261. A Hate That Killed - The Life and Death of Blaze Bernstein

In this episode, Payton and Garrett explore the heartbreaking case of Blaze Bernstein. After vanishing during a visit to his family in Orange County, investigators race to retrace his final steps—only to uncover a disturbing truth that leaves the community reeling. Links: NEW MERCH LINK: https://mwmhshop.com Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/themwmh Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/murderwithmyhusband/ Watch on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@murderwithmyhusband Listen on Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/into-the-dark/id1662304327 Listen on spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/36SDVKB2MEWpFGVs9kRgQ7?si=f5224c9fd99542a7 Case Source: Forward.com - https://forward.com/news/629814/samuel-woodward-guilty-blaze-bernstein-murder/ CNN.com - https://www.cnn.com/2024/11/16/us/samuel-woodward-sentenced-blaze-bernstein-killing/index.html TheDP.com - https://www.thedp.com/article/2024/11/penn-woodward-sentenced-life-without-parole-blaze-bernstein-case Patch.com - https://patch.com/california/lagunabeach/life-too-short-blaze-bernstein-obituary ABCNewsGo.com - https://abcnews.go.com/US/blaze-bernstein-murder-case-samuel-woodward-verdict/story?id=111659996 NBCLosAngeles.com - https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/samuel-woodward-first-degree-murder-former-classmate-blaze-bernstein/3561861/ 6ABC.com - https://6abc.com/post/blaze-bernstein-murder-penn-student-2020-samuel-woodward/15748785/ Yahoo.com - https://www.yahoo.com/news/former-classmate-sentenced-life-hate-013424774.html BlazeBernstein.org - https://blazebernstein.org/ CBSNews.com - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/blaze-bernstein-murder-sam-woodward-hate-crime-california-48-hours/ Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Blaze_Bernstein Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

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• 0:29Payton Moreland?

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• 1:14Payton Moreland?

  with professional monitoring. If you've been thinking about a security system, it is now. 70% off, guys, when you visit simplisafe.com/husband. That is simplisafe.com/husband. And when you order, just write in Murder With My Husband at checkout. Tells them we sent you. Really helps the show. SimpliSafe, ahead of crime in real time. You're listening to an Ono Media Podcast. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the podcast. This is Murder With My Husband. I'm Payton Moreland.

• 1:43Garrett Moreland?

  And I'm Garrett Moreland.

• 1:44Payton Moreland?

  And he's the husband.

• 1:45Garrett Moreland?

  And I'm the husband. Well, I'm gonna be honest. I know I'm supposed to be recording right now, and I will be recording because I love all you guys. But there is a pretty important game on right now, Alabama versus Robert Morris. And Morris is hanging on. They're down by four points. There's four minutes left. So if you're on YouTube and you casually see me looking at my phone, that's why. But don't worry, Peyton is gonna be locked and loaded, ready to go. So there's nothing to worry about.

• 2:12Payton Moreland?

  And just remember before you're like, Garrett, what? He hates this. He hates it. Remember?

• 2:19Garrett Moreland?

  But I do it because I love you guys.

• 2:20Payton Moreland?

  He's a full blown hater. He still hates true crime and genuinely does not enjoy listening to these cases.

• 2:26Garrett Moreland?

  True. It is true. But I'm here. I'm ready to get into this case. I've just been watching March Madness. Pete and I were in California for a few days. We're back in Utah, hanging out. That's... We got anything else? Or is that about it for us?

• 2:45Payton Moreland?

  Well, we drove.

• 2:47Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, my gosh. We left at 3...

• 2:51Garrett Moreland?

  Can someone explain to me why there's not a high-speed train from California to Utah, Colorado, so on and so forth, Vegas? I don't know. I just, I find it insane because other countries have great transportation and we're just like, nah, we don't need that. I'm complaining because we woke up at 3:30 to drive back from California to Utah. And the reason we woke up so early is because we wanted to skip all the traffic and it was a, it was a journey, huh?

• 3:20Payton Moreland?

  I'm honestly not quite sure how we're alive right now.

• 3:23Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I'm pretty tired, but

• 3:27Garrett Moreland?

  ain't no rest for the wicked. Money doesn't grow on trees. I got bills to pay. I got mouths to feed. Ain't nothing in this world for free. Name that song. On that note, let's get into this case.

• 3:39Payton Moreland?

  Our sources for this episode are forward.com, CNN.com, thedp.com, patch.com, maybe cnews go.com, NBCLosAngeles.com, sixabc.com, yahoo.com, blazebernstein.org, and CBSnews.com. You guys, hate is a very dangerous weapon, but it doesn't come from nowhere, right? Oftentimes on this show, we see hate stem from things like jealousy, resentment, abuse, money, revenge. But sometimes hate is planted like a seed by other people. Grown and watered with things like indoctrination, brainwashing, being told that your way of life is superior to all the rest.

• 4:23Payton Moreland?

  And anyone who doesn't think like you, look like you, or act like you is not worthy of a happy life, or in extreme cases, a life at all. And that might be the most dangerous kind of hate that there is, because it's one that lurks in the shadows. It doesn't necessarily come from someone close to you, or even sometimes someone you know. And it will strike at the first opportunity, all as a way to make some sort of proclamation, some sort of statement. But as you'll learn in today's case, hate never wins in the end. What do you think about my little intro things like that? Like?

• 5:04Garrett Moreland?

  I love your intro things. Yeah, I like them all. I sit there, I listen, I take it all in, and then I try to figure out what the case is gonna be about.

• 5:11Payton Moreland?

  See, sometimes I feel like you're not taking it in because you'll be like, wait, I'm interested to see if she lives. And in the beginning, I would have said if the person-

• 5:20Garrett Moreland?

  I guess it depends. Sometimes I take it in, sometimes I don't. You know what I'm saying?

• 5:25Payton Moreland?

  Yeah. Well, you know, I'm trying to do like a hook so people are ready for what today's case is gonna be about.

• 5:30Garrett Moreland?

  No, I like it. You're doing great, babe.

• 5:32Payton Moreland?

  I almost just called the listeners chat. I've been streaming on Twitch too much.

• 5:37Garrett Moreland?

  There definitely are listeners.

• 5:38Payton Moreland?

  Listeners, let me know what you think about my hooks, okay? So let's head over to-

• 5:44Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, I did see that someone that they don't like the hooks when it spoils the cases.

• 5:49Payton Moreland?

  Okay.

• 5:50Garrett Moreland?

  Which I guess can make sense.

• 5:51Payton Moreland?

  That's why I said sometimes I feel like you don't listen, because there will be times where I'll say whether they live or die.

• 5:57Garrett Moreland?

  I think I like the hooks when I don't, when it makes a story like even more mysterious, or case. You know what I'm saying?

• 6:04Payton Moreland?

  Okay, yeah.

• 6:05Garrett Moreland?

  Not that I'm criticizing or anything, I'm just saying.

• 6:08Payton Moreland?

  I, there's criticism and then there's just plain rude. That's not plain rude. That's just criticism.

• 6:13Garrett Moreland?

  And then there's hate, like Peyton's talking about, and hate never wins in the end.

• 6:17Payton Moreland?

  Hate never wins. He's a jerk.

• 6:21Payton Moreland?

  That was a good sentence, I felt like.

• 6:23Garrett Moreland?

  It was, it was a good baby.

• 6:24Payton Moreland?

  Okay, we're starting the case. We're starting the hate never wins case. So let's head over to Orange County, California. Where Blaze Bernstein was born on April 27th, 1998.

• 6:40Garrett Moreland?

  No way, his name is Blaze.

• 6:41Payton Moreland?

  His name is Blaze Bernstein.

• 6:44Garrett Moreland?

  I'm sorry, I promise I were not these people usually, but I have to interrupt. You know what it reminds me of?

• 6:50Payton Moreland?

  What?

• 6:50Garrett Moreland?

  Have you seen Dodgeball?

• 6:52Payton Moreland?

  No.

• 6:52Garrett Moreland?

  Taser, laser, blazer. I mean, they don't say blazer, but anyways, if you watch Dodgeball, you'll get the reference. If you haven't seen it, then ignore me. We're gonna keep going.

• 7:02Payton Moreland?

  So Blaze comes from what sounds like a truly loving family. Okay, he's born in 1998. He has two other siblings. His mom, Jean, is a former lawyer and his father, Gideon, is a partner at a financial consulting firm. And they really do seem like these nurturing, supportive parents. Because they embraced the fact that Blaze was a bit of a quirky kid. He was a little unique and different growing up in the early 2000s. Plus, he had a lot of interests and they wanted to give him the opportunity to explore all of them. Writing, cooking, participating at his local synagogue.

• 7:46Payton Moreland?

  Blaze did it all. And he was the kind of person who always took others into consideration. He was warm, thoughtful, respectful of everyone. The kind of kid you would instantly connect with, fall in love with. Even in 2016, when he made the trip east from California to attend the Ivy League School, the University of Pennsylvania. Blaze is actually, I was born two years before him, so we're kind of on the same timeline a little bit here. So he's in Ivy League, which I wasn't. So there Blaze chose to become a pre-med student with dreams of one day becoming a doctor. In the meantime, he found a place where his love for writing and food could intersect

• 8:31Payton Moreland?

  as he became a copy editor for the campus's food-driven magazine, Pen Appetit.

• 8:39Garrett Moreland?

  Kind of, that's kind of smart.

• 8:40Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, and freshman into sophomore year, Blaze was really finding his stride. He embraced his sexuality. He was a gay Jewish man on campus and he started to really find his circles. He was also finding his voice, using writing as a platform to support the issues he believed in most. But Blaze never lost sight of his roots. Every school break, he made his way west to his family home in Orange County, California, to unwind and reconnect. See old friends, stop by the local synagogue, celebrate holidays and old traditions, which

• 9:18Payton Moreland?

  was exactly what the 19-year-old Blaze was doing in the winter of 2017. So it's winter break and like every year, Blaze celebrated Hanukkah with his family while he, the budding chef, took to the kitchen to prepare them a lavish feast. As winter breaks sped by, the holidays turned into New Year's Eve, and before Blaze knew it, it was now January of 2018. But he still had another week or two before he was to be summoned back to campus for his next semester. So Blaze made the most of it, seeing friends, any opportunity he got.

• 9:59Payton Moreland?

