Bernie’s Billionaire Tax, Mamdani vs. Amazon & Bukele Takes On Haiti’s Gangs | The Tom Bilyeu Show

Welcome to Impact Theory. In today’s episode, the team breaks down a hot October inflation report, with consumer prices up 0.4% and Fed officials floating a December rate hike, possibly a half-point. Tom argues that hiking into a weak, supply-shocked economy could repeat the European Central Bank’s 2008 and 2011 mistakes, while admitting he’s glad he isn’t the one making the call. Next, Nvidia and Jensen Huang face a shareholder class action alleging they misled investors about his relationship with a Megaspeed executive reportedly suspected of spying for China. Then the team reacts to Anthropic’s report that Claude Fable 5.2 coordinated more than a thousand subagents over eight days to build a bootable operating system. They also debate AI-made games and short films and who actually captures the money, and dig into SpaceX’s request to launch up to a million solar-powered satellites as orbital AI data centers. On the political side, Rep.-elect Don Leonard says senior House Democrats warned him of a “living hell” if he didn’t back Hakeem Jeffries unconditionally. Bernie Sanders vows a federal billionaire tax after California’s Prop 40 falls short, and the House sends Thomas Massie’s Hegseth impeachment resolution to committee in a 211–204 vote. The room splits over Mayor Zohran Mamdani’s push for the Delivery Protection Act and whether Amazon’s contractor model is a loophole or a rational answer to regulation. Finally, the team covers Nayib Bukele sending special forces into Haiti after gangs kidnapped four Salvadoran aviation technicians, and James Gunn and Peter Safran’s exit from DC Studios under David Ellison. Super Chats cover Godzilla Minus One, unions, and why foreign central banks are buying gold. Note: This episode contains opinion and commentary on developing stories, including the Nvidia shareholder lawsuit and unproven espionage allegations, Rep.-elect Don Leonard’s claims about House Democrats, and El Salvador’s operation in Haiti. Views expressed are the hosts’ own, and nothing in this episode is financial advice. What's up, everybody? It's Tom Bilyeu here: Want my help starting a business? Join me here inside Zero To Founder https://tombilyeu.com/zero-to-founder?utm_campaign=Podcast%20Offer&utm_source=podca[%E2%80%A6]d%20end%20of%20show&utm_content=podcast%20ad%20end%20of%20show Sign up for my AI Masterclass: AI Masterclass https://tombilyeu.com/ai-masterclass?utm_campaign=Live%20Masterclass&utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=evergreen Follow Me: Instagram:https://www.instagram.com/tombilyeu/ Tik Tok:https://www.tiktok.com/@tombilyeu?lang=en Twitter:https://twitter.com/tombilyeu YouTube:https://www.youtube.com/@TomBilyeu Tailor Brands: Check out Tailor Brands to launch your business starting at $0 + state fees: https://bit.ly/TailorBrandsSept Quince: Free shipping and 365-day returns at https://quince.com/impactpod Pipedrive: Get more leads and grow your business. Go to https://www.pipedrive.com/impact and get started with a 30-day free trial. Incogni: Take your personal data back with Incogni! Use code IMPACT at the link below and get 60% off an annual plan: https://incogni.com/impact HeyGen: Create your first three AI videos for free at https://heygen.com/impact. Tailor Brands: Check out Tailor Brands to launch your business starting at $0 + state fees: https://bit.ly/TailorBrandsSept See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:01Speaker 00

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• 0:30Tom Bilyeu?

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• 1:15Tom Bilyeu?

  Their dashboard tracks what comes next based on what your business actually needs. So EIN number, registered agent, licenses and permits, bookkeeping, business banking. I tell every founder the same thing. Just make it official. Click the link in the show notes to check out Tailor Brands and get started on your business today. This is a paid advertisement. Hot inflation data is causing the Fed to consider a potentially fatal mistake. The Nvidia situation just keeps getting worse with mega lawsuits and a political blast radius that keeps getting bigger. The dirty dealings of the Democratic Party are going viral as members elect are putting private conversations on blast that reveal intra-party threats.

• 2:00Tom Bilyeu?

  We're going to get into that. Bernie Sanders has a solution for the entire economy. Burn it all down. We've got the crazy ass details. You're going to have some fun with that. The situation in Haiti is absolutely insane as Bukele makes good on a promise that you guys won't believe. There's footage there, man. You'll be able to see it firsthand. Elon's latest project is sci-fi scale madness in the best way possible. You can hate him all you want, but wait until you hear what he's building now. And James Gunn's DC Universe just ran headlong into the buzzsaw that is the Ellison takeover of Warner Brothers. We've got the gory details. All of that and more today on the Tom, Bill, you show live. Welcome, everybody. All right.

• 2:43Tom Bilyeu?

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• 3:19Speaker 02

  Happy Veterans Day.

• 3:21Tom Bilyeu?

  It's Veterans Day, everybody. Shout out to my dad, by the way, who's a veteran. Shout out to anybody that has served this country. You have my mad respect. I know that these days it is somewhat controversial, but nonetheless, I am wildly on fire for everybody that has served this country. Put your life at risk so that we could all have the benefits of the most prosperous nation the world has ever seen. Now, we're going to get into some of the realities of being that prosperous economy right about now. Hot inflation data is causing the Fed to consider a potentially fatal mistake that we're going to be talking about. The October Consumer Price Index just came out November 10th and prices rose 0.4% in one month.

• 4:02Tom Bilyeu?

  That was hotter than economists forecast, which always creates a lot of drama, usually more drama than the numbers warrant. But nonetheless, that's where we're at. You're going to see that the Fed's likely reaction is not going to be the best, given the weakness of the economy. Now, the core inflation, which strips out food and energy, rose by 0.3%. And that's got the Fed increasingly convinced that they're going to have to raise rates. We're hearing a lot more noise about rates going up in December. Originally looked like maybe there for a second. We weren't, wasn't, but like maybe a week ago that we were talking about the fact that yeah, probably going to be chill in December. They're most likely going to hold. Now that likelihood is moving in the opposite direction.

• 4:46Tom Bilyeu?

  The problem is that they would be raising rates into a very weak economy where consumers are getting poorer by the day. Literally, if you look at just the raw numbers, you can paint one story. But if you think about the fact that people are actually from a purchasing power perspective, they are moving in the wrong direction. So inflation continues to run hotter than real wage increase. As long as that is true, then you're in a dicey position because things are already getting more expensive. September spike was basically a gas story. So everything that was going on in Iran caused gasoline to jump 9.1% that month and just 1% in October.

• 5:30Tom Bilyeu?

  So that is actually cooling off. So the thing that caused the spike in September has stopped. So with gasoline nearly flat, the headline should have fallen a lot further than it did, but it only got to 0.4 because food basically has taken over, driving the costs up. I think there was also a spike in housing that's causing much of the spike as well. So when you start looking at the day to day things that are problematic for people, they continue to move in the wrong direction. Now, the mechanism is diesel. So gasoline hits you at the pump, but diesel hits you at the shelf. So it takes longer to work its way through the economy.

• 6:13Tom Bilyeu?

  And that was basically the original story was, hey, this is going to be pretty narrow. This is something that typically an energy shock won't last very long. It will be very acute. It will cause sort of immediate term problems, but then it tends to dissipate very quickly. The problem is when you have diesel dragging on as long as it has, it begins to work its way through the economy. And that is the broadening that we see. So diesel set a record above $6.50 a gallon in September. It averaged about $6.25 in October, roughly $2.50 more than a year earlier. Ouch. And that was obviously a big part of what we saw in the actual elections. Trucking costs were already up 19% by September.

• 6:58Tom Bilyeu?

  And those costs ultimately land on producers first and then reach store prices a month or two later. In October is when they started arriving. So we're starting to see all of that work its way through. Now, services are also becoming a problem and most of it unfortunately doesn't have to do with oil, which means that you're likely to see that continue to spread through the economy. So if you strip out food, housing and energy, services still rose by 0.4%, pushed by transportation, medical care and insurance. Over the last three months, core inflation ran at a 3.7% annual pace, which is the fastest of the year.

• 7:41Tom Bilyeu?

  Gas prices go up, but you can expect them to come back down. Insurance premiums, however, and hospital bills, once they go up, they don't come back down. And therein lies the problem. So the Fed is about to raise rates into a supply shock at a point where people are extremely paranoid about their, about what will happen to them if they get laid off. So most people aren't paranoid about their own job prospects, but the vibe of a recent poll that's trying to check consumer expectations of inflation, which are hugely important because it will drive their spending behavior. Their expectations are that if they lose their job, they are very likely to be in a dire situation.

• 8:26Tom Bilyeu?

  And their ratings on that likelihood of being, I think the average right now is like seven months. So if you lose your job, you're going to be looking for another job for seven months. That is a cliff that people do not like looking at when they see it. And that is the highest rating that they've given it in terms of a fear index since, I think, April of 2020. So imagine the last time that we were in this position was when we were at the absolute height of the paranoia about the pandemic. People were losing their jobs hand over fist. And so all of this uncertainty is going to be made even worse if the Fed ends up jacking the rates. Now, the Fed is looking at inflation that is broadening.

• 9:11Tom Bilyeu?

  And so they're thinking, oh, we have one tool. And the only tool that we have is to restrict loans by making the rates more expensive. But if you do that and you drop people out of the job market because you make it harder for companies to run, then now you're putting people into the very thing that they're absolutely terrified of, which is if I lose my job, it is going to be a very big problem. And this is something that has been made famous by a guy named Trichet. And he was working at the European Central Bank. And the whole idea is, so July 3rd, 2008, the European Central Bank decides to raise rates to 4.25%.

• 9:53Tom Bilyeu?

  And its president, Jean-Claude Trichet, said that the move was needed to stop an oil shock from spreading into other prices and to keep inflation expectations anchored. So it sounds very familiar. The problem is, we now know what he didn't know at the time, which was that the economy was actually very, very weak. And so when you make that kind of cut into an economy that has a hidden weakness, let's say, at least they weren't fully thinking through the ramifications of what was going on in the housing market. When you do that, now you end up with a problem. So, oil was basically the whole story back then. So, you strip out energy and food and European inflation was under 2%.

• 10:37Tom Bilyeu?

  Lehman Brothers, though, ends up collapsing just 10 weeks later. By October, the bank realized, oh my God, we're in an emergency situation and we now have to cut rates. So, we take them up, only to have to, in a panic, start bringing them back down, which is exactly what people are worried about is going to happen now if they keep raising rates, because the underlying economy is still weak. And so, if you're looking at things from AI being hot, because from an investing standpoint, it's still the hottest thing around. It has certainly had some corrections as of late. But that is one of the big things that is driving the inflation that we see now. You see so much competition for just investment dollars pouring into that for the economic build out.

• 11:21Tom Bilyeu?

  But also, could be a part of what could exacerbate a turn down in the economy if it keeps going in the wrong direction and these companies keep pulling back. And the very thing that we are counting on to drive a lot of new jobs, especially for working class Americans. If that all begins to dry up, which is certainly the direction of travel right now, you're cutting into a period where you have weakness. And the very thing that people are right to be paranoid about is how long they would be without a job if they got laid off. So, Trichet basically ends up putting himself in that position. He does it again in 2011. He puts two hikes on an energy spike that forces everybody straight into a debt crisis.

• 12:03Tom Bilyeu?

  And his successor, Mario Draghi, basically started reversing all of those decisions at the first meeting. And so, spreading price pressure and anchored expectations at the Fed, that is their exact argument today. So, we very much are running the risk that we put ourselves back in that same situation. When you cut into a weakened economy, you make things worse. Then you panic and try to reverse course. And that makes the, basically, the dollar become far more weak. And that creates all kinds of problems, certainly outside of the US. And so, we'll be talking more about that as we get into some later segments. But that is the big fear that people have right now is that,

• 12:46Tom Bilyeu?

  yes, understood that from the upside of the K perspective, you have pressures that are still sucking a lot of money into AI specifically in this case. That is driving some of the inflation. But you're not going to get the response that you want by cutting, because you already have a non-productive economy that is weak, that people have high expectations around paranoia of. And so, you end up creating a death spiral, essentially, where your only thing is to immediately reverse course and begin backing out of this. So, we'll see if that actually comes to pass. This is all a December question. It hasn't been settled right now, but more and more of the Fed chairs are starting to talk about exactly that.

• 13:28Tom Bilyeu?

  Not only talking about a 25 basis point hike, but some are saying we might need a 50 basis point hike. So, you can imagine fragile economy meets a 50-point basis hike. That causes a contraction. And then that causes people to get laid off, which causes them to be in a death cycle, which is already bad. And this could, that kind of move would likely exacerbate that. So, seven months becomes what? It becomes nine, becomes more than that. So, that's where all of the anxiety is resting right now. We're hitting pause for a moment, but there's plenty more ahead, so don't go anywhere.

• 14:10Tom Bilyeu?

  Thanks for sticking around. Let's get right back into the action.

• 14:12Speaker 02

  I'm always told that the Fed is doing this to just control liquidity and how money flows. There is there, I didn't know there was a direct correlation with them raising rates leading to companies, I guess, feeling less cash strapped. And that's what would lead to the layoffs? I'm trying to think how the rates jump to the layoff part. What's that?

• 14:28Tom Bilyeu?

  So, when, if you're restricting the rate at which companies can get capital, then they're not going to be investing. They're not going to be focused on growth. They're either going to be focused on holding steady or contracting, either of which is bad for an economy that's looking for more jobs. So, if you imagine that part of the reason that we're holding steady right now is that you have low firing rates and you have slow growth rates. If you can get low firing rates and high growth rates, now you're in a position where the worker starts to become empowered, because there are a lot of jobs vying for their talents. And so, they're looking around and saying, hey, I can work wherever I want to work. Not wherever, but I've got options.

• 15:11Tom Bilyeu?

  And when I have options and I can negotiate a better salary if I don't want to leave, or I can go jump ship and get more money at this new job. But when there are few jobs available, now all of a sudden, being let go becomes this terminal affair where it's like, it is so hard to get a new job. Not because everybody's getting laid off. It's hard to get a new job because people are like, I don't know that we're hiring right now. That's where luxury brands are not charging you more for better cashmere. You're paying for the storefront, the ad budget, the name on the tag. But Quince cuts all of that out. They work directly with ethical factories. They skip the middlemen and sell 100% Mongolian cashmere, starting at just 60 bucks. 50 to 80% less than similar brands.

• 15:55Tom Bilyeu?

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• 16:37Tom Bilyeu?

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• 17:19Tom Bilyeu?

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• 18:02Tom Bilyeu?

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• 18:44Tom Bilyeu?

