Michael Dell ON: Dreaming Bigger Than Your Goals & How to Play Nice But Win

Michael Dell sits down with Jay Shetty to talk about how he built a multi-billion dollar technology business. It was a risk he was willing to take for he saw these risks as opportunities he could leverage to achieve his goals. He didn’t allow people’s opinions to dampen his innovative pursuit to build an empire where failures are seen as stepping stones and financial challenges remain a temporary drawback. Michael is chairman and chief executive officer of Dell Technologies, an innovator and technology leader providing the essential infrastructure for organizations to build their digital future, transform IT and protect their most important information. His first book, Direct from Dell: Strategies That Revolutionized an Industry, was written in 1999 and is currently promoting his second, Play Nice But Win: A CEO's Journey from Founder to Leader. What We Discuss with Michael: 00:00 Intro 02:52 “I started as a dishwasher boy at a Chinese restaurant.” - Michael Dell 05:45 If you got little to lose, go take a risk 10:08 Some big risks are just opportunities 13:51 Play nice but win 14:52 You have too feel right about what you’re doing 17:31 It wouldn’t feel right to win if you cheated 19:15 Building a business is not for the faint of heart 21:37 Going against a big corporation 24:26 Fighting for the company to retain its risk-taking spirit 26:26 A great work-life balance doesn’t work when you’re starting a business 28:54 Set boundaries when you have a family 32:25 Collecting company mementos 33:34 3 key factors your leading the company right 35:29 Michael on Final Five Like this show? Please leave us a review here - even one sentence helps! Post a screenshot of you listening on Instagram & tag us so we can thank you personally! Episode Resources: Michael Dell | Twitter Michael Dell | LinkedIn Michael Dell | Dell Technologies Play Nice But Win: A CEO's Journey from Founder to Leader Achieve success in every area of your life with Jay Shetty’s Genius Community . Join over 10,000 members taking their holistic well-being to the next level today, at https://shetty.cc/OnPurposeGenius See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Jay Shetty?

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• 1:27Jay Shetty?

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• 2:35Speaker 01

  If you looked at it from the outside in, you know, people would say, well, dropping out of college, that was a pretty big risk. Taking the company private, that was a pretty big risk. Doing the largest tech acquisition ever with 50 or 60 billion dollars in debt, you know, that was, that was a pretty big risk. But, you know, to me, they actually didn't see that risk.

• 3:01Jay Shetty?

  Hey, everyone. Welcome back to On Purpose, the number one health podcast in the world. Thanks to each and every single one of you that come back every week to listen, learn and grow. Now, today's guest is someone that I was really excited to have today on the show because I think there's so many moments in his life where he's gone through experiences that we can all learn from. I'm talking about none other than Michael Dell, the chairman and chief executive officer of Dell Technologies, an innovator and technology leader providing the essential infrastructure for organizations to build their digital future. Now, he's the author of two books, including the next upcoming book. The one that I really want you to read is Play Nice But Win:

• 3:44Jay Shetty?

  A CEO's Journey From Founder to Leader. I love the title. I've already loved chapters of the book that I've read, and I cannot wait for you to read it. Michael is an honorary member of the Foundation Board of the World Economic Forum and is an executive committee member of the International Business Council. I welcome to the show, Michael Dell. Michael, thank you for taking the time to do this. I cannot wait for people to read your book. And I'm so lucky that I get to sit down with you as the author of the book before everyone gets to. So, thank you so much for your energy.

• 4:15Speaker 01

  Yeah, thank you, Jay. Great to be with you and great to be with your audience.

• 4:19Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, like I said, I love the title. I want to dive into the book a bit later, but I want to start off with asking you a question that I've been asking a lot of people recently because I think there's something beautiful about learning about this. I'll share with you a story. I was, I work with a lot of corporate clients as a speaker or a coach. And I was speaking with one of my clients recently. And of course, we're on Zoom and he's got his, something in his background and I'm wondering what it is. And he has a paintbrush hanging on his background wall. And it's a real paintbrush and it's a big paintbrush. You can't miss it. And I said to him, I said, "Look, I don't want to be creepy, but I'm just being curious. Why do you have a paintbrush on your wall?" And he said, he started laughing. He said, "No one's ever asked me that before."

