Francisco who live in a one-bedroom apartment side by side. The play is a small, two-person cast. It's character-driven, revolving around the relationships between the two women. One of the women is in her mid-20s, the other is in her mid-30s, and they create this
48:26 Speaker 02 sort of mentorship friendship with some possible erotic undertones. It's a simple and beautiful story.
48:35 Speaker 03 I agree about Persephone. Unfortunately, a lot of what's described, the women going through, hasn't changed significantly. Although it's dated in some ways, and I think it ought to be staged in the time it was written.
48:49 Speaker 02 The play is set in the 1970s. It was Daryl's present day, but now it feels like a period piece.
48:55 Speaker 06 The two plays that I can remember Daryl always working on was Mustang and Persephone.
49:01 Speaker 02 Here, Dan brings up the other play we selected. Mustang Zero One. It's an obvious choice, but a challenging one.
49:08 Speaker 06 Mustang is a very complicated play with technical issues that... I am not an artist of any... I can't even draw a stick man, so from an artistic perspective, don't ask me how you could stage a play like Mustang.
49:26 Speaker 02 Mustang Zero One is supposed to have more than 20 characters. Staging issues aside, I'm not sure how any theater company in this day and age could afford to pay 20 actors to be in a play. I'm intrigued by Mustang, by the possibility of producing it. For me, the artistic side of me would want to do probably a staged reading, or just a read-through, maybe workshop with some actors. Mustang would likely need to be workshopped and edited before it could be ready for production.
49:55 Speaker 03 It depends on what you're... How you're intending to go about it? Yeah. Putting it out there.
50:01 Speaker 02 Let's think about Mustang as existing as a workshop. These are the two plays we've selected. Persephone Rising and Mustang Zero One. Persephone is ready for production today, but Mustang would likely need to go through a workshop phase. And this, listeners, is where you come in. Do you work for a theater company? Do you know an artistic director or an actor or someone involved in the theater scene? This is the point where you have the chance to shape the story. We are looking for artistic directors and theater companies who might be interested in staging Persephone and Mustang. If you're interested, send us an email at [email protected] .
50:45 Speaker 02 It's also in the show notes and on our website, resurrectionpodcast.com. And tell us about yourself, your theater connection and your interest in Daryl's work. We don't know what'll happen, but we think there's a chance we could get Daryl's work up on stage in the future. Plays, after all, are meant to be played.
51:07 Speaker 03 I think we were all just waiting to get organized for Dane to come along. And because we needed a jumpstart of energy and focus. And then I wondered, where have you been?
51:23 Speaker 02 Well, thank you. I'm glad that my hyper-focused, obsessive personality can-
51:28 Speaker 03 That's it. That's what we needed.
51:29 Speaker 02 Can help. Yeah, well, you know, I love disassociating from my regular life through projects. Before I wrap up with Dan and Janet, I have one final question. What do you think Daryl would say to all of us if he was here with us in this moment? Which he may be. But if you had to give voice to him?
51:58 Speaker 03 I'm so proud of you. And keep doing what you're doing. All the way through, it's been one foot in front of the other.
52:10 Speaker 06 Yeah.
52:13 Speaker 03 And then he'd say, shall I go make some drinks?
52:15 Speaker 06 From my perspective, though, I think it's already been said, but this was all meant to happen. It was preordained. Daryl had to be somehow exposed to the world in one way or the other, whether this podcast or one of his plays. He needs that to be told. He needs a story to be told.
52:38 Speaker 02 Now that we've united the Triforce and brought Dan and Janet together for the first time, it's time for one final stop on our trip to San Francisco. We pack up and head out of Janet's, but Dan and Janet exchanged contact information. And you'll be happy to know, they've been in contact since the interview. No need for me as an interlocutor. And me and my two Matthews get in the car and drive to our final destination.
