Advice Line with Richard Branson of Virgin

Virgin Group founder Richard Branson joins Guy on the Advice Line, where they answer questions from three early-stage founders. Plus, Richard’s recent adventures in bungee jumping, ziplining, space exploration and more—all in the name of promoting some of his brand’s latest offerings. First we meet Lola from New York City, who’s looking to maintain a personal touch as she scales her travel accessory brand. Then Ross from Phoenix, who’s wondering how to make a splash with his above-ground pool rental business. And Andrew from Cumberland Gap, Tennessee, who wants to start selling his small-batch granola in locations beyond his juice bar. Thank you to the founders of Silver & Riley, Now Pools, and The Juice Spot/Lone Wolf Granola for being a part of our show. If you’d like to be featured on a future Advice Line episode, leave us a one-minute message that tells us about your business and a specific question you’d like answered. Send a voice memo to [email protected] mailto:[email protected] or call 1-800-433-1298. And be sure to listen to Virgin's founding story https://art19.com/shows/831bd173-0992-41b7-b1eb-112db904d947/episodes/d2d10ea6-14ca-4f75-aa30-24e0a836ca91/embed as told by Richard Branson on How I Built This in 2017. This episode was produced by Chris Maccini with music by Ramtin Arablouei. It was edited by John Isabella. Our audio engineer was Neal Rauch. You can follow HIBT on X https://twitter.com/HowIBuiltThis & Instagram https://www.instagram.com/howibuiltthis and sign up for Guy's free newsletter at guyraz.com http://guyraz.com/. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Speaker names marked ? are inferred from speaking time and the show’s known hosts — they are not voice-verified.

• 0:00Guy Raz?

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• 5:16Guy Raz?

  Hello and welcome to the Advice Line on How I Built This Lab. I'm Guy Raz. This is the place where we help try to solve your business challenges. Each week, I'm joined by a legendary founder, a former guest on the show, who will help me try to help you. And if you're building something and you need advice, give us a call and you just might be the next guest on the show. Our number is 1-800-433-1298. Send us a one-minute message that tells us about your business and the issues or questions that you'd like help with. You can also send us a voice memo at [email protected]. And make sure to tell us how to reach you. And also, don't forget to sign up for my newsletter.

• 6:00Guy Raz?

  It's full of insights and ideas from the world's greatest entrepreneurs. You can sign up for free at guyraz.com. And we'll put all this info in the podcast description. All right, let's get to it. Joining me this week is legendary entrepreneur, Sir Richard Branson, founder of Virgin Group. Sir Richard, it's great to have you back on the show.

• 6:21Speaker 01

  It's always good to be on your show, so thank you.

• 6:24Guy Raz?

  You were a guest on the show back in 2017. It is an incredible episode. If you guys have not heard it, we will put a link in the episode description. Of course, Virgin is such an iconic brand, it is really well worth going back and listening. The story about how you started a student magazine in the 70s, I think you went and interviewed James Baldwin in his hotel room. Then you started a mail order, a record business when you were 20, and then you turned that into Virgin into, wow, an empire of record stores, cinemas, a record label, cola, vodka, airlines, trains, phones, banks, hotels, space tourism, like more than 200 businesses over the past 50 years. It's just an incredible story. And just a few years ago, after we talked, you blasted off to the edge of space in your

• 7:09Guy Raz?

  own rocket ship.

• 7:12Speaker 01

  Yeah, that was quite a ride, and it had been a dream come true. I dreamt of going to space ever since I saw the moon landing. And then, you know, the last 20 years, we're trying to build our own spaceship, and our own mothership, and our own rockets, and finally, we got to space. So it was definitely a pinch, a pinchy moment.

• 7:35Guy Raz?

  That's amazing. Richard, before we get to today's callers, I want to ask you a couple of questions. When you started Virgin, right, and you started this record store, and you gave it this name, Virgin, at what point did you think, you know, this could be a brand that goes way beyond record stores?

• 7:58Speaker 01

  That's a good question. I mean, I've never really been interested in building companies with the money motive, and I've never really thought of myself as being a business person. And I never really thought of myself as building a brand. I just was having a lot of fun doing things that I thought could make a difference. And it sort of turned out that I think because we were enjoying what we were doing, we were sticking our neck out, doing it in a fun way, that suddenly we had a brand that was perceived as one of the top, maybe top 10 brands in the world. But it wasn't something that we planned. It was just something that, you know, happened over time.

• 8:43Guy Raz?

  As somebody, I mean, who is such an important brand builder, right? What do you think a brand, what are some of the elements that a great brand needs to, needs to have, needs to develop?

• 8:56Speaker 01

  I think maybe the most important thing is that you must, first of all, never let people down. So every new venture that Virgin's done over the years, we make sure that it's brand enhancing and it's better than what we did before. I mean, if I take our latest venture, Virgin Voyages, we've now got four beautiful cruise ships out there on the seas. Every single little detail, the team got right. It's Virgin through and through, adults only, really fun experience. And people who go on it get off singing its praises.