• 5:04Jay Shetty?

  And I was thinking, "Wow, like people must really be scared of you." But he said that, he said that the reason he has it is because his first ever job was that he used to paint fences. And then when he did that successfully, he painted walls. And then when he did that successfully, he got to paint homes. And he keeps that paintbrush up there to remind him of where he started. Today, he's a very successful executive. I wanted to ask you, what was your first ever, ever job that you did? And is there a lesson that you learned there that you've carried with you throughout your success?

• 5:35Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know, I, first of all, I'm a big believer in those early jobs. You know, my first job, I was 12 years old. I was a dishwasher in a Chinese restaurant. I got promoted to a water boy and then assistant maître d'. So I was moving up pretty fast. And I got recruited away by another restaurant. And I've been working every day since then, pretty much. And I have to say, I've loved it.

• 6:01Jay Shetty?

  That's incredible. Do you mind me asking you, how much did you used to make at the time as a 12-year-old?

• 6:06Speaker 01

  I guess it was like, this would have been in 1977. So what was the minimum wage back then? Like a dollar or $2 or, you know, something like that? It wasn't very much.

• 6:17Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. What would you save it up for? Like, what were you doing with that money at that time? What was it leading towards?

• 6:22Speaker 01

  Yeah, so at the time I was into stamps and I started, you know, I was collecting stamps. Then I started like buying and selling stamps. I ran a stamp auction. I got into stocks and, you know, currencies when I was like fourteen, fifteen, started investing. My mom was a stockbroker, really got interested in financial markets. You know, around fourteen, fifteen, it was sort of the dawn of the microprocessor age. And I happened to, you know, get exposed to the origins of what became the PC. And that obviously impacted my life in a big way.

• 7:04Jay Shetty?

  So if you were a twelve year old today, you'd be doing NFTs and crypto. And that would be your world, I'm guessing, seeing as.

• 7:11Speaker 01

  Probably, yeah, yeah. You know, now there's so many interesting things going on with, you know, technology and, you know, the intersection of the biological sciences and the computational sciences. And, you know, it used to be technology was about IT departments and stuff like that. Now it's pretty much affecting everything and every business is getting upended in some way by technology and AI and data and networks. And it's, it's super exciting to see the pace that the economy is changing with technology at the fulcrum of that.

• 7:51Jay Shetty?

  Absolutely. And I know that you dropped out of college and a lot of successful founders have dropped out of college and I'm not at all recommending that or encouraging that and neither are you. I'm intrigued to think about though, if you finished your degree, how differently do you think your life would have gone? That's the first part of the question. And the second part of the question is, what gave you the courage to actually drop out and pursue something which at the time, as you said, was very new and, and very cutting edge and innovative, but people didn't really have a lot of certainty and surety around it.

• 8:27Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know, it seemed like kind of an easy decision for, for me. I mean, let me start with the first part, you know, what would have happened if I'd graduated? I don't know. I don't know that I would have gone down this path. I might be like a, you know, a doctor in Houston somewhere, you know, which is what my parents wanted me to be. But. You know, when I, when I started, first of all, if you have nothing, you have nothing to lose, right? So, so it's, it's a pretty easy decision. You know, the University of Texas here in Austin, you can take a semester off and come back with no academic penalty. So that was kind of the deal I made with my parents, that I would go do this for a while. And if it worked out, I would keep doing it. And if it didn't, I'd go back to school. So, you know, it didn't,

• 9:10Speaker 01

  didn't seem like an enormous risk to me. My parents were, were pretty upset with me for sure, because, you know, in the world they came from, giving up an opportunity for an education was like the worst thing you could possibly do. But, you know, it all, it all worked out.

• 9:27Jay Shetty?

  I love that. I, I want to hear more about that interaction with your parents, Michael, because I feel there are so many children today and young people and young adults that go through the same experience as you did. They, they either want to quit, or they want to start something new, or they're on the verge of an idea they have, but they don't have the confidence, their parents might not be into it. What does someone look to at that time, at that early stage in their career, where they don't have the wins on their list yet? They, they don't have the successes, but they, they want to follow their dreams, follow their passion, follow their heart. What advice do you have for someone who's in that position right now?

• 10:06Speaker 01

  Well, it's, it's difficult and extremely emotional. And I, and I talk about this in the book, and the kind of struggle that I had with that and with my parents. You know, ultimately, I just decided that I was going to do this, whether or not I had their approval, you know, which, which was, which was a really tough thing to do. And, and my mother was, was unbelievably upset with me. And I would say it took about a year or two, maybe three, you know, to sort of fully, fully get through that. I don't know that there is universal advice here, other than if you are in a situation where you can take the risk.

• 10:51Speaker 01

  And you don't have a lot to lose and you can fall back on something else. You know, look, I think a lot of people don't achieve even a small fraction of what they're capable of because they're afraid to fail and they're not willing to take on more risk. And there's a lot of potential that's left on the field that never gets utilized. Uh, because people want the perfect plan or they want to do what they're supposed to do, or they're just not willing to take on that risk. And we need people to take on risk, not just for new companies, but you know,

• 11:30Speaker 01

  for existing companies and to redo and rethink and reimagine our world. You know, we can't just like do a little bit better version of what we had before. We have to constantly be reimagining things.

• 11:43Jay Shetty?

  You spoke a lot about risk there, Michael. I'm wondering, what do you think's the biggest risk you ever took? You said that decision was fairly easy. What do you think, what was the time when you feel you like, yeah, I took a big risk? And whether it paid off or not, I'd love to hear about how it panned out. But what was the biggest risk you ever took?

• 12:00Speaker 01

  If you looked at it from the outside in, you know, people would say, well, dropping out of college, that was a pretty big risk. Taking the company private, that was a pretty big risk, you know? Uh, doing the largest tech acquisition ever with 50 or 60 billion dollars of debt. That was a pretty big risk. But you know, to me, they actually didn't seem that risky, right? Because like I, you know, I sort of on a risk adjusted basis, I could see my way through to the opportunity. And could it have all gone wrong? Sure, but I didn't think it was going to. It's also a situation where, you know, if I had sat there and said, gee, should I drop out of school? Should I not drop out of school? Let's go talk to 10 or 100 people and ask them what they think.

• 12:45Speaker 01

  Probably most of them would have told me, you're crazy for dropping out of school. Okay, I didn't ask anybody. You know, that wasn't how I was thinking about it.

• 12:54Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, what would you say would be your biggest failure till date? That you feel like you were down and out, where it was a really tough situation? Was there a moment where things really felt like they weren't working out? When would that have been?

• 13:08Speaker 01

  Well, look, there have been plenty of times and you know, I think what people maybe fail to understand is that. Embedded in success are failures, right? And at the root of success, you have kind of curiosity, learning, experimenting and failure. And without those things, you don't have any success, right? And so failures are not necessarily bad, you know, especially if you're learning from them. And so, yeah, we've had all kinds of failures along the way to, you know, cumulative revenues of about 1.4 trillion dollars, right?

• 13:47Speaker 01

  But yeah, I mean, you know, early on, we had some super ambitious technical projects that failed. And we learned from that. We built a lot of capability that allowed us to create all kinds of new, new products as a result. We had inventory planning challenges early on. That led us to be really world-class at supply chain management because we had to, right? And, you know, necessity is the mother of invention. And the key is to learn from the failures and correct them quickly and hopefully not make the same mistakes over and over again.

• 14:29Speaker 01

  And if you can learn from other people's mistakes, you know, learn from, from your new mistakes that you're making and correct them quickly, you're going to be very successful. You've got to be willing to experiment and fail. The other thing is, you know, when you're, when you're going into new areas, there's no playbook, right? There's, you can't like read a book or talk to an expert, like tell you how to do this. You just have to start.

• 14:56Jay Shetty?

  I love that. Thank you, Michael. No, I, I love hearing that. It's always, it's always wonderful to hear of someone who seems to be having fun and, and growing continuously and enjoying life on the journey as well. And I want to come to your book now, you know, Play Nice But Win: A CEO's Journey From Founder to Leader. I, I wanted to talk about the title for a bit. When you hear the words play nice but win, were these words that you said a lot? Were these words that you heard a lot? How did these words take shape in your life?

• 15:30Speaker 01

  Yeah, so my, my two brothers and I, you know, when we were little kids and we would go out in the street and play ball with our friends, that's what our parents told us. You know, almost every time they say play nice but win. And so it kind of became this philosophy of, of, you know, let's not forget about the winning part, right? But, but we're gonna, we're gonna play nice. We're gonna play fair. We're gonna do it, you know, kind of ethically, responsibly. But yeah, well, we're, we're in it to win, right? And so it kind of been something that's just stuck with me ever since I was a little kid. And it goes, goes back to my childhood. And I, I talk about that in the book as well.

• 16:13Jay Shetty?

  Did you ever meet anyone along the way that tried to challenge that and tell you it wasn't possible? Or tell you you had to play ruthless? You had to play bad and win? Like, was there anyone who challenged that? And not specifically, I don't need you to tell me exactly who. I'm just saying, was there anyone who really debated and challenged that hypothesis and said, Michael, this is not going to work. You're gonna have to play unfair. And was there anyone in your life that you met that completely disagreed with that statement?

• 16:45Speaker 01

  Well, look, I, you know, I've been running our company for 37 years. I mean, I believe markets are, are long-term efficient, right? And, you know, I think everything sort of comes back to you in a good way, you know, or, or a bad way, if you're playing the, the other side. And I've just kind of avoided the opposite path. And it's worked for me. And, you know, it just feels right to me. And, and at the end of the day, you know, you have to feel right about what you're doing. And, you know, when I'm 90 or 100 or hopefully older, I want to be proud of everything I did and the way I did it. And that's just really important to me.

• 17:28Speaker 01

  So, and, and look, I've, I've run into plenty of people that didn't play nice. And I just tried to, you know, certainly not have them in our company, you know, avoid doing business with them to the extent I could. And that's what's worked for me.

• 17:45Jay Shetty?

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• 18:28Jay Shetty?

  That's indeed.com/podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Need to hire? This is a job for Indeed sponsored jobs. This episode is brought to you by Amtrak. You know that feeling when you're already tired and you haven't even gotten there yet? That's where Amtrak comes in. Leave the driving behind and settle into a comfortable seat with plenty of room to stretch out. Catch up on work with wifi, grab a snack at the cafe car, or just sit back and enjoy your favorite podcast. Choose a cellar or northeast regional and get there without the stress of getting there. Visit amtrak.com to plan your next trip. This episode is brought to you by Orange Theory Fitness. One of the best investments you can make is in your own strength.

• 19:13Jay Shetty?

  The choices you make today can help shape how you feel for years to come. Orange Theory Fitness provides a one-hour workout to build strength, burn fat, and build muscle with an expert coach guiding you every step of the way. Head to orangetheory.com/onpurpose to learn more and get your first class free. Orange Theory Fitness, helping people live longer, more vibrant lives. Terms and conditions apply. See webpage in studio for details. Yeah, was there ever a time though that you felt pressured that you might have to change your approach to win? Or was it always easy to stay to that? I just, I feel like, I love it by the way, I completely agree with you. Like, I think my favorite way to win is to play nice and the best way to play nice is to make sure you win. So I, I love that approach to life.

• 19:58Jay Shetty?

  I'm just wondering whether there were any times where you actually maybe just had a thought and you thought, well, maybe if I didn't play so nice, maybe I'd win more, maybe I'd, maybe I would be more successful if I did this or did this thing. Did you ever have that debate? Did you ever have that thought internally or were you always convinced that this was the way?

• 20:19Speaker 01

  Not, not, not for a second. I mean, it wouldn't feel right to win if I had cheated or done it in an unscrupulous way. You know, and I talk about in the book, some of the early formative experiences where we had people that did things that weren't exactly correct, right? In one way or another. And it really surprised me. Maybe I was naive or, I think people love the clarity of, of knowing what we stand for, right? And knowing that we don't change the rules depending on who it is or how important it is or anything like that. It's like, hey, we're, we're very clear about the ethical standards that we uphold as a

• 21:02Speaker 01

  company and it's just a lot easier that way.

• 21:05Jay Shetty?

  I love hearing that. Trust me, I am so happy to hear that because I think value-based businesses are so needed in, in the world right now. And when we look at things like conscious capitalism and the idea of creating wealth, creating impact through values and through purpose and through mission, it's beautiful to hear that you never even got, you know, you never even had a moment of doubt. I, I love hearing that because I think it shows what's possible. I, I wonder, there's a lot of our listeners who may be trying to decide between entrepreneur or employee. And, you know, today, because the entrepreneurial life mindset has become so mainstream culture and accessible, a lot more people are thinking in that direction.

• 21:50Jay Shetty?

  I wonder what can you do to teach us about the difference between the entrepreneur mindset and the employee mindset? And what differences people can see so that they can see where they're best placed?

• 22:00Speaker 01

  When things get pretty heated, you, I think you see more opportuners.

• 22:07Speaker 01

  You know, and not necessarily the pure entrepreneurs. And, you know, that's okay. Everybody can choose their own path. You know, in, in my experience, it's not for the faint of heart, right? To go start a business. I mean, it is all in. And, you know, when, when I started, fortunately, I was 19 years old and I could work 18 hours a day and sleep at the office and had no responsibilities, you know, in terms of family or any, anything like that. And I had the kind of physical stamina to, to work like a maniac for several years, which that's sort of what it took at the beginning. Fortunately, that didn't have to perpetuate.

• 22:50Speaker 01

  But yeah, I mean, it's not all glamorous and success. And, and there are plenty of businesses that don't work out. And, yeah, I mean, it's easy to look at the successful businesses and say, wow, it was just straight up, you know, to the right forever. It's like, eh, not exactly, that's not exactly the way it goes really in, in any business. But, uh, yeah, I mean, it's, it's a very personal decision in terms of what someone's risk appetite is. And, you know, are they willing to take all that on? And, you know, when you put your head down at night, you're thinking about all those people that you're responsible for.

• 23:29Jay Shetty?

  I loved how in chapter three, you said, you know, you don't start a company if you're not an optimist. Uh, you know, there, there has to be that optimism. And, and part of your optimism was the openness to compete with IBM and to, you know, to challenge a, a long established company, even when you were young. Where did that confidence come from? Where did that ambition, that, that desire come from? Uh, that gave you so much confidence and strength in that sort of a mindset?

• 23:56Speaker 01

  I guess if I was being objective, looking at it now, I'd say there was some naivete there for sure as well. But all that mixture was, was pretty powerful. And, you know, what, what I saw when I looked at the IBM PC back in 1981, when it first came out, it just had the 40th anniversary, a month or two ago of the IBM PC. Was it was this thing they sold for like $3,000, but it had $500 worth of parts in it and none of the parts were made by IBM. So to my teenage mind, it kind of seemed like a criminal enterprise. You know, it's like, why does it cost so much? And why does it

• 24:39Speaker 01

  take so long? And why can't it be faster? And, you know, had a ton of ideas. And it's hard for people to really understand right now. But back in the early 1980s, IBM was not just the most successful, you know, computer company. They were like unbelievably dominant in this field, unlike any other company, except maybe like Standard Oil, you know, back in the day. They just dwarfed any other company in the IT data slash data processing field. Obviously, very different 30, 40 years later. But at the time, they were the giant

• 25:22Speaker 01

  and they were also like the most valuable company in America. Right? So it was a big business. But hey, they seem vulnerable to me.

• 25:29Jay Shetty?

  I love that example of what you said, like, looking at it and seeing a criminal enterprise because of the, you know, because of the shocking difference between the parts and the and the pieces. And you're right. I mean, I grew up in a world where IBM was was still very powerful. But I know what you mean. You're talking about the scale of it at the time. And you talk about in chapter seven, the fight for Dell to go private. And it's been like a long disruptive process for everyone that's involved. And you mentioned in the book that in Dell, you had this saying, a failure is not an option. I want to know what kept you going in that fight to make it private? Like, what was the thing that

• 26:11Jay Shetty?

  kept you consistently fighting? Because sometimes we're fighting for fighting sake. But in this situation, that wasn't it. You were fighting for something more important and more deep. Where did that come from?

• 26:21Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know, I really felt that going private would allow us to accelerate our transformation. And it would allow us to kind of reignite the entrepreneurial risk taking spirit that was the origin of the company. And you know, I think Winston Churchill said something to the effect of, you know, if you're going through hell, you know, keep going. So we were in the middle of it. It's not easy to like, stop and say, ah, we're just kidding. Never mind, forget it. You know, I guess we could have done that, but once you get started, it was a fight worth winning. I thought we could win. You know, I thought it was truly believed in, that it was a very important thing for

• 27:02Speaker 01

  the company to do at that time to inflect the, the transformation. And we can look back seven years later and say, yeah, good, good thing we did that.

• 27:13Jay Shetty?

  Everyone else can make the connections in hindsight, but you were able to make the connections in the process. And I think that's always what's harder. But another area of your life, apart from your professional success, of course, but you're one of the few people who have this rare personal success too, with marrying your wife, your four children. And, and I wanted to understand, you probably get asked the work-life balance question a million times. I personally don't believe in balance. I think it's a myth. I'm not convinced that it's real. And I think that it's actually causes more pressure than creates fuel in our lives when we're constantly trying to balance. I wanted to understand what was your journey in creating a successful professional life,

• 27:56Jay Shetty?

  an extremely successful professional life, but also managing to have a real, genuine personal life as well?

• 28:03Speaker 01

  Yeah. So first of all, I think when you're starting a business, you know, this idea of balance, you know, just forget about it. It's like, you know, it's like you're, you're not going to have it. So, you know, if you're thinking, oh, I'm going to be an entrepreneur, I'm going to start a company and I'm a great work-life balance, eh, it's not going to happen. If it is, it's a foreign thing to me. I don't understand how, how you could do that. But you know, once you have a business kind of up and running and you're into year ten, year fifteen, year twenty, right? You've got systems and processes and people and well, what you find is there's a diminishing return to the number of hours worked. And also, you

• 28:48Speaker 01

  know, your happiness is impacted and you don't have to do everything yourself. And you sort of always kind of are reassessing, what is the point of impact where I can make a meaningful impact on the company and, you know, cause something great to happen. And I'm not going to do that in my, you know, 90th hour or 100th hour of work in a week, right? You know, there's a sweet spot there. And so, yeah, I also consciously wanted to have a family and children and a family life and that kind of grounding that that I had as a child. And

• 29:30Speaker 01

  that was something I really desired. And so I sought it out and planned planned my life in that way, because I also knew that, you know, if I kept working for another 10 plus years and didn't have that, I would be unhappy.

• 29:46Jay Shetty?

  Yeah. And but I'm sure that there were those tough decisions to make. Like, I'm sure there were moments where maybe your wife and your children wanted your time, but you had to be at an important meeting, or you had to be on a plane, or how did you deal with those challenges? Because they're very natural. It doesn't, you know, it doesn't make you a bad person. But it's like, you, I'm sure there were moments where you felt guilty, or you couldn't be somewhere with your family that you really wanted to be with. How did you deal with that and get through that successfully when so many other people struggle with those moments?

• 30:18Speaker 01

  First of all, you know, you have to have some boundaries and and set some boundaries. And I'll say, I was pretty good about having boundaries. Didn't really do a lot of work on the weekend. So that was pretty sacred time.

• 30:36Jay Shetty?

  When in the journey did that happen? Or was that from the beginning? You never worked weekends.

• 30:40Speaker 01

  I'd say, you know, when we started having, you know, little kids. I also, you know, kind of set up our, our house where we had a place where people could come over for dinner. And so I would often have a lot of dinners still do at the house. And that way it just saved time. Sometimes my, my kids would, you know, this is kind of a funny story. My son, he, he figured out when he was about five or six that, you know, if he came to one of the dinners toward the end, he could get a dessert, right?

• 31:15Speaker 01

  But, but then after a while, he's like, hey, that's Bill Gates. You know, it's like, let's, like, you know, maybe I'll learn something, you know? So he, he, he would like come and sit down and participate in the dinners. It helped a lot to, to do that at home. And yeah, you gotta have some boundaries. You can't make it perfect all the time, you know? And there are going to be times when, we haven't been doing this lately, obviously, but you know, when I would go to Europe or Asia on business trips, you're just going all out, like for, for a long time, from early morning to late at night. And that's okay, you know, you, you, you can sprint for a while and, and do that.

• 31:56Speaker 01

  But also, yeah, I made time to relax and play and exercise and think and not be overly scheduled too.

• 32:05Jay Shetty?

  I think, I think the dinners is a genius one. I love that, that opening up your home and having those work dinners or people over for dinner so that you're actually at home. You're with your family. It's, it's still part of family time. I think that's, that's genius and it makes so much sense as to why that's beneficial for the family, for work, for, for so many other things. So I love you sharing that tip.

• 32:25Speaker 01

  You can make story time with the kids and still have a, still have a dinner with your business colleagues, you know?

• 32:31Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, it's brilliant. That, that's a brilliant one. This episode is brought to you by Whole Foods Market. If you're talking about quality food, you can't forget Whole Foods Market, who've been holding themselves to the highest standards since they opened in 1980. That means you'll see thousands of organic products across their stores, from the produce department to the aisles. It also means you'll never see certain ingredients. They've banned artificial sweeteners and colours, high fructose corn syrup and more, so you can shop with peace of mind. Shop Whole Foods Market in-store or online. This episode is brought to you by State Farm. We talk a lot about intentional decision-making, and that extends to the practical stuff too,

• 33:14Jay Shetty?

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• 33:57Jay Shetty?

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• 34:42Jay Shetty?

  Wayfair. Every style. Every home.

• 34:46Jay Shetty?

  You mentioned in the book that you always kept mementos in your office, like some personal, some about the highs and low points of the company. Can you tell us about some of these mementos? Because I'm a, I mean, you collected stamps, obviously. So collecting is part of your, your DNA. I love collecting mementos as well. I want some inspiration. What were some of the things that you held on to?

• 35:06Speaker 01

  Yeah, you know, I kept things that were meaningful. In the book, I have, I have a picture of the motherboard that Jay Bell, our first engineer, hand-wired up. You know, that's obviously a pretty treasured memento for, for me, about the origins of our company and tons of stories there.

• 35:26Jay Shetty?

  I love how one of the values of your company was to be known as a great company and a great place to work at. You know, the first few years of my entrepreneurial journey and trying to build a team, we have a team of, you know, just shy of 50 people across the world that are working on my certification school, my courses, my podcasts, my videos, my, my books, just the whole, the whole area of my work. And I love that you said you wanted your company, one of the values was to be known as a great company and a great place to work at. I wanted to know, what were three key ingredients in ensuring you were doing that as a leader?

• 36:04Speaker 01

  First of all, you want to have an inspiring mission and you want to have people excited, not just engaged, but you want them to believe that what they do is really important and makes a difference in the world. And you're basically engendering passion, which is way more powerful than just about anything else you can present as a motivational tool. I'd say the second thing is you want people to feel like they can succeed and grow and fulfill their full potential inside the organization.

• 36:39Speaker 01

  And there's nothing holding them back. There's no limits for them and that you're caring about their success. I think a part of that is probably the third point is that you've created an environment that is inclusive and anybody can succeed. You're not looking for people that are all the same. You want, you know, to hear a diverse set of voices and, you know, you're, you're stronger because of the, you know, diverse set of voices and ideas coming together. And we're all focused on ultimately something that's bigger than ourselves. And, you know, again, we've got a really important reason to get up out of bed every morning. You know, what we do matters in the world.

• 37:22Jay Shetty?

  Yeah, absolutely. I love that. Thank you so much. That's going to be really, really useful to me as we continue to grow. So, Michael, I want to thank you for just being so generous with your time and giving us such great insights. And I'm so excited for my audience to read Play Nice But Win. And I want to end, as we always do, on On Purpose with our final five. These are our fast five questions. You have to answer them in one word to one sentence maximum. That's it. So, Michael, these are your fast five. The first question is, what is the best piece of advice you've ever received?

• 37:56Speaker 01

  If you find a problem, fix it as fast as you find it.

• 38:00Jay Shetty?

  I love that. Okay. Second question, what is the worst advice you've ever received?

• 38:04Speaker 01

  Nobody ever says, boy, I'm glad you waited to make that tough decision. All right. And so it's important to lean into difficult conversations and difficult decisions. And, you know, anybody that tells you otherwise is just creating more problems.

• 38:21Jay Shetty?

  Got it. Yeah, absolutely. Question number three, what's the first thing you do in the morning when you wake up and the last thing you do at night before you go to bed?

• 38:29Speaker 01

  I spend some time every morning thinking about what do I want to accomplish during the day? What's really important for me to get done today and be proud of at the end of the day? And then as I'm going to sleep, I'm really trying to wind down and relax and calm myself. And sleep is super important. I try to go to sleep early, get up early, want to get a great night's sleep, want to get a high score on my Oura ring and my sleep eight pod. And just try to relax, calm myself, think grateful thoughts and not be too wound up about all the stuff I have to do tomorrow.

• 39:11Jay Shetty?

  Awesome. Question number four, what is your current purpose today?

• 39:15Speaker 01

  Our purpose as a company is still enabling human potential with technology. And I think that's a super powerful mission that will continue for a long, long time. That's enduring and we're continue to be excited by it.

• 39:32Jay Shetty?

  Fantastic. And fifth and final question, Michael, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be?

• 39:40Speaker 01

  Be grateful for what you have and take responsibility for your own life. Self determination, don't blame it on other people. It's all on you. You've got to go make it happen and it's nobody else's fault.

• 39:57Jay Shetty?

  I love it. Michael Dell, everyone. And the new book is out. It's called Play Nice But Win: A CEO's Journey From Founder to Leader. Michael, I want to thank you again for your energy. I hope that everyone who's been listening or watching that you're going to share your greatest insights on Instagram, on Twitter. Make sure you tag me and Michael and let us know what resonated with you. And again, go and grab a copy of the book. Michael, thank you for this time. I look forward to meeting you in person one day soon. All the best with everything you're working on. And I'm so happy that we got to spend this time together.

• 40:28Speaker 01

  Thank you so much, Jay. Great to be with you.

• 40:30Jay Shetty?

  If you want even more videos just like this one, make sure you subscribe and click on the boxes over here. I'm also excited to let you know that you can now get my book, Think Like a Monk, from thinklikeamunkbook.com. Check below in the description to make sure you order today.

• 40:47Speaker 02

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• 41:17Speaker 03

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• 41:43Speaker 04

  Mr. President, my company informed me of the explosion on our rig on October 2nd.

• 41:47Jay Shetty?

  Causing massive water displacement and triggering a tsunami. They all heap the blame on me.

• 41:52Speaker 04

  Tom Cruise is. Digger got us into this mess, and Digger's gonna dig us up. From the director of Birdman and The Revenant.

• 42:00Speaker 05

  What would happen if I stopped drilling? You stop, you freeze to death, that's what.

• 42:04Speaker 04

  With great power comes great deniability.

• 42:07Speaker 05

  I'm not the first then.

• 42:08Speaker 04

  Digger. See the trailer online. Only in theaters October 2nd. Rated R. Under 17. Not a minute without parent.