Murder on the Appalachian Trail

Margarett McFaddin Harritt and Joel Polson sparked an unlikely friendship that lead them to plan a thru hike on the AT in 1974. On just their second night they met a strange man at the Low Gap shelter, who unbeknownst to them, was a criminal on the run from police. Their encounter left one of them dead and the other in a fight for survival. For a full list of our sources, visit npadpodcast.com/episodesFor the latest NPAD updates, group travel details, merch and more, follow us on npadpodcast.com and our socials:Instagram: @‌nationalparkafterdarkTikTok: @‌nationalparkafterdarkSupport the show by becoming an Outsider and receive ad free listening, bonus content and more on Patreon or Apple Podcasts. Want to see our faces? Catch full episodes on our YouTube Page! Thank you to this week’s partners! AG1: Try AG1 and get a FREE bottle of Vitamin D3K2 AND 5 free AG1 Travel Packs with your first purchase at drinkAG1.com/NPAD. IQBAR: Text PARK to 64000 to get 20% off all IQBAR products and free shipping. Sierra Club: Book your 2025 trip today at sierraclub.org/outings, and use code NPAD to get $100 off. BetterHelp: National Park After Dark is sponsored by BetterHelp. Get 10% off. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 1:01Cassandra Yahnian?

  In the spring of 1974, the amount of AT through hikers had rapidly grown, but was still very unpopular in comparison to today's numbers. The number of people inspired to make the trek had slowly been increasing since the trail was built and completed in 1937. In 1973, 93 people made the journey. The number of people who finished was much less. At the time, what concerned people the most was the weather, the tough terrain, and injuries that could happen in the remote wilderness. However, in 1974, a new fear swept over the through hiking community. A killer had entered the woods. And in the first time in documented history, someone was murdered on the trail. Today, over 3,000 people

• 1:46Cassandra Yahnian?

  attempt to through hike the entire footpath each year. And around 3 million people each year pay the trail a visit. Despite the rise in numbers, to date, there have been only 10 murders along the AT. But that first killing in 1974 set an unsettling precedent that still makes hikers wary of strangers to this day.

• 2:09Cassandra Yahnian?

  Welcome to National Park After Dark.

• 2:33Danielle LaRock?

  Hey everyone and welcome to the first official episode of 2025.

• 2:38Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yes, welcome. Happy 2025. We're here. It's a new year, new year, new me, all that good stuff.

• 2:45Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, et cetera, et cetera.

• 2:48Cassandra Yahnian?

  Et cetera, et cetera. It's another day. But it's also, I do like the beginning of the new year because I think it's fun to reflect on everything that happened in the past 365 days, where you were, what you did, who you were with, any accomplishments, any hard times that have passed. It feels like a fresh slate, but at the same time, it's also like, it's just another day.

• 3:08Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 3:08Cassandra Yahnian?

  It's not, it's not that big a deal. If you're not having like this epiphany of changed my life, it's not a big deal. It's yesterday was 2024, today is 2025. It doesn't matter.

• 3:17Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, time isn't real. It's fine.

• 3:19Cassandra Yahnian?

  It's made up.

• 3:20Danielle LaRock?

  It's an illusion, as they say. But yeah, well, we are here for another year and hopefully many more. We have a lot of cool plans and things to look forward to in 2025 as National Park After Dark. And we're kicking it off with kind of an OG type of story. We have, we like to deviate from time to time with just like the content and things like that. But this is really a story based on what you just told me that seems to be in the vein of like the early, early days of National Park After Dark with true crime, national parks shaking hands. And here we are.

• 3:58Cassandra Yahnian?

  It sure is. And I love that you said that true crime and national parks shaking hands because I did add a little blurb at the very beginning of the story before we get into the first documented murder to happen on the AT. I put in a little blurb that just explains why the AT is part of the National Park Service because it's obviously not and then the trail isn't a national park, but it is part of the National Park Service. So we wrote a little, little something.

• 4:23Danielle LaRock?

  Okay.

• 4:23Cassandra Yahnian?

  So the AT is managed in conjunction with several different government agencies. The National Park Service manages 21 national scenic and historic trails. official name is the Appalachian National Scenic Trail and it is managed by the National Park Service, but it's also managed by the US Forest Service, the Appalachian Trail Conservancy, and numerous state agencies. So it goes from Maine all the way up to, or I'm going in the opposite direction, most people think of it as, it goes from Georgia all the way up to Maine to Katahdin, and there are a lot of different places along the eastern coast there. And it

• 5:02Cassandra Yahnian?

  actually goes through several national parks. So the trail itself is 2,190 miles and it passes through six national parks. It goes through Great Smoky Mountains, Shenandoah, the two like bigger ones that it goes through. But then it also goes through Harper's Ferry National Historic Park, Chesapeake and Ohio Canal National Historic Park, and Delaware Water Gap National Recreation Area. In addition to those parks, it also passes through eight different national forests along the eastern part of the United States. So it has, uh, it's got a lot going on that is within our realm of conversation for the podcast.

• 5:38Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. And we've done a couple of episodes regarding the AT. I think most notably would be your Grandma Gatewood episode.

• 5:45Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 5:45Danielle LaRock?

  That people really loved. Yeah.

• 5:47Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. If people want an AT book recommendation, Grandma Gatewood is, and you're looking for an inspiring woman's story, it's perfect.

• 5:54Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. I think you have done all the episodes on the AT so far, which is fine.

• 5:59Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. I like the AT. I think the AT is cool.

• 6:01Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 6:01Cassandra Yahnian?

  I think through hikers are cool. I'm not a through hiker, but uh, that's okay. I'm a, I like, I'm a day hiker. I love a good day hike.

• 6:09Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. You can admire and not be a mom. That's fine.

• 6:12Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. One day, one day I'd like to do, I think it would be really cool to say that I through hiked something and I would like to do it at some point. I don't know if the AT is the one I'm gonna jump onto, but uh, something shorter.

• 6:24Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, that's fine. Build up to it.

• 6:26Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So today we are going to be talking about through hiking and through hiking the AT and we are going to be talking about the first murder that ever happened on the trail. It's a sad story. I guess just as I know a lot of people listen with their children and things, uh, and I just like to. Say, before we jump into stories, this is not only a story of a murder, but it's also a story of a kidnapping. And it's a, it's pretty, um, it's a harder story. I think it's really scary. I think you can put yourself in these situations. So just be aware of that before, um, listening with whoever you are listening to, make sure you're comfortable with that. But going into the story.

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• 7:40Cassandra Yahnian?

  Margaret McFaddin-Harritt and Joel Poslin met in 1974, when Joel came into a restaurant that Margaret was working at in Five Points, South Carolina. Margaret grew up in South Carolina, but had recently made the move to Five Points to begin her freshman year at the University of South Carolina. She was one of the youngest in her class as she is, as she had finished high school in just three years and had only just turned 17 years old when her college school year began. She was a bookworm who enjoyed learning and was yearning for new adventure in life. College had been very expected of her and she was extremely book smart, but she found her classes uninspiring and she was feeling lost in what to do with her future. Nevertheless, she never missed school and got a job as a waitress

• 8:25Cassandra Yahnian?

  at a local popular restaurant called Capri's Italian to afford her life there. Joel walked into the restaurant one evening in March and struck up a conversation with Margaret. Joel was nine years older than her, wore glasses and had a hippie style with long curly hair, a goatee and mustache. But he was extremely kind natured. He didn't have an enemy in the world and was a huge lover of photography and adventure. He particularly loved the outdoors and doing long bicycling trips. Growing up, he was a shy kid. described him as even a little awkward, but he always participated in clubs and events in his high school and was always known to be friendly to everyone that he met. In their first conversation, Joel spoke of his upcoming adventure that he had been dreaming of and preparing for for months.

• 9:08Cassandra Yahnian?

  It was going to be his very first through hike that he would be doing, and it was along the Appalachian Trail. He spoke with such enthusiasm and excitement that his adventurous spirit was contagious. Before the end of the night, he asked Margaret if she would like to join him on the trail. And at first she declined. She was very busy with school, upcoming exams and work. Plus, she had just met Joel. For him to ask her to go on the AT, she was like, you know, you seem really cool. You seem nice, but I don't know you to want to go on the trail. But also, she wasn't a hiker. She couldn't even envision herself through hiking the AT. It had never been something that was in her, in her mind that she would do. So she said no, but Joel continued to come to the restaurant.

• 9:50Cassandra Yahnian?

  Speaking of his plans and his excitement of the through hike, and the two of them began a real friendship. And that's truly what it was. Margaret considered Joel a friend and his excitement for adventure began to rub off on her. Before meeting Joel, she had already decided that she wouldn't be coming back to the University of South Carolina for a second semester. She was just too lost and unhappy there, and she needed to find a change for her life direction. The more Joel spoke of his adventures, the more she began to think that the AT might just be the inspiration that she was looking for in life as well. She eventually agreed to go and she began to save her money. She spoke to her parents about her plans and they were supportive and felt that it was a good idea as well. Joel was thrilled and offered her list of supplies that she would need and gave her

• 10:34Cassandra Yahnian?

  book recommendations to prepare for her journey. Because Margaret had final exams coming up, they decided that Joel would start first and Margaret would take the bus to where he would be. However, after two weeks on the trail, he returned to Five Point, South Carolina because of an issue that he was having with hemorrhoids. He waited for Margaret to finish her exams before he went back out onto the trail again. By the time the two of them set foot on the AT together, it was May 7, 1974, which was a little later than a normal start for the AT. Most through hikers begin in March or early April, but Margaret's schedule had made them push things off a little bit and force them to begin a bit later. They hitchhiked a ride from a kind older gentleman who was local to the area and was frequently giving through hikers rides.

• 11:19Cassandra Yahnian?

  They paid him $5 to drop them off at a road crossing at the Testanee Gap, which was a point approximately 38 miles or 62 kilometers from the starting point of the AT at Springer Mountain, but was where Joel had left off before he had started experiencing his medical issues. So he was jumping right back on where he left off. They thanked the man for the ride and for good conversation before stepping on the trail to officially begin their journey together with full packs of gear, food, maps, and definitely more than everything that they needed. And hearts full of excitement, they made their way to their very first shelter. It was just 1.5 miles away from the road, but they had begun their journey late in the afternoon and they were losing daylight.

• 12:02Cassandra Yahnian?

  It was the only shelter they could make it to unless they wanted to hike in the dark. So they decided, you know, first day out on the trail, we'll just do an easy 1.5 miles, sleep for the night and get started. And that first night went well. There were two other guys staying at the shelter, but when they arrived, they were already asleep. And in the, and the following morning, they woke up together, had a quick chat, and they discovered that the two men who were actually at this campsite were done with the trail. They had been out there for about five days and they said, no, this is our last day. We quit today. We're heading, we're heading back out.

• 12:34Danielle LaRock?

  I mean, there's something to be admired about that, you know, just kind of calling it, being honest with yourself and being like, you know,

• 12:41Cassandra Yahnian?

  Not for me.

• 12:42Danielle LaRock?

  Not for me. Not for me.

• 12:43Cassandra Yahnian?

  Which is totally fine.

• 12:45Danielle LaRock?

  Which is, yeah, I can totally resonate with that. I feel like maybe it would be, I wouldn't mind trying a through hike, but I, I'm pretty.

• 12:53Cassandra Yahnian?

  Love your bed.

• 12:54Danielle LaRock?

  Oh, God. I do love my bed.

• 12:57Cassandra Yahnian?

  That bed is so good.

• 12:59Danielle LaRock?

  Like.

• 12:59Cassandra Yahnian?

  So good.

• 13:00Danielle LaRock?

  Especially when you do an everything shower, which girls know, an everything shower.

• 13:05Cassandra Yahnian?

  Everything shower takes a long time.

• 13:07Danielle LaRock?

  A lot of commitment and time in there. By the time you're out, you're tired. But then you get into a bed that has like fresh sheets and pillowcases and maybe even like a little fuzzy blanket. You get in, watch a good movie. There's just truly nothing better than a really nice bed. And I love camping and I love being outdoors, but it's like almost an equal amount of love of being indoors. And that's balance.

• 13:33Cassandra Yahnian?

  It is balance. Hey, I am all for a good day hike, one that really kicks your butt and you see some beautiful views. And to the point where you're exhausted at the end of the day, I think there's nothing better than doing a fantastic hike, getting the best meal you've ever had. It doesn't even matter what it is after a crazy hike. The meal that you have after a hike is the best meal you ever have. And then just showering and laying in bed. So nice.

• 14:00Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, but.

• 14:01Cassandra Yahnian?

  And these guys probably felt the same way.

• 14:04Danielle LaRock?

  Whoever you are, I get it. That's all I have to say.

• 14:06Cassandra Yahnian?

  And for them, they're like, okay, the first people we met on the trail are already leaving and quitting. But that wasn't a deterrent for them. They were so excited. It was, they're finally there, they're there together. Joel's medical issues are behind him. This was this fresh start. They're like, you know, respect, we respect that, but we're so excited. That's not going to deter us from our journey. So they wake up in the morning, they pack up their things full of excitement and they head to the next shelter, which they was several miles away. And shortly into their hike, they came across a ranger who was doing trail maintenance, chopping up trees that were down and, and clearing sticks that were on the trail and just doing general trail maintenance.

• 14:50Cassandra Yahnian?

  And they stopped and they had a quick conversation with him. And during their chat, there were two or three more men who arrived and joined in uh, before Margaret and Joel bid them a good day and made their way towards the next shelter. They tracked for about five miles before they came upon a. Sign that read low gap shelter 150 yards with a sign that pointed off of the AT. While they hadn't traveled far, the trail proved to be difficult with steep inclines and roots and rocks to climb over. With their heavy packs and their untrained trail legs, they both agreed that they would make camp there, rest and eat, and continue hiking the following day. They hiked down to the path to the low gap where they happened upon a small stream, good for drinking water and a basic shelter. It had a roof with an open platform underneath

• 15:34Cassandra Yahnian?

  to set up some sleeping bags, a picnic table, and a fire pit. Away from the building, there were several flat cleared areas that would also be good for tent camping. When they arrived, there was already one person who was there, and making pleasantries with a fellow hiker, they initiated conversations with the man, who they learned his name was Ralph, and he had been staying there for a couple of days. He stated that he had been there waiting for two of his buddies to arrive, and asked if Joel or Margaret had come across them. They believed they could have been the two men who joined in on the conversation with the ranger, and after describing them, Ralph agreed that they were who he was waiting for. From first glance, Ralph was unassuming. He seemed to be a little bit older than Joel. He was about five inches shorter than him and had a small build. He had a wispy mustache,

• 16:18Cassandra Yahnian?

  horn-rimmed glasses, and a receding blonde hairline that was combed straight back. His skin was dirty and he looked like he had been out in the woods for a while. While at first glance, he seemed harmless, there was something off about him immediately. While Margaret and Joel had almost certainly overpacked for the AT, Ralph had almost nothing with him, which was odd for a person who claimed to be a through hiker as well. With him, he had a blanket, leather jacket, and a rucksack, and he didn't exactly look like a hiker. Margaret pushed the thought from her head and rationalized that he seemed nice enough, and then both Margaret and Joel dropped their packs and walked down to the stream to wash up some of their clothing. And when they were out of earshot of Ralph, Joel voiced his concerns in a whisper, to be sure he wasn't heard by anyone but Margaret.

• 17:04Cassandra Yahnian?

  He thought he seemed odd, and observed that he wasn't dressed appropriately to be a through hiker. He mentioned the suede boots he was wearing, which would be terrible for hiking, and his lack of any proper gear. He was also concerned that they left all of their belongings right next to where he was and thought that they might steal from them. After this quick conversation, they rushed back to the shelter to find all their gear untouched and Ralph unmoved from his spot from where he had left him. They strung up a clothesline to hang their wet clothes, started a fire and made some dinner. They offered Ralph some of what they cooked, which he happily accepted. Afterwards, Ralph went out into the woods and brought back logs to keep the fire going. When he left a second time to get more wood, Joel commented to Margaret that maybe he had misjudged him and he was all right after all.

• 17:49Cassandra Yahnian?

  But he also stated that he wanted to get out of there first thing in the morning. Margaret went to bed, crawling into her sleeping bag under the roof of the shelter. Joel and Ralph stayed up later, sitting around the fire with each other, before they each tucked into their own sleeping bags on the shelter platform as well.

• 18:10Cassandra Yahnian?

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• 19:33Cassandra Yahnian?

  Early the next morning, sometime around 7:00 AM, Joel woke Margaret up to make a plan for the day. Joel had been up for a while at that point and had already packed his belongings away. After a quick conversation, it was decided that neither of them were hungry yet, and they would wait until they reached the next summit to have breakfast there and have a nice, beautiful view over a meal. Margaret emerged from her sleeping bag and put her boots on while Joel walked over towards the fire pit. Still drowsy, Margaret sat slowly lacing up her boots when the almost silent morning was interrupted by gunfire. She turned quickly to see that Joel was slumped over a rock by the fire pit, not moving. A second later, Ralph was standing above her, demanding she lay belly down on the floor, and he was

• 20:16Cassandra Yahnian?

  holding a revolver. Margaret obeyed, and the man tied her hands behind her back before forcing her onto her feet and leading her down a path past the bathrooms and off the trail deeper into the forest. He then forced her to sit down with her legs around a tree and tied her feet together. He instructed her not to yell or scream and asked if he needed to put a gag in her mouth. She said no and asked if he would move Joel off of the fire so he wouldn't be burned. The last time she saw him, it was over the fire pit, and she wasn't sure if there was a fire going and was concerned about him. Ralph said that he would, and Margaret asked if he was dead. Ralph responded by saying that he was just hurt and not to worry, but it was clear that the strange man was now panicking, and his

• 20:59Cassandra Yahnian?

  words did not put her at ease that Joel was alive at all. He seemed very nervous. He was like looking around crazy. He didn't seem like he had, he knew what he was doing. He seemed very like out, out there. She felt that he was saying that to try and make her calm, but she felt anything but, and asked him what he planned to do with her next. Ralph stated that he was unsure before he left.

• 21:22Danielle LaRock?

  Oh, that is not what you need to hear from someone who's losing their mind and just killed your friend.

• 21:29Cassandra Yahnian?

  I don't know what's worse, someone who feels like they've done it before and they had, like, it's calculated and they have a plan, or someone who is clearly like, oh my God, what just happened? What do I do? And they're just acting like crazy.

• 21:43Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, there's like pros and cons to.

• 21:45Cassandra Yahnian?

  To both.

• 21:46Danielle LaRock?

  To both because the unpredictability and like the panic of someone who's uncertain is scary, but the smooth, calm, collected demeanor in a terrifying situation is also scary. So I'm not sure.

• 22:00Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yes.

• 22:01Danielle LaRock?

  But I feel like with this scenario, maybe you have a little bit more wiggle room with changing their mind or working their uncertainty to your advantage.

• 22:12Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 22:13Danielle LaRock?

  You know?

• 22:13Cassandra Yahnian?

  If they're, if they seem as scared as you are.

• 22:15Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 22:16Cassandra Yahnian?

  Like, maybe there's some type of conversation that can be made. After about 15 minutes, the man returned and untied Margaret from the tree, but he kept her hands tied behind her back and led her back to the shelter. When they arrived, Joel was no longer anywhere to be seen and Ralph explained that he had gotten rid of him. He then did something surprising and confusing to Margaret. He had her sit down and made her a cup of coffee and gave her breakfast. He told her to eat as she would be in the woods all day. Out of fear, she listened to him, but was also confused on why he was being nice to her. It was like a weird gesture. Um, but as she's sitting there eating breakfast because she's, he told her to, Ralph rummages through Joel's pack, searching for money. And all he found there were some traveler's checks that Joel had packed with him.

• 23:01Cassandra Yahnian?

  And Margaret also gave him a small amount of change that she had with her as well. She asked again if he planned to kill her and told, and told him that he had no reason to. She said, I haven't done anything bad to you at all. There's no reason to harm me. And he responded with, well, neither did Joel.

• 23:18Danielle LaRock?

  Well, I mean, true, but that is chilling.

• 23:23Cassandra Yahnian?

  After another 15 minutes, Ralph instructed her to pack all of her things and grab her pack. He then explained that he was going to tie her up in the woods off the trail, but would leave a note at the shelter explaining where she was. They walked around as Ralph searched for a spot he deemed okay to leave her. He noted that he didn't want to leave her close to the edge of a nearby mountainside as he was afraid she could fall and be injured. Ultimately, he found a log he deemed safe and reasonable for her to stay on. He tied her legs around a tree and buried her backpack in some leaves. He then took a hard hat. That Joel had brought with him and filled it with water. He also put a bag of Margaret's cereal on her lap and explained that in case she was there for a long time, she would have access to some food and some water.

• 24:06Cassandra Yahnian?

  So all this is really confusing to her. She's like, okay, you just killed my friend, but you're trying to keep me alive and you're also concerned about my safety. You don't want me near a cliff edge. But, but she's like, why are you being nice? All this while, he still has a gun on her. So he's not being that nice, you know? And it's just very, very confusing because she had just seen him shoot Joel. And now she was pretty certain he was dead, even though she, he said that he was fine. And just a little injured, but he had threatened to harm her as well. Nothing about Ralph's demeanor was calm or calculating and he just continued to spiral. He seemed like a mess. He kept saying killing Joel was an accident, but he was much larger than him, so it needed to happen for him to take his belongings.

• 24:49Cassandra Yahnian?

  He also kept repeating that he had never killed a girl before, and he didn't want to harm Margaret. Regardless, he was erratic and she feared for her life as well. Ralph eventually set Joel's watch on the log beside her so she could see the time and bid her farewell. With her hands tied behind her back and her legs around a tree, she had no way to move. She was afraid to yell for help as Ralph would most likely hear her. She sat and hoped he was actually leaving a note as they had walked far off the trail. Even if she did yell, she wasn't sure if anyone would hear her or if anyone would even be in the area anytime soon. She also feared that he would be back to kill her. Sure enough, 15 minutes passed and she heard his footsteps crunching on the leaves towards her once again.

• 25:32Cassandra Yahnian?

  She said a silent prayer, sure that this was the moment that Ralph would shoot her too. And having accepted her fate, she quietly said, okay, God, here I come. Disheveled as ever, Ralph appeared before her and stopped. He said, I just can't leave you here. What if it's days before anyone shows up? You'd die and I don't want that. He explained she had a choice. She could stay tied up or he offered to allow her to hike out of the mountains with him. When they reached the next highway, he would let her go back home.

• 26:02Danielle LaRock?

  Why isn't there a third option of I will untie you? And leave and then you can leave in like 20 minutes.

• 26:09Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 26:09Danielle LaRock?

  Without me.

• 26:10Cassandra Yahnian?

  Without me. I'm gone. Yeah.

• 26:12Danielle LaRock?

  Right.

• 26:13Cassandra Yahnian?

  You would think, but also.

• 26:15Danielle LaRock?

  Well, none of this makes sense.

• 26:16Cassandra Yahnian?

  None of it makes sense. And he's clearly trying to like have some type of control over her still, whether it's in the woods or with him. I don't know. It's a weird, it's a weird situation. And with her, I mean, there's no great options here. So she took him up on his offer and said, okay, I'll hike out with you. So he untied her and they began their hike, but not before he threatened to kill her if she did anything that would bring suspicion to them. So if they passed anyone and she said anything, he would kill not only her, but everyone else. She believed his threats and promised not to do anything and assured him that she just wanted to go home. She didn't want to cause any trouble. Now carrying Joel's pack, he forced Margaret to walk in front of him on the trail.

• 26:58Cassandra Yahnian?

  While if they had headed from where Margaret and Joel had originally came from heading south, it would have been just about five miles until they reached the nearest road. But Ralph forced them to go north, which was much further to the nearest road, and they didn't even know when it would be. Ralph told Margaret that she would set the pace and assured her that if she needed a break at any point, they could take it. Joel's pack that Ralph was carrying wasn't fitted for his body, though. The arms and hip straps were much too large and meant for someone with a longer torso, and it was heavy. Shortly into the trail, it wasn't Margaret that was the one needing breaks. It was actually Ralph. He was out of breath and shifting the pack constantly in attempts to carry it better. Every few minutes, they had to stop for him to adjust or to take a break.

• 27:41Cassandra Yahnian?

  Another clear sign that he wasn't a hiker. For nearly four miles, they trekked on through an old roadbed trail lined with ferns. Margaret turning around to look at him every few minutes, fully expecting Ralph to shoot her at any moment. Ralph noticed her nervousness and announced that if he had wanted her dead, he would have shot her when he shot Joel and not to worry. This, of course, did very little to reassure Margaret of her safety, but she continued to hike nonetheless, starting conversation with Ralph to try and keep her own nerves calm. Through their conversation, she learned that Ralph had been in and out of jail, and he was currently on the run from escaping prison and the FBI was looking for him.

• 28:20Danielle LaRock?

  Oh, lovely.

• 28:21Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 28:21Danielle LaRock?

  Like, that's great.

• 28:23Cassandra Yahnian?

  That's what I wanted to hear. I'm out here with an actual criminal, too.

• 28:26Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 28:27Cassandra Yahnian?

  He didn't mention what had landed him in prison, but he said that he needed the gear and Joel's pack to stay in the woods for a long period of time. Eventually, they stopped again and sat down on some rocks. They pulled out some chocolate to snack on during their break and sat a bit longer than the other breaks they had taken. They had walked about four miles and it hadn't been easy. Ralph was getting tired and after a few moments went by, two men came into view down the trail. Margaret immediately recognized one of them as the forest ranger she had seen the day before with Joel, who was doing trail maintenance. The ranger recognized Margaret, but he didn't seem to realize that Ralph wasn't Joel. And all he stated was, "Oh, hey, I saw y'all yesterday." Terrified of what Ralph might do, Margaret simply went along with it.

• 29:12Cassandra Yahnian?

  But she also asked how far away the highway was and the direction that they were heading. They learned that it was indeed very far and that the two of them would more than likely be spending another night in the woods together before they made it to the road. The conversation was short and the two men moved on without any suspicion that Margaret was in trouble. It was another five miles before they came across another shelter. They didn't stay long, but while they were there, a family was sleeping there for the night, had explained to them that the highway was just one more mile and it was downhill walking from that point. Even though they had hiked close to 10 miles, Ralph wanted to get off the mountain as much as Margaret did and opted to continue for the highway. To Margaret's dismay, however, he announced that because it was getting late,

• 29:54Cassandra Yahnian?

  they would be hitchhiking to spend the night together in a motel and he would let her go the following morning.

• 29:59Danielle LaRock?

  Okay, what, what is the reasoning though? I don't, I'm not understanding.

• 30:03Cassandra Yahnian?

  I don't know.

• 30:04Danielle LaRock?

  That, or if there is anything to understand, I don't know, but...

• 30:08Cassandra Yahnian?

  He keeps saying it's for her own safety, like it's dangerous to be out here at night. Don't hitchhike by yourself, it's dangerous.

• 30:15Danielle LaRock?

  It's like you just murdered somebody in front of me and are holding me hostage.

• 30:20Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 30:21Danielle LaRock?

  That is the definition of danger.

• 30:23Cassandra Yahnian?

  He's clearly not in his right mind. Yeah, it's like I'm currently in danger.

• 30:27Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 30:27Cassandra Yahnian?

  I'll take my, I'll take my chances, thank you. But yeah, he tells her that they're gonna spend the night together. After an hour, they reached the road and shortly after... Afterwards, a young girl named Jody stopped to pick them up when she saw them thumbing for a ride. She explained that she was heading into town to try and bail a friend out of jail, and she could give them a ride to hell in Georgia. First, they stopped at a restaurant where Margaret went in and cashed one of her own traveler's checks that she had for $20, which the restaurant kindly did for her. And again, she's still under this fear. He's saying like, go in there, get some money for us. But if you tell them if there's any suspicion, I will just start killing people.

• 31:03Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 31:04Cassandra Yahnian?

  Jody then drove them down the road to a motel where they were, where they were able to get a room for the night for just $10. Ralph signed them into the hotel under Joel's name and signed them in as Mr. And Mrs. Poulsen, because Joel's last name was Poulsen. All this time, Margaret stayed calm, but was fully aware that Ralph still had a gun and could harm her at any moment. Before settling in for the night, they stopped at a market next to the motel to pick up food, beer, and wine. When they eventually entered their motel room, Margaret was sure that this was where Ralph would assault her and most likely kill her. But he didn't. Instead, he nervously turned the television on to the news channel, waiting to see a breaking news report of a body found at the Low Gap Shelter.

• 31:46Cassandra Yahnian?

  And he waited and watched, fully expecting something to show up, but there was nothing. Feeling less worried, Ralph pulled out a pen and paper and practiced writing Joel's signature so he would be able to cash his traveler's checks. Margaret asked him if it was okay that she showered, and he allowed her to. However, because there was a window in the bathroom, he sat in the room with her to ensure that she didn't escape. He made it a point, however, not to look at her as she undressed or when she showered to give her some privacy. When it came time to sleep, Ralph offered Margaret the bed. He sat in a chair beside her with a gun in his hand, alert with no intentions of sleeping at all that night. Margaret, though still terrified, through her exhaustion, she managed to fall asleep.

• 32:31Cassandra Yahnian?

  She slept hard and didn't wake up until the sun came through the window the following morning. When she opened her eyes, Ralph was still sitting there, gun in his hand, wide awake.

• 32:41Danielle LaRock?

  That is so terrifying.

• 32:43Cassandra Yahnian?

  I just imagine you're so exhausted. You've been through so much. You've hiked 10 miles. Your frie- your friend was killed. You're afraid for your life. You're finally in, you're in a bed and you pass out and you have like these moments of almost peace and then you wake up and you're right back in it.

• 33:00Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. And there's just this guy like staring at you with a gun, nowhere to go.

• 33:05Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 33:13Speaker 05

  It's me, the

• 33:16Speaker 05

  we don't need the jingle twice. Stop it. This is about vacation inflation and how Priceline negotiates amazing deals on hotels, flights and rental cars.

• 33:28Speaker 05

  Yeah, but I didn't mention that you can save up to 60% off hotels in the Priceline app.

• 33:34Speaker 05

  Fine. No one deals more deals than please stop. Touche.

• 33:41Speaker 05

  Priceline.

• 33:46Danielle LaRock?

  Okay. So what's the plan now? So they're, they're awake. Now they're going to go their separate ways. So

• 33:52Cassandra Yahnian?

  So he said that he would let her go in the morning, but it wasn't exactly like that. It wasn't like, okay, it's morning time. You can leave its light out. He makes her stay with him. Eventually they pack up and they walk to the restaurant that Margaret had cashed her check at the evening prior and they ordered coffee and Ralph cashed one of Joel's traveler's checks for $20. Over breakfast, Ralph explained to Margaret that he was uncomfortable letting her leave from there. He knew that she still needed to make it from Georgia to South Carolina and he was worried about her hitchhiking by herself. He said, quote, "You never know what kind of person might pick you up" and that it was dangerous. Instead, he devised a plan

• 34:35Cassandra Yahnian?

  to go to a bus stop together where she could hop on a Greyhound home. So they thumbed a ride together to the nearest bus station and with Margaret's heart pounding at the thought that her freedom was so close, she approached the ticket counter and asked for a one-way ticket to Columbia, South Carolina. Her hopes of escaping right then Were quickly deflated when the man explained that they didn't have any buses running to Columbia and that she would need to get a ticket to Atlanta first, or she could go to another bus station down the road and go directly from there.

• 35:07Danielle LaRock?

  Okay, yeah, pick a place, any place, any place that is not there. I don't care if I'm going to Columbia, Atlanta, or Timbuktu, get me out.

• 35:13Cassandra Yahnian?

  Like, get me out of here. However, you would think that that would, and I'm sure

• 35:17Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 35:18Cassandra Yahnian?

  she felt that way too. Ralph was uncomfortable with the idea of her taking two buses. So he didn't want her to get lost and was unco- like, again, he brings up these excuses, like he's really worried about her safety, like he's being this gentleman to be like, "Oh, you're just a girl. Like, I don't want you to get lost in the bus station and go on multiple buses. I'll just take you to the most convenient bus stop." Like, he's like, it seems like he's trying to be like chivalrous, but he kidnapped her, so, and killed her friend, so that's kind of a mute point. But anyway, he's uncomfortable with that, so they hitch a ride again together to the next bus station. And this one was much smaller. It was just a downtown storefront.

• 36:01Cassandra Yahnian?

  And to Margaret's dismay, they found the door locked with a sign on the glass that said, "Go on to the doctor, be back in the afternoon."

• 36:09Danielle LaRock?

  No. Okay.

• 36:11Cassandra Yahnian?

  It's like, okay, I'm so close, like, please come, what is this? Why am I with him for so long? Um, so he's like, okay, well, we, we can do some stuff while we wait for the train. So together, they left to go to the bank to cash more of those travelers' checks. And then they went to a restaurant and got lunch together. They returned a few hours later to find the door unlocked, and Margaret was finally able to purchase her bus ticket to Columbia. Ralph bought a ticket as well, but his was for Atlanta.

• 36:40Danielle LaRock?

  Okay, oh my god, I almost was like, no.

• 36:43Cassandra Yahnian?

  It's like, he's gonna jump on the same bus.

• 36:45Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 36:46Cassandra Yahnian?

  So his bus was actually scheduled to leave first before hers, which he said he was okay with. But as they sat in the waiting room, Ralph showed signs of regret of letting Margaret live at all. He told her that he knew that she would be calling the police and reporting what he did. But he hoped that he could get a head start before police found him. He threatened that if she called the police as soon as he boarded the bus, and if he arrived in Atlanta with police waiting for him, he would just start shooting innocent people. He didn't care who died.

• 37:18Danielle LaRock?

  Okay.

• 37:19Cassandra Yahnian?

  And in this, she sat silently, like unsure of what to say. Okay, I'm not gonna, I just want to get out of here, you know?

• 37:26Danielle LaRock?

  Right.

• 37:26Cassandra Yahnian?

  Just let me, let me go. I'm not, I'm not gonna put other people's lives at risk. Just, just let me go. So when his bus arrived, Joel's pack was loaded into the cargo hold and Ralph climbed on. Moments later, the bus pulled away and Margaret finally could breathe and was free of him. She sat in silence, stunned that she was alive, in shock of what had happened, not wanting anything more than to be home with her family. And she didn't call the police in those moments. She waited for the bus and when it arrived, she boarded. She was afraid. She was still afraid of him. She didn't want to call. A few hours later, she arrived in Columbia. From a station payphone, she called her brother who lived in the city, but he didn't answer. Then she called her mother, who also didn't pick up the phone.

• 38:11Cassandra Yahnian?

  Then she called the police. She said, "Someone's been killed in Georgia and I need to tell you about it. Could you come get me?" She told the person on the other line, "Just that." And they said, "Yeah, I'll be, we'll send someone over right away." In the early hours of May 11th, a Georgia Bureau of Investigation agent, Stanley Thompson, was dispatched to the Low Gap Shelter. By the time he arrived, a Georgia sheriff, Frank Banker, was there and had already found Joel. He had been hidden under sticks and leaves across the stream from the shelter. They found him with a bag over his head, which looked to be placed there to contain the blood from the bullet wound. News reports went out about what had happened and a description of Ralph was plastered in the papers and all over the news.

• 38:55Cassandra Yahnian?

  On May 16th, five days later, the Atlanta Police Department received a phone call from a woman who believed she knew who the suspect was and where he lived. The police obtained a warrant for the apartment, and when they arrived, no one was home. Regardless, they entered the premise to find Joel's backpack, his clothing and gear, along with a revolver still loaded. They discovered the man living there was Ralph Howard Fox, and he had an extensive criminal record.

• 39:24Danielle LaRock?

  I don't want to, I mean, there's been so many, like, what the hell moments here, but I'm surprised that he said his real name to her.

• 39:31Cassandra Yahnian?

  I know. He just like, it feels like he really didn't have this planned. It was like, he just decided this and had no idea what he was doing.

• 39:40Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 39:41Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah, but to say his real name, crazy.

• 39:43Danielle LaRock?

  And like, all this information about him, like, yeah, I escaped from this prison. This is my plan. I want to hide out in the woods. This is my legal name.

• 39:52Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 39:52Danielle LaRock?

  I don't know, it just seems kind of like amateur hour. I'm not a criminal, and I know not to do that.

• 39:57Cassandra Yahnian?

  I don't know. I mean, you say amateur hour, but we'll get into his criminal record, and this was not his first time.

• 40:10Speaker 05

  It's me, the

• 40:14Speaker 05

  We don't need the jingle twice.

• 40:17Speaker 05

  Stop it. This is about vacation inflation and how Priceline negotiates amazing deals on hotels, flights, and rental cars.

• 40:25Speaker 05

  Yeah, but I didn't mention that you can save up to 60% off hotels in the Priceline app. Fine. No one deals more deals than Please stop. Touche. Priceline.

• 40:42Cassandra Yahnian?

  So Ralph was from Detroit, and he started getting into trouble very early on. As a teenager, he kidnapped a classmate that attended a party he threw when his parents were out of town. At 17 years old, he was arrested for car theft, and a year later, he was caught breaking and entering. At 20 years old, he ran off to New Mexico with a 16-year-old girl and was arrested for statutory rape. After his arrest, he ended up marrying. While his wife, who was a child, she's 16, was pregnant, he kidnapped a teenage girl at gunpoint and drove her to a wooded area over 13 miles away from where he picked her up. Fortunately, a cop spotted him trying to tie the girl's hands behind her back and arrested him and stopped the situation from there.

• 41:27Cassandra Yahnian?

  For this incident, he was sentenced to 15 years at the Michigan State Prison. And Anne, who was his wife, the 16-year-old divorced him. His sentence was cut short when he escaped the prison, but was recaptured in Miami. Eventually, he was released on parole where he went back to find Anne and tried to kill her. He broke into her apartment and waited for her to come home. And when she opened the door, he fired a shot at her, but missed and then fled where he eventually found himself on the AT. When police had entered his home and found that he wasn't there, they waited for Ralph to return to his apartment. And when he opened the door, they were waiting for him with their guns drawn. He was arrested without incident and Margaret was able to pick him out of a lineup,

• 42:10Cassandra Yahnian?

  verifying that he was the person who had kidnapped her and killed Joel. He pleaded guilty to the charges against him and was eventually sentenced to life in prison to be served in a Georgia State Prison. Where it seems like this story should end here, a tragic story where justice was served, it does not. Ralph spent the next 17 years behind bars. But in July of 1991, when his brother died, he was granted a one-month reprieve to attend the funeral in Michigan. That furlough was then changed to being released out on parole, where he would be under the supervision of the Michigan authorities. At the time, he moved in with his sister, who reported that he had completely changed.

• 42:50Cassandra Yahnian?

  He had aged, was much quieter, and he seemed like he really wanted to live a new, quiet, not criminal life. That was short-lived, though. After seven months free, he failed to report to his parole officer and he never showed up at his job. A week later, the body of a woman was found in a rural field who had been killed by strangulation. Officers at the scene found evidence of a car that had been stuck in the mud nearby and after calling around to tow Companies, one reported pulling a blue gray Mercury Cougar from that very field. The car belonged to Ralph. While Ralph never admitted to the murder, he was convicted of it. He served the rest of his life in prison until he passed away from lung cancer in two thousand and three.

• 43:32Danielle LaRock?

  So what a load of crap about like wanting to, I know at the, at that time with Margaret, he said he had never killed a woman before, but it just made it.

• 43:41Cassandra Yahnian?

  He was escalating.

• 43:42Danielle LaRock?

  Well, he's escalating. Yeah, for sure. But I don't know, just he tried to kill a woman before her.

• 43:49Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah, right before her.

• 43:51Danielle LaRock?

  Immediately prior and just like the, I don't know, what an interesting, I hate to say interesting guy because.

• 43:59Cassandra Yahnian?

  But it is kind of like, what was his thought process?

• 44:01Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, what is going on?

• 44:03Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. And also such an oversight for the, like, for the justice system to be like, oh, you're out for your brother's funeral. Let's just keep you out. You were fine. You didn't do anything bad at the funeral. You're good.

• 44:18Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, it's like I, and the one month, a one month.

• 44:21Cassandra Yahnian?

  Hiatus from jail.

• 44:23Danielle LaRock?

  Say also.

• 44:25Cassandra Yahnian?

  After you're in there for murder?

• 44:27Danielle LaRock?

  Bereavement leave here in the United States for many companies and many places of employment are three days.

• 44:35Cassandra Yahnian?

  And he gets a month and he's a convicted murderer.

• 44:38Danielle LaRock?

  That is, that is a big problem.

• 44:40Cassandra Yahnian?

  I agree on the month. I think people should get a month, but for a convicted murderer to get it, but not an everyday person out here paying taxes and doing our job as citizens.

• 44:51Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah, that, that's a huge issue.

• 44:54Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah, that's not right.

• 44:55Danielle LaRock?

  Wow. Yeah. Okay. Anyway, so what happened with Margaret? Like, how did she? I can't even imagine like hearing, you know, that another woman lost her life at the hands of Ralph. And just seeing how the ball was dropped by the justice system and.

• 45:12Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah. And it's interesting because so Margaret actually didn't come out about this whole story publicly until a few years ago.

• 45:20Danielle LaRock?

  Oh, okay.

• 45:21Cassandra Yahnian?

  Outside Online did a really good article and I used them for reference. I'll put it in the show notes for their conversation with her and there's also court documents, but she never publicly came out about her story. And I have to wonder if, because it wasn't too long after he died in prison that she did come out and tell it. And I have to wonder if part of that was because another woman lost her life. But as for Margaret, she definitely struggled after the incident. She started smoking pot and drinking and she was doing what normal teenagers kind of do at her age, but she had started the AT to find herself and she found herself a lot more lost. And now she had gone through a serious trauma. After about a year, she decided to quit doing

• 46:04Cassandra Yahnian?

  the drugs that she was trying and stopped drinking alcohol and she got a job working on an orchard. The job itself and working in the outdoors spoke to her so much that she decided to re-enroll in school at Clemson University to study forestry in 1975. She then went on to get her doctorate, which required her to work for several years in the forests of Brazil. And according to Outside Online, she then joined the US Agency for International Development, where she managed projects in places like Honduras, Nicaragua, Bolivia, where she spent years in the jungles there. And she even worked in landscapes of Pakistan and other dangerous areas. And today she is retired, but she still works as a contractor and will occasionally be

• 46:48Cassandra Yahnian?

  dropped by marine helicopters and hot zones, wearing a bulletproof vest, working on forestry projects in dangerous areas to help the ecosystems in those places.

• 46:59Danielle LaRock?

  Wow.

• 47:00Cassandra Yahnian?

  So basically she turned into badass.

• 47:02Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah.

• 47:03Cassandra Yahnian?

  Truly. Yeah. She, uh, she went through some stuff and I, I thought it was really interesting that now she's wearing a bulletproof vest, going into dangerous zones. And you have to wonder if this experience in the outdoors, being here and having, going through that, if that kind of sparked it where she was powerless and kind of submissive in the situation and then she went in and did all this work in these other places and not. Not to say being submissive was bad. I think it saved her life, but she put herself in more of a power position after that.

• 47:36Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. And it sounds like it added to her resiliency. So

• 47:41Cassandra Yahnian?

  For sure.

• 47:42Danielle LaRock?

  Wow, that's I had no idea that this story existed. I knew that especially with our talks with Andrea Langford, especially kind of comparing the AT to the PCT.

• 47:54Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 47:54Danielle LaRock?

  As far as violent crime and people going missing and things like that. So based on those conversations, I've always understood that the AT was quote unquote, more dangerous when it comes to violent crime than the PCT. But I did not know, and of course you covered Julie and Lolly's story.

• 48:15Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah, which was also the AT and Shannon Doh.

• 48:18Danielle LaRock?

  Which was a big one. So I don't know. I just, I had no idea that there was a murder slash kidnapping story that took place there. And

• 48:29Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah.

• 48:29Danielle LaRock?

  Yikes. Well, thank you for sharing it. And I know you said it was a suggestion by somebody. So whoever did that, thanks.

• 48:35Cassandra Yahnian?

  Yeah, thank you. It's a very, I hadn't heard of it either. Like this hadn't been a story that would have been in my, in my list of things to cover. So I'm glad that you guys recommended it and keep sending us recommendations. We love doing stories that you all are asking for. Like, of course, we have our own list here and we find things that we're inspired by, but we love to hear what you want to hear about too. So it was, it was definitely interesting. There was a lot of stuff here that I never knew about. So.

• 49:04Danielle LaRock?

  Yeah. And if you're curious on the best way to send in a suggestion, there are a couple of ways, but just the most streamlined place for me, especially in my type A personality is I created a form on our website, npadpodcast.com. And there is a link that brings you to a Google form and that magically turns into an Excel spreadsheet on our end. So everything is kind of in one spot that we can both access and organize nicely. So there is a space to do that on our website, but if you don't want to go through all that, you don't have to. You can email us as well or DM us. It's just, I like forms. What can I say?

• 49:47Danielle LaRock?

  Well, thank you everyone for joining us. We will see you next week. In the meantime, please enjoy the view.

• 49:52Cassandra Yahnian?

  But watch your back.

• 49:53Danielle LaRock?

  Bye, everyone.

• 49:54Cassandra Yahnian?

  Bye.

• 50:00Danielle LaRock?

  Thank you so much for joining us again this week. If you have a trail tale or story suggestion, send us an email at [email protected]. Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at National Park After Dark and on Twitter at NPAD Podcast. Join our Outsiders Only community on Patreon or Apple subscriptions to listen ad-free, unlock monthly bonus episodes, and exclusive content.

• 50:25Cassandra Yahnian?

  And remember, when you support our sponsors, you are supporting our show. For our exclusive discount codes and source information from today's episode, check out the show notes. For more information on our show, our book recommendations, merch updates, and more, visit our website at NPADpodcast.com. And please rate, review, and subscribe from wherever you listen to podcasts.

• 50:55Speaker 04

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