53:08 Speaker 02 Hello. Hello. Hi. Okay, Matt. Thank you so much. Are you Roddy? Yes, I'm Roddy. Great. Nice to meet you. Dave. Nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. And this is Matt. Matt. And Matt. Matt. Can I maybe start by just having you say your name and like what you're involved in? Sure. Roddy Williams. I'm the Quilt Operations Manager. I've been with it for 20 years. This is Gert.
53:31 Speaker 04 Yeah, my name's Gert McMullin, and I've been with the quilt since 1987.
53:35 Speaker 02 We are in San Leandro, meeting with Roddy and Gert, who both work for the AIDS Memorial Quilt, which has been happening since 1987.
53:45 Speaker 04 The AIDS quilt was started as an activist thing. It was not as a memorial, really. It was about that thousandth person had died in San Francisco and Cleve decided he was going to have a march.
53:54 Speaker 02 Cleve Jones is an AIDS activist. He's the one who first conceived of the AIDS Memorial Quilt. In 1985, during a march, Cleve had people write the names of loved ones on signs, loved ones who were lost to AIDS-related causes.
54:08 Speaker 06 And so we all marched down to the federal building, plastered up these names all over the federal building. And he thought it looked like a quilt. So then about a year later, he started the quilt. But it was done purely as an activist thing.
54:21 Speaker 02 The Names Project AIDS Memorial Quilt, or AIDS Quilt, commemorates those who've died from AIDS-related causes. The quilt is made of tens of thousands of panels honoring the dead. Each panel is three feet by six feet.
54:37 Speaker 06 They're three foot by six foot because that's the size of a grave. And we were laying down our dead in front of the White House for them to take action. And we thought we'd saved the world. And we had no plans of continuing afterwards. We were just gonna go there, save the world, and be done with it.
54:51 Speaker 02 Since its conception, though, the AIDS Quilt has taken on greater meaning.
54:55 Speaker 06 It's still an activist thing. It's many things. That's a thing. But it's like, you know, we are about anger and being fed up and stuff like that. But it is a memorial to it. And it's a memorial for the people that have been left behind in many ways. It's, that's who we help and who, you know, those panels are a reflection of the person that died. But they're also a big reflection of the person that's alive, that made it.
55:19 Speaker 02 The AIDS Quilt is stored in a warehouse. It's massive, weighs about 54 tons. Because the quilt is so large, the panels are folded and stored on big, multi-level shelves. They're catalogued, like in a library. So anyone who wants to visit and see their loved one's panel simply has to make a request to come in.
55:37 Speaker 06 That's 50, almost 50, not quite, 50,000 panels and 105,000 names on there.
55:42 Speaker 02 On occasion, parts of the quilt are displayed publicly. But we're here for a specific reason. We're here because Daryl has a panel on the quilt. Actually, he has two panels. One was created and submitted by Jonathan Dan and his group of friends. Unknowingly, Janet created another panel. Gert and Roddy have pulled the two panels from the catalog for us to take a look at.
56:09 Speaker 06 There's some space on the ground to be able to open again. And I only feature that we do normally hang them, but we can, we'll open up the ones, the two that you requested. That's amazing. Yeah.
56:19 Speaker 02 On this block, we have the... Panel that was put together by Dan, I believe Jonathan as well. They've put together this square with a, it's like a light blue square, a little bit of a silver trim, some leaves on it, and then they've put a script onto the panel. And there's a quote from Mustang 01 on the panel. "We cry for the living, not for the dead, for us who remain. The dead are all right, they've lived and it's now behind them. We cry for ourselves and for our hurt, and we remember all those times we failed to reach out, and failed to speak, and failed to forgive."
57:05 Speaker 02 The second panel, from Janet, is patchwork. It's made from a series of small fabric squares, blues, purples, yellows. I'd describe it in more detail, but I don't need to. Because you've been looking at it this whole time. The cover art for this podcast uses a picture of this panel that we took when we were visiting The Quilt. The panel Janet made features little patches highlighting different parts of Daryl's personality. Hallroom dancer, producer-performer, Irishman, traveler-outdoorsman, playwright, graduate, US Air Force.