  But on the night of January 2nd, 2018, Blaze didn't seem to tell his parents what he was getting into. After all, he was a college student now. Any constrictions he may have had in high school were probably no longer on the table. All they assumed was that Blaze had left the house sometime later that evening to go meet up with a friend. But the following morning, Blaze was scheduled for a dentist appointment. His mother Jean was actually planning to meet him there. But when she got to the waiting room and realized Blaze was a no-show, she sensed that something was wrong. It was completely unlike Blaze to miss a responsibility like that.

• 10:42Payton Moreland?

  And now that he wasn't answering his cellphone either, it sent a chill down his mother's spine. So she rushed home, raced right to Blaze's bedroom, and that's when it was undeniable to her that something was really wrong here. Blaze's retainer, wallet, keys, and glasses were all still in his bedroom, as were his bags that he had brought home from college, which told Jean that Blaze wasn't planning to stay out overnight from the night before. Doesn't matter who he was with. But not only was Blaze not answering his phone, his Find My Friends app, meaning his location services of his phone,

• 11:25Payton Moreland?

  were no longer being shared with anyone. His location had been turned off. So that's when Blaze's parents began calling every friend they could think of to try and find their son. But not a single one of his friends seemed to know where Blaze was or what he had done the night before. So next thing his parents do is call Verizon just to see if they can tell them where Blaze made any recent phone calls using his phone number. Only they confirm that Blaze hadn't made any phone calls since they had last seen him. And when they check Blaze's laptop, they don't find any text messages or Facebook messages that seem alarming either.

• 12:06Payton Moreland?

  So not only is there no sign of where 19-year-old Blaze went, it's also unclear who he met up with the night before, which means the next stop is to the Orange County Sheriff's Department. Now Blaze's mom says, at first, the Orange County Sheriff's Department did not seem too alarmed by Blaze's disappearance. They actually tell her that 100% of the time that kids his age go missing, they are actually out on a quote booty call. So while I do.

• 12:41Garrett Moreland?

  Hundred percent is a.

• 12:43Payton Moreland?

  That's a crazy.

• 12:43Garrett Moreland?

  A broad statement there.

• 12:45Payton Moreland?

  Maybe we could have just went to 99. You know what I mean? Like, so while they do get a missing persons report filed, it doesn't seem like there's this huge urgency for the police to begin an investigation that day. So the Bernstein's sort of feel like they're on their own for right now, which is when Gene and Gideon, his parents, get their 14-year-old daughter Bo to help them with another angle. Because we all know any 14-year-old kid excels at social media, especially in 2018. And that's when she tells him, look, we should probably check Blaze's Snapchat account.

• 13:28Payton Moreland?

  Now, the Bernstein's get lucky because Blaze's username and password are saved in his iCloud keychain on his laptop. So they don't actually have to try to get in or guess anything.

• 13:40Garrett Moreland?

  But they would have to know his like password on his computer, which I'm guessing they did.

• 13:44Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, or he just didn't have one on his computer. So they're able to log into his Snapchat and they see that Blaze sent his address to someone the night before he went missing. Now, they don't know who the user is, but they send the user a DM saying, hey, can you call us? And then they just sort of pray that this person responds. And shockingly, they do. A short while later, they get a call from another kid in the area. Someone Blaze had gone to high school with, a kid that they'd never heard of, named Samuel Woodward. Now, they ask Sam, did you see Blaze last night? Like, obviously, you found our DM and called us.

• 14:25Payton Moreland?

  And they tell him like, he hasn't come home. We're looking for any help we can get. We just want to locate him. And Sam actually seems pretty cooperative with the family. He tells Gideon that he and Blaze actually did see each other last night, that it was super spur of the moment. They both were in town and decided that they hadn't seen each other in a while and they should get together and catch up. Sam says, so when we decided to hang out, I drove over to Blaze's house and picked him up around 11:00 PM. But Blaze then asked Sam to drive him to a place called Borrego Park that's nearby, so they could meet up with another one of his friends too. So, quick synopsis.

• 15:07Payton Moreland?

  According to Sam, Blaze Snapchats him, gives him his address. Sam goes and picks him up. And then when he picks him up and they're driving, he says, actually, can we go to this park and meet up with another one of my friends? And Sam said he did what he asked of him. Now, I do just want to clarify here, we are in a very typically safe area of Orange County.

• 15:29Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I was looking up where that park is and if it's where I think it is. Orange County is like a bubble, right? It's usually a very safe place depending on where you're at in Orange County.

• 15:39Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I'm curious. I'm curious what happened.

• 15:41Speaker 04

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• 17:12Payton Moreland?

  So he and Blaze went to the park, according to Sam. They both got out of the car. Sam asked him, yeah, who are we meeting? And Blaze said, oh, you'll see soon. Then Sam claimed he went over to the public restroom in the park. But when he came back, Blaze was nowhere to be found. Sounds like. Did he wander off? So he strolled around the park for a bit, calling out for Blaze. He didn't see or hear anything. So Sam just gets back in his car and he's like, what do I do? So he heads home and he doesn't see Blaze again after that.

• 17:50Payton Moreland?

  Now, there's a few other messages that they found between Blaze and Sam that actually seemed to corroborate this version of events. Because Sam sent Blaze a few Snapchats afterward that night, asking, hey, where did you go? I can't find you. What's going on? And before Sam hangs up on the phone with Blaze's dad, Gideon, he says, quote, "I'm sorry. I want to find Blaze as much as you do." So he seems like he can be trusted, but here's where things get strange. When Blaze's parents start calling around to Blaze's friends, asking, hey, yeah, he was last seen with Sam Woodward. Do you know this guy? Did like, was Blaze in him friends?

• 18:34Payton Moreland?

  Well, his friends start saying, uh, this isn't a very good sign. Blaze's friends tell his parents, Sam Woodward is actually kind of a dangerous individual.

• 18:48Garrett Moreland?

  Interesting. Okay.

• 18:49Payton Moreland?

  So a little bit about 20-year-old Sam. He went to Orange County School of the Arts for high school alongside Blaze. And a lot of the kids there said he was a bit quiet, withdrawn. He was definitely an introvert. That he didn't really have any one group of kids that he hung out with. Basically, he was the polar opposite of Blaze at school, who was very social, popular and outgoing. Maybe the only thing the two had in common was the fact that they both grew up in households where religion was a pretty big part of their lives. For Blaze, it was Judaism, but for Sam Woodward, it was strict Catholicism. Like so, if I said that wrong, I'm gonna get torn.

• 19:33Payton Moreland?

  Like so strict that Sam's mother wouldn't allow them to read Harry Potter because it supported the idea that witchcraft and dark forces were something fun and entertaining. There's also some sources that say Sam Woodward showed signs of being neurodivergent from as early as preschool, but he was finally diagnosed with autism at age 18. Here's the thing, though. Sam's parents pulled him out of Orange County School of the Arts his junior year because get this, Sam had gotten in trouble multiple times for being homophobic towards the gay students there, which seemed to be a bit of an open secret

• 20:19Payton Moreland?

  at the school.

• 20:19Garrett Moreland?

  Wow.

• 20:20Payton Moreland?

  Because when a lot of kids heard that Sam and Blaze connected on social media, this little detail rang in the back of their heads. They're like, well, Sam's a known homophobic. As did all the other times Sam was caught drawing guns in his notebook during class.

• 20:37Garrett Moreland?

  All right.

• 20:38Payton Moreland?

  Found himself saying something racist, sexist, homophobic. I mean, all of the above.

• 20:42Garrett Moreland?

  Did we start drawing guns in our class?

• 20:44Payton Moreland?

  So Blaze's parents are learning all of this, right? Like, they talk to Sam, he seems nice. And then they start talking to more of Blaze's friends, saying he was last seen with Sam. And these people are like, red flag, red flag, red flag. This is weird. Sam is not a very good person.

• 21:03Garrett Moreland?

  I wonder if Blaze knew that Sam was like known as a homophobe.

• 21:06Payton Moreland?

  Well, that's just what his parents are thinking. Like, what would a kid like Sam want, like be wanting to hang out with Blaze for? To a lot of Blaze's friends, there were only two viable options. Either Sam was always closeted.

• 21:21Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 21:21Payton Moreland?

  And he had come out to Blaze and maybe wanted to meet up with him because of that. Or Sam had much more nefarious intentions with Blaze Bernstein that night. Now luckily, Blaze's parents had the foresight to record the conversation that they had with Sam on the phone that afternoon, which is so smart, because this is the last person he snapchatted. It's just smart of them to record that, just in case there were critical details they missed. And so they share that conversation with the police and then also all the background they had learned about Sam from Blaze's friends. And the police decide to bring Sam Woodward

• 21:59Payton Moreland?

  in for questioning on January 4th. So this would be two days after Blaze apparently went missing while hanging out with Sam. But there, Sam gives the police the exact same story he told Blaze's parents that he picked Blaze up. He asked to go to the park. Sam drove him there and then couldn't find him. They got separated. And police have to sort of take Sam at his word at this point. While he may have had some radical opinions about race, sexuality and gender in the past, not something you can really arrest someone for. So Sam is sent home that night without any charges. And the following day, the search for Blaze Bernstein actually begins in earnest.

• 22:41Payton Moreland?

  Now by now, news of Blaze's disappearance had kind of spread all over Southern California as people came out in droves to try and find the missing 19-year-old. There were hundreds of tips called into the Orange County Sheriff's Department within the first few days of the investigation. And meanwhile, police were still keeping a close eye on Sam, tracking his movements to see if there was anything suspicious, anything that might give him away. And at the same time, police looked into Blaze's cellphone data to see if they could zero in on his final location. Sure enough, it seemed Blaze, or at least his cellphone, had never made it out of Borrego Park that night.

• 23:24Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 23:24Payton Moreland?

  And on the night of January 9th, seven days after Blaze was last seen, police did another search of the area. And that evening, it was pouring rain, which happened to be the exact thing police needed. Because it helped them spot a body, one that had been covered in dirt and tree branches before, but had since revealed itself with the downpour.

• 23:51Garrett Moreland?

  I don't know, burying a body in a, like, in a public park, like, it's not going to be found.

• 23:56Payton Moreland?

  Especially the park you said you last saw him at.

• 23:59Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 24:00Payton Moreland?

  Obviously, this body is later identified as the missing 19-year-old Blaze Bernstein, confirmed even further when police found his smashed cellphone less than a foot away from his body. Now, when Blaze's autopsy is performed, it reveals just how terrible the crime committed against him was. Because Blaze had been stabbed 19 times-

• 24:27Garrett Moreland?

  Holy crap.

• 24:28Payton Moreland?

  -in his neck. But investigators know he fought back. He had defensive wounds all over his hands, which means this is not a missing persons case. This isn't even looking like a homicide. With everything police know, it appears to be a vicious hate crime.

• 24:45Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 24:46Payton Moreland?

  And the only suspect police have is Sam Woodward.

• 24:49Garrett Moreland?

  Nineteen times.

• 24:50Payton Moreland?

  In the neck. So on January 12th, as Sam is pulling out of his driveway of his parents Newport Beach home, police pull him over and arrest him on suspicion of murder.

• 25:01Garrett Moreland?

  I just have to say something, and I know a lot of you are gonna disagree with this and even Peyton probably disagrees with this. I'm just a little more extreme than she is. She's probably scared of what I'm gonna say right now. But dude, just stabbing someone 19 times, I feel like you should be stabbed 19 times back. You know what I'm saying?

• 25:20Garrett Moreland?

  Eye for an eye. Anyways, on that note, let's keep going.

• 25:23Payton Moreland?

  So they pull him over in front of his Newport Beach home and they arrest him and they impound Sam's car as evidence. And inside of it, they find blood, blood that belongs to both Sam Woodward and Blaze Bernstein. But they also find a heck of a lot more evidence inside Sam Woodward's parents' home.

• 25:47Garrett Moreland?

  I heard you say pants.

• 25:49Payton Moreland?

  Not only do they find the murder weapon, a folding knife that still has Blaze's blood on the blade. They also find a mask that's covered in blood, not just any mask though. This was a Adam Waffen mask, which is a far-right extremist neo-Nazi terrorist organization. One that primarily recruits people online and specifically targets members of the LGBTQIA+ community and Jewish people, which makes Blaze Bernstein a prime target. Police also discover what they call a hate diary in Sam's bedroom

• 26:33Payton Moreland?

  with entries that read things like, quote, "Text is boring. Murder isn't." Next to hand-drawn images of knives and skulls.

• 26:43Garrett Moreland?

  What is wrong with people? I don't want to use the word.

• 26:48Payton Moreland?

  It is embarrassing.

• 26:49Garrett Moreland?

  It's like.

• 26:50Payton Moreland?

  It's embarrassing and it's gross.

• 26:53Payton Moreland?

  It's awful.

• 26:54Garrett Moreland?

  Get a life or don't get a life and.

• 26:57Payton Moreland?

  He did. This is his life.

• 26:58Garrett Moreland?

  Die.

• 26:59Payton Moreland?

  Hating people.

• 27:00Garrett Moreland?

  I'm just like, what?

• 27:01Payton Moreland?

  But apparently Sam's involvement with the Atom Waffen wasn't confined to his bedroom. He had even made a trip to Colorado in the past to meet with a neo-Nazi leader. And then another trip to Texas where he attended an Atom Waffen retreat. It was literally called a hate camp.

• 27:21Garrett Moreland?

  Are these not like on the radars of like FBI? I mean, I thought I want to go down a rabbit hole, but you know what I'm saying?

• 27:29Payton Moreland?

  Okay, but get what they learn at this hate camp. Members of this group would go to this hate camp and get specialized training on how to commit a hate crime. How to become a violent extremist, basically how to become a violent member of this group. It's terrifying to think that this exists in our world.

• 27:50Garrett Moreland?

  Dude, that's so wild.

• 27:52Payton Moreland?

  I, to me, it's just like you attend this group. Bye. Like that has to be illegal, is it not?

• 28:01Garrett Moreland?

  Um, I don't think you're committing any crimes, so probably not, right? What crime are you?

• 28:05Payton Moreland?

  I guess freedom of speech, right?

• 28:07Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I mean, you're not committing any crime. I mean, I'm not going to say it's the same thing, but I mean, you have like cults, stuff like that.

• 28:14Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 28:14Garrett Moreland?

  I mean.

• 28:14Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 28:15Garrett Moreland?

  It's, they're not doing anything illegal. So, but I mean, I get it. Yeah.

• 28:19Payton Moreland?

  I get it.

• 28:20Garrett Moreland?

  It feels like it should be.

• 28:21Payton Moreland?

  Right, right. I get it. I get it. So apparently Sam was so involved in this group. He was even the one designing the admissions test at one point for these guys. So this isn't just like a morbid curiosity. There is evidence that Sam was actively involved in this terrorist group.

• 28:36Garrett Moreland?

  Sorry, I guess to go back for a second, I guess it could be illegal if it was like conspiracy to commit X, X and X.

• 28:42Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 28:42Garrett Moreland?

  Right?

• 28:43Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, like you're known to do this.

• 28:45Garrett Moreland?

  Like, you know, like terrorism, like conspiracy to commit.

• 28:48Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, I guess they don't have to do the act first. So it appears that this started back as early as middle school when Sam first took an interest in World War II Nazi history. And as he approached his teenage years, Sam began seeking out neo fascist and neo Nazi groups online and quickly became radicalized.

• 29:09Garrett Moreland?

  And I can't believe that exists.

• 29:11Payton Moreland?

  Well, I know if you're a fan of true crime, you also probably became heavily involved in World War II history on the spectrum of thinking that the Nazis were absolutely horrific and what they did to Jewish people and minority groups was horrific. And to think that Sam also became heavily involved in World War II history, but was idolizing the Nazis.

• 29:36Garrett Moreland?

  That Blaze was Jewish as well. So duh, all this is making 100% sense.

• 29:42Payton Moreland?

  Um, which is a whole other scary thing to think that teenage children could be seeking these hate groups out on the internet and are getting indoctrinated without parents even being aware, because that's what he did. He became fascinated with the Nazis and then got online and searched to see if there were any other people out there who were fans of this behavior. So what police come to discover was Blaze Bernstein was being targeted by Sam months before they actually met up in December.

• 30:11Garrett Moreland?

  See that, I mean, I'm pretty sure that's illegal.

• 30:14Payton Moreland?

  In fact, Sam had created a Tinder account the prior summer, so 2017, probably looking for the perfect target to prove his loyalty. And that's when he came across a profile he recognized Blaze from high school and he began planting the seed. The two began talking over the following months. Blaze confided in Sam about his GPA dropping and the idea of taking a semester off. A flirtation even started between the two Blaze telling Sam that he's attracted to him and Sam seemingly returned the sentiment in these messages. When Blaze's friends were asked why he might have even entertained a connection with Sam,

• 30:55Payton Moreland?

  they said Blaze might have been intrigued by the idea of a once very conservative classmate finally coming out of his shell and just accepting his sexuality that he was probably, you know, against gay people because he was actually gay.

• 31:12Payton Moreland?

  And so there was something about

• 31:14Garrett Moreland?

  Like some projection, basically.

• 31:15Payton Moreland?

  Yeah. And so there was something for Blaze about, you know, finally helping someone accept this. Chances were Blaze being the kind and thoughtful person he was, he saw an opportunity to support someone who needed a confidant and he chose to play that role for Sam. But I guess their conversation sort of fizzled out over the following months. That was until the two matched again in January of 2018. It was actually that night. That's when Blaze decided to give Sam his address and see where the conversation went in person. So finally meet up. Of course, he had no idea that Sam had become this radicalized member of a terrorist organization and that he was literally walking into a lion's den.

• 31:58Payton Moreland?

  So the police felt pretty confident that Sam acted on his own here, at least when it came to the actual murder. But when they go through his computer and the forms that he visited after committing the murder, it does seem like he told other members of his community about the murder and was praised

• 32:17Garrett Moreland?

  Wow.

• 32:18Payton Moreland?

  for it, which is why seven months after Sam's arrest, prosecutors actually upgrade his charges from murder in the first degree to murder in the first degree with a hate crime. The difference is actually the possibility of parole. If Sam was found guilty of a hate crime,

• 32:35Garrett Moreland?

  No parole.

• 32:36Payton Moreland?

  it would take that possibility off the table, which would mean Sam would die behind bars. Now, of course, Sam Woodward pleaded not guilty to all of his charges.

• 32:45Garrett Moreland?

  It surprises me that, sorry, sorry to interrupt you. It surprises me that he pleaded not guilty. He think, you would think his, um, I guess his defense probably is that, no, he did it, wink, wink. But you would think his defense would be like, take the plea deal, plead a first degree without the hate crime, because then he might be able to get on parole. Yeah.

• 33:03Payton Moreland?

  Yeah. Well, I don't think Sam believes he did anything wrong. I don't think he thinks he is guilty.

• 33:08Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, probably not.

• 33:09Payton Moreland?

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• 34:13Garrett Moreland?

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• 34:24Payton Moreland?

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• 36:11Payton Moreland?

  That is six years of the family's life that they just have to sit and wait and see.

• 36:16Garrett Moreland?

  Gosh, that's horrible.

• 36:17Payton Moreland?

  If there will be justice.

• 36:19Garrett Moreland?

  Make me a judge. I'll go through these cases really fast.

• 36:22Payton Moreland?

  That's also six years of stress, lawyer fees, time, sleepless nights, wondering if the person who murdered your son is gonna stay behind bars. That's way too long, in my opinion, for anyone to wait for justice, especially because the stakes are really high in this case. In a way, it's not just about getting justice for Blaze. It's also getting justice for hate crime, which when someone is a target of hate crime, it feels like an attack on that entire community, the community that was targeted. And finally, just standing up and facing evil and hatred as a whole. And when Sam Woodward walked through the doors into that courtroom that day, he really did look like the embodiment of evil.

• 37:07Payton Moreland?

  His matted hair was dangling in his face. He was a spitting image of Charles Manson. But for the members of the jury, the question wasn't going to be a matter of, did Sam kill Blaze Bernstein? It's gonna be, is this a hate crime? And the defense was armed and ready with their own version of events, mainly surrounding Sam's own struggles with his sexuality. So this is the defense that they come with. They paint-

• 37:37Garrett Moreland?

  This is gonna be so embarrassing. I already know where this is going.

• 37:40Payton Moreland?

  So they paint this picture. Sam Woodward was someone who had been battling autism, specifically a form of it called Asperger's Syndrome, and obsessive compulsive disorder for much of his life. This played into his inability to maintain personal relationships and basically build trust, which also caused problems when Sam began questioning his sexual identity. Of course, they said it didn't help that Sam had been brought up in a very politically conservative and strictly religious Catholic household, one that spoke openly against the acceptance of homosexuality. So the defense claimed the events of that fateful night played out like this. Sam had connected with Blaze out of sexual interest. It was real.

• 38:20Payton Moreland?

  He picked Blaze up that night, went to the park, smoked a joint on a bench, and then Sam blacked out. This is the defense. He wakes up, his pants were unbuckled. He claimed Blaze was groping him and taking a video of him.

• 38:34Garrett Moreland?

  Not only is Blaze dead, but now they're trying to pin it on him?

• 38:39Payton Moreland?

  Sam at court says Blaze not only took the video, but was planning to out him, basically to everyone. And so Sam snapped. He claimed that in the moment, all he could think about was how his parents would react if they knew that he had done this. So he grabbed a knife and began stabbing Blaze. Blah, blah, blah. This is the defense. And actually, the murder weapon, that knife that he brought with him, was actually from his Boy Scout years. Was from his years in the Boy Scout, he got that knife and then stabbed someone. I have so many problems, obviously, with this version of events. Not only does it contradict all of the evidence, the hate diary, the terrorist ties, everything he did afterward.

• 39:21Payton Moreland?

  It's the fact that there is actually no evidence that this photo or video existed on Blaze's phone.

• 39:27Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, I guess, I guess they could claim that it was like, film on Snapchat.

• 39:31Payton Moreland?

  Yeah, I guess.

• 39:32Garrett Moreland?

  And then you press the X and there's nothing. That'd be the only way you could claim it. If not, you can see deleted videos.

• 39:38Payton Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 39:38Garrett Moreland?

  Deleted photos.

• 39:39Payton Moreland?

  But I think as Blaze's family, there would be nothing more disgusting and hurtful than to go in court and try to seek justice for your son who was killed because of a hate crime for being nothing than who he was. And then to hear the defense paint your son as the perpetrator, your son as the bad person, your son, who was sexually assaulting and videoing someone and threatening to out them. I, that would be insanely hurtful to hear as a family.

• 40:14Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, I have so many issues with this. I know there's a lot of, we have a couple, um, I feel like we have a couple of defense attorneys that listen to this. Um, people in law school, people that have, have their law degrees in general. And the reason I have a problem with this is because the defense team is defending him, right?

• 40:34Payton Moreland?

  Yes.

• 40:35Garrett Moreland?

  They know he did it. Like, don't get me wrong. Don't, don't even try to come at me my DMs right now and be like, no, they have no idea. No, we all know he did it. The evidence is obvious. They know they're just trying to get him out of the hate crime, right? So then it just sucks as like, I guess it's just part of the game, but it sucks as like, the defense team knows that it was probably a hate crime. They're just trying to get around it, but they're still willing to drag Blaze's name through the mud and do this to the family. And so it's just like, you're.

• 41:05Payton Moreland?

  How do you go home and sleep at night?

• 41:06Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah, moral, moral wise, like, how do you go home and you're like, yeah, it's fine. It's just because I was defending my client and I was trying to give them a, um, right to a speedy and fair trial, you know?

• 41:21Payton Moreland?

  They're obligated to give them the best defense possible.

• 41:24Garrett Moreland?

  No, a hundred percent. And it's just, it's just frustrating though, because it's just.

• 41:28Payton Moreland?

  Revictimizing people.

• 41:29Garrett Moreland?

  It's morally, morally, it seems extremely wrong. I get the game. I understand it. I understand it. Um, I don't know. Maybe defense attorneys are just different breed and they just, they just don't care.

• 41:42Payton Moreland?

  Or they just look at it as a job.

• 41:44Garrett Moreland?

  Or they just look at it as a job, but. It's, I just think it's pretty messed up. Like, I just think it's pretty messed up, but that's, that's just my two cents on that. And we'll, we'll go back into the case.

• 41:55Payton Moreland?

  Okay, so what I do want to talk about, there's actually another part to this case that comes out at trial.

• 42:02Garrett Moreland?

  Okay.

• 42:02Payton Moreland?

  Police searched all of Sam's media, phone, computer. They find a good deal of gay porn sites on Sam's computer.

• 42:13Garrett Moreland?

  Interesting, so maybe he really was closeted.

• 42:15Payton Moreland?

  As well as these neo-Nazi forums, you know what I mean? He was heavily involved in, in both. And they also find witnesses that say, oh, um, Sam actually has been hiding his sexuality or trying to repress it. In high school, Sam would not talk to this kid, but then at night would send him nude photos of himself. So he like would avoid him and not talk to him at school, but then at night over the phone would send naked photos. There was another connection they found on Sam's Tinder where he was sending naked pictures to other boys. Maybe you could argue this was just a way for him to lure victims that he hated so much. That really wouldn't be necessary.

• 42:57Payton Moreland?

  This to me reads more like Sam really was struggling with his sexuality. He felt like he wasn't allowed to embrace it and still be accepted by his parents. So instead he took his frustrations out on someone who was openly gay and accepted by his parents. In a way, Blaze was living the life Sam seemed to want, and that was unacceptable for him. Which still makes this murder against Blaze an undeniable hate crime. He was doing it.

• 43:24Garrett Moreland?

  It's still a hate crime because you're doing it because the other person is gay.

• 43:29Payton Moreland?

  But is there a lot of projection going on here?

• 43:32Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 43:32Payton Moreland?

  Sam hated himself so much that he would get on these forums and talk about people who were exactly like him and then ended up killing someone. You know what I mean?

• 43:41Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 43:41Payton Moreland?

  By July of 2024, Sam's trial had concluded. After six years of uncertainty, the family would finally have their resolution when the jurors returned with the verdict. We, the jury, find the defendant Samuel Woodward guilty of the crime of first degree murder.

• 44:00Payton Moreland?

  And there was another piece of paper, one that said, we, the jury, find it to be true that the defendant Samuel Woodward committed

• 44:10Garrett Moreland?

  Yep.

• 44:10Payton Moreland?

  Hate crime, first degree.

• 44:12Garrett Moreland?

  I love, I love when the jury gets things right. Love it.

• 44:15Payton Moreland?

  There was a packed courthouse this day, full of people who loved Blaze. And when it was read that there was a hate crime, cheers actually erupted in the courtroom. So later that year, Sam Woodward was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole.

• 44:35Garrett Moreland?

  Sheesh. Imagine, imagine just being like, I'm glad, but there is absolutely no way.

• 44:42Payton Moreland?

  You will get out.

• 44:43Garrett Moreland?

  I'm ever getting out.

• 44:44Payton Moreland?

  As for the hate group that Sam was a part of, that online presence has pretty much dissolved entirely today. This group doesn't really exist, but this threat absolutely still exists. As there are other factions and hate groups that try to recruit vulnerable people online every single day. Still, Blaze's case has brought this world one step closer to snuffing out that sort of hate. In a statement to the court, his mother Jean said this. To lose my firstborn child, my dream for the future, my partner in fun, is the single worst thing that has ever happened to me.

• 45:26Payton Moreland?

  He accomplished more than most people do in a full life. And for that, we are grateful. Blaze, we did the best we could for you. We figured out who did this. We brought him to justice and we have worked to make this world better. Which is why Blaze's case is proof that love will always win in the end. And that is the case of Blaze Bernstein.

• 45:52Garrett Moreland?

  We talk about it so much, just, um, I mean, just killing people for no reason. Like, there's no reason. Like, I mean, yeah, I guess.

• 45:58Payton Moreland?

  Hate.

• 45:59Garrett Moreland?

  I guess the person who commits the act of killing someone might think they have a reason. At the end of the day, there's never a reason to kill somebody.

• 46:08Garrett Moreland?

  I don't know. Horrible. So sad.

• 46:12Garrett Moreland?

  Crazy because I know all the areas where where this happened. I had no idea this case was even out there.

• 46:19Payton Moreland?

  I think, you know, sometimes it can feel like, oh, well, it's just hate on this minority group. But technically, every single school shooter falls into this category.

• 46:30Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 46:30Payton Moreland?

  Of killing for hatred, killing for hatred, killing innocent, random people who ever happens to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. And it's just like.

• 46:41Garrett Moreland?

  Bro, can we just stop killing people? So sad. Like, it's so sad to just take somebody's life.

• 46:53Garrett Moreland?

  Like willingly just take somebody's life.

• 46:55Payton Moreland?

  And I also just think the fact that like.

• 46:56Garrett Moreland?

  It's so messed up.

• 46:57Payton Moreland?

  Blaze was completely lured in thinking this was going to be.

• 47:02Garrett Moreland?

  Oh, yeah, that part I just can't even.

• 47:03Payton Moreland?

  You know what I mean?

• 47:04Garrett Moreland?

  Cause it just gets me.

• 47:06Payton Moreland?

  You've done nothing.

• 47:08Garrett Moreland?

  This is why, I'm sorry, this is why I hate it. I just like infuriates.

• 47:13Payton Moreland?

  No, you know, I.

• 47:14Garrett Moreland?

  That's why I was like, sorry, Sam, we're stabbing you 19 times. Like, I'm just like, no. Like, I'm just, I'm not okay with this.

• 47:21Payton Moreland?

  You know, there have been times like during the podcast where I have struggled like immensely with the fact that there's just like so much ugly in this world.

• 47:31Garrett Moreland?

  Yeah.

• 47:32Payton Moreland?

  So much ugly. But and that is a really easy place to live in because it's true. It is the reality. But when we get to that point, I think it's important to remember that you, you individually, you listen to this, me sitting here, Garrett sitting here, we can be beautiful. We can be good and it will spread. If you are light and you are good, it will spread. And that's all we can do, really.

• 48:02Garrett Moreland?

  And I mean, to be honest, and majority of people are good. Majority, majority of people aren't killers. Majority of people have good morals and are looking to do good things for other people and treat others nicely. Obviously, the cases we do are the anomaly when it comes to that. It's hard because sometimes it makes it feel like, geez, there's just so many bad people out there. And there are, but. I personally would dare to say majority of people are good. They want the best for other people. And yeah.

• 48:33Payton Moreland?

  Yeah. All right, you guys, we love you so much. And that was our case for this week. We'll see you next time with another episode. I love it.

• 48:42Garrett Moreland?

  And I hate it.

• 48:43Payton Moreland?

  Goodbye.

• 48:50Speaker 05

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