• 9:35Speaker 01

  And so that then makes it that much more easy for us to then launch the next Virgin product and will make it that much more likely that somebody who's been on a Virgin Voyage will want to try a Virgin Atlantic plane or a Virgin Active Health Club. And so the key thing is just to make sure you're the best in your field. So if you launch a cruise company, it's got to be the best cruise company. If you launch an airline, it's got to be the best airline.

• 10:03Speaker 01

  And you mustn't compromise at all along the way.

• 10:08Guy Raz?

  I mean, there's virtually no other brand on earth that is in so many different categories. It's quite remarkable. I'm curious, I mean, today, obviously, there are thousands of employees all around the world involved with Virgin Group. And so there are people who can telegraph and transmit what it means to be a Virgin brand. But when you have to do that, how have you been able to really make sure that people understand what Virgin means to you so that they can take that idea and that meaning and translate it into a great product or service?

• 10:42Speaker 01

  Well, we have an advantage, and that is that because we were involved in so many different ventures around the world, if we Set up a new Virgin company, I can, you know, pull in people from our trains company, I can pull in people from our airline company and, and they already know what it is like to have worked for a Virgin company. So, you know, for instance, we're just looking at maybe taking on Eurostar through the channel tunnel and the designer that I've got to look at designing trains that will, you know, make Eurostar look like old trains.

• 11:23Speaker 01

  Is the designer that created the Heathrow Clubhouse in London, which, you know, has been there for many years, but anybody who flies with Virgin will talk about the Virgin Heathrow Clubhouse and she did a magnificent job there. So, you know, she'll do a magnificent job for our trains. What we're trying to create is completely fresh ideas with anything we do. So our team have to always go a little bit above themselves.

• 11:51Guy Raz?

  I mean, you've taken really big swings and you, you have had some very public failures. We talked about them when you were on the show back in 2017, I remember. But you, you keep trying out new ideas, new businesses even now. And, and I can't, I imagine you will do this until the day you breathe your last breath. What, what drives you to keep, to keep at it, to keep starting new things all the time?

• 12:16Speaker 01

  You know, you only live once and I think you, you, you, you know, I've, I've had 55 years of building businesses, but also building not-for-profit organizations to try to tackle the problems of the world. And, you know, apart from our businesses, we have 20 global organizations that we run on a not-for-profit basis, looking at all issues from climate change through to the state of the planetary boundaries, to conflict resolution issues, to drug reform and so on. And it would be, I think, such a waste of a life if you, if you get, find yourself in a position where you can pick up the phone to pretty well anybody in the world and get through.

• 12:58Speaker 01

  And by getting through, hopefully get things done, you know, get, get change made. So I don't want to waste the position I'm in. Well, I will, I will continue working day and night, most likely until I drop and want to be, you know, want to be proud of, you know, what, you know, what our wonderful teams are creating and, and I can sort of, you know, like I'm in Canada today, launching flights from Toronto to the UK. And, you know, I'm just ziplined down the Niagara Falls as you do. And it helps to have somebody who's, you know, the, the head of a company to be the icing on the cake. And everybody else has done all the hard work in getting the airline up and, up and

• 13:39Speaker 01

  going and, and getting the check-ins desk sorted and the lounges built and the, uh, the cabin crew trained and the pilots trained. And then I can come in and, and try to make sure that people know that we've launched um, uh, London to Toronto or Toronto to London. And, and then it gives it a better chance of succeeding.

• 13:57Guy Raz?

  Richard, having you on the advice line is kind of like having Michael Jordan at a sports clinic. So I'm super excited for the entrepreneurs today. Why don't we go ahead and take some calls? You ready?

• 14:08Speaker 01

  I am as ready as ever.

• 14:10Guy Raz?

  All right, let's do it. Let's bring our first caller. Please introduce yourself. Tell us your name, where you're calling from, and just a little bit about your business.

• 14:18Speaker 02

  Yes. Hi, Guy. Hi, Sir Richard and everyone listening.

• 14:21Speaker 01

  Lovely to talk to you.

• 14:22Speaker 02

  Great to be here. It's truly an honor. Uh, my name is Lola Banjo and I'm calling from lovely New York City. I am the founder of Silver and Riley, an ethical luxury brand that makes travel and fashion accessories. We handcraft Italian-made bags that blend gorgeous style, heritage craftsmanship with modern innovation and functionality, all designed to elevate your journeys.

• 14:44Guy Raz?

  All right. Awesome. Lola, thank you for calling in and welcome to the show. So Silver and Riley. You make travel gear, like purses, bags? Tell me a little bit more about what you make.

• 14:55Speaker 02

  Yeah, so we make travel and fashion bags, which include duffel bags. We have women's handbags. We have men's messenger bags. We also have small leather accessories like passport holders, wallets, card holders, things like that, yeah.

• 15:11Speaker 01

  And I heard the story of how you were on a flight one day. And it wasn't a Virgin flight, I hasten to add.

• 15:18Speaker 02

  It was not a Virgin flight.

• 15:20Guy Raz?

  What's the story?

• 15:22Speaker 01

  She wanted a blanket and the stewardess said, I'm sorry, but that's just for the business class passengers.

• 15:27Speaker 02

  Exactly.

• 15:29Guy Raz?

  So that experience inspired you to start a brand?

• 15:32Speaker 02

  That inspired me to start?