  Again, that's pipedrive.com/impact and you can be up and running in just minutes. Where we are today. Now imagine that you have fewer people getting jobs or just less jobs available and there are more people looking for those jobs. So, now you've got a position where the companies are empowered, because you have a large group of people looking for the few jobs that actually exist. And so, that disempowers them. They are more likely to stay at a company even if they're unhappy with the circumstances or the wage. And so, my drumbeat is just over and over and over. You've got to empower your middle-class workers. If you don't find a way to empower your middle-class workers, to put them in a position where they can actually get a wage that outpaces inflation,

• 19:29Tom Bilyeu?

  a wage growth that outpaces inflation, then you're back into a bad place. And right now, we're sort of in this steady state where, okay, don't have a lot of new jobs. One month, we got good jobs data, right? Jobs data comes out much higher than people expected. That's great news. One dot on the plot, though, does not make a line. And so, we need to see if that continues going up or if it comes back down. But the thing that would make it come back down almost immediately would be a rate hike. So, that's where it's like, ooh, you've got to be very careful. The jobs that are coming online at least are no longer just healthcare. That's a very good sign that there are more jobs coming on in the market in a more diverse way.

• 20:12Tom Bilyeu?

  Because when I look at healthcare, I get very skeptical that you're looking at more administrators. You're looking at a defunct system that is basically just pilfering from people. So, I never get super excited to hear about that.

• 20:25Tom Bilyeu?

  When you start seeing it broaden out like we are now, then there's a moment of like, oh, this might go somewhere. So, when you see the Fed standing there with a gigantic hammer that says, I'm about to fuck all of this up, that's where you start going, hmm, we may not get the relief that we were hoping for.

• 20:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, and to your point, this is from the Kubisi letter. Inflation has wiped out all of US consumer wage gains since the 2020 pandemic. So, to your point, inflation is outpacing wage growth.

• 20:52Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, if anybody's looking at that graph, not only is it outpacing it, but now it's beginning to tick up. So, the growth of the gap between the two is already accelerating. And the question is, will it continue to accelerate? If it continues to accelerate, then things get worse. And this is where the midterms were a referendum on, I feel poorer. And this graph says, that's only going to get worse. And so, now the question becomes, so one of the big complaints and one of the things that's driving the inflation that we see right now is tariffs. Here's the problem with tariffs. Tariffs is a stand-in for, you must do something to incentivize companies to bring the employees home. Also, the fact that we have stopped importing cheap labor is fantastic.

• 21:37Tom Bilyeu?

  It will drive costs, but it drives tariffs. And stopping importing cheap labor drive costs, but they're driving costs by giving American working-class.

• 21:51Tom Bilyeu?

  Workers more leverage in their negotiations. That is the thing that we should want. And so that's where it's like, listen, inflation is going to happen because of the economic setup that we have. So wishing for no inflation is a fool's errand. It's not going to happen. So now what you have to make sure is happening is that inflation is being driven largely by employees getting more money, that they're actually getting paid more. And that's what's driving up the cost. Now, if the employee is getting paid more and you're getting a sufficient level of innovation, which is exactly what people should hope for and want, though that is very anti the Democrat stance, but you should want employees making more money, not just at the executive level, like the average working class person making more money.

• 22:35Tom Bilyeu?

  They're then going to be driving costs up. But if the innovation is such that you maintain a lower rate of inflation than the amount that they're getting paid, now you're winning. But that, like, no matter what side of the aisle you're on, that is what you must do. You must get a situation where the workers are able to get more money, but you innovate your way out of a one for one handover of that inflation. We haven't been doing that for a long time. All of the innovation, all of the wins from the innovation is being captured by the executives and not by the average worker because of globalization, because of importing cheap

• 23:17Tom Bilyeu?

  labor, and that many of the gains are coming from technologies that don't require as many workers. That that is a very real thing. And obviously, AI looming is part of what has anxieties up there. But once you understand the basic mechanism of what you're trying to do, higher wages for the average employee, enough innovation that you outstrip a one to one trade off there, and then worker wages go up faster than the cost of things go up, and literally everybody's happy. Because then you can start inflating your debt away without hurting the average person. So yes, your inflation is going up and that makes your debt easier to deal with, but real wages are going up more, so everybody still feels richer. And you don't have to outstrip by much.

• 24:02Tom Bilyeu?

  Post-World War II, we were outstripping by, I want to say, one or 2%? Like, it wasn't a huge difference, but people were so optimistic because they knew, I'm going to be a little bit richer, I'm going to be able to afford a little bit more a month from now, a year from now, and my kids are likely to do even better than me. And when people have that kind of optimism, now your economy starts to turn. People are spending money, you have high turnover, high velocity of money. When you have high velocity of money, reasonable rates, real rates going up, that is the definitional boom, as long as people buy into it. If psychologically they get trapped like the Japanese, you can have other problems. But assuming that they feel that sense of growing wealth, then your economy really

• 24:45Tom Bilyeu?

  booms because you need people spending money. That velocity, that turnover of money goes a long way towards making people feel richer. So, but it's always going to be tied to, are there real wages going up or not?

• 24:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, we got on this by saying if the Fed raises rates, that's going to be a death blow, we should do the opposite. Are you saying that we should hold or do you even consider we should be lowering rates right now?

• 25:08Tom Bilyeu?

  Whenever I'm asked this question, I'm always going to give the same answer, which is thank God, I'm not the one making this decision. All I can say is I know what the setup is meant to look like. Now, me, as a person who is not a central banker, and I'll be the first to admit, most of those guys will have a far deeper understanding of the economy than I will, at least for now. Maybe that gap narrows by the day, but I am certainly cognizant of my limitations. Now, having said all of that, I will say that right now, holding steady seems like the only reasonable response, because you've got to explain to me what you see in terms of robust consumer spending, because I'm not seeing it. If you see robust consumer spending, if you see a shift in the attitude of people and

• 25:53Tom Bilyeu?

  they really believe this is going somewhere good, okay, cool, then you might be in a better spot and maybe we do need to cool down the AI junkies and get them to stop taking on so much debt. Cool, but that's not what I see. Right now, it's seven months to get a job, it's people ejecting out of the economy, meaning that they are, part of the reason that the unemployment rate is so low is people are leaving the workforce. Now, some of the leaving of the workforce is that we're not importing cheap labor, so you just don't have as many people flooding in, that's good. Some of it is people are aging out, that's good in terms of it gives the people who are still in more opportunities.

• 26:33Tom Bilyeu?

  However, it creates a somewhat delusional sense of how strong the jobless claims are. So, Warsh is talking about, this is like the best unemployment rate in generations, and that's where I'm like, eh, sort of? We've had so many people just say, I'm not, I'm not even trying anymore, because a seven month hunt for a job is so demoralizing, AI is so demoralizing. You know, I'm working class, let's say, and I'm looking at this and I'm like, my job is going away. So I'm not thinking about getting retrained, I'm thinking about what government handout can I ride out on so that I don't have to be engaged in the economy? And so I'm no longer looking.

• 27:14Tom Bilyeu?

  And I haven't done a re-dive on that in a few months, so it's possible that that number really has changed, but I have not seen any data that counteracts the initial deep dive that I did on this that was very distressing. It was like 8% of people who should be looking for jobs just aren't. And when you put that back in, now you're looking at a 12% unemployment rate, and that's pretty bad. So that's where I'm like, eh, yes, if you ignore the people who have exited out of the economy out of despair, the numbers look good. You start putting them back in, it's less rosy.

• 27:51Speaker 02

  Yeah, I was watching a podcast that was talking about black unemployment rate and black teens from 18 to 24, they're at 11.2% right now unemployment.

• 27:58Tom Bilyeu?

  God damn.

• 27:59Speaker 02

  When you start slicing into those specific demographics and different things and not just nationwide, the people who are looking for jobs is 4%, but then everybody who's working age, who's eligible for a job, the number's a lot, lot higher.

• 28:10Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah.

• 28:11Speaker 02

  One person who should be looking for a job but is not is Jensen Wong. Nvidia's crashing right now.

• 28:17Tom Bilyeu?

  You, do you actually want to see him out?

• 28:20Speaker 02

  No, I'm a founder guy, so I never want to see the founders leave. If he was, if it was like an Ellison situation, like HBO are like, this is CEO number seven, then yeah, get out of here, you're just trying to pump the stock number up. But he was a day-woner, so I kind of like people to control their company that they built. And plus, I feel like we're selectively being moral with that, like, people have sex every day, B, like, we can't get mad at him for that. It's the China export thing that we really need to figure out, but.

• 28:46Tom Bilyeu?

  It, it is, every clip of him ever is going to now be replayed in the context of, but you're dating a Chinese spy. So, yeah, also, the administration is getting sucked into this, but I'm getting ahead of myself. All right, the Nvidia situation, it just keeps getting worse. You've now got mega lawsuits, a political blast radius, it keeps getting bigger. And the case that's being brought against Nvidia is Kisten Mocker versus Nvidia. It was filed very recently in Northern District of California. One retail investor who's put in about 20 grand in purchases wants to represent basically everybody who's brought in a win, bought in a window. So from October 9th to November 8th, and, sorry, October 9th of '25 to November 8th of this year.

• 29:31Tom Bilyeu?

  And the whole theory around the fraud rests on some statements that Jensen has made. So Nvidia said that it found no sign its chips were diverted through MegaSpeed. Uh-oh, MegaSpeed is the company of Alice Huang, the woman that Jensen was having the affair with, or is, I'm so curious to know if this is still going on. A spokesman called Huang's contact with Alice Huang, and I quote, "not unusual or unexpected." So that one's going to hang out there, that's going to be hard for him to defend against. And Huang himself described the MegaSpeed dealings as "normal and not unusual." So you can imagine saying all of that before we find out that he's actually having an

• 30:12Tom Bilyeu?

  affair with her, somebody that the US Intelligence Committee has intimated is a spy. She hasn't been charged with anything, so I'm not sure the veracity of those claims, but that's certainly the jaundiced eye with which everybody is looking at this right now is, well, hold on a second, this guy was saying everything was fine? Everything, he's having an affair with a Chinese spy? You've got the US, Rubio wrote a private memo saying, hey, kids, I think he's involved with a Chinese spy. Trump was obviously brought into that and nonetheless took him to China. The policy around restricting China's access to advanced Nvidia chips changed in the window that he was having the affair with this woman from MegaSpeed.

• 30:55Tom Bilyeu?

  And now, obviously, there's increased scrutiny on exactly what MegaSpeed was doing, whether they were diverting chips to China or not. Now, the crazy thing is, China's response after all of this was going on, when Huang went to China, Jensen went to China, the answer was, all right, sure, our companies can buy these new H200 chips if they want, but I would really like them not to. So Beijing is putting pressure on them not to buy the chips. And I think it's only like 1% of Nvidia's chip revenue is coming from the H200s, the more advanced chips that are now being sold to China. So all of that sort of came to nothing.

• 31:40Tom Bilyeu?

  So the real question is going to be, how much of a there, there is there? So yes, he's having an affair, yes, he is, been pro-China, but he's been pro-China for a long time. Why would he not be pro-China? It's an absolutely massive market. He's been incentivized to want something to happen in China forever.

• 32:02Tom Bilyeu?

  And the if you're an investor looking at Nvidia and the woman that he's having the affair with has bought billions of dollars of chips, how much has that impacted the value? It certainly wouldn't have impacted the value in a negative direction. So it's only been the market's response to this coming down that's really been a problem. So if you're a holder of Nvidia stock, China buying Nvidia chips is good for you. MegaSpeed buying chips is good for you. It's understandable why the US government doesn't want that to happen. It's understandable why we as people who would want to have a lead over China would want to do that. But the reality is in restricting the chips, you actually turn China into a chip manufacturer.

• 32:46Tom Bilyeu?

  And so in the final analysis, it may not have bought you much. It may, in the final analysis, it may be true that Jensen was right all along that we should have been selling chips to China. So it becomes a question of who exactly got hurt by whatever dealings he's doing with MegaSpeed. Now, again, the government's reaction to this is a totally separate thing from the reaction of shareholders. So when you look at the lawsuit, the really thing, the thing that's going to be really interesting are the claims that there was nothing weird going on. That is where the lawsuit actually has something strong in their advantage. Now, whether you think they ought to or not, a chief executive does not have a legal duty to disclose an affair.

• 33:30Tom Bilyeu?

  But lying about it becomes a different matter. So once Wong chose to describe the relationship as normal, he now has to own all of the things that he's not disclosing. And whatever he knew, whatever framing he gives it, obviously is going to be pinned on the company itself. Now, the weakest part of the case is the timeframe. So an affair doesn't make a 2025 chip diversion statement false, and nothing public shows when the relationship began or that Wong knew what American intelligence suspected. That will have to come out. Now, Congress is desperate to get this guy before them. He has rejected an earlier request, but now that this has come out, I do believe that

• 34:15Tom Bilyeu?

  they have one set for the 18th of this month. So we will, we'll see what ends up happening. It would probably be likely for a judge to cut the 13-month window down pretty far. So we'll see damages are also going to be smaller than the headline that people are reporting. Recovery tracks the stock drop, which was $7.97 a share. And Nvidia will point out that the stock was already 25.3% below its October record before all of this came out for completely unrelated reasons. So we'll see how all of this ends up panning out. I don't expect there to be much of a long-term backlash that you'll be able to pin specifically

• 34:58Tom Bilyeu?

  on the affair having trackable effects on the share price. I think the share price may still go down, but that's going to be part of an overall AI correction. This may have been a catalyst, though, in investors' minds who are looking for that straw that broke the camel's back to give them a reason to get out. And so if the stock doesn't recover, you've got that angle that will almost certainly be argued in court. But we will see how this all plays out. This is definitely not a good time. Now, for Jensen and Nvidia, the funny thing is Jensen has said the very thing that makes a entrepreneur great is character.

• 35:39Tom Bilyeu?

  And when asked like, hey, what makes for a good CEO? What he says is, I wish all of them basically pain and suffering. Because that's going to be the thing that tests your character. It's actually a quote, I think it's directly from Nietzsche, maybe not, but I think it is a quote from Nietzsche, who, when pressed, was said basically, the only thing that matters about a person is whether they endure. And so to those that I love and care about, I wish pain and suffering so that you may discover whether you can endure or not. It's always, it's a quote that I think is just absolutely banger. It is certainly an idea that is brilliant.

• 36:23Tom Bilyeu?

  But this nonetheless is going to be a black mark on his quote unquote, character from the perspective of not being able to be faithful to your wife. Obviously calls into question bad judgment, calls into question, uh, character around morality and do you say, do you do what you say you're going to do, et cetera? I don't think that's really what Jensen meant when he was talking about character, but nonetheless, it's all going to get wrapped up in this.

• 36:46Speaker 02

  I mean, technically, this, this makes him feel like a go-getter. This makes, this says that he's more ambitious. This makes him say that I'm going to go beyond the off beaten path, you know?

• 36:58Tom Bilyeu?

  Have you heard the whole, uh, it's not a honey pot, it's a honey dick? Theory?

• 37:03Speaker 02

  No, what's the?

• 37:04Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah. Okay, wild conjecture, wild conjecture time, but it actually is a pretty funny hypothesis that goes like this. Guys, Jensen Huang knew exactly what he was doing. And you've got the US intelligence agency telling Trump, this is what's going on. You've got Trump likely going to him and saying, hey, listen, man, I want to take you to China, but I need to know that there's not going to be a problem here. And in fact, what I want you to do, so the theory goes, what I want you to do is feed bad information to China. I want you to mislead them. And so he was involved with a Chinese spy all the while being a US spy. I think it's a bit of an unhinged theory, but nonetheless.

