E184 - Dr. Sue Morter: What Actually Causes Energetic Blocks (And How to Release Them)

Dr. Sue Morter returns to explore what it truly means to awaken — not as a concept, but as a lived, embodied experience. Beneath our protective personality and performance-driven identity lies a deeper intelligence — an electromagnetic master system that governs healing, perception, and consciousness itself. In this conversation, we explore how nervous system regulation opens the doorway to higher awareness, why triggers are invitations to reclaim lost parts of ourselves, and how building energetic circuitry transforms reactive patterns into creative power. From subtle anatomy and the Shoshumna channel to the relationship between consciousness and matter, this episode bridges science and spirituality in a grounded, practical way. Try LMNT & get a free sample pack https://drinkLMNT.com/KnowThyself Try Boncharge & 15% off their red light devices https://www.boncharge.com/knowthyself Know Thyself Community Event Waitlist: https://www.knowthyselfpodcast.com/live André's Book Recs: https://www.knowthyselfpodcast.com/book-list ___________ 00:00 Intro 5:48 The Illusion of Inherent Brokenness 11:37 The Fuel Behind Achievement 17:21 The Protective Personality 31:21 Ad: LMNT 32:46 The Return to Second Innocence 47:04 Ad: BON CHARGE 48:13 Expanding the Space Between Stimulus and Response 1:04:06 The Science of Subtle Anatomy 1:29:24 The Limits of Spiritual Language 1:43:07 Embodiment of Expanded Awareness 1:49:02 Moving From Joy Instead of Lack 1:54:16 The Transformative Power of Immersive Experience 2:15:22 Surrendering Fully Into Feeling 2:25:42 A Message to the Heart of Humanity ___________ Episode Resources: Dr. Sue Morter's book: https://nt113.isrefer.com/go/HYHYL-Book/KnowThyself/ https://www.instagram.com/drsuemorter https://www.instagram.com/andreduqum/ https://www.instagram.com/knowthyself/ https://www.youtube.com/@knowthyselfpodcast https://www.knowthyselfpodcast.com Listen to the show: Spotify: https://spoti.fi/4bZMq9l Apple: https://apple.co/4iATICX

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Speaker 00

  Everything is energy and we are all a part of that field. The universe doesn't just have my back, I'm made of it. So I'm never not with it. But what happens is you will fall into what will feel like a void. You're falling into the parts of you that you've not allowed to develop because they were set aside for all these years, which is what we're really here to do. Every single thing that has happened has been in my favor of awakening. Changed my life forever.

• 0:26André Duqum?

  Wow.

• 0:26Speaker 00

  What we have to realize is that we come into this dimension so that those frequencies that we're unfamiliar with will get stirred. We don't have to suffer to awaken. But if we suffer, it could contribute to our awakening.

• 0:38André Duqum?

  If you have 60 seconds to whisper a message into the hearts of humanity, what would you say?

• 0:44Speaker 00

  Oh my gosh. Science and spirituality have to work together to really understand the essence of who we are. Are we the body that is trying to find spirit? Or are we the spirit that is coming into a body for a darn good reason, experiencing the things that we're experiencing?

• 1:08André Duqum?

  Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the Know They Self Podcast. Oh, we have puppies in the studio today. Because returning guest Sue Mortar is here. She is an internationally bestselling author, speaker, who's supported millions of people with mind-body integration and connection.

• 1:27André Duqum?

  And she really helps people work with awakening from the level of energy. Our community loved our last conversation and I'm really looking forward to continuing the conversation today. So, Dr. Sue, thanks for coming back.

• 1:40Speaker 00

  It's great to be back.

• 1:41André Duqum?

  And you came with puppies.

• 1:42Speaker 00

  Came with puppies, right? That's better.

• 1:45André Duqum?

  These guys are ridiculous.

• 1:48Speaker 00

  So we'll probably set them aside at some point here so we can get down to the nitty gritty of life. Yes, but we are...

• 1:56André Duqum?

  So we've got Pearl and Rosie here?

• 1:57Speaker 00

  This is Rosie, right here. And this is Pearl. And so together they are trouble.

• 2:08André Duqum?

  They are adorable.

• 2:09Speaker 00

  And the beautiful delight of, you know, love and life.

• 2:14Speaker 00

  They have their nicknames, of course. Her nickname is Bobby Socks and Loafers because she has little white paws with little brown underneath. Yes, yes. She never knows when she's in trouble. She just thinks she needs to cheer up whoever's upset with her, for whatever reason.

• 2:30Speaker 00

  And her sister Pearl is, you know, just a delight. She's an amazing, amazing little, very, they're brilliant. And, you know, isn't it just what love is all about?

• 2:41André Duqum?

  We are recording this on Valentine's Day.

• 2:44Speaker 00

  Of course, it's the love day, the love dogs. Here we are.

• 2:47André Duqum?

  This is the first, this is the first, and hopefully not the last.

• 2:53Speaker 00

  Oh, beautiful.

• 2:55André Duqum?

  Okay.

• 2:55Speaker 00

  So, thank you for having us all.

• 2:56André Duqum?

  Yes. Well, on that note, I felt like we picked up really amazing momentum towards the end, especially of our last conversation. And I would love to just pick up where we left off. But not assuming everybody has tuned into that conversation. What is the essence of what you hope most of our listeners walk away today's conversation with?

• 3:17Speaker 00

  You know, we live in a world that has become so interested in changing our beliefs and getting our mind thinking more positively and kind of pushing forward in a raise your vibration, you know, get on with it and achieve and accomplish sort of modality. And what I would really love for people to recognize is that there's a significant version of self that could get left behind when we start pushing the river in such a way. And all of the principles that we know about how thoughts and beliefs create our reality are absolutely true. And what we want to make sure that we also accommodate for

• 4:00Speaker 00

  is a deep core wisdom that is trying to rise within our system all the time. And that wisdom goes beyond our thinking mind. The wisdom is a presence that has always been and will always be. And we're made of that energy that we call wisdom. And I'd love for us to, you know, just explore and get to know. How the relationship works between our deep core wisdom and our thinking mind, so that the things that we pursue in life are actually aligned with our authentic self. They're actually unfolding our true path, so that we're not pushing and striving and trying to make things happen

• 4:43Speaker 00

  in a way that ends up unfulfilling. You know, yes, we achieve, yes, we accomplish, and at the end of the day, are we fulfilled? And there is a way to ensure that that gets to happen. And so it is by regulating the nervous system that we allow that to begin. But we need to look at what dysregulates the nervous system and what happens if the nervous system is not dysregulated? What if it is functioning in a harmonious way? Then what is it that can occur in our lives, in our bodies, in our consciousness, that isn't allowed to unfold when we are overthinking and overdriving and overtrying? Even if we're trying to heal,

• 5:28Speaker 00

  or trying to love, or trying to reveal some deeper truth, the efforting alone, you know, can suppress it and keep us really in this place of lack and striving.

• 5:43André Duqum?

  Well said.

• 5:44Speaker 00

  That was a long, short answer.

• 5:45André Duqum?

  No, that was great.

• 5:48André Duqum?

  You know, there is a very common narrative, popular narrative, that your worth is inherently tied up in your performance. And we can go on this hamster wheel of never-ending self-improvement. What I love so much about your work and the energy in which you share is that it's more about a remembering and an allowing and a receiving. And it kind of takes away so much of this tension, which is comparatively driven through how we see other people are successful online. And it invites us to allow what wants to move through us instead of forcing our way to success or worth. And so when you're really challenging this notion that we are inherently broken and we're not enough inherently, and that we need fixing,

• 6:32André Duqum?

  and you're supplementing it with this new, more accurate perspective that we are already inherently whole and it's a remembering process, can you set a bit more of a stage for that framework?

• 6:44Speaker 00

  Absolutely. You know, people are looking for their problems, their blockages, the interferences that are in the way of their life that they love, of the joy that they want to experience, of the success that they would like to be, you know, a part of. What happens is, we build circuitry, we build a perceptive field, we build a reality that is based on, "I know there's a problem and I have to find it, so that I can fix it." And when we spend day after day, you know, hour after hour, moment by moment, really focused in on trying to find what my blockage is, what happens is, at the end of the day, all we're good at is looking for problems to solve. And maybe we get good at solving them,

• 7:28Speaker 00

  but the next day, we will have to have another problem to solve in order to feel accomplished, like we actually achieved, you know, what we're here to do. And that is a realm, it is a reality, a world that people can live in. And people accomplish a lot of problem fixing and they do experience a lot of success. And in a larger sphere of consciousness, in a larger universe that we might allow ourselves to live in, there is another way of looking at life. And it is that we are creators and that we don't have to use that energy just on creating a solution for a problem that we found. We can just go straight to the creation of what we would love to be experiencing.

• 8:13Speaker 00

  And as we learn how to do that, we're actually sitting back inside of ourselves more deeply. Instead of living in our heads and strategizing and thinking our way through it all, we're dropping inside, of course, and learning how to sit down in the core of our being. And as such, we have access to different vibrational frequencies, different energies that will automatically generate different kinds of awarenesses. Different kinds of thoughts will spring forth from that as well. And what happens is, we see solution without problem. We see possibility, we see through potential, simply because we're adding more to the recipe as we move forward.

• 8:58Speaker 00

  And what we're finding is that, you know, science is showing us, and this is, you know, just a law of physics, that all physical matter is compressed energy. And so...

• 9:09Speaker 00

  We are compressed energy. Our physical body is energy that is compressed. And so I got curious about, well, what's the nature of that energy that is compressed? Who is that? What is that? And if it was decompressed, what would it be? And it takes us to the quantum field. When you decompress and decompress and decompress. So if you compress and compress and compress, that field of energy of infinite possibility, you end up compressing into the physical form that is the human being. The human system is compressed energy that is compressed in varying degrees. For instance, our physical body is more compressed than our thoughts and our emotional states, our chemistries, et cetera. There's a hierarchy of those order of compressions.

• 9:53Speaker 00

  But if you continue to decompress and decompress, there's a through line that takes us all the way to the infinite. And that infinite recompressing down into this physical state has a through line that actually connects us to what we would call source. There's a direct connection. So we don't need to continue to think of ourselves as separate from that. We just need to learn how to animate and utilize the vibrational frequencies at higher and higher bandwidths that allow that reunion to occur in our consciousness, allow the unison to be true in our perceptive field and our influencing the ways that we think

• 10:38Speaker 00

  and operate and be, because it translates into, the universe doesn't just have my back, the universe comprises my back. You know, I'm made of it. So I'm never not with it. I'm always that. And it's a way of shifting our whole perception. And when we do, we start to realize the constructs that have divided us and separated us and caused us to feel lacking and caused us to overly depend on our mind to drive the bus, to find safety and stability. And all the while, we could use that mind differently, in an observing witness sort

• 11:23Speaker 00

  of way, to sense and feel what is truly trying to rise up through this system. And at some point, I can show an image that... Kind of gives a demonstration of how that all fits together when we get there.

• 11:37André Duqum?

  Amazing. Yeah.

• 11:40Speaker 02

  This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Football has a play for just about everything. You can go deep, keep it on the ground, or draw up something nobody sees coming. And whether you want to run a flea flicker or the tush push, you need a plan to fit your unique situation. That's why State Farm takes the time to get to know you, so they can help personalize coverage for your life and budget. Now that's a solid game plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

• 12:08Speaker 03

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• 12:38André Duqum?

  The notion from the perspective of the individualistic mind could use like so many different fuel sources to accomplish something in life, right? We can use anger and fear and the seeking of validation to drive us to accomplish our goals in life, which can bear amazing results like this. And it does for a lot of people. But what do you think it is that we actually fundamentally want? Because a lot of the goals that we chase, so to speak, and the things that we proclaim that we want in life, are essentially a means to an end to a certain feeling that we think those things are going to give us. And so, the perspective that I would just want to keep exploring here is that those fuel sources, while they can bear results, are not the only thing that's on offer.

• 13:24André Duqum?

  And it's not just what you do, but who you are doing, who you are being while you're doing what you're doing, and how you're, the energy you're carrying in it. And, um, and so, talk to me about the difference about that come from, and the possibility to move from that state of wholeness instead of... Luck.

• 13:41Speaker 00

  You know, who's doing the doing is everything, really. Because we all know that someone can do A, B, and C, and be a great success, and others can try to mimic that A, B, and C, and will possibly not achieve the same kind of success. Even if this individual is saying, "Do A, B, and C. I did, and look what happened for me, so do these things." But when, you know, person number two, or person number three, or person number, you know, two million and three, begins to try to do those same things, they're doing it from an intellectual standpoint. Their educated mind is deciding, is making a choice, to do those same things, to try to achieve those same things.

• 14:25Speaker 00

  Whereas, the individual initially, that was able to achieve great success in doing those things, might have been following their own true deep path. They might have been inspired and following something that was deeply internal and heartfelt, or perhaps just an impression that they knew at a cellular level was their destiny. And so they kept walking toward it. But it may have been internally driven for them. And so, when everyone else tries to do the same thing, it's externally driven for the crowd. And so, many of the crowd may accomplish the same or similar, because they had a similar destiny. But many others may feel like, "What's the deal?

• 15:08Speaker 00

  I'm doing all the do, and I'm trying all the try, and it's not happening for me, it's not working for me." And so, what I love to do is, you know, bring, just kind of unveil this whole idea that the come from is everything. You know, how are you making your decisions? From what part of you is there a signal that you are receptive to perceiving, able to perceive it, and then taking action on it? And for most people, it requires, you know, "We gotta slow down." We gotta sit down and slow down and find our deep core center. And as we learn to do that, people start to feel at home.

• 15:49Speaker 00

  They start to discover and they start to feel a version of themselves that they didn't before. They maybe didn't even know it existed. And as they do, they, they start to heal lots of things because there's an essence that's being able to be cultivated, that is a healing vibration. And that inside of that, they feel welcomed and they feel more whole and complete. And it's beautiful. And as they continue to cultivate that, their mind has determined that actually, when I sat down, I started to heal. Actually, when I slowed down, I started to heal. Actually, when I stopped a lot of the things that I was doing before, I began to heal.