• 15:33Guy Raz?

  Wow.

• 15:34Speaker 02

  Sir Richard, I'm so honored that you actually know that story. Yes, I was traveling weekly as a management consultant, right? So that's one of the reasons I was on that flight. That was really freezing. And I was just like, you know, Sir Richard, you always talk about your best ideas are born out of frustration. And I was so frustrated during that flight, like, everyone needs to have these travel conveniences and why aren't they these travel conveniences? And that's what inspired me to start the brand.

• 16:00Guy Raz?

  Well, Richard was inspired to start an airline because he couldn't get a flight back from the Caribbean, I think, right?

• 16:05Speaker 02

  Right.

• 16:06Guy Raz?

  Tell me a little bit about how the business is doing so far.

• 16:09Speaker 02

  Yeah, the business is doing great. So we launched five years ago and we are a seven-figure brand. We're still a young brand, but I'm very proud that we are, we have clients across 27 different countries. We have nearly 50% repeat customers. 14% of our customers own five or more products from us. And that's with an average AOV of around $600.

• 16:31Guy Raz?

  Wow.

• 16:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, we're primarily direct to customer, but we're also partnered with major retailers.

• 16:36Guy Raz?

  Where are you selling your, so you're direct to consumer mainly, but where else are you selling?

• 16:40Speaker 02

  Yeah, we are also partnered with Nordstrom, Stax, and the summer Macy's, Bloomingdale's as well. So definitely building and we just launched five years ago. So I'm proud of where we are, even though we still have a lot of work to do.

• 16:53Guy Raz?

  All right, before we ask you more questions, what is your question that you brought for us today?

• 16:59Speaker 02

  Yeah, absolutely. So I grew up with humble beginnings and it's been really, there's been real challenges, real trade-offs, rejections, and failures along the way. The space is not necessarily built for someone like me to thrive in. So my question is, Sir Richard, you have built an incredible, purpose-led, global empire in some of the most competitive and capital-intensive industries. What helped you stake bold and mission-driven when the odds were stacked against you and resources were tight? And Guy, I'd love to hear from your vantage point as well. What advice would you give a founder like me that's building with deep purpose in an industry where those values can be at odds and where the lack of capital remains our biggest challenge?

• 17:44Guy Raz?

  All right, we'll get to them. Richard, I want to bring you in because clearly, some parallels in the early part of your career. So thoughts for Lola?

• 17:54Speaker 01

  Well, look, first of all, you've got bundles of personality. You should be able to sell, go in and sell anybody anything.

• 18:03Speaker 02

  Thank you so much.

• 18:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, so I mean, in the early days of Virgin, you know, we were doing something we passionately believed in, which was, we had a magazine and there was the Vietnamese war going on. We thought it was an unjust war. And so we were campaigning very strongly against the war. So we very much had a purpose and we surrounded ourselves with other people who believed in our purpose. And so people worked enormously hard, day and night, to make the magazine succeed. So, I mean, I think that with your company, you have a purpose and if you can inspire your team

• 18:47Speaker 01

  to embrace that purpose, I feel absolutely sure that you'll succeed. As to the second half of the question, over to you, sir.

• 18:58Guy Raz?

  Yeah, Lola, a quick question for you is how, I mean, with a brand like yours, I know you've you've broken through seven figures in sales, which is awesome. You know, you're five, six years in. I'm looking at your website and your products are beautiful. Just very briefly, how are you connecting with customers? How are you making this a personalized experience?

• 19:18Speaker 02

  Yeah, we actually, we probably over anchor on personalization down to handwritten notes and you know, just how our CRM personalizes the experience as well. Our clients are family. We address them as part of the Silver and Riley family and I really see them as such. And I think that's why they keep coming back, you know, almost a half, 50% repeat customer rate and you know, just making sure that they all feel like they're part of the story. You know, we, I personally do outreach and I know that's not necessarily scalable, but in the early stages, that's something that you know, I have really leaned into.

• 19:56Speaker 01

  Is it true that you wish them a happy birthday on their birthday?

• 19:59Speaker 02

  Yes, we do. We actually have CRM that does that. So I don't necessarily need to do that.

• 20:04Guy Raz?

  But that's the great thing about about the, many of these things are scalable, right? Like, I mean, you look at great brands like Virgin, right? When you go on to a Virgin plane or a train, you know, or use a Virgin product or hotel, you're going to get a level of personalization. You look at brands like Zappos or Nordstrom where you know, you're working with them. I mean, they are, one of the, the reasons why those brands are so successful is because they've leaned in on customer service and customer experience. And so, to me, the question isn't how can we continue to do that? It's how can we not, right? Like, that's really the the value proposition here. And so, when you build that into the mission and into the culture of the organization, that's going to inform

• 20:49Guy Raz?

  every decision you make, right? I mean, I think that's sort of the way you guys operated Virgin, Richard.

• 20:57Speaker 01

  Now, just thinking, I mean, if we, if somebody has a problem on, in one of the Virgin companies, generally speaking, I'll ask the companies to make sure I know about it. And if we deal with it, you know, properly, I mean, if I do a handwritten note and, you know, really take a bit of trouble over it, that customer will be your, your friend for life and they'll, they'll, they'll tell another thirty or forty people, you know, and, and so, you know, with the birthdays, the more personal one can make, make some of these things, the better and the more genuine, the, the better.

