Trump's Liberation Day Tariffs HEATED Debate w/ Sam Seder | PBD Podcast | Ep. 570

Patrick Bet-David, Tom Ellsworth, Vincent Oshana, and Adam Sosnick are joined by political commentator Sam Seder for a fiery episode as they break down Trump’s explosive “Liberation Day” tariff announcement, shocking results from Florida’s special election, a major shakeup in the Wisconsin Supreme Court race, and the tragic death of Texas high school football star Austin Metcalf. ------ 💳 VT RFID CARDHOLDERS: https://bit.ly/42eIld7 👕 GET THE LATEST VT MERCH: ⁠https://bit.ly/3BZbD6l⁠ https://bit.ly/3BZbD6l 📕 PBD'S BOOK "THE ACADEMY": ⁠https://bit.ly/41rtEV4⁠ https://bit.ly/41rtEV4 📰 VTNEWS. AI: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3OExClZ⁠ https://bit.ly/3OExClZ 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON SPOTIFY: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4g57zR2⁠ https://bit.ly/4g57zR2 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON ITUNES: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4g1bXAh⁠ https://bit.ly/4g1bXAh 🎙️ FOLLOW THE PODCAST ON ALL PLATFORMS: ⁠https://bit.ly/4eXQl6A⁠ https://bit.ly/4eXQl6A 📱 CONNECT ON MINNECT: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4ikyEkC⁠ https://bit.ly/4ikyEkC 👔 BET-DAVID CONSULTING: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3ZjWhB7⁠ https://bit.ly/3ZjWhB7 🎓 VALUETAINMENT UNIVERSITY: ⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/3BfA5Qw⁠ https://bit.ly/3BfA5Qw 📺 JOIN THE CHANNEL: ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://bit.ly/4g5C6Or⁠ https://bit.ly/4g5C6Or 💬 TEXT US: Text “PODCAST” to 310-340-1132 to get the latest updates in real-time! ABOUT US:Patrick Bet-David is the founder and CEO of Valuetainment Media. He is the author of the #1 Wall Street Journal Bestseller “Your Next Five Moves” (Simon & Schuster) and a father of 2 boys and 2 girls. He currently resides in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs.

• 0:30Speaker 01

  Visible puts the ultimate wireless hack in the palm of your hand. With unlimited 5G wireless data and hotspot, designed to keep you connected. Powered by Verizon's 5G network. And no contract holding you back. Plans start at $25 a month. Or get the premium Visible Plus Pro plan and save $10 on your first month when you use promo code HACK. Make the switch at visible.com. Terms apply. See visible.com for details.

• 1:08Patrick Bet-David?

  Adam, what's your point? The future looks bright. My handshake is better than anything I ever signed, right here.

• 1:17Patrick Bet-David?

  You are a one of one? My son's right there.

• 1:19Adam Sosnick?

  I don't think I've ever said this before.

• 1:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, so episode 570. We have a very rich man here today, Sam Seder. He's a guy that loves rich people. He just, you know, anybody that's a billionaire, his favorite people. Absolute big fan. And he's going to tell us why today. We've had him on before. I always respect anybody that is willing to come on, that may have opposing ideas to sit down and have a conversation. Sam, it's great to have you back on here again.

• 1:48Speaker 04

  It's a pleasure to be here. I just want to say that some of my best friends are rich people.

• 1:53Patrick Bet-David?

  I believe you. I believe that you have a lot of rich friends. Trust me, I believe you. Now, the question is, you want him to get taxed 90%. But we'll have that conversation as well. Gang, a lot of stories.

• 2:03Speaker 04

  Top marginal rate of 90%.

• 2:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Right. But you're rich too, Sam. Let's not, you know.

• 2:08Speaker 04

  Oh, no, I am rich as well.

• 2:10Patrick Bet-David?

  You're rich too. Okay. We got a lot of stories to talk about. Sam is obviously a diehard fan of Elon Musk. He wants to give some more praise to him today. We'll talk a little bit about him. We'll talk about terrorists with liberation day. One of the stories CNBC hosts hits Trump with insult. He'll hate amid tanking. Stock market. We'll talk about that story. Frustration grows with Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick ahead of Trump's tariff announcement. Loose cannon with half baked ideas.

• 2:41Patrick Bet-David?

  Another story about private companies added 155,000 jobs in March. More than expected. ADP says. Hooters bankruptcy devastating for a lot of people. 376 million dollar debt. And restructuring Charlie Javis. Must wear an ankle monitor despite her budding. Pilates career judge rules. Gen Z is facing a career. Apocalypse Stephen A. Smith. Drops mountain of receiveds. On MSNBC writer who called his MAGA mouthpiece. We'll play that clip. ESPN's Monica McNutt claims Caitlin Clark is popular because she's a white girl. From middle America. This Tik Tok deal is getting very interesting. We don't know whether Amazon's gonna buy it, whether Andreessen Horowitz gonna buy it, whether they're both gonna be involved.

• 3:26Patrick Bet-David?

  There's a lot of interesting people saying they're gonna buy it. So eventually one person will. Who that is, we don't know. There's a couple of stories here with Vanguard. Sam Gard gets real. Sam Seder gets real. About Anna Kasparian and Cenk Uygur spills the tea. On the young Turks. I think that may be an older story, but we'll cover it anyway since it's been a couple of years. Elon Musk to the five on Tesla attacks. We know who was behind it. And we are coming for them. Obama was working against Kamala Harris behind the scenes. Didn't think she could win. New book reveals. Nevada school ban at a ban. Uh, schools banned trans athletes from girl sports and major reversal reversal from state.

• 4:09Patrick Bet-David?

  We'll cover that part and then we got a couple of the stories here. Democrats approval rating remains low point. Uh, unhinged Jasmine Crockett roasts herself by admitting. She's a D E I hire. Which story is that? Sky News, Trump administration freezes funding to Maine for letting trans athletes in girl's sports. Massive layoffs hitting health agencies that track disease and regular food. Female fencer takes a knee forfeits in protest of transgender opponents. Texas high school football star. This is a devastating story. Austin Metcalf stabbed in the heart, left to die in twin's brother arm at track meet. And the dad react, this is going to be a tough one to watch folks when we go through it. Yeah.

• 4:53Patrick Bet-David?

  We're talking about it right before the podcast. Elon Musk's 24 hours, a Wisconsin Supreme Court loss, Tesla's sales plunge and reports he may soon leave. Role in Trump's White House Yahoo News will cover that story. And in Nashville police and final report downplay covenant shooters transgender identity hatred of Christianity. That's a daily wire story and we got a few other things I will cover as well. Before we get into the podcast, guys, we want a million people to support the future looks bright gear. We are getting very close to it. We got something unique that came in, just so you guys know, I only, and I mean, I only wear the Valuetainment wallet. This is all I have. I think Adam's the same as well.

• 5:34Patrick Bet-David?

  But we got these new wallets, okay, that are R F I D protected wallets to have with different future looks bright. Uh, uh, uh, signs on it, Rob, if you can go through, we got the red one, we got the black one. Uh, if you can go to the neck, all the colors so they can see it, beige, blue, gray, brown, you name it. We have it here, anybody that places an order with these R F I D wallets, you're going to get a leather. Uh, keychain added to it with the Valuetainment logo design on it. Again, you support the brand, you follow what we do. If you, if you, if you believe like we do that the future looks bright, go support the gear. These will not last a long time, just like the leather backpack did it on Tuesday. That thing went in no time.

• 6:14Patrick Bet-David?

  Go place your order, carry your wallet with this R F I D wallet protector, future looks bright. Okay. All right, so let's get right into it. Sam, question for you. From the last time you were here, I think it was two years ago, that it was, give or take two years ago. At the time, it was probably a terrible season for Trump, I think we can say. Trump wasn't having a lot of victories. Trump was at a very low. Republicans were not convinced that he could go. Republicans were thinking it's probably going to be DeSantis, or it's going to be somebody else. There was a bit of a split in the Republican Party on the MAGA, like, I don't know. Even when he opened up his announcement that he's running at Mar-a-Lago, there was not a lot of people there. People were saying, I don't even know this person wasn't there, that person wasn't there, this person wasn't there.

• 6:59Patrick Bet-David?

  And then you get these CNN polls. Rob, if you can pull up the CNN video showing where the Democratic Party is at today. Play this clip, and I want to ask you, Sam, what happened to the Democratic Party? Go for it.

• 7:14Speaker 05

  Voters' views of the Democrats in Congress, among all voters, disapprove 68%. And look at the approved number, just 21%. Even lower than the Democratic Party at large. This is the lowest on record for Democrats, according to Quinnipiac University polling. You think these numbers are bad? Let's go to this side of the screen, we'll look how Democratic voters feel. Get this, the plurality of Democratic voters disapprove of Democrats in Congress at 49%. And just 40% approve. Horrible, horrible, horrible. Oh my goodness gracious, you just can't get worse than these numbers.

• 7:49Tom Ellsworth?

  And this is the number right here, really driving all of this. If Democrats have turned, if Democratic voters have turned on Democrats in Congress and the Democratic Party, that's what puts the numbers at historic lows. What is it they want to be seeing, these voters?

• 8:02Speaker 05

  What is going on? I'll tell you what's going on. They don't like what's coming out of some of those Senate Democrats like Chuck Schumer. Because take a look at the direction of the party. Democratic voters on Democrats in Congress, doing too little to oppose Donald Trump. Look at this, 77%. Should stay principled, even if it means nothing gets done in Washington DC. 65%. And this 65% is such a difference from where we were in 2017 at this point, when just 33% of Democrats say they should stay principled, compared to 59% who said they want to compromise. Democrats do not want compromise at this point. They want to fight it. They want to go into the ring like Muhammad Ali. They want to take down the Republicans. They do not want this compromise anymore. They want to be more like Republicans, get up to that stage and fight. And right now, they

• 8:47Speaker 05

  feel like their leaders in Congress are simply put not doing so. And that is why their approval rating for Congressional Democrats is at all time low, even among Democrats.

• 8:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Rob, if you want to pause that. Sam, what happened? What happened to the Democratic Party?

• 8:59Speaker 04

  Well, I should start by saying, I always thought that Trump would be the nominee. And I don't, two years ago, I was wondering why Ron DeSantis was lighting his career on fire by trying to run against Donald Trump, to be honest with you. I think, you know, Trump and the Republican Party, I think they're one in the same. And so that doesn't surprise me. Those numbers are some of the most encouraging numbers I've seen in the 20 some odd years I've been doing this. Because I want to see it communicated to Democratic leadership

• 9:35Speaker 04

  that we want you to fight. And I've been riding Chuck Schumer for, you know, 10 years, trying to get him, I mean, Harry Reid was a great, I think, as far as they go, leader of the Senate for Democrats. But it is, I think it's time for new leadership in the Democratic Party. We need a, and this is not even ideological from my perspective. I think there are Democrats that I agree with and Democrats that I disagree with on an ideological standpoint. But I think a different generation of Democrats understand that the Republican Party is in transit. There

• 10:18Speaker 04

  is no negotiating with them. I think the biggest thing that Joe Biden, the biggest mistake that Joe Biden made was following the American Rescue Act, which was a massive boon to the American public. We cut child poverty by 45% in a year. I just want to repeat that. We cut child poverty by 45% in a year because of that, that act when Biden first got in. And you know what Republicans were talking about? After we, we passed bills that cut child poverty in a year, that extended unemployment benefits, that provided food stamps, that provided health insurance.

• 11:05Speaker 04

  Republicans were talking about two books that the Dr. Seuss publisher decided not to publish. And so, in my mind, the Republican Party there is completely bankrupt of ideas. And Joe Biden, instead of pushing through Build Back Better over that summer, he opened the door for the Republicans to give a proposal. That went nowhere for three months. Then he opened the door for Kristin Sinema and Rob Portman to come in and give a proposal. And that ultimately, I think, is when Democratic voters started getting impatient with Biden. Because we were thinking $5 trillion, $4 trillion, Joe Manchin was saying $6 trillion Build Back

• 11:49Speaker 04

  Better bill. And we never got anything like that. It ended up getting split into the IRA, which was a good bill, but I think insufficient. And then infrastructure stuff, also important, but insufficient. And so, I think what you're seeing is frustration from Democratic voters who are saying, A, you're not fighting, B, you're allowing the Republicans too much opportunity, and C, we need more government intervention.

• 12:16Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you think it's more that they're not fighting? Or do you think that their policies are simply bad policies and they're not landing?

• 12:23Speaker 04

  No, I think it's that they're not fighting. What are their policies?

• 12:27Patrick Bet-David?

  So, so tell me what policies are, like, right now, the Democratic Party? Who is the face of the Democratic Party? And what are the top three things you guys stand for?

• 12:36Speaker 04

  Well, I don't think there is a face of the Democratic Party at the moment. I mean, Chuck Schumer is nominally the, you know, the highest elected Democratic official that's out there.

• 12:48Patrick Bet-David?

  That's not a good sign for you guys.

• 12:51Speaker 04

  100%. I agree. I call for him to resign every day.

• 12:57Speaker 04

  I don't know that there is a single, uh, I don't think the Democratic Party has coalesced around an agenda. This is, we're having a, uh, we're, there's a fight, uh, within the Democratic Party.

• 13:10Patrick Bet-David?

  What do you like, do you have someone you like that you would, you would want to see? Or do you want to see the capitalistic competitive, uh, philosophy of somebody just comes out and let's see who it is? Because if there is, even you right now, Sam.

• 13:22Speaker 04

  Capitalistic, I don't understand.

• 13:24Patrick Bet-David?

  What I mean by capitalistic, like competitive, let's just see who comes out of the competition.

• 13:27Speaker 04

  Competition predates capitalism.

• 13:29Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, so that's good. The competition is a good thing, right?

• 13:31Speaker 04

  Yeah, I know. I mean, I think, yeah, I, obviously, there's gonna be a competition, uh, I-

• 13:35Patrick Bet-David?

  Is there anyone you like?

• 13:36Speaker 04

  Well, I, I think there are policies that I like that are, that are expressed by like, uh, Sanders and AOC on their tour, their anti oligarchy tour. I mean, obviously, um, I think, uh, there are other, you know, uh, policies that are floating around that, that I don't know that they're necessarily embodied in politicians yet. People are looking, there's a lot of stuff that Tim Walz did in, um, uh, in Minnesota that I think is great, um-

• 14:04Speaker 05

  Putting the tampons in the bathroom, which was, that was my favorite. Putting in the, in the men's bathroom, that was, that was probably one of the best ones. Putting that, cause that, that's, that's type of policy that I think that we need in the country. I don't know about you guys.

• 14:15Speaker 04

  Tell me, tell me what Walz did that you liked. Substantially, statistically, that Walz did. I think, think, uh, I think things like, um, uh, lunches for, for kids, expanding educational opportunities, uh- Wait a minute, there weren't lunches for kids? There wasn't federal money from the Department of Defense? Free lunches for kids? Yeah. Okay.

• 14:36Patrick Bet-David?

  What else?

• 14:36Speaker 04

  Well- No, let's, let's go. I want, I, I really want to hear it because a lot of this was federal money that just, that floated. I really want to know what was so substantial during things. I mean, expansion of, of Medicare and Medicaid, I should say Medicaid in, uh, in Minnesota, um, he provided for- Expansion to who specifically?

• 14:58Speaker 04

  To, uh, through the ACA, the people making 400% of poverty, uh, he's got, uh...

• 15:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Wait a minute. Medicaid is designed, if I walk in with a broken leg to a public hospital, right, that Medicaid is there to take care of me if I'm destitute and unable to it. That's a good thing. And that's exactly the things that California did, and that's, it was already there. What was expanded, what was expanded about that in Minnesota?

• 15:28Speaker 04

  There, there, there's, it's, it's, you're expanding the pool of people who can access Medicaid on a state-by-state basis. There's still, I don't know, half a dozen states, Republican states, that don't, uh, don't allow that expansion of Medicaid.

• 15:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, so you just...

• 15:43Speaker 04

  Are you not aware of that?

• 15:44Patrick Bet-David?

  So you, yeah, I am absolutely aware of it. But what I want to ask you is when you expand Medicaid, it is a fact that basically you closed the public hospitals. And so what you're talking about, the things he did in...

• 15:56Speaker 04

  That's not true.

• 15:57Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, yeah? Ask Gavin Newsom. Ask him what happened to King Drew in Los Angeles. This is well documented. I'm stunned you don't know that.

• 16:03Speaker 04

  No, you can, you can do a choice if you want to close a public, I mean, Andrew Cuomo closed a lot of public hospitals in, uh, New York State. That's not a function of Medicaid payments.

• 16:14Patrick Bet-David?

  You want to go take a look at California and King Drew and what happened? Gavin Newsom himself talked about it.

• 16:18Speaker 04

  I'm not a fan of Gavin Newsom, but you're asking me about Walz and, uh...

• 16:24Patrick Bet-David?

  No, we didn't ask about Walz. You were talking, you said you like some of the things Walz was doing.

• 16:27Speaker 04

  He asked me what was in, what I like about Tim Walz.

• 16:30Patrick Bet-David?

  No, you said you like...

• 16:31Speaker 04

  And I wanted one of the specifics of the things that he did.

• 16:35Patrick Bet-David?

  Right. Okay, so, but continue with, with the following, uh, uh, Sam, if you don't mind, because this is what I'm trying to find out.

• 16:41Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 16:42Patrick Bet-David?

  So, one, the Republican Party, like you said, I knew two years ago that Trump would be, DeSantis, all this other stuff.

• 16:48Speaker 04

  Right.

• 16:48Patrick Bet-David?

  We were on the same page. I, I thought it was going to be him. But a lot of Republicans were a little bit still staying safe and hesitant of whether they were going to go all in or not the first time you and I spoke. But today... When I said, "Who do you like?", what policies? You said, "I like what AOC is doing." You said Sanders, anti oligarchy, all that stuff, right?

• 17:08Speaker 04

  I have a different, I think, way of looking at politics, maybe, than you do. It's not for me, like, if a candidate emerges who embraces a wider set of my preferred policies, that's the one I'll support. I don't really get too involved in the individual, frankly. I mean, you know, Joe Biden was not my favorite candidate by a long shot in 2020. The fact that there were coalitions built out of Warren and Sanders supporters that

• 17:49Speaker 04

  ended up bringing us a much better set of labor policies than we've seen in my lifetime from my perspective, with the National Labor Relations Board, with just the appointments of people like Abruzzo as the general counsel there, the extension of unions' ability to unionize and helping working people in that way, and then the antitrust regime that was largely a function of, like, the Warrenites putting in their people to undermine big concentration of money and power. Those are big positives. So, you know, do I like Joe Biden? No.

• 18:33Speaker 04

  But I also know that if there are the right coalitions formed that have, you know, influence within the context of an administration, that's good from my perspective.

• 18:47Speaker 00

  This episode is brought to you by Indeed. You're ready to level up your business, but the pressure to find the right person to make that happen is intense. Indeed-sponsored jobs can help carry the load. It boosts your job post to help it reach quality talent fast. Cut through the chaos with Indeed-sponsored jobs. Get a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed-sponsored jobs.

• 19:17Speaker 01

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• 19:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Got it. But to me, like, running a business or politics, right? Or it shifts when people all of a sudden look at you and they say, "I don't like these ideas anymore." So in the Democratic Party, you have a lot of different people that would have different policies. "Hey, I think we should do this and I think we should do that." Great. Obviously didn't land November 5th, 2024. Whether it was Kamala Harris, whether it was the policies, whether it's seven states you lose, battleground states you lose, whether it's the majority. It was a bad loss. It was a humiliating loss. One could say it was Kamala. One could say it was Obama. One could say it was Biden stepping. One could say it's Schumer. One could say it's Pelosi. Let's set that part aside. To me, the most basic part is ideas.

• 20:32Patrick Bet-David?

  If someone has ideas that's producing results that people like, they want to continue that, right? And we watched, like, if I ask a Democrat, even right now, Ben, I ask you for 15 minutes, I still don't know if Democrats know what they're for.