• 37:46Speaker 02

  I'll take him for the team, sir. No problem.

• 37:49Tom Bilyeu?

  Dude, the funniest thing, I wish I had pulled this now. The funniest thing I've seen in response to this was the most attractive Asian woman you can imagine, just like whatever is, is an 11 on your scale, an 11, just a shot of her like walking in the skimpiest outfit towards camera. And it was a guy posting with that video playing and it just said, uh, dear China, I am an AI expert that knows like all this. I was falling over laughing. Like people are now lining up to get the Chinese badness sent their way. It's like, if, if only I knew that's what it took to get the Chinese government to hand pick, uh, somebody for me to have an affair with. Absolutely hilarious.

• 38:31Speaker 02

  Yeah, crazy.

• 38:33Tom Bilyeu?

  Taking a short break, but there's more Impact Theory after. Stay tuned.

• 38:38Speaker 00

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• 39:50Tom Bilyeu?

  Thanks for staying tuned. Now let's get back to it.

• 39:52Speaker 02

  To me, I think there's just going to be much ado about nothing. We're going to get another boom. A model is going to be updated. Chat GPT-7 is going to drop. Everybody's going to be excited about AI again. Nobody's going to care about the who.

• 40:03Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, well, you just had the most recent, what is it? Uh, Fable and Methos 5.2 drop, higher scores on benchmarks. One of the crazy things is that they were able to program an operating system in like eight days from scratch. I don't believe there was any human intervention. So he just described what he was looking for and then set it loose and it worked. So that is wild. That's where you start getting into, um, anthropic reporting that one of their security flags has been tripped. So for them, they're super paranoid about one very specific thing. Will AI be able to do a fast takeoff scenario? To do a fast takeoff scenario, one of the things that AI must be able to do is self-improve.

• 40:46Tom Bilyeu?

  And they're saying the fact that this thing is able to create an operating system from scratch without human intervention, uh, and all they gave it was like an empty folder. The fact that it was able to do that. Tells them that we're now reaching its ability to do this self-improvement. And by the way, they obviously would be putting this together without needing to have seen that one specific example. But the things that led that to be true, they've obviously been watching happen behind the scenes with their unreleased models. And they understand that this stuff is now really getting close to being able to self-improve meaningfully without human intervention. And that's where this stuff starts to get crazy. Now Anthropic is prone to catastrophizing.

• 41:29Tom Bilyeu?

  So put that in, you know, give that a Dario discount, if you will, that he's likely to say, oh my God, like this is, you know, just absolutely going crazy. We've lost control. We've got to do something. So that's his MO, but I think that there is some smoke there. And so it's certainly worth looking at, what is the potential fire underneath? How far is this going to be able to go on its own?

• 41:52Speaker 02

  This is the story, just a breakdown for people who might not have heard of it. As an experiment, one Anthropic engineer gave Fable 5.2 the task of designing a prototype operating system. Starting from an empty folder, the model coordinated over a thousand subagents working around the clock for eight days, writing, testing, and reviewing code. It produced a working operating system that boots on a laptop with its own core that runs the machine, drives drivers for the disk, keyboard, in-network, permanent file storage, windows, a login screen, an installer, and built-in claw functionality. Crazy.

• 42:21Tom Bilyeu?

  Dude, that is really crazy. Now, what's wild is you're getting a lot of frame of reference reactions to this stuff. I put a link in the doc, if you can pull it up, that says, is Zitron or Ed, one of the two, is he trolling with this answer? So this response is so bizarre, I don't even know how to make this make sense. So Ed Zitron, if you guys know, he's a bear on AI. He thinks that all the circular financing is so problematic that these companies are going to crumble under the weight of their own debt, which is not, by the way, an unhinged response. I have been following his analysis of the internal debt structures for a while. He's got some of the best analysis out there.

• 43:04Tom Bilyeu?

  However, if you're looking at your screen right now, what you're seeing is a video game that is, I'll call double A quality. It is very high quality. And the guy's thing was, I wanted to test Fable 5.2's quality with one-shot prompts without human feedback. Everything in this game is from scratch, models, sounds, textures, $550 at API pricing, approximately 2.7 million output and 445 million input tokens, heavily cached. And it took

• 43:35Speaker 02

  Eight hours.

• 43:35Tom Bilyeu?

  Took eight hours. Okay, so what you're looking at, look, as a game developer, I can tell you that this game is basic bitch. There's no doubt about that. The graphics can definitely fool you into thinking that the gameplay is better than it is. But the fact that Ed's responses looks like shit, bro, that's a single prompt. That is insane. I cannot tell you how long that would take a human developer. If you had to create the, if you had to create the assets, Drew, that would take months. If you bought the assets, that would take weeks just to get to the point where you've got a basic bitch game that isn't very fun to play, but nonetheless has all this functionality built in. People do not understand how many decisions have to be made, even just to get to that point.

• 44:19Tom Bilyeu?

  And the fact that AI just makes all of them for you, this is crazy. The response to this, to say this looks like shit, is such a bizarre reaction. You are trapped inside of a frame of reference where you only want to see bad things that you're not projecting into the future. Dude, think about where one-shot prompts were a year ago. Think about where they were two years ago. Now think about where they're going to be in two or three years with an AI that is getting dangerously close to un

• 44:47Tom Bilyeu?

  helped self-improvement. It is going to get insane. Speaking as a game developer, this is existential.

• 44:55Speaker 02

  I'm literally playing it right now.

• 44:59Tom Bilyeu?

  This is Drew playing this game. This is fucking crazy, man. So the fact

• 45:06Speaker 02

  This is wild.

• 45:07Tom Bilyeu?

  The fact that he's playing this in a browser, which by the way, is one of the hardest places

• 45:11Speaker 02

  I literally just pulled it up.

• 45:12Tom Bilyeu?

  To be able to perform on. So yeah, it is crazy. And I'm seeing some of the simulations that are coming out, like there's a guy doing what I would describe as like a liquid simulator. It looks photorealistic and he, so he had already built that and then he used the new Unreal Engine 5.9, which has like all these upgraded AI features to basically recreate his game almost instantaneously in a web browser with dials that allow him to control the movement of the water, the movement of the photorealistic water. It is fucking crazy. Now, it'll be janky as hell, but the fact that people peg this is like, well, I mean, look, it's trash. It's like, dude, it is getting better at a rate that is so terrifying.

• 45:57Tom Bilyeu?

  I don't understand how people's reaction is anything other than rate of change. Like everybody's eyes should be on rate of change and the rate of change is really, really extraordinary.

• 46:11Speaker 02

  I'm not gonna lie, I was like giggling like a little kid just now. Like I literally just started playing it.

• 46:15Tom Bilyeu?

  A single prompt.

• 46:16Speaker 02

  You could actually play, it's functional, it's good. I'm not a keyboard player, so that's why I died so fast, but like, it's like, you gotta call a spade a spade. Like after a while, like it's like, okay, you might not like her, but she bad. Like, you know what I mean?

• 46:29Tom Bilyeu?

  I don't understand the response you're getting. I'll see similar things in the game development community where it's like, oh, this is garbage. This is so boring. Dude, it was a single prompt. It's a single prompt, man. And a computer just runs off and does it for you. It is crazy. And especially because just two years ago, AI was like mildly helpful, but like, meh, like it wasn't really going to do anything.

• 46:54Speaker 02

  It just kept making stuff up and lying to you. Like, yeah, absolutely. You're right.

• 46:57Tom Bilyeu?

  What it would make would just not work at all. Like, yeah, we'd get some things right, but it was really fumbly. We actually had an internal conversation, this was a couple of months ago now. We had an internal conversation, because AI is getting so good, that do we just rewrite all of our code from scratch as AI first? We decided not to do it, but man, it was a narrow margin. Ask me that question again in six months, it's entirely possible that before we launch, we just go, all right, AI, you see what the game is, is meant to be, but now we want the code to be way, way, way leaner. So rewrite this, super lean, get rid of all the like old bloated code, et cetera, and see what it can do.

• 47:36Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, it's wild. To drop even like $10,000 or $15,000 to have it run that would be worth just the experiment to see. Like, can it make it better? So yeah, it's crazy. And what we're finding is if you do the human intervention, you can actually train it to output code that looks more like code you would use, because one of the things that people are complaining about is when AI creates code, it's giving you code that like humans can't update, but you can train it to make code in your way. So you can go in and say, listen, this is what I want it to look like. Look at the organizing principles in the same way that you can get AI to sort of write in your voice. And it's getting better and better by the day. You're going to be able to get it to output code that matches the way that you want it.

• 48:20Tom Bilyeu?

  So yeah, remember, AI is intelligence itself. It's intelligence itself and you are never going to wish you had less intelligence. Unless of course it becomes super sentient, takes over and kills us all.

• 48:32Speaker 02

  I was reading this thread earlier before we started the show. I kind of want to bring it up. This is like perfectly relevant. Overheard some friends talking about AI in China and it's very alarming. AI short films with massive in China market because of how good the video models are now. For the record, see Dance 3.0 is live in China. It's not, we're only getting 2.5, so apparently you can like one-shot movies over there. Like, it's wild.

• 48:53Tom Bilyeu?

  And like anybody that's a fan of anime, there, people are starting to use these tools to tell really good human stories that like make you feel something. People also, before you keep reading, sorry. People also have to separate out the like new model comes out, people one-shot things. So they can just see with no human intervention, what does it look like? And so there's going to be awkwardness for sure. However, when you then take that tool and give it human like directives. So we have a new art director that just started. Shout out to Daniel. Welcome to the team. Could not be more excited. And we're building trees. Maybe not the most exciting thing in the world.

• 49:32Tom Bilyeu?

  But the fact that he went from sketch to it's in the game in a day is so crazy. It's so crazy how fast we can put in assets. Now, for somebody that doesn't understand how long it typically takes to create a novel asset that has a certain look and feel and is not derivative of something else you've seen before, literally is like him sketching, doing drawovers, putting it back in, and then finally getting an answer, dropping it into 3D, making refinements, getting it to the point where it's now highly performant. Meaning it's like the UVs and the topology and all that stuff is like, yep, this is like what a human would do. So that it will run well inside of the game in a day is just wild. It's wild and that's six months ago.

• 50:17Tom Bilyeu?

  It was like, we could do it, but the assets in the game, we never thought were final assets. So we went from, we could do it in a single day, but we always knew that this was going to need to be replaced down the road. To we're doing it in a single day. It's a final asset. It's top quality. It's fucking awesome. So yeah, again, just rate of change. Sorry. Back to your.

• 50:33Speaker 02

  No, no, no. Okay. Um, so AI short films with massive in China market because of how good the video market models are now. The first wave of people who mastered using AI to generate short films and comics made quite some money because they could produce a lot more content than traditional workflows. But within just a few months, everybody and their mom can make equally good short films because all the expertise could be written in a markdown file. When everyone's more productive, no one actually has an advantage and it's a race to the bottom. Very quickly becomes impossible to make money and everyone's busier than they were without AI. The only one making money now is companies like ByteDance who owns user demand and distribution. They sell ads to creators who pay to get traffic and eventually ad spend becomes 80% of those creators operating expense. While AI tokens is less than 5%. So what are the problems here? There is no moat if you're creating anything with AI.

• 51:18Speaker 02

  If a human is really good at something and it's hard to find more humans who can do the same. They can leverage the scarcity of their skill to get paid very well. But if AI is good at something, it will be infinitely replicated. So there's no scarcity. Hence, you can't really expect a sustainable business by creating anything with AI. Two, more creators that created more content people actually like. That's a good thing, but the economic benefit of all that got absorbed by the distribution platform. There's a famous Chinese poem. I'm not even gonna try. It basically says, people who dress well, aren't the people making dresses. That's exactly what's happening here. If our society doesn't figure out a better way to distribute wealth, AI will help billionaires become trillionaires. While average people become more exhausted than ever.

• 51:54Tom Bilyeu?

  So this is the drum that I've been beating for a very long time now. This, when I say it will disaggregate capital, this is what I'm talking about. It will become very hard to make a living because um, there's just so much more of it. So you're going to get more people that can actually build an audience of say a thousand people, but you're going to get far less big companies that are able to become like a Disney where it's, it was so hard to build that mass of IP. But once you have it, you're now a juggernaut and you can just keep doing that thing. And so, yeah, the odds that somebody now is going to be able to really make a name for themselves in the age of AI. Climb to the top uh, is going to be very, very difficult.

• 52:36Tom Bilyeu?

  So as a society, we are going to find out what it looks like when you disaggregate capital. When people from a cultural standpoint no longer share the same touchstones. We're not all watching Sleeping Beauty anymore. We're watching like an infinite number of very deep, very narrow slices of things. So whatever you're into, you're going to be able to get much more of it, can be as niche as you want it to be. And it's all going to be there for you. But the shared um, cultural zeitgeist is going to dissipate wildly. But shorts were already doing some of that. And yes, the people that are going to make the money are going to be the people that have the distribution platforms.

• 53:17Tom Bilyeu?

  Now, some of the question will be, will other platforms now be able to compete with those guys? Because they'll be able to spin it up or will the network effects still be just an impossible hurdle to get over? That YouTube is interesting because it has so many people viewing it. So if I'm a content creator, I want to be on YouTube. This was the exact decision we had to make when designing a game. Do we design for UE FN? Which is to exist inside of the ecosystem of Fortnite? Or do we design for Roblox? Or do we design to be inside of Minecraft? Or do we make something that stands on its own that doesn't already have that built in community? For a whole host of reasons that I won't uh, go into right now, we decided we want to build our own thing. But that's a very dangerous decision, given that there's no player base.

• 53:59Tom Bilyeu?

  The only thing we're leveraging is the YouTube of video games, which is Steam. So we'll be on Steam, but it's like with so many AI games. Pre-AI, 20,000 new games came out a year. Dude, it's like 70 a day. So now you can imagine when you've got 50,000, 100,000 a year. Uh, you've got hundreds of new games coming out every day. How do you even get attention? So that's where it is going to be a very different world. Now people's fears about uh, basically like a permanent underclass. I really don't think that's going to happen. We don't have the appetite for it. You, you will break into revolution long before that happens. Uh, the government has a massive appetite.

• 54:41Tom Bilyeu?

  Certainly the Democrats have a massive appetite for redistributive um. Tax policies and things like that. You're, you're not just going to see the billionaire spiral up into trillionaires and, and it's trillionaires are broke. Um, but you are going to see us have to grapple with from a policy perspective. What happens if people are like unable to break out and make money doing the thing? Now the question is, if it's only for artists, then the world will just be like, whatever. Uh, they'll just be glad that they have the content. If it becomes everybody, drivers, um, machinists, coders, uh, healthcare professionals. Then people will be like, yeah, this isn't going to stand.

