Pod Insights Pablo Torre Finds Out Share & Smooch & Tell with Katie Nolan and Michael Cruz Kayne About this episode When did Hollywood get so good at cucking? Can hot guys be character actors? Who's your work wife? Would you drink a bucket of Wegovy? And is Shrek real? Plus: Paris Hilton, #MeSlurp, Smooching+ and the Shaquille O'Neal of hiding behind a tree... of braces. Also: Haaaaamburger.
Further content:
• "I Couldn't Get a Job and I Lost Everything" https://variety.com/2025/film/news/neal-mcdonough-hollywood-shut-out-kiss-women-1236474566/
• "It Had to Be You" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt4414438/
• Serena Williams Opens Up About Being on a GLP-1 https://www.vogue.com/article/serena-williams-glp-1-interview
• Subscribe to "Casuals with Katie Nolan" https://www.iheart.com/podcast/269-casuals-with-katie-nolan-255227604/
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Transcript 11,015 words · 14 speakers
Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.
0:01 Pablo Torre? I'm Pablo Torre and this episode of Pablo Torre Finds Out is brought to you by Remy Martin 1738 Accord Royale. Exceptionally smooth cognac for all your game day festivities. Please drink responsibly because today, we're gonna find out what this sound is.
0:18 Speaker 01 I mean, not back in college.
0:21 Pablo Torre? For god's sake. For absolute god's sake.
0:24 Speaker 01 But now...
0:24 Pablo Torre? King offering a fist bump to a limp fist. I just got a non-consensual fist bump.
0:32 Pablo Torre? Right after this ad.
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1:37 Pablo Torre? This episode is brought to you by apollo.io. A lot of the stories on this show start the same way. Something that looks pretty simple turns out to be a mess, once you look under the hood. Well, it's no different in the sales world. Your team has a tool for finding prospects, a different tool for reaching out to them, and a third for keeping track of it all. On paper, that's a system. In practice, it's a salesperson spending the better part of the day copying names from one tab into another and not much of it actually selling. Apollo.io is a platform that helps sales teams find the right buyers and reach out to them. It brings prospecting, outreach, and follow-up into one place instead of several separate tools.
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2:46 Speaker 01 Where the [bleep] were you?
2:47 Speaker 05 Dude, I'm at work, dude. I got a [bleep] job, dude.
2:50 Speaker 01 Does it make it into... So do I. Does it make it into the YouTube video if I'm not late? If I'm the one who was here first?
2:56 Speaker 05 Were you...
2:57 Speaker 01 Does it make it into it then?
2:59 Speaker 05 First before all... Before both of us?
3:02 Speaker 01 No, well...
3:02 Speaker 05 First before me.
3:03 Speaker 01 I mean, Pablo lives here. It's his office.
3:05 Pablo Torre? I slept under this table.
3:06 Speaker 01 He works all the time and everyone's mad at him.
3:10 Speaker 01 Is it funny?
3:10 Pablo Torre? And that makes me wealthy.
3:12 Speaker 01 It's not your first New York Times episode because you guys did an episode without me, but I...
3:17 Speaker 05 With hamburger.
3:17 Speaker 01 This might be my first New York Times episode.
3:19 Pablo Torre? Oh, that's right. In our partnership, this is a very legal, specific...
3:22 Speaker 01 Is it or is it not?
3:23 Pablo Torre? Language in our partnership with the New York Times and The Athletic.
3:26 Speaker 05 That was hamburgers, New York Times, right?
3:27 Pablo Torre? Yeah. Hamburger made its debut in The Athletic Podcast Network in partnership with the New York Times. Do you guys not pick up what I'm putting down? This is a very specifically...
3:37 Speaker 01 Apple time!
3:37 Pablo Torre? Oh, yeah, we got merch. A fan...
3:39 Speaker 01 That's a nice hat.
3:40 Pablo Torre? A fan-made merch. This is not even our own doing, but thank you to Ernie Threads.
3:44 Speaker 01 I want that. Ernie Threads, let me get one.
3:46 Speaker 05 Ernie Threads!
3:46 Speaker 01 Look at that stick hat. What's the joke? I missed... Not that I don't listen to every episode, Pablo. It's just...
3:52 Speaker 05 I have the "Transferred Every Episode" tattooed on my back if you want to read it.
3:55 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
3:55 Speaker 05 Every episode.
3:56 Pablo Torre? This is a key part of the thing that people are already sick of us doing.
3:59 Speaker 01 On your back? You big-backed?
4:00 Pablo Torre? It's an apple time, sure.
4:01 Speaker 05 Billy Big Bang.
4:02 Pablo Torre? How are you guys?
4:04 Speaker 01 Good.
4:04 Speaker 05 Can I say something? Did Alonso at Hamburger, did he send you a message on Instagram?
4:08 Pablo Torre? Yes, he did. He sent me a text. "I got, 'Dear Pablo, mere words cannot express my gratitude for allowing me to guest on your podcast. I never imagined the episode would achieve such an overwhelming response. I truly appreciate the opportunity. Kudos to your editing staff. What an awesome job!" Exclamation point. It goes on, it goes on. Hamburger was not entirely sure when he joined whether it was in fact Michael's show or not. I think for various parts.
4:30 Speaker 05 It's not clear to him still.
4:31 Speaker 01 I feel bad. I'm glad it went well. I also felt bad in the moment being blindsided by Hamburger because I did feel like I owed it to stand-up comedy to have known who that was. I should have known that. That was like the whitest thing I've ever done was not knowing who he was.
4:43 Pablo Torre? I think it's the whitest thing that all of us had ever done.
4:45 Speaker 01 And then I got left out of when you guys got to go like, "We're not that white." And I'm like, "Yeah, that's, I know."
4:49 Speaker 05 Because we literally aren't that white.
4:51 Speaker 01 I know.
4:52 Pablo Torre? We had to lose you on account of being the whitest person in the room.
4:56 Speaker 01 Yeah.
4:56 Pablo Torre? But he was so gracious.
5:00 Speaker 05 What, that's so sweet.
5:01 Speaker 01 That's so sweet.
5:02 Pablo Torre? No one sends a thank you note after.
5:05 Speaker 01 No.
5:05 Pablo Torre? That begins, "Dear Pablo, mere words cannot express my gratitude." And it goes on. I'm just like, this man.
5:11 Speaker 01 Yeah, that's really sweet. That made me cry a little bit.
5:13 Pablo Torre? And now I just love that people on our like social accounts just, whenever you do something notable, people just go, "Hamburger."
5:21 Speaker 05 Speaking of your social accounts, I don't think this show follows me. I don't think I'm followed by this show on Instagram. And honestly, that's fine. Whatever. Whatever.
5:30 Speaker 01 I don't follow this show.
5:32 Speaker 05 What's that? I don't follow anyone. So maybe that's why. I never follow the show.
5:35 Speaker 01 You don't follow anyone?
5:37 Speaker 05 I follow my wife, my son, my sister, my brother.
5:40 Speaker 01 But it's part of the ecosystem. In order, if anyone's gonna follow you, you owe it to follow.
5:45 Speaker 05 Well, I don't, though.
5:45 Pablo Torre? This is why we weren't in the VIP line for a special. It was those people that he follows.
5:49 Speaker 05 You were.
5:49 Speaker 01 If you were on Instagram, you'd know we're a big deal. If you followed us, you'd know.
5:54 Speaker 05 I only, I only look at the people, like if you, let's say you like my thing, then I look, then I look at your thing.
6:00 Speaker 01 That's, do you realize how that sounds? Are you hearing yourself say it?
6:04 Speaker 05 You don't understand, though. Yes, it sounds bad, but the people, the people.
6:08 Pablo Torre? It sounds purely transactional.
6:09 Speaker 01 If you like me, I'll consider you.
6:12 Speaker 05 Yeah, people look at my, like, I look through, people look at my story, you know, whatever. Then I look, then I go click, click, click, click, click through those people.
6:17 Speaker 01 That's insane. That's an insane person's behavior.
6:20 Speaker 05 If I follow, I don't want to be following people on Instagram. It's too much.
6:23 Speaker 01 What if the people who look at your story don't know, what if you don't know them? What if they're just people who look at your-
6:26 Speaker 05 Then I very quickly, I'm like, I'm not, well, I'm not following this.
6:28 Speaker 01 What a waste of your precious time.
6:30 Speaker 05 I don't know. I think if I followed more people on Instagram, it would be, it would be bad for my, Twitter, Twitter now is absolutely horrible for me.
6:36 Speaker 01 Yeah, Twitter sucks in general.
6:38 Speaker 05 It does.
6:38 Speaker 01 It's gone. I miss what it was.
6:40 Pablo Torre? Disagree.
6:41 Speaker 05 You like it better now.
6:42 Speaker 01 Oh, boy.
6:43 Speaker 05 Because you're, but you're famous now.
6:44 Speaker 01 You're engaging in stuff. I mean, you're having full back and forths with billionaires.