• 20:49Speaker 04

  Well, I'm not, you know, I'm not speaking for the Democratic Party. I can tell you what I'm for.

• 20:53Patrick Bet-David?

  Tell me, what's your for?

• 20:53Speaker 04

  Oh, I am for universal healthcare, single payer healthcare.

• 20:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Yep.

• 20:59Speaker 04

  I am for increased ability to unionize. I am for decomodifying parts of the housing sector. I am for decomodifying power. I am for decomodifying access to the internet. I mean, those are my big ones right there.

• 21:19Patrick Bet-David?

  Who in your party is for that?

• 21:22Speaker 04

  Well, who in the Democratic Party is for that? I don't know that there's anybody who in our party who embraces all of those. I mean, that is a, you know, major political figure. I mean, I think I'm to the left of the Democratic Party. But I think there are elements of what I want that are represented by people in the Democratic Party. I mean, I think having a very jaundiced eye to the overwhelming concentration of wealth and wealth disparity, I think is a fundamental problem that we have in this country.

• 22:02Speaker 04

  I think too much of what happens in this country is a function of the concentration of wealth. I mean, that gets back to why I want to return back to the tax regime we had in the 50s and the 60s, where the top marginal rate was 90% for every dollar above, in what today's money would be about $4 million. So, and just to explain this, because I've seen so many people on the right not understand marginal tax rates, that it's almost disturbing. The first million dollars that you earn is taxed at 32% or whatever the prevailing rate

• 22:47Speaker 04

  is. The second, $2 million, $1 million you earn, 32%. The third, 32%, because I think that's the highest, maybe it's 37% is the highest. Once you get over $4 million, every extra dollar after that is taxed at a 90% rate.

• 23:05Patrick Bet-David?

  That's what you want.

• 23:06Speaker 04

  That is what we had in this country for several decades in the post-world war.

• 23:12Patrick Bet-David?

  But why do you think that's good, though? Because we talked about this. Why do you think that's good?

• 23:16Speaker 04

  I'll tell you. Because it flattens wealth disparity. And that is when you have the greatest expansion of the economy. When the wealth of the country is shared by as many people as possible. Obviously, it's not everybody gets the same amount, but...

• 23:35Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you think that's a popular idea? Do you think 80% of Americans want that? Americans want that?

• 23:41Speaker 04

  I think if I was to show Americans... If I was to show Americans-

• 23:45Patrick Bet-David?

  You've been showing for 20 years though.

• 23:46Speaker 04

  No, no, no. Put up a, put up a graph of, of income disparity.

• 23:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Right.

• 23:52Speaker 04

  The, you put up a graph of income disparity, Americans are shocked when they realize how much money-

• 23:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 23:59Speaker 04

  -is held by the top 1% in this country. Really, the top 0.1%, relative to the rest. I mean, like, literally, a handful of families-

• 24:09Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 24:09Speaker 04

  -have more money and more wealth in this country than 50% of the population.

• 24:15Patrick Bet-David?

  But, but, but, there's so many questions to that. For me, the question is the following. Here's where I'm trying to go with a guy like you.

• 24:19Speaker 04

  Yeah, you show that to 80% of Americans and there's no questions. It's just gonna be like, what the fuck?

• 24:24Patrick Bet-David?

  You know what other-

• 24:25Speaker 04

  I don't know if I can swear on you.

• 24:26Patrick Bet-David?

  You know what else you can show? You can't, because you're a guest. But, you know what else? You can. C-A-N. You can. You can. You're a guest. So, if you, somebody could go and say, okay, why don't you pull up, uh, who pays the most taxes in America? The top 1% pays 50% of taxes in America, okay? So, you can give that argument. So, to me, if we go back and forth, but, but this is the part I want to do with this specific argument. This specific idea, where I want to go with a guy like you, okay, is, I think sometimes, like, the Democratic Party, you go to a message, and you know how Trump tests things out? Yeah, Greenland, we, it's Greenland, Greenland, Greenland, Greenland. Greenland? Yeah, Greenland. It's gonna be, we, we, so one way or another, we're not gonna go to where we're wanting.

• 25:11Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, you know, a, a third term, I, you know, I'm not talking about third term, but a lot of people are talking about third term, third term, third term. Yeah, you know, uh, uh, you know, uh, Canada should just be a 51st state. Governor Trudeau, Governor Trudeau, Governor Trudeau, Governor Trudeau. Trump will throw these things out there, okay? And then, the market reacts to it. And the market will say, what the, what, what is he talking about? And then, I believe-

• 25:36Patrick Bet-David?

  This is cuz, this is how I do it as a business owner. You kinda, I'll, I'll be in front of, I'll never forget. One time I brought nine of my guys and I dropped an idea on them. You should've seen the reaction on everybody. You know what the reaction was? They looked at me like I was high. They looked at me like I am on shrooms. They're like, what the fuck? Pat, respectfully, these are terrible ideas. So you know what happens to business owner? They're so used to coming up with bad ideas. What do they do? They move on with bad ideas. So to me, Trump gets up there and says, what do you think about this? And then he looks, he says, okay, what's the guy that I respect? Okay, this guy's pretty reasonable. What did he say? What did she say? Okay, let's move on. To the democratic side, somebody like you.

• 26:12Speaker 04

  But, but I would...

• 26:13Patrick Bet-David?

  But let me just finish the point, I'll come to you. Trust me, I wanna hear from you. To me, it's, I feel like the democrats, like you, okay? You have a voice. People watch you. You're an influencer in your community. And you actually have the ability to kinda go and help your community out, help your party out. There are certain policies that you keep pitching that is no longer popular, that's been exposed so many times. Because what we learned, like the biggest part why some of the conservatives like the Doge concept and some of the democrats that like the Doge concept is it's government wasted expenditure. Obama talked about it, Clinton's talked about it. People on the left have talked about it for many, many years. And the average person watches this and says,

• 26:58Patrick Bet-David?

  okay, so after four million, you wanna put the tax rate at 90%? Yes, I do. Okay, so all you're saying is that the government knows how to use my money better than free enterprise? I don't believe that.

• 27:12Speaker 04

  Well...

• 27:12Patrick Bet-David?

  So that's where the argument stops.

• 27:14Speaker 04

  That's not the, that's not the premise of why I wanna do that taxation. I mean, um, the government will redistribute the money.

• 27:22Patrick Bet-David?

  That's, that's no longer a popular, uh, idea in America.

• 27:25Speaker 04

  I, I, I...

• 27:27Patrick Bet-David?

  That's the part where you see the young Turks kinda growing and evolving and seeing some of the ideas that kinda is not popular.

• 27:34Speaker 04

  I, I, listen, the fact of the matter is government always redistributes money. It always redistributes money. Every government at every moment is redistributing money. The question is, which direction is that money flowing? That's it. There is no doubt. Governments redistribute money at every moment. The question is which?

• 27:56Patrick Bet-David?

  How successful are they at it?

• 27:57Speaker 04

  What?

• 27:58Patrick Bet-David?

  How successful have they been at it? How good are they at it? How much waste have they done with redistributing money?

• 28:04Speaker 04

  Oh, there's no, listen, there's no doubt in my mind. Like, look, we have a massive, massive military budget. And if you want to look for waste and fraud in government, that is where you go. That's where all the money is. Everybody knows it. There's an enormous amount of waste and fraud. They can't even get through an audit. How many audits has it been? Half a dozen? Social Security?

• 28:23Patrick Bet-David?

  Seven, yeah.

• 28:23Speaker 04

  And they can't pass a single audit.

• 28:25Patrick Bet-David?

  I agree.

• 28:26Speaker 04

  Social Security is audited all the time. Do you know how much money? Let's talk about this for a second. I watched the video of you guys on the plane down of when Elon Musk was in Wisconsin blowing up his whole brand, essentially. And he was onstage with a guy named Garcia. Do you guys remember this video?

• 28:46Patrick Bet-David?

  Of course.

• 28:46Speaker 04

  Yeah. Okay. It was like two days ago.

• 28:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Yes. The social security numbers spiking in the last four years.

• 28:52Speaker 04

  The social security numbers.

• 28:53Patrick Bet-David?

  2.2 million new non-citizen social security numbers.

• 28:55Speaker 04

  Yes. And the amount of misinformation from every single person, all of you, was astonishing to me. What was it? What was the misinformation that was said? I mean, I almost feel like we should go through the whole video.

• 29:09Patrick Bet-David?

  This is coming from a socialist.

• 29:11Speaker 04

  No, no, no.

• 29:11Patrick Bet-David?

  The level of credibility of a socialist.

• 29:13Speaker 04

  Progress.

• 29:14Patrick Bet-David?

  A system that is never worth.

• 29:16Speaker 04

  Wait.

• 29:16Patrick Bet-David?

  But I want to hear.

• 29:17Speaker 04

  That is anti oligarch.

• 29:19Patrick Bet-David?

  But I want to hear it. I want to hear it. I want to hear it. Go for it.

• 29:21Speaker 04

  First off.

• 29:22Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 29:23Speaker 04

  You seem to not understand that these were not undocumented immigrants who were getting these social security numbers. They are non-citizens. Now, when you came to this country.

• 29:36Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 29:37Speaker 04

  You were an immigrant. Your parents came.

• 29:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Legally.

• 29:40Speaker 04

  Legally. Every single one of those people who got those social security numbers are here legally. They're not citizens, just like you weren't when you first came to this country.

• 29:50Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 29:50Speaker 04

  You get a green card. Your parents get a green card. They go through a process.

• 29:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 29:54Speaker 04

  All of those people. And to understand, they got their, they got their social security card.

• 30:01Patrick Bet-David?

  I really want to see your point.

• 30:02Speaker 04

  Well, the point is, you referred to them as undocumented and illegal. You did.

• 30:05Patrick Bet-David?

  I said non-citizen.

• 30:06Speaker 04

  Excuse me.

• 30:07Patrick Bet-David?

  Don't say everyone here. I said non-citizen. Correct yourself.

• 30:11Speaker 04

  I can't remember which one of you got it wrong. I think you did. Just be honest with yourself.

• 30:14Patrick Bet-David?

  You're thinking, but I.

• 30:16Speaker 04

  We can play the video and go through it, but I just want to make, well, the point is they're not on, they're not illegal. They're not undocumented. They're all legal.

• 30:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Right.

• 30:25Speaker 04

  The expansion from that program, the EBE program, which is enumeration beyond entry, was started under the Trump administration. The numbers have gone up because, yes, under Biden, as opposed to Trump, there was an expansion of people who we hear like you're like, you know, probably, I'm not sure.

• 30:46Patrick Bet-David?

  A lot of illegals.

• 30:47Speaker 04

  No, no, excuse me. Not a single one of them. Not a single, hold on, you're changing the subject now.

• 30:53Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, I'm not changing the subject.

• 30:54Speaker 04

  I'm talking about that video and every one of those social security numbers that was handed out.

• 30:59Patrick Bet-David?

  So how do you feel about the illegal immigrants that came those four years?

• 31:02Speaker 04

  I will get to it. Yeah, you don't care about those people. I will get to the undocumented. You cared about children. Well, you don't want to talk about this and I don't blame you because it's embarrassing.

• 31:09Patrick Bet-David?

  But let me, let me do a quick time out.

• 31:10Speaker 04

  Every one of those social security numbers.

• 31:12Patrick Bet-David?

  Do a quick time out here. Sam, let me just do a quick time out. You said you don't want to talk about this. You just spun away from a question I asked you and you brought this up. You haven't even addressed the question I asked you.

• 31:22Speaker 04

  Let me finish and we'll get to the illegal documents.

• 31:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Let's go back to what I asked you. I asked you a question that the money that's going in, Americans prove that they don't trust the government getting the money than free market, free enterprise.

• 31:37Speaker 04

  I don't think that's the case. I don't think that's the case. People love social security. People love Medicare.

• 31:43Patrick Bet-David?

  What we learned with Doge. The American people said, Sam, enough of you taking our tax money and see what you're doing with it.

• 31:49Speaker 04

  Elon Musk made that Wisconsin election of a referendum on Doge. To the extent that we've seen anybody vote on Doge, nobody heard the word Doge before November of last year. To the extent that we've seen a referendum on Doge, it just happened in Wisconsin. It happened in Florida where the, where the size of the win by those Republican congressmen was cut by 17, 20 points. I mean, this is a wipeout and, and every Republican, you're going to see a difference in Republican lawmakers over the next year and a half because anybody who was in a plus Trump. Eight district or less is now starting to go like, wait a second.

• 32:32Speaker 04

  That's why Musk is being shown the door supposedly. So getting back to my point about those social security numbers. They were given all to legal, uh, non-citizens. And every one of those cards, you can't vote. Cause I think you definitely said, and I think maybe you said that this is a democratic strategy to get voters. Hold on for a second. The social security card that they get literally says not legitimate for voting purposes. It is so that these, uh, these non-citizens who are legal, just like when you came in, excuse me, pay into the social security system and get, many of them never get that money back.

• 33:17Speaker 04

  So in addition to the undocumented immigrants who pay in 22 billion dollars a year into social security and get zero back. These people pay several billion dollars in a year and only if they become citizens, which mo-most of them won't. Most of them will go back home over a period of time. They're here for temporary protected status. Maybe some of them are refugees and they get permanent, uh, citizenship. They won't get that money either. So every single thing of that video, this video here was completely wrong that you guys did. It was fascinating to me because I feel like you, at the very least, I, I believe that you care about the information you're putting out.

• 34:01Speaker 04

  And this was all wrong and.

• 34:04Tom Ellsworth?

  So they're up there, so Sam, this is all a lie. These guys were up there just completely bullshitting with all the numbers. Where he's saying that people in the government, people in the government are blowing the whistles. He didn't want to say their names. He was giving them praise and for some, Sam, for you to say that you care, you care about the kids and the labor and all that stuff. We've had an open border for four years and all the illegals, way more than 10 million have come into this country. California, is that where you live?

• 34:29Speaker 04

  No.

• 34:29Tom Ellsworth?

  Where do you live?

• 34:30Speaker 04

  I live in New York.

• 34:31Tom Ellsworth?

  Okay, great, even better. California, so the amount of money that we spent on illegals with housing and all that shit. And Gavin Newsom passing a law that you don't even need an ID to vote.

• 34:41Patrick Bet-David?

  You're saying that we're coming up with where where these people aren't coming in for the votes? That's the main goal of this whole thing. What was the open border for? Why? Why was the border open for four years? Answer me that question. First of all, the border was not open. Give me a, are you, are you kidding me? Look at the, what do you mean the border wasn't open? Are you, hold on. Did you smoke before you came in here? That's ridiculous. By the way, Vinny, here's the part though. You're full of it, bro. Here's the part. Sam, here's the part when I hear this, okay? Anybody can look at that video. The things you were saying yesterday was a complete sack of lies or just misinformation. Be honest with me, the border. Immigration year over year over year. Type in illegal, immigration year over year.

• 35:22Patrick Bet-David?

  The fact that you're saying the border wasn't wide open, how many deaths, how many deaths have happened? How many fentanyl deaths have happened per year while your freaking president, Joe Biden, was in office? How many, hold on, how many Americans died just from fentanyl? And you're saying the border wasn't wide open? We've had the most illegal entry in four years in the history of the country. You're, you're, and this is why, let me, let me finish. And this is why your party sucks. This is why your party is at 29% approval. 20%. Because you got 20, thank you. Because all you guys do is talk shit and just go anti-Trump. You have no policies, you guys have no vision, you have no leaders. You're talking about oligarchs and you hate the oligarchs.

• 36:05Patrick Bet-David?

  What do you think Bernie Sanders and AOC are gonna get their money from? Their donors? Are you, like, don't lie to yourself. For you to look and, like, brother, you're talking about yesterday, we lied. AOC and Bernie Sanders don't take money from those people. You're, you're saying that we lied two days ago. You just lied and you're gonna look like a fool that the border wasn't wide open. Look at this chart. What does that chart say to you? Sam, what, what is that? What did, what did Trump, when Trump was in, he was trying to close it, but your party was fighting it? It's unbelievable. How many illegals have come in the past 100 days? But this is, this is, this is the part to just be very, just show the data. Illegal immigration, this is Wall Street Journal, is a bigger problem than ever. Oh, no, that's fake news. These five charts explain why. Go a little bit lower, that's under Biden.

• 36:46Speaker 04

  Trump got shot trying to show these charts, literally.

• 36:50Patrick Bet-David?

  This is October of 2023. Go to the next one.

• 36:52Speaker 04

  A guy who was registered Republican.

• 36:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Here's another one.

• 36:54Speaker 04

  Hold on, let me, can I address what his rant was?

• 36:57Patrick Bet-David?

  And then I want you to say what you want to say. Go a little bit lower with the data, Rob. No, because he said it's inaccurate. This is another one here showing data.

• 37:04Speaker 04

  Okay, well, go back up. Go back up to the, go to the one, go to the, go to the top one here.

• 37:08Patrick Bet-David?

  I mean, this is the numbers you were talking about. So this is, you can-

• 37:11Speaker 04

  Start one by one. Go up.

• 37:13Patrick Bet-David?

  Explain every one of them. Go for it. Yeah, go ahead.

• 37:15Speaker 04

  Yeah, you can see that this is what constitutes illegal immigration. These are, if it was an open border, you would not have these numbers. You would not have the numbers to know when Title 42 ends.

• 37:30Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 37:30Speaker 04

  More people are coming to the border and they're being put into a system. Period.

• 37:35Patrick Bet-David?

  That's the best part about-

• 37:36Speaker 04

  And that's, so that's the definition-

• 37:38Patrick Bet-David?

  Because they were told to come, Sam, let me explain something. When your president says, "Come to the country." Is he just gonna yell all the time? No, I'm not yelling. You just give me facts.

• 37:45Speaker 04

  Can I turn down his microphone? Because it does feel like he's yelling.

• 37:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, just see which one he is. I think he seats three or which one is it, Rob?

• 37:50Speaker 04

  C3.

• 37:51Patrick Bet-David?

  C3. C3. Go ahead. Lower that right there. And then the mic. Right there. There you go. Can you, is that good? Is that good? C2. Oh, C2. There you go. Okay, go for it. All right. All right, good. Okay, go ahead.

• 38:01Speaker 04

  All right. So-

• 38:03Patrick Bet-David?

  You're still gonna hear the truth, though. Go ahead.

• 38:05Speaker 04

  No, no, I'm happy to.

• 38:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Can't turn down the truth, is what you're saying.

• 38:08Speaker 04

  Open border would mean that we have no records of people coming across the border. The law in this country has been that if you, uh, put your foot in this country, it's a, it's an international law, it's a US law. If you put your foot in this country and you apply for asylum, you are due a process to do that. 98% of, of those people who are then, what you guys would call catch and release, come back for their hearings. We are woefully understaffed in terms of like immigration judges, and that process is definitely broken. I would love to see more money spent in the processing of these people

• 38:51Speaker 04

  so that we can establish which ones, like your family-

• 38:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Like my family as well, illegal immigrants.

• 38:59Speaker 04

  No, no. But but came in

• 39:00Patrick Bet-David?

  Yup.

• 39:00Speaker 04

  Through a refugee status. They weren't citizens on day one. They came in, they went through a process. And they, and it's possible the, at that time, I mean, I remember, you know, I was old enough to remember the Iran hostage situation. I remember the, the fallout afterwards. There may have been some form of temporary protected status, whatever was at the time, that allows people to come in, then they're assessed and processed. It's determined that yes, their claim for asylum is appropriate or not, et cetera, et cetera. That's what we're looking at there. As you, as you scroll up on those other, other charts.

• 39:39Speaker 04

  You can see when, when Title 42 ends, which was only supposed to be an emergency situation for, have, that has to do with health. And you can't have it both ways. Either COVID ends or it doesn't end.

• 39:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 39:52Speaker 04

  The pandemic. And so people come in. There's no doubt. And that number on that chart that, um, Musk had. Under Biden, more people received temporary protected status. We had a problem in Haiti, uh, as the country is falling apart. Uh, you had people from Ukraine coming in because of obviously the invasion. These are all under temporary protected status. They all got social security numbers so they could pay taxes into our government and not necessarily get the services back.