• 55:25Speaker 02

  Yeah, I don't know. I feel like AI is going to be like the new like digital camera. Cause I feel like everybody was like with, with uh, iPhone cameras and digital cameras so cheap, everybody could be a photographer now. And everybody has a camera sitting in their closet or something. I'm like, yeah, I used to take pictures, but I don't really take pictures anymore. I feel like that's going to be the cause. Like everybody's going to gold rush to it and want to do it. But the people that actually love it are going to master those tools. And I think that's the, that's the one reason why I'm bullish on AI. Because I think that there is going to be the grifter, YouTuber slop aspect of it of just, I need to make something as fast as possible to make as much money as possible. And then there's going to be that one kid in the corner. It's like, I wish I had the resources to make this really beautiful, artful piece and I don't. But I'm going to spend my time using AI and I'm going to take human interaction.

• 56:08Speaker 02

  And I'm going to make, actually shoot it and maybe I'll do an AI layer or maybe I'll do an AI filter or something like that. And then that's going to differentiate it. So I do think there's going to be, there is going to be slop. We have to be honest about that, but I also think that there is going to be some type of cream rises to the top of people who just prompt AI. Like I just don't think, I still think there's going to be separation because art is art, man. People think good movies are things blowing up and he gets the girl and all these other things. And as you start to write movies, you know, you start to realize like, oh, if that just happens, it's a straight line and nobody likes it and it makes it worse. So I feel like that.

• 56:39Tom Bilyeu?

  I totally agree. And right now, we're in the golden age of AI where AI by itself will not give you something that makes people feel what they want to feel. AI plus human lets a lot more humans who have that ability get to that point where they can do something at incredible quality, at incredible scale. Um, without having to go through gatekeepers. But even that is going to disaggregate capital. Because even if you just 10x the number of people that are able to make something great. That will fundamentally destabilize the economic realities of that kind of thing. So in the same way that we saw uh, basically legacy media have to reinvent themselves on modern platforms.

• 57:23Tom Bilyeu?

  Because so many other people were able to make a living at something like YouTube. Now imagine that you 10x the number of people on YouTube. So you will have the same ratio of people that are good to the people that are bad. But there will just be so many more people that get pulled off into the streamer that gets 100 views. But when there's, you know, whatever, a million streamers that get 100 views. That's a very different economic model than when you have uh, 100,000. So we'll see where this actually plays out. Uh, but yeah, I think over time, AI is going to continue to disaggregate capital in some pretty extreme ways. It's just a question of, does it only hurt artists or does it go far beyond that?

• 58:07Speaker 02

  Got it. Um, okay. I want to jump over to Elon Musk really quick because I think that this was ridiculous when I seen this tweet. I was like, those were, I understand those words, but that doesn't make sense to me. So we'll see, but SpaceX has ordered 100 GW year of

• 58:21Tom Bilyeu?

  Gigawatts.

• 58:22Speaker 02

  Uh, gigawatts a year of HJT solar manufacturing equipment from Singulus in Germany. This is for Star Mine to create a sentient sun.

• 58:32Tom Bilyeu?

  I love this.

• 58:33Speaker 02

  I feel like we already have a sun. Why do we need another one?

• 58:36Tom Bilyeu?

  Well, let's get into it, shall we? All right. Elon's latest project is literally sci-fi scale madness, but in a phenomenal way. I know a lot of people hate when Elon has a new announcement, but what he's building now is very exciting, especially if you want to see data centers go into space. So if you're at all worried about the environment or anything like that, Elon has Elon has an answer for you. SpaceX has asked the Federal Communications Commission for permission to launch up to 1 million satellites. And every one of them is basically like an orbiting data center.

• 59:15Tom Bilyeu?

  They'd orbit between 500 and 2,000 kilometers up in the sky, run on nothing other than solar power, and be able to talk to each other by laser. The first model is called AI1. SpaceX says each one handles about 120 kilowatts of compute. And Elon says the design is simpler, cheaper, denser, and lighter than a traditional server rack. So why does he call this a sentient sun? Because he's basically taking the energy from the sun and turning that into AI. So the fact that it can think for itself. I've said this many times, the reason that if AI does what everybody thinks it's going to do, or what people in the bear case side think it's going to do,

• 59:58Tom Bilyeu?

  the reason it's going to drive costs to effectively zero is that you're going to get free energy from the sun. Just put it up in orbit. It's sunny all year round, all day, all night. There's no difference in space. It's just sun, sun, sun. And then you're going to be able to basically feed that robot that energy. And so now intelligence comes for free. Here on Earth, intelligence requires you to grow crops, have cows. You've got to keep people alive. You need water. Up in space, all you need is the sunlight and everything else over time will begin to take care of itself by driving costs near to zero. So again, robots simply need that first bit of raw equipment to be mined and all of that.

• 1:00:40Tom Bilyeu?

  Once the first set of robots comes on board, they can actually go do those things. Now you have self-replication effectively for free, limited only by the resources here on Earth. But if we master space and it sounds like we are well on our way, you can imagine a world, say in 50 years, where you're able to harness or harvest asteroids and things like that, and be able to, people have run the numbers on this stuff, but 100X, 1,000X, the resources that we have here on Earth. So if we play things out like that, resources aren't going to be a problem. Corrupting the Earth is not going to be a problem. So it really does get very exciting, very fast.

• 1:01:20Tom Bilyeu?

  And when you think about these things that Elon is building, the first ones are scheduled to launch in the fourth quarter of 2027, and then hit significant scale in 2028. So we're talking, what, a year, 18 months? So it is pretty wild. And even before that, SpaceX plans to put compute on its regular Starlink satellites. So you're going to see small scale data centers essentially be put into orbit very soon. And the scale of all of this is the wild part. The plan is to launch a million tons of satellites a year. And that adds 100 gigawatts of AI compute every single year. The biggest data center on Earth today uses about one gigawatt, just to give you a sense of the scale.

• 1:02:02Tom Bilyeu?

  So that's 100 of the world's largest data centers going up every year. And none of it draws on the local power grid, none of it requires local water. So like all of the biggest pushback on AI, it just poof, it's gone. This is what I talk about when I talk about innovation, man. When you allow people to innovate, they will overcome these problems. The problem is when you try to innovate or you try to regulate them out of business. That's where we run into issues. Now, the rocket that makes all of this possible is already flying. So it's not like there's some big question mark there. Starship reached orbit for the first time on September 28th. So we are up and running, man. The things that we need to get all of this going is already happening.

• 1:02:48Tom Bilyeu?

  And SpaceX also raised $75 billion when it went public in June. So they got the money for it. So strap in, boys and girls, it's going to get wild. Elon is going to put mass drivers on the moon, literally, things that just seem like pure science fiction. He's actually doing that stuff. He wants to build factories on the moon that build these satellites and basically then just chuck them out into orbit. It's wild. It's wild. So expect this to get very, very exciting. Now, also expect people to have some sort of weird backlash, just partly because they don't want to see Elon succeed, partly because AI is scary, whether it's in space or it's here. And their real problem probably was never the data center anyway. It's fear, it's resentment, all grouped up into one big bundle of pushback.

• 1:03:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, we'll see. He's notorious for missing them deadlines. So we'll see what actually lands at what time.

• 1:03:36Tom Bilyeu?

  He is fair, but he's also notorious for doing the thing he said he was going to do, just not on the timeline.

• 1:03:42Speaker 02

  Yeah, but I mean, he's not like 10 for 10, like he has missed, but everybody has. We all fostered the glory of God.

• 1:03:49Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, I would say he misses a lot less than the average entrepreneur.

• 1:03:53Speaker 02

  Oh, yeah. Okay, we got some super chats.

• 1:03:56Speaker 04

  Yes, we do.

• 1:03:57Tom Bilyeu?

  Let's go.

• 1:03:57Speaker 04

  First up from the super chats, Nate of the South says, thank you, veterans.

• 1:04:01Tom Bilyeu?

  No joke, and shout out to you for supporting the show to say something kind to veterans.

• 1:04:07Speaker 02

  I was gonna say the applause is going there. I couldn't hear it. Okay, yes, shout out to the veterans, applause, all forces, all branches, even the reserves.

• 1:04:15Tom Bilyeu?

  Indeed.

• 1:04:16Speaker 04

  Steve Lamoth says there are currently 7.5 million open jobs, a record high. People dropping out of the labor force is a farce. They're simply unwilling to retrain and holding out for specific jobs. I see it all the time as an owner.

• 1:04:31Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, that's part of the problem, though, is you're up against psychology. And every time you have a major technological revolution, you run into the psychological buzzsaw that we saw not too long ago, where it became a slur to say learn to code. So it was actually good advice. I was so confused because I was outside of the sort of cultural commentary bubble. When I first heard that people were getting canceled for saying learn to code, I was legitimately baffled. I had no idea how that could be like a dirty phrase. It's like, hey, you just lost your current job. Get trained for the modern economy. And now this gets into something that you guys have heard me talk about at the margins. It's becoming a bigger thing that occupies my thoughts, which is,

• 1:05:16Tom Bilyeu?

  how are we going to pass legislation that respects the thing that people are really saying, which is people are too dumb to navigate real life and they need the government to take care of them, but we should allow them to vote? What? Either people are too dumb to navigate the real world and they need government help and ought not vote, or they're smart enough to navigate the challenges of the real world and therefore should vote. But you can't have a nanny state and let the kids vote on how you run the thing. Like that is literally the inmates running the asylum. So, yeah, we got to get real clear-eyed on what's actually going on here. So if you stop giving people handouts at the level that we do now,

• 1:05:58Tom Bilyeu?

  suddenly people will be far more eager to take a job that they otherwise might not consider. They might consider beneath them or whatever. They're going to get real clear-eyed, real fast, when they don't have an eternal welfare state to rely on.

• 1:06:13Speaker 04

  Lazy Joe says, Tom, love the show. I'm a Chicago video creator with 20 plus years' experience, obsessed with AI and tech. Would you hire or contract remotely? I'd love to join your team. I'm pretty good at making money for people.

• 1:06:24Tom Bilyeu?

  My man.

• 1:06:27Tom Bilyeu?

  We don't have a, like, never will I outsource something remote, but boy, do I try to avoid it. So yes, right now I'd be working against you to be in Chicago. But if you are unbelievably good at video creation, and it's the kind of thing that we need, I'd love to see your stuff. So by all means, drop a link in Discord. Ryan will get it to me. I will certainly check it out. I'll give you 30 seconds. If it's good, I'll keep going. Yeah, love it.

• 1:06:57Speaker 04

  Truth Devon says, Tom, I'm noticing people use ChatGPT like it's a truth machine or a fact checker. Meanwhile, AIs like Gemini and others don't agree with each other. Do you worry it's a problem how people use AI to think for them?

• 1:07:09Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes, I think that people, some, a subset of people will allow AI to turn their brain to mush. Those people were already in trouble because they would just listen to what is said on the news or whatever, and not critically think and try to solve problems. So it's not a new issue. AI might allow it to scale. I think it makes it far more addictive to just be like, tell me how it works, or give me the answer instead of tell me how it works. But it's so powerful for anybody willing to put in the time and effort to actually learn, to pit different AIs against each other, to ask even one AI, give me the best arguments on both sides, and then come up with your own conclusion, and then debate the AI based on the conclusions that you reach,

• 1:07:53Tom Bilyeu?

  call out the things you think they're getting wrong. The AIs usually correct pretty fast. Now, Google is a fucking mess. And so at least last check, Gemini was just an outright, like, ideologically captured AI. It's so ridiculous. It will just stop talking to you about things that are controversial and not even tell you why it stopped talking to you. Absolute insanity. But not all of them are like that. Even Anthropic, I think, is pretty good, and those guys have strong ideology behind the company. But when you push back, present it with facts, it will often go, yeah, you're right, okay, I didn't consider that. And now let me integrate that. And you can debate about it, and it will pretty fast depart from its ideology. And I will say that there are times where I am convinced I have something right,

• 1:08:39Tom Bilyeu?

  and I will be working with Claude, and Claude will keep pushing back. And I will default assume that Claude is pushing back because it's ideologically captured. But because I'm not just going to overwrite it, I'm actually going to go look into the facts that it's presenting. And it has, on numerous occasions, convinced me. I'm like, oh shit, okay, I thought you were just being an ideological stooge, but actually, you're right. I was stuck in my own bubble. And so if you hold yourself accountable to being able to win the argument by looking at the facts and all of that, it is, it is an unbelievable thought partner. So beware of the ones that are really bad. Beware of the things that's likely to lie about or to have ideological capture about. Use multiple AIs, pit them against each other. All of that stuff is super helpful.

• 1:09:24Tom Bilyeu?

  But when I think back to when I was a wee lad and I would have to get somebody's mom to drive us to the local university library, go through the card catalog, find a name I'd heard of, go get their book, which by the way, I would have heard of vanishingly small names, go pick up the book, read the table of contents, try to find a chapter that might have something interesting, skip to that and start skimming for quotes. It's like, compared to now, dude, all of human knowledge, you can now essentially debate with it. It's, it is such an unmitigated good. It's like...

• 1:10:01Tom Bilyeu?

  Think about the food logistical pipelines that we have now that allow us to have billions of people on planet Earth. It, does it also allow some people to get chronically obese and die young because they couldn't control themselves? Yes, it does. However, is it an unmitigated good despite those downsides or on balance? It's a, it's goods so dramatically outweigh the bads that anybody that votes against it is literally sinister? Uh, yes. So that's how I feel about AI. This is so powerful.

• 1:10:41Tom Bilyeu?

  It will be abused by the weak-minded, if you will allow me something so aggressive. Uh, but it's so powerful, I would, I'll accept that some people are gonna mushify their brains.

• 1:10:54Speaker 02

  That's it for soup chats. Cool. Uh, all right. Everybody's excited about the blue tsunami. Everybody excited for change in America, but some of these new Democrats are realizing, you know, they had the call. They're getting a little bit of hazen. They gotta get in line. They gotta play the team ball.

• 1:11:08Tom Bilyeu?

  New boss, same as the old boss. All right, let's hear about it.

• 1:11:13Speaker 05

  Evening, y'all. So it's starting to get real over here. I guess it must be Monday. Tonight, I met with, we'll call them senior members of the Democratic House, who told me in no uncertain terms that the-

• 1:11:35Tom Bilyeu?

  Was he always talking slow?

• 1:11:37Speaker 02

  He from Ohio, you know.

• 1:11:39Speaker 05

  Decision as to whether or not I support Jeffries regardless of his willingness to speak with me and meet the interests of my constituents on a couple of key issues. Number one, getting a constitutional amendment to Citizens United.

• 1:11:56Speaker 02

  Let's go.

• 1:11:57Speaker 05

  And number two, ending US support for the war in Iran and the country, Israel, that led us into it. Um, that that would basically mean both making my life a living hell for the next two years here in Washington, as well as, um, being sure to lose my election in two years. Um, you know, we kinda knew this stuff was coming. It's, it's part of the, the stuff you see in the movies. It's a whole nother thing when, you know, it's in person by people who actually care about you and are cheering for you, but expect you to wear the team jersey and, and, you

• 1:12:42Speaker 05

  know, be a good team player. You know, we're searching our hearts tonight as to, uh, how we can reach Leader Jeffries and help him be a better speaker. Um, at the end of the day, the big D Democratic Party needs some little D democracy and, um, I'm just a stubborn SOB. So, um, we'll continue meeting with, uh, our fellow members of Congress and members elect and, uh, try and see if we can build support for what we're trying to do here.