• 21:32Speaker 02

  Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think that's also why, what drives a really high referral rate for us as well. Seventeen percent of our, our new clients come from existing customers. I learned this also from, from my mother. You know, she passed away, but when I was younger, she had a bakery and I remember every single person that would walk through the bakery doors, she would remember very little details about them that made them feel good. And I always took that away from, from that. And so the handwritten notes, which of course is not scalable, but I still do them, you know, during Christmas time, I'm writing hundreds of handwritten notes every day. And my team is like, just get it printed. And I'm like, I get the feedback from our clients that say, that makes me

• 22:13Speaker 02

  feel seen and valuable. I do worry about when we're scaling globally, how I can still maintain that. So that's something that I, I am watchful for, but, you know, it's something that really, really means something valuable to the brand. And so I'm grateful to be able to continue that and personalize that. Just like Virgin, I remember my first Virgin flight, I was just like, this is the best airline ever. Like, you know, I didn't even have status in Virgin and they still treated me amazing and just, I just felt really great. And I felt like, you know what, I want every Silver and Right client to feel like that as well. So.

• 22:46Speaker 01

  Another company that we started when I was very young was, was a recording studio in, in the countryside in Oxford and.

• 22:54Speaker 01

  You know, we'd have artists coming every two or three days. And in time, you're just not going to remember all the little things about those artists. So like, say Frank Zappa comes to the manor, you know, and you have a conversation. I would, after dinner, go and write a few things down, like, you know, the name of his wife, and then, you know, the name of his children, you know, his mother may have been ill or something, you know, just little things so that, you know, a year or two later or five years later, they come again. And you can actually remember one or two of these personal things, which just makes such a difference.

• 23:33Speaker 01

  So, I mean, if you're going to a big chain of retail shops and you have a chat with, you know, with the head of the retail, it's worth going to the loo afterwards and just taking a note of some of the things the person said, because it's so good to be able to drop it into the conversation the next time you see them.

• 23:51Guy Raz?

  That is great advice. It reminds me about how Bill Clinton used to keep index cards of everyone he met, and then, of course, paid back in spades when he ran for president. Lola Banjo, the brand is called Silver and Riley. Thanks so much for calling in. Good luck, we're cheering you on.

• 24:05Speaker 01

  Yeah, very much. Good luck.

• 24:07Guy Raz?

  Journey.

• 24:08Speaker 02

  Thank you, Guy, and thank you, Sir Richard. Guy, I have to say, How I Built This has just gotten me through some of the toughest times. So you're doing amazing work, so I just want to say thank you for everything you do.

• 24:17Guy Raz?

  Great having you on. Yeah, that's such good advice. I mean, this idea of remembering details. When you see somebody, you know, even a year later or two years later, and you remember something, the name of their spouse or a kid, like, people are just blown away by that. It really stays with them.

• 24:34Speaker 01

  Yeah, it really, really is important.

• 24:36Guy Raz?

  All right, we're going to take a quick break, but we'll be right back with another caller and another round of advice. Stay with us. I'm Guy Raz, and you're listening to the Advice Line, right here on How I Built This Lab.

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• 27:04Guy Raz?

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• 28:29Guy Raz?

  Welcome back to the Advice Line on How I Built This Lab. I'm Guy Raz, and my guest today is Virgin founder, Richard Branson, the legendary Richard Branson. Richard, let's bring in our next caller.

• 28:40Speaker 05

  Yeah.

• 28:40Guy Raz?

  Hello, welcome to the Advice Line. You are on with Sir Richard Branson. Please tell us your name, where you're calling from, and just a little bit about your business.

• 28:49Speaker 05

  Yeah, hi Guy and Sir Richard. I'm Ross Novotny from Phoenix, Arizona. I am co-founder of NowPools. NowPools is the world's first and only on-demand pool and spa company. So think pools as a subscription.

• 29:04Guy Raz?

  I love this idea. Ross, thanks for calling in. I was just in Tucson during the middle of a heatwave and it was really hot. So I can imagine a lot of people might be really interested in a temporary pool. So these are temporary pools. You could basically can rent a pool and you go and put it in someone's backyard?

• 29:22Speaker 05

  That's right. Yeah, we take care of all the headaches of owning a pool. So you can subscribe to our service. We go out and we set up an above-ground pool. Then we take care of weekly cleaning and maintenance and chemicals, any warranty issues, and then we remove the pool when you're done with the subscription. So you get your yard back.

• 29:40Guy Raz?

  Well, how did you come up with this idea?

• 29:42Speaker 05

  So my wife and I adopted our kids when they were a little bit older. And having sort of young, rambunctious kids, wanting to send them outside in the middle of the summer in Phoenix seems like cruel and unusual punishment. So we, you know, I wanted a pool, but didn't want to spend the money and didn't want to lose our yard. So I thought there had to be some sort of temporary way to make all this happen. And thus, NowPools was born in that sort of crisis moment as a parent.

• 30:12Guy Raz?