• 40:21Patrick Bet-David?

  And vote for Democrats.

• 40:22Speaker 04

  No, they can't vote. Those social security cards literally say on the card, say, you can't use this for voting.

• 40:29Patrick Bet-David?

  AOC said, we don't have an illegal immigration problem. We have a documentation problem. That's what AOC said. So I, this is not, this is not something new. You know how when you talk about who's better at gerrymandering? Who's better at gerrymandering? The left or the right?

• 40:42Speaker 04

  Republicans seem to be better at that. Republicans are much better.

• 40:44Patrick Bet-David?

  I agree. Guess what? But get, so it's not like they can fight it and say, no, we're not. That's their reputation. They have it. They're, they're better at gerrymandering. Strategically, they're better at doing that. But when, for you to sit here.

• 40:56Speaker 04

  I don't have a problem like you do with document, with immigrants. Yeah.

• 41:00Patrick Bet-David?

  When I, when you sit here and you watch yourself, when you're saying these policies and you spew out these policies. What the average person does, they'll watch it. And if they've already outgrown it, because today, the problem with, you know, folks, content creators have today's the following. Say we say something on a video and we're wrong. You know what others will do? They'll react to it and they'll say stuff to it. And if we're right, they'll keep coming to us to want to hear more of it. Because they'll say, at least you sound reasonable. And they'll say, you know, I have to, I want to hear what John has to say. I want to hear what Joe has to say. I want to hear what Megan has to say. I want to hear what, you know, whoever these people are that are giving ideas out there want to say, right?

• 41:42Patrick Bet-David?

  But when you keep saying stuff that others are able to tear apart so many times that a liberal, a former liberal watches that maybe was a viewer of you and says, "How can Sam not see this and outgrow it? He is still stuck on this policy that's been proven. Americans don't want to pay more taxes to a government that wastes their taxes. How does he not see that? How does he keep pushing this agenda back and forth?" Then you lose an audience and the people you keep is the following. Here's who you end up keeping. You end up keeping an audience that makes you think you're right, but that's not always the case. You keep an audience that of course hates rich people. Rich people are bad people and they're probably not making a lot of money.

• 42:27Patrick Bet-David?

  And they come to Sam to save him. "Hey, let's trash and bash rich people because this is what we gotta do." "Yes, Sam, let's go after the rich people."

• 42:34Speaker 04

  Are you talking about me? Because we just had our biggest month. And when people on my show-

• 42:41Patrick Bet-David?

  You had your biggest month because of Jubilee. You were on Jubilee and you were on that show-

• 42:44Speaker 04

  We've been going back up.

• 42:45Patrick Bet-David?

  No, you were on Jubilee and Jubilee gave you a lot of eyeballs. So Jubilee brought a lot of traffic to you.

• 42:49Speaker 04

  A lot of people agreed. A lot of, I mean, no, no, no. I mean, a lot of people agreed.

• 42:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Did more agree or disagree?

• 42:56Speaker 04

  I would say a lot more agreed.

• 42:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, you would say that because you're in it.

• 43:00Speaker 04

  Well, I mean, you want me to do metrics? We had our biggest subscription a month-

• 43:05Patrick Bet-David?

  I believe you because Jubilee helped you.

• 43:06Speaker 04

  Okay, but my point is, is that-

• 43:08Patrick Bet-David?

  Credit to, you should say thank you to Jubilee.

• 43:10Speaker 04

  Oh, thank you Jubilee. I would also add that like, I think there are definitely people who watch my show and then over a period of time are going, "I disagree with Sam." And proudly- Those people move to the left of where I'm at.

• 43:27Patrick Bet-David?

  You think people move to the left?

• 43:29Speaker 04

  Hundred percent.

• 43:29Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam, do you realize, do you realize how, how to, to make a statement, and I love that you said it.

• 43:36Speaker 04

  Oh, it's true.

• 43:37Patrick Bet-David?

  I love that you said it. So you think people who age and live longer, they go further to the left than to the right? You think as people mature in life?

• 43:46Speaker 04

  Am I the oldest person on this?

• 43:47Patrick Bet-David?

  No, you're not.

• 43:48Speaker 04

  I'm pretty close, I bet.

• 43:49Patrick Bet-David?

  No, you're pretty far. It's just the other guy looks very young, but you, as you-

• 43:53Speaker 04

  How old are you?

• 43:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Uh, he's sixty-two.

• 43:55Speaker 04

  You got me by three years.

• 43:57Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, so you're not, you, you, so- You're fifty-nine, dude. Yeah. Good for you. But, but do you think, do you think, do you think as people age, they become more conservative or more liberal, more leftist?

• 44:07Speaker 04

  Um, I think it changes with generations.

• 44:10Patrick Bet-David?

  No, that's not the case. There is a evident more of one or the other. Do you think, like, it's asking a question. Do you think as we age, do our bones get stronger or weaker? They get weaker. As we age, do we become more leaning, what, okay, this is a chart, perfect, thank you for that, Pew Research. As we age, we become more conservative. But to you, the more you age, the more you become progressive and leftist. See, that's the part where Americans, as they age and go through, you may have a very young audience that finds you.

• 44:41Speaker 04

  This, I, I think if you look at this chart, and first of all, you'll also notice that, like, the dynamic shifts, right? If what you were saying was true, seventy to seventy-nine, uh, would be, uh, greater Republican favor than sixty to sixty-nine. I don't know what to tell you, but, but I will also tell you-

• 45:01Patrick Bet-David?

  I'm starting to realize what your shtick is.

• 45:02Speaker 04

  What my shtick is? I'm looking at the numbers you put up on those graphs.

• 45:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Eighteen to twenty-four is thirty-four, then it goes to thirty-two, oh my god, you know, they became more liberal. Because they went to college and they screwed up their brains.

• 45:13Speaker 04

  Wait, wait.

• 45:13Patrick Bet-David?

  And then they go to forty to forty-seven, fifty, fifty, oh, oh, they dropped to fifty-one, and they go to fifty-eight. Nope, they're becoming more liberals at seventy to seventy-nine. Do you know why seventy to seventy-nine become more liberal?

• 45:23Speaker 04

  I will also suggest-

• 45:23Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you know why seventy to seventy-nine becomes more liberal? Do you know why seventy to seventy-nine becomes more liberal?

• 45:28Speaker 04

  Yes, because they're, they're getting social security.

• 45:30Patrick Bet-David?

  Exactly. So they gotta protect it, so they're like, hey, man- At least, yeah, I agree, but still at eighty plus, they're more conservative.

• 45:37Speaker 04

  But I will also suggest you.

• 45:41Patrick Bet-David?

  I get the stick you play now.

• 45:43Speaker 04

  With the years that you grow up in.

• 45:44Patrick Bet-David?

  It's the same thing I said to you last time as well.

• 45:46Speaker 04

  Fifty to fifty-nine, grew up in a Reagan era, in a Thatcher era. And as in, in the wake of that, you can see that people are, are more progressive, increasing.

• 45:57Patrick Bet-David?

  Why did Charlie Kirk blow up so much the last four years? Specifically eighteen months, why did he blow up on TikTok out of all the places?

• 46:04Speaker 04

  Did you see?

• 46:05Patrick Bet-David?

  How do you blow up on TikTok? Do you know he was the most viewed Jubilee out of all of them?

• 46:10Speaker 04

  Did you, did you see that Milo?

• 46:12Patrick Bet-David?

  Can you see how many views Charlie Kirk got on Jubilee?

• 46:14Speaker 04

  But this is, this is, this is, this is just absolute.

• 46:19Patrick Bet-David?

  Why do you think Charlie Kirk blew up, blew up though?

• 46:21Speaker 04

  I, I have theories.

• 46:22Patrick Bet-David?

  I want to hear it.

• 46:23Speaker 04

  Um, how did he start? How did he, how did Charlie Kirk start?

• 46:28Patrick Bet-David?

  I don't care how he started, I'm asking how he's finishing. How did he blow up so much in the last eighteen months?

• 46:33Speaker 04

  Going to colleges, speaking in front of colleges, what do you mean? Yeah, how did that TPUSA get started?

• 46:37Patrick Bet-David?

  Tell us, let's see what angle you're gonna, what stick.

• 46:40Speaker 04

  He was going to college talking to students.

• 46:41Patrick Bet-David?

  I actually want to hear what he says because I'm, I'm watching these two times.

• 46:45Speaker 04

  He got paid by a billionaire to start that organization. It's just the truth, what's wrong with that? Listen, there's nothing wrong with it.

• 46:52Patrick Bet-David?

  Conviction on what Charlie does.

• 46:53Speaker 04

  No, no, I'm sure there's conviction in what Charlie does.

• 46:56Patrick Bet-David?

  Why did Charlie do so much last eighteen months?

• 46:58Speaker 04

  I, I, I mean.

• 46:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Why do you think, a twenty-year-old guy, why is he blowing up the way that he is? Why is this?

• 47:02Speaker 04

  Well, he's not twenty, he's in his.

• 47:03Patrick Bet-David?

  Twenty-eight years old, twenty-nine, thirty years old.

• 47:05Speaker 04

  He's thirty now, but he started when he was twenty.

• 47:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, the last two years he was in his twenties, why has he blown up so much?

• 47:10Speaker 04

  I, I mean, I think there's a lot of money circulating on the right.

• 47:14Patrick Bet-David?

  But he started when he was eighteen. Forget the money.

• 47:16Speaker 04

  Sam, Sam, Sam.

• 47:18Patrick Bet-David?

  To go to colleges.

• 47:20Speaker 04

  Blame it on the money, what about his voice, his reason, his rationale? He's compelling.

• 47:24Patrick Bet-David?

  By the way, by the way, so here's a question, here's a question. So you think, if you got the same money Charlie got, you would have the same views?

• 47:32Speaker 04

  Um, yeah, I think, you know, I saw Milo Yiannopoulos on Tim Poole, uh, about a month or two ago.

• 47:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 47:39Speaker 04

  Talking about how the Daily Wire got so big. And he said.

• 47:49Speaker 04

  This is Milo Yiannopoulos. Well, he said-

• 47:52Patrick Bet-David?

  Charlie's different than Daily Wire.

• 47:53Speaker 04

  Hundred percent. He said, "In the right-wing

• 47:56Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 47:56Speaker 04

  content area, era, he said, "We buy. We buy bots. We buy views. We buy..." I mean, I knew- I'm telling you what Milo Yiannopoulos said. Go ahead. This is what he said.

• 48:09Patrick Bet-David?

  This is fantastic.

• 48:11Speaker 04

  And he said-

• 48:12Patrick Bet-David?

  This is fantastic.

• 48:13Speaker 04

  "We fake it till we make it."

• 48:15Patrick Bet-David?

  And that's why he's, that's why he's non-existent anymore. He used to be a big voice. Now you don't hear nothing about it.

• 48:19Speaker 04

  Sam, respectfully, there's something called giving credit where credit is due. Regardless of where Charlie got his money. Hold on, hold on, hold on. I don't care. Great. I'll give him credit. Charlie Kirk has made a lot of money. But that's not where the credit is due. What do you want me to say? And I don't even know how much money he's made. The, the point is, he's motivated a lot of people. That's what, where the credit should be done. He's changed the hearts and minds of people-

• 48:43Patrick Bet-David?

  He helped Trump win.

• 48:44Speaker 04

  On campuses. He would arguably be the number one reason that Trump flipped Arizona.

• 48:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 48:48Speaker 04

  To not give someone credit for the good work they've done and blame it on a billionaire. Musk's money flipped Arizona. You look at, TPUSA played heavily in the Carrie Lake race. Huge. And, and the, the biggest, the widest loss they had was people under the age of 30. Okay. So you don't want to give Charlie any credit? You blame, so- No, I don't care. But Sam, hold on. Before being- I can give him all the credit in the world. Sam, before being a nihilist- I'll give him a trophy. Sam, you've had, let me just ask this question. What does he want? He can take the- Sam.

• 49:22Patrick Bet-David?

  I don't think Charlie wants-

• 49:23Speaker 04

  We're right here, buddy.

• 49:23Patrick Bet-David?

  I don't think Charlie needs anything.

• 49:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, Sam. Well, I don't understand what this conversation is. So a billionaire gives Charlie money and he automatically wins. Okay, I got a question for you. Explain how Marc Benioff puts money into Time Magazine and it goes down. I, I don't know who Marc Benioff is. And I haven't read Time Magazine in, in- Well, you should get around more. It's unfortunate. Come out of the echo chamber. Marc Benioff is one of the most successful entrepreneurs of all time who used-

• 49:49Tom Ellsworth?

  His money after his business success and he went and he buys Time Magazine because he wants to push liberal views and values and the thing craters.

• 49:58Patrick Bet-David?

  He would love it.

• 49:59Speaker 04

  Then me not reading Time Magazine would be getting out of my bubble, right?

• 50:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, but you know what it is? That's true. Sam, I like to give everybody the benefit of the doubt. I truly do. And I try to look at the only one you can succeed in business and in life and in sales like you're developing other people is you have to always look at the best of everybody. You don't have a choice. As a parent, you have to always look at the best of your kids. You don't have a choice for them to do their best, right? And I truly want to look at you and look at it from the part of the best to say capable, great communicator. Uh, uh, you know, temperament is solid. You go through it. I want to see all the good with you. But the part where you sit there and you realize some policies don't work.

• 50:46Speaker 04

  What policies don't work?

• 50:47Patrick Bet-David?

  Go, go to.

• 50:48Speaker 04

  What policy, name a policy that I support that doesn't work.

• 50:51Patrick Bet-David?

  What do you think about? Ninety percent tax rates. I would, I would start there.

• 50:54Speaker 04

  Like I say, when we had those in this country, this is, everybody can look this up. We had what was known as the great compression. It was the greatest expansion of our, of our economy. And the lowest wealth disparity we had in the history of this country. I don't know how you would define it, anything other than a success.

• 51:15Patrick Bet-David?

  Let me ask you a question. Let's stay right here in this ninety percent tax rate. Ninety percent. So.

• 51:19Speaker 04

  Top marginal.

• 51:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, I'm with you. So you get to keep ten percent.

• 51:23Speaker 04

  No, no, no. Ten percent of every dollar after four million.

• 51:27Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay. No, well, here we go. I'm gonna ask you a question. Like, stay with me for a second. You just said you had a great month, a great quarter, right? Like you. Jubilee was a big help. Whatever it was. Jubilees is billionaires. You know what billionaires are to you? How much additional profit revenue did you make in the last quarter because you've went viral so many times? How much?

• 51:46Speaker 04

  I, I mean, I don't know, but I would guess it's somewhere around tens of thousands.

• 51:49Patrick Bet-David?

  Tens of thou- so not millions, tens of thousands. Okay. So what are you gonna do with that? Extra thirty grand, hundred grand. What are you gonna do with it?

• 51:57Speaker 04

  We're gonna hire another person.

• 51:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, so you're gonna expand?

• 52:00Speaker 04

  Well, I don't know if we're gonna, uh, expand, but I, I'm gonna, I'm gonna probably, I mean.

• 52:06Patrick Bet-David?

  You're gonna invest?

• 52:07Speaker 04

  Well, I may invest in some of it.

• 52:09Patrick Bet-David?

  You're not just gonna bury it in the sand, you're gonna use it?

• 52:11Speaker 04

  Correct.

• 52:11Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay. Oh, wow. Here, here, here's the problem.

• 52:13Speaker 04

  No, no, no, we understand. This is the company. These are pre-tax dollars. When I say ninety cents on every dollar, I'm talking individual tax. So, this is not about corporate tax. It wouldn't impact anything you're saying about the business, but go ahead.

• 52:27Adam Sosnick?

  But, we're talking about taxes in general.

• 52:28Speaker 04

  No, no, no. There's a difference between personal taxes and corporate taxes.

• 52:32Adam Sosnick?

  Well, if you have an S corp, it flows through to the individual, so it's the same thing. How are you registered with the, with the, uh?

• 52:38Speaker 04

  It's an S corp.

• 52:38Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, so it flows through to you?

• 52:40Speaker 04

  It's pre-tax dollars.

• 52:41Patrick Bet-David?

  It's literally what it does. It's the same as individual, but respect to you. But, you can't take- See, we don't have a problem with you making money and getting rich. We'll be okay with that.

• 52:49Adam Sosnick?

  Honestly, I'm a little disappointed. It was only tens of thousands of dollars. I wish it was millions of dollars. I wish the best for you. But here's the problem, why you can't tax your way to making everybody wealthy?

• 52:58Speaker 04

  No, no, no. I'm not taxing my way to making everybody wealthy. I am taxing, my, understand, the ninety percent tax rate on, on every dollar after four million is to deal with wealth disparity in this country. Because I believe the more you concentrate wealth, the more you concentrate political power.

• 53:17Adam Sosnick?

  Why four million?

• 53:18Speaker 04

  And I believe in democracy.

• 53:19Adam Sosnick?

  Why four million?

• 53:20Speaker 04

  Just because that's what we had for fifteen, twenty years in this country. I mean, it was four hundred and seventy thousand in nineteen forty.

• 53:27Adam Sosnick?

  No, no, no. I, I, I'm, just because I'm a student of history and I really appreciate Ronald Reagan. You know the Reagan story of why he ended up running for governor and for president? Do you know the whole tax story? Let me give it to you real quick.

• 53:38Speaker 04

  I know the story of, uh, GE sending him around to fight against, uh, um, uh, Medicare.

• 53:43Adam Sosnick?

  Okay, but that's not the story.

• 53:45Patrick Bet-David?

  Talking about the tax story that Ronald Reagan basically was like, holy crap. Cause everything with taxes has to do with incentives and motivation. So the story with Reagan was the following.

• 53:57Patrick Bet-David?

  The ta- the top marginal tax rate back in the forties and fifties when Ronald Reagan, before he became a governor, he was a famous what?

• 54:04Speaker 04

  Actor.

• 54:05Patrick Bet-David?

  There we go. We're on the same page.

• 54:06Speaker 04

  Be.

• 54:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Was $200,000. And the equivalent of $200,000 today is 2.5 million. So at $200,000, the top marginal tax rate was your favorite number?

• 54:18Speaker 04

  90%.

• 54:18Patrick Bet-David?

  90%. We're going, we're going somewhere. So do you know his famous quote? I'll do two movies a year. I get paid $100,000 per movie. Tell me why I should go make a third movie. Because if you're going to tax me at 90%.

• 54:33Speaker 04

  And you know what?

• 54:33Patrick Bet-David?

  He shouldn't.

• 54:34Speaker 04

  If you've seen these movies. We didn't miss much.

• 54:36Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, no. Don't go there, guy. Don't go there, guy.

• 54:38Speaker 04

  I don't know what to tell you.

• 54:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Talk numbers.

• 54:39Speaker 04

  If you don't wanna, if you don't wanna make a movie, don't make it.

• 54:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Stop it. The reason he wouldn't make the movie is because he would only keep 10%. He said famously, I can make fricking Gone with the Wind. I wouldn't keep any of the money. It has to do with, you said shtick, carrots and sticks. If you don't incentivize people, if you don't incentivize entrepreneurs.

• 54:59Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 55:00Patrick Bet-David?

  Why will they work harder?

• 55:01Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 55:01Patrick Bet-David?

  Why will they invest?

• 55:02Speaker 04

  So.

• 55:02Patrick Bet-David?

  You just had a great incentive. You killed it. You made tens of thousands of dollars.

• 55:07Speaker 04

  I'm gonna take your metaphor.

• 55:08Patrick Bet-David?

  Do something with that money.

• 55:09Speaker 04

  So what happens when Ronald Reagan gets to that threshold of the, of the wealthiest, the wealthy in the country? Cause that's what it takes, right? To, to be making $4 million a year.

• 55:20Patrick Bet-David?

  But you're, no, no, no. You're, you're making up 4 million like a woozy, a floozy, a woozy.

• 55:24Speaker 04

  2.5.