• 16:29Speaker 00

  And I feel so much more connected and I feel so much more aligned and like I belong. And I can make, you know, a, a better decision in my life because I have found this different version of myself. And the issue is then, we now have a large population of people that are very good at sitting down and being present with a greater truth. And they can see, they can witness when someone else is not operating that way. They can feel the vibration when someone is not being authentic. They can discern these distinctions and it's a beautiful thing. And what I feel is needed now is that that population of people that has gotten so

• 17:13Speaker 00

  much better at sitting down and being present with self, that they learn how to stand up and to take that stillness out into the world and to bring it into the actions and the decisions and the, the leading of conversations into a different direction. And we have to build the circuitry to be able to do that. We have to stop running from this performing personality version of ourselves. Sit down and find the true, whole, essential self. And then as we discover that one, stand up. And take some action steps with that in such a way that we can bring wisdom into conversations

• 17:57Speaker 00

  and we can allow for a reorganization of how humanity is operating and what our value system is and how we make decisions and what we move forward as is a more complete version of humanity's potential. So I don't know if I'm speaking to exactly what you're asking, but steer me where you want to go with that.

• 18:21André Duqum?

  Absolutely, yeah. One thing that I think is really important to highlight there is that you get in touch with the experience of the wholeness that you are, and then you go and put it into action and you move from that place of knowing, which is kind of where the rubber meets the road, and you get to use life and the continual mirror that it is to meet with what used to be resistance, a more embracing, loving self.

• 18:48André Duqum?

  I think the contrast or paradox for a lot of people is that we do have this protective personality self that you speak to a lot, that is programmed pretty deeply from a young age. And as this whole conversation is also going to be pulling theme from your new book, Anatomy of Awakening, starting with the protective personality in that self, and then we can start to go on the journey of what essentially is waking up, and we can get into the science and breaking down the nitty gritty of what that actually means, but starting with that for people that are familiar with, you know, the programming that we're inculcated with from an early age,

• 19:30André Duqum?

  how do you lay the framework for how that becomes the formula in which a lot of adults continue to live their life from?

• 19:37Speaker 00

  So we're born into a world that is all operating in this protectivism that we're speaking of. Our parents are, you know, trying to rear their children the best way that they know how, and they're infusing the same constructs that they believe and that they were raised in and that they've experienced right into, and so of course it keeps generation after generation, you know, recreating itself. And so we evolve into a state of adulthood where we're able to look around and say, you know, This whole thing that I've been taught and that I'm living from doesn't match what I feel inside. And so it stirs and the friction that it generates is the fueling of this performing personality

• 20:21Speaker 00

  or this protective personality. It's like, there's not a match. And either that's wrong or I'm wrong. There's something that needs to change out there or something that needs to change in here. And so the individual has two choices. They either push against it and try to outrun it and beat it, or they implode and they go, they internalize these whole distinctions that cause them to feel less than or intimidated or hesitant in some way. Either way, we're not really processing life from a realistic perspective. There's a distortion in the field and we keep contributing to it. And so we continue to be operating in either a protective mode or a super performing mode.

• 21:04Speaker 00

  We either try to outrun it or we withdraw and hide and operate as though we are less than something. And neither of those things are going to lead us to our destiny. Except that, they're actually going to show us the way to find our divine destiny if we let them. So when we have a reaction to something, when we get triggered by something, when we find ourselves resisting or withdrawing, it's actually the perfect signage on the road to point you in the direction of embracing the parts of you that get pocketed off in those moments when your internal environment isn't matching your external environment. For instance, we show up with these loving beings, you know, these puppies that were here just a moment ago.

• 21:49Speaker 00

  It's like, who doesn't open their heart? Who can't be in a state of love when you see this? That's how we arrive on the planet. We are that. You know, you look into the eyes of an infant and that glow is just right there. There's an emanation and a beauty that's just pouring off of them. And then little by little, as we, you know, begin to engage and infuse ourselves into this world, we start to layer on top of that perceptive concepts and ways of using our faculties.

• 22:18Speaker 00

  That conceal us, but that that internal presence is still there. It's always going to be there. It's what we're made of. And so the truth is still there and our job is to discover it. So when we're out here operating in this, you know, in this survival based reality, we get triggered, we get upset, we get reactive. And if in that moment, we recognize, I'm having a reaction here. You know, I'm a little triggered. I can feel my heart beating. I can feel the tension. I feel my spine bow up a little bit. You know, I'm a little bit more lucid in ways that that could serve me if I knew what to do with that energy in that moment.

• 23:04Speaker 00

  It's a beautiful sign. So, so what I'm doing is having people.

• 23:10Speaker 02

  This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Football has a play for just about everything. You can go deep, keep it on the ground, or draw up something nobody sees coming. And whether you want to run a flea flicker or the tush push, you need a plan to fit your unique situation. That's why State Farm takes the time to get to know you so they can help personalize coverage for your life and budget. Now that's a solid game plan. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there.

• 23:38Speaker 03

  Visible puts the ultimate wireless hack in the palm of your hand. With unlimited 5G wireless data and hotspot designed to keep you connected. Powered by Verizon's 5G network. And no contract holding you back. Plans start at $25 a month or get the premium Visible Plus Pro Plan and save $10 on your first month when you use promo code HACK. Make the switch at visible.com. Terms apply. See visible.com for details.

• 24:08Speaker 00

  Recognize that, that in this moment, instead of asking, why do you do that? Because every time you do it, it upsets me. Or, "So what's wrong with you?" Like, "What do I have to do to get you to stop doing that?" Or, "What's wrong with me that I'm reacting to this?" Or, "What do I have to do differently?" Just ask a better question. And that is, you know, from the foundation of the work that I do is we're going to build some new circuitry to be able to be present with this situation instead of reactive to it. We're going to be able to be more merging with and collaborative with these energies. So, we ask a better question. And that is, where in my system could I build circuitry to be able to tap into aspects of my deep consciousness that's been pocketed away?

• 24:53Speaker 00

  And pull it up and out? Because if I could pull up and out all of the parts of my wholeness, I could be present with anything and not be triggered, not be reactive. I could see it for what it is and embrace, and maybe even keep my wherewithal enough to offer up a solution or to offer up another way of looking at things instead of getting emotional and reactive, et cetera. And so, what is hidden inside of me wants out in a moment of being triggered. And so, if I ask the question, "Where in my system could I open a door to allow that to contribute to my engagement at this time, my interactions at this time?" The system will automatically offer up an answer

• 25:37Speaker 00

  because that's how we're built. Body, mind, and breath are designed to operate together to allow this system to flourish and to animate and to become emergent in this world. So, we, here, somebody comes along, says something, triggers me. I ask, "Where in my system could I build the circuitry to be able to stay present at this moment?" And my mind will go to here, it'll go to here, it'll go to here, it'll go to here, it'll go to here, it'll go somewhere instantly because they're designed to operate together as a unified system. You ask the question, the question is answered instantly. We just haven't known that that's how we could operate with this system

• 26:21Speaker 00

  and have it work and become super-functional. And so... Suddenly, your mind has landed somewhere. And then, inside the work that we do to build this circuitry, people are taught how to bring all of their awareness into that area of the body that is a mirror to our consciousness. When we are animated in all levels of our consciousness, our body is responding accordingly. It is healing, it is self-illuminating, it is capable of regenerating and moving forward in an ever-renewing way, if we let it. But if we're overriding it with our, you know, shutting it down by the idea that "you shouldn't do that because it upsets me,"

• 27:05Speaker 00

  or "that should never have happened 20 years ago or 50 years ago in my life." And so, I'm now harboring this anger or this frustration based upon what has happened in my story. Now, what happens is, we say, "For just a moment, I'm gonna get underneath that whole story layer of me and free up this energy again." Because that anger can become passion. And that frustration can become an intuitive presence that allows us the fortitude to begin again, to stick with it, to not let go of this opportunity to build the circuitry. So, we can recycle those energies

• 27:48Speaker 00

  and use them to our advantage once we know how, once we learn how to do that. And so, it starts by being present with something. But it doesn't stop there. It starts by becoming present with it and then allowing that energy to take on a new role in your life. Instead of it being this pocketed-off little crevice in your consciousness, it becomes opening again. And now, that power can work in your favor instead of ultimately creating cellular breakdown because we're trying to conceal something that isn't designed to be concealed. It won't be concealed. It will create cellular breakdown, a chronic degenerative disease, a cancer, you name it. Or it will create an inability for us

• 28:31Speaker 00

  to maintain that sort of anger or resentment. And the mental capacities will begin to falter over time. Because, at the end of the day, this system is a flowing, open system. It's not a closed system. So, when we close it off by shutting down with all these judgments and all these, you know, angers that we're harboring. That energy's gotta go somewhere. So it starts breaking things down. So this system of circuit building inside of the energy codes and everything that I'm teaching is to teach people how, let's go into that reaction, because it's an energy that you don't know what to do with. That's why we call it a trigger. It spirals us into, you know, a loss of consciousness.

• 29:16Speaker 00

  We get reactive and we're living in that reactivity. But what if in that moment, you could take that energy and use it to collaborate and to build up a state of consciousness within this system that allows us to transform, not just transcend the primitive brain, not skip over it, but to transform its function and its role in our lives. Because when we do that, it gives us the power to stay the course and it gives us the strength to allow for yet another moment of circuit building and another moment of circuit building until we break free through that primitive brain function that has us stopped and cycling and recycling.

• 30:00Speaker 00

  And we open up into higher brain centers where we can be in a state of illumination and clarity. And we can see that these things that have been happening since we got here were actually trying to show us how to disassemble the patterns of our ancestors and reassemble them in a state of relevance and consciousness that is fluid with a loving flow through our systems and intention for us to grow and evolve and flourish, which is what we're really here to do, to experience the magnificence of ourselves and of life and possibility,

• 30:42Speaker 00

  instead of just live to fight another day, kind of thing. And so when we learn how to, the moment that we feel a trigger, Come into the body, notice it, honor it, and not just sit there and be with it, but to, you know, what we do is we squeeze the tissues to further accentuate the contraction that we're feeling, to let the body know that the mind is on to it, and it's not abandoning this time. It's going to stay the course together, mind and body. And then we start breathing up and down through a central channel that is part of this whole invisible anatomy that I'm referring to, which we can show an image of in a bit. But what happens is,

• 31:27Speaker 00

  we then are able to route that energy up and down the central core of our being, which is, for thousands of years, has been represented as the Shishumna. It is now represented in this toric field, flow, and energy field that we know about bioenergetics and how energy moves through the body. And at the center of that flow is where we have an integrative capacity that brings all of the levels of consciousness that we are together. It integrates them. So if you think about it like a chakra system that runs up the center of the body, you know, we can sometimes be powerful. We can sometimes be loving. We could sometimes be deeply wise.

• 32:11Speaker 00

  We could sometimes feel energetic and powerful. We could sometimes speak our truths and sometimes listen and hear something that actually changes our lives. Or we could sometimes have experiences in meditation or multidimensional, you know, versions of ourselves. But, you know, the real thing is when we can have all of that all the time, when we can have each of those aspects of self helping each other to stabilize and to ground and to integrate and to translate those beautiful experiences that many have in meditation in a way that makes a difference in their lives. Like, it turns into functional clarity in a moment where something at work isn't going well, and you can, you know,

• 32:53Speaker 00

  you can stay present instead of being reactive. And so, so the issues, here's another part of my short answer here. The issues that bother us are showing us exactly what is needed now to have more of our wholeness animated in our lives. And they're nothing more than that. They aren't trying to take us out of the game. They're trying to put us in a bigger game all the while.

• 33:21André Duqum?

  We'll get right back to the episode. A quick share. If you have been following me for a while, you know I care a lot about starting the day well. And hydration is a simple lever that makes the world of a difference on your energy, focus, and mood. Many of us are chronically dehydrated, and a good support for that is Element. Element is a zero-sugar electrolyte drink mix that contains a science-backed ratio of sodium, magnesium, and potassium that helps regulate your appetite, curb your cravings, and improve your brain function. I've been drinking Element almost every day now for years, and it genuinely helps with mental clarity and steady energy. Whether it's post-workout, sauna, during a long recording day, or just dialing in hydration, it's a staple

• 34:06André Duqum?

  for me. There is no sugar, no artificial colors, no junk, and they're also branching out into retail this year with their sparkling electrolyte water. These things are absolutely crack. If you want to try them out, you can get a free eight-count sample pack with Element's most popular drink mix flavors with any purchase at drinklmnt.com/nolesself. And if for any reason you don't like it, they have a no questions asked refund policy. You don't even have to send it back. That's drinklmnt.com/nolesself. Everything is linked down in the description. As always, thanks, Element, for supporting the show. Back to the episode.

• 34:46André Duqum?

  Let's keep going there. So you referred to earlier the inherent purity and innocence that we perceive emanating from a newborn child. And sometimes it's referred to the return of the second innocence, right? It's all one thing, but as you grow through the traumatic and personal developmental journey and process of individuation, you pick up stuff along the way, some of which you could say was genetically there, ancestrally, whatever. And the return of the second innocence is the matured remembering and returning to that state that is that pure, coherent energy. And I love how you're inviting the perspective that where we feel resistance, where we feel that stuck energy is not in the way, it's

• 35:30André Duqum?

  on the way. It's the opportunity to reveal where there is more opportunity for embracing self. And I think for most of us, The difficulty is like making contact with that energy. Some of probably why, because we try to solve a lot of the energetic problems with the level of the story in the mind, which I know you talk to about how to get to the raw energy of the experience. I think there's many different therapies and doorways to be able to access that space, right? All the psychoanalysis and gestalt therapies and ways that we can enter through the mind. But there's, depending on the constitution of the individual, sometimes just working

• 36:13André Duqum?

  and getting directly intimate with that energy is a more direct path. And so I'd love for you to share your thoughts on how to, one, identify and raise awareness of where those pockets of stuck energy are, right? For this open channel, for this open vessel, where are those distortions, contortions within our system? And then how can we effectively make contact with it? And then move it in a new direction? So like really getting to that, that's a really practical kind of question. As somebody, you know, turns off this podcast with a loving conversation with filled with puppies and they meet a situation in life that triggers them, that is difficult for them to stay present with and have an open heart with.

• 36:58André Duqum?

  How can they in real time meet that energy and transform it?

• 37:01Speaker 00

  Yeah, beautiful. So what I like to remind people is that in that moment, when something is triggering or is just a real challenge and there it is, it's right upon you. You know, people often ask, what do you do in those moments, right there, where the rubber's hitting the road right now? And I like to say that, you know, it's what you do in that moment is what you can do in that moment is determined by what you do in the in-between moments. In the moment before that happened, what were you doing? What, where were you? Where were you living in your, in your, in your awareness of self? How much of the field that is you are you filling up?

• 37:45Speaker 00

  How much are you living into your wholeness? Not just your potential, because we have a tendency with a story around the word potential, that it sort of infers something in the future that I'm going to grow into. But really, we're made of energy that is waiting to be potentiated. It is waiting to just be activated and animated. And so, when we are in the body, staying in the body, we are grounding a tremendous amount of high-frequency, full-on potential energy. We're grounding this unified field that we're made of into this one grand central station of this physical system.

• 38:27Speaker 00

  And so, the first thing that I do is invite people to anchor themselves in the body. Now, of course, taking a belly breath starts to bring you from your head into your heart, down into the deep wisdom sense of who we are. And by breathing in the belly, it nurtures that and keeps gathering these billions of bits of information that are bombarding us every millisecond here in this body in terms of information, wisdom. They're photons, little packets of consciousness, of awareness. We want to gather them and gather them in a coherent fashion into the core of our being. And so, by belly breathing, as simple as it seems, it keeps that happening. So, do we do that all the time?

• 39:12Speaker 00

  Or do we just do it as a little isolated practice in the morning and then get on with the day? Do we stay? Do we stay? Do we stay? And so, then I teach people about anchor points, ways that they can stay anchored in that channel, in that deep core space. And so, there are certain groups of muscles that we can contract periodically throughout the day until we actually, you know, find ourselves going in to that aspect of our physicality and doing so often enough that we actually set up camp there. It becomes our come-from, instead of just a go-to. And as it becomes our come-from,

• 39:56Speaker 00

  when you're seated in this channel and anchored in this way, you are going to have a different response to what happens in your day when someone crosses your path and says something that just is, you know, antithetical to what you think and feel and believe, or honor, or value in life. You're not going to be as reactive when you are grounded in the physicality, okay? It stirs other parts of you. It brings a presence forward that is not only your ancestral wisdom,

• 40:34Speaker 00

  But a timeless version of you that is capable of presencing with anything. It's been there, it's done that, etc. And so, deep in this core channel, the shasishumna is not time-bound. What that means is, there's a stream of energy in you that has been there and done that. And if you can find yourself coming into the depths of your being on a regular basis, you will feel like things are more okay than you thought they were. Nothing's changed, but you just feel like you could manage it if it sprung up. Or you'll have a sense of, you know, I don't know what's happening in the world. I don't know where we're headed. I don't know what things are gonna unfold.

• 41:15Speaker 00

  Things certainly aren't the way they were, you know, five years ago, 10 years ago, etc. And I just know that I'll be okay, that we'll be okay, if we just stay grounded and present and allowing the vibrational frequencies that emerge when we're doing that to emerge. One of which is a deeper state of loving presence than most people are aware of. And I don't mean love like transactional love or romantic love. I mean the love of life force itself. I mean the love that is the light that dances on the surface of the water. The love that is what causes the, you know, the trees to,

• 42:00Speaker 00

  the leaves on the trees to rustle in a gentle breeze. It is this essence that is source itself. And we can develop a greater and greater appreciation for that automatically the deeper inside this system we sit. And the more deeply we sit there and breathe there and anchor there, the more capable we are of allowing that to rise into becoming a, you know, an activation of the brain in our gut, which then allows, through epigenetics, you know, signals on these little antennas on the surface of the cells to produce a message inward into the cell that says,

• 42:45Speaker 00

  you know, things are pretty good. We don't need to be on edge. We can chill, and it's okay, it's safe, it's actually smart. And when we do that, the energies begin to rise through this system the way it's designed to run. And they rise to the heart space, where we have neurotransmission happening. We have the development of chemistries that we didn't know happened in the heart do. And it stimulates the system to flourish in an unconditional way and to continue to rise and to allow this consciousness to, as we said earlier, transform the function of this primitive brain

• 43:28Speaker 00

  into the strength and the fortitude to stay present in every situation and not be distorted, buckled over, derailed by it. And what happens then is an area of the brain, the hypothalamus and the thalamus, start talking to each other again. This doorway opens, if you could envision it that way, and they start communicating with each other again. And when that happens, it elicits a new response inside the center of the brain, where the pineal is, and all of the functions that we know about the third eye, you know, get to happen in an authentic way, in an integrated way, because we've learned to stay instead of be affected

• 44:12Speaker 00

  by the movie that we're walking around in, this collective agreed-upon reality that we are all navigating. And so what happens is we then illuminate in high-brain-center fashion. And what's happening is we're translating information that's on the rise, and emergence is happening. So if we understand that system and then we fast-forward back to the question that you asked and say, "What do you do when somebody, you know, triggers you if something happens?" There, in the in-between moments, if we have an understanding of the system that I just described, and we're regularly anchoring in these anchor points, which I can show everybody,

• 44:57Speaker 00

  you know, what that would be like, if that's appropriate, and we're living down inside this system in this way. There is a richness that unfolds in every situation. And we don't see it the same way that we did. But if we do, if we're not seasoned in this just yet, and we're just learning about this, or just hearing about this, we would contract these anchor points, which automatically pulls us right in. And if we've been practicing that in the in-between moments, then when the going gets rough and the stakes are higher and there's an upsetting situation in front of us,

• 45:36Speaker 00

  it's not as hard to find this seat of the soul, if you will. And so, it's what happens in the in-between moments that we build this familiarity. And if that familiarity is there, when this situation occurs, it doesn't derail us. We recognize it as, oh, this is what I've been practicing for. Oh, this is the deal. This is actually the joy of life on earth, is that I get to find the parts of me that I've pocketed off. And the body is going to tell the story. The body is going to show us where we have not ignited those parts of us that we are here to ignite, where our personal power has been shut down,

• 46:19Speaker 00

  where our internal wisdom has been ignored or denied, where our voice has been shut down. It's not an intellectual process that I'm describing. It's a felt, sense, physiological response. And when we, it's called pradhyahara. When we take our attention from the outer world to withdraw our senses into the inner world, where the truth resides, where the true self resides, and our abilities reside, we can sense and feel. We can learn to develop a sensitivity that we feel the tightness in our chest the instant it happens. We feel our throat clamp down. We feel a knot in our stomach. We feel a pressure in our gut in some way. We feel weakness in our knees,

• 47:04Speaker 00

  or a trembling in our musculature. And people always equate that, you know, like the trembling in the knees or the quivering in the musculature. We equate that with a fear response. But what if it wasn't? What if we didn't learn that that jittering in your core was fear? What if that jittering in your core was actually your solar plexus trying to come online, trying to hatch, trying to awaken, trying to open? And if you handled it as such... You would nurture it instead of running away from the situation to go get safe. What if you would celebrate? What if we were raised in an environment where our parents said, hey, when you feel that thing, stay the course, plant your feet, take a deep breath, because you're birthing yourself into a greater sense of power.

• 47:47Speaker 00

  You're starting to get to know the reason that you came. This is it. And so we would lean in instead of run away. We would embrace instead of, you know, reject and resist. And so your question is, how does someone, you know, sense and feel this? We have to develop a sensibility. We have to develop a nurtured relationship between mind and body that allows the subconscious that is stored in the body, the unresolvedness that is stored in the body, to become conscious. That when the body awakens, body awake, leads to an ability to manage situations, not only

• 48:27Speaker 00

  as triggers come up, but between the moments where triggers are coming up, it allows us to become innovative and creative and generative of projects and ideas and ways of living that are more what we want, rather than just preparing for the next time I get triggered. You know, it's just, it's just not enough to, to only worry about what do I do when I'm triggered?

• 48:54André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 48:55Speaker 00

  You know, it's, it's really about how do I develop the creator in me, rather than just prepare the defender in me.

• 49:05André Duqum?

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• 49:50André Duqum?

  that are worth checking out. You can head to boncharge.com/ know thyself and use coupon code know thyself to save 15%. That's B-O-N-C-H-A-R-G-E.com/ know thyself to save 15%. All Bon Charge products are HSA/FSA eligible, giving you tax-free savings of up to 40%. I hope you enjoy. Back to the show.

• 50:14André Duqum?

  That's great. No, that was very well said. I think about that space, right? Between stimulus and response. And by expanding that gap, awareness itself has the ability to be like a solvent. Awareness itself is a great solvent. And I think such immense value that comes from a meditative practice is you start to expand that gap, you know, between you and your reactionary self, the things that those triggers are igniting within you. And in that, you are literally reclaiming agency over your life. For me, this is one of the most important things to reflect on. To the degree I'm a compulsive reactionary person is to the degree I'm not actually living

• 50:59André Duqum?

  my life. These programs are living themselves out. And that's really sad, you know, because avoidance of pain and suffering is one thing, but the missing of joy and beauty that's around us is another. And to me, I think that that is really devastating, to be able to like be living life and realize that you're actually not intimate with it. You're not actually being connected to the degree you could be and thus missing the beauty of the sound through the leaves and the light through the trees. And the simple moments that don't require a grandiose, huge, you know, experience is really beautiful. So like in this day and age, especially ever increasingly, you turn on your phone,

• 51:44André Duqum?

  the news, there's just more and more chaos every single day. In this day and age, like the biggest flex is just a regulated nervous system. And it's quite a big endeavor for most of us because we're kind of plugged into a time and a society where there seems to be so much division and chaos, and there is to a big degree.

• 52:06André Duqum?

  But to reclaim that agency is to, again, bring back into space, bring back into awareness that space between stimulus and response. And so what you mentioned with Prajapalara, with the withdrawal of the senses, one of the eight limbs of yoga, kind of taking space at least once or twice a day where we can kind of marinate in that sense of being that isn't so reactionary. For me, that practice has brought great awareness into when those triggers happen, what's actually happening biochemically, the sensations in my body, and then the fluctuations of my breath. Like, if something happens where I'm not okay with it, I have resistance to some degree for whatever reason, I notice my breath go up here. My shoulders kind of come up a little bit.

• 52:50André Duqum?

  I'm breathing more in my chest. And you can actually notice that in real time ever increasingly through these practices, you know, to expand that space. And to me, that's the birthplace of freedom, because then you're not living in response to the external circumstances and seeking of them, arranging them in a certain way. But you actually get to be a creator of your life. That's what it means to actually raise consciousness. Not this woo-woo philosophical saying, you know, it's a really practical thing that we can cultivate in our day-to-day life. And so when you think about the nervous system and what you refer to as building the circuitry, this energetic circuitry, what are the most important insights there that we should be remembering? Because being with it, right, is one thing.

• 53:35André Duqum?

  You talk about transforming it into moving the energy in a new direction. And then it's like building what you refer to as your energetic circuitry. So what is that? We can go into the subtle anatomy and start kind of putting up some charts for people and kind of getting into it. But for a lot of people, as you go down this path and you go deeper, deeper down the contemplative path, you start to encounter things within your subtle, subjective experience. These, obviously, to varying degrees, have or haven't been proven by science, in terms of the objective subtle body or torridic field or markava field or, you know, the different names we could give to it. But for millennia, mystics,

• 54:19André Duqum?

  upon doing these contemplative practices for decades, have encountered repeating structures in the subtle anatomy of their body.

• 54:30André Duqum?

  And so that's the place we're going to. As you wake up, you start to gain bigger and bigger awareness of like what this life actually is and what the energy that's making up our bodies is structured like. But kind of going from the protective self to that personality structure, to a regulated nervous system. And then you start to have more of these experiences that give you contact with the greater truth of who you are, which I know you've had, you know, a few probably really big highlight experiences that in those moments where you're actually in the experience, like the ontology of those experiences, obviously worth way more than any podcast you could listen to or a book you could read because it becomes self-evident in that space.

• 55:14André Duqum?

  And that's where, for me, like, there's a fine line here. Where in this industry of podcasting and sharing information, I try to increasingly provide a space that can bring people into an invitation for them to explore it in their own self and not a belief system that they just take that's replacing old ones, which may or may not be improving their life to some degree, but it's nothing compared to the actual experience of validating what we're saying in your own experience. That's where it becomes real, instead of a philosophy that you just carry in your life. So, long story short.

• 55:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, you're speaking my language.

• 55:52André Duqum?

  Yeah, walk us through the process of building that energetic circuitry.

• 55:57Speaker 00

  Beautiful. Thank you for all of that. So, the, you know, here's the thing. There are, there are two systems that run our body, our life. One is the nervous system, which we know about regulating the nervous system is an essential thing for, you know, moving forward with health and vitality and really transcending or transforming, in my opinion, more importantly, you know, this fight or flight, you know, tendency and the whole construct that we've developed and a way of living that we've called a new norm, right? And so then we find out that, you know, it turns out I'm gonna burn out my adrenals, I'm gonna, you know, compromise my immune system, I'm gonna, you know, decrease my ability to If I keep living this way.

• 56:41Speaker 00

  And so we start getting interested in regulating that nervous system. And then what we're saying is, you know, once you regulate that nervous system, or even have the intention to do so, you're now starting on a different path. You're not being reactive. You're starting to become conscious and intentional about living your life. And then what happens when, we don't have to have it perfectly regulated, and it will never be balanced. It's always moving, you know, parasympathetic, sympathetic dominance. Those parts of the nervous system are always, you know, depending on what's needed in any given moment. We're supposed to be able to rise to the occasion, as if we were fighting a bear in a moment when there's an emergency situation. But we're also supposed to be able to come down out of that when there is no emergency. And what's happened is we get stuck in that emergency fight or flight. So we know that about the nervous system.

• 57:25Speaker 00

  And it's a huge thing. I'm thrilled that that's part of our vernacular and part of our common conversation now. Because when I opened my clinic, you know, many years ago, a few decades ago, people didn't, nobody knew about that conversation. So, so we've come a long way in 40 years, you know, believe it or not. And what happens when we do start to regulate that is we're starting to animate this presence that has domain over our nervous system. Like, we have choice. Like, I don't need to be habituated into some pattern and just fight or flight, you know, freak out because everybody else is. I'm, now I'm cultivating this observer version of myself that has choice on how I'm, you know, how I'm gonna manage things.

• 58:10Speaker 00

  So now what we're doing is starting to introduce the other system that runs the body and runs our lives. And it's actually the truth of who we are. It's the electromagnetic energy system. So when we talk about bioenergetics, it just means body energy. And the body's energy is electromagnetic, and it is the master system over the whole thing.

• 58:32André Duqum?

  Electrical before chemical, as they say.

• 58:35Speaker 00

  Yes, yes. Electrical before chemical. And when, when the heart is involved, when consciousness is involved.

• 58:43Speaker 00

  Consciousness in the body generates the love experience that we're speaking about. Consciousness in body form generates the vibrational frequency that is loving presence. It is our basic desire to connect, to offer, to share, to nurture. There is, underneath our fight or flight, that's who we become. Once we regulate the nervous system, we automatically have a desire to do well, to make better, to offer and to share. And so, it's important for people to realize that. It's like, "I'm just so busy regulating my nervous system, I have no idea who I'll be once I do." So, it's a really good idea to have some sense of who we would be being, because we can go straight to that.

• 59:26Speaker 00

  So, here's the beauty of this electromagnetic energy system. I call it the master system, because it builds every system in your body. It builds the nervous system. It builds it in the developing embryo. It builds the immune system, the chemical system. It builds the digestive and the respiratory systems of flow. This master system is it. It's in charge. And what it's made of is the unified field compressed and compressed and compressed and compressed into this physical dimension, and it's having its way, expressing in this world through all these various systems that comprise our physiology.

• 1:00:03Speaker 00

  And so, when you describe, "Hey, if I can just come in here and stay present with something, some feeling that I'm feeling, and not be afraid of that feeling, not be afraid of that energy, if I can just, you know, be with it, I start to master my fear of it. If I can just, you know, allow it, I can start to own domain over the full keyboard of my existence. I can animate all of it and not be afraid of any of it. And when I do that, I start to become more and more of the truth of who I am. I become more masterful at life.

• 1:00:46Speaker 00

  I'm starting to identify with the master system, because the master system is the full keyboard. It's all of the keys, all of the notes, all the black ones, all the white ones, all the da-da-da, all the octaves, you know, on a keyboard. And so, if I am... Breathing with more and more of myself, I'm able to be present with more and more of life's circumstances because I have familiarity. There's resonance, there's coherence. My autonomic nervous system is automatically going to recognize, "Oh, I've felt this feeling before. I don't have to be afraid of it." Or, "Oh, I've been present with this kind of feeling. I've had to come present with this kind of a feeling before, and because of that, I know that I can generate that presence no matter what my circumstances are."

• 1:01:31Speaker 00

  And even if there's not a threatening circumstance, I can go to that vibration and cultivate it on my own, anytime I choose. And so, when we do that, we start to become a vibrational coherence or resonance with higher and higher possibilities, greater and greater, I should call them greater and greater possibilities. So I'm not afraid to step into the unknown because I kind of know it. I know the unknown. I can feel it and sense it inside the system. So it's by coming into this core and allowing it to provide the opportunity

• 1:02:13Speaker 00

  for my consciousness to land on vibrational frequencies that I used to avoid at all costs because I didn't know what they meant, I didn't know how to be with it, I didn't know what it was going to mean in terms of my future or what have you. And now, that space, that gap, as we broaden it, we have the spaciousness to just invite it and to realize, "I can be with this sensation, and it's not going to take me out. It's not going to kill me. It's just an energy. And I can breathe with this particular vibration." And when I do, I come to know a version of myself that I may never have known if the set of circumstances that elicited it hadn't occurred

• 1:02:58Speaker 00

  and stirred it. That what we have to realize is that we come into this dimension so that those frequencies that we're unfamiliar with will get stirred, so that we can awaken to them consciously, so that we can experience our wholeness regardless of our external circumstances. So the circumstances are required to guide us in. And when we feel, "Where's that impacting me?" "Oh, it's got me right here." Oh, that was getting me right here. So wherever it is, where it is impacting us has everything to do with why it is impacting us. Because the different areas of our body

• 1:03:40Speaker 00

  are correlating directly to aspects of our wholeness in terms of consciousness. Like we were saying earlier, my deep internal power is at the solar plexus. And if I can learn to soften the solar plexus, what happens is the mind field, the field of mental-body energies is stored in the solar plexus. So if I can soften here, I can soften my mind's reactivity and I can allow my deep core wisdom and the loving heart meet each other because I'm opening and breathing in here. So when we start to feel that soften inside of us because we're literally drawing everything right into this space

• 1:04:24Speaker 00

  and we're cultivating the chemistry that allows for the outer world to be tuned out and the inner world to be tuned up, what happens is we do sense and feel these subtle responses. We do feel the subtle nuances of our invisible anatomy. And when that starts to land in our consciousness, it gets amplified, it gets magnified. And as it gets magnified and amplified, we become able to nurture it and to utilize it. And so when we start to feel something softening between the heart and the gut, we are, we're actually harnessing our ability

• 1:05:07Speaker 00

  to transform ancestral lineage inheritance in ways that we feel like we're working something out that our ancestors couldn't. We feel that we're, we're having to, you know, carry the baton in some way. People feel a little burdened by that sometimes. But really, It's how we evolve. It's how we carry it forward and into what we're meant to be in this world. So by opening to the vibrations that we don't want to feel, we allow them to settle and to stir aspects of our sleepfulness and to bring it up to a conscious level.

• 1:05:49Speaker 00

  So thereby, we become more of who we truly are instead of constantly resisting or rejecting, you know, these parts of us in our attempts to defend and guard and just get by.

• 1:06:05Speaker 02

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• 1:07:03André Duqum?

  This is good stuff. This is good stuff.

• 1:07:06Speaker 00

  Yay.

• 1:07:07André Duqum?

  So to continue on this train, you know, I often think about the debates that happen between religious and science, you know, religion and science. And the argument is that like, you could throw out all the sacred texts, all the religious doctrines, and in a couple thousand years, you probably would have different texts that would come up, right? The same Bible wouldn't be there, et cetera. Science, like you would discover the same laws of physics, for example. When it comes to who we are and the energetic circuitry... I think we probably both agree that if we threw out all of the yogic texts, all of the understandings about what our subtle structure looks like, the nature of the mind, in a couple of thousand years,

• 1:07:52André Duqum?

  it would be much more like it on the science side of things, where we would still discover these structures, these energy centers that correlate to a certain level of mind, emotional landscape. And so I think it's important that the role that teachers have, especially like yourself, that are bringing light to these, to the anatomy of the internal, more subtle, energetic, electrical aspects of self, then it gives people a reference point to discover, verify that in their own self, but then also be able to work with when they experience a certain level of fear, resentment, anger, guilt, ambition, go up the whole center, or the whole spine. You could correlate different parts, different energies,

• 1:08:37André Duqum?

  with different parts of your body. And so I'd love for you to walk us through now, like, we can throw up a couple of charts on screen. When you're talking about the actual structure of our energy, what is that? That if people were to go deep down this path, they could potentially discover for themselves? But what have the yogic sciences said and the contemplative practices revealed about how the structure is made up?

• 1:09:04Speaker 00

  Okay, so we know that this electromagnetic energy system builds the physical body, okay? In the developing embryo, it's measurable. We can watch the structure developing, the physiology, the physical form, and through the multiplication and division of cellular structure developing into tissues and systems in the physical body. And it does so through a rhythmic process that pulsates. In other words, there's a pulsation in the developing embryo before there's even a heart built to beat. So there's a pulsation to something that's happening.

• 1:09:46Speaker 00

  There's an intelligence, this innate intelligence that built the body will ultimately run the body and heal the body. And it doesn't go away once we're born. It's still here. Once we birth into, you know, through the birth canal and out into the world, that energetic is still present, is still guiding.

• 1:10:05André Duqum?

  So how would you? Like, it's obviously the biggest miracle of life, that you get one cell from a mother, one cell from a father, and then the self-emerging, complex organizing system called a fetus starts to develop in the embryonic stage. And you see how incredibly intelligent this design that's springing forth in life, right?

• 1:10:26Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 1:10:26André Duqum?

  The energy that you're saying is making this possible, is it physical? Do you think that the energy that we're referring to is inherently like a non, there's a non-physical component? Or is it just a subtle level of energy that we don't maybe fully know or understand scientifically?

• 1:10:46Speaker 00

  So if you think about, everything is energy. And energy is vibrating at different frequencies. And the frequencies that we're used to experiencing are at the physical end of the spectrum. But it's one long continuum, all the way to no experience at all, to the void, to the great unified field of consciousness.

• 1:11:10André Duqum?

  That if you take the densest material on the planet and go subtle and take a microscopic look down into the subatomic realm, that you'd go down to the Planck scale, and you would see this foam. There's like, we don't, our instrumentation fails at a certain point of understanding what energy actually is, right? So we don't actually even know.

• 1:11:32Speaker 00

  Right.

• 1:11:33André Duqum?

  But nonetheless, yes, there is levels to density in the subtleties of energy.

• 1:11:37Speaker 00

  So it's this essence that it goes from nothing into a, an essence, a liquid light is how we describe what the cosmos is made of, this liquid aqueous solution that then continues to compress into liquid crystalline structure that compresses into crystalline structure, which compresses into the physical form that we're used to witnessing and experiencing, the chair that we sit in, the body that's holding, you know, space for this consciousness. But it's all a continuum. I call it this divine continuum because it goes from here to all the way, what we prefer, or what we refer to as there. You know, there is no there, it's just. Right here, and it's compressing, compressing, and compressing.

• 1:12:19Speaker 00

  And so there is a field between us that represents the truth of us. And it goes through you and between us and through me. And it keeps going on forever. And we are all a part of that field.

• 1:12:32André Duqum?

  Would you refer to that as consciousness itself? Or how do you, how do you label that?

• 1:12:36Speaker 00

  What, what, yes, I do personally. And what science is showing us is that the foundation of reality is based in consciousness. That it's energy that is awake. That is, it is truly our drawing forth from this unified field or the void. It's so much there that we can't measure it. It's just everything. That we draw forth from this great void, whatever we're choosing to draw forth on a super conscious level for the specific experience that we're here to have.

• 1:13:05André Duqum?

  Which the leading edge researchers in this field are, are ever increasingly starting to explore, right? The materialist reductionist notion, which is just like a maybe 150, 200 year paradigm. It's like a, a page on the turn of, on the turn of humanity's story, right? But the leading edge consciousness researchers are, are exploring and starting to scientifically verify to increasing degrees that consciousness is not an emergent phenomenon from matter, but that matter is actually an emergent phenomenon from consciousness. And that is going to possibly be the biggest revolution in our understanding of reality and paradigm of, of how we understand the universe in the coming decades and century.

• 1:13:50André Duqum?

  So that was just a footnote, because we've had, you know, Donald Taufman on and various different consciousness researchers who are exploring this from the contemplative practices, but then also the scientific lens. And it's a very exciting time to be alive where these two are coming together.

• 1:14:04Speaker 00

  Yes, indeed. We used to think that the body emanated the field. But what we now know is that the field is creating a body. And then the body function creates another field. But the foundational process, the anatomy is, and the physiological component there, is that the field is compressing and compressing and compressing and compressing into physical form. And so we are the field compressed into these bodies. We are generating a body so that we can come into this physical dimension and exchange. And so we're directing our consciousness into the physical exchange, and we get lost in the exchange and think that that's what's real. And so what we're doing,

• 1:14:49Speaker 00

  what science is allowing, is for us to open the blinders a little bit more so that we can perceive more and satisfy the left brain into allowing what is true to be seen, to be felt, to be experienced. Otherwise, we shut it out, and we just are focused here on the physical matter that's observable. So the invisible world is the real world. And this compressed physical exchange that we witness is a reflection of why we came. We came into this dimension to awaken to certain aspects of who we are. And so by the interactions and the dynamic there, we can either use it to our advantage

• 1:15:34Speaker 00

  or we can get buckled over by it and feel like, you know, you're not being kind, you know? And so if you're just presenting something to me, and I learn how to respond accordingly and maintain my identity as this whole unified and integrated presence, I can utilize the exchange that happens here to awaken to parts of myself that I never would have known had you not come along and said what you said or done what you did, right? So it's, we're at choice, right there. Which way are we going to play it? Are we the body that is trying to find spirit? Or are we the spirit that is coming into a body for a darn good reason, experiencing the things that we're experiencing?

• 1:16:19André Duqum?

  It's so...

• 1:16:21André Duqum?

  One of the great joys of being able to do this is to see so many different disciplines agreeing and saying the same thing from different angles. You know, we just had a great Abhijit Vedantik teacher talking about the philosophy of understanding how oneness, the consciousness of oneness, differentiates itself into manyness, perhaps only for the joy of remembering its oneness. And you could look at it from the meditative lens and the ancient wisdom traditions to the scientific lens, from the energetic lens. And yeah, I think this is just a perfect foundation for then starting to understand, okay, that's the source of which all matter and energy is kind of emerging from. And now it takes a certain shape.

• 1:17:05André Duqum?

  And so I'll let you continue.

• 1:17:07Speaker 00

  Yeah, so I didn't get into the full explanation to your previous question.

• 1:17:11André Duqum?

  But we have so many exciting tangents, we could just riff for hours.

• 1:17:13Speaker 00

  So go over here and play. Let's go over here and play. So this unified field, you know, we draw forth from this and through a series of compressions, we find ourself in this physical dimension. And so what I'm referencing as this continuum is the through line through those series of compressions that we go through to bring ourselves here into this realm. And so once here in this realm, the pouring in of that continues to happen. That unified field, that essence, that energy is still streaming into our experience. It doesn't ever stop because we are that. We are streaming ourselves here.

• 1:17:56Speaker 00

  And so it takes on an anatomy, it takes on a structure that we hit this physicality and it starts to build and build and build upon itself. This field, this stream folds over and over and over and flourishes and flourishes. And it rises as high as it can go relative to how conscious we are while we're here. If I can remain the consciousness that I was when I chose to come, once I'm here, I'm going to animate that on a conscious level. If I don't recall it, I'm going to... And splat and forget everything and try to and have to work my way up for the pure joy of remembering the truth of who I am, right?

• 1:18:38Speaker 00

  So, so as we do, we meet this, we, we, the energy folds over on itself enough that we, we meet this state of consciousness that is revelatory. We wake up, we're like, oh, this is why I'm here. This is what I'm doing. I'm not, I'm not this, this outer layer of surviving, you know, presence. There's more to me. There's a deeper stream here. This river, this river runs really deep. And as I explore and find that deep within, like we were speaking about earlier, I begin to recognize, oh, I'm this whole thing. I get it. And as we do, we start to recognize that everything that's happening is in favor, has been since I got here.

• 1:19:22Speaker 00

  Every single thing that has happened has been in my favor of awakening to this. We, we become, you know, truly realizing the system that's happening here. And so what happens is physically, we know that the, the bioenergetics of how this system operates is there is energy pouring in, goes through the body before there's even a body. It descends and hits the earth, rises up and recycles into this toric field. So it rises as high as it can go until we hit a level of consciousness that we just can't keep together yet. And then it spills around and because our intention is to come here and to have this experience, it gets recycled.

• 1:20:06Speaker 00

  So we draw it up again and it runs up again. And you'll see in this image right here, it's just kind of a picture worth a thousand words. First, I'm going to show this continuum that I'm speaking about. Just imagine this coming in from the unified field, this, this swooping down continuum that hits the earth, rises up and then projects out through our true, you know, presence here in this physical form, projects before us into this technicolor movie that we're walking into all of our lives, this rainbow movie that we're walking into. And so we are able to see and draw out of the unified field. What we're here to see, those are the eyes that we look through. And so we see opportunities, or we see challenges, or we see a world that cares, or a world that doesn't care.

• 1:20:51Speaker 00

  All because, if you look at this close up, you'll see that the rising of this energy either rises in its stable fashion and cycles around in the historic field, or you'll see how it circumvents and goes around areas of our own consciousness that we've shut down. And as it goes around these aspects of our system that we've shut down, maybe we loved once and we got hurt, so we shut it down there. We were ridiculed by a parent in some way, or a coach, or a teacher at some young age, and so we shut down our personal power. Or we were speaking our, you know, our delight in some situation got shut down, so, you know, our throat center. And these kinds of things are typical responses.

• 1:21:36Speaker 00

  And so what happens in this rising energy is that it now has to circumvent all these areas that we've shut down, and it creates a wobble, and it creates a distortion in this historic field system. Now this person is standing inside this field, looking out through a distortion, and it reinvents over and over. It confirms for them, the movie is reflecting back to them how they have shut down in certain ways by the way their experience is going, and how people treat them today. It's a reflection of what we've owned and what we've not owned, what we've shut down, or what we've flourished in and nurtured. And so when we begin to see it this way,

• 1:22:20Speaker 00

  we start to recognize that there's a whole system, when we put all of this together, that is flowing and processing. And as we're projecting out what's in front of us from a... Distorted fashion, we end up in a distorted reality that is constantly being confirmed for us. It keeps recreating itself because we haven't changed how this essence that we are, this energy, this light, can pour through us and onto the movie screen. So, the good news is, when we bring our attention into the core of the body, based on a reaction that we have to a challenge that's in our outer world, or even based on a reaction that we have when we start dreaming and visioning

• 1:23:05Speaker 00

  about the life that we would love to be living, there's also a reaction when we start envisioning what we feel like we came here to have, or to be, or to do, or to contribute, or to experience. And we get all exhilarated, or we get excited, and there's a cellular response to that because we're tapping into what we were built for, that has been suppressed because we've shut certain things down. And so, when we feel that quiver, it's because we're opening and we're awakening, but we've misperceived that quiver as danger. So, we shut it down again, and we avoid it. So, now that we see the ability to bring our attention into

• 1:23:47Speaker 00

  and feel where these energies are bumping up against each other, there's no stream of flow, and we can build a superhighway for that stream of flow to happen. And what happens is, these areas that we've been circumventing and going around, we literally start to build circuitry through them. We build consciousness through them every moment that we are present with a feeling right in this area, or this area, or this area, or this area, wherever we were directed. When we can bring our consciousness there and melt and soften and be with it, and start to breathe up and down this channel, while staying anchored in these anchor points at the base of our spine, and at the heart center, at the throat center, and at the third eye level, we begin to build photon density,

• 1:24:32Speaker 00

  these little packets of energy that are creating our reality. We draw from the field what is required for a stability on the inside. But because we've been externally Focusing all of our lives, we, energy follows thought. So, all of our little photons rush into the story. They rush on to the other people that we think are triggering us, those people that abused us, or those circumstances. We don't gather the photons into the deep core center. So, if we're not gathering the photons, there's no felt sense of self. If we gather more photons, it creates a substance. It creates a concentration of energy packets of consciousness.

• 1:25:14Speaker 00

  These little packets of awareness that our whole reality is built upon. It follows thought. We landed here, we splattered, and we externalized our attention, like figuring out what happened, where did I go wrong? Who do I need to please? You know, what do I need to do to be okay, or to fit in, or to be safe? And so now, we're saying, you know what? I'm just gonna gather this. Coming, I call it coming on to subject versus being distracted on to object. Coming on to self. When we do, we gather enough photon density that the sensory nervous system now can perceive there's someone in here. There's a sense of me. There's a presence here that I never knew I had. And as we do, and we do that in an organized fashion,

• 1:25:56Speaker 00

  this whole structure gets to be enlivened with the true essence of who we are. And so, we now are gathering enough of a sense of self that the sensory nervous system can pick up on it, and it contributes to the processing of our nervous system. And our motor responses shift because our sensory input is more accurate. We're now sensing through a filter that is enlivened and conscious and integrated and embodied. And so, the information that rises to the brain to be processed in terms of, what should I do? Who am I? Where do I go? What decisions do I make? What's appropriate for me? What's possible for me?

• 1:26:40Speaker 00

  Is now based upon greater wholeness. And as such, the, in the integrative nervous system that is processing that information in the space of the gap between, you know, action and reaction. Or input and reaction, or stimulus and response. There's a spaciousness now that is filled with presence. There's something here that's more okay, it's more whole. And why that's possible is I'm animating inside that wobble, this wobble in the toric field in such a way that the whole continuum can be something I can relate to.

• 1:27:19Speaker 00

  Instead of something like the divine or the heavens are there and I'm here. There's a direct connection between the two. And I'm drawing upon those frequencies that are full and whole and comprehensive when I'm filling this system. And so my motor responses are going to be altered. You know, a scientific premise is input, process, output. If you don't like the output, we have to change the processing or we have to change our perception of the input if we don't like what's happening. So we're here allowing the whole thing to be connected again in this invisible anatomy, in a structure that shows us

• 1:28:04Speaker 00

  if you put these different studies together, we recognize that this is how energy behaves, it's how light behaves. And the wholeness of our being is being validated and actually has been since the beginning of recorded history, through ancient Egypt and through India and the yogic practices and even through Greek mythology. These were all actually instruction manuals, given the names of gods and goddesses as parts of the whole cosmic principle, the cosmic law that is governing this whole existence here. It was instructions for you, not talking about a god or a goddess that lived a long time ago.

• 1:28:45Speaker 00

  But it got marginalized into that kind of a conversation in terms of what science would have us think when we were only focusing on what we could see with our physical sciences. Quantum science has changed the whole picture and allowed us to realize that hmm, you find what you're looking for. So we have to be aware of who's looking and what is our intention.

• 1:29:14André Duqum?

  So many good nuggets in there. I wanted to ask you about actually the term, the use of the term photon as like a particle of light that you're using as a sort of packets of energy. I'm curious, where do you, why do you choose to use that, that language for that in particular? Because I could see for, for some that are like more, a bit more scientifically minded, it might create an unnecessary rub in receiving information because of preconceived notions or sort of scientific delineation of what is energy versus what sounds cool. And obviously, because I think you're such a big and bright light, I just want to invite that inquiry and see, what do you really mean when you're using those terms?

• 1:29:56Speaker 00

  Okay, so in the quantum world, right where we are, you know, at the, at the, at the meeting place between energy and physical matter, we know that we can create a vacuum and a few randomly placed photons inside of this vacuum. We can think a thought into that and they will rearrange. And we know, so that we have, we, we know that we have influence over the physical world, something that's almost matter, something that's tangible and measurable with the power of thought, concentration and intention. And so it's one of the terms in the subatomic world that I use that simply because it's one

• 1:30:40Speaker 00

  that most people have been exposed to on some level, just referencing this threshold between matter and non-matter and the role of consciousness that, that play, that the consciousness plays in the materialization of the collapsing of energy waveform into particle. It's right there at that level that I'm just referencing the doorway itself. So we can, we can talk in other subatomic particles, of quarks and such, that, that are also this nearly invisible, you know, aspect of life, that what I'm wanting to do is just give people the opportunity to realize that, that our

• 1:31:24Speaker 00

  Our intentions play a role, that we can shift our DNA function. We have an ability to shift physical form and that we have ability to move and reshape self and the world around us with the power of our thought. But our thought alone isn't enough usually to do that consistently enough to create change and shift in our world, in our life experience. And so when we move into the deep core presence of self and then introduce the qualities of love and intention and a deep heartfelt sense of self, when we start to bring all of that

• 1:32:06Speaker 00

  together, it generates enough consistency that we can do that long enough inside of this space and time, you know, version of the whole continuum to be able to see shift and change in our physical exchange in the world. So hopefully that's helpful.

• 1:32:27André Duqum?

  Yeah, I mean, we could, we could talk more about it if we want, but I think largely there's a, I think a distinction that I tried to carry most when exploring the mystical areas of life where there's a, there's a fine line, I guess, between the precision of language and sort of useful metaphors to sort of have some sort of conceptual understanding of what we're talking about because we're on a podcast. And if we were actually going to speak an absolute truth, we'd probably just sit here silent the whole podcast. It probably wouldn't make for that great of a podcast.

• 1:33:00Speaker 00

  Right, right, exactly.

• 1:33:02André Duqum?

  So it's always kind of discerning between, between that. I just wanted to make sure that, do you feel complete with the understanding of the subtle anatomy or do you wanna, I just wanna make sure you feel like you've kind of covered that. The mapping of that, if there are any other charts you want to magically pop up on screen, from the Shishuma Channel to the Torridic Field, to the Energy Centers, is there anything else in regards to that that you think is important to highlight?

• 1:33:30Speaker 00

  Yeah, so there's this other little map that I have here that we can take a look at, that just starts to bring in, you know, we have this chakra system that people are, a lot of people are familiar with. And so I speak about that as well, in terms of levels of consciousness, not just wheels of energy inside the physical body, but that each of them are representing a different vibrational frequency. On this same continuum, there is a vibrational frequency, so everything is energy, and it's all vibrating in different frequencies. And there are aspects of your frequency code that are, you know, the root chakra, chakra number one, and the wisdom chakra, chakra number two. And there are

• 1:34:14Speaker 00

  lots of different studies around the world, in different cultures, that have divided chakra systems in different ways. But in the use of a seven chakra system, what I'm doing with the anatomy of awakening is saying, you know, what we need to do is explore levels of consciousness that are even higher than chakras one through seven. And so chakras eight, and nine, and 10, and 11, and 12, in a 12 chakra system, are some of the things that I'm bringing into the conversation for this reason. When we begin to relate to and resonate with these additional five levels of consciousness that are also included

• 1:34:56Speaker 00

  in our invisible and visible anatomy, we begin to relate to and resonate with higher and higher locations up that continuum.

• 1:35:08André Duqum?

  What were the five levels of consciousness?

• 1:35:10Speaker 00

  Okay, so they would be the higher five chakras. So it would be chakra eight, and nine, and 10, 11, and 12. And so they are, what I do is reference it in the reverse, because we start at chakra 12, which is more of a...

• 1:35:27Speaker 00

  A presence, a, the unified field coming into form. You know, science would describe our existence here, like we were talking about earlier, where there's an essence in the space in between us that runs through you and keeps going forever, and runs through me and keeps going forever, and we are all part of that. And so I oftentimes describe this as if you hung up a big bed sheet, and just a big, you know, king-sized bed sheet, and you came up to that sheet that was hanging on edge, and you just pinched it, that that pinching is the folding over of this unified field, and it compressing toward itself, those two pinches, is basically what we are. We are a wrinkle in this field of consciousness.

• 1:36:12André Duqum?

  Yeah, David Bohm, with his implicit order, would say, would echo a similar sentiment, that there are like these nested or enfolded realities within itself, just another avenue for people to explore if they want.

• 1:36:26Speaker 00

  Yes, yes, yes. And in fact, I think it was probably in some of his research, that 20 years ago, when I was trying to figure out what was happening to me, you know, these things are opening up in my consciousness, I'm experiencing other realms, what's going on? Because, you know, as a doctor in a clinic and trying to just get outcomes and results with people, and I was using energy medicine techniques and things like that, but, because I was raised with that, but at the same time, it was stimulus-response, you know, get this outcome, we had to, people had to heal, or I didn't have a practice, you know, that's what I was doing with people. And then these things started opening up, and I was, I was studying his, his input

• 1:37:06Speaker 00

  and, and the reversal output, and that we are just flashing, you know, into existence here, through this enfoldment reality that, that you're referencing. So it's, it's fascinating when you start putting all these things together, and the reason that I had some of this, and some of this, and some of this, was because I needed to explain what I was experiencing. It was experiential for me, it wasn't, it wasn't theoretical.

• 1:37:29André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 1:37:30Speaker 00

  I was just curious about like, what the heck is going on here?

• 1:37:33André Duqum?

  Which is just important to highlight, and I know you shared your story in kind of one of your big transpersonal experiences last time, on the previous conversation we had, but for-

• 1:37:45André Duqum?

  Scientific skeptical minds, when it comes to like the certainty around chakra systems and energetic structures, I think it's just important to continue to highlight that like, these aren't things that you or I are asking anyone to believe, but to keep an open mind, not so much that it falls out of your head, but have an open mind to a degree where you keep it as a possibility. And if you were to have the transpersonal experience of where it became self-evident, that's the only real way to kind of verify that within your experience. But I just wanted to double down that it is actually, this is kind of coming from your own experience that you're trying to make conceptual sense

• 1:38:24André Duqum?

  of, and these structures that you can actually encounter within yourself. So, yeah.

• 1:38:33Speaker 00

  Well, thank you for that. And absolutely is not a belief system. You know, just think about it. Like, there's a part of you that feels tender at times, right? You just feel tender. And there is a part of you that feels, that knows, stuff that you maybe haven't even been taught, but you just, a situation shows up and you just know what to do. But nobody said, hey, when this situation comes up, do this. But through your assimilation of past experience and your innate intelligence, your own inherent wisdom, we, in those moments, we rush forward and we know what to do. It happens, we just do. And, and there is a

• 1:39:12Speaker 00

  part of us that is just loving and willing to forgive, even though X, Y, and Z has happened. Or maybe not willing to forgive, but when we decide to forgive, we feel the repercussions of that. We feel the effects of having let go of something. It's a physiological shift that anyone can sense. Try it on. And so, what, what all of, you know, the sciences and all of spirituality are actually trying to do is bring organization to an understanding of that. You know, in true spiritual practice, that's what we're doing. We're inquiring into our true nature. That's it.

• 1:39:54Speaker 00

  So it's not about religion in my world at all. It's about, you know, if you look deeply into some of the sacred texts and these writings, with the ears that have turned on inside of my system, I hear or see something differently than I did 20 years ago when I read it before I started having these experiences. I see, oh my gosh, there's actually an instruction manual there physiologically that isn't about a belief. It became about that for so many. But if you, if you're looking into it from what do I do? And what is happening underneath the story energetically? You can hear instructions being shown to you

• 1:40:39Speaker 00

  through the words that were spoken or the things that were said about, you know, someone or something sometime long ago. And if you're listening from this perspective, you can actually perceive that a guidance was there about our own physiology, very tangible parts of us, our own physicality. And inside of the Anatomy of Awakening, I drew some parallels and showed people that, that, that if you trace this back to the physiology, you see the ventricular system in the brain and the central channel in the body. And if you, if you take this,

• 1:41:19Speaker 00

  you see that, that this whole deity that was being described in, in Hinduism was actually about the primitive brain and transforming its function. And we can see that unfolding when we lay the sciences over upon one another. So it's about like, what if we just entertain? What if this equals this? And we start bridging these worlds and these different disciplines of study. And we start allowing them to be representing something within each other. Because I truly contend that, that science...

• 1:41:56Speaker 00

  And spirituality have to work together to really understand the essence of who we are. And we can prove a lot scientifically. And then there's that little something extra that keeps us from being able to go into a laboratory and create a human being without that little something extra. We know all the particles and all the chemistries and all of the, even the chemical reactions that take place between them. But to actually build a human being, there's a little something more. And, you know, and spirituality can only go so far if it doesn't include some left-brain activity, if it doesn't include some logic, if it doesn't include some reproducibility

• 1:42:39Speaker 00

  and some substantiation that, that can settle our minds and allow us to feel comfortable exploring such things. But I think that's where we sit right now, that it's our job to blend the two, instead of edging something out for the one thing that feels more comfortable for us. You know, quantum science is really inviting us into that.

• 1:42:59André Duqum?

  Yeah, and that would require the more scientifically oriented individuals to maintain an open mind when exploring less immediately verifiable, transpersonal experiences and what people claim to experience. And it requires individuals that are having mystical experiences not to immediately label it with certainty as to, as to what it is. Because there's a whole realm of our mind that needs to make meaning out of experience. And the subtlety between reality and a hallucinated state is fairly fine.

• 1:43:43André Duqum?

  There is a saying that the psychotic drowns in the same waters that the mystic swims in, you know? And so... Discernment is just super important here. And that's why I love having conversations with individuals like yourself, who can do both and can have an open mind in regards to both. Okay, continuing. Did you want to kind of finish off those upper five?

• 1:44:10Speaker 00

  Sure, you know, I just want to comment on what you were just saying. What I think is helpful when it comes time to discern and to keep grounded in these spiritual experiences, instead of spinning way out and becoming super esoteric, is the body, the physical body helps us. The more we embody, the more we can translate those mystical spiritual experiences into terms and processes and visions and inspirations and intuitions and innovations that allow us to open our scientific mind to discover more than science has been able to discover before.

• 1:44:52Speaker 00

  Right? So I think that it's the, for us here in this physical dimension, our physical body has a lot to do with why we're here and how to be here effectively. And because it's the physical dimension version of us. So if we can embody, if we can integrate in the body and build more neurocircuitry and breathe inside this system and animate these aspects of who we are, we can more accurately interpret the things that may happen in a meditative state or in a vision state or, you know, in whatever it is that happens with someone, whether they're pursuing, you know, transcendental experiences or they just happen in the shower one day.

• 1:45:37Speaker 00

  You know, that for us to be able to translate that into usable information that changes our lives for the better, that we can offer up to others as some guidance or some reassurance at the very least, then, then I feel that being embodied, being fully in the body facilitates our ability to make it understandable, relatable, accessible and reproducible. And that's what the scientific world needs to see in order to, you know, check the box and to feel that it has value.

• 1:46:11André Duqum?

  Yeah, similarly also in the spiritual meditative side, the grounding in an integration and embodiment of expanded awareness and insight. Is very much so needed, especially as you integrate and embody that knowing, your presence inherently like a candle will effortlessly illuminate darkness, will provide a level of transformative quality in no matter what field of work that you have in life. You know, and for those that maybe have these experiences, which can be on the one side, like deeply transpersonal, mystic, out of body experiences, or the subtle recognition of who you are in any given moment,

• 1:46:56André Duqum?

  that carrying that recognition with you in your day to day life as a level of embodiment is what would keep somebody, for example, in the more scientific mind, a bit more open. Because there is something inherently radiant of somebody that embodies truth, right? And there is an inviting quality to it. Whereas the typical paths to proselytize your own belief system into others, indoctrinate them into your own self righteousness, the other alternative is actually from the space of needing no validation, or, you know, needing nothing, you sort of get everything, in a sense.

• 1:47:40André Duqum?

  In many different ways, the person or the self that wants the world cannot be the same one that receives it. You know, and so, yeah, I think, I just love, and especially in our last conversation, you talked about the descended masters, you know? So much of like the spiritual conversation these day and age is like, we're here, but we're supposed to get up and out and higher. And sure, to a degree, there is a perspective there, you know? But to the degree our roots go deep, the branches go high. And so, I just, I love continuing to come back to like grounding this insight, you know, coming back into your body. And seeing how they're all interconnected, so.

• 1:48:22Speaker 00

  Yes, beautiful. So what I was saying about this map is speaking about that, exactly. That for anything to rise, it has to descend first. It has to drop in and then it rises automatically. And so on this map, we see that this, you know, this level of consciousness that is our true nature, our true essence, our unified fieldness, the fact that we are that energy compressed into form, is Chakra 12. The action of compressing, compressing and compressing and compressing, gives the experience of movement or gives the experience of descending into this dimension, coming in through a series of compressions. And so that's the Chakra 11 is this cosmic quality,

• 1:49:07Speaker 00

  this universal quality of movement and compression. And it is that movement that happens through our body that is the sustaining quality of being here. The circulation of our blood, the regulation of our digestive system, our hormonal system flourishing through the body. The movement of that chemistry is the communication and the connection that happens because we're compressing energy. It generates a vibration which generates movement. And so that's the Chakra 11 aspect of us. So what that translates to in like regular speak is we're designed to be in flow. We're designed to be in movement, which is why, you know,

• 1:49:51Speaker 00

  our popular conversation is find your flow, get in your flow, get in your, get in that rhythm of your life and allow life to be this stream because it's our true nature. It's how we come in. And so then Chakra 10 is the quality of consciousness that does receive, that does have. It's the gathering and the presencing of self here in this dimension. And so it's like a vessel that fills and fills and fills. And when the vessel fills and it brims over the top, this statement of, you know, when your cup runneth over kind of thing, that it's the often. ...of self that is building, like we're not jumping out ahead of ourselves.

• 1:50:34Speaker 00

  We're staying right on the self and allowing the self to cultivate and allowing presence to cultivate inside this system. And as it does, we awaken up through this primitive level of survival into flourishing and abundance and sharing because we can feel it. We know who we are. We know that this is for us. It isn't against us. And it's an experience that we are generating for ourselves. And so there's a level of consciousness that is revelatory in that way, which I mentioned before. But as you see in this map, it's like one leads to another, leads to another, leads to another. And in this revelatory state, we realize that this essence, this unified field, this

• 1:51:16Speaker 00

  infinite possibility is in our favor. It's in our favor. It's not against us. Life is not against us. And if we are perceiving it as such, we are choosing a smaller reality for ourselves than we could. We could choose a bigger reality. And the way to find it is ironically to go deeper. The deeper we go, the sooner we find that pure stream that is that through line that is following this whole map that we've flashed up and shown people. And so we see life as a blessing. We see that we are being blessed and that we are offering ourselves into life in such a way that, you know, leaves it better than we found it in terms of this thing that we're

• 1:51:59Speaker 00

  in, this collective, you know, project that we're engaged in.

• 1:52:03Speaker 02

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• 1:53:05André Duqum?

  I love it. I love it. I, uh...

• 1:53:10André Duqum?

  I think these conversations can support people in experimenting and getting in touch with that space themselves. And to me, you know, where this really translates into how it changes people's day-to-day experience is kind of how we started this conversation, which is instead of orienting yourself towards the world to fulfill a sense of lack within yourself, you're moving from joy. And I'm just curious, what do you think is joy? And what happens when we start to move from that place and not in the search of it?

• 1:53:48Speaker 00

  Yeah, I have to say that in the transcendental experiences, the transpersonal experiences that I have had and continue to have, I just in this last month had another very large opening that happened in real time, actually, while I was teaching a course. And I was leading a big meditation. And usually I stay in this like role of, you know, supporting others. And it just sucked me in. And all of a sudden, I was in it, you know, having my own experience while I was, you know, trying to share and guide hundreds of people into this, you know, experience simultaneously. But the reason this one popped into my mind when you asked this question was that there

• 1:54:28Speaker 00

  was so much vibratory ecstatic joy in the midst of this moment that something just moved forward in my, um, in my reality in a, in a beautiful way. Here's what I know. Every time that I've had these, these massive openings, this sense of joy is almost unspeakable.

• 1:54:54Speaker 00

  Like, the one that I shared with in our other, in our other conversation, was just this exalted state, high above the earth, could see in every direction, you know, the same in a light so brilliantly bright. It was ten times brighter than the brightest thing I'd ever experienced, in the desert or anywhere else. And I was suspended above the earth, and I knew that this was the truth of, you know, who I was and who we are. And that we were engaging in a project here, in this, in this dimension. It's not, this isn't all that we are. It is who we are, but it's not all that we are. It's, we're more than meets this eye here. And so, the state of being in that exalted realm

• 1:55:39Speaker 00

  was complete joy. It's complete just peace and joy combined. Like, there was just nothing missing. There was nothing else, nothing to do, nothing to become, nothing except this pure illuminated truth about, you know, who we are and, and what we are. And these, you know, and then, you know, through the twenty year, twenty-five years, I've had multiple of these experiences, and every time, joy is a factor bigger than I knew before. And, and so, what I know is that when, when this energy is compressed, there's a vibration. And at its foundational level,

• 1:56:23Speaker 00

  that vibration is, in my experience, the most ecstatic presence of love and delight and joy that, that I could ever have, more than I could have ever imagined, more than I could have ever imagined. And so, I feel that it is the experience that happens when we decompress enough, but we are still in the body form, that we can feel the vibrations of the true essence of who we are. We can experience that on a vibrational level in the body. It feels beyond the body. It feels like it's in here and out here, to the point that there's no division between inner and outer. It's just an ecstatic presence.

• 1:57:08Speaker 00

  And I think the degree to which we open and integrate and embody Will determine the degree of consistent and sustainable life joyful life experience. That it's an opening, it's a decompression of an overly compressed state that we have generated upon ourselves because of an overuse of thinking without a present allowing an equal presence of love and breath inside the body. That when love and breath and consciousness are combined, and we decompress enough of our beliefs and our past experience through story of the history of our lives and the contractions that we created,

• 1:57:53Speaker 00

  that when enough of that is integrated, we release inside and we allow something more belonging to have a life and something more pure to be presencing itself in all different kinds of life experiences. And that vibration that is generated in those moments is what we call joy in my ability to translate that best I can.

• 1:58:19André Duqum?

  Yeah. Of course, beyond words. But in my similarly, in my experience, like those

• 1:58:29André Duqum?

  those experiences like expand you to a place where you cannot contract beyond that knowing. It's a reference point that kind of carries with you vibrationally, if you will, for throughout all that you do.

• 1:58:42André Duqum?

  And that's why I've found like, we're recently gonna, you know, this year, we're planning different live events to bring this community that's online and podcasts online in person to start exploring these, you know, these practices and these insights in person. Because for me, like, the transformational containers of like immersive experiences in person is where I've like really transformed and grown the most. When you really get to actually experience it and it's not a fanciful thing you hear on a show, you know. Yeah, as a side of people wanna, more information on that, we'll leave a link down in the description. I'm feeling just really excited about cultivating the community that can have these experiences and then go back into the rest of their life. And

• 1:59:25André Duqum?

  That insight and that expanded awareness carries into everything else they do and their relationships. And it's cool to see how you refer to this joy that is like ever increasing. Like there, once you think there's like a certain amount of love or joy that you can hold, you can like expand beyond that.

• 1:59:40Speaker 00

  Yes, yes.

• 1:59:41André Duqum?

  And keep going.

• 1:59:42Speaker 00

  It's a lot. And so it keeps me delving even deeper and building deeper circuitry and accepting even more and deepening my roots into, you know, like Chakra 10 is the invisible root chakra. You know, it's like they, the root chakra for this larger anatomy. So here's another image that shows this whole 12 chakra system and how they fit together. We have this, this immediate chakras, one through seven, that everyone's familiar with. And then there's an eight and a nine overhead and a 10 that is deep in the earth. And then an 11, which is the energy and the essence that is cycling inside this whole big chakra 12, you know, which is referenced as this light body or the energetic, you

• 2:00:24Speaker 00

  know, system, foundation that, that I'm deepening into, in Chakra 10 is referencing this divine destiny. It's like, it's your destiny to have this joy. It's your destiny to awaken to the ecstatic self while you're here, walking and talking and living right through the illusionary boundaries that we've been operating in. And so when we have these experiences, and I love that you're, you're gonna do some live events, because people love to do that. I know when I have my live events, people come and they just, they open up and they flourish and we find these frequencies that are, that are compounded with other people in the space doing the same thing.

• 2:01:06Speaker 00

  When someone in the space starts to get it, open up and integrate, you know, pop, pop, pop, pop, other people do the same because we're in coherence and we're just, you know, each other showing the way for these, these greater openings of embodiment. So. Inside of that, you know, as these openings keep happening with me, I start experiencing, you know, beyond the greatest experiences I had 20 years ago. It is, I couldn't begin to measure the difference in the life experience I'm having now in terms of even finding joy in situations that would have upset me previously. That I see it completely differently.

• 2:01:47Speaker 00

  And I delight in the project that humanity is creating for itself in the myriad of different vibrational presence, you know, presentations that are happening with different peoples, you know, and their varied beliefs and ways of operating, et cetera, that things that would have derailed me before, I find joy in it.

• 2:02:10André Duqum?

  There's something really powerful about just the comical nature of it, in a sense, and being able to laugh at yourself. Even when you get triggered, you still have a relative degree of like, like, the funny nature that you're being triggered by something you're perceiving outside of yourself. It's not like a detached essence. It's more of like, there's a, like, life is perfectly designed to trigger you for your own greatest evolution. And the more that you increasingly are aware of that, the more it's funny when you can kind of catch yourself slipping back into that.

• 2:02:47Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:02:47André Duqum?

  And to me, that just creates a little bit of separation also between like, taking it seriously and, you know, maintains more contact to be able to work with it.

• 2:02:57Speaker 00

  And you know what that is, in my perception? Is that's a way that self-love expresses, you're loving yourself. You're like, oh, come on, look what you just did. Come here, come here. You know, so like, come on, don't do that, let's do this instead.

• 2:03:10André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 2:03:10Speaker 00

  And by playing with it that way, that love is what we wanted to be experiencing when we landed here. And the people around us didn't know how to do that because they were lost in the splat as well. And so, we can generate that and we pick up right where we left off way back then because we're truly timeless. And so, if we'll allow that presence to be cultivated by ourselves, for ourselves, in the midst of all of this, it generates this beautiful, you know, life laboratory that is more like a playground than a laboratory.

• 2:03:50André Duqum?

  Yeah, there was, this happened a few days ago. I was just driving through LA. Traffic is crazy. This one person cut me off in like a crazy way. And I got irritated. And, but like immediately after, and like this person was like on their phone, just driving reckless, like super dumb. But I was, I saw myself getting irritated at it. And but like fairly short, within a couple of seconds after, I just kind of like chuckled at myself like, "Why aren't you acting the exact same way I want you to?" You know, like making light of how we subconsciously like, expect life to happen in the exact way we want it to.

• 2:04:32Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 2:04:33André Duqum?

  And, and then just like, you know, for me, that's just another way to kind of undermine the substantiality we give to like a lot of these triggers. It's almost like a table with like three legs. It's like, there's always, if you could always kick it out underneath you.

• 2:04:49Speaker 00

  Right, right.

• 2:04:50André Duqum?

  And to me, again, that's just another way to create a bit of self-love and just diffuse the seriousness we carry so much in life that causes so much suffering. So, yeah, it's just a funny example.

• 2:05:02Speaker 00

  Right. If the foundation of our being is, is, you know, Ananda, is bliss, is joy, is delight. If we can bring delight into the retraining process, then what we're doing is actually revisiting these parts and coming back and picking them up in a loving fashion. We're guiding and nurturing instead of trying to beat ourselves over the head for reacting. You know, now I have a reaction to the fact that I'm reacting. And, and that just tightens down the entanglement. And what we have to do is just breathe into that in a, in a loving and supportive way. And the next thing we know, we're, we're building a new structure based upon, you know, presence and possibility. And, and this realm that we try to achieve toward,

• 2:05:47Speaker 00

  all we have to do is start actioning from that place. And we begin to, you know, become that in all, in all of life's circumstances.

• 2:05:56André Duqum?

  Yeah, and to me, it feels like there's a progression there of when you get triggered, it's like an all-consuming, ever-pervasive distortion in your mind and your body, and you become it, you know? And then it's like you start to create a bit more distance, and it diffuses it, and maybe you just get pissed off for a little bit, you know, to then where it's like, instead of a forefront, forebrain takeover, it's sort of like, less of a shout and more of a whisper, you know? And like, it becomes more and more subtle in terms of the annoyance, the irritation, to the resistance to what is in every given circumstance. And then, the contemplative practices would say there's a point where you actually can dissolve the self. You're still fully involved in the world, but you're no longer ever under the presumption

• 2:06:42André Duqum?

  that life is happening to me. There is a solid self in which is a victim of the external circumstances happening in the world. Like, to that point is like, absolute freedom. The journey and the grading up there is ever-increasing access to more and more freedom, you know, energy. And, uh, and so, I love that you brought in self-love and kind of just self-compassion along the journey, because

• 2:07:08André Duqum?

  it allows you to continue to move on that path, you know?

• 2:07:12Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:07:13André Duqum?

  And realize that, like, this is very much so in many ways the game we're here to play, you know? And so, there's like, the irritation that we think the world is creating, and there is the second dagger that we twist into ourselves for the judgment of having the irritation, you know?

• 2:07:29Speaker 00

  Right.

• 2:07:29André Duqum?

  And so, like, I think that perspective, that is super helpful, to be able to stop twisting the arrow that you, that, you know, the world puts in you first.

• 2:07:39Speaker 00

  Right. At some point, we have to recognize that our response to all that is unfolding is ours to choose. And, you know, what I love doing is just bringing people into the self-enough, finding ways to stay and sit and breathe and be there, uh, that allows us to remain Compassionate and caring and presence, you know, because it's really the parts of us that we marginalized at the beginning of our life experience that we're having to go back and get. And the only way to call them back out of hiding is to be what we were unable to be when we shoved them aside. We didn't have the wherewithal to do that. So it is always going to be love, whether it's self-compassion

• 2:08:24Speaker 00

  or presence or just, you know, breathing slower, slow down your mind, create the space to allow for some of that to just come back into your working environment, into the recipe that you're operating from, so that you are now a rising presence instead of a hollow program that you were running on before.

• 2:08:47André Duqum?

  Yeah, and I think this is, this will continue to help ground a lot of this conversation is, for everybody that's listening right now, like, we all have had those early developmental experiences where something happened in our youth that was beyond our ability to process it in the moment, creating some sort of behavioral compensation, a shift in identity structure, a personality formation that becomes the color-tinted glasses in which we view the world through. And through many of the practices and insights and things we've been sharing in this conversation, you start to diffuse that, you start to get a bit more curious, you start to, what you could say is, take full custody of your inner child again, and you start to be a bit more soft around those triggers.

• 2:09:32André Duqum?

  And there, in your work, you explain the direct link between the emotional blockages that we have, the corresponding biological diseases and illness and sickness that can then come from it, those energy centers. And I think we largely just overlook how psychosomatic

• 2:09:54André Duqum?

  Physical diseases are, we think of them as purely physical, failing to realize there is an energetic and mental emotional component to it. So for everybody that can, you know, they, everybody listening right now has their own area of stuck energy. You know, to varying degrees, we're aware of it. There's, there's certain parts in our body that we feel it, certain organs that aren't functioning as well. And disease is one way that we become, it becomes glaringly obvious that there's an issue or, or blockage in our, in our system. Now, I would just love for you to share whatever you want in regards to how emotion and these sort of

• 2:10:34André Duqum?

  mental distortions and coping mechanisms are tied directly to the biological stuckness of energy and diseases that forthcoming after that, how they're kind of connected and how people can start to gain awareness and, and, and give loving attention to those, to those spaces. Which will then result in who knows what, but for a lot of people, big healings, greater joy and so on and so forth.

• 2:11:03Speaker 00

  Yeah, you know what, what people don't, many people don't realize is that the physical body is the caboose on a train that is being driven by the full-on acceptance of our, our conscious magnificence, really, our consciousness and the magnitude of it. And so if we're not aware of our magnificence in some way or another, and we're not, we're all learning and realizing and remembering, then what happens is the caboose can only go where the engine is taking it, right? It just follows the path. So the physical body is a reflection of what we're embracing and what we're rejecting. It's just as simple as that. So, well, it's not simple, it's very complex, and it runs our lives.

• 2:11:48Speaker 00

  But it is, it's, it's clear that the physiology is a reflection of what consciousness is being embraced and what is being rejected. And so if I am rejecting a part of my own, you know, ability, my capacity, my okayness, my well-being, my

• 2:12:04Speaker 00

  Fullness, my inherent sovereignty, then my physical body is going to reflect what happens when I live in a state of fear, or when I live in a state of anger, or resentment, or frustration. And so, we have a myriad of physical ailments that correlate to, you know, different shutdowns in the body that we were referring to earlier. And there's a place in the body where those energies impact us. In other words, there are certain patterns of effect that anger creates in the human system. And fear generates a different effect. And animosity, or resentment, or fear, anxiety, they each have their own

• 2:12:49Speaker 00

  pattern of influences in the physiology, which then influence the levels of consciousness that different organs and systems of the body correlate to. So, literally, there is a state of consciousness that is influencing, for example, our respiratory system. If I am in rejection to life, and I'm not exchanging easily with life, if I'm hesitant, I'm likely to develop respiratory issues, you know? If I am not digesting and metabolizing the things that happen in my life with accuracy and an open willingness that we've been speaking about here today, I'm likely to end up with a digestive issue in my physiology.

• 2:13:33Speaker 00

  If I am, you know, suppressing my desire to love and be unconditionally loving, and to be loved, and to love in some way, if I've shut down or put barriers around myself, it's, you know, there's just so much clinical evidence that shows us, you're going to end up with something showing up. You could easily, you know, see something show up in the physiology around the heart system.

• 2:13:59Speaker 00

  And so on. So, we know this correlation. We've known it for decades, and it's so important that people connect those dots. And what I know is that if we just ask in the body, "Where could I build the circuitry to better allow my consciousness to flow?" And for me to come to know these parts of myself better than I ever have, and embrace and accept them in some way that I haven't before, then I will have an effect on the chain reaction, the train reaction of how it's going to show up in my physiology. And so, by asking, "Where in the body could I build the circuitry?" And if your mind goes somewhere, don't be surprised if at some point, when you start working with that

• 2:14:42Speaker 00

  and anchor yourself in your body with these anchor points and breathe up and down in the central channel in the in-between moments, so that when you ask that question, it takes you somewhere. Don't be surprised if you sit there and breathe with that part of you that you've been directed toward. If a tear doesn't start to come down your face, or if some respiratory reset doesn't happen because you're synchronizing aspects of your physiology with aspects of your consciousness again for a reset. And you're getting another chance to allow that part of you to have a life, to come into your life.

• 2:15:24Speaker 00

  And when you do, you may feel that you fall into what may feel like a deep, dark well for a minute. Just fall. Don't resist it. Don't let your thinking mind kick in and try to understand what's going on. Just know that, hey, you're here in a safe space. There's nothing going to happen. It's just you. It's just energy. But you will fall into what will feel like a void, a deep, dark well. People talk about it all the time. And if that's happening, you're falling into the parts of you that you've not allowed to develop because they were set aside for all these years. So when you fall into them and you start to welcome them back into the mix, they don't have a name. They don't have a familiar face.

• 2:16:08Speaker 00

  These parts of your consciousness, it looks like you don't know who you are, you don't know what's going on. But if you will let that be, and you'll just drop into it with compassion. Just like, you know, there was a moment in my life when this started happening with me. These openings were happening. I didn't know what was going on, and my life was changing rapidly. A relationship ended. I was going out and teaching instead of just being in my clinic all the time. Flights were always canceled, and I had to cancel patients Monday morning because I couldn't get back to the clinic in time. And lost my, my mother made her transition. She was my best friend. It was just all this stuff, like in a short period of time. And I was headed to the clinic one day, turned back because I forgot something, had to go back, walked past my bed to get to my closet to get the thing,

• 2:16:52Speaker 00

  fell onto my bed, just broke, you know? And in that moment, I thought, you know, I'm having a breakdown. But actually, I was breaking in, and I was falling and falling and falling. And tears were just coming. And I was just like, out of it, lost, spinning and spinning, falling down some deep, dark well. And, and something happened in that moment where I, I let go for the first time in my life. I didn't try to control and get myself together so I could get to work and see those patients. I just was like, I'm having it. I just fell, and I just felt everything just falling away.

• 2:17:31Speaker 00

  And I felt like, if I lose it all, at least I'll have me. I found a me that I had never known before. So it was this pinnacle transformative moment where, cha, nothing was real except this connection. Now, my consciousness had landed on a part of me that was unconditional, was unwavering, was timeless, it was always going to be there. And, and I, you know, it knew, I knew it in some way, but it wasn't an intellectual process, it just had me. And I was crying and crying, and all of a sudden, I was laughing and laughing. And in the midst of that greatest pain was the most magnificent joy I had ever experienced in the body. This was after my first experience that I had shared with you,

• 2:18:16Speaker 00

  and, you know, maybe, maybe 10 years later. But now I was having that experience in the body. And I just, it didn't, nothing mattered because this joy was here. It was like, oh, my God, I'm like free in the midst of all of this pain that was happening in my life. So I know that

• 2:18:34Speaker 00

  When that is happening, when transition, transformation is happening with an individual, it's gonna come with a lot of unfamiliarity. It's gonna come with letting go of your educated mind. And, you know, I was trained and, you know, as a doctor and a scientist and had to get all these results. And that part of me, just the logical part of me, just let go. And there was such a freedom. Not that you then throw logic out the window from here on out, but it got to share the space with something greater than itself. You know, we can't live in a logical world and pray for a miracle. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't make good logical sense to do that. You know, we could open up and allow for what is beyond logic to play a role in what we are gathering and organizing

• 2:19:18Speaker 00

  and the information that we are, you know, choosing to live from. If, if that is where we find our stability, we can increase our territory in that way.

• 2:19:27André Duqum?

  Amazing, amazing. Thank you for sharing. Yeah, I know those moments where you surrender into the full acceptance of feeling your feelings, you know, which I think most of us probably, you know, I definitely probably also perceive, think like it's, it's this big catastrophic thing that's gonna take you over forever as opposed to minutes to an hour of fully being with what is, right?

• 2:19:57Speaker 00

  It was minutes. Changed my life forever.

• 2:20:00André Duqum?

  Wow. So you would say you, the circumstances that led up to you like fully breaking in, as you said, into this experience within a couple of minutes, you, would you say you stopped trying to hold it together?

• 2:20:15Speaker 00

  Yep, and it came together.

• 2:20:18André Duqum?

  It's funny how that works.

• 2:20:20Speaker 00

  Right. It's like, oh, if there's a bigger system here trying to do its thing, and if I just let it, it will.

• 2:20:26André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 2:20:27Speaker 00

  And that bigger system I had had a direct experience with in the meditations that I shared with you. I knew about it. I lived it. I was there. And then I was walking in this world, trying my best to figure it out. And at the end of the day, the only way to own it in this body was to let go, was to stop trying.

• 2:20:47André Duqum?

  Do you think that we largely just need those external triggers to really go there? Because I think

• 2:20:56André Duqum?

  Like, if we live long enough, we're gonna have really challenging like dark nights or moments where we're kind of forced to go there. I think the invitation is that like, while those may occur, there's also a possibility to like access that without everything around you crumbling. But I feel like it's harder when you don't have that forcing, universal kind of arm wrestle where you're forced to go there. You got no other option, right?

• 2:21:21Speaker 00

  Right, right. It settles us, you know, it stills us when, you know, I was in a state of overwhelm. I had so many things happening at the same time. And I was very capable as a kid, broad shoulders, I can do this, you know, that whole thing. So that was my go-to, always. And it was the personality that I developed. And then we lose sight of the fact that it developed. And we think that's who we are and who we've always been and all that is. And it's not, but it's what we operate as if. And so it had to crack because it was gonna limit me. The very thing that I thought had gained the strength that brought me here wasn't gonna get me there, wasn't gonna get me to the rest. And so it had to dissolve. And so the circumstances were collecting in intensity

• 2:22:05Speaker 00

  in proportion to my stubbornness based upon the strength that I knew. I knew what it had taken to get me through the life circumstances of abuse and abandonment and the things that had happened in my childhood and growing up. I knew what it took to get okay with that. But it wasn't really okay. It was survivorship. It really was an open presence and acceptance and piercing the veil of this illusionary world that we are living in here. It wasn't really victorious. It was winning the battle, but it wasn't the ultimate destination. It wasn't the fulfillment. And so by having all these things collect,

• 2:22:48Speaker 00

  it was enough to implode and boom, you know, and it was free. So your question is, you know, is that necessary? No, just surrender voluntarily sooner. Just keep in a state of surrender and witness and maintain your strength and clarity and your willingness to move forward in life and to do good and to be all that you can be and to offer up all that you do know, open and available to everything else that's available for you to know. And when that comes together, we don't have to suffer to awaken.

• 2:23:19Speaker 00

  But what I know is that if we suffer, it could contribute to our awakening. So it can explain the suffering that's been happening. And if we could use it to our advantage, and we can, by building circuits and by being present inside the system, then we can translate that, those circumstances, in a non-suffering way sooner. So I think that as we just become conscientious people, and we care, and we allow ourselves to come home, and we anchor in this system in the way that it's designed to be utilized, we will automatically become conscientious and compassionate people. Because that's the nature of our truest nature. It's who we are. It's what we're made of.

• 2:24:03Speaker 00

  And so we become more loving, because we're less afraid. The moment we stop fearing, the next thing that's going to happen is we're going to start loving. And so the moment something that we were afraid of is over, you'll notice this in life, everybody that's watching. The moment that something you've been afraid of is over, you feel so uplifted. You just want to hug everybody. It's all good, right? Because you get past the fear, and something else gets to emerge. So what if we learn to just embrace the fear? Not get past it. What if we reinterpreted fear? And we can start with our physiology. When you feel what you think is fear in your body, understand in that moment, this could be signaling something different than what I think it is.

• 2:24:46Speaker 00

  It could be the activation of my true self, thinking that this is a now moment that I could come out. And instead of shutting it down and getting away from it, you open, let it, come on out. Let's do this. Let's have it.

• 2:25:00Speaker 02

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• 2:25:59André Duqum?

  It's interesting because I could hear probably a lot of people that are listening to this conversation say like, oh, I want that. I want that level of breakthrough. I want that moment of realization. In many ways, it's the lack of the I that wants the experience where the experience becomes possible. You know, the I that wants to break through, the I that wants the alignment is the barrier to the very thing. And like your surrender, the surrender you're talking to is beyond the self you've been, you've been, right? And so I, I think of like how all the incredible remissions that happen from the physical lens. You know, there's been many cases with people that have multiple personality disorder.

• 2:26:44André Duqum?

  And one personality is allergic to oranges. The other one is left-handed. The other one has an accent. This is all one person.

• 2:26:52Speaker 00

  Yeah.

• 2:26:52André Duqum?

  Having different fractured parts of their mind that have correlated realities according to their personalities. And, you know, I've seen this even my sister recently. She's got deep into meditation. I'm so happy for her. She's been suffering with eczema and allergies to nuts her whole life. And that just completely went away after a few months of meditating.

• 2:27:13Speaker 00

  That's so funny.

• 2:27:13André Duqum?

  Like an hour or two a day. And it's just, it's so cool what becomes available when you start to stop being in resistance, however subtle. Like we're so often living life on the surface of personality instead of the goldmine of spirit that is available to us beneath that. And. To think that it may be as little as a few minutes of feeling something fully, to be able to access that and live from that place is both hysterical and frustrating.

• 2:27:45Speaker 00

  Yeah, right.

• 2:27:46André Duqum?

  And.

• 2:27:47Speaker 00

  It's so ironic.

• 2:27:48André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 2:27:48Speaker 00

  It's all of the all, all of the all. In my clinic, I was working with people that I had a couple of patients early on, the first couple of years that I was in practice, that were, one was multiple personality and the other one was actually considered to be schizophrenic. And, you know, that one, the second one was brought in, you know, with family members and, and, you know, just supported in terms of us working together. And I was doing some hands-on work that is bioenergetic work where we're rearranging, sort of like acupuncture, but it's taking into account, how did this energy get distorted? And it always goes back to consciousness. There's a distortion in the field that then shows up in the body, you know, that we can, we can track these things in the field before they even show up in the person's physical

• 2:28:33Speaker 00

  experience. You can measure that there's, there's interference in the field and then someone steps off the curb and breaks their ankle. And so we can, we can address the disturbance in the field and preempt, you know, these things that are showing physically. So it's fascinating when we start working with this invisible world. So in working with balancing the energy flow through these individuals, Aina was her name. She, she was, she was, there were times that she would come in and she would not know me at all. And, you know, she was a different version of herself. This one had diabetic symptoms and another version of her had none.

• 2:29:14Speaker 00

  And the version that had none remembered me, knew me every time. And so I could tell in an instant what we were going to be working on as, as she would come in. And as these things integrated, she became aware of the other. Which she wasn't initially. And in such, she began to work it out. One interacting with the other, having conversations between the two. And as such, it was through meditation and deep breathing, and me routing the energy and just facilitating that process for her, that she was able to, you know, bring that together. And wasn't plagued by having no awareness of, you know, of the other version of herself.

• 2:29:58Speaker 00

  And there were others as well, but these two versions of herself were the ones, are the ones that stick out in my mind many, many years ago. But it was just a miraculous transformative thing, that she became highly functioning in the world, able to have a job and, and, you know, have a life experience that she wasn't able to have before. All because these, these different compartments that we develop as a survival strategy are now no longer necessary. And the, and the, but the primary thing that was happening there was a deep, slow, channeled breath that was slowing her down so much that she could come present to herself in a way that she had never been able to.

• 2:30:42Speaker 00

  She had an abusive past and had just, you know, clamped down to, to survive.

• 2:30:47André Duqum?

  Wow. Yeah, I think those cases where it becomes way more like dense or obvious and the multiple personalities is like, is one end of the spectrum. And then we can like all relate to that in our own individual ways, right? In a more subtle sense perhaps, in different ways.

• 2:31:08André Duqum?

  Yeah, I, I, I'm curious. So like if you, if you had 60 seconds, this is a big question, take time if you need. If you had 60 seconds to whisper a message into the hearts of humanity and everybody was listening, what would you say?

• 2:31:26Speaker 00

  So.

• 2:31:28Speaker 00

  There is nothing broken, there is nothing missing, there is nothing wrong. You are here, whole and complete, and you are on a project of discovering that. And you are constantly supported and guided through this process. It is a direct through line, right here. You are the unified field come into physical form. And you are here to pierce through the illusion and experience yourself as the great, deep, joyful presence that you are. You'll do so by embracing more than you reject and by accepting more than what you've denied inside of yourself and to step forward in what is true. It won't require courage, it might feel like it in the beginning, but at the end of the

• 2:32:12Speaker 00

  day, it's just the flow of this divine continuum pouring through into your life. And let it do exactly what it is meant to do. Let yourself have the life that you're meant to have. I don't know if that was 60 seconds or not, but-

• 2:32:28André Duqum?

  It was perfect what it was. If there was a mic that you were holding, I'd ask for you to drop it. That was beautiful. Yeah, we started with puppies and we ended in bliss.

• 2:32:39Speaker 00

  And we ended in bliss, that's it.

• 2:32:40André Duqum?

  I guess they're the same thing.

• 2:32:41Speaker 00

  That's it. Right.

• 2:32:46André Duqum?

  Yeah, we've been going for almost two and a half hours.

• 2:32:48Speaker 00

  Wow, wow.

• 2:32:49André Duqum?

  Just drop into a portal.

• 2:32:50Speaker 00

  Timeless.

• 2:32:51André Duqum?

  Yeah, I feel like we could talk for days and not get tired just because, you know, there's a lot of different kinds of conversations and I feel grateful to be able to have many different types of conversations on this podcast. But there's certain conversations that I feel like a little, or a little or a lot more just energetic resonance with it and how deep we can go. And so, thank you for being able to dance with me in that realm.

• 2:33:17Speaker 00

  Absolutely. I'm thrilled, you know, I'm around the world and lots of interviews and engagements and, you know, all of that, conferences, et cetera. And being with you in this space is something that I was very much looking forward to today because of my past experience with you. And thank you for who you are to allow this to be shared, so.

• 2:33:37André Duqum?

  Thank you. It's my honor as well, and- Just last couple of words. People will leave links down in the description for where people can stay connected with you, your work. I think you have a guide to meditation as well. So any words on just exciting offerings, things that you have coming up and people can stay connected with you?

• 2:33:58Speaker 00

  Well, loving the launching of this book. This book, Anatomy of Awakening, is all about what we're talking about. It's about how tos, lots of practices inside of it, just bringing into consideration people from all different angles and levels of experience and states of study, different studies that bring us together in conversations like this. And keeping all that in mind, that's what the book is presenting. And I also have in-person courses or classes and experiences. I take people on Journey Awake excursions to sacred sites around the world, to Egypt and to India and to Sacred France with the Mary Magdalene tour and all kinds of fun stuff like that, just playing with, hey, these truths have been here forever and boy, did

• 2:34:43Speaker 00

  we forget. And so this is how we remember doing all these kinds of things, lots of online courses, et cetera. I live for the offering of information that is going to help humanity get it together and have the beautiful life experience that we're intended to be having on this planet, regardless of our external circumstances. We're here to bring it and to transform what we see.

• 2:35:04André Duqum?

  Well said. Well, round two, complete. Thank you. Yeah, I appreciate you. I'm excited to go hang out with the pups for a little bit.

• 2:35:13Speaker 00

  Okay, let's go do that.

• 2:35:15André Duqum?

  And yeah, just congrats on everything. I know it's no small endeavor to write a book where you pour yourself into it. It takes a lot of time and energy and commitment and devotion. So congratulations on that and all your offerings in the world.

• 2:35:29Speaker 00

  Thanks much.

• 2:35:29André Duqum?

  Yeah.

• 2:35:30Speaker 00

  Thank you, thank you.

• 2:35:30André Duqum?

  Everybody, I feel you very deeply. I appreciate you for tuning into this episode of the Know thyself Podcast. Let us know in what ways this resonated with the journey that you currently find yourself on. Until next time, be well.