  I love it. And just briefly, Ross, what, tell me a little bit about how the business is doing. I know you started this in 2020. What are your sales been like?

• 30:20Speaker 05

  Yeah, this year we'll cross $1 million lifetime revenue. So, I mean, you know, we're getting there. It's been slow-going, a slow build, but positive, really positive reviews from clients, a lot of return clients. We've had clients for five years now that have come, you know, back year after year, and we're gaining each year in our subscriptions. So slowly but surely, we're growing market share.

• 30:44Guy Raz?

  And I'm looking at the, a picture of the large pool, which is quite large, actually. I mean, you could have a bunch of kids in there. How much, roughly, how much does it cost to rent it?

• 30:52Speaker 05

  So it starts at $675 a month and then goes up to $825 for the shortest time period. So the longer you sign up for, the cheaper it becomes per month.

• 31:04Guy Raz?

  Awesome. And what's your question for us today?

• 31:07Speaker 05

  Yeah, so a question regarding marketing and specifically Sir Richard, a huge fan of yours and all that you've done with your bold unconventional marketing and now pools. We're trying to create an entirely new market that's never existed before. So what kind of framework or strategic approach might you take when you're trying to launch something that the world doesn't even know exists?

• 31:32Guy Raz?

  All right, so Richard, we've got Ross has got this brand, this company in Phoenix, starting in Phoenix with, I guess, plans to expand, where you could rent a pool for the summer and it's built in your backyard above ground and they take care of everything. How should he start to, well, you may have some questions for him before you answer his question.

• 31:50Speaker 01

  Well, look, nice to talk to you and what a great idea. So it's definitely servicing a gap in the market. And presumably, just for first question, presumably you don't have to get planning permission for a pool that you just put on the top of the, on the top of the ground.

• 32:06Speaker 05

  Correct. Yeah, every municipality across the country is going to be different, but no, no permit required.

• 32:11Speaker 01

  Which is fantastic because I mean presumably with, if you're digging a pool, you would have to get permission, is that right?

• 32:17Speaker 05

  Correct.

• 32:18Guy Raz?

  Yes.

• 32:19Speaker 01

  Okay, so, so, and do you push that point a little bit?

• 32:24Speaker 05

  Yeah, we don't necessarily think we are adversarial to in-ground pools. We think we're, we're serving a little bit different markets. Somebody who wants a temporary solution, someone who may not have the funds to buy an in-ground pool. And, and also, we really push the temporary nature of it. You can have a pool for just a few months at a time. If your plans change and you want to go on vacation one summer, just don't get a pool from us and then maybe come back the next year.

• 32:50Speaker 01

  So, I mean, is it word of mouth that, you know, you put one pool in and then a neighbor sees it and they then want one for their house? Is that the main way it's being?

• 33:01Speaker 05

  Yeah, I would say word of mouth has been our biggest driver. We've, you know, the earned media, we've been on the news and sort of some traditional media outlets several times, but we're, we're trying to make a bigger splash, no pun intended, to be able to really get the word out there that we're even an option people should consider.

• 33:19Speaker 01

  Have you done any sort of fun gimmicks in the pools and got any interesting? People swimming in the pools or?

• 33:27Speaker 05

  We were hoping you would come out to Phoenix sometime and take a dip. But other than that, we've done some events, whether it's concerts. We've done some festivals and, you know, trade shows and things like that. And even had recently like a canine, a police dog event where they jumped into one of our pools, which was pretty fun, but haven't been able to still get that critical mass that we're looking for as far as awareness.

• 33:51Speaker 01

  I mean, with Virgin, what I tried to do was just do something fun that would get you on the front page of the papers or in the news or something. And, and I was just thinking earlier that, you know, if every time you opened a pool, you could have a mermaid for an hour or so in the pool or something which would attract attention. But whenever we launched something new, we would, we would come up with something which would make people smile.

• 34:17Speaker 05

  And did you have a strategic approach to try to come up with those marketing events that really caught people's attention?

• 34:23Speaker 01

  Um, because I do it every single time we launch a new venture, I never quite know what's about to happen. So, I mean, when I turned up in Australia to launch Virgin Mobile, they drove me from Sydney out to a field and there was a helicopter there. And, and I thought, oh, well, that's nice. I'm going to get in a helicopter. And the next moment they're putting a bungee thing around my waist and I'm, I then are heading into Sydney 100 feet below the helicopter and landed on top of a big cage and I had to rip the cage open and free up everybody who were locked up with contracts on other mobile phone companies.

• 35:05Speaker 01

  So, um, so I think just coming up with something which will make people smile. A mermaid somehow fits, somehow fits with pools.

• 35:16Guy Raz?

  But all of these things are so smart because they attract media attention and buzz and hype. And I, and you know, of course, you know, we're, Ross, you're not Richard Branson, but there are, there are elements and ideas here that I think could work. I mean, um, you know, obviously you, you want to think about putting this up for a couple of days a week. Free swimming, you know, even even at like church fairs or block parties, community gatherings like, I mean, I wouldn't even think about doing something analog like radio in the Phoenix area, you know, it's going to be a hot summer, have a pool to cool down. I mean, even cool videos that you could geo-target, you know, through social media, just to specific types of of customers. You want to really focus some

• 36:00Guy Raz?

  of your attention on identifying your target customers, right? And once you do that, you start to use stories that sort of build around the product and around the appeal of this because it to me, it's a no-brainer, especially in a place like Phoenix.