• 55:25Patrick Bet-David?

  It's 200,000. Yeah, let's use actual math. That's what the correlation is. Yes, yes, yes.

• 55:29Speaker 04

  So if you're making $2.5 million a year, that places you in the top one or 2% I would imagine, maybe even smaller.

• 55:37Patrick Bet-David?

  It's less.

• 55:38Speaker 04

  0.5%.

• 55:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, top 1% is about 600, 500,000 dollars.

• 55:42Speaker 04

  So you're in the top 0.5% of the, of the country.

• 55:45Patrick Bet-David?

  Just like you're in the top 1.0% of a podcaster. You're doing great.

• 55:49Speaker 04

  Top 0.5%. What happens when Ronald Reagan decides, I'm only going to make two movies a year is you get an opportunity to be that actor. And then somebody else gets the opportunity to make that money.

• 56:02Patrick Bet-David?

  So shittier actors get more opportunities.

• 56:05Speaker 04

  It sounds like DEI. No, it's not. Believe me, I've been out in LA. The best actors don't necessarily get every role. And so it gives an opportunity to spread. Oh, it's about centralized, subjective fairness on the altar of greed and jealousy. That's what it is. Because it's not fair that all of these people worked their ass off and did and achieved something. We have to stop them and go get someone else who maybe isn't working hard. Because it's so unfair. Are you telling me that there aren't enough hardworking actors who get to? No, no, no, stop changing it. That's your stick. That's what your stick is. No, it's Sam. What you're saying, I'm asking you a question here because it's about greed and jealousy, isn't it?

• 56:47Speaker 04

  So the greed that you attack is the greed that you that you have. You're sitting there, these people must have been greedy, they got all this money and everything. And you're envious and you're greedy for their money, so we're gonna take it from them. It should be 90%. They'll keep making, oh, but that's good because now we've stopped them from making good movies. It's pretty obvious to everybody how jealous I am of all of you. Uh huh. No, it's not. Not, not everyone. But yes, please, go ahead. About, about incentives. That is why Ronald Reagan brought in Arthur Laffer. The Laffer curve, yes, of course. Explain it. Uh, Laffer curve says that if you, the higher you go up on taxes, the least incentive there is for people to make money. Yeah. Or to try harder or to earn more and work harder and stay late and be an entrepreneur.

• 57:32Speaker 04

  And try to build something. Go on. But the lower you have taxes, you can actually lower taxes and you'll get more revenue. Because these people are gonna actually be more incentivized because they get to keep more. Arthur Laffer was the key advisor to Sam Brownback when he became governor of, of, of Kansas in 2012. You can look this up. People just have to Google Sam Brownback, Kansas, 2012. What happened with the Great Kansas Experiment? He did exactly what Arthur Laffer said. He slashed taxes, slashed taxes for S Corps, etc.

• 58:07Speaker 04

  Within, I think it was two or three years, the Republican legislature rose taxes because revenues had cratered so badly and they had so destroyed what was once the jewel of Kansas, their education system, their higher education system, they rose taxes.

• 58:25Speaker 04

  Well, there you go. I mean, there it is. Kansas provides compelling evidence of the failure of supply-side tax cuts, which is exactly what you're at. Do you know how many, do you know how many case examples I can show of, of cutting taxes? Helps states, helps companies, helps people? Yes, please, show me one. How do you think this company that we're sitting, hold on, Sam, Sam, hold on. Google the state. You want to throw out some, how do you think this company right here?

• 58:46Patrick Bet-David?

  Wait, wait, wait, no, let him, let him say that and respond to it, okay? So, for example, where are we at right now? What state?

• 58:53Speaker 04

  Florida.

• 58:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, can you tell me why, out of all the 50 states in America in 2024 that voted for president, why did 54 50 state become more Republican? Can you tell me why, out of 50 states that voted for president in 2024? Can you tell me why the two state that lost the most people, the only two states in America that lost a trillion dollars of money under management that left their states to another state like Nevada, Texas, and Florida? Can you tell me why those two states, imagine, New York and California, during COVID, lost a trillion dollars of wealth that left to other states? And even after all those people that left, the two states that became more Republican than they were before in 2020 were New York and Texas. Can you tell me why people come to Texas? Why do people go to Nevada? Why do people go to Florida?

• 59:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Why do you think it is? Is it because maybe they don't have state taxes? Why do you think Arthur Laffer is in Tennessee? Why do you think Musk is in Texas? Why do you think Rogan went to Texas? Why do you think California is losing so many jobs?

• 59:49Speaker 04

  I think, I think there are definitely people who like to evade taxes, sure.

• 59:53Patrick Bet-David?

  It's evade taxes. So you see, but no, no, but guys, let me, Sam, respectfully, I just figured out who you are.

• 1:00:01Patrick Bet-David?

  I'm telling you, I just figured out who you are. Deep down inside of you, you have, you are driven by so much power, control, a deep rooted feeling, matching the qualities of a communist that wants to tell you what to do. And you think you know what's best for others, and if it isn't your, uh, your way, everybody else is wrong, and by the way, an extremely unattractive quality, but very, very-

• 1:00:29Speaker 04

  I'm literally just advocating for higher taxes on super wealthy people.

• 1:00:33Patrick Bet-David?

  No, you're not, because what you, what you just said-

• 1:00:35Speaker 04

  Yeah, but super wealthy is not two and a half million.

• 1:00:36Patrick Bet-David?

  What you just said, let me just make the point here. You just said, people who left California and New York, your first response was, "They're evading, as if they have to pay you." That's not how this was, they're evading taxes, these guys are tax evaders, they left. No, it's called, if a company offers better benefits, are you on Rumble?

• 1:00:59Speaker 04

  Uh, I think we, uh, stream on Rumble.

• 1:01:01Patrick Bet-David?

  Where do you, where do you put your video clips the most?

• 1:01:04Speaker 04

  Um-

• 1:01:05Patrick Bet-David?

  YouTube?

• 1:01:06Speaker 04

  YouTube.

• 1:01:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Why, why YouTube?

• 1:01:08Speaker 04

  It's just where, what, what the technology was when we started.

• 1:01:11Patrick Bet-David?

  Why don't you do it on Vimeo?

• 1:01:13Speaker 04

  We do run it through Vimeo.

• 1:01:14Patrick Bet-David?

  Why don't you do all your stuff through Vimeo? Why do you do it on YouTube?

• 1:01:19Speaker 04

  Uh, that's where the most people are.

• 1:01:21Patrick Bet-David?

  And that's where they pay the best?

• 1:01:23Speaker 04

  Well, that's, yeah, I mean, that's where we have the most audience, but if we had a bigger audience, I'd trade-

• 1:01:27Patrick Bet-David?

  You're evading, you're evading the revenue going to another company, you're such an evader of our sponsorship money going to another company that keeps more money of it. You're such an evader.

• 1:01:36Speaker 04

  Shame on you.

• 1:01:36Patrick Bet-David?

  Why are you evading all this sponsorship money, you're such a sponsorship money evader? Sam Seder's a sponsorship money evader, everybody, come on, man.

• 1:01:43Speaker 04

  I'm a, I'm a sponsorship evader, what is it?

• 1:01:46Patrick Bet-David?

  What did you call it? No, you called people leaving California New York tax evaders. See, that's the part-

• 1:01:51Speaker 04

  I think there's a lot of people who leave high tax states for low tax states.

• 1:01:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Is that evading, or is that just common sense and one of them- You just called them tax evaders. I think there's a lot of people that do that.

• 1:02:01Speaker 04

  If they're going for tax, uh, reasons, then they're trying to-

• 1:02:04Patrick Bet-David?

  There's also a lot of people that go to, uh- Lower cost restaurants versus higher cost restaurants. There's people that shop at H and M versus shopping at Gucci. It's called saving money.

• 1:02:15Speaker 04

  Situation.

• 1:02:17Patrick Bet-David?

  If I have to be under someone's watch, like a dictatorship quality like you that thinks you know what's best for others.

• 1:02:26Speaker 04

  You think I'm a dictator?

• 1:02:27Patrick Bet-David?

  Financial dictator. The way you are, where you feel, your first answer was a tax evader. That's how you view them. You don't view them as a, as a asset to the state. You see them as criminals. You just called entrepreneurs that leave New York and California as criminals. Is tax evader a criminal? Rob, can you pull up what a tax evader is? Type in tax evader synonym. Tax evader synonym. What are some tax evader synonyms? Can you go to tax evader synonyms? Tax dodger, tax fraud, tax avoidance? You're calling these people criminals.

• 1:03:04Speaker 04

  A person who tries to avoid paying taxes, often through illegal means.

• 1:03:07Patrick Bet-David?

  Calling somebody who leaves paying taxes. So me, I left, so I left California because.

• 1:03:12Speaker 04

  I'm sorry, I should have said tax avoiders.

• 1:03:15Patrick Bet-David?

  Right, okay, so tax evaders, right.

• 1:03:18Speaker 04

  Avoiders.

• 1:03:19Patrick Bet-David?

  It's, it's, it's called.

• 1:03:20Speaker 04

  Are we good with tax avoiders?

• 1:03:21Patrick Bet-David?

  It's called better opportunities.

• 1:03:23Speaker 04

  Am I a better person if I say tax?

• 1:03:24Patrick Bet-David?

  But Sam, you're also a tax avoider. Better opportunities. Because if you have an S corp, you have what is called as write offs. Well, that's such an evader. And so like when you do, when you write, you do write offs?

• 1:03:33Speaker 04

  Do I do?

• 1:03:35Patrick Bet-David?

  I already know the answer, of course you do. You write off? So you write it off, why you avoided tax? Why would you do such a thing, Sam? You're a tax evader. Tax, it's. Shame on this guy for writing off tax evaders. Call the feds. Here's something that I.

• 1:03:50Speaker 04

  You probably have an accountant helping you.

• 1:03:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, he does. Sam, here's something that I've learned. It's okay to say the following, you ready? Man, I might have been wrong on that one.

• 1:03:58Speaker 04

  I just conceded.

• 1:04:00Patrick Bet-David?

  In anything.

• 1:04:01Speaker 04

  I should have said tax avoider.

• 1:04:03Patrick Bet-David?

  Because where growth happens is we'd be like. Yeah, when you grow, I remember the most amount of money I ever made was in 2016. I was like, oh my God, I'm a millionaire now. It's a tax therapy session. I was like, oh my God, I'm paying all this taxes. I don't like this.

• 1:04:17Speaker 04

  You know what fascinates me about this is that like, I'm talking about policies that impact the country. I'm talking about the implications of taxation on the top 0.5%, top 1% of this country.

• 1:04:32Patrick Bet-David?

  Who pay 50% of taxes, Sam.

• 1:04:34Speaker 04

  And it is boiled down to you guys saying that I'm a bad person.

• 1:04:37Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, no, no. I actually think you're a great person with bad ideas.

• 1:04:43Speaker 04

  I don't care about like, any of you as individuals.

• 1:04:47Patrick Bet-David?

  You same boat as us.

• 1:04:48Speaker 04

  I don't care about me, exactly.

• 1:04:49Patrick Bet-David?

  I don't disrespect you though.

• 1:04:50Speaker 04

  I'm talking about policies. And when we get into policy, I notice how this all pivots. And I don't blame you because frankly, if you tell the American public, and maybe not this audience, because this audience is built on your business, around your business doings and whatnot.

• 1:05:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:06Speaker 04

  But if you tell the American public that they're getting fleeced and they are losing political power to money, they react like they did in Wisconsin. They basically reject it. And so that is...

• 1:05:21Patrick Bet-David?

  What happened in November 5th? What happened on November 5th?

• 1:05:26Speaker 04

  Those people didn't come out. They came out to vote for Donald Trump because Donald Trump is a character that they like.

• 1:05:31Patrick Bet-David?

  Why didn't they come out in 2020?

• 1:05:34Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh.

• 1:05:34Speaker 04

  Why didn't they come out? Because Donald Trump was very close to their experience. And I think, I have a feeling in 2024, they'd also vote him out if he tries to run again.

• 1:05:45Patrick Bet-David?

  Can you imagine, like, you had four years of a guy, his name is Donald Trump. Then this motivational speaker named Joe Biden shows up, and he fills up the arenas. And he wins. Every time he spoke, 200, 300,000 people would show up to just hear this man give a speech. Like one of those great orators.

• 1:06:03Speaker 04

  No, that's the thing. Biden was a complete placeholder for not Donald Trump.

• 1:06:07Patrick Bet-David?

  This guy gets up there and he crushes Trump.

• 1:06:12Patrick Bet-David?

  And you guys are like, oh, he got so destroyed, crushes Trump. Look at the way Biden beat Trump. People don't want a person like Trump. And in America, watched all the policies that you support. Biden comes president, he does what he does. Four years later, his vice president, his VP Kamala Harris.

• 1:06:32Speaker 04

  Google antitrust and see how popular it is.

• 1:06:35Patrick Bet-David?

  His VP runs for office, okay, runs for office, loses every battleground state. Eighty-nine county, fifty for fifty states become more Republican. And you're sitting here saying, you guys think you got better policies?

• 1:06:50Speaker 04

  No, I think Kamala Harris, Kamala Harris is, I mean, I think, look. I think it was, uh, what Biden did in staying in was atrocious. He should have gotten out way earlier. There's a story coming out now of like Ron Klain coming, seeing him before the debate and realizing the guy was a mess. Um, and I think Harris's campaign was also poorly run. Um, I think that, you know, we, nobody could tell what her policies were. Mark Cuban's going out there saying, we're gonna get rid of, right, I agree. Mark Cuban's coming out there saying like, oh, don't worry, she's not gonna do any more of this antitrust stuff. Uh, on one hand, I don't want a billionaire coming out and speaking for my candidate.

• 1:07:30Patrick Bet-David?

  Um, did you, did you vote for her? Did you sit that one out?

• 1:07:33Speaker 04

  No, I voted for her.

• 1:07:35Patrick Bet-David?

  You voted for Kamala? Why, why, just because?

• 1:07:38Speaker 04

  I voted.

• 1:07:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Hold on, hold on, I want to, what did, what did, I want to, hold on. You voted, this is what drives me crazy about your side. You guys voted?

• 1:07:48Speaker 04

  I voted for the lesser of two either.

• 1:07:49Patrick Bet-David?

  That is un, what policy were you going for? What do you think that she was gonna do different? What, what can you possibly, I would rather have you sit that one out, Sam, go ahead.

• 1:07:57Speaker 04

  I'll tell you.

• 1:07:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Go ahead.

• 1:07:59Speaker 04

  She was not going to, uh, cut social security functioning. She's not gonna cut the USDA. She's not gonna cut the FDA. She's not gonna lose us $500 billion worth of, of, of, uh, return on investment with the IRS. She's not gonna cut, um, the Bureau of Labor Statistics. She's not gonna cut 300.

• 1:08:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Investment, investment. Investments.

• 1:08:22Speaker 04

  Return on investment. Yeah, every dollar that you give to the IRS would get six or seven back. She's not gonna cut the museum and library.

• 1:08:32Speaker 04

  Google it. Every dollar spent at the IRS gets six back in returns. They're anticipating the cuts from Doge, the cuts from Doge are gonna cost the, our government $500 billion.

• 1:08:47Patrick Bet-David?

  According to who? Studies suggest.

• 1:08:49Speaker 04

  Alright, I undersold it a little bit.

• 1:08:51Patrick Bet-David?

  According to who?

• 1:08:52Speaker 04

  Okay, well, you can spend time attacking the people who do these calculations. Do you need me to tell you more about why?

• 1:08:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, I'm just curious, yeah, I'm just curious to what-

• 1:09:01Speaker 04

  Just rando tariffs applied in a willy-nilly fashion that crashed the economy.

• 1:09:08Patrick Bet-David?

  So you don't, so you don't think the tariffs that Trump is, and I get it, that's exactly, the tariffs are exactly what America needs right now, because, let's just go to the border. What he did with the border, with Mexico, with the tariffs, what happened to fentanyl? What happened to all the deaths? What happened to all those illegals that are caught? What do you mean? He threatened them and they went-

• 1:09:24Speaker 04

  Fentanyl comes across the border at ports of entry.

• 1:09:28Patrick Bet-David?

  Fentanyl?

• 1:09:30Speaker 04

  Yeah, fentanyl comes across the border, not in illegals crossing the desert, it comes in-

• 1:09:35Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, really? Coyotes and, oh, really?

• 1:09:37Speaker 04

  It comes in, it comes in at ports of entry. Google that!

• 1:09:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam, I don't need to Google, but it's like-

• 1:09:45Speaker 04

  Yes, you do!

• 1:09:46Patrick Bet-David?

  You said you voted for, you voted for someone, you're coming up with these policies, the worst pick ever, the biggest loss ever, she lost everything because your side, you're talking about-

• 1:09:58Speaker 04

  I don't even know what that-

• 1:09:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Guys, let me ask you a question. You're acting like your whole side was surprised that Biden wasn't there. Everybody knew, including you, he wasn't there at all, but you guys are like, he's just not Trump. The worst president in the history of the world are, of this country, four years, because you guys were pretending that he was all there and we knew it. And who was making all the decisions? Who was making all the decisions? Who was signing all the shit? Who was signing off? How many times did you have to see Biden sitting there and they'd ask him a question and he'd go, "Oh, I can't because they told me I couldn't." He wasn't in charge. Yeah, who was they? Come on, Sam. It's like the most devastating loss. The world, the country is over it.

• 1:10:38Patrick Bet-David?

  You guys aren't pivoting, okay? And if you think the future is Gavin Newsom, AOC, Bernie Sanders, and Jasmine Crockett, you guys are doomed. Nothing is going to change. And Elon Musk, you think Elon Musk is a net positive or a net negative for society for what he's doing? And pointing out what the hell, these people have been screwing us for all these years and he's pointing out. You guys are mad at the person pointing out who robbed from you than the actual robber. That's the truth, bro. Yeah, he's a billionaire. You think he's doing it because he needs the money?

• 1:11:08Speaker 04

  What fraud has he found?

• 1:11:09Patrick Bet-David?

  What do you mean? How much, how much fraud has he found?

• 1:11:12Speaker 04

  Yeah, where's the person who is going to be indicted for fraud?

• 1:11:16Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, what about the waste?

• 1:11:17Speaker 04

  What waste?

• 1:11:18Patrick Bet-David?

  Because it's not, stop it, Sam.

• 1:11:20Speaker 04

  What waste? They just cut the, the, they cut, they cut the agency that provides 295 million dollars to museums and libraries. You appreciate libraries, don't you? I know how much reading is important to you and your kids.

• 1:11:33Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam, you're pinpointing the one good thing that they probably did. What about the waste of countries all around the world? For LGBTQ agendas in Rwanda or something?

• 1:11:41Speaker 04

  The money you're talking about is a fraction of a percentage. And if we wanted to get rid of that money, there is a way of doing it. And that is to have Congress vote and reverse what they authorized in the first place.

• 1:11:56Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam.

• 1:11:56Speaker 04

  But to have a billionaire come in and decide based upon what his personal preferences are, that he's going to cut government in this way. I'm sorry, that's not democracy. It's not even remotely close to it.

• 1:12:08Patrick Bet-David?

  He doesn't have the power to do anything. He makes a suggestion and then the administration will do it. Why do you think Americans voted for this?

• 1:12:14Speaker 04

  I don't think Americans heard the word Doge outside of it being some type of crypto before.

• 1:12:21Patrick Bet-David?

  Why do you think, why do you think Americans voted for Trump?

• 1:12:24Speaker 04

  Well, I think because they're, they want change.

• 1:12:27Patrick Bet-David?

  In what? What were they not happy with?

• 1:12:29Speaker 04

  I think inflation was a big part of it for them.

• 1:12:31Patrick Bet-David?

  What else do you think?

• 1:12:34Speaker 04

  I think for a, for, for a, 90% of his voters voted for Mitt Romney. I think there is a, the Republican Party wants to, you know, have tax cuts.

• 1:12:48Patrick Bet-David?

  How do we get inflation? How does inflation happen? Can we stay in 2024? You said inflation. Tom, give me one second. How does inflation happen?

• 1:12:54Speaker 04

  Inflation can happen a couple of different ways. Inflation can happen because you have too much monetary supply.

• 1:12:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 1:13:00Speaker 04

  Uh, inflation can happen in terms of both from a monetary supply level or a fiscal stimulus.

• 1:13:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Right.

• 1:13:07Speaker 04

  And inflation can also happen if you have a once in a lifetime pandemic that completely screws up all of your logistics. And so you've got, uh, um, you know, shipping containers that usually cost four grand to ship, but now they cost 22 grand to get because they're in far flung places because the, the pandemic screwed up.

• 1:13:28Patrick Bet-David?

  That was in 2021.

• 1:13:29Speaker 04

  Well, it reverberates through the thing. We saw inflation dropping through 2024.

• 1:13:34Patrick Bet-David?

  Sure.

• 1:13:34Speaker 04

  We saw, I mean, we saw rate cuts, uh, on the table because we saw inflation drop.

• 1:13:38Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you think any of it was with, uh, uh, again, so those are the main two issues. You don't think anything else. So you mainly think it was inflation and your second point was, um?

• 1:13:50Speaker 04

  Well, I think in, in large, large part, we have structural problems in this country. And that's why we keep getting change elections where we keep going back and forth, back and forth.

• 1:13:59Patrick Bet-David?

  What was, what was?

• 1:14:00Speaker 04

  And I would say those structural problems range from, I, I think a lot of them have to do with wealth inequality.

• 1:14:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay. So, so you think Democrats are better, better at helping wealth inequality or Republicans?

• 1:14:11Speaker 04

  I think Democrats are marginally better.

• 1:14:14Patrick Bet-David?

  Tell me, but due to what policy?

• 1:14:16Speaker 04

  Well, taxation helps. Uh, that's a big part. Strengthening labor, I think, uh, uh, you know, during Biden, I have a lot of problems with Biden, but they-

• 1:14:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Where 6% of the workers work from home. Yeah.

• 1:14:27Speaker 04

  Labor, I mean, strengthening labor, strength in the marketplace helps with wealth inequality. I think antitrust goes a long way, uh, to wealth inequality because it, it literally is to break up the concentration of wealth.

• 1:14:40Patrick Bet-David?

  Here's the other question for you. So Trump's closed up the border, right? where we are not getting like this numbers have dropped dramatically.

• 1:14:46Speaker 04

  Well, I mean, if you go back and look in the and I don't necessarily agree with Biden doing this. But if you go back and look at the numbers starting in the summer of 2024, maybe a little bit before.

• 1:14:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Stop it.

• 1:14:56Speaker 04

  I'm sorry, go look, just put it up there.

• 1:14:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, when he started.

• 1:15:00Speaker 04

  But listen, I'm not in favor of him doing this, but he did do it. Wait, put up the graph of.

• 1:15:06Patrick Bet-David?

  So you mean in an election year, in an election year, he tried to slow down the border. Let me just get through this, and then guys, here's what I'd like to do.

• 1:15:11Speaker 04

  I'm not in favor of it, but he did it.

• 1:15:12Patrick Bet-David?

  Here's I'd like to do. I'd like to get through some stories, but I just want to close the knot here and move on because we're not gonna make any progress here.

• 1:15:18Speaker 04

  See if you can get a graph of that.

• 1:15:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Rob, if you just want to show up graph on immigration from 2021, 22, 22, is that the chart you want to see? What do you want to see?

• 1:15:28Speaker 04

  Let's see the one over the past, you said he dropped it dramatically in January, and I'm suggesting to you, if you look at the past 12 months.

• 1:15:37Patrick Bet-David?

  It's the, okay, Rob, do me a favor, find the chart on immediately when Trump comes in, what happens to illegal immigration in America? While you're doing that, here's a question for you. 10 million illegal immigrants escaped through the border in four years under Biden. Way more. You're saying it's more.

• 1:15:54Speaker 04

  What's the number of undocumented immigrants you think we have in this country right now?

• 1:15:57Patrick Bet-David?

  The, what I'm asking is those four years. How many do we have during those four years?

• 1:16:01Speaker 04

  That, that came across?

• 1:16:03Patrick Bet-David?

  Through that we have according to credible sources, what's the number you hear?

• 1:16:07Speaker 04

  That were, that are in the country now or actually just crossed?

• 1:16:09Patrick Bet-David?

  That came through illegally during those four years.

• 1:16:11Speaker 04

  I would imagine it's probably close to like five, six, maybe to 10 million.

• 1:16:16Patrick Bet-David?

  Let's say 10 million. Tom Hobart said 10 million. Let's say it's 10 million, let's say it's 10 million, but give or take 2 million. Let's just say it's 10 million, the number, okay? Those 10 million people that are coming here, are they rich?

• 1:16:26Speaker 04

  No, vast majority of them, I would say.

• 1:16:28Patrick Bet-David?

  Are poor, right? Okay, that they're coming here. Who does that benefit? They're gonna need jobs, right? And what are they willing to work for?

• 1:16:37Speaker 04

  Oh, I, I, I, I think they're going to get exploited without a doubt if that's where you go with it.

• 1:16:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, so let me get this straight. So, so who do they benefit? Do they benefit larger corporations that get cheap labor?

• 1:16:49Speaker 04

  They benefit, yes.

• 1:16:50Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, so let me get this straight.

• 1:16:51Speaker 04

  Meat processing plants and whatnot. Oh, that's why I want them to have documents. Great, let them come to the border.

• 1:16:59Patrick Bet-David?

  So.

• 1:16:59Speaker 04

  Give them documents so that they can get worker protections.

• 1:17:03Patrick Bet-David?

  So then if that's the case, you know what that validates? Joe Biden and the Democratic policies are better for the billionaires than Trump's are. Because they brought in cheap labor and that cheap labor helps who? Helps the rich.

• 1:17:18Speaker 04

  Oh, I am in favor of, of a, a path to citizenship that is much easier.

• 1:17:24Patrick Bet-David?

  And by the way, those 10 million people that came here illegally, give or take.

• 1:17:27Speaker 04

  And that was in that bill that they suggested in, in the fall of 2023 that Trump said he didn't want because he wanted to keep it as a, an issue.

• 1:17:36Patrick Bet-David?

  Who do those 10 million people take jobs away from? Who do they take jobs away from?

• 1:17:41Speaker 04

  I don't know that they take jobs away from that many, no.

• 1:17:44Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, really?

• 1:17:44Speaker 04

  We are at, when I, in, in 20 years ago, we were told that the lowest unemployment that it was possible to have with a functioning economy was what? You remember? It was something like 6 to 8%. And now our unemployment is at 4%. And so I. And it was lower than that before. I continue, I, I.

• 1:18:04Patrick Bet-David?

  You're not answering the question though. Who do those people take jobs away from?

• 1:18:07Speaker 04

  I, I, I have answered it. I think largely they don't take jobs away from people.

• 1:18:11Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, they don't?

• 1:18:12Speaker 04

  Of course they do.

• 1:18:13Patrick Bet-David?

  Perfect. I love what you just said. You think they don't take jobs away from anybody? Perfect. So if we go and we look at when China started trading, let me make the point, when China came through and was able to bring labor to us, 1971, it was called the Pink Pong Agreement that they had where, you know, we can send labor there and labor at the time was 8 cents to 20 cents an hour, where for us, minimum wage was a buck 60. Then in 2001, when the Clinton policies helped China join the World Trade Organization and at the time, minimum wage in China was 20 cents to 50 cents, depending on different regions and for us was 5.15. We lost 6 million manufacturing jobs, give or take, the next seven years.

• 1:18:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Michigan, you got Indiana, you got all these other places. Where did those jobs go to? Who did they replace? Who lost those jobs? What happened to Detroit?

• 1:19:03Speaker 04

  All that manufacturing went to China.

• 1:19:04Patrick Bet-David?

  That's right. So what do you think these 10 million people that come here? Who are they gonna take jobs away from? Americans who are here legally. Those jobs are gonna go to somebody that's cheap labor.

• 1:19:13Speaker 04

  That was the movement of capital. Capital decided that it was cheaper for them to move to China.

• 1:19:19Patrick Bet-David?

  I'm specifically talking about last four years. So when you're saying labor's not gonna be taken from people in America, that's the credibility you lose. That's where people in 2000... Rob, can you play the clip with Stephen A. Smith? Who has been a staunch supporter of the Democratic Party for decades? And now Stephen A. Smith is being called as a member of MAGA. You know, Rob, we can't play the whole thing. Can you go to the main part? Do you know the main part or no? I do. Right after he reads this is when he responds. Okay, let's see what he says, Rob. Go for it.

• 1:19:50Adam Sosnick?

  This Owens, Sean Hannity and other prominent voices from the right on this podcast as reasons for his premise. Here's a portion of what he wrote on msnbc.com in an article titled ESPN Stephen A. Smith is a megaphone for MAGA propaganda. Jones says, quote, "Stephen A. Smith's embrace of the MAGA movement and its influencers has only continued. In recent days, for example, he has spoken with right-wing commentators, Ben Shapiro, Megyn Kelly and Bill O'Reilly. You might be thinking that these were adversarial chats between a left-leaning centrist and a conservative. But to adroit listeners, they can come across more as conservatives

• 1:20:34Adam Sosnick?

  in friendly discussion than anything else. Smith's overt politicism seems to fly in the face of ESPN's apparent effort in recent years to deter some of its talent from speaking on controversial political matters. Either way, the network's most..." Recognizable host is now regularly platforming MAGA propaganda at will. End quote. Now, um, my team reached out to Jones to have a discussion about the article. I wanted to invite him on the show to talk with me one on one personally. I hope we get the opportunity to have that dialogue. He was busy. He didn't avoid the call or anything like that. It was no comment or anything like that. He didn't say anything. He was just very, very busy. I hope we called it the last minute. No shade on him. That's why it didn't happen.

• 1:21:19Adam Sosnick?

  But in the meantime, let me express to you what I think about what he wrote.

• 1:21:25Adam Sosnick?

  I think that's the exact problem with the left.

• 1:21:29Adam Sosnick?

  You see, if I don't agree with you, I must be MAGA.

• 1:21:35Adam Sosnick?

  It must be the case.

• 1:21:38Adam Sosnick?

  I'm platforming MAGA propaganda. Is that so? I don't view it that way. First of all, even though Eileen left, particularly with how I vote with presidential elections, I want to emphasize that I've always been a centrist my entire life. I've never once described myself as a Democrat or a Republican. I'm a centrist. I'm a moderate. I don't trust either side. I'm not on one side or the other hook, line or sinker. You will see images or you'll hear me rattle off names of people who've been on this show.

• 1:22:16Adam Sosnick?

  Yes, you see Ben Shapiro there. Yes, you see Bill O'Reilly there. Yes, I was recently on Meghan's, Meghan Kelly's show. Did you know I'm on News Nation with Chris Cuomo every week?

• 1:22:29Adam Sosnick?

  Did you know that I just appeared with Jake Tapper? On CNN? Do you know I've been on MSNBC on several occasions?

• 1:22:38Speaker 00

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• 1:23:40Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you know? You can pause it here. Yeah, Sean. So, do you know what happens when a guy like Stephen A. Smith? He said he's always voted left when it comes on to presidential candidates that he has. So, he's not a guy that voted for Trump, right? When a guy like him comes out and he says, what the hell is going on with the Democratic Party?

• 1:24:01Speaker 04

  Is that what he said there?

• 1:24:02Patrick Bet-David?

  And, and, oh, he said it many. You must, you must not follow what he says because he has said that nonstop the last two months, three months.

• 1:24:09Speaker 04

  No, I don't follow it.

• 1:24:09Patrick Bet-David?

  You should. He's actually very good. He's reasonable. It would be good for you to watch. I like his approach. I think he's a.

• 1:24:14Speaker 04

  Do you guys identify as MAGA?

• 1:24:17Patrick Bet-David?

  No.

• 1:24:18Speaker 04

  Do any of you guys identify as MAGA?

• 1:24:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Here's my question. What, the guy's a question?

• 1:24:21Speaker 04

  He seems to think it's an insult.

• 1:24:23Patrick Bet-David?

  Yo, that's what I'm saying. Make America Great Again? It shouldn't be in a, if you want to make America great again, I'm all in. Call me MAGA all freaking day. Call it, yeah. I'm MAGA. I'm MAGA. I just, I'm MAGA. I just want to make America great.

• 1:24:34Speaker 04

  He seems to take it as an insult.

• 1:24:35Patrick Bet-David?

  No. I am America first. I'm America first. I voted for Trump in 2016. I voted for him 2020. In 2022, when people were leaving to the DeSantis camp, I stayed on the Trump camp. I've never been off that camp. He's the right guy for America and I've been a registered independent now for about 17 years.

• 1:24:54Speaker 04

  What do you think about these tariffs?

• 1:24:56Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, stay on this topic here with Stephen A. We'll go to tariffs next.

• 1:24:59Speaker 04

  What is the topic? That some guy from, I've never heard of, from?

• 1:25:02Patrick Bet-David?

  I've never heard of Stephen A. Smith?

• 1:25:04Speaker 04

  No, the guy who wrote the, the.

• 1:25:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Thank God. If you didn't hear of Stephen A. Yeah, but what, when you think about Stephen A., you know, what he's been talking about lately with the Democratic Party having issues?

• 1:25:12Speaker 04

  He's a centrist. I don't have to subscribe to what a centrist's perspective. I mean, he's a centrist like Gavin Newsom is a centrist. Gavin Newsom is saying the exact same thing as Stephen A. Smith.

• 1:25:26Patrick Bet-David?

  How? Because he realizes that progressive policies have been a disaster.

• 1:25:29Speaker 04

  Okay, I mean, so that's, that's.

• 1:25:31Patrick Bet-David?

  He's a centrist, hasn't he? A week ago, when he realized progressiveness is horrible. Maybe it's because. Sam, Sam.

• 1:25:37Speaker 04

  I, I, I just, you don't understand. You guys don't seem to understand. I have a set of politics. I don't care what Stephen A. Smith does. I don't care what Gavin Newsom does.

• 1:25:47Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 1:25:48Speaker 04

  I don't, I don't care.

• 1:25:49Patrick Bet-David?

  So you're rigid, you're not changing anything?

• 1:25:51Speaker 04

  It's not a question of I'm rigid and I'm not changing anything. Like, I, uh, uh, there are specifics, like, you know, over time, I have had a different perspective on the deficit, uh, over the past 20 years and understood it in a different way.

• 1:26:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Liberal over the last 20 years. You've become more of a leftist and progressive. You gotta be more malleable. You gotta be more malleable, buddy.

• 1:26:11Speaker 04

  I mean, to the extent, like, I don't, you know, like, you guys have these, like, labels that you like to, to, to use, and, and there's some type of gradation.

• 1:26:19Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 1:26:20Speaker 04

  But I've always been, I've always been about where I am in terms of taxation, but I am for a little bit more decomodification probably than I was 20 years ago.

• 1:26:30Patrick Bet-David?

  So, and, and, and all I'm saying here before, look, I'm gonna go to the audience. Audience, we're coming to here in a second to go through some of the stories here.

• 1:26:35Speaker 04

  Why? We're gonna talk about tariffs?

• 1:26:37Patrick Bet-David?

  We're gonna talk about whatever stories we go through, but the one thing we did learn here with you is, America grew up the last four years. Adam, sorry about that. America grew up the last four years. Many Democrats grew up. Every state became more Republican because of the horrible policies on the left. Whether it was how they handled COVID, what they did with our kids, how they handled people that didn't want to take the vaccine, and people were fed up. And they voted for a guy who had already been president for four years. So it's not like they said they want something new. They said, no, we want to go back to the guy previous to that guy. That is the biggest black eye to Obama, to Kamala, to Democrats, to everybody on the left.

• 1:27:21Patrick Bet-David?

  When they went back to the guy that they said they didn't want four years later, saying, it's like an ex coming back and saying, babe, I messed up. I should have never gone with the other guy. You were my guy. Or guy, babe, I screwed up. I should have never left you for the other girl. I'm such a dummy. Please, Trump, come back. That's what America did. And a guy like you.

• 1:27:41Speaker 04

  I'm not a big fan of Obama's and I'm not a big fan of Harris's either.

• 1:27:47Patrick Bet-David?

  But the point is you still haven't graduated Sanders. That's like 7th grade. The people that follow Sanders and AOC are in 7th grade, 8th grade. Their heroes are in high school. Your philosophies are popular in high schools, not with adults. The policies that you support are high school policies.

• 1:28:04Speaker 04

  They were not popular when I was in high school.

• 1:28:04Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, are you kidding me? Karl Marx was a hero in kids that went to high school because teachers were feeding the Karl Marx stuff.

• 1:28:11Speaker 04

  Uh, well, I went to high school, Ronald Reagan was president. I can assure you that, um, and the wall still existed and uh, there is fear of communism and that socialism was barely ever expressed.

• 1:28:26Patrick Bet-David?

  You're a step away from communism. Like socialism is a step away from communism. That's kind of where you are. You're like, you're right there saying, guys, I don't want to fully publicly say I'm a communist. I'll stay in this room.

• 1:28:36Speaker 04

  No, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not even, I don't even identify as a socialist either.

• 1:28:41Patrick Bet-David?

  You're a progressive though.

• 1:28:42Speaker 04

  I, I would say I'm a progressive.

• 1:28:44Patrick Bet-David?

  So what's right of progressive, what's left of progressive? I know you're not big on labels, but just humor me. What's right and left of being a progressive?

• 1:28:53Speaker 04

  I'm probably a social Democrat, so I would say that there is a certain amount of society where I believe we do not need the private market to, to deliver it. It is less efficient. So when it comes to health insurance, we have already in this country, one third, maybe a little more actually, on, uh, some form of government health insurance. The VA is actually government healthcare. The doctors work for the government and that is actually gets very, very high marks.

• 1:29:25Patrick Bet-David?

  And all I hear is good things about the VA. The VA gets high marks?

• 1:29:29Speaker 04

  The healthcare does, yeah.

• 1:29:30Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, time out, time out. That's 100% false. I get the worst service from the VA. Let's just, and I'm a veteran and he's a veteran. He doesn't go to the VA. I go to the VA. I, I called yesterday just to make an example in our, in our, in our work area. I called, nobody's picking up the phone for me to get an appointment. Zero. And when you go there, it's the most depressing thing. But the good news is when you go to like get your, um, DMV, the driver's license, that's great service, right? No, that's the best. Yeah, that's the best. No, the VA, the same, the VA is not good.

• 1:29:58Speaker 04

  The states run the DMVs, but my experience at the DMV is not that bad.

• 1:30:04Patrick Bet-David?

  You want to go to Terry?

• 1:30:05Tom Ellsworth?

  Respectfully, there's one thing you said, there's one thing you said. You said the private market is less efficient. We can look at 250 years of government and everything we've got here. I just can't get past that.

• 1:30:14Speaker 04

  What's the administrative cost for Medicare?

• 1:30:16Tom Ellsworth?

  And if that's your, if that's your feeling... Hang on. If that's your, your, one of your foundational beliefs that the private markets will be less efficient, then it's no wonder where you are. I'm not going to pick on it. If that's your foundational belief, then I...

• 1:30:30Speaker 04

  What is the administrative cost for Medicare?

• 1:30:34Tom Ellsworth?

  Tell us.

• 1:30:35Speaker 04

  Two to three cents of every dollar Medicare is spent on administrative costs. And the private health insurance...

• 1:30:42Tom Ellsworth?

  Administrative defined as what? You got to be careful. I got to be careful when I hear things like that because guess what? You go back and you look at, well, I was only counting this. I'm not counting this. It's like the same way...

• 1:30:53Speaker 04

  You have a dollar...

• 1:30:54Tom Ellsworth?

  Same way you're side with count unemployment and come out later and readjust all the stats.

• 1:30:58Speaker 04

  97 to 98 cents actually goes to paying Medicare providers, doctors, you know, labs and whatnot.

• 1:31:07Tom Ellsworth?

  We're going to move on because your core tenet...

• 1:31:09Patrick Bet-David?

  Let me answer the question, Tom.

• 1:31:10Tom Ellsworth?

  Your core tenet that the private markets are less efficient is wrong.

• 1:31:14Speaker 04

  It is 17 cents on every dollar.

• 1:31:16Tom Ellsworth?

  And if that's your foundation, we can't discuss anything.

• 1:31:17Speaker 04

  Because they're paying for advertising, they're paying for shareholder value, et cetera, et cetera. So for every dollar you spend and, and on top of which, anybody who has private health insurance, who deals with it themselves, knows it's like having a second job. Just to either get reimbursed or you get, you, you get to figure out every year when you re-sign up, is my doctor in or out of the program? It's a mess. It's a disaster. It is the most inefficient possible...

• 1:31:43Tom Ellsworth?

  Well, Medicare is so good and so wonderful.

• 1:31:44Speaker 04

  People love Medicare.

• 1:31:46Tom Ellsworth?

  Why was Medicare and Medicare Advantage invented? It's so good Medicare, it's everything for you.

• 1:31:51Speaker 04

  Because the Republicans wanted to privatize it and it is widely understood...

• 1:31:55Tom Ellsworth?

  Oh, I don't get benefits, okay.

• 1:31:56Speaker 04

  That Medicaid, that Medicare Advantage is the worst part of Medicare and people get sucked into it and they find out that they've been hoodwinked.

• 1:32:06Speaker 04

  I mean, these are all easily found data points.

• 1:32:08Tom Ellsworth?

  Sam, did you fly here?

• 1:32:10Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 1:32:10Tom Ellsworth?

  Did you go through TSA? Did you go through TSA PreCheck? Did you go through Clear? Who'd you, what'd you go through?

• 1:32:16Speaker 04

  On the way here, my TSA PreCheck was not on the thing, so I just went through.

• 1:32:20Tom Ellsworth?

  That's messed up. You paid for it though, right?

• 1:32:22Speaker 04

  Yeah, it was 60 bucks for the TSA.

• 1:32:24Tom Ellsworth?

  I'm saying, but you pay, I think, it was like a 500 bucks or 100 bucks for five years for TSA PreCheck?

• 1:32:29Speaker 04

  TSA PreCheck, I think, is $65 for five years.

• 1:32:32Tom Ellsworth?

  That's amazing. It's a great deal. Why don't you do Clear?

• 1:32:35Speaker 04

  I don't want to do a private company.

• 1:32:37Tom Ellsworth?

  TSA PreCheck is basically like a public-private partnership.

• 1:32:41Speaker 04

  No, TSA PreCheck is, TSA PreCheck is the government.

• 1:32:45Tom Ellsworth?

  You pay a little bit more.

• 1:32:47Speaker 04

  I'm not going to give my biometrics to Clear.

• 1:32:50Patrick Bet-David?

  He looks at private companies and he frowns about, frowns upon private companies.

• 1:32:55Tom Ellsworth?

  Is that what's going on?

• 1:32:56Patrick Bet-David?

  That's all it is.

• 1:32:57Tom Ellsworth?

  Oh, I didn't fully understand.

• 1:32:58Patrick Bet-David?

  He said, "I'm not going to give my money to a private company."

• 1:33:01Tom Ellsworth?

  And meanwhile, you own and run one.

• 1:33:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, so let's, let's go to the next story with terrorists.

• 1:33:07Tom Ellsworth?

  Can we stay there for a second, please? You don't want to give money to a private company, but you are a private company.

• 1:33:11Speaker 04

  Well, I don't want to give my biometric information to a private company.

• 1:33:15Tom Ellsworth?

  You're using it as a... Or your dollars. What about just private companies in general?

• 1:33:18Speaker 04

  I'm happily fine with TSA PreCheck.

• 1:33:20Patrick Bet-David?

  We already got it. I'm moving, Adam.

• 1:33:23Tom Ellsworth?

  Okay. I'm, I'm learning.

• 1:33:24Patrick Bet-David?

  I'm moving on. No, I already learned. I understand.

• 1:33:26Tom Ellsworth?

  Okay, gotcha, gotcha.

• 1:33:27Patrick Bet-David?

  It's great, so we know what the argument is.

• 1:33:28Tom Ellsworth?

  Progressive.

• 1:33:29Patrick Bet-David?

  Trump set to unleash Liberation Day tariffs. President Trump will unveil Liberation Day tariffs on Wednesday at 4:00 PM.

• 1:33:38Speaker 04

  That was yesterday.

• 1:33:39Patrick Bet-David?

  That was yesterday. In a White House's Rose Garden, promising to stop America being ripped off and deliver a new golden age of US industry. Though US White House, White House President Clinton said that he was still perfecting it to make sure it's a perfect deal with advisors less than 24 hours before. Trump, who on Monday claimed he'd be very kind, has kept details vogue with reports suggesting options from reciprocal tariffs to a 20% blanket rate or preferential treatment for some nations. Rob, if you want to play this, is this yesterday, Rob, or is this? This is yesterday from the Rose Garden. Okay, fantastic. Go for it.

• 1:34:16Adam Sosnick?

  My fellow Americans, this is Liberation Day. I've waited for a long time.

• 1:34:23Speaker 04

  You're all about to be liberated from your money.

• 1:34:26Adam Sosnick?

  April 2nd, 2025 will forever be remembered as the day American industry was reborn.

• 1:34:31Tom Ellsworth?

  The day America's destiny was reclaimed and the day that we began to make America wealthy again. We're gonna make it wealthy, good and wealthy. I also have another clip. This is the president discussing how the tariffs will help eliminate income tax possibly. From 1789 to 1913, we were a tariff-backed nation and the United States was proportionately the wealthiest it has ever been. So wealthy, in fact, that in the 1880s, they established a commission to decide what they were going to do with the vast sums of money they were collecting. We were collecting so much money so fast, we didn't know what to do with it. Isn't that a nice problem to have? What do you think, Marco?

• 1:35:16Tom Ellsworth?

  Good problem? Marco would love that problem. But we don't have that problem anymore, but we're not gonna have it very much longer, I will tell you. But they collected so much money. Favorite word. They actually formed a commission to determine what they were gonna do with the money, who they were gonna give it to and how much. Then in 1913, for reasons unknown to mankind, they established the income tax so that citizens, rather than foreign countries, would start paying the money necessary to run our government. Then in 1929, it all came to a very abrupt end with the Great Depression, and it would have never happened if they had stayed with the tariff policy. It would have been a much different story.

• 1:35:57Tom Ellsworth?

  They tried to bring back tariffs to save our country, but it was gone. It was gone. It was too late. Nothing could have been done. Took years and years to get out of that depression, far longer than even FDR had that office right over there for a long period of time. The ramp system, it's rather intricate, was built because of him, and every time you walk up, you think of him, and he did a great job in many ways, but it lasted long beyond his terms, as you know. But it's not too late any longer, and we're going to start being smart and we're gonna start being very wealthy again. We're gonna be wealthy as a country because they've taken so much of our wealth away from us. We're not gonna let that happen.

• 1:36:41Tom Ellsworth?

  And we truly can be very wealthy. We can be so much wealthier than any country. It's not even believable, but we're getting smart.

• 1:36:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, Tom, your thoughts on this, and I'm gonna come to you.

• 1:36:51Speaker 04

  So, markets love continuity, even if continuity is rooted in, you know, trade inequality and things have been going on for decades.

• 1:37:01Patrick Bet-David?

  Yep.

• 1:37:02Speaker 04

  And to get through the shift, to get through the food poisoning, it's gonna, we can see markets react to sentiment, and markets don't know what to make of this. How many tariffs are gonna stay for a day versus a week versus a month? You don't know. How many tariffs are gonna shift? Israel actually backed down and said, okay, we're done. Yesterday, correct? Israel went, hang on, we're good, we're backing off, we're done here. Interesting. Canada moved a couple of them. Not the rest of them, Canada's still figuring it out, but they're blinking. Canada is blinking. So now the question is gonna be, how long does all this take? And the markets, you know, the markets don't like it. The markets don't like the sentiment of uncertainty. And that's why you have Jim Cramer and other people, oh, we're getting

• 1:37:46Speaker 04

  killed out here. You're getting killed because you like the status quo that you had a minute ago, because you knew how to play that game, and you knew how those markets worked. And respectfully, they're there to trade and make money in increasing market. What is easier? It's easier to stay yesterday with what we've got, or there's a greater goal. And the greater goal is American jobs, and the jobs report was better than people thought. Huh, interesting. That's not a headline. Why is that buried? And you've got the uncertainty of the markets. Now, the uncertainty of markets makes everybody look at their 401K and look at the things and be concerned. And yes, there's concern there. But you gotta look down the street and see where we're going. And it is not easy to get through the food poisoning, but there

• 1:38:30Speaker 04

  is life on the other side, and you can see that's what the president is talking about. And I think we gotta trust it, and we gotta look at what's going on. We can already see little islands of change going on, so let's find out how everybody else moves on these tariffs.

• 1:38:44Speaker 00

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• 1:39:45Speaker 04

  You said tariff was the last word. That was the only time you used the word tariffs. Look, I am in favor of tariffs when it is part of a specific agenda to build a certain industry or a certain industry within a certain region. This is absolute insanity. First off, they're going to use this as a potential revenue. Like he says, it's not going to replace the income tax, but what they're going to do is they're going to use it as an excuse to cut taxes on wealthy people. You guys will be very excited about that. But who's going to pay that tax? If it's $600 billion a year, as they're saying, over a 10-year period, it's going to be $6 trillion.

• 1:40:29Speaker 04

  That is going to be a five, an average of $5,000 tax on Americans. It is a regressive tax. I like taxation, but I like progressive taxation because $5,000 for somebody making $40,000 is a much bigger problem than $5,000 for me or for you. And so this is a regressive tax on Americans. Now, if it's to work... To build up industry, and I don't know how we're gonna have a banana industry in this country, or how we're gonna have a lumber industry to rival Canada's, because we just don't have the wood, or, and so on. I mean, people get the idea, you know, there's certain

• 1:41:10Speaker 04

  industries you can actually say, this is one we're gonna build up. Maybe there'll be a low-cost clothing business that revives in this country, but I doubt it. But if tariffs are meant to work to build up industry, that means people aren't paying those taxes. So, the tariffs may not raise the money, but what will happen is, and I think you understand this too about pricing, if the price of goods goes up on average, and it looks like in some of these places, it's gonna go way above 10%. I mean, some of, like, you know, Vietnam, like, 39%, China, 75%, they're adding all these tariffs on, it's insane. Then, US

• 1:41:54Speaker 04

  companies, to the extent that there are ones that are making these same goods, they have between 0 and 75% to raise their prices. And they will, because, you know, like, the price of this, there's a certain elasticity, and they can justify raising their prices 5% if their nearest competitor is, you know, 25% raise in price. I mean, they'll do it, because, you know, there's some products that people just can't do without. So this is such a disaster. And of course, it also, what it also does, is, last time, we had a major financial crisis in this country in 2008, it took six years for the stock

• 1:42:35Speaker 04

  market to get back at parity. You're talking about, you know, 401Ks have been a disaster insofar as, like, people just don't put as much money in them as they should, because they don't have the money on a regular basis. But, God help those people if there wasn't social security, or robust social security, because if you've got to retire and you're 65 and you were planning on retiring, you have a small 401K, it is screwed, and it may not come back for years. Maybe it'll come back tomorrow, but...

• 1:43:05Patrick Bet-David?

  How do you feel about reciprocal tariffs?

• 1:43:08Speaker 04

  Here's the other absolute insanity. Those tariffs that he claimed on that chart are not tariffs. Every economist out there has been saying, where did he get these numbers? And they're starting to figure out that they did some weird... There's countries on there that don't even have people in them. It's bizarre. They took like the CIA fact book and just made a list of countries. I mean, it's completely for show. Which countries? Uh, there's... Google it. There's like one or two places where there's no people. Every single one of those countries is a massive country. They released a big release. He'll find it. Um, and these are not actual tariffs that are being applied to us. Every single one of these countries is China.

• 1:43:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Are you sure there's people there?

• 1:43:52Speaker 04

  The China, the EU, Vietnam, Taiwan, Japan, India, South Korea, Thailand, Switzerland, Indonesia, Malaysia, Cambodia. Which of those countries aren't there not people living? Put in the, uh, Trump just, uh, you know, added a tariff on a country with no people. Okay, so he added one country that maybe is underwater. It's just an indication of how slapdash this is. No, dude! But these are not tariffs. These are not... You're focusing on one random little... Those reciprocal tariffs, they're not... They're not... Those aren't tariffs. He is... He is combined... He is basically what they've tried to figure out is like, where'd they get these numbers from? And they have taken the trade deficit and divided it by, um, by what we send there.

• 1:44:36Speaker 04

  And that's the way that they've assumed that that's a tariff. It's basically, they're just saying, we have these trade deficits. And of course, we have trade deficits with certain places because there's some products that we're just never gonna make. And there's some places that don't have the buying power that we have. I mean, so this is... This is just bizarre. And, uh, and even like former Trump trade people were just like, well, maybe it's just an opening salvo for a negotiation. And maybe it is. I mean, you know, like, I'm just fortunate that I'm not planning on retiring soon and my 401K isn't, uh, decimated. But this is gonna cause inflation and these prices are not gonna come down. I mean...

• 1:45:18Speaker 04

  Trump is trying to tell US automakers, don't raise your prices. And if he wants to impose price controls, he would not be the first Republican president to do this. Nixon was the first president and the only president, as far as I know, to do price controls, at least in the modern era. I'm not necessarily against price controls in certain situations, but this is like such an own goal. It's fascinating. Of course.

• 1:45:42Patrick Bet-David?

  No, Jimmy Carter's wage of price controls were decades before Nixon. Whoops, whoops. Checking my notes. No, he was after.

• 1:45:51Patrick Bet-David?

  It wasn't just Nixon.

• 1:45:52Speaker 04

  Well, Nixon started it, right?

• 1:45:54Patrick Bet-David?

  And there was no other president since Nixon. I was just kind of correcting that.

• 1:45:57Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 1:46:00Speaker 04

  I'm for price controls.

• 1:46:01Patrick Bet-David?

  You are for price controls?

• 1:46:03Speaker 04

  Well, I think we should have, we should have, we should have implied, we should have applied some in the, in the wake of COVID. Yes, there was a lot of gouging going on. I think everybody knows that. I think it's. I mean, there's plenty of data that at least 40% of the inflation was a function of gouging in some form or another. Well, Sam, number one, respect for you for being here. I don't think, like genuinely, you're, whether you're a progressive or democratic socialist or skew socialist, you're talking to a bunch of capitalists and an angry patriot. That's cool. Like, we're not going to change your mind. You're probably not going to change our mind. But what we're solving for is the truth. The reality is these reciprocal tariffs, what Pat asked you about. Are you familiar with the golden rule?

• 1:46:47Speaker 04

  Do unto others as you want to do unto them, is that it? Bingo. Do you abide by the golden rule? I mean, in my personal relationships, yes. There you go. So, the golden rule is, you want to do something to me, I'm going to do it to you. If you treat me fairly, I'll treat you fairly. If you're good with me, I'll be good with you. But if you want to. What constitutes fair? Hold on, guy. If you want to actually take advantage of me, then all of a sudden, we might have to have a economic war. And that's what's happening. So if you show up that list, I know you want to focus on the one random country that you can't name. Hold on! Tell us how England is taking advantage of us. Well, England is part of the UK. We understand that. But if you want to go number six. How is the UK? Hold, Sam. Taking advantage. Hold on. You know, when people talk, you listen. And then when you talk, I listen. That's how conversations go. You know that.

• 1:47:32Speaker 04

  I'm just asking you to clarify your statement. I'm gonna get there. So, the way that these tariffs work is if they're doing something to us, we'll do something to them. Rob, show the picture. So, I would love to.

• 1:47:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Here where you think so all these countries have people living in all these countries these uh you know China the EU that's part of you know

• 1:47:50Speaker 04

  Yeah

• 1:47:50Patrick Bet-David?

  All those countries over there you get the UK over there Vietnam Taiwan Japan India I'm pretty sure there's a bunch of people living in India South Korea Thailand all these countries are charging us so the reality is if you go through the numbers not feeling Sam

• 1:48:04Speaker 04

  There's the whole list

• 1:48:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam I need you to pay attention

• 1:48:07Speaker 04

  I got it

• 1:48:09Patrick Bet-David?

  Here we go now

• 1:48:09Speaker 04

  The whole list

• 1:48:10Patrick Bet-David?

  They're charging us way more

• 1:48:12Speaker 04

  Ninety percent of Vietnam

• 1:48:13Patrick Bet-David?

  To access their markets than we are charging

• 1:48:15Speaker 04

  That is not that's the whole point those are not tariffs

• 1:48:18Patrick Bet-David?

  Stop it you're gonna have to bring

• 1:48:19Speaker 04

  Rob do me a favor

• 1:48:20Patrick Bet-David?

  So we're charging on average two and a half percent The EU is charging on average twenty percent Japan is twenty four percent China thirty four percent Taiwan thirty two percent Vietnam forty six percent These is what the numbers are now if you have different numbers I'd love to see them but the reality is some of these countries are our friends And some of these countries are our foes and in as Trump says if you want to listen to what Trump says in many cases you know many of our friends are a lot worse He cited Australia won't even let us sell US beef so all these situations are actual numbers you know he talks about the golden rule There's a there's a there's a similarity there the golden age of America is what he talking about because this is a way

• 1:49:04Patrick Bet-David?

  To bring down our deficits to reduce taxes I would love to hear if you had a better idea

• 1:49:09Speaker 04

  Bring down our deficits when you

• 1:49:11Patrick Bet-David?

  There's these are trade deficits

• 1:49:12Speaker 04

  Okay

• 1:49:12Patrick Bet-David?

  So we have a trade deficit with Canada of two hundred billion dollars a year they charge us in in many cases two hundred to three hundred percent for dairy Okay Mexico is an example

• 1:49:22Speaker 04

  Do not no you're absolutely a hundred percent wrong in the dairy no no no your dairy thing is absolutely wrong

• 1:49:29Patrick Bet-David?

  You think this is my dairy thing

• 1:49:31Speaker 04

  This is not there is not

• 1:49:33Patrick Bet-David?

  Speech

• 1:49:33Speaker 04

  Yes Trump lied there is not a single pint of milk

• 1:49:37Patrick Bet-David?

  Like you lied about how many countries don't have people

• 1:49:40Speaker 04

  Dairy

• 1:49:40Patrick Bet-David?

  Pretty sure India's got a couple people

• 1:49:42Speaker 04

  That dairy goes to to Canada not we don't if we we sell a certain threshold tariffs are applied but we don't reach that threshold ever There are no not a dollar

• 1:49:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Because it's too damn expensive to access the marketplace anyway I'm talking about the Sweeping tariffs you're talking about being a milkman what I want to understand is why don't you think

• 1:50:04Speaker 04

  Care about any of the facts at all

• 1:50:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Don't BS me.

• 1:50:08Speaker 04

  No, it's hilarious.

• 1:50:09Patrick Bet-David?

  I used to think like you.

• 1:50:10Speaker 04

  Google dairy, Google dairy tariffs to Canada.

• 1:50:12Patrick Bet-David?

  Fuck your dairy.

• 1:50:14Speaker 04

  You brought up dairy.

• 1:50:16Patrick Bet-David?

  But you wanna go, I'm giving one example, you wanna have twenty minutes?

• 1:50:18Speaker 04

  That's the only example you gave.

• 1:50:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Auto, auto industries, they're charging us 25%. We're now doing a minimum tax 10% across the board.

• 1:50:27Speaker 04

  So, minimum, but in other places, Vietnam, China.

• 1:50:30Patrick Bet-David?

  Let me ask a simple question. The whole thing Adam just said, it could have been simplified to, we have around a trillion dollars of trade deficits. Would you like to fix that?

• 1:50:38Speaker 04

  Part of the reason why we have those trade deficits is because, A, we keep our dollar strong. B, because there are bigger customer bases in this country than in other countries. We, our economy is based upon consumption.

• 1:50:56Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you think we're helping other countries' economy improve? Don't you think we have the leverage to ask more from them?

• 1:51:01Speaker 04

  I, I think, again, I think tariffs work if there is a specific industry.

• 1:51:06Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 1:51:06Speaker 04

  We saw this in the CHIPS Act, right? There were carrots and there were sticks in the CHIPS Act. We want to onshore chip production in this country, both for like, you know, economic reasons, but also like, long-term national security reasons.

• 1:51:20Patrick Bet-David?

  For example, for me?

• 1:51:20Speaker 04

  And so what you do is, you provide incentives and disincentives.

• 1:51:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Have you ever negotiated a deal with anybody?

• 1:51:26Speaker 04

  Well, I mean, yeah, I guess so.

• 1:51:28Patrick Bet-David?

  You do, and are you a decent negotiator? Are you a bad negotiator? Are you a horrible negotiator? What would you put yourself as a negotiator?

• 1:51:34Speaker 04

  It, it, it depends on the context.

• 1:51:37Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, do you try to find a way to negotiate where both sides win? Like a fair negotiation?

• 1:51:43Speaker 04

  Yes.

• 1:51:43Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, so this is Newsweek. It's a, you know, newspaper, an outlet that's on the left, but Rob, if you can go all the way to the top, okay? This is a Newsweek outlet, so full list of countries of reciprocal tariffs. This is from today, I believe, if I'm not mistaken. Yesterday was updated today, okay? Go a little bit lower, Rob, if you could, so let's just kinda go, no, no, let's just start from the top and see what it says. So it talks about the liberation day, great, got it. Why it matters tariffs remain in place until US narrows a 1.2 trade imbalance, recorded last year. That means we're making others. 1.2 trillion dollars more than we're making. Okay, that's the imbalance. Okay, so this is Newsweek. The president said there was a baseline-

• 1:52:23Speaker 04

  It means that we are buying more stuff from other places than they're buying from us.

• 1:52:29Patrick Bet-David?

  Sure.

• 1:52:29Speaker 04

  Because we have the biggest consumer engine in the world.

• 1:52:34Patrick Bet-David?

  Sure.

• 1:52:34Speaker 04

  So it would make sense.

• 1:52:35Patrick Bet-David?

  But, okay, so if that's the argument, continue. Now, then, the next thing would be, hey, charge me the same thing I'm buying from you as you're buying from me. Let's keep that number, the same number. Don't overcharge me for it. That's very, that is not a tough request that we're making. Go a little bit lower, Rob. Keep going. So the president's based on tariffs of 10% of all imports. Okay, great. According to Charles Trumpell, you have 34% on Chinese imports, 20% on goods, European goods. All that, that'll come up when we go a little bit lower. That's the picture he's talking about. Keep going lower, Rob.

• 1:53:02Speaker 04

  So it's ultimately going to be 54 plus another 10 on China.

• 1:53:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Until we become reciprocal, yes. The US had an overall trade deficit of 918 in 2024, with the largest gaps coming from China, 295, EU, 235, Mexico, 172, Vietnam, 123. That's the numbers that we have there. Then Cambodia topped at a chart of 49% tariffs, followed by Madagascar, 47%, Sri Lanka, 44%, Vietnam, 46%. If these were the two countries you said they don't have people there, I think they got people there. So if we go a little bit lower, uh, keep going, keep going, keep going. Here's a full list from, uh, uh, Newsweek. China, tariffs charged to the US, 67%.

• 1:53:41Speaker 04

  That's just not-

• 1:53:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Us to them, 34%. EU, 39.

• 1:53:45Speaker 04

  This is the list that the White House put out, and all economists are looking at this and going, what are they talking about?

• 1:53:50Patrick Bet-David?

  Newsweek can fact check this. Yeah, they're not going to put out false information. Newsweek can fact check this. If not, that's Newsweek. You don't believe in fake news.

• 1:53:56Speaker 04

  The President of the United States just held up the thing.

• 1:53:58Patrick Bet-David?

  You believe in real news. So, uh, Taiwan, 64, 32. Japan, 46, 24. India, 52, 26. Who the hell negotiate? Look at, by the way, each one of them, it's almost 2X. 26 times 2 is 52. 25 times 2 is 50. 36 times 2 is 72. 31 times 2 is 62, but they did 61. 32 times 2, 64. Malaysia, 24, 47. Go a little bit lower, Rob. 49, 97. 10-10, UK, we're the same. So, South Africa, 30, 60. Brazil, 10-10. Bangladesh, 37, 74, 2X.

• 1:54:30Patrick Bet-David?

  If if these numbers are true, Sam, let's say somebody on the left, okay? Fact checks this, and this is someone that's a person you respect. If these numbers are accurate, what do you say then?

• 1:54:42Speaker 04

  I'm gonna read from CNBC, since you guys won't Google this. Many observers said the US appeared to have divided the trade deficit by imports from a given country to arrive at tariff rates for individual countries. I just Google CNBC, how did the US arrive at its tariff figures?

• 1:55:01Patrick Bet-David?

  Go for it. We're not uncomfortable showing clips. Just say it, he'll pull it up. So which part do you want him to read?

• 1:55:05Speaker 04

  Well, scroll down right there. Just number two. Many observers said the US appeared to have divided the trade deficit by imports from a given country to arrive at tariff rates for individual countries. Many observers. Such methodology doesn't necessarily align with conventional approach to calculate tariffs. I mean, they've just made up what the tariffs were. No.

• 1:55:26Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam.

• 1:55:26Speaker 04

  Okay, maybe their methodology is different. What are the actual tariffs?

• 1:55:30Patrick Bet-David?

  This is my question, though.

• 1:55:31Speaker 04

  Google the tariffs!

• 1:55:31Patrick Bet-David?

  I actually wanna know this here. Rob, you can ask Grok to fact check it. You can go under Charlie Kirk and just type in Grok, is this accurate, these numbers? You can go to ChatGPT, that's ran by Sam Altman, who is an enemy of Musk, and see what that one says. You can fact check both of them. This is all I wanna ask you, to see what's your credibility with being able to reason. If those are correct, that they are charging us more taxes than we are, what do you think is the right thing to happen? If those numbers are correct.

• 1:56:02Speaker 04

  I think we should look at what industries we wanna build in this country. Car industry, let's say. Let's say we wanna build solar panels, which is one that I would choose. Um, just as an example. We could go down the list, right? And I would also look at like, okay, what regions do we have in this country that need more jobs, more manufacturing? And then I would target tariffs, not necessarily on the whole country that's coming in, but I would target on those products coming from a given country. Because that is what is called a plan.

• 1:56:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Does it matter what the product is?

• 1:56:41Speaker 04

  Absolutely.

• 1:56:42Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, so you're willing to pay more to the, you're willing to allow the other person to tax you more for product you're buying than you're doing it to them? Who needs who more?

• 1:56:52Speaker 04

  They're not taxing me.

• 1:56:54Patrick Bet-David?

  But hang on a second. Reciprocal tariff is simple. It's saying, if you charge me an additional 30, let's match it. I'll do 30 as well.

• 1:57:03Speaker 04

  The, the point is, is that when, let's say China has a 50% tariff on our cars.

• 1:57:09Patrick Bet-David?

  Yes.

• 1:57:10Speaker 04

  Okay? And they do that because they want to build their car industry. It is not going to create inflation in China, uh, because they have such a high tariff on our car.

• 1:57:22Patrick Bet-David?

  We, we may have, and certainly by we, we mean corporate America. Politicians, not corporate America.

• 1:57:28Speaker 04

  Oh, it's corporate America.

• 1:57:30Patrick Bet-David?

  It's politicians.

• 1:57:30Speaker 04

  Listen, I, I, I saw in the 90, like how corporate America was so freaked out by Tiananmen Square.

• 1:57:38Patrick Bet-David?

  You still haven't answered my question here.

• 1:57:39Speaker 04

  I'm telling you.

• 1:57:40Patrick Bet-David?

  My question is, if that's accurate, if those numbers are accurate, that we're being charged more.

• 1:57:44Speaker 04

  I'm not going to punish the American people with a regressive tax because you have some literally elementary school notion of fairness.

• 1:57:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Elementary school.

• 1:57:52Speaker 04

  Honestly.

• 1:57:53Patrick Bet-David?

  If those are true, okay? On them charging us more, would you sit there and support?

• 1:58:01Speaker 04

  They're charging more for our products to get in there.

• 1:58:04Patrick Bet-David?

  Do you think it's fair for us to pay twice as much as they're, we're charging them? Do you think that's fair?

• 1:58:09Speaker 04

  I don't think that fairness has anything to do with it.

• 1:58:12Patrick Bet-David?

  You're the fair guy.

• 1:58:15Speaker 04

  What's best for the American public is the question I would ask.

• 1:58:18Patrick Bet-David?

  Who needs who more? Does YouTube need you or do you need YouTube?

• 1:58:23Speaker 04

  Um, I, I probably need YouTube.

• 1:58:26Patrick Bet-David?

  Why do you need YouTube more?

• 1:58:28Speaker 04

  Because they have a lot of other people they can go to.

• 1:58:30Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, thank you. Who needs who more? America? Do you need the American customers? Or do we need Bangladesh? Who needs who more?

• 1:58:37Speaker 04

  Uh, we better hope that a lot of these countries don't, I mean, Canada is starting to like,

• 1:58:41Patrick Bet-David?

  What an, what an argument here.

• 1:58:43Speaker 04

  Develop a different relationship with China. I mean, this is going to ruin, uh, a lot of-

• 1:58:48Patrick Bet-David?

  It's gonna bring jobs to America. This is why Apple said, I'm investing 500 trillion here. This is why EU, uh, uh, uh,

• 1:58:55Speaker 04

  The CHIPS Act.

• 1:58:55Patrick Bet-David?

  UAE said 1.4 trillion. This is why Saudi said 600 billion. This is why all these companies said hundreds of billions.

• 1:59:03Speaker 04

  From your mouth to God's ear. I hope this goes well.

• 1:59:05Patrick Bet-David?

  But why are they saying that though? Why are they saying that? But why do you think, why, why did Rolls Royce said, we're gonna move our different, uh, uh, plants that we have from Mexico, Canada and China to US? Why are they saying that? Why are they, why are they saying that? These are jobs for your American people that are not getting paid. Trump's trying to get those people jobs. Why don't you support it?

• 1:59:21Speaker 04

  There may be, there may be, uh, there may be some benefit in terms of like manufacturing, but overall, you're gonna have a regressive tax on Americans.

• 1:59:29Patrick Bet-David?

  If, if, if you sit there-

• 1:59:30Speaker 04

  It's not targeted. When you target cars, I agree with you. Tariffs have a place, but there's no plan here. The idea of just blanket fairness doesn't mean anything.

• 1:59:41Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, they don't have any plan.

• 1:59:42Speaker 04

  Because you're forcing Americans-

• 1:59:44Patrick Bet-David?

  Dude, the guy's done more in the first 60 days than the last previous four presidents, and not including Ken, including him.

• 1:59:53Speaker 04

  And I hope the courts continue to inhibit what he's doing.

• 1:59:55Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, well, that's, yeah, that's a good job.

• 1:59:57Adam Sosnick?

  Sam, just, just to build on what Pat was saying. Apple, promising to invest 500 billion. SoftBank, Oracle, 500 billion. Nvidia, TSMC, the, uh, some of the-

• 2:00:08Speaker 04

  Because of these tariffs?

• 2:00:09Adam Sosnick?

  100 billion, 200 billion. Meta, 500 billion. Eli Lilly, 27 billion. Johnson and

• 2:00:14Patrick Bet-David?

  Johnson, DMX, CMA, CGM, Salantis, GM Hyundai, the list goes on. All these companies are basically saying we're gonna bring back manufacturing jobs to America. Bringing back jobs will stimulate the economy. Isn't that good for America? A part of why I respect Sam Seder is the fact, let me tell you why I respect Sam. Do you know why I respect Sam?

• 2:00:34Speaker 04

  Can be helpful.

• 2:00:35Patrick Bet-David?

  Here's what I respect Sam.

• 2:00:36Speaker 04

  We're not gonna get huge banana production in the United States, but now your bananas are gonna cost an extra 10, 20%.

• 2:00:43Patrick Bet-David?

  Hundreds of billions of dollars. But he's not gonna give you credit. He's not, you don't understand. He just said earlier, I'm not gonna give my money to a private corporation. Okay, gotcha. He just told you earlier.

• 2:00:52Speaker 04

  I said I'm not gonna give it to Clear at the airport.

• 2:00:55Patrick Bet-David?

  No, no, you said private corporation.

• 2:00:56Speaker 04

  I have TSA Pre. Why would I give it to the private one?

• 2:00:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Go back and play what you exactly said. This is recorded. So for me, to me, I'm already at a point that for, you know, you, I ask you, if it's the same, if those numbers are accurate, do you support it?

• 2:01:13Speaker 04

  No.

• 2:01:13Patrick Bet-David?

  I would go, okay, so no matter what Trump does, you're not gonna support.

• 2:01:16Speaker 04

  No, I would support targeted tariffs.

• 2:01:19Patrick Bet-David?

  If trillions of dollars are gonna be invested in the US economy to create jobs, you don't support that.

• 2:01:24Speaker 04

  What's that?

• 2:01:25Patrick Bet-David?

  If trillions of dollars of money is gonna be invested into our economy to create jobs, you don't support that.

• 2:01:28Speaker 04

  No, of course I do.

• 2:01:29Patrick Bet-David?

  You want that money to go to the 10 million illegal immigrants that came here that was open order under Biden. That's what you're saying. And by the way, the fact that you're open about it and you're honest about it, great.

• 2:01:38Speaker 04

  Okay.

• 2:01:39Patrick Bet-David?

  At least you're not playing games. At least you're saying that's who I am. I would much try to give my money to TSA because it's a government entity. Then Clear, it's private. I would much try to give my jobs to illegal immigrants than give the jobs to Americans.

• 2:01:52Speaker 04

  Clear is also like double the price. It is. At least you get what you pay for.

• 2:01:58Patrick Bet-David?

  You're changing now the argument.

• 2:02:00Speaker 04

  I mean, I even had a problem, to be honest with you, paying TSA Pre.

• 2:02:05Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah.

• 2:02:06Speaker 04

  Because it is sort of just creates two tiers.

• 2:02:08Patrick Bet-David?

  $65 for five months. Would you be comfortable if there was no Clear and no TSA Pre check and everyone just had to do?

• 2:02:13Speaker 04

  Be exactly the same, just everyone TSA? I mean. Would you be comfortable with that? Comfortable in this, I mean, the way that it was. There's no paying for anything. There's no clear. I do think it's unfair to people who can't afford to pay, that they have to wait in line and that, uh, rich people get to fly through. I, I, I, I do struggle. Did you fly first class on the way here? No. Have you ever flown first class? Uh, back in my show business days. What an elitist you are. They would pay. Have you ever flown private? No. So everyone should be the same. Everyone should just do TSA. Everyone should fly economy. It's very unfair if some people are doing better than others.

• 2:02:52Speaker 04

  I think we can, I think we can agree that it is a little unfair that money will get you through that line at the airport, which is like, uh, supposed to be mass communication. I mean, uh, mass transportation. Yeah, I do think.

• 2:03:07Speaker 04

  Do you only take the regular basic Uber? Do I only take the right? Basic Uber, Uber, Lyft? Do you only take, do you never use the black? You never use the, the SUV? I did to come here. What an elitist you are. That was the one you sent. Oh, so you won't pay out of pocket, but if someone will pay for you.

• 2:03:23Patrick Bet-David?

  But wait, there's one thing.

• 2:03:25Speaker 04

  You're a straight up communist. I love it.

• 2:03:27Patrick Bet-David?

  Hold on, there's one thing that you said that I kind of.

• 2:03:29Speaker 04

  I respect the fact that you're, that you're here. You're just espousing socialist communist ideas. Massive respect for you coming here. You can embrace it. It's all good.

• 2:03:39Patrick Bet-David?

  The one thing that kind of we just brushed over.

• 2:03:40Speaker 04

  That's who I am.

• 2:03:41Patrick Bet-David?

  No, it's you saying that you hoped that these judges keep interfering with Trump's agenda, which is you're basically cheering for unelected bureaucrats to go against the will of the people. Like you're hearing yourself. That's not democracy. That's a power grab. So you're happy with all the judges and all the law.

• 2:03:55Speaker 04

  Those unelected bureaucrats.

• 2:03:56Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, those unelected guys. You're cool with that? So if that happens to your guy?

• 2:04:00Speaker 04

  I am cool with judges appointed by Bush and Obama and Biden and Trump, uh, stopping the unelected bureaucrat Elon Musk from shutting down key functions of our government. Yes.

• 2:04:17Patrick Bet-David?

  Okay, our government has been broken for, like, what, what has anybody done to fix any of the problems? All the money going, all the everything, the fact that you're happy with them trying to, Sam, this is the will of the people. How many, 70 some million people, you can laugh all you want, but you're happy with judges interfering with what the president of the United States has been tasked to do. He has a mandate and he's kicking ass and I feel, Sam.

• 2:04:42Speaker 04

  I will quote from Elon Musk. This is a referendum on Trump. This is a referendum on Doge. This is a referendum on Musk. And two nights ago, he got clobbered in Wisconsin. And he was there, on the ground, in front of a big, uh, American flag, telling lies about social security and, uh, the American people in Wisconsin, not all, not all, 60%, 60% of the people in Wisconsin. This purple state basically said, "Go home." Enough so that Trump has to leak that he's gonna go, he's gonna get rid of, uh, Musk and kick him out. I don't think he actually will, but he feels, he felt the sting enough

• 2:05:26Speaker 04

  that he realizes he has to do that because Doge and Musk, and I suggest Trump, very unpopular, I mean, obviously, we're talking a margin, right? Because, uh, there's gonna be 45% of people who are gonna be in favor of whoever the Democrat is and 45% who are gonna be in favor of whoever the Republican is. But on the margins, yes, six months ago, it was different, but today, it's very different, I think.

• 2:05:53Patrick Bet-David?

  But Sam, and here's the thing, okay, so Trump is done after this, right? Four years, he's gone.

• 2:05:57Speaker 04

  You promise?

• 2:05:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, he's gonna be gone. Like, he likes to troll all you guys and you guys all lose your minds and I, and I get it.

• 2:06:02Speaker 04

  I haven't really.

• 2:06:03Patrick Bet-David?

  But what, what, here's my thing, again, and this is going back to the beginning, what are you guys offering? What is your side saying to, okay, besides the Trump evil Hitler, because that shit didn't work, your side literally called him Hitler and the guy got shot in the freaking head. Okay, that's your party. Now, now, he's gonna be gone, okay? What, who are you guys gonna put up? Who is it? Cause it looks like it's gonna be Gavin Newsom. He's podcast, all this shifting to the other side. You guys literally have nobody.

• 2:06:30Speaker 04

  I would bet you, I would bet you any amount of money that it's not Gavin Newsom.

• 2:06:33Patrick Bet-David?

  It's gonna be the front. Runner for this upcoming up the

• 2:06:35Speaker 04

  I will bet you any amount of money that the nominee in 2028 will not be Gavin Newsom.

• 2:06:40Patrick Bet-David?

  That nominee or is it gonna be running?

• 2:06:42Speaker 04

  Guys, guys, place your bet. Yeah, hundred bucks. Hundred bucks?

• 2:06:46Patrick Bet-David?

  That's all?

• 2:06:47Speaker 04

  Let's do 500 bucks.

• 2:06:48Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh, look at that. Sugar for 100, sugar for 100.

• 2:06:52Speaker 04

  Don't be a pussy.

• 2:06:53Patrick Bet-David?

  Adam, shut your freaking mouth. I bet you 500 all the freaking time.

• 2:06:56Speaker 04

  Bet in the middle of 250 right now.

• 2:06:58Patrick Bet-David?

  Know who would, who would you think?

• 2:07:00Speaker 04

  Hold on.

• 2:07:01Patrick Bet-David?

  And in 2028, and let me finish. In 2028, who is, if right now, I know it's, it's a while out. Who in 2028 is gonna be the front runner for the Democratic Party? If it's not gonna be Gavin Newsom, who that slithering snake is making the move to do it? Who, who is it gonna be? I'm very curious.

• 2:07:19Speaker 04

  I will bet you a thousand it won't be Gavin Newsom, but you're stuck at 100.

• 2:07:26Speaker 04

  I don't know. I think there's a chance that, I think that like, if I had to guess, and this is not necessarily who I would support. Um, and I'm gonna wait. I don't really, to be honest with you, I have spent zero time thinking about 2028. But if I had to guess, I would say somebody, no, it's absolutely true. Uh, I would say, um, Pritzker, Whitmer.

• 2:07:50Patrick Bet-David?

  Oh.

• 2:07:50Speaker 04

  Um.

• 2:07:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Pritzker. Pritzker.

• 2:07:52Speaker 04

  Pritzker.

• 2:07:53Patrick Bet-David?

  Really a billionaire?

• 2:07:54Speaker 04

  You're comfortable with the fact that he's a billionaire? No. Um, like I say, I'm just guessing based upon like what I'm, I'm seeing out there. I think Buttigieg also not a fan. I think he's gonna run. I think, like you say, Newsom's gonna run. I would imagine there's gonna be a couple of people in Congress who are gonna run. Um, I, I, you know, I don't, I don't know if we know, if I could, even in a list of people that I would name, I would feel that confident that I would know who would win. If you, if you could.

• 2:08:24Patrick Bet-David?

  Cry and shame, Stowe and Mullen have been dead for so long.

• 2:08:27Speaker 04

  If you could root for one person, like, just like, I would like to see this person. Who would it be?

• 2:08:32Patrick Bet-David?

  He said it earlier, AOC or Bernie?

• 2:08:33Speaker 04

  Oh Bernie? Well, no, Bernie's, I mean, too old. So AOC? No, I mean, AOC, I don't think would win. So who's your person? If you could put your money on one person?

• 2:08:43Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, that's my point, they don't have anybody, that was my point. They have nobody.

• 2:08:47Speaker 04

  I don't speak for the Democratic Party. Exactly, I'm asking Sam Seder, I'm asking the Democratic Party. You gotta have someone in mind that you would like to see. I think Murphy's also gonna run. I wanna see what people, like, who shows up with what? I'm not even speculating, I'm asking, who would you wanna see? You? No, no, but you- You don't have anybody? Yeah, you don't understand- Really? Yeah, I wanna see who's gonna- You're a big podcaster, you don't have one person you'd like to see? To be president? Yes. It really depends, like, on- Just give me a name of who you would- I don't have, like- How do you not have a name?

• 2:09:17Patrick Bet-David?

  Well, that was my point, they don't have anybody, bro. That's the whole point I was making.

• 2:09:21Speaker 04

  They, I'm not asking, I'm just saying, Sam Seder, professional podcaster, progressive, democratic socialist, you don't have one person you'd like to see? Like to see as president?

• 2:09:32Patrick Bet-David?

  Himself, I'd vote for Sam, that's it.

• 2:09:34Speaker 04

  I mean, I'm curious, you know, I'd be curious, like, if, I just don't know enough about, like, someone like Andy Beshear. Okay, but you know enough of who you like. Just say who you like. I don't, I, I, I, I don't, I don't have that kinda relationship with politicians. You don't, you don't know their names? You don't know their names? I've had on the show- Come on, Sam, bro. Do better, just say a name and we'll move on.

• 2:09:59Patrick Bet-David?

  Jasmine Crockett.

• 2:10:01Speaker 04

  No, I don't like her policies. Who do you like? Um, I mean,

• 2:10:07Speaker 04

  I, Jim McGovern from Worcester, Mass. There we go, Jim McGovern. There we go. My congressman. Congratulations, Jim McGovern. I would say Jim McGovern. I don't think he- There's our boy. There he is. Future President of the United States.

• 2:10:19Patrick Bet-David?

  Look at Jim.

• 2:10:19Speaker 04

  Jimmy McGovern.

• 2:10:20Patrick Bet-David?

  Get it, Jim.

• 2:10:21Speaker 04

  Make an America great again.

• 2:10:22Patrick Bet-David?

  Let's go to the next story to, to, I'd like to do two more, I'd like to do two more-

• 2:10:27Speaker 04

  He's a great, actually, congressman. No doubt, no doubt, he's got a chance.

• 2:10:31Patrick Bet-David?

  Texas high school football star.

• 2:10:33Speaker 04

  You know, you should also keep an eye on Pat Ryan. I mean, there's some stuff I disagree with him on policy, but he's also pretty good up in the 18th.

• 2:10:40Patrick Bet-David?

  All right, now you know names. I love it. Texas high school football star Austin Metcalf stabbed in the heart, left to die in twin brother's arms at track meet. This is a very, very difficult story. This is the father. And Vinny, maybe you want to preface what happened with the story here. Okay, so, so they, allegedly, they went to a track meet? Yeah. And I guess the, the guy in the bottom said something like, or the, the guy in the top said, hey, you're like, you're in the wrong area. He stands up, stabs that kid on, on the top, in the heart. And the other guy runs away. And then his brother, his twin brother, comes and holds him as he's taking his last breath and, and he dies. And then this, this is the father, which is the most,

• 2:11:25Patrick Bet-David?

  this is probably one of the most humble, Christian, like, based freaking interviews. He's getting a little bit emotional, but listen what he says about the whole situation.

• 2:11:33Speaker 04

  He died in his brother's arms. They were, they were twins, identical twins. And his brother was holding on to him, trying to make it stop bleeding. And he died, and he died in his brother's arms. And I rushed up there and I saw him on the, on the gurney. And I could tell, and I said he wasn't breathing. I could see all the blood. I saw where the wound was. Austin, his father shares was born two minutes before his twin brother Hunter, the two inseparable, as you can imagine. Austin is being remembered as an outstanding student at Memorial High, his football team's MVP and a young man of faith. His father grappling with loss and forgiveness.

• 2:12:16Speaker 04

  I'm not trying to judge, but what kind of parents did this child have? What was he taught? He brought a knife to a track meet and he murdered my son by stabbing him in the heart.

• 2:12:32Speaker 04

  The son, the guy was in the wrong place. They asked him to move and he bowed up. This is murder.

• 2:12:39Speaker 04

  I don't know. I know they have someone in custody. Yeah, they do. And you know what? I already forgive this person.

• 2:12:47Speaker 04

  Already? Already. God takes care of things. God's gonna take care of me. God's gonna take care of my family.

• 2:12:55Speaker 00

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• 2:13:24Speaker 01

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• 2:13:55Tom Ellsworth?

  Tom.

• 2:13:58Tom Ellsworth?

  I think this is one of the most amazing testimonies I've seen in a long, long time.

• 2:14:05Tom Ellsworth?

  And I think there's something, there's two things here. And he's asking without condemnation, just the question that I think we all should be asking. What was up with the parents? Is this, is this a single parent household? Is, what was sort of guidance was there? What sort of enablement, you know, are we, are we giving? And to stand up and say, I forgive this, most people won't understand. They say, I can't forgive him. I want him to go to prison. Well, and maybe that's what you want now. And maybe that's what you're gonna get. Cause there's consequences for crime. And if this young man, the one that's photographed there in the mugshot that's being circulated, if that's the guy and this is what he's done and the witnesses confirm it,

• 2:14:47Tom Ellsworth?

  then he's gonna go to trial and that's all gonna shake out and he's gonna go to prison for a long, long time. And I think consequences are different from forgiveness. And the forgiveness this guy has in his heart. Which appears to be led by Christian values is tremendous. And what it means is, I'm not going to let eternal bitterness here hurt me. Is he gonna hate what happened? Absolutely. And the loss he's got for his son, the grief has just begun. But he's also saying, I'm turning to the Lord to remove my bitterness so that I can go forward and live. And there's gonna be consequences here on earth, this kid. There's two tragedies here.

• 2:15:28Tom Ellsworth?

  The tragedy is, we have one young man, apparently, if this is the guy, who's gonna go to prison for a long, long time. So he's gonna be gone to his friends and family, just as this young man that was murdered is gone to his family. And the question is, what was the core of the belief structure and the life support and the examples and the mentoring and big brothers and people around that leaves this guy? Why do you bring a knife to an event? Because you have intent and you're gonna show people and you're gonna do things. This is all well documented in the failures of what goes on. And I have a lot of, um, man, I just got so much respect for the father at this time

• 2:16:13Tom Ellsworth?

  of grief to be speaking this way. But I've also got it, it says, you get what you want. You know, you get what you vote for and you get what you want in this country. And if you want things that are gonna help, you know, kids develop differently and better, let's get behind that. But there's a flaw somewhere in the heart of this kid that number one, he's carrying a weapon that he intended to use, apparently, and he used it.

• 2:16:39Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam, what are your thoughts on that?

• 2:16:41Tom Ellsworth?

  Let's go look at that.

• 2:16:42Speaker 04

  Um, I think it's, I mean, anything involving like, uh, children is difficult as a parent. That's always like, uh, difficult to see. And I think, you know, very admirable, uh, the father's response to it. It is sort of reminiscent of like, uh, what they call restorative justice, which I think... Has application in some areas and in others, you know, a little bit more difficult. But you know, that's, that's what you're talking about when you talk about like that type of forgiveness and, and making sure that the victims of the crime or the family of the victims can, can move on and, and live their life without being stuck in that,

• 2:17:23Speaker 04

  in that moment, you know, to the extent that you can. I can't even imagine losing a child or a sibling, frankly, but I think it's a little bit exploitive to assume that this is such a, this is necessarily a political issue. I mean, yes, I don't think people should be carrying weapons in, in public. I don't know where this took place, what the, you know, the gun laws are or, or what, but yes, I am against people having weapons in public. I don't know why this guy brought the knife in his pocket when he left the house. I don't

• 2:18:04Speaker 04

  know what goes on at his house. I don't know if the guy was in a, was on the other team or, you know, I don't know any of the details about it. So I wouldn't, you know, make some type of like larger political statement that this has something to do with electoral politics. I mean, we have a society that, that in many ways elevates violence and, you know, and I think you could argue the, the, the violence that we pay for, you know, in other countries and get back pictures on your Tik Tok every day of the, what the, our weapons have done.

• 2:18:47Speaker 04

  Certainly MLK said, you know, every bomb that we, we drop in Vietnam blows up here. And the, the idea behind that was that like, you know, you cannot have a society that condones waging violence and not expect that violence to end up being self inflicted. So.

• 2:19:08Patrick Bet-David?

  Adam. Well, it's a sad story. I mean, hurt people, hurt people. I think it's entirely.

• 2:19:16Adam Sosnick?

  Appropriate to speculate. Who raised this young man? You're 17 years old. You're bringing a knife. To a track meet. Someone asks you to, hey, get out of the way in the wrong place and you end up stabbing them. In the heart. I mean, what's going on with this person? What type of? Emotional pain, what type of anger, what type of hurt was this person already dealing with? That this was how he enacted his revenge for being? Told to move at a track meet? You know?

• 2:19:45Adam Sosnick?

  Texas has the death penalty if I, if I, if I'm correct. So I don't know what's gonna happen with this kid. He's 17 years old. I'm sure he'll be tried as an adult, in my opinion. But my message is to one person and one person only. It's to the twin brother who's still alive. Uh, Hunter. And I can't even imagine what this guy is going through right now because the father took the high road. Obviously, uh, probably a man of faith, a Christian, and. I understand his perspective. The twin brother who looks identical, I believe, I can't even imagine. The hurt, the pain, the grief. Every time he looks in the mirror. He's gonna see the brother that was killed and died in his arms. Uh. You know, oftentimes people say, hey, I'm praying for you. I'm praying for you.

• 2:20:29Adam Sosnick?

  Genuinely, I think anyone that runs into this guy in his life. Give this guy the biggest bear hug you possibly can. And help this guy cope. I recently, uh, was in New York because I had to go to a funeral. For one of my closest friend's younger brothers. And, um, they were incredibly tight. And to see the hurt in the family and the pain in the family and the hurt. In my good friend's. Heart because he lost his brother was, was so tough to deal with. And all I could do was give him a hug and say I'm there for him. So. Hunter. Uh, the, the brother who's still alive, you're living for two now. Uh, my message to you would be like, honor your brother. Live for him. And. And make the most out of this life because you got two people to represent for. So God bless.

• 2:21:14Patrick Bet-David?

  Yeah, that was a very good take, Adam, on a story like this. You hear this, it breaks my heart as a parent. You don't have anything to say. And for the father to react that way? I mean, give me a break. Like, there's not more class to be shown than to handle that. You know, I don't see the story everywhere. I don't see people talking about it. I don't see it, you know, where it's being publicized or talked about. You did say, you said this is, it's, what word did you use? You said, "I don't think it's a story for us to use as anything." You said something about political. I don't think there's political or anything to it. The question that a lot of people would ask is, what would have happened if this was the flip side? Who would be covering it right now?

• 2:21:57Speaker 04

  Oh, my God.

• 2:21:57Patrick Bet-David?

  Everybody. Where would it be right now? Where would the story be right now? That's the divisiveness of what America's sick of. That's the divisiveness. That father gave a message that's a unifying message. That father gave a message that is a example to other fathers. That you try to, you're like, "Oh, my God, the standard." But to me, when we think about why America flipped in certain places, and why maybe mainstream media has been getting a black eye just as much as the Democratic Party, just as much as the US government, just as much as CIA, just as much as FBI, is because the American people are just sick of it. They're fed up. They want to go back to living a normal life, and they want these divisive messages to slow down and find ways for us to sit down and have a conversation together.

• 2:22:41Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam, there's probably less than 10% of policies you and I would agree with. But the more and more I listen to you speak and say the things that you say, and your approach to it, I sit there and I say, "Hm, I can't understand this guy, why he believes what he does." But you know what I will say? Tremendous respect for you to come here. You came, you gave your arguments, did your thing, you leave. This is the second time we've done this. Not a lot of your peers do this often, and they all get invited. They all get invited, but they don't come.

• 2:23:19Speaker 04

  I don't know that I have any peers.

• 2:23:21Patrick Bet-David?

  No, what I mean is from people on the left that are... You got 1.76 million subscribers, you put up 26,000 views. You are somebody that, in your space you speak, and you have an audience that listens. They like to see your perspective. But a lot of people on the left, when we invited, for whatever reason, they don't show up. And I got.

• 2:23:40Speaker 04

  It's a long trip for me. It's just a straight shot down from New York.

• 2:23:43Patrick Bet-David?

  Respect for a guy to come in, sit down, have the conversation. And everybody that's watching this, whether you agree with him or not, you have to respect that he came here. Because that, to me, is a very, very high level of respect of anybody that's willing to have the conversation. If you do that, we need more of that and let the American people decide and say, I don't agree with Pat. I think Pat is wrong here. I don't agree with Sam. I think I agree with, I think I agree with, I think I, no problem. You get to decide and we get to have the conversation.

• 2:24:12Speaker 04

  Let me at least return the compliment to you because I, according to Tim Poole, was blacklisted by all the right wing shows two years ago when you had me on. And I think, you know, I I think it was my opportunity to say like, I can be well behaved sitting here and we can get into arguments and whatnot. You were the only show that would do it. Now, Tim has since sort of oddly reversed. And I was on his show in November. But after, I think he sat right here and said that I was a grifter. But be that as may, so I appreciate that and I appreciate the fancy car that took me here.

• 2:24:57Patrick Bet-David?

  Next time we'll just do regular Uber X and put you in economy, Sam.

• 2:25:01Speaker 04

  Feel free.

• 2:25:02Patrick Bet-David?

  Sam.

• 2:25:02Speaker 04

  It was a two minute ride.

• 2:25:03Patrick Bet-David?

  Publicly, please come back again, would you? A year from now, whatever. What do you mean? Even in four years with the bet, it's a hundred dollars.

• 2:25:10Speaker 04

  A hundred bucks. I'll come back for that a hundred bucks. We should charge interest on it.

• 2:25:15Patrick Bet-David?

  So tomorrow, we have Terrence Howard. That's a podcast is gonna go up. Very interesting conversation. I brought a guy that was a 17 year. He's been, he's currently with NASA. Like, he had to give a disclaimer and say, my opinions today are not the opinions of NASA. So we brought a physicist that works at NASA to sit down while we had Terrence here. I had a lot of different conversations. Play this intro. This will go out tomorrow morning, 9 a.m. Go ahead, Rob.

• 2:25:40Tom Ellsworth?

  After I'm done here today, I'm going to put online the equations necessary to have unlimited energy, just to say [bleep] you to the world.

• 2:25:51Patrick Bet-David?

  Interesting. Okay.

• 2:25:56Patrick Bet-David?

  You guys have never met. And you're currently working for NASA.

• 2:26:00Speaker 04

  That's correct.

• 2:26:02Tom Ellsworth?

  I don't have the degrees he has. And guess what he doesn't have? He doesn't have an understanding of how the universe works.

• 2:26:09Patrick Bet-David?

  You don't think Eric Weinstein has an understanding?

• 2:26:10Tom Ellsworth?

  He has no understanding. Entire quantum mechanics built on this model. Is wrong.

• 2:26:16Patrick Bet-David?

  He's bringing another dimension.

• 2:26:21Patrick Bet-David?

  If another country gets their hands on this.

• 2:26:22Tom Ellsworth?

  It's an end of America.

• 2:26:24Patrick Bet-David?

  What have you found?

• 2:26:24Tom Ellsworth?

  If I have to go to China, they won't hesitate a moment to use Lynch pad, which they're forcing me to do. Do you know that they took away my passport?

• 2:26:33Patrick Bet-David?

  Why does this matter?

• 2:26:35Tom Ellsworth?

  Puffy invited me.

• 2:26:37Patrick Bet-David?

  Are you saying what I think you're saying?

• 2:26:39Tom Ellsworth?

  He's like, I think he's trying to [BLEEP] you. That's what my assistant said. And I was like, oh.

• 2:26:45Tom Ellsworth?

  If it's wrong, you'll never hear from me again. I'll walk away. But if I'm right.

• 2:26:54Patrick Bet-David?

  Let me tell you. So you guys talked about everything. It was so entertaining. By the way, here's the crazy part. Guys, you know who I'm talking about? Here's the crazy part? By the way, it's, it's, you gotta, it's very interesting. Cause you know, he was on Rogan, the first one. It was very interesting. Yeah, of course. And then they do the one with Eric Weinstein, the four hour, which I thought it was fascinating to watch the exchange. But for whatever reason, the, the gentleman, Dr. Yu, from NASA didn't fully disagree with some of the things he was talking about, which was very weird for me and had never met. So he didn't find him. We didn't tell him that he was gonna be here until he came. The first time he met Dr. Yu was two minutes before we went live. Yeah, I was there. I saw him. Yeah, that's right.

• 2:27:38Patrick Bet-David?

  So anyways, by the way, here's the crazy part. Terrence Howard's on Manect. I said, Terrence, all these people that ask me stuff, I'm not doing it no more. I want them to ask you. So if anybody wants to ask any questions of Terrence Howard, download the app Manect. Uh, Rob, you have the QR code or not? We do. We have the lower third right now. Okay, so it's in the lower third. If you see it, just go, uh, you can send him a Manect and whatever questions, thoughts and stuff that you have, he's officially on Manect. You can ask him the question. All right, Sam Seder's YouTube channel is gonna be also below in the description. If you want to give it a sub and, uh, follow his content, we're gonna put that there as well. God bless everybody. Take care. Bye bye, bye bye. Thanks.

• 2:28:13Speaker 04

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• 2:28:20Adam Sosnick?

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• 2:28:49Tom Ellsworth?

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