6:49 Speaker 05 For you, it's good.
6:49 Speaker 01 That's why Twitter sucks, because I log on for, like, little jokey joke.
6:53 Speaker 05 Yeah.
6:54 Speaker 01 The, the, the website that used to be all about the character limit that taught me about how to make things, it made me funnier.
6:59 Speaker 05 Yeah.
7:00 Speaker 01 Is now I log on and it's 18 paragraphs from a billionaire about how business works at my friend. And I don't understand or care about any of it. And I go, I'm just gonna go scroll through people's pictures from vacation.
7:12 Pablo Torre? Can I confess that, like, I'm so glad?
7:14 Speaker 01 Have we started the podcast?
7:15 Pablo Torre? I don't know anymore.
7:15 Speaker 01 This is so exact, can we just say that the podcast is gonna start?
7:18 Speaker 05 Well, a thing that used to happen with this podcast also, it used to be like, hey, guys, before you come in, have like some this, this, and this prepared.
7:24 Speaker 01 Yeah, I've stopped drinking and stuff.
7:25 Speaker 05 Now it's just absolutely Wild West.
7:26 Speaker 01 I know.
7:27 Speaker 05 Anything can happen on this podcast.
7:29 Pablo Torre? It used to be a thing where I tried to structure it, and now I just see this so genuinely as relief. And I mean that in every sense, like, relief for-
7:38 Speaker 01 This is how most people use a social life. But I, I understand.
7:45 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This feels like a nice change of pace.
7:48 Speaker 01 I lost him.
7:49 Pablo Torre? I was, I was, I was like-
7:50 Speaker 01 I lost him completely. And then you started writing an email. What did you say?
7:52 Pablo Torre? I was just making sure that the Paris Hilton TV series was not called The Social Life. It was called The Simple Life.
7:59 Speaker 05 The Simple Life.
8:00 Pablo Torre? And I was like, are you comparing me to just like this episode to just-
8:03 Speaker 05 Was Nicole Richie also on The Simple Life?
8:05 Pablo Torre? Yeah.
8:05 Speaker 01 Yeah.
8:06 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
8:06 Speaker 01 They did a whole, um, you know, that pitchfork, what's that called? American?
8:11 Pablo Torre? Yeah.
8:11 Speaker 05 Gothic.
8:11 Pablo Torre? American Gothic.
8:12 Speaker 05 Grant is part of it. Grant's show is not correct. That's the guy from Melrose Place who's married to the lady who won the Emmy.
8:19 Speaker 01 Who, which one?
8:20 Speaker 05 Is this the podcast?
8:21 Speaker 01 That won the Emmy. Did you see Chris Milliotti's speech? Most likable lady on earth. I love that woman. She was so good in Penguin.
8:28 Pablo Torre? I did not see it.
8:29 Speaker 01 And her speech was so cute. It was just so sweet. Thank you so much. I love you and I love acting so much.
8:39 Speaker 05 She seems delightful.
8:40 Speaker 01 She seems delightful.
8:41 Pablo Torre? She was there.
8:41 Speaker 05 I saw her in Once the Musical on Broadway.
8:44 Speaker 01 Oh my god.
8:45 Speaker 05 And she was.
8:46 Speaker 01 I love Once the Musical.
8:47 Speaker 05 Incredible.
8:47 Speaker 01 Wait, she can sing?
8:49 Speaker 05 Oh, brother.
8:49 Speaker 01 Oh, **** hell. I think she kissed Dan. I think she kissed Dan in a movie. I've never watched it. Dan's in a rom-com.
8:56 Pablo Torre? Now we're finding out stuff.
8:57 Speaker 01 Just don't, please don't show it to me. I'd rather see the bathtub, okay? I don't like the...
9:03 Speaker 05 Why did you say the bathtub?
9:04 Speaker 01 Because I don't want them to show me them kissing.
9:07 Speaker 05 Don't the bathtub.
9:08 Speaker 01 Because she's so cool. She's so funny.
9:10 Speaker 05 There's no reason for the bathtub.
9:11 Speaker 01 She's so pretty, she's so successful. I know it's acting, but I don't, I'm not an actor. So I'm not built, I don't know what actors have in them, the ability to go...
9:19 Speaker 05 The ability?
9:20 Speaker 01 That's not my husband that's kissing that person. I go like, ew, stop.
9:24 Speaker 05 Yeah, I think, I think actors have the ability to break up and get divorced. That's what they have.
9:29 Pablo Torre? Can we talk about, this is a good topic.
9:30 Speaker 05 Okay, here we go. Here we are.
9:32 Pablo Torre? Here we are.
9:32 Speaker 05 We've landed on...
9:33 Pablo Torre? We found it on...
9:34 Speaker 01 This is what I brought. I'm gonna, I feel like I'm gonna expose myself. I feel like that's not a progressive way of thinking. I feel like I'm embarrassingly monogamous.
9:43 Pablo Torre? Hmm.
9:44 Speaker 05 I see what you're saying. I also, I also feel that way. Uh, I think that if I had to do, well, first of all, I'm nowhere even remotely near the level of success that someone is like, would you want to be in this scene that involves a lot of smooching?
9:57 Speaker 01 Mm-hmm.
9:58 Speaker 05 Or smooching plus, God forbid.
10:00 Speaker 01 I mean, I couldn't.
10:02 Speaker 05 But the idea...
10:02 Pablo Torre? That's the streaming service.
10:03 Speaker 05 The idea, yeah. The idea of smooching plus is absolutely, it's horrifying to me. And I guess it is, that's just part of it.
10:11 Speaker 01 Just looking at it.
10:12 Speaker 05 It's just part of it.
10:13 Speaker 01 I would never, I'm, I don't know if I would never stop him. I would never stop him from doing something he wants to do. We would have to have a conversation. But I would absolutely stop myself from watching it. That's like, I wouldn't, it would bum me out. Why would I do that?
10:26 Pablo Torre? This was like a controversy, it's always, it seems a controversy. Certainly when it comes to like the Superman stuff. Have you guys heard about that controversy?
10:34 Speaker 05 What's a Superman?
10:35 Speaker 01 No, I don't think.
10:37 Pablo Torre? So David Koren Swett.
10:38 Speaker 05 Yeah.
10:39 Pablo Torre? Who is the new Superman and the Lois Lane.
10:41 Speaker 01 Visually, I haven't seen it yet. Visually, what a Superman, huh?
10:44 Speaker 05 Yum yum delish.
10:46 Speaker 01 I didn't. That's not what I meant, but also, yes.
10:48 Speaker 05 Is it not what you meant?
10:50 Speaker 01 But isn't.
10:50 Speaker 05 Absolutely Superman. Like if you, if you just, if you saw that guy walking down the street, you'd be like, well, that's Superman. That's probably Superman.
10:56 Speaker 01 Oh, is this Superman? Yeah.
10:57 Speaker 05 Yeah, I think I just saw Superman.
10:58 Speaker 01 He has glasses on, but I think it's him.
11:00 Pablo Torre? I think I have delish heat vision.
11:01 Speaker 05 Have you seen his, okay, I'm not even letting you get the thing you wanted to say. Have you seen his audition tape? His audition tape was circulating.
11:06 Speaker 01 Great.
11:06 Pablo Torre? Oh, yeah.
11:06 Speaker 05 Oh, my God, this guy's so good.
11:08 Speaker 01 A lot of credit goes to his, also his partner, his, I believe that's his girlfriend or wife or whatever his relationship situation is that's doing the reading with him. I'm like, they're doing a great job.
11:16 Speaker 06 It's August 28th, 2025, about 3:00 PM. I'm sitting here with, of all people, Superman.
11:24 Speaker 07 Hello.
11:25 Speaker 06 Welcome.
11:25 Speaker 07 Thank you. I'm pleased to be here.
11:32 Speaker 06 This is weird.
11:35 Speaker 07 I'm not weirded out at all. You said you wanted to interview me.
11:38 Speaker 06 Yes, but I've helped Dan with self tapes and been like, oh, I'm not given with that.
11:42 Speaker 01 She was letting things breathe.
11:44 Speaker 05 Has also helped me with self tapes. And I feel like, my wife has, went to college for acting as an incredible actress, but sometimes she's like, I'm really not into doing this for the 50th time.
11:52 Speaker 01 Mm-hmm.
11:52 Speaker 05 So I have to, I have to get in those first few takes or she very, absolutely reasonably is like, I think this is enough now.
11:58 Speaker 01 Yeah, I think we have it. If we were gonna get it, we got it.
12:02 Speaker 05 Yeah, none of these takes are different at this point.
12:04 Pablo Torre? I love the gentle.
12:05 Speaker 01 And you're in severance, so.
12:06 Pablo Torre? The gentle feedback of like, you need to stop thinking this is gonna get better.
12:11 Speaker 05 Yeah, what is happening is progressively you are getting more tired, not better.
12:15 Pablo Torre? Rachel Brosnahan.
12:17 Speaker 05 Yeah.
12:17 Pablo Torre? Plays Lois Lane in The New Superman.
12:19 Speaker 01 She's great. She was great in Maisel, but she was also great in House of Cards.
12:24 Speaker 05 House of Cards? Yeah, she's great in House of Cards.
12:26 Pablo Torre? So the point being that there was this controversy around her significant other in real life, um, her partner, and, uh, it's a function of how steamy the chemistry was.
12:38 Speaker 05 Yeah.
12:38 Pablo Torre? Between the two of them, such that even there were these, like, behind the scenes, uh, videos of like, maybe her planting.
12:48 Pablo Torre? Seemingly a smooch after the camera had stopped rolling so into the scene they were.
12:54 Speaker 05 Yeah.
12:55 Pablo Torre? This was one of the clips that got circulated. And so the question that happened was, how does her partner in real life feel now that all of these people are in his mentions, making fun of him for being cucked by Yum Yum Delish Superman?
13:11 Speaker 01 I mean, anybody would be.
13:12 Speaker 05 I think the mentions are, the mentions really amplify the problem, I think. Because it's like, you know, when two people are talking and the conversation's kind of innocuous and a third person comes by and is like, oh, shit. You're like, wait, did I?
13:23 Speaker 01 Wait, were we at that? I didn't feel that, but now that it's been felt, I have to take the offensive.
13:28 Speaker 05 Has the podcast started? It's just the podcast. The, so I could see that being, however, whatever capability you have to overcome just the smooching plus, a third party jumping in and being like, you should be upset about this, I think would make you naturally. I'm not strong enough to imagine a world where that doesn't make me feel worse.
13:48 Pablo Torre? So here's a Variety headline from July of this year.
13:51 Speaker 05 Okay.
13:51 Pablo Torre? As this episode now.
13:52 Speaker 05 So this is effectively news. This is just.
13:54 Speaker 01 Breaking.
13:54 Pablo Torre? Guys, we're in the news cycle right now. Neil McDonough says in Variety, quote, Hollywood turned on me, end quote.
14:02 Speaker 05 Oh, I remember this.
14:04 Pablo Torre? I wouldn't kiss another woman on screen.
14:05 Speaker 05 Yeah.
14:06 Pablo Torre? Colon, I couldn't get a job and I lost everything.
14:09 Speaker 01 Oh, my God.
14:10 Pablo Torre? Neil McDonough, veteran character actor who's appeared in everything from Band of Brothers to Desperate Housewives, Minority Report, American Horror Story, Suits and more.
14:17 Speaker 01 What a, what a IMDb.
14:19 Speaker 05 Suits and more.
14:19 Speaker 01 That's great.
14:20 Pablo Torre? Suits plus.
14:21 Speaker 05 Smooching plus.
14:22 Pablo Torre? He revealed during an interview on the Nothing Left Unsaid podcast that Hollywood shut him out when he refused to kiss other actors on screen.
14:28 Speaker 05 Yeah, I remember, I remember hearing about this.
14:30 Pablo Torre? They have five children together, he and Ruve Robertson. Since 2003, they have been married. He said in his contracts that he wouldn't kiss another woman on screen. And it was him really who had a problem with it. This is the quote, "My wife didn't have any problem with it, but he couldn't do it and Hollywood turned on him." Apparently. He got blackballed is what he's saying because.
14:51 Pablo Torre? He had this rule.
14:52 Speaker 01 That's, but that, um.
14:54 Pablo Torre? Real Katie Nolan position is what I'm hearing. That's what you, that's what you would do.
14:59 Speaker 01 Um, I don't know. I just like, I can't, um. I have always said, I don't think I'd be a very good actress because I'm not very, my, I kinda only am just this one way. And if you like it, that's awesome. And if you don't, unfortunately, this is what I've got. And so acting's always interesting to me. I also feel like with the rise of misinformation, just to like zoom out a little bit. Every, the thing I'm losing sight of first is like real and fake. The, anything that blurs the line of real and fake to me at this time makes me go like, I don't know. I think we need to know what's real and what's fake because it's, things are starting to get a little.
15:37 Pablo Torre? Oh wait, what are you talking about?
15:38 Speaker 01 Unmoored.
15:38 Pablo Torre? You're talking about crisis.
15:39 Speaker 01 I'm zooming out too far to then zoom back in.
15:41 Pablo Torre? Okay.
15:41 Speaker 01 That like, the, I've always had, I've struggled with being able to act. I couldn't act like I was kissing somebody unless I really was enjoying kissing them. That would be what I would have to do.
15:52 Pablo Torre? You're a method, you're a method.
15:52 Speaker 01 I would have to be enjoying it to look like I was enjoying it. I mean, not back in college.
15:59 Speaker 05 For god's sake. For absolute god's sake.
16:02 Pablo Torre? King offering a fist bump to a limp fist.
16:05 Speaker 05 I just got, I just got a non-consensual fist bump.
16:09 Speaker 01 But now as a fully realized, connected adult, like I can't, um, I don't know how people do. That's how I recognize, what I'm trying to explain is how I recognize acting is a skill. Because there are people that just go like, yeah, I'm, I'm kissing that person. It is, it means nothing. I am not enjoying it. They actually have really bad breath. The ability to just make it seem like this incredible, to create fake chemistry is the antithesis to me of what my whole life is about. So I, that's why I, why am I explaining this? And you're looking at me like I'm crazy.
16:39 Pablo Torre? I think this is a compliment?
16:40 Speaker 01 I don't know. I'm just trying to explain why I don't, why I can't do that. And I respect that he, I think he's saying the same.
16:47 Speaker 05 I think, I respect, I respect it too, being like, I look, I just don't want to do that. It makes me feel weird. Is it, is that you got blackballed? Like every, every part they were like, and this is, and it's smooching plus.
16:59 Pablo Torre? Quote.
16:59 Speaker 01 Is it he finished all those roles and then said, no more kissing? And they were like, bye?
17:03 Speaker 05 I don't remember, I don't know his oeuvre well enough to know how much smooching he's done on screen.
17:07 Speaker 01 I'm scrolling through my library of times I've seen his face and I don't see any where there's parted lips.
17:12 Speaker 05 Also, I don't think of him as a, I think he's too, I guess maybe I'm misunderstanding the definition of a character actor. Cause I think he's kind of too handsome to be a character actor. To me, a character actor is someone who you look at and you're like, ew, how'd he get famous? You know what I mean? But this guy, right away.
17:24 Speaker 01 Oh, I thought a character actor, and I could be wrong, but he's went to Harvard. Where'd you go? Just so we can, I can know who to appeal to.
17:31 Speaker 05 New York University.
17:33 Speaker 01 Also, really good.
17:34 Speaker 05 Hey, thanks, pal.
17:35 Speaker 01 But in this situation, you're picking Harvard.
17:37 Speaker 05 Yeah.
17:37 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
17:38 Speaker 01 I thought a character actor was like a guy who plays a lot of, like, small, or woman, a guy is gender neutral, who plays a lot of, like, little roles in big things that you've seen that, like, really help the plot, but they don't get a lot of credit.
17:50 Speaker 05 Sure, sure, but you wouldn't say, like, you know, there are, for example, on Sex and the City, there are sometimes an actor who's like the [bleep] hot guy in this episode, and you wouldn't be like, that's a character actor.
18:00 Speaker 01 Oh, sure, sure.
18:01 Pablo Torre? But, so, for instance, Paul Giamatti, Philip Seymour Hoffman.
18:05 Speaker 05 Character actor.
18:06 Pablo Torre? So this is, this is part of, I think.
18:07 Speaker 01 Oh, then I'm wrong with what I think it is.
18:08 Speaker 05 Steve Buscemi, character actor.
18:10 Pablo Torre? So, so, when I had Hank Azaria on the show, I was calling him a character actor, not sure if that was pejorative.
18:17 Speaker 05 I don't think it's necessar- some people might take offense.
18:19 Pablo Torre? But I guess for him, like, he was literally, he's known for different characters and voices, so I think for him, maybe it's different, but the definition of it seems to be an actor known for playing unusual, or eccentric, or interesting characters in supporting roles, rather than leading ones. So it doesn't need to be like you're on screen for a second, but you're just not the main guy, and you are, apparently, pretty weird.
18:40 Speaker 05 Yeah, it's like a little bit of a weirdo. Like, this guy's playing, like, the, the, the police chief, you know what I mean?
18:45 Pablo Torre? Well, I guess, well, character actor is also kind of like a backhanded way of saying, like, you're also not.
18:51 Speaker 01 You're not the famous guy.
18:52 Pablo Torre? You're not the hottie.
18:52 Speaker 01 You're not the big, famous hottie.
18:53 Speaker 05 The hot guy's not the character actor, normally.
18:55 Pablo Torre? Can hot guys be character actors?
18:57 Speaker 01 Probably, let's think of one.
18:59 Speaker 05 Laugh to your face.
19:00 Speaker 01 I'm thinking, I'm looking at all the pictures.
19:02 Pablo Torre? Katie's spank bank is very, it's very painful to cycle through.
19:06 Speaker 01 I'm scanning my hot guy repertoire. Mmm, looking really hard, ooh. Uh, I don't have, I don't, no.
19:12 Speaker 05 I don't think I could do, I don't think I could do, I mean.
19:16 Pablo Torre? But this seems to be.
19:17 Speaker 05 I don't think I could do the smooching either.
19:18 Pablo Torre? Just because.
19:19 Speaker 05 I mean, I guess I would do it, but I'd be so [bleep] stressed out.
19:23 Speaker 01 Sorry, that was for your wife.
19:24 Speaker 05 He said he would do it.
19:24 Speaker 01 He said he wants to kiss other people.
19:26 Speaker 05 I would be so stressed out. The idea of it is just, is very stressful.
19:29 Pablo Torre? Yeah, I don't think it would be comfortable.
19:30 Speaker 01 Whenever I've heard people talk about it, they talk about how valuable having like a very comfortable scene partner is. That it's like, oh, I depended on that person the entire time because they are, they do this all the time. And for me, I was very freaked out by it.
19:44 Speaker 05 Even that feels kind of something to me, right?
19:46 Speaker 01 Well, that's why we have intimacy coordinators.
19:48 Speaker 05 You know, like Joan made it, what's that?
19:49 Speaker 01 I said, that's why they have intimacy coordinators.
19:51 Speaker 05 I guess.
19:51 Speaker 01 But now it's become a cool thing to signal that like, I didn't even need or want one. I actually told them to take the day off. And you're like, they're, they're.
19:59 Pablo Torre? I'll coordinate this myself.
20:00 Speaker 01 You're not helping. You're not helping.
20:02 Speaker 05 But even when they are like, you know, oh, but I was so scared to do it, but then I worked with Sarah and she made it so easy. It's like, that's also kind of like, wait, it makes it, makes, sounds like, oh, we have a special, I'm in love with this woman.
20:13 Speaker 01 Yeah.
20:14 Speaker 05 It was actually quite easy because I'm in love with her.
20:16 Pablo Torre? Well, there's also just the larger context, and this is true of all workplaces, where like, people who work together, especially in romantic settings, the performance of romantic, at least, they do actually end up dating.
20:27 Speaker 01 Yeah.
20:28 Speaker 05 Like a showmance.
20:30 Pablo Torre? A showmance.
20:31 Speaker 01 Yeah, I.
20:32 Pablo Torre? Like the whole work wife premise?
20:33 Speaker 01 I was gonna say, I've met a lot of, um, of the people that I've dated at various jobs throughout my life. So like, I, that also probably I'm realizing feeds into why I feel this way where I'm like, if my job were to kiss you and they, everybody claps, like, of course, your brain, your brain would have to be so strong to not go like, so we're in love with this person, right?
20:56 Speaker 05 Yeah, I think so.
20:57 Speaker 01 This is, we're performing a relationship.
20:59 Pablo Torre? Now we're podcasting.
21:01 Speaker 01 So I've, am I a bad person that I'm like, oh, it would be tough? Anyway, the whole point was.
21:05 Pablo Torre? I think it's almost, I think you're almost virtue signaling.
21:08 Speaker 01 Oh, no. That's bad, right?
21:10 Speaker 05 You're pure.
21:11 Speaker 01 I, I wish, I think what it is, is I'm fascinated by people's ability to go, oh, well, that's acting. It doesn't matter. And I'm like, oh, I wouldn't. Be able to do that. I just don't think I would be able to do that.
21:21 Speaker 05 I understand that it's acting. I understand that, but it would still, it would make me uncomfortable if my wife, who was an actress, was like, I'm gonna be an actor again, and the first role I'm taking is Smooch City. I'm gonna be like, well, I wish you, I wish you would take something else.
21:34 Pablo Torre? The spin city spinoff.
21:36 Speaker 01 If it's like, is that why you got back into it? So that you could go smooch? I just feel like it would be like if the murder was real.
21:42 Speaker 05 If the murder.
21:42 Speaker 01 If you would go into a movie set and when you were acting murder, you actually murdered. It's like that you actually kissed.
21:50 Pablo Torre? Right. This is like Tom Cruise actually doing his own stunts.
21:53 Speaker 05 This is, this is so close to you being like, I think Shrek might be real.
21:57 Speaker 01 Yeah. And why not? Has anyone considered Fiona? Probably not. But Shrek? Certainly.
22:03 Pablo Torre? There is a donkey thing I, workshopping over here.
22:06 Speaker 01 Let us know when you get it.
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24:03 Pablo Torre? The work wife as a related concept. Okay. Which is a thing that is certainly like, speaking of just like, things people are talking about this year, I feel like I've been inundated with like, work wife viral.
24:13 Speaker 01 Oh, because of the Coldplay thing?
24:14 Pablo Torre? Yes.
24:15 Speaker 01 Yeah. You saw that, obviously.
24:17 Pablo Torre? Of course.
24:18 Speaker 01 Yeah, I just didn't know. Sometimes I don't know. This one, I think, got to every single buddy.
24:22 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
24:22 Speaker 01 That exists.
24:24 Pablo Torre? But just the premise.
24:24 Speaker 01 Kind of like Hocktua.
24:27 Pablo Torre? Yeah, good. We're just gonna be just churning out references. Let's rank the things that. You guys know Hocktua?
24:32 Speaker 01 I watched a guy watch that on his phone.
24:34 Pablo Torre? Speaking of Smoochun Plus, you know what I mean?
24:40 Speaker 01 The work wife. You got a work wife, Pablo?
24:42 Pablo Torre? Uh, yeah, Rob. I can see Rob being your work wife. Rob's been whispering sweet nothings into my ear this whole podcast.
24:49 Speaker 01 That's really sweet.
24:50 Pablo Torre? He sent me a photo of a guy named Robert, is it Richard, Richard? I don't know how to pronounce.
24:56 Speaker 01 He's doing this?
24:56 Pablo Torre? He has, he has a, he has an apostrophe between the R.I., apostrophe, and the charred. And he looks like that guy that we just talked about, Neil McDonough.
25:09 Speaker 01 We've named too many men? I've lost them in my mind.
25:11 Pablo Torre? So check this out. This is Neil McDonough.
25:13 Speaker 01 Yep.
25:13 Pablo Torre? Check this out.
25:14 Speaker 01 Oh, my God. It's a real Jay-Z Troy Aikman.
25:18 Pablo Torre? We got a Jay-Z Troy Aikman situation with Robert Richard.
25:21 Speaker 01 Yeah. I see it.
25:23 Pablo Torre? That's what Rob's whispering into my ear.
25:24 Speaker 01 Thanks, Rob, that's helpful stuff.
25:25 Pablo Torre? We've had a side chat about this guy for a while.
25:27 Speaker 01 And you guys work, Smooch, you said?
25:29 Pablo Torre? I mean, it just feels like emotionally fraught sometimes.
25:32 Speaker 01 So he did kiss her, you're saying?
25:34 Pablo Torre? David Lawrence, what?
25:36 Speaker 01 No, Dan and Chris Milliotti.
25:38 Pablo Torre? Oh. Oh.
25:41 Speaker 05 So.
25:42 Speaker 01 So that's super cool chick who's incredible at her job.
25:45 Speaker 05 And great at singing. Did I mention incredible singer?
25:47 Speaker 01 Yeah, you did mention it. It's how this came up.
25:48 Speaker 05 I think she plays an instrument too.
25:50 Speaker 01 Wow, I bet. Wow, I bet.
25:52 Speaker 05 And my god, when you see her play the piano, you will be blown away. I mean, my goodness. So you were at the Emmys? I was at the Emmys, yes.
25:59 Speaker 01 Did you win? You won an Emmy?
26:00 Speaker 05 I did not win an Emmy.
26:01 Speaker 01 I'm sorry. Is that the mean? If you had one, I would have felt bad if I said.
26:04 Speaker 05 No, that's okay. That's okay. I did not win an Emmy. I was at the Emmys.
26:06 Speaker 01 He didn't win a Peabody.
26:07 Speaker 05 I did.
26:07 Speaker 01 Peabody. Peabody.
26:08 Speaker 05 God damn it. I won a Peabody. We heard. Anyway.
26:12 Speaker 01 I've seen.
26:13 Speaker 05 Yeah. I've also seen.
26:15 Speaker 01 Because we hang out without cameras.
26:17 Speaker 05 We did that one time. That one time. That one time we did. Never again, probably, but possibly.
26:22 Speaker 01 No, yeah.
26:22 Speaker 05 Even when we do hang out without the cameras, it's almost like this.
26:26 Speaker 01 Yeah.
26:26 Speaker 05 It's like, have you seen? Pablo takes out his computer.
26:31 Speaker 01 What were you saying?
26:32 Speaker 05 I have no idea. You were at the Emmys and you won but didn't? Well, I didn't win. The show that I work for won.
26:38 Speaker 01 That's winning.
26:39 Speaker 05 That's winning.
26:40 Speaker 01 That's winning.
26:41 Speaker 05 Well, I don't get a statue. The producers, etc., get statues. I don't get a statue. But it was pretty fun. It was cool.
26:48 Speaker 01 That's sick.
26:48 Speaker 05 Yeah. So that's kind of.
26:50 Speaker 01 And you were nominated for Severance?
26:52 Speaker 05 Yeah, I was nominated for smallest role.
26:54 Speaker 01 Tiniest little half of a face.
26:56 Speaker 05 Least likely to be seen on an episode of a television from a season that was before this year.
27:00 Speaker 01 Okay, yeah. And they just, that's new this year. They just started giving that out. Last year's best tiny guy from a show, I think.
27:05 Speaker 05 Uh huh. Good. This feels good. Best actor in a cable news reenactment. Yeah. Best actor on a TV show inside a TV show.
27:12 Speaker 01 I don't know. Hold on. There were a lot.
27:14 Speaker 05 Yeah, that probably goes to like Wolf Blitzer in something.
27:16 Speaker 01 Yeah.
27:17 Speaker 05 Right. Like Sharknado.
27:18 Speaker 01 Somebody from Succession, the other S show.
27:22 Speaker 05 Mm-hmm. Good. A great show.
27:23 Speaker 01 Yeah. Were you in that?
27:25 Speaker 05 I'll tell you what. I was in that, but they cut me out. A fun story about that was.
27:30 Speaker 01 Wait, you literally were in it and they cut you out?
27:31 Speaker 05 I literally was in it. I had. I heard this recently when Hamburger was there in your turn. Did I tell the story on Hamburger? You referenced it, but I was actually curious, like, what happened? I think it was the pilot I was in won. I had one line. I think the line was like, "Hey Captain," or something like that.
27:46 Speaker 01 Nice, that was good.
27:47 Speaker 05 Boy. One of those. It's one of those things where like, you know, on the day of, they're like, "Oh [bleep], they just wrote a new, uh, who does anybody know that could do this?" I think it's, I think that's how I got that. I get there and the director gives me a very specific set of instructions. He's like, "I want you, at this exact moment when this thing is happening, that's when I want you to say this line to Jeremy Strong." And then Jeremy Strong is like, "Hey, I get conflicting ideas from..."
28:13 Speaker 01 Oh no.
28:14 Speaker 05 Jeremy Strong. Maybe, I don't know, maybe it wasn't Jeremy Strong. Anyway, I get, I get two-
28:18 Speaker 01 Different, very specific.
28:20 Speaker 05 Absolutely opposite directions. So I abs, I just- So you smooched? I'm abs, I, yeah, I'm totally in smooch city. I kiss him.
28:26 Speaker 01 I kiss.
28:26 Speaker 05 So I kiss him. I try, I tried, I tried to kiss him.
28:29 Speaker 01 I tried to plus.
28:30 Speaker 05 I just felt so, I was so anxious about this one line, and I said it, and you'll, you'll never see it anyplace. It's, it's not a line that's necessary in the show. What was the line?
28:39 Speaker 01 He thinks it's "Hey Captain."
28:40 Speaker 05 The line, I'm pretty sure was, "Hey Captain," or, "Hi Captain," or-
28:44 Speaker 01 It's gotta be so scary when you sense that like-
28:47 Speaker 05 Or you're the captain now.
28:48 Speaker 01 I have to do this perfect, or they're like, gonna be mad at me.
28:52 Speaker 05 Yes.
28:53 Speaker 01 Like, "Do it exactly like this," and you're like, "It's not, we're not feeling out the scene. I'm here to do this if I don't do it right."
28:59 Speaker 05 I'm effectively a lamp.
29:00 Speaker 01 If I screw him up, it's gonna be a big problem.
29:03 Speaker 05 That's exactly right. And so it's, and it's also, one of the first times that I was on a set where it's like, "Oh, this is like, really real." It's very real. So just like, I'm stressed out, I'm getting complete opposite directions, I'm trying to do it right, I'm su- It's almost impossible to do it like, really badly, I think.
29:21 Speaker 01 Hmm.
29:21 Speaker 05 The other fun thing about doing it that early on is I don't, the other actors in the show didn't know that I was no one, I don't think.
29:28 Speaker 01 Hmm.
29:29 Speaker 05 So I'm like, in holding with them, just like, chilling with all them. And everybody was super nice.
29:32 Speaker 01 Cool cast.
29:33 Speaker 05 That's kind of the end of that story.
29:34 Speaker 01 That's really cool.
29:35 Speaker 05 But I was in succession, even if you can imagine it, less than I was in severance.
29:40 Speaker 01 It's very funny. And I'll just also say, they don't, um, only cut stuff that was bad, or that they didn't like.
29:47 Speaker 05 Thank you.
29:48 Speaker 01 They have to cut stuff for time.
29:49 Speaker 05 You know what? It might have been too good. They might have thought, "If we show this guy, we gotta do a spinoff."
29:53 Speaker 01 Exactly what I was saying.
29:54 Speaker 05 We're gonna have to do a "Hey Captain" spinoff.
29:55 Speaker 01 Exactly what, and he can't steal the show.
29:57 Speaker 05 Yeah, coming this year to HBO Family. "Hey Captain." "Hey Captain."
30:04 Pablo Torre? The story of an intern at Waystar Royco.
30:09 Speaker 01 That's where you started, but wait till you see where he ends up.
30:12 Pablo Torre? Wait till you see he ends up a hobo.
30:16 Pablo Torre? Katie, what do you know about the thing where Dan smooched?
30:20 Speaker 01 Uh, it's either called It Had To Be You, or It's Only You, or There Was Always You. It's something-
30:27 Pablo Torre? It's a movie or it's a-
30:27 Speaker 01 It's a movie.
30:29 Pablo Torre? You know what the plot is?
30:30 Speaker 01 No, I don't. I don't. And this isn't because I don't love him. It's because I do. It's because I love him so, so much.
30:37 Pablo Torre? Yeah, you're ready. You're about to find out what it's about.
30:39 Speaker 01 And that's fine. I can do the plot. Just please don't actually show me them kissing.
30:43 Pablo Torre? Is it, it had to be you? Pablo's trying to engineer a fight between you and Dan. It had to be you.
30:48 Speaker 01 Is that, that's what it's called?
30:49 Pablo Torre? That's what it's called.
30:50 Speaker 01 Okay.
30:50 Pablo Torre? Sonia, a neurotic and charming jingle writer, dreams of having an exciting life. I wonder if she sings and plays the piano in there too.
30:56 Speaker 01 Oh my god, it's like Zooey Deschanel.
30:58 Pablo Torre? It is riveting.
30:59 Speaker 01 I bet.
31:00 Pablo Torre? The sudden marriage proposal from her boyfriend-
31:02 Speaker 01 And that's him?
31:03 Pablo Torre? Forces Sonia to confront whether she joins the ranks of her married friends or pursue her fantasies.
31:09 Speaker 01 Is he not even named? Like, as the character?
31:12 Pablo Torre? Are they, is he the lead of the movie? Sonia, a thirty-something young woman, panics when live-in boyfriend Chris Jensen-
31:18 Speaker 01 Is that him?
31:19 Pablo Torre? Dan Soder.
31:20 Speaker 01 Okay, Chris Jensen.
31:20 Pablo Torre? Let's go! Proposes marriage.
31:22 Speaker 01 Yeah.
31:23 Pablo Torre? Her refusal hurts him, and he walks out. Sorry.
31:27 Speaker 01 Been there, done that, said yes.
31:29 Pablo Torre? So Kristen Miladi. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. I mean, now, I feel like I'm gonna watch this movie. I think we should, uh, we should probably just play it.
31:38 Speaker 01 What? No.
31:39 Pablo Torre? It's gonna be the bathtub scene.
31:40 Speaker 01 That's not poss-
31:41 Speaker 06 Did you email about Google?
31:43 Speaker 01 I'll kill you. I'll kill you.
31:46 Speaker 06 Google?
31:47 Speaker 01 Oh, I hate it!
31:50 Pablo Torre? So her leg is strewn across-
31:51 Speaker 01 Stop it, Pablo! What the [bleep]?
31:55 Pablo Torre? They're on a couch, just watching TV.
31:56 Speaker 06 That's a very true thought.
31:57 Speaker 01 This is what I do every day. She's playing me!
32:03 Pablo Torre? She's me, but she can sing.
32:05 Speaker 06 This is your career.
32:05 Speaker 01 Hey!
32:06 Speaker 06 This is your whole life.
32:07 Pablo Torre? But you can sing too, brother. I've heard you, you can sing.
32:09 Speaker 01 I was just kidding.
32:10 Speaker 06 You're so great at what you do. You, you, you should pursue this. Maybe.
32:16 Speaker 06 Oh, maybe. Chris, you... Why are you getting so worked up about this? Because you're just, you're like this with everything. It's like you're, you're okay with everything just being okay. Why shouldn't I be? Because, okay is like, it's, you know... That's like settling for a seven out of 10. A seven is great. A seven is, it's, that's barely passing. If you get, if you get below a 70 on a test, you fail. You only live once and you should at least try to have everything in your life be a 10. That's crazy. That's not crazy. Why is that crazy?
32:49 Speaker 05 Is 68 failing?
32:50 Speaker 06 I think... 65, isn't it? I think you're more than a 10. You do? Of course I do.
32:59 Speaker 06 If they fucking kiss, I swear to God I'll walk out.
33:02 Speaker 05 Shield your eyes.
33:02 Speaker 06 I'll fucking walk out, Pablo.
33:03 Speaker 05 Shield your eyes.
33:04 Speaker 06 I'll fucking walk out. We won't be friends anymore. Pablo!
33:09 Pablo Torre? I don't know what's about to happen! Oh.
33:14 Speaker 05 Honestly, that was, this is, this to me is very sweet. The level of actual legitimate anger.
33:19 Pablo Torre? I was about to throw this cap over Katie's eyes to preserve our friendship. I didn't know what was about to happen in that video.
33:25 Speaker 06 I didn't finish watching it!
33:27 Speaker 05 The control room pressed like a big red button to turn that on. Fade to black!
33:31 Speaker 06 I was like, they wouldn't do this to me. They wouldn't do this to me. You were about to do that to me. They, she's...
33:37 Speaker 05 Dan's so good!
33:38 Speaker 06 Is he? So cute, so young, such a baby. He's a baby.
33:42 Speaker 05 I don't think I've seen him do acting stuff. I know that he does.
33:46 Speaker 06 He's a Billions. Yeah, that's what everybody knows him from, I thought. I'm sorry, I'm... Why you haven't fucking watched Billions?
33:50 Pablo Torre? He's Jim Billions in Billions.
33:53 Speaker 06 He's Mr. Billions. No, he's great. He's, um, he's the best.
33:57 Pablo Torre? That was, that was a high... But by the way, a couple of things. Number one...
34:00 Speaker 06 So stressful. Here's your wife cheating on you. Roll it, boy!
34:04 Pablo Torre? Katie, I don't think you've learned anything from our conversation about the ins and outs of what Hollywood is like. Real Neil McDonough energy. Blame, blame my work husband for that.
34:14 Speaker 06 I will. I will.
34:15 Speaker 05 Yeah, we blame, we blame him.
34:16 Speaker 06 I'm gonna, I'm gonna push for a work divorce.
34:18 Pablo Torre? I will also point out that, knowing nothing about this film, other than what I've been Googling quietly while you guys have been saying words, she does appear to be playing the role of Katie Nolan.
34:29 Speaker 01 Does she say yes? Do they get married? Did it have to be each other? Um, she's, I just, the whole point of this was, she's so good in The Penguin. Did you watch it?
34:39 Speaker 05 I did not watch.
34:40 Speaker 01 Have you seen it?
34:40 Speaker 05 The Penguin.
34:41 Speaker 01 It's okay if you haven't. It's okay. Get to episode four.
34:44 Speaker 05 That's right. It all happened.
34:45 Speaker 01 She's unreal. And I don't know, I'm not up on all of the lore of, of Batman and all of that. And I still, as a standalone show, I mean, there's a lot of great acting in it. She's unreal.
34:59 Speaker 05 Oh, wow. Okay. I'm gonna check it out.
35:01 Speaker 01 And she won, and she gave the cutest little speech. And she sings and she can, I should just, she can have him, right? She's probably like married and happy. It's not a
35:10 Speaker 05 Yeah.
35:11 Speaker 01 thing. It's just, you know.
35:13 Speaker 05 Do you want to see a scene where they're in bed together?
35:15 Speaker 01 No, what? Yes. What has led you to think that yes is the answer?
35:18 Speaker 05 I heard, I read that she has a secret husband who does stand up. I wonder who it is?
35:24 Speaker 01 We should look into it. Pablo should find out. I'm gonna mark Cuban. I'm just gonna be two. And third of all, if you'll see, he truly loved me the most.
35:42 Speaker 08 Are you the kind of sports fan that wants to dig into the story behind the stats? Then join us daily on The Athletic Live, where we'll be live on YouTube to cover all the sports stories you can't stop talking about. On game days, we watch the biggest matchups, live alongside The Athletic's most tapped in reporters. Or come hang on an off night for an inside look at how headlines happen. We want you dropping questions in the chat, and we'll bring answers straight from the source. The Athletic Live is presented by Google Gemini. Subscribe now on YouTube.
36:13 Speaker 09 Hi, I'm Jenna Ushkowitz. You might know me from Glee. This is At the Table, the food allergy podcast, a show about food, connection, and what it really looks like to live with food allergies. Each episode, we hear stories from real people like Daniel.
36:28 Speaker 10 People would always think I was lactose intolerant, so I just kind of shortened my explanation to I'm deathly allergic, in a big way that defined a lot of my childhood.
36:38 Speaker 09 And while there are challenges, there are moments that remind you you're not alone.
36:44 Speaker 11 One of the best guys that I dated, he made a point to memorize all my food allergies.
36:50 Speaker 09 So join us and hear their stories and more. Because living with food allergies isn't just about what you can't eat. It's about still having your seat at the table. Brought to you by Genentech and Novartis. Listen to At The Table, the food allergy podcast on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow At The Table and start listening on the free iHeart Radio app today.
37:10 Speaker 04 With the Discover Cash Back Card, it's payback time when you earn cash back on everyday purchases. Activate and earn 5% cash back at different categories each quarter on up to $1,500 in purchases. That's 5% cash back at different places each quarter, like grocery stores, on gas, and at restaurants. It pays to discover. Terms apply. See discover.com/five for details.
37:42 Pablo Torre? I'm going to admit to just having Googled Dan Soder's sex scene.
37:45 Speaker 01 What the [bleep]. After that whole speech about how it really is genuine. And he's like, and I liked the pain.
37:51 Pablo Torre? I just need to know.
37:52 Speaker 01 I actually kind of liked seeing her.
37:54 Pablo Torre? I just need to know if it's out there.
37:55 Speaker 01 Scared. I actually was looking for a way to get out of this friendship. So if I could just find Dan.
38:00 Speaker 05 Off-ramp to knowing you.
38:02 Speaker 01 How's your family, who I now know, and I feel genuinely interested in how they? You brought your daughter to the Emmys.
38:08 Speaker 05 My daughter came with the Emmys.
38:08 Speaker 01 She looked great.
38:09 Pablo Torre? Did she?
38:10 Speaker 05 She had a really good time.
38:11 Speaker 01 You guys looked like you had a great time.
38:12 Pablo Torre? Appreciate the...
38:13 Speaker 05 I think she did. She met a lot of people that I work with. And after pretty much every person that she met, she was like, oh, I think that's my favorite one now.
38:21 Speaker 01 I love that.
38:22 Speaker 05 Because I work with a lot of delightful people.
38:23 Speaker 01 I love that.
38:24 Speaker 05 And yeah, she kind of had a really great time. And also, the people at my work are very... They're very willing to center a child. So they really like make her feel like a superstar.
38:36 Speaker 01 Not me.
38:37 Speaker 05 Yeah, no, you were meaner.
38:40 Speaker 01 Oh, she's a cool kid. I'd center her.
38:42 Speaker 05 Um, she had, she had, she had a great time. She recently got braces. That's something that's going on in our house. Did you guys have braces?
38:48 Speaker 01 Yeah. I had a tough time in my life, too. I was not looking my best.
38:52 Speaker 05 Yeah.
38:53 Speaker 01 I was going through a tough.
38:54 Speaker 05 We're gonna want a picture. We're gonna need a picture of that. Yeah, I find that.
38:57 Speaker 01 There were, I've reached a point now where I can look at them and not, there was a point in my life where I was like, I don't ever show me me in middle school. I was miserable. I was so sad.
39:05 Speaker 05 Did you have the haircut?
39:06 Speaker 01 Yeah, I was actually kind of, but at one point I was growing out the haircut, which I had already prepared for was going to be a tough, that's why I was like, let me get this out of the way in middle school before I get to high school. Um, but it's, it was a tough transitional period of haircut where it just, I had a shaggy, long.
39:23 Speaker 05 Dying for these photos.
39:24 Speaker 01 And I had, and I had these big braces and I was just, uh, but now I look at that and I see it's the same, I'm in there, you know, it's, it's me. I just was, people weren't very nice to me about what I looked like.
39:38 Speaker 05 Were there nicknames?
39:39 Speaker 01 Yeah. Then I'm sure.
39:42 Speaker 05 She's fully crying.
39:43 Speaker 01 What's going on today? Is the goal to get me to be upset?
39:47 Speaker 05 I also, I had braces and it did not happen at a good, things were already going so badly for me.
39:53 Speaker 01 Mm-hmm.
39:53 Speaker 05 And then I got braces, but I thought,
39:57 Speaker 05 I thought I would be fine with the braces. No one will even know that I have them because I'm getting clear braces. Oh, no. And just to be crystal clear on what that means, it's not Invisalign.
40:05 Speaker 01 Not crystal clear at all.
40:06 Speaker 05 It's braces that are like, you know, vaguely translucent.
40:11 Speaker 01 Pretending not to be there.
40:11 Speaker 05 It's the Shaquille O'Neal hiding behind a tree of braces. It looks like your teeth also have teeth.
40:17 Speaker 01 Teeth.
40:19 Speaker 05 It's not cute in any way. So I had, um, I had acne that was absolutely [BLEEP] crushing the game.
40:26 Speaker 01 Did you get on Accutane?
40:27 Speaker 05 No, I did not.
40:28 Speaker 01 Good, that's good.
40:29 Speaker 05 And I had braces and I had straight up bubonic eczema. I mean, I had eczema just, just all over the place. So I was kind of, I was, uh.
40:38 Speaker 01 You were going through it.
40:39 Speaker 05 I was really going through it.
40:40 Speaker 01 You were molting.
40:41 Speaker 05 Yes.
40:42 Speaker 01 You were molting. You were becoming the beautiful butterfly you are today.
40:46 Speaker 05 Once those braces came off and the acne went away and the eczema was still there. Remains.
40:52 Speaker 01 Until Sky Rizzi changed her life.
40:54 Speaker 05 No, it's Dupixent, baby.
40:56 Speaker 01 Sorry, I get it. I call it Sky Rizzi every time.
40:58 Speaker 05 No, it's Dupixent. Give me that sponsorship, whoever, whoever you are. Dr. Do, give it to me.
41:02 Speaker 01 You wouldn't do a pharmaceutical sponsorship.
41:04 Speaker 05 For Dupixent? I absolutely would.
41:05 Speaker 01 Well, because you do use it. Yeah, yeah, maybe.
41:07 Speaker 05 But I would absolutely do it. I would, I would shoot Dupixent into, I would, I would have, I would come in here like Pinhead. You know that Pinhead from Hellraiser?
41:14 Speaker 01 Yeah.
41:15 Speaker 05 With the Dupixents. I love, I love it.
41:17 Speaker 01 Wait, I have, can, I want to, can you table the Serena Williams Row conversation?
41:23 Speaker 05 Serena Williams Row?
41:25 Speaker 01 Oh, because I'd like to have it.
41:26 Speaker 05 Because she's doing the Ozempic.
41:27 Pablo Torre? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
41:28 Speaker 01 She's doing We Go V.
41:29 Pablo Torre? R O is the.
41:31 Speaker 01 I think We Go V.
41:32 Pablo Torre? Is the GLP-1 of choice.
41:34 Speaker 01 No, Row is the company that she gets it through. It's like you can also use Row. I believe it used to be called Roman, but then they started appealing to women as well. They dropped man and it just became Row.
41:45 Pablo Torre? Hims is a thing.
41:46 Speaker 01 Yes, and you can get.
41:47 Pablo Torre? Provided we don't have them as a sponsor in this episode, let's proceed to discuss.
41:50 Speaker 01 Bleep out when he said Hims. Uh, it's like you, allows you to connect with a doctor and they'll give you a prescription without ever having to. It's like that kind of telemedicine that became a thing during COVID from necessity, born from necessity.
42:00 Speaker 05 Yes.
42:01 Speaker 01 And now that I think they're like trying to figure out how to regulate it or whatever. She did, uh, ads for Row. Her husband sits on the board.
42:08 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
42:09 Speaker 01 And.
42:09 Pablo Torre? Just to Reddit.
42:10 Speaker 01 In the ads for Row, she's just pushing the actual product, which made me go like, that's interesting because it's not, she's not being paid by the pharmaceutical company to push the product. She's being paid by the company that gives it to you, but yet the headlines were all like Serena Williams confesses that she too uses GLP-1s. And it just seemed like such a very complex, layered story that you love those. So I wanted to drop that in your lap and have you make sense of it, Jimmy. Because that was tough. I mean, seeing an athlete, nobody, everybody's got body stuff. Body stuff is hard to talk about.
42:48 Speaker 05 Not me.
42:50 Speaker 01 I didn't mean to laugh.
42:51 Pablo Torre? Cannot relate.
42:53 Speaker 01 I didn't mean to laugh right away. Everybody has body stuff and we're, it's like every, I hate talking about it because I don't like the thought of making somebody at home feel any type of way about their own body. But that was weird to me because she is the.
43:05 Pablo Torre? Paragon of female athleticism.
43:07 Speaker 01 And, and it, and she said that even she need, she just needed to use it to get the last, the last 15 off. And I don't know, I looked into the medicine of the stuff. It's actually very interesting. They're, they're like currently trying the medicine that was originally used as like a diabetes medicine. And then they approved it for weight loss. And now it's being approved for a lot of other uses. They're actually looking into using it to treat addiction.
43:28 Pablo Torre? Yep.
43:28 Speaker 01 Because of its ability to target whatever it is that's causing that. And so in that way, I'm like, this medicine really might be like game changing, life changing, like can help people that really need it in all types of ways. I just don't know why the thought of the woman that speaking about it being Serena Williams makes me go like, well, that she isn't one of the, and I don't wanna.
43:54 Pablo Torre? She shouldn't need it.
43:54 Speaker 01 But then, then you're like, you don't want to tell anybody what to do with their own body.
43:57 Pablo Torre? But this is, this is, this is interesting. I mean, because really what you're describing is your reaction not to her decision, but to the presumed pressure that she must have felt to want to make that decision.
44:08 Speaker 01 Yes. And also the, the pressure that might, somebody else might feel once to her, she's saying that she wants to de-stigmatize it by coming out and saying like, even I needed it. But in the articles about this, since it's not on behalf of that company, it's on behalf of Ro, they're using language that suggests shame. So they're saying like Serena Williams comes clean about using GLP-1s. And in the article, she's saying that she wants to de-stigmatize it.
44:35 Pablo Torre? We're seeing Serena, we're seeing Serena Williams goes public. We're seeing Serena Williams opens up.
44:39 Speaker 01 Admits, opens up. And it's, these are all.
44:41 Pablo Torre? Finally opens up, reveals.
44:43 Speaker 01 All things that suggest there should be shame involved while she's saying she's trying to remove shame.
44:50 Pablo Torre? Serena Williams shocked fans with her new slim selfie.
44:53 Speaker 05 But I do think there is shame. Like people, the, everyone in Hollywood is like, oh, the 400 pounds I lost? I mean, I've just been walking a lot. It's like, no, you, you haven't. We, we know that you've been on these drugs. So there is actual shame around using it. Everyone's pretending they're not using it. But when suddenly everyone lost 20 pounds at the exact same time, you are like, huh, this diet is either incredible or you're all on these drugs. And they all are. And to me.
45:19 Pablo Torre? I'm not saying that, I'm not arguing against anything you've said.
45:22 Speaker 01 No, put them up.
45:23 Pablo Torre? Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely GLP it away, bro.
45:26 Speaker 05 Fist up.
45:27 Speaker 01 No, put your dukes up, please.
45:29 Pablo Torre? I think you should do, do it. Wegovy, the other one.
45:32 Speaker 01 Totally.
45:33 Pablo Torre? Ozempic.
45:33 Speaker 01 Ozempic, there's a bunch.
45:34 Speaker 05 Pixin it.
45:35 Pablo Torre? Dupixent, Dupixent doesn't do this particular thing.
45:37 Speaker 01 I'm saying, I agree with you. I think anyone should do anything that they want.
45:41 Speaker 05 That is also my house position.
45:42 Speaker 01 Right. I think, what my issue is, is that I understand the mentality of her doing it from her standpoint, but I'm watching it in execution, and it's not de-stigmatizing, it's actually reinforcing the shame that's associated with it by saying that she's coming clean about it. And if she's not de-stigmatizing it, then what she is doing is, I don't know, it's scary to me. I think of being a little girl who, everybody goes through a time where they're like, learning their body and how their body carries weight and how their body handles exercise and responds to certain, whatever it is, and they're going, Serena Williams needs it, I need it, I'm gonna get on it right away.
46:22 Pablo Torre? Is it?
46:22 Speaker 01 When really, that person might not have needed it. Maybe that person just needed to, and then, because then I think, now that's a lifetime with a pharmaceutical company. And that, to me, goes, gets really risky. Like pushing that on, I don't know, people look up to Serena Williams. So it's very complex, and again, I wanna be clear, like, I don't, if you use it, I don't judge or anything in any way.
46:45 Pablo Torre? We're gonna clip this very unforgivingly, and so you will get in trouble.
46:48 Speaker 01 You know what I'm saying?
46:49 Pablo Torre? Outside of that.
46:49 Speaker 01 Sorry to talk about I don't.
46:50 Pablo Torre? Totally nuanced discussion.
46:51 Speaker 01 But it is interesting.
46:52 Pablo Torre? But like, her truly profiting off of this as a spokesperson for the broker of GLP-1s. I think that does change the premise.
47:02 Speaker 01 Right.
47:02 Pablo Torre? It's not simply, she believes in a product and has said that she uses it, it's the act of selling and promoting via some membrane of separation between the actual product, the drug.
47:13 Speaker 01 And how does that sound to you? What does that do in your brain? Because you were just talking about how you would gladly do a Dupixent, you would be paid by Dupixent because you used Dupixent.
47:20 Pablo Torre? I would, I would, I would drink a bucket of Wegovy.
47:25 Speaker 05 What I have heard is that, I have heard that it can give you-
47:30 Pablo Torre? I would drink-
47:31 Speaker 05 Bring out the bucket.
47:32 Pablo Torre? I would drink a beer snake.
47:33 Speaker 05 Do you know those, do you know those hats that you have with the upside down things and the straws going into your mouth? You could load that [BLEEP], you could do a Wegovy in this one and an Ozempic in that one and I would slurp that [BLEEP]. I guess to me, I don't have any, I'm distrustful of pharmaceuticals, companies and their motives all the time.
47:54 Speaker 05 I, that's maybe a dangerous thing to say. I don't know of anyone who's been on these things that has suffered like long-term side effects. But that could just be like a yet.
48:02 Pablo Torre? Well, exactly.
48:04 Speaker 05 But you could be on Wegovy or Ozempic and die from a disease that no one's even heard of yet. Because it's a, because it's a Wegovy side effect that we haven't tracked. But I know people who have taken it-
48:12 Pablo Torre? Yes, me too.
48:13 Speaker 05 And had incredibly bad gastro issues in the, in the like, you know, whatever, the maintenance phase or whatever. Gotten like diarrhea for real. You know what I'm saying?
48:23 Pablo Torre? That's what it says on the box.
48:24 Speaker 05 Diarrhea. For real.
48:26 Pablo Torre? In italics.
48:27 Speaker 05 Yeah. May cause diarrhea and then a little asterisk. FR FR. For real. FR FR is the sound the diarrhea makes.
48:36 Speaker 05 Oy. So I, I'm not, what I'm saying is, I have no judgment of people who take it, which I don't think you're saying either. No.
48:43 Pablo Torre? No, and if, by the way, it does seem to be, as drugs that have been debuted in a dystopian era, as those go, this seems to be wildly effective based on early returns.
48:54 Speaker 05 Yeah.
48:54 Pablo Torre? With all of the caveats that we're all pointing out of like, who knows what unintended consequences, both sociologically and pharmaceutically.
49:03 Speaker 05 And the other thing that will happen, that's already happening is you will, some people can afford this, some people can't. So in many ways, how like, you know, just general health is a marker of your economic status. Like this, it'll be clear, once everybody's on this, like who, there's gonna be a-
49:20 Pablo Torre? Right.
49:20 Speaker 05 A very visible line between who can afford it and who can't.
49:24 Pablo Torre? Yes. All of this, you slurping.
49:28 Pablo Torre? GLP ones.
49:29 Speaker 05 Hashtag me slurp.
49:31 Pablo Torre? Hashtag me slurp. Um, reminds me of course-
49:33 Speaker 05 There's no other way to think of that?
49:34 Pablo Torre? Well, there's, there's one other way. There's one other way I want to think about it.
49:38 Speaker 01 Oh, boy.
49:39 Pablo Torre? And it's the video I want to show Katie.
49:40 Speaker 01 No. God damn it.
49:41 Speaker 05 God, f***ing damn it.
49:42 Speaker 01 I jokingly pointed at the TV.
49:43 Speaker 05 No, but this is your fault, actually.
49:45 Speaker 01 I jokingly... No, because he also did the kiss. I said I would be willing to do this so as not to see the f***ing kiss.
49:51 Speaker 05 I can't understand. Can't you not show this?
49:54 Speaker 01 You know what? I pivoted. I love this clip. He showed me this clip.
49:58 Speaker 05 Put me, you know what, actually-
49:59 Speaker 01 Oh, show me the part where he puts the c*** in his mouth. I want to see it right now.
50:02 Speaker 05 Edit us, and edit me into this clip is what I want.
50:05 Speaker 01 Make it me who's doing it. Make it f***ing me who's doing this. I actually would love that.
50:11 Speaker 05 I think you shouldn't say that. The internet doesn't-
50:13 Speaker 01 I actually f***ing love the way he rubs his face in it, okay? I'm loving this. Oh, good. Run it back from the beginning.
50:18 Speaker 05 I, I have tried to be on board with this bit and I am, I can't do it. I can't be here for it. How long does he do this for? What did he win?
50:28 Speaker 01 Unless they just cleaned that tub, you are, you've got old hair in your mouth.
50:34 Speaker 05 I don't think we watched this much of it before.
50:36 Speaker 01 I don't think we did either. I think I got them to turn it off.
50:38 Speaker 05 This is unbelievable.
50:40 Pablo Torre? We've rarely gotten this deep into the clip.
50:42 Speaker 01 Unbelievable.
50:44 Speaker 05 Have either of you seen this movie? Has either of you?
50:46 Pablo Torre? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
50:47 Speaker 01 You know what I just realized? He kinda looks like Walker Buehler.
50:49 Pablo Torre? Mmm.
50:50 Speaker 01 You know Walker Buehler, the pitcher?
50:52 Speaker 05 I don't. I'm not a baseball guy.
50:54 Pablo Torre? Los Angeles Dodger, Walker Buehler is what you think of.
50:56 Speaker 01 No, he was, and then he was on the Red Sox, and now I think he's on the Phillies. Philadelphia Phillies pitcher, Walker Buehler, kinda looks like-
51:04 Speaker 05 I kinda gave up on baseball, TBH.
51:05 Speaker 01 Well, it's back. It's back in a big way.
51:07 Speaker 05 You know I love Shohei Ohtani. That's, that's, that's-
51:09 Speaker 01 He just, um-
51:10 Speaker 05 Fifty-fifty.
51:11 Speaker 01 Yeah. Well, a new fifty-fifty now. It's the fifty-
51:14 Pablo Torre? Thank you for reminding people we're a sports podcast.
51:16 Speaker 05 Sports, sports, sports.
51:17 Speaker 01 By the way, these are sports. They happen. Watch.
51:18 Speaker 05 Hashtag me slurp.
51:19 Speaker 01 Well, they might not happen. I feel like you're ending the NBA. Can I be honest? I feel like we're not gonna have an NBA anymore.
51:24 Speaker 05 NBA is over.
51:24 Speaker 01 I feel like it's just done.
51:25 Pablo Torre? Our investigation continues.
51:26 Speaker 01 I know, and I'm like, kind of half-understanding it.
51:30 Pablo Torre? Can we, can we, uh, end with a palate cleanser? What does that mean?
51:35 Speaker 01 No, cuz, oh, that's before it got bad, you guys. That's when she was still just the cutest little thing.
51:39 Pablo Torre? Come on, look at her. Look at this. Look at that hair. Young Katie Nolan. This is before, this is before?
51:45 Speaker 01 That's in second grade. That was the day I got, that was probably like one of the first days I had that haircut. That was the first day my mom was like, this is what we're gonna do with your hair.
51:51 Pablo Torre? You're wearing a necklace.
51:53 Speaker 01 Over my turtleneck.
51:53 Pablo Torre? Over a dark green, forest green turtleneck. Framingham, where are you from?
51:57 Speaker 01 Mm-hmm, Framingham, Massachusetts.
51:59 Pablo Torre? And look at that, look, look, look at that hair, the bangs, the machio-esque.
52:04 Speaker 01 Yeah.
52:04 Pablo Torre? It is giving.
52:05 Speaker 01 Yarmir Yager haircut.
52:07 Pablo Torre? Yarmir Yager. Imagine a second grader walking into the salon being like, I want what he has. And it's a picture of Yarmir Yager. If you could tell, if you could tell young Katie Yarmir Yager Nolan. I want the Mario Lemieux, please.
52:24 Speaker 01 If I could tell her what?
52:25 Pablo Torre? That, uh, everything that came out of your mouth in the last five minutes would come out of that mouth, uh, as an adult. I don't know.
52:33 Speaker 01 What?
52:33 Pablo Torre? Yeah, that was gross. We're gonna probably, let's just end the episode.
52:36 Speaker 01 I'm talking to a kid, Pablo, what the [bleep].
52:47 Pablo Torre? This has been Pablo Torre Finds Out, a Meadowlark Media production. And I'll talk to you next time.
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Previous Lina Khan (and Zohran Mamdani) on Why Billionaires Never Learn — and the Apolitical Absurdity of $6,000 World Cup Tickets Next Why Isn't There Tickling in MMA? An Investigation Page updated November 1, 2026 · transcript and summary are machine-generated