• 36:13Speaker 01

  Maybe once a month, you could just turn up at an underprivileged school and and just set up a pool there and bring some fun figures that can come and rollick in the pool with the kids or something. I mean, just, you know, just surprise the parents, surprise the school. And actually, you know, a lot of the parents might end up wanting one of your pools themselves. So I think a little bit of that might be good as well.

• 36:37Speaker 05

  I love that. That's a great idea.

• 36:39Speaker 01

  April Fool's Day. I know it's just gone by, but I always found April Fool's Day was a great day where you could put your products on the map in a in a fun way. We once built a UFO, as you do, and we flew over London at 4:00 AM in the morning on April Fool's Day in a UFO, and the whole of London got into a panic and the radio stations, the police, the army were called out. We landed in a foggy field and and the door went very, very slowly down. And this little ET figure, who is a friend of mine, was dressed up in a little ET figure, walked walked down and this policeman who they'd

• 37:21Speaker 01

  sent out to meet us just ran in the opposite direction. But, you know, we got the headlines.

• 37:27Speaker 05

  All right. So mermaids and aliens is what you're saying?

• 37:31Guy Raz?

  Mermaids and aliens, yes.

• 37:33Speaker 01

  It's been not, hopefully, it's been useful to you. But doing a few, you know, I mean, since you can, you know, fill it up with water and then leave the next day, you can actually, you know, you can pop into worthwhile events and make people smile as well.

• 37:48Guy Raz?

  Yep, for sure. Ross Navatny, the company's called Now Pools. Good luck. It's a great idea. I can't wait to hear more.

• 37:55Speaker 05

  Thank you so much to both of you.

• 37:57Speaker 01

  Cheers.

• 37:58Guy Raz?

  Yeah, thank you so much. I love it. Mermaids. He could have like scuba divers in there. I mean, maybe put some tropical fish inside. I mean, right? You've got to get attention. You got to get people talking about it.

• 38:12Speaker 01

  Exactly. And no, anyway, he's, he's obviously got the business side and now it's the marketing. So good, best, best for him.

• 38:21Guy Raz?

  All right, we're going to take another quick break, but we'll be right back with another caller. Stay with us. I'm Guy Raz and you're listening to the advice line right here on How I Built This Lab.

• 38:45Guy Raz?

  Welcome back to the advice line on How I Built This Lab. I'm Guy Raz and today I'm taking your calls with Sir Richard Branson. Sir Richard, let's bring in our, our last caller. Welcome to the advice line. You are on with Sir Richard Branson. Please tell us your name, where you're calling from, and a little bit about your, your business.

• 39:02Speaker 06

  Hey guys, Sir Richard. Thanks for having me. This is an honor. My name's Andrew Perez and I'm calling from East Tennessee. I'm the co-founder of The Juice Spot and Lone Wolf Granola. The Juice Spot's a no-nonsense whole food smoothie and juice bar. And from there, what we were able to do was create Lone Wolf Granola. It's our small batch, handcrafted granola that actually started as an ingredient for our osasibos, but it just quickly took on a life of its own.

• 39:28Guy Raz?

  Awesome. Well, thanks for calling in, Andrew. So you're in Eastern Tennessee. Where are you in Tennessee?

• 39:32Speaker 06

  Um, well, I'm, I'm in the tri-state area. It's a pretty nice little interesting area in the Appalachian area, Cumberland Gap.

• 39:41Guy Raz?

  Cumberland Gap. There's a national park there. Famous Gap where Daniel Boone went through Cumberland Gap.

• 39:46Speaker 06

  You know, it's the gateway to the West.

• 39:48Speaker 01

  And you have, you have a very, very, very, very small population, but lots of tourists. So, so you're tapping into them.

• 39:55Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 39:55Guy Raz?

  So tell me how you, are you from there? Like, is that why you opened up this juice bar?

• 40:00Speaker 06

  No, no, actually, the story's much deeper than that. I'm originally from Southern California and, you know, same with my life partner, Lisa, who is in on this with me all the way. And we grew up around fresh, healthy foods. It was, you know, part of just a lifestyle that shaped both of our families. And, uh, you know, with the shared belief in the fact that, you know, food's a way of bringing people together. With my degree in biochemistry and, uh, you know, I have a huge love for fitness. Uh, I think those things pair very well together.

• 40:30Guy Raz?

  So how did you guys, how did you guys end up in Cumberland Gap, Tennessee with a juice bar?

• 40:34Speaker 06

  Well, I'll tell you the story. My, my, Elisa, you know, my partner, she was feeling a little homesick. And I said, hey, you know what? It would be a great thing to take you out and go visit your parents. So I bought us a plane ticket and, uh, you know, I wish it would have been Virgin, but they don't fly out this way. And, uh,

• 40:51Speaker 01

  We'll put that right.

• 40:52Speaker 06

  Let's fix that quick.

• 40:53Speaker 01

  But you've got, your population's got to be more than a hundred and fifty people in this city.

• 40:59Speaker 06

  So, long story short, we took a hike and we was in the middle of summer. Um, it was really hot. I told my father-in-law, I said, hey, uh, smoothies on me. Let's go out and get some smoothies, some fresh pressed juice. And he looked at me and gave me this real funny look and said, all we got is about Mick Cafe and that's all you can get over here, you know, just a McDonald's smoothie. And I was baffled because there's a private university about a mile away from where we're located. So it, it just blew my mind that that wasn't available.

• 41:25Guy Raz?

  So you're thinking there's a, and there's a tourists come through here and there's nothing like this. There's no juice bar. So clearly it made sense for you guys to do this.

• 41:34Speaker 06

  Absolutely. I mean, I saw, I saw a problem that needed a solution.

• 41:38Guy Raz?

  Do you, you have this juice bar, but you also made granola, which has now become kind of a popular thing, right? You guys are selling a lot of granola.

• 41:46Speaker 06

  Yeah.

• 41:46Guy Raz?

  And, and before we get into that, tell me what, what's your question for us?

• 41:50Speaker 06

  So, um, my, my question is, in today's business landscape, what are three tangible pieces of advice that you would give to me as I continue to grow these two distinct but very complementary brands, each with its own unique demand and, uh, growth challenges?

• 42:10Speaker 01

  Well, you, you've got, you've got a great brand. I think Lone Wolf Granola is a very strong brand. I mean, do you want to try to get your juice bars and the granola into other outlets or, or more standalone places yourself?

• 42:26Speaker 06

  Um, that's a great question. You know, right now, what I'm currently doing, you know, with the juice pot itself, I'm working along this private university to get in and help fuel their athletes and create a program as they're working to become a D1 school. Um, and as far as the granola, I, I, I just want to get it out to the masses. I, I have a great product and I think that everybody needs to get their hands on it and it should be a staple in the house.

• 42:52Guy Raz?

  Uh, Andrew, let's, let's focus on the granola for a moment because I know you've got the juice bar, but the granola, it sounds like the granola is really, you want to turn this into a CPG brand, right? You want to turn this into a brand that you could sell beyond Cumberland Gap, right? In, in stores and, and I guess, imagine that you want to figure out how to do that, right? It's not easy to get, get your stuff out there and Cumberland Gap is a small place, even though you've got some tourists coming and buying it. Um, have you made any efforts or any attempts so far to reach out to any retailers or grocers to see if they might be interested?

• 43:24Speaker 06

  Um, I have, I, I work, I work alongside of a lot of smaller farm to table grocers. Um, and I've been working with some nutrition shops, um, just outside of my area in Knoxville, Tennessee, to try to tap into the market there. It would be my goal and, um, I guess, you know, I, I would probably need a little bit of guidance to try to figure out how to tap into that market more appropriately.

• 43:49Speaker 01

  I mean, if you could get, um, one other store apart from your own to be selling it and, and you can then use the statistics of how well they do to then, you know, and that to then approach others, other stores, um, that obviously would be helpful. I mean, it's, it's, it's great to be able to say, well, you know, if you stock this, it's likely to sell X. I mean, what sort of advertising? Well, you, you obviously don't spend money on advertising because you've only got your one store at the moment.

• 44:17Speaker 06

  We do spend money on advertising. The budget's fairly small, but you know, we use a lot of social media platforms and we work with micro influencers in the area to get that product out. I do sample quite a bit.

• 44:29Guy Raz?

  That's, that's critical, what you just said, Andrew. You know, look, I think that you've got a lot of things you're interested in doing and focused on. The juice spot and working with the athletes at the local university and the granola, but I do think that you're going to have to at some point make some hard choices about how, how to divide and conquer between you and your, your partner. Maybe one of you focuses on the juice bar and one of you really leans into the granola for a time, period of time, because if you're going to try and turn this into a CPG brand, you've got to start in a city. And you, the closest city I'm looking at the map is Knoxville. And Knoxville is not an unimportant place. I mean, I was looking in Knoxville, Mountain Dew was founded in Knoxville, Ruby Tuesdays was founded in Knoxville, Regal Cinemas, White Lily Flowers. So there are brands that started there. I

• 45:14Guy Raz?

  think you need to really get into Knoxville to the regional markets. There's Food City there. There's Ingalls, The Fresh Market, Three Rivers Market. Go to places like that and you've got to sample the hell out of this. You've got to be there every weekend with cups of this stuff, sampling this so people can try it. I think that's the market you have to start in Knoxville because, and then you can get to Nashville, which is, you know, once you're Nashville, you're a national, potentially national brand. But I think you have to really make some hard choices right now if you want to try and turn this into a real brand. Richard, what do you think?

• 45:49Speaker 01

  So we, we have a hotel in Nashville. Why don't we, why, why don't we just stock a little bit for a while and see, you know, see whether our customers like it. And, and I'd be delighted to do that. So I'll get somebody to be in touch and we'll get some in that hotel.

• 46:06Guy Raz?

  Wow.

• 46:07Speaker 06

  Thank you, Richard.

• 46:08Speaker 01

  Yeah. And then, is your granola, do you add sugar to it, just as a matter of interest?

• 46:14Speaker 06

  I do add a little bit of sugar. It's a, it's a, it's a raw, organic brown cane sugar. And I add a splash of that. There is, we do use a, a raw and filtered organic honey as well, to kind of offset the, the sugar. And other than that, I have some pecans in there, some, some oats, some sunflower seeds.

• 46:37Speaker 01

  It might be worth you, because. Granola is associated with, you know, healthiness. You might, might be worth you giving people the choice of, you know, granola with sugar, granola without sugar, since, you know, sugar's becoming such, such a big thing. So, um, if you can make it, try to make it as tasty without sugar, um, you know, that will definitely go well in sort of health shops and so on.

• 47:00Guy Raz?

  Maybe agave, yeah.

• 47:02Speaker 06

  Oh, yeah, yeah. I use agave in the shop. That's great. I'll, I'll, I'll work on fine tuning your formula, Sir Richard.

• 47:07Speaker 01

  Great. Well, I look forward to going to Nashville and having a, having a breakfast.

• 47:11Speaker 06

  Thank you so much.

• 47:12Guy Raz?

  That would be, wow. Look at that. Andrew Perez, The Juice Spot and Lone Wolf Granola. Uh, thanks for calling in. Good luck. Congrats on, on our things so far.

• 47:19Speaker 01

  Cheers.

• 47:20Speaker 06

  Thank you.

• 47:22Guy Raz?

  Wow. That's so cool. I mean.

• 47:25Speaker 01

  That'll be fun. I'll be, I look forward, look, really just look forward to tasting it.

• 47:28Guy Raz?

  Do you know, I make granola because when I go to someone's house, I live in, in San Francisco. And so, you know, what am I going to bring? I have friends who are winemakers and, and, and food, and I'm not going to bring them wine because they make wine. I make granola and then I put it in a jar and I put, my wife puts like a nice label on it and it's a really nice gift. It's actually people, you took the time to make it.

• 47:48Speaker 01

  Ah, you say you, you make it and give it away. It's lovely.

• 47:50Guy Raz?

  I make it and give it, I've got some in the oven as we speak, Richard. It's at 220 degrees Fahrenheit, slow.

• 47:57Speaker 01

  You, you, you're going to have to invite me to breakfast sometime.

• 47:59Guy Raz?

  You're, I'm, anytime.

• 48:01Speaker 01

  All right. Nice.

• 48:03Guy Raz?

  Richard, before we let you go, I want to ask you one final question. When you sort of look back on your time building Virgin, you know, if, if you could go back to the, to the 20 year old kid, starting that, that mailer business and say, hey, I'm coming from the future. I've got 50 plus years of advice and experience now. I want to give you a piece of advice. What do you, what would you have said to your former, your, your younger self?

• 48:28Speaker 01

  Well, look, I'm, I'm lucky. I would not change a thing. So even, even my mistakes, I would not change because I think, you know, as, as an entrepreneur, uh, if you don't make mistakes, you're not going to achieve anything. So, um, and I just think for other 26 year olds, that, that they, they need to look out for situations in life where, um, you know, where, where they're frustrated about something, leap in and try to, you know, improve on it, um, and just give it a go. Um, and, um, you'll have a lot of fun in the process, a lot of learning in the process. And sometimes you'll fall flat on your face and sometimes it'll succeed.

• 49:07Guy Raz?

  That's founder of The Virgin Group, Richard Branson. Sir Richard, thank you so much for coming back onto the show.

• 49:12Speaker 01

  Well, as always, thanks very much for having us and talk to you. See you soon.

• 49:17Guy Raz?

  And by the way, if you haven't heard Richard Branson's original How I Built This Episode, you've got to go back and check it out. It's really, truly one of the best out of the 10 years we've been doing this show. You can find a link to it in the podcast description. And here is one of my favorite moments from that interview.

• 49:32Speaker 01

  You know, I find the bank manager sitting on my doorstep and stupidly I invited him into the house and he tells me that he's going to close the whole Virgin Group down on the Monday. And I don't normally get angry, but I just literally stood up and pushed him out of my house and told him he wasn't ever welcome there again, which was not maybe the best thing to do to your bank manager.

• 49:56Guy Raz?

  Thanks so much for listening to the show this week. Please make sure to check out my newsletter. You can sign up for it for free at guyraz.com. Each week it's packed with tons of insights from entrepreneurs and my own observations and experiences interviewing some of the greatest entrepreneurs ever. And if you're working on a business and you'd like to be on this show, send us a one-minute message that tells us about your business, the issues or questions you'd like help with, and hopefully we can help you with them. And make sure to tell us how to reach you. You can send us a voice memo at [email protected] or call us at 1-800-433-1298 and leave a message

• 50:41Guy Raz?

  there. And we'll put all this in the podcast description as well. This episode was produced by Chris Messini with music composed by Ramtin Arablouei. It was edited by John Isabella. Our audio engineer was Neil Rouch. Our production team also includes Alex Chung, Casey Herman, Iman Maani, Elaine Coats, J.C. Howard, Catherine Seifer, Kerry Thompson, Sam Paulson, and Neva Grant. I'm Guy Raz, and you've been listening to the Advice Line right here on How I Built This Lab.