57:45 Speaker 02 Janet also decided to include a quote from one of Daryl's plays on the panel. Even though Janet and Dan only met for the first time today, it feels like their souls touched years ago when they made these two panels. It's the same quote. They both put the same quote on their panel. "We cry for the living, not for the dead." This is like a little bit overwhelming. All 50,000 of these squares are a person who had just as full a life as Daryl did. And we spent years digging into Daryl's story and, you know, look, there's a square just above him. Michael Accacello.
58:30 Speaker 02 A square below him for, well, we've got, look, a memorial for a bunch of, there's probably 50 names on this square. Bridges Memorial for Boston.
58:49 Speaker 02 Standing in a warehouse filled with names and panels, I felt a pulsing, an energy, from all those lives, all those people lost. It was overwhelming. Then, in the corner of the room, I spot one panel that hasn't been sewn into the quilt. It's hanging, alone on a wall. It says, "The Last One." I ask Gert what it is, why it's alone on the side.
59:14 Speaker 06 This says, "When the last one is named, we will begin to heal."
59:18 Speaker 02 There's a note attached to this panel, too. A sheet of paper with a message written on it. Gert tells us she's the one who wrote the note, and she agrees to read it for us.
59:28 Speaker 06 I sent this to the board. Because the other evening, I was going through my things-to-do box. This was in it. It had been for over 10 years. That was a long time ago, in 1989, just before the '88 tour. A man came into the workshop. The Market Street just submitted a panel. Jack Castor and I asked if we could wait until, and hold on to it. It would be a day we would all share. I'll start crying. So it would be the last one sewn in.
59:56 Speaker 02 This panel will be the very last one sewn into the AIDS quilt.
1:00:00 Speaker 06 What could be more wonderful than to sew the one in with all you had given, all you had for the quilt, with those who had lost so many friends? The panel maker agreed, and the panel was set aside. I've never seen that man again. I often wonder what happened to him. Since that day, everyone who knew of the "Last One" panel has died. They will not know the joy of sewing it in. I sometimes wonder if I will. So I share the story with you. Stories are not much if you're the only one telling them. So this is our reminder of what we do and what we're here for. To sew the last one in and be done with this. It is a dream. It is all of our dream.
1:00:47 Speaker 02 For a long time, I didn't know how to end this series. After five years and countless hours, I feel I've done Daryl justice. I've shared his art and I've shared his life with all of you. So this last part, it's not for you. It's for me and for Daryl. It's my way of saying goodbye. This story started with Daryl's letters. I thought I could end it the same way. First, I asked Dan and Janet to each write me a letter from Daryl's perspective of what he'd want to say here at the end. Dan finished his letter first. He wrote it from the perspective of Daryl,
1:01:30 Speaker 02 as if Daryl had never gotten sick, never died, as if AIDS had never happened and Daryl was still alive today.
1:01:38 Speaker 06 2023. Wow. What a long way the queer community has come over my 84 years. Who would have thought? I now live with two partners, Julie and Paul. It's been 20 years, but all three of us decided to form our new family. We are in a non-monogamous, polyamorous relationship, and that is great because I love to flirt with whomever catches my eye. I am thrilled that Dane took on the task of helping me spread the word about my work. I continue to write plays about my lived experiences, the good, the bad, and the ugly, but I dwell more about the good these days because I have lived my life to the fullest. I have met and joined in relationships
1:02:23 Speaker 06 with many different men and women over the course of my life, and I feel blessed to have shared those times with them. I have traveled the world and am thankful for them. Well, I am off to visit Janet and head off to the winery for our afternoon glass and a chat. I am so thankful that our relationship has evolved into best friends. I love Janet so much. Much love, Daryl.
1:02:48 Speaker 02 Next, a letter from Daryl, written by Janet.
1:02:56 Speaker 06 Dear Dane, I chose to write this as if I have been on a long journey, having left my work, the plays, behind me. To a certain extent, that is exactly what I have done. I'm just now dropping back in to remind myself of what I left and to comment on how your project evolved and came together. First, Dane, I think that you and I are cut from the same cloth. We are, of course, separate and unique individuals, but we see the world in many similar ways. We see both the light and the dark, and we struggle to balance them. I couldn't have imagined a more appropriate person to bring this project into being.
1:03:40 Speaker 06 You and the project brought together people I loved, who were important in the life I lived here. I appreciated the difference in their perspectives and in the areas where their perceptions of me seemed to agree. I appreciated that you took the time to draw out what was unique from each of them. And I treasured the way you wove my life together with my work, those plays that meant so much to me, that came from my heart, my soul, and my mind. If those plays and my life speak to others, creatively or personally or both, then you and I have done our jobs. As I thought through the ideas I would write to you in this letter, I began to wonder, what else could I say to you?
1:04:23 Speaker 06 Not about the project so much as about you and your life and your dreams. I realized I would want to thank you for your hard work, for persevering when things didn't fall easily into place, and for your unstoppable curiosity that propelled everything along. But most importantly, I would hope that having completed this project, you will now focus on your own needs, both creatively and personally. Relatively speaking, we have so little time in this life to bring ideas to fruition before we move on. I wish for you the time to do all the things that unfold in your active fertile imagination. And I'll enjoy watching how you do this. With many thanks and much love,
1:05:06 Speaker 06 Daryl.
1:05:08 Speaker 02 Now, the last goodbye. A letter from me to Daryl.
1:05:15 Speaker 02 Dear Daryl, It's strange to be saying goodbye to you now, after all these years. Firstly, Fuck you. I had no idea it would take five years for me to put your whole life together. Five years! That's a long time, man.
1:05:33 Speaker 02 But, It's been worth it.
1:05:36 Speaker 02 I hope you're happy with how I represented you. I hope you feel good about what we've done with your plays. When I started this project years ago, I struggled with this darkness inside me. And, if I'm being honest, I still do. I wanted to learn to love the way that you did. Full force, full commitment, no fear. Well, I'm happy to tell you that you have taught me that over the past few years. I was always afraid in relationships. I would always run away, put up walls when things got vulnerable or difficult. But I learned from you the value of pushing through that.
1:06:19 Speaker 02 I've been dating a man. It's been nearly a year now. I know, that's a long time for me.
1:06:27 Speaker 02 And I love him, a lot. It's not always perfect. I'm not always perfect. But when things get hard, I don't run away. Think about what you would do, and I face the challenges, head-on.
1:06:44 Speaker 02 I don't know what'll happen in the long term, but I love this guy. And, in a lot of ways, I think you showed me how to do that. You taught me how to love, taught me how to be an artist. You taught me to value every single day I get in this fucked-up, messy, beautiful gay life.
1:07:06 Speaker 02 So now it's time to put down the microphone, close my laptop, and get out there in the world. It's time for me to go live.
1:07:16 Speaker 02 Thanks, for everything.
1:07:19 Speaker 02 Dane.
1:07:40 Speaker 02 Thank you so much for listening to our series on Daryl Allen. If you've enjoyed the show, please tell some friends. It helps a ton. Matthew Rogers is our editor and sound designer and wrote all of the original music in today's episode, except for the acoustic guitar, which came from Ethan Soil. Davide Kietze is the voice of Daryl's letters and scripts. Additional voice acting by Renee Hodgins and Stephen Tighe. Hannah Sung is our executive producer. Our outro track is called "Easy to Love," written for us by Clara Jones. Matthew Karyatsenary is the platonic love of my life and my co-producer. Huge, huge thanks to Dan Wiley and Janet Allen for helping out with this project.
1:08:24 Speaker 02 Resurrection is written, researched, and hosted by me, Dane Stewart. The creation of this podcast was made possible thanks to the financial support of the Conseil des Arts de Montréal, le Conseil des Arts et des États du Québec, and the Canada Council for the Arts. Thanks so much for listening, everyone. Now, go out there and live your lives.
Previous Resurrection, Episode 7: Mustang Zero-One Next Introducing: Creation Myth Page updated October 31, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated