KEKE PALMER: "At 17, I Had a Midlife Crisis”

Keke Palmer has spent her life performing for the world, but in this deeply honest conversation with Jay, she shares what it took to finally come home to herself. From childhood fame and anxiety to motherhood, identity, boundaries, and healing, Keke reveals how the practices that saved her life helped her redefine success from the inside out. Together, they explore the courage to honor your emotions, let go of who the world expects you to be, and discover the confidence that comes from choosing yourself. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty A State Farm agent can help you choose the coverage you need. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Visit: https://www.statefarm.com/ On Purpose is now Netflix and Spotify exclusive http://www.netflix.com/onpurposewithjayshetty https://open.spotify.com/show/5EqqB52m2bsr4k1Ii7sStc?si=33f7898fb334437c JAY’S DAILY WISDOM DELIVERED STRAIGHT TO YOUR INBOX Join 900,000+ readers discovering how small daily shifts create big life change with my free newsletter. Subscribe https://news.jayshetty.me/subscribe Check out our Apple subscription to unlock bonus content of On Purpose! https://lnk.to/JayShettyPodcast What We Discuss: 00:00:00 Intro 00:01:06 Honor Uncomfortable Feelings 00:02:57 Escaping the Momentum Trap 00:03:59 What Motherhood Taught Me 00:05:32 My Toddler's Powerful Boundaries 00:07:20 The Potty Training Battle 00:08:35 Seeing Your Parents Differently 00:10:43 How Successful People Think 00:13:08 Depression Started the Journey 00:17:08 How She Survived Success 00:20:16 Why We're All Here 00:22:24 Growing Up a Child Star 00:25:25 Trust the Process 00:27:33 Give That Love to Yourself 00:29:53 Healthy Boundaries Matter 00:31:53 Listen More, Fix Less 00:34:33 Virgos, Leos & Astrology 00:36:07 The Energy You Bring 00:37:45 When Power Feels Unsafe 00:41:13 The Freedom of Speaking Truth 00:44:31 Why Words Matter 00:47:31 Reclaiming Her Voice 00:48:29 The Gift of Awareness 00:50:21 What Makes a Great Partner? 00:55:23 Finding Real Connection 00:57:08 Why Trust Is So Hard 00:59:11 Don't Let Others Define You 01:00:38 Does It Have a Little Sweetness? 01:05:09 What Childhood Taught Me 01:06:50 Practice Self-Compassion 01:08:04 Keke on Final Five Episode Resources: Website | https://kekepalmer.com/ Instagram | https://www.instagram.com/keke TikTok | https://www.tiktok.com/@kekepalmer Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jay Shetty?

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• 0:43Jay Shetty?

  Give your clothes a second life with Vinted. Download the Vinted app for free to start selling with no seller fees, so you keep every dollar you earn. This episode is brought to you by AG1. Are you feeling September reset too? Shorter days, longer to-do lists, earlier alarms, all those routines you promised yourself you'd pick back up. It can feel like your whole life is recalibrating. And when everything around you is changing, it helps to have a few things you can rely on. AG1 Next Gen is one of those easy habits to keep. It's the clinically-backed, comprehensive daily health drink that supports your gut health, energy production, and foundational nutrition all in one scoop.

• 1:26Jay Shetty?

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• 2:06Jay Shetty?

  Shorter days, longer to-do lists, earlier alarms, all those routines you promised yourself you'd pick back up. It can feel like your whole life is recalibrating. And when everything around you is changing, it helps to have a few things you can rely on. AG1 Next Gen is one of those easy habits to keep. It's the clinically-backed, comprehensive daily health drink that supports your gut health, energy production, and foundational nutrition all in one scoop. AG1's ingredients are sourced from quality partners for absorption, potency, and nutrient density to deliver the foundational nutrition your body needs. And alongside a proper diet, AG1 Next Gen meets 94% of nutrient requirements,

• 2:49Jay Shetty?

  and it's clinically shown to enrich the gut microbiome. For a limited time, save 20% on your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro at drinkag1.com/onpurpose. That's drinkag1.com/onpurpose.

• 3:10Jay Shetty?

  I've been waiting for this since you interviewed me and made my life a living hell, because I was like, where is she gonna take this conversation? Only Kiki could put me in these uncomfortable places.

• 3:21Speaker 01

  Oh my gosh.

• 3:22Jay Shetty?

  Hey, it's Jay. I don't know what your day's been like, but I was just thinking about you for a minute. And I hope you're being a little patient with yourself, because you deserve it. And yeah, I'll talk to you soon.

• 3:45Jay Shetty?

  Kiki Palmer, welcome to On Purpose.

• 3:48Speaker 01

  Jay, I'm so happy to talk to you. And I just know we're gonna have such a great conversation. Like, I just love it.

• 3:52Jay Shetty?

  Kiki, I wanted to start with, like, you do so much. I just talked about it. Film, television, podcasting, music, businesswoman, entrepreneur, mother. When do you feel the most like Lauren?

• 4:03Speaker 01

  When I allow myself to have uncomfortable feelings. Because I think that that's what I've been working on getting back to, because being able to do all the stuff I do and, you know, on the road to success, I was trying so hard to just, you know, be the best and, you know, be in a good mood and be ready. And so the part that really got pushed down was like the human part, the one that just sometimes is sad and that doesn't feel very strong, that doesn't feel very capable. So when I'm, what I'm learning is the more that I honor the space for that, and when I tell people like, hey, I could probably push it and do this, but I would rather not. That's, that's the part of me that has not gotten a lot of air.

• 4:44Speaker 01

  So I feel really good when I'm honoring the fact that I might have a larger capacity, but I, but it's okay if I can't give it out right now.

• 4:50Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Does that part ever win, or does it lose?

• 4:53Speaker 01

  It's getting better now.

• 4:54Jay Shetty?

  Okay.

• 4:54Speaker 01

  Most of my life, crazy, it's one, the, the part that just pushes through. That's been guiding everything to the point of being disembodied in moments. And I think that having my son brought me to a place of presence as kids do, where I started to realize that, that maybe that disconnection was happening. And so now I'm more active in being like, it's okay if you don't have it. It's okay if you don't feel like I had something I was supposed to do after this, but my day got pushed back and I was late coming here and I was like, oh no, I said, I can't do it. You know, the old me would have still tried to push through, and I don't mean to say the old me, but part of me that was habitually thinking that what other people wanted was greater than what I needed for myself. That side of me is, you know, I'm aware of it now.

• 5:37Speaker 01

  And so I can say like, look, I don't have it. And, and that makes me feel really truly confident and secure.

• 5:43Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. And that's hard to do when you're winning.

• 5:45Speaker 01

  Oh my gosh.

• 5:46Jay Shetty?

  It's hard to do when you're losing, because you feel like you have to get going and you've got to get started.

• 5:51Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 5:51Jay Shetty?

  Then it's hard to do when you're winning, because you're like, oh, I've got to keep this going.

• 5:54Speaker 01

  The momentum.

• 5:55Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 5:55Speaker 01

  The momentum game that we play with ourselves. It can be tough. It can be tough, but it's so funny how it does that, because being good with yourself is actually what's going to make you better for that, those things, at least that I've found. But we trick ourselves into thinking that by force is how we get everything.

• 6:12Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 6:12Speaker 01

  And there might be some truth to it. There's a time and a place for everything where it's like, I gotta hustle, I gotta hustle. But you gotta be also like, let me not be so in the hustle that I don't feel when the frequency has changed, and now is the time for rest.

• 6:24Jay Shetty?

  Yes.

• 6:25Speaker 01

  And so it's like, you know, sometimes we can step out of the alignment when we, when we so busy thinking that there's one way to get it done.

• 6:30Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. No, so well said. And you mentioned there, you talked about your son, who we got so much of in this adorable AD piece. I was like, oh my gosh, he's so cute.

• 6:38Speaker 01

  I'm so obsessed with my son. It's too much.

• 6:41Jay Shetty?

  He's just the best energy too. Like, it just like flies off the screen. But I was thinking about that, and I wanted to ask you, like, what have you learned about yourself since becoming a mom that you feel you didn't know before?

• 6:51Speaker 01

  Well, I do feel like my son reflects qualities in me that are the most human. Before we get into like our adaptive way, as human beings do, we all do that. We adapt for the room, for who we're around, for what we want, and you know, all those kinds of things. So I get to see a human before they become aware of how they relate to others can impact them, or how others see them might impact them. So I've learned that I'm very demanding.

• 7:18Jay Shetty?

  He's really demanding?

• 7:19Speaker 01

  He's demanding. He has clear boundaries, but he's also really loving and he's polite. But he's like, what are you doing here? And I don't have time for that. And so watching him in his like truth, it has really given me so much courage.

• 7:34Jay Shetty?

  So you're getting self-awareness.

• 7:35Speaker 01

  I'm getting self-awareness. I'm like, so that's what I was like before I decided that I cared about folks. You know what I mean? And so I love seeing those. And then, like I said, the presence piece. Because kids make you be, you cannot be somewhere, I mean, you could, but it's like, it's hard to go to that other place when you have this being in front of you that's looking and learning and again, reflecting so much of you back, that you, you start noticing space and time is starting to stretch in a way that it hasn't before. It's crazy. When you have one, you realize that what we've always said is true.

• 8:07Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 8:08Speaker 01

  Children are really the future. They're the most greatest gifts. They're so bright eyed and their spirit is so open and pure and it can't help but affect you.

• 8:18Jay Shetty?

  This episode is presented by State Farm. We spend so much energy becoming the best version of ourselves, building better habits, showing up more fully, embracing mindfulness. But sometimes, the most purposeful thing you can do is just handle the thing you've been putting off. If getting your insurance sorted has been living on that list, State Farm is there to help you choose the coverage that's right for you. Go online at statefarm.com or use the easily accessible app to get help from one of their over 19,000 local agents. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. What does he demand? And what are the boundaries that he sets?

• 8:57Speaker 01

  So his boundaries, he's really bounded about like touch. He's like, he wants his space. I need space.

• 9:02Jay Shetty?

  Well, when you're trying to hug him.

• 9:03Speaker 01

  When I'm trying to hug him, I try to kiss him. No more kisses. That's too much. He'll tell me.

• 9:07Jay Shetty?

  How old is he?

• 9:08Speaker 01

  He's three. Oh, he'll be open to it. But then when it's like, it's my mommy, no more kissing. That's too much kissing. And I have, I say, okay, I understand. I respect that. You know, he'll be like, in terms of demanding, he'll be like, I want my lechita. You know, like, I want my milk. He's like, I'm very hungry. I want food. Or he was like, absolutely not. Don't try to feed me anything. Like, he's really like, he will tell you, the more words that he has, the more things that he says. He'll say things like, I would like to watch Monster Truck. And he's a really good debater, like a really good, like, he'll try to pick around. So he'll be like, can I do this? And you'll be like, no, what about this? And he'll be like, okay, no, what about that? You'll say, yes. Okay, phew. You know, he says like, phew, very expressive. He's actually very animated. Don't know where he gets that from.

• 9:51Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, I know.

• 9:52Speaker 01

  It's the cutest. So it's like, it's so funny to just see someone's personality developing. And as a mom, as a parent in general, you want to be able to guide them, but you don't want to stop them from discovering who they are in their own way. You don't want to be so much of a curator that you impede their ability to come into their own character. My son has such a great sense of power within self. And as much as I want him to be respectful and kind and all that kind of stuff, it's a constant balancing act because I don't want him to lose his strength and his ability to, especially as a young man, I feel like he's getting to live my male dreams. So I want him to know that he has power and influence and obviously using it in the right way.

• 10:34Speaker 01

  And it's like, he's only three years old, but these are the things that you're thinking about already. Cause you just, you want to just make sure you set them up correctly.

• 10:41Jay Shetty?

  It sounds like you figured it out. It sounds like you got it down.

• 10:44Speaker 01

  And so many, much more to come.

• 10:46Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 10:46Speaker 01

  That potty training got me in a chokehold. Damn, it's hard. It's like.

• 10:50Jay Shetty?

  Really? Walk me through it.

• 10:51Speaker 01

  Well, you don't, they don't know the comfortability of the toilet. Like for us adults, we could sit on the toilet for a long time on our phones. We could sit on it. You know, we, we have a different relationship to it. As him, he has the relationship where I use the bathroom. This is on my body, my diaper. I get to keep doing what I'm doing. I never have to stop and go to the, like, he doesn't get the whole stopping what you're doing and going to the bathroom and then sitting on the toilet and then the toilet being the place where it goes. So the conversation and the comfortability you have to get him with to understand, like, no, the toilet is safe. The toilet is comforting. The toilet is your space. The bathroom is, is cool. You know, you get to have a private moment. And so it's just like getting that, getting his mind wrapped around it. And it's, it's not easy. And I don't have the same parts as him.

• 11:33Speaker 01

  Like, he looks at me and he's like, who chopped it off? And I'm like, you know, it's like, I'm like, I can't, you know, I'm not a guy. You know what I mean? So that is like very funny, you know?

• 11:44Jay Shetty?

  That's hilarious.

• 11:45Speaker 01

  He's like, somebody took hers away. I'm spooked.

• 11:51Jay Shetty?

  Oh my gosh, for three, that's a lot of personality for three.

• 11:54Speaker 01

  Oh my gosh, such personality.

• 11:57Jay Shetty?

  What have you learned about your parents after becoming a parent?

• 12:00Speaker 01

  I've had my times of being very hard on my parents, especially like in my early twenties. Never as hard as that would have made me not hold space for them. Cause we've always been really close, even in our times where we weren't as close day to day talking or being around each other when I was kind of being in my more like, I need to be independent bag. I still think I was always very like, I understand my parents. I hold space for them. You know what I mean? I have compassion for the things they did right and things they didn't do right. But I think that I understand it much more embodied now. Before I was trying to be on my Jay Shetty. I was just trying to be like, you know, I'm being mindful and I'm choosing the right path. But there's like, doing that mentally, and then there's like actually feeling it really. And so I think I was saying that for a long time without actually feeling it.

• 12:44Speaker 01

  And I think having my son, and obviously many things, you know, getting older, you know, allowed me to really understand from their perspective of what that challenge may have been like to just raise a child, let alone a child that's in the public eye. That many people are around and influencing and you're trying to keep a hold, but you want, you're putting them here to have opportunity to become more. But then there's also this whole idea that you become not enough for their world. Or the assumed idea that you're not enough for their world. And so I just, I think that my parents have a lot of courage. I realized that they are really brave people and they're so, they, they also love me enough to be that courageous

• 13:27Speaker 01

  to actually open doors for me to flourish. Like they pretty much were watching me go down the yellow brick road. And they had their ideas of what the wizard was, but they still held hope and faith for me. And I was able to come back and give them something too, in the end of it all, or as we continue to grow together in this new framework. But it was really hard. You know, they were there like my, my, you know, my scarecrow and tin man and cowardly lion and you know, we're, we've been together on this journey. So to see how they've been able to have the strength to allow me to become. I can only hope to be that brave with my child.

• 14:05Jay Shetty?

  Have you told him that?

• 14:06Speaker 01

  No, my mom's heard it just now, I guess. You prompted this question. I never have, have articulated it or said it because I never really had the opportunity to. But yeah, that's how I feel. I think that she's really brave and, and my dad is really brave and I'm really grateful that they weren't afraid to let me be me.

• 14:22Jay Shetty?

  Wow. I can tell that you, you're like, you're like really living in it for a second.

• 14:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, I am. You know, it takes so much time for, I think, the things that we tell ourselves to hit us. And I think I spent a lot of time, especially in my early, my late teens, early twenties, really getting into like the concepts around mindfulness. I learned watching YouTube videos online that the only thing that separated me from the people that I admired was they thought differently. And so I focused on like, what do people that are successful do? What does it, they put into their mind? How do they talk to themselves? And so I started like practicing those things, you know, going to a trip to Sedona, you know, having somebody beat on my chest with Reiki at nineteen, you know?

• 15:06Speaker 01

  Going on this excursion where I'm in silence, you know, I've tried to put that my, those things in my life, but it didn't really hit me.

• 15:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 15:14Speaker 01

  You know, I was just like doing them and I was believing, I, I remember one of my favorite quotes, I got it tattooed is Aristotle, we are what we repeatedly do. Excellence then isn't an act, but a habit. And that's how it started. It started as an act, not a fake one, but me just trying to figure out how to get to this place where it feels real. And then when you arrive there, it's like, it's, I remember talking to Raven Simone and she was like, thirties are the, are the, is the decade of revelations. Like, and obviously, obviously Jesus, you know, I'm not unique, but it's like, when she put it like that, it was like, okay. And then as I've been in my decade of the thirties, there have been so many revelations that it's like, what is coming next?

• 15:54Speaker 01

  And this year I turned thirty-three. So it's like, what is about to happen? You know what I mean? Come on, Jesus here. You know, what is about to be reborn? You know, what's going to happen? And it's been remarkable, man, because the seeds that I sold, even though I didn't know when it was going to really hit me, when it was going to really feel true, I still planted those seeds. I really did. And I watered them sometimes every day, sometimes once a month, sometimes every couple of weeks. You know, and then I come back and I do it more consistently, but I kept watering and watering and watering. And I now I'm seeing the growth from those seeds that I sold or that I planted, you know?

• 16:30Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What, what even took you on that journey? Why did you want to pursue the path of understanding your thoughts and mindfulness and even going on that silent journey? Like, I get that that wasn't even your path, but why did you even want to go on that path? What were you looking for? What was, what was life like that you were asking those bigger questions?

• 16:47Speaker 01

  So I think what started me to get into these kinds of conversations was deep depression. I suffered from like a lot of depression and anxiety, a lot of feigning spells and panic attacks and stuff like that. Like I would go sometimes and like my period would disappear because I would be so stressed. And this started when I was like twelve. And I would always journal. My journal is, I think, one of my earliest rituals and practices. Brandy gave me my first journal. She said, you're gonna need this. And she was really right. Because it really allowed for me to get a lot of things out. I think it saved my life in a lot of ways, being able to come back to myself and remember who I am while dealing with so much of my responsibilities and, and just the projections of being in front of the camera. And so I would journal a lot and I just started to really understand that I was dealing with stuff.

• 17:32Speaker 01

  And this is why I have such a, I really do love the internet and, and technology in a lot of ways, because it saved me. I remember I started searching up words and searching up feelings and the way that I felt about certain things. And then different philosophers would come up, you know, or different people that would say certain things. I would put in a word on this website called thinkexist.com. And I found out words about stress. Then I found about that what I was feeling was anxiety. And these are like, were small things to me, you know? In my, my mind now, I know them very regularly in my dialogue, but at the beginning, I didn't know any of those things. I thought something was wrong with me. And then I started to realize that these were concepts and things that people have been talking about for thousands of years. Like the fact that I was asking these questions, it wasn't actually crazy. It was kind of correct. You know what I mean? And I should continue to ask these questions.

• 18:18Speaker 01

  And so that's when I started to realize that there was other stuff out there and that how I was feeling, even if it wasn't something that was common in my industry or something that we were talking about in entertainment, there was a space for it. And so through that, you obviously learn about Buddha and you learn about like all these different concepts of, you know, monks and people going on retreats and the concept of all this type of stuff. And I started this, looking at that when I was probably like fourteen, fifteen. And then by the time that I was eighteen, nineteen, I was like, I want to see these and have these experiences for myself. Because my identity was constantly being broken down and attacked. After I was seventeen, my TV show, True Jackson VP, went off of the air.

• 18:56Speaker 01

  It was like, I would liken it to a, a, a sixty-year-old man retiring or being removed from his top position as a CEO. At seventeen, that's how I felt. I felt like I was having a midlife, midlife crisis. Like, it was like, whoa, like the money is different, my ability to help, my family is different. You know, I don't know who I am as an adult, let alone as, as an entertainer, as a, as an, as now a grown woman. So it was like, there was a lot happening and I knew that if I was going to survive it. That I was gonna have to get my mind right. I just knew that my mind and I would watch videos of like Will Smith. Will Smith at this time too would always be talking about this kind of thing.

• 19:32Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 19:33Speaker 01

  He was like.

• 19:34Jay Shetty?

  Those old interviews are like, yeah, they're insane.

• 19:37Speaker 01

  He was always talking about get your mind right, get your mind right. And so it's like, I was, I was like, I want to be like, well, you know what I mean? I want to be able to be I, robot. I want to be able to be the, the hero of my life.

• 19:47Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 19:47Speaker 01

  And I took it to heart, man. I took it so to heart. And so I started getting physical. I started, I remember I got a trainer when I was like 18, 19. I was like, I was on the Will Smith program. You know what I mean? I was getting my.

• 19:58Jay Shetty?

  You were in the Ali program.

• 19:59Speaker 01

  I was in the Ali program. I was on that therapy, getting my body right, getting my mind right. And it just became a, a part of the things I was into. It became a, a part of my hobbies, a kind of part of my personality. It was like doing my work and my job and then trying to be on some, you know, wellness, nourishment kick. And my family was like, okay, this is crazy, you know? But that's who I've been in my family, you know? And that's became a part of my life. And, and so, yeah, and from then that just kept being something that I always was chipping away at, caring about, investing in, you know?

• 20:29Jay Shetty?

  That's incredible. I didn't know that. I love for everyone who's listening to know that. Like, how much would you dedicate and say, because of that work I did when I was 18, when I was coming out of a dark period, when I went through this midlife crisis at 17 years old, and I refocused myself, how much of your success today would you owe to that part?

• 20:44Speaker 01

  I mean, I want to be dramatic, but I would probably say everything. And I would say not just the success of me as an entertainer, the success of me surviving being an entertainer. I remember watching the Eddie Murphy documentary and Dave Chappelle said, not only is Eddie Murphy successful, but he survived being Eddie Murphy. Being a successful person is a great accomplishment, but it comes with a lot of things. It comes with a lot of stuff, what, you know? On the road to success is tough. I think you said similar, something similar to this earlier. On the road to success is tough because it's tough. And then when you get there, the concept of sustaining it, what does it look like to evolve it? How does it look like to deal with what people expect from you because you are so successful? So, yeah, I think that be, you know, people say, oh, your childhood, you know, they survived and all this kind of stuff.

• 21:29Speaker 01

  Like, those are the practices that have helped me, you know? And when I started my company, Key TV Network, that was focused on helping you with your business, your brand, creating the practice of being able to actually do stuff. I could not leave out an opportunity to build something else, practice by Palmer, which is, these are the practices that helped me be able to be the person that I am in business. You have to be good in your mind. You have to know who you are. And there's no way to stay in touch with you, who you are in this world, without having some type of forms of rituals. You know what I mean? That's why a lot of people are like, oh, I'm not religious or I'm not. At the base level, it's a ritual. It's a, it's something that you can go to. You know what I'm saying? Even though I, I grew up Catholic, I have not been consistently to a Catholic church in years.

• 22:13Speaker 01

  But those rituals, Lord not laying me down to sleep, I pray the Lord my soul to keep. You know, it grounds you. It's a, at the, at the baseline of what it is. If you take away anything that you think about religion, it's a conversation with yourself.

• 22:25Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 22:26Speaker 01

  It's a conversation with the universe. Hey, you know, this is what's on my mind. You need to get that stuff out. That's how we know what's going on inside. It's the journaling, spending moments of silence and seeing what comes up into your mind. And, you know, it don't have to be quiet. I remember when somebody first turned me that mindfulness isn't just your mind being quiet. It's actually you watching your mind be not quiet.

• 22:46Jay Shetty?

  Mm hmm.

• 22:47Speaker 01

  And actually just sitting back and being like, now that was interesting. I'm gonna let you rock. You know what I mean? Like, like being in that space. Like, so for me, it's like, that is so important to go side by side. To me, you are not a successful person if you can't be with yourself, if you can't know who you are outside of your achievements. And I just, I really was afraid of, I didn't want to be lost. And I think it was also scary, the feeling of having all so many things stripped from me. At that age, I saw like, I've got to always be okay. If the money not there, if the projects ain't there, if the people don't care, I gotta be okay because this could take me for a jail span.

• 23:28Jay Shetty?

  If you ever open up a church, I'm there. I'm telling you right now. Yeah, I'm like, I want to come to your monastery. I've been going to the wrong thing. This is like, I'm like, I'm in church right now. This is amazing.

• 23:36Speaker 01

  Come on, praise him.

• 23:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. No, but it's, as I'm listening to, I'm like, wow, it's, it's so fascinating hearing someone. What I love about this is I feel like everyone at their point in life comes to recognize the value of this work, whatever you call it, whether it's religion, spirituality, therapy, coaching, work, the work. Everyone comes to it in their own way. And when I hear people's stories about how they found it, it's never the same. It's totally unique. It's also someone from such a different background and walk of life. Like, I found it at the same age as you did, but I found it in a completely different way. And it was a completely different whirlwind and experience that I was having. But the fact that we both have so many things in common, even though we come from totally different backgrounds.

• 24:16Speaker 01

  Well, I really related to your story when we talked on the show, even though I didn't go necessarily specifically in that path. I still have, you know, done entertainment work. I love it that much that I could see that for myself. So I'm like, I love your life because it's like you get to do that every single, you get to talk about stuff that I think is so meaningful. I mean, I'm not trying to say entertainment's not meaningful because it, everything plays a part. Sometimes you want to lose yourself in a project. Sometimes storytelling is the only way you can understand something. So those things are absolutely useful. But what I love is just the opportunity to also bring it back to the attention to that because as human beings, it's really scary.

• 24:48Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 24:49Speaker 01

  Just don't think we talk about it enough. We don't know why we're here. We don't, we don't know if we're like a, a cell microbiome in some big giant's life that lives on another planet. Like, we don't know.

• 25:00Jay Shetty?

  Some sort of experiment.

• 25:01Speaker 01

  Right, you know what I mean? We don't, we don't. These are the things that go into your mind. And obviously, there are ways that, there are things that people do believe about that. But at the baseline of it is, it can feel really lonely.

• 25:11Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 25:12Speaker 01

  It can feel really scary. You don't know if you should try to achieve something and be quote unquote, successful, or just be over there in a village by a lake with your family and do nothing and just appreciate the opportunity of being. All of us are trying to figure it out. And so I love when we can talk about that because it's like, that's the real stuff. That's, that's the stuff that sometimes can drive you crazy or make you a narcissist, as they say, because you just want to feel like you matter. You know, at the core of that is just, I want to matter. I want to know that I matter and that my life meant something. And that's something that any of us can relate to. So it brings me great joy because it's always in my mind.

• 25:46Jay Shetty?

  Did you find that a lot of the people around you, as you were coming up as a child star, were struggling with that as well?

• 25:53Speaker 01

  Yes, most of them were turning to different things to help them. And I felt like my parents were overprotective of me then. I felt very alone and I felt like all I had was my journal. Um, and that I didn't have anybody that I could talk to. And I had one friend who just, who passed away, uh, named Brandon. Yeah, he was my first boyfriend.

• 26:10Jay Shetty?

  He passed away recently.

• 26:11Speaker 01

  He passed away recently, sick of cell anemia, only 34 years old.

• 26:15Jay Shetty?

  So sorry to hear that.

• 26:16Speaker 01

  And he was my friend that I would talk to a lot. And I have my friend, Taylor Parks. Like, I have very few friends that I didn't get to see often in my journal. You know, I mean, thanks to MySpace, I was able to talk to them. Tom, I'll always love you. I will always love you, okay? So I, it was very, you know, I had a couple of people, but I felt very alone dealing with things that I, and I didn't have anybody to relate to because I didn't have a lot of friends in the industry. The ones that were, were, it wasn't the same, you know what I mean? Gravity. And a lot of kids my age, I could see now, like when I had conversations with people like Demi, I wish that I did talk to them. I think I also felt very isolated being a lot of times the only black. And my experience with being the only black in my school back in Illinois was like, stay in your lane, girl. You know what I mean?

• 26:58Speaker 01

  And so I was obviously the star of my own show and I never was like putting my head down, but I kind of was like, I don't know if I'm really, what we really talking about. Like, I really didn't know. So I was just like, showed up, hey, we polite, we talk. But we weren't really necessarily getting into it because we didn't have the language that we have now. Like, there was no words for microaggressions. There was no words for, you know, what that felt like, any of those nuances. And so, but when I see now, I see that we all really was dealing with a lot of different, you know, in our own way, but a lot of the same things that I wish that we all could have talked. But there was no space for that, you know? So a lot of times, you know, people were, sex or drugs or whatever it might have been for them to be able to cope. And honestly, for me, I was a really an internet kid. I went to the internet and I still be on there, you know what I mean?

• 27:43Speaker 01

  You know, so it's like, I was, I was the kid that was making friends.

• 27:46Jay Shetty?

  You found the good side of the internet, though.

• 27:47Speaker 01

  Man, it was, I mean, we had some time, you know, those early days with the wild, wild west. But I really do feel grateful to have experienced MySpace. I really found some really genuine people.

• 27:56Jay Shetty?

  You're giving some big shout outs to MySpace.

• 27:58Speaker 01

  Honestly, because it was the place where I just, I just was coding. You know what I mean? I was meeting friends and learning about their space. I was having so much fun being able to express myself in my small corner. And it was private, right? Because this is before Twitter, this is before, you know, entertainers being online. This is like, back in the day, me and any of the friends that I had or, or I should say peers, colleagues that I had on Disney and Nickelodeon, we had private pages. Like, our names would be like, Fanny, Fanny, Toot, Toot. You know what I mean? Because we're like trying to be like all incognito, you know what I mean? So it was like before all that time and it was the one place that I felt like I could express. So that was a saving grace for me.

• 28:36Jay Shetty?

  What's it like now? What are the rituals now?

• 28:39Speaker 01

  I thought you were about to say with the internet.

• 28:41Jay Shetty?

  Oh, no. We'll go there later, maybe, maybe.

• 28:44Speaker 01

  Sorry, go ahead.

• 28:45Jay Shetty?

  Actually, let's go back a step. When you were 18 and you're looking forward and you're like, God, I got to learn all these things and I've got to learn the mindset and I'm watching the Will Smith video and whatever else it may be, did you ever think you would find the answer? Or did you feel scared that you may never know?

• 29:01Speaker 01

  I actually did believe. I really did believe. I didn't know when, though. So I had to really have a lot of patience. But I did believe, I believed that if I keep, I, why, why would that not happen? If I don't keep, if I keep chipping away, it's like that picture that goes viral every two years where the guy's like chipping away and he turns around and he was already, he was just there. I really believed that like, there's no way if I keep chipping away, that I won't get to wherever I'm trying to be. I really truly believe that. And so even though it will be hard in times, and then you see small, small things, like things that, that stuck, you know what I mean? Like, things that were like, oh, I went from working out every now and then to now it's a part of my every single day. Or, you know, I went to, you know, only going for a walk X amount of times of the year.

• 29:46Speaker 01

  Now I'm doing them X, you know, now I'm doing a thousand steps, you know, whatever it is. I started to see those changes. But my attitude is, I think a lot of times you think you're going to have a new mind, but my mind is actually just so much more compassionate. The new mind was compassion for myself to be able to grow. Like, I realized that it was not like a new person that I would be, but that it would be like, it would just be a version of me that supports the person I've always been.

• 30:13Jay Shetty?

  Hmm.

• 30:13Speaker 01

  You know what I mean? And giving myself a safer place to land and being okay when things don't go right and knowing that I can get right back up again. Instead of thinking that, oh, I messed up on Monday, I guess I don't get another chance till Friday. It's like, why would that be the case? You still have the opportunity in the next couple of hours, even, to decide to have a better mood. So I think that's the cool thing that I've discovered when I think about me and my, you know, 18 and those early teen years of getting into awareness of myself with intention. It's like, wow, like, I didn't become a new person. I just started being nicer and more loving and supportive of the person that I've always been. And because of that, I've bloomed. You know what I mean?

• 30:51Jay Shetty?

  That is so good.

• 30:53Jay Shetty?

  That is so good. No, because I think that's we constantly convince ourselves that you're going to become a new person. That you've got to become a new version of yourself. And you're so right that it's actually just seeing the version that already is there.

• 31:05Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 31:06Jay Shetty?

  That exists, that lives, that breeds, that has all the skills, the potential, the the tools, the mindset. And and being present for that version and being compassionate, because if you're always telling yourself, you have to be someone else to be successful.

• 31:18Speaker 01

  Well, that just sucks. You're just being so mean to you. You know, Brene Brown speaks a lot about that kind of thing with the shame piece. And it's so interesting how that can show up in your life and you just you don't think that that's what you're doing. But you are, I think I used to feel so much shame or guilt around my large capacity. So I would constantly outsource it and then I'd be so sad when I got nothing back. Because it was like that, the capacity, that abundance, it actually should be inward. And I shouldn't feel guilty that I can pull myself up or, you know, decide to go out there for my goals or, you know, instead of always feeling like it's my job to make other people feel great about themselves. Because they they don't have that energy. Well, what would happen if I, you know, I gave that out when I could and when I felt like doing it. But I gave it back to myself.

• 32:01Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 32:01Speaker 01

  And it's like, damn. Yeah, I needed this. And when now I see how I feel when I'm actually giving what I've been giving out to me.

• 32:09Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 32:10Speaker 01

  You know?

• 32:10Jay Shetty?

  And we feel selfish when you fast do it.

• 32:13Speaker 01

  You do.

• 32:14Jay Shetty?

  Right?

• 32:14Speaker 01

  And I don't, it's a guilt, it's a shame. It's a shame around seeing something, having insight around something, feeling something, knowing something. For whatever reason, I don't know what that is. But as human beings, the moment that we feel that we have a lot. It's just so weird. I don't know what that does, but you know, yeah, I feel that that that I've had to deal with that. That I felt shame since I was a little kid, being able to be happy even. You know, and those are like priceless things. But I think I felt guilt about it, that I was able to be so happy. Even when we was living in poverty and nothing was good was going on. I felt like I could find a reason to have joy. I could get out on the floor and dance and be, you know, I always felt like that. That was like a superpower for me. And I felt like, oh, guilty about that because everybody else can't be happy. Now it's my job to make everybody.

• 32:59Speaker 01

  You know, and it's like, that's different. It's a different feeling of giving. Because you want to and then giving because you feel that people need you to.

• 33:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 33:07Speaker 01

  You're like guilty, giving from a place of guilt and shame for having joy as opposed, you know, that can, that can really distort the gift.

• 33:15Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, when you feel you're responsible for other people's emotions. That just sends you down the wrong path, whereas when you feel you're on your path and you can overflow and give people the love that they deserve and need. That's a totally different thing and it's such a fine line.

• 33:31Speaker 01

  Yes, it is.

• 33:32Jay Shetty?

  For people with big capacity, especially.

• 33:34Speaker 01

  Because sometimes just your presence is enough.

• 33:36Jay Shetty?

  I can relate to everything you're saying right now.

• 33:37Speaker 01

  You know, because you get, and that's your work and that's just so cool. I remember one time I was talking to, and I'm sure I would.

• 33:43Jay Shetty?

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• 34:26Jay Shetty?

  That's indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need to hire? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. This episode is brought to you by Wayfair. Home should be a place that feels like a sanctuary, a space that truly reflects who you are. But it can be challenging to balance style, budget and endless options. I was looking to create a dedicated calm space for my morning meditation and reading. But I was struggling to find pieces that felt grounding but could also stand up to daily use. I went on Wayfair and found a beautiful, solid wood accent chair and a bookshelf. Now that corner is my favorite place to anchor my day. The quality is incredible, it's built to last, and it completely shifted the energy of the room.

• 35:08Jay Shetty?

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• 35:50Jay Shetty?

  State Farm is there to meet you where you are and they know how sweet it is to feel good about your decisions. Talk to a State Farm agent today to learn how you can choose to bundle and save with a personal price plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state. This episode is brought to you by Whole Foods Market. If you're talking about quality food, you can't forget Whole Foods Market, who've been holding themselves to the highest standards since they opened in nineteen eighty. That means you'll see thousands of organic products across their stores, from the produce department to the aisles.

• 36:33Jay Shetty?

  It also means you'll never see certain ingredients. They've banned artificial sweeteners and colors, high fructose corn syrup and more, so you can shop with peace of mind. Shop Whole Foods Market in store or online.

• 36:47Speaker 01

  Love to hear if you have a version of this. One of my um teachers, one of the people first that were mentoring me on this path was a makeup artist and she introduced me to another kind of master yogi type of person. And but I could only call him at a certain amount of time. He was only available till a certain amount of time. And if you didn't catch him, you didn't catch him. And you also cannot call him after this time.

• 37:08Jay Shetty?

  Wow.

• 37:09Speaker 01

  And so I would talk to this man every now and then. One time I called this man and Lily, like the time was like eight P M. I called this man at eight oh one. He answered the phone, why would you call me? Why would you call me? It sounded almost like we was in beyond belief active fishing and he was going to disappear after this. It was like so urgent. He was like, why would you call me? Why would you call me? And I was like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I have never been able to contact that man again.

• 37:32Jay Shetty?

  No.

• 37:33Speaker 01

  I have never been able to reach him again, never have been able to. It's like gone. It's like gone in the wind. Like it's like he's gone. You know what I mean? And I say that to say like I really respected that he had clear boundaries. He had a large capacity, millions of people probably called that man, A, day to tell him about something. To talk to him about a new path. But he had very clear boundaries to the point where he said, you didn't follow and you can't be involved. Because I have a lot to give and I have to protect it so that I can keep giving it to its full capacity. So that made me think with you, I'm sure that you have so many friends that's calling you, that's telling you, do you have something that you try to let them know like? I'm not open for business with this right now.

• 38:19Jay Shetty?

  Well, I have a rule that I don't give friends advice. Because I just want to be a friend.

• 38:26Speaker 01

  Well, guess what? We're not friends.

• 38:27Jay Shetty?

  We're not friends. All right.

• 38:28Speaker 01

  We're not friends, so I'm gonna call you.

• 38:30Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, exactly. You can call me. Yeah, we're not friends. Because I used to feel like when we'd be just hanging out and someone's talking about their problems. I don't like giving unsolicited advice. That's first of all.

• 38:39Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 38:39Jay Shetty?

  Like, no one needs unsolicited advice. So that's first of all, I don't give that. But what I didn't like was like friends would be just talking about their problems and I'm like, oh, Jay, tell us what to do. And then no one's going to follow up and listen to it because they're your friend.

• 38:49Speaker 01

  Exactly.

• 38:50Jay Shetty?

  They're not going to take it seriously either. So I'm like, look, I'm just gonna hang, we're just gonna, you know, talk about soccer or something, talk about the basketball, like, let's just be friends. And and it's safer that way. And then when someone's coming to you, asking you for advice, truly locking in, truly saying, hey, I'm taking this really seriously. I'm not asking the group chat. I'm coming to you because I want your help and support. I'm locked in, I'm there to help, of course. But that was my boundary setting where it was like, if we're committed to each other. That you want to do the work and I'm going to help you, then I'm in. But if we're just giving free advice and hanging out, that's not going to help anyone because we're all going to feel spent. But I mean, I should do the eight oh one thing. That's what I said.

• 39:27Speaker 01

  That motherfucker ain't him. I ain't heard. I was trying to get back to him for years. He was like, you're done. But it's so important because I feel like we find ourselves doing that too. Like, I can at least say for myself where it's like when I take a step back, like everything that I was trying to tell others or support others on, even if they ask, even if they, we were just having a conversation and I accidentally spilled extra over, those were things that I needed. And so I've really been in a season of restraint, even if somebody asks me, I'm not telling them what to do or tell them. I'm just being a listening ear and allowing my presence to at least just be a bouncing board. Which is so funny because that's what we always say a good therapist is anyway. Like, you know what I mean? A good, a good person that you actually are going to for help. Generally pushes you toward the answers that you have yourself.

• 40:12Jay Shetty?

  Yes.

• 40:13Speaker 01

  So it's so funny how you can be thinking that, you know, it's, it's your job, it's your duty. And it's like, actually your best thing is to just be there, to listen and to reflect. And so in my season of restraint, I feel like, A, I'm getting so much of the things that I thought that other people needed from me. I'm actually realizing how much better off I am by having my relationships reflect information to me. And instead of thinking I'm supposed to share it, but actually like leaning into the intuition myself, seeing what reality reveals to me. And then also taking what I learn or what I'm seeing reflected in the relationship and actually turning it back into myself and say, well, what's my relationship to this? If I think that that's what's happening with this person, is that showing up in my life? Instead of thinking I'm supposed to tell the person something.

• 40:57Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What's that? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, we feel better when other people are doing worse.

• 41:04Speaker 01

  And obligated, and obligated in some way to be like, by the way.

• 41:08Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 41:08Speaker 01

  A Virgo is good for some by the way ass shit.

• 41:10Jay Shetty?

  I'm a Virgo.

• 41:15Speaker 01

  I'm a Virgo. We can be really, if we're not healed, we can be actually.

• 41:20Jay Shetty?

  Well, but what's your birthday?

• 41:21Speaker 01

  August twenty sixth.

• 41:22Jay Shetty?

  Oh, I'm six September.

• 41:24Speaker 01

  That's creepy. We can literally be by the way.

• 41:29Jay Shetty?

  I had to really control that. I had to rein it in.

• 41:31Speaker 01

  Me too. By the way, Aries, you're not, you're not free.

• 41:35Jay Shetty?

  Oh, really?

• 41:35Speaker 01

  Aries love.

• 41:36Jay Shetty?

  Why are you calling out Aries?

• 41:37Speaker 01

  Aries love to be like, actually.

• 41:42Jay Shetty?

  What's Leo?

• 41:43Speaker 01

  Leo is a Leo rising, a Taurus moon and a Pisces sun. And he's not an actually person. He's actually like, actually your ass. Leo is like Tia and Tamara. I got my own mind. I do my own style at my own time. He is so unbothered. Oh, my gosh. Well, they say Pisces are perfect opposites of Virgos.

• 42:06Jay Shetty?

  Oh, interesting. My sister's a Pisces.

• 42:08Speaker 01

  Very let it flow, very let it go. Very, my son is so present and so like, he cool, you know?

• 42:14Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 42:15Speaker 01

  Who gave you these blue eyes? They are remarkable.

• 42:17Jay Shetty?

  Complete anomaly in my family. No one has them.

• 42:20Speaker 01

  They're just awesome.

• 42:21Jay Shetty?

  No one has them. I got really lucky. I grew up with jokes about how my mom had an affair with the milkman.

• 42:25Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh. It's giving Pitbull. Pitbull got those eyes too.

• 42:28Jay Shetty?

  Does he? Does he?

• 42:29Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 42:29Jay Shetty?

  I never noticed them on Pitbull. Oh, that's so funny.

• 42:31Speaker 01

  Mister Worldwide.

• 42:32Jay Shetty?

  I never knew that. Wow, that's funny. Yeah, no, complete anomaly. You're so like, when you walk into a room, you are such a force.

• 42:39Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh.

• 42:39Jay Shetty?

  You're just such an energy, a spark, like whether it's a big room, a small room like this, whatever it is. How would Lauren walk into a room?

• 42:46Speaker 01

  Hmm. Well, she would probably walk in and not feel like she had to make people feel comfortable about it. See, I think that I always knew that I, that the energy existed. But because it would make people feel some type of way, and I learned this very early on when I started going to private school, because the teachers were like, stay in your line. The energy was clear that for whatever reason, however I was perceived on the outside, the power that I had within was not allowed. And so I just, I learned not to silence the power, but to make it more palatable. And make it a little bit easier for you to get into. And that's when my, that's when those skills sets, you know, of me being able to regulate a space

• 43:25Speaker 01

  or be able to translate who I am, whether through code switching or charm or whatever it could be called. That was me trying to create safety for myself. And it was the best way that I knew how to create safety. And then there are things that they are part of me, you know, they're who I am. But now I don't always feel like, you know, or I'm at least better about where I choose to go. If a place requires me to do that, to be safe. Because ultimately, that's where it came from. It came from a place of feeling unsafe. Showing up, being seen as powerful, being felt as powerful, power that I didn't even know that I had. And trying to figure out how to make sure that it was hands up, don't shoot, basically. You know what I'm saying?

• 44:04Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 44:05Speaker 01

  As a black, young black person and as a young black woman. And so I, it was just me managing the fear that that would put into others.

• 44:13Jay Shetty?

  Did you have experiences like that, that felt very, very unsafe?

• 44:16Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh, yes, all the time. You know what I mean? Whether it was with, you know, misogyny and then also racially. When people feel like you are challenging the status quo in some regard. Also, I saw it in history. I remember having a conversation with somebody, you know, and I was thinking about like Martin Luther King. You know what I mean? And it was like, that's a fear that black people really genuinely feel. Anybody that is of a person of color or dealing or from a particular group that decides to stand up, a lot of times they've been murdered. You know, they've been attacked. Caring about my community, being passionate, you can't be Michael from Good Times and actually live long. That's what you've seen the pattern to be.

• 44:58Speaker 01

  And so, yeah, very young, knowing that I had impact, doing movies like Akela and the Bee, my community saying, we got, became kind of afraid at a certain age where it's like, well, I don't want nobody to take my ass out. You know what I'm saying? I want nobody to be afraid of me, you know, or think I'm gonna do, you know what I mean? And I remember after I did one of the marchings that we were dealing with, and I say one of the marchings, because there's so many that it gets to the point where it's like, you know, right after George Floyd died. I was like, I just, something had came over me. And I was, I had a moment with the National Guard that people filmed. And I remember being really, really scared. But I think that that marked like a moment in my life where I maybe was trying to come out of that fear. Because I was spooked that like, I remember calling my mom like, they're probably gonna get me for this.

• 45:39Speaker 01

  So I'm gonna be, I was really spooked that people are gonna get me for just standing up for my community in this way. And it was really scary to me, but something had just come over me in that moment. And it was, it was during COVID and everything was, and I felt just so like, I just was like, I, I just can't believe this. You know, I was just so unhappy and just so, but I didn't want that to make me silent. And then I just, it was just so much feelings that I had to do that. And then I, but I was a little bit scared, but I feel like it was the marking of me kind of shedding some of that fear. And also like being able to understand and articulate some of these things. But you're constantly trying to figure out how to manage these things. You know what I mean? From whoever you are, whatever background, whatever you believe in, you know, we're all dealing with some challenges.

• 46:21Speaker 01

  And I remember I would have these experiences like going to Harvard and the Harvard would be doing a thing on me and they would be talking to me about power. And I'm, I would be trying to figure out like, why am I the case study? You know, so it took me many years to understand what I was holding, how I was affecting people and why it was such a thing that I had to manage all the time and then to be at peace with that.

• 46:42Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, it's amazing how we develop all these skills and tools in order to feel safe. And then they become the very things that make us feel unsafe because we get so disconnected from who we are deep down. It's so fascinating, isn't it?

• 46:56Speaker 01

  You ate that. You ate that. It's like our protective tool became too good.

• 47:01Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, it's like how like your protective tool suffocates you, which is like a fascinating idea when you think about it. And we all do that as kids. For me, like watching my parents argue, watching my parents behave in the way they did, I was picking up cues. And I can, I can walk into a room and I know every energetic field that is going on in a room, in any room. I can listen to each corner. I know what's happening over there and I can be fully present over here because I had to. I didn't have a choice. And I love that skill. Yeah, I love that skill. I love that tool. And at the same time, it can take away from being able to flow and have human experience. And so you have to be aware of it. So you almost have to be aware of the tools that you're built to protect and make sure they don't suffocate you. What have you done to create those spaces where these incredible tools you have?

• 47:46Speaker 01

  Yeah, yeah.

• 47:47Jay Shetty?

  That you use so wisely. You've learned how to be really effective with them. And at the same time, they are true to you. They're not, they're not inauthentic. But then how have you allowed yourself to put the sword and shield down sometimes and breathe? Like, what does that look like?

• 48:01Speaker 01

  Well, I think when I did my TED Talk, that was a big moment of reclamation. Thank you so much.

• 48:06Jay Shetty?

  I want, I want you to know, my whole team watched it and everyone was like raving about it. So just so you know.

• 48:10Speaker 01

  And thank you so much. That was a big rec, moment of reclamation for me parasocially. I think in my personal life, you know, like I said, my practices, holding space for myself over time have allowed me to let those things, have those moments of breath, you know? But parasocially, that was an opportunity to really also speak to my audience about that differentiation. My nuance outside of just being fun and joyful and energetic is I have feelings. I'm a human being. I've had, my, my experience in this and being, coming this has been, has cost me a lot of things. My nervous system is readjusting from all these experiences that I've had. And that it's okay to be nuanced and complex and that I don't want to be the poster child for hyper functioning

• 48:54Speaker 01

  if it doesn't sit alongside this truth. That was like a big, big moment for me in my life. Now it's, everything is integrated. Because it was always fragmented from my private life and my professional life. And so that was a big moment of integration in a major way. Again, being able to speak the truth, being able to speak truth to power. That is the greatest liberator of that voice that's inside that had to rest. Is to actually speak truth on the things that I experienced and what it cost me and how I had to learn this stuff and that adaptive intelligence and what performance is and what is authenticity that lives inside of that. Like, these are conversations that I felt like I wasn't allowed to have or I couldn't have. And then a lot of times in the early days, people didn't want to have. Did nobody care, give a damn about this?

• 49:38Speaker 01

  You know, they didn't want to, you had to just be ready to go and be.

• 49:40Jay Shetty?

  Totally.

• 49:41Speaker 01

  Job. Like, you know, you want to be just, hey, it's too much. So it's like, if you talk, if I can have the conversation, then I can have the conversation. So I'll also say time. And that's why I've taken care of yourself. I'm so happy that I did those things so that when the world also was arriving at these times, that I could share that, that I could share this truth because people could be open and ready to hear it. And so I felt like that was also true for my generation, how I came up in this industry and what, you know, what it took for me to get here was like, also waiting for spaces like this to exist. I feel like, you know, I mean, obviously podcasting exists back then, but it was called talk radio.

• 50:18Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. And you weren't having conversations like this.

• 50:21Speaker 01

  Right, you know? And so also we've all caught up to our period. So it's like a collective shift that has gone on that I get to be a part of.

• 50:30Jay Shetty?

  No, for sure. And you were ahead of it. You were doing it when it wasn't trendy. So now that it's kind of come into vogue.

• 50:36Speaker 01

  Yeah, which is crazy.

• 50:37Jay Shetty?

  This episode is brought to you by Amazon Health AI. We've got to talk about those panicked internet searches. You know, the ones that I'm talking about, when something about your body just doesn't seem right? So you search and search and scroll and scroll and trying to figure out your body by endlessly looking for answers. Thankfully, now there's Amazon Health AI. It can connect your symptoms with your medical history and it can even get you care 24/7. So call off the search. Amazon Health AI is here. Healthcare just got less painful. When you were talking about your childhood, I remember having what now I know are panic attacks or anxiety attacks. And I'd go to the doctor, the doctor would wire me up with this like crazy technology,

• 51:22Jay Shetty?

  checking my heart rate, checking my heartbeats. And then 24 hours I'd have to wear it at school. It would look really weird. And then the next day I'd go back and it'd be like, there's nothing wrong with him. And I'm like, mom, there's something wrong with me. Like I'm, I'm having an experience and we just didn't have language for it. And so what you're saying about language is huge, but vocabulary, emotional vocabulary is just so huge. And I feel like people being exposed to ideas and words is so important.

• 51:45Speaker 01

  I mean, I didn't even realize that, how the recursive like, kind of like boom that is when I was thinking about the fact that I did Akela and the Bee. This movie that, again, it's inspiring in many different ways, but for me, it became re-inspiring because it's like, yes, a little girl having language to express how she feels. That's crazy. Yeah, that is powerful because words, once you can put words in, I mean, we can get all into Lacan that words have different meanings for other people. Like, you know, yes, of course, love doesn't mean the same to me as it means to you. But if we're generally speaking, having the words to define and articulate how you feel with precision is without a doubt liberating.

• 52:30Speaker 01

  And that's why the TED Talk experience was so major for me. Because it was a moment that I had to sit down, actually write, and I'm gonna tell you something that was crazy too.

• 52:39Speaker 01

  With this whole TED Talk thing. So I was getting ready to film a movie. Right in the middle of when I'm getting ready to do the TED Talk and have the TED Experience. And I was fine with it. I was like, I'll go in, just do my, my talk that one day. I won't get to do the whole TED, but I'll get to do my talk that one day. That'll be fine. In the midst of me, you know, preparing for my talk, we're preparing for the movie. And they're, they're, they're chipping away at a lot of stuff. Like the movie was supposed to be a certain amount of days. Now it's staying there two days. Not literally, but you know what I mean? It ain't a long time. Now the movie was supposed to be this much money they doing with it. Now it's crunched this much money. Okay, that's gonna make things harder for us as well. You know, all these little things started to happen that started making me feel really just not happy and uncomfortable. You know, in, in the midst of that, they were also chopping down my TED days.

• 53:22Speaker 01

  So originally I was gonna have all my TED days and be able to have the experience. But then suddenly that stopped going from that to me just having the one day. And I was still like, all right, fine, all right. Then they call and they say again. And pretty much they're gonna take away the TED day. And I did something that I've never done before. Which I am still so proud of myself doing this. Said I'm not doing the movie.

• 53:43Jay Shetty?

  Wow.

• 53:44Speaker 01

  I'm not doing the movie. I'm done. Cause by the way, I already didn't wanna do the movie. The truth of the matter is I was already doing the same shit that I'm talking about doing in this speech that I ain't doing, gonna do no more. I don't feel good. It doesn't make me happy. I'm not gonna enjoy this. This is requiring me to chop off pieces of myself that matter to me. Man, when I tell you that I said no to that movie, I felt so liberated and had my experience with my TED conference. And had my talk. And was able to feel truly embodied in that moment and to know that I was actually making choices that really were real for the person that, the true full person that I am.

• 54:28Speaker 01

  That was a moment. I'm so proud of myself.

• 54:31Jay Shetty?

  I'm proud of you. That's amazing. Yeah.

• 54:33Speaker 01

  I'm so proud of myself.

• 54:34Jay Shetty?

  Those, those are the hardest moments though.

• 54:36Speaker 01

  When you're put to the test.

• 54:37Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, exactly. You're up there saying the thing. And then you almost have to live it. I've, I've had many of those moments and those are the hardest because you can tell whether you're in alignment or you're misaligned.

• 54:47Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 54:47Jay Shetty?

  Because you're like, I'm saying this thing over here, but.

• 54:50Speaker 01

  And it's so crazy because then to get the feedback that I had gotten on my TED Talk, I look, I just like, God is just so real to me, you know? Because it's like, God will show you, life will show you. And it's not about like, just data and insights. It's about impact. It's about the fact that somebody comes up to me and they say, girl, I feel the same way and this is what I've been experiencing with my family. Like, I love doing movies and I love performance and I love all that type of stuff. But you can't take these, if something is going to take moments like that away from me, true connection like that for me, then it ain't right. I know that it ain't right. If it doesn't feel good, if I'm not liberated and excited about it, then it can't be, it can't be correct for me. It can't be true. And so that really was a big moment for me this year. It really was.

• 55:32Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. At the beginning, you kinda can cut corners. You, you're trying to figure your way, right? Like you, you, you, not everything's gonna be fully aligned when you start. You have to do certain things. You have to compromise. But then when you get to a certain point. That's why you get to that point, right?

• 55:47Speaker 01

  To your point about that point, you can't deny the awareness. I had become so aware. I had become much too aware.

• 55:54Jay Shetty?

  When you started, you don't know.

• 55:55Speaker 01

  But once you are aware, I was aware that if I said yes to that movie and, and didn't do what I wanted to do with Ted. I would have been betraying myself. See, these other situations, the self betrayals are not as glaring. Cause we don't really even know how to really show up for ourselves. We're still trying to become aware of what we want. But once you become aware of what you want and aware of what's not in alignment with that, and you decide to still do what's not in alignment with that, well now. You gonna have me dealing with, I betrayed myself. And that. Once I become aware of when I could be betraying myself, I'm not closing my eyes to that. Like you can, I am not going to put ninefold it to that.

• 56:32Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 56:33Speaker 01

  One thing, if I can't really see it, I don't really know, and it's a delayed reality. But when I know straight out, this is the moment I was waiting for. What am I gonna do with it? And I'm going to show up for me. I must.

• 56:45Jay Shetty?

  Pause. Pause. That was, that was, that was just, I, I wanna go to this church. I'm waiting, Kiki. You gotta set this up. I'm like, I'm all in. I'll be the first disciple. I'm like, right there. I'll be the first student to sign up and subscribe. I'm in. I'm so in. I'm like, I've never been this motivated in my life. I'm gonna walk out of here and like change the world after this, like.

• 57:04Speaker 01

  You already do.

• 57:06Jay Shetty?

  No, no, no.

• 57:06Speaker 01

  That's the thing.

• 57:07Jay Shetty?

  No, but that's what I'm saying. Like, no, it's like, this is like, this is the most pumped up I've ever been on the show. I'm like, dude, you need to God to sort your life out. What are you doing?

• 57:16Speaker 01

  You want a bomb, Jay.

• 57:17Jay Shetty?

  I'm being serious.

• 57:17Speaker 01

  From one Virgo to another, man, we here.

• 57:19Jay Shetty?

  I'm being serious. I, I mean it. I'm not just saying it. I, I actually mean it. I'm being very genuine. You mentioned a couple of moments ago, the idea of love, and I was thinking about, a lot of our audience are young women, they're entrepreneurs, they're doing incredible things, they're winning at life. But the question that I constantly get is, Jay, I wanna find the right partner. I wanna find the right person. That's an important part of my life. What do you look for in a partner today with everything you've achieved, everything that you are, all the inner work that you've done? What do you look for?

• 57:46Speaker 01

  You know, this is a question I've been asking myself. I had a cool little moment with my mom the other day where it was kind of a realization of if you're not really.

• 57:54Speaker 01

  Wanting what you say you want, your relationships are gonna keep failing. And I feel like, because my parents were traditional, I thought that that's what I wanted. And by traditional, I just mean like, partic, you know, married, you know, we are in a, a very, just like, my parents are so all American and ain't even funny. You know, they found each other out of college, fell in love of a year, got married, they ain't left each other's sides since. They are an American story. And so I assumed that that was for me. Cause I admire it so much. And I just thought it was just so awesome. But the truth was, that actually is not in alignment with who I am in my life. My parents weren't entertainers, full time. They weren't doing the kind of work that I were doing. They weren't dedicated to a passion in this regard.

• 58:37Speaker 01

  They don't have my same personality. They don't have my same makeup. They made me from that. But I'm not actually that traditional. I've always loved whoever I've wanted to love. Relationships can look any which way to me. Like, that's how they felt, even though I was trying to do something that I felt was the only way to do it. And so now what relationships look like for me is like, I'm somewhere between Uncle Jesse and Erykah Badu, probably. You know what I mean? I'm living with my family. You know what I mean? Like, I love that. You know, I wanna be in my own house and I wanna be in my own house with my family, with my sisters, with my niece, my nephew. Like, I always want us to have that. Like, that makes me happy. So I don't think that my real like love or relationship with me necessarily looks like we live together.

• 59:20Speaker 01

  Or if we do live together, we live together part time. Like when I'm coming to where you're at and I decide to stay with you for a little while and then I go back to my house. So there's a big space that has to be held for independence and freedom. That doesn't mean. I wanna sleep with everybody in the world. That's not what I mean by freedom, although it could look, it could look like that. It really means, I just wanna have my own space to be me. And I think that's something I used to lie about, to myself about. Because I felt like I had to perform what it was to be a partner. That means we gotta be together all the time. That means we gotta do all this together. But that actually isn't what I liked. And so then my personality changed. I started being a little withdrawn. I don't really care as much. And now you feel like I'm lying. But I'm not intentionally lying. I'm just trying to be a role that I don't wanna play and I act most of the time. So now I'm tired of acting with you. And now the relationship is done.

• 1:00:05Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:06Speaker 01

  And so I think what I'm learning about myself are those things, right? I don't necessarily need to be with somebody all the time. Because I still wanna be with my friends and I wanna be with my family and I wanna be with myself. That's number one. We have to have great sex. Sorry. Good looking.

• 1:00:22Jay Shetty?

  You didn't care about that.

• 1:00:22Speaker 01

  I'm like, that's, I mean, that's, that's a reliever. You know what I mean? You need that relief in life. So we have to have some type of passion and chemistry in that regard. And I don't think I always was, again, as a woman, you're not allowed to.

• 1:00:34Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:34Speaker 01

  You can't be truthful with it. But half the time, that's why you're mad. Because you're not getting that vitamin D. You needed it to be at a certain level and it was given not enough. So, you know, I gotta be real about that.

• 1:00:45Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:00:45Speaker 01

  So I think that's important to me. And experiences, like quality time, we could be on the couch, watching a movie or show. Or we could be going on an excursion somewhere in the Alps. So experience, I think I see, I think for me, relationship, love is less about what it looks like to other people. What relationships are supposed to be. And truly what makes me happy, what allows me to be fully myself, what's fun to me. Not that we don't have difficult times, but what is ultimately fun, respectful and true.

• 1:01:18Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:01:18Speaker 01

  I remember I was talking to some guy recently and. He kept saying sorry every time that he would be late to a message to me or something like that. And I really wanted him to know, like, you're not obligated to me. We, we know, I know we vibing and I love the vibing and I love that you wanna reach out to me, but I wanna know that you wanna reach out to me because you wanna reach out to me. Not because you think I'm gonna be angry with you or because the connection's then gonna be lost or, cause if you need time, I want you to know that I can hold space for you to need time for you. Because I want you to hold space for me because the truth of the matter is you don't wanna talk to somebody all days long sometimes.

• 1:01:52Jay Shetty?

  Definitely.

• 1:01:52Speaker 01

  It don't mean you don't love them.

• 1:01:53Jay Shetty?

  Especially as you get older, yeah.

• 1:01:54Speaker 01

  You know what I mean? It don't mean you don't love them. It just means you need to be, you might need to be in your mind for a minute. Or you might need to take, you know, a break or whatever. And then you come back and say, hey. It was a hard day for me. I know you ain't heard from me all day, but in, I'm hold space for you. Because I don't need you to perform connection. I need you to just be truthful in you. And I think that's what it looks like for me now. What is the truth for you? And can you still love me in there? Or do you still like me in there? You still wanna hang out with me? If you still wanna hang out with me, then maybe we could be meant to be, you know?

• 1:02:26Jay Shetty?

  That's such a great answer. I feel like everyone's doing some version of that, forming, folding, molding, performing, right? We're all kind of going, oh, you want me to be a bit more that? Then I'll be a bit more that. And you want me to be a bit less that? Then I'll be a bit less that. And then we end up becoming this version and then we resent ourselves. And then that person doesn't like us either because, it's like, it's like all of it, we failed at all of it.

• 1:02:48Speaker 01

  So many times. Because I've just thought that I had to be this traditional vibe and it wasn't me. And so then after a while, I'm tired of playing this role. And it ain't even like there's some secret that you're hiding. It's like, I wanna be in my room alone. And I just didn't take enough space for myself. And so now I'm mad in my relation because I betrayed me and I'm resenting.

• 1:03:10Jay Shetty?

  We're scared that being ourselves will push the other person away. But then if you become the person they want you to be, you push them away anyway. Because.

• 1:03:19Speaker 01

  You don't like yourself.

• 1:03:20Jay Shetty?

  You don't like yourself. And you can't do it for that long. How long are you gonna do it for? And so, it's so fascinating that, yeah, we, we'll say, oh no, but if I, if I tell them that this is what I want and this is what I need, then they might go away. And right? It's true. Like, that's, that's what people are thinking.

• 1:03:34Speaker 01

  And honestly, maybe they should. You know, some of these people.

• 1:03:41Jay Shetty?

  This is that Virgo right now. It's like, you know.

• 1:03:43Speaker 01

  We are having a Virgoing time. It's absolutely incredible. But it's true because sometimes you doing all that shit and it's like, that was never for you, girl, or guy, or them or they, that wasn't for you. And so we do have to really start being truthful so that we can actually be connected with the people that are on our same frequency. The more that we're contorting ourselves into being who we're not, the more that we're actually getting what we don't want. Oof, which is just like so sucky.

• 1:04:08Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. It's the worst. It's the worst. Do you find it hard to trust people?

• 1:04:13Speaker 01

  I think so. Even just put some of my shit down with them. Trust. Because I also feel like that my life comes with a lot of stuff that people can end up getting affected by. So it's hard, A, because I feel, you know, that my life is a lot going on and I don't want it, like, it's hard to trust someone with that weight. And so I kind of just say, well, I don't want to tell it because that's too much for you and I don't want to really put it on you. But then also, when I have let people into my world, the lights are bright. And the reality of it is, every relationship is a little bit transactional. Doesn't mean that it's bad, like, you know, there's always a gift. Somebody's gonna be getting something, you're gonna be giving something.

• 1:04:58Speaker 01

  And it happens back and forth and that's, to me, there's nothing wrong with that. That's humanity, that's relationships. But what happens sometimes with me is that sometimes people get stuff they didn't even ask for. They get attention, the perception could be either inflated or it could be deflated. There's so much that they could get, that they're not even aware that they could get, that they didn't even necessarily want. But then they're then asked what they're willing to take. And I've been very disappointed a lot of times because I've learned that a lot of people will take more than they need, just because it's there. And it's very human, but it's very hurtful to me because then I feel like I'm not being seen or valued really for who I am, but you're now being lost in the world of who I'm perceived to be.

• 1:05:42Speaker 01

  And you're willing to take whatever that world gives you. And that is an extraction, actually, from me. It's very extractive. So that has hurt me a lot in relationships. Being able to say it has become so happy.

• 1:05:54Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:05:55Speaker 01

  Because I would just feel it.

• 1:05:56Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:05:57Speaker 01

  I'm being robbed of something. I don't know what you're stealing, but there's something being dimmed. But I've learned now what it is that's happening. And I hold grace for those people, but I create a healthy distance.

• 1:06:08Jay Shetty?

  Yes.

• 1:06:09Speaker 01

  Because without that awareness, you might rob me. And I'm not open for theft, you know?

• 1:06:14Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, people, yeah, people fall in love with your avatar. They, they fall in love with that, you know, that 2D version of you. And that happens to everyone, by the way. You don't have to be a public figure or be in movies for people to do that. People fall in the 2D version of you and often that 2D version is the version they even made up of you. And then the benefits that come with that 2D version. And none of us want to be loved for that.

• 1:06:35Speaker 01

  No.

• 1:06:36Jay Shetty?

  Because it's a caricature. It's like a.

• 1:06:37Speaker 01

  It feels like erasure.

• 1:06:38Jay Shetty?

  Yeah.

• 1:06:39Speaker 01

  It feels like you're being erased. It feels like erasure. It's like, damn, I don't matter, I don't. And it's so funny because you find yourself in these relationships where it's like, again, this goes back to what we're talking about, where it's like, well, you erased that person first. Because you didn't speak the truth. You didn't actually say your boundaries. You didn't actually say your limits. You didn't actually, so they're only acting like you. And so it's really important for perception to not be something that guides you and for you to know yourself enough to know what is reality and what is just other, pigment of other people's imagination.

• 1:07:16Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah. And we outsource that a lot. What does my mom think? What does my friend think? What does my, you know? And, and you can just outsource the biggest decisions of your life to the group chat.

• 1:07:26Speaker 01

  Woo, that group chat, I need to be on pause.

• 1:07:28Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah.

• 1:07:29Speaker 01

  Right now, the whole world is up over here.

• 1:07:31Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, but we do it.

• 1:07:32Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:07:33Jay Shetty?

  We do it all the time. We do it all the time. Kiki, we've got a game for you.

• 1:07:36Speaker 01

  Oh, I'm so excited.

• 1:07:37Jay Shetty?

  I want to play with you. Got a few more moments. Like, this was made just for you. It's called, Does It Have A Little Sweetness To It? So I'm gonna give you a scenario and you'll tell me if it's sweet or if it's a no-go when it comes to dating.

• 1:07:48Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:07:48Jay Shetty?

  All right? They create a playlist for you.

• 1:07:51Speaker 01

  Oh, that's sweet.

• 1:07:52Jay Shetty?

  That's sweet.

• 1:07:53Speaker 01

  I think that's sweet, a playlist. I just made a playlist.

• 1:07:55Jay Shetty?

  For someone?

• 1:07:56Speaker 01

  I did. They don't know, though.

• 1:07:57Jay Shetty?

  Okay. What, you're scared of giving it to them?

• 1:07:59Speaker 01

  I'm not giving it to them.

• 1:08:01Jay Shetty?

  Oh, you're not giving it to them?

• 1:08:01Speaker 01

  I'm not, I'm scared. It's for me when I'm thinking about them.

• 1:08:04Jay Shetty?

  Ah, okay.

• 1:08:04Speaker 01

  It's like a playlist for me when I want to be the soundtrack of my mind.

• 1:08:07Jay Shetty?

  Okay, morning, evening?

• 1:08:09Speaker 01

  All day.

• 1:08:09Jay Shetty?

  All day. Wow, oh, wow, all right. Some lucky person, Kiki, this is, all right. They keep a photo of you in their wallet.

• 1:08:17Speaker 01

  That's sweet.

• 1:08:18Jay Shetty?

  Okay.

• 1:08:18Speaker 01

  That's sweet. And their wallet is sweet.

• 1:08:20Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. Not their screensaver, though, on their phone. Screensaver or wallet?

• 1:08:24Speaker 01

  Just me? Screensaver's a bit much. I think screensaver is us. I'm happy with.

• 1:08:31Jay Shetty?

  Got it.

• 1:08:31Speaker 01

  Just me.

• 1:08:32Jay Shetty?

  Cringe, screensaver's cringe. All right, don't do that, all right. They bring you soup when you're sick.

• 1:08:36Speaker 01

  That's so lovely. That's so thoughtful. Absolutely.

• 1:08:39Jay Shetty?

  You're very empathetic, compassionate, loving, human being. Someone else would be a bit more savage with this. All right. They plan an entire date but won't tell you where you're going.

• 1:08:47Speaker 01

  I like that.

• 1:08:48Jay Shetty?

  Do you like surprises?

• 1:08:49Speaker 01

  I like, well, I like to know that I'm about to be surprised. So if he's set the context of, this is a surprise, then I'm cool. Sometimes surprise can be a bit much. If I'm not in the mood for the, because I get overstimulated. And this is what I've also noticed with my son. The reason why my son is like that is because he knows he's overstimulated. And so he'll be like, back up all this shit. You know what I mean? Y'all doing too much. That's what I actually feel. And so I've learned to like, actually just say like, don't, you know what I mean? Because it's, I get overstimulated and then I become plateaued. It's too much.

• 1:09:19Jay Shetty?

  I get it, yeah, I get it. All right, a few more. They write you a handwritten letter.

• 1:09:23Speaker 01

  Is it positive or is it like?

• 1:09:25Jay Shetty?

  No, no, it's a love letter.

• 1:09:26Speaker 01

  It's a love letter? I'm here for the love letter.

• 1:09:29Jay Shetty?

  Okay, all right.

• 1:09:29Speaker 01

  I'm here for the love letter.

• 1:09:30Jay Shetty?

  I love it.

• 1:09:31Speaker 01

  Oh, my gosh.

• 1:09:32Jay Shetty?

  Gosh, you're so easy to please. You're like, yeah, I'll take it all.

• 1:09:35Speaker 01

  That's the problem.

• 1:09:35Jay Shetty?

  They ask to take a picture together after the first date.

• 1:09:38Speaker 01

  Uh-uh. No. That's an absolute now. Picture together after the first day? What we doing is, this is not a, no.

• 1:09:46Jay Shetty?

  No.

• 1:09:46Speaker 01

  I don't want that.

• 1:09:48Jay Shetty?

  There's no exceptions to that one. All right. They call instead of texting you back.

• 1:09:52Speaker 01

  Absolutely not. Do not call me, ever.

• 1:09:56Jay Shetty?

  Ever?

• 1:09:57Speaker 01

  I'll call you. If I don't start the calling with you, don't call me. I'm here for texts, I'm even here for voice notes. Don't call me.

• 1:10:04Jay Shetty?

  I hate voice notes.

• 1:10:06Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:10:06Jay Shetty?

  Especially people talk so slow.

• 1:10:07Speaker 01

  Do you have your transcript?

• 1:10:08Jay Shetty?

  I'm like, get to the point, bro.

• 1:10:11Speaker 01

  Do you have your transcripts on?

• 1:10:13Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

• 1:10:13Speaker 01

  I just read the transcripts half the time.

• 1:10:15Jay Shetty?

  I literally, I'm like, I can't stand voice note. Unless you have an amazing voice and I ask you to send me a voice note or something. Please do not send me a voice note. Please don't send me a voice note.

• 1:10:25Speaker 01

  You are too funny.

• 1:10:26Jay Shetty?

  They want to spend every day together. Obviously, we know the answer to that one.

• 1:10:29Speaker 01

  That's too much. It's not even because I don't like you, but we're not gonna be good if we do this. Like, we're just not. I think what would be like, really good, like, my minimum would be like, once a week, seeing you in person. That's like a stretch. Like, I would like to see you at least three times a week. I think three times a week is good. And then we can have space in between there. You know what I'm saying? Because let me miss you. I also have learned that I like that. That I like being able to come back to be, oh, my gosh, you won't believe what happened the last few days. I didn't get a chance to tell you about this. We need that.

• 1:11:02Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, you don't want that daily, just routine, yeah.

• 1:11:04Speaker 01

  Because what are we saying?

• 1:11:05Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. How's it day? Yeah, yeah. They tell their mom about you after the second date.

• 1:11:11Speaker 01

  No, no, no, no, no.

• 1:11:13Jay Shetty?

  Has someone done that before?

• 1:11:14Speaker 01

  Yeah.

• 1:11:15Jay Shetty?

  Wow.

• 1:11:15Speaker 01

  Somebody had me meet their whole family.

• 1:11:17Jay Shetty?

  On this, after the second?

• 1:11:18Speaker 01

  On the second date.

• 1:11:20Jay Shetty?

  How did you walk into that?

• 1:11:23Speaker 01

  I was going through a breakup. I said, hey.

• 1:11:26Jay Shetty?

  And what did you do? Did you just go, hey?

• 1:11:28Speaker 01

  I just said, hey, y'all. I mean, it turned into a tour. I felt like I was on a super fan tour. You know what I mean?

• 1:11:34Jay Shetty?

  That's the worst.

• 1:11:34Speaker 01

  I didn't have anything else going on. So I went with it.

• 1:11:37Jay Shetty?

  Last one, they dance with you in the kitchen.

• 1:11:40Speaker 01

  That's sweet. I love that, we're dancing in the kitchen, yeah.

• 1:11:43Jay Shetty?

  It's sweet, I like it.

• 1:11:44Speaker 01

  It's a little bit of a movie.

• 1:11:45Jay Shetty?

  I like it. Okay, so this is good. This is, there's, there's lots of opportunities.

• 1:11:48Speaker 01

  I'm super sentimental and super like.

• 1:11:49Jay Shetty?

  Me too, I am too. I think that's, is that the Virgo in us or is that just?

• 1:11:52Speaker 01

  I think that is.

• 1:11:53Jay Shetty?

  The hopeless romantic in us?

• 1:11:54Speaker 01

  We clearly have a similar personality. I don't know how much of that is our signs, but us having the same sign, I mean, it does seem like it goes hand in hand. We love genuine sincerity moments. Like, that's always gonna win with us. We don't like anything. Virgos don't really like when stuff is like, just false.

• 1:12:10Jay Shetty?

  Yes, yes.

• 1:12:11Speaker 01

  You know, so those things feel pure.

• 1:12:12Jay Shetty?

  Pure, yeah, and real. We talked about this, but I wanted to talk about it from the perspective of like, you just took on so much responsibility when you were young. And for me, it's like, I do, I remember taking on responsibility for myself and that was hard enough. I started working when I was 14, I paid for my, my own phone bill, paid for my first car, paid for all of that stuff, but I wasn't taking care of my family. My family was taking care of me overall. So I'm like, I can't imagine what that does. What do you feel you've had to unlearn from your childhood?

• 1:12:38Speaker 01

  That time is over.

• 1:12:41Speaker 01

  Because I think that that was necessary at that time. You know, I come from a village, the village of Robbins. And community is everything, and I still stand behind those rituals. In order for my family to get out of poverty, that was what it took. But I just didn't realize when it was done. It did require a lot for me, but I didn't do it alone. My parents were there for me. It was definitely like, it was a scenario. You know what I'm saying? It's like, there's some things that like, we've got to understand that like, are systemically what happens, and it's not a scenario that you would hope for. But I felt like I could do it. And so I did my very best, and my parents were there. And it was a business that we held up. It was a lot of it was on me because I was the one in front. But I didn't do it alone. They were there to support me. And so it got to a point where it's like, that's over.

• 1:13:25Speaker 01

  So everything that I had to learn to be during that time, I just didn't learn. And I'm gonna have to have as many years of relaxing it to know that it's done with. Because I don't have to operate from that same level. Don't have to operate from that same place, that the same thing that was driving me then, or what I was feeling like I was up against, I'm no longer up against. Because I think that, like, realizing that, that, that it's over, that we survived it. You know what I mean? Is, has been the biggest thing.

• 1:13:54Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, it's so hard, isn't it? Again, it goes back to those tools that you develop. You develop a mindset that gets you out of the mess.

• 1:14:00Speaker 01

  Yep.

• 1:14:00Jay Shetty?

  And then you have to let go of that mindset in order to get the next one.

• 1:14:03Speaker 01

  Exactly. And really, self compassion is the main one. My feelings were not important. My desires to rest, my desire to be free. You know, see, so you see these collections of why I see love the way that I see it. You know, because being responsible for other people, that I've exhausted that. Or feeling responsible for other people, I've exhausted that. That I've had enough time with that in my life. So being able to feel like I can be my own self, that's what's more connected to what is actually needed for me in my life, in, in love, in friendships, in family. And so being able to be free, being able to be my own self, being able to say that I don't want this, being able to say that I'm tired of you, being able to say that I need

• 1:14:47Speaker 01

  a break, being able to say no to the project. Those are all versions of me reminding myself that I'm not in survival mode. I've survived it. We've survived it. I can truly be free.

• 1:15:02Jay Shetty?

  Kiki, I love talking to you.

• 1:15:03Speaker 01

  I love talking to you too. We have a ball.

• 1:15:06Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, we have a great time.

• 1:15:07Speaker 01

  I know, you're the best.

• 1:15:08Jay Shetty?

  We end every episode of On Purpose with a final five. These questions have to be answered in one sentence maximum.

• 1:15:13Speaker 01

  Okay.

• 1:15:13Jay Shetty?

  And so Kiki Palmer, these are your final five. The first question is, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received?

• 1:15:19Speaker 01

  Never let someone else's perception of you be your perception of yourself.

• 1:15:23Jay Shetty?

  Good advice. Question number two, what is the worst advice you've ever heard or received?

• 1:15:27Speaker 01

  Oh, that's hard.

• 1:15:29Jay Shetty?

  You don't remember it anymore.

• 1:15:30Speaker 01

  Right, I probably had to block that shit out. I don't know. That was hard.

• 1:15:34Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, that's hard. That's good, we'll skip it. Question number three, how do you define a good friend?

• 1:15:40Speaker 01

  I mean, it maybe seems simple, but a good friend is somebody that lets you be you. You know, good friend is somebody that you don't have to perform around, that, that you can truly rest in who you are.

• 1:15:49Jay Shetty?

  Absolutely. Question number four, I want you to repeat this and finish the sentence. I think I think too much about.

• 1:15:57Speaker 01

  I think, I think too much about systems and structures.

• 1:16:02Jay Shetty?

  Tell me more.

• 1:16:04Speaker 01

  I'm a person that's really driven on pattern recognition. Like, that's like how my cognition functions. I'm like constantly searching for the pattern.

• 1:16:14Speaker 01

  I love that. I have that. We have us now for each other. Because I'm about to be like. Because literally, dude, I just, I'm always looking at the underneath, underneath of the underneath of what caused that and why was that? You know, it's a good thing, but sometimes it's like, take a break, babes. Just, just stop looking for the reasons, the reasons that we're here.

• 1:16:42Jay Shetty?

  Sing it.

• 1:16:44Speaker 01

  Whose song is that?

• 1:16:45Jay Shetty?

  I haven't, I don't know.

• 1:16:46Speaker 01

  Damn, I don't know why that popped into me when I just thought about that. But it's like, I'm always doing that. And I remember back from when I was a little bitty girl in my grandma's house outside of a porch, looking at the ants, studying patterns, systems, structures. I've always been obsessed with that, with my lines, the way I learn my lines, the way I understand words, the way that I understand experiences. Everything is based on that. And so it's, it's obviously something I truly enjoy. You know, it's like math ontologically. It's like, you know, the experience of being able to recognize what's gonna come next just because you're watching and learning through what you see. I love it, but sometimes I need to take a break and just be.

• 1:17:25Speaker 01

  And stop always trying to be Albert Einstein.

• 1:17:30Jay Shetty?

  I love that. Fifth and final question, we ask this to every guest who's ever been on the show. If you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be?

• 1:17:39Speaker 01

  I hope nobody's mad at me, but I think that this would help us with all this over manufacturing everything like this. You don't have to be a vegetarian, maybe you don't have to be a vegan, but let's be seasonal and have things for a period of time. Maybe only chicken this time of year. Maybe only beef this time of year. Maybe only fish this time of year. Maybe only, you know, these vegetables when they're in season, only. Like, I feel like it would help us a little bit. I think, you know, I've been thinking a lot about the global warming bit. I've been thinking a lot about the earth and how we can try to get something under control. I think it would be good if we did things marked off so that we wouldn't overdo it. And then the people getting sick, and then now we gotta pump everything up because we don't have enough of it. Well, if it was only for this time of year, or if we had a year where it's like, this

• 1:18:23Speaker 01

  is the year of chicken, or this is the year of, you know what I mean? Like, just, I don't know. I just feel like we gotta get that under control.

• 1:18:29Jay Shetty?

  Yes.

• 1:18:29Speaker 01

  This, yo, so I would love to do something where the food and stuff was like, you know, more accessible, especially in food deserts. I grew up in a food desert. We only had a liquor store. I remember working the first time when I was a kid with this organization called Urban Farming, because they actually would go in urban areas and farm because there was no access to actual food. Everything was just processed packaged stuff. And so like, you know, I wish that those things were free. I wish that people could have free foods that grow. They should be able to grow where you are, and you shouldn't have to pay for them. I know, I know farmers is coming for me. I'm not coming for you farmers. I'm not saying you don't deserve to be paid. I'm just saying that maybe the government could hook us up. Help us out, you know what I mean?

• 1:19:12Jay Shetty?

  God. Kiki Palmer.

• 1:19:15Speaker 01

  You are the bomb.

• 1:19:16Jay Shetty?

  Kiki, you are the best.

• 1:19:17Speaker 01

  You have the best questions. This is the best conversation.

• 1:19:19Jay Shetty?

  Honestly, I have not had this much fun on the podcast ever before. I have to give it to you.

• 1:19:23Speaker 01

  I'm so thrilled.

• 1:19:24Jay Shetty?

  If anyone asks me, what was the most fun you've had on the show? It's with you.

• 1:19:27Speaker 01

  I love you, Jay.

• 1:19:28Jay Shetty?

  I mean, it's been seven years too, so when I say that, it's, it's a real statement.

• 1:19:32Speaker 01

  I feel the same. I just knew, that's why I was telling everybody, because I was working today and I'm like, oh, it's gonna be so great with Jay, because he's gonna be talking about something so interesting. I just knew. And so you didn't disappoint.

• 1:19:43Jay Shetty?

  Good, I'm glad. We'll come back anytime.

• 1:19:46Speaker 02

  Whenever fall comes back around, it always feels like a fresh start. This year, I've been layering in some styles from the new Lululemon fall drop, because the weather is shifting and I find I have to be ready for the entire day and not just one part of it. Lululemon's fall line has some really versatile transitional pieces, so I can just wake up, throw on a matching set, add a jacket or a fleece, and head out, knowing that I'll feel comfortable enough to go wherever the day takes me. Check out the new fall arrivals in store and online now at lululemon.com.

• 1:20:16Speaker 03

  This episode is brought to you by Netflix's new series, East of Eden. A bold reimagining of John Steinbeck's masterpiece, following generations of the Trask family through love, betrayal, and the choices that shape humanity. Starring Mike Feist and Christopher Abbott as the Trask brothers, and Florence Pugh as Kathy Ames, the complex anti-heroine determined to build the life she wants, no matter the cost. Watch East of Eden, October 1st, only on Netflix.

• 1:20:45Speaker 04

  Mr. President, my company informed me of the explosion on our rig on October 2nd. Causing massive water displacement and triggering a tsunami. They all heap the blame on me. Tom Cruise is.

• 1:20:56Speaker 05

  Digger got us into this mess, and Digger's gonna dig us out. From the director of Birdman and The Revenant.

• 1:21:02Speaker 06

  What would happen if I stopped drilling? You're stalled, you're freezing there, that's what.

• 1:21:06Speaker 05

  With great power comes great deniability.

• 1:21:09Speaker 06

  I'm not the first man.

• 1:21:11Speaker 05

  Digger, see the trailer online, only in theaters October 2nd. Rated R, under 17, not a minute without parent.

• 1:21:16Speaker 01

  Yes.

• 1:21:16Jay Shetty?

  Thank you, Kiki.

• 1:21:17Speaker 01

  You're the bomb.

• 1:21:18Jay Shetty?

  You're the best. Thanks, Kiki. You're so much fun.