• 1:13:15Tom Bilyeu?

  All right. Well, Putin has tried to tell us, everybody. Putin has said a thousand times, everybody when they're campaigning, they got big promises that they're gonna make, things that they're gonna do, and then men in black suits roll up and they tell you how the government actually works. The dirty dealings in the Democrat Party are exactly that. But you have the same thing in the Republican Party. Maybe they manifest in slightly different ways, but this is just how it is. And so this video here is going viral because when you have somebody coming into office that is been elected, the will of the people to get something done, and then the very party that that person belongs to pulls him aside and says, hey, we're going to make your life a living hell, you've got a problem.

• 1:13:57Tom Bilyeu?

  Now, what is interesting to hear is that these members-elect are now putting private conversations on blast that are revealing this kind of intra-party threats. So this was Don Leonard. Uh, he is an incoming Democratic Congressman from Ohio. He just flipped the state's 15th district, beating Republican incumbent Mike Carey. On November 10th, he posted that video saying, "These kids are coming for my neck and they're going to make my life a living hell." That is absolutely crazy. Now, this is part of what I've been talking about, uh, since I read that book, um, The Machiavellians: Defenders of Freedom, where it was talking about, hey, in this day and age, when everybody has access to the media and anybody can self-publish any sort of

• 1:14:40Tom Bilyeu?

  news report ever, everything is going to be more transparent. And will democracy be able to survive? So what's going to happen when you've got more and more people like this that are just ratting out the people around them and saying, listen, we've gotta have change in our party? So this is the populist revolution. You guys know my feelings on populism. I hate it the most. However, seeing the dirty laundry of how politics works actually beginning to get aired out in the hope that that actually forces reforms, that we start voting for actual policies that make sense, like getting rid of Citizens United, like getting rid of, uh,

• 1:15:21Tom Bilyeu?

  the way that all the trading happens in Congress and the Senate and the executive branch, that shit is crazy. And so the more that we have people talking openly about the things that are going on behind the scenes, the more voters can actually be informed as to how government works, like the for-real-for-real ugly side of politics. And getting everybody to vote in one big block on a tribe is the problem. So we should want people to constantly be doing bipartisan things so that people actually are doing things that are good for the people, instead of saying, I've gotta vote with my team, I've gotta do what my team says, because that's the only way that we're going to remain in power. All of these guys work for us. It's that simple. And when they're allowed to spiral off into like a house of cards hellhole, where all

• 1:16:06Tom Bilyeu?

  of them are, uh, betraying their voters, doing things that are politically expedient because it's what they need to do to climb in power, then all of us are the worst off for it. So, yeah, I for one, love an increased level of transparency, and if that's going to require people like this putting these conversations on blast, then so be it. Uh, but I really wanna see these guys say, here's what I stand for, this is why I'm trying to move this legislation forward, and if that means jumping on board with the other team, I'm totally here for it. If that means going against your own team, I'm definitely here for it. I want to see people say, this is the cause and effect reason why I'm voting for this thing. And because these guys can get their own attention now, let the voters decide, is this

• 1:16:50Tom Bilyeu?

  person doing what I want them to do or not? They don't have to have a national voice, but they do need a voice to their constituents. And if their constituents are paying attention and seeing, okay, this guy's actually trying to get across the things that I want, and my own party is stopping him from doing that, that we cannot tolerate. And finally, stopping the use of basically hiding everything as a way to bamboozle the public, boy, would that be nice. Now, is that what we're actually going to see, or will this be a momentary blip and all of these guys will get consumed by the blob? If I'm honest, I fully expect them to get consumed by the blob, because they will see that eventually it's just too hard to get anything done if you don't have friends. And if you're constantly alienating people, then you're gonna be isolated and you really

• 1:17:33Tom Bilyeu?

  will lose the vote in the next election, because you won't be able to get anything done. So such is one of the dramatic pain points of the human experience.

• 1:17:43Speaker 02

  Yeah, we'll keep monitoring the situation. Um, a lot of people now, again, that the blue wave is active, a lot of people have already started their own proposals for how we can fix the economy. Bernie Sanders came out with his after the California wealth tax got shut down. He tweeted, "Oligarchs spent 425 million against California's billionaire wealth tax, outraising supporters 250 to 1 on ads. The result, they got a whopping 52%. I've got bad news for these oligarchs, your victory is fleeting, we will pass a federal billionaire wealth tax and end your greed."

• 1:18:21Tom Bilyeu?

  Bernie Sanders. Bernie Sanders looks at an ailing economy and says, "Hold my beer, I have a solution for this. We're just gonna break the whole fucking thing and burn it down." Remember, this is a guy that reveres Russia, this is a guy that reveres Cuba, this is a guy that reveres, uh, communism, socialism, uh, reveres China. It, it is so wild that anybody listens to him when it comes to the economy. This is a classic case of identifying that there is a problem and then presenting a solution that is so much worse than the problem that you're guaranteed to create way, uh, more pain and suffering. So if you're looking at California, for instance, and the first words out of your mouth aren't,

• 1:19:04Tom Bilyeu?

  okay, cool, let's get money out of politics, that would be a very good idea, and then second, let's balance the budget, and third, let's make sure that when we do government initiatives like dealing with homelessness, or like getting high-speed rail, that they actually function. And if they don't, then we need to address that. What we don't need to do is just keep getting more and more money to throw at a broken system. Remember, the system is entirely broken, it is wildly dysfunctional, it is parasitic, it does not have the will of the people, um, as its core, like trying to make their lives better. Its job is to get bigger and to stay in power. Once people understand that that is what politicians are actually trying to do, they are trying to make the apparatus of the government itself bigger, and to do that, you wanna get more people needing things from the government.

• 1:19:49Tom Bilyeu?

  So California is on path right now to pass a bill that would give, um, illegal immigrants access to a federal or a state housing program that would allow them to qualify for up to $150,000 to put a loan down on a home. Okay? Already, it's a terrible idea. That isn't how, forget illegal immigrants. That's not how you solve the housing problem. Say it with me now, how do you solve the housing problem? You build more houses. And you've got to get rid of NIMBYism. You've got to get to the point where you let entrepreneurs take all the risk, build as many houses as they want. And if they build too many houses, then they go out of business and that's bad on them. You will find an equilibrium point. We're seeing this in places in Texas, especially Houston.

• 1:20:34Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes, housing prices don't just go up and up until the end of time. But at the same time, houses are far more affordable. That is exactly the kind of thing that California should be doing. Instead, what do we hear politicians bang on about even at the national level? They bang on about wealth taxes, not solving the actual problem. They want punitive taxes that will do nothing to make the problem better. If you do not build more houses, houses will not get more affordable. You will simply create a subclass of people that are able to get access to these loans and they will get a more affordable house. But it doesn't make housing affordable for everybody. But there is a solution to making housing affordable for everybody. And these guys avoid it like the fucking plague

• 1:21:16Tom Bilyeu?

  because the homeowners that are already on the property ladder, they don't want it. They want their property to keep going up in value always and forever. That is what people should be fighting against. That is the drum that Bernie Sanders should be building, which is, hey, let's just shovel all of the risk onto the entrepreneurs. Ha, ha, ha, let those guys deal with it. Cool. Yes, that is what you should do. And a bunch of entrepreneurs will get hurt trying to find what that equilibrium is. It is what it is. Tough luck. That is the role that an entrepreneur plays. They all think they're clever. Many of them, most of them are going to fail. But boy, oh, boy, the ones that we thought were crazy every now and then actually pull it off. They do the innovation that allows us to have what we were talking about at the top of the show,

• 1:22:00Tom Bilyeu?

  which is real wages grow faster than inflation because of innovation. But if you don't let entrepreneurs try and innovate because you bury them under regulations, you get high speed rail that goes nowhere. You get housing homelessness that keeps growing and you get houses that remain unaffordable. This, this shit is such a wind up. When you start clocking your man as being bitter, as being resentful, he's going to start making more sense. He used to say millionaires and billionaires were bad. Then he became a millionaire and suddenly it's only billionaires are bad. So the reality is there are mechanistic ways to solve these problems. He's talking about none of them.

• 1:22:44Tom Bilyeu?

  A wealth tax, I want to hear him actually break down whether he understands the difference between money and wealth. That would already be fascinating. And then if he does understand it, what do you expect to happen to the economy, dear sir? When you start forcing people like up and coming entrepreneurs? When you start forcing them, because they're billionaires on paper, but not in reality? You start forcing them to act like they're going through divorce and fire sale their assets. It's so ridiculous. It's so economically illiterate. There are solutions. We're just not willing to do the real ones. Instead, you get people like Bernie Sanders that do emotional appeals all day, that have legitimate desire to see our nation go communist. And it will break the economy. It will be way worse.

• 1:23:28Tom Bilyeu?

  And remember, because I know there are people right now, ready to dislocate a finger, trying to tell me that this isn't about communism. And we have Hassan Piker saying just straight up, we should run straight communist, and I quote, in these districts where we have that much support. That is what these guys want. They, they're either just evil or they don't understand. Either one is disqualifying.

• 1:23:50Speaker 02

  I'm sorry, I went down a rabbit hole because I'm trying to think of where did the,

• 1:23:58Speaker 02

  I'm trying to see where did California approve the home loans for illegal immigrants?

• 1:24:02Tom Bilyeu?

  They haven't approved it. They're on path right now. It's passed in the Senate and is going back to the House, I believe, for final signature. It is expected that it will pass and it is expected that Gavin Newsom will sign it.

• 1:24:18Speaker 02

  This refers to a 2024 legislation, AB 1840, that passed a CA legislator but was vetoed by Governor Newsom on September 6, 2024. No equivalent bill has passed in 2026.

• 1:24:31Tom Bilyeu?

  Scroll back up. So it's my understanding, though I could just be wrong, is this new?

• 1:24:39Speaker 02

  This is based 21 hours ago.

• 1:24:41Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay, it's possible then that the community note is accurate and that he's already shot it down.

• 1:24:46Speaker 02

  I thought you were talking about Prop 37 and I was like, wait, Prop 37 has nothing to do with illegal immigrants. And then I started searching in and I got them.

• 1:24:51Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay, so well, thank you. We'll have to look and see if that actually is true. What I was reading today put forward that it had been amended and was going back through. But if that's all fake news, then I'm very glad that you're correcting it.

• 1:25:08Tom Bilyeu?

  Now, nonetheless, from the argument standpoint, it's all the same. That may not, that may be a bad example if it got vetoed. But going back to the whole thing that what Bernie is saying is, all right, this failed now, but it's not going to fail again in the future. And I will take that same approach with what's happening in California as we become more and more of a super majority, that sure, it failed once, but will it continue to fail into the future? That becomes my question. As somebody who lives here, this is what I think about all the time. What is the direction of travel of California politics? And given how Newsom himself has gone to bat to make sure that aid is available regardless of immigration status, I'm actually very surprised to hear that he vetoed that.

• 1:25:54Tom Bilyeu?

  But where I would point people's attention is it still made its way to his desk.

• 1:26:00Speaker 02

  In other news in the House, Thomas Massie brought up resolutions to impeach Pete Hegseth, but it failed in the House, 2011 to 204. A lot of people are looking at the 11 Democrats who failed to show up for the votes. If they would have gone, it would have passed. But yes, Pete Hegseth is.

• 1:26:16Tom Bilyeu?

  If they would have gone and they would have voted for it. Because the question is, did they not go because they weren't planning to vote for it? And they just didn't want to be on record? So that's where everybody covering the story has to separate. There's a reason they didn't go. And now it's possible they all had food poisoning. But it's also possible that they knew that they weren't behind it. And so they just wanted to be absent for that reason. So them merely showing up does not mean that this would have passed, just for the record.

• 1:26:42Speaker 02

  Because they would have voted against it.

• 1:26:43Tom Bilyeu?

  Possibly, we don't know, we'll never know. And odds are that they want it exactly that way. They don't want people to know where they would have come down on it. That is often, not exclusively, but that is often why people won't show up for a vote, is they don't want any record of how they felt about that thing.

• 1:27:03Speaker 02

  New, the new incoming minority whip, Tom Elmer, Republican, he just went off. I'm gonna play the video, then we could talk about it.

• 1:27:12Speaker 06

  Come January 3rd, 2027, you will regret ever putting your name on a ballot. House Republicans will hold each and every Democrat accountable for every vote cast, every committee hearing held and every sentence said on MSDNC. This Republican leadership team will expose the Democrats' lies and show the American people their true colors as the radical communists that they are. We will expose every empty promise that they made to voters. We will expose Democrats' economic agenda that will make housing, food, gas and healthcare more expensive. We will expose the Democrats' sanctuary state, open border policies, all that will make our communities less safe.

• 1:27:56Speaker 06

  Not only will we ensure the American people know who these people really are, but House Republicans will put forth an agenda that speaks directly to the American people. Policies that actually lower the price of goods, increase wages, create affordable housing and give every American the opportunity to build their American dream. With this House Republican team, I am confident we will win back the trust and confidence of the American people in short order. We will undo the damage and chaos caused by these radicals and we will retake the majority in 2028. And those of you who are smiling right now, remember, we told you this back in 2018 as we were going into 2019 and nobody thought we could.

• 1:28:40Speaker 06

  And we did, we are going to do it again. I want to thank my colleagues for trusting.

• 1:28:45Speaker 02

  All right.

• 1:28:45Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay, so here's the thing.

• 1:28:50Tom Bilyeu?

  This is all political theater. These guys are in power right now and they couldn't get shit done. So what they're talking about is not passing legislation. What they're talking about is trying to embarrass the Democrats to reveal their real thinking, which hey, great. Uh, finding out what people are actually willing to vote for is wonderful, but it's really not going to make a difference. Your only hope is that there are independent voters that are high information enough that they're actually going to pay attention to this thing failed to uh be brought for a vote, or this thing uh failed to uh get passed, even though it'd be good for America. But like it, that kind of thing only speaks to people who are actually persuadable.

• 1:29:34Tom Bilyeu?

  The people that are um on a tribe, they're not going to listen at all. The vast majority of people don't pay attention to the things that do pass, let alone the things that just uh get put forward and don't pass. Um, so anyway, this is the political game. I suppose I shouldn't be um surprised, and I'm not surprised, but all of this stuff is just political theater. When you're out of power, you act like the other guys are just these evil blowhards. Uh, and when you're in power, you quickly realize how hard it is to get something done. Uh, and so some of that being stymied is good and is part of the reason that America doesn't whipsaw even harder than it whipsaws culturally now. Uh, but yeah, I'm not expecting much to come out of that tough talk.

• 1:30:17Speaker 02

  Yeah. Um, also the effects of the one big beautiful bill going to affect January of next year. So in March or April, when we have record um people who have kicked off of SNAP, because that takes effect when we have people who say that their healthcare bill is the biggest it's ever been. Those cuts take care in January. So a lot of the things that the Republicans did pass, the one big beautiful bill is their prime legislation. It does take into effect next year, so we'll see what happens. And it's, it'll be interesting who takes credit for what and who blames what, who for what.

• 1:30:46Tom Bilyeu?

  Well, I can already tell you, the Republicans will say the Democrats are the problem on everything and Democrats will say Republicans are the problem on everything. Like that, you can just count on it. If it's good, uh, e- each side is going to try to take credit for it. And if it's bad, then each side is going to distance themselves from it. Uh, it will be completely insincere and nonetheless happen exactly like that. That is the bad news.

• 1:31:08Speaker 02

  Yeah. And then um Trump, after the 60 Minutes interview, um, the White House put out the tweet that when he had a press conference on the lawn and said that there won't be amnesty. So after he was talking about what he said in the 60 Minutes interview, people have been here 10 to 20 years, people who could have been, had a pathway to get here. Um, he got that backlash and then quickly said, nope, there won't be any amnesty.

• 1:31:30Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah, that, his own supporters were like, wait, what? Uh, so I'm not at all surprised to see that backtrack. Now, is there something that will look like amnesty, act like amnesty, but not be called amnesty? That is certainly possible. Um, but I think that the problem he's going to run into is he may have a reasonably sensible position about, listen, there are some people that qualify, that we do want them here. They're net taxpayers, they've been like a boon, and so we do want to give them a path to citizenship. That to me makes all the sense in the world. Uh, but that will not go nearly far enough for where the energy is in the Democrat Party. So uh, if you want to know where the energy is in the Democrat Party, you can look to California, you can look to New York, sanctuary states.

• 1:32:13Tom Bilyeu?

  Um, and yeah, they're going to push it as far as they can. And I don't think they will pass legislation that they don't think goes far enough. So I expect that to go nowhere.

• 1:32:22Speaker 02

  All right, and Tom's favorite politician, Mam Donnie, is looking at the, is pushing to pass the protect, the Delivery Protection Act. Um, this is his video announcing it.

• 1:32:32Speaker 07

  When I say worker, you say power, worker, worker, worker.

• 1:32:39Tom Bilyeu?

  Funny thing is, he's right about that, just the way he's gonna do it.

• 1:32:42Speaker 07

  And an Amazon branded truck delivering an Amazon package and then an accident happens, an injury happens, something goes sideways. They want to turn around and say that Amazon has nothing to do with it, but it has Amazon literally written all over it.

• 1:33:04Tom Bilyeu?

  Pause it for a second. People don't understand how companies work. So basically, it's not like no one is responsible for this. So those guys are employed by a third party that Amazon then hires, because Amazon doesn't want to deal with the liability and all that stuff. And so basically, the company run by an entrepreneur realizes, oh, there's an opportunity here. I'll take on the risk and I'll aggregate all these employees. I'll do all the background checks, all that stuff. And then you guys don't have to worry about that. You don't have to try to make that your expertise. You do the logistics and all that. We'll handle the workforce, get a bunch of, you know, whether they're 1099 or whatever. We'll aggregate that and handle all the laws around that. Cool. Uh, we did something very similar with hiring at Quest.

• 1:33:45Tom Bilyeu?

  We were, we had to fight so hard to make sure that our employees were all legal, that we were like, Jesus, this is becoming like a full-time job for us. And there are people that offer this service. And so that is like a completely reasonable approach to say, all right, there are people that have expertise in this, they have the understanding of the law and all that, and I would rather lean on them. It's the same reason, I don't know if this is true anymore, but at one point, I know Quest, after I left, but Quest moved away from manufacturing, because it was like, dude, yay, thank you to the founders for getting us this far. You guys had to become your own manufacturers. But manufacturing is hard. It is low margin. We, now that the whole world has copied what you do,

• 1:34:27Tom Bilyeu?

  we can outsource this to other people that now have the expertise that you guys had to build. And so they moved away from it. So it's like, yeah, this is a question of what does the business want to be expert at? So it's not like the workers don't have a company that they can go appeal to or sue or whatever. It's just not Amazon. So this is uh, a activist movement where people want to target a company because it's run by a billionaire, owned by the wealthy class. It has that stigma on it. But if you really look at, is Amazon adding value to the world or even just America?

• 1:35:05Speaker 02

  Uh, I feel like we gotta take a step back, because I think adding value is a cover for loopholes. And I think that what you described is an entire business sector that's a loophole. It shields Amazon from legal ramifications. If a delivery driver does something dumb, sue that third-party company. You don't gotta sue me, that third-party company.

• 1:35:24Tom Bilyeu?

  Why is that bad?

• 1:35:26Speaker 02

  Because.

• 1:35:27Tom Bilyeu?

  If it's not Amazon that did it, what's the problem?

• 1:35:30Speaker 02

  But that's the thing, Amazon is the structure that causes everything.

• 1:35:33Tom Bilyeu?

  Let's say that you're a taxi driver and your car explodes on impact. Should the taxi driver be held liable or the car company that made the car?

• 1:35:41Speaker 02

  Car company that made the car.

• 1:35:42Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay.

• 1:35:43Speaker 02

  Or the taxi driver, if he drives it into an oil canister.

• 1:35:45Tom Bilyeu?

  Agreed. So now, if Amazon is doing something that's bad, go after Amazon. And if the company that assembles the workforce is the one that's abusing the employees or whatever,

• 1:35:56Speaker 02

  But that's the thing.

• 1:35:56Tom Bilyeu?

  Then you go after them.

• 1:35:57Speaker 02

  Amazon is outsourcing the thing. It, it's one of those things, like, I'm trying to think of a, like, very direct analogy, because I think what happens in America in 2026, and don't get me wrong, in a perfect world, if we were to talk about the aughts of things, companies will be responsible, companies will pay a living wage, everybody will be happy. Jobs at our jobs will be jobs that are for teenagers. Jobs at our careers will be careers long-term that people can retire with, whatever, whatever, whatever. All those things will be in a beautiful world where people are having a free market and we understand that capitalism is done at the appropriate and right way. But we all know that we don't live in a free market now. We're living in crony capitalism. People are just trying to consolidate and buy and do, and squeeze every penny of profits. That way they can drive the stock revenues. That way the executives get their bump, that way the stock market can then go up, that way they can have people more invest in them.

• 1:36:42Speaker 02

  When they have that additional investment, they can then do more processes and more services. They could charge more money and it's just that flywheel, so that way the corporation can grow. Just like governments have the tendency to grow, corporations want to grow, businesses want to grow, everybody wants to grow. I understand that, I get that. But I do think that there are certain legal loopholes that we have established, independent contractors, certain, uh, especially for the delivery companies, they just, uh, DoorDash just settled. It's the same type of mechanism. I am going to say, I need people to do this uh work, but I don't want the legal responsibility of taking care of people, so I'm going to outsource it to somebody else. That other person is now going to take the legal responsibility to um take care of these people. But once they have a process, uh, problem that is too big, they're just gonna fold. It's an LLC, they're gonna fold the company, they're gonna walk away.

• 1:37:28Speaker 02

  Amazon's like, dang, that's crazy, I need somebody else to spin one up. Amazon was literally paying people to start companies to take that liability risk instead of just them taking it. Amazon can uh accept it, Amazon can hold it. And if I'm wearing an Amazon vest, to Mam Donnie's point, if I was wearing a third-party company's vest, then cool. Okay. If I'm wearing the third part, if I'm driving the third-party company's van, okay, cool, okay. But Amazon wants all the public um experience, wants all the public praise for delivering this service and doing this good and helping create those problems. But then when it comes to the liability, they're like, yeah, somebody else could take care of that.

• 1:38:01Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes, but that is precisely what you have to do. So when you are creating a legal structure, uh, the government's creating a regulatory burden or whatever, you're moving it, you're, you're creating a problem that the business must solve for. So you've got options. Don't create that problem or understand that the business is going to solve for it. So this is like the private credit markets. 2008 happens and the banks are like, fuck that, we're never gonna let this happen. Regulators say, we're never gonna let that happen again. They go and regulate the banks. But they did not get rid of the consumer desire for that thing. So risky credit goes somewhere else. Risky credit now moves over into the private credit market. And anything that there is an appetite for, somebody's going to create. Create prohibition, you create speakeasies.

• 1:38:45Tom Bilyeu?

  So what I'm saying is, when you don't address the thing at the foundational layer of actually solving the mechanistic problem that leads you to that, which is, the world has gotten so expensive due to inflation that there is massive opportunity for any company that can drive costs down. Now, unfortunately, politicians and bankers created that problem, but the need for cheap goods did not, or the desire for cheap goods did not go away. So it's going to move somewhere else. That somewhere else is Amazon. Amazon goes, okay, you're trying to regulate me and drive my costs back up, which means I won't be able to provide.

• 1:39:16Speaker 02

  Who's trying to regulate them?

• 1:39:17Tom Bilyeu?

  The government.

• 1:39:18Speaker 02

  Trying to regulate Amazon in what way?

• 1:39:20Tom Bilyeu?

  In every way you can imagine, up to and including some of the laws, I don't know if they ended up passing it, but they were trying to do this to Uber, you can't have 1099 employees. So that is something that adds immediately 30% cost. So because you have to do all the benefits and all that stuff. Now, how do we end up there? 1946 law gets passed, we're dealing with World War II. We, or 1943 maybe, we understand that this is getting way too expensive. So we, the government, do a top-down thing where we say, can't, can't offer raises. Wages are frozen. Now, does that stop employees from wanting more money? No, of course not. Does it stop employers from wanting to offer more to get better talent? No, it does not.

• 1:40:03Tom Bilyeu?

  So it moves out of salaries and into benefits. And the knock-on effect of that is it completely fucks up our healthcare system. So dumb policy, put from the top down, but it doesn't eliminate the need for that thing. So that thing is going to find an outlet. I'm saying, as long as the world is like, I can't afford shit, you must drive my costs down, dear entrepreneurial world, then they go, where are my costs high? Labor. Okay, cool. We've got to find a solution for this that is legal, which this whole setup is legal. I get that some people think it's gross or whatever, but people are voting with their wallets. They want cheap shit from Amazon. Now, why are they so hardcore about wanting cheap shit from Amazon? Because the world has gotten so fucking expensive.

• 1:40:45Tom Bilyeu?

  Now, if you're going to ask me to tell you all the regulations that led us here, I'm not going to be able to, but hopefully you will concede that there are regulations and a lot of them. Now, the regulations that should exist, like antitrust regulations, those were fucking weak on because the system is being abused by politicians, corporations and all that. I completely concede that point.

• 1:41:04Speaker 02

  You don't see the circular argument of that? Is that there's regulations by politicians that are creating problems for companies, that companies then lobby politicians to create loopholes for them to then exploit those regulations?

• 1:41:14Tom Bilyeu?

  It's almost like we should solve the underlying mechanism instead of trying to do all this top-down bullshit. That is my entire fucking argument. So the second you try to go, companies, you're making too much profit, we can't have that. Well, then they start lobbying. But if you do as light of touch as possible, you let the market vote with their dollars, you let companies do what they're going to do within the confines of not becoming predatory, you're good. But we don't do that. We keep regulating, regulating and regulating and regulating.

• 1:41:44Speaker 02

  I thought that's what the LLC solves. So that way, if a company really is, this is too expensive for me, this is not making sense, I could just dissolve it and I could walk away. So the company is then quote-unquote shielded.

• 1:41:53Tom Bilyeu?

  While a true statement, you're pulling in something that doesn't really tie into this. What, so let's confine our argument, just to keep it from spiraling into madness.

• 1:42:01Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:42:03Tom Bilyeu?

  In no way, shape or form do I think that corporations ought to be left alone. They will become predatory, just to make sure everybody understands I'm saying that.

• 1:42:10Speaker 02

  Copy.

• 1:42:10Tom Bilyeu?

  Now, when you have a need for cheaper goods, people are going to do some pretty extraordinary things, up to and including the government opening their borders. So you've got to find a way to make things cheaper for people. That, that's just like a full-blown mandate. We just saw, bear with me, because I, I want to make sure you and everybody listening understand that this is a problem created by bad policy. Otherwise, we're all going to be very confused why what they're promoting, which is another top-down solution, is not going to work. So you have created a situation where you're inflating faster than you're raising wages because you did globalism, money printing and imported cheap labor. All bad things. Perfect cocktail to make life bad for the average worker.

• 1:42:54Speaker 02

  I, I just feel like that's a wave away because globalism is not some faceless, mindless company. Like, Apple paid $200 billion into China in order to make iPhones. And people are saying, well, if they did it in America, iPhones would be $1,500. Plot twist, iPhones are $1,800 now. So at some point in time, it has to be the company that says, I'm going to pay this.

• 1:43:13Tom Bilyeu?

  I'm going to pay what?

• 1:43:15Speaker 02

  This, I have to pay the cost of run this business. It costs money to make this business.

• 1:43:18Tom Bilyeu?

  They are paying the cost to run the business and they found a legal way to do it. And now these guys are going, okay, I see you solved this problem. I don't like the way you solved it. I'm now going to try to make this illegal.

• 1:43:26Speaker 02

  The legal way they do it was lobbying to create this loophole that they allowed them to then assign to.

• 1:43:29Tom Bilyeu?

  So you're saying that 1099 employees are, it's predatory by nature. And anybody that's a 1099 employee, they're too fucking stupid to make their own decisions. And so we should just not let that be a thing.

• 1:43:40Speaker 02

  And this is on the back of us talking about, we started with the Fed and saying that people are seven months without a job. So now that we're calling 1099 employees, you're calling them stupid now because they can't find another idea. And then we just started the show. You just said that, you said 1099 employees.

• 1:43:54Tom Bilyeu?

  You're saying that.

• 1:43:55Speaker 02

  I'm saying 1099 employees are so stupid because they deserve benefits, they want to work, they want full-time wages.

• 1:44:00Tom Bilyeu?

  The whole point is I don't want.

• 1:44:02Speaker 02

  They can't find a regular job because it takes seven months.

• 1:44:04Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay, so, oh god, stopping this from spiraling to so many points is going to be very difficult.

• 1:44:09Speaker 02

  Okay.

• 1:44:09Tom Bilyeu?

  Uh, so let's, because the 1099 thing, I think is a key part of your argument, let's say that.

• 1:44:14Speaker 02

  I have a separate one. I think that we'll be able to like sum it up because I feel Walmart's a perfect example. Walmart, 50% of its employees are legally eligible for welfare. Full-time employees, they work 40 hours a week and they're legally eligible for welfare.

• 1:44:27Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay.

• 1:44:29Speaker 02

  They take welfare out. We now say there's too many people on the welfare is done.

• 1:44:34Speaker 02

  At one point Walmart is now saying, I'm not going to pay the employees. The government's going to take care of that, so I don't need to pay that.

• 1:44:40Tom Bilyeu?

  Pretty stupid, right?

• 1:44:41Speaker 02

  A little bit, yeah. So in that case, is it Walmart saying, I'm giving you cheap shit? This is all legal. So what, if you, if you collect welfare, you need to just get a better job? I don't care, I'm walking away? And that's the totality of the argument?

• 1:44:54Tom Bilyeu?

  You have created a situation where, where companies like Walmart can now rely on the fact that the government is going to pay part of their, their compensation. Instead of them going, I'm not going to take a job for that little money and forcing the wages to go up. So if you stop creating that kind of safety net, then you get into the position where Walmart's like, fuck, I can't keep this staffed. How do I get people in the door? Because now people have to go find a better paying job somewhere else to make ends meet for their family. And so Walmart then goes, fuck, I'm going to have to pay more money. And then you get people that can work. But if the government is basically like the tip jar and goes, hey, restaurants, you can pay less than you probably should because we expect people to tip.

• 1:45:37Tom Bilyeu?

  And now people are freaking out because it's like, I'm not paid a living wage. And these guys are just trying to like, make the customer pay in tips for me to make this living wage. Now Walmart's like, all right, cool. We've got that much going on in welfare? Facts. And now you roll in, this is what we pay? And you're like, okay, cool, I can make that work with my welfare. Fantastic. And you have now found yet another unintended consequence of trying to do shit from the top down. What we.

• 1:46:04Speaker 02

  So what, what needs to happen is every Walmart employee, if you work at Walmart in the chat, talk to all your friends, all you guys need to walk off the job and say, we're not going to take this job. This is paying too low, it's shitty. The border is closed. Based on this logic, Walmart is going to say, I messed up, guys. I'm going to increase the pay. And then that's going to increase you guys' pay. So everybody just quit working and just leave. And then when your rent's due, don't pay your rent either, we'll market. Then the banks will be like, okay, you guys didn't pay your rent, that makes sense. Let, we'll lower the rates and we'll work with you. We just need to do a wage and rent strike and that would be a bottom-up movement because at that point, the corporations can't take advantage of it.

• 1:46:38Tom Bilyeu?

  Let's ask one simple question. Not whether we like it, just would that work?

• 1:46:43Speaker 02

  What I just said?

• 1:46:44Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah.

• 1:46:45Speaker 02

  Probably.

• 1:46:46Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay. Now, that's not what I'm telling people to do, but we both just identified something that would work. You've gotten rid of the ability for Walmart to take advantage of the welfare state. And so now they're like, oh shit, we need workers. We are going to have to pay more money to get those workers. So now the question becomes, how do we create an incentive system where people actually have power? The local worker is able to make more money. First of all, they have to be worth more money, so let's start with that. So education, going to have to have a real step up. Then we also have to make sure that there aren't an influx of immigrants that will work for less money. Just real talk.

• 1:47:32Tom Bilyeu?

  And then we've got to make sure that they don't have another thing that they can fall back on where they can make it work anyway. That is how you put yourself in a position where it's like, fuck, as the guy trying to run Walmart and I need to offer people something cheaper, I've got to find another way to do it because my labor costs are going up. So I'm going to have to find somewhere, somewhere else, a way to drive these costs down. Now, the company originally was all about innovation. And I forget this, Sam Walton? Sam Walton used to walk the store, like the aisles of every store around him to figure out all the things that they were doing well and to bring that into one store. And that's how he was able to start driving his prices down because he was making himself stronger because more people were shopping where he was at.

• 1:48:16Tom Bilyeu?

  He could then use that as leverage when he was buying anything and everything. As somebody who has sold into Walmart, I will tell you right now, this is still their attitude. We're so big, we're a kingmaker and you're going to give us the best deal you've ever given anyone else ever. You're going to give us more margin. And then we're going to use that margin that we just negotiated out of you because we're so big and we're going to pass that on to the customer. And that's how Walmart won. Innovation led to strength, led to an ability to negotiate. It wasn't a whole bunch of bullshit that the government was trying to do from the top down. Now, again, companies will become predatory, so you have to have some guardrails. But Mom Donnie is not a person that goes, oh, the companies need some guardrails.

• 1:48:59Tom Bilyeu?

  He goes, all of this shit is predatory, everything that you do is bad, Amazon, and so we're going to make it impossible for you to do that. And he has identified the right problem, workers don't have power. His solution is so retarded, it is just going to hurt the people who buy from Amazon because he is artificially going to raise the prices. This is not the public saying, no, no, no, I'm not willing to pay this or the quality is not good. It's not the workers saying, I'm not willing to work here. It is a top-down solution that will force the energy somewhere else. So all the things that I used to get from Amazon because they were cheap, I can't get from Amazon now anymore, so I'm going to go somewhere else. Or Amazon solves a problem in some other way that I cannot predict at this point.

• 1:49:42Tom Bilyeu?

  But until you make the need for something cheaper go away, you will get up to and including a black market. The, the reality of people saying, I need this shit cheaper, does not move. So all of this shit is fucking idiotic. And the fact that they cannot figure out that all I can do is hammer Amazon. I have not solved the problem for the people who are saying, bro, I need this shit this cheap. So it, it's like, either address the actual cause and effect that's going on here or accept all you're going to do is break the engine of prosperity that's actually serving people. Because anybody that looks at the government goes, you know what? The government's done a lot more for me than Amazon, is out of their minds. Amazon has made.

• 1:50:29Tom Bilyeu?

  Things so much cheaper and easier to obtain. It is quite literally a modern miracle. But because in America, we don't even realize, I've lived in the UK. Even in the UK, first world nation, OECD country. Even there, you're like, you guys don't have, insert 10,000 things that we take for granted here. They just don't have, because logistically, they can't get it for the right price. And it's like, America has an unbelievable entrepreneurial class that has made everything cheaper. The amount of availability is insane. Now, we have fucked the American worker. And I've talked endlessly about the actual mechanisms by which we fuck them.

• 1:51:13Tom Bilyeu?

  We must undo those mechanisms. Trying to do some top-down bullshit like this, which is essentially saying, you can't have contract workers. You're going to pay the, um, the benefits. And fuck you if you think otherwise. Okay, great. Well, there went all of the margin that they were able to pass on to the consumer. That all goes away. That makes them less competitive. You get less stuff for free. And it is what it is. And here we are. And now who ends up suffering? They're firing workers left, right, and center because now they're just too expensive. So all those people are now just without jobs. And then they start raising prices because they have to to deal with higher labor costs. So who exactly wins in this scenario? So unfortunately, unions do not protect workers. I know we like to think they do, but they don't.

• 1:51:58Tom Bilyeu?

  And, uh, Mamdani and socialist policies really are not going to protect workers, which is why socialist countries are run at the end of a fucking gun. Because it doesn't end up being better. It ends up being much worse. Now, that's not a vote for crony capitalism. That is a vote for solving the problem at the level of mechanism and not at this will feel good because I fucking hate these rich guys that run this country, this company.

• 1:52:22Speaker 02

  Yeah. Uh, all right, we gotta jump over to I E T. Um, Boo Kelly has sent his 2,000 special forces troops to look for his force, uh, pilots. Um, we are still not quite sure the whereabouts of them. But he tweeted, we kept our promise. We deserted the house of La Mans en Juve and 400 Mademoiselle gangs headquarters. Most of them ran away without even trying to fight. What cowards. Mario Nolfall then retweeted, then tweeted on top of that, Trump told Boo Kelly to go fight Haiti's gangs, but now the State Department is telling him to stop. Boo Kelly sent special forces into Haiti after four Salvadorian aviation technicians were kidnapped by gangs. Trump reportedly gave him the green light, but after firefights erupted in Port-au-Prince, American diplomats accused Salvadorian troops of poor coordination, endangering peacekeepers,

• 1:53:07Speaker 02

  and even hitting the US embassy with gunfire. El Salvador denies allegations and now openly questioning the credibility of Washington's top diplomat in Haiti. Imagine getting permission from the US president only to receive a formal complaint from his own State Department.

• 1:53:21Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay, Drew, I need you to talk me off a ledge or hype me up. I'm not sure which. I think you're gonna talk me off a ledge. Um, I love seeing Boo Kelly go ham on Haiti. Because I think without the gangs, the country would have a better chance at clawing its way out of where it's at now. You'd have to deal with corruption in the government. Uh, but man, if you could El Salvadorize the streets of Haiti and get the hardened criminals off the streets so that people actually felt safe, you could now start moving in a better direction. Now, as somebody with deep ties to Haiti, am I out of my mind?

• 1:54:04Speaker 02

  Um, I understand your logic. I understand the cause and effect. Um, we'll see what happens. I'm being very short on this topic intentionally. Um, I don't want to speak on it.

• 1:54:16Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay.

• 1:54:16Speaker 02

  Yeah.

• 1:54:16Tom Bilyeu?

  As, as somebody who loves and cares about you, I'll leave it at that. Uh, well, then we're back to my unhinged take. Um, I think ultimately people are not being honest about how important safety is. And that if on the streets you are not safe, the, you're going to be stuck forever in poverty. Because as soon as you tried to build something, it's going to be a target for, uh, attack. The attack could be economic. It could be standard, um, thug behavior like the mafia used to do. Where it's like, boy, it'd be a real shame if something happened to this nice store that you're building. Uh, so pay us some protection money. Um, that is the kind of thing that you see even here in the US. You get rough neighborhoods that become what they call food deserts,

• 1:55:01Tom Bilyeu?

  where stores just realize, oh, it is not profitable to be in these neighborhoods. So we're just gonna close up shop. Uh, we saw a lot of that after the 2020 riots. So, man, it is really sad to watch, uh, any country be taken over by crime and to see El Salvador's turnaround and think, oh, the guy that did that might actually be able to, um, clean up the gangs in Haiti if they are welcomed warmly. And I do not know if the average people, obviously, I'm being asked to believe that the average people are welcoming them warmly. And I was hoping Drew would either confirm or deny. Uh, so I don't have, uh, any more information than that. But I would be a little surprised if there wasn't a fair amount of support,

• 1:55:44Tom Bilyeu?

  unless these guys are just becoming a bigger version of the problem. So, um, obviously, the thing that they promised to do was basically go after this gang member that had this big compound. They blew it to shit, uh, supposedly killed a bunch of people in doing so. If that's where the US is now having beef that like, all right, hey, this is cool. You guys have pushed this a little too far. Um, I would certainly understand that because this can very quickly become, uh, start feeling like an invasion that you might have good intentions. But if the people on the ground that are getting hurt are not the people that you're actually trying to, um, protect from, then you have an issue. So I'll need more detail. But I will admit at this point, when I see this, I get excited

• 1:56:28Tom Bilyeu?

  with the fingers crossed that he can actually clean up the gangs. We'll see.

• 1:56:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, well, Chelsea will be monitoring that situation. Um, something else that needs cleaning up is DC. Um, I'm not gonna lie, I liked the new Superman. I thought Lanterns was good. I like how DC's TV division has like reimagined these classics in different ways. I feel like I got the vision, but, um, the higher-ups didn't agree. James Gunn is out as the head of the DCU.

• 1:56:56Tom Bilyeu?

  November 9th, the day that will remain in infamy. Skydance announced that James Gunn and Peter Safran are finished running DC Studios. Uh, it doesn't actually go into effect until December 1st, but they're done. The press release called it stepping down, but the trades are telling, I think, a far more realistic story. According to the Hollywood reporter, David Ellison and his co-CEO Enon Krez showed up at their offices on the Warner Brothers lot on November 6th and told them the plans had changed because originally, everybody was like, no, no, no. Uh, James Gunn, you are good. You're a part of what we're gonna be doing moving forward, all is well. So, um, this was a definitely a reversal of course.

• 1:57:38Tom Bilyeu?

  And that was one month to the day after Ellison closed his $111 billion takeover of Warner Brothers Discovery, um, and had put them both on that leadership team. So Gunn, excuse me, Gunn was already drafting a third Superman movie. The second one, I think, is already in post-production. Uh, so he'll have an ongoing creative role as he finishes out the things that are going, uh, that are already deep in motion. Now, their replacement is Jeremy, Jeremy Latcham, the Marvel veteran who shepherded Iron Man and the Avengers. And the rap reports Ellison was talking to Latcham more than a month before the merger even closed. So this might have been on his radar longer, uh, than people think. Or maybe he was, um, weighing his options in the beginning

• 1:58:22Tom Bilyeu?

  and decided finally in the end that he was gonna go very specifically in that direction. Now, this comes down to basically success. And the projects that James Gunn had been running just were not nearly successful enough. So if you look at Superman, it kind of limped across the finish line. Probably broke even, maybe a little bit profitable, uh, but certainly was not a gigantic win. Then Supergirl followed it up. It's one of the biggest flops in superhero history. Absolutely tanked. Then they followed that up with a smaller budget horror film called Clayface or about Clayface as the character that's out right now. Uh, and it's doing well for the budget, but it's not exactly, um, gonna be a runaway hit.

• 1:59:04Tom Bilyeu?

  And so you put that together with the fact that a lot of the, um, other projects that they did, like animation and stuff, just didn't seem to really have a big influence. Uh, and then there's certainly a large portion of the fan base that was pretty upset with the direction that Gunn was going. Uh, so unfortunately, uh, his tenure has come to an end. I say unfortunately because I really want to see the DC Universe do well. And, uh, I was a huge fan of a lot of the stuff that James Gunn had done leading up to this and was very excited when they put him at the top. My only concern was his vibe is so specific that would it translate to a much larger universe? And that's one of the criticisms that people have given is that he's such a specific flavor that you start to see the formula.

• 1:59:49Tom Bilyeu?

  And, uh, yeah, so anyway, I think Gunn is a very talented filmmaker. It would be very interesting to see, as he said, just returning to the pure creative filmmaking of it all. He said he was excited to get back to that. Uh, and I can certainly understand dealing with the politics and the business side of things can be pretty frustrating. And so now that he's a bit more unchained and doesn't have to like tie everything into a gigantic universe, uh, will we get back to a James Gunn of old that's doing things in a very fresh way? That feels very different than everything else that's out there? Uh, or does he just now sort of disappear because the things that he's touched? He's sort of had his moment, uh, and people get the formula and now won't be as enamored by it? We will see what happens from here. But the DCU trying to reinvent itself again for a second time in a decade?

• 2:00:34Tom Bilyeu?

  I think that's gonna be pretty tough to pull off. My advice to, to Warner Brothers would be to park all things DCU. Go silent for three to five years. Let people sort of get over everything and then come back to it with a very fresh, specific take. But odds of that are probably pretty low. My guess is that there's gonna be a lot of pressure from the takeover for them to start kicking off cash pretty fast. Uh, and so, yeah, we're unlikely to see that come to fruition, but that would be my advice.

• 2:01:05Speaker 02

  Um, the interesting thing about it, I seen a tweet, I was trying to find, I couldn't. They said, "The only thing that MCU has over DC is low expectations." When the first Iron Man came out, it made $500 million. Everybody was like, "Oh, cool, that's a smashing success." And then they kind of walked away. Superman made 670, I want to say. It was positive, it was in the green. But it was like, "Well, Spider-Man just made a billion, this had to make a billion." And I feel like DC is comparing Marvel's Year Five, Movie 30, to James Gunn's Day One, Movie One. And I feel like that is the hard part.

• 2:01:39Tom Bilyeu?

  I'm gonna take a violently different opinion and say, what Marvel had going for it was tone. And they really nailed it when they put Jon Favreau together with, um, Robert Downey Jr. And they know that internally, which is, so I went to the, like, private screening that, um, Robert Downey Jr. was at, um, the guy who was running Disney at the time, Bob Iger was at, like, Kevin Feige was at, and I got to see them publicly, like, they called Robert Downey Jr., this was the screening for the final one, uh, god, whatever it was. Um, and they were like, "Listen, none of this would have been possible without Robert Downey Jr.

• 2:02:24Tom Bilyeu?

  Please come up, like, we were standing on your shoulders for, you know, whatever, 10 movies, and we're just so grateful." Uh, because they understood that he was sort of uniquely able to capture that tone, where it could go from funny tongue-in-cheek to, like, real emotion within a single movie. And that was the thing that I think Marvel got right, and I'll shout out Kevin Feige, who I think, when, in that sort of initial, what, phases one, two, three, and four, he did a generational run that I think is still unprecedented in cinema history, of a group of films that came out as one sort of cohesive thing, that told one story, introduced side characters, uh, and then gave them their own films.

• 2:03:06Tom Bilyeu?

  I mean, it was really, really brilliant, and I was completely blown away. Um, and it's this classic, as a comic book reader, you understand this is like a long-term schism between DC and Marvel. Marvel was always more grounded, it was in, uh, the real universe. It wasn't Metropolis and Gotham, it was like Queens, New York, was where Spider-Man was from. And it just felt a lot more like, "Oh, I can relate to this." But was also, um, had a more playful tone. DC, on the other hand, was way darker, these more fantasy-driven universes. It wasn't your real hometown, it was a fantasy version of your hometown.

• 2:03:48Tom Bilyeu?

  And so, it always had a darker edge, it was more serious in tone. And so, when they tried to bring that seriousness to the screen, at a time where what was popping was Marvel's more popcorn-munching fare, but with an emotional core, like a real heart to it, it just looked weird. And so, the Zack Snyder, like, heaviness, darkness, all that, anti-heroes and shit, just wasn't playing. People wanted, like, the heroes, they wanted that Robert Downey Jr., Tom Holland vibe, between Iron Man and Spider-Man, like, that, that showed the emotional core. And just what the Avengers were able to do as a cast coming together, they really felt like they had chemistry on and off-camera, it just, they got so many things right tonally,

• 2:04:30Tom Bilyeu?

  that, that's why I was worried, okay, so you tried a really dark tone with Zack Snyder, then you were trying a really weird tone with James Gunn, that when it's a spice and it's, you know, one of the movies, very interesting, when it becomes the whole tone, it's like, okay, it's a bit too weird, a bit too specific. So, I think that what DC has to figure out is, how do you have a tone that is as universally appealing as Marvel without just copying them? And I'm not sure that you can do it. It's quite literally the same, um, thing that I'm dealing with as a developer, going up against Minecraft. It's like Minecraft is goaded. So, I'm not even trying to beat Minecraft, I'm trying to be the thing you graduate into, and so...

• 2:05:12Tom Bilyeu?

  But that means we have to have a tone that's very different, we have to have a tone that's, I won't say universal, but it's very broad, but it has to be different, so that you don't just feel like, "This is Minecraft, but worse." It's like, we've got to have our own identity. And it can't be so specific that it feels like a James Gunn, it can't be dark, because we're still aimed at kids. So, it's like, yeah, they failed to answer that question.

• 2:05:35Speaker 02

  You weren't, were you a fan of the Superman that just came out?

• 2:05:38Tom Bilyeu?

  Um, I thought it was okay. It was very forgettable, but I enjoyed it.

• 2:05:43Speaker 02

  Got it. Um, cool. Alright, um, send the requests, we got some super chats.

• 2:05:47Speaker 04

  Yes, we do. First up on the super chats, Luke Adam Miller says, "Tom, Godzilla -1 is in my top 20 films, seeing the sequel tomorrow. Would you interview the writer-director? And does Tokyo Junkie detail how Japan adopted a new post-World War II national narrative? If so, how? Thanks, stay legendary."

• 2:06:04Tom Bilyeu?

  I don't know Tokyo Junkie, so I can't answer that question. Anybody give me context on that?

• 2:06:09Speaker 04

  Yeah, I don't know. I don't know who Tokyo Junkie is.

• 2:06:11Tom Bilyeu?

  Um, so, yeah, I can't speak to that, but, um, what I will say is, the answer in terms of how they did it, um, give me one second, so I'm not doing two things at once.

• 2:06:23Speaker 02

  Oh, Tokyo Junkie is a book?

• 2:06:24Speaker 04

  Yeah, I found the book.

• 2:06:25Tom Bilyeu?

  Oh, shit! The funny thing is, I, I think I've read that, and I may have talked about it. Okay, so did Tokyo Junkie talk about that? Nooo. I got that from a different book, which was called Embracing Defeat, uh, which is about post-World War II Japan and Tokyo. Um, so, yeah, if you want to know about that, read Embracing Defeat, absolutely incredible. Um, okay, so what was the first part of the question?

• 2:06:50Speaker 04

  Oh, let me just...

• 2:06:51Speaker 02

  Would you interview the writer-director?

• 2:06:53Tom Bilyeu?

  I would not, because they won't perform on the show. Um, so, you have to be very realistic about what the audience actually wants, and our audience has displayed no interest for those kind of just like, um, philosophical things. When we bring somebody on, there has to be a sense of urgency to it, or they underperform wildly.

• 2:07:11Speaker 04

  Favorite Grandson Tech says, "Show me your friends and I will show you your future." That's the quote. "I didn't have time to access to ideal people, I didn't have the time or access to ideal people around me. This show has been an amazing substitute, thank you sincerely." Uh, thank you sincerely. Remember, everyone to hit like and sub.

• 2:07:28Tom Bilyeu?

  Yes, please, thank you so much, I appreciate that. Uh, always, since I do such a terrible job of reminding you guys. Also, there's a hype button, somebody needs to hype this thing up, let's go, let's go. Uh, and thank you, by the way, it always amazes me that people take the time to do a super chat, uh, contribute, only to say something nice. That's amazing, thank you. And Eric, I have sent you the request, it is waiting.

• 2:07:51Speaker 04

  Dan Clark, Controller Wipes, thank you for the 50, says, "Team, do you have a place to mail a free box of controller wipes to the team as a thank you? You've had a large impact on my life, inspired me to start this company, and have helped me to think from first principles, which feels rare as a Zoomer."

• 2:08:06Tom Bilyeu?

  I love that. Um, that's very kind of you, to do controller wipes, um... Do we have an address? Probably not that we're gonna say publicly, but if you hit us on Discord, we ought to be able to get you that. Yeah, all true.

• 2:08:24Speaker 04

  Steve Lamoth, thank you for, uh, the 40 total today, says, "All Amazon haters on this independent contractor model. FedEx has run this model for decades, routes are independently owned and not FedEx-owned. Many millionaires made by Amazon and FedEx."

• 2:08:39Tom Bilyeu?

  Too true, too true. Yeah, uh, it makes me sad to see the IR go in the wrong place, but alas, welcome to populism.

• 2:08:46Speaker 02

  John Geezer had like five that were all under the threshold, but I'm gonna bundle them together, because he keeps asking questions. So, I'll, I'll read them. Um, so first he said, "Amazon requirement forced the delivery volume to be so high that it does cause dangerous behavior, happens in delivery and in their warehouse. Employees just all need to..."

• 2:09:04Tom Bilyeu?

  Hold on, so let's address that, so, uh, presumably, if it's dangerous, there are already laws. So, this is one of those things where people are like, enforcement's the problem, but they want to act like the law's the problem. If, if, if it is dangerous, there is already a law, I guarantee it. So, just enforce the law.

• 2:09:20Speaker 02

  Um, "Employees just all need to quit, then starve, and be homeless until the company concedes. Honest question, what is Tom's suggestion if someone, of some way, workers can gain power? People starve within 30 days."

• 2:09:32Tom Bilyeu?

  It's so wild, because I've made my argument so many times, it's just that I think people think, "Well, that's never gonna happen, so what's the real answer?" It's like, no, that is the real answer. Everything else is what I just talked about. It's so bad, it just keeps pushing into, uh, there being a sufficient amount of pain and suffering that people finally accept the bitter pill. But there is no way around the bitter pill. If you don't balance budgets, you will forever be here. If you don't stop importing cheap labor, you will forever be here. If you don't stop sending your jobs overseas, you will forever be here. You must return jobs to America, you must, um, stop importing cheap labor, you must incentivize companies with carrot and stick to be building and creating, you must...

• 2:10:12Speaker 02

  I feel like those are top, well, how would you incentivize it if he was from the employer class, from the worker?

• 2:10:17Tom Bilyeu?

  The only way for the worker to be empowered is to say, "I don't need this job."

• 2:10:22Tom Bilyeu?

  And if you bring a union on board, it will not do the thing that you're hoping it will do. First of all, it has low, low, single-digit impact on actual employee, uh, employee, yes, employee wages. It's like 2%, maybe like 2.2 or something, but it's very small. Uh, what ends up happening is you create an in-group, yes, the people that are in, they're fine, but you stifle the company, the company doesn't grow, you don't bring more people on, and you start fighting for really dumb shit, that makes the whole organism worse off, look at education. So, it's like, uh, it, it is not the right way to handle it. The right way to handle it is growth, which is what I was about to say, you have to deregulate, so that people can actually grow. Uh, you've got to get the engine of growth going.

• 2:11:04Tom Bilyeu?

  That is like, job number one, grow, grow, grow, your economy must be focused on growth. Uh, and then, don't export, don't import, and jobs. And that is about your only known method to overcome this. Now, AI could cause a deflationary event that makes life far more, um, affordable, but there will be some tension between the inflationary pressures and people just having no economic power because, um, or no power in their job, because AI becomes the ultimate cheap immigrant.

• 2:11:38Speaker 02

  Um, cool. Alright, we have those two from, uh, Big Digglers.

• 2:11:41Speaker 04

  Yes, Big Digglers first one says, "Currently, the slimmest of silver, of dollars are directly created without debt. Silver eagle, eagle equals a dollar, gold equal 50, etc. The US Treasury and Fed can change these numbers by fiat and create liquidity from DR side of BS with no debt."

• 2:12:01Tom Bilyeu?

  Okay. Um, so I think what he's saying is what go, do they already have the gold or sorry, the silver? And you're saying just mint it. And now we've got more liquidity in the system without debt. That's gotta be what he's saying. Um, yes, they're not going to do it. So this goes back to part of that big argument that you made in your, um, the letter that you sent. Uh, it's one of those things that, okay. If a country wanted to be, wanted to have sound money, they could. But a country that is driven by fiat is just, they're never going to do that. And so now the question becomes, okay, if we know that we're in a system

• 2:12:43Tom Bilyeu?

  where we're using, uh, debt and deficits, how do we make that system work? And the only way to make that system work is to have the debt go into the productive economy instead of into, um, war, instead of into welfare. You wanna put, you're going to use debt, but you wanna be putting it in the right place. I think that's the only real answer. Um, so them trying to create some amount of liquidity through precious metals, uh, they're just not gonna do it. And I don't even know that it would be enough. I would have to look at that. Maybe that it would be a sufficient amount of money. Uh, it's just not the system that we have.

• 2:13:26Tom Bilyeu?

  And I'm so unconvinced that we will ever have that system. I would rather find a way in the system that we have to make this work. And I think that's debt going into the productive economy.

• 2:13:36Speaker 04

  Big diggler's second one. Thank you for 40 total. Says Brent would argue every time the world could have chosen to shy away from the dollar, read a dollar down. Offshore players actually double down by just borrowing even more, uh, dollars, the denom debt. I'm assuming denomination?

• 2:13:52Tom Bilyeu?

  Yeah.

• 2:13:53Speaker 04

  Yeah.

• 2:13:53Tom Bilyeu?

  Denominate.

• 2:13:53Speaker 04

  Oh, denominate. CB's, UST sales may just be mark to market.

• 2:13:58Tom Bilyeu?

  Sorry, read that very last thing again?

• 2:13:59Speaker 04

  Uh, CB's, UST sales, and they put that in quotes, may just be a mark to market.

• 2:14:04Tom Bilyeu?

  Central Bank, uh, United States Treasury's got it. Uh, is that true? I don't think. I don't know. That's the honest answer. I've not heard anybody say that. So I'd be a little surprised if that ends up being true. Uh, so I would say, look at the flip side. The amount of gold that they're buying is dramatically higher. The Basel III laws that they passed to make sure that gold could be counted, tells you the direction of travel that they wanted to go in. Um, yeah. So my read on that situation is very aggressively that they're like, we need something. Uh, they're not zeroing out the US debt that they hold, nor would I expect them to. But making it a smaller part of their portfolio, they are clearly doing.

• 2:14:45Tom Bilyeu?

  And intuition, but I don't think it's just marking to market. I think that they have a penchant towards gold because they understand that the US is doing something that is not sustainable. Uh, and at a minimum, they know financial repression is coming and they don't wanna be on the wrong side of that. That's my instinct.

• 2:15:03Speaker 04

  Awesome. That's it for super chats.

• 2:15:05Tom Bilyeu?

  All right. You beautiful people, thank you so much for joining us today. Again, if you guys are starting a business, Tailor Brands is gonna make it so much easier for you. You can start out by paying nothing other than state fees. They're gonna help you get set up, uh, legal formation, your EIN number. They've got business coaching, bookkeeping, business banking, everything that you would need to start a company. They've got all of that. It's absolutely incredible for beginning entrepreneurs, anybody in their early phases of a company. Click the link in the description to start with the amazing Tailor Brands today. Uh, launch your business again, starting at $0 plus state fees. And then we have our next AI masterclass coming up Thursday, December 10th at 11:00 AM, uh, Pacific. Link is in the description to sign up. I hope you guys will join me.

• 2:15:50Tom Bilyeu?

  Stuff changes so rapidly in AI. It is one of my great pleasures to get to spend time with you guys. It's free, by the way, completely free. I'll walk you through how to start a business. Using AI, you can ask me any question you want about AI or anything else. Uh, it is a lot of fun. Uh, and we'll walk you through everything that we're doing to help entrepreneurs get off the ground. All right, everybody, we'll see you Friday. Until then, my friends, be legendary. Take care, peace. Let's talk about a pattern that is guaranteed to be killing your progress. You know what you need to do. You need consistent nutrition. We all do. You need vitamins, probiotics, greens. We all know that we should be doing more of it. When your morning gets chaotic, you skip it. When you travel, you skip it. When your routine breaks, everything tends to break. And that inconsistency compounds against